[00:05.280 --> 00:06.320]  All right.
[00:07.980 --> 00:09.020]  Do we have audio?
[00:09.740 --> 00:11.120]  Do we have audio?
[00:11.280 --> 00:12.060]  Yes, we have audio.
[00:13.060 --> 00:15.320]  Give everybody a minute to settle down.
[00:15.560 --> 00:16.300]  Oh, they're popping.
[00:21.500 --> 00:25.140]  It's apple juice, that French Clicquot apple juice.
[00:25.400 --> 00:25.520]  Yeah.
[00:26.520 --> 00:27.580]  Yeah, top me off.
[00:28.240 --> 00:29.180]  Yeah, top me off.
[00:30.680 --> 00:31.100]  Thank you.
[00:32.820 --> 00:33.840]  But he's waiting.
[00:35.240 --> 00:36.880]  Oh, sorry, sir.
[00:37.780 --> 00:38.820]  Yeah, that's the idea.
[00:40.260 --> 00:42.660]  We're celebrating a group marriage anniversary.
[00:42.660 --> 00:43.720]  Can we get a hand, please?
[00:43.960 --> 00:44.200]  Thanks.
[00:46.100 --> 00:47.780]  We've all been married for six years.
[00:48.380 --> 00:50.000]  We all touch each other's buttons.
[00:50.000 --> 00:51.040]  It's amazing what you can do in West Virginia.
[00:55.880 --> 00:57.020]  They have two over there.
[00:57.140 --> 00:57.840]  Oh, they have two?
[00:58.620 --> 00:59.820]  They got two.
[01:01.880 --> 01:02.360]  Okay.
[01:02.640 --> 01:03.080]  All right.
[01:03.160 --> 01:03.560]  Introduce ourselves?
[01:03.820 --> 01:06.220]  Yeah, well, welcome to Building Hacker Spaces.
[01:06.400 --> 01:08.820]  I'm Count Zero from the Cult of the Dead Cow.
[01:10.040 --> 01:10.960]  Oh, thank you.
[01:11.640 --> 01:12.280]  Give it up.
[01:14.820 --> 01:21.480]  We have a really great lineup of people here from actually not only around the country in the United States, but around the world.
[01:21.980 --> 01:28.380]  And what we are hoping with this talk is to share some of our experiences with setting up real world hacker spaces.
[01:29.180 --> 01:37.180]  Basically, you know, physical spaces where a bunch of people pay rent and pile all their shit together, all their electronic gear, and work on projects.
[01:38.100 --> 01:41.140]  And, you know, just basically, you know, be themselves like Javaman.
[01:41.140 --> 01:41.840]  We keep it real.
[01:42.720 --> 01:47.360]  And what I want to do first is just go, because I think, where's Broadway Hacker?
[01:47.460 --> 01:48.000]  He's not here yet.
[01:48.500 --> 01:52.000]  We're going to go, we're going to, we're going to go down the line here.
[01:52.140 --> 01:54.360]  And I think everyone should introduce themselves real briefly.
[01:54.560 --> 02:01.000]  And then we have some slides to show you, you know, just to give you some details about what it takes to set up these spaces.
[02:01.120 --> 02:05.320]  We're not up here to tell you, you know, we set up these things and they're so great.
[02:05.720 --> 02:09.300]  We're here to share our experiences with you and to engage in a Q&A.
[02:09.500 --> 02:22.880]  So that if any of you out there are interested in getting a bunch of friends together and you want to set up a space, maybe, you know, get a dedicated network connection, work on projects, we want you to learn from the stuff that we've done and the mistakes that we've made,
[02:22.960 --> 02:25.720]  the fuck ups that we've done, and what goes wrong.
[02:25.840 --> 02:29.340]  Everyone loves stories like that, you know, how things, how things go wrong.
[02:29.560 --> 02:32.060]  So we're going to start on the left here.
[02:32.260 --> 02:33.620]  And I don't know if all these mics are working.
[02:34.640 --> 02:37.740]  I am, I'm Reverend Al from New Hack City East, New Hack City West.
[02:44.370 --> 02:46.390]  Hi, I'm Gweeds from New Hack City West.
[02:46.610 --> 02:46.970]  How's it going?
[02:47.830 --> 02:53.790]  Yeah, I'm Death Veggie, the Minister of Propaganda for Cult of the Dead Cow and a founding member of New Hack City East and New Hack City West.
[02:56.310 --> 02:57.450]  Thank you very much.
[02:58.070 --> 03:00.750]  Hi, I'm Javaman and I'm an alcoholic.
[03:07.600 --> 03:12.180]  I'm from Philadelphia Walnut Factory, which is a fucking A.
[03:12.560 --> 03:15.460]  And so, that's my thing.
[03:16.120 --> 03:17.960]  Bob Binary from Hasty Pastry.
[03:22.380 --> 03:24.220]  He's the quiet, he's the quiet one.
[03:25.120 --> 03:27.740]  Snarf Blatt from I Bleed for This.
[03:28.500 --> 03:31.280]  And I'm from the pizza space of Somerville, Mass.
[03:37.030 --> 03:41.370]  Hi, I'm Dr. Nick from the Philadelphia Walnut Factory and I am a drunk, not an alcoholic.
[03:42.130 --> 03:43.150]  Alcoholics go to meetings.
[03:45.070 --> 03:48.990]  Hey, I'm Shardy from Hacker Halfway House here in New York City.
[03:53.290 --> 03:55.870]  Hi, I'm Freak Out from Cult of the Dead Cow.
[03:56.130 --> 04:01.950]  I've done Hell, Phoenix Project, New Hack City East, New Hack City West, and the Hasty Pastry.
[04:05.840 --> 04:09.500]  Hi, I'm Mangala and I'm from Husky in Utrecht, the Netherlands.
[04:14.350 --> 04:15.390]  All right, cool.
[04:15.530 --> 04:17.030]  So, I'm going to start through a couple...
[04:17.230 --> 04:18.430]  I don't know.
[04:18.550 --> 04:19.630]  I'm the guy drinking on stage.
[04:20.350 --> 04:21.890]  I'm going to start through the slides now.
[04:23.410 --> 04:25.470]  The first up is the Walnut Factory.
[04:26.370 --> 04:26.770]  So...
[04:27.930 --> 04:28.670]  I'll take it.
[04:28.890 --> 04:29.450]  Just take it.
[04:30.650 --> 04:33.290]  So, yeah, I just want to run through some pictures of the Walnut Factory.
[04:33.290 --> 04:36.090]  This is a little bit washed out, but basically, you can see the shithole that we live in.
[04:37.190 --> 04:49.430]  Basically, we rent a little room in a factory, and we have a couch in there, a rack full of junk, and we have a network rack, and we have a 36-inch TV with video games hooked up to it.
[04:50.030 --> 04:50.430]  And...
[04:52.450 --> 04:53.410]  Oh, God almighty.
[04:56.030 --> 05:02.650]  So, here is our rack, and this machine, that is ghetto.org right there.
[05:02.650 --> 05:05.570]  So, if anyone ever wondered what it looked like, that's it.
[05:06.070 --> 05:06.510]  Looks ghetto.
[05:06.770 --> 05:07.330]  Looks ghetto.
[05:07.570 --> 05:09.210]  It is a dual P-Pro 200.
[05:09.490 --> 05:10.470]  It's blazing fast.
[05:11.430 --> 05:13.230]  But this is kind of like what we work in.
[05:13.350 --> 05:14.650]  That's our network area.
[05:14.790 --> 05:18.650]  And we have just a general workshop of spare hardware laying around.
[05:19.230 --> 05:21.090]  Anything that we need, we pretty much have in-house.
[05:21.650 --> 05:25.010]  Mostly trash-picked or decommissioned from other locations.
[05:25.730 --> 05:27.490]  This is what the space looked like while it was empty.
[05:28.370 --> 05:32.290]  On the left is our landlord, Steve, and some people on the right.
[05:33.350 --> 05:34.990]  And this is a view from the roof.
[05:35.610 --> 05:36.750]  So, yay, Philadelphia.
[05:37.590 --> 05:39.530]  And here's the most critical things.
[05:39.710 --> 05:41.450]  This is the statistics for us.
[05:42.030 --> 05:46.810]  It's about $100 per person per month to run this.
[05:47.930 --> 05:49.010]  It's about...
[05:49.010 --> 05:49.510]  How many people?
[05:50.350 --> 05:56.390]  We have eight, over eight members, and six people are reliable for cash every month.
[05:56.850 --> 05:59.530]  And it's very important to distinguish between the two people.
[05:59.690 --> 06:00.170]  There's two things.
[06:00.290 --> 06:06.550]  There are six people who will always give us money, and sometimes those people are late, sometimes they're not, not because they intend to be.
[06:06.770 --> 06:08.490]  But everyone's got to mention the same thing.
[06:08.590 --> 06:12.030]  Our bandwidth is provided by Dr. Nick of Dr. Nick's Bandwidth Service.
[06:12.890 --> 06:13.310]  Yes.
[06:14.530 --> 06:15.370]  Netaccess.com.
[06:15.490 --> 06:17.370]  Yeah, it's from netaccess.com.
[06:18.010 --> 06:25.070]  And our core projects, mostly internal maintenance right now, doing ghetto colo work and supporting some artists that are involved in the local art community.
[06:25.810 --> 06:29.110]  Our core problems, I'll be dead honest with you, is organization, we're very poorly organized.
[06:29.430 --> 06:32.110]  We have a hard time getting people off their ass to do things.
[06:33.130 --> 06:34.630]  And that's all of our own...
[06:34.630 --> 06:34.790]  Funny how it works.
[06:34.790 --> 06:35.670]  Yeah, it's funny how it works.
[06:35.770 --> 06:36.610]  It's all of our own faults.
[06:36.730 --> 06:40.610]  And so we kind of had to start out with these very high expectations of what we wanted to do.
[06:40.750 --> 06:45.190]  And we had to ratchet down those expectations over time after we realized what people's free time actually was.
[06:45.190 --> 06:49.150]  So let me turn it over to the Hasty Pastry crew.
[06:51.170 --> 06:53.050]  Do you want to stand at the podium?
[06:53.230 --> 06:54.310]  You can stand at the podium.
[06:54.430 --> 06:54.590]  Sure.
[06:58.550 --> 06:59.850]  Why do you call it the Hasty Pastry?
[07:00.350 --> 07:02.530]  Well, it used to be a...
[07:03.130 --> 07:10.490]  It used to be a bakery, and that bakery apparently was not licensed to be a bakery.
[07:11.450 --> 07:12.890]  It was a renegade bakery.
[07:13.030 --> 07:13.990]  It was licensed to be a self-service...
[07:13.990 --> 07:14.810]  Rogue Bakery.
[07:15.350 --> 07:18.430]  And it had actually been in operation for as much as 10 years.
[07:18.870 --> 07:20.630]  And, I mean, they even changed...
[07:20.630 --> 07:24.550]  I mean, they changed the whole place and put in ovens and a walk-in refrigerator.
[07:24.830 --> 07:26.110]  Had been there 10 years.
[07:26.350 --> 07:29.690]  And finally the city realized that they weren't supposed to be there.
[07:29.790 --> 07:32.410]  And, you know, they lost their license.
[07:32.410 --> 07:39.850]  And we decided that instead of, like, having a, you know, sort of cyber tech name, we'd go with Hasty Pastry.
[07:40.510 --> 07:42.390]  And that's a sexy binary there.
[07:42.630 --> 07:45.270]  The URL is hastypastry.net.
[07:45.270 --> 07:47.330]  If you want to look at the website, too.
[07:48.970 --> 07:51.230]  So, here we have the Hasty Pastry.
[07:51.710 --> 07:54.310]  That's our electronics workbench.
[07:58.050 --> 08:01.690]  We've got...Maya's working on the Sunrise Linux distribution.
[08:02.350 --> 08:05.350]  We've got another workstation here that's mine.
[08:07.570 --> 08:08.770]  That's where they keep you when you're bad.
[08:09.050 --> 08:10.470]  That's the hole into the basement.
[08:10.710 --> 08:11.810]  We have a little trap door.
[08:12.490 --> 08:13.410]  That's where they keep the gimp.
[08:15.630 --> 08:17.250]  That's where we keep the gimp.
[08:17.570 --> 08:18.550]  Yeah, he cracks the pattern.
[08:18.570 --> 08:21.790]  This is our idea of, you know, colo space.
[08:22.810 --> 08:24.070]  This looks very familiar.
[08:24.070 --> 08:27.270]  In every hackerspace, you'll see duct tape on the colo.
[08:28.030 --> 08:29.290]  Dude, that's not even duct tape.
[08:29.390 --> 08:30.110]  That's masking tape.
[08:30.690 --> 08:31.170]  Sorry.
[08:31.650 --> 08:32.010]  Yeah.
[08:32.290 --> 08:33.590]  What the hell kind of joint are you running?
[08:35.410 --> 08:36.410]  That's Mini Moose.
[08:36.970 --> 08:37.870]  Oblacetory Zim.
[08:38.150 --> 08:38.870]  Zim reference.
[08:39.330 --> 08:40.650]  Invader Zim reference there.
[08:41.470 --> 08:42.890]  Yeah, that's what I'm talking about.
[08:44.190 --> 08:46.150]  Here's the front area of the space.
[08:46.370 --> 08:55.770]  One of the things I learned with NewHack was it was just very good to sort of split, here's your fun area, here's your project, work space.
[08:56.790 --> 08:57.950]  You know, keep them separate.
[08:58.930 --> 09:03.230]  There's an LCD projector there, too, so if we're watching movies and a pay phone that works.
[09:03.770 --> 09:07.070]  And then the Lady of the VAX held over from the L0phft.
[09:07.170 --> 09:09.430]  All people pay reverence to the Lady of the VAX, please.
[09:09.430 --> 09:10.370]  The infamous L0pht.
[09:13.590 --> 09:16.270]  Also obligatory, you know, cow reference.
[09:16.450 --> 09:17.230]  Oh, dude, you skipped ahead.
[09:20.030 --> 09:20.990]  Oh, back up.
[09:21.170 --> 09:21.670]  The back arrow.
[09:21.810 --> 09:22.550]  The back arrow.
[09:23.530 --> 09:23.630]  The back arrow.
[09:23.630 --> 09:23.950]  Corp.
[09:25.490 --> 09:29.570]  Oh, you ruined Christmas.
[09:30.050 --> 09:31.290]  It's a Macintosh.
[09:31.770 --> 09:33.370]  It's a Macintosh, that's the problem.
[09:33.650 --> 09:34.090]  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[09:34.090 --> 09:39.210]  See, we don't understand, we don't understand what's it called, PowerPoint.
[09:39.410 --> 09:39.770]  Wait, do you guys still have the...
[09:39.770 --> 09:40.630]  Where's Brian Oblivion?
[09:41.230 --> 09:41.950]  Good question.
[09:42.110 --> 09:42.590]  He knows Mac.
[09:43.130 --> 09:45.310]  So, anyways, there's another shot of the space.
[09:45.450 --> 09:46.690]  You got the lady there.
[09:47.470 --> 09:51.010]  The area over by that wall down there is down at the basement.
[09:51.450 --> 09:51.930]  Where's Kalchuk?
[09:52.970 --> 09:54.890]  I guess there was no picture of Kalchuk.
[09:55.050 --> 09:55.290]  Oh.
[09:55.610 --> 09:55.890]  No.
[09:56.310 --> 09:56.470]  Ooh.
[09:56.590 --> 09:57.110]  No, I didn't.
[09:57.250 --> 09:58.090]  Dude, I'm sorry.
[09:58.370 --> 09:58.730]  Kalchuk!
[09:58.810 --> 10:00.030]  Yeah, why don't you tell us about Kalchuk?
[10:00.390 --> 10:01.330]  Kalchuk is the...
[10:01.330 --> 10:02.390]  I should have brought Kalchuk.
[10:02.550 --> 10:03.950]  Well, Kalchuk can't be photographed.
[10:03.950 --> 10:05.670]  This image will not show up on film.
[10:06.270 --> 10:08.690]  Kalchuk is the embodiment of fear of the elite.
[10:10.150 --> 10:22.370]  So, you ever have that experience where, you know, at 2600, I mean, there's that group of, you know, elite people, and then there's sort of like you got your new people, and they want to approach the elite, but they can't.
[10:22.930 --> 10:24.010]  They can't go over there.
[10:24.130 --> 10:26.270]  They might have some kind of question, but they can't make it over there.
[10:26.850 --> 10:28.630]  That's the spirit of Kalchuk.
[10:29.470 --> 10:31.550]  He sacrifices chickens and stuff to this thing.
[10:31.550 --> 10:32.290]  It's really weird.
[10:33.050 --> 10:33.790]  I don't know.
[10:34.390 --> 10:38.730]  Every hackerspace has a shrine with some sort of religious thing to it.
[10:38.730 --> 10:40.350]  Like a cement bust of Mr. T, for instance?
[10:40.550 --> 10:41.210]  Yeah, or Kalchuk.
[10:42.110 --> 10:43.870]  Here's the AHP stats.
[10:44.350 --> 10:49.670]  We have, you know, six regular contributors and pay between 150 and 200.
[10:50.670 --> 10:55.170]  I recommend not paying anything more than 200 a person.
[10:55.210 --> 10:57.110]  I don't care how much you make, you know.
[10:59.350 --> 11:00.650]  Previously, we've...
[11:00.650 --> 11:01.490]  Go back to Russia.
[11:01.490 --> 11:05.670]  We've paid more, and it's just not right.
[11:05.930 --> 11:11.430]  But we have T1 through our co-op ISP, which binary we'll talk about later.
[11:12.490 --> 11:13.450]  Core projects.
[11:14.010 --> 11:18.230]  You know, one of the things about spaces is you will end up...
[11:18.230 --> 11:31.850]  The space is supposed to be there to help you, you know, do all these different research projects and get together and organize, and you end up spending so much time just working on the environment and getting it to a state that you can work on it.
[11:32.210 --> 11:32.630]  Amen.
[11:34.690 --> 11:44.230]  We work on, you know, the Sunrise Linux, some co-location, the Sonic Beating, sort of a Psytrance dance.
[11:44.590 --> 11:46.870]  That's Binary's website.
[11:47.010 --> 11:49.030]  Homemade 15,000-watt PA.
[11:49.810 --> 11:52.370]  And various, you know, sort of CDC-related projects.
[11:53.190 --> 12:04.410]  This space, compared to, you know, other spaces, you know, I've dealt with, very, you know, cramped for the number of people and number, like, you know, the equipment we have and the projects we have going on.
[12:07.670 --> 12:08.390]  Mark, you take me?
[12:08.530 --> 12:08.910]  Yeah, sure.
[12:09.070 --> 12:10.950]  So, the next group is New Hack City.
[12:11.870 --> 12:14.810]  Well, I'd like to say that New Hack City was founded in, what, 1995?
[12:14.810 --> 12:22.370]  Yeah, New Hack City was originally a house in Alston, Massachusetts, which these guys lived at.
[12:22.670 --> 12:25.150]  It was a hacker house with no...
[12:25.150 --> 12:27.030]  Actually, do you want to talk a little bit about the old New Hack City?
[12:27.250 --> 12:28.510]  I don't know what else you can say.
[12:28.630 --> 12:29.210]  It was a hacker house.
[12:29.210 --> 12:29.750]  Well, there was no basement.
[12:29.870 --> 12:30.110]  I was there.
[12:30.290 --> 12:30.910]  Freak Out was there.
[12:31.150 --> 12:32.050]  Silicosis was there.
[12:32.250 --> 12:33.550]  Tweedy Fish from CDC was there.
[12:34.010 --> 12:34.630]  Various other people.
[12:34.730 --> 12:43.730]  And basically, it was sort of developed as a place to take in sort of refugees from other hacker houses and hacker-related houses that had fallen apart for various reasons.
[12:43.730 --> 12:45.270]  Being evicted, etc.
[12:46.070 --> 12:48.950]  But it was nice in that, when we moved into the house, it had...
[12:48.950 --> 12:51.550]  Yes, the basement was kitty litter and sewage.
[12:52.870 --> 12:58.870]  And the landlord, a crazy Israeli guy, was nice enough to basically say, if you pay for the... if you do the...
[12:58.870 --> 12:58.930]  What?
[12:59.590 --> 12:59.850]  Half.
[13:00.130 --> 13:10.490]  Yeah, he basically went halves and fixed up the basement, you know, put in a cement floor, wired it all up, insulated it, and turned it into a sweet hacking space, you know, project space.
[13:10.930 --> 13:12.470]  We painted...
[13:12.470 --> 13:13.490]  We painted the...
[13:13.490 --> 13:13.870]  Talking to the mic.
[13:14.010 --> 13:14.530]  Talking to the mic.
[13:14.530 --> 13:14.690]  Talking to the mic, bro.
[13:15.370 --> 13:18.690]  We painted the floor circuit board green and...
[13:18.690 --> 13:19.070]  With gold.
[13:19.410 --> 13:20.650]  With traces all along it.
[13:20.790 --> 13:22.510]  We built our own benches.
[13:23.190 --> 13:30.370]  We had, you know, a number-like machines that were hanging from chains in the wall, which, you know, cleared up our desk space.
[13:31.490 --> 13:42.610]  So our original plan was to actually leave a space in the cement so we could put hard drives in it, so if the feds ever came, we could have stuff mounted in cement, but we didn't actually get around to do that.
[13:42.790 --> 13:43.010]  Yeah.
[13:43.530 --> 13:43.590]  Yeah.
[13:44.350 --> 13:47.990]  He jokes, but we were actually very concerned about those types of things during those days.
[13:48.370 --> 13:48.450]  Yeah.
[13:48.510 --> 13:49.130]  Well, yeah, yeah.
[13:49.130 --> 13:51.190]  After, after euphoria, kind of...
[13:51.190 --> 13:53.990]  Yeah, well, what's your story about when you went back and they said the FBI?
[13:54.090 --> 13:55.310]  Yeah, so I actually visited...
[13:55.310 --> 13:56.370]  This is after New Hack...
[13:56.370 --> 14:01.370]  There's two things, New Hack City East, which is this hacker house, and New Hack City West, which no one was supposed to live in.
[14:01.390 --> 14:02.650]  We all packed up and moved to California.
[14:02.650 --> 14:17.490]  So everyone moved to California to follow the dot com gold, and some of us, me and Rosie Rive, went back and explored the New Hack City East, and the people who lived there hadn't been in the basement at all because there was no electricity, so they hadn't... there was still a bunch of computers and bullshit in the basement.
[14:17.630 --> 14:18.350]  And a fire hydrant.
[14:18.590 --> 14:19.970]  Still running, which was pretty cool.
[14:21.470 --> 14:22.730]  Yeah, it was pretty tight.
[14:22.990 --> 14:36.050]  So then everyone went to the west coast and followed the dot com gold, and everyone had these nice jobs where we could afford $300 a month to throw in a bunch of money for a bandwidth colo and space for parties and stuff like that.
[14:36.190 --> 14:42.550]  And I don't know if any of you have been to California very much, but everyone likes ecstasy and raves and lots of crazy music and shit like that.
[14:42.830 --> 14:43.190]  Yeah, everyone.
[14:43.190 --> 14:45.330]  So we did a lot of that, and it was pretty fun.
[14:47.250 --> 14:48.050]  A lot of fun.
[14:48.150 --> 14:49.210]  I can't remember a lot of it.
[14:51.070 --> 14:52.430]  Can you get back to the visit?
[14:52.430 --> 14:54.150]  I remember you without any pants on.
[14:54.310 --> 14:54.610]  Does that count?
[14:54.850 --> 14:55.390]  Yeah, the visit.
[14:55.770 --> 14:56.310]  So, what?
[14:57.410 --> 14:58.170]  What do you mean the visit?
[14:58.290 --> 14:58.690]  The slide.
[14:59.010 --> 15:05.450]  I think that the first big difference between New Hack City East and New Hack City West was New Hack City West had a hot tub, which I think pretty much...
[15:05.690 --> 15:06.970]  Basically, we found a...
[15:06.970 --> 15:07.970]  Actually, Chuck found...
[15:07.970 --> 15:09.050]  Chuck, the architect, who was in here.
[15:09.210 --> 15:09.990]  God bless his soul.
[15:10.110 --> 15:10.790]  Here's a little champagne.
[15:12.070 --> 15:13.070]  The brothers didn't make it.
[15:13.330 --> 15:15.110]  They found a hot tub in the...
[15:15.110 --> 15:17.230]  You know, this is California, so it's actually part of the building code.
[15:17.330 --> 15:19.970]  That you have to build a hot tub into any space that you're building into.
[15:21.510 --> 15:22.770]  So, we had a hot tub.
[15:22.890 --> 15:25.070]  We had a big old deck and a lot of parties and stuff like that.
[15:25.150 --> 15:28.170]  We're able to raise a lot of money through those kinds of things, like a lot of goodwill.
[15:28.330 --> 15:31.110]  And we did a lot of presentations like GSM cracking and stuff like that.
[15:31.190 --> 15:36.310]  People would do like press conferences from there and try to host a lot of stuff and host a lot of stuff on our servers.
[15:36.850 --> 15:38.170]  We did a lot of media work too.
[15:38.430 --> 15:39.510]  Yeah, I think...
[15:39.510 --> 15:40.630]  I call it media outreach.
[15:40.870 --> 15:42.070]  Yeah, it was a lot of media work.
[15:42.210 --> 15:42.610]  We did...
[15:42.610 --> 15:45.210]  The original Back Orifice?
[15:45.210 --> 15:45.970]  The first launch was from there.
[15:46.430 --> 15:46.750]  Also...
[15:46.750 --> 15:47.250]  Focus.
[15:47.910 --> 15:48.230]  Focus.
[15:48.550 --> 15:48.770]  Oh, yeah.
[15:48.930 --> 15:49.070]  Sorry.
[15:50.890 --> 15:52.090]  I kind of am going about that.
[15:52.210 --> 15:55.490]  We had maybe 10 core people and maybe 20 or 30 people in the whole community.
[15:55.610 --> 15:59.690]  And New Hack City West went on for about 1997 when we first got the place.
[15:59.770 --> 16:00.570]  And we moved to another space.
[16:00.670 --> 16:03.830]  We got kicked out of this one building because we kept on breaking into the building.
[16:03.930 --> 16:04.690]  Well, they only gave us two keys.
[16:04.930 --> 16:08.930]  They gave us two Medeco keys, which cost like $50 to replicate because it's like that angle cut.
[16:09.110 --> 16:10.950]  But we figured out we could just pry the door open.
[16:10.950 --> 16:13.330]  We just kind of broke the lock on the building and they kept on going in.
[16:13.990 --> 16:15.750]  Yeah, it was a pretty tight building.
[16:16.030 --> 16:21.290]  So then we moved into the ghetto of Sixth and Market, which is like a lot of people pissing and shitting on the sidewalks out top.
[16:22.110 --> 16:22.510]  And...
[16:22.510 --> 16:25.490]  I actually had people trying to hide behind me to smoke crack.
[16:26.290 --> 16:27.670]  I was like...
[16:27.670 --> 16:29.390]  I was like, uh...
[16:29.390 --> 16:32.690]  That actually got to count towards Veggie's community service hours for parole.
[16:33.070 --> 16:34.570]  Just like helping the crack people.
[16:34.890 --> 16:36.550]  So we had a lot of...
[16:36.550 --> 16:37.410]  We had some projects.
[16:37.510 --> 16:38.990]  We had some software and some hardware projects.
[16:39.230 --> 16:40.330]  We built a lot of walls.
[16:40.510 --> 16:42.910]  One of the main architects is this guy named Chuck, Charlie Rhodes.
[16:42.910 --> 16:43.790]  Chuck can do anything.
[16:44.070 --> 16:45.410]  He's a CDC guy, Chuck from CDC.
[16:45.670 --> 16:46.630]  Really amazing architect.
[16:46.930 --> 16:49.550]  And we built a lot of walls and that was pretty awesome.
[16:49.730 --> 16:53.650]  The space we moved into the second time was formerly a...
[16:53.650 --> 16:54.330]  Sweatshop.
[16:54.530 --> 16:55.970]  Sweatshop for sewing people.
[16:56.150 --> 17:00.750]  So like 30 Asian women would crowd into it for about 13 hours a day.
[17:00.890 --> 17:02.410]  That sounds so completely unfamiliar.
[17:02.630 --> 17:03.170]  What do you think, Nick?
[17:03.630 --> 17:05.350]  Yeah, they would sew mittens and stuff like that.
[17:05.470 --> 17:05.750]  It was pretty tight.
[17:05.750 --> 17:07.110]  What it meant, it was already...
[17:07.110 --> 17:07.830]  It had power.
[17:07.990 --> 17:09.250]  The power requirements that we needed.
[17:09.270 --> 17:09.450]  Yeah, the power was really nice.
[17:09.470 --> 17:11.110]  And it had the cooling requirements that we needed.
[17:11.410 --> 17:11.550]  Yeah.
[17:11.550 --> 17:11.710]  All right.
[17:11.770 --> 17:16.150]  So the last thing I'm gonna say is that because it was an offline hacker scene, it was a big social scene.
[17:16.250 --> 17:16.930]  The parties are all the time.
[17:17.010 --> 17:21.570]  It definitely had the offline problems, which is everyone partied together, slept together, and had a lot of drama together.
[17:21.870 --> 17:21.930]  Yeah.
[17:21.990 --> 17:26.510]  Everyone slept with each other's girlfriends and it pretty much fucking collapsed and everyone ran out of money.
[17:26.950 --> 17:27.510]  Oh, there we go.
[17:29.130 --> 17:29.490]  Yeah.
[17:30.810 --> 17:31.170]  Yeah.
[17:31.850 --> 17:31.990]  Yeah.
[17:31.990 --> 17:32.010]  Yeah.
[17:32.010 --> 17:32.530]  And that's it.
[17:32.870 --> 17:37.170]  And pretty much just like the last, the end.
[17:37.530 --> 17:37.670]  Yeah.
[17:38.350 --> 17:39.630]  Is there any more champagne over there?
[17:40.370 --> 17:41.010]  I'm sorry.
[17:41.070 --> 17:42.370]  Is there any more sparkling apple juice?
[17:42.410 --> 17:43.210]  There's more sparkling apple juice over here.
[17:43.410 --> 17:43.810]  Thank you.
[17:44.670 --> 17:46.510]  That was a good way to get him to stop talking, wasn't it?
[17:46.630 --> 17:46.790]  Yeah.
[17:46.990 --> 17:47.270]  It's nice.
[17:48.090 --> 17:48.830]  You guys are talking fast enough.
[17:48.850 --> 17:50.490]  I'm gonna talk about the original loft.
[17:50.670 --> 17:52.510]  This is the original server...
[17:52.510 --> 17:53.050]  No, I'm kidding.
[17:53.050 --> 17:57.730]  This is actually shortwave radio out in California that I was working on.
[17:58.010 --> 18:01.950]  But the original loft was founded by...
[18:01.950 --> 18:05.470]  Basically, it was me and Brian Oblivion way back in 1992.
[18:05.730 --> 18:10.450]  And it was a space in the south end of Boston in the...
[18:10.450 --> 18:13.350]  It was in a building that used to be like a factory.
[18:13.790 --> 18:19.510]  So there was like, you know, the oil-soaked floors, which is really nice for like fire hazard stuff.
[18:19.830 --> 18:22.610]  And it started back in 1992.
[18:22.610 --> 18:23.310]  Piano factory?
[18:23.770 --> 18:23.850]  Yeah.
[18:24.030 --> 18:25.110]  And I was looking for old pictures.
[18:25.270 --> 18:33.770]  And like the only ones I could find were like these old 640x480 GIFs that I had as an advertisement for the BBS ATDT, which was...
[18:33.770 --> 18:34.710]  Is there a...
[18:34.710 --> 18:36.850]  Has everyone here heard of the loft, by the way?
[18:37.490 --> 18:38.430]  The original loft?
[18:38.450 --> 18:38.590]  Yeah.
[18:38.590 --> 18:39.870]  Let's give a little hand up for the lofts.
[18:40.010 --> 18:40.210]  Woo!
[18:40.370 --> 18:42.650]  That is the weakest response I ever heard.
[18:42.730 --> 18:43.170]  Come on!
[18:46.090 --> 18:48.890]  The loft has a long and really great history.
[18:48.890 --> 18:54.070]  I mean, it started out, you know, basically it was just space for us to store crap.
[18:54.270 --> 18:55.510]  And this is an original picture.
[18:55.590 --> 18:57.730]  That's Brian Oblivion back when he used to wear a hat.
[18:57.850 --> 18:59.430]  He wore that hat everywhere all the time.
[18:59.430 --> 18:59.750]  All the time.
[18:59.850 --> 19:04.310]  We wondered like if he had a plate in his head or something wrong with his head because he always had that hat.
[19:04.310 --> 19:11.290]  And at the bottom it says, Adventures at the loft, home of ATDT, 617-350-STIF.
[19:11.450 --> 19:12.670]  That was our dial-up number.
[19:12.790 --> 19:14.070]  Do you have any pictures of the VAX'in?
[19:14.250 --> 19:15.310]  Oh, the VAX'in are coming.
[19:15.450 --> 19:17.810]  So this is just an example of the initial...
[19:17.810 --> 19:18.270]  This is...
[19:18.270 --> 19:19.190]  Think back in 1992.
[19:19.450 --> 19:21.670]  Sherman set the Wayback Machine to 1992.
[19:22.430 --> 19:29.470]  And all we were primarily concerned with initially was basically getting together manuals, getting together printed material and hardware.
[19:29.610 --> 19:30.750]  That was our main focus.
[19:30.910 --> 19:36.050]  So this is a picture of us with a U-Haul with a ton of manuals, literally a truckload of manuals.
[19:37.030 --> 19:40.290]  There's Brian Oblivion with his book, Zen and the Art of Codes.
[19:40.590 --> 19:41.710]  He looks so young.
[19:42.270 --> 19:42.770]  He looks...
[19:42.770 --> 19:44.290]  Weren't we all so young back then?
[19:44.510 --> 19:44.850]  Yes.
[19:45.810 --> 19:47.410]  And they're the VAX'in.
[19:47.910 --> 19:48.070]  Yeah.
[19:48.270 --> 19:49.250]  We actually...
[19:49.250 --> 19:50.450]  Our wildlife photographers...
[19:50.450 --> 19:52.030]  What we would do was...
[19:52.030 --> 19:57.710]  We would look for people, like primarily academic institutions, that were upgrading their mainframe hardware.
[19:57.930 --> 19:58.870]  And we would just like...
[19:58.870 --> 20:05.050]  Basically we would put out, you know, on Usenet like things saying basically like, if you come with a truck, you can take it, please.
[20:05.290 --> 20:06.050]  Because we...
[20:06.050 --> 20:07.310]  It weighs 2,000 pounds.
[20:07.610 --> 20:08.290]  So we would...
[20:08.290 --> 20:09.110]  We would like, yeah, sure.
[20:09.230 --> 20:10.770]  We'll rent a U-Haul and we'll bring it in the loft.
[20:11.150 --> 20:12.070]  And these are the...
[20:12.070 --> 20:12.970]  These are the VAX'in.
[20:13.090 --> 20:19.610]  It says our wildlife photographer spots the VAX'in grazing peacefully in a shaded grove of buildings.
[20:20.590 --> 20:22.450]  Do you have a picture of Jack the crack smoker?
[20:22.450 --> 20:23.670]  No, but I'm gonna explain.
[20:23.810 --> 20:25.490]  That's one of the problems we had with the original loft.
[20:25.770 --> 20:26.170]  But...
[20:26.170 --> 20:27.350]  So anyway...
[20:28.030 --> 20:28.430]  Um...
[20:28.430 --> 20:28.950]  Back it up.
[20:29.130 --> 20:29.830]  So there it is.
[20:29.870 --> 20:33.870]  You can see a VAX 11/750 in an unnatural habitat.
[20:35.150 --> 20:35.550]  Yeah.
[20:36.490 --> 20:40.250]  We set all these bad boys up and we carried them up a flight of stairs.
[20:41.050 --> 20:42.170]  And I still...
[20:42.170 --> 20:42.470]  Yeah, that...
[20:42.470 --> 20:42.950]  That sucked.
[20:43.150 --> 20:45.050]  My knees remember it every time it rains.
[20:45.350 --> 20:45.970]  Oh, it's wonderful.
[20:46.590 --> 20:46.990]  There's...
[20:46.990 --> 20:47.730]  There's a little pullback.
[20:47.850 --> 20:51.650]  You see like, you've got like the pillows because we were trying to keep them from bouncing around too much.
[20:51.650 --> 20:57.650]  I remember riding back in a truck with Oblivion back from New Jersey picking up these babies and like they're rolling around in the back.
[20:58.310 --> 21:01.710]  And I said like, gee, wouldn't it be needed like if we got killed by a computer?
[21:04.090 --> 21:05.830]  So anyway, that was...
[21:05.830 --> 21:08.650]  So this is sort of a summary of like, you know, initially...
[21:09.690 --> 21:11.090]  It was just a space...
[21:11.090 --> 21:12.070]  You know, this is back in 1992.
[21:12.430 --> 21:15.830]  So, you know, it was about 100, 150 monies per member.
[21:15.970 --> 21:17.310]  There were probably about five of us.
[21:17.450 --> 21:19.190]  And there were additional people that grew over time.
[21:19.190 --> 21:21.110]  You know, our bandwidth cost...
[21:21.110 --> 21:22.090]  It was dial-up.
[21:22.310 --> 21:22.570]  Yeah.
[21:23.610 --> 21:24.050]  V34.
[21:24.610 --> 21:25.970]  Wait, then didn't you get a...
[21:25.970 --> 21:27.330]  Didn't you get a lease line 56K?
[21:27.550 --> 21:28.110]  Uh, no.
[21:28.330 --> 21:28.650]  I mean, I...
[21:28.650 --> 21:29.430]  Well, that was later.
[21:29.590 --> 21:36.370]  But initially, it was funny too because, um, you know, our initial contributors members, six people, core projects.
[21:36.550 --> 21:42.730]  All we were concerned about was just like getting our computers fucking connected to each other and somehow magically getting it connected to the internet.
[21:42.730 --> 21:43.290]  Playing network doom.
[21:43.290 --> 21:44.650]  And it was initially...
[21:44.650 --> 21:52.190]  The initial thing that started us really getting serious about getting our computers networked over coax, 10 base 2, was doom came out.
[21:52.450 --> 21:53.070]  And that was...
[21:53.550 --> 21:54.930]  That was the driving force.
[21:54.930 --> 21:55.150]  Give us some sugar.
[21:56.550 --> 21:58.430]  Basically, it was, uh...
[21:58.430 --> 22:02.230]  It was, you know, we wanted to be able to blast the hell out of each other with rockets.
[22:02.750 --> 22:05.290]  And, um, and so our core projects...
[22:05.290 --> 22:06.410]  Remember, this is 10 over...
[22:06.410 --> 22:07.190]  Like, 12 years ago.
[22:07.310 --> 22:10.270]  It was really just internal networking and hardware acquisition.
[22:10.690 --> 22:13.750]  And, uh, the core problems eventually, well, you know, it's not really a problem.
[22:13.910 --> 22:17.710]  I mean, spaces evolve over time and that's one of the things you have to realize when you start a space.
[22:18.010 --> 22:18.710]  Initially, it was a...
[22:18.710 --> 22:23.230]  It was very much sort of a communal, kind of, communistic, socialist kind of environment.
[22:23.430 --> 22:27.890]  We just wanted to get together and have fun and, you know, watch videos and do cool projects.
[22:28.150 --> 22:29.570]  And eventually, commercial...
[22:29.570 --> 22:31.310]  And people were interested in taking things more commercial.
[22:31.470 --> 22:31.910]  And that was cool.
[22:32.030 --> 22:33.030]  It evolved over time.
[22:33.490 --> 22:35.490]  Um, but it's important to remember those kinds of things.
[22:35.570 --> 22:38.510]  When you set up a space, and I remember, um...
[22:38.510 --> 22:44.010]  You know, just realizing at the moment when it sort of started changing to become more commercial, everything evolves over time.
[22:44.150 --> 22:46.190]  So you can't expect what you set up to be frozen.
[22:46.890 --> 22:47.610]  It's gonna evolve.
[22:47.710 --> 22:49.310]  And the other problem we had was crack, actually.
[22:49.430 --> 22:50.210]  That was a real problem.
[22:50.790 --> 22:54.350]  We had people smoking crack on the loading dock outside in front of the space.
[22:55.170 --> 23:01.150]  And we actually took some pictures and we had some, if anyone has these old stickers from some previous hopes.
[23:01.470 --> 23:03.230]  I actually found a big stash of those right before I came.
[23:03.230 --> 23:07.830]  Yeah, and our motto was, the loft, more fun than a pipe full of crack.
[23:08.670 --> 23:08.990]  Zero.
[23:09.190 --> 23:10.750]  And we had a picture of someone lighting up.
[23:10.870 --> 23:11.150]  It was great.
[23:11.370 --> 23:11.610]  Zero.
[23:11.670 --> 23:14.110]  What about that VCR that was up near the front of the door?
[23:14.650 --> 23:15.430]  Do you know what I'm talking about at all?
[23:15.490 --> 23:15.730]  The what?
[23:15.810 --> 23:16.310]  The VCR?
[23:16.530 --> 23:17.470]  The VCR that got stolen.
[23:17.530 --> 23:18.250]  The broken VCR.
[23:18.370 --> 23:20.170]  Oh, we had people who broke into it too.
[23:20.410 --> 23:20.530]  Yeah.
[23:20.670 --> 23:22.430]  And people like, took all of us cell...
[23:22.430 --> 23:23.670]  They took all our cell phones.
[23:23.790 --> 23:25.270]  They took my copy of Heavy Metal.
[23:25.530 --> 23:26.830]  Man, that fucking pissed me off.
[23:27.010 --> 23:28.770]  It was in the VCR that they stole.
[23:29.290 --> 23:29.610]  Master!
[23:30.050 --> 23:30.150]  Son of a...
[23:30.150 --> 23:32.670]  And this was before it was released, okay?
[23:32.790 --> 23:33.810]  So this was a bootleg copy.
[23:33.910 --> 23:34.910]  I was so fucking pissed.
[23:34.910 --> 23:39.890]  I actually slept on the couch for a week after that with my shotgun waiting for the fucker to come back.
[23:40.810 --> 23:41.730]  I was waiting.
[23:42.130 --> 23:44.990]  I remember you taking your wrist rocket to the... to Jack the Crack.
[23:45.010 --> 23:49.090]  Well, that was too... yeah, we had a wrist rocket and we used to shoot ball bearings at the people shooting...
[23:49.090 --> 23:51.290]  uh, firing up crack in the loading dock.
[23:51.510 --> 23:53.830]  And it was funny cause like, we wouldn't want to hit them.
[23:54.010 --> 23:57.090]  But we'd like, shoot next to one of these sparks flying and they're just like...
[23:59.310 --> 24:00.030]  Didn't phase them.
[24:00.290 --> 24:02.790]  So it was... at the time it was funny cause it was in the south end.
[24:02.890 --> 24:05.530]  Right now it's a very, you know, fancy, tony kind of area.
[24:05.730 --> 24:07.430]  But at the time it was real kind of sketchy.
[24:07.850 --> 24:12.670]  Um, but uh, you know, that's some of the things you have to think about when you're setting up a space, a physical environment around you.
[24:12.750 --> 24:14.410]  At the time we were in a real ghetto.
[24:15.570 --> 24:15.850]  So...
[24:16.630 --> 24:18.170]  Alright, so we're moving right along.
[24:18.430 --> 24:19.210]  Where's the wireless mic?
[24:20.750 --> 24:21.190]  PUSCII!
[24:21.370 --> 24:22.470]  Hand it to the next person.
[24:22.610 --> 24:22.870]  PUSCII!
[24:22.890 --> 24:23.110]  PUSCII!
[24:23.210 --> 24:24.330]  Or you can stand up here.
[24:24.570 --> 24:24.970]  There you go.
[24:25.690 --> 24:26.610]  Relinquish the podium.
[24:27.030 --> 24:28.030]  I don't want to!
[24:28.510 --> 24:31.210]  So, uh, I'm here to talk about PUSCII.
[24:31.650 --> 24:34.630]  Uh, PUSCII happens to be in a squatted house.
[24:34.890 --> 24:36.830]  We all like PUSCII in this country, don't we?
[24:37.250 --> 24:37.430]  Yeah!
[24:37.990 --> 24:38.210]  Woo!
[24:41.010 --> 24:42.490]  It's not what you think it means.
[24:44.170 --> 24:44.910]  But, uh...
[24:44.910 --> 24:45.950]  Half pussy, half assky?
[24:45.950 --> 24:48.050]  Pictured here, you can see the squatted houses.
[24:48.350 --> 24:49.650]  Both of them happen to be monuments.
[24:49.850 --> 24:52.870]  One is a city monument, the other one's a national monument.
[24:53.510 --> 24:56.170]  And they happen to be in the center of the city of Utrecht.
[24:56.410 --> 24:56.770]  That's not right.
[24:57.670 --> 25:02.730]  And naturally, that's, uh, not a very pretty site for the city council.
[25:03.630 --> 25:07.790]  They've had a lot of problems with the squatters, trying to get them out.
[25:09.230 --> 25:13.430]  But, uh, there's not much they can do, because they have, uh, laws...
[25:13.430 --> 25:14.850]  Is that really where Anne Frank lived?
[25:15.010 --> 25:15.430]  Or no?
[25:15.550 --> 25:16.290]  No, that was in Amsterdam.
[25:16.470 --> 25:16.810]  Oh, thanks.
[25:18.590 --> 25:19.530]  Dude, that's not even right!
[25:19.530 --> 25:20.230]  Are those bananas?
[25:20.510 --> 25:20.950]  What are those?
[25:20.990 --> 25:21.510]  Are those bananas?
[25:21.530 --> 25:22.950]  Actually, that's a spinal cord.
[25:23.510 --> 25:24.070]  Oh, okay.
[25:24.150 --> 25:25.090]  A banana spinal cord.
[25:26.130 --> 25:27.070]  I see bananas.
[25:27.070 --> 25:38.430]  Um, if you look all the way in the corner, right on the bottom, right where that, uh, furthermost car is, that's where PUSCII actually is.
[25:38.550 --> 25:39.510]  It's not the whole squat.
[25:40.410 --> 25:43.190]  Uh, PUSCII is just one room.
[25:43.350 --> 25:50.130]  And what we try to do is, uh, provide free internet access and open source training to people who can't afford it.
[25:51.590 --> 25:56.090]  Um, actually, you probably want to know what PUSCII means.
[25:57.130 --> 25:58.330]  Just, just a little bit.
[25:58.430 --> 25:59.110]  I'm not ready to do that.
[25:59.290 --> 25:59.550]  Oh, okay.
[25:59.610 --> 25:59.810]  I'm sorry.
[26:00.870 --> 26:02.110]  Can you make up something cool?
[26:03.610 --> 26:04.030]  Yeah.
[26:04.350 --> 26:05.230]  But I'm not gonna do it.
[26:08.170 --> 26:15.370]  Uh, PUSCII is actually, uh, was the second squatted internet cafe.
[26:16.350 --> 26:20.550]  It was, uh, modeled after ASCII in Amsterdam, which, uh...
[26:20.550 --> 26:22.070]  It is half PUSCII and half ASCII.
[26:22.070 --> 26:26.250]  Which means, uh, Amsterdam's subversive center of information interchange.
[26:27.490 --> 26:31.390]  So, PUSCII kind of making fun of ASCII in a friendly way.
[26:31.510 --> 26:35.870]  They call themselves progressive Utrecht, subversive center of information interchange.
[26:36.710 --> 26:36.930]  Yeah.
[26:36.930 --> 26:37.830]  And that's what that means.
[26:37.970 --> 26:39.250]  You Europeans are so witty.
[26:42.270 --> 26:42.730]  Yeah.
[26:42.950 --> 26:44.430]  And that's what, um...
[26:47.770 --> 26:48.230]  Nice.
[26:48.510 --> 26:48.950]  Come back.
[26:49.130 --> 26:49.350]  Nice.
[26:50.850 --> 26:51.070]  Come back.
[26:51.510 --> 26:56.930]  Uh, let me tell you about squatting in the Netherlands, uh, why this is possible.
[26:57.710 --> 27:00.250]  There are two general rules to squat.
[27:00.530 --> 27:04.210]  It is legal if the house has, is not being used.
[27:05.670 --> 27:08.530]  And if it has been empty for more than a year.
[27:09.490 --> 27:14.690]  After that, uh, squatter can just walk in, call the police and say, hey, we've taken the building.
[27:15.790 --> 27:18.670]  And you've got that, the law part out of the way.
[27:18.670 --> 27:23.810]  And all it is actually after that is all your problems have to do with the owner of the building.
[27:26.210 --> 27:32.110]  If he wants to get you out, he has to, uh, submit a court injunction to get you out.
[27:32.230 --> 27:34.970]  Are guns legal in that area of the world?
[27:35.550 --> 27:36.490]  Or commonly held?
[27:36.910 --> 27:37.350]  Blunderbusses.
[27:37.830 --> 27:38.910]  Prostitution's legal there, right?
[27:39.070 --> 27:39.250]  Yeah.
[27:39.670 --> 27:40.510]  That's what I hear.
[27:40.610 --> 27:41.890]  They can prostitute you out.
[27:42.730 --> 27:43.410]  Pimpin's legal.
[27:44.130 --> 27:46.410]  Shotgunning weed is legal, but not shotguns.
[27:48.750 --> 27:49.550]  Keyboards are legal.
[27:53.010 --> 27:55.110]  Yeah, this house was on, uh, went on fire.
[27:55.270 --> 27:56.630]  It used to be in a furniture store.
[27:56.810 --> 27:58.810]  It was called Ubica, as you see there.
[27:59.150 --> 28:02.190]  It was a mattress and furniture store, and it went on fire.
[28:02.890 --> 28:05.350]  The owner didn't really care about, uh, the building.
[28:05.950 --> 28:07.970]  And the roof caved in after the fire.
[28:08.510 --> 28:09.410]  So the city council...
[28:10.090 --> 28:11.090]  You guys fix the roof?
[28:11.530 --> 28:12.670]  Well, I'll get to that in a minute.
[28:12.670 --> 28:13.370]  Yes.
[28:13.430 --> 28:16.910]  The city council, being that these two buildings are, uh, monument...
[28:16.910 --> 28:18.470]  National monuments and city monuments.
[28:18.770 --> 28:21.830]  Uh, the city council tried to get, uh, the owner to fix the roof.
[28:22.010 --> 28:24.070]  And he wouldn't do it, because he really didn't care.
[28:25.150 --> 28:27.970]  So, uh, they sent a contractor in to fix the roof.
[28:29.250 --> 28:31.750]  And they charged him for the payment.
[28:31.750 --> 28:33.950]  And the owner said, well, I didn't order that.
[28:34.230 --> 28:36.310]  It's too expensive, and I'm not gonna pay for it.
[28:36.830 --> 28:39.510]  So the city council had a problem with the owner for a while.
[28:39.670 --> 28:44.470]  And, uh, this house was, uh, empty for about two and a half years before the squatters came in.
[28:45.730 --> 28:48.330]  And, uh, the squatters were in there for about ten years.
[28:48.530 --> 28:55.470]  And after that, a few of them decided to make PUSCII in that corner room.
[28:58.050 --> 28:58.510]  Yeah!
[29:02.570 --> 29:04.150]  I gotta watch what I say here.
[29:05.010 --> 29:06.870]  He's, he's ignoring the euphemisms.
[29:07.090 --> 29:07.270]  I know.
[29:07.470 --> 29:07.730]  Isn't it?
[29:07.870 --> 29:08.970]  It's so cute.
[29:10.490 --> 29:11.890]  The other one's called ASCII.
[29:12.010 --> 29:13.290]  That doesn't sound that bad, does it?
[29:13.990 --> 29:14.930]  It's actually a tip.
[29:14.950 --> 29:15.390]  Yeah!
[29:16.890 --> 29:18.130]  Text files and girlies.
[29:20.310 --> 29:24.410]  Yeah, naturally the advantage of squatting a house is you don't pay rent.
[29:25.470 --> 29:25.930]  Yeah!
[29:29.330 --> 29:32.770]  So, uh, we do this basically for nothing.
[29:33.310 --> 29:39.850]  The only costs we have are electricity and internet, which we share with the rest of the squatters.
[29:40.730 --> 29:44.050]  They can amount to about 50 euros or about 50 bucks a month.
[29:44.970 --> 29:54.130]  Um, naturally, uh, like I said, electricity costs money and, uh, we rely on donations.
[29:55.870 --> 30:00.110]  There are about eight core members working at PUSCII and 12 in ASCII.
[30:00.930 --> 30:03.650]  And we get volunteers from all over the world.
[30:06.090 --> 30:08.790]  Our core projects are spreading our idea.
[30:09.390 --> 30:11.810]  We're trying to move to other cities in Europe.
[30:13.110 --> 30:18.110]  Trying to offer hackerspaces where hackers can present anything.
[30:20.730 --> 30:27.950]  A lot of hacker groups in the area don't have a place, uh, where they can meet up and give presentations, so we offer that.
[30:32.290 --> 30:40.130]  And we're also thinking about offering web hosting and web space for people who are not allowed to host anywhere else.
[30:40.550 --> 30:45.430]  Who have political problems or, uh, just problems with their government.
[30:50.430 --> 30:53.390]  And, naturally, with every advantage, you have disadvantages.
[30:53.930 --> 30:55.330]  Money is our biggest disadvantage.
[30:56.210 --> 31:02.530]  We have some organizational problems, and we're all so constantly faced with a threat of eviction.
[31:03.250 --> 31:06.090]  Being that, uh, it's not ours.
[31:09.180 --> 31:11.350]  But other than that, it works.
[31:17.350 --> 31:17.750]  Great.
[31:19.250 --> 31:22.790]  So, actually, we're going to introduce, uh, Hacker Halfway House now.
[31:23.170 --> 31:24.970]  And, uh, I'll just hand the mic over here.
[31:29.040 --> 31:29.840]  New York City.
[31:30.800 --> 31:35.100]  So, I, uh, took all these pictures of our place, and somehow they didn't make it into the slides.
[31:35.300 --> 31:36.620]  So, I'm just going to talk for a little bit.
[31:36.840 --> 31:38.300]  He has no PowerPoint foo.
[31:38.580 --> 31:44.560]  And, against our better judgment, we're having a big party at our place tomorrow night.
[31:44.560 --> 31:46.500]  So, some of you might even get to see the place.
[31:46.620 --> 31:47.340]  Because we're local.
[31:48.220 --> 31:49.560]  So, um, yeah.
[31:49.720 --> 31:50.860]  There are a few of us here.
[31:51.500 --> 31:53.620]  Um, Benign Punk and Pharr are over there.
[31:54.260 --> 31:55.260]  I'm sure you've heard of them.
[31:58.340 --> 32:00.560]  I don't know if Carton's here, if he's down at the Nock.
[32:00.740 --> 32:03.260]  But, uh, he's also here.
[32:03.860 --> 32:05.040]  Um, but, yeah.
[32:05.200 --> 32:07.140]  We basically have been there for about a year.
[32:07.260 --> 32:07.780]  We're in Brooklyn.
[32:08.080 --> 32:11.580]  We're in a fairly sketchy part of an industrial part of Brooklyn.
[32:12.360 --> 32:13.440]  Bushwick, to be specific.
[32:13.560 --> 32:13.900]  No sleep till.
[32:15.700 --> 32:18.300]  And we, we got a loft.
[32:18.980 --> 32:20.820]  And we built walls.
[32:21.120 --> 32:24.400]  And we tore down very sketchy walls and built new ones in their place.
[32:25.120 --> 32:25.600]  And...
[32:25.600 --> 32:26.200]  All right, shut up.
[32:28.180 --> 32:30.460]  And we've been working on our projects there.
[32:31.060 --> 32:32.100]  Uh, Benign Punk was...
[32:32.100 --> 32:38.340]  All the banners and the canvases and all that that you've seen around here that Benign Punk was doing, that was in our living room.
[32:39.120 --> 32:40.560]  Uh, we did a bunch of the...
[32:40.560 --> 32:41.440]  Let's hear it for the banners.
[32:41.600 --> 32:42.220]  Aren't those awesome?
[32:42.300 --> 32:42.860]  Aren't those awesome?
[32:43.320 --> 32:44.000]  Come on.
[32:45.860 --> 32:46.260]  Excellent.
[32:52.580 --> 32:52.980]  Uh...
[32:54.320 --> 32:55.120]  Mention the artist.
[32:55.320 --> 32:56.180]  Come on, give them props.
[32:56.520 --> 32:57.120]  She's up next.
[32:57.820 --> 33:03.600]  Um, but we, we did a lot of the, uh, network testing and staging for the network here at our place.
[33:03.600 --> 33:06.920]  Uh, we had some meetings to do some testing out of stuff.
[33:07.200 --> 33:12.280]  At our last party, we throw these really big parties after all the local NYC 2600 meets.
[33:12.440 --> 33:14.680]  Which is probably how most people around here know us.
[33:14.800 --> 33:16.420]  Because we throw really big parties.
[33:17.400 --> 33:18.980]  Um, which we'll be doing tomorrow.
[33:19.180 --> 33:19.680]  Yeah, the bucket.
[33:19.840 --> 33:20.360]  That's really bright.
[33:20.960 --> 33:27.200]  Um, basically we've got about 2,000 square feet of space in a warehouse in Brooklyn.
[33:27.940 --> 33:31.460]  Um, we've got five to six people depending on how you want to count it.
[33:31.460 --> 33:35.860]  Uh, we're paying a little bit more than these other guys because we're in New York City, of course.
[33:36.180 --> 33:39.440]  Uh, but it's pretty cheap compared to everything else out here.
[33:39.680 --> 33:44.240]  Uh, we're also out in the boonies of Brooklyn, so we're not able to easily get a T1.
[33:44.580 --> 33:46.660]  We're looking into a wireless link.
[33:46.880 --> 33:48.300]  You know, five, five and a half megabits.
[33:48.460 --> 33:51.860]  But right now we've got, uh, 1.1 megabit DSL.
[33:52.040 --> 33:52.960]  It works pretty well.
[33:52.960 --> 33:59.300]  We're hosting a number of projects out of our place, including the, uh, 2600 IRC network.
[33:59.960 --> 34:04.400]  Uh, Ivy Ministries, Oculet, various other things.
[34:04.640 --> 34:06.360]  So, you might have seen stuff that we're hosting.
[34:06.980 --> 34:07.800]  Stone Coder!
[34:07.920 --> 34:08.560]  Yeah, Stone Coder.
[34:09.100 --> 34:10.300]  Can't forget about that.
[34:11.120 --> 34:16.820]  Um, our, our big advantages are that we're very central to the big scene out here.
[34:16.880 --> 34:18.060]  There's a lot of stuff going on.
[34:18.060 --> 34:19.140]  We've got our own projects.
[34:19.320 --> 34:20.340]  We've got group projects.
[34:20.620 --> 34:22.300]  There's usually something going on.
[34:22.560 --> 34:27.060]  Uh, some of the disadvantages are, again, disorganization, which seems to be everywhere.
[34:28.460 --> 34:29.860]  And people like Boris.
[34:30.000 --> 34:30.600]  Is Boris here?
[34:30.900 --> 34:32.400]  Get your hands out of my pockets!
[34:32.580 --> 34:33.840]  Yeah, see, people like him.
[34:34.980 --> 34:46.260]  Like, he, he comes over, and he, he eats all of our food, and he sleeps on our couch, and he takes up the PlayStation, and he just, you know, is Boris.
[34:47.400 --> 34:47.840]  So...
[34:47.840 --> 34:49.680]  Every hacker space has a person like that.
[34:49.960 --> 34:50.240]  Yeah.
[34:51.040 --> 34:51.760]  Called a leech.
[34:52.180 --> 34:52.620]  Rogan!
[34:52.800 --> 34:53.240]  Rogan!
[34:54.040 --> 34:55.400]  I think, I think you mean...
[34:55.400 --> 34:57.980]  As we came, as he, as we came to know him...
[34:57.980 --> 34:58.680]  Couch Agent 006?
[34:58.720 --> 34:59.220]  Couch Agent 006.
[34:59.220 --> 34:59.320]  Yes.
[34:59.580 --> 35:00.760]  Couch Agent 006.
[35:01.160 --> 35:01.300]  Yes.
[35:01.380 --> 35:02.880]  You stole my line, dude!
[35:03.060 --> 35:03.840]  I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
[35:04.220 --> 35:06.000]  We tried to coordinate, but it doesn't always work out.
[35:06.160 --> 35:08.840]  But, basically, that's Hacker Halfway House.
[35:09.200 --> 35:20.300]  Uh, we're throwing a party here at the hotel later on tonight, so maybe if you want to find one of us and figure out what's going on, you can come by our party, see the bucket that we're kind of known for, thanks to Benign Punk.
[35:22.280 --> 35:24.080]  You gotta come by and see the bucket.
[35:24.300 --> 35:24.680]  It's...
[35:25.320 --> 35:28.740]  You'll probably remember it unless you have too much, in which case you won't.
[35:29.580 --> 35:32.920]  Um, but yeah, so we're doing a party tonight and tomorrow at our place.
[35:33.040 --> 35:36.620]  Find us if you want to come by and see the place and see what we have going for us.
[35:37.100 --> 35:39.640]  Otherwise, you know, we're free to answer any questions.
[35:40.520 --> 35:40.600]  All right.
[35:40.600 --> 35:41.140]  Thank you.
[35:41.420 --> 35:42.180]  Let's hear it, Port.
[35:47.050 --> 35:48.110]  You think he's in a blanket?
[35:49.650 --> 35:50.370]  Okay, so...
[35:50.370 --> 35:50.710]  He's good.
[35:50.830 --> 35:54.830]  We're gonna talk a little bit about cooperative ISPs here, and, uh, Binary's gonna give us our...
[35:55.770 --> 35:56.210]  All right.
[35:56.330 --> 36:06.910]  So, uh, every, you know, workspace needs bandwidth, and you can go with a commercial DSL line or T1, but there's some inherent problems to that, where you really don't know where your traffic's going or who's looking at it.
[36:06.910 --> 36:09.810]  So, one way around that is you just start your own ISP.
[36:10.330 --> 36:17.630]  So, there's some advantage to that, where you pay basically wholesale bandwidth costs, the same amount that the ISP itself that you'd be using would be paying.
[36:18.130 --> 36:20.190]  You have a pretty inexpensive monthly cost.
[36:20.250 --> 36:28.330]  All you do is pay, you know, the ILEC, uh, your loop cross, uh, and your, uh, cross connect, and then your access membership for whatever bandwidth that you're buying at wholesale.
[36:29.030 --> 36:35.910]  And the members are responsible for their own equipment and support, so you don't have to deal with people complaining, or if your line goes down, you just fix the problem yourself.
[36:36.470 --> 36:53.090]  Um, the big advantage to that is your ingress and egress traffic are pretty much going to where the ISPs were is bypassing, you know, whatever monitoring systems or whoever else is looking at the traffic and peering directly, um, at any different peering point where you decide to co-locate your access router.
[36:53.530 --> 36:54.430]  Go to the next slide.
[36:55.070 --> 36:59.030]  The disadvantage to this are your, uh, initial startup cost is pretty high.
[36:59.170 --> 37:09.090]  You have to invest in a pretty decent router, um, the initial cross connect and setup fee for a DS3 or many T1s, um, and the installation charge for all the lines.
[37:09.090 --> 37:20.770]  You probably need about 10 or 15 people to get involved, um, and you just go to the, uh, whatever phone company you have and you say, hey, I have 10 people I want to place an order for 10 T1s for three years.
[37:20.910 --> 37:22.070]  They'll give you a really good discount.
[37:23.350 --> 37:29.170]  Um, another disadvantage is you really need to have people that know what they're doing, uh, to set up a T1.
[37:29.170 --> 37:31.290]  You really can't call anybody to ask for help.
[37:31.450 --> 37:32.510]  You kind of just have to do it yourself.
[37:33.250 --> 37:36.330]  And the other problem is most ILECs require a three year commitment.
[37:36.650 --> 37:40.070]  But if you can get all that, the advantages pretty much outweigh the disadvantages.
[37:40.570 --> 37:44.370]  And I'm going to use the, um, Cambridge Bandwidth Consortium as an example.
[37:45.310 --> 37:49.550]  Uh, this is what we're currently doing in Cambridge and this is how we have connectivity through the Hasty Pastry.
[37:50.190 --> 37:54.890]  Um, the, uh, the CBC provides dedicated T1s to its members.
[37:55.070 --> 37:55.270]  CBC?
[37:56.070 --> 37:56.470]  CBC.
[37:57.710 --> 37:58.110]  CBC.
[37:58.770 --> 38:03.310]  There's approximately 15 or I think 18 members right now, uh, that have T1s.
[38:04.110 --> 38:15.370]  Um, and our infrastructure consists of a dedicated enterprise access router and a, uh, management server, um, in the basement of the Boston City Hall, which is the, uh, MXP or, yeah, MXP in Boston.
[38:15.990 --> 38:23.130]  Um, and we basically just pay for Ethernet VLAN pairing, um, is our bandwidth, you know, we pair with three or four people.
[38:23.850 --> 38:26.110]  And it's a pretty good way to get, uh, cheap bandwidth.
[38:26.110 --> 38:27.230]  You know, we have T1s.
[38:27.290 --> 38:31.070]  You can get it to about $200 to $250 a month for a full T1.
[38:31.510 --> 38:33.030]  And there's not many people looking at it.
[38:33.230 --> 38:41.710]  So, if you're able to, that's something, if you're considering starting a space or even starting a bandwidth, uh, co-op in your area, it's something to look, uh, look into.
[38:41.710 --> 38:42.430]  Weed's bot.
[38:44.390 --> 38:44.850]  Mini Moose?
[38:44.850 --> 38:45.330]  Hey, Mini Moose!
[38:46.130 --> 38:47.070]  Yay, Mini Moose!
[38:47.870 --> 38:48.190]  Meep!
[38:48.330 --> 38:49.230]  Wait, I have a question.
[38:49.470 --> 38:50.630]  What happened to that slide?
[38:51.070 --> 38:51.890]  What happened to what slide?
[38:51.890 --> 38:52.110]  What slide?
[38:52.290 --> 38:53.650]  Oh, I think you know the slide I'm talking about.
[38:53.730 --> 38:55.230]  I couldn't get the pictures offline.
[38:55.910 --> 38:56.230]  What?
[38:58.070 --> 38:59.910]  I think it was gonna show Tub Girl or something.
[39:00.050 --> 39:00.350]  I don't know.
[39:00.570 --> 39:01.770]  Yeah, I was gonna show software.
[39:01.930 --> 39:03.350]  Yeah, it definitely was soft at the point.
[39:03.910 --> 39:06.270]  So, this is, uh, we actually, uh, this is perfect.
[39:06.410 --> 39:07.330]  We've got 20 minutes now.
[39:07.330 --> 39:10.030]  So, this is, we're gonna open it up for Q&A and, um...
[39:10.030 --> 39:12.050]  Um, does anyone out there have any, uh, alcohol?
[39:12.230 --> 39:17.330]  Yeah, actually, you know, we're kinda dry because I'm the only guy who brought, uh, apple juice.
[39:17.470 --> 39:18.130]  Oh, God bless you.
[39:18.250 --> 39:20.710]  And, uh, if anyone's got, like, flasks, uh...
[39:20.710 --> 39:21.570]  Thank you, Alex.
[39:21.870 --> 39:27.670]  Shots, jello shots, uh, please, it'll help us do the, we'll answer your questions faster.
[39:27.830 --> 39:30.210]  You can be on our, you can be on our panel if you have any alcohol.
[39:30.330 --> 39:32.910]  So, raise your hand if you got a question and, uh, we'll, uh...
[39:32.910 --> 39:33.930]  Raise your hand if you have any alcohol.
[39:34.230 --> 39:34.970]  This guy right here.
[39:35.030 --> 39:36.530]  Oh, one last thing before...
[39:37.310 --> 39:44.470]  One last thing before we get started, uh, something very critical I forgot to mention is, uh, the importance of finding the right balance of personalities.
[39:45.130 --> 39:55.410]  Don't shop for people based off of the skills you think they have, but I, I highly, highly, highly recommend you shop for people based off the personalities you want to collect for the space you want to assemble.
[39:55.770 --> 39:58.670]  Because you will be, uh, um...
[39:59.090 --> 40:02.750]  Okay, so one day, all of you are gonna get a real job, possibly.
[40:03.210 --> 40:03.930]  And, and...
[40:03.930 --> 40:04.770]  Thank you for the alcohol.
[40:05.790 --> 40:06.110]  Thank you.
[40:06.130 --> 40:06.190]  God bless you.
[40:06.190 --> 40:08.570]  And you're gonna do something which you swore you'd never do.
[40:08.750 --> 40:08.870]  God bless you.
[40:08.890 --> 40:12.930]  You're gonna do something you swore you'd never do, and that's called going into the, uh, into technical management.
[40:12.930 --> 40:19.150]  And you're going to, in this job, go and herd ten nerds into doing one thing at one point.
[40:19.270 --> 40:21.730]  And you're gonna see how fucking impossible it is to do this.
[40:21.850 --> 40:23.710]  It's like herding cats, basically.
[40:23.710 --> 40:23.870]  It's true.
[40:24.350 --> 40:25.050]  Herding cats.
[40:25.050 --> 40:31.530]  I would also like to say that, I think that every successful hacker house, hacker space needs somebody like a Chuck.
[40:31.950 --> 40:37.590]  Somebody who can do anything, you know, physical in terms of like, building things, making things, fabrication.
[40:37.890 --> 40:40.150]  I think what you're saying is the, the A-team model.
[40:40.350 --> 40:41.110]  The A-team model, yeah.
[40:41.150 --> 40:41.830]  You need a Mr. T.
[40:41.930 --> 40:42.250]  Of hacker space.
[40:42.410 --> 40:42.950]  Yes, the A-team.
[40:43.050 --> 40:43.710]  You need a Murdoch.
[40:43.750 --> 40:44.770]  A MacGyver, a Mr. T.
[40:44.930 --> 40:45.290]  Exactly.
[40:46.110 --> 40:48.150]  You're mixing metaphors here, not MacGyver.
[40:48.730 --> 40:49.030]  That's important.
[40:49.030 --> 40:49.510]  That's an A-team.
[40:49.610 --> 40:50.770]  I like the herding cats metaphor.
[40:50.970 --> 40:52.570]  It's like herding cats that sleep with each other.
[40:52.570 --> 40:52.910]  Yeah.
[40:54.050 --> 40:54.930]  It's kind of creepy.
[40:55.330 --> 40:55.470]  Yeah.
[40:56.630 --> 40:59.570]  So, so I think, all right, we'll just open it up for questions.
[40:59.670 --> 41:01.310]  And you were, you, you had your hand up.
[41:01.530 --> 41:01.630]  Yeah.
[41:01.790 --> 41:01.950]  First.
[41:02.650 --> 41:03.250]  You need a mic.
[41:03.470 --> 41:05.290]  You got a wireless mic.
[41:05.570 --> 41:06.670]  Get the, get the mic boy.
[41:06.790 --> 41:07.430]  Where's mic boy?
[41:07.670 --> 41:08.270]  Mic boy.
[41:08.710 --> 41:09.330]  Oh, mic boy.
[41:09.590 --> 41:10.110]  Go on.
[41:10.790 --> 41:11.430]  Sword boy.
[41:11.650 --> 41:12.450]  Sword boy.
[41:12.590 --> 41:12.730]  Yeah.
[41:12.810 --> 41:13.790]  Just rip it out of there.
[41:13.910 --> 41:14.150]  It's good.
[41:14.430 --> 41:14.970]  It's all good.
[41:15.170 --> 41:15.290]  Get out.
[41:22.170 --> 41:22.570]  Woman.
[41:22.930 --> 41:23.350]  Thank you.
[41:23.350 --> 41:25.830]  You told me you were allowed to speak.
[41:26.110 --> 41:27.150]  Get back in the kitchen.
[41:27.650 --> 41:28.590]  Get back in the kitchen.
[41:29.030 --> 41:30.170]  Back in the kitchen.
[41:30.450 --> 41:30.630]  Back in the kitchen.
[41:30.630 --> 41:30.850]  Back in the kitchen.
[41:32.370 --> 41:34.070]  What are you doing wearing shoes?
[41:35.450 --> 41:36.490]  Where's my dinner?
[41:37.950 --> 41:39.270]  I want my chicken pot pie.
[41:39.270 --> 41:39.450]  Yeah.
[41:39.910 --> 41:40.610]  Is this working?
[41:43.850 --> 41:44.690]  God damn it.
[41:46.310 --> 41:47.670]  Hey, respect my authority.
[41:49.650 --> 41:50.710]  Don't ever do that again.
[41:50.930 --> 41:51.030]  Yeah.
[41:51.210 --> 41:52.750]  That was, that was good, but don't do it again.
[41:52.890 --> 41:53.130]  Thank you.
[41:53.170 --> 41:55.270]  Way to break those fat guy stereotypes, by the way.
[41:57.370 --> 41:58.350]  Hey, I, I try.
[41:58.570 --> 41:59.050]  I try.
[41:59.710 --> 42:00.070]  All right.
[42:00.070 --> 42:00.870]  What's your question?
[42:01.130 --> 42:01.930]  The question is first...
[42:01.930 --> 42:03.030]  Ask, Queens is a dick?
[42:04.370 --> 42:04.850]  It's okay.
[42:05.070 --> 42:05.470]  I don't mind.
[42:06.130 --> 42:06.870]  I've met Queens before.
[42:07.350 --> 42:09.570]  Uh, the question is, what do you guys get your bandwidth for?
[42:09.750 --> 42:11.770]  Uh, for the co- like, for the cooperative bandwidth?
[42:12.050 --> 42:17.290]  And also, uh, how exactly do you, um, go about in letting people in?
[42:17.410 --> 42:19.650]  Like, is it like you meet them through like the meetings and whatnot?
[42:19.870 --> 42:20.730]  And so that, and...
[42:20.730 --> 42:24.030]  We go through a heavy background screening process, and then, uh...
[42:24.610 --> 42:26.030]  It involves a lot of drinking, usually.
[42:26.710 --> 42:27.790]  Actually, that really is it.
[42:27.790 --> 42:28.290]  It involves measuring up.
[42:28.370 --> 42:29.110]  Actually, I'm serious.
[42:29.350 --> 42:29.930]  I'm very serious.
[42:29.930 --> 42:33.570]  Actually, I worked with someone who once said that they would never hire someone that they couldn't take out drinking.
[42:33.810 --> 42:37.970]  And I truly believe that's, that is an accurate assessment of someone's personality.
[42:38.410 --> 42:39.610]  And so, for like, the bandwidth, though?
[42:40.090 --> 42:48.770]  Um, the bandwidth, uh, we were lucky enough in Cambridge to just start our space at the time where the, uh, cooperative ISP was starting up, and we got involved in it.
[42:49.290 --> 42:56.630]  Um, if you guys have any questions about starting a cooperative ISP, I guess you can email me, um, binary at sonicbeating.org is probably the easiest.
[42:56.630 --> 42:59.950]  I don't know if my hasty pastry melt works, but you try that, too.
[43:00.410 --> 43:03.990]  Uh, uh, actually, Nick, can you speak to this also?
[43:04.190 --> 43:06.370]  It's like, what, what it took for you to get ISP started?
[43:06.870 --> 43:09.750]  Um, call the telco, order a T1.
[43:10.030 --> 43:14.590]  Yeah, you want to get about ten people together and order T1, T1s in bulk.
[43:14.770 --> 43:28.990]  And if you go to the phone company and say, hey, I want to order ten T1s, I want a three-year commitment on it, you'll probably get it on, if you've talked to the right people, about fifteen dollars over loop cost, which, at least in Boston, is, uh, somewhere around a hundred ninety dollars.
[43:30.170 --> 43:30.230]  Yeah.
[43:30.490 --> 43:35.830]  The other cool thing is with the, uh, actually, the 2600 meetings is a great place to, uh, you know, meet new people.
[43:35.990 --> 43:45.250]  And I know, like, with the Hasty Pastry, we have, uh, well, we have a 2600 meeting, and then we have what's called the 2621 meeting afterwards, which are the people who can drink and go to the bar.
[43:45.250 --> 43:53.010]  You know, I actually, I would, uh, I would contradict that statement because, uh, like or not, most of us are severely broken people.
[43:53.790 --> 43:57.290]  And, uh, severely broken people don't work well in a large group.
[43:57.550 --> 44:00.490]  Uh, so I, I really recommend you take that into some point consideration.
[44:00.870 --> 44:03.950]  I mean, be very careful about who you, who you pick and choose.
[44:04.110 --> 44:07.930]  And if, and at the initial onset, you're gonna have one or two members that are gonna fall out.
[44:08.110 --> 44:08.150]  And don't sleep with them.
[44:08.970 --> 44:10.010]  Don't sleep with each other.
[44:10.150 --> 44:11.390]  That's, it makes it complicated.
[44:11.390 --> 44:12.250]  Don't sleep with them.
[44:12.370 --> 44:17.150]  Don't sleep with each other's wives, girlfriends, anything, or, or husbands, or, or, or boyfriends.
[44:17.730 --> 44:21.370]  But the 2600 meetings are a great way to get new people involved in the spaces.
[44:21.530 --> 44:23.410]  But you have a screening process.
[44:23.670 --> 44:23.890]  Yeah.
[44:23.990 --> 44:24.290]  You see.
[44:24.470 --> 44:24.730]  Yeah.
[44:24.750 --> 44:29.490]  So, uh, the original New Hack City West actually had a free T1, which is pretty chill for two years.
[44:29.970 --> 44:42.770]  Uh, just because someone else inside the building we were in, we were in this huge, like, two-block-long building where American Industrial Complex in San Francisco, and it was where the, the, the big hall-walking scene from, uh, the right stuff was filmed.
[44:42.950 --> 44:49.750]  Anyway, so there was a lot of dot-com stuff in that building, and this, this, we basically made friends with someone who moved out of their space, and they had their T1 circuit still.
[44:50.150 --> 44:53.930]  And, uh, so we just kind of, like, broke into the phone closet and routed their T1 into our space.
[44:53.930 --> 44:54.970]  We put up all these wires.
[44:55.330 --> 44:57.790]  We put up all these, uh, these, like, pipes into our space.
[44:57.830 --> 44:59.190]  We basically just rerouted their T1.
[44:59.430 --> 45:02.690]  Um, we, right, rerouted their pairs into our building, or into our space.
[45:02.950 --> 45:04.490]  And, uh, we had a free T1 for two years.
[45:04.650 --> 45:06.530]  And until we were kicked out, we had, uh, free bandwidth.
[45:06.710 --> 45:06.950]  It was nice.
[45:07.770 --> 45:09.890]  I think we were lucky that we had problems with the T1.
[45:11.650 --> 45:13.170]  Why don't you come up and start forming a line?
[45:14.050 --> 45:15.690]  Do you have any alcohol, though?
[45:17.270 --> 45:19.830]  Somebody at the ISP must have been a CDC fan.
[45:20.690 --> 45:22.850]  Even though there were problems, they basically...
[45:24.230 --> 45:25.510]  Get in line, Mofo.
[45:27.970 --> 45:28.770]  What up, Turk?
[45:29.030 --> 45:29.570]  Get in line.
[45:29.810 --> 45:32.250]  If you guys could take your pants off, everyone is in line, too.
[45:32.690 --> 45:33.970]  That's like our policy.
[45:34.330 --> 45:35.050]  You take your pants off.
[45:36.050 --> 45:37.050]  Take my shirt off.
[45:37.050 --> 45:37.770]  You're wearing pants.
[45:37.770 --> 45:39.450]  It's not your pants, sir.
[45:39.450 --> 45:41.250]  Can you take all your nipples a little bit?
[45:42.210 --> 45:42.630]  Nipples?
[45:42.630 --> 45:43.430]  Are your nipples?
[45:43.570 --> 45:45.110]  Are you happy like a little girl?
[45:45.250 --> 45:48.470]  If you're not wearing pants already, then I guess you win.
[45:49.030 --> 45:51.250]  Let the man ask the question.
[45:51.990 --> 45:56.150]  This is specifically for the PUSCII, but also for the rest of you.
[45:56.270 --> 46:01.770]  What kind of relationship do you have with the community around where the hacker houses are?
[46:01.850 --> 46:04.270]  Like the local community, not just the hacker community.
[46:04.270 --> 46:07.310]  Well, I think I told you about people hiding behind me to smoke crack in our case.
[46:07.570 --> 46:14.170]  Well, then like PUSCII specifically, like do you have with the political community and things like that?
[46:14.310 --> 46:17.190]  Or are the rest of you involved with political communities in the area?
[46:17.890 --> 46:25.330]  The thing about PUSCII, like this was a building that was rotting away for about two and a half years.
[46:26.090 --> 46:31.670]  A lot of people got scared because, you know, it was abandoned and it was on fire and burned out.
[46:32.390 --> 46:42.110]  And actually the squatters, what they've done is they've added like a vegetarian restaurant inside, a bicycle rent place.
[46:42.110 --> 46:49.370]  And there used to be like a little store where you can trade things in and get stuff in return.
[46:49.650 --> 46:52.930]  And that's where PUSCII  use is now.
[46:53.970 --> 47:02.950]  So actually the neighborhood is pretty much satisfied with the squatters because they've done more than the furniture store ever did.
[47:04.210 --> 47:13.330]  And the only people that don't like the squatters naturally are the city council because like they're in the center of the town and they're in monumental buildings.
[47:14.310 --> 47:16.010]  I'd like to speak to that also as well.
[47:16.430 --> 47:26.470]  Our group, we have a lot of not very tight ties, but kind of loose ties to the Prometheus Radio Project and a lot of the other indie groups in Philly.
[47:26.870 --> 47:36.890]  And so it's not that we give each other continuous direct help, but we're definitely known for, you know, if, you know, there's a little bit of a question, you can kind of touch bases with our person and say, oh, here's a resource that's available.
[47:37.090 --> 47:43.750]  So it seems that once you actually start building one of these spaces, you immediately start getting hooked in with some of these other groups that exist.
[47:44.030 --> 47:45.970]  I think we should let the women filter to the front.
[47:47.090 --> 47:47.730]  Ladies first.
[47:47.930 --> 47:48.730]  Where are your manners?
[47:49.150 --> 47:49.450]  Thank you.
[47:49.870 --> 47:52.070]  I just want to make a comment to like the Hasty Pastry.
[47:52.170 --> 47:56.030]  We have, we're adjacent to a really good Greek restaurant and they really like us.
[47:56.030 --> 47:57.930]  Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, are we additional waiting?
[47:58.150 --> 48:10.750]  In terms of our neighbors and the people around us, our downstairs neighbors have told us or informed us actually that it is polite to take off your shoes after 10 p.m.
[48:10.930 --> 48:12.330]  when you're living in an apartment building.
[48:12.530 --> 48:14.410]  So that's what they think of us.
[48:15.130 --> 48:16.010]  That's bad.
[48:17.310 --> 48:17.870]  Hello?
[48:18.230 --> 48:18.950]  Okay, next question.
[48:19.290 --> 48:19.530]  Yes?
[48:19.850 --> 48:19.930]  Yes?
[48:20.090 --> 48:20.690]  Is this on?
[48:20.930 --> 48:21.790]  I'm talking.
[48:26.370 --> 48:27.230]  Excuse me?
[48:29.510 --> 48:31.470]  Okay, so I like all of your attention.
[48:31.810 --> 48:35.110]  This isn't going to be directed to any one person, so I don't want to give out their name.
[48:35.450 --> 48:38.110]  But all I have to say is, baby daddy.
[48:39.210 --> 48:40.690]  You know who you are.
[48:41.010 --> 48:44.430]  And next time, use this.
[48:50.210 --> 48:51.290]  You don't call.
[48:51.550 --> 48:52.470]  You don't write.
[48:52.910 --> 48:54.350]  You don't send any support.
[48:54.750 --> 48:55.250]  So you know what?
[48:55.310 --> 48:55.730]  You know what?
[48:55.730 --> 48:56.290]  I'm talking.
[48:56.610 --> 48:58.090]  Why are you wearing shoes?
[48:58.470 --> 48:59.850]  Why are you in a kitchen?
[48:59.850 --> 49:01.030]  Yeah, I just want to point out that.
[49:01.070 --> 49:02.290]  Why aren't you in the kitchen?
[49:02.410 --> 49:02.830]  You know what?
[49:04.370 --> 49:07.330]  Hacker spaces of the future pretty much have nurseries.
[49:07.490 --> 49:08.590]  There's a nursery in New Hack City.
[49:08.930 --> 49:09.990]  You've got to take care of the kids.
[49:10.210 --> 49:10.610]  Excuse me?
[49:10.730 --> 49:11.430]  All I'm not...
[49:11.430 --> 49:13.650]  Who's to say who the father really is?
[49:14.510 --> 49:14.910]  Right?
[49:15.630 --> 49:17.550]  Show me the DNA test results.
[49:17.850 --> 49:18.590]  Do you not lie?
[49:18.590 --> 49:18.930]  You.
[49:19.210 --> 49:20.230]  Next question, please.
[49:26.370 --> 49:27.310]  Oh, yeah.
[49:30.230 --> 49:31.490]  Stupid girl in front.
[49:31.770 --> 49:32.130]  Thank you.
[49:32.270 --> 49:33.610]  So, I don't...
[49:34.030 --> 49:34.510]  Thank you.
[49:35.190 --> 49:36.170]  Okay, thank you.
[49:36.270 --> 49:36.770]  Next question.
[49:37.410 --> 49:43.110]  You didn't talk about the women who cleaned for you, who cooked for you.
[49:43.270 --> 49:46.090]  Who do you think used to vacuum to VAX 11, huh?
[49:46.090 --> 49:47.010]  That was me.
[49:47.330 --> 49:47.770]  I used to talk.
[49:48.170 --> 49:48.450]  I used to talk.
[49:53.570 --> 49:54.270]  That was you.
[49:54.330 --> 49:55.170]  That was you, kid.
[49:56.550 --> 50:00.070]  You're just so upset about the time we stuck you in the VAX 11/750.
[50:00.130 --> 50:01.010]  Locked you in the VAX 11.
[50:01.010 --> 50:01.450]  Because you...
[50:01.450 --> 50:02.590]  We just did it because you fit.
[50:03.610 --> 50:04.770]  At least it was warm.
[50:05.090 --> 50:08.750]  If all the ladies in the room could give their email address to Al, Reverend Al, that'd be great.
[50:08.970 --> 50:09.510]  Yeah, so much.
[50:09.710 --> 50:10.730]  Right here at the end.
[50:10.870 --> 50:11.330]  In the blue shirt.
[50:11.410 --> 50:11.430]  Yeah.
[50:11.710 --> 50:12.370]  And their measurements.
[50:13.130 --> 50:17.450]  So, let's talk about that hole down in the Hasty Pastry, down that goes into the basement.
[50:17.450 --> 50:21.110]  You know, where you keep all those women who code your exploits all night.
[50:21.550 --> 50:22.430]  Staying up.
[50:22.550 --> 50:24.070]  You know, those projects.
[50:24.310 --> 50:24.450]  Yeah.
[50:24.690 --> 50:25.350]  Women can't read.
[50:26.130 --> 50:26.610]  Oh.
[50:27.430 --> 50:28.690]  They can't think about it.
[50:29.590 --> 50:31.230]  You're fucking crazy talk, girl.
[50:31.710 --> 50:35.290]  We say it's like coding your little exploits.
[50:35.310 --> 50:39.010]  And then in the morning, we call into work when you're sick.
[50:39.430 --> 50:43.250]  After you've been on your Coke and do marathon binge all night.
[50:43.410 --> 50:43.590]  Yeah.
[50:44.450 --> 50:46.470]  What do you think you're going to do without us, huh?
[50:46.590 --> 50:46.830]  Huh?
[50:48.590 --> 50:49.470]  Thank you very much.
[50:49.630 --> 50:50.590]  Next question, please.
[50:51.570 --> 50:53.430]  I'm sorry, she's suffering from hysteria?
[50:53.970 --> 50:55.430]  It's a kind of female condition.
[50:55.950 --> 50:57.470]  It's caused by being out of the kitchen.
[50:57.630 --> 50:59.070]  Can I just say, ladies.
[51:00.670 --> 51:01.470]  The ladies.
[51:02.770 --> 51:04.770]  Next, I know, it's weird, isn't it?
[51:05.030 --> 51:05.190]  Yeah.
[51:05.490 --> 51:06.170]  Yeah, just go ahead.
[51:06.550 --> 51:06.710]  Go ahead.
[51:07.470 --> 51:11.850]  I'm sorry, if there's a lack of drama, I suppose I can pretend I had one of your children.
[51:12.090 --> 51:12.870]  Well, you're pretty cute.
[51:13.150 --> 51:13.870]  You'll find me.
[51:14.950 --> 51:17.370]  Show me your belly button.
[51:17.370 --> 51:18.330]  Show me your belly button.
[51:19.110 --> 51:20.070]  You'll find me.
[51:20.350 --> 51:21.190]  I don't remember that.
[51:21.190 --> 51:21.430]  I'm sorry.
[51:21.590 --> 51:22.210]  That that was.
[51:22.450 --> 51:24.310]  I look like a dragon and look over your shoulder at me.
[51:26.850 --> 51:27.250]  No.
[51:27.490 --> 51:28.270]  Okay, go ahead.
[51:28.470 --> 51:28.770]  I'm sorry.
[51:29.150 --> 51:29.330]  Yeah.
[51:29.390 --> 51:30.570]  No, I'm not sorry, but go ahead.
[51:30.950 --> 51:31.730]  I understand.
[51:31.730 --> 51:51.030]  No, I've been thinking about starting up something, like some sort of, like, hacker space in my hometown, though the problem is there are only about 45,000 people there, and I'm thinking, well, how do I attract enough people to this thing that, you know,
[51:51.110 --> 51:55.050]  I have a critical mass where we're not, like, dying from rent?
[51:55.050 --> 51:57.250]  Honestly, you're going to move to a new city.
[51:57.650 --> 52:01.530]  I'm not, I'm not, I mean, 45,000 people is kind of a low density.
[52:01.870 --> 52:03.610]  You should move out of Winnipeg.
[52:04.790 --> 52:09.810]  No, no, no, seriously, seriously, 45,000 people is a low density.
[52:09.810 --> 52:21.410]  Because you've got to figure that out of any given population, be it 100,000 people or 600,000 people, a certain percentage of that population are going to be the right kind for you.
[52:21.410 --> 52:25.430]  And I've found, I mean, I've lived all over the U.S.
[52:25.450 --> 52:33.070]  and been part of hacker collectives in various, various places, that that percentage seems to be fairly constant.
[52:33.370 --> 52:39.870]  You know, the people that have the sort of hacker mentality, and then the people that have the hacker mentality that you can actually deal with, people that have some social skills.
[52:40.870 --> 52:43.270]  Because Lord knows there's some of us with no social skills.
[52:43.850 --> 52:45.590]  Basically, you should go for diabetics.
[52:46.130 --> 52:47.090]  Diabetics are really good.
[52:48.670 --> 52:51.130]  So you start, you start with the people, though.
[52:51.290 --> 52:52.950]  You don't go looking for them.
[52:53.050 --> 52:57.990]  I mean, you start with, you have the good people, and then you go, you find the, uh...
[52:57.990 --> 53:01.570]  I think that we've been fouled out, red card, which...
[53:01.570 --> 53:01.950]  Out of time.
[53:02.250 --> 53:02.430]  Oh.
[53:02.690 --> 53:03.450]  Oh, one last one.
[53:03.450 --> 53:04.410]  I'm afraid to think fouled out.
[53:04.470 --> 53:05.750]  We are not out of time.
[53:06.950 --> 53:10.910]  And I want to add to that, too, actually, really look for your close friends.
[53:11.170 --> 53:16.970]  And, I mean, because what it comes down to is a hacker space is a collective of friends, and friends are people you can trust.
[53:17.090 --> 53:20.070]  And trust means, I know, warm and fuzzy.
[53:20.190 --> 53:20.930]  Can we get a group hug?
[53:20.930 --> 53:21.290]  Cue up the hair bear.
[53:21.430 --> 53:21.910]  Can we get a group hug?
[53:22.030 --> 53:27.210]  But, no, it's about people getting together who, you know, you can trust them to pay the rent on time and all of that.
[53:28.310 --> 53:29.230]  Okay, okay, last question.
[53:29.230 --> 53:29.830]  We're getting a group hug.
[53:29.830 --> 53:31.150]  Last question, last question.
[53:31.250 --> 53:33.930]  Two-part question for Gweeds, if you could stand up for this.
[53:34.450 --> 53:34.790]  How's it going?
[53:35.190 --> 53:36.210]  This is going to be naughty.
[53:36.210 --> 53:39.070]  So, my question was, where are your pants?
[53:39.770 --> 53:43.490]  And the follow-up to that was, could I have your shorts?
[53:45.590 --> 53:49.210]  I don't really see what that has to do with hacker ideals and ethics.
[53:50.990 --> 53:59.730]  I think the downfall of New Hack City West will really just be completely explained by the absence of your pants.
[53:59.730 --> 54:02.310]  I don't think the 800 people in this room get your inside jokes.
[54:03.930 --> 54:05.670]  Well, I think that it's about 11 o'clock.
[54:05.710 --> 54:06.110]  Where are your pants?
[54:06.110 --> 54:07.230]  Make a question, diabetes.
[54:08.570 --> 54:10.450]  It's about 11 o'clock, which means we're ready to...
[54:10.450 --> 54:11.710]  No, no, we got six minutes more, dude.
[54:11.830 --> 54:12.650]  We got six minutes more.
[54:12.770 --> 54:14.430]  We got five hours out of the room around.
[54:14.670 --> 54:14.990]  All right.
[54:16.010 --> 54:17.470]  Well, yeah, we're going to give that talk, too.
[54:18.010 --> 54:19.050]  We're going to give that talk, too.
[54:19.070 --> 54:20.430]  The next talk is pirate radio.
[54:20.650 --> 54:23.970]  And we'll be giving that, we'll tell you what you need to do to start a pirate radio station.
[54:24.150 --> 54:24.470]  Absolutely.
[54:25.110 --> 54:26.010]  My name is Monk.
[54:26.190 --> 54:28.090]  I'm from KBFR.
[54:30.210 --> 54:36.790]  I want to just say, first of all, that I think all of us will be here for the rest of the conference and we'll be very approachable, seriously, here.
[54:37.030 --> 54:40.070]  By the way, if anybody doesn't realize that this is the 20th anniversary of the Cult of the Dead Cat.
[54:40.670 --> 54:40.990]  Yeah!
[54:44.570 --> 54:45.150]  Very nice.
[54:45.250 --> 54:48.070]  Can I also say that this is actually Veggie's 28th birthday?
[54:48.210 --> 54:49.670]  Can we get a singing happy birthday to him?
[54:49.790 --> 54:49.910]  Woo!
[54:50.990 --> 54:53.550]  Happy birthday to you!
[54:54.750 --> 54:57.410]  Happy birthday to you!
[54:58.610 --> 55:00.550]  Happy birthday to you!
[55:01.050 --> 55:02.070]  Happy birthday to you!
[55:02.370 --> 55:05.250]  Happy birthday to you!
[55:06.490 --> 55:10.010]  After this, I'll be over at the Blarney Rock if anybody wants to buy me drinks.
[55:10.470 --> 55:10.990]  There you go.
[55:11.130 --> 55:21.290]  We'll all be here for the rest of the conference and we really encourage all of you, if you have questions about the details of setting these kinds of places up, or if you want to buy us a drink at the Blarney Rock, which is right around the corner.
[55:21.430 --> 55:22.190]  Thank you very much.
[55:22.190 --> 55:24.110]  It's all about Blarney Rock.
[55:25.710 --> 55:27.870]  Show me the DNA test and we'll talk.
[55:27.990 --> 55:28.910]  Look like a frog!
[55:29.310 --> 55:31.070]  Thank you so much for your hospitality.
[55:31.070 --> 55:32.130]  Thank you very much.
[55:32.270 --> 55:34.770]  We appreciate you enduring our insanity.