[00:00.000 --> 00:02.460]  Something that's absolutely not reported in the U.S.
[00:02.600 --> 00:15.640]  press is that on an annual basis, a series of resolutions are introduced into the United Nations General Assembly calling for implementation of the NPT, Article 6, calling for disarmament, and so on and so forth.
[00:15.920 --> 00:22.700]  And the nations opposing this are generally the United States, supported by Israel, and maybe one other country.
[00:22.900 --> 00:25.560]  So there's kind of a partnership here, and the U.S.
[00:25.840 --> 00:27.500]  has not been willing to move in that direction.
[00:27.500 --> 00:37.460]  The next review of Article 6 of the NPT will take place in 2005, with a preparatory committee scheduled to meet this spring in New York on April 26th.
[00:37.640 --> 00:40.220]  For Free Speech Radio News, this is Peter Graff.
[00:40.640 --> 00:44.780]  And this is radio station WBAI in New York, where the time is 7.02.5.
[00:45.040 --> 00:47.960]  That means it's late for off the hook.
[00:53.330 --> 00:57.670]  The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[00:58.670 --> 01:03.150]  I caught myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
[01:03.870 --> 01:08.510]  We couldn't get much worse, but if they could, they would.
[01:08.770 --> 01:11.430]  Bunded me bombed for the best, expect the worst.
[01:12.090 --> 01:13.910]  I hope that's understood.
[01:14.250 --> 01:15.090]  Bunded me bombed!
[01:33.670 --> 01:35.010]  And a very good evening to everybody.
[01:35.110 --> 01:37.470]  The program is off the hook, sorry for the late start.
[01:37.850 --> 01:39.390]  Bernie joins us from Philadelphia.
[01:39.610 --> 01:40.150]  Bernie, you down there?
[01:40.810 --> 01:42.410]  A cold good evening to you.
[01:42.410 --> 01:44.510]  And Jeff is here in the studio.
[01:44.730 --> 01:45.410]  Good evening.
[01:45.690 --> 01:46.490]  Along with Mike.
[01:46.830 --> 01:48.050]  And that's Jim over there.
[01:48.230 --> 01:48.870]  Yes, it is.
[01:49.430 --> 01:55.550]  Before we go any further, I'd just like to take a moment out to introduce you folks to a new member of my family.
[01:56.570 --> 01:59.350]  I just got this today.
[01:59.410 --> 02:00.450]  My new phone.
[02:00.610 --> 02:02.970]  My new phone from Verizon Wireless.
[02:03.790 --> 02:05.350]  Yes, I went and I did it.
[02:05.350 --> 02:10.390]  I went out to the Verizon Wireless store and I told them, I don't want Sprint PCS anymore.
[02:10.630 --> 02:11.450]  Take this from me.
[02:11.750 --> 02:12.910]  Give me my phone number.
[02:13.130 --> 02:14.830]  Keep the same phone number, different company.
[02:15.570 --> 02:18.410]  And, well, let me introduce you to the phone here.
[02:18.970 --> 02:19.870]  It's really nice.
[02:20.270 --> 02:28.230]  Phones have gotten a lot better in the last couple of years, ever since I got this, the previous phone.
[02:28.750 --> 02:32.390]  Um, let's see if I can make this, uh, actually make some sounds.
[02:33.310 --> 02:35.030]  It's the evolution of design.
[02:35.310 --> 02:41.690]  There's a, uh, classic essay from the mid-1800s by Samuel Butler on how pipes evolved.
[02:42.050 --> 02:42.350]  Uh-huh.
[02:42.710 --> 02:44.150]  And same thing with phones.
[02:44.210 --> 02:47.350]  Yeah, he definitely has something to say about, uh, the whole, uh, phone situation.
[02:47.930 --> 02:50.750]  Uh, this, this, it blows me away.
[02:50.770 --> 02:52.150]  I had to get a camera for one thing.
[02:52.310 --> 02:53.850]  I mean, it's not like I had a choice.
[02:54.050 --> 02:55.310]  They all have cameras these days.
[02:55.570 --> 02:56.230]  It seems that way anyway.
[02:56.650 --> 03:00.330]  Uh, let's listen if I can get, uh, this is the default ring that I have.
[03:00.650 --> 03:01.330]  It's beeping.
[03:14.370 --> 03:16.090]  How could you ever want to pick this up, you know?
[03:16.850 --> 03:17.710]  It's a symphony.
[03:18.950 --> 03:23.110]  I was, I was walking down the street and it started to ring.
[03:24.090 --> 03:25.650]  And at first I didn't know what it was.
[03:25.810 --> 03:27.030]  It was just this, this noise.
[03:27.330 --> 03:28.630]  So it takes...
[03:29.730 --> 03:31.050]  It just, it followed me around.
[03:31.270 --> 03:35.610]  You ever see the episode of Family Guy where he creates his own music and it follows him around wherever he goes?
[03:36.490 --> 03:37.310]  That's how I felt.
[03:38.470 --> 03:43.470]  And when you have this kind of music as your ring, it's, it's, it's rude to pick it up.
[03:43.550 --> 03:44.050]  It really is.
[03:44.150 --> 03:45.890]  So you have to let it sort of play out and then...
[03:45.890 --> 03:47.050]  You can put that on your iPod.
[03:47.390 --> 03:49.370]  Uh, well, why do I want to put it on my iPod?
[03:49.470 --> 03:50.370]  Well, you want to listen to it.
[03:50.510 --> 03:50.890]  Oh, yeah.
[03:51.050 --> 03:53.850]  But, you know, it's, it's kind of a surprise when somebody calls and I hear that.
[03:54.530 --> 03:56.650]  Uh, anyway, what happened was, so that's my ring now.
[03:56.850 --> 03:57.550]  That's one of my rings.
[03:57.650 --> 03:58.450]  I have a whole bunch of them.
[03:58.450 --> 04:01.490]  Um, I can, I can probably do that too.
[04:01.910 --> 04:07.130]  Uh, this is, uh, I got the LG phone, uh, which, uh, has all kinds of neat little features.
[04:07.670 --> 04:22.310]  Um, but I went into the, uh, the, uh, Verizon store and I'd say probably, uh, the whole thing took about 20 minutes from when I went in there, um, to when they made remarks about my hat, uh, and then when I got that out of the way and then they, we got down to business and,
[04:22.310 --> 04:26.350]  uh, actually signed me up for service, the service I wanted, the phone I wanted.
[04:26.750 --> 04:37.450]  Uh, and, um, there was a period of time, I'd say about three hours where just like the caller mentioned last week, I could receive calls on one phone and make calls on the other with the same phone number.
[04:37.890 --> 04:42.290]  Uh, the thing is though, I could make calls on both phones at the same time.
[04:42.290 --> 04:47.730]  I was able to make a call on the, on the Verizon phone and on the Sprint phone and they both were coming from the same phone number.
[04:48.130 --> 04:49.070]  So that was pretty cool.
[04:49.350 --> 04:56.830]  Then on the way over here, on the way over here, I got a message, a text message, and that was a text message telling me that, uh, that I was signed up officially.
[04:57.110 --> 04:59.770]  And from that point on, my Sprint phone was no longer working.
[04:59.770 --> 05:03.570]  I could, uh, I could no longer, uh, make a, uh, a call on it.
[05:03.670 --> 05:06.310]  I get a recording saying that my account could not be verified.
[05:06.750 --> 05:08.310]  And that's when my phone started to ring.
[05:08.510 --> 05:11.210]  Somebody called me on this, uh, on this phone and the little symphony started.
[05:11.930 --> 05:15.930]  Did you attempt to dial yourself from one phone to the other?
[05:16.150 --> 05:17.370]  Did I attempt to dial myself?
[05:18.430 --> 05:19.010]  Should have.
[05:19.230 --> 05:20.390]  Yeah, you know, I should have done that.
[05:20.410 --> 05:21.010]  What an opportunity.
[05:21.210 --> 05:21.470]  Yeah.
[05:22.070 --> 05:22.470]  Missed.
[05:22.930 --> 05:27.950]  Well, no, I know what would have happened, because the only phone that was ringing was the Sprint phone.
[05:28.130 --> 05:30.790]  So no matter what number I called, I would get the Sprint phone.
[05:31.290 --> 05:43.070]  So in other words, the other phone, which had your number, which as we all know is X, you would have dialed out from X, and the Sprint phone, the new phone, would have received on X.
[05:43.270 --> 05:44.970]  No, the new phone would not have received.
[05:45.170 --> 05:49.030]  What would have happened was the same thing if you dial your own number on a cell phone, you get voicemail.
[05:49.170 --> 05:49.390]  Oh.
[05:49.730 --> 05:52.250]  Yes, that's what would happen if I did it from the Sprint phone.
[05:52.330 --> 05:55.190]  If I did it from the Verizon phone, I would have gotten the Sprint phone to ring.
[05:55.450 --> 05:55.830]  I see.
[05:56.110 --> 05:58.350]  So anyway, that's my exciting...
[05:58.350 --> 06:00.370]  It was so painless, so easy.
[06:00.710 --> 06:01.350]  No problems.
[06:01.750 --> 06:05.010]  You know, a few hours ago, I had a Sprint phone.
[06:05.270 --> 06:06.530]  Now I have a Verizon phone.
[06:06.530 --> 06:07.690]  I have the same phone number.
[06:07.990 --> 06:11.650]  I'm sure by next week we'll have a full report of all the problems you experience.
[06:11.950 --> 06:12.590]  Well, I don't know.
[06:12.690 --> 06:13.650]  I was pretty impressed.
[06:13.730 --> 06:16.470]  I wasn't impressed with the customer service because they seemed hostile.
[06:16.470 --> 06:17.950]  Not to me, but to all the other people.
[06:18.050 --> 06:20.750]  There were people... the people in there were irate.
[06:20.810 --> 06:21.550]  Everybody was irate.
[06:21.630 --> 06:23.170]  They were complaining about all kinds of different things.
[06:23.530 --> 06:27.730]  And you know there's a problem when the people in the store pick up the phone and say, Sir, nobody disconnected you.
[06:28.570 --> 06:31.730]  And that's kind of what the theme of the place is.
[06:31.850 --> 06:33.130]  It's just battling hostility.
[06:33.350 --> 06:34.730]  I'm happy with this phone so far.
[06:35.330 --> 06:38.370]  The service seems to be better from what I've heard.
[06:38.570 --> 06:40.010]  I haven't yet had a chance to test it.
[06:40.050 --> 06:43.830]  I did see a poster in the store, though, that says they have all the tunnels covered.
[06:44.050 --> 06:48.470]  In other words, every tunnel going out of the city you can receive phone calls in.
[06:48.670 --> 06:49.610]  Not true.
[06:50.090 --> 06:50.990]  For Verizon Wireless.
[06:51.190 --> 06:51.630]  For Verizon Wireless.
[06:51.710 --> 06:55.610]  I have Verizon, and I continually drop calls in the tunnel.
[06:55.810 --> 06:57.630]  Well, this is a big revelation here, then.
[06:57.730 --> 06:59.390]  No, I'm just telling you from personal experience.
[06:59.550 --> 06:59.830]  All right.
[06:59.990 --> 07:02.310]  Well, that's indeed sobering news from Jeff there.
[07:02.310 --> 07:05.670]  Then maybe, in fact, I won't be getting signal in the tunnel.
[07:06.170 --> 07:09.870]  But, you know, in Washington, D.C., I hear that they have signal in the metro.
[07:10.730 --> 07:11.270]  Oh, no.
[07:11.450 --> 07:11.790]  That's right.
[07:11.830 --> 07:17.870]  That means you can talk your face off while you're on a train underground and annoy everybody around you.
[07:18.990 --> 07:19.410]  That's true.
[07:19.710 --> 07:20.410]  I can see it now.
[07:20.510 --> 07:22.670]  Get on the phone and say, Honey, we're at DEFCON 4.
[07:22.690 --> 07:24.270]  Get the kids out of town now.
[07:25.010 --> 07:26.590]  Yeah, that could do it, too.
[07:27.630 --> 07:30.010]  Anyway, so that's a little adventure that I had.
[07:30.090 --> 07:33.210]  Now, the other adventure, which is unfolding right now, this is a night of beginnings.
[07:33.430 --> 07:36.730]  It's a night of births, I guess, is the best way to describe it.
[07:37.250 --> 07:48.430]  We have just unveiled, as this radio program has begun, with the help of technicians all around the world, our new website for the new conference, the new HOPE conference.
[07:48.430 --> 07:56.530]  Now, if you go to www.hope.net, that is the official site for the HOPE conferences.
[07:56.690 --> 07:58.270]  And it has just changed.
[07:58.270 --> 08:04.210]  As of 1900 hours Eastern Time in New York, you will now see...
[08:04.210 --> 08:05.170]  I'm going to read it.
[08:05.270 --> 08:06.550]  I have a printout of it.
[08:06.730 --> 08:08.650]  It works better with pictures.
[08:08.650 --> 08:15.270]  So if you have access to the Internet, it's better if you go there and see the pictures unfold.
[08:16.390 --> 08:18.790]  And as I read the pictures, I will hand them to Jim.
[08:19.110 --> 08:19.730]  Oh, that's good.
[08:20.670 --> 08:20.990]  Whoops.
[08:21.550 --> 08:23.910]  I guess Bernie was a bit miffed that I wasn't handing it to him.
[08:24.570 --> 08:25.890]  But, you know, I couldn't do that.
[08:26.230 --> 08:26.890]  There's no way I could.
[08:27.530 --> 08:29.830]  Bernie is, of course, still using Sprint PCS for reasons...
[08:29.830 --> 08:30.310]  I don't know.
[08:30.890 --> 08:31.830]  I don't know why.
[08:31.890 --> 08:34.130]  It's possible he's in a tunnel in Philly.
[08:34.710 --> 08:36.010]  No, he was home.
[08:36.130 --> 08:36.590]  Oh, okay.
[08:36.670 --> 08:37.430]  Unless he lives in a tunnel.
[08:37.650 --> 08:39.490]  All right, I'm going to try calling him again live on the air.
[08:41.470 --> 08:43.630]  I know there are people out there that don't like it when I do this.
[08:43.630 --> 08:54.610]  So we'll get the experience of having the pictures unfold here within the studio, which people at www.hope.net can get even as we speak ahead of us in the studio.
[08:54.810 --> 09:01.250]  Those people that don't like me dialing on the air are welcome to come down and answer the phone or make calls themselves and see if we can get Bernie back.
[09:05.910 --> 09:07.490]  Maybe I should get a Verizon phone.
[09:07.610 --> 09:08.910]  Maybe you should, Bernie.
[09:09.030 --> 09:12.750]  But, you know, this kind of behavior will not be tolerated, so...
[09:12.750 --> 09:14.230]  I have no more excuses, do I?
[09:14.230 --> 09:15.330]  Consider this, consider this.
[09:15.410 --> 09:16.630]  I don't know why you stick with them.
[09:16.650 --> 09:18.350]  You have some kind of super-duper plan, right?
[09:18.390 --> 09:19.990]  Because you were, like, the first Sprint customer.
[09:20.050 --> 09:23.290]  Yeah, I signed up in 1997.
[09:25.050 --> 09:26.990]  And they didn't start offering service until 1999.
[09:27.690 --> 09:30.390]  Well, I was one of the first customers in Philadelphia for Sprint.
[09:30.790 --> 09:34.490]  And I was grandfathered into this airtime plan, which is pretty good.
[09:35.590 --> 09:40.850]  It's actually coming close to what the plans that are offered now are with, like, god-awful amounts of minutes.
[09:41.210 --> 09:48.070]  But whenever I call Sprint, they say they can't recognize what plan I'm on because nobody has worked at Sprint for seven years.
[09:48.190 --> 09:50.450]  They're all, you know, they've got such a high turnover.
[09:50.670 --> 09:50.850]  Right.
[09:51.090 --> 09:55.270]  So they don't even recognize this plan or the phone I have is over five years old as well.
[09:55.450 --> 09:56.290]  But I like it.
[09:56.350 --> 09:57.090]  It's a good phone.
[09:57.290 --> 10:02.230]  So you could have the phone strapped to your head and be making phone calls 24 hours a day and it still pays off.
[10:02.430 --> 10:03.950]  You don't lose any...
[10:03.950 --> 10:04.430]  Pretty much.
[10:04.590 --> 10:04.710]  Yeah.
[10:04.930 --> 10:06.330]  Well, he'd be making 24...
[10:06.330 --> 10:09.890]  He'd be attempting to make phone calls 24 hours a day, only succeeding about 12.
[10:10.050 --> 10:10.270]  Yeah.
[10:10.510 --> 10:12.410]  I think he'd become blinded to that after a while.
[10:12.590 --> 10:13.070]  But it's interesting.
[10:13.070 --> 10:17.350]  I have a similar experience with T-Mobile because I've been with them since the Omnipoint days.
[10:17.570 --> 10:19.230]  That's the GSM provider, right?
[10:19.270 --> 10:21.710]  I have two different wireless phone companies.
[10:22.070 --> 10:22.530]  It's fun.
[10:22.670 --> 10:23.510]  It's fun to compare.
[10:23.850 --> 10:30.210]  But they say because I've been a customer of theirs for so long, they can give me the same prices that they give other people with contracts.
[10:31.410 --> 10:35.930]  So, you know, how they lower the cost of the phone if you sign up for a certain amount of time.
[10:36.070 --> 10:39.150]  They'll give me that phone for that amount without me signing up.
[10:39.230 --> 10:41.450]  But the funny thing is, some phones are free.
[10:41.990 --> 10:45.950]  So what I'm wondering is, can I just simply say, okay, I'll take that phone for free.
[10:46.050 --> 10:46.330]  Thank you.
[10:46.410 --> 10:51.590]  Now I'm going to take the other phone, you know, also for free and just keep that up for a while until somebody tells me to stop.
[10:52.210 --> 10:52.970]  It's worth a try.
[10:53.130 --> 10:54.130]  It's worth a try, definitely.
[10:54.330 --> 10:55.730]  Anyway, let's get back...
[10:55.730 --> 10:56.770]  What's the model of your phone?
[10:57.030 --> 10:58.570]  It's an LG, but LG what?
[10:58.690 --> 10:59.610]  It's the 6000?
[10:59.610 --> 11:00.290]  The VX6000?
[11:01.790 --> 11:02.590]  The VX6000.
[11:03.230 --> 11:04.410]  I've heard good things about that.
[11:04.590 --> 11:05.790]  It's good, yes.
[11:06.050 --> 11:08.970]  You can monitor satellites on it and all kinds of neat things.
[11:09.910 --> 11:15.490]  Anyway, let's get on with the hope thing, as we were starting to do before you really cut out on us.
[11:15.730 --> 11:16.010]  Sorry.
[11:16.130 --> 11:18.170]  I'm going to read what is on the website.
[11:18.170 --> 11:20.250]  I'm sure there are people right now going through the website.
[11:20.250 --> 11:25.850]  And this, in fact, is, I guess, kind of an announcement, too, because we're announcing the name of the conference.
[11:25.990 --> 11:27.590]  No, it is not H2K4.
[11:27.610 --> 11:28.990]  And I said that in 2002.
[11:30.070 --> 11:30.370]  All right?
[11:30.810 --> 11:33.070]  The one thing we cannot do is become predictable.
[11:33.430 --> 11:33.850]  All right?
[11:33.850 --> 11:36.430]  We had H2K in 2000.
[11:36.750 --> 11:37.870]  It's kind of a play on Y2K.
[11:38.210 --> 11:41.050]  We had H2K2 because nobody was expecting that.
[11:41.570 --> 11:44.430]  Nobody was expecting us to come up with a name like that.
[11:44.490 --> 11:45.750]  And it wasn't the second conference.
[11:46.050 --> 11:47.570]  It was the fourth conference.
[11:48.990 --> 11:50.870]  And this time it's going to be called Bob.
[11:51.710 --> 11:52.070]  Yeah.
[11:52.730 --> 11:53.710]  That's the big surprise.
[11:54.490 --> 11:54.770]  Okay.
[11:54.910 --> 11:56.270]  So, basically, I'm going to read the text here.
[11:56.350 --> 11:58.290]  But remember, there are pictures that go along with the text.
[11:58.410 --> 11:59.910]  And it's so much better if you look at the pictures.
[12:00.470 --> 12:01.070]  Here we go.
[12:01.890 --> 12:05.770]  And I'm sorry if I offend anybody of a religious bent.
[12:06.230 --> 12:06.670]  All right?
[12:06.710 --> 12:08.190]  But it's very hard not to these days.
[12:08.410 --> 12:09.090]  And it's just...
[12:09.090 --> 12:11.670]  The way this was written, it just kind of...
[12:11.670 --> 12:13.050]  Oh, I'm stealing myself already.
[12:13.210 --> 12:13.750]  It flows.
[12:13.790 --> 12:16.370]  It flows really well in this particular...
[12:16.370 --> 12:21.470]  You know, the Bible does not have the claim to this type of writing.
[12:21.590 --> 12:21.910]  I'm sorry.
[12:22.650 --> 12:23.850]  Anybody can write like this.
[12:23.950 --> 12:24.170]  All right.
[12:25.170 --> 12:27.450]  In the beginning, there was hope.
[12:28.750 --> 12:30.710]  It was mostly without form and void.
[12:30.990 --> 12:35.050]  And darkness was upon our faces, as we had never done anything like this before.
[12:36.510 --> 12:39.950]  And we said, let us go forward without worry.
[12:40.610 --> 12:41.470]  And we did.
[12:42.750 --> 12:47.990]  And the people saw that the hope of 1994 was pretty damn good.
[12:48.130 --> 12:49.110]  And what is so funny?
[12:49.910 --> 12:51.710]  I'm turning your microphones down there.
[12:51.990 --> 12:53.290]  You can't control yourselves.
[12:53.630 --> 12:54.470]  The photos are great.
[12:54.590 --> 12:56.990]  The photos are meant to be very, very, you know...
[12:56.990 --> 13:00.810]  They're meant to tug at your heartstrings and also be a bit humorous.
[13:00.970 --> 13:01.470]  So, yes.
[13:01.610 --> 13:01.770]  Okay.
[13:01.850 --> 13:03.130]  It's good of you to giggle, I guess.
[13:03.210 --> 13:04.070]  But I'm still turning down your mic.
[13:04.270 --> 13:05.230]  I was looking at midnight fast.
[13:05.570 --> 13:06.050]  All right.
[13:06.130 --> 13:07.310]  And the hackers saw the light.
[13:07.730 --> 13:10.110]  And they said, this must be done again.
[13:10.830 --> 13:16.230]  And so it was, in 1997, that we were beyond hope.
[13:16.810 --> 13:21.530]  And for two days and nights, beyond hope infested the city.
[13:22.770 --> 13:26.470]  And Garth Brooks did play in Central Park to welcome the hackers.
[13:27.530 --> 13:31.690]  And the people saw that beyond hope was also damn fine.
[13:32.990 --> 13:34.710]  And the millennium was approaching.
[13:35.010 --> 13:36.410]  And the people were afraid.
[13:36.750 --> 13:40.430]  And we said, we must become part of the fear.
[13:40.910 --> 13:43.750]  And so, H2K came to be.
[13:43.990 --> 13:45.850]  And there was Jell-O for all.
[13:46.550 --> 13:47.610]  For three days...
[13:49.390 --> 13:50.910]  Please, I have to get through this.
[13:52.190 --> 13:55.970]  For three days and nights, the hackers brought knowledge.
[13:55.970 --> 14:00.630]  And on the fourth day, we went to court for hosting the ECSS.
[14:01.870 --> 14:04.050]  But it was all good.
[14:05.090 --> 14:10.050]  And in the year 2002, the next hope came a year early.
[14:10.730 --> 14:13.190]  And H2K2 was bigger than all the rest.
[14:13.710 --> 14:14.950]  And it was good.
[14:15.670 --> 14:18.290]  Thus, the previous four hopes were finished.
[14:18.290 --> 14:21.690]  And each was unto itself what others could never hope to be.
[14:22.550 --> 14:26.130]  And we said, let us go forward once more.
[14:26.950 --> 14:31.170]  And so, without fanfare, we announce...
[14:31.670 --> 14:32.530]  The Fifth Hope.
[14:33.090 --> 14:35.270]  July 9th through 11th, 2004.
[14:35.590 --> 14:37.370]  The Hotel Pennsylvania, New York City.
[14:38.310 --> 14:39.490]  And there you have it.
[14:39.750 --> 14:40.550]  The Fifth Hope.
[14:42.310 --> 14:42.770]  The Fifth Hope.
[14:45.390 --> 14:51.210]  If the conference is as much fun as the website is, I think everybody will enjoy it.
[14:51.370 --> 14:53.410]  Bernie, any thoughts from down there?
[14:53.690 --> 14:55.970]  We have a theme, don't we, for The Fifth Hope?
[14:56.330 --> 14:57.090]  We have a scene?
[14:57.310 --> 14:58.010]  A theme.
[14:58.530 --> 15:00.510]  Oh, I thought you meant that there was a scene down there.
[15:00.630 --> 15:02.070]  People rioting against what we've done.
[15:03.170 --> 15:04.350]  Oh, that's probably that, too.
[15:04.390 --> 15:05.110]  We have a theme.
[15:05.210 --> 15:06.990]  Yes, our theme basically is propaganda.
[15:08.030 --> 15:10.650]  And that's something that you're going to be seeing a lot of.
[15:10.910 --> 15:12.730]  A lot of propaganda coming from us.
[15:12.770 --> 15:14.210]  Is that a well-mannered goose?
[15:14.390 --> 15:14.990]  A propaganda?
[15:17.290 --> 15:21.150]  Yeah, and you'll be seeing some things like that as well.
[15:21.290 --> 15:23.330]  And you'll be seeing spontaneous reaction.
[15:24.310 --> 15:26.650]  So, yes, that's the announcement of the night.
[15:27.010 --> 15:31.030]  The Fifth Hope is the official name of the next conference, taking place July 9th through 11th in New York.
[15:31.150 --> 15:38.950]  We will be having all kinds of additional information as how you can get involved, registration, if you want to be a speaker, you want to start a panel.
[15:39.490 --> 15:41.770]  I believe we're also going to be running a wiki this year.
[15:41.770 --> 15:42.650]  Is that not right, Mike?
[15:43.570 --> 15:44.970]  Uh, I hope it's right.
[15:45.130 --> 15:45.550]  Okay, good.
[15:45.630 --> 15:46.230]  What is a wiki?
[15:46.490 --> 15:53.390]  A wiki is a sort of collaborative website where anyone can go in and edit any page on the site.
[15:53.530 --> 15:53.830]  Okay.
[15:53.990 --> 15:57.010]  And create links to other pages and create links to the outside world.
[15:57.010 --> 16:00.670]  And we've seen this used successfully at some of the European conferences.
[16:00.870 --> 16:02.870]  And, uh, so hopefully we're going to try it here.
[16:03.350 --> 16:03.650]  All right.
[16:03.770 --> 16:05.250]  Well, we're going to try a lot of different things here.
[16:05.390 --> 16:11.810]  I had a lot of, uh, really, um, um, inspiring conversations and meetings with people overseas when I was in Holland and Germany.
[16:12.530 --> 16:14.230]  And, uh, people are really into this.
[16:14.230 --> 16:18.590]  You would think that people would be, uh, you know, afraid to come to the country and, uh, kind of backing away.
[16:18.790 --> 16:20.090]  But no, I'm seeing the exact opposite.
[16:20.230 --> 16:24.590]  I'm seeing people wanting to get more and more involved and, uh, reach those people that have a clue.
[16:25.150 --> 16:29.550]  And, uh, I think it's going to be, uh, better than, than even the last, uh, last bunch of hopes that we've got.
[16:29.770 --> 16:30.730]  Besides, fingerprinting is fun.
[16:30.910 --> 16:31.090]  Yes.
[16:31.670 --> 16:32.390]  Well, yes.
[16:32.730 --> 16:35.030]  Um, not everybody has to be fingerprinted, though.
[16:35.190 --> 16:36.430]  Only people from certain countries.
[16:37.550 --> 16:38.250]  Like Brazil.
[16:38.410 --> 16:44.350]  And, of course, Brazil is, uh, is, uh, continuing with their, uh, fingerprinting program against the United States.
[16:44.370 --> 16:51.930]  However, uh, visitors to the Fifth Hope from, uh, from overseas can, uh, fly in, uh, through Canada and avoid the fingerprinting.
[16:52.870 --> 16:53.230]  Really?
[16:53.290 --> 16:53.730]  Is that easy?
[16:53.730 --> 16:58.390]  Yes, you can fly into Canada and then travel from Canada to New York City.
[16:58.590 --> 16:59.450]  By land, though.
[16:59.870 --> 17:01.290]  Without going through the fingerprinting.
[17:01.290 --> 17:02.130]  Do you have to go by land?
[17:02.130 --> 17:03.310]  You can't really fly, right?
[17:03.590 --> 17:09.150]  Um, from what I heard, uh, flights from Canada, uh, people don't have to be fingerprinted.
[17:09.290 --> 17:15.930]  It doesn't make any sense to me because none of this whole plan makes any sense with this, uh, uh, fingerprinting system.
[17:16.250 --> 17:22.770]  But don't you have to go through the same exact, uh, um, customs lines that say, what country are you from?
[17:23.730 --> 17:23.990]  That's what I heard.
[17:24.130 --> 17:25.070]  Definitely the land-based.
[17:25.290 --> 17:31.230]  You know, you could take a train from Montreal or something to New York and avoid it that way for sure.
[17:31.370 --> 17:31.530]  Uh-huh.
[17:31.610 --> 17:33.210]  Well, Mike, you've taken the train from Montreal.
[17:33.490 --> 17:33.670]  Yeah.
[17:33.970 --> 17:34.950]  Um, what do they do?
[17:35.150 --> 17:36.610]  How do they, uh, deal with customs?
[17:36.830 --> 17:40.410]  Well, it's, it's probably changed, uh, since the, since I went.
[17:40.410 --> 17:49.850]  But, uh, some people come onto the train and look at your passport and say, oh, you're an American, you know, do you have any drugs or Cuban cigars with you?
[17:50.090 --> 17:50.350]  Uh-huh.
[17:50.670 --> 17:52.390]  Uh, and, and they, then they take...
[17:52.390 --> 17:53.830]  They specifically ask for Cuban cigars.
[17:53.870 --> 17:55.470]  No, but that's what they're looking for.
[17:55.830 --> 18:01.890]  Uh, and then they take all the kind of darker skinned people to another car and, uh, interrogate them further.
[18:02.170 --> 18:03.610]  I mean, you have to expect that kind of a thing.
[18:03.610 --> 18:04.950]  This is the United States, after all.
[18:05.550 --> 18:06.730]  Um, all right.
[18:06.810 --> 18:09.090]  Well, uh, that's, um, that's something, I guess.
[18:09.290 --> 18:13.750]  Uh, but, you know, those people that have to go through this, tell us your stories when you get here.
[18:13.950 --> 18:22.430]  You know, you'll get here one way or another and, uh, we want to, uh, you'll have a sympathetic audience to tell you exactly, uh, you know, what you should have done or what you shouldn't have done.
[18:23.150 --> 18:25.870]  Um, there's all kinds of other crazy things going on in the skies.
[18:26.050 --> 18:29.650]  This is, um, probably the funniest story I've seen in a long, long time.
[18:29.650 --> 18:30.690]  It just came over today.
[18:31.470 --> 18:32.930]  Um, this has to do with Qantas.
[18:32.930 --> 18:33.870]  You guys heard about this one?
[18:34.470 --> 18:34.990]  No.
[18:35.270 --> 18:35.550]  All right.
[18:35.810 --> 18:36.970]  Then this will be new for everybody.
[18:37.450 --> 18:39.490]  Qantas, they're the Australian airline.
[18:39.670 --> 18:49.810]  They've instructed their pilots and flight crew to use fastened seatbelt signs if necessary to help break up queuing for toilets aboard long-haul flights to the United States.
[18:50.190 --> 18:54.610]  A notice issued to cabin crew warns them to take seriously the controversial U.S.
[18:54.730 --> 18:59.850]  directive to stop passengers from congregating around toilets during the 14-hour flight across the Pacific.
[18:59.850 --> 19:24.550]  Uh, the memo obtained by the Sydney Herald, uh, and confirmed by Qantas as authentic has upset the Flight Attendants Association of Australia, the FAAA, uh, which warns that, yeah, which warns that the, uh, use of the seatbelt warning could lead to a boy who cried wolf scenario in which passengers ignore the sign when a real mid-air safety problem occurs.
[19:24.550 --> 19:35.650]  Uh, the memo signed by the company's technical and operational information controller, Kerry Green, states, under the captain's direction, flight crew will make the following pre-flight public address on flights to the U.S.
[19:35.650 --> 19:36.490]  The U.S.
[19:37.030 --> 19:44.770]  Transport Security Administration requires that for flights to the United States, passengers are not to congregate in groups in any area of the aircraft, especially near the laboratories.
[19:45.530 --> 19:47.390]  The cooperation with this policy is greatly appreciated.
[19:47.470 --> 19:49.890]  What I have to wonder, what if people are sitting together?
[19:50.190 --> 19:51.450]  Isn't that congregating in a way?
[19:51.530 --> 19:57.670]  You know, if you buy a bunch of tickets for a bunch of Australians heading over here and you're like eight or nine people, how are they going to prevent that?
[19:57.910 --> 19:59.270]  That immediately came to mind.
[19:59.270 --> 20:00.470]  What if you're coming to the U.S.
[20:00.510 --> 20:02.770]  with your extended family, six people or so?
[20:03.550 --> 20:05.010]  You get up to walk around.
[20:05.130 --> 20:08.150]  They tell you on a long flight, 14 hours, get up, walk around.
[20:08.270 --> 20:10.450]  Otherwise, you'll get blood clots in your leg and it might go to your heart.
[20:10.690 --> 20:12.490]  Well, I'm talking about just sitting in your chair, though.
[20:12.570 --> 20:13.310]  You're still congregating.
[20:13.330 --> 20:14.210]  Well, yes, that's true.
[20:24.570 --> 20:31.470]  And, you know, your grandmother and your great-grandmother can decide while waiting for the lavatory or congregating somewhere else to rush the cockpit.
[20:32.110 --> 20:33.850]  Now, Jeff, you found another story about this.
[20:34.010 --> 20:35.910]  Yeah, this was on the BBC News.
[20:36.130 --> 20:38.210]  I got this last week on the 8th.
[20:38.390 --> 20:41.350]  But it's basically the same story as they reported.
[20:43.370 --> 20:44.250]  And it's...
[20:44.950 --> 20:47.330]  It's making us look like fools to the whole world, you know.
[20:48.790 --> 20:50.670]  Everybody's got something to say about this kind of thing.
[20:50.830 --> 20:53.530]  What's kind of surprising is that Qantas is playing along.
[20:54.710 --> 20:55.910]  Well, do they really have a choice?
[20:56.090 --> 21:03.150]  I mean, when I was over in England, all the airlines were going nuts over there, which made me feel really good because I was flying, you know, a British airline to come back here.
[21:03.450 --> 21:07.430]  But they didn't want to put sky marshals on airplanes because they said it was not safe.
[21:08.010 --> 21:14.690]  And, of course, I don't know if you remember, but shortly after 9-11, people were talking about should we have sky marshals on board airplanes.
[21:14.950 --> 21:18.370]  And now all of a sudden it's just, yeah, we're going to do it regardless of what people say.
[21:18.970 --> 21:23.850]  All the fears and worries of having live ammunition on an airplane have gone out the window.
[21:24.230 --> 21:27.390]  Over there, though, people are still a little concerned about this.
[21:27.630 --> 21:28.830]  No pun intended, right?
[21:28.830 --> 21:29.590]  No pun intended, no.
[21:30.110 --> 21:34.070]  And they don't want to just kowtow to what the United States tells them to do.
[21:34.170 --> 21:36.630]  But in the end, that's what they wind up doing.
[21:37.270 --> 21:41.810]  There's a practical problem with this no lines at the bathroom situation.
[21:42.130 --> 21:44.330]  Oh, I can think of a bunch of problems, but what's your practical problem?
[21:44.330 --> 21:47.130]  Yeah, I mean, does everybody just have to jump out of their seat as soon as the door opens?
[21:47.190 --> 21:48.330]  I mean, how does this work?
[21:49.510 --> 21:50.270]  I don't know.
[21:50.550 --> 21:55.090]  You ring the flight attendant, she gives you a little number, and they put a little number at the...
[21:55.090 --> 21:55.870]  Oh, like in the deli.
[21:56.150 --> 21:58.150]  Right, they put a LED number.
[21:58.790 --> 22:01.730]  You've got, let's say, four bathrooms, A, B, C, and D.
[22:02.270 --> 22:06.350]  And they'll say, A, 25, B, 16.
[22:06.810 --> 22:08.650]  It's going to be number one or number two.
[22:08.990 --> 22:12.890]  Or they could be like that game show, you know, number 43, come on down, you know.
[22:13.210 --> 22:15.110]  We're the next contestants on...
[22:15.110 --> 22:18.350]  Okay, well, this is silly, and it's going to continue getting more silly.
[22:18.470 --> 22:20.070]  But you see, that's the beauty of it.
[22:20.090 --> 22:21.130]  It's a ridiculous situation.
[22:21.650 --> 22:24.090]  We don't have to let it drive us insane.
[22:24.090 --> 22:26.750]  We can share little anecdotes and things like that.
[22:26.750 --> 22:34.810]  And, of course, the new Bush administration plan to color code passengers is moving right ahead.
[22:35.090 --> 22:37.770]  Passengers coded red would be stopped from boarding.
[22:38.010 --> 22:40.630]  Yellow would mean additional screening at security checkpoints.
[22:40.770 --> 22:45.250]  And green would mean an only standard level of scrutiny.
[22:45.490 --> 22:47.690]  So I guess nobody gets a free pass.
[22:48.450 --> 22:53.170]  Airlines and airline reservation companies would reportedly be forced to turn over all passenger records to U.S.
[22:53.250 --> 22:56.250]  government officials who struck out in a trial program.
[22:57.770 --> 22:58.470]  I don't know.
[22:58.830 --> 23:01.150]  This article makes no sense at all.
[23:01.310 --> 23:01.630]  I'm sorry.
[23:01.910 --> 23:02.870]  I'm not going to read.
[23:02.950 --> 23:03.870]  This is CBS News.
[23:04.410 --> 23:05.850]  It doesn't make sense in English.
[23:06.170 --> 23:07.990]  But what it's trying to say...
[23:07.990 --> 23:16.010]  What it's trying to say is that they're putting all kinds of color-coding systems into effect for every person that boards airplanes.
[23:16.250 --> 23:17.430]  This is the CAPS-2?
[23:17.830 --> 23:18.350]  Yes.
[23:18.350 --> 23:20.130]  CAPS-2 was the original name.
[23:21.590 --> 23:23.250]  But this is a part of it, yeah.
[23:23.430 --> 23:23.610]  Yeah.
[23:23.770 --> 23:25.350]  It's more commonly referred to as CAPS-2.
[23:27.330 --> 23:27.690]  Yeah.
[23:27.790 --> 23:30.570]  It's the second generation of CAPS-1, which is a system now in use.
[23:30.770 --> 23:33.970]  It stands for Computer Assisted Passenger Prescreening.
[23:34.930 --> 23:39.030]  The ACLU objects to CAPS-2, saying it would make every American a suspect.
[23:39.690 --> 23:42.770]  And it lacks due process protections for people who are unfairly labeled.
[23:42.910 --> 23:44.430]  And it's based on judgments made in secret.
[23:44.810 --> 23:46.990]  And it would be easy for terrorists to circumvent.
[23:46.990 --> 23:51.110]  But regardless, it's going to be the way things are.
[23:51.110 --> 23:53.830]  Think of all the federal contractors it will provide jobs for.
[23:54.690 --> 23:55.370]  Yeah, yeah.
[23:56.850 --> 24:01.830]  Another late-breaking news item, which we've gotten about a dozen times at OTH at 2600.com.
[24:01.910 --> 24:03.650]  Thank you, everybody, for emailing us over there, by the way.
[24:04.390 --> 24:07.230]  It seems that there are some pranksters on the loose in Michigan.
[24:07.910 --> 24:13.110]  Some drive-thru customers at a Troy Burger King are getting more than the meals they expected.
[24:13.290 --> 24:22.370]  Police in the northern Detroit suburb are looking for someone who is using a device to broadcast on the same frequency as a Burger King drive-thru speaker.
[24:22.370 --> 24:24.050]  That's according to the Detroit News.
[24:49.510 --> 24:53.670]  Police suspect the calls are being made by a radio transmitter or walkie-talkie near the restaurant.
[24:53.670 --> 24:56.690]  The person could be charged with a misdemeanor if caught.
[24:57.410 --> 25:03.410]  Kevin Barnes, a spokesman for Michigan Multi-King, which owns the restaurant, said his company wants to keep the incidents low-key.
[25:03.570 --> 25:05.250]  That's why they're putting a news story out about it.
[25:05.770 --> 25:08.570]  It's rare, but I've heard this has happened at other businesses.
[25:08.830 --> 25:11.150]  Well, Mr. Barnes, yes, it has happened at other businesses.
[25:11.150 --> 25:13.290]  This is something that is as old as the hills.
[25:13.590 --> 25:15.570]  In fact, it's even in Freedom Down Time.
[25:15.650 --> 25:17.050]  You can see people doing it live.
[25:17.250 --> 25:18.150]  It's not hard.
[25:18.230 --> 25:19.830]  I don't know why this is getting so much publicity.
[25:19.830 --> 25:23.770]  It's been moving on every newswire, and we've gotten different copies of this story.
[25:23.870 --> 25:29.430]  People saying, don't get a Whopper, you're too fat to get a Whopper, get something else, or we don't have this, or we're closed.
[25:29.590 --> 25:31.030]  You know, little pranks like that.
[25:31.730 --> 25:36.310]  But for some reason, it got leaked to the right reporter, and now it's everywhere as if it's a news story.
[25:36.430 --> 25:37.610]  Bernie, how easy is this?
[25:38.130 --> 25:42.790]  It's extremely easy, especially if you're any kind of a radio hobbyist.
[25:43.550 --> 25:48.850]  The frequencies are very easy to find online or with a frequency counter, which is a little portable thing.
[25:49.630 --> 25:51.310]  Jeff, you have a frequency counter, don't you?
[25:51.610 --> 25:52.770]  Yeah, I think I have one.
[25:52.990 --> 25:54.710]  Someone helped me purchase it one day.
[25:54.930 --> 25:55.690]  There we go.
[25:55.870 --> 25:58.770]  So you can find them at Dayton Hamtention and other places.
[25:58.810 --> 25:58.890]  There you go.
[25:58.910 --> 26:05.910]  Anyway, you can walk up to one of these fast food restaurants with a frequency counter and read off the frequencies as transmitted.
[26:05.910 --> 26:08.010]  There's actually two frequencies being broadcast.
[26:08.470 --> 26:13.570]  One is they're full-duplex conversations, so there's two transmitters going on on different frequencies.
[26:13.770 --> 26:15.750]  There's a customer frequency, which is the...
[26:15.750 --> 26:18.130]  We talk into the intercom at the drive-thru.
[26:18.310 --> 26:27.770]  That transmits via radio to the clerk's headset, and the clerk transmits back on a different frequency, so you can, you know, interrupt each other in a full-duplex conversation.
[26:28.370 --> 26:43.210]  If you go to a website called Fordyce.org, it's F-O-R-D, as in David, Y-C-E, dot org slash scanning, you'll find a host of fast food restaurant radio frequencies.
[26:43.650 --> 26:59.010]  And you can buy an inexpensive ham radio for a couple hundred dollars and go online and find out instructions on how to modify it to work outside the amateur radio bands and transmit on these frequencies.
[26:59.930 --> 27:13.010]  McDonald's, for instance, has... the customer frequency is 457.5375, and the clerk frequency, which is what they were using here, is 461.0875.
[27:13.790 --> 27:17.110]  There's other frequencies, too, depending on which McDonald's it is, but that's a common one.
[27:17.190 --> 27:19.050]  But, Bernie, they were talking about Burger King.
[27:19.630 --> 27:21.110]  Well, okay, let's look up Burger King.
[27:21.110 --> 27:27.370]  In fact, I challenge you, pick any fast food restaurant you can think of, and I'll tell you the frequency.
[27:27.810 --> 27:29.690]  Okay, well, you're a whiz at this, aren't you?
[27:30.190 --> 27:36.410]  Well, let's start with Burger King, since we were talking about Burger King, and since there might be people out there, you know, that are curious about this kind of thing.
[27:36.590 --> 27:46.430]  How about 457.55 as the customer frequency, and 467.775 as the clerk frequency.
[27:46.650 --> 27:47.730]  That's different than McDonald's?
[27:48.750 --> 27:49.610]  Yes, it is.
[27:49.830 --> 27:49.990]  Okay.
[27:50.630 --> 27:52.830]  I know Taco Bell uses this system as well.
[27:53.250 --> 27:54.190]  Taco Bell.
[27:57.810 --> 28:09.930]  457.5375, which is the same customer frequency as McDonald's, so they can't be too close to each other, or 468.3875, which is different than McDonald's for the clerk frequency.
[28:09.930 --> 28:13.330]  I wonder if fast food restaurants have interfered with each other sometimes.
[28:13.690 --> 28:16.810]  They try to coordinate this stuff so they don't interfere with each other.
[28:16.910 --> 28:24.470]  Whoever installs the radio system for the restaurant checks to see what close-by restaurants you're using, what frequencies.
[28:24.670 --> 28:28.130]  I'm surprised they're still using an analog system that can be so easily hacked.
[28:28.310 --> 28:30.250]  I mean, this is pretty much child's play.
[28:30.330 --> 28:35.850]  If you have a modified two-way radio, basically just punch in this frequency like dialing a phone, and you can transmit on it.
[28:35.910 --> 28:39.110]  It's not legal from an FCC regulation standpoint.
[28:39.110 --> 28:40.810]  But it's fairly harmless.
[28:41.070 --> 28:45.430]  I mean, it's not harmless if you transmit on law enforcement frequencies and interfere with their operations.
[28:45.670 --> 28:51.050]  But these are largely, most of these frequencies are unlicensed now.
[28:51.050 --> 28:59.130]  The FCC has given up licensing what they call their itinerant frequencies, and they're allocated for generic purposes like this.
[28:59.130 --> 29:13.030]  So, next time you see someone at a fast food restaurant with one of those headsets, it's actually a walkie-talkie, and they're talking to the two-way radio that's built into the intercom system that you drive through, and it can very easily be monitored on your scanner.
[29:13.210 --> 29:22.830]  I once placed an order at a Kentucky Fried Chicken from three blocks away, and by the time I got there, I just drove right past the intercom and picked up my order.
[29:22.990 --> 29:23.770]  It was amazing.
[29:23.770 --> 29:25.610]  What would you have done if somebody else got in line?
[29:26.850 --> 29:27.990]  They would have gotten your order.
[29:28.210 --> 29:29.130]  It was a slow day.
[29:29.370 --> 29:29.730]  Okay.
[29:30.090 --> 29:33.990]  I scoped the place out, and I tried this concept out, and it worked.
[29:34.110 --> 29:36.790]  Well, we can't let you mention KFC without giving their frequency, so...
[29:37.250 --> 29:39.210]  Actually, it used to be Kentucky Fried Chicken.
[29:39.250 --> 29:40.230]  Now it's KFC.
[29:40.490 --> 29:41.550]  And I'm actually cheating.
[29:41.650 --> 29:42.250]  I have a list here.
[29:42.290 --> 29:44.030]  I don't remember these off the top of my...
[29:44.030 --> 29:47.990]  You know, I figured you had some kind of hocus-pocus going on there.
[29:47.990 --> 29:48.790]  Oh, well.
[29:49.370 --> 29:58.270]  Kentucky Fried Chicken, 460.6625 and 462.7625.
[29:58.570 --> 30:13.430]  Now, as I said in Freedom Downtime, the documentary we made a couple of years ago, there's a scene where we're showing somebody doing this at a fast food place and basically just talking to a bunch of people at the drive-in who really find the whole thing kind of humorous.
[30:13.430 --> 30:16.970]  Of course, the person in the story didn't find it that humorous and eventually came out to investigate.
[30:18.910 --> 30:20.510]  It's a fun thing to do.
[30:20.790 --> 30:22.590]  It's going to upset them, yes.
[30:23.930 --> 30:27.850]  But, you know, maybe they should get a better system where it's not so easy to interfere with.
[30:27.890 --> 30:32.770]  It's not something worthy of reporting in all the major newspapers of the country, though.
[30:33.390 --> 30:38.210]  I think it would have been better if these pranksters told the people, you know, don't buy a bidmack.
[30:38.410 --> 30:40.910]  Buy a vegetarian meal down the street.
[30:40.910 --> 30:41.670]  They have good salads.
[30:41.910 --> 30:44.610]  Or, you know, say something of meaning to these people.
[30:44.610 --> 30:50.190]  Or, like, you know, don't you know McDonald's clears so many acres of rainforests every hour?
[30:50.550 --> 30:51.750]  Or, you know, something like that.
[30:51.890 --> 30:52.670]  Just inform people.
[30:52.950 --> 30:55.890]  Or just ask people, you know, stop the war in Iraq.
[30:56.050 --> 30:57.210]  Or say something more important.
[30:57.730 --> 30:59.970]  Well, that's something...
[31:00.490 --> 31:03.230]  Suggestions for some people out there that might be engaged in this kind of thing.
[31:03.270 --> 31:05.190]  But we don't suggest that people do this in the first place.
[31:05.210 --> 31:05.850]  No, no, no, no, no.
[31:05.850 --> 31:14.610]  But people who do this kind of thing might try something like, well, there are some additional scenes in the DVD that are going to be released later this year.
[31:15.330 --> 31:24.510]  Such as, outside of Taco Bell, where somebody suggested to the person at the drive-in, We're having trouble with our microphones.
[31:24.590 --> 31:28.190]  Just, if you could honk your horn two times, one second each.
[31:29.510 --> 31:31.130]  And, of course, everybody would do that.
[31:31.210 --> 31:34.570]  And that was all the proof you needed that the person was able to hear what was going on.
[31:34.650 --> 31:36.550]  And, of course, it annoyed the people inside the Taco Bell.
[31:36.710 --> 31:37.130]  No end.
[31:38.090 --> 31:39.330]  All right, enough of this.
[31:39.630 --> 31:41.430]  How about this for an interesting story?
[31:41.550 --> 31:42.790]  A bunch of weird stories today.
[31:43.430 --> 31:51.170]  German police are investigating after an angry man returned a computer he had just bought, saying it was packed with small potatoes instead of computer parts.
[31:52.010 --> 32:00.290]  The store replaced the computer free of charge, but became suspicious when he returned a short time later with another potato-filled computer casing.
[32:00.830 --> 32:09.890]  Police in the western city of Kasserschlatten said on Monday, the second time he said he didn't need a computer anymore and asked for his money back in cash.
[32:10.310 --> 32:13.750]  Police are now investigating the man for fraud and potato theft.
[32:14.070 --> 32:15.530]  Well, my computer has chips.
[32:18.370 --> 32:19.630]  Why are people...
[32:19.630 --> 32:21.910]  I mean, come on, you get away with it once, you do it again?
[32:22.150 --> 32:23.810]  How stupid can you possibly be?
[32:24.670 --> 32:26.790]  New ground is being dug here.
[32:27.010 --> 32:29.110]  I'm surprised you got away with it the first time.
[32:29.170 --> 32:30.210]  Yeah, well, you can get away with...
[32:30.210 --> 32:31.210]  I have a potato-filled computer.
[32:32.810 --> 32:33.870]  Small potatoes crying.
[32:34.190 --> 32:34.410]  Yeah.
[32:36.030 --> 32:41.050]  Do you have the story about the kid, I think he was down in Texas, 13-year-old.
[32:41.310 --> 32:42.850]  I mean, my new hero is...
[32:42.850 --> 32:43.790]  The kid that said, hey?
[32:43.990 --> 32:44.110]  Yeah.
[32:44.210 --> 32:45.210]  Yeah, tell us about this.
[32:45.230 --> 32:45.770]  This is great.
[32:46.110 --> 32:50.210]  My new hero is Dave Lieber, who writes the column, In My Opinion.
[32:50.210 --> 32:51.950]  And this...
[32:52.450 --> 32:56.650]  It was fine and lovely to see somebody who gets it and puts it out there.
[32:57.790 --> 33:03.930]  And it was also interesting to see the woman that was responsible for taking care of the computers.
[33:04.070 --> 33:14.730]  How she basically talked the principal into suspending a student who sent out, after his dad had showed him, how the old DOS system, you used to be able to send a message throughout the network.
[33:14.730 --> 33:16.190]  Kind of what IM is today.
[33:16.390 --> 33:19.710]  This is what that did back then, just through DOS on a network.
[33:20.010 --> 33:24.110]  And so what does anyone who learns something do but share it with a friend?
[33:24.670 --> 33:26.070]  That's what education is about.
[33:27.630 --> 33:28.910]  So this kid did it.
[33:29.050 --> 33:29.950]  The principal saw it.
[33:30.110 --> 33:31.030]  Didn't see who it was from.
[33:31.110 --> 33:31.850]  So he just deleted it.
[33:31.910 --> 33:32.370]  No big deal.
[33:32.830 --> 33:33.690]  I saw that.
[33:33.790 --> 33:34.390]  I saw that phrase.
[33:34.570 --> 33:34.870]  It's what?
[33:34.910 --> 33:35.650]  An instant message?
[33:35.910 --> 33:36.910]  Or something on the screen?
[33:36.910 --> 33:37.710]  How do you delete that?
[33:37.930 --> 33:39.470]  You just click the X.
[33:39.910 --> 33:41.490]  It just pops up as a window.
[33:42.270 --> 33:42.630]  Okay.
[33:42.830 --> 33:43.990]  Is that really deleting it, though?
[33:44.310 --> 33:45.070]  Can you save it?
[33:45.790 --> 33:47.270]  I'm used to messages coming over my screen.
[33:47.270 --> 33:48.430]  I either read them or I don't.
[33:49.090 --> 33:49.510]  Yeah, no.
[33:49.630 --> 33:50.550]  It's like a pop-up band.
[33:50.570 --> 33:51.850]  It's a minor point, but...
[33:51.850 --> 33:52.030]  Right.
[33:52.150 --> 33:52.690]  No problem.
[33:52.690 --> 33:57.370]  So when the woman who takes care of the...
[33:57.370 --> 33:58.290]  And we can basically...
[33:58.290 --> 33:59.810]  I mean, her name was Beverly Sweeney.
[33:59.970 --> 34:01.850]  I don't know if we want to embarrass her anymore.
[34:02.490 --> 34:04.990]  But she actually accused the student of hacking.
[34:06.410 --> 34:07.210]  Beverly Sweeney?
[34:07.330 --> 34:08.370]  Is that spelled with an E?
[34:08.390 --> 34:08.690]  Beverly Sweeney.
[34:08.850 --> 34:09.150]  I don't know.
[34:09.150 --> 34:10.610]  Maybe her middle initial is S.
[34:10.610 --> 34:11.350]  I'm not sure.
[34:11.510 --> 34:13.750]  Is it S-W-E-N-E-Y or N-Y?
[34:15.010 --> 34:16.510]  E-E-N-E-Y.
[34:16.670 --> 34:16.910]  E-Y.
[34:17.030 --> 34:17.170]  Okay.
[34:17.590 --> 34:18.990]  No, I don't think we should embarrass her anymore.
[34:19.110 --> 34:20.290]  She's already embarrassed herself.
[34:20.490 --> 34:20.970]  Yes, yes.
[34:20.970 --> 34:32.150]  But it was nice that since she did use her address that's in the school, she used computers from the school, it is a public document then, and he was able to print the entire thing.
[34:32.150 --> 34:34.830]  And also, consider what Beverly Sweeney's initials are.
[34:35.970 --> 34:36.950]  Yeah, continue.
[34:38.410 --> 34:38.930]  Okay.
[34:40.190 --> 34:43.390]  So, as I said, she accused him of hacking.
[34:43.630 --> 34:51.650]  And as I said, he'll say, the first problem here is that Sweeney, a computer teacher, apparently doesn't understand the term hacking.
[34:51.850 --> 34:54.590]  Hacking is not using a built-in command to send message.
[34:54.730 --> 34:56.450]  Hacking is defined in two general ways.
[34:56.450 --> 34:59.850]  One, use of a computer to break into someone else's computer system.
[34:59.990 --> 35:03.810]  And two, the sophisticated techniques used by an adept computer programmer.
[35:04.590 --> 35:06.390]  And he just goes on to talk...
[35:06.390 --> 35:14.990]  I mean, this is a nice long article that I think everyone should go to thestartelegram.com and hunt for it and read the entire thing.
[35:15.070 --> 35:15.850]  It's well worth it.
[35:15.930 --> 35:16.750]  And where did this take place?
[35:18.310 --> 35:21.990]  The town is Richland Middle School in Richland Hills.
[35:21.990 --> 35:23.830]  I think that's in Texas.
[35:24.290 --> 35:25.690]  I'm not 100%.
[35:25.690 --> 35:27.730]  But it is startelegram.com.
[35:27.910 --> 35:28.170]  Uh-huh.
[35:28.910 --> 35:29.430]  And...
[35:29.430 --> 35:33.150]  You see people being charged with all kinds of crazy things these days.
[35:33.450 --> 35:35.770]  And, you know, we know it's crazy.
[35:35.930 --> 35:38.150]  And years ago, everybody would have known it's crazy.
[35:38.550 --> 35:43.290]  The really funny thing, and funny in a sad way, is that we're getting used to it.
[35:43.290 --> 35:52.190]  And you can charge a kid with hacking and make hacking something bad because he sent a message on a computer screen which is designed to do just that.
[35:52.210 --> 35:55.690]  And he was using it in one of the ways it was designed to be used.
[35:56.190 --> 35:56.430]  Yeah.
[35:56.530 --> 35:58.290]  And the poor kid didn't get any warning.
[35:58.710 --> 35:59.110]  No...
[35:59.110 --> 36:01.490]  There's no policy that says that this shouldn't happen.
[36:01.510 --> 36:02.250]  He can't do it.
[36:02.370 --> 36:04.490]  And he was clobbered with a three-day suspension.
[36:06.190 --> 36:10.890]  So, you know, even as a teacher myself, you know, that I thought was a bit much...
[36:10.890 --> 36:12.070]  Especially as a teacher yourself.
[36:12.070 --> 36:21.130]  I mean, you know, just because you're a teacher doesn't mean that you would discipline somebody for doing something, you know, outside the norm if it was completely harmless and just curiosity.
[36:21.870 --> 36:36.270]  Another blaming the messenger situation where the teacher, if she had a clue, Beverly, should have made herself aware of the features of the system she was administering and disabled that feature if she didn't want her students to be using it.
[36:36.270 --> 36:43.310]  But since she was clueless, her teacher, her students are naturally going to explore and use the features that are built into the system.
[36:43.630 --> 36:44.190]  That's right.
[36:44.250 --> 36:50.290]  Now, speaking of blaming the messenger, interesting story unfolded here in New York last week.
[36:50.290 --> 36:54.710]  And that was of someone we've had on this show before, hacker Adrian Lemmo.
[36:55.070 --> 37:03.490]  He pleaded guilty on Thursday to federal computer crime charges arising from his 2002 intrusion into the New York Times internal network.
[37:03.770 --> 37:08.730]  And he faces a likely 6 to 12 months in custody when he's sentenced in April.
[37:09.230 --> 37:11.730]  Most ridiculous case I've seen in a long time.
[37:11.830 --> 37:13.530]  I think it even beats the hey kid.
[37:14.490 --> 37:23.490]  In a plea deal with prosecutors, Lemmo admitted to cracking the Times network and recklessly causing damage exceeding $5,000.
[37:24.270 --> 37:33.710]  Both sides agreed on the 6 to 12 month sentencing range, which under federal guidelines could permit Lemmo to serve his sentence under house arrest or confined to a halfway house at the court's discretion.
[37:33.710 --> 37:36.890]  Let's hope that the court's discretion is somewhat sane.
[37:36.890 --> 37:46.330]  The judge is not bound by the sentencing recommendation and could technically sentence Lemmo to as much as 5 years in custody, though it's unlikely.
[37:46.630 --> 37:52.890]  The hacker also potentially faces $15,000 to $20,000 in fines and could be ordered to pay financial restitution.
[37:54.430 --> 37:55.130]  Amaging what?
[37:55.550 --> 37:57.250]  That's a very good question, Bernie.
[37:59.910 --> 38:08.970]  Basically, what's really interesting about this is initially they were saying that he caused $300,000 in charges by conducting 3,000 searches on LexisNexis.
[38:09.010 --> 38:14.370]  Now, keep in mind, this was after he had publicly said what he had done.
[38:14.550 --> 38:19.330]  An article on Security Focus had been printed about this, and he had revealed everything about it.
[38:19.330 --> 38:28.570]  And they apparently left all the security holes wide open, and this was able to continue being done by him and whoever else read the article.
[38:29.490 --> 38:34.130]  So they said, yes, you racked up $300,000 in charges by using LexisNexis.
[38:34.210 --> 38:42.350]  And I also have to think that the New York Times probably has an unlimited account with LexisNexis where they pay a flat fee and use it as much as they want.
[38:42.510 --> 38:42.850]  I don't know.
[38:42.910 --> 38:43.830]  That's just my theory here.
[38:43.830 --> 38:45.770]  So I don't know if this $300,000 ever made sense.
[38:45.770 --> 38:48.870]  But they cut that down.
[38:49.310 --> 38:52.870]  They said, okay, initially we said $300,000.
[38:53.230 --> 38:55.890]  We really meant between $30,000 and $70,000.
[38:56.390 --> 39:03.370]  Now, right there, I have to wonder, how can they get away with saying something is $300,000 when they really meant it was a tenth of that?
[39:04.230 --> 39:15.590]  And is that not some kind of fraud right there to get people's attention to make people think, yeah, this guy has to be prosecuted and maybe get the feds to take an interest by claiming this huge amount?
[39:15.770 --> 39:21.250]  Which they never would have taken an interest if it was this tiny amount, which I still think is way too much.
[39:21.330 --> 39:29.510]  I think there's no way somebody could cause that kind of damage for simply accessing a system, a system that was well known to be insecure.
[39:30.630 --> 39:32.350]  So, yeah, he pleaded guilty.
[39:32.350 --> 39:43.750]  I completely understand why he pleaded guilty because when you're facing something like this, just as we saw with Fiber, with Kevin, with Bernie, yourself, you know, you have to make a deal with the devil, right?
[39:43.750 --> 40:01.910]  The way the federal sentencing guidelines are set up is that you can either take your case to trial with an opponent that has a 97% conviction rate, or you can plead guilty.
[40:01.910 --> 40:10.890]  If you take it to trial, they will sentence you with a maximum guideline, which is, if you look at the chart, they're just insane guidelines.
[40:11.150 --> 40:12.590]  They're just years and years in prison.
[40:12.990 --> 40:19.310]  Or you can plead guilty, and they'll give you a much lesser sentence, which is still an outrageous sentence.
[40:19.490 --> 40:24.350]  I mean, Adrian shouldn't go to jail for a year for pointing out security holes in a system, in my opinion.
[40:25.690 --> 40:28.230]  But, in any case, you have a choice.
[40:28.490 --> 40:41.850]  You can either, in my case, I agreed to plead guilty if the government agreed not to come up with estimated damage figures in a case where they didn't have to prove there was any damage at all.
[40:41.910 --> 40:48.830]  They could just say, well, you know, we estimate there must have been this much damage, although we can't prove any damage or any victims at all.
[40:49.030 --> 40:53.850]  So they agreed to admit there were no victims, in my case, if I pled guilty.
[40:54.350 --> 40:55.390]  So, what was I going to do?
[40:55.510 --> 40:57.410]  Spend a few more years in prison or plead guilty?
[40:57.510 --> 41:04.710]  And I'm sure that Kevin and Adrian and Fiverr and others, a lot of other people, face the same sort of situation.
[41:04.910 --> 41:07.690]  And you don't want to spend too much time in prison if you can help it.
[41:08.730 --> 41:09.450]  Certainly true.
[41:09.670 --> 41:19.570]  But the big disadvantage, of course, to this is that they have another victory under their belts to say that we've prosecuted successfully another dangerous computer hacker.
[41:20.430 --> 41:23.210]  And, you know, you have a case here, especially with this case.
[41:23.210 --> 41:35.230]  This guy had been able to hack into, what was it, Excite at Home, Yahoo, Blogger, even WorldCom, which wound up praising him for what he told them as far as their vulnerabilities.
[41:35.430 --> 41:37.630]  He did this using nothing but a web browser.
[41:37.810 --> 41:38.250]  That's right.
[41:38.430 --> 41:51.050]  Now, I think if you can figure out a way, using a web browser, to get into the New York Times and reveal that they're keeping everyone's private identification, their social security numbers, all kinds of things like that.
[41:51.130 --> 42:00.910]  And the worst that you do is insert your name into that list of writers as a computer security expert, which I think, you know, in any other day would be considered funny.
[42:02.210 --> 42:03.470]  I think you're doing a service.
[42:03.950 --> 42:05.790]  He never spread this information around.
[42:05.870 --> 42:06.530]  He certainly could have.
[42:06.670 --> 42:07.890]  He could have caused all kinds of mayhem.
[42:09.590 --> 42:13.390]  But for this, he's blamed as if he had caused a security hole in the first place.
[42:13.450 --> 42:16.870]  And it's just sad because not only is he a victim of this, we're all victims.
[42:17.290 --> 42:20.630]  People who discover these kinds of things in the future aren't going to want to tell anybody.
[42:21.370 --> 42:25.650]  And the systems will remain completely wide open and vulnerable.
[42:26.370 --> 42:28.630]  Adrian attended our last conference, I believe.
[42:28.770 --> 42:29.190]  Yes, he did.
[42:30.130 --> 42:32.750]  And he's also known as the homeless hacker.
[42:33.790 --> 42:36.230]  I don't know why he's known as that, because he has a home.
[42:37.070 --> 42:40.830]  Basically, that's a media fabrication that he wanders around.
[42:40.890 --> 42:41.850]  Therefore, he's a homeless hacker.
[42:42.210 --> 42:42.690]  It's kind of silly.
[42:42.970 --> 42:44.910]  More of a nomadic... maybe the nomadic hacker.
[42:44.930 --> 42:46.350]  Yeah, nomadic, I guess, is a little better.
[42:46.450 --> 42:48.550]  But it's like calling, you know, Kevin the dark side hacker.
[42:48.550 --> 42:52.010]  They have to put an adjective of some sort in front of the word.
[42:53.170 --> 42:54.970]  Yeah, I'm just going to move on to the next one.
[42:55.590 --> 42:56.170]  I agree.
[42:56.310 --> 42:57.870]  Just because he travels a lot doesn't make him homeless.
[42:58.330 --> 43:02.390]  But before you do, I just want to point out this kind of an interesting parallel to this.
[43:02.470 --> 43:11.810]  I don't know if you heard this story, where the Associated Press accidentally leaked a private phone list of all the celebrities that they talk to, that their sports department talks to.
[43:12.330 --> 43:17.230]  The AP phone list was packed with more than 750 celebrity listings, many of them home and cell numbers.
[43:17.690 --> 43:21.590]  And it got sent out to all these Associated Press affiliates.
[43:21.610 --> 43:23.070]  And it's all over the place now.
[43:23.070 --> 43:23.790]  It's on the Internet.
[43:24.010 --> 43:25.810]  And you can get people's...
[43:26.590 --> 43:29.210]  Kareem Abdul-Jabbar's home phone number and cell phone number.
[43:29.370 --> 43:31.090]  And they keep this information out there.
[43:31.150 --> 43:32.330]  And they occasionally make mistakes.
[43:32.390 --> 43:35.310]  And they just violate your privacy because they don't know what they're doing.
[43:35.630 --> 43:38.310]  And the people who get blamed are the people that tell them, hey, you know what?
[43:38.370 --> 43:41.550]  You shouldn't be doing this because you might wind up doing something wrong.
[43:41.950 --> 43:56.710]  Now, the government with this CAPS-2 system, which is going to keep track of people's credit information and date of birth, social security number, home address, credit card numbers, the government's never going to make any mistakes and accidentally leak this information,
[43:56.830 --> 43:57.250]  is there?
[43:57.990 --> 43:59.650]  If they do, it will be with the best intentions.
[44:00.110 --> 44:00.550]  Yeah, I'm sure.
[44:01.090 --> 44:01.710]  Jeff, what do you have?
[44:02.110 --> 44:04.430]  All right, quickly, just because I know we should start taking some calls.
[44:05.350 --> 44:07.010]  209-2900 is our phone number.
[44:07.350 --> 44:12.970]  They're going to start putting the RFID tags in casino chips and then maybe money.
[44:13.650 --> 44:14.950]  Oh, what fun.
[44:15.410 --> 44:17.750]  So all that stuff will be able to be tracked.
[44:18.130 --> 44:18.430]  Exactly.
[44:18.650 --> 44:19.850]  You're late with the casino chips.
[44:19.970 --> 44:21.850]  They've been doing that for some time.
[44:23.170 --> 44:26.570]  It wasn't so much that you could pick it up by radio.
[44:26.570 --> 44:31.370]  You had to have a wand in proximity literally touching the chip.
[44:31.790 --> 44:33.110]  But that was no problem.
[44:33.110 --> 44:35.370]  You just run it through some sort of sorting machine.
[44:35.890 --> 44:38.070]  Yeah, just to get rid of the counterfeits and all.
[44:38.210 --> 44:39.050]  Well, tell us about the money.
[44:39.170 --> 44:40.210]  How does that work exactly?
[44:41.670 --> 44:42.770]  This is speculative.
[44:43.230 --> 44:43.450]  Yeah.
[44:43.570 --> 44:46.610]  It's the European Central Bank that's planning to do this, possibly.
[44:46.850 --> 44:47.290]  Euros.
[44:47.590 --> 44:53.870]  They're actually talking about planning to do this if RFIDs become a little more technically advanced and smaller and a little cheaper.
[44:54.050 --> 44:59.850]  If the technology can be transferred to notes, banks and stores will easily be able to check the money that is not counterfeit.
[45:01.070 --> 45:03.690]  But they're going to put it in the non-counterfeit money, right?
[45:03.690 --> 45:03.870]  Right.
[45:04.250 --> 45:05.590]  Also known as the real money.
[45:05.630 --> 45:06.830]  Yeah, for them to do it in the...
[45:06.830 --> 45:12.530]  Okay, so if money doesn't have an RFID identifier, then it's counterfeit.
[45:12.630 --> 45:13.690]  That's the assumption here?
[45:13.790 --> 45:14.190]  Yeah.
[45:14.350 --> 45:19.270]  So I guess if your money goes through the wash or you somehow destroy the tag in your money...
[45:19.270 --> 45:19.330]  It's a bad deal.
[45:19.570 --> 45:21.150]  If you tamper with it, yes.
[45:21.410 --> 45:22.090]  It's a bad bill.
[45:22.630 --> 45:22.990]  All right.
[45:23.130 --> 45:24.370]  That's something to consider.
[45:24.370 --> 45:33.130]  On that subject, the Central Bank Counterfeit Deterrence Group, do you use Photoshop CS, Jeff, in your work?
[45:33.230 --> 45:38.690]  No, I've heard about this, that we don't have the newest version yet.
[45:38.690 --> 45:45.770]  And I understand that they've got that set up now to recognize currency and then not allow the file to be output.
[45:46.030 --> 45:49.010]  I remember that was the case with color copiers when they first came out.
[45:49.010 --> 45:49.290]  That's right.
[45:49.390 --> 46:08.590]  The Canon buckled to the Secret Service and allowed the Secret Service to install technology in all of their color copiers that if you tried to copy a banknote, the machine would error out with a special error code that wouldn't let you use the machine anymore until you called Canon and a technician came out and reset it and brought along a Secret Service agent with them.
[46:09.310 --> 46:10.630]  Just for trying to copy money.
[46:11.210 --> 46:11.610]  Exactly.
[46:12.130 --> 46:16.110]  Well, just, you know, if you're going to use it in an art project or whatever, it didn't even have to be a good copy.
[46:16.110 --> 46:26.550]  Adobe recently caved, one of our favorite companies, to the Central Bank Counterfeit Deterrence Group and installed a detection system, which they couldn't even look at.
[46:26.630 --> 46:30.430]  This was like this black box software that Adobe agreed to put in there.
[46:30.490 --> 46:31.830]  They couldn't even examine the code.
[46:31.990 --> 46:36.670]  It's supposed to prevent you from scanning a banknote into the software.
[46:36.830 --> 46:40.690]  Well, as soon as this came out, everybody was finding all kinds of workarounds.
[46:40.810 --> 46:54.670]  Like, you could scan it, you could scan the banknote from another piece of software and then import it into Photoshop or use an older version of Photoshop and then scan it into a newer version of Photoshop or simply launch Photoshop CS from another application and then it would be a workaround.
[46:54.810 --> 47:00.250]  I mean, it's ridiculous and it makes people wonder, why did they even bother doing this in the first place if it was so easy to defeat?
[47:00.690 --> 47:01.590]  Yeah, you have to wonder.
[47:01.670 --> 47:04.610]  They have all these security measures in place with all this money that they produce.
[47:05.110 --> 47:11.330]  And if it's as easy as simply scanning it or copying it on a color copier, you know, where are these security measures?
[47:11.530 --> 47:13.070]  It doesn't seem like they really exist.
[47:13.070 --> 47:19.950]  And there are guidelines that they tell you that you must make the currency 75% smaller, 150% larger.
[47:19.950 --> 47:22.030]  You can only use one side, but you can use it.
[47:22.090 --> 47:24.070]  I mean, we're using it right now with posters that we're doing.
[47:25.630 --> 47:25.990]  So...
[47:25.990 --> 47:26.570]  Interesting.
[47:26.790 --> 47:28.030]  All right, let's take some phone calls.
[47:28.110 --> 47:31.110]  212-209-2900 is our phone number.
[47:31.410 --> 47:32.930]  And let's take our first listener call.
[47:33.390 --> 47:34.610]  And good evening, you're on the air.
[47:35.430 --> 47:36.070]  Oh, hi.
[47:37.130 --> 47:37.850]  I wonder...
[47:37.850 --> 47:49.550]  I don't know if you talked about this, but there was an article in the paper a few days ago about Boston University and someone releasing all the social security numbers of about 2,000 students.
[47:49.770 --> 47:51.630]  It's NYU, actually.
[47:51.630 --> 48:00.550]  What happened is you would sign up for intramural sports and clubs and such, and you'd put in your student ID number, which was your social security number.
[48:00.730 --> 48:00.990]  Right.
[48:00.990 --> 48:02.990]  This was kept in an unsecure file.
[48:04.010 --> 48:05.850]  Somebody put it on the net.
[48:06.010 --> 48:08.290]  Somebody actually not directly associated with NYU.
[48:08.810 --> 48:09.030]  Right.
[48:09.190 --> 48:11.010]  But apparently they were going after that guy.
[48:11.230 --> 48:13.450]  And, you know, do you know whatever happened to him?
[48:13.630 --> 48:15.830]  They were sort of blaming the messenger again.
[48:16.010 --> 48:16.270]  Yeah.
[48:16.470 --> 48:17.930]  Yeah, it's another case of blaming the messenger.
[48:17.930 --> 48:21.710]  But on the other hand, he didn't just announce that it was here and available.
[48:22.030 --> 48:23.910]  And by the way, here it is if you want to look at it.
[48:24.030 --> 48:25.750]  It was, here it is if you want to look at it.
[48:25.850 --> 48:27.350]  Oh, and I have this because there's a hole.
[48:27.350 --> 48:32.130]  Oh, so is that just NYU or could you find us out of that?
[48:32.590 --> 48:42.670]  I've had some interesting success in web browsing for obvious social security fields because, you know, it's always three digits, dash, two digits, dash, four digits.
[48:43.070 --> 48:47.890]  And so just pick some numbers at random and see if you can get a hit.
[48:48.050 --> 48:51.910]  Schools are notoriously insecure at guarding students' private information.
[48:52.030 --> 48:52.790]  That much I can tell you.
[48:52.950 --> 49:02.330]  I remember when I was at Penn State, they would post grades on the professor's door, not with your name next to the grade, but they'd have a printout of social security numbers with the grade next to it.
[49:02.410 --> 49:02.670]  Uh-huh.
[49:02.910 --> 49:03.310]  Great.
[49:03.510 --> 49:03.750]  Yeah.
[49:04.050 --> 49:04.930]  It was great.
[49:05.130 --> 49:06.390]  In alphabetical order.
[49:06.630 --> 49:10.310]  Yeah, but they try to make a big deal about not doing that at universities now.
[49:10.490 --> 49:18.070]  And it seems, you know, when somebody can go online and find this all out in large quantities, I wonder, is it...
[49:18.570 --> 49:20.070]  Well, they're clearly not doing enough.
[49:20.290 --> 49:23.810]  And it's important for people to point this out when they find things like this.
[49:24.410 --> 49:25.470]  Thanks for your call.
[49:25.710 --> 49:26.090]  Okay, thanks.
[49:26.950 --> 49:28.470]  212-209-2900.
[49:28.590 --> 49:29.510]  Let's go up here.
[49:30.190 --> 49:30.870]  And good evening.
[49:30.950 --> 49:31.370]  You're on the air.
[49:31.970 --> 49:32.850]  Hey, how you doing, guys?
[49:33.070 --> 49:33.470]  What's up?
[49:33.810 --> 49:43.090]  Listen, I'm wondering if anybody could possibly hack into WBAI's network and convert the station back from an anti-white male station.
[49:45.110 --> 49:48.510]  Well, ironically, you're talking to four white males at the moment.
[49:48.650 --> 49:49.590]  Well, no, he doesn't know that.
[49:49.790 --> 49:50.290]  Oh, well.
[49:50.610 --> 49:51.630]  But how can we do this?
[49:55.610 --> 49:57.370]  We have to hack into the brains.
[49:57.510 --> 49:59.790]  Hack into the brains and change...
[49:59.790 --> 50:02.310]  You've watched The Matrix way too many times.
[50:02.570 --> 50:02.990]  I'm sick of this.
[50:04.270 --> 50:06.830]  I thought I could have some fun with that, but I just got upset.
[50:07.090 --> 50:07.330]  Good evening.
[50:07.390 --> 50:07.790]  You're on the air.
[50:08.970 --> 50:09.130]  Yeah.
[50:09.250 --> 50:09.550]  Hello?
[50:10.090 --> 50:10.410]  Whoa.
[50:11.570 --> 50:12.210]  I'm certainly...
[50:12.210 --> 50:13.530]  Yeah, you hear me?
[50:13.630 --> 50:14.050]  Yeah, I hear you.
[50:14.130 --> 50:14.830]  I hear you fine.
[50:14.990 --> 50:15.250]  Yeah, yeah.
[50:15.250 --> 50:25.910]  Okay, tell us how we can send Stormbringer, you know, like a few dollars for the commissary so he has stamps and...
[50:25.910 --> 50:27.830]  Well, I'm not sure.
[50:28.110 --> 50:31.330]  Bernie, you know more about this than me as far as how you can send things.
[50:31.510 --> 50:33.090]  You can't just send money, can you?
[50:33.270 --> 50:36.290]  No, you have to send a money order, preferably a U.S.
[50:36.410 --> 50:39.190]  postal money order, to him.
[50:39.190 --> 50:45.070]  And if you go to stormbringer.tv, it has information there on how you can do that.
[50:45.150 --> 50:55.290]  But frankly, I think as much as money, which he can use to buy, you know, basic necessities like a soap and so forth at the commissary, he really appreciates people writing to him.
[50:55.370 --> 50:57.110]  He says it's a rare day he gets a letter.
[50:57.530 --> 50:59.490]  And he just sent me two big, long letters.
[50:59.570 --> 51:00.810]  He's got a lot of time on his hands.
[51:00.970 --> 51:07.150]  And if you could make his day, just write him a letter or send him some pictures, print out something off the web he'd find interesting.
[51:08.570 --> 51:09.930]  Bernie, do you have his address handy?
[51:10.930 --> 51:12.450]  No, but I can...
[51:12.450 --> 51:16.790]  If you go to stormbringer.tv, his whole mailing address is on there.
[51:17.090 --> 51:22.770]  And also, you might want to read that because it has special instructions on how to send him money or how to send him a book.
[51:22.950 --> 51:24.250]  You have to send it to the publisher.
[51:24.430 --> 51:25.690]  All the special rules are there.
[51:25.790 --> 51:28.030]  And if you don't read that, he'll never get it.
[51:28.190 --> 51:28.830]  Okay, thanks.
[51:29.110 --> 51:29.590]  All right, thanks.
[51:29.810 --> 51:30.310]  Thanks for your call.
[51:30.650 --> 51:36.270]  You know, it's interesting, too, because I've received lots of pieces of email from various people.
[51:37.150 --> 51:46.850]  Pointing out another story of how victims of all these crimes are very upset that the people who committed these crimes are writing about them on webpages.
[51:47.070 --> 51:49.030]  You know, basically what they do is they're in prison.
[51:49.170 --> 51:51.650]  Let's say they're, you know, a horrible killer or something like that.
[51:51.710 --> 51:55.530]  And they actually write their memoirs and forward it to somebody.
[51:55.530 --> 51:58.510]  And it gets posted on the internet, on a web page someplace.
[51:59.170 --> 52:01.830]  And that kind of thing is just accepted.
[52:01.990 --> 52:02.690]  I mean, that's what happens.
[52:03.210 --> 52:03.870]  It's speech.
[52:03.970 --> 52:05.230]  It's horrible speech, but it is speech.
[52:05.590 --> 52:10.810]  And then you compare that to what happened here where somebody in prison tried to talk over the radio.
[52:10.810 --> 52:18.790]  Not about specifics of his case, at least not 100% about that, but about technological issues.
[52:18.930 --> 52:21.210]  Things that were of interest to him and of interest to us.
[52:21.630 --> 52:23.770]  And that's something that's considered a threat.
[52:23.890 --> 52:25.110]  That's something that must be stopped.
[52:25.610 --> 52:27.330]  He didn't even call in to talk about his case.
[52:27.470 --> 52:27.830]  He called in.
[52:27.930 --> 52:28.850]  We asked him about it.
[52:28.870 --> 52:29.590]  We asked about his case.
[52:29.670 --> 52:29.790]  Right.
[52:30.230 --> 52:30.450]  Right.
[52:31.090 --> 52:38.770]  So the fact that other people happen to be in the studio makes, apparently, according to the Bureau of Prisons, makes it a third-party call, which is prohibited.
[52:38.870 --> 52:42.070]  And they're going to take away his phone privileges for a whole year, but they're trying to.
[52:42.210 --> 52:43.430]  So this makes no sense.
[52:43.910 --> 52:44.250]  All right.
[52:44.310 --> 52:45.350]  Well, we wish him the best of luck.
[52:45.590 --> 52:46.550]  Let's take another phone call.
[52:47.170 --> 52:47.770]  And good evening.
[52:47.850 --> 52:48.270]  You're on the air.
[52:51.350 --> 52:52.730]  Listen, I have a hacking call.
[52:52.830 --> 52:54.450]  Am I in danger of being arrested?
[52:54.910 --> 52:55.330]  All right.
[52:56.450 --> 53:01.670]  Let me just interject and say that January 6th was the 10th anniversary of MetroCards.
[53:02.230 --> 53:02.950]  Was it really?
[53:03.050 --> 53:03.550]  Yes, it was.
[53:03.650 --> 53:03.850]  Wow.
[53:03.950 --> 53:05.110]  Time is flying so fast.
[53:05.190 --> 53:05.790]  Yes, it is.
[53:05.870 --> 53:06.890]  You know what I just discovered today?
[53:07.070 --> 53:16.130]  That when you're on a bus and you put the MetroCard in and it says $2 paid, if you stand around for another second and make everybody behind you wait, it'll tell you how much is left on your card.
[53:16.190 --> 53:17.310]  I've noticed that for years.
[53:17.950 --> 53:19.470]  Well, you know, it's a stupid thing to do.
[53:19.470 --> 53:23.910]  Why don't they tell you right away so that you don't have to wait to see that information, which is valuable information to have.
[53:25.450 --> 53:25.930]  All right.
[53:26.170 --> 53:26.770]  Good evening.
[53:26.950 --> 53:27.670]  You're on the air.
[53:29.890 --> 53:30.250]  Hi.
[53:30.890 --> 53:31.490]  How are you doing?
[53:32.370 --> 53:33.150]  This is Matai.
[53:33.850 --> 53:34.830]  My name is Matai.
[53:34.910 --> 53:39.370]  I have a science project and I wanted to know if there was a laser that didn't damage the eyes.
[53:39.730 --> 53:41.790]  If there's a laser that doesn't damage the eyes.
[53:41.930 --> 53:42.730]  A laser pen.
[53:43.010 --> 53:44.750]  A laser pen that doesn't damage the eyes.
[53:44.950 --> 53:45.110]  Yeah.
[53:46.590 --> 53:48.230]  Don't look at your laser pen directly.
[53:48.450 --> 53:53.970]  I mean, you can look at the reflected beam, but don't point it right in your eye or look at a direct reflection off of something shiny.
[53:54.150 --> 53:55.230]  And don't stick it in your eye either.
[53:55.230 --> 53:55.750]  That's not good.
[53:55.830 --> 53:57.410]  So in other words, don't point it in the mirror.
[53:57.890 --> 54:00.050]  Don't stick it in your ear or any other orifice.
[54:00.770 --> 54:01.090]  Yeah.
[54:01.330 --> 54:02.570]  It's generally...
[54:02.570 --> 54:06.110]  Is that your project to find a laser that's safe for the human eye?
[54:06.170 --> 54:15.790]  No, we actually have to invent an invention and we invented, me and my friend, my friend and I, we invented a scissor with a laser pen attached and it guides the scissor to cut.
[54:15.930 --> 54:16.370]  Uh-huh.
[54:17.330 --> 54:17.730]  Wow.
[54:17.730 --> 54:20.710]  So we just wanted to know if there was a scissor that didn't like...
[54:20.710 --> 54:22.670]  Can I ask what grade you're in?
[54:23.430 --> 54:24.090]  Fifth grade.
[54:24.230 --> 54:24.710]  Fifth grade.
[54:24.850 --> 54:28.710]  Boy, you know, I wasn't dealing with lasers until at least the latter part of sixth grade.
[54:29.690 --> 54:31.170]  Gee, Bernie, any advice?
[54:31.710 --> 54:32.630]  I don't know what to say.
[54:32.970 --> 54:35.650]  Well, I mean, they're fairly harmless, but you just don't want to...
[54:35.650 --> 54:36.390]  It's a very...
[54:36.390 --> 54:37.470]  It's coherent light.
[54:37.610 --> 54:43.110]  So instead of light that goes off with the photons going off all directions, they're all pointed one direction.
[54:43.110 --> 54:50.150]  If that hits your retina, it'll make a tiny spot that you won't even notice you're blind in it, but you don't want to even like one little...
[54:50.150 --> 54:53.350]  One of those cones and rods in your eye to go bad.
[54:53.530 --> 54:55.110]  So don't look at the direct beam.
[54:55.170 --> 54:59.130]  You can look at the reflection off of the wall or whatever, but don't point it and somebody's eye.
[54:59.230 --> 54:59.890]  It's a bad idea.
[55:00.530 --> 55:00.670]  Yeah.
[55:00.970 --> 55:01.130]  Okay.
[55:01.610 --> 55:01.830]  Good luck.
[55:02.610 --> 55:02.870]  Hello?
[55:03.090 --> 55:03.490]  Yes, go ahead.
[55:03.570 --> 55:03.730]  Quickly.
[55:03.830 --> 55:12.310]  I just wanted to say that in case anybody's ever looking for a good school, the French American School, it's a very good school.
[55:12.450 --> 55:12.950]  We go there.
[55:13.070 --> 55:16.050]  It's always one grade ahead of the other schools.
[55:16.170 --> 55:17.810]  It's a private school in Maranek, New York.
[55:17.970 --> 55:18.330]  Okay.
[55:18.490 --> 55:19.870]  Well, I'm glad you got that out.
[55:20.010 --> 55:23.010]  Thanks for that call, and I'm sure everybody in that school is cheering now.
[55:23.470 --> 55:24.730]  And everybody's good looking there, too.
[55:24.730 --> 55:28.550]  Yeah, we're out of time, and boy, what a note to end on.
[55:29.230 --> 55:32.910]  We'll be back next week with the first of the spring fundraising shows.
[55:33.110 --> 55:37.710]  So please, if you feel generous, stick around next week because we definitely will be needing your help as far as that goes.
[55:38.530 --> 55:39.930]  This is it for this week.
[55:39.930 --> 55:49.850]  Again, visit hope.net and www.hope.net to find out about the latest HOPE conference called The Fifth Hope, and write to us, OTH at 2600.com.
[55:50.210 --> 55:54.890]  Stay tuned for the personal computer show, which will be coming up right away.
[55:55.470 --> 55:56.250]  See you next week.
[55:56.310 --> 55:56.470]  Good night.
[56:18.920 --> 56:33.580]  Machines, machines, they keep right on going Machines, machines, they keep right on going But I am weak