[00:42.780 --> 00:44.340]  Okay, I've had about just enough of that.
[00:44.480 --> 00:49.000]  It's time for Off the Hook here on radio station WBAI in New York.
[00:55.660 --> 00:57.700]  The telephone keeps ringing.
[00:57.940 --> 01:00.280]  So I ripped it off the wall.
[01:01.160 --> 01:03.300]  I cut myself while shaving.
[01:03.900 --> 01:05.920]  Now I can't make a cough.
[01:06.540 --> 01:08.680]  It couldn't get much worse.
[01:09.240 --> 01:11.280]  But if it could, they would.
[01:11.540 --> 01:14.220]  Bumbly Bump was the best, expect the worst.
[01:14.820 --> 01:16.760]  I hope that's understood.
[01:16.980 --> 01:17.820]  Bumbly Bump!
[01:44.090 --> 01:45.070]  I'm just not sure.
[01:45.990 --> 01:46.870]  I'm not aware.
[01:47.790 --> 01:48.870]  I don't recall.
[01:49.690 --> 01:50.610]  I don't know.
[01:51.890 --> 01:53.070]  I'm not sure either.
[01:53.850 --> 01:54.930]  I'm just not sure.
[01:55.830 --> 01:56.770]  I'm not aware.
[01:57.710 --> 01:58.790]  I don't recall.
[01:59.590 --> 02:00.510]  I don't know.
[02:01.790 --> 02:02.970]  I'm not sure either.
[02:03.730 --> 02:04.850]  I'm just not sure.
[02:05.730 --> 02:06.670]  I'm not aware.
[02:34.660 --> 02:36.880]  What do you think, Richard Nixon, Bill Clinton?
[02:38.120 --> 02:39.040]  I have no idea.
[02:39.300 --> 02:39.940]  No idea, okay.
[02:40.220 --> 02:41.260]  Well, we're gonna get to it.
[02:41.260 --> 02:43.620]  It sounds like a congressional testimony when you look at it.
[02:43.720 --> 02:45.380]  It does, it certainly does.
[02:46.800 --> 02:52.460]  And we'll be getting to more of it, yes, throughout the hour.
[02:53.200 --> 02:56.440]  This is Off The Hook, Emmanuel Gustin here with you, Isaac over there.
[02:57.380 --> 03:01.660]  And I only have one ear, so I might sound kind of off-base because of that fact.
[03:03.620 --> 03:05.680]  We've got all kinds of fun things happening.
[03:07.600 --> 03:09.680]  I guess I should just get right to it, right?
[03:09.880 --> 03:10.460]  Let's jump in.
[03:10.720 --> 03:18.200]  Yeah, well, in case you don't know, in case you haven't been keeping up with things, and apparently, Isaac, you have not been keeping up with things, you don't know this voice.
[03:18.340 --> 03:18.780]  I don't know.
[03:20.240 --> 03:21.340]  I'm not sure I know.
[03:22.080 --> 03:23.380]  He's not sure he doesn't know?
[03:24.200 --> 03:24.940]  I'm not aware.
[03:26.060 --> 03:26.960]  I don't recall.
[03:27.940 --> 03:28.700]  I don't know.
[03:31.360 --> 03:32.860]  Is there someone who didn't do their own work?
[03:32.860 --> 03:32.980]  I'm not sure.
[03:34.040 --> 03:34.840]  I'm not aware.
[03:35.900 --> 03:36.880]  I don't recall.
[03:37.780 --> 03:38.600]  I don't know.
[03:39.980 --> 03:41.100]  I'm not sure I know.
[03:41.940 --> 03:42.920]  I'm just not sure.
[03:43.940 --> 03:44.740]  I'm not aware.
[03:45.800 --> 03:46.740]  I don't recall.
[03:46.740 --> 03:50.940]  Well, that is... the voice of... Jack Valente.
[03:51.260 --> 03:51.560]  Jack!
[03:51.840 --> 03:52.000]  Yeah.
[03:52.180 --> 03:52.800]  I'm just not sure.
[03:53.040 --> 03:53.980]  You're a favorite person.
[03:54.170 --> 03:54.620]  I'm not aware.
[03:54.840 --> 03:55.120]  Yeah.
[03:55.820 --> 03:56.620]  I don't recall.
[03:56.820 --> 03:57.840]  He doesn't seem to know very much.
[03:57.900 --> 03:58.320]  I don't know.
[03:58.420 --> 04:02.600]  He doesn't know anything, uh, as far as, uh, who's got the testimony, since we... I'm not sure.
[04:02.600 --> 04:06.540]  We don't have a copy of the actual testimony other than... I don't recall.
[04:06.820 --> 04:07.360]  Some of this.
[04:07.780 --> 04:08.080]  I don't know.
[04:08.080 --> 04:08.240]  Okay.
[04:08.420 --> 04:09.360]  That is very large.
[04:09.580 --> 04:12.220]  Give me, give me the, uh, yeah, hundred or so pages.
[04:12.400 --> 04:12.560]  I'm not sure.
[04:13.420 --> 04:14.360]  And, uh, I'm not aware.
[04:15.240 --> 04:16.670]  I'll just have to thumb through this.
[04:17.440 --> 04:18.200]  I don't know.
[04:19.640 --> 04:20.340]  I'm not sure.
[04:20.600 --> 04:21.960]  Is it a hundred pages of this?
[04:22.180 --> 04:22.460]  I'm not sure.
[04:22.880 --> 04:23.860]  Uh, pretty much.
[04:23.960 --> 04:24.940]  Pretty much.
[04:25.980 --> 04:28.600]  Um, head of the MPAA for 34 years.
[04:28.670 --> 04:30.060]  Well, here's, okay, here's the interesting thing.
[04:30.200 --> 04:32.220]  You can read all of this on the 20-second site.
[04:32.280 --> 04:38.200]  In fact, you can hear the audio of this, both in, uh, in real audio and MP3 format.
[04:39.080 --> 04:44.180]  Um, basically what he, what, uh, what, um, you know, it's really annoying.
[04:44.320 --> 04:45.880]  I'm going to turn this down for a few minutes.
[04:46.000 --> 04:46.670]  I can imagine.
[04:46.740 --> 04:48.760]  Now how, uh, how our lawyers felt.
[04:51.260 --> 04:51.640]  Yeah.
[04:52.100 --> 04:59.180]  Um, basically, uh, the first thing he was asked was, what is the DVD CCA?
[04:59.580 --> 05:01.580]  And he had no idea what the DVD CCA is.
[05:02.060 --> 05:06.260]  Uh, do you know who issues the licenses to the hardware manufacturers that play DVDs?
[05:06.320 --> 05:06.560]  No.
[05:07.180 --> 05:11.800]  Uh, do you know who issues the licenses to the replicators that make DVDs from the films that are submitted to them?
[05:11.860 --> 05:12.360]  No, I do not.
[05:12.480 --> 05:14.400]  Have you ever met anybody at the DVD CCA?
[05:14.400 --> 05:15.360]  Not that I'm aware of.
[05:15.900 --> 05:17.720]  Uh, do you know what that entity is at all?
[05:17.820 --> 05:18.500]  No, I don't.
[05:18.600 --> 05:19.760]  Do you know who controls licenses?
[05:20.120 --> 05:20.640]  No, I don't.
[05:21.400 --> 05:23.800]  Uh, do you know the name of the defendant in this case?
[05:24.320 --> 05:25.170]  I'm not sure.
[05:25.600 --> 05:26.760]  I'm just not sure.
[05:27.920 --> 05:31.360]  What's your best recollection of the defendant's name, 2600?
[05:31.520 --> 05:33.060]  Does the name Goldstein mean anything to you?
[05:33.120 --> 05:34.360]  No, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
[05:35.640 --> 05:39.020]  This is the same guy that put out press releases with my name on it.
[05:39.060 --> 05:40.300]  That you're evil, you're a pirate.
[05:40.620 --> 05:43.800]  That I'm evil, I'm an evil pirate, and all kinds of horrible things going on there.
[05:44.260 --> 05:49.280]  Actually, I'm going to pass this around, so if anybody finds anything interesting, please, uh, let us know.
[05:49.320 --> 05:50.020]  Still someone with that.
[05:50.020 --> 05:51.600]  Yeah, it's a lot of testimony there.
[05:52.580 --> 05:58.060]  Um, yes, well, someone other than Isaac, because he can't talk and read at the same time.
[05:58.140 --> 05:59.020]  That becomes somewhat difficult.
[05:59.200 --> 06:01.280]  Yeah, so let's try and find something.
[06:01.740 --> 06:04.200]  Um, but yeah, that's pretty much how it went the whole way.
[06:04.760 --> 06:10.580]  Uh, now either, you know, according to all the feedback we've been getting, either this guy is a genius or he doesn't know anything.
[06:11.340 --> 06:12.160]  You know, and, uh...
[06:12.160 --> 06:12.880]  One extreme or the other.
[06:13.060 --> 06:13.240]  Yeah.
[06:13.440 --> 06:15.440]  This was actually taken how long ago?
[06:15.520 --> 06:18.380]  This was taken, I believe, two weeks ago.
[06:18.520 --> 06:19.680]  And it was only released recently.
[06:19.680 --> 06:21.740]  It was released, uh, last Thursday.
[06:21.960 --> 06:22.180]  Last Thursday.
[06:22.180 --> 06:24.720]  Actually, yeah, the transcript was released Thursday.
[06:24.720 --> 06:27.660]  The audio, uh, we got up on our site early Saturday morning.
[06:27.900 --> 06:28.220]  Okay.
[06:28.620 --> 06:30.760]  Uh, we had to jump through all kinds of hoops to get that.
[06:31.220 --> 06:38.760]  Uh, there are bits omitted, um, but, uh, the, the, the main gist of it is, uh, is there.
[06:39.220 --> 06:40.180]  I'm just not sure.
[06:42.260 --> 06:42.740]  Yeah.
[06:43.040 --> 06:45.540]  And, uh, continues on like that for quite some time.
[06:48.380 --> 06:48.860]  Yeah.
[06:48.860 --> 06:48.920]  Yeah.
[06:50.040 --> 06:54.020]  So that's, uh, yeah, Alex is here and, uh, you found something interesting.
[06:54.700 --> 06:57.040]  Well, considering what he just kept repeating.
[06:57.320 --> 06:57.540]  Uh-huh.
[06:57.760 --> 07:04.060]  I believe it was Garbus who asked him, uh, during the course of time you've testified before Congress.
[07:04.500 --> 07:05.920]  His answer, yes.
[07:06.880 --> 07:07.320]  Obviously.
[07:07.720 --> 07:07.940]  Right.
[07:08.220 --> 07:08.420]  Yeah.
[07:08.560 --> 07:10.420]  He seems to be quite suited to that.
[07:10.580 --> 07:10.780]  Mm-hmm.
[07:10.960 --> 07:12.440]  More or less than 1,000 times.
[07:12.580 --> 07:14.900]  Oh, no, I haven't testified 1,000 times, but a lot.
[07:14.900 --> 07:16.560]  Uh, 300, I haven't any idea.
[07:17.520 --> 07:18.200]  A lot.
[07:18.360 --> 07:19.540]  I'd like to read his testimony.
[07:19.740 --> 07:24.340]  I bet his testimony at Congress was, uh, I don't know, a bit more revealing than, than his testimony here.
[07:25.260 --> 07:31.080]  Um, this person writes in, Jack Valenti's testimony is the most intriguingly, horrifyingly, bemusing work I have ever read.
[07:31.080 --> 07:36.680]  After reading it, the only conclusion I can come to is that Jack Valenti is a comic genius, a scheming fool, or a skilled bar member.
[07:37.240 --> 07:40.220]  Uh, he says, I'm not aware of any discussions I've had.
[07:40.220 --> 07:43.880]  And, of course, of course, that's beautiful.
[07:44.020 --> 07:45.580]  That's something that was attributed to Clinton as well.
[07:45.780 --> 07:45.980]  Yeah.
[07:46.440 --> 07:46.560]  Yeah.
[07:46.980 --> 07:48.080]  A master politician.
[07:48.320 --> 07:55.100]  I mean, this guy has been in the White House, not as the president, but he's definitely, he was, he was in the motorcade when, when Kennedy was shot.
[07:56.060 --> 07:56.400]  Yeah.
[07:57.520 --> 07:57.960]  Unbelievable.
[07:58.240 --> 07:59.920]  He was on the plane when Johnson took his oath.
[08:01.340 --> 08:03.160]  He was Johnson's special advisor.
[08:03.380 --> 08:04.660]  He was Johnson's special advisor, yeah.
[08:04.920 --> 08:05.580]  Pretty special.
[08:05.720 --> 08:07.740]  He sure advised him into some good things, didn't he?
[08:08.460 --> 08:14.920]  Uh, of course, when, uh, taken out of context, this seems nonsensical, but when put in context, it is worthy of the Best Comedic Performance Award.
[08:14.920 --> 08:21.020]  This man shows cunning and genius in his answers that, that is when he's rambling and confusing the defendant and the plaintiff.
[08:23.580 --> 08:31.500]  Uh, hopefully we'll have the video up soon, we just don't have the bandwidth for it, or the means to record it right now, but, uh, hopefully we'll fix that pretty soon.
[08:31.720 --> 08:34.500]  But, uh, it's, it's, it's captivating, I'll say that much.
[08:35.560 --> 08:36.620]  Uh, that's, that's...
[08:36.620 --> 08:37.540]  You mean hypnotic?
[08:37.740 --> 08:39.060]  Yeah, it's pretty hypnotic.
[08:40.360 --> 08:41.760]  Pretty, pretty, uh, pretty amazing.
[08:41.960 --> 08:43.020]  How can you possibly not know?
[08:43.400 --> 08:43.680]  Yeah.
[08:44.220 --> 08:46.340]  Well, I'm gonna be in this position probably another week or so.
[08:46.440 --> 08:46.700]  Yes.
[08:46.860 --> 08:49.260]  So, uh, I'll have the chance, I'll have the chance to say I don't know.
[08:49.440 --> 08:50.000]  I've already told you.
[08:50.200 --> 08:50.660]  Don't recall.
[08:50.940 --> 08:53.240]  It'll be the most boring hours of your life.
[08:53.840 --> 08:54.660]  Well, I don't know.
[08:54.800 --> 08:56.780]  Will I be boring people, or will they be boring me?
[08:58.100 --> 08:58.740]  Mutual boredom.
[08:58.820 --> 09:05.360]  Well, I mean, they're trying to dig up all kinds of dirt, so, I mean, they might reveal things that I didn't think they'd find, and so I'll be shocked, and I'll be surprised.
[09:05.480 --> 09:06.100]  That won't be boring.
[09:06.100 --> 09:08.520]  Well, you know, be, uh, scared, intimidated.
[09:08.520 --> 09:10.520]  All you have to reply is, well, I wasn't aware of that.
[09:10.780 --> 09:12.220]  Well, you lived this life, didn't you?
[09:12.400 --> 09:13.740]  Well, I'm not sure.
[09:13.980 --> 09:14.640]  Who told you that?
[09:14.740 --> 09:14.920]  Right.
[09:15.040 --> 09:15.800]  Yeah, things like that.
[09:16.300 --> 09:17.620]  Well, you really can't ask back.
[09:18.720 --> 09:19.580]  You can't ask back?
[09:19.760 --> 09:20.100]  Not really.
[09:21.340 --> 09:24.500]  I suppose you can't, uh, stand up on the table and shout and things like that.
[09:24.660 --> 09:24.820]  No, you're allowed to do that, though.
[09:24.820 --> 09:25.580]  All kinds of restrictions.
[09:25.720 --> 09:25.920]  Can he?
[09:26.020 --> 09:26.260]  All right.
[09:27.760 --> 09:29.180]  Well, so I'm looking forward to it.
[09:29.280 --> 09:29.740]  I really am.
[09:30.120 --> 09:37.400]  And, of course, the trial's scheduled for the, uh, the day after H2K, which, uh, takes place, July 14th through 16th.
[09:37.820 --> 09:44.940]  Uh, we have new, uh, a new speaker list, um, uh, an addition to the speaker list up on our website, h2k.net.
[09:45.520 --> 09:48.640]  Uh, so, uh, we definitely would like people to visit that.
[09:48.660 --> 09:53.940]  Of course, we'll be adding some more, some more speakers as the weeks go by.
[09:54.220 --> 09:55.520]  It's not locked in stone.
[09:55.520 --> 09:56.960]  We can always add some more.
[09:57.060 --> 10:00.120]  We've got plenty of room and a whole weekend full of activities.
[10:01.600 --> 10:02.320]  It's going to be fun.
[10:02.500 --> 10:02.900]  24 hours.
[10:02.900 --> 10:03.060]  24 hours, right?
[10:03.140 --> 10:03.720]  24 hours.
[10:03.960 --> 10:10.040]  We're not going to have speakers running 24 hours, unless we have speakers for 24 hours, but basically the network room is going to be open the whole time.
[10:11.000 --> 10:15.520]  And, uh, people will never have to stop if they have the energy to keep going.
[10:15.800 --> 10:20.460]  Well, you know, you could do all three days straight at H2K, but then you're going to miss out the fun of the trial.
[10:20.660 --> 10:21.120]  That's true.
[10:21.600 --> 10:23.260]  So, you've got to pace yourself at these things.
[10:23.660 --> 10:23.840]  Yeah.
[10:24.720 --> 10:25.300]  Yeah, you do.
[10:26.740 --> 10:28.740]  Anything, uh, anything new in your neck of the woods?
[10:29.540 --> 10:30.260]  Not particularly.
[10:30.260 --> 10:30.620]  Uh-huh.
[10:30.640 --> 10:32.000]  Same sort of things going on.
[10:32.320 --> 10:32.460]  Yeah.
[10:32.920 --> 10:34.000]  I'd be afraid of going, though.
[10:34.380 --> 10:34.540]  Yeah.
[10:35.780 --> 10:37.020]  Yes, I, uh...
[10:37.020 --> 10:40.140]  A lot of good reactions to the, uh, MP3, uh, streaming.
[10:40.360 --> 10:42.020]  Not streaming that we do now, but the storage.
[10:42.100 --> 10:42.660]  The archiving.
[10:42.820 --> 10:43.820]  The archiving in MP3.
[10:43.940 --> 10:45.180]  We started last week's show.
[10:45.760 --> 10:53.020]  This person says, I can now listen to LTH in my Rio, and also can finally delete pesky real audio with all its mainstream media advertising and other BS.
[10:54.080 --> 10:55.600]  And, yeah, you know, it's...
[10:56.640 --> 10:58.180]  It's gotten that way, lately.
[11:00.340 --> 11:00.780]  Um...
[11:00.780 --> 11:03.240]  Well, real audio does play MP3s.
[11:03.600 --> 11:04.500]  Yeah, that's true.
[11:04.500 --> 11:06.980]  It plays MP3s, but, uh...
[11:06.980 --> 11:08.740]  You don't need real audio...
[11:08.740 --> 11:10.040]  To play MP3s.
[11:10.120 --> 11:12.500]  And I think that's the point people are getting at.
[11:13.700 --> 11:14.140]  Um...
[11:14.140 --> 11:17.000]  But if you want the commercialized crap, you can hang on to it.
[11:17.040 --> 11:17.980]  Yeah, if you really want that.
[11:18.840 --> 11:22.460]  You see, uh, this, uh, Courtney Love piece in Salon.com?
[11:22.900 --> 11:23.260]  No.
[11:23.420 --> 11:26.000]  She really goes off on the, uh, on the record companies.
[11:26.900 --> 11:29.300]  Oh, this is, this is her commentary on the RIA app.
[11:29.420 --> 11:30.140]  Yeah, yeah.
[11:30.480 --> 11:35.600]  I can't read all of it because it's, it's amazingly long, but I can tell you that it's on, uh, www.salon.com.
[11:35.700 --> 11:36.600]  It's S-A-L-O-N.
[11:37.340 --> 11:39.500]  Slash text, slash feature, and there's a lot of other...
[11:39.500 --> 11:41.580]  After that, you can probably find it if you look around.
[11:42.540 --> 11:42.900]  Um...
[11:42.900 --> 11:46.760]  This unedited transcript of comments she made here in New York on May 16th.
[11:46.760 --> 11:49.360]  Um, a couple of, uh, highlights.
[11:49.540 --> 11:50.980]  Today, I want to talk about piracy in music.
[11:51.160 --> 11:51.840]  What is piracy?
[11:51.940 --> 11:55.500]  Piracy is the act of stealing an artist's work without any intention of paying for it.
[11:55.740 --> 11:57.820]  I'm not talking about Napster-type software.
[11:58.000 --> 12:00.580]  I'm talking about major label recording contracts.
[12:00.960 --> 12:01.400]  Hmm.
[12:02.420 --> 12:02.700]  Yeah.
[12:03.380 --> 12:08.720]  Um, just to give you a quick example of, of how it works, how it really works.
[12:09.340 --> 12:17.500]  Um, this story is about a bidding war, a bidding war band that gets a huge deal with a 20% royalty rate and a million dollar advance.
[12:18.240 --> 12:21.200]  No bidding war band ever got a 20% royalty, but whatever.
[12:21.660 --> 12:28.780]  This is my funny math based on some reality, and I just want to qualify it by saying that I'm positive it's better math than what Edgar Bronfman Jr., remember him?
[12:29.240 --> 12:32.920]  The president and CEO of Seagram, which owns Polygram, would provide.
[12:33.400 --> 12:34.900]  Now, what happens to that million dollars?
[12:35.780 --> 12:38.120]  They spend half a million to record their album.
[12:39.060 --> 12:41.220]  That, uh, leaves the band with $500,000.
[12:41.660 --> 12:42.360]  You ready to understand, Isaac?
[12:42.480 --> 12:42.660]  Okay.
[12:42.880 --> 12:42.980]  Okay.
[12:43.160 --> 12:43.520]  Good, okay.
[12:43.680 --> 12:43.820]  50%.
[12:43.820 --> 12:45.060]  I don't want to go too fast for you.
[12:45.220 --> 12:46.240]  Well, I got to keep track of this.
[12:46.260 --> 12:46.520]  All right.
[12:47.180 --> 12:51.440]  Uh, they pay $100,000 to their manager for 20% commission, leaving how much, Isaac?
[12:51.640 --> 12:52.160]  Uh, $400,000.
[12:52.160 --> 12:53.080]  $400,000 is left.
[12:53.260 --> 12:56.500]  They pay $25,000 each to their lawyer and business manager.
[12:56.500 --> 12:58.500]  So that's $50,000, that's $350,000.
[12:58.740 --> 13:01.240]  That leaves $350,000 for the four band members to split.
[13:01.460 --> 13:06.380]  That, after $170,000 in taxes, there's $180,000 left.
[13:06.500 --> 13:08.700]  That comes out to $45,000 per person.
[13:08.920 --> 13:13.380]  That's $45,000 to live on for a year until the record gets released.
[13:14.020 --> 13:16.180]  The record is a big hit and sells a million copies.
[13:16.900 --> 13:25.680]  How a bidding war band sells a million copies of its debut record is another rant entirely, but it's based on any basic civics class knowledge that any of us have about cartels.
[13:25.680 --> 13:33.400]  Put simply, the antitrust laws in this country are basically a joke, protecting us just enough to not have to rename our park service the Philip Morris National Park Service.
[13:33.880 --> 13:36.860]  So, this band releases two singles...
[13:36.860 --> 13:38.260]  Don't worry, Isaac, it'll come.
[13:39.340 --> 13:42.320]  This band releases two singles and makes two videos.
[13:42.440 --> 13:47.080]  The two videos cost a million dollars to make, and 50% of the video production costs are recouped out of the band's royalties.
[13:47.260 --> 13:50.800]  The band gets $200,000 in tour support, which is 100% recoupable.
[13:50.800 --> 13:54.720]  The record company spends $300,000 on independent radio promotion.
[13:54.880 --> 13:57.240]  You have to pay independent promotion to get your song on the radio.
[13:57.900 --> 14:06.800]  Independent promotion is a system where the record companies use middlemen so they can pretend not to know that radio stations, the unified broadcast system, are getting paid to play their records.
[14:07.220 --> 14:10.200]  All of those independent promotion costs are charged to the band.
[14:10.500 --> 14:15.760]  Since the original million dollar advance is also recoupable, the band owes $2 million to the record company.
[14:16.640 --> 14:24.720]  If all the million records are sold at full price with no discounts or record clubs, the band earns $2 million in royalties, since their 20% royalty works out to $2 a record.
[14:25.040 --> 14:29.260]  $2 million in royalties minus $2 million in recoupable expenses equals zero.
[14:30.380 --> 14:31.940]  How much does the record company make?
[14:32.100 --> 14:33.780]  They grossed $11 million.
[14:35.660 --> 14:41.060]  And she arrives at zero for the artists and $11 million for the record company.
[14:41.100 --> 14:41.780]  Yeah, it's all here.
[14:41.980 --> 14:42.180]  Okay.
[14:42.320 --> 14:43.400]  I just went over the whole thing.
[14:43.840 --> 14:46.440]  Do keep in mind that these artists do sign the contracts.
[14:46.660 --> 14:47.060]  Well, yeah, of course.
[14:47.060 --> 14:48.320]  The artists do sign the contracts.
[14:48.480 --> 14:49.240]  But here's the thing.
[14:49.500 --> 14:51.280]  Today, they don't have to do that anymore.
[14:51.500 --> 14:51.640]  Correct.
[14:51.640 --> 14:52.520]  That's the beauty of it.
[14:52.600 --> 14:52.780]  Yes.
[14:52.880 --> 14:53.820]  That is the beauty of it.
[14:53.940 --> 14:57.180]  So, I'd like to see this whole system change.
[14:57.220 --> 14:59.620]  And the only way it's going to change is if things like this flourish.
[14:59.960 --> 15:01.540]  If we encourage...
[15:01.540 --> 15:03.120]  You know, I used Napster.
[15:03.340 --> 15:04.980]  I used Napster for the second time in my life.
[15:05.000 --> 15:05.200]  You did?
[15:05.200 --> 15:05.840]  Two days ago.
[15:05.920 --> 15:06.720]  I've actually never used it.
[15:14.040 --> 15:18.900]  And so, I wanted to see, okay, I'm not going to go out and buy this thing just based on someone's review.
[15:18.920 --> 15:19.620]  I want to hear it.
[15:19.720 --> 15:23.700]  So, I found it very quickly on Napster and played something.
[15:24.360 --> 15:24.920]  It sucked.
[15:25.060 --> 15:25.920]  It was the worst thing I ever heard.
[15:25.940 --> 15:26.860]  So, I'm not going to buy it.
[15:27.520 --> 15:28.580]  Napster saved me at $20.
[15:29.340 --> 15:29.780]  Not bad.
[15:29.940 --> 15:30.460]  Yeah, not bad.
[15:30.460 --> 15:33.880]  But, of course, I'm sure the record companies will look at this as them losing.
[15:34.240 --> 15:37.400]  Yeah, they lost $20 that I would have spent and been unhappy about.
[15:38.520 --> 15:39.300]  So, that's...
[15:39.960 --> 15:40.680]  Well, what is it?
[15:40.760 --> 15:43.600]  Something like 80% of the sales have gone up since Napster?
[15:43.940 --> 15:44.520]  Is that much?
[15:44.700 --> 15:45.660]  That's what everybody's claiming.
[15:45.800 --> 15:47.100]  That's the new percentage.
[15:47.220 --> 15:48.400]  That's fairly astronomical.
[15:48.800 --> 15:49.660]  That's what I've heard.
[15:50.020 --> 15:50.280]  Mm-hmm.
[15:51.440 --> 15:52.460]  Seems likely, though.
[15:52.900 --> 15:55.940]  Now, here's something that...
[15:55.940 --> 15:57.100]  Actually, who wants to do this?
[15:57.100 --> 16:01.420]  Someone went to the trouble of printing out all possible Verizon names on the telephone.
[16:01.660 --> 16:04.880]  Yeah, someone actually sent that to the OTH address, if I recall correctly.
[16:05.280 --> 16:07.840]  So, there might be another word in there that spells something even better.
[16:08.040 --> 16:08.680]  Oh, I looked.
[16:09.020 --> 16:09.520]  You looked?
[16:09.600 --> 16:10.260]  You went through the whole thing?
[16:10.340 --> 16:10.840]  Nothing better?
[16:12.240 --> 16:13.040]  Nothing, uh...
[16:13.040 --> 16:14.980]  It was like a...
[16:15.860 --> 16:16.660]  T-U...
[16:16.660 --> 16:18.540]  I forget what it was, but, you know.
[16:19.280 --> 16:19.680]  Vescazon.
[16:19.800 --> 16:20.160]  Not all...
[16:20.160 --> 16:20.240]  Yeah.
[16:21.320 --> 16:22.800]  It's kind of an odd combination.
[16:23.000 --> 16:24.200]  It is an odd combination of letters.
[16:24.820 --> 16:25.200]  Terezu.
[16:25.400 --> 16:25.800]  There you go.
[16:25.860 --> 16:26.220]  Terezu.
[16:26.260 --> 16:26.620]  Terezu?
[16:26.620 --> 16:27.400]  Yeah, that's a good one.
[16:28.940 --> 16:29.260]  Terezan.
[16:30.420 --> 16:31.720]  Now, Terezu's in there twice or so.
[16:31.840 --> 16:32.780]  Oh, because there's two O's.
[16:32.900 --> 16:33.220]  I get it.
[16:33.720 --> 16:34.040]  Interesting.
[16:34.260 --> 16:37.200]  So, yeah, you can spell out all kinds of things on a touchtone phone.
[16:38.440 --> 16:39.700]  Now, this is...
[16:40.040 --> 16:41.620]  Actually, Shana, you sent me this piece.
[16:41.760 --> 16:43.020]  But I tried to print it out.
[16:43.140 --> 16:44.540]  The stupid Wired website.
[16:44.860 --> 16:45.960]  What is with those people?
[16:46.040 --> 16:47.360]  They don't want you printing things.
[16:47.500 --> 16:48.380]  They omit...
[16:48.380 --> 16:48.700]  Look at this.
[16:48.800 --> 16:51.340]  A blank page when you try to print from Wired.
[16:51.580 --> 16:53.240]  When you go to a Wired site...
[16:53.240 --> 16:54.020]  Is this the printer-friendly version?
[16:54.200 --> 16:56.900]  The printer-friendly is not terribly friendly either, but it's a little...
[16:56.900 --> 16:57.900]  Have you noticed this?
[16:57.960 --> 17:00.560]  When you go to their site and then you try to go back, it won't let you.
[17:00.640 --> 17:01.880]  It goes back to the same page.
[17:02.900 --> 17:05.300]  They hijack your browser somehow so that you can't go back.
[17:05.420 --> 17:07.780]  And you have to hit it, like, really, really, really, really fast.
[17:08.240 --> 17:09.620]  And, yeah, you've never done this.
[17:10.040 --> 17:10.200]  No.
[17:10.200 --> 17:14.240]  Try going to any Wired story and then hitting back, and it's a nightmare.
[17:14.440 --> 17:14.980]  It really is.
[17:16.160 --> 17:17.300]  Avoid that site like the plague.
[17:17.460 --> 17:20.580]  But anyway, okay, Shana, you've got the story there, so hopefully you can read it.
[17:20.940 --> 17:22.800]  Oh, well, I mean, I'll sum it up.
[17:22.980 --> 17:24.120]  It's a little long, I guess.
[17:24.540 --> 17:26.200]  What happened, I guess, is...
[17:26.200 --> 17:26.680]  Whoa, whoa.
[17:26.920 --> 17:27.460]  I can move on.
[17:27.720 --> 17:36.180]  What happened in Washington State, there's this Senate race going on, and apparently the incumbent Republican Senator Slade Gordon.
[17:36.420 --> 17:37.680]  Slade's such a good word.
[17:38.220 --> 17:48.680]  But I guess the Democratic challenger, Maria Cantwell, during her campaign, I guess what they did was, apparently he's got this anti-environmental thing going on.
[17:48.880 --> 17:50.720]  And so what they did was they had...
[17:53.540 --> 17:54.160]  Feedback.
[17:54.560 --> 17:57.240]  What she did was she linked to a picture.
[17:57.240 --> 18:07.260]  She had a picture of him next to a guy who's an environmental protester guy who's dressed up as Buster the Salmon on the site.
[18:07.480 --> 18:13.400]  And so I guess what it did is the picture pointed to Gordon's website.
[18:13.600 --> 18:19.100]  And so Gordon's people accused Cantwell of hijacking his site.
[18:19.280 --> 18:22.120]  Apparently this was what they considered hacking.
[18:22.640 --> 18:29.060]  So wait, the person basically linked to a picture that was on the opponent's site, and they considered that hacking.
[18:29.240 --> 18:32.360]  Well, because they changed the code.
[18:32.600 --> 18:37.200]  So the Republican on Mr. Gordon's people changed the code on the site.
[18:37.400 --> 18:51.280]  And so then the next time somebody went to Cantwell's site, instead of seeing the picture of the Republican senator incumbent and the foam rubber Buster the Salmon person, it had another picture on it.
[18:51.360 --> 18:52.280]  But it was their own site.
[18:52.980 --> 18:54.600]  They changed the picture on their own site.
[18:54.600 --> 18:59.760]  And because the other people were linking to it, they thought they changed it on their site.
[18:59.940 --> 19:01.540]  Yeah, well, this is piracy.
[19:01.920 --> 19:02.300]  Yeah.
[19:02.620 --> 19:03.060]  Unbelievable.
[19:03.440 --> 19:04.880]  This is actually kind of frightening.
[19:05.260 --> 19:14.900]  Basically, they left the image tag or the image link in the Democrat site, which just points, so that the person with the browser will load it from the Republican site.
[19:15.260 --> 19:20.040]  And then the Republicans redid their site and changed the graphic on their own.
[19:20.040 --> 19:21.920]  And that's insane.
[19:22.040 --> 19:26.980]  But the better part, though, is that Maria Cantwell is vice president of the internet media company, Real Networks.
[19:27.440 --> 19:27.800]  Okay.
[19:27.940 --> 19:28.140]  Really?
[19:28.520 --> 19:29.580]  Have we heard about Real Networks?
[19:29.580 --> 19:30.320]  Yes, we have.
[19:30.420 --> 19:30.600]  Okay.
[19:30.720 --> 19:30.820]  Right.
[19:32.840 --> 19:34.360]  And she still doesn't know what's going on.
[19:34.500 --> 19:34.620]  Right.
[19:34.800 --> 19:35.500]  That's not surprising.
[19:35.920 --> 19:38.920]  She's a self-proclaimed champion of internet privacy, too.
[19:39.280 --> 19:39.540]  Really?
[19:39.720 --> 19:40.080]  This is...
[19:40.080 --> 19:43.080]  Well, everyone's going to be that, by the way, because that's supposed to be the new issue.
[19:43.080 --> 19:44.040]  The Democrat woman, yeah.
[19:44.460 --> 19:51.340]  That's supposedly the new election issue, your privacy and the internet, where people are supposedly so concerned about that.
[19:51.380 --> 19:53.600]  So who's the clueless one here, Gordon or Cantwell?
[19:53.680 --> 19:55.060]  I think they both are a little bit.
[19:55.160 --> 20:01.200]  Because they're saying that the Gordon campaign has accused me of computer hacking, and that allegation has appeared in at least one headline.
[20:01.480 --> 20:03.800]  I'm an internet professional, and it's something I have to take seriously.
[20:03.800 --> 20:05.920]  It's a little like accusing an accountant of embezzling.
[20:06.480 --> 20:10.360]  It's clearly a bogus accusation, and it proves what Senator Gordon doesn't know about the internet.
[20:10.960 --> 20:17.800]  I thought it was unethical to take the graphic, put it on our server, and gain control of it, although I couldn't resist using the photo, so I deep-linked to it.
[20:19.160 --> 20:19.800]  Okay, all right.
[20:20.040 --> 20:20.140]  Yeah.
[20:20.920 --> 20:26.260]  You link to the other site, the person's browser loads it, so you don't actually house it on your own server.
[20:26.260 --> 20:28.020]  So according to Gordon...
[20:28.020 --> 20:28.920]  Which one is Gordon, though?
[20:29.200 --> 20:31.540]  Gordon is the Republican incumbent.
[20:31.860 --> 20:32.460]  Republican incumbent.
[20:32.800 --> 20:33.880]  Incumbent, though, that's very interesting.
[20:34.540 --> 20:34.820]  Yeah, yeah.
[20:36.420 --> 20:36.780]  Wow.
[20:37.040 --> 20:40.420]  Well, you know that two-thirds of us now are afraid of hackers and cybercriminals.
[20:40.460 --> 20:40.580]  Yeah.
[20:40.580 --> 20:41.220]  Did you see this poll?
[20:41.360 --> 20:41.920]  That's what I'm saying.
[20:41.920 --> 20:43.500]  This is going to be the big election issue.
[20:43.720 --> 20:45.540]  There's another poll that just happened.
[20:45.800 --> 20:46.960]  We're afraid of hackers now.
[20:47.760 --> 20:49.340]  Two-thirds are Americans, it says, or something like that?
[20:49.360 --> 20:51.500]  Two-thirds are afraid of hackers and cybercriminals.
[20:51.640 --> 20:51.760]  Yeah.
[20:51.920 --> 20:52.720]  What are the other third?
[20:52.880 --> 20:53.420]  Are they hackers?
[20:53.620 --> 20:54.560]  Yeah, the other third are the hackers.
[20:54.700 --> 20:54.880]  Okay.
[20:55.080 --> 20:55.880]  You know what I'm afraid of?
[20:55.880 --> 20:59.120]  I'm afraid of the GTE Bell merger, which got the go-ahead last week.
[20:59.320 --> 21:02.400]  The deal creates America's largest local telephone company.
[21:03.600 --> 21:16.960]  America's FCC said the new company would have to spin off GTE's internet assets, the new local and long-distance company, to be called Verizon, will control about 63 million telephone lines, one-third of all lines in the U.S.
[21:17.320 --> 21:23.600]  The new company aims to offer customers the full range of fixed line and wireless phone and internet services.
[21:24.480 --> 21:25.940]  Yeah, the full range.
[21:25.940 --> 21:27.080]  Do you see what's happening?
[21:27.600 --> 21:28.520]  Yo, I see what's happening.
[21:28.920 --> 21:33.240]  We're sliding back to the one large company who happens to be able to do it the best.
[21:34.040 --> 21:35.480]  You think this is a good thing, Isaac?
[21:35.580 --> 21:37.260]  You really think it's a good thing to have monopolies?
[21:39.520 --> 21:40.300]  I'm not sure.
[21:41.380 --> 21:42.300]  Answer the question.
[21:43.480 --> 21:44.240]  I'm not aware.
[21:44.520 --> 21:45.680]  No, but that's what it's coming to.
[21:45.960 --> 21:50.320]  All this antitrust action is, you know, the same thing's going to happen with Microsoft.
[21:50.760 --> 21:54.940]  You have to know that it's not necessarily the people who are best at what they're doing.
[21:54.940 --> 22:01.800]  It's the people who are best at controlling the market, the best at the industry, the best more at the politics than at the actual service.
[22:02.300 --> 22:08.640]  Well, the people who are really bad at the actual service won't be surviving to the point where they can go buy someone else.
[22:08.720 --> 22:11.540]  I think it's the people who don't have the money that won't be surviving.
[22:12.280 --> 22:13.120]  That's what I think.
[22:13.280 --> 22:14.540]  I don't think it has anything to do with quality.
[22:14.700 --> 22:15.100]  I don't think...
[22:15.100 --> 22:16.460]  Well, how does a business get money?
[22:16.520 --> 22:20.260]  Just like I don't think Steve Forbes necessarily is...
[22:21.000 --> 22:22.160]  or Donald Trump.
[22:23.580 --> 22:24.840]  Guys, we're doing a radio show.
[22:24.940 --> 22:26.040]  If you don't mind.
[22:27.500 --> 22:40.540]  Just like I don't think that they're, you know, the most brilliant people politically, you know, I don't think these guys are the most, I don't know, technically savvy because they just happen to be the monopoly.
[22:40.680 --> 22:42.120]  I just don't think it works that way.
[22:42.160 --> 22:43.000]  They're combining forces.
[22:43.380 --> 22:48.020]  It's economics, it's politics, and it happens to be that these people seem to know what they're doing.
[22:48.160 --> 22:49.880]  Otherwise, people are not giving them money.
[22:49.880 --> 22:57.700]  They know how to take over the marketplace and how to squash the competition, but just ask anybody who's tried to get a DSL line installed at Bell Atlantic, knows what they're doing.
[22:57.960 --> 23:01.980]  And before that, ask anybody who tried to get an ISDN line from 9X if they knew what they were doing.
[23:02.080 --> 23:03.240]  And the answer is no, of course not.
[23:04.160 --> 23:14.340]  Basically, Bell Atlantic, by the admission of their own employees, sabotages its competitors' DSL lines that are in the central office and then takes a sweet time to repair them.
[23:14.760 --> 23:16.780]  That, to you, is knowing what they're doing?
[23:16.900 --> 23:18.260]  Well, that would be grounds for a suit.
[23:18.620 --> 23:18.820]  Yeah.
[23:18.820 --> 23:20.580]  A violation of contracts, such like that.
[23:20.880 --> 23:26.260]  Yeah, and there are many such suits being filed, but it doesn't stop the practice.
[23:26.260 --> 23:27.000]  That's the problem.
[23:27.640 --> 23:30.320]  The only thing that stops the practice is fair competition.
[23:31.060 --> 23:32.340]  We don't seem to have any of that.
[23:32.480 --> 23:33.140]  Which you can't force.
[23:33.460 --> 23:40.020]  But anyway, we've just jumped four tangents in a matter of three minutes, so we'll get back on track and quit confusing our poor listeners.
[23:40.540 --> 23:44.520]  I think you could force people to not be monopolies or force corporations not to be monopolies.
[23:44.560 --> 23:45.280]  I think that's fair.
[23:47.080 --> 23:59.360]  I think I agree somewhat with Isaac that the best person should rule the market, but I think the way that Verizon is becoming the best person in the market is pretty sleazy.
[23:59.360 --> 24:01.620]  But it's not the best person who controls the market.
[24:01.760 --> 24:02.820]  It's the people with the most money.
[24:03.620 --> 24:04.980]  It's the people with the most money.
[24:05.000 --> 24:06.820]  Money just doesn't drop from a tree.
[24:06.920 --> 24:09.800]  It's given to you by customers in exchange for services.
[24:09.800 --> 24:11.460]  It's investment, I think, but it's marketing.
[24:11.480 --> 24:13.280]  So you're saying I don't have to give money to Verizon.
[24:13.400 --> 24:14.440]  I can give it to somebody else.
[24:14.600 --> 24:16.260]  Yes, you could say go with Tommy Point.
[24:16.480 --> 24:17.620]  You could go with Sprint.
[24:17.660 --> 24:20.600]  You could take some other wireless carrier, perhaps Nextel.
[24:20.860 --> 24:21.680]  We're not talking about wireless.
[24:21.840 --> 24:23.220]  We're talking about wireless.
[24:23.260 --> 24:24.680]  We're talking about local service.
[24:25.200 --> 24:32.900]  And so far, there is no competition that I can find because everybody has to pay Verizon or Bell Atlantic, whatever they're called this week.
[24:33.100 --> 24:35.320]  And because of that, they have to charge higher prices.
[24:35.580 --> 24:36.580]  The smaller companies exist.
[24:37.260 --> 24:38.320]  Have you done the research?
[24:38.320 --> 24:38.940]  Yes, I have.
[24:39.700 --> 24:48.760]  AT&T offers service in my area, but the price is ridiculous because Bell Atlantic is paid by AT&T and all the others.
[24:48.960 --> 24:54.540]  So you are willing to pay less for a service that is lesser in order to save yourself some money.
[24:54.660 --> 24:56.420]  That is a conscious decision on your part.
[24:56.540 --> 24:59.880]  If you wanted superior service or alternative service, then you're paying the money for it.
[24:59.880 --> 25:00.700]  You're not hearing me here.
[25:01.060 --> 25:07.400]  Bell Atlantic has monopoly on the actual physical plant, which is the cable, the wires, all that kind of thing.
[25:07.400 --> 25:12.760]  So because of that, there is no company that can just simply come in and rewire everything.
[25:12.900 --> 25:14.200]  There is no real competition.
[25:14.520 --> 25:16.320]  Everybody has to pay off that company.
[25:16.480 --> 25:23.640]  And because of that, they have to charge higher prices, which means nobody's going to sign up with them, which means that Bell Atlantic continues to have their monopoly.
[25:23.760 --> 25:25.600]  Well, why can't AT&T run fiber to your home?
[25:26.800 --> 25:28.860]  It's... I mean, they can do that, I guess.
[25:28.860 --> 25:30.300]  It's going to take a long, long time.
[25:30.300 --> 25:32.760]  And that's something I hope will happen at some point.
[25:32.780 --> 25:35.240]  There's LightPath, CableVision's LightPath.
[25:35.340 --> 25:35.620]  Yeah.
[25:35.900 --> 25:38.420]  They have two switches on Long Island now.
[25:38.500 --> 25:39.000]  Two switches.
[25:39.240 --> 25:39.780]  Two switches.
[25:40.280 --> 25:42.440]  After all this time, all they have is two switches.
[25:42.480 --> 25:43.640]  And they've been around a long time.
[25:43.740 --> 25:44.800]  That's who we use at work.
[25:44.880 --> 25:45.540]  They're not bad.
[25:45.540 --> 25:46.880]  I can barely get cable TV.
[25:47.140 --> 25:49.040]  The basic point is that there are alternatives.
[25:49.560 --> 25:50.320]  No, there aren't.
[25:50.420 --> 25:51.380]  There aren't alternatives.
[25:51.400 --> 25:51.840]  They exist.
[25:51.920 --> 25:53.260]  You just are not looking for them.
[25:53.260 --> 25:53.460]  All right.
[25:53.460 --> 25:55.240]  You're not willing to separate yourself from...
[25:55.240 --> 25:56.740]  I want to hear all the alternatives.
[25:56.960 --> 25:58.580]  I want the listeners out there...
[25:58.580 --> 25:59.520]  I'm happy with Bell Atlantic.
[25:59.520 --> 26:00.620]  You didn't do the research.
[26:00.820 --> 26:01.580]  You didn't check into this.
[26:01.580 --> 26:02.760]  I didn't do the research because I'm happy with Bell Atlantic.
[26:02.920 --> 26:03.820]  You're happy with Bell Atlantic.
[26:03.860 --> 26:04.000]  Yes.
[26:04.100 --> 26:05.060]  Why are you happy with Bell Atlantic?
[26:05.440 --> 26:06.540]  You really think that's as good as you can get?
[26:06.540 --> 26:07.520]  Do you know how my phone works?
[26:07.920 --> 26:11.040]  I make one call a month, which goes to my ISP.
[26:11.260 --> 26:15.260]  And I pride myself when I only pay 10.6 cents on my entire bill.
[26:15.860 --> 26:23.080]  So my bill actually looks very strange, where I get 10.6 cents in charges, and then the rest of it is all like the usage fees, and more than half of my bill is in tax.
[26:23.080 --> 26:25.860]  Okay, but for those of us who talk to people on our phones...
[26:25.860 --> 26:26.460]  Oh, well, yeah.
[26:26.560 --> 26:27.520]  You know, it's...
[26:27.520 --> 26:28.360]  That's what Sprint's for.
[26:28.360 --> 26:33.840]  So that, you know, and in various parts of the country and things like that, you might want to have, like, you know, a choice of some sort.
[26:34.100 --> 26:38.380]  Well, we're talking about a date line here that's up for 30 days straight without having a problem.
[26:38.660 --> 26:40.600]  I'd say that's fairly consistent service.
[26:41.960 --> 26:42.320]  It's...
[26:42.320 --> 26:43.720]  Yeah, it's a line that's put up.
[26:43.840 --> 26:47.440]  But, you know, you're in the city, so it's easy to keep a line up.
[26:47.580 --> 26:50.960]  But out in other places, believe me, there's all kinds of things going on.
[26:50.960 --> 26:52.780]  Which is where the competition can really flourish.
[26:53.020 --> 26:55.580]  Yeah, and it's the last place the competition goes to.
[26:55.580 --> 27:00.160]  The competition will first approach businesses in the city, all right?
[27:01.700 --> 27:06.240]  And basically, the people are the ones who need competition more than anybody, and they're the last ones to get it.
[27:06.240 --> 27:09.760]  Well, perhaps the corporation should go out and try to rewire middle America.
[27:10.400 --> 27:11.300]  It's tough to do.
[27:11.460 --> 27:12.580]  Let me tell you a little...
[27:12.580 --> 27:13.880]  It's tough to do initial investment, but it might be elastic.
[27:14.100 --> 27:21.280]  I think it was a big mistake to approve this merger, and I think we're going to be regretting it for years to come, just as we've regretted the other mergers that have happened, you know.
[27:21.280 --> 27:24.300]  I have a problem with the very fact that mergers like this have to be approved.
[27:25.480 --> 27:29.160]  Well, I'm sure you'd like a totalitarian state where there's just one company.
[27:29.380 --> 27:29.820]  What's a totalitarian state?
[27:30.060 --> 27:31.160]  We're talking more freedom.
[27:31.320 --> 27:31.800]  You're saying you need to have something to stand.
[27:31.800 --> 27:32.600]  You're talking more freedom.
[27:32.860 --> 27:33.980]  Okay, all right, then go back.
[27:33.980 --> 27:34.800]  And I'm a totalitarian?
[27:34.960 --> 27:40.680]  Go back in time, all right, to when the Internet was non-commercial, all right, which was about four years ago.
[27:40.800 --> 27:41.380]  I recall it.
[27:41.620 --> 27:44.160]  Back in the glory days, all right, and...
[27:44.160 --> 27:46.160]  I was one of the people who was very upset.
[27:46.160 --> 27:50.980]  You had small companies all over the place offering Internet service, all right?
[27:51.120 --> 27:52.380]  And you could pick and choose.
[27:52.580 --> 27:53.200]  You can go...
[27:53.200 --> 27:55.660]  Are we before the commercialization or not?
[27:55.760 --> 27:56.780]  Before the commercialization.
[27:56.920 --> 27:58.120]  So we're talking about universities.
[27:58.820 --> 27:59.760]  No, I'm not talking about...
[27:59.760 --> 28:03.840]  I'm not talking about when there were no people that weren't part of the universities using the Internet.
[28:03.900 --> 28:08.160]  I'm talking about before advertising was every place you looked, before the web was completely...
[28:08.160 --> 28:11.420]  Yeah, you had the large corporations like RAND, you know, MITRE.
[28:11.920 --> 28:13.880]  No, I'm not talking about the backbone.
[28:14.100 --> 28:17.280]  I'm talking about Internet service providers, all right?
[28:17.360 --> 28:21.400]  You had dozens, if not hundreds of companies in the area offering this.
[28:21.800 --> 28:22.760]  Now, what do you have?
[28:22.860 --> 28:23.780]  You have DSL.
[28:24.200 --> 28:29.720]  DSL can only be provided by certain companies who just happen to be these same monopolies.
[28:29.820 --> 28:33.620]  And those certain companies wind up controlling a lot of what you do.
[28:33.700 --> 28:35.780]  They say, you can't put this kind of site up.
[28:35.840 --> 28:36.760]  You can't go there.
[28:36.880 --> 28:42.520]  We had somebody write us a letter saying that they got kicked off their system because the company didn't approve of the websites they visited.
[28:42.860 --> 28:43.680]  So you changed companies.
[28:44.360 --> 28:47.560]  But, Isaac, when there's a monopoly, when there's no competition...
[28:47.560 --> 28:48.280]  How do you change companies?
[28:49.540 --> 28:54.220]  You find enough people who are equally pissed off and do something like that.
[28:54.500 --> 28:55.680]  There is always an alternative.
[28:56.720 --> 28:58.100]  It always exists.
[28:58.340 --> 29:01.340]  It's just going to cost you more to do what you want to do.
[29:02.100 --> 29:04.560]  Like moving out of the country and starting someplace else.
[29:04.640 --> 29:04.840]  It's an alternative.
[29:05.040 --> 29:05.120]  Yeah.
[29:06.240 --> 29:06.660]  All right.
[29:06.860 --> 29:07.840]  I'm curious for the listeners...
[29:07.840 --> 29:09.980]  This is what a lot of UK businesses are going to be doing in the near future.
[29:09.980 --> 29:11.400]  Curious listeners think about this.
[29:11.520 --> 29:16.860]  I'm really, you know, I'm fed up to the point of, you know, being a raving maniac about the commercialization of the net.
[29:17.000 --> 29:23.540]  I just think it's been completely coerced and destroyed by Madison Avenue and the surrounding streets.
[29:25.420 --> 29:28.420]  All the old assets are still there.
[29:28.640 --> 29:32.020]  I mean, it's not as though there's a finite space where people are being pushed away.
[29:32.560 --> 29:36.720]  You can still, you know, go over to the UMN Gopher site and play around.
[29:38.000 --> 29:40.520]  It's actually a hobby of mine, but, you know...
[29:40.520 --> 29:40.820]  All right.
[29:41.000 --> 29:42.940]  Well, we'll have to figure out how to take back the net.
[29:43.120 --> 29:44.100]  That's what I think we should do.
[29:44.220 --> 29:44.900]  We already have it.
[29:45.620 --> 29:46.000]  Okay.
[29:46.000 --> 30:00.780]  Well, then let's just shape it to a more people-friendly type of enterprise rather than simply, you know, where people are paying a million dollars for domain names and throwing people in jail for, you know, doing something that a company thinks is wrong,
[30:00.880 --> 30:02.420]  which is basically renaming a file.
[30:02.420 --> 30:04.880]  Well, you know, that kind of nonsense has to stop.
[30:06.060 --> 30:06.580]  All right.
[30:06.680 --> 30:09.140]  Our phone number, 212-209-2900.
[30:09.820 --> 30:13.000]  We have some more listener mail.
[30:15.360 --> 30:20.520]  And this is basically having to do with something we talked about last week.
[30:20.940 --> 30:23.200]  Actually, yeah, we mentioned this.
[30:23.360 --> 30:27.840]  The video virus that was being passed around on the net.
[30:27.840 --> 30:30.440]  The movie virus, the thing that the exec decided to put out?
[30:30.520 --> 30:38.020]  This person doesn't want his name published in response to this, but we have some information that I think will be helpful to those people.
[30:39.960 --> 30:42.020]  I have, in fact, downloaded this infected video.
[30:42.440 --> 30:46.720]  And, indeed, my machine was infected with something that was attempting to enable my installation of Merck.
[30:48.040 --> 30:51.720]  It installed the egg drop bot, which is not something I've ever installed myself.
[30:53.000 --> 30:54.440]  It's an IRC bot.
[30:54.440 --> 30:58.580]  I determined it through behavioral things that this virus was doing to my machine.
[30:58.860 --> 31:01.540]  And I managed to nail it by killing enough of the symptoms.
[31:02.740 --> 31:05.260]  I've since installed Norton Antivirus.
[31:05.820 --> 31:08.480]  And, once again, I downloaded the file inadvertently.
[31:08.600 --> 31:10.920]  I was just a carpet bomb downloading from Usenet.
[31:11.820 --> 31:14.860]  This time, Norton AV trapped the file as containing back orifice.
[31:15.540 --> 31:19.860]  Of course, it must have had some other mechanisms to get back orifice installed on my machine.
[31:22.140 --> 31:25.960]  Anyway, the reason the name of the file is not given is because it's kind of embarrassing.
[31:26.620 --> 31:28.960]  You mean the reason the guy's name isn't given because...
[31:28.960 --> 31:32.880]  No, the reason the name of the file is not given is because the name of the file is rather embarrassing.
[31:33.000 --> 31:34.480]  And I don't think people want to admit they have this.
[31:34.740 --> 31:34.960]  Oh, okay.
[31:37.760 --> 31:38.480]  Asvid.exe.
[31:38.900 --> 31:43.940]  All right, so you have a file called Asvid.exe on your system.
[31:44.680 --> 31:47.180]  It's just a little movie of a donkey walking around, you know.
[31:47.260 --> 31:47.800]  The point is...
[31:47.800 --> 31:48.480]  It's perfectly harmless.
[31:48.480 --> 31:49.960]  Here's the real point, all right?
[31:50.120 --> 31:55.980]  Whether it's, you know, ASVIT or something else, don't run a .exe file on your system.
[31:56.100 --> 31:56.660]  I mean, come on.
[31:56.940 --> 32:00.240]  Well, he just said he's like carpet downloading from Usenet.
[32:00.420 --> 32:00.840]  Yeah, okay.
[32:00.920 --> 32:02.040]  Downloading is one thing.
[32:02.220 --> 32:03.120]  Downloading is one thing.
[32:03.280 --> 32:06.380]  But running, executing programs, that's another thing, all right?
[32:06.560 --> 32:09.540]  You won't get a virus by just downloading something.
[32:09.720 --> 32:12.680]  You will get a virus, though, if you run something on your system.
[32:12.880 --> 32:14.320]  You know, I don't mean reading mail.
[32:14.440 --> 32:15.960]  I don't mean looking at pictures or whatever.
[32:16.180 --> 32:17.640]  I mean running a program.
[32:17.640 --> 32:23.240]  You know, it actually does something on your system and could do God knows what, because you don't know what it's doing.
[32:23.900 --> 32:25.320]  You have no idea.
[32:25.540 --> 32:27.280]  You're trusting a complete stranger.
[32:28.080 --> 32:34.500]  Well, unfortunately, it's getting to the point where even looking at files winds up, you know, spawning off weird executables.
[32:34.540 --> 32:37.500]  If you have programs installed that do that, yeah.
[32:37.640 --> 32:41.160]  If you're foolish enough to have, you know, your system set up that way.
[32:42.200 --> 32:44.440]  So, that's the way it goes.
[32:44.860 --> 32:46.480]  PortShop, we have updates on H2K.
[32:46.480 --> 32:49.820]  Yes, several things are going on with H2K.
[32:50.740 --> 32:57.540]  First off, a lot of regarding volunteers, it's worth noting that the volunteer...
[32:57.540 --> 33:01.660]  There will be no more volunteers added to specific areas of H2K.
[33:02.200 --> 33:06.920]  Now, it's just going to be people going into the general H2K vol list.
[33:07.280 --> 33:13.580]  And we're having a general meeting two weeks before the conference and then another one one week before the conference.
[33:13.840 --> 33:15.140]  It's a real in-person meeting?
[33:15.140 --> 33:20.340]  This is a real in-person meeting right at the Citicorp Center where we have the 2600 meetings.
[33:20.960 --> 33:22.660]  The first one is on the 30th.
[33:22.720 --> 33:44.260]  That's in 10 days, starting at 7 p.m., where we hope we'll see a lot of the upcoming volunteers for the conference meet in person, decide who's going to do what, so you make a couple decisions, and basically get to know people's actual faces, which does help a lot.
[33:44.440 --> 33:45.140]  Oh, yeah, absolutely.
[33:46.660 --> 33:55.100]  If you want to do something that's, you know, if you want to do something important for the conference, or if, you know, you just want to volunteer generally, if you're in the area, please, please do come.
[33:56.740 --> 34:00.060]  It's, like I said, the 30th of this month, 7 p.m.
[34:00.060 --> 34:02.480]  at the Citicorp Center, 53rd in Lexington.
[34:04.920 --> 34:06.260]  And when is this first meeting?
[34:06.420 --> 34:07.260]  First meeting is...
[34:07.260 --> 34:07.840]  The 30th.
[34:08.020 --> 34:08.780]  Which is when?
[34:08.920 --> 34:09.420]  That's the Friday.
[34:09.820 --> 34:10.180]  Which Friday?
[34:10.260 --> 34:10.960]  This Friday coming up?
[34:11.060 --> 34:13.200]  That's the Friday... not this Friday coming up, the Friday thereafter.
[34:13.300 --> 34:14.020]  Friday after that.
[34:14.160 --> 34:14.680]  At what time?
[34:15.280 --> 34:16.940]  And then the second meeting would be...
[34:16.940 --> 34:18.200]  I'm still on the first meeting.
[34:18.280 --> 34:19.960]  The first meeting, it starts what time?
[34:20.260 --> 34:20.900]  7 p.m.
[34:21.040 --> 34:21.620]  7 p.m.
[34:21.680 --> 34:24.860]  So it's basically the same place that the 2600 meetings are at, one week earlier.
[34:25.080 --> 34:25.680]  One week earlier.
[34:25.760 --> 34:26.380]  7 p.m.
[34:26.580 --> 34:26.720]  Right.
[34:26.720 --> 34:29.280]  And that's if you're interested in volunteering for H2K in any capacity.
[34:29.520 --> 34:29.780]  Mm-hmm.
[34:29.940 --> 34:40.440]  And even if you're already on the list, if you're not on the list, Come on by, we'll tell you what's going to be happening, what to expect, and then we'll be doing it again the week after, in the middle of the 2600 meeting.
[34:40.600 --> 34:40.900]  Right.
[34:41.200 --> 34:41.360]  Okay.
[34:41.800 --> 34:43.160]  And then the conference is the week after that.
[34:43.300 --> 34:43.760]  That's right.
[34:43.980 --> 34:44.240]  Wow.
[34:44.700 --> 34:45.240]  How about that?
[34:45.280 --> 34:46.120]  Action is coming up fast.
[34:46.240 --> 34:47.240]  It is coming up fast.
[34:47.340 --> 34:49.180]  It's hurtling towards us like a freight train.
[34:50.020 --> 34:52.860]  And what's on those boxcars, nobody knows until they get here.
[34:53.940 --> 34:54.700]  Run us over.
[34:54.880 --> 34:55.880]  Yeah, it'll be fun.
[34:56.340 --> 35:02.640]  All the other conferences we've done, actually we've only done two, they've been fun, so we expect this one to be as fun, at least.
[35:02.860 --> 35:10.060]  Again, www.h2k.net has all the latest information, and we'll continue to have updates in weeks ahead.
[35:10.960 --> 35:14.380]  Let's take some phone calls, 212-209-2900.
[35:15.760 --> 35:18.620]  I guess we can just mosey right over to the phones.
[35:20.160 --> 35:20.660]  I don't know.
[35:21.380 --> 35:22.420]  I'm just not sure.
[35:23.400 --> 35:24.240]  I'm not aware.
[35:24.560 --> 35:25.380]  Some traveling music.
[35:25.520 --> 35:26.240]  I don't recall.
[35:26.700 --> 35:27.780]  Good evening, you're on the air.
[35:28.700 --> 35:29.300]  Good evening, John.
[35:29.960 --> 35:30.340]  Speak up.
[35:30.340 --> 35:30.840]  Good evening.
[35:31.120 --> 35:33.440]  I called you last week concerning the martial arts comics.
[35:34.340 --> 35:35.460]  My name is Sagamore.
[35:35.700 --> 35:36.620]  Your name is what?
[35:37.180 --> 35:37.580]  Sagamore.
[35:37.720 --> 35:39.380]  S-A-G-A-M-O-R-E.
[35:39.620 --> 35:43.580]  I called last week concerning what happened to all the martial arts comic books on the stand.
[35:43.920 --> 35:48.000]  I'm glad you called because, you know, I spelled your name because we were going to ask you that.
[35:48.580 --> 35:49.280]  Comic books.
[35:49.500 --> 35:50.520]  It's about an hour, two hours.
[35:50.520 --> 35:51.620]  I got a card for you.
[35:51.780 --> 35:52.600]  You got a card for me?
[35:52.740 --> 35:53.000]  Yes.
[35:53.240 --> 35:53.460]  Okay.
[35:53.460 --> 35:57.360]  All of Jackie Chan movies are made by Topps comic books.
[35:58.100 --> 36:05.940]  Every movie that Jackie Chan produces for the screen, Topps, T-O-P-P-S, comic books, produces a comic book.
[36:05.960 --> 36:06.320]  Here's the thing.
[36:06.540 --> 36:10.900]  The comic book show is on in an hour and a half, really.
[36:11.020 --> 36:11.140]  Yeah.
[36:11.140 --> 36:11.580]  All right.
[36:11.700 --> 36:15.160]  And they owe us a hacking call now because we gave them a comic book call.
[36:15.520 --> 36:16.400]  I thought that was Rebel.
[36:16.500 --> 36:16.900]  I really did.
[36:16.960 --> 36:17.520]  It sounded like him.
[36:18.120 --> 36:19.000]  He was incognito.
[36:19.280 --> 36:19.480]  Yeah.
[36:19.900 --> 36:20.080]  All right.
[36:20.100 --> 36:20.480]  Let's go over here.
[36:20.660 --> 36:21.080]  Good evening.
[36:21.160 --> 36:21.540]  You're on the air.
[36:22.600 --> 36:23.080]  All right.
[36:23.280 --> 36:23.500]  Yeah.
[36:23.620 --> 36:24.260]  No longer on the air.
[36:24.320 --> 36:24.540]  Good evening.
[36:24.600 --> 36:25.020]  You're on the air.
[36:25.760 --> 36:26.360]  Oh, hi.
[36:26.480 --> 36:27.280]  This is Daniel C.
[36:27.520 --> 36:27.940]  How are you doing?
[36:28.100 --> 36:28.380]  Okay.
[36:28.500 --> 36:29.060]  Yourself, Manuel?
[36:29.320 --> 36:30.040]  I'm just fine.
[36:30.320 --> 36:30.560]  Cool.
[36:31.580 --> 36:35.960]  You had mentioned that you can't get a virus from just reading email.
[36:35.960 --> 36:47.820]  But if you're unfortunate enough to have JavaScript enabled or using Microsoft Outlook, actually, there is a virus going around that is automatically inserts itself into the footer of email.
[36:48.120 --> 36:48.320]  Right.
[36:48.880 --> 36:49.040]  Oh.
[36:49.600 --> 36:49.760]  Oh.
[36:50.100 --> 36:51.320]  Very clever.
[36:51.680 --> 36:53.300]  Don't use Microsoft Outlook.
[36:53.620 --> 36:53.840]  Oh.
[36:53.840 --> 36:56.280]  How many times do people have to be told this?
[36:56.760 --> 36:57.740]  It's ridiculous.
[36:58.760 --> 37:04.600]  And that's what I mean when I say that the people who are the monopolies are not necessarily the brightest ones.
[37:04.600 --> 37:08.700]  In this case, maybe they are because maybe it's their plan to get everybody infected with some stupid virus.
[37:08.880 --> 37:10.400]  They're certainly doing a bang-up job with that.
[37:10.500 --> 37:11.400]  It could have been a clever virus, though.
[37:11.520 --> 37:17.060]  I mean, to stick itself indiscriminately, you know, or very discreetly into the footer of the email.
[37:17.220 --> 37:17.780]  I was like...
[37:17.780 --> 37:22.020]  I was impressed by the genius behind it, but also it's just like, why?
[37:22.200 --> 37:23.100]  Give me a break, okay?
[37:23.520 --> 37:24.540]  So, anyway.
[37:25.200 --> 37:26.560]  So, be careful, boys and girls.
[37:26.780 --> 37:27.120]  All right.
[37:27.280 --> 37:27.440]  Bye.
[37:27.660 --> 37:28.660]  Thanks for the call.
[37:28.720 --> 37:37.480]  That's what I was getting at when I said even reading now is becoming a bothersome thing because you can't read something without executing random bits, Java and JavaScript.
[37:37.880 --> 37:39.740]  If you're foolish enough to set it up that way.
[37:40.020 --> 37:40.680]  That's how you have it.
[37:40.820 --> 37:40.960]  Yeah.
[37:41.120 --> 37:43.340]  And I just don't understand why people do that.
[37:43.440 --> 37:44.000]  I really don't.
[37:44.320 --> 37:45.320]  Because they don't know any better.
[37:45.780 --> 37:46.520]  That's how the things...
[37:46.520 --> 37:47.680]  Yeah, but see, here's the thing.
[37:47.760 --> 37:51.780]  We've had so many warnings, so many examples of why you shouldn't do it that way.
[37:51.780 --> 37:54.840]  And yet, you know, we're not...
[37:55.260 --> 37:57.280]  It's not drilled into our heads enough, I don't think.
[37:57.520 --> 37:57.780]  No, it was.
[37:57.780 --> 38:03.940]  Microsoft continues to ship out this program with the default settings, making it so that people get these things.
[38:05.520 --> 38:10.860]  And then they have the gall to say that, you know, if we were broken up, we might not have been able to handle it as efficiently as we did.
[38:11.060 --> 38:12.380]  Yeah, that was kind of frightening.
[38:12.980 --> 38:13.520]  Good evening.
[38:13.600 --> 38:13.940]  You're on the air.
[38:14.000 --> 38:14.580]  That's sickening.
[38:15.220 --> 38:15.600]  Hello.
[38:15.920 --> 38:16.280]  Speak up.
[38:17.620 --> 38:33.880]  I don't know if you saw this week's New Yorker or anything, but there's a cartoon of a prince saying, first they took my domain, then they took my domain name, and I believe the article was about Verizon.
[38:34.940 --> 38:35.340]  Interesting.
[38:36.120 --> 38:36.260]  Yeah.
[38:37.180 --> 38:38.800]  This was in the New Yorker this week?
[38:39.020 --> 38:39.240]  Yeah.
[38:40.000 --> 38:40.220]  Wow.
[38:40.220 --> 38:40.800]  This issue of it.
[38:41.400 --> 38:43.280]  And you don't know anything else about what they said?
[38:43.420 --> 38:44.900]  No, I just saw the little cartoon.
[38:45.140 --> 38:46.160]  My friend emailed it to me.
[38:46.280 --> 38:46.900]  Wow.
[38:47.180 --> 38:49.940]  Okay, well, we'll have to go down to the newsstand and look that one up.
[38:50.060 --> 38:50.880]  And a couple more things.
[38:51.060 --> 38:55.280]  One, there's a Trojan out there that auto-downloads itself.
[38:55.660 --> 38:58.740]  It's not an E, it's through FTP.
[38:59.660 --> 39:06.220]  So, if you're using Microsoft Internet Explorer, there's no little prompt that comes up telling you that you're downloading it.
[39:07.140 --> 39:07.580]  Aha.
[39:07.920 --> 39:09.280]  So, you have to watch out for that.
[39:09.460 --> 39:10.540]  Wait, what does this thing do?
[39:10.880 --> 39:13.900]  Oh, it's an IP stealer.
[39:14.340 --> 39:15.700]  An IP stealer?
[39:15.840 --> 39:16.040]  Yeah.
[39:16.280 --> 39:22.620]  It'll just send your IP to someone's mailbox, and it infects your computer.
[39:24.000 --> 39:24.520]  Aha.
[39:24.880 --> 39:25.200]  Why?
[39:27.860 --> 39:28.920]  Go ahead and ask.
[39:29.020 --> 39:33.740]  I can think of, like, four different ways to do this that doesn't involve downloading anything.
[39:34.220 --> 39:35.500]  But, all right, keep going.
[39:35.640 --> 39:36.140]  Point number two.
[39:36.140 --> 39:37.860]  And, um, one more thing.
[39:38.300 --> 39:42.840]  Um, if I'm not able to make it to H2K, will you be putting the movie on the DVD?
[39:43.520 --> 39:47.460]  Uh, well, I guess the trial will kind of, uh, decide that.
[39:47.460 --> 39:48.580]  We just can't use CSS.
[39:49.280 --> 39:49.500]  Okay.
[39:49.740 --> 39:51.520]  Well, maybe, maybe we'll do it that way then, you know?
[39:51.640 --> 39:52.480]  Well, we could do that.
[39:52.600 --> 39:52.960]  I don't know.
[39:53.140 --> 39:56.660]  I, uh, are people allowed to use DVDs if they don't?
[39:56.660 --> 39:57.840]  It's an open format.
[39:58.380 --> 39:59.760]  CSS is the closed bit.
[40:00.260 --> 40:01.720]  What about the DVD CCA?
[40:01.800 --> 40:02.740]  What do they have to say about it?
[40:02.780 --> 40:03.760]  That's for CSS.
[40:04.060 --> 40:06.400]  They issue the keys that will allow you to play with CSS.
[40:06.400 --> 40:07.220]  But they say DVDs.
[40:07.220 --> 40:08.400]  Are we allowed to call it a DVD?
[40:08.560 --> 40:09.800]  Maybe we can't say that word.
[40:10.280 --> 40:12.680]  Uh, I would imagine it's part of the open standard, but, okay.
[40:12.840 --> 40:13.020]  All right.
[40:13.040 --> 40:14.080]  We've got to check into these things.
[40:14.200 --> 40:16.860]  It's not a simple thing of just releasing your material anymore.
[40:18.020 --> 40:19.940]  Format's the only thing open about it, apparently.
[40:20.280 --> 40:20.520]  Yeah.
[40:20.960 --> 40:21.280]  Good evening.
[40:21.340 --> 40:21.720]  You're on the air.
[40:23.160 --> 40:23.700]  Speak up.
[40:23.900 --> 40:24.580]  Hey, Alex.
[40:25.300 --> 40:26.000]  Emmanuel, Alex.
[40:26.300 --> 40:26.740]  Hey, Dylan.
[40:26.900 --> 40:27.340]  How's it going?
[40:27.680 --> 40:33.320]  Hey, um, you were talking about, um, I'd like to mention a lot of things that don't work anymore.
[40:33.960 --> 40:36.980]  Um, but how can you mention it when you have no mouth?
[40:37.660 --> 40:37.960]  What?
[40:40.080 --> 40:40.740]  Just kidding.
[40:40.840 --> 40:41.100]  Keep going.
[40:41.500 --> 40:41.800]  All right.
[40:41.980 --> 40:45.400]  A lot of things I'm going to be mentioning this at Beyond Hope, H2K.
[40:46.040 --> 40:50.120]  Um, a lot of things I find just don't work anymore.
[40:50.340 --> 40:51.080]  I mean...
[40:51.080 --> 40:52.500]  Didn't you say this two weeks ago?
[40:52.700 --> 40:53.660]  A lot of things don't work anymore.
[40:53.780 --> 40:54.060]  We know.
[40:54.200 --> 40:55.000]  A lot of things don't work anymore.
[40:55.240 --> 40:56.860]  I want to tell you some of the things that don't.
[40:57.240 --> 40:57.780]  All right.
[40:58.080 --> 40:58.320]  All right.
[40:58.360 --> 40:59.780]  We're just going to get angry, but go ahead.
[41:00.060 --> 41:00.340]  All right.
[41:00.340 --> 41:06.140]  One of them is that AT&T does not place directly dial calls and bill it to the hotel room anymore.
[41:06.420 --> 41:07.060]  Oh, my God.
[41:09.620 --> 41:14.300]  Also, the payment center that I used to mention years ago, that used to make you be able to...
[41:14.300 --> 41:18.420]  the courtesy phone, you used to be able to dial an outside line and dial the operator's number.
[41:18.740 --> 41:19.800]  That doesn't work anymore.
[41:20.200 --> 41:23.120]  You know, these are all things that shouldn't work in the first place.
[41:23.260 --> 41:23.560]  Right!
[41:24.080 --> 41:25.080]  That's my point.
[41:25.380 --> 41:30.040]  But what still works is the fact that AT&T puts third number calls through.
[41:30.340 --> 41:33.820]  You can use AT&T and just bill calls for any number.
[41:34.160 --> 41:36.000]  Well, that's if you're calling from your house.
[41:36.280 --> 41:36.580]  Right.
[41:36.660 --> 41:37.600]  Or a residence.
[41:37.940 --> 41:38.180]  Yeah.
[41:38.600 --> 41:39.860]  Or someone else's residence.
[41:40.000 --> 41:40.560]  Right, of course.
[41:41.560 --> 41:46.520]  Yeah, and that results in all kinds of contested bills and hurt feelings and things like that.
[41:46.660 --> 41:46.840]  Yes.
[41:47.360 --> 41:52.420]  Anyway, thanks for updating us on basically a roundup of everything you've called in about over the last five years.
[41:52.780 --> 41:54.280]  No, like ten years, isn't it?
[41:54.540 --> 41:55.660]  Something like that, yes.
[41:56.080 --> 41:57.640]  212-209-2900.
[41:57.820 --> 41:59.160]  Please, please give us a call.
[41:59.160 --> 42:01.460]  So, give us something to talk about.
[42:01.560 --> 42:01.780]  Good evening.
[42:01.880 --> 42:02.340]  You're on the air.
[42:02.960 --> 42:03.520]  Hi, Emmanuel.
[42:03.660 --> 42:04.180]  It's Bobcat.
[42:04.500 --> 42:04.700]  Hi.
[42:04.740 --> 42:05.080]  How are you doing?
[42:05.420 --> 42:06.100]  I'm doing fine.
[42:06.300 --> 42:09.420]  I've got to support Isaac on the competitive phone company thing.
[42:09.520 --> 42:09.820]  Thank you.
[42:10.220 --> 42:14.180]  Anybody can file to become a competitive local exchange carrier.
[42:14.180 --> 42:15.260]  That's called a SELEC.
[42:15.720 --> 42:17.960]  And start phone service in any area.
[42:18.200 --> 42:20.540]  Yes, but you notice how nobody's doing it.
[42:21.280 --> 42:22.260]  COVAD is doing it.
[42:22.300 --> 42:23.940]  That's how they're supplying DSL to people.
[42:23.940 --> 42:29.880]  But you should have heard the rant I got from COVAD about how Bell Atlantic sabotages their operations constantly.
[42:30.100 --> 42:31.320]  Then they should be suing them.
[42:31.560 --> 42:37.080]  Yeah, well, you know, I don't know if they're suing them or not suing them or what, but the point is the customers are the ones that wind up suffering.
[42:37.280 --> 42:41.480]  And yeah, you know, they can be fined, but the customers don't get the money when they get fined.
[42:41.480 --> 42:44.840]  You know, it's absurd, you know?
[42:45.160 --> 42:49.860]  Still, anybody can start their own voice or data service.
[42:50.120 --> 42:54.200]  Right, and anybody can be president, which means, oh, yeah, everybody can change the world.
[42:54.300 --> 42:55.580]  But it doesn't work that way.
[42:55.980 --> 42:57.100]  It's simplistic.
[42:57.620 --> 43:00.480]  Well, I was in a switch room in Stanford.
[43:00.760 --> 43:06.220]  It was an OC192 ring, which covers the whole downtown, five ESS.
[43:06.640 --> 43:10.140]  And they have 100% competition in the entire city.
[43:10.880 --> 43:12.320]  How many people signed up with them?
[43:13.020 --> 43:14.240]  A lot of businesses do.
[43:14.360 --> 43:16.580]  Obviously, they paid for a five ESS, and they're making money.
[43:16.800 --> 43:17.680]  Why only businesses?
[43:17.680 --> 43:18.360]  Why not people?
[43:19.320 --> 43:22.240]  Well, Stanford was a special case because they tore down all the houses.
[43:24.040 --> 43:29.740]  Also, if you have a problem with the net being commercial, you know, there's people like selling T-shirts and stuff.
[43:29.980 --> 43:31.500]  You probably want to clamp down on that.
[43:32.460 --> 43:33.580]  People selling T-shirts?
[43:33.760 --> 43:33.980]  Explain.
[43:34.680 --> 43:35.800]  You're selling T-shirts.
[43:36.060 --> 43:37.480]  You don't like commercialization.
[43:37.840 --> 43:39.020]  Why are you doing it yourself?
[43:39.020 --> 43:41.560]  Well, how is selling a T-shirt commercialization?
[43:41.780 --> 43:43.660]  We're raising funds for our defense.
[43:44.880 --> 43:46.320]  We're not selling products.
[43:46.760 --> 43:50.780]  Yeah, we're selling T-shirts, but the money goes for our defense fund.
[43:51.460 --> 43:52.620]  It's not the same thing.
[43:53.120 --> 43:53.540]  Okay.
[43:55.560 --> 44:02.660]  Look, when we stick a banner ad on 2600.com or have a full-page ad from Microsoft in the magazine, then I'll listen.
[44:02.660 --> 44:04.960]  You know, that's selling out.
[44:05.040 --> 44:05.940]  That's commercialization.
[44:07.840 --> 44:13.500]  Well, I just assume that the regular T-shirts went to the magazine rather than to the defense.
[44:13.680 --> 44:14.380]  Yeah, okay.
[44:14.460 --> 44:15.960]  Those are magazine T-shirts.
[44:16.080 --> 44:20.700]  But again, you know, if we put commercial things, that's our magazine.
[44:20.840 --> 44:21.400]  That's who we are.
[44:21.500 --> 44:22.900]  We're selling our own thing.
[44:23.380 --> 44:24.820]  You know, commercialization...
[44:24.820 --> 44:26.840]  So what you're talking about is you don't like the ads.
[44:27.580 --> 44:27.900]  Exactly.
[44:28.080 --> 44:31.840]  Everywhere you go on the net these days, there's ads screaming at you in your face.
[44:31.900 --> 44:32.220]  All right.
[44:32.360 --> 44:34.960]  Every mail, every other piece of mail I get...
[44:34.960 --> 44:38.760]  No, I'd say nine out of ten pieces of mail I get is an advertisement that I don't ask for.
[44:39.520 --> 44:43.100]  You know, commercialization has completely destroyed any meaningful communication on the net.
[44:43.880 --> 44:46.660]  Well, I try to go to places where I don't have to look at ads.
[44:46.800 --> 44:47.760]  I turn off the banners.
[44:49.120 --> 44:52.600]  As far as competition among ISPs, there used to be lots of little ones.
[44:52.780 --> 44:54.480]  And now there's lots of free ones.
[44:55.380 --> 44:57.700]  So it's better for people with no money.
[44:59.100 --> 45:00.400]  I can get free DSL.
[45:00.680 --> 45:01.400]  Free DSL?
[45:01.620 --> 45:03.540]  Free ISDN?
[45:03.620 --> 45:05.060]  If you're willing to look at the adverts.
[45:05.080 --> 45:06.620]  There's a company called Free DSL.
[45:08.060 --> 45:09.540]  And supposedly they're giving it out.
[45:09.720 --> 45:09.980]  Okay.
[45:10.160 --> 45:11.640]  I'd like to hear from somebody who's using them.
[45:11.640 --> 45:12.680]  No bandwidth is better than no bandwidth.
[45:12.860 --> 45:13.880]  And free is better than a dollar.
[45:14.160 --> 45:16.220]  Well, I'd like to know more about this.
[45:16.220 --> 45:19.400]  Because all I know is I had to jump through hoops to get DSL installed.
[45:19.580 --> 45:20.880]  It took over a year.
[45:22.080 --> 45:23.820]  And, you know, anything that can help people?
[45:23.920 --> 45:32.280]  Well, the DSL net in Connecticut, who is also in Stanford and the other major cities, got it into the place I ordered in about two weeks.
[45:32.900 --> 45:35.400]  And the only holdup was, of course, SNET.
[45:36.680 --> 45:38.020]  But we got DSL.
[45:38.140 --> 45:40.040]  It's been working great for over two years now.
[45:40.180 --> 45:42.000]  Now, SNET, they've been taken over too, haven't they?
[45:42.100 --> 45:43.100]  Yes, the SBC.
[45:44.380 --> 45:45.660]  So Southwestern Bell, is it?
[45:46.480 --> 45:50.740]  They've now taken over Southern Earing Telephone, which was an independent phone company.
[45:51.120 --> 45:54.720]  Yes, Connecticut is unique in that I had a lot of independent phone companies.
[45:54.880 --> 45:56.260]  I don't know that there's any left.
[45:56.460 --> 45:56.700]  Yeah.
[45:57.020 --> 45:58.620]  They had the Woodbury Telephone Company.
[45:58.620 --> 46:01.880]  There was a couple of little ones in Danbury with a couple hundred customers.
[46:02.400 --> 46:02.540]  Right.
[46:04.160 --> 46:04.900]  The old days are gone.
[46:05.160 --> 46:06.820]  Those independent phone companies were pretty cool.
[46:07.240 --> 46:08.240]  I really like them.
[46:08.480 --> 46:10.860]  I think this one's still left in Fisher's Island, but I'm not sure.
[46:11.280 --> 46:11.560]  Sorry?
[46:11.640 --> 46:13.300]  If you lived under SNET, you wouldn't think it was so cool.
[46:13.300 --> 46:18.000]  Well, I'm not saying, you know, service is necessarily going to be great, but that's where competition comes in.
[46:18.040 --> 46:26.080]  I mean, yeah, if you were part of an independent phone company and you had no choice, it's the same complaint that you have if you're under Verizon and you have no choice.
[46:26.080 --> 46:31.280]  You have nowhere else to go and no place to get something different for a better price.
[46:32.180 --> 46:35.300]  Now in Connecticut, we have two competing cable systems.
[46:35.460 --> 46:36.720]  We have SNET and Cablevision.
[46:37.500 --> 46:40.360]  Cablevision also offers telephone service in some areas.
[46:40.360 --> 46:41.680]  It's going to be everywhere pretty soon.
[46:41.880 --> 46:42.200]  Uh-huh.
[46:42.400 --> 46:44.320]  I would love to see competition in cable.
[46:44.320 --> 46:45.260]  I've never seen that.
[46:45.460 --> 46:47.840]  I've never seen a place where we can get a different cable company.
[46:47.880 --> 46:51.140]  You see competition in cable every time you go home.
[46:51.420 --> 46:51.800]  I do?
[46:52.020 --> 46:52.320]  Yes.
[46:52.400 --> 46:53.900]  You have a DSS dish, don't you?
[46:54.540 --> 46:55.560]  I'm talking about cable.
[46:55.720 --> 46:56.200]  That's different.
[46:56.380 --> 46:57.920]  New York City can get Time Warner.
[46:57.920 --> 46:59.000]  Different type of technology.
[46:59.340 --> 47:01.740]  It's a providing of television service.
[47:02.400 --> 47:04.020]  Yes, but it's not the same thing as cable.
[47:04.140 --> 47:05.820]  Cable is something that comes to your house.
[47:06.260 --> 47:07.480]  DSS is a different technology.
[47:07.640 --> 47:08.860]  Over the air is a third technology.
[47:09.240 --> 47:09.520]  I think you've got a service and a utility here.
[47:09.700 --> 47:12.460]  Yeah, but you're talking about different services.
[47:12.740 --> 47:15.560]  There are different things you get on cable that you don't get on DSS.
[47:15.680 --> 47:16.720]  There are different things over the air.
[47:17.340 --> 47:18.560]  Local channels, for instance.
[47:18.760 --> 47:21.560]  You will be having local channels very soon on DSS.
[47:21.680 --> 47:24.200]  Yeah, but there's no way you can get all the local channels.
[47:24.280 --> 47:26.400]  And you know why you can't get local channels now?
[47:26.400 --> 47:30.860]  Well, because of FCC regs and trying to make sure that the competition is all fair.
[47:30.960 --> 47:38.740]  Actually, Isaac, it's because of commercial entities that don't want foreign signals being imported into different cities.
[47:38.900 --> 47:40.200]  That's what's been holding this up.
[47:40.340 --> 47:48.800]  The fact that NBC or ABC doesn't want me watching a TV station in a different city because then I won't be watching the commercials for the local city.
[47:49.260 --> 47:53.080]  It's as ridiculous as not reading the Washington Post because it's not your local newspaper.
[47:53.240 --> 47:54.240]  I think you should watch it if you want.
[47:54.240 --> 47:57.180]  I don't want the FCC to go with a must-carry rule like they do with cable.
[47:57.700 --> 48:01.900]  If someone can receive that broadcast, any cable system in the area must carry it.
[48:02.100 --> 48:05.240]  Yeah, but the only problem with that is there's limited bandwidth in the air.
[48:05.500 --> 48:07.180]  You know, and for them to do that...
[48:07.180 --> 48:08.300]  There's 500 channels.
[48:08.420 --> 48:09.500]  How many HPOs do you need?
[48:09.600 --> 48:10.900]  Wouldn't you rather have your local channels?
[48:11.220 --> 48:12.600]  Listen, local channels.
[48:12.740 --> 48:14.380]  How many local channels are there per city?
[48:14.560 --> 48:17.380]  All right, for them to carry all the local channels...
[48:17.380 --> 48:18.860]  There's 20 local channels in New York.
[48:18.960 --> 48:20.400]  Okay, but that's...
[48:20.400 --> 48:22.120]  That is New York.
[48:22.280 --> 48:23.220]  That's one city.
[48:23.220 --> 48:23.960]  All right?
[48:24.080 --> 48:25.800]  Now, how many satellites do you think they have up there?
[48:25.980 --> 48:26.560]  It doesn't matter.
[48:26.900 --> 48:27.840]  They just launched another one recently.
[48:28.540 --> 48:29.560]  Yeah, but the point is...
[48:29.560 --> 48:30.340]  There's going to be plenty of...
[48:30.340 --> 48:34.800]  They would have to have thousands of open-channel slots to cover all the things you want to cover.
[48:34.940 --> 48:35.460]  It's impossible.
[48:35.740 --> 48:36.520]  You can't do that.
[48:36.820 --> 48:37.580]  You can't...
[48:37.580 --> 48:38.560]  You can't do that.
[48:38.640 --> 48:39.880]  You have to cut all the services when you do that.
[48:39.880 --> 48:40.340]  Let's move on.
[48:40.820 --> 48:42.080]  We'll have this discussion at dinner.
[48:42.300 --> 48:43.480]  Thanks for the call.
[48:43.500 --> 48:45.920]  We'll do the math on that and see how many stations we'll need to get up.
[48:45.960 --> 48:46.180]  Yeah.
[48:46.340 --> 48:46.560]  All right.
[48:47.400 --> 48:49.480]  No, it's already a problem on DSS.
[48:49.500 --> 48:50.040]  It's not how it works.
[48:53.480 --> 48:58.280]  They've taken a huge chunk because now they are allowed to have local stations, but not all of them.
[48:58.400 --> 49:01.020]  Only like maybe three or four per city.
[49:01.300 --> 49:09.280]  But by doing that, they've taken up all remaining bandwidth with all these ridiculous local channels that you can't even watch because you're only allowed to watch your local city.
[49:09.580 --> 49:10.080]  You know?
[49:10.180 --> 49:14.620]  But all the other slots in the satellite have been taken up by local channels.
[49:14.720 --> 49:15.040]  It's ridiculous.
[49:15.220 --> 49:15.640]  It's not an issue.
[49:15.840 --> 49:16.660]  I mean, it's not an issue.
[49:16.720 --> 49:17.260]  You brought it up.
[49:17.260 --> 49:18.500]  I'm telling you why...
[49:18.500 --> 49:19.240]  You have more...
[49:19.240 --> 49:25.800]  You are more restricted by a coax cable and that distribution network than you are by a satellite...
[49:25.800 --> 49:28.520]  A geosynchronous platform that's beaming you down.
[49:28.520 --> 49:30.400]  There's more capacity, but it's still...
[49:30.400 --> 49:31.660]  There's more room in the air.
[49:32.400 --> 49:33.240]  There's more room.
[49:33.320 --> 49:35.720]  But I'm saying when you clog it up with other things, then...
[49:35.720 --> 49:36.560]  You're not clogging it up.
[49:36.620 --> 49:37.240]  There's more room.
[49:37.440 --> 49:38.420]  It's the same thing with the internet.
[49:38.620 --> 49:43.240]  All these commercial entities can sit there and they're not going to interfere with all of your education and all of your scientific...
[49:43.240 --> 49:48.220]  You call DirecTV and tell them they have more room, but they say they are full and all their satellites...
[49:48.220 --> 49:48.960]  I'm sure they're going to see it.
[49:48.980 --> 49:50.840]  101, 119, and whatever the other...
[49:50.840 --> 49:53.420]  Because there's only so much processing that the satellites can do.
[49:53.580 --> 49:53.700]  Yeah.
[49:53.980 --> 49:57.620]  But as far as an actual physical limitation, no.
[49:57.800 --> 49:58.700]  There's room in the air.
[49:59.040 --> 50:00.180]  And there's room in cable, too.
[50:00.260 --> 50:01.980]  Digital cable has access...
[50:01.980 --> 50:07.280]  Digital cable's not a story because they have to go through and do a lot of things with the amps and the distribution network.
[50:08.520 --> 50:09.460]  It's still cable.
[50:09.980 --> 50:10.540]  All right.
[50:11.200 --> 50:12.900]  It's a different kind of cable, but it's cable.
[50:12.900 --> 50:14.620]  It's a lot closer than DSS is to cable.
[50:15.020 --> 50:16.100]  Let's move on.
[50:16.340 --> 50:16.880]  Good evening.
[50:17.000 --> 50:17.340]  You're on the air.
[50:19.500 --> 50:19.900]  Hello?
[50:20.100 --> 50:20.440]  Yes, go ahead.
[50:20.960 --> 50:21.360]  Hey.
[50:21.620 --> 50:21.860]  Sorry.
[50:22.000 --> 50:23.580]  There's a delay on the web broadcast.
[50:24.080 --> 50:24.340]  Ah.
[50:24.740 --> 50:26.040]  There's an incredible delay on the web broadcast.
[50:26.060 --> 50:26.260]  Yeah.
[50:26.380 --> 50:26.580]  Okay.
[50:26.880 --> 50:28.500]  Well, there's no delay on the phone, so go ahead.
[50:28.800 --> 50:29.000]  Okay.
[50:30.080 --> 50:35.860]  With all the virus stuff that's been going on lately, like, have you guys looked at what the virus companies are listing?
[50:37.280 --> 50:38.020]  At the what?
[50:38.460 --> 50:38.720]  Oh.
[50:39.160 --> 50:42.600]  Like, Semantic is listing as hostile and so forth?
[50:44.120 --> 50:46.700]  What Semantic and companies like that are listing as hostile.
[50:46.960 --> 50:47.300]  Yeah.
[50:47.400 --> 50:50.200]  Things like Netbus and Back Orifice and, like, legitimate tools.
[50:50.540 --> 50:50.680]  Mm-hmm.
[50:50.800 --> 50:51.020]  Yeah.
[50:51.100 --> 50:52.340]  They've been doing that for a very long time.
[50:52.520 --> 51:01.000]  You can pick up the same thing with the Semantic parental control products, where sites like ours are listed, you know, with very dangerous people, you know.
[51:01.140 --> 51:02.960]  I don't think you're allowed to tell people what's listed, though.
[51:02.980 --> 51:03.600]  You'll get sued.
[51:03.800 --> 51:04.240]  That's right.
[51:04.240 --> 51:08.760]  In fact, some folks cracked that open, displayed it, and Semantic is trying to hunt them down.
[51:09.640 --> 51:10.720]  I think they did hunt them down.
[51:10.920 --> 51:10.980]  Are they enjoying it now?
[51:10.980 --> 51:13.920]  They managed to get them to stop doing it, which I think is ridiculous.
[51:14.380 --> 51:14.560]  Yep.
[51:14.860 --> 51:18.620]  And if I had that list, I'd be spreading it all over the place, of course, then it'd be another lawsuit to deal with.
[51:18.620 --> 51:20.780]  Yes, you seem to attract these sources.
[51:21.500 --> 51:22.560]  See, that's the thing.
[51:22.740 --> 51:26.340]  We've been doing the same thing we've always done for 15 years now.
[51:26.740 --> 51:30.300]  But it's only recently that corporate America has gone nuts with the lawsuits.
[51:30.500 --> 51:34.580]  And that's because of this whole change in mentality on the net, where, yeah, the net belongs to us now.
[51:34.580 --> 51:37.540]  It's a commercial entity, and the people have absolutely no say in it.
[51:37.840 --> 51:39.320]  And I just think it's...
[51:39.320 --> 51:42.720]  The power that these companies have with what they're listing, it's amazing.
[51:43.000 --> 51:43.260]  Mm-hmm.
[51:44.300 --> 51:47.160]  Like, I run a little website, anti-AV.com.
[51:47.160 --> 51:57.800]  I'm basically really pissed off at the antivirus companies and the fact that they list, you know, really decent programs like Netbus as Trojans, but there's whole tons of other stuff out there that does the same damn thing.
[51:57.820 --> 52:06.160]  Microsoft has their own thing, which in many cases is even worse than the Netbus so far as being open and allowing you to tinker with NT.
[52:06.440 --> 52:07.580]  And of course, that's listed, too.
[52:07.720 --> 52:08.300]  Oh, it's not listed.
[52:08.360 --> 52:09.340]  Of course it's not listed.
[52:09.620 --> 52:11.160]  It's in a Microsoft product.
[52:11.160 --> 52:13.120]  Why, they could never list something like that.
[52:13.560 --> 52:13.800]  Yeah.
[52:14.540 --> 52:15.420]  I mean, there's a case...
[52:15.420 --> 52:16.960]  What about the competition, Isaac?
[52:17.160 --> 52:17.700]  What an competition.
[52:18.200 --> 52:18.760]  Oh, thank you.
[52:18.940 --> 52:19.080]  Okay.
[52:19.560 --> 52:20.360]  Finally, we agree.
[52:20.600 --> 52:20.620]  What do you mean?
[52:20.880 --> 52:28.500]  You have, like, seven players in this antivirus industry, and these are the same seven players that have been playing with it for, like, coming on a decade now.
[52:29.280 --> 52:30.680]  None of this stuff is new.
[52:30.920 --> 52:42.600]  It's basically the media, like, just peddling more and more FUD, fear, uncertainty, and doubt that has these antivirus companies, like, saying, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we're doing this, we're doing that, and the other thing.
[52:42.600 --> 52:43.640]  And who owns the media?
[52:45.520 --> 52:48.500]  That's another issue entirely, if you want to get into that.
[52:48.640 --> 52:49.400]  Hey, thanks for the call.
[52:49.720 --> 52:50.180]  No problem.
[52:50.420 --> 52:50.720]  All right.
[52:50.860 --> 52:52.160]  The simple answer is the advertisers.
[52:53.300 --> 52:53.620]  Yeah.
[52:54.520 --> 52:55.700]  That is a simple answer.
[52:56.420 --> 52:56.880]  Good evening.
[52:56.960 --> 52:57.340]  You're on the air.
[52:58.080 --> 52:59.780]  Yeah, I just forgot to give them the email address.
[52:59.960 --> 53:00.340]  It's Rebel.
[53:00.680 --> 53:03.980]  It's too bad that you got cut off like that, because the email address never made it out.
[53:03.980 --> 53:04.340]  Good evening.
[53:04.380 --> 53:04.800]  You're on the air.
[53:05.960 --> 53:06.640]  Speak up, please.
[53:07.860 --> 53:09.100]  Okay, you got to move faster than that.
[53:09.160 --> 53:09.420]  Good evening.
[53:09.560 --> 53:10.000]  You're on the air.
[53:10.940 --> 53:15.800]  Yeah, I found the perfect analogy for DVDs playing on computers.
[53:16.040 --> 53:16.240]  Okay.
[53:16.440 --> 53:21.300]  When you're in an airline and you want to listen to their movie, you have to use their headphones.
[53:21.860 --> 53:24.560]  You're not allowed to bring your own headphones with you.
[53:24.640 --> 53:27.180]  I've gotten into that fight a couple of times on airlines.
[53:27.640 --> 53:32.100]  In fact, I've even saved headphones from previous flights and plugged them in.
[53:32.300 --> 53:32.600]  Oh, yeah.
[53:32.840 --> 53:34.140]  Sometimes they let you do it.
[53:34.200 --> 53:35.720]  Sometimes they get into a big fight over it.
[53:37.240 --> 53:38.740]  I mean, I got a collection at home.
[53:39.060 --> 53:41.240]  TWA, American Airlines, all of them.
[53:41.400 --> 53:43.880]  Oh, you just pick up the one as you go on your way to the airport, then?
[53:44.460 --> 53:46.900]  Yeah, well, I know people that are flight attendants.
[53:47.100 --> 53:48.020]  Ah, you know.
[53:49.340 --> 53:51.280]  All the little bags of peanuts you could ever want.
[53:51.720 --> 53:51.940]  Yeah.
[53:52.140 --> 53:53.660]  Well, I mean, it's a good analogy.
[53:53.880 --> 53:57.020]  Basically saying you can't listen to this unless you buy our headphones.
[53:58.220 --> 53:59.280]  Yep, that's what they're saying.
[53:59.560 --> 53:59.740]  Yeah.
[54:00.780 --> 54:02.760]  All right, well, good luck fighting that battle.
[54:04.500 --> 54:05.040]  Good evening.
[54:05.200 --> 54:05.620]  You're on the air.
[54:06.740 --> 54:07.060]  Hello.
[54:07.320 --> 54:07.780]  Yes, go ahead.
[54:08.020 --> 54:11.240]  Yeah, I had a question about an article you mentioned last week, an issue of Playboy.
[54:11.460 --> 54:11.720]  Okay.
[54:12.000 --> 54:13.540]  It was some privacy article.
[54:13.860 --> 54:14.880]  I've been looking for the article.
[54:15.020 --> 54:16.260]  I was wondering if you could help me.
[54:17.260 --> 54:19.360]  I don't have the reference for it handy.
[54:19.420 --> 54:21.460]  I do know it was on the Playboy site.
[54:21.740 --> 54:22.500]  It was on the site.
[54:22.720 --> 54:24.000]  I think his name was J.J.
[54:24.200 --> 54:24.380]  Luna.
[54:24.800 --> 54:25.740]  Was it J.J.
[54:25.900 --> 54:26.440]  Luna who wrote it?
[54:26.500 --> 54:27.620]  Yeah, I think that was the last name.
[54:27.740 --> 54:28.080]  J.J.
[54:28.380 --> 54:28.720]  Luna, okay.
[54:28.920 --> 54:29.060]  Yeah.
[54:29.180 --> 54:30.520]  But that must have been a pseudonym, right?
[54:30.640 --> 54:31.280]  Oh, probably was.
[54:31.280 --> 54:32.460]  He was talking about privacy.
[54:32.620 --> 54:34.420]  Yeah, it would be pretty silly if you let his real name out.
[54:34.800 --> 54:35.000]  Okay.
[54:35.080 --> 54:35.500]  So, all right.
[54:35.580 --> 54:36.040]  Good luck with that.
[54:36.160 --> 54:36.460]  Thank you.
[54:36.680 --> 54:36.980]  All right.
[54:38.300 --> 54:39.440]  You were talking about Playboy?
[54:39.600 --> 54:40.260]  Oh, yeah, that's right.
[54:41.900 --> 54:42.320]  Good evening.
[54:42.380 --> 54:42.760]  You're on the air.
[54:43.340 --> 54:46.300]  Hi, um, I have a question about the H2K network.
[54:47.380 --> 54:48.260]  Okay, go ahead.
[54:48.420 --> 54:53.580]  Is it going to be compatible to older operating systems, like 1980s operating systems?
[54:53.940 --> 54:55.560]  It's TCPIP, so far as I know.
[54:55.840 --> 54:56.640]  Oh, oh.
[54:56.840 --> 54:59.480]  So, if you can speak TCPIP, I'd imagine you can sit on it.
[54:59.800 --> 55:00.560]  Oh, okay.
[55:00.980 --> 55:03.380]  Well, I'm going to get my basic books out.
[55:05.040 --> 55:07.120]  Well, what kind of system are you planning on running?
[55:07.440 --> 55:10.660]  Uh, COCO-2 on either Flex or Nitro-9.
[55:11.420 --> 55:11.880]  Ooh.
[55:11.880 --> 55:12.140]  Wow.
[55:12.740 --> 55:14.300]  That'll be, uh, that'll attract a crowd.
[55:14.560 --> 55:14.700]  Mm-hmm.
[55:14.800 --> 55:15.020]  Oh, yeah.
[55:15.020 --> 55:15.980]  That'll be fun to look at.
[55:16.060 --> 55:17.520]  Good luck getting it on the net, but...
[55:17.520 --> 55:17.760]  Yeah.
[55:18.320 --> 55:18.720]  Well, uh...
[55:18.720 --> 55:21.460]  We've got all weekend to get it on the net, so that's, that's, you know...
[55:21.460 --> 55:21.740]  Yeah.
[55:22.980 --> 55:24.680]  Well, uh, I don't know.
[55:24.740 --> 55:28.020]  I have a recipe for an old program called Cuts, which is a Usenet program.
[55:28.600 --> 55:33.040]  And I could tweak it and possibly make something.
[55:34.120 --> 55:34.440]  Okay.
[55:34.580 --> 55:36.440]  Well, uh, we'll see how it works out.
[55:36.740 --> 55:37.100]  All right.
[55:37.240 --> 55:37.460]  All right.
[55:37.620 --> 55:38.760]  Thanks for the, uh, thanks for the call.
[55:38.800 --> 55:38.880]  Oh, one more question?
[55:38.880 --> 55:39.240]  Yes, go ahead.
[55:39.680 --> 55:41.860]  Um, is there room for a retro computer?
[55:41.860 --> 55:42.520]  Do you have a retro computing panel?
[55:43.180 --> 55:45.340]  Um, I think we have room for a couple more panels.
[55:45.460 --> 55:49.240]  So, yeah, if you want to submit something, by all means, uh, send it in to, um...
[55:49.240 --> 55:52.400]  I think speakers at h2k.net is the best, uh, email for that.
[55:52.720 --> 56:02.020]  And that's if you, uh, if you have an idea for a panel and you, you want to give us some detailed information both on, on who you are and what you want to do, uh, we'll try and squeeze it in.
[56:02.080 --> 56:05.020]  Because we do have, we do have as many as three rooms for the whole weekend.
[56:05.020 --> 56:07.800]  And so, we'll try and squeeze in as much as we can.
[56:08.180 --> 56:08.660]  All right.
[56:08.800 --> 56:09.040]  All right.
[56:09.100 --> 56:09.540]  Thanks for the call.
[56:09.860 --> 56:10.000]  Bye.
[56:10.220 --> 56:12.140]  Alex, you've got, uh, something interesting from the transcript.
[56:12.320 --> 56:12.460]  Go ahead.
[56:12.680 --> 56:16.920]  Uh, yes, I do, actually, uh, as regards the I do not recall, I don't know.
[56:17.700 --> 56:18.080]  Uh-huh.
[56:18.760 --> 56:19.560]  Yeah, that's it.
[56:19.740 --> 56:20.200]  You got it.
[56:20.300 --> 56:20.940]  I'm not aware.
[56:21.260 --> 56:21.920]  I'm not aware.
[56:22.700 --> 56:24.480]  He deciphers this later on.
[56:25.060 --> 56:25.280]  Okay.
[56:25.620 --> 56:26.920]  At, uh, at Garbus's request.
[56:27.040 --> 56:29.220]  Garbus, uh, of course, is Emanuel's lawyer.
[56:29.500 --> 56:29.740]  Mm-hmm.
[56:30.020 --> 56:30.760]  Uh, fine man.
[56:31.140 --> 56:31.840]  Yes, fine man.
[56:32.200 --> 56:32.540]  Thank you.
[56:32.660 --> 56:33.260]  He says...
[56:33.260 --> 56:33.700]  Oh, Garbus, you mean.
[56:33.820 --> 56:34.160]  Yeah, yeah.
[56:34.440 --> 56:34.540]  Yeah.
[56:34.940 --> 56:36.460]  I don't think we'd be talking about you.
[56:37.160 --> 56:43.660]  Uh, he, Garbus asks him, do you know whether or not any of the defendants in this case ever de-encrypted a DVD through DCSS?
[56:44.360 --> 56:46.540]  And Valenti answers, I'm not aware.
[56:46.760 --> 56:50.840]  And then Garbus says, when you say you're not aware, does that mean you don't know?
[56:50.840 --> 56:54.260]  And then he answers, that's a good synonym, a synonym, I'm sorry.
[56:54.720 --> 56:59.580]  So then Garbus says, okay, when you said before you don't recall, does that also mean you don't know?
[56:59.840 --> 57:09.320]  And then Valenti answers, well, I don't recall, when, meaning, I don't recall, I mean, that's a, that's a simple declarative English sentence, I don't recall.
[57:09.900 --> 57:14.680]  So then Garbus says, so there's a difference in your mind between I don't recall and I'm not aware.
[57:15.080 --> 57:20.720]  And then Mr. Cooper, Valenti's lawyer, interjects and says, is this a semantic discussion?
[57:21.160 --> 57:25.480]  And then Mr. Garbus says, no, I just want to know where we go with respect to the questions.
[57:26.000 --> 57:30.540]  And then Valenti says, well, the answer is, I'm fairly informed about the mother tongue.
[57:31.060 --> 57:36.380]  And it seems to me, I don't recall, or I'm not aware, means I have a vague understanding of it and I'm not sure.
[57:37.120 --> 57:38.500]  And that's how he cleared it up.
[57:39.560 --> 57:43.620]  Well, the mother tongue is about the only thing he's informed in, because everything else he didn't know anything about.
[57:44.060 --> 57:49.720]  Considering he's the main spokesperson for the organization, I mean, I think he's being used, I really do.
[57:49.720 --> 57:55.040]  I think the MPAA has used him, used his name, and he really... I believe him.
[57:55.100 --> 57:56.220]  I don't think he knows what's going on.
[57:56.360 --> 57:56.960]  I believe it, too.
[57:57.160 --> 57:59.620]  It's really unfair for them to treat him that way.
[57:59.680 --> 58:03.060]  It's the lawyers, it's the poor lawyers taking advantage of this poor old man.
[58:03.380 --> 58:04.480]  I mean, the evil lawyers.
[58:04.640 --> 58:04.920]  Yeah.
[58:05.420 --> 58:06.420]  Taking advantage of him.
[58:06.480 --> 58:08.960]  What do you call a lawyer up to his neck in sand?
[58:09.240 --> 58:13.680]  I don't know, Isaac, but we'll have to get back to your anti-lawyer remarks.
[58:13.840 --> 58:14.540]  Not enough sand.
[58:14.660 --> 58:15.200]  Yeah, all right.
[58:15.500 --> 58:17.460]  Next week, we're out of time now.
[58:18.440 --> 58:21.520]  So, I guess we'll be back next week with more updates on this.
[58:22.540 --> 58:23.720]  And there'll probably be more...
[58:23.720 --> 58:26.000]  Actually, you know, next week at this time, I think I will have been deposed.
[58:26.140 --> 58:27.300]  So, oh boy.
[58:28.080 --> 58:30.120]  I'll have the chance to get up there and...
[58:30.120 --> 58:30.840]  What do we call?
[58:31.020 --> 58:32.060]  ...say all kinds of things.
[58:33.120 --> 58:34.820]  Until next week, everybody, have a good night.
[59:20.560 --> 59:28.580]  Join host and producer Malika Lee Whitney for Women, Sensuality, and Creative Power.
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