And Jerry Brown came to you over WBAI in New York.
And Jerry will be back again tomorrow from 7 to 8 p.m.
Here on listener-supported radio, WBAI in New York.
And now it's time for Off the Hook.
And the phone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a cough.
It couldn't get much worse, but if they could, they would.
Bon Dillibon for the best to expect a word.
I hope that's understood. Bon Dillibon!
And a very good evening to one and all.
This is Emmanuel Goldstein.
The program is Off the Hook.
We're with you every week from 8 p.m. to 9 p.m. Tuesday nights
talking about the latest in high technology and the dark age,
which is almost upon us.
Here with Walter tonight, who went with me to visit Bernie S. in prison.
Walter, is your microphone working?
Hello. Testing.
Oh, good. Okay.
We went to see Bernie S. Bernie's on the phone with us now.
Bernie, are you there?
Bernie. Oh, I forgot to press the button.
Bernie, are you there now?
Hello?
Yes. Okay.
I heard a beep.
You heard a beep, huh?
I don't know whether that was your end or my end.
Uh, we generally don't beep on this end unless there's a reason for it.
Well.
There's no reason to beep.
Well, we could be recorded, but I'm aware of that anyway.
Okay.
Well, um, it was good seeing you, uh, this past, uh, this past weekend.
Although I have to say, uh, going to a prison like that is always a bit, uh, disheartening.
Uh, Walter's here with us, uh, tonight as well.
He also, uh, went on the, uh, on the journey.
Hi, Walter.
Hiya, Bernie.
Hey.
Um, anything, has anything changed since we saw you last?
Uh, well.
That cough is nothing new, I can tell you that.
No, I'm, uh, I'm relapsing from this prison flu or whatever I have.
Now, there's a flu epidemic in the prison.
Is that, uh, is that what's going on?
Uh, yeah, about a hundred, a hundred of the five hundred inmates here have come down with
a particularly nasty infection.
I don't know whether it's bacterial or viral, but, um, they've got a lot of, uh, very, uh,
uncomfortable symptoms like, uh, extreme headache, uh, um, congestion, a lot of coughing,
diarrhea, that sort of thing.
Uh-huh.
It's, uh, very unpleasant, and, uh, the past three days I haven't been given my medication
because the, uh, nurse has said that she doesn't have time to give it to me.
So, um, I filed, you know, whatever official remedies I'm supposed to file, paperwork, but,
you know, by then I couldn't get sicker.
I don't know.
But it's not, uh, it's not unusual for this, uh, health system.
The health, uh, the health services here have been recently privatized.
They have an outside company coming in to do this, and there's been, uh, recent newspaper
articles here in this area, um, quoting people who were recently fired from, uh, this private
company saying that they're cutting back on medications in order to save money so they
can increase the profits.
So I don't know whether this is a, uh, my, not getting my medication, which was prescribed
by a doctor last week, has anything to do with that or not, but, uh, bottom line is, I feel
like shit.
Well, uh, the thing is, uh, when you're in prison, all kinds of, uh, of nasty things can happen.
You don't have, you just don't have any control over anything, and that's what's really frustrating.
When, when we went there, uh, when we went there to visit on Sunday, um, we, we got there
shortly before 6.30.
By the time they, they actually let us in to see you, though, it was about a quarter after
eight, and we only got half the time we were supposed to get, uh, because of that.
Uh, that kind of thing is kind of, uh, common, unfortunately, in a, in a, in a prison environment.
They're always, uh, you know, jerking you around, uh, every which way.
I had gotten prior written authorization to, to, uh, visit with you guys for, uh, for an
hour, but, you know, apparently that's not worth anything, because that's not what happened.
Uh-huh.
Um, I'm curious about after you left, were you, uh, were you searched as you, as you left
the prison?
Uh, no, we were not searched at all.
Ah.
Yeah.
I was.
I didn't leave the prison, obviously, but, uh.
All right.
I was forced to submit to a, uh, to a strip search.
Is, is that common?
They do that every time?
I, I don't know, but, uh, I was taken into a, a small room.
As, after I, after you guys left, and, uh, was asked to remove all my clothing, and then
the guards, uh, cut out rubber gloves and proceeded to search me.
Now, um, have you had a chance to see the, the article that appeared in the Philadelphia
City Paper?
No, I haven't.
Okay.
You had mentioned its existence to me, but I don't know what it says.
Well, then this is your lucky day, because I'm about to read it over the air.
Oh, great.
And you can actually listen to it.
Um, and I, I should say that, uh, I've spoken to a number of reporters.
There's interest is finally, finally starting to catch on a little bit on this story.
And on the way over here, I was also listening to an old show of ours from 1990, uh, where
the Steve Jackson case was just beginning to hit the, uh, hit the news.
And one of the main topics we were talking about was, why hasn't the press written anything
about this?
Well, as you know, the Steve Jackson case now is one of the most famous cases ever to
have involved hackers in the Secret Service.
So, uh, I see that as a, as a bit of optimism.
Uh, you know, the press hasn't learned anything.
Okay, that's, that's a given.
But it's quite possible that you'll get the press you deserve on this story, uh, at some
point.
There's, there's at least one person that I'll tell, I'll tell you about off air that
wants to contact you, but we'll, uh, we'll talk about that a little later.
Uh, this story is called Bernie Burned, uh, the never-ending saga of Ed Cummings, a.k.a.
Bernie S., lands the computer hacker behind bars again.
Uh, this is written by Scott Formelant of the, uh, Philadelphia City Paper.
Fresh off a seven-month prison stint, a smiling Ed Cummings dropped by City Paper last October
to chat about his bad karma, sharing a prison cell block with dumb fella John Stanfa and
crimes.
Um, Cummings grinned despite his run-in with, uh, with Secret Service and Haverton Cops,
uh, who earlier nabbed him for having equipment that can potentially defraud telephone companies.
Cummings, the first person ever sent away under a new federal law, even though he owned his
stuff before Congress outlawed it, seemed glad to put prison behind him.
Suddenly, Cummings blurted a warning, be careful what you do today, tomorrow they can go back
and charge you.
Instead, Cummings has learned about paying for yesterday's acts, for as Cummings discovered,
the law can strike twice.
Three months after tasting freedom, Cummings, known as Bernie S. in Philly hacker circles,
is behind bars.
The odds say Cummings will not get out anytime soon.
Northampton County Judge Jack A. Piniella locked Cummings up on January 12th on $250,000
bail for violating probation.
On March 5th, Piniella will decide whether to put Cummings away for upwards of two years
for a 1993 misdemeanor charge.
Under state law, the Secret Service slash Haverton charge constitutes an automatic probation violation.
The hacker community and Cummings' lawyer are extremely angry at the second jail term,
blaming the Secret Service for Cummings' latest woe.
This is a case based on a sick vendetta by a government agency, wrote Emanuel Goldstein,
publisher of the Long Island-based 2600 Hacker magazine, in a recent internet posting.
Cummings is in jail with murderers and rapists.
The conditions are appalling.
The Secret Service has taken more than a passing interest on this case, says attorney Ken Trujillo.
For them to continue to claim that he's dangerous when they know he's not dangerous, that's absurd.
Neither of the two leading investigators, Secret Service agent Thomas Varney or Haverton detective John Morris,
would comment, but one law enforcement source speaking on conditions of anonymity
both defends and questions Cummings' treatment.
Do we consider Cummings dangerous, says the official.
I think the question is, dangerous to who?
What do you do with somebody who flagrantly violates the law?
Do we just say more probation?
He was given a break the first time, and he didn't take it.
So what's the answer?
Who knows?
The source adds that Cummings' personal journals suggest, quote,
totally unrelated felonies, unquote, which are still being investigated and will be revealed on March 5th.
Trujillo denies this assertion.
There's a lot of stuff in those journals, but nothing that would constitute a crime, says the lawyer.
I don't remember any confessions being in there.
Moreover, Trujillo says there is no evidence that Cummings is a threat to hurt anybody or to flee.
At a January 26th hearing, where Piniella dropped bail to $100,000, Varney and Morris labeled Cummings as dangerous
because he had the anarchist cookbook, which tells how to make bombs, obtains material, showing how to create a false identity,
plus includes the 1983 Secret Service code name for President Reagan, which Cummings found in an old Monitoring Times article.
Varney also said Cummings had material resembling C4 plastic explosives.
It was, in fact, material used to mold dentures.
Varney admitted Cummings did not have guns or explosives, had not issued threats, and did not harm anybody since his October release.
While Varney isn't saying why he portrayed Cummings as dangerous,
confiscated photos might shed some light on why the Secret Service is after Cummings.
The pictures taken by Philly hackers and circulated throughout that community
show Secret Service agents on an undercover assignment.
One shot reveals an agent picking his nose.
The photos have aired on Fox 29.
In any event, it seems doubtful that Cummings will escape more prison time at his March 5th hearing.
Sources familiar with Northampton's courts say probation violators are routinely jailed.
Further, Piniella is described in Northampton legal circles as Father Time.
Ed fully expected to wind up in jail on the probation violation, sighs Trujillo.
He's not a happy guy.
Cummings currently sits in a maximum wing of an eastern Pennsylvania jail housed with high bail prisoners,
including criminals like the notorious Joseph Henry, who sexually mutilated a woman before strangling her with a slinky.
Cummings reports cold and filthy conditions at the age of facility built right after the Civil War,
including roach infestation.
Those following Cummings' case pray the public sits up and takes notice.
The only positive development is that more people are slowly starting to realize what's happening, says Goldstein.
Yes, I got the final word on that one.
Any major problems with that article?
Well, I'd like to know who this anonymous law enforcement source is who said that my diary describes felonious acts.
I'd like to know what that is, frankly.
Well, I have a feeling everyone will find out just what this anonymous person is talking about as I guess they disguise his voice or whatever in the courtroom.
Whatever it is they're talking about, apparently it wasn't serious enough for them to warrant filing any charges against me.
No, apparently not.
And I didn't write anything.
I remember when I took notes in my journal, only purely kept it for a couple of years in the early 90s, 91, 92.
I didn't write about anything technological.
It was just basically my very personal thoughts and feelings in relationships and just in life in general.
And I was going through a hard time in my life.
And I wrote down things, I don't know, a lot of just random thoughts.
I guess if anyone were to take excerpts from someone's diary over a period of time and present them out of context, you could paint almost anyone as an antisocial thinker, perhaps.
But in any case, we'll see what they have in store.
But whatever it is, they didn't charge me with anything related to what was in my diary, so it can't be all that illegal.
Don't forget, Bernie, the point of this hearing is not to charge you with anything more.
It's to present you as a danger to society so they can lock you up for the maximum amount of time.
If they can make you sound like you're some sort of bizarre introvert that has weird deviant fantasies of some sort, they will do that.
And it should be a very interesting hearing.
I want to point out that people can attend this hearing.
It's not very far from New York City either.
It's only about an hour or so out of New York City on Route 78 heading west in eastern Pennsylvania.
And the hearing starts at 8.30 a.m. on Tuesday, March 5th.
Well, it's supposed to start at 8.30, but as you're aware, you waited several hours for the other one to start.
That's true.
We had a pleasant time drinking coffee from the vending machines and trying to figure out who the feds were that were lurking about the building.
I'm going to have to call you back since I just heard our 30-second warning.
Okay.
I'll call back on the same number, I guess.
Okay.
We'll await your call.
Okay.
All right.
Take care.
Sounds pretty bad there.
He's definitely got a bad case of the flu, and they're not doing much to help him, that's for sure.
He mentioned how he was having trouble getting cough medicine.
Walter, I believe you heard part of that, right?
Yeah.
There was this story about the nurse who just didn't bring him this cough medicine.
Didn't have time to bring him cough medicine.
He even offered to go downstairs with her to get it himself, but of course they don't do things like that.
She doesn't have time.
That's not permitted.
So, yeah, he's there coughing up blood, I'm afraid, various things like that.
Each week it gets worse and worse, and I don't know where it's going to end.
I don't know how bad this is going to be.
We were talking, Fibers here now, we were talking about things that happened six years ago.
I was listening to an old radio program, which is about to be put up on our FTP site, in fact, so you can download it.
But that was right about the time when the Steve Jackson games saga was beginning.
And also the Phrack magazine had just been shut down.
The emergency 911 document had just made its debut into the public eye.
We were talking then about how, first of all, the press is noticing this,
but we were also talking about the Secret Service and how incompetent they were,
how they weren't able to understand what it was they were doing.
I believe, Fibers, they had come to your house at that point
and said that you had caused the AT&T crash in Martin Luther King Day.
Yeah, that was in late January of 1990.
They had accused me and possibly two other people
of having some role in the crash of the AT&T long-distance network.
You have a telling collect call from a county jail.
The call is from Bernie S.
To accept this collect call with a push-button phone, please press 2 now.
Let's accept this one by voice.
To reject this collect call, press 8 now.
To accept this collect call, press 2 now.
If you still wish to accept this collect call after the tone, please say yes.
Say yes.
Yes.
What's wrong with you?
The tone.
Yes.
Thank you for using the Lens.
I was waiting for the tone.
You've got to move faster than the tone.
Sometimes the tone doesn't come at all.
Well, it worked this time.
All right.
Thank God for that.
I recognize Phiber's yes in the background.
Hello, Phiber.
Hey.
How are you?
So we were just talking about the Secret Service back in 1990
when they raided Steve Jackson and Craig Neidorf and Frack Magazine.
Back then, we were concerned with how inept they were.
They had accused Phiber of crashing AT&T on Martin Luther King Day.
Today, it's a different matter.
The Secret Service is not incompetent.
It's that they're vindictive, that they intentionally want to cause someone harm,
and they want to keep somebody locked away, and they understand fully what they're doing.
That's a major difference that has happened in six years.
Yes, I think, I don't think they're, well, in some ways, I do think they are technologically inept,
but they know enough to know better.
They know enough to know better, and they're deliberately trying to use what I think,
what I would call official oppression to persecute people who experiment
or who they would call hackers, just to have a boogeyman to blame, I guess.
I don't know.
And that would be you.
Well, or anyone else.
I mean, I don't consider myself alone in any of this.
I'm certainly not the first person, and I don't think I'll be the last person
who's charged with and sent to prison for doing something that hasn't victimized anyone
and simply playing with technology.
But in any case, it's just a sad state of affairs.
I mean, people who have not a shred of violence in their background
are hurting anyone or anything like that or victimizing anyone.
Well, what you say is very true.
You won't be the last one.
I think a lot of these civil liberties groups are missing the boat
when they look at these cases.
They're not seeing the importance of the individual cases.
Rather, they're flocking around the Communications Decency Act, the easy targets.
You know, the ACLU filed papers the day after the CDA was passed.
Great, you know.
And, in fact, that law has been temporarily suspended while there are hearings held on the matter.
And we all know that the abortion clause is going to be thrown out
because there's no way that kind of thing can be upheld where they make it illegal
to talk about abortion on the Internet.
These are all easy targets.
But the real war is won on the hard ones, on the hard individual cases
where not everybody understands the relevance.
And those are cases like yours.
And I'm sad to say, I don't know of a single civil liberties group
that has taken an interest in this.
And the thing is, listening to Steve Jackson six years ago, he said the same thing.
He was saying how no civil liberties group, and this was before EFF existed,
he had contacted the ACLU, and they just didn't see any interest in the case.
Well, you know, I sure wish, I'm sure they wish, that they could go back in time
and take a bit more of an interest in that case,
seeing as how it was very significant in the development of the electronic age.
I think they'll have the same regrets over your case when it's all said and done.
Well, maybe it'll be water over the dam at that point,
but there just seems to be no or very little in the way of any kind of public lobby
or voice that has any power speaking up for people who experiment or who hack.
It's not a, I guess it's not a popular stand to take up,
but, you know, I think it has some merit,
and the ACLU, I guess, has larger issues that they'd like to focus their energies on.
Yeah, the usual antics over there, right?
I'm sorry?
That's the usual antics over there at the prison, right?
Yeah, well, I guess you can hear the background noise.
I'm being told by a guard that I need to be locked up.
They're close to 8.30.
They tend to lock up, but they're going to lock us up early tonight for some reason,
probably because I'm on the phone.
Maybe because they all want to watch NYPD Blue at 10.
I don't know. I don't have a television.
No, but the guards do.
All right, that's true.
Okay, well, Bernie, don't get in trouble or anything on our behalf,
but we will keep in touch.
And you have not gotten much mail from our listeners, have you?
I got a couple of letters from a couple of kind people last week.
Thank you very much.
Can you quickly give out your address?
Sure, it's Ed Cummings, C-U-M-M-I-N-G-S, Northampton County Prison,
and the address is 666 Walnut Street, number D22, D as in dog, D22,
it's my cell number, and that's in Easton, E-A-S-T-O-N-T-A, 18042.
Any words of encouragement anybody can send is a...
Excuse me.
Helps the day go by.
It's extremely boring here.
So any cards, notes, letters, jokes, newspaper clippings, anything at all.
Magazines and books apparently aren't allowed in because they're, I guess, dangerous.
But if you work for a publisher, you can send that, is that correct?
They have to be sent to the law library if it's books, and I'll get them in that case.
But thanks for supporting me out there.
I appreciate it, everybody, and thanks for coming to visit me.
Okay, we'll see you again in two weeks, and also we'll hear from you next week.
Take care of that cough.
Get the best care you can under the situation.
I'll probably call you tomorrow evening regarding that person you said needs to get in touch with me.
Okay, that would be good.
Thanks again. Good night, everybody.
All right, take care.
That's Bernie S. live from Northampton County Prison in Easton, Pennsylvania.
Every week we talk to him.
Every week it just seems to get more and more disturbing.
Boy, Fiber, I don't know.
You saw a prison like that, I guess, for a couple of days, right?
You saw the hole when they put you away in another part of Pennsylvania.
But for the most part, you were in a fairly civilized place.
Didn't sound like that.
I remember when you used to call in, it was...
Well, it got pretty damn noisy at times.
In fact, there were some days when it sounded just like that.
Yeah.
It was a fairly noisy place.
But what was the worst crime?
Somebody was in your camp.
They called it a camp where you were.
What was the worst crime someone was accused of?
Yeah, ironically it was called a camp.
But probably some of the worst things that people were in there for were drug-related crimes.
I mean, if you want to rate that as being worst.
But on a legal scale, that was probably it.
No murderers?
No, no murderers.
Well, no admitted murderers.
You know, if they murdered anyone, we didn't know if they were, you know...
They kept it to themselves.
Yeah.
I mean, it's perfectly possible that somebody could have murdered or raped somebody and,
you know, just, they didn't get charged for it.
No one ever knew.
Unbelievable.
Well, we'll keep you updated on this.
But as we said before, this will be coming to a head on March 5th, Tuesday, March 5th,
8.30 in the morning, and it's open to the public.
So however many people can fit into that courtroom to witness this.
You know, there's really not much you can do.
It's not a question of who can cheer the loudest or anything like that.
In fact, you're not supposed to do that at all.
But if you're there, at least you can witness it for yourself and tell people about it.
And I think that's almost as important to be able to do.
Well, we'll be back again.
We'll be back in a couple of minutes to take phone calls and talk about other things going on in this madhouse.
In the pits of despair
And a thousand yards there
I don't easily scare
But you better beware
You're who I want and where
Doesn't anyone care?
Our telephone number is 212-279-3400
And if you want to write to Bernie S.
And you're too lazy to actually write
Something down with a pen
You can always email to Bernie S.
That's B-E-R-N-I-E-S
At 2600.com
And we will forward it to him
At the earliest possible time
Okay, changing
Changing topics here
Very important announcement that we have to make
Very important, I'm sure five of you have heard about this
You're instrumental in getting word out to people
About this very important event
Which takes place every
Well, you don't have to look that mystified
You know what I'm talking about
We all know what we're talking about here
We do?
Yeah, this is something that happens every four years
Obviously, because it's leap year
It's that time again
As many of you know
Each leap year, the internet must be shut down
For 24 hours
In order to allow us to clean it
The cleaning process
Which eliminates dead email
And inactive FTP, WWW, and Gopher sites
Allows for a better working and faster internet
This year, the cleaning process
Will take place from
12.01 a.m. Greenwich time
On February 29th
Until 12.01 a.m. Greenwich time
On March 1st
During that 24 hour period
Five powerful internet crawling robots
Situated around the world
Will search the internet
And delete any data that they find
Okay, therefore
It's very important
That we pass this on to people
In order to protect your valuable data from deletion
We ask that you do the following
Number one
Disconnect all terminals and local area networks
From their internet connections
Two
Shut down all internet servers
Or disconnect them from the internet
Three
Disconnect all disks and hard drives
From any connections to the internet
Four
Refrain from connecting any computer
To the internet in any way
We understand the inconvenience
Walter, is there a problem?
Are you laughing at something?
It's really inconvenient actually
It's very inconvenient
But there's nothing funny about it
I'm laughing at the inconvenience
All right
Well, it's not funny
I have to do all that work, you know
It's not funny
It's funny in a bad way
It's a serious issue here
Yeah, exactly
All right
Try to refrain from giggling over there
It's like what's happening to Bernie S
It's so ridiculous
It's funny, but it's a really bad thing
Well, yeah
I guess it's sort of like that
We understand the inconvenience
That this may cause some internet users
And we apologize
However, we are certain
That any inconveniences
Will be more than made up for
By the increased speed
And efficiency of the internet
Once it has been cleared of electronic
I've never even heard of those words before
I'm not even sure if they're obscene or not
So I'm not going to say them
We thank you for your cooperation
And since the last internet cleaning
Of course, the number of internet users
Has grown dramatically
Please assist us
In alerting the public
Of the upcoming internet cleaning
By posting this message
Where your users will be able to read it
Please pass this message on
To other sysops and internet users as well
Thank you
And we're going to forward this
To every member of America online
Is that right?
Because we know that they'll do our job for us
And they'll help to spread this around everywhere
Where it belongs
Okay, that's the important announcement for today
And if you have any questions about this
I guess, who should they contact?
That's a good question
The Christian Coalition I know
Can answer some questions on this
The Cyber Angels
They'll be happy to help
And also, I believe, various other organizations
That have been so helpful to us in the past
Okay, now we have a special feature
Where we go out on, I guess, a voyage of discovery
That's what we're here for, right?
They won't allow Discovery Magazine into the prison
But we can discover things out here
And one thing we're going to discover
If we can get our dial tone here
Do we have one?
There we go
We're going to call a special number, alright?
Okay, we're dialing here
This is a number, believe it or not
In the 7-1-0 area code
Do you remember what 7-1-0 is, Fiber?
Uh, yeah
7-1-0 is that special government
It's for emergency use by FEMA
That's right
A special government area code
We've been trying to find out
What this area code is all about for years, really
Because it's been mentioned several times
Well, guess what?
We found a number that actually works
Listen to this
Now that tone, it wants touch tones
So let's give it some touch tones
Uh, one, two, three, four, five
And a pound sign
Hey, I think I got somewhere
Uh, I'm going to do it again
One, two, three, four, five
Pound sign
Please re-enter your PIN now
Ah, re-enter the PIN now
Okay
If I was a PIN, I would be
Five zeros
Your call cannot be completed if dialed
Please check the number and dial again
2-2-8-T
Wow
We got routed to a recording
It tried to make a phone call somehow
Yep
Now, what do you think this is?
Um
It sounds like a repeating recording
I'm going to keep it on just to see what happens to it
Sometimes they recycle
2-2-8-T
First of all, where's 2-2-8-T, do you know?
Um, 8-T is, uh
That's a toll office somewhere in Manhattan
Uh-huh
Um, 8-T
Okay, so it's using 8-T to get out
Oh, yeah, yeah
I don't remember specifically which toll center 8-T is
Uh-huh
Okay
Uh, it has hung up, so it only plays that recording twice
Which I guess is, uh, is good
Um
You know what, I think what we should do
We should get an operator to help us here
Because when in doubt
The operator is the ultimate authority
And they can tell you
What something is
How it works
What it's for
You know, we shouldn't be wasting our time here
On the radio right now
Talking about this number we know nothing about
When there's an operator
You know, sitting only a few miles away
Who has all the answers
So, let's get back on the telephone here
And put a zero
In front of this number
Oh, you know what?
Put the zero in the wrong place
Okay
Oh, yeah, we'll give out the number, too
Don't worry about that
Uh
That way people can, uh
Hopefully come up with some theories of their own
AT&T
It's coming online
AT&T
Please enter your calling card number
And PIN
Or
Major credit card number
And
The four digit expiration date
Now
Well, that's new, isn't it?
It's definitely new
Major credit cards are accepted by AT&T now
What do you know?
This is AT&T
Please say
Calling card
Person to person
Or operator
Now
What if you don't say any
Operator, now
Please hold for operator assistance
Not bad
It ignored all the stuff I said before
AT&T
How may I help you?
Uh, yes
Good evening, operator
I'm having some difficulty with this phone number
That I'm trying to, uh, to reach
Can you tell me where it is?
Oh, mama
Thank you very much
That's the, um
Get's number
Are you on a touch-tone phone?
Uh, yes I am
Can you hear me?
Yes, one moment, okay?
Okay, thank you
Yes, I'm on a touch-tone phone here
AT&T
Is checking this out for us
Well, while she's checking it out
Maybe we should, uh
Discuss what
We're doing
Talk amongst ourselves
Well, yeah
Yeah
Um, the number
Is
710
627
4387
Yes
Yes, you're calling to a, um
Government telecom service number
A
Government telecom service number?
You dialed 710
627
4387
That's what I dialed, yes
Okay
That is a
It's called a GETS number
But
You won't know what I'm talking about
Uh, what
Well, what is a GETS number?
I'd like to know
A government emergency telecom service
That's all we know
Oh, a government emergency telephone service?
Telecom
Telecommunication
I see
But whatever it is, you don't have
It's
We billed for this number that we have here
So, I can connect you to it
An operator would have had to connect you
Uh huh
That's why you got an operator
Uh, okay
Um, do you know where they're located?
Uh, I can see if it shows up
Hold on
Okay
No, it doesn't
Doesn't say where
I don't think it's
It's
No, it doesn't show up
710 is not ERICO
Wherever that is
It's some
I mean, I don't know where it is
It's like 800 in other words
Yeah
It can be anywhere
Uh, do you know how I can find out more information about this?
Because this is a very interesting subject to me
Okay, hold on
Let me ask what the provider
Thank you
Thank you
Very, uh, helpful
Don't you think?
Yeah, she's a lot smarter than the other operator
What other operator?
The one that told us that it didn't exist
Oh, that one
Yeah
Well, we didn't do that on the air
Right
NCS GETS
Did you know that GETS stood for Government Emergency
I wasn't sure what GETS stood for
Yeah, but NCS stands for National Communication System
So they got a nice, uh, seven-letter acronym there
NCS GETS
NCS GETS results, I guess
Um, according to this piece of paper that's been handed to me
Uh, National Communication System is located in Northern Virginia
Probably
In that big building?
You know what the...
There's a lot of big buildings in Virginia
Oh, the big one, the really, really big one, you know
What, the five-sided one?
Yeah
Oh
Could be in there
Um, I guess it's a good idea to, to let people know
That, obviously, this is not something to be trifled with
Uh, yeah, but I, I would doubt highly that the system is located in any one place
Well, I'm not saying just wherever it's located
I'm saying because of, you know, who's running it and things like that
Oh, obviously
I mean, we're putting this on here for informational purposes
To, uh, you know, to talk about, uh, what, what the system is all about
And that kind of thing
Yeah, we should, we should further caution that this number is not to be used
Unless, uh, in case of a federal emergency
And that's something I'm more interested in
Well, you know, we have to move on
So I don't think we can stay waiting for the supervisor much longer
Um, what we'll do is we'll call back
And let them know, or let, let the listeners know what, what we're told in the future
Uh, that's the 710 story for tonight
Now, we have, uh, open phone lines
212-279-3400 is our telephone number
If you want to call in with any kind of, uh, of question, comment, observation, or what have you
Uh, feel free to do that
212-279-3400 is our telephone number
Um, let's take our first call
Good evening, you're on
Hi, hi, Manuel
Oh, it's Rebel
Yeah, I just got back from Florida
Haven't heard your cheery voice in many weeks
Well, I've been away in Florida
Way in Florida, huh?
Right
Is that by, by court order, or is that, uh, because you wanted to?
Uh, no, that's because I wanted to
Okay, well, that's good
Did you get my article?
Uh, yes, in fact, I just opened it a few minutes ago
Perhaps, uh, you could, you could discuss it for us
Uh, well, I don't, I can't really elaborate on it
Because I didn't really read the whole thing
Now, um...
You just saw the word telephone and you ripped it and, and send it to us
That's exactly
Yeah
Now, what I, what I, what I, the other thing I wanted to tell you is that
When I went to Florida, I stopped in North Carolina first on purpose
So that I could see what the phones are like there
Uh-huh
You know, the phone company, it's an independent phone company called the Rock Hill Telephone Company
In, uh, on the, by Charlotte, North Carolina, down going toward, um, uh, Columbia, South Carolina
On the road, and you dial zero, their local operator, and it says, local telephone company
It doesn't say Rock Hill, it just says local telephone company
Uh, I experienced that out west, um, when I was out there
Um, and when you had them dial an 800 number
The ANI that's passed is not the phone number of where you're calling from
It's the, another phone number, um, but it's, when I call the phone number that's passed to them
Like, when you, every dial, like, 1-800-MY-ANI-IS
The phone number of where you're calling from is not passed, but another phone number is passed
The phone number that's passed, I called it, and it's their operator service number
You don't say
Right, it's the Rock Hill Telephone Company
Now, when I dialed the Carry Roxas, not the Carry Roxas, but the Long Distance
The default is Community Long Distance, which I guess is their Long Distance Company
Community Long Distance, eh?
Right, and, uh, Rock Hill, South Carolina
North Carolina, you said
Uh, I don't know, was it in South Carolina?
You can't tell the difference between North Carolina and South Carolina?
No, I was on the border, I actually drove down to Georgia, to Augusta, Georgia
Which is another story, because I stayed in a hotel, and in the motel I dialed 0 for the AT&T
9 and then 1-0-2-8-8-8-8-8-8
They asked me my room number, I gave them my room number on purpose
So that I can see what happens
I went to the front desk
AT&T has an automated system that calls the front desk
And, I don't know what they say, because I didn't hear
But they, I guess say, a call is placed by room number such and such
And, uh, I guess it tells what, how much it is and how long they took to the time and date
Did you take any time out to have fun, or were you doing research the whole time?
Of course! I gotta
Well, I, if I came down to the studio now, you'd see how tan I am
Yes, I guess that's one of my regrets that I won't get to witness that.
Well, I'll be at the meeting.
But the other thing I wanted to say is that in Florida, the payphones are like cocots.
It's like there's a Bell Operating Company payphone,
but it's like when you dial numbers, it gives you the cocot voice saying,
please deposit 25, you know, that robotic voice.
You do a good job on that, too.
And also, let's see, what else?
What else did I discover?
I hope to be going out west in a couple of months to San Francisco to see the phones alike out there.
Well, maybe we could send you, you know, to Australia or something, or maybe Antarctica.
When I finish with the United States phone system, then I'll go out of the country.
Okay, well, then we must help you as much as we can so that you can bring back knowledge.
If you want to buy me a plane ticket there, I'll be happy to go there.
It's worth considering.
It is.
Well, thank you very much, Rebel, for all the information.
And, of course, if anybody wants to hear Rebel speak at the 2600 meeting, just show up.
And I want to give out my website.
First Friday of every month.
My website.
Rebel has a website.
Okay, let's...
My website.
You can see my webpage at www.escape.com.
That's the escape system.
Right.
E-M-A-P-E dot com.
And then the slash, and then the tilde, and then Rebel.
The slash is the forward slash, I guess, or however...
Yeah, it's a forward slash.
Yeah, and then tilde, and then Rebel.
Okay.
And if you want to email me, send email to rebel at escape dot com.
E-S-C-A-P-E dot com.
Okay, and there's nothing there that would violate the Communications Decency Act?
In fact, I'm putting pictures of myself and pictures of phones.
Well, that's precisely what I mean.
No, no, no, no, no.
I mean a picture of, like, you know, like what I do, like with phones and how things work
and, you know, different, like, pay phones and stuff.
And, by the way, when I made...
Let's see, what else do I want to say?
Hmm.
Well, okay, I think maybe we've reached the end of this particular informative session.
But thanks for calling, nonetheless.
We'll see you at the meeting the first Friday of the month.
Move on to another phone call.
212-279-3400.
By the way, this reminds me, during the visit to Bernie S,
well, I wouldn't say we had an adventure, Walter.
We basically were wandering around looking for a place to eat, right?
Yeah.
After the...
And it's really sad when you get to go someplace
and you realize that he's stuck, you know, inside the place eating whatever swill they happened to hand out that night.
But we were trying to find a pay phone so we could call information
to see if a particular fast food place that we wanted existed anywhere out there.
And so we were looking all over the place.
Finally, we drove over the bridge to where we saw a pay phone
and ran over to the phone and dialed 411.
And guess what?
You get James Earl Jones welcoming you to Bell Atlantic.
You know, he says, welcome to Bell Atlantic.
And it's just like the voice of God there on the phone.
And you get like three rings before you get his voice,
and then you get about ten more rings afterwards.
And then finally I got an operator, and I said, yeah, I'm looking, you know,
for this particular place in Easton.
And she's like, Easton, New Jersey?
And I said, no, Easton, Pennsylvania.
What are you, stupid or something?
I didn't say that.
But then she said, well, what did you call New Jersey for?
I said, I didn't call New Jersey.
See, I just dialed 411.
How did I get someone in New Jersey?
And she said, well, there's no way you really could have gotten me
unless you were in New Jersey yourself.
And then suddenly I realized when we crossed that bridge,
we were right at the border, and I had crossed over into New Jersey accidentally.
And so I...
The Delaware River.
The what?
The Delaware River.
Yeah, the Delaware River apparently is right there in Easton.
So I apologized profusely, and we went back over the bridge to Pennsylvania,
where guess what?
You have to pay 25 cents for information from a payphone.
Can you believe that?
And so I got another operator who was nice, too.
The operators like to talk a long time, I've noticed, in these various parts.
I talked to an operator in Rhode Island not too long ago,
one in New Jersey, one in Pennsylvania,
and they all kept me on the phone for about two minutes,
telling me various things about the area,
giving me directions to the place I wanted the phone number for.
It's kind of weird.
They don't do that in New York.
They just want to get you out of there as quickly as possible.
212-279-3400.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
How you doing?
Okay, how are you?
You know the last guy I just called?
Do I?
Well, I mean, come on.
We can't go around criticizing our fellow listeners.
That's not fair.
Is it?
I mean, that's our job.
That last caller, I don't know.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Hello, Manuel.
Yes, go ahead.
This is more of a question directed to Fiber Optic.
Okay, well, he's right there.
Okay, Fiber, I've just completed, I guess, the first part of installing NetBSD version 1.1.
Okay.
All right, I have everything.
I have the file system on the desk.
What's the next thing I have to do?
What program must I get in order to put the kernel on there to get the unit to boot from the hard drive?
I'm looking all around, and I just loaded down the binaries a couple days ago, and I didn't find any, what do you call it, any kind of read me or docs along with it.
Unfortunately, you have me at a loss.
I'm not, I don't commonly do NetBSD installations.
All right.
That's pretty much all I wanted to get at.
Thanks anyway.
Okay, is there a way we can possibly direct this person someplace?
Is there a news group or a website or an organization?
Well, there's certainly news groups.
There's probably a couple of dozen that talk about Unix and specifically BSD.
I mean, it would be pretty easy to locate them if he had access to an Internet service provider.
Well, if he's still installing his operating system, that might be kind of difficult, but otherwise, I guess what, he could just search for NetBSD on the web?
Yeah, he could do that.
Okay, well, I wish him luck.
Good evening, you're on the air.
Hello?
Yes, go ahead.
Yeah, I sent you a message about my phone dying and my radio dying at this time going through a blasting zone on the New York Space Rueway.
They weren't blasting at the moment, but they were, it was very weird.
Your phone and your radio died?
At the same time.
While you were going through a blasting zone?
Yeah, it was like the weirdest thing.
I felt like I was going through the Bermuda Triangle.
Uh-huh.
And then later on, they both came back, and then my phone died.
My phone died again periodically.
I would, you know, do my cellular phone, and then I would get like a fast dizzy, like a, but it wasn't even fast dizzy.
It was more than that.
It was like a, like that.
Okay.
Did you notice any missing time or things you couldn't remember?
No, I sort of ruled out the abductee theory, because no, there wasn't any missing time.
What kind of geographic area is this?
You weren't going through a tunnel or anything, were you?
No, no.
I was going through like about a 15-mile stretch of the New York State Thruway between Suffern and the Tappan Zee Bridge,
and then it remained dead on the other side, and now it's come back.
I have no idea why.
The phone's come back.
The radio has not.
The radio died, and then it came back for a while, and then it died again.
In other words, like I turn on the radio, and the little light, you know, it shows the time.
It doesn't show the station, and then I play a tape, and it doesn't play the tape.
It just plays static through the speaker, so it's not a fuse or anything.
So I think something sort of killed my radio and knocked my phone out at the same time.
You know, going through that blasting zone, it was like the weirdest thing,
but have you guys had any experience with that?
I posted, you know, some messages on 2600 and alt-cellular and stuff like that,
but I haven't, you know, heard anything that really, you know, makes any sense.
Well, I'd like to know if there are people up there that know the region you're talking about,
if they could just drive through a few times and see if similar things happen.
I mean, it could be something that just happened to happen to your equipment at that moment.
It does seem unusual, I'll grant you that.
So, like, two things sort of go out at the same time.
Uh-huh.
Uh-oh.
Uh-oh, I'm crossing the bridge.
What's happening here?
I'm crossing the Tappan Zee Bridge.
Oh, you are? Okay.
Yeah, yeah.
I just did that a couple of days ago.
Oh, yeah, how do you like it?
It's a nice bridge. I like it a lot.
It's really nice. Just don't do it during rush hour.
No, no, or during blizzards either. That doesn't quite work out very well there.
Yeah, but I thought it was quite a strange phenomenon,
especially, you know, like when your radio doesn't come in,
you think, oh, okay, well, I'll play a tape,
and then the tape didn't work either.
Uh-huh.
It's like your whole stereo system just got sort of fried or something.
Yeah, but there's power going to it, like, you know, the LEDs go on and everything.
Now, who is doing the blasting?
What are they doing the blasting for?
They're doing, I think they're excavating for a shopping center somewhere in Valley Cottage.
Uh-huh.
And Valley Cottage is, like, around exit 12 off the New York State Thruway.
But they're doing the blasting between 11 and 12, you know, 11 a.m. and noon,
like just for an hour a day.
And it wasn't at that time that I was going through.
It was during the snowstorm on Wednesday, on Valentine's Day, that this happened.
And it happened probably about, you know, 10 or 10.30 in the morning.
And nothing has been the same since, eh?
Nothing has been the same since.
My phone has come back.
I mean, and it didn't work.
It didn't work, like, as of Friday.
And then it started working again on Saturday.
And it's worked okay, you know, ever since.
So I think that's okay now.
But it wouldn't even get 611, you know.
So a lot of good 611 is when your phone doesn't work at all.
True.
I mean, if your phone works good enough to get 611, then, you know.
Well, you know, it can't hurt to bring the phone in and ask somebody what happened to this thing.
And maybe they can say you were, you know,
you had this intense magnetic beam pointed at you or something.
I don't know.
Someone with answers that can look at the actual hardware might be very helpful to you.
Yeah, yeah.
So, in other words, in a blasting zone, they're emitting stuff.
Because they always say turn off two-way radio.
Well, no.
No, they're afraid that you're going to emit something and affect them.
No, they're afraid that if you're operating radio equipment,
that you're going to set off their detonators.
Oh.
That's what they're afraid of.
Yeah, they don't like that.
Unless you were driving through a nuclear testing area,
there's no pulse that's going to be generated that's going to knock out electronics equipment.
And then the question is, is there a nuclear testing area up there in Suffern?
Well, that's what I'm wondering about.
You know, I'm just wondering if there's some, like, top-secret thing that's going on
that they're not telling us about.
Well, it's not top-secret anymore, is it?
I don't think so.
All right.
Well, I'm sure there'll be a lot of people already making some phone calls up there.
Okay.
I'm going to email you personally with my address.
Okay.
Well, you can mail us here at the show.
We have an email address, O-T-H, for offthehook, at 2600.com.
Oh, great.
That'll get to people affiliated with the show.
Okay, thanks.
Just remember, the truth is out there.
It is.
Well, it should be.
You just got to find it.
Yes.
Thank you.
All right.
Good luck.
Thanks.
I don't know.
I've never had anything like that happen to me.
No, I can't say I have either.
Although, I have heard stories about weird lights in the sky around Stewart Air Base.
Really?
Yeah.
Wow.
Well, if it happens, you'll hear about it here first.
Might be the last thing you ever hear, too.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Hello.
How are you doing?
Okay, how are you?
What are we having to that?
I'm doing pretty well.
How are we having to that Atlantic 9X merger?
I think it's still in the works.
It hasn't been approved yet?
I heard that they were hitting a snag and that they were sort of saying, oh, we'll dally around
and some things together, but we won't get together exactly.
So, I don't know if you've heard the same thing, but you've heard that it's still on.
As far as I know, it's still on.
I've not heard it's been canceled, so I would imagine you'll probably hear something in a month or two.
That's interesting.
The other question was, I understand that PSI actually got back to you guys.
Yes, PSI refunded our money and the dispute is over.
Did the webpage help at all?
Yes, the webpage, in fact, was instrumental in having them reach that decision.
The letter we got, basically, it was kind of funny.
They just said, it has come to our attention that you've been having some difficulties.
And, of course, this was after they sent us a threatening letter from a lawyer saying they were going to sue us
if we didn't take the webpage down.
That was the last thing that I heard, that they were objecting to the fact that you were too close to their trademark.
Well, we changed that because we didn't want to infringe on their look at all.
But they were also upset with the recorded phone calls that we had of their representatives saying something that wasn't true.
But, you know, now that it's over, we took the site down.
We took that page down on our own behalf.
They didn't tell us to do that because it served its purpose.
And it's a good show of what power the web has as far as getting word out about something that you want a lot of people to read about.
Now, this was in relation to the fact that you wanted ISDN access to the network, right?
Right, which we have.
We've gotten ISDN through another provider.
It's not a big deal.
Can you share the provider's name?
It's called Villagenet.com.
Okay, and that's in Manhattan?
No, actually, they are in Manhattan now.
You know, what you do is, you're on the net?
Yes, and actually, I've been trying to, I know there's Ingress, Skylab, and there's another one that I, I think, DIT or DTI.
There's a lot of them out there.
If you do a whois on Villagenet.com, you'll get a phone number back and then call that phone number and find out where they are in New York.
I'm not sure quite what the setup is.
Can I finger them too?
You should be able to, but WHOIS will get you all the names and phone numbers and things like that.
And it's Villagenet.
Yeah, one word, Villagenet.com.
All right, and the last thing is, do you know their pricing at all?
I really couldn't say.
That's all right.
Don't worry about it.
But it worked.
Well, we do the 56K data over voice, no problem whatsoever, except for 9X occasionally, but that's not that big a deal.
Well, the big thing is, what they promise, Pi and the Skywise, is that if you run on a 128, if you bond the two together, and you run on a 128,
that if a Paul comes in and you have it set up in such a way that it'll knock you automatically down to 56.
Right.
No, well, actually, 64 if you have 128.
64, right.
Yeah, Fiber's been doing that for a number of months now.
Oh, great.
Yeah, that's a function of your hardware.
That has nothing to do with the service you're calling.
Well, they have to support it.
Well, no, all they have to support is multi-link PPP.
Okay.
The fact that if an incoming call will de-locate one of your channels, that's a function of your hardware, not theirs.
All right.
So then if you're able to have multi-PPP along with their service provider, it should support the fact that if someone calls in you or you pick up the line, it'll knock yourself down to 56.
Yeah, and then when you hang up, it will automatically bring back up the other channel.
And likewise, if you make an outgoing call.
Oh, that's interesting.
That's a particular feature of the BitSurfer Pro from Motorola, which is what I use.
And not from the BitSurfer period?
No.
The BitSurfer period doesn't have multi-link PPP capability.
All right.
Well, the other question is, and you would probably know this fiber, is if you're using a voice call and you're using a data line, I guess the person that would try to contact you then would have a busy signal.
Is that right?
No.
Actually, it all depends on whether or not you have additional call offerings, which basically gives you the functionality of call waiting on ISDN.
So you would hear like a call wait, so to speak.
Yeah.
Actually, the BitSurfer and the BitSurfer Pro simulate call waiting tone.
Well, who's going to hear the call waiting tone if you're on line?
Wait, is that what you're asking?
No, I think what I'm getting is that if you're on voice line, it'll knock yourself down to 64.
If you're not, it'll knock whatever the 128K line is down to 64.
As soon as you pick up the receiver and you're at 128, it's going to go down to 64.
64, right.
And then if you're on voice communication, assumedly, if you have it set up like Faber says, I guess you would hear that friendly call waiting tone.
Right, yeah.
You would hear that regardless of whether or not you had data calls set up.
Now, any talk on the horizon, because this is what I heard, is that 9X was thinking about dropping the penny a minute charge.
I hear at least three rumors a week that that has happened, and none of them have panned out yet.
Have you heard any?
Yeah, we also heard the rumor that 9X is going to increase their rates.
I didn't hear that rumor.
I think both and neither are true.
I mean, unless 9X actually announces it publicly, I'm not going to believe what anybody says, because I've not heard this directly from 9X, and I'm not willing to believe a random rumor floating around.
Well, they were just starting to get the idea that a lot of people, what they were doing was using their hardware to flip the channel so that people were making ISDN line calls 56K, albeit, or 64K, albeit, through the voice line and avoiding the minute.
56.
56.
Yeah, that's what you'd wind up with is 56.
Oh, with, I'm sorry?
You'd wind up with 56 if you went data over voice.
56.
And you can do bonding as well and achieve a speed of 112.
Right.
Oh, I'm sorry.
You're saying you're thinking 56K?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, I'm sorry.
And I defy anyone to tell me the difference between 112 and 128.
Probably not much, but you need a special computer.
I mean, a lot of the serial ports only support up to 56K.
That's not true at all.
And any serial port that, I mean, any computer that you've bought over the past few years can go up to 115, 200.
All right.
And if it can't, you should just go out and buy a serial card for $50.
I was thinking more on the Mungle Max.
I know the new UARTs for the PCs go up to 230, actually.
And the power PCs go up to 230.
But the old Max, and I guess the older PCs can't go up to that.
Yeah, the older Max, they only go up to 57, 600.
But you can get a newer, what is it, new bus?
You can get a new bus card with the serial ports on it.
You can always set up an Ethernet port, I guess.
Okay, listen, thanks for the phone call.
We're going to try to squeeze in one more real quick because we're almost out of time here.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Yeah, I just wanted to tell you that last caller that was after me.
I didn't know what he was talking about.
Well, okay, but I'm sure many people are after you, but we have to get to another phone call.
You've been on already.
Wait a minute.
I want to tell you that there are a lot of people removing the handsets on these blue charger call phones.
And I'm putting up a picture of that on my website, and I'm also putting up a picture of the funny coin returns on co-carts
that you don't push for a coin to get your coin.
It's like your quarter.
It comes back like one through a slot, like one coin at a time.
What if you're making a long-distance call?
You need to speak up.
You're fading away.
Barely hear you.
Speak up a little louder.
I can't hear you at all.
Let's go to another phone call here.
That happens sometimes.
People fade away.
Good evening.
You're on.
Oh, boy.
I'll tell you, what a week.
I mean, we lost two of the great Hollywood actors, McLean Stevenson and Martin Balsam.
It's amazing.
I can dial a phone.
But the reason I'm calling you is I'd like to know.
Last week, you guys played some music that just really sent me, and I was like, wow.
And I just got to know, do you know what the name of the song?
You played some song.
I think you opened the show.
Oh, you're talking about Folk Implosion.
Yes.
Is that what it was?
I had people stopping me on the street asking me what that was.
That's what it was?
Yeah, Folk Implosion.
They're great.
You can find that on the kids' soundtrack.
Right.
It's bought then.
I'm getting it.
Thank you.
Okay.
I'm glad we were able to help you out.
A lot of people were asking about that, so I'm glad we were able to accomplish something.
That's it.
Do you have something, Joker?
Yeah.
Make it quick.
You have 10 seconds.
Add more fuel to the fire.
At the Internet World Mecklamedia Expo, they had representatives from the ISDN department at 9X,
and the word I got from them is they're dropping the penny-made surcharge.
Okay.
So you didn't get it on paper, but...
You've just gotten another rumor here.
Yeah, exactly.
All right.
So now we are officially spreading the rumor, too.
Great.
All right.
When we know officially, we'll certainly let you know, too.
Anyway, this is Emanuel Goldstein for Fiber Optic and the rest of the crew saying good
night for now.
Why is my theme not coming up now?
You see that?
It's playing.
I have it up, and it's not coming over.
The studio is broken.
No, that's not right.
That button isn't what it's supposed to hit.
Oh, right.
No, no.
See, it's wrong, and our theme is playing now, but we're running out of time.
We have no theme tonight, folks.
We have to do something else.
Housing Notebook is up next.
Our theme is playing in the background someplace, but not...
Oh, that's fine.
What's why?
No, I have Cart 2 up.
I have it up.
Let's give them an announcement.
Let's give them an announcement instead.
Good night, folks.
We'll see you next week.
This is an astonishing work, breathtakingly bold in conception and passionately written,
and in its historographical aspects, convincing.
So wrote Princeton University's Institute for Advanced Study about British historian Dr.
Martin Bernal's monumental work, Black Athena, the Afro-Asiatic roots of classical,
Civilization.
On Friday, February 23rd, beginning at 6 p.m., Dr. Bernal will deliver a rare public lecture
at the Martin Luther King, Jr. Labor Center, 310 West 43rd Street in Manhattan, near 8th Avenue.
He'll then be joined by renowned historians, Drs. John Henry Clark and Jan Carew, for a lively debate
around the theme of Africa's relationship to Greco-Roman culture, modern civilization, and
attempts at historical revisionism in academe.
For more information, please call 212-330-8277.
That's 212-330-8277.
And you are tuned to listener-sponsored WBAI-FM in New York City, where the time is 9 o'clock.
And in case you haven't heard the news, Pat Buchanan has won the New Hampshire primary,
and we'll deal with that in a minute or two.
This is Housing Notebook, Karen WBAI.
And in honor of Pat's victory, we will open with something a little different today.
Hmm.
And why is it that this...
There we go.
Why is it that this turntable does not work?
Is this...
You had a problem...
This is what you had a problem with?
Mm-hmm.
That's the bad one.
That's the bad one.
Nothing works.
Let me try that.
Hmm.
They're all...
It says on air, and we hear nothing.
Great.
Our brand new equipment here that you've all pledged a million dollars to.
We keep going.
Off to a great start here, but we will give you this opening theme, and I'll tap you Canada
folks, no matter what.
This is WBAI.