[00:07.700 --> 00:09.420]  Hello, I'm David Rothenberg.
[00:09.640 --> 00:17.320]  One of the real battles in the fight against crime, an arena rarely discussed, is what happens to a man or woman when they are released from jail or prison.
[00:17.540 --> 00:22.460]  Where will they live, earn a living, function in society after being institutionalized?
[00:22.580 --> 00:27.220]  We'll be exploring that in a special edition of Wake Up Call, Tuesday, July 13th.
[00:27.220 --> 00:38.500]  I'll be joined by Stanley Richards, who has experienced all of those transitional hazards, and together we'll talk with men and women who are overcoming the blockade that faces them when they return to society.
[00:38.740 --> 00:42.460]  Join us on Tuesday morning, July 13th, from 6 to 9 a.m.
[00:42.600 --> 00:45.580]  for a special Wake Up Call program, Coming Home.
[00:45.600 --> 00:50.920]  It's the real battle against crime and creating hope for a forgotten and ignored population.
[01:02.300 --> 01:07.380]  Hey, and you're listening to radio station WBAI in New York, where the time is just about 7 o'clock.
[01:07.480 --> 01:08.140]  Time for Off the Hook.
[01:13.310 --> 01:17.670]  The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[01:18.730 --> 01:23.190]  I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a cough.
[01:23.910 --> 01:25.990]  We couldn't get much worse.
[01:26.710 --> 01:31.450]  I'm really wrong, but the best is great, the worst.
[01:32.250 --> 01:33.950]  I hope that's understood.
[01:34.330 --> 01:35.030]  I'm really wrong.
[03:28.440 --> 03:29.580]  And a good evening to everybody.
[03:29.680 --> 03:30.780]  The program is off the hook.
[03:30.880 --> 03:34.400]  Emmanuel Goldstein here with you on this Wednesday night.
[03:34.780 --> 03:37.120]  Wednesday night, uh, what is it, Mike?
[03:37.260 --> 03:38.000]  Ten days before Hope?
[03:38.100 --> 03:38.480]  Nine days?
[03:38.560 --> 03:38.920]  Eight days?
[03:39.080 --> 03:39.120]  What?
[03:39.200 --> 03:39.600]  Nine days.
[03:39.740 --> 03:40.220]  Nine days.
[03:40.400 --> 03:40.700]  Oh, boy.
[03:41.240 --> 03:44.340]  Conference is coming together, and of course that's taking place next weekend.
[03:44.340 --> 03:47.080]  And not this weekend coming up, the one after that, July 9th through 11th.
[03:47.600 --> 03:54.440]  Right here in New York City with, uh, oh, boy, all kinds of, uh, activity, um, we're involved in, in the midst.
[03:54.520 --> 03:55.580]  That's why we sound so out of breath.
[03:56.100 --> 03:56.260]  Yeah.
[03:57.640 --> 03:58.600]  That and all the running.
[03:58.780 --> 04:00.140]  All the running around the city, yeah.
[04:00.320 --> 04:01.400]  And, Jeff, you're here tonight.
[04:01.640 --> 04:01.940]  Yes.
[04:02.080 --> 04:02.360]  How you doing?
[04:02.560 --> 04:03.580]  I'm good, thank you.
[04:03.900 --> 04:06.400]  Well, you know, doing okay.
[04:06.640 --> 04:07.100]  Did you miss me?
[04:07.600 --> 04:08.480]  Yeah, I did, actually.
[04:08.720 --> 04:08.800]  Huh?
[04:08.800 --> 04:10.240]  Because there was nobody here to press the phones.
[04:10.300 --> 04:11.300]  Nobody competent, that is.
[04:11.300 --> 04:14.580]  No, and I, I heard you make a comment, because I listened to the show.
[04:14.720 --> 04:14.880]  Yeah.
[04:15.120 --> 04:21.840]  It's a simple thing, pressing phone buttons, but, uh, here at B.A.I., we try to make everything as complicated as possible, and, uh, certainly no exception.
[04:22.500 --> 04:23.880]  And, uh, welcome, Jim.
[04:24.300 --> 04:24.480]  Hello.
[04:24.660 --> 04:25.640]  And, Bernie, you're on the phone.
[04:26.240 --> 04:30.280]  Yes, it's some very nice, relaxing music you have on tonight.
[04:30.420 --> 04:32.180]  I think we all, we all need it right now.
[04:32.300 --> 04:43.160]  Yeah, well, it comes from one of the, um, I, I, I think a film that, uh, has to do with, uh, passive, uh, uh, resistance and, uh, um, you know, non-violence, that kind of thing.
[04:43.860 --> 04:45.560]  Non-violence is not always passive.
[04:45.780 --> 04:48.440]  Yeah, well, this was a pretty non-violent film, I think.
[04:49.840 --> 04:50.640]  Kill Bill, you ever see it?
[04:51.220 --> 04:52.260]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[04:52.700 --> 04:53.020]  Anyway.
[04:54.000 --> 05:00.180]  Speaking of music, we should, uh, we should mention the song that you played at the end of the show last week, because apparently a lot of people liked it.
[05:00.180 --> 05:07.540]  A lot of people like it, and you know what, I, they liked it so much, I decided to do something I, I don't usually do, and play it again this, this week, after the end of the show.
[05:08.260 --> 05:09.560]  So, let's talk about it then.
[05:09.880 --> 05:11.540]  Some people have to listen to the whole show before I play it.
[05:11.540 --> 05:11.960]  After you play it?
[05:12.140 --> 05:13.080]  No, before I play it.
[05:13.140 --> 05:13.400]  Oh, okay.
[05:13.480 --> 05:14.260]  But at the end of the show.
[05:14.360 --> 05:14.580]  All right.
[05:15.280 --> 05:20.180]  That way all those people who tuned in, just trying to find out what the name of the song was, have to listen to us babble about.
[05:20.320 --> 05:21.760]  This is why you are the host.
[05:21.920 --> 05:23.340]  You know to do things like this.
[05:23.360 --> 05:24.480]  It's, it's the radio business.
[05:24.620 --> 05:26.240]  It's not pretty, but it has to be done.
[05:27.120 --> 05:33.900]  Um, okay, we have all kinds of important news items that have taken place this week, including a number of legal precedents that have been set.
[05:34.000 --> 05:41.100]  Bernie, why don't you start with, like, what's probably the most important one, one that would affect your case, Kevin's case, Fiverr's case, all kinds of cases.
[05:41.380 --> 05:51.560]  Well, I don't know if it's the most important in the grand scheme of things, but it's very important, um, to hackers and people who are interested in exploring technology and who might be at risk of prosecution.
[05:52.460 --> 05:58.160]  Um, last week, uh, Supreme Court ruled, and this was in a kidnapping case, but it still applies.
[05:59.020 --> 06:22.080]  Um, that in cases where, uh, numerical values are involved, whether it's dollar amounts that are alleged to have been, uh, stolen or defrauded or, or damages, as we recall in Kevin Mitnick's case, the federal government accused him of causing hundreds of millions of dollars and damages to,
[06:22.080 --> 06:24.460]  uh, corporate computer systems.
[06:25.080 --> 06:27.840]  Um, and in my case, it was zero dollars.
[06:28.000 --> 06:48.400]  But in any case, the, uh, Supreme Court ruled that the government, um, now has to prove to a jury beyond a reasonable doubt that these dollar amounts or drug weights or whatever numerical piece of information is used to calculate the sentence enhancements must be proven to a jury.
[06:48.400 --> 06:50.240]  Now, the way it works, um, try to be brief here.
[06:50.720 --> 06:57.320]  Um, when you're, uh, when you're convicted or plead guilty of a federal crime, then you go through this whole process called sentencing.
[06:57.560 --> 07:09.280]  And in a sentencing process, the government, uh, then tells the judge, uh, well, this person caused this much damage or defrauded this much dollars or possessed this much in drug weights, whatever.
[07:09.760 --> 07:13.060]  And, uh, they don't have to prove it to the judge.
[07:13.280 --> 07:16.960]  It's not an evidentiary process at that point.
[07:17.460 --> 07:20.820]  Um, you can dispute it, but you don't, you don't, there's no proof that's required.
[07:21.180 --> 07:29.080]  Um, and in Kevin Minnick's case and a lot of other cases and mine and others, the government uses that as a big stick because they know they don't have to prove these dollar amounts.
[07:29.740 --> 07:34.000]  Um, all they have to do is prove that some contact, contact happened.
[07:34.160 --> 07:39.280]  Like in Kevin's case, they could prove that, or he admitted to having access systems without authorization.
[07:39.720 --> 07:43.700]  Uh, in my case, I admitted to possessing technology that they didn't want me to possess.
[07:44.340 --> 07:50.620]  So, um, now the government actually has to prove their words, which I think is an amazing precedent.
[07:50.620 --> 07:52.720]  And there's going to be a lot of people going back to appeal.
[07:53.060 --> 07:53.940]  I'm not going to bother.
[07:54.220 --> 07:56.020]  Uh, Kevin got all excited and I called him about it.
[07:56.060 --> 07:56.580]  He's like, you're kidding.
[07:56.680 --> 07:57.300]  He didn't believe me.
[07:57.400 --> 07:59.900]  And I told him and he's like, my God, I got to call my lawyer.
[08:00.360 --> 08:08.400]  So, um, this is, this is, this is a pretty breathtaking change in how, uh, how hackers are going to be, uh, hacker cases are going to be prosecuted, I think.
[08:09.340 --> 08:09.740]  Sure.
[08:09.740 --> 08:10.400]  Sounds that way.
[08:10.760 --> 08:12.840]  Um, actually having to prove damages.
[08:13.040 --> 08:13.200]  Wow.
[08:13.680 --> 08:14.000]  Wow.
[08:14.440 --> 08:15.380]  What a concept.
[08:15.660 --> 08:17.200]  So let me, let me see how I understand this.
[08:17.380 --> 08:22.100]  Uh, you basically, uh, would be found guilty or plead guilty.
[08:22.100 --> 08:25.720]  And then the sentencing would be based on something they said after that.
[08:26.060 --> 08:26.500]  Yeah.
[08:26.580 --> 08:35.120]  What, what happens is that there's federal, there's a U S sentencing commission, uh, set up these federal sentencing guidelines, which judges are pretty much bound to follow.
[08:35.280 --> 08:36.180]  It's a, it's a chart.
[08:36.340 --> 08:40.500]  It's a grid where it shows now on the, on the vertical axis, it shows a base offense level.
[08:40.740 --> 08:44.800]  And on the horizontal axis, it's a, uh, prior criminal history.
[08:44.960 --> 08:53.040]  And Kevin's in my case, that was fairly low, but, um, there's also these things called enhancements and there's all kinds of things they throw in as enhancements.
[08:53.180 --> 09:01.620]  And some of them pertain to dollar amounts that are alleged to have been, uh, part of the damages or, or defrauded or drug weights or whatever.
[09:02.020 --> 09:04.900]  And the, it's, it's, it's that that enhances your score.
[09:05.040 --> 09:12.620]  So many extra points in my case, it would have been several more years in prison, uh, had I gone to trial and the secret service had already lied.
[09:12.620 --> 09:25.920]  I read the writing on the wall and said, well, um, if they're going to agree to promise to not, not make up, uh, estimated damages after, after it's sentencing, then I'll take the deal and, and do my time.
[09:26.080 --> 09:38.600]  Um, as opposed to them going through a trial, me being found guilty and then punishing me for going to trial by coming up with outrageous fabricated dollar amounts like they did in Kevin's case, which is routine process.
[09:38.800 --> 09:39.620]  They always do this.
[09:39.920 --> 09:41.680]  Um, just how they play the game.
[09:42.260 --> 09:44.360]  Um, it's not an evidentiary process.
[09:44.720 --> 09:46.260]  It's not an evidentiary hearing.
[09:46.420 --> 09:54.400]  There's no mechanism to, to, to really make the government prove that hundreds of millions of dollars of damages were caused or whatever.
[09:54.640 --> 09:59.480]  And it just adds up extra points so much per dollar or drug weight or whatever.
[09:59.620 --> 10:01.480]  And that can enhance your sentence by years.
[10:01.500 --> 10:06.500]  And they use that as a, as a bargaining chip to, to coerce people into pleading guilty.
[10:06.500 --> 10:07.560]  And it's really not fair.
[10:07.680 --> 10:10.500]  They should have to prove what they say, but, uh, now they do.
[10:10.620 --> 10:11.260]  And that's a good thing.
[10:11.460 --> 10:11.800]  All right.
[10:11.900 --> 10:14.440]  So, so Bernie, now, is this going to affect Adrian Lomo?
[10:15.060 --> 10:16.800]  Who's getting ready to be sentenced soon?
[10:17.100 --> 10:23.460]  Well, it, it depends on how his, uh, it's a very good question, uh, Jeff.
[10:23.940 --> 10:30.900]  Um, it, it depends on how much dollar amount they alleged Adrian defrauded, um, Nexus.
[10:31.140 --> 10:31.760]  Was it Nexus?
[10:32.020 --> 10:34.920]  They had accused him of, uh, using what do anybody remember?
[10:35.080 --> 10:35.740]  We had him on the show.
[10:35.820 --> 10:36.720]  How many, what was it?
[10:36.840 --> 10:38.140]  What was an outrageous dollar amount?
[10:38.260 --> 10:39.060]  Do you seem to calculate?
[10:39.220 --> 10:39.600]  What was it?
[10:40.240 --> 10:41.120]  300,000.
[10:41.380 --> 10:42.780]  I think it was 300,000.
[10:43.160 --> 10:43.400]  Yes.
[10:43.840 --> 10:44.060]  Okay.
[10:44.200 --> 10:46.600]  Well, this definitely would affect his, his case.
[10:47.180 --> 11:09.140]  Um, because the Supreme Court ruled that it's unconstitutional to introduce anything to a judge after sentence, after conviction, uh, at the sentencing stage that would enhance, uh, the defendant's sentence without proving beyond a reasonable doubt to a jury that those numbers were kosher.
[11:09.520 --> 11:12.340]  So, um, I think it very well could affect his case.
[11:12.380 --> 11:15.960]  And I'm sure he's got a good lawyer, uh, Adrian's is looking at, Adrian is looking at that right now.
[11:16.060 --> 11:20.700]  So perhaps it's a good thing that his sentence was, his, uh, sentencing was postponed earlier this year.
[11:20.980 --> 11:26.080]  And it's going to be, I believe, uh, second week of July here in New York that that sentencing would be taking place.
[11:26.160 --> 11:27.460]  We'll, of course, keep people updated on that.
[11:27.760 --> 11:31.260]  But it sounds, it sounds like, uh, it sounds like a positive thing for once.
[11:31.260 --> 11:34.740]  And hopefully this, uh, this is a precedent that's being set.
[11:35.500 --> 11:37.880]  But you never know what the Supreme Court's going to say.
[11:38.080 --> 11:39.000]  Yeah, it's true.
[11:39.540 --> 11:43.880]  Uh, and of course, uh, there are other, uh, legal, uh, issues this, uh, this past week.
[11:44.160 --> 11:49.840]  Uh, Supreme Court, uh, ruling Monday the war on terrorism does not give the government a blank check to hold a U.S.
[11:50.180 --> 11:52.560]  citizen and foreign-born terror suspects in legal limbo.
[11:53.100 --> 11:59.560]  Uh, this is widely seen as a forceful denunciation of Bush administration tactics since the September 11th attacks.
[11:59.680 --> 12:01.060]  And that's from the Associated Press.
[12:01.280 --> 12:02.040]  Very surprising.
[12:02.560 --> 12:03.580]  Uh, did... Sorry, go ahead.
[12:03.580 --> 12:04.900]  Did you hear about that new thing?
[12:05.020 --> 12:06.540]  Uh, I saw it this morning in the papers.
[12:06.740 --> 12:12.840]  Uh, these two Iranians were kicked out of the country for, uh, taking photographs of New York landmarks?
[12:12.840 --> 12:13.760]  I did read about that.
[12:14.140 --> 12:18.840]  Um, and, uh, supposedly they had been, they were, they were guards, I think, for the United Nations.
[12:19.120 --> 12:23.080]  And they had been warned a couple of times not to take pictures of subway trains and bridges.
[12:23.260 --> 12:24.120]  And they did it anyway.
[12:24.380 --> 12:25.660]  Yeah, this is several times.
[12:26.020 --> 12:26.760]  Several times.
[12:26.940 --> 12:32.180]  Now, it's, it's amazing to me that this kind of a thing is considered to be, uh, risky or bad.
[12:32.300 --> 12:32.920]  And it's not illegal.
[12:33.260 --> 12:34.060]  It's not illegal.
[12:34.160 --> 12:36.520]  There is no law anywhere that says you cannot do this.
[12:36.660 --> 12:39.600]  You'll just come up against cops and, and, and guards that will tell you not to.
[12:39.660 --> 12:42.140]  But Iran is in the axis of evil, according to Bush.
[12:42.360 --> 12:42.800]  So what?
[12:42.860 --> 12:44.060]  They can't see what bridges look like?
[12:44.180 --> 12:49.100]  Right, no, I mean, they're taking basic, you know, what pictures that tourists would take if you were in New York.
[12:49.420 --> 12:49.700]  Uh-uh.
[12:49.940 --> 12:51.620]  But they did it in a bad way.
[12:52.160 --> 12:53.860]  They did it surreptitiously.
[12:54.100 --> 12:55.760]  They allegedly... They did it while Iranian is what they did.
[12:55.780 --> 12:56.680]  No, no, no, no, no.
[12:56.760 --> 12:57.480]  Not only that.
[12:57.700 --> 13:04.640]  The government alleges that they, uh, had their video cameras concealed at stomach level under their jackets.
[13:04.960 --> 13:07.360]  You know what, you know what surreptitiously means in this case?
[13:07.480 --> 13:09.840]  It means in a way that the government decided not to like.
[13:10.340 --> 13:10.960]  Pretty much.
[13:11.120 --> 13:13.040]  I mean, you can use these definitions in all sorts of different ways.
[13:13.060 --> 13:19.420]  Now, what's interesting, and this could be a defense, um, is, uh, I think I've sent this to the, uh, to the list a while back.
[13:19.680 --> 13:24.000]  Um, Amtrak, uh, which is part of the federal government, people don't know this.
[13:24.460 --> 13:28.740]  Uh, government corporation, uh, recently, uh, held contests, which is still in effect.
[13:29.380 --> 13:32.940]  Uh, something about picture, uh, picture you in this train or something.
[13:33.100 --> 13:38.560]  And it's encouraging people to go out and take pictures of trains, uh, to win the contest.
[13:38.560 --> 13:44.000]  And the best picture gets, uh, like a free pass to ride the Amtrak rails all summer or something like that.
[13:44.280 --> 13:46.000]  Definitely sending mixed signals, aren't they?
[13:46.080 --> 13:46.840]  I would say so.
[13:46.940 --> 13:52.120]  That one part of the government is saying, hey, take pictures of trains and you'll win a free ride.
[13:52.460 --> 13:56.640]  And another part of the government says, take pictures of trains and we'll deport you or lock you in jail.
[13:56.940 --> 13:57.540]  Same thing.
[13:57.960 --> 13:58.140]  Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
[13:58.320 --> 14:01.080]  Is Amtrak across the country really a prize?
[14:03.340 --> 14:04.860]  That's a booby prize, I guess.
[14:05.140 --> 14:06.600]  Uh, it could be, it's true.
[14:06.620 --> 14:07.440]  I like riding trains.
[14:07.960 --> 14:09.540]  Yeah, well, we're talking about Amtrak, though.
[14:09.980 --> 14:10.580]  That's true.
[14:11.180 --> 14:11.440]  Okay.
[14:11.880 --> 14:13.700]  We have a lot of choices in this country, you know?
[14:13.900 --> 14:14.200]  Yeah.
[14:15.080 --> 14:21.960]  Uh, so, yeah, of course, we're always interested in, uh, all kinds of things as far as, um, as, as far as, uh, I guess, suspension of rights.
[14:22.380 --> 14:28.920]  Um, um, Walter, you're here, over on the other side of the, he called me earlier today and said that there are protests outside the post office already.
[14:29.220 --> 14:29.740]  Already, yeah.
[14:29.880 --> 14:39.120]  In, uh, in, in New York City, uh, due to the fact that they couldn't get permits for the main demonstration coming up in August for the Republican convention.
[14:39.360 --> 14:47.860]  So, you know, you're going to see more and more of this kind of thing of people being denied rights of various sorts, whether it be taking pictures or demonstrating or, or, or whatnot.
[14:47.860 --> 14:47.980]  Right.
[14:48.120 --> 14:51.180]  Or walking down the street in order to get to work, you know?
[14:51.180 --> 14:51.700]  Walking down the street.
[14:51.780 --> 14:53.100]  That's going to be quite a challenge.
[14:53.180 --> 14:55.720]  And we're going to be watching it every step of the way here at BAI and off the hook.
[14:55.920 --> 14:57.540]  Some, some of us will even be walking.
[14:57.740 --> 14:58.240]  That's right.
[14:58.240 --> 14:58.700]  Or running.
[14:59.600 --> 15:15.800]  What's, what's even worse for these protesters is in New York State now, uh, the state legislature has recently added to the list of the crimes for which you can have your DNA added to the felony DNA database, added a hundred misdemeanors, including, uh,
[15:15.980 --> 15:20.460]  patronizing a prostitute, and a few other, uh, absurd-sounding things.
[15:20.640 --> 15:21.440]  So, heaven knows.
[15:21.440 --> 15:26.300]  Uh, if you are arrested for protesting, your DNA may go into the database as well.
[15:26.540 --> 15:30.260]  If you bend an MTA card, do you have to get your DNA, uh, submitted?
[15:30.740 --> 15:31.820]  Uh, I really don't know.
[15:32.420 --> 15:33.940]  That would be a good question to research.
[15:34.260 --> 15:35.760]  Well, um, interesting.
[15:35.900 --> 15:46.420]  But on the subject of, of the, the post office and Penn Station and all that kind of a thing, do you know they, they, they've decided to have a pedestrian overpass just for the press, so that they can get from the Farley post office building to the, uh,
[15:46.680 --> 15:47.580]  Madison Square Garden region.
[15:48.060 --> 16:03.140]  So, rather than cross the street, they've, they're constructing an actual pedestrian overpass just for this event, and I've, I've found out on, on good internal, uh, knowledge from the, uh, from the infrastructure people at New York City that they will be placing it this weekend.
[16:03.500 --> 16:07.160]  Maybe even after the 2600 meeting or, or just sometime over the weekend.
[16:07.160 --> 16:14.440]  So, if you want to get a big crowd of people together to watch this thing be lowered onto the street or onto the, above the street, they can't stop that, can they?
[16:14.680 --> 16:15.000]  They can.
[16:15.000 --> 16:16.280]  That's a good thing to take pictures of.
[16:16.300 --> 16:17.220]  You could take pictures of that.
[16:17.720 --> 16:18.760]  Wouldn't it be a bridge, though?
[16:19.100 --> 16:19.360]  Yeah.
[16:19.460 --> 16:19.940]  It is a bridge.
[16:20.020 --> 16:20.480]  It is a bridge.
[16:20.640 --> 16:23.060]  And you can take a picture of the bridge being lowered onto its foundations.
[16:23.380 --> 16:24.460]  Now, is it a bridge?
[16:24.880 --> 16:27.740]  Is a bridge a bridge before it falls into place?
[16:28.740 --> 16:29.380]  I don't know.
[16:29.460 --> 16:31.300]  But, you know, that pedestrian walkway has to be someplace.
[16:31.520 --> 16:32.500]  They have to keep it someplace.
[16:32.560 --> 16:39.240]  I, I think in this case it is a bridge because they're building it intact two blocks away and traipsing it over at some... How do you know that?
[16:39.960 --> 16:43.340]  I'm the one who told you about them lowering it in the whole thing this weekend.
[16:43.520 --> 16:45.180]  Well, I didn't want to burn the source.
[16:45.560 --> 16:45.980]  Oh, alright.
[16:46.500 --> 16:47.500]  You burned yourself there.
[16:47.960 --> 16:50.420]  It's not a bridge unless it leads from one place to another.
[16:50.580 --> 16:53.360]  So technically it's not a bridge until it's lowered into place and becomes a bridge.
[16:53.360 --> 16:54.960]  It still leads from one place to another.
[16:54.960 --> 16:58.880]  It just leads from a place two blocks away to a place three blocks away now.
[16:59.180 --> 17:01.000]  And then they're going to move it to where they want it to be.
[17:01.000 --> 17:05.460]  Can we, as citizens of this city, walk over there and walk back and forth on that bridge while it's on the ground?
[17:05.460 --> 17:06.760]  No, I don't believe so.
[17:06.840 --> 17:20.240]  I believe that they've got the construction site sealed off and then it will be a bridge between Madison Square Garden and the Farley Post Office building because they're putting the press in the Farley building because Madison Square Garden isn't big enough.
[17:20.580 --> 17:22.300]  It will cross no bridge before it's time.
[17:22.560 --> 17:28.160]  I just wanted to add, there's a way you can protest without actually being... I mean, it would be good if you're there protesting.
[17:28.260 --> 17:29.100]  The more people, the better.
[17:29.100 --> 17:35.580]  But another way to protest would be also to, you sign up, you volunteer for the RNC, to be a volunteer there.
[17:35.780 --> 17:43.200]  And you go to their sessions and all that and you smile and, you know, you're going to do this and you love the Republican Party and then you don't show up to any of your shifts.
[17:43.420 --> 17:46.540]  Well, actually, you know, I think it might be better if you did show up because then you're...
[17:46.540 --> 17:48.300]  Or yes, you show up and wreak havoc.
[17:48.440 --> 17:48.760]  That's another...
[17:48.760 --> 17:51.620]  Well, not necessarily wreak havoc, but just provide intelligence.
[17:52.480 --> 17:55.060]  We're in a relatively obnoxious button.
[17:55.240 --> 17:58.980]  I mean, everything else is just ridiculously petty, I think.
[17:58.980 --> 18:04.120]  If, you know, if they have enough people volunteer and then not show up, then they'll be ridiculously understatement.
[18:04.140 --> 18:09.280]  Somehow, I don't think they're going to have a shortage of people volunteering to do the things that they want to do.
[18:09.380 --> 18:09.560]  Leo.
[18:09.940 --> 18:10.420]  Also...
[18:10.420 --> 18:10.580]  What happened?
[18:10.860 --> 18:11.140]  Go ahead.
[18:11.540 --> 18:15.160]  Also, a quick update on the DNA list database.
[18:15.540 --> 18:19.540]  It's not only misdemeanors, it's also felonies covered under Megan's law.
[18:20.180 --> 18:21.020]  How about that?
[18:21.520 --> 18:26.200]  I would like to mention that my passport does have my DNA in it, but it was an accident.
[18:27.380 --> 18:28.400]  We don't need to know.
[18:28.400 --> 18:29.340]  We won't ask you that.
[18:29.660 --> 18:30.260]  All right, all right.
[18:30.920 --> 18:34.600]  But, well, that might lead well into the next piece here.
[18:34.680 --> 18:44.780]  The WhiteHouse.com pornography website, which poked fun at the government namesake, its government namesake, with parody sections about first ladies and interns, has been stripped of all political references.
[18:45.300 --> 18:51.140]  Its owner, Dan Parisi of New York, agreed to the changes to comply with a recent ruling by the U.S.
[18:51.260 --> 19:01.980]  Patent and Trademark Office, granting his website a potential trademark for White House, but only if he took steps to make sure visitors to his pornography site don't believe it was associated with President Bush's site.
[19:02.920 --> 19:05.240]  It's funny how they refer to it as President Bush's site.
[19:05.560 --> 19:05.840]  Yeah.
[19:06.140 --> 19:07.740]  www.whitehouse.gov.
[19:07.880 --> 19:08.600]  If you do it, who is on it?
[19:08.620 --> 19:09.880]  I don't think you see George W.
[19:10.000 --> 19:10.760]  Bush's name and address.
[19:11.680 --> 19:15.960]  Anyway, he's negotiating to sell the website and get out of the pornography business.
[19:16.320 --> 19:21.620]  He said he removed the parody featuring John Kerry and changed references from interns to simply girls.
[19:22.240 --> 19:24.840]  He also removed the section describing first ladies.
[19:25.520 --> 19:27.240]  We figured we might as well get the trademark.
[19:27.240 --> 19:29.120]  He said we've already taken that stuff off.
[19:31.160 --> 19:34.100]  This whole thing seems to be really kind of silly and crazy.
[19:34.660 --> 19:38.600]  And I don't understand the point of people doing that in the first place.
[19:39.920 --> 19:40.980]  Okay, moving on.
[19:41.160 --> 19:42.900]  We have new $50 bills coming out.
[19:43.500 --> 19:47.860]  Emanuel, you mentioned pornography and the COPA decision had just been overturned as well.
[19:48.480 --> 19:49.660]  You want to tell us something about that?
[19:49.660 --> 19:50.460]  Yeah, I'm familiar.
[19:50.560 --> 19:53.860]  That's the Children Against Pornography Act or something like that.
[19:54.020 --> 19:57.680]  Child Online Pornography Act, which I think was back in 99.
[19:57.900 --> 19:58.680]  Wait, wait, wait.
[19:58.900 --> 20:00.500]  Child Online Pornography Act?
[20:00.660 --> 20:02.340]  The Child Online Pornography Act.
[20:02.380 --> 20:03.000]  It's not protection.
[20:03.000 --> 20:04.320]  That sounds kind of obscene in itself.
[20:04.480 --> 20:05.000]  Oh, you're right.
[20:05.160 --> 20:06.480]  Child Online Protection Act.
[20:06.480 --> 20:06.980]  Thank you.
[20:07.300 --> 20:08.400]  That's what I thought it was.
[20:10.760 --> 20:11.660]  Okay, so that...
[20:11.660 --> 20:12.540]  You need to legislate more pornography.
[20:12.820 --> 20:14.380]  Tell us something about that.
[20:14.500 --> 20:15.080]  What happened there?
[20:15.080 --> 20:25.320]  Unless I'm wrong, it was back in 99 that here in Philadelphia, as a matter of fact, I sat in at some of the hearings with ACLU who argued that case successfully.
[20:25.900 --> 20:27.260]  Well, actually, not successfully.
[20:27.420 --> 20:28.140]  Now they were successful.
[20:30.080 --> 20:46.700]  That basically the Third Circuit ruled back in 99 that people had to, libraries and so forth, had to provide filtering to prevent certain types of content from reaching people who are browsing the web.
[20:46.960 --> 21:00.040]  And one of those content things was pornography and because it could, you know, harm or corrupt children if children are at the library browsing the web and they ran across some picture of Janet Jackson or something.
[21:00.040 --> 21:19.980]  So, what the Supreme Court ruled this week, and I'm just paraphrasing this, they said that the damage to our society by blocking legitimate content was greater than the damage that was being caused by...
[21:19.980 --> 21:29.940]  The damage to the Constitution was greater than the damage that was caused by kids looking at pornography when their parents weren't looking, something along those lines.
[21:30.040 --> 21:31.880]  Sounds like they actually have a clue now.
[21:32.340 --> 21:35.740]  Well, you know, you just never know what the Supreme Court's going to rule.
[21:36.480 --> 21:37.760]  It's really surprising.
[21:37.760 --> 21:44.520]  You'd think that with all these Reaganites and Bushites in there that it would go just rubber stamp one way.
[21:44.580 --> 21:56.280]  But with this Homeland Security thing that was decided this week, Scalia was one of the most vociferous advocates of the constitutional rights of these detainees.
[21:56.380 --> 21:57.680]  And that surprised the hell out of me.
[22:00.160 --> 22:06.440]  Hasn't the Supreme Court ruled time and time again against basically the same law, which Congress then keeps repassing?
[22:06.900 --> 22:07.260]  Yes.
[22:07.360 --> 22:09.700]  The first, it was the Communications Decency Act.
[22:09.860 --> 22:11.300]  So this is what, like the third one?
[22:11.460 --> 22:12.160]  The second one?
[22:12.240 --> 22:12.820]  The fourth one?
[22:13.080 --> 22:13.540]  I think it's...
[22:13.540 --> 22:13.940]  I think it's...
[22:13.940 --> 22:15.820]  It's either the second or third one.
[22:15.960 --> 22:19.520]  And I bet you anything Congress is going to try again and it'll get a return.
[22:19.740 --> 22:21.900]  I mean, don't they have anything better to do in the Congress?
[22:21.900 --> 22:28.940]  That's why you need groups like the ACLU who will just continue to fight and fight and fight because they don't give up.
[22:29.200 --> 22:31.020]  You know, the government doesn't give up.
[22:31.260 --> 22:37.260]  And the right wing doesn't give up when it comes to trying to curtail constitutional rights.
[22:38.200 --> 22:39.620]  So you've got to be ever vigilant.
[22:40.040 --> 22:41.980]  You know, I don't think it's just one wing or another.
[22:42.180 --> 22:44.860]  I think anybody in power is always trying to do that.
[22:45.740 --> 22:46.180]  So...
[22:46.180 --> 22:46.740]  You're right.
[22:46.940 --> 22:50.920]  You know, the Clinton administration was terrible when it came to privacy and things like that.
[22:50.920 --> 22:54.500]  I mean, I think if we have Bush, if we have Kerry next year, I think we're also going to have a draft.
[22:54.880 --> 22:56.080]  I just think that's going to happen.
[22:56.600 --> 22:57.380]  That's my prediction.
[22:57.780 --> 22:58.160]  All right.
[22:58.300 --> 23:00.600]  Well, you think we're not going to have a draft either way or just with one?
[23:00.760 --> 23:03.520]  I don't think either way because I think the government loves...
[23:03.520 --> 23:11.060]  I think the military loves and the administration, no matter who's in power, loves to say, but these people really have no way to complain because they all volunteered.
[23:11.220 --> 23:14.800]  Yeah, but they're all dying, too, so they need to replace them with fresh blood and nobody's...
[23:14.800 --> 23:20.900]  I mean, they're calling back people now that are, like, haven't been around in the military for years and years.
[23:20.900 --> 23:22.680]  They just still owe, like, a few months.
[23:23.060 --> 23:25.840]  And they've been in private sector for, like, years.
[23:25.840 --> 23:28.600]  And when they go through them, they're going to have to find another source.
[23:29.280 --> 23:29.960]  Good point.
[23:30.060 --> 23:30.740]  We'll see what happens.
[23:31.660 --> 23:32.420]  Interesting times.
[23:33.480 --> 23:33.880]  Okay.
[23:33.940 --> 23:35.820]  I mentioned that we have a new $50 bill coming out.
[23:35.900 --> 23:37.460]  It's just like the $20 bill.
[23:37.660 --> 23:44.580]  New multicolored 50 will be released on September 28th, so don't bother bringing these to Hope because we won't accept them.
[23:47.220 --> 23:55.800]  I just wanted to make sure people knew that because there's a picture of one here on CNN.com, which, you know, I guess if your Xerox did or something and gave it to somebody, it could...
[23:55.800 --> 23:56.640]  and blew it up a little bit.
[23:56.740 --> 24:02.080]  You know, I'm almost tempted to say anyone who can make one this quickly that will actually fool us, you know.
[24:02.320 --> 24:02.560]  Mm-hmm.
[24:03.080 --> 24:04.440]  I'd almost say we should take it.
[24:04.640 --> 24:06.900]  I do buy counterfeit bills at face value.
[24:06.980 --> 24:07.740]  I've said that before.
[24:08.160 --> 24:11.220]  And I, you know, but let's not bring it to the conference.
[24:11.300 --> 24:11.860]  Let's bring it to me.
[24:12.000 --> 24:12.280]  Okay.
[24:12.300 --> 24:13.900]  We'll conduct a little private transaction there.
[24:13.900 --> 24:16.700]  Does it look like the 20 in a similar design?
[24:17.020 --> 24:17.980]  Similar design, yeah.
[24:18.120 --> 24:19.480]  It's got a little bit of red on it.
[24:20.400 --> 24:21.500]  You know, it's...
[24:21.960 --> 24:24.260]  It's still, you know, ugly, I think.
[24:25.280 --> 24:25.980]  It really is.
[24:26.220 --> 24:26.860]  All ugly.
[24:26.940 --> 24:27.780]  All the new ones are ugly.
[24:27.960 --> 24:29.860]  Is the reverse of the bill on the website?
[24:29.880 --> 24:35.580]  Are there those little yellow 50s that correspond to the little yellow 20s?
[24:35.580 --> 24:37.760]  I've handed it to Jim, so now Jim can answer his own question.
[24:37.880 --> 24:40.320]  Well, it's a little too small on this printout to tell.
[24:40.320 --> 24:42.420]  All right, well, while Bush...
[24:43.260 --> 24:51.780]  While Jim is looking that over with magnifying glass, we'll move on to this story, which just came in today, and it's kind of shocking, I think.
[24:52.140 --> 24:53.580]  Long-distance company TELUS.
[24:53.580 --> 24:54.500]  You ever use this company?
[24:55.120 --> 25:02.420]  They're blocking all long-distance direct dial calls to four countries to help reduce modem hijacking.
[25:02.680 --> 25:03.560]  Yeah, that's right.
[25:03.760 --> 25:05.000]  This is from their press release.
[25:05.000 --> 25:15.000]  As part of TELUS' commitment to help reduce incidents of modem hijacking, TELUS on July 1st will begin blocking all long-distance direct dial calls to...
[25:15.000 --> 25:15.520]  Moldova?
[25:16.140 --> 25:17.140]  No, no.
[25:17.720 --> 25:19.820]  And forgive me if I pronounce any of these countries wrong.
[25:20.160 --> 25:21.120]  Guinea-Bissau?
[25:21.400 --> 25:21.700]  Bisou?
[25:22.240 --> 25:22.980]  One of those.
[25:23.280 --> 25:27.900]  Guyana, Nauru, and Saltome, or Saltome.
[25:28.200 --> 25:29.120]  I don't know, I don't say those words.
[25:29.120 --> 25:29.220]  Saltome.
[25:29.360 --> 25:29.980]  Saltome, okay.
[25:31.020 --> 25:31.540]  Meltorme.
[25:31.660 --> 25:32.880]  They're not going to let you call Meltorme.
[25:32.880 --> 25:36.840]  The modem hijacking scams most commonly originate in these countries.
[25:37.000 --> 25:37.860]  I think that's unfair.
[25:38.220 --> 25:43.320]  I mean, how dare they cascate an entire country based on the actions of a few?
[25:43.440 --> 25:46.180]  I mean, if that happened to us, can you imagine all the things that we'd be blocked from?
[25:46.480 --> 25:49.200]  They're small countries, and those countries, a few is a many.
[25:49.400 --> 25:52.980]  Well, I feel like making friends in those countries now and needing to call them.
[25:53.540 --> 25:56.200]  And for some reason, switching to TELUS and having to do that.
[25:56.640 --> 25:58.760]  Nauru is probably the smallest of them all.
[25:59.000 --> 26:00.520]  There's hardly anyone living there anymore.
[26:00.520 --> 26:02.880]  It's like a detainee cam now.
[26:02.980 --> 26:03.400]  Did you know that?
[26:03.400 --> 26:04.720]  Well, this kind of thing isn't going to help.
[26:04.920 --> 26:06.280]  It's going to make more people leave.
[26:06.460 --> 26:09.020]  There's not even a pile of guano on Nauru anymore.
[26:09.340 --> 26:09.780]  That's right.
[26:09.840 --> 26:10.680]  They harvested it all.
[26:10.780 --> 26:14.100]  TELUS customers who want to make legitimate calls, though, to these countries.
[26:14.200 --> 26:18.400]  TELUS is providing an operator who will process the call manually.
[26:19.040 --> 26:23.880]  And customers who make an operator-assisted call will be charged the same rate as if they dialed directly.
[26:24.260 --> 26:25.520]  So I guess that's kind of cool.
[26:25.520 --> 26:32.260]  Well, if you can get a country to be condemned as fraudulent, then you can make operator-assisted calls for the same rate as you would direct dial calls.
[26:32.580 --> 26:36.040]  But that also prevents people from redboxing to Nauru.
[26:36.640 --> 26:37.040]  Yeah.
[26:37.120 --> 26:38.420]  You have to go through an operator.
[26:38.460 --> 26:40.040]  I guess that would make it harder to do that.
[26:40.080 --> 26:40.260]  Or Canada.
[26:40.260 --> 26:41.880]  If you're using TELUS.
[26:42.120 --> 26:47.720]  TELUS is the second-largest long-distance carrier, second-largest phone company in Canada, isn't it?
[26:47.920 --> 26:48.680]  I believe so.
[26:48.800 --> 26:49.520]  Yeah, they're big in Canada.
[26:49.680 --> 26:50.660]  They're not so big here.
[26:51.840 --> 26:53.280]  They're the second...
[26:53.280 --> 26:55.900]  Behind Bell Canada, they're number two, according to...
[26:55.900 --> 27:02.900]  According to them, they're the largest telecommunications company in western Canada, the second-largest in the country, with more than $7 billion of annual revenue.
[27:04.320 --> 27:07.100]  It doesn't say much about them in the United States, though.
[27:07.280 --> 27:09.480]  But I'm more interested in this modem hijacking business.
[27:09.640 --> 27:11.400]  When's the last time anybody had their modem hijacked?
[27:11.480 --> 27:13.080]  When's the last time anybody used a modem around here?
[27:13.380 --> 27:14.580]  1980-something, wasn't it?
[27:14.820 --> 27:15.220]  Yeah.
[27:17.400 --> 27:18.840]  Well, basically, these are their tips.
[27:18.980 --> 27:23.660]  Customers with high-speed internet, ADSL, cable modem, should not be susceptible to this scam.
[27:23.660 --> 27:28.400]  However, customers with high-speed and a dial-up connection, such as a fax modem, may be susceptible.
[27:28.680 --> 27:31.740]  They should ensure they disconnect all dial-up connections when not in use.
[27:31.740 --> 27:36.120]  For example, if a customer has a fax modem connected to the computer, it should be disconnected when not in use.
[27:36.460 --> 27:36.860]  Okay?
[27:38.460 --> 27:39.820]  Well, they just wanted to make that clear.
[27:40.200 --> 27:43.920]  Customers should not download a program from a website or source they do not know or trust.
[27:44.920 --> 27:48.600]  Carefully read disclaimers, terms and conditions, and warnings before downloading information.
[27:49.220 --> 27:55.440]  Customers can subscribe to TELUS Callgate to help prevent unauthorized users from making certain types of calls.
[27:55.600 --> 27:55.980]  Isn't that nice?
[27:56.020 --> 27:59.460]  They have a service where you pay them money to protect you.
[27:59.460 --> 28:03.440]  So, this is a reverse of the usual phone company business model.
[28:03.600 --> 28:04.900]  Usually, you pay to make calls.
[28:05.000 --> 28:06.560]  In this case, you pay to not make calls.
[28:06.720 --> 28:06.920]  Yeah.
[28:07.320 --> 28:07.520]  Yeah.
[28:07.720 --> 28:08.780]  It's probably more profitable.
[28:09.280 --> 28:13.140]  So, that's what's new in the long-distance business there.
[28:14.620 --> 28:15.020]  Okay.
[28:15.020 --> 28:16.140]  What else is going on?
[28:19.080 --> 28:20.580]  We have a whole bunch of letters.
[28:20.700 --> 28:21.320]  We'll be taking phone calls.
[28:21.380 --> 28:24.560]  I guess we should talk about the conference a little bit because that's obviously coming up.
[28:24.560 --> 28:27.000]  Today is the last day of pre-registration, June 30th.
[28:27.260 --> 28:27.780]  What time?
[28:28.780 --> 28:30.560]  You know, as soon as we can get to a terminal.
[28:30.920 --> 28:34.760]  Whenever it stops being June 30th, that's a fair bet that you're not going to be able to pre-register for the conference.
[28:35.520 --> 28:39.240]  To pre-register, though, you can go to our website, www.2600.com.
[28:39.280 --> 28:39.840]  Follow the links.
[28:41.680 --> 28:45.760]  And if you don't pre-register, you can always buy your ticket at the door of the conference.
[28:45.860 --> 28:46.800]  You might have to wait in line, though.
[28:46.960 --> 28:50.420]  And it's better for us if people pre-register because we have more to work with that way.
[28:50.560 --> 28:52.620]  We'll secretly hit you if you don't pre-register.
[28:52.620 --> 28:53.740]  Yeah, we will.
[28:53.920 --> 28:54.420]  No, we won't.
[28:55.400 --> 28:56.240]  We did last year.
[28:56.320 --> 28:57.440]  We sneered at the people online.
[28:57.820 --> 28:59.180]  Yeah, there was a little bit of sneering going on.
[28:59.260 --> 29:00.160]  I didn't endorse it, though.
[29:00.380 --> 29:00.620]  I know.
[29:00.740 --> 29:00.960]  I know.
[29:01.020 --> 29:01.860]  It was unofficial sneering.
[29:02.040 --> 29:02.680]  Unofficial sneering.
[29:02.740 --> 29:03.760]  You will be subjected to that.
[29:04.040 --> 29:05.260]  We talk about this every year.
[29:05.480 --> 29:09.780]  I think we should offer some sort of minor premium to people who register online.
[29:11.420 --> 29:12.820]  A handshake from Bernie S.
[29:12.880 --> 29:13.420]  How about that?
[29:13.520 --> 29:13.940]  That would work.
[29:14.020 --> 29:14.620]  Hey, I'll do that.
[29:14.740 --> 29:15.080]  Bernie S.
[29:15.200 --> 29:18.320]  will stand and personally handshake the hands of people who come on.
[29:18.320 --> 29:19.280]  I volunteer to do that.
[29:19.400 --> 29:20.800]  But this is also an important thing.
[29:20.800 --> 29:25.920]  A bunch of people pledged for this during our last fundraiser here at WBAI.
[29:25.980 --> 29:27.160]  They pledged for two tickets.
[29:29.920 --> 29:33.600]  We've gotten in touch with most of them, I believe, but there might be some who slip through the cracks.
[29:33.700 --> 29:37.020]  The way things go here sometimes, premiums aren't properly allocated.
[29:37.240 --> 29:39.960]  We want to make sure everybody gets what's coming to them.
[29:39.960 --> 29:46.880]  So if you have not... if you pledged during the show back in May for the tickets to Hope and you have not heard from us...
[29:46.880 --> 29:47.860]  And you paid your pledge.
[29:47.960 --> 29:48.640]  And you paid your pledge.
[29:48.680 --> 29:49.700]  Yeah, that's an important caveat there.
[29:50.120 --> 29:53.720]  You do need to contact us because there may have been some problem someplace.
[29:54.240 --> 29:58.660]  And the phone number to contact is 631-474-2677.
[29:58.780 --> 29:59.900]  That's our office staff.
[30:00.200 --> 30:02.860]  And they can help figure out what happens.
[30:02.860 --> 30:04.720]  It's 631-474-2677.
[30:04.800 --> 30:08.900]  If you've not gotten your Hope tickets and you pledged for them at WBAI.
[30:09.040 --> 30:12.200]  If you pledged... if rather you made a...
[30:12.200 --> 30:13.100]  You made a... sorry?
[30:13.260 --> 30:13.760]  And you paid.
[30:13.880 --> 30:14.260]  And you paid.
[30:14.700 --> 30:19.180]  If you pre-registered, though, in the last couple of days, obviously you wouldn't have gotten them yet.
[30:19.680 --> 30:23.180]  But everybody should receive everything by Tuesday.
[30:23.360 --> 30:26.660]  And obviously, if you're leaving early to come to New York City, and people are already starting to arrive...
[30:26.660 --> 30:29.060]  In fact, people have started to arrive as of last week...
[30:30.140 --> 30:32.720]  Pre-registering probably isn't a good idea because then we'll send them to your house.
[30:32.720 --> 30:34.580]  And you'll be here and won't do anybody any good.
[30:35.060 --> 30:35.480]  Right?
[30:35.660 --> 30:35.820]  Leo?
[30:36.440 --> 30:38.100]  Well, a question about IDs.
[30:38.440 --> 30:41.620]  Will you need to bring an ID when you pre-register?
[30:41.740 --> 30:43.820]  And what if you pre-register under a different name?
[30:44.120 --> 30:48.200]  Well, you should bring either a copy of the pre-registration receipt...
[30:48.200 --> 30:51.360]  or the credit card you use so that we know you're the same person.
[30:51.740 --> 30:54.960]  Just something that we know that it's the right person that we're giving the tickets to.
[30:55.460 --> 30:59.400]  You know, it's not too difficult to do that.
[30:59.640 --> 31:01.780]  But it's for your own security.
[31:01.780 --> 31:03.300]  Or a DNA sample.
[31:04.100 --> 31:05.640]  Yeah, we'll be collecting those later.
[31:06.840 --> 31:07.760]  So, yeah.
[31:08.020 --> 31:10.420]  And, you know, I have to say one thing, though.
[31:10.540 --> 31:15.000]  And I feel a bit of a bastard for saying this, but I have to say it because I'm just getting so many requests.
[31:15.100 --> 31:17.800]  Please, people, we can't give out free tickets.
[31:18.620 --> 31:21.680]  It doesn't matter how good a friend you are of anybody.
[31:21.940 --> 31:24.740]  It doesn't matter, you know, how much work you've done on various things.
[31:24.740 --> 31:28.360]  I know it stinks, but all the volunteer people have to pay to get in.
[31:28.580 --> 31:31.040]  We're charging very, very little to get into this thing.
[31:31.800 --> 31:35.320]  It's really important that we not lose our shirts over this.
[31:35.520 --> 31:38.080]  And, you know, we've come close to doing that in conferences past.
[31:38.460 --> 31:44.500]  So please contribute in that way to ensure that we will continue to be able to do this in the future.
[31:45.540 --> 31:46.220]  Yes, Jeff?
[31:46.260 --> 31:47.020]  We all pay.
[31:47.260 --> 31:47.420]  Yeah.
[31:47.580 --> 31:47.880]  That's right.
[31:48.040 --> 31:48.860]  I certainly do.
[31:49.260 --> 31:51.280]  Everybody on this show has paid for their own ticket.
[31:51.600 --> 31:51.960]  Absolutely.
[31:52.300 --> 31:52.440]  Yeah.
[31:52.740 --> 31:54.080]  And, you know, it's...
[31:54.080 --> 31:57.500]  And, of course, everyone here also volunteers an awful lot as well.
[31:58.380 --> 32:03.180]  And I've got to say, guys, we would not be able to do any of this stuff without those tireless efforts.
[32:03.360 --> 32:16.680]  And the things we're able to pull off at a minuscule fraction of the cost of what, you know, other conferences would cost just to put on the show in the first place, let alone charge attendees, it's a miracle every time.
[32:16.680 --> 32:17.560]  I'm amazed by it.
[32:17.660 --> 32:19.040]  I'm amazed by the things we've accomplished already.
[32:19.220 --> 32:26.800]  Just looking at all the people who have gotten together on the speaker list and put together one incredible program, people are just clamoring about this.
[32:27.000 --> 32:32.800]  When word got out about that about a week or so ago, we just kept getting all these inquiries about it.
[32:32.900 --> 32:35.360]  People could not believe so many cool people were speaking.
[32:35.540 --> 32:39.260]  We have, just as the keynotes, we have Steve Wozniak, we have Kevin Mitnick, and Jello Biafra.
[32:39.420 --> 32:40.780]  But that's only the tip of the iceberg.
[32:40.780 --> 32:44.140]  We've got all kinds of other speakers that...
[32:44.640 --> 32:50.800]  It would take hours just to go through all their credentials and the talks, the nature of their talks.
[32:51.120 --> 32:52.100]  It's going to be amazing.
[32:52.240 --> 32:55.320]  And it's going to go from Friday all the way through Sunday.
[32:55.360 --> 32:57.020]  When we say Friday, we mean Friday morning.
[32:57.180 --> 32:59.980]  We don't mean starting late Friday afternoon like some places might.
[33:00.160 --> 33:02.420]  And we don't mean ending early Sunday afternoon.
[33:02.420 --> 33:03.760]  We're going straight into Sunday evening.
[33:04.440 --> 33:05.640]  Two main tracks.
[33:06.320 --> 33:10.440]  That enables you to see more stuff because we're running longer hours from 9 a.m.
[33:10.460 --> 33:11.100]  to about midnight.
[33:11.920 --> 33:14.340]  We also have a third track of unscheduled speakers.
[33:14.340 --> 33:15.640]  You sign up at the conference.
[33:15.880 --> 33:19.980]  And that allows people who show up late that have something to say to have an audience of some sort.
[33:20.660 --> 33:23.600]  In addition, we're also going to have a 24-hour movie room.
[33:23.700 --> 33:25.520]  And Red Hack, do you have a couple of things to say about this?
[33:26.300 --> 33:26.700]  Sure.
[33:27.000 --> 33:29.940]  Well, basically, I'm going to be running the movie room.
[33:30.380 --> 33:32.680]  I've got a whole list of movies that we're going to be showing.
[33:34.140 --> 33:35.300]  Let me just get some highlights.
[33:35.520 --> 33:36.880]  A lot of hacker productions out there.
[33:36.960 --> 33:40.700]  Not just Freedom Downtime and Unauthorized Access and Owned and things like that.
[33:41.060 --> 33:43.340]  There's all kinds of film shorts, things on the web.
[33:43.620 --> 33:44.000]  Yeah, yeah.
[33:44.140 --> 33:47.340]  And also, I mean, we have a lot of content that you probably wouldn't see anywhere else.
[33:47.340 --> 33:49.640]  We've got some propaganda films that have been given to us.
[33:49.680 --> 33:50.020]  Oh, great.
[33:50.160 --> 33:52.340]  A whole bunch of Bell and AT&T things.
[33:52.920 --> 33:53.240]  You know.
[33:54.720 --> 33:55.960]  Some really rare things.
[33:56.120 --> 33:57.460]  I've seen some of the lists coming across.
[33:57.460 --> 34:03.400]  I understand, and this is only a rumor at this point, that we're getting North Korean propaganda films in English.
[34:03.720 --> 34:03.960]  Yeah.
[34:04.120 --> 34:04.940]  That is cool.
[34:05.180 --> 34:08.620]  It's called Four Seasons of the Pyongyang.
[34:09.160 --> 34:09.600]  Wow.
[34:09.980 --> 34:10.160]  Yeah.
[34:10.420 --> 34:11.040]  How about that?
[34:11.280 --> 34:13.200]  Yeah, so you're going to see all kinds of neat stuff.
[34:13.880 --> 34:15.760]  You know, hacker stuff, government stuff.
[34:15.920 --> 34:16.900]  Also, we have...
[34:16.900 --> 34:17.280]  There's...
[34:17.960 --> 34:25.140]  I don't have the full list of all those movies, but there's going to be a four-hour presentation on Saturday evening by Scott Baiman.
[34:25.140 --> 34:28.760]  It's called The Lost Film Fest, and that should be phenomenal.
[34:29.080 --> 34:29.660]  Great stuff.
[34:29.680 --> 34:30.460]  I'm looking forward to that.
[34:30.540 --> 34:32.600]  We showed some of that last conference.
[34:32.780 --> 34:33.380]  It was great.
[34:33.640 --> 34:34.840]  I have that DVD, yeah.
[34:35.160 --> 34:35.380]  Uh-huh.
[34:36.020 --> 34:36.380]  That's...
[34:36.380 --> 34:38.380]  Do you have any of the titles or any of the information?
[34:38.380 --> 34:39.440]  You know, I didn't bring...
[34:39.440 --> 34:40.360]  I can bring them next week.
[34:40.520 --> 34:42.680]  Okay, Bernie, do you have anything on the actual films?
[34:44.120 --> 34:51.540]  I don't have them in front of me, but if you do a Google search for Lost Film Fest, there's some information about the lineup there.
[34:51.540 --> 34:56.080]  And now, when people show up at the conference, Emanuel, how can they find out what films are playing when?
[34:56.640 --> 34:59.360]  Well, I mean, we'll have a schedule up outside the movie room.
[34:59.820 --> 35:00.020]  Okay.
[35:00.240 --> 35:06.080]  Also, I've been told that someone is bringing an LED sign that we can put up outside to show what's currently playing.
[35:06.620 --> 35:08.320]  I mean, the door will be open.
[35:08.320 --> 35:11.100]  You can just look in, but that'll, you know, also add to it.
[35:11.280 --> 35:12.520]  Ah, like a movie marquee.
[35:12.640 --> 35:13.060]  Pretty much.
[35:13.180 --> 35:14.640]  And it's going to be going around the clock.
[35:14.800 --> 35:14.900]  Yeah.
[35:14.900 --> 35:20.020]  And it's going to be hard to figure out where you want to be because there's going to be great speakers and also great films.
[35:21.080 --> 35:26.900]  But overnight, the movie room will be open and the downstairs area, the whole downstairs area, which is a huge space.
[35:26.920 --> 35:28.880]  It used to be a sports authority retail store.
[35:29.160 --> 35:31.320]  So that's where we're setting up the public terminals.
[35:31.320 --> 35:34.980]  We're setting up the computer network where you can plug in your own laptop.
[35:35.460 --> 35:39.820]  We're setting up various workshops, including lockpicking, and we're setting up the movie room.
[35:40.060 --> 35:40.220]  Yep.
[35:40.660 --> 35:41.880]  It's going to be phenomenal.
[35:42.100 --> 35:42.400]  It is.
[35:43.000 --> 35:50.720]  All right, so again, today's the last day of pre-registration, www.hope.net if you want information on the conference, and there's a section there for registering.
[35:50.880 --> 35:51.040]  Jeff?
[35:51.180 --> 35:55.380]  Should we mention also that on Friday night we're going to do a special extended version of the radio show?
[35:55.460 --> 35:56.400]  No, I don't think we should mention that.
[35:56.440 --> 35:57.220]  I think we should surprise people.
[35:57.220 --> 35:57.720]  We'll surprise them?
[35:57.800 --> 35:57.940]  Okay.
[35:58.240 --> 35:59.040]  No, actually...
[35:59.040 --> 35:59.780]  We won't bring it up then.
[35:59.820 --> 36:00.360]  Let's bring it up.
[36:00.460 --> 36:06.980]  We are going to do a special two-hour broadcast of Off the Hook from the site, 8 o'clock to 10 o'clock here in WBAI.
[36:07.400 --> 36:08.540]  And that's going to be a lot of fun, too.
[36:08.540 --> 36:15.680]  We'll have a lot of guests on there, and you're, of course, invited to come down to the conference and be part of the studio audience.
[36:16.600 --> 36:18.080]  I can see what we all look like.
[36:18.320 --> 36:18.440]  Yeah.
[36:20.060 --> 36:24.560]  Speaking of films, this was the weekend of the big blockbuster documentary.
[36:24.960 --> 36:25.780]  Everybody in this room see it?
[36:26.200 --> 36:26.640]  Yeah.
[36:26.760 --> 36:27.180]  I saw it.
[36:27.760 --> 36:27.920]  Yeah.
[36:28.520 --> 36:28.880]  Jim?
[36:29.340 --> 36:29.560]  What?
[36:29.700 --> 36:30.200]  Didn't see it?
[36:30.620 --> 36:31.320]  I'm waiting.
[36:31.720 --> 36:32.520]  What are you waiting for?
[36:33.460 --> 36:34.760]  Until it becomes moot.
[36:35.080 --> 36:35.300]  Uh-huh.
[36:35.640 --> 36:37.440]  Well, I just think it's fascinating how...
[36:37.440 --> 36:41.700]  We talked about this on the other show last night, how people are just flocking to this thing.
[36:41.960 --> 36:46.200]  It's made a documentary for the first time, I believe, in history, the top-grossing film over the weekend.
[36:47.060 --> 36:47.980]  That's interesting in itself.
[36:48.100 --> 36:51.880]  But they're also talking about issues, which is always a good thing, no matter what side of the coin you're on.
[36:53.760 --> 36:57.940]  I mean, it was practically impossible to get tickets on Friday when it opened.
[36:58.200 --> 37:00.360]  But we got there 45 minutes before the show began, and it was...
[37:00.360 --> 37:00.720]  It was full.
[37:00.800 --> 37:01.220]  It was full.
[37:02.360 --> 37:06.060]  It's just kind of cool to see that enthusiasm, and I hope we have something like that at the conference.
[37:06.060 --> 37:07.200]  We were in the village, though.
[37:07.380 --> 37:07.940]  That's kind of...
[37:07.940 --> 37:12.060]  That's true, but, you know, I've heard reports from all over the country, people going through similar things.
[37:12.260 --> 37:14.800]  And it's just... it's pretty neat.
[37:15.160 --> 37:16.900]  It was sold out for days here in Philadelphia.
[37:17.180 --> 37:17.420]  Uh-huh.
[37:18.060 --> 37:19.800]  What was your theater experience like, Bernie?
[37:20.540 --> 37:21.720]  Oh, the theater was packed.
[37:21.820 --> 37:22.000]  Uh-huh.
[37:22.000 --> 37:28.640]  And people were very enthusiastic and vocal, and I was surprised at the mix of people.
[37:28.940 --> 37:33.760]  There was a... people from... it wasn't just young activists showing up at this thing.
[37:33.800 --> 37:47.760]  There were a lot of elderly people, a lot of people dressed very conservatively, and you could just sort of feel the tension in the air as some of these scenes rolled by.
[37:47.760 --> 37:50.220]  It was just... it's a pretty interesting film.
[37:50.320 --> 37:50.900]  I recommend it.
[37:51.040 --> 37:53.440]  We're talking about Fahrenheit 9-11, in case anybody doesn't know that.
[37:53.700 --> 38:00.760]  And also, last week, we talked about the Google thing with Michael Moore and negative advertising.
[38:02.120 --> 38:09.980]  Basically, if you type Michael Moore into Google and looked at what came up under sponsored links, you would see michaelmoorehatesamerica.com.
[38:10.460 --> 38:20.800]  Uh, and, uh, we were wondering, because of Mike's case, uh, with, uh, the, the, the company that he's, uh, uh, kind of, um, uh, holding a mirror up to, I guess, is the best way to phrase that.
[38:20.840 --> 38:27.100]  He had a sponsored link that was taken down because it was considered to be negative, and if you, you, you typed in the name of the company, CoVad, right?
[38:27.280 --> 38:27.600]  CoVance.
[38:27.740 --> 38:27.980]  CoVance.
[38:28.440 --> 38:32.280]  Uh, if you typed in the name of the company, you would see his ad, but then they took it off because it was negative.
[38:32.460 --> 38:37.060]  We talked about the hypocrisy of Google leaving the michaelmoorehatesamerica.com ad up there.
[38:37.060 --> 38:39.860]  Wouldn't you know, the next day, it was gone.
[38:40.240 --> 38:42.360]  It was taken off the next day after our show.
[38:42.520 --> 38:44.320]  But, I just did a search now, and it's back.
[38:44.460 --> 38:44.800]  It's back.
[38:44.800 --> 38:45.840]  It's back up, yes.
[38:46.640 --> 38:47.940]  Along with a whole bunch of other ones, too.
[38:48.020 --> 38:48.640]  That's five altogether.
[38:49.240 --> 38:50.620]  Um, I don't know what happened.
[38:50.740 --> 38:52.620]  Apparently, there was some kind of backlash to that.
[38:52.760 --> 38:54.320]  You know, personally, I think it should be up there.
[38:54.380 --> 38:55.280]  I think yours should be up there.
[38:55.380 --> 38:55.840]  I don't think it's a problem.
[38:55.840 --> 38:57.120]  I'm going to put mine back, see what they mean.
[38:57.120 --> 38:57.460]  You should.
[38:57.640 --> 38:59.780]  I'm curious what the logic was for putting it back up.
[38:59.860 --> 39:02.600]  I'm also curious if our show was responsible for having it taken down.
[39:02.780 --> 39:03.900]  That's not, that wasn't the point.
[39:04.040 --> 39:05.200]  I, I, I don't want it taken down.
[39:05.200 --> 39:06.120]  I want yours taken down.
[39:06.340 --> 39:08.820]  I think positive and negative ads should be allowed.
[39:09.020 --> 39:11.940]  Although I have to say, I'm not really that eager to give them more money, so...
[39:11.940 --> 39:12.120]  Yeah.
[39:12.280 --> 39:13.460]  Well, we had a letter about this, too.
[39:13.660 --> 39:17.480]  This person was listening to last week's show and the discussion about MichaelMooreHatesAmerica.com.
[39:20.340 --> 39:23.720]  Basically, he's saying that Michael Moore Hates America is a documentary.
[39:23.720 --> 39:26.760]  That's probably why Google doesn't have a problem with the ad word listing.
[39:27.180 --> 39:30.700]  Maybe you could produce a short film about Covance and then advertise it with ad words.
[39:30.860 --> 39:33.800]  There is indeed a short film linked to from my site.
[39:33.800 --> 39:34.920]  Well, there you go.
[39:35.020 --> 39:35.820]  It's half an hour long.
[39:36.060 --> 39:37.960]  It's not especially good, but there it is.
[39:38.100 --> 39:38.840]  That comes from Jordan.
[39:39.320 --> 39:43.820]  Michael Moore has claimed that this Michael Moore Hates America film doesn't even exist.
[39:45.040 --> 39:45.480]  Really?
[39:45.960 --> 39:46.520]  Yeah, he says...
[39:46.520 --> 39:47.440]  Well, it hasn't been made yet.
[39:47.780 --> 39:48.220]  Exactly.
[39:48.480 --> 39:49.100]  You think it's...
[39:49.880 --> 39:53.300]  I mean, how can you promote a film or how can you justify having a...
[39:53.300 --> 39:58.180]  If that's the rule that Google has, that you can't have a website up unless it's advertising something that's real.
[39:58.440 --> 39:58.600]  Yeah.
[39:58.720 --> 40:00.440]  Advertise a film that is vaporware.
[40:00.600 --> 40:01.400]  It doesn't even exist.
[40:01.400 --> 40:04.040]  Out below the Matrix, the Lord of the Rings trilogy?
[40:06.840 --> 40:10.120]  Well, you know, Michael Moore's film almost didn't exist, too, because of Disney.
[40:10.280 --> 40:11.060]  It almost didn't get distributed.
[40:11.220 --> 40:11.640]  So, I don't know.
[40:11.740 --> 40:13.840]  I'd like to see what status this film has.
[40:13.900 --> 40:14.600]  And I'll go see it, too.
[40:14.680 --> 40:16.000]  You know, I want to see what this guy has to say.
[40:18.000 --> 40:19.520]  But we'll keep following that as well.
[40:20.020 --> 40:23.520]  So, okay, continuing with our film stories here.
[40:24.260 --> 40:25.440]  This was in Wired.
[40:25.600 --> 40:32.220]  People who secretly videotape movies when they are shown in theaters could go to prison for up to three years under a bill approved unanimously by the U.S.
[40:32.320 --> 40:33.100]  Senate on Friday.
[40:33.180 --> 40:33.900]  Can you believe this?
[40:34.040 --> 40:35.840]  This is what they're focusing their attention on.
[40:36.680 --> 40:38.720]  Three years in prison for videotaping movies.
[40:39.320 --> 40:48.460]  Hackers and industry insiders who distribute music, movies, or other copyright works before their official release date would also face stiffened penalties under the bill, which passed by voice fraud.
[40:48.520 --> 40:52.520]  Isn't it great why it has their ears to the ground that they know hackers are the ones doing this?
[40:52.620 --> 40:54.760]  Well, how can they lump us in with industry insiders?
[40:54.900 --> 40:55.340]  I'm insulted.
[40:56.580 --> 41:03.980]  Copies of hit movies frequently show up on the Internet while they're still in theaters, allowing fans to see new releases, such as all the popular films out there.
[41:03.980 --> 41:06.740]  And by the way, Fahrenheit 9-11 is out there, too.
[41:07.280 --> 41:08.960]  I happen to have heard that somewhere.
[41:09.960 --> 41:15.380]  Pirates sneak camcorders into movie theaters to tape films... Pirates now, not just hackers, industry insiders.
[41:15.520 --> 41:17.240]  Can they identify them by the eyepatches?
[41:17.360 --> 41:17.760]  I don't know.
[41:18.900 --> 41:26.800]  They tape films directly off the screen while industry insiders also leak copies to tech-savvy hackers before they're officially released.
[41:26.880 --> 41:27.740]  Okay, so that's how it works.
[41:27.920 --> 41:30.300]  The industry insiders don't know how to put it on the net themselves.
[41:30.300 --> 41:32.100]  They need hackers to do that for them.
[41:33.840 --> 41:34.200]  Yeah.
[41:34.200 --> 41:34.560]  Okay.
[41:35.600 --> 41:36.320]  Anyway, those...
[41:36.800 --> 41:50.040]  I think they're getting confused in the fact that, you know, it might be hackers that write software that can, you know, encode and decode video or do peer-to-peer networking, but that doesn't mean necessarily that, you know, that they're the ones... They're doing this to distribute copyright material.
[41:50.360 --> 41:50.520]  Right, right.
[41:50.520 --> 41:54.440]  You know, there are plenty of reasons to be able to... I mean, documentary distribution, all sorts of things.
[41:54.600 --> 41:59.780]  You know, it doesn't mean, well, we wrote this codec or we wrote this software to distribute this part of the content.
[41:59.780 --> 42:07.020]  Well, those of you who think they don't mean business, those found guilty would face up to three years in prison for a first offense or five years if it was done for profit.
[42:07.700 --> 42:10.500]  Repeat offenders could spend ten years behind bars.
[42:10.660 --> 42:11.880]  Boy, we need more prisons, don't we?
[42:12.320 --> 42:13.080]  This is insane.
[42:13.160 --> 42:14.400]  I mean, you can kill somebody and get less time.
[42:15.040 --> 42:18.860]  Anyway, as the person submitted this says, the name is Lupus, thank you very much for sending it in.
[42:18.860 --> 42:20.740]  This article is almost too stupid even for Wired.
[42:22.040 --> 42:27.560]  Well, the article is one thing, but the bill itself is whole new levels of stupidity.
[42:27.560 --> 42:30.140]  And here's something else, too, that's related to what we were just talking about.
[42:30.200 --> 42:40.500]  Hoping to take advantage of the heat from Fahrenheit 9-11 and the upcoming political season, a trio of producers has announced plans for a DVD release of Bushisms, the first term in his own special words.
[42:41.160 --> 42:49.380]  Venture management principal Adrian Loudermilk is learning from... learning is teeming, sorry, it's a very tiny print here.
[42:49.620 --> 42:59.420]  Teeming with Slate Magazine and producers Elizabeth Reeder and Tiller Russell on the project, based on Slate editor Jacob Weisberg's series of books, which chronicled the accidental wit and wisdom of George W.
[42:59.560 --> 43:05.960]  Bush from his campaign for president in 2000, to quotes from a few weeks ago, such as, Karen is a West Texas girl just like me.
[43:07.840 --> 43:09.700]  Oh, come on, he didn't really say that.
[43:09.920 --> 43:10.500]  He did.
[43:11.260 --> 43:13.200]  He said... did you hear him say that?
[43:13.320 --> 43:14.240]  Is there a video of this?
[43:14.460 --> 43:15.960]  I heard the clip.
[43:17.800 --> 43:19.680]  I regretfully confirmed that.
[43:20.440 --> 43:22.600]  All right, well, Jim, maybe you can lend some insight here.
[43:22.600 --> 43:26.360]  What did he actually mean when he said he's a West Texas girl just like me?
[43:26.380 --> 43:30.680]  He meant to say, you know, from West Texas just like me, but threw in the word girl.
[43:32.780 --> 43:34.000]  I have a lot of trouble.
[43:34.220 --> 43:37.080]  This is a more common mistake than his normal ones.
[43:37.100 --> 43:40.900]  I mean, I've heard other, even liberal people say things like that.
[43:40.940 --> 43:42.800]  He just says that to scare the terrorists.
[43:43.800 --> 43:48.120]  I mean, if you really look at it, though, it's just the way he put the order he put the words in.
[43:48.180 --> 43:52.260]  He's a West Texas girl, and just like me, just like I'm from Texas.
[43:52.260 --> 43:54.500]  I mean, it's, you know...
[43:54.500 --> 43:55.440]  It's funny, okay?
[43:55.580 --> 43:55.820]  All right.
[43:56.340 --> 43:56.740]  Well, okay.
[43:57.480 --> 43:58.360]  Basically, what I have here...
[43:58.360 --> 43:58.980]  I don't like him, but I have to...
[43:58.980 --> 44:03.060]  I'm going to pass this around so people can amuse themselves while, you know, I talk on.
[44:04.420 --> 44:07.460]  Basically, it's an updated list of some of his most recent comments.
[44:07.600 --> 44:10.080]  And I'm just going to read a couple, all right, because I don't want to spend too much time on this.
[44:10.440 --> 44:11.780]  And I am an optimistic person.
[44:11.780 --> 44:16.140]  I guess if you want to try to find something to be pessimistic about, you can find it no matter how hard you look, you know?
[44:17.960 --> 44:18.800]  I understood that.
[44:18.980 --> 44:19.640]  What's wrong with that?
[44:19.760 --> 44:20.040]  I don't know.
[44:20.080 --> 44:20.640]  That makes sense.
[44:20.640 --> 44:21.280]  That makes sense.
[44:22.180 --> 44:22.300]  Huh.
[44:22.500 --> 44:22.720]  Okay.
[44:24.260 --> 44:28.940]  I'm honored to shake the hand of a brave Iraqi citizen who had his hand cut off by Saddam Hussein.
[44:29.160 --> 44:31.620]  Well, let me just interrupt at this point.
[44:31.800 --> 44:32.260]  That's just...
[44:32.260 --> 44:33.180]  That's crazy.
[44:33.280 --> 44:34.680]  Let me interrupt at this point.
[44:34.680 --> 44:42.400]  Let me say that in the last five minutes, one of the people in this room has uttered a glaring Bushism that no one caught.
[44:42.500 --> 44:47.260]  And if you're listening to this on Archive, I want you to go back and find it and email it to us.
[44:47.620 --> 44:48.560]  Are you going to tell us what it is?
[44:48.560 --> 44:49.920]  No, I'm not going to tell you what it is.
[44:50.000 --> 44:50.760]  Are you telling us who it was?
[44:51.120 --> 44:54.100]  In the last five minutes, it's 43 minutes after the hour now.
[44:54.260 --> 44:54.380]  Is it me?
[44:56.040 --> 44:57.260]  It was somebody in this room.
[44:57.340 --> 44:57.740]  Was it you?
[44:57.920 --> 44:58.500]  No, it wasn't me.
[44:58.600 --> 44:59.280]  Planting Bushism?
[44:59.420 --> 44:59.640]  No, no.
[44:59.720 --> 45:00.720]  A glaring Bushism.
[45:01.320 --> 45:02.440]  You know, in other words...
[45:02.440 --> 45:03.460]  We're not running countries, though.
[45:03.680 --> 45:06.440]  No, but the point is, anybody can make these errors.
[45:06.680 --> 45:06.840]  Yes.
[45:06.840 --> 45:09.560]  If you talked as much as the president, you'd make more of them.
[45:10.280 --> 45:10.980]  I guess.
[45:11.720 --> 45:12.440]  Oh, you know what?
[45:12.440 --> 45:14.500]  I found the extended quote.
[45:14.960 --> 45:17.080]  And I think he's been done a bit of an injustice.
[45:17.440 --> 45:20.520]  He's talking in more complex ways than we're used to listening.
[45:20.660 --> 45:25.660]  He basically has phrases that he comes back to a few minutes later and makes reference to those phrases.
[45:25.700 --> 45:27.120]  And then people just quote the last part.
[45:27.180 --> 45:27.820]  It doesn't seem to make sense.
[45:27.820 --> 45:29.280]  Listen to the whole quote, though.
[45:29.560 --> 45:32.420]  I want to thank my friend, Senator Bill Frist, for joining us today.
[45:32.600 --> 45:33.960]  You're doing a heck of a job.
[45:34.100 --> 45:35.540]  You cut your teeth here, right?
[45:35.780 --> 45:37.120]  That's where you started practicing.
[45:37.380 --> 45:37.840]  That's good.
[45:38.140 --> 45:40.060]  He married a Texas girl, I want you to know.
[45:40.400 --> 45:41.300]  Karen is with us.
[45:41.400 --> 45:44.040]  A West Texas girl just like me.
[45:44.460 --> 45:48.500]  He's referring to the West Texas girl he married, but he's referring back to a couple of phrases.
[45:48.820 --> 45:52.520]  No, but that makes perfect sense if the phrasing on that is different.
[45:53.660 --> 45:57.020]  I can't believe I'm defending him, but it makes sense in that way.
[45:57.020 --> 45:58.260]  But nobody talks like that.
[45:58.320 --> 45:58.560]  I'm sorry.
[45:58.680 --> 45:59.020]  You want to report.
[45:59.180 --> 46:00.140]  No, people do talk like that.
[46:00.300 --> 46:13.220]  You know, speaking of political films, there's one that is opening here in the city today, which features actual substantive analysis rather than like stupid jabs at the president's speech patterns.
[46:13.500 --> 46:19.280]  The film is called The Corporation, and it's playing at the film forum four times a day.
[46:19.540 --> 46:25.220]  And the film, I guess if you're hearing this now, you missed it, but the filmmaker was there at 620 today.
[46:26.160 --> 46:29.220]  But they present an analysis of the corporations.
[46:29.480 --> 46:33.080]  Corporations, as you know, under the law are persons.
[46:33.300 --> 46:34.480]  They have the same rights as you and I.
[46:35.760 --> 46:42.380]  And so he gets some psychoanalysts to analyze the corporation, and they turn out to be psychopaths.
[46:42.380 --> 46:53.740]  And he's got a number of interviews with, you know, CEOs of Fortune 500 companies as they attempt to explain or defend the corporation as an entity.
[46:53.780 --> 46:57.160]  And I haven't seen the film yet, but I'm looking forward to it.
[46:57.680 --> 46:59.580]  Okay, and again, it's playing at the film forum.
[46:59.660 --> 47:00.340]  It's called The Corporation.
[47:00.960 --> 47:03.000]  And their website is thecorporation.com.
[47:03.320 --> 47:07.560]  Okay, I'd like to erase through some listener mail really quickly and then take some phone calls, 202-209-2900.
[47:07.880 --> 47:12.820]  This person writes in to say, yes, it's still possible to get rooms at the Hotel Pennsylvania, which we've been saying is sold out.
[47:12.960 --> 47:23.220]  I guess what happened was they probably had some cancellations or they had like something set aside and a date came and went and they released a whole bunch more rooms.
[47:23.220 --> 47:31.480]  So, yeah, you can go through Travelocity, lodging.com, things like that, and still find rooms for that period, July 9th through 11th, if you're coming from out of town.
[47:31.740 --> 47:34.200]  But you have to hurry because I know they're not going to last very long.
[47:34.820 --> 47:36.520]  And that's from Donna.
[47:36.680 --> 47:38.120]  Thank you very much for writing in.
[47:39.280 --> 47:40.340]  And let's see what else.
[47:42.980 --> 47:44.580]  There's other hotels that are very close.
[47:44.600 --> 47:45.420]  Oh, yes, there's plenty.
[47:45.520 --> 47:47.060]  In fact, tell us something about the wiki, Mike.
[47:47.460 --> 47:49.800]  Sure, we have a wiki, which is a...
[47:49.800 --> 47:50.020]  There's a wiki.
[47:50.020 --> 47:56.820]  A wiki is a collaboratively editable website, which means in English that anyone who goes to the website can change it.
[47:58.620 --> 48:04.160]  So we've been using such a thing for some of the planning and discussion for the Fifth Hope Conference.
[48:04.520 --> 48:07.020]  And one of the things we have there is a list of hotels.
[48:07.140 --> 48:09.380]  So you can see what other folks have suggested.
[48:09.420 --> 48:11.940]  And if you know a hotel that's not on there, you can add it.
[48:12.100 --> 48:16.580]  A lot of people have been adding their favorite places to eat in the area, too, which is turning into a real massive list.
[48:16.660 --> 48:19.440]  But it's a great way to get your thoughts out there.
[48:20.020 --> 48:22.060]  Is there a room-sharing page on the wiki?
[48:22.220 --> 48:22.800]  There is not.
[48:23.400 --> 48:23.700]  Ah.
[48:24.360 --> 48:25.900]  I guess we could do something like that, too.
[48:26.220 --> 48:27.200]  It's getting kind of tight, though.
[48:27.620 --> 48:28.560]  How do people get to the wiki?
[48:29.640 --> 48:36.880]  Well, you go to the Hope website, hope.net, and on the bottom of the page, there's a link to the Fifth Hope wiki.
[48:37.020 --> 48:37.960]  It's the easiest way.
[48:38.260 --> 48:38.500]  Okay.
[48:38.740 --> 48:41.980]  Again, our phone number, 212-209-2900, if anybody wants to call in.
[48:42.180 --> 48:45.000]  This person writes in with a complaint about last week.
[48:45.000 --> 48:47.100]  I tried to call last show, but you hung up on me twice.
[48:47.580 --> 48:48.740]  You thought I was Rebel.
[48:49.440 --> 48:50.580]  Do I sound like him?
[48:50.740 --> 48:51.400]  I sure hope not.
[48:51.700 --> 48:51.880]  What?
[48:52.040 --> 48:52.640]  Did we do that?
[48:52.800 --> 48:53.680]  Did we hung up on the wrong person?
[48:53.680 --> 48:55.980]  We did hung up on somebody that sounded like Rebel twice.
[48:56.260 --> 48:57.620]  It wasn't Rebel, obviously.
[48:58.260 --> 48:58.940]  Unless he's lying.
[48:59.080 --> 49:00.500]  Was it last week or two weeks ago?
[49:00.580 --> 49:01.000]  It was last...
[49:01.000 --> 49:01.940]  Well, this person says it was last week.
[49:01.960 --> 49:02.320]  Last week?
[49:02.420 --> 49:02.560]  Okay.
[49:02.800 --> 49:05.940]  I also was trying to push the buttons and probably...
[49:05.940 --> 49:08.060]  Let's just not talk about your intention to push the buttons.
[49:08.600 --> 49:10.260]  Anyway, I saw the movie Fahrenheit 9-11.
[49:10.260 --> 49:12.540]  It reminds me so much of your documentary, Freedom Downtime.
[49:12.600 --> 49:17.340]  I was amazed at the part where the undercover cop was secretly infiltrating the peace organization in California.
[49:17.520 --> 49:19.820]  In fact, we talked about that story last week on this show.
[49:19.880 --> 49:21.420]  I was unaware it happened last year.
[49:21.560 --> 49:22.880]  I was amazed when it showed up in the film.
[49:23.540 --> 49:25.400]  So, obviously, it was a bit older.
[49:25.520 --> 49:27.000]  It took place in 2003.
[49:27.940 --> 49:28.820]  Anyway, this person continues.
[49:28.840 --> 49:32.020]  I've been a volunteer for the International Answer Coalition since 1998.
[49:32.460 --> 49:35.060]  I don't think any undercover law enforcement has come to us.
[49:35.180 --> 49:36.580]  I wouldn't count on that.
[49:37.020 --> 49:38.200]  At least not that I know of.
[49:38.240 --> 49:38.900]  That's the idea.
[49:38.900 --> 49:39.740]  I'm not going to tell you.
[49:40.300 --> 49:41.280]  Anyway, keep up the good work.
[49:41.400 --> 49:43.420]  I will be going to the Fifth Hope sign, Don, from Queens.
[49:43.600 --> 49:44.560]  You know, Rebel lives in Queens.
[49:45.260 --> 49:46.840]  Maybe it's a Queens accent?
[49:47.000 --> 49:47.240]  Could that...
[49:47.240 --> 49:48.760]  No, but I grew up in Queens, too.
[49:49.380 --> 49:51.200]  Rebel has a pretty distinctive voice.
[49:52.360 --> 49:55.140]  Unless Rebel is getting really cagey and this is a letter from Rebel.
[49:55.760 --> 50:02.120]  But if there is a Don, Don, come up to us during Hope and establish what you sound like.
[50:02.120 --> 50:05.020]  And we'll see if you are a Rebel sound like.
[50:05.740 --> 50:07.020]  It could be a Rebel look-alike, too.
[50:07.020 --> 50:08.040]  You know, that would be very scary.
[50:08.660 --> 50:09.400]  All of it was...
[50:09.400 --> 50:13.680]  We make sure if he's a Rebel look-alike, we get the two of them together.
[50:14.100 --> 50:14.340]  All right.
[50:14.500 --> 50:15.020]  Well, I don't know...
[50:15.020 --> 50:17.260]  Rebel has his own panel at the conference, doesn't he?
[50:18.500 --> 50:19.700]  Probably in the third track someplace.
[50:19.980 --> 50:20.860]  He's going to sign up.
[50:20.940 --> 50:22.520]  I heard he's going to sign up for the third track.
[50:22.640 --> 50:24.520]  So maybe this guy can be on at the same time.
[50:25.180 --> 50:25.460]  All right.
[50:25.520 --> 50:30.680]  And just so people know, you're limited to an hour, assuming that other people want to speak for other hours.
[50:30.960 --> 50:33.520]  So you can't block an entire day in case anyone's planning on that.
[50:33.520 --> 50:35.820]  How do you sign up if you want to be on the third track?
[50:36.220 --> 50:41.120]  Basically, when you come to the conference, there'll be a sign-up sheet at the info desk.
[50:41.420 --> 50:44.820]  And then the schedule will then be posted afterwards all throughout the conference.
[50:45.380 --> 50:47.000]  So people will know where to go.
[50:47.060 --> 50:48.040]  First come, first serve.
[50:48.200 --> 50:48.700]  Pretty much, yeah.
[50:49.160 --> 50:49.360]  Yeah.
[50:49.380 --> 50:49.520]  Okay.
[50:50.260 --> 50:50.620]  Okay.
[50:50.820 --> 50:52.480]  A couple more letters, and we'll take some phone calls.
[50:53.060 --> 50:55.680]  I knew nothing about hacker culture when I first stumbled across your show.
[50:55.820 --> 50:58.120]  I still know relatively little, but I look forward to your show every week.
[50:58.220 --> 51:02.200]  I realize just how much I enjoy your delightful banter when you were preempted by the fundraiser.
[51:02.200 --> 51:05.040]  Thank you for livening up the end of my boring workday.
[51:05.440 --> 51:06.500]  Oh, that's very sweet.
[51:06.580 --> 51:06.700]  Thank you.
[51:06.700 --> 51:10.700]  There must be people driving home who have had horrible days at the office, and we're cheering them up a little bit.
[51:10.740 --> 51:11.880]  It's nice to know that...
[51:11.880 --> 51:14.660]  Is it only Wednesday that's a horrible workday for him?
[51:14.880 --> 51:16.360]  Well, it's the middle of the week.
[51:16.580 --> 51:17.580]  Oh, yeah, well...
[51:17.580 --> 51:17.740]  Yeah.
[51:20.580 --> 51:23.260]  And here's something interesting I saw in the Washington Post.
[51:23.300 --> 51:25.320]  A very brief synopsis here.
[51:25.320 --> 51:31.660]  The federal government is handing some government contracting firms a free pass against liability lawsuits for their homeland security work.
[51:31.800 --> 51:41.560]  The Department of Homeland Security, in a gambit aimed at luring companies to develop more goods and services to protect the country from terrorist attacks, has granted four companies liability protection from lawsuits.
[51:41.720 --> 51:54.620]  Teledyne Technologies, Michael Stapleton Associates, Lockheed Martin, and Northrop Grumman, have developed five anti-terrorism technologies that, as of today, will enjoy indemnity in case their products fail to perform during a terrorist attack.
[51:55.040 --> 51:55.760]  Isn't that nice?
[51:56.260 --> 51:56.560]  They...
[51:57.840 --> 51:58.240]  They...
[51:58.240 --> 51:58.760]  They...
[51:58.760 --> 52:03.560]  They range from an anthrax sniffing device to a giant water pick capable of cutting through steel and concrete.
[52:03.820 --> 52:07.800]  Well, I'm glad to know that any anti-terrorist technologies don't have to live up to par.
[52:07.960 --> 52:11.600]  I'll sell the government a technology that doesn't work for a tenth of the price.
[52:13.020 --> 52:13.420]  Yeah.
[52:13.720 --> 52:14.680]  All right, let's take a phone call.
[52:15.380 --> 52:15.780]  And...
[52:15.780 --> 52:16.680]  Good evening, you're on the air.
[52:17.500 --> 52:18.100]  Go ahead.
[52:18.620 --> 52:19.280]  Hey, how you doing?
[52:19.420 --> 52:19.760]  Pretty good.
[52:19.800 --> 52:20.300]  Where are you calling from?
[52:20.440 --> 52:20.660]  London.
[52:20.920 --> 52:21.160]  London.
[52:24.620 --> 52:25.320]  What's on your mind?
[52:25.920 --> 52:30.500]  Yeah, I wanted to talk about the recent Supreme Court decisions that you were talking about there earlier on.
[52:30.560 --> 52:35.060]  You know, the ones related to the prisoners in Guantanamo and the COPA.
[52:35.060 --> 52:40.560]  And I think the other one was related to federal offenses, where you had to prove the amounts.
[52:41.700 --> 52:42.520]  Yes, go ahead.
[52:43.200 --> 52:55.760]  Yeah, I was just thinking, like, you know, without meaning to sound too cynical, it sounds somewhat too convenient that the Supreme Court be coming up with somewhat liberal decisions running into a presidential election coming in November.
[52:55.760 --> 53:03.060]  And I was just wondering if it might be somewhat of an underhand ploy to kind of win over a more liberal vote during the elections.
[53:04.280 --> 53:05.840]  It's still pretty early for that.
[53:06.000 --> 53:08.080]  They don't usually start for another month or so.
[53:10.100 --> 53:16.900]  And I don't think there are that many voters who really base their decision for president on what the current Supreme Court does.
[53:17.500 --> 53:26.600]  I mean, the Bush administration has come out against this ruling, obviously, so, you know, voting for Bush wouldn't seem to be voting for what's coming out of the Supreme Court in this case.
[53:26.740 --> 53:35.680]  But it doesn't change anything, because these guys have made their decision, and you can't change the current Supreme Court by changing the current president.
[53:35.940 --> 53:39.240]  No, you can only change things way down the road by having more appointees.
[53:39.760 --> 53:40.460]  Oh, okay.
[53:40.740 --> 53:55.480]  No, I was just wondering, because it kind of seemed somewhat kind of a contradiction in terms that the administration itself would be coming across so conservative, and then all of a sudden, you know, when people are starting to actually wonder what's happening to their rights,
[53:55.620 --> 54:03.160]  that all of a sudden the Supreme Court seemed to be kind of favoring or leaning more towards people's rights, you know, when it's creating such backlash in the country.
[54:03.460 --> 54:07.340]  The people appointed to the Supreme Court have been there since before the administration.
[54:07.340 --> 54:10.580]  It's not an administration-by-administration thing.
[54:10.660 --> 54:11.520]  They're there for life.
[54:12.220 --> 54:12.600]  Oh, right.
[54:12.840 --> 54:13.320]  Oh, okay.
[54:13.880 --> 54:14.900]  You know, I would agree with you.
[54:14.960 --> 54:21.300]  If it was the Bush administration changing their policy and becoming suddenly a bit more liberal in some things, then I would suspect that.
[54:21.300 --> 54:28.200]  In this case, you know, you could suspect the entire structure of the nation in some way, but I don't think it's the political process.
[54:28.380 --> 54:35.340]  And then, of course, there's the Hibble case, which was not a liberal ruling at all, where they ruled that the guy in Nevada had to present identification.
[54:35.860 --> 54:41.620]  So, saying that the Supreme Court is suddenly becoming more liberal, I think, is somewhat inaccurate.
[54:42.380 --> 54:42.840]  Okay, yeah.
[54:42.840 --> 54:43.300]  Thanks for your call.
[54:43.620 --> 54:43.980]  No problem.
[54:44.160 --> 54:44.420]  Take care.
[54:44.500 --> 54:44.640]  Bye.
[54:45.560 --> 54:47.160]  212-209-2900.
[54:48.040 --> 54:48.740]  And good evening.
[54:48.800 --> 54:49.220]  You're on the air.
[54:49.640 --> 54:50.500]  Could you turn it off on?
[54:50.840 --> 54:51.480]  Hi there.
[54:52.260 --> 54:54.640]  I'm calling you up from the Easton area.
[54:55.200 --> 54:58.880]  And I was wondering if sort of Bernie Yaskin maybe answered his question.
[54:59.800 --> 55:04.340]  Bernie, when you went to federal court, was that Van Antwerpen was your judge?
[55:05.820 --> 55:06.140]  No.
[55:08.500 --> 55:09.800]  I'm trying to remember the name.
[55:09.940 --> 55:11.320]  Actually, I had more than one judge.
[55:11.540 --> 55:13.920]  But, no, there wasn't that judge.
[55:14.080 --> 55:15.920]  He was the judge who was sitting in Easton.
[55:15.960 --> 55:17.400]  I don't know if you went to Easton's.
[55:17.560 --> 55:17.880]  No.
[55:18.260 --> 55:20.800]  When I was in, there wasn't a federal judge in Easton.
[55:20.960 --> 55:25.740]  My case was handed by the Secret Service back to local authorities in Easton at one point.
[55:25.740 --> 55:28.940]  And the judge, Jack Piniella, heard my case.
[55:29.000 --> 55:29.960]  But he wasn't a federal judge.
[55:29.960 --> 55:37.580]  He was a local judge who now is on the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, or Pennsylvania Superior Court, as they say in Pennsylvania.
[55:38.720 --> 55:39.600]  So, Piniella.
[55:39.740 --> 55:40.800]  But he wasn't a federal judge.
[55:41.300 --> 55:44.360]  So, how did they manage to stick you with doing federal time, though?
[55:44.760 --> 55:48.880]  It's a convoluted story that takes about two hours to tell.
[55:49.100 --> 55:49.200]  Yeah.
[55:49.300 --> 55:52.420]  You know, you can hear some of the story on the Freedom Downtime DVD, extra footage.
[55:52.540 --> 55:52.720]  There you go.
[55:53.700 --> 56:00.440]  Okay, well, I just wanted to tell you this man, Antwerp, and he got promoted to a U.S.
[56:01.200 --> 56:02.340]  Circuit Court of Appeals.
[56:02.900 --> 56:09.840]  Reagan put him in, and then George Bush Sr. put him in, but both times he was knocked down by the Democrats.
[56:10.420 --> 56:12.300]  And now, finally, he's made it now.
[56:12.580 --> 56:15.520]  It's interesting following judgeships.
[56:16.040 --> 56:17.500]  Really, it's worth doing.
[56:17.660 --> 56:19.340]  There's a lot of things worth following, but that's one of them.
[56:19.780 --> 56:20.060]  Okay.
[56:20.420 --> 56:21.060]  Thanks for your call.
[56:21.060 --> 56:21.720]  Thanks for calling.
[56:22.160 --> 56:23.720]  Let's see if we can squeeze in a couple more.
[56:25.160 --> 56:25.980]  And good evening.
[56:26.080 --> 56:26.420]  You're on the air.
[56:27.800 --> 56:28.380]  Go ahead.
[56:28.480 --> 56:28.680]  You're on.
[56:28.940 --> 56:29.300]  Hello?
[56:29.560 --> 56:29.760]  Yes.
[56:30.140 --> 56:31.000]  Oh, okay.
[56:31.460 --> 56:32.860]  Thank you for taking this call.
[56:32.960 --> 56:38.480]  You know, I just wanted to ask a technical question about telephones, okay, telephony.
[56:39.340 --> 56:54.460]  I have read in the New York Times Circuit section that there is a device now that when you call somebody, let's say your phone is 222-5555, but you're wanting the other person's caller ID to come another number, and that you can do that.
[56:54.820 --> 56:55.220]  Well...
[56:55.220 --> 56:56.300]  But somebody did it to me.
[56:56.500 --> 56:56.660]  Yeah.
[56:56.760 --> 56:59.340]  Somebody put my number in my telephone number.
[56:59.540 --> 56:59.680]  Mm-hmm.
[56:59.780 --> 57:01.160]  It's a trivial thing to do.
[57:01.340 --> 57:02.440]  There are ways of...
[57:02.440 --> 57:03.740]  Yes, don't point at me.
[57:03.820 --> 57:04.780]  I didn't...
[57:05.800 --> 57:07.200]  There are ways of doing it.
[57:07.300 --> 57:07.800]  Let's put it this way.
[57:07.900 --> 57:08.800]  There's different methods.
[57:08.940 --> 57:11.400]  You can use a company, PBX, and program it that way.
[57:11.500 --> 57:14.540]  There's also increasing amount of services where you can...
[57:14.540 --> 57:15.820]  A company, PBX, you can use for that?
[57:15.920 --> 57:17.360]  If you have control of it, yes.
[57:17.560 --> 57:17.820]  Mm-hmm.
[57:18.160 --> 57:20.360]  And you have enough lines that you can do that with.
[57:20.400 --> 57:30.140]  But I've seen examples where people can literally call up phone numbers, enter the number they want to see show up on caller ID, and the number goes through that way.
[57:30.580 --> 57:32.100]  And it works like a charm.
[57:32.920 --> 57:34.140]  It's kind of scary.
[57:34.300 --> 57:40.700]  It really is kind of scary because, you know, if you're calling somebody's cell phone, it will ring with their personalized ring and their name and their face, whatever else shows up on the phone.
[57:41.080 --> 57:42.460]  So you can fool a lot of people.
[57:42.780 --> 57:43.660]  You can fool a lot of people.
[57:44.460 --> 57:46.480]  Caller ID is not something to be trusted.
[57:46.720 --> 57:47.640]  We've been saying that for years.
[57:48.160 --> 57:48.660]  Thanks for that call.
[57:48.760 --> 57:49.940]  Let's try to get one more.
[57:50.940 --> 57:51.540]  And good evening.
[57:51.660 --> 57:51.880]  You're on.
[57:52.340 --> 57:53.280]  Well, not that one, then.
[57:53.420 --> 57:55.160]  Let's try and get that one there.
[57:55.260 --> 57:55.500]  Good evening.
[57:55.620 --> 57:55.800]  You're on.
[57:57.100 --> 57:57.420]  Hello.
[57:58.320 --> 57:59.120]  Hi, Emanuela.
[57:59.440 --> 57:59.960]  This is Ahmad.
[58:00.440 --> 58:05.240]  Remember the guy that got stuck outside in Europe?
[58:05.600 --> 58:09.980]  And you won't let him in because his name matches a suspect on the terrorist list?
[58:10.080 --> 58:10.640]  I do remember.
[58:10.640 --> 58:10.960]  Yes.
[58:11.260 --> 58:11.800]  Yes, yes.
[58:11.800 --> 58:16.880]  By the way, I still have two bills, a $20 bill each for you.
[58:16.880 --> 58:18.240]  You're supposed to give me counterfeit money.
[58:18.760 --> 58:19.200]  Exactly.
[58:19.420 --> 58:22.300]  I'm going to show it to you at the show, at the conference, by the way.
[58:22.600 --> 58:25.440]  But you probably know me because I used to work in the Lower East Side.
[58:25.680 --> 58:26.840]  That'll be great.
[58:26.840 --> 58:28.520]  Okay, another thing.
[58:28.600 --> 58:34.400]  Do you know that I found out everything about why my name is on the list and everything from the most unlikely source?
[58:34.640 --> 58:36.140]  You have to wrap this up in 10 seconds.
[58:36.560 --> 58:37.320]  Okay, quickly.
[58:37.460 --> 58:39.940]  I bought a jacket from eBay from a gentleman in China.
[58:39.940 --> 58:42.280]  So I had to wire the money through Western Union.
[58:42.960 --> 58:44.660]  And they would not wire the money.
[58:44.860 --> 58:50.460]  So I decided to use my social engineering skill in hacking to get the people in Western Union to tell me why.
[58:50.640 --> 58:51.620]  And it was really easy.
[58:52.220 --> 58:53.780]  This gentleman is really on the list.
[58:53.940 --> 58:54.920]  His name matches mine.
[58:55.280 --> 58:57.320]  But the funny thing is I provided my...
[58:57.320 --> 58:59.520]  beside my name, my address and everything.
[58:59.720 --> 59:02.160]  I mean, you'd expect that the FBI would knock on my door.
[59:02.380 --> 59:08.900]  They just refused to transfer the money until I provided them with my security number and date of birth and all this stuff.
[59:08.900 --> 59:10.440]  So it was very inviting.
[59:10.920 --> 59:15.060]  Okay, we're going to have to fade down this interesting story there and hopefully continue it at another time.
[59:15.760 --> 59:18.380]  Guys, thank you very much for calling in, for being part of the show.
[59:18.500 --> 59:20.760]  And yes, as promised, we're replaying this song.
[59:20.860 --> 59:21.660]  Sorry, I'm talking over it.
[59:21.920 --> 59:24.300]  It comes from a band called the Studebakers.
[59:25.140 --> 59:30.080]  And I heard this actually on the film that somebody sent us for the conference that features the Dayton Hamvention.
[59:30.880 --> 59:31.680]  That'll be shown.
[59:31.780 --> 59:32.260]  That'll be shown.
[59:32.440 --> 59:33.760]  It's called I Enjoy Being a Nerd.
[59:34.060 --> 59:35.020]  The Studebakers.
[59:35.120 --> 59:35.480]  Look them up.
[59:35.720 --> 59:36.200]  See you next week.
[59:36.300 --> 01:00:21.420]  Strangers on the net I look and I wonder if I'm only Web searching for the life I'll never get A net surfing Unix guru I run with the website herd I'll send all my gift files to you I enjoy being a nerd I lust for your high-speed cable modem And 500 megabytes of RAM I'll turn all your floppies into hard ones That's exactly the kind of scuzzy girl I am I'm simply an e-mail female And my future,
[01:00:21.420 --> 01:00:57.020]  I hope, will be Dialed in with a guy who'll be male Who enjoys being absurd Having a nerd Like a digital girl In an analog world I enjoy being a nerd Ooh, hey, you know, we got a lot of people that like that song here at WBAI New York 99.5 The award-winning personal computer show coming up next after this.
[01:00:57.800 --> 01:00:58.280]  Thank you