mitnick-digest Tuesday, October 27 1998 Volume 01 : Number 184 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1998 20:13:23 -0800 (PST) From: rOTTEN Subject: Re: [mitnick] ZDNET--off topic review On Mon, 26 Oct 1998, XxGaLxX wrote: > I'm sorry but that article is crap--strictly my opinion though. If my > parents even slightly thought i could do something illegal with my > computer, i would be shipped off to boarding school so fast i wouldn't even > get to say goodbye. They wouldn't "talk" it over with me or any of that > shit by asking questions, and from where a couple of my friends are > now...their parents are the exact same. i know this is probably really OFF > TOPIC...but just wanted to tell ya my reaction to it. Interesting point. Question for ya: What would you do? And also important: If you were assigned to do an article on "what to do if your kid is a computer hacker", how would you address the topic? <..rOTTEN..> nobody move, nobody get hurt error187(1) critical failure - - - - - - To do: 1) Update my "To do" list. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 00:33:52 -0500 From: "zoltan" Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... in response to that, let me tell ya somethin. you go be an admin. for 12 hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or really care how you spell. ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer - -z > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mitnick@2600.com [mailto:owner-mitnick@2600.com]On Behalf Of > Phoenxknt@aol.com > Sent: Monday, October 26, 1998 8:01 PM > To: mitnick@2600.com > Subject: Re: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a > Cellmate... > > > In a message dated 98-10-25 23:18:40 EST, you write: > > << k, so that makes to people... > > -z >> > > May I ask, DID you go to school? First you screwed up and said > > < only as a > Cellmate... > Date: 98-10-25 21:11:18 EST > From: zoltan@well.com (zoltan) > Sender: owner-mitnick@2600.com > Reply-to: mitnick@2600.com > To: mitnick@2600.com > > damn am I the only guy here not is school? > > -z>> > > and then the "to" for two. Tsk Tsk, maybe you could go back to > school. We have > room in my English class if you'd like. > > -AM > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 13:06:39 -0600 From: Zach Miller Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... At 12:33 AM 10/27/98 -0500, you wrote: >in response to that, let me tell ya somethin. you go be an admin. for 12 >hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or >really care how you spell. > >ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer > >-z ok lets cut the "aol sucks" crap NOW before it turns into one of those off-topic "discussions" that go on for days. if you dislike aol for whatever reason that's your opinion but keep it off the list. and just because someone uses aol doesn't make them lame. - -zm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 08:13:50 +0000 From: kerry Subject: [mitnick] Financial info from a shareholder - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 22 Oct 1998 21:40:33 -0500 2600, I am not sure how relevant this information may be at this time, but I have financial information relating to Nokia, Motorola and Sun, at least from the perspective of a shareholder. I own common stock in all three of these companies, and I can tell you this: - - Nokia, for FY 1993 (calendar June 1992-May 1993) and FY 1994 (June 1993-May 1994) reported an operating charge of $12.2 million relating to ramping up to make digital cellular telephones. No mention was made in the shareholder report of any illegal activities against the company. - - Motorola for calendar year 1993 and calendar 1994 reported no operating charges (at least ot 12-G status) and in fact posted a 10 year gain of $223.9 million. - - Sun, in 1993 and the first half of 1994 took a total charge of $14.9 million thanks to declining profits in the server market. No mention of any losses due to criminal activities were made. In addition, unfortunately, the statute of limitations for filing shareholder lawsuits for FY 1993 reports has expired (it is 4 years), but 1994 may still be available depending on when the companies filed reports (the limit has passed for all three of these companies, as they filed during the first half of 1994). There was an inquiry into this at Sun Microsystems, to no resolution. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1998 23:32:38 -0800 (PST) From: Hardrock Llewynyth Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... On Tue, 27 Oct 1998, zoltan wrote: > in response to that, let me tell ya somethin. you go be an admin. for 12 > hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or > really care how you spell. dunno what languages and Operating Systems you use; but it has been my experience with C, Java, Unix, and DOS that if you can't or don't spell everything correctly, you are in for a world of hurt. Windows, otoh, you're in for a world of hurt regardless. > ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer hardrock, some of my best friends are AOLers... - -- "I will not eat any animal that has ever been a cartoon character." --Dave Lister ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 02:53:56 EST From: Bobwil623@aol.com Subject: [mitnick] action alert #1 - we need more like this. the following deserves re-reading at this late date, in this writer's opinion... taken from we may want to take a page from amnesty international's book, and begin a regular series of action alerts. time to get busy..... addresses at the end. ==begin attachment== - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 08:50:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Free Kevin To: lacc@suburbia.net Subject: GeeK: LACC: File 2--Free Kevin Mitnick -- Action Alert #1 FREE KEVIN MITNICK -- ACTION ALERT #1 5 July 1998 ----------------------------------------- PLEASE REDISTRIBUTE THIS DOCUMENT TO APPROPRIATE FORUMS ----------------------------------------- 1) Happy 4th of July 2) Let's Screw Kevin Again: The Movie 3) Where Are the Activists? 4) What You Can Do ------------------------------------------------------------ 1) Happy 4th of July Did you have an enjoyable 4th of July weekend? Did you hang out by the barbecue, beer in hand, and eat too many burgers and/or tofu dogs? Well, whatever you did, it was probably more enjoyable then Kevin Mitnick's 4th of July. Kevin spent his in the same place that he had the last few -- the Metropolitan Detention Center (MDC) in Los Angeles. Kevin has been held without bail for three years and four months pending his trial on a 25 count federal indictment, and it will likely be more than four years without bail by the time his trial actually takes place. MDC is a pre-trial facility and is intended for much shorter periods of detention, so Kevin is only allowed visits from his attorney and immediate family. Amazingly, Kevin has never had the opportunity to present evidence and cross-examine witnesses in an adversarial detention hearing, as is required by the Bail Reform Act. Kevin did waive his right to a speedy trial, as most defendants do, but this isn't quite what he had in mind. What makes all of this worse is that Kevin is not likely to get the facilities that he needs to defend himself properly while he is in MDC. The government is entering loads of evidence against Kevin that exists in electronic form, and he will need a computer and a lot of time to properly sort through it all. So far it appears that he will be given neither the time nor the equipment to properly prepare a defense against the government's case. How long will this go on? Kevin has never committed a violent crime, and there's no evidence that there was any profit motive behind his hacking. Violent and truly dangerous criminals get lighter treatment than Kevin every day and no one blinks. What would the Founding Fathers have thought of such an obvious attempt to prevent someone from obtaining a fair trial? Let's hope that Kevin doesn't have to spend another 4th of July in custody next year... ------------------------------------------------------------ 2) Let's Screw Kevin Again: The Movie >From the Exploitative Journalism Makes Good Movies department: Miramax pictures recently announced that they will begin shooting in July on "Takedown," a movie based on the book by Tsutomu Shimomura and John Markoff. The book, which chronicles Shimomura's version of the events leading up to Kevin's capture, was criticized by some as a self-serving attempt by the authors to cash in on the hype surrounding Mitnick's arrest. People who have seen the script for the movie say it's even worse. Emmanuel Goldstein, editor of "2600" magazine, was one of the first Mitnick supporters to obtain a copy of the "Takedown" script. Goldstein writes that the script is "far worse than I had even imagined." "If this film is made the way the script reads," he adds, "Kevin will be forever demonized in the eyes of the public. And mostly for things that everyone agrees *never even happened* in the first place!" Inaccuracies in the script range from the merely comical (Kevin makes free phone calls by whistling touch tones into the handset) to the outright false and defamatory (Kevin assaults Shimomura in an alley with a garbage-can lid, and Shimomura visits Kevin in prison and tells him "good work" for cracking his systems). Goldstein's notes on the script is online at: http://www.kevinmitnick.com/review.html In an article for ZDTV, columnist Kevin Poulsen writes, "nobody predicted that the script, supposedly based on the dry, but inoffensive book of the same name, would be filled with so much blatant fabrication. No one expected that Kevin Mitnick might become the most feared and hated screen villain since Hannibal Lecter." Poulsen, himself a convicted hacker who was held for years without bail, scored a revealing interview with one of the "Takedown" screenwriters, John Danza. Danza told Poulsen that he had wanted to present a different view of Mitnick's case, one that "wasn't so black and white; good and bad-- I think Tsutomu was basically self-serving, and I thought it would be an interesting idea if he realized that." The studio allegedly didn't buy off on Danza's ideas, or even on his draft that stuck more closely to the book. "Then they gave it to a high-priced polish writer who gets paid an enormous amount of money to spice up the dialog," Danza told Poulsen, "and I think he did that and also changed quite a bit. I've read that draft and I'm even less satisfied." Poulsen's article is at: http://www.zdnet.com/zdtv/cda/index/0,2073,2115491-2103615,00.html He's written several other articles about Mitnick's case: http://www.zdnet.com/zdtv/cda/index/0,2073,2110084-2103615.00.html http://www.zdnet.com/zdtv/cda/index/0,2073,2000162-2103615.00.html http://www.zdnet.com/zdtv/cda/index/0,2073,2000163-2103615.00.html ----------------------------------------------------------- 3) Where Are the Activists? One of the most disturbing aspects of Kevin Mitnick's case is the lack of support for his plight from Net activists. The same people who could probably quote moving passages from their dog-eared copies of "The Hacker Crackdown" seem to become very quiet when it comes to Kevin's case. Not only have groups like EFF not lent direct legal support to Kevin, but they have done little else to show any support for him. It's time for Internet activists to take a stand. It's time for people to realize that for phrases like "Cyber Rights Now" to have any meaning, they must apply to Kevin Mitnick as well as every other netizen. Even if we assume that the worst accusations about Kevin's hacking are true, it still becomes quickly clear that his case has been blown way out of proportion. Kevin is the victim of a campaign to hype his story, a campaign which has made millions of dollars for those responsible. Obviously, Net activist organizations have a limited amount of time and must focus their resources. They cannot respond to every potential crisis, and no reasonable person would expect them to. They have other, more practical concerns as well, like the possibility of alienating potential donors and sponsors. That's reality. What's also reality is that Kevin's case is sure to be a landmark in the field of computer crime, and that activists should be getting involved to make sure that bad precedents aren't set which could impact us all. Kevin is obviously being singled out to act as an example for other hackers, and the message is pretty clear so far: that the government can do as it pleases when it comes to hackers, civil rights be damned. If that's the case, then how safe is anyone? Why should a "computer criminal" be treated more severely than violent criminals are? Is a hacker more dangerous to the fabric of society than a rapist or murderer? Should someone be penalized more severely for their crimes because they involve computers? Is a computer a weapon, something to be feared? Will the real activists please stand up? Ironically, it's the movie of "Takedown," which some people feel may do irreversible damage to Kevin's reputation, that may put him in the same boat with some prominent netizens. EFF co-founder John Gilmore reportedly is portrayed in a negative light in the script, as is the management of The Well. And believe it or not, Goldstein writes that the script portrays "'Electronic Freedom Foundation' types" who actually aid in Mitnick's capture. Things aren't quite that bad in real life, but they could be a lot better. ------------------------------------------------------------ 4) What You Can Do There are a lot of things you can do to help Kevin's situation: A) Donate to Kevin's defense fund. This is one of the most helpful things you can do. Over $3,000 has been raised so far, but that's just a drop in the bucket. Kevin needs expert witnesses, research, and other things that the court is unlikely to provide much financial help for. Information about donating is at: http://www.kevinmitnick.com/df.html If you can't afford to donate, though, there are still other things you can do. B) Bumper stickers. The tres chic "Free Kevin" bumper stickers are available for $1 apiece through www.kevinmitnick.com, and the money goes towards Kevin's defense fund. You can also place a virtual bumper sticker on your web page and link it to www.kevinmitnick.com. C) Join the mailing list. "2600" has set up a Majordomo list for discussion of Kevin's case, and it's a great place to stay tuned for information about the case and other related events. Email majordomo@2600.com with the words "subscribe mitnick" (without the quotes) as the body of your message. You can also get info on Kevin's case (and many other topics) from "Off The Hook," Emmanuel Goldstein's radio program that airs on WBAI in New York, and via RealAudio. More info is at: http://www.2600.com/offthehook/ D) Protest the movie, "Takedown." Plans are being put in place now for pickets of the Miramax offices in New York and Los Angeles, and there will likely be some sort of demonstrations in North Carolina when shooting there begins. Join the mailing list using the directions above to stay up to date on these events. Also, write letters to those involved with the movie expressing your feelings about the project. Individuals involved with the production might not even be aware of the finer points of the case, and they deserve to know what they're getting themselves into. A list of contacts is at the end of this message. E) Write legislators, members of the media, and anyone else you can think of who might be able to have a positive impact on Kevin's situation. F) Join the RC5 team. We're participating in the distributed.net effort to crack RC5-64, and if someone on our team hits the key we will donate our winnings to Kevin's defense fund. It's also an opportunity to get some positive publicity for Kevin, and, after all, they're just spare CPU cycles. You might as well use them for a good cause. More information is at: http://www.paranoid.org/mitnick/ G) Contact Net activists and ask them to get involved. The trial is getting nearer, and Kevin needs help now, not in a couple of years on appeal. H) Read, read, read. Read the books about Kevin's case, and the information at www.kevinmitnick.com. The more information you have, the better able you'll be to discuss the case. I) Spread the word. Tell people about Kevin's case, hand out fliers, do whatever you can to try to help balance out the negative hype. J) Repost this message to appropriate forums. K) Think of more ideas like these and post them to the mailing list. ------------------------------------------------------- CONTACTS: For feedback about this document, contact mitnick@paranoid.org. Emmanuel Goldstein of "2600" can be reached at emmanuel@2600.com. Feedback on the www.kevinmitnick.com website should go to fill@2600.com. We can all be reached through the mitnick@2600.com Majordomo list. ASCII art by rOTTEN. ----------------------------------------------------- People to contact about the movie "Takedown," as posted to the mitnick@2600.com list: Miramax Films 7966 Beverly Blvd. Los Angeles, CA 90048 (213) 951-4200 (213) 951-4315 (fax) Miramax Films 375 Greenwich St., 3rd floor New York, NY 10013 (212) 941-3800 (212) 941-3949 (fax) ANDREW STENGEL Publicist for Miramax (212) 625-2222 DAILY VARIETY 5700 Wilshire Boulevard #120 Los Angeles, CA 90036 (213) 857-6600 MONICA ROMAN Variety writer who wrote internet announcement about "Takedown" movie (212) 337-7001 (Variety New York office) HOLLYWOOD REPORTER 5055 Wilshire Bouevard #600 Los Angeles, CA 90036 (213) 525-2000 SKEET ULRICH (actor who will play Kevin Mitnick) ICM 8942 Wilshire Boulevard Beverly Hills, CA 90211 (310) 550-4000 (310) 550-4100 (fax) (this is the agency representing Skeet) Aleen Keshishian (212) 556-5698 (Skeet's agent) JOE CHAPPELLE (director of Takedown) Bohrman Agency 8489 W. Third Street Los Angeles, CA 90048 (213) 653-6701 (agency representing Chappelle) DAVID NEWMAN HOWARD RODMAN JOHN DANZA (writers of Takedown script) There were too many Newmans to trace. Danza is not listed with the Writers Guild. Howard Rodman is represented by: Creative Artists 9830 Wilshire Boulevard Beverly Hills, CA 90212 (310) 288-4545 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 04:26:39 -0500 (EST) From: ksandre Subject: Re: [mitnick] ZDNET On Mon, 26 Oct 1998, rOTTEN wrote: > > They dumbed it down. It originally was a funnier piece. > What was posted here wasn't the whole article. (I am posting the whole version next because it's worth it. It's a pretty decent compromise and informative to the uninitiated - I'd like to see more links within the article that give more examples and history and technical innovation stories. AllInAll, it would be a nice starting place for an entire WEB Page dedicated to catalysing that impulse and urge to innovation.) > Naturally there > were some issues that Poulsen had with writing it in the first place. He > couldn't outright say that hacking was wrong. As I said above - it's a decent compromise. Given his situation, he can't seem too pro-H/P either. (I'd still like to see more referrals to history - especially pointers to invovation and solutions invented from H/P walkabouts....) "All Power To The Imagination!" - - Paris, 1968 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 04:26:58 -0500 (EST) From: ksandre Subject: [mitnick] [ZDNET] - whole "Is Your Kid A Hacker" article November, 1998 Is Your Kid a Hacker? By Kevin Poulsen If you suspect your kid is a computer hacker, here's some advice from a convicted hacker on how to handle it It starts with a knock on the door. A dozen men in suits and shoulder holsters are outside, their Buicks and Broncos crammed into your driveway and parked along the street. Over their shoulders you can see your bathrobe-clad neighbors watching the spectacle from their lawns. It might be the FBI, it may be the Secret Service, but whoever it is, the humorless agents hand you a piece of paper and head toward your son or daughter's room. You wonder, perhaps for the first time, what your kid has been doing in there with the computer. If you're a parent, you probably regard the Internet as a font of both promise and peril for your children. It can be an invaluable learning tool and a way to encourage your kids to develop the basic computer skills they'll eventually need. But what if they take to it a little too eagerly and enthusiastically and begin using it to get into places where they don't belong? In that case, normal youthful rebellion, or simple inquisitiveness, if it's expressed over the Internet, could turn your family upside down. It happened last February in Cloverdale, California, when surprised parents found out their teenage son was suspected in a series of Pentagon intrusions. It happened again in Massachusetts a week later, when the Justice Department won its first juvenile conviction under the Federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. It happened to my family 15 years ago, in one of the first hacker raids in the country. At that time, I was the teenage miscreant who was illegally accessing federal computers. Now, in my early thirties, I've begun to wonder how I would protect a kid of my own from becoming a poster child for computer crime. I believe the best approach is to stay informed and to communicate with your potential cyberpunks. Open Communications Channels [Is Your Kid a Hacker?, continued] Open Communication Channels Some of the things you might view as ominous warning signs are actually quite harmless. For example, if your teenager calls himself a "hacker," he may not be headed for trouble. Despite the media's breathless exhortation, hackers are not lawbreakers by definition. The word actually describes someone with a talent for technology, a deep interest in how things work, and a tendency to reject any limitations. If your son disassembled the Giga Pet you gave him for Christmas, he's probably a hacker. If he made it run better, he definitely is. Of course, some hackers go further and test their skills against the adult world of corporate and governmental computer systems. If I thought my kids were cracking computers, I would want to put a stop to it -- though not because it's the crime of the century. True hackers live by an ethical code that precludes damaging systems or profiting from their intrusions. There are worse values for a teenager to have. But regardless of motives, a hacker who's caught in the act today is likely to be treated as an industrial spy or a national security threat. A single moment of rebellious exploration could land a teenager an early felony conviction. If you suspect that your kid may be crossing the line, there are various software packages on the market that will allow you to monitor or control his or her access to the Internet. Don't even think about using one. If your teen really is a hacker, your technological solution will be a source of amusement and derision, as well as an insult to his talents. Instead of putting up barriers, I suggest you talk to your kids. If your kid is reading underground Web sites for hackers, read them yourself. If he has a subscription to a hacker magazine, go through it and ask questions. Feel free to marvel at the cleverness of the latest hacker technique. Then talk about consequences: the rising costs of legal representation, the problems that a convicted felon encounters in academia and the job market. Start looking at alternatives to a life of cybercrime. Constructive Alternatives [Is Your Kid a Hacker?, continued] Constructive Alternatives If your kid has a rebellious streak, I suggest giving up on trying to suppress it; try to channel it instead. When hackers grow up, they often find a reasonable substitute for the thrill of intrusion by working the other side. Ask your teen how he would plug the latest security holes. Get him thinking about it. Ask him for advice on protecting your own e-mail or your ISP account. The hacker tradition has always contained an element of disrespect for authority. Up until 15 years ago, cracking systems was an acceptable rite of passage in the industry, and some of the same people who pioneered artificial intelligence and the personal computer also ushered in phone phreaking, lock hacking, and computer intrusion. Early hackers believed that computers were a public resource and that access to them and knowledge about them should be free. In a sense, the first-generation hackers won their battle when they created the personal computer: It gave them free access to computing power anytime they wanted. Today, kids can claim that victory on the Internet by authoring a Web page. There is plenty of room for innovation and creativity. Today's PCs are as powerful as yesterday's mainframes. With today's PCs, no one needs to break the law to explore technology. With the right tools, and parental support, kids can earn the respect of their peers and get an early start on their future by mastering the latest programming languages. If my kid were a hacker, I'd encourage him to shun the instant gratification of cracking a Fortune 500 company in favor of the greater satisfaction of creating something unique from scratch. Ultimately, that's what hacking really is all about. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Kevin Poulsen does not have an e-mail address --he's banned from using the Internet and e-mail until June 3, 1999. -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Copyright © 1998 FamilyPC. All Rights Reserved. Reproduction in whole or in part in any form or medium without express written permission of FamilyPC is prohibited. FamilyPC and the FamilyPC on the Web logo are trademarks of ZD, Inc. webmaster@zd.com -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 05:30:27 -0500 (EST) From: ksandre Subject: Re: [mitnick] Commentary on financial info On Tue, 27 Oct 1998, kerry wrote: > > This is interesting commentary on the financial "losses" alleged by the > government in kevin's case. It was emailed in to the site. > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1998 11:05:54 -0500 > > Horrific. > > I can't begin to describe the horrific nature of the bogus indictment I > just read. > > > I can't wait for January. I calculate the damages for Kevin against the > Government must be well in excess of, well lets say $10.00 Billion, give > or take. > > Steve > !!! That's terrific. I hope this person emailed the article to other places aside from the Mitnick Site! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 05:30:53 -0500 (EST) From: ksandre Subject: Re: [mitnick] Financial info from a shareholder On Tue, 27 Oct 1998, kerry wrote: > Subject: [mitnick] Financial info from a shareholder > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Thu, 22 Oct 1998 21:40:33 -0500 > I am not sure how relevant this information may be at this time, > but I have financial information relating to Nokia, Motorola and Sun, > at least from the perspective of a shareholder. I own common > stock in all three of these companies, and I can tell you this: > > > In addition, unfortunately, the statute of limitations for filing > shareholder lawsuits for FY 1993 reports has expired (it is 4 years), > but 1994 may still be available depending on when the companies > filed reports (the limit has passed for all three of these companies, > as they filed during the first half of 1994). Did this person mention if they had written the Boards of these companies to express their concern about Kevin Mitnick's impending trial and the charges relating to alleged losses by these companies? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 05:31:21 -0500 (EST) From: ksandre Subject: Re: [mitnick] action alert #1 - we need more like this. On Tue, 27 Oct 1998 Bobwil623@aol.com wrote: > Subject: [mitnick] action alert #1 - we need more like this. > the following deserves re-reading at this late date, in this writer's > opinion... taken from > we may want to take a page from amnesty international's book, and begin a > regular series of action alerts. > time to get busy..... addresses at the end. > ==begin attachment== > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 08:50:02 -0700 (PDT) > From: Free Kevin > > FREE KEVIN MITNICK -- ACTION ALERT #1 > 5 July 1998 > ----------------------------------------- Yes. It would be nice to have a new, updated one of these to distribute. (I suppose one could simply change the date except for all the commentary pertaining to the Fourth Of July - how 'bout a 'Happy ThanksGiving' one?) This one was published in CUD first, wasn't it? (I believe that's where I first saw it.) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 08:07:03 -0500 From: "zoltan" Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... I say "lamer" not because he is an AoL user. Just because that is how is acting. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mitnick@2600.com [mailto:owner-mitnick@2600.com]On Behalf Of > Zach Miller > Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 1998 2:07 PM > To: mitnick@2600.com > Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a > Cellmate... > > > At 12:33 AM 10/27/98 -0500, you wrote: > >in response to that, let me tell ya somethin. you go be an admin. for 12 > >hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or > >really care how you spell. > > > >ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer > > > >-z > > > ok lets cut the "aol sucks" crap NOW before it turns into one > of those off-topic "discussions" that go on for days. if you > dislike aol for whatever reason that's your opinion but keep > it off the list. and just because someone uses aol doesn't make > them lame. > > -zm > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 09:39:24 -0500 (EST) From: Esoteric Resources Subject: [mitnick] ZDNET article - correction! IS YOUR KID A HACKER? > Is your teen hacking the Pentagon instead of doing homework? > How to tell -- and how to handle it. Convicted hacker Kevin > Mitnick gives his views. NOTE! This article is by convicted hacker Kevin POULSEN. Not Kevin Mitnick. >http://www.zdnet.com/familypc/content/9810/columns/parental.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 10:16:29 EST From: Phoenxknt@aol.com Subject: Re: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... In response to you A) This is not my only ISP if you could even call it that (And if you notice, a main person on this list is an AOLer; BadGirlinLa) B) YOU try being a KID and having adults say you aren't worth shit and you won't amount to anything, or a teacher on your case because you're not perfect at writing IGAP (ISAT i believe it is now....for Illinois) persuasive papers C) I'm a student full time, my family life sucks, social life's non-existent. And i spell just fine - -Absolute Matter << in response to that, let me tell ya something. you go be an admin. for 12 hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or really care how you spell. ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer -z >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 10:21:08 EST From: Phoenxknt@aol.com Subject: Re: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a Cellmate... Lame Ass AOL User...that seems to be a pretty general statement about this "service". - -Absolute Matter << I say "lamer" not because he is an AoL user. Just because that is how is acting. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-mitnick@2600.com [mailto:owner-mitnick@2600.com]On Behalf Of > Zach Miller > Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 1998 2:07 PM > To: mitnick@2600.com > Subject: RE: [mitnick] My close encounter with Visiting KM, only as a > Cellmate... > > > At 12:33 AM 10/27/98 -0500, you wrote: > >in response to that, let me tell ya somethin. you go be an admin. for 12 > >hours, and program for another five. then tell me how well you spell, or > >really care how you spell. > > > >ps- at least i am not a lame ass AoL user. lamer > > >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 10:37:44 EST From: Bobwil623@aol.com Subject: [mitnick] knowledge is power england is often recognized as a "lieutenant" that acts as proxy for united states' political interests (see the noam chomsky archives at for more info in this regard). fbi attempts to enact legislation enabling comprehensive surveillance of digital information transactions have been periodically rebuffed in this country even as the fbi continues to intensify their efforts to get those capabilities enacted into federal law. kevin's case, sadly enough, is a pawn in this struggle; judge pfaelzer is a key player in this struggle (though i'm guessing she is unaware of/doesn't care about the larger political issues at stake in kevin's case) if her recent decisions to deny a bail *hearing* are any indication. article shown below demonstrates the method that fbi is attempting to use, and will likely succeed in implementing, in this country. suprisingly enough, the most important information is found in the last paragraph, and the most important sentence is the last sentence of the article. hmmm....i wonder if they know about the a.p. book of style.... knowledge is power, people -- "educate yourself, organize with like-minded people, and agitate for change" -- michael parenti -- from http://www.internet-magazine.com/news/oct/26a.htm >>UK users unhappy at proposed encryption legislation<< Civil liberty groups and Internet users are up in arms at the proposed provision that the Department of Trade & Industry (DTI) is intending to insert into planned legislation. The main points are that companies wanting to offer encrypted services including digital signatures will need to apply for a licence if they want their services to carry the full protection of the law. Those without a licence will have to prove in court that their signatures are as secure as licensed ones are presumed to be. The licence will require companies to use a trusted third party, Oftel, which will hold keys to user's encryption code. The UK Government has publicly stated that it wants to be able to access encrypted transmissions over the Internet for fear of abuse by criminals. Indeed, the DTI is planning to make it a criminal offence if a user is informed that their key has been handed over to the police. The government is very much going it alone after the EU declared that third-party systems are too unwieldy to be functional. As if to emphasise the point, encryption services licensed outside of the UK will not be recognised and signatures will be regarded under law as non-licensed. The DTI has said it will receive comments on the proposed legislation and will hold discussions with 'all interested parties' prior to passing legislation. However, the DTI is emphasising acceptance by the business community rather than the average user, who rights would seem to be under serious threat. Civil liberties groups are most concerned that only the recommendation of a senior police officer is required in order to get a user's key, not an order from the Home Office as is required for other forms of investigation; that user's are not allowed to know whether their key has been handed over to the police; and that the government is effectively forcing companies to use the licensing system by not offering the protection of the law to non-licensed encryption systems. Even users of personal systems such as PGP will be required to hand over either their PGP key or the plain text of messages upon police request. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 10:50:52 EST From: Bobwil623@aol.com Subject: [mitnick] knowledge is power #2 http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/98/10/biztech/articles/26privacy.html the nytimes is a subscription site only (free), but be sure to use an email address where you don't mind getting spam - they are proud of selling their email lists, and the address you give them will get a bunch of trash after you subscribe. note that i think you have to give a valid email address, cause that's where they send the password confirmation after subscribing.... links to their articles go dead around midnight of the day they're published on the web. the attached article is going to the list to compare with the article from internet world just submitted (subject line: "knowledge is power").... ("class, this is our compare and contrast exercise: examine the articles, talk amongst yawselves, and we'll get back together in 15 minutes. everyone ready? good! discuss...")... note, in particular, the 'graphs that begin/end with "!!!!" (emphasis added by moi). ==================== October 26, 1998 European Law Aims to Protect Privacy of Personal Data By EDMUND L. ANDREWS FRANKFURT, Germany -- The European Union put into effect a law Sunday prohibiting U.S.-style buying and selling of personal data, a move that could interrupt electronic commerce with the United States if the two sides fail to resolve deep philosophical and legal differences over protecting privacy. The goal of the European law is to prohibit companies from using information about their customers in ways the customers never intended -- for example, selling it to other companies for use as a marketing tool. The new law affects an enormous range of information that companies collect about people in the course of daily business, from credit-card transactions to magazine subscriptions to telephone records, as well as the electronic footprints that people leave when they visit sites on the World Wide Web. The law was adopted three years ago by the European Union after a majority of its 15 member nations agreed to issue what is known as a directive. Under European law, each member nation is required to implement the directive by enacting its own law. Six nations have drafted or passed such laws so far. Beyond its impact on Europe, the directive has the potential to disrupt electronic commerce with the United States. A key provision of the new measure would prohibit any company doing business in the European Union from transmitting personal data to any country that does not guarantee comparable privacy protection -- foremost among them, at this point, the United States. American direct-marketing companies, which make money buying, selling and developing business strategies based on huge data banks of personal information about consumers, have lobbied hard against government regulation of their industry. As a result, the Clinton administration has adopted a more laissez-faire approach under which data industries would be allowed to police themselves through self-regulatory organizations. U.S. officials say they agree with Europe on the basic principle that privacy should be protected but they have big differences about the best way to carry it out. "They have privacy czars and bureaucracies, and that kind of top-down approach would probably be regarded as a violation of privacy rights by many people in the U.S.," David Aaron, undersecretary of commerce, said of European nations. Aaron, who held talks on the issue with European officials in Brussels, Belgium, earlier this month, added, "We say, 'Let's create a situation where, if companies agree to follow certain data practices, they can be held harmless under the new directive."' If the issue, which neither side paid much attention to until a few months ago, is not resolved, European officials could theoretically soon begin to block trans-Atlantic data transfers by multinational corporations and the growing number of Internet companies. European officials say they have no plans for any blockades soon, and are hopeful about reaching a peaceful resolution. Officials from the United States and Europe say they held constructive positive discussions earlier this month. The European Commission has scheduled a meeting on the issue for Monday, and it is expected to seek some kind of temporary solution while the two sides negotiate. !!!!Underlying the debate is a deeper political issue that is fraught with cultural baggage. For years, European nations have been far tougher than the United States about protecting privacy. Many countries essentially ban telephone marketing to people's homes, and that prohibition is now being applied to unsolicited sales approaches by fax and e-mail.!!!! Several nations, including Germany and the Netherlands, have government agencies devoted exclusively to protecting personal data. Acting as ombudsmen, these agencies investigate complaints from individuals who believe that companies have mishandled information about them. Companies that are accused of violating privacy laws can be prosecuted under criminal laws. !!!!"There is a great difference in attitudes about privacy protection between Europe and the United States," said Ulrich Sieber, a law professor at the University of Wuertzburg in Germany.!!!! U.S. privacy laws are far more lax and consist of a hodgepodge of statutes and regulations enforced by various state and federal agencies charged with oversight of other industries, like, for instance, those that regulate banks. In sharp contrast with Europe, an entire industry has arisen in the United States that specializes in trolling public and private sources for vast quantities of personal information, like birth records, drivers' license numbers and torrents of data accumulated by retailers about customers' individual purchases. The new European directive embraces several basic principles that national governments must now translate into their own laws. It requires that companies tell people when they collect information about them and disclose how that information will be used. In addition, customers must provide informed consent before any company can legally use that data. The law also requires companies to give people access to information about themselves. !!!!U.S. officials say they agree with those requirements in principle, but disagree with giving people unconditional access to information about themselves, saying access should be allowed only if it is reasonable or practical to do so.!!!! The more difficult issues are enforcement and policing. Aaron says the United States wants to give companies a variety of "safe harbors" to satisfy privacy protection. One idea is to create independent self-regulatory organizations that would monitor a company's data practices and would give well-behaved companies what amounts to a stamp of approval. Another option, they say, should be for companies to deal directly with European officials and demonstrate that their systems and practices are appropriate. !!!!But legal experts say the new law could easily take on a life of its own, because it gives individuals and private organizations the right to sue companies that they say fail to provide adequate privacy protections.!!!! !!!!Industry and government officials worry that independent privacy advocates in Europe will simply invoke the letter of the law and begin taking U.S. companies to court.!!!! "I'm not sure the idea of creating safe harbors will be practical, because people can still go ahead and sue a company regardless of whether the governments reach an agreement among themselves," said Christopher Kuner, a lawyer in Frankfurt who specializes in European information law. In the short term, government and industry officials predict that nothing much will happen. Most countries have yet to implement their own laws to carry out the directive. And several countries, including Germany, have had tough laws in place for years, and companies have found ways to deal with the requirements. One of the pioneering cases in Germany involved Citibank, which ran afoul of German data-protection authorities in 1995. But since Citibank, which has a major business presence in Germany, demonstrated to government officials there how its system protected data in the United States, it has operated without conflicts. Executives of American Express Co. said they had reached similar agreements in many countries and that they believed they could live with the new directive. "It is a crucial issue for us, but it has not been a burden so far," said James Tobin, an American Express spokesman in London. John Borking, vice president of the Data Protection Authority of the Netherlands, said, "We are not information police, and I expect that in the whole of Europe nothing will happen." But, added Borking, European governments will always take privacy protection seriously. "We are at the beginning of a new information society, and no one really knows the outcome," he said. "But privacy and trust are important parts of this society." ------------------------------ End of mitnick-digest V1 #184 *****************************