[00:00.000 --> 00:10.040]  ...American War warned his supporters this amalgamation of white men and Indian and Negroes would cause impurity of white blood.
[00:10.460 --> 00:16.380]  That kind of political debate would poison American political debate for the next century and a half.
[00:16.680 --> 00:20.920]  That said, it was not a nice, sweet, sanitized debate.
[00:20.940 --> 00:28.820]  It was raucous, intense, emotionally charged, and designed to attract the attention of the then-white electorate.
[00:28.820 --> 00:31.120]  It wasn't boring, that's for sure.
[00:31.480 --> 00:36.060]  If Kerry sought to deepen and broaden his political base, it's doubtful this happened.
[00:36.280 --> 00:41.520]  If Bush sought to deepen and broaden his political base, it's unlikely this occurred either.
[00:42.380 --> 00:47.820]  Americans could survive a debate where two or more men and women talk to each other.
[00:48.060 --> 00:51.060]  There is no earthly reason why this can't be done.
[00:51.420 --> 00:57.700]  The intentional dumbing down of American politics and media coverage does not bode well for American democracy.
[00:57.700 --> 01:01.500]  Americans waged a revolution against princes.
[01:01.820 --> 01:06.800]  There's no need for them to sit in respectful silence when politicians speak.
[01:07.080 --> 01:17.840]  If this was a debate about foreign affairs, it must somehow be possible to discuss the deep structure underlying the core of American politics, imperialism.
[01:17.840 --> 01:25.520]  No major political candidate in the last 60 years has dared question the existence or growth of the U.S.
[01:25.620 --> 01:25.920]  empire.
[01:26.240 --> 01:29.980]  This means that no matter who wins, the imperium wins.
[01:29.980 --> 01:31.000]  And the U.S.
[01:31.480 --> 01:38.060]  military continues to march abroad to carry the latest ridiculous standards, like the war on terrorism.
[01:38.460 --> 01:41.800]  From Death Row, this is Mumia Abu-Jamal.
[01:43.260 --> 01:47.120]  These commentaries are produced by Noelle Hanrahan for Prison Radio.
[01:56.800 --> 02:07.400]  Free Speech Radio News is produced at Pacifica Station's WBAI in New York, KPFA in Berkeley and KPFK in Los Angeles and community radio station WMNF in Tampa, Florida.
[02:07.680 --> 02:10.820]  The newscast is produced by Monica Lopez and Simba Russo.
[02:11.140 --> 02:13.800]  Headline's editors are Randy Zimmerman and Nell Abram.
[02:14.000 --> 02:16.040]  Our DC editor is Mitch Jesserich.
[02:16.040 --> 02:21.900]  Our technical production team is Jade, Padgett-Seekins, Pauline Bartalone, Mick, Mylan and Eric Klein.
[02:22.280 --> 02:24.660]  Special thanks to Transbay for web services.
[02:25.120 --> 02:27.740]  Free Speech Radio News is a worker-run collective.
[02:27.740 --> 02:33.260]  For more information, you can visit our website at www.fsrn.org.
[02:33.680 --> 02:35.920]  In New York, I'm Deepa Fernandes.
[02:38.660 --> 02:47.120]  We're inviting you to attend a regular meeting of the WBAI Local Station Board on Wednesday, October 6th at 6.30 p.m.
[02:47.380 --> 02:53.580]  Come to the Theater for the New City at 155 First Avenue at 10th Street in the East Village in Manhattan.
[02:53.860 --> 02:57.640]  We will have a report back from the Pacifica National Board Meeting.
[02:57.940 --> 03:02.140]  This meeting will include public comment and is wheelchair accessible.
[03:02.140 --> 03:09.180]  Again, the WBAI Local Station Board meeting is Wednesday, October 6th, 6.30 p.m.
[03:09.200 --> 03:13.080]  at the Theater for the New City, 1st Avenue and 10th Street in Manhattan.
[03:13.560 --> 03:16.260]  Take the L train to 1st Avenue or the No.
[03:16.360 --> 03:17.860]  6 train to Astor Place.
[03:18.100 --> 03:22.720]  We encourage all members of the WBAI community to come on out.
[03:23.120 --> 03:23.780]  Thank you.
[03:27.480 --> 03:33.820]  And since you're not coming out right now, stay inside and listen to WBAI New York, where the time is 7 o'clock.
[03:34.120 --> 03:35.020]  Time for Off the Hook.
[03:40.250 --> 04:02.100]  The telephone keeps ringing So I ripped it off the wall I cut myself while shaving Now I can't make a call We couldn't get much worse Put the billy bump For the best expect from worst I hope that's understood But make me move
[04:41.050 --> 04:42.270]  And a good evening to everybody.
[04:42.370 --> 04:43.230]  The program is Off the Hook.
[04:43.410 --> 04:47.450]  Emmanuel Lestine here with you on this glorious Wednesday evening.
[04:48.970 --> 04:55.690]  And we have news just coming into us, actually, concerning some RNC protesters.
[04:55.870 --> 05:00.170]  Turns out that charges against more than 200 protesters have been dropped.
[05:00.870 --> 05:06.190]  These are the protesters that marched with the Roar Resisters League down by the World Trade Center.
[05:07.410 --> 05:11.030]  The ones I would have been arrested with had I stayed there just a little bit longer.
[05:11.690 --> 05:16.070]  But, silly me, I went up to Union Square and stood on a sidewalk.
[05:16.070 --> 05:19.550]  So I'm still being prosecuted here.
[05:19.690 --> 05:23.250]  But, fortunately, these guys all had their charges dismissed today.
[05:23.390 --> 05:27.070]  They were being charged with disorderly conduct and marching without a permit.
[05:27.690 --> 05:37.090]  The DA's office asked for the charges to be dropped because the group was not being violent and may have been confused by police orders regarding their march.
[05:38.250 --> 05:41.310]  I think the police were the ones who were a little bit confused.
[05:42.450 --> 05:51.450]  Anyway, the New York Civil Liberties Union asked the DA to drop the charges saying it had a videotape showing that those arrested had been acting lawfully.
[05:52.290 --> 05:53.650]  The NYCLU says,
[06:02.270 --> 06:04.930]  Well, you know, I just hope this is not the end of it.
[06:04.990 --> 06:08.130]  I really hope that something else comes of this.
[06:08.450 --> 06:12.210]  If you're one of those 200 people, I'd like to know what you're feeling right now.
[06:12.290 --> 06:14.890]  I mean, yeah, it's great to have the charges dropped, but is that it?
[06:15.090 --> 06:15.890]  Is that the end of it?
[06:15.890 --> 06:18.410]  You know, is that where it all finishes?
[06:18.870 --> 06:23.330]  You get arrested for walking on a sidewalk and charges dropped.
[06:23.530 --> 06:26.210]  You get to spend two or three days in hell.
[06:26.870 --> 06:27.490]  I don't know.
[06:27.570 --> 06:29.750]  The whole thing just seems like a big mess to me.
[06:29.790 --> 06:41.170]  I went to my hearing on Friday in Center Street, and they offered me the ACD, adjournment in contemplation of dismissal, and I did not take it.
[06:41.730 --> 06:49.690]  I saw one other person didn't take it, and now I have a trial date, or at least another court appearance date, of November 17th, so we'll see where that goes.
[06:50.810 --> 06:56.310]  The story just continues, but certainly there'll be ramifications.
[06:56.310 --> 06:57.770]  I certainly hope so, anyway.
[06:59.450 --> 07:00.550]  All right, Mike, you're here.
[07:01.030 --> 07:01.370]  Hi there.
[07:01.510 --> 07:01.870]  How you doing?
[07:02.350 --> 07:02.990]  I'm okay.
[07:03.370 --> 07:04.650]  And Jim is here.
[07:04.870 --> 07:05.530]  Yes, I am.
[07:05.730 --> 07:06.690]  Walter and Lynn are here.
[07:07.190 --> 07:07.790]  Hey, hello.
[07:08.210 --> 07:09.490]  And Bernie, you're there.
[07:09.830 --> 07:12.770]  Just crawling out of a taxi cab in Philadelphia.
[07:13.310 --> 07:14.010]  How about that?
[07:14.110 --> 07:17.610]  Just shuttling around from section to section.
[07:17.730 --> 07:19.670]  Did you catch the debate last night?
[07:20.150 --> 07:23.550]  I heard part of it on the radio, and I had a friend of mine videotape it.
[07:24.050 --> 07:24.690]  You know...
[07:24.690 --> 07:30.090]  I'm going to have to play it back, but I heard the part where factcheck.com was mentioned.
[07:30.090 --> 07:38.350]  Yeah, well, you know, basically what they should do is Republicans, people who don't use the Internet very much...
[07:38.350 --> 07:41.350]  I'm not saying all Republicans don't use the Internet, but a lot of them don't.
[07:42.130 --> 07:45.290]  They shouldn't quote the Internet because, you know, they're going to get the domain names wrong.
[07:45.430 --> 07:47.290]  They don't know the difference between .com and .org.
[07:47.870 --> 07:50.630]  Unlike the previous vice president who, of course, invented them.
[07:50.630 --> 07:52.170]  He invented the Internet, so he's allowed.
[07:52.310 --> 07:56.850]  But, no, the thing is, he mentioned, Janie mentioned factcheck.com.
[07:56.930 --> 07:59.410]  He used this as a reference.
[07:59.850 --> 08:09.330]  And, of course, almost immediately, factcheck.com got redirected to, what was it, georgesoros.com?
[08:09.710 --> 08:10.130]  Yeah.
[08:11.350 --> 08:13.590]  I mean, I didn't think to go there until later.
[08:13.930 --> 08:17.870]  You know, I guess I just assumed that he got the site name right.
[08:18.590 --> 08:22.710]  And so I went there, and it redirected, and I just could not believe it.
[08:22.890 --> 08:27.970]  You know, I thought George Soros had, you know, spent a billion dollars or something and gotten them to immediately redirect.
[08:28.110 --> 08:44.050]  But, no, it turns out, it turns out there's this site called nameadministration.com, and it just so happened that this particular domain was one of their domains that they were, I guess, reserving or something like that.
[08:44.550 --> 08:48.030]  And so what they did was they simply redirected it themselves.
[08:48.030 --> 08:51.350]  And the reason for that is because of their own political beliefs.
[08:51.990 --> 08:54.030]  I thought that was kind of interesting.
[08:54.250 --> 09:00.730]  Meanwhile, the site that Cheney meant to be talking about was factcheck.org.
[09:00.730 --> 09:09.310]  And if you go to their site, their headline is Cheney and Edwards mangle facts, getting it wrong about combat pay, Halliburton, and factcheck.org.
[09:09.710 --> 09:19.050]  So either way, either way, I think Cheney loses because he gave a site, and even if you figure out what the right site is, they're not exactly supporting what he said.
[09:19.870 --> 09:27.490]  Cheney wrongly implied that factcheck had defended his tenure as CEO of Halliburton, and the vice president even got our name wrong.
[09:28.190 --> 09:31.950]  He overstated matters when he said Edwards voted for the war and to commit the troops to send him to war.
[09:32.090 --> 09:33.110]  He exaggerated a number of times.
[09:33.270 --> 09:38.070]  Kerry has voted to raise taxes and puffed up the number of small business owners who would see a tax increase in the Kerry's proposal.
[09:38.210 --> 09:42.110]  This is the site that he's referencing to back him up.
[09:42.150 --> 09:43.330]  So I just think there's a lot to be...
[09:43.330 --> 09:44.950]  It's a pretty good website, factcheck.org.
[09:45.030 --> 09:45.470]  It's not bad.
[09:45.470 --> 09:48.430]  I was kind of surprised to hear their name brought up.
[09:50.190 --> 09:52.730]  So, yeah, I was also watching the meter.
[09:52.830 --> 09:54.130]  I think they had some kind of...
[09:54.950 --> 09:58.690]  They had this experimental group of people that had...
[09:58.690 --> 10:02.050]  I don't know if they had electrodes attached to them or something, or maybe they were just pressing buttons or...
[10:02.050 --> 10:02.450]  I don't know.
[10:02.570 --> 10:03.190]  But it just...
[10:03.190 --> 10:10.930]  It showed their reaction, their positive reactions to various things that the candidates said and where it went up...
[10:16.470 --> 10:20.950]  Well, I didn't see that part of it.
[10:21.050 --> 10:32.410]  But what I did see was, you know, a bunch of people sitting around and whenever the candidate would say something that they liked, they would press a button, I guess, and the meter would go up.
[10:32.530 --> 10:42.390]  And for Edwards, it was at some point where he was, I believe, attacking the whole idea of the war or the connection with terrorists or something like that.
[10:42.470 --> 10:44.610]  I forget exactly what it was that was his high.
[10:44.770 --> 11:00.750]  But Cheney's high was when he was basically, I guess, acknowledging what Edwards said about his family, you know, his gay daughter and all that, saying now, you know, he supports the right for people to make their own choices.
[11:00.850 --> 11:11.390]  I just thought it was interesting that his highest point came at something that he's disagreeing with the Bush administration about, which is basically that people have the right to live the lives that they want to live.
[11:12.150 --> 11:13.530]  I just thought that was kind of interesting.
[11:13.710 --> 11:15.230]  Anyway, that's all I have to say about that.
[11:15.530 --> 11:16.150]  I thought it was...
[11:16.150 --> 11:33.890]  I think it would be helpful if Cheney and really all candidates, vice presidential candidates, when they're, or whether they're vice president or not, when they're speaking their opinion, to make it clear whether this is their own personal opinion or whether it's that of their administration or future administration.
[11:33.950 --> 11:38.670]  Because a whole lot of people were confused on that issue, with thinking that Cheney was speaking for the administration.
[11:38.970 --> 11:40.610]  And he did nothing to dispel that.
[11:41.150 --> 11:48.850]  And then, you know, so for all we know, they're always just speaking their own personal opinion when they talk, and not that of their administration.
[11:49.030 --> 11:49.650]  It's very confusing.
[11:49.850 --> 11:51.250]  There's a lot of that going on this week.
[11:51.430 --> 11:55.930]  You had Rumsfeld saying that there was no connection, al-Qaeda and Saddam Hussein.
[11:56.710 --> 11:59.750]  You had Bremer saying that there's not enough troops over there.
[11:59.750 --> 12:01.470]  You had Bush saying there is a connection.
[12:01.710 --> 12:02.850]  You had Cheney saying there's a connection.
[12:03.810 --> 12:04.690]  It's a free-for-all.
[12:04.770 --> 12:06.090]  Everyone's just spouting their own views.
[12:06.210 --> 12:08.570]  It's kind of like, you know, board meetings here at BAI, I think.
[12:08.750 --> 12:12.710]  I just have one tip for debate viewers for the next, future debates.
[12:12.950 --> 12:16.390]  If you watch on C-SPAN, they'll show you the pre-debate show.
[12:16.830 --> 12:26.730]  And the best part of the whole thing is watching the moderators warn the audience of all the bad things that will happen to them if they should so much as make a peep.
[12:26.730 --> 12:29.910]  It makes me wonder, why is there an audience in the first place?
[12:30.130 --> 12:30.810]  They don't...
[12:30.810 --> 12:31.850]  They're not allowed to react.
[12:32.010 --> 12:32.910]  They're not allowed to applaud.
[12:33.110 --> 12:34.530]  They're not allowed to laugh.
[12:34.670 --> 12:38.050]  They're not allowed to scream or shout or ask questions or anything.
[12:38.170 --> 12:39.430]  What is the point of having an audience?
[12:39.810 --> 12:43.470]  I don't know, but I did learn that Jim Lehrer is hardcore, man.
[12:43.850 --> 12:46.350]  Well, did you see the moderator last night?
[12:46.510 --> 12:47.330]  Did she do the same thing?
[12:47.870 --> 12:49.850]  You know, I have to say she wasn't as good.
[12:50.090 --> 12:50.710]  No, she wasn't.
[12:50.710 --> 12:53.910]  She asked this bizarre question, you know...
[12:53.910 --> 12:55.970]  I'm speaking solely...
[12:55.970 --> 13:02.790]  I haven't evaluated her total performance, only her performance in scolding the audience.
[13:02.930 --> 13:04.930]  And I have to say she did not do as good a job.
[13:05.010 --> 13:15.250]  This one bizarre question she addressed to the vice presidential candidates about speaking without mentioning the name of the person you're running with confused Edwards, no end.
[13:15.730 --> 13:16.910]  I just thought it was kind of funny.
[13:17.370 --> 13:18.910]  I was kind of confused by it myself.
[13:19.830 --> 13:23.730]  But anyway, we'd like to know people's opinions on that, obviously, as well as everything else.
[13:23.750 --> 13:26.170]  But there's so many other things we have to be talking about tonight.
[13:26.350 --> 13:28.750]  And we were on for a couple of hours.
[13:28.750 --> 13:30.710]  We'd easily fill it with all kinds of interesting material.
[13:30.830 --> 13:31.310]  But we're not.
[13:31.450 --> 13:39.050]  We should quickly mention that if you live in New York State, you have until this Friday, that's two days, to register to vote.
[13:39.230 --> 13:41.110]  Contact your local Board of Elections.
[13:41.110 --> 13:42.690]  You can go on the web and find them.
[13:42.910 --> 13:44.750]  Or in New York City, call...
[13:44.750 --> 13:45.470]  What's the number?
[13:45.470 --> 13:47.890]  You're a 2-1-2 vote NYC.
[13:48.150 --> 13:48.550]  Okay.
[13:48.650 --> 13:50.970]  Now, what kind of hoops do you have to jump through to register around here?
[13:51.130 --> 13:55.270]  I mean, I know some places in the world you can just register on spot.
[13:55.270 --> 14:00.570]  You can register when you get your car registered or your license.
[14:00.910 --> 14:03.430]  Well, they have these eight-foot hula hoops that...
[14:03.430 --> 14:15.070]  You fill out a form, and you either have to show a photocopy of a government ID or a utility bill, and it has to be postmarked by Friday, or you have to carry it into a Board of Elections office.
[14:15.130 --> 14:17.910]  There's one in each of the boroughs and in each county of the state.
[14:18.150 --> 14:25.090]  Now, if I have bills sent to different addresses, how are they able to prove that I already registered at a different address?
[14:25.830 --> 14:30.570]  This is a nasty little loophole that I think I've addressed here and there.
[14:30.570 --> 14:32.950]  So, they don't, in other words, is what you're saying.
[14:33.030 --> 14:33.390]  Yeah, pretty much.
[14:33.530 --> 14:40.010]  Now, what if I'm registered in a different district and I want to vote in the city because I don't feel like going to that other district?
[14:40.170 --> 14:41.610]  Can I just register here?
[14:41.730 --> 14:50.670]  You can either file a change of address form with the New York City Board of Elections or you can ask your previous district for an absentee ballot.
[14:52.170 --> 14:53.770]  Assuming that you actually have a residence here.
[14:53.770 --> 14:55.410]  I want to go in the machine.
[14:55.670 --> 14:56.070]  Uh-huh.
[14:56.110 --> 14:56.570]  Pull the levers.
[14:57.230 --> 14:57.430]  Okay.
[14:57.750 --> 14:58.970]  Then you better hurry up.
[14:58.970 --> 15:00.390]  Well, yes, Bernie.
[15:00.870 --> 15:02.010]  You need no proof of anything.
[15:02.210 --> 15:03.910]  You don't have to show ID or address.
[15:04.070 --> 15:06.050]  You just fill out the form and that's it.
[15:06.270 --> 15:07.470]  When do you have to register by?
[15:08.170 --> 15:09.130]  That's a good question.
[15:09.430 --> 15:12.430]  Someone told me this week was the deadline, but I don't know the exact.
[15:13.070 --> 15:21.970]  But if you go to philly.gov, you will find out the answer.
[15:22.150 --> 15:22.930]  Philly.gov?
[15:23.050 --> 15:23.650]  Philly .gov.
[15:23.890 --> 15:24.650]  Okay, that's a good one.
[15:24.650 --> 15:26.370]  That's actually not true, Bernie.
[15:26.970 --> 15:27.470]  What is it?
[15:27.470 --> 15:44.350]  The Help America Vote Act, which seems to work primarily by helping Americans not vote, now requires that if you recently registered to vote, then the first time you vote at your new polling place, you must show a photo ID.
[15:44.510 --> 15:45.230]  And that's nationwide.
[15:45.230 --> 15:46.030]  It's a change.
[15:46.370 --> 15:46.610]  Ah.
[15:46.890 --> 15:47.830]  Well, okay.
[15:48.110 --> 15:48.430]  All right.
[15:48.430 --> 15:48.930]  I can't correct it.
[15:49.110 --> 15:53.390]  Last time I registered, a couple years ago here, when I changed my address, I had to show nothing.
[15:53.390 --> 15:54.530]  But I guess they've changed that.
[15:55.830 --> 15:57.170]  Your administration at work.
[15:57.270 --> 15:58.190]  You can try it again.
[15:58.350 --> 15:59.410]  Helping America vote.
[15:59.550 --> 15:59.730]  Yeah.
[16:00.130 --> 16:02.270]  We got a letter from somebody, actually, on this subject.
[16:02.290 --> 16:04.290]  It says, Hi, I want to vote for the Democrat.
[16:04.550 --> 16:05.990]  I guess you didn't want to name him by name.
[16:06.230 --> 16:10.470]  But I'm afraid to register because I don't want to get called to jury duty or get junk mail.
[16:10.770 --> 16:14.430]  I get telemarketing calls from political recordings, and I am not even registered to vote.
[16:14.850 --> 16:17.210]  I think that this is what's keeping people from voting, and it's a shame.
[16:17.390 --> 16:18.990]  Why do people even need to register?
[16:18.990 --> 16:21.950]  Can't you just show some sort of proof of citizenship at the polling place and vote?
[16:22.290 --> 16:24.370]  Why do you need to be registered to a particular party?
[16:24.510 --> 16:25.330]  Chuck from Boston.
[16:25.370 --> 16:27.150]  You don't have to be registered to a particular party.
[16:27.150 --> 16:27.510]  You don't.
[16:27.550 --> 16:29.030]  But if you want to vote in the primaries, you do.
[16:29.110 --> 16:29.290]  Right.
[16:29.510 --> 16:29.550]  Right.
[16:29.870 --> 16:32.150]  But, yeah, it's a valid concern.
[16:32.470 --> 16:34.530]  His letter addresses his own concern.
[16:34.730 --> 16:38.670]  He hasn't registered to vote, and yet the political parties are calling him.
[16:38.830 --> 16:44.290]  They get you for a whole slew of databases for all sorts of things, including jury duty.
[16:44.530 --> 16:46.950]  Jury duty, I know they pull that from motor vehicles.
[16:47.730 --> 16:48.130]  Taxes.
[16:48.130 --> 16:51.390]  And those preferred chopper cards at supermarkets.
[16:51.510 --> 16:52.650]  That's a great rumor to start.
[16:52.690 --> 16:53.510]  I think we should do it tonight.
[16:53.670 --> 16:57.790]  But, I mean, the voter registration records are public, so they can pull...
[16:57.790 --> 17:02.090]  I mean, theoretically, a company could get a lot more value.
[17:02.350 --> 17:04.390]  Yeah, you can get all that information for nothing.
[17:04.590 --> 17:04.830]  Yeah.
[17:04.910 --> 17:06.990]  It's a great way to find people's addresses.
[17:08.070 --> 17:09.630]  Unfortunately, that's how it works.
[17:10.390 --> 17:11.450]  Yeah, the jury duty thing.
[17:11.710 --> 17:12.910]  You know, jury duty is not so bad.
[17:13.050 --> 17:14.530]  You know, people are always trying to avoid jury duty.
[17:15.030 --> 17:16.910]  It's really not the worst thing in the world.
[17:17.470 --> 17:23.530]  I think if more people didn't try to avoid it, it wouldn't be such a hardship on those that actually wound up serving.
[17:23.710 --> 17:26.270]  If you act crazy during jury selection, they probably won't.
[17:26.310 --> 17:28.190]  Yeah, you know, there's all kinds of ways to avoid things.
[17:28.190 --> 17:28.710]  That's true.
[17:28.870 --> 17:30.130]  But, I don't know.
[17:30.450 --> 17:31.990]  It just seems like people try to avoid that too much.
[17:31.990 --> 17:37.770]  I had a teacher once who liked teaching so much that she'd go there and act completely senile just so she wouldn't miss any days of class.
[17:37.910 --> 17:38.150]  Uh-huh.
[17:38.470 --> 17:39.870]  Where she also acted completely senile.
[17:40.450 --> 17:40.850]  True.
[17:41.170 --> 17:41.430]  All right.
[17:41.670 --> 17:44.470]  I wouldn't be doing my job for this segment.
[17:44.650 --> 17:51.850]  By the way, while we fetishize voting, I'd like to point out that it's not or not always the most effective way to change things.
[17:51.850 --> 17:56.230]  And, you know, voting's good sometimes when there's candidates worth voting for.
[17:56.590 --> 17:58.990]  Sometimes standing on the sidewalk is all it takes to make change.
[17:59.170 --> 17:59.550]  There you go.
[18:00.270 --> 18:00.810]  Who knows?
[18:00.810 --> 18:04.530]  If you have any other alternatives to voting, please let us know because we're looking for alternatives.
[18:05.630 --> 18:07.570]  What's this about the U.S.
[18:07.730 --> 18:09.750]  cybersecurity chief abruptly resigning?
[18:09.830 --> 18:10.470]  Did you hear about this?
[18:11.010 --> 18:23.790]  The government's cybersecurity chief abruptly resigned after one year at the Department of Homeland Security, confiding to industry colleagues his frustration over what he considers a lack of attention paid to computer security issues within the agency.
[18:23.930 --> 18:25.330]  Now, there's two ways you can take that.
[18:25.750 --> 18:27.190]  Number one, they're not doing their job.
[18:27.270 --> 18:29.030]  Number two, their own computers aren't secure.
[18:29.050 --> 18:30.130]  I don't know if he meant that.
[18:30.590 --> 18:32.010]  But it's kind of strange.
[18:32.150 --> 18:36.370]  I mean, this is what they're supposed to be doing, paying attention to computer security issues.
[18:36.370 --> 18:41.970]  And according to Amit Yuron, who is the outgoing U.S.
[18:42.030 --> 18:43.590]  cybersecurity chief, they were not doing that.
[18:44.690 --> 18:45.070]  Hmm.
[18:45.250 --> 18:46.770]  Something sobering there.
[18:46.970 --> 18:49.510]  So I guess that means we're open to cyber attack.
[18:50.090 --> 18:50.430]  Sorry, Bernie.
[18:50.530 --> 18:50.590]  What?
[18:50.990 --> 18:54.310]  Didn't Richard Clark also have similar concerns about that?
[18:54.390 --> 18:57.850]  Because he was our cybersecurity chief of some sort, wasn't he, at one point?
[18:57.970 --> 19:02.030]  He was somebody who recognized the need for a cybersecurity chief.
[19:02.130 --> 19:04.270]  I'm not sure if he actually served that position himself.
[19:04.270 --> 19:11.330]  But he was saying how terrorist attacks will come over the web or something along those lines.
[19:11.390 --> 19:16.470]  So now we should be concerned not only with North Korea's nuclear missiles, but also the 600 hackers they've hired.
[19:16.570 --> 19:17.210]  You heard about that.
[19:17.210 --> 19:17.430]  Yes, you have.
[19:17.470 --> 19:19.170]  600 North Korean hackers.
[19:19.310 --> 19:20.570]  Yeah, they're out there.
[19:20.790 --> 19:24.830]  We're not protected from, you know, the cybersecurity department's not doing its job.
[19:24.990 --> 19:25.690]  I don't know.
[19:25.830 --> 19:26.930]  We can't have it both ways.
[19:26.930 --> 19:33.070]  Either they're in the dark ages in North Korea and nobody can eat anything or find their way around in the dark.
[19:33.110 --> 19:38.250]  Or they have sophisticated computer hackers that are out there trying to break into NORAD.
[19:38.970 --> 19:39.990]  I don't know.
[19:40.230 --> 19:44.390]  Well, it's actually possible that a small privileged minority has the internet.
[19:44.710 --> 19:45.350]  Yeah, that's true.
[19:45.350 --> 19:46.410]  Quite even possibly likely.
[19:46.410 --> 19:53.310]  But I remember, you know, when we had the whole spy plane scandal, how these Chinese hackers all of a sudden emerged to cause problems.
[19:54.270 --> 19:57.850]  And, you know, it just seemed like a bunch of scripts running, really.
[19:58.210 --> 20:00.670]  We have an expert on Chinese hackers in the room with us.
[20:00.710 --> 20:00.970]  Do we?
[20:01.050 --> 20:02.250]  But I don't think he's saying anything.
[20:02.450 --> 20:02.670]  Okay.
[20:03.470 --> 20:15.890]  Well, in any event, in any event, North Korea has trained as many as 600 computer hackers to be capable of launching a cyber war on South Korea, the U.S., or Japan.
[20:16.510 --> 20:19.430]  That's according to South Korea's defense ministry.
[20:19.530 --> 20:24.470]  Now, of course, all this comes from, you know, one agency, the defense ministry, saying this.
[20:25.170 --> 20:35.590]  Coming amid intelligence reports that Pyongyang might be preparing to test a ballistic missile, well, the report will exacerbate jitters over the extent of the communist state's destructive ability.
[20:37.290 --> 20:39.710]  Well, it's something to keep in mind.
[20:40.190 --> 20:44.710]  I've yet to see anything in the North Korean domain, including their own home web page.
[20:45.110 --> 20:52.170]  No, the only thing I ever got was about 2,800 root attempt on our Linux box.
[20:52.330 --> 20:52.950]  From North Korea?
[20:53.110 --> 20:53.850]  No, South Korea.
[20:53.930 --> 20:54.090]  Oh.
[20:54.390 --> 20:55.930]  Oh, yeah, that I see all the time.
[20:55.930 --> 20:57.110]  That's close, but...
[20:57.110 --> 20:58.730]  It's close, but not really.
[20:59.810 --> 21:01.990]  Maybe they own some boxes in South Korea.
[21:02.230 --> 21:03.370]  Well, you know, I'll say this.
[21:03.450 --> 21:09.370]  Anybody who connects to us through a North Korean domain, we'll give you an account on our machine.
[21:09.370 --> 21:09.970]  How about that?
[21:10.070 --> 21:10.490]  How's that?
[21:10.590 --> 21:11.770]  Is that illegal to me to say that?
[21:11.850 --> 21:12.870]  I think we should give them more.
[21:13.130 --> 21:14.470]  Am I doing business with the enemy?
[21:14.670 --> 21:15.570]  Oh, that's a good question.
[21:16.370 --> 21:17.030]  Well, I'll say this, too.
[21:17.030 --> 21:17.870]  We'll get it to you through channels.
[21:18.310 --> 21:23.410]  Anybody in North Korea who wants a copy of 2600 Magazine, in fact, we'll give you a subscription.
[21:23.570 --> 21:23.850]  You know what?
[21:23.850 --> 21:26.730]  We'll give you the DVD of Freedom Downtime.
[21:26.850 --> 21:28.850]  Now, does it count if they bounce through North Korea?
[21:30.250 --> 21:32.250]  Well, if you can bounce through North Korea, I'd be impressed.
[21:32.250 --> 21:32.950]  I really would be.
[21:33.510 --> 21:35.550]  But you have to be able to receive mail there, okay?
[21:35.670 --> 21:36.650]  Because we're going to reply to you.
[21:36.750 --> 21:36.890]  Right.
[21:37.110 --> 21:39.010]  But if you send us paper mail, you can do that, too.
[21:39.130 --> 21:43.890]  Send us paper mail from North Korea, and we'll happily send you back something.
[21:44.210 --> 21:46.190]  What is the top-level domain for North Korea?
[21:46.190 --> 21:47.490]  I would imagine it's .nk.
[21:48.850 --> 21:51.470]  Someone correct me if nobody has Internet access here.
[21:51.650 --> 21:52.750]  Well, I'm sure...
[21:52.750 --> 21:53.010]  We could check.
[21:53.270 --> 21:53.350]  Yeah.
[21:53.510 --> 21:54.330]  Dick Cheney might know.
[21:55.030 --> 21:57.590]  Well, he's full of all kinds of tidbits as far as the Internet goes.
[21:58.130 --> 22:03.610]  Speaking of tidbits, though, did anybody see the article in the New York Times about area codes this past week?
[22:03.690 --> 22:05.210]  Oh, it was fascinating, and I learned something.
[22:05.330 --> 22:06.190]  About sermons?
[22:07.290 --> 22:08.350]  Sermons and area codes?
[22:08.710 --> 22:09.690]  Sermons and area codes.
[22:09.850 --> 22:11.810]  You have to explain what you mean by that.
[22:11.810 --> 22:26.090]  The article referenced a priest from Maryland who's written a sermon about area codes losing their geographic underpinnings.
[22:26.090 --> 22:27.090]  Oh, yeah, I do see that here.
[22:27.130 --> 22:27.590]  How about that?
[22:28.050 --> 22:36.650]  Just as the Bible provides easy access to the Holy One, new technology also provides ready access to 212, which has become an almost transcendental symbol.
[22:36.750 --> 22:41.710]  You know, I must have just sort of filtered that out when I read it, because I tend to do that with religion when it passes.
[22:41.810 --> 22:43.410]  See, that's the difference between us.
[22:43.730 --> 22:43.930]  Uh-huh.
[22:44.150 --> 22:44.730]  Well, okay.
[22:45.150 --> 22:52.330]  But, yeah, the one fact I learned, and nobody in this room can mention it, because we all can see it.
[22:52.670 --> 23:04.150]  But I'm going to ask our listeners, if anyone out there knows, the secret involving my home area code, 516, my former home area code.
[23:04.930 --> 23:07.570]  There's a dark secret involved in that area code.
[23:08.110 --> 23:09.810]  Yeah, a dark secret.
[23:10.410 --> 23:11.890]  You might be interested in this, too, Red Hack.
[23:12.670 --> 23:13.150]  All right.
[23:13.270 --> 23:14.130]  For different reasons.
[23:14.650 --> 23:15.670]  I'll get to it in a moment.
[23:15.790 --> 23:19.910]  Maybe somebody can call in and tell us some of the history involved in this.
[23:21.190 --> 23:27.330]  But here are some other absolutely useless bits of information from a site called areacode-info.com.
[23:28.770 --> 23:31.010]  In 1947, the number of U.S.
[23:31.530 --> 23:34.210]  states assigned a single area code was 35.
[23:35.230 --> 23:38.190]  By 1994, that number had slipped to 24.
[23:38.870 --> 23:41.850]  And in 2002, the number stood at 15.
[23:42.630 --> 23:44.670]  And I don't know if New Mexico has split yet.
[23:44.670 --> 23:45.830]  If they have, then it's 14.
[23:46.850 --> 23:49.910]  The first area code ever to be assigned was...
[23:49.910 --> 23:51.090]  Okay, anybody want to guess on this?
[23:51.670 --> 23:52.450]  Well, I read the site.
[23:52.450 --> 23:53.910]  Not if you already read the site, okay?
[23:54.230 --> 23:55.090]  Walter, how about you?
[23:56.390 --> 23:57.790]  Looks like you're thinking about something.
[23:57.930 --> 23:59.650]  So I figured maybe you're the person to ask.
[23:59.730 --> 24:01.470]  What good is it to have one area code?
[24:01.810 --> 24:02.630]  That's a good point.
[24:02.850 --> 24:04.610]  That is a good point, actually.
[24:04.850 --> 24:06.810]  Well, maybe it was the first one to be assigned.
[24:07.090 --> 24:08.570]  And then they immediately assigned a second one.
[24:08.610 --> 24:08.750]  Yeah.
[24:08.910 --> 24:09.710]  I would say probably New York.
[24:09.970 --> 24:10.470]  New York.
[24:10.670 --> 24:11.030]  212.
[24:11.430 --> 24:11.590]  Yeah.
[24:11.930 --> 24:12.330]  202?
[24:13.110 --> 24:14.110]  212 is New York.
[24:14.270 --> 24:15.490]  Either that or Washington, D.C.
[24:15.630 --> 24:16.870]  Yeah, 202 is my guess.
[24:17.330 --> 24:17.650]  202.
[24:17.810 --> 24:18.390]  Which is Washington.
[24:18.430 --> 24:19.290]  Because that would be the shortest.
[24:19.290 --> 24:20.330]  I bet it wasn't a big city.
[24:20.510 --> 24:21.550]  You bet it wasn't a big city, Walter.
[24:21.630 --> 24:22.430]  Why would you say that?
[24:22.730 --> 24:24.150]  Because I just have a feeling.
[24:24.150 --> 24:24.930]  He's contrarian.
[24:25.090 --> 24:26.690]  Because I think I remember something being...
[24:26.690 --> 24:28.130]  Well, actually, you were right, Walter.
[24:28.330 --> 24:28.710]  You were right.
[24:28.970 --> 24:30.530]  Without giving an answer, you were actually right.
[24:31.950 --> 24:35.730]  Well, if you think, you know, obviously, 212 would be the first one.
[24:35.850 --> 24:36.110]  New Jersey.
[24:36.130 --> 24:37.150]  Because it can't be a 211.
[24:37.270 --> 24:38.090]  Where Bell Labs was.
[24:38.190 --> 24:40.270]  But 201 comes before 202.
[24:40.270 --> 24:45.870]  And 201 was the first area code given out in 1951.
[24:46.950 --> 24:47.550]  All right.
[24:47.830 --> 24:56.430]  Dialing a zero takes 10 times as long as dialing a one back when there were rotary dials and step-by-step switches.
[24:56.690 --> 24:57.150]  That's true.
[24:57.190 --> 25:00.130]  And back then, touch-tone phones were way too expensive for anybody to have.
[25:00.290 --> 25:00.530]  Yes.
[25:00.750 --> 25:03.410]  So everybody had to do the rotary dial thing.
[25:03.850 --> 25:10.490]  So the 212 was the shortest area code as far as number of dial pulses when you dialed your phone, which saved a whole lot of time.
[25:10.710 --> 25:19.050]  You know, this thing is filled with contradiction because it says right here the first area code to be assigned was 201 in 1951.
[25:19.190 --> 25:22.490]  And then it talks about the original 1947 area code assignments.
[25:23.850 --> 25:24.950]  So I'm not sure.
[25:25.070 --> 25:26.410]  Someone's got to clarify this for us.
[25:26.730 --> 25:29.270]  But some very interesting facts here.
[25:29.270 --> 25:34.830]  New York City received the only 5-pulse area code.
[25:35.030 --> 25:36.290]  5-pulse area code.
[25:36.350 --> 25:39.530]  That's what 212 is known as because if you add the numbers up, you get 5 pulses.
[25:40.010 --> 25:45.090]  So we have the only 5-pulse area code in the United States or Canada.
[25:45.390 --> 25:45.850]  So there.
[25:45.970 --> 25:56.730]  Northern Illinois, including Chicago, and Southern California, including Los Angeles and San Diego, received the only two 6-pulse codes, 312 and 213, respectively.
[25:57.950 --> 26:10.630]  Southeastern Michigan, including Detroit, northeastern Texas, including Dallas, and southwestern Pennsylvania, including Pittsburgh, were assigned 7-pulse codes, 313, 214, and 412, respectively.
[26:11.910 --> 26:14.090]  Bernie, you're 215, right?
[26:14.090 --> 26:15.230]  So you're way down there.
[26:16.010 --> 26:16.910]  Yeah, 7-pulses.
[26:17.090 --> 26:18.050]  Yeah, that's something.
[26:18.170 --> 26:19.010]  Actually, 8-pulses.
[26:19.590 --> 26:20.470]  8-pulses.
[26:20.610 --> 26:29.290]  If you examine the original 1947 map, you'll notice that every state, territory, and province that was assigned a single code had a 0 as the middle digit.
[26:29.790 --> 26:36.850]  Areas assigned multiple codes, such as California, Texas, Illinois, New York, Pennsylvania, received area codes with a 1 as the middle digit.
[26:37.010 --> 26:41.650]  That practice was abandoned in 1954 when they realized they were about to run out of numbers if they kept it up.
[26:43.670 --> 26:44.310]  Let's see.
[26:44.430 --> 26:50.250]  The westernmost area code is Alaska's 907, at the furthest part of the Aleutian Islands.
[26:50.570 --> 26:52.530]  The easternmost part, anybody want to guess?
[26:53.570 --> 26:54.010]  Nobody?
[26:54.650 --> 26:55.670]  Uh, Labrador?
[26:56.270 --> 26:58.110]  That's a good guess, but it's wrong.
[26:58.370 --> 26:58.510]  Oh.
[26:58.830 --> 26:59.530]  Uh, Guam.
[27:00.310 --> 27:00.570]  Ah.
[27:01.070 --> 27:04.590]  Area code 671, where America's Day begins.
[27:05.390 --> 27:07.650]  The northernmost, anybody want to guess on the northernmost?
[27:08.550 --> 27:09.310]  Alaska again.
[27:10.010 --> 27:11.530]  Well, that's a good guess.
[27:11.750 --> 27:13.170]  Oh, no, Canada would be further north.
[27:13.170 --> 27:14.110]  Canada would be further north.
[27:14.330 --> 27:14.910]  Northwest Territories.
[27:15.210 --> 27:15.930]  How narrow-minded of them.
[27:15.930 --> 27:17.970]  But none of you know what the area code is, do you?
[27:18.210 --> 27:18.430]  No.
[27:18.690 --> 27:20.430]  See, back in the old days, people would know what the area code is.
[27:20.430 --> 27:21.490]  We don't have any friends there.
[27:21.490 --> 27:22.510]  Eight, six, seven.
[27:23.470 --> 27:24.170]  Eight, six, seven.
[27:24.230 --> 27:25.150]  So remember that from now on.
[27:25.210 --> 27:26.950]  Eight, six, seven is northernmost.
[27:27.290 --> 27:27.590]  It's easy to remember.
[27:27.590 --> 27:29.490]  It's easy to remember because it spells top.
[27:30.430 --> 27:31.030]  Oh, you're right.
[27:31.070 --> 27:31.670]  It does spell top.
[27:31.770 --> 27:32.390]  How did you know that?
[27:32.490 --> 27:33.190]  I read the site.
[27:34.310 --> 27:36.230]  It says it right on the paper in front of you.
[27:36.350 --> 27:37.490]  It says top of the world.
[27:37.610 --> 27:40.050]  I just didn't know that it was spelling top at the same time.
[27:40.150 --> 27:40.270]  Yeah.
[27:40.270 --> 27:41.950]  Okay, and the southernmost.
[27:42.190 --> 27:44.450]  You could have brought Mike Uhas into this conversation.
[27:44.450 --> 27:45.290]  I could have done that.
[27:45.430 --> 27:45.790]  Yes.
[27:46.270 --> 27:47.310]  I'm happy you remember that.
[27:47.390 --> 27:50.890]  Mike Uhas, my former co-host at WUSB, is an area code expert.
[27:50.930 --> 27:51.490]  But you know what?
[27:51.790 --> 27:58.970]  He ripped up the map and threw it in the air and walked away in disgust when all these crazy area codes started being assigned because it really is ridiculous.
[27:59.650 --> 28:01.390]  It's hard to know where anything is these days.
[28:02.710 --> 28:04.190]  But you're not going to avoid the question.
[28:04.290 --> 28:05.370]  The southernmost area code.
[28:06.070 --> 28:06.790]  American Samoa?
[28:07.210 --> 28:08.310]  That's a very good guess.
[28:08.590 --> 28:09.250]  Is it right?
[28:09.250 --> 28:11.170]  Completely wrong, but it's a very good guess.
[28:11.370 --> 28:12.110]  Well, I try.
[28:12.410 --> 28:13.010]  Anybody else?
[28:13.610 --> 28:14.090]  Chile?
[28:15.490 --> 28:16.850]  An area code, Jim.
[28:16.990 --> 28:17.790]  That's a country code.
[28:17.850 --> 28:18.490]  Different country.
[28:18.630 --> 28:20.910]  The North American numbering plan is...
[28:20.910 --> 28:21.230]  Mexico.
[28:21.490 --> 28:22.210]  Country code 1.
[28:23.270 --> 28:24.570]  That's also a different...
[28:24.570 --> 28:25.550]  That's country code 52.
[28:26.130 --> 28:27.870]  Although, it brings up an interesting point.
[28:27.950 --> 28:30.750]  Mexico used to have dialing from the United States.
[28:30.750 --> 28:35.590]  Area code 903 and 905 were kind of like fake area codes.
[28:35.590 --> 28:39.730]  And then 706 was Baja, California.
[28:40.290 --> 28:45.470]  Those have all been reassigned within the United States, but it was kind of like a shortcut.
[28:45.790 --> 28:50.250]  They still had a country code of 52, but you could get to some numbers by dialing those area codes.
[28:50.550 --> 28:57.330]  Anyway, the answer to the question, the southernmost area code is Trinidad and Tobago's 868, which is only a few degrees away from the equator.
[28:58.430 --> 28:58.970]  All right.
[29:01.810 --> 29:06.810]  And again, we have the dark secret involving the 516 area code, so if anybody has that information, please call up.
[29:06.950 --> 29:12.390]  Let me just comment on something you said about how in 1951, touchstones were prohibitively expensive.
[29:13.450 --> 29:15.710]  Are we sure that they were even developed then?
[29:18.190 --> 29:21.990]  You said, you know, we were talking about pulse dialing as opposed to touchstone dialing.
[29:22.070 --> 29:26.330]  You said the reason was that in 1951, it was too expensive for anyone to have a touchstone phone.
[29:26.330 --> 29:27.410]  It flew right over your head, didn't it?
[29:27.450 --> 29:28.110]  That was a joke.
[29:28.270 --> 29:28.970]  Just want to make sure.
[29:29.050 --> 29:30.490]  I want to make sure we're not getting mail.
[29:31.350 --> 29:33.170]  Yeah, because we hate getting mail so much.
[29:33.530 --> 29:34.110]  Sorry, Bernie.
[29:34.170 --> 29:34.370]  Go ahead.
[29:34.670 --> 29:36.930]  Personal computers were prohibitively expensive in 1951.
[29:36.930 --> 29:37.350]  They were.
[29:37.470 --> 29:37.790]  They were.
[29:37.970 --> 29:39.450]  I mean, even millionaires couldn't afford them.
[29:40.290 --> 29:40.650]  Okay.
[29:40.650 --> 29:43.910]  We have a correction on the top-level domain for North Korea.
[29:44.070 --> 29:47.990]  The Korea Democratic People's Republic is .kp.
[29:48.510 --> 29:49.890]  Thank you, RedHack, for pointing that out.
[29:50.530 --> 29:51.150]  South Korea.
[29:51.330 --> 29:52.470]  They might know what South Korea is.
[29:54.470 --> 29:57.470]  Oh, Lynn, you said you had people trying to get rude on your machine.
[29:57.670 --> 29:58.790]  Don't you remember what the domain was?
[29:58.990 --> 29:59.330]  No.
[29:59.490 --> 30:01.290]  It's been several months.
[30:01.390 --> 30:01.630]  All right.
[30:01.770 --> 30:03.630]  RK.KR.
[30:03.990 --> 30:04.330]  .KR.
[30:04.530 --> 30:05.070]  Good guess, Jim.
[30:05.210 --> 30:05.570]  It was backwards.
[30:07.150 --> 30:07.650]  Let's see.
[30:07.710 --> 30:08.410]  What else do we have?
[30:08.850 --> 30:12.310]  Bernie, you have something on Holland, the Netherlands.
[30:12.810 --> 30:14.130]  Something bad happening there again?
[30:14.130 --> 30:17.590]  Well, it depends on where you're coming from.
[30:17.770 --> 30:21.090]  But apparently, let's see here.
[30:21.230 --> 30:22.470]  I have that down here somewhere.
[30:22.890 --> 30:25.370]  Yeah, the Dutch government and the U.S.
[30:25.490 --> 30:31.750]  government signed a pact, or several pacts, on anti-terror cooperation.
[30:32.910 --> 30:43.270]  So, in the Hague earlier this week, both countries signed agreements that basically allowed, it expanded the extradition treaty.
[30:43.650 --> 30:48.530]  So, for those of our listeners who are hoping to avoid extradition to the U.S.
[30:48.530 --> 30:52.190]  by moving to Holland, they can kiss that away now.
[30:52.690 --> 30:57.730]  They had an extradition deal before, but now it's basically, they can do whatever they want.
[30:58.470 --> 31:10.310]  Well, I mean, a big case a couple of years ago was someone who was dealing drugs in Amsterdam, and they dealt drugs to an American, and they were able to be extradited to the United States.
[31:10.310 --> 31:15.510]  I believe they were able to plea bargain before that happened, but the fact that that was even a possibility shocked a lot of people.
[31:15.990 --> 31:30.630]  One of the, I think one of the restrictions prior was that if the death penalty was involved or was a potential sentence for the accused, which it is in many, many drug cases, that there'd be no extradition.
[31:30.770 --> 31:33.310]  But now, good luck.
[31:34.890 --> 31:37.790]  Yeah, well, it sounds like more bad news from over there.
[31:39.130 --> 31:40.890]  It'd be nice to have some good news every now and then.
[31:41.030 --> 31:43.710]  There's a lot of information sharing stuff going on, too.
[31:43.890 --> 31:46.990]  Sharing of databases and that sort of thing.
[31:47.170 --> 32:00.510]  So, sharing of wiretap information, bank financial information, any kind of credit transactions, travel information, it's all a free-for-all, and they can swap it like so many baseball cards.
[32:00.610 --> 32:02.150]  But sharing is supposed to be good, isn't it?
[32:02.210 --> 32:03.630]  I mean, that's what it's all about.
[32:03.810 --> 32:06.290]  Maybe in the sandbox, but not across the pond.
[32:06.830 --> 32:10.450]  It's open source, except we're the source, and they're sharing our information.
[32:13.610 --> 32:14.910]  It's sobering times, I guess.
[32:16.430 --> 32:17.450]  Okay, how about this?
[32:17.710 --> 32:26.030]  There's another point that's not being brought up about these pacts, is that similar to the way that the NSA gets around U.S.
[32:26.170 --> 32:29.930]  laws that prevent them from surveilling U.S.
[32:30.370 --> 32:30.970]  citizens electronically.
[32:31.610 --> 32:33.010]  In fact, the U.K.
[32:34.130 --> 32:38.290]  MI6 will do this, or the GHCQ.
[32:38.510 --> 32:43.090]  Their equivalent of the NSA in Britain will be able to eavesdrop on U.S.
[32:43.490 --> 32:43.490]  citizens.
[32:43.490 --> 32:48.970]  and then legally, and then give that information legally to the NSA, and they scratch each other's back.
[32:49.130 --> 32:53.050]  With these pacts like Holland and the U.S.
[32:53.070 --> 33:03.910]  are now engaged in, where maybe the government would not be permitted to delve into certain personal information of its own citizens, the Dutch can do it for the U.S.
[33:04.050 --> 33:07.190]  and vice versa, without them violating each other's laws.
[33:07.370 --> 33:12.870]  Sounds like the tactic they used in 2000 at the Republican convention where they got Washington, D.C.
[33:13.030 --> 33:17.330]  police to infiltrate the activist group since it was illegal for Philadelphia police to do that.
[33:17.490 --> 33:18.550]  All kinds of loopholes.
[33:18.710 --> 33:34.950]  If a mere mortal citizen were to engage in such kind of chicanery or loopholes, they'd be charged probably under the RICO Act, because it was a felony of, you know, conspiracy to commit a crime.
[33:34.950 --> 33:36.990]  But the governments get away with it with impunity.
[33:37.530 --> 33:39.290]  That's certainly nothing new there.
[33:39.830 --> 33:41.690]  This is an interesting story out of Florida.
[33:41.830 --> 33:44.730]  Another black eye for Florida's child welfare agency.
[33:44.730 --> 33:52.090]  Officials acknowledge that confidential records for nearly 4,000 abused and neglected children were available on the Internet until last week.
[33:52.250 --> 33:57.530]  The files were accessible on the website of Kids Central, a privately run child welfare agency.
[33:57.530 --> 34:03.050]  They included the names of foster children, birth dates, Social Security numbers, photographs, and case histories.
[34:03.350 --> 34:06.390]  They even provided directions and maps to their homes.
[34:06.970 --> 34:08.350]  Can you believe this?
[34:08.450 --> 34:16.910]  The Department of Children and Families, which oversees Kids Central under a contract, had the website shut down last Wednesday after being alerted by the Miami Herald.
[34:17.430 --> 34:20.370]  There's no evidence any child was harmed as a result of the problem.
[34:21.050 --> 34:26.090]  Kids Central began phasing in the computer system called COBRAs around April or May.
[34:26.090 --> 34:34.590]  It was designed to let private caseworkers access to the state's child welfare computer system called HomeSafeNet using the Internet.
[34:35.290 --> 34:35.970]  Oh, boy.
[34:37.570 --> 34:44.010]  The confidential information was available because computer help desk officials allowed all support requests to be viewed online without passwords.
[34:44.010 --> 34:47.750]  Many of the requests came from caseworkers who had trouble gaining access to HomeSafeNet.
[34:48.110 --> 34:53.230]  Some of the replies included usernames and passwords to access to confidential files.
[34:53.990 --> 35:00.030]  Who in the world is responsible for monitoring this kind of stuff, said Chelly Shembera, a retired child welfare administrator.
[35:00.150 --> 35:04.910]  This is a gross violation of confidentiality and it compromises the integrity of the entire system.
[35:05.710 --> 35:06.430]  And you know what?
[35:06.430 --> 35:07.230]  It's not that unusual.
[35:07.830 --> 35:09.310]  This kind of thing happens all the time.
[35:10.450 --> 35:15.230]  Nothing happens to the people responsible for these lapses and judgments.
[35:15.230 --> 35:30.290]  Yeah, I'm constantly surprised by how people are just sort of, you know, given safe passage into the Incompetence Hall of Fame where the people who discover this oftentimes are blamed as if they're the ones who made the problem in the first place.
[35:32.190 --> 35:33.290]  What else do we have here?
[35:33.290 --> 35:37.530]  We've got a lot of letters and we're going to take phone calls, 212-209-2900.
[35:38.030 --> 35:38.850]  Interesting website.
[35:38.850 --> 35:44.910]  People interested in RFID tagging that was sent to us, www.spychips.com.
[35:45.430 --> 35:49.530]  And then check out this section called frontline-letter.html.
[35:50.150 --> 36:03.930]  Apparently, there is an instance of somebody taking pictures of RFID tags that were on consumer items, which apparently goes against what certain companies have been saying they intended to do.
[36:04.310 --> 36:05.430]  The trade show, right?
[36:05.590 --> 36:06.550]  This is a trade show.
[36:06.550 --> 36:11.770]  Apparently, this guy got in there because they believed that he was a representative of some company.
[36:12.350 --> 36:16.590]  And he wound up taking pictures of some of the items that they had there.
[36:16.750 --> 36:20.410]  And now they're sending him letters saying, take your pictures off the web.
[36:20.950 --> 36:23.010]  And he's, of course, printing their letters instead.
[36:23.770 --> 36:25.910]  So it's interesting to see this.
[36:26.090 --> 36:27.450]  It doesn't translate well over the radio.
[36:27.630 --> 36:30.730]  But I'm not quite sure where they're going.
[36:30.730 --> 36:51.230]  The pictures were interesting from the standpoint that they were of RFID tags that were concealed in individual articles of clothing and individual products, which is not what the industry trade group promoting RFID has been saying RFID tags would be used for.
[36:51.310 --> 36:54.970]  They've all been along saying, no, no, no, they're not going to be used for individual products or clothing.
[36:54.970 --> 36:59.890]  They're going to only be used on, like, crates and pallets and cases.
[37:00.270 --> 37:00.890]  For inventory.
[37:01.110 --> 37:02.530]  For inventory control only.
[37:02.890 --> 37:15.090]  Where now you're seeing prototypes of RFID tags sewn into the label inside the shirt collar of a Calvin Klein shirt that you couldn't even see if you were looking at the shirt.
[37:15.090 --> 37:20.230]  You'd have to actually take the tag apart to see the RFID tag embedded inside it.
[37:20.350 --> 37:29.350]  So you could be tracked, you know, by a short-range sensor, no matter where you walk, if someone set one of these things up, and not be the wiser.
[37:29.510 --> 37:36.350]  So it's kind of scary, and it shows that the industry trade group promoting RFID is not being straightforward about their intentions.
[37:36.550 --> 37:38.450]  So, Bernie, what could their intentions be?
[37:38.570 --> 37:41.610]  What would this technology allow them to be able to do?
[37:42.810 --> 37:50.890]  Well, I don't think that industry trade group is so much interested in tracking individuals, but they are interested in cutting their costs when it comes to the checkout counter.
[37:51.050 --> 38:03.250]  They can just pass these individual products at the counter, and it can be just like scanning a barcode, only, you know, they can just pass it through a portal, and it doesn't have to be optically scanned.
[38:03.250 --> 38:05.570]  It can be in a wrapper or whatever.
[38:06.110 --> 38:12.310]  But the danger, I think, is that there seems to be no controls over the data.
[38:13.390 --> 38:27.470]  Once you purchase something, say, with a credit card or a debit card, at the checkout counter, the unique RFID code assigned to the tag in that shirt or jacket or pants or whatever they are could be linked to your ID.
[38:27.870 --> 38:31.830]  So then that information, that database, could be shared with anyone.
[38:32.030 --> 38:33.550]  Uh-oh, I think they're coming to get me here.
[38:33.550 --> 38:34.990]  You finish the sentence fast, then.
[38:36.830 --> 38:45.170]  And, you know, whoever has that database, and if they also set up, you know, short-range RFID scanners in different places, could tell.
[38:45.330 --> 39:01.250]  Like, when you walk by this thing, you know, in a shopping mall or in a library or any public place or private place, for that matter, you could put one in a car and anybody walking by the sidewalk, their ID tag could be detected without their knowledge and cross-reference to the database,
[39:01.270 --> 39:02.750]  and they know who walked where and when.
[39:03.550 --> 39:07.550]  So, I mean, they may sound a little paranoid, but we don't know how this data is going to be used.
[39:07.630 --> 39:11.510]  Well, I think we're allowed to be paranoid when we catch them lying about it.
[39:11.650 --> 39:11.930]  Yes.
[39:12.270 --> 39:12.590]  All right.
[39:12.750 --> 39:15.650]  I mean, one... I was just trying to think from the industry point of view.
[39:15.650 --> 39:28.890]  One potential use could be... Right now, a lot of, like, control of items as far as shoplifting and all that is done with the magnetic tags, but if you could hide the RFID thing somewhere and, you know, just keep track of what's been bought and what hasn't been bought,
[39:28.970 --> 39:36.650]  then when someone walks out with something that hasn't been paid for, it could, you know, set off alarms versus them just removing the magnetic thing if they have the right tool.
[39:37.650 --> 39:38.050]  Interesting.
[39:38.070 --> 39:39.990]  We'll be following that in the weeks ahead.
[39:40.250 --> 39:45.590]  Bernie, you had some information on the Drug Enforcement Agency that they don't want us to give out, but we're going to give out anyway, right?
[39:45.730 --> 39:54.270]  Well, we had a listener just to email us today about... apparently there's a DEA museum now.
[39:55.170 --> 39:55.790]  Let's see.
[39:55.870 --> 39:56.450]  What did he say?
[39:56.610 --> 40:05.870]  This was... Alex Santos wrote in and said there's a DEA museum in one Times Square building until the end of January next year.
[40:06.110 --> 40:11.950]  So you've got, what, three, four, four months to go to the DEA museum at one Times Square building.
[40:11.950 --> 40:14.450]  I haven't been there, but it sounds interesting.
[40:14.550 --> 40:29.790]  And it reminded me, a few years ago, when I was in Manhattan visiting a friend in Chelsea, they pointed out a large, huge, nondescript building that's at 99 10th Avenue at 17th Street on the West Side Highway.
[40:31.070 --> 40:35.630]  And I was really curious, because this thing just smelled of government...
[40:35.630 --> 40:37.350]  Wait a minute, that's pretty close to Pier 57.
[40:37.770 --> 40:38.430]  Yes, it is.
[40:38.590 --> 40:39.290]  Very close.
[40:39.670 --> 40:41.290]  You could probably see it from the roof.
[40:41.290 --> 40:41.770]  Oh, boy.
[40:42.210 --> 40:42.490]  Okay.
[40:42.830 --> 40:47.170]  But this window, this huge building had blacked out windows and armed guards standing outside of it.
[40:47.230 --> 40:50.610]  And it was like, it just reeked of government, like, hiding something.
[40:51.230 --> 40:53.610]  So I asked one of the guards, what is this building?
[40:53.770 --> 40:58.170]  And they said, those who... actually, it wasn't me who asked.
[40:58.250 --> 41:00.470]  My friend asked them, what's in this building?
[41:00.590 --> 41:03.130]  And they said, those who need to know, know.
[41:03.130 --> 41:03.130]  Oh.
[41:04.430 --> 41:04.790]  Wow.
[41:05.390 --> 41:08.630]  So that was too... when I heard that, it was too tempting to let that go.
[41:08.810 --> 41:15.810]  So I walked around the building, and some of the windows, which were tinted, and you couldn't really see through them, they had that reflective stuff on them, or just that dark stuff.
[41:16.710 --> 41:32.030]  Around the other side of the building, I stuck my eyes right up against the glass, and near one of the entrances, there were silhouettes of three big photos hanging on the wall of the attorney general, the president, and the vice president, which I've noticed from my tour of federal buildings,
[41:32.030 --> 41:35.210]  that they're always present in large government agencies.
[41:35.250 --> 41:42.130]  You always see a picture of the president, the vice president, and whoever is in charge of that branch of government, in this case, the Justice Department.
[41:42.470 --> 41:53.410]  And then I saw a tiny little piece of paper inside one of the windows that was kind of hard to read, but it was a building permit that they had to legally stick in the window, but they did their best to obscure it, and it was a drug enforcement administration.
[41:53.770 --> 41:59.590]  So if you want to check that place out, again, it's at 99 10th Avenue at 17th Street on the West Side Highway.
[42:00.490 --> 42:01.110]  Check it out.
[42:01.290 --> 42:04.590]  All right, and check out the Pier 57, which is nearby.
[42:04.710 --> 42:08.570]  I've got to find out how close that is, if it's connected in any way.
[42:09.270 --> 42:11.110]  Okay, fascinating bit of information there.
[42:11.730 --> 42:13.650]  Let's read a couple of letters, and we'll take some phone calls.
[42:14.510 --> 42:15.490]  In relation to the U.S.
[42:15.530 --> 42:20.230]  visitor program, what is to happen if the visitor is an amputee and has no hands or artificial limbs?
[42:20.250 --> 42:21.610]  Are they to be turned away?
[42:22.130 --> 42:23.150]  That's a valid question.
[42:23.150 --> 42:23.570]  I don't know.
[42:23.650 --> 42:24.890]  What do they do in situations like that?
[42:24.970 --> 42:26.710]  They can't take your fingerprint if you don't have any fingers?
[42:28.930 --> 42:29.730]  I... Aha!
[42:29.930 --> 42:30.490]  Nobody knows.
[42:32.170 --> 42:32.970]  He called them.
[42:33.170 --> 42:33.430]  Yeah.
[42:34.630 --> 42:37.370]  I was wondering if you knew whether or not the U.S.
[42:37.850 --> 42:42.250]  visits program applies to people stopping in to catch a connecting flight.
[42:42.630 --> 42:45.970]  I currently live in New Zealand, however, I might be moving to Canada.
[42:47.230 --> 42:49.090]  That's interesting, too.
[42:49.110 --> 42:51.790]  I guess the only way to find that is if somebody does it and tells us.
[42:51.910 --> 42:54.650]  Well, now, isn't it as you're exiting through customs that this happens?
[42:54.990 --> 43:00.990]  Because if you're just staying within the... You have to go through customs sometimes, even if you're just transferring.
[43:00.990 --> 43:03.010]  In Miami, this has been a big issue.
[43:03.570 --> 43:08.290]  And a lot of airlines are actually moving their hubs into Mexico because of the problem.
[43:09.190 --> 43:09.670]  Really?
[43:09.850 --> 43:13.290]  Their passengers have missed connections and stuff like that because they get delayed.
[43:13.510 --> 43:18.890]  So they're moving a lot of their hubs out of Miami because of that.
[43:20.050 --> 43:20.610]  All right.
[43:20.650 --> 43:21.810]  Here's a correction.
[43:21.910 --> 43:28.090]  The URL that was given out for the Brazilian report on the voting system last week.
[43:28.210 --> 43:29.670]  HTTP colon slash slash.
[43:29.970 --> 43:37.610]  I'm sorry if I read it too fast, but, you know, it's... We can't spend many minutes, you know, reading over URLs.
[43:37.850 --> 43:41.110]  That's why we store the shows online so you can play it to your heart's content.
[43:41.110 --> 44:05.950]  Anyway, www.tse.gov.br slash e-l-e-i-c-o-e-s slash s-e-c-u-r-a-n-c-a slash r-e-l-a-t-o-r-i-o underscore u-n-i-c-a-m-p slash r-e-l underscore f-i-n-a-l dot pdf.
[44:07.530 --> 44:09.090]  You're going to make a tiny URL?
[44:09.250 --> 44:10.950]  It'll be a tiny URL for next week.
[44:11.110 --> 44:11.170]  All right.
[44:11.230 --> 44:13.770]  Weren't you supposed to make a tiny URL for this week or something else?
[44:14.690 --> 44:16.010]  Yeah, and it wasn't...
[44:16.010 --> 44:16.510]  It was this.
[44:16.650 --> 44:17.490]  Oh, the same URL?
[44:17.670 --> 44:17.830]  Okay.
[44:17.910 --> 44:18.310]  All right.
[44:18.390 --> 44:20.930]  So next week, we'll announce the tiny URL of that.
[44:21.690 --> 44:27.650]  This person writes in wondering if the audio or video files from Hope 5 are available anywhere.
[44:27.790 --> 44:30.750]  First of all, it's the fifth Hope, not Hope 5, not H2K4.
[44:31.790 --> 44:34.270]  Best thing to do is call it by the right name, and then we'll answer the question.
[44:34.690 --> 44:35.230]  No, okay.
[44:35.290 --> 44:37.170]  We'll answer the question anyway, but just this once.
[44:38.070 --> 44:43.350]  We're working on it right now, in fact, and hopefully audio will be available very, very soon.
[44:43.450 --> 44:44.630]  Video shortly after that.
[44:45.410 --> 44:46.170]  Just a lot.
[44:46.290 --> 44:53.210]  You know, we had so much material and so much else to do and so many other things that get in the way, but we are trying.
[44:53.410 --> 44:53.930]  We really are.
[44:55.770 --> 44:59.230]  Emmanuel, thank you for reading my previous email and Christianity is stupid, et cetera, on the air.
[44:59.310 --> 45:00.470]  You have renewed my faith in you.
[45:00.630 --> 45:02.030]  Oh, no, I have faith in Emmanuel.
[45:02.330 --> 45:03.330]  I can hear the chant now.
[45:04.370 --> 45:05.310]  Emmanuelism is stupid.
[45:06.390 --> 45:07.130]  Go ahead.
[45:07.270 --> 45:07.690]  Go ahead.
[45:08.310 --> 45:09.350]  Have a ball.
[45:12.230 --> 45:13.770]  Let's see what else we have here.
[45:14.390 --> 45:15.050]  Oh, yes.
[45:15.190 --> 45:18.330]  We got a bunch of mail about those yellow ribbons we were talking about.
[45:19.010 --> 45:22.210]  And a lot of people wrote in to tell us that they aren't ribbons or stickers.
[45:22.210 --> 45:25.430]  They're actually thin, flexible magnet signs.
[45:26.030 --> 45:30.670]  And apparently they're being sold in grocery stores and all kinds of places for cheap.
[45:30.690 --> 45:32.650]  And that's why they're winding up on cars everywhere.
[45:32.830 --> 45:40.390]  So if you're wondering why the car in front of you has a yellow ribbon or a red, white and blue ribbon on it, it's because they just picked that up at a supermarket someplace.
[45:40.670 --> 45:43.570]  I imagine that that means anybody can just take them too.
[45:43.770 --> 45:46.310]  If it's just a magnet, you just can peel it off the car pretty easily.
[45:46.770 --> 45:50.610]  But the thing that's more important here is that apparently these things are very popular.
[45:50.910 --> 45:54.910]  So all kinds of political views could be represented in these ways.
[45:55.330 --> 45:56.590]  Something to take note of.
[45:57.010 --> 46:02.430]  One of the URLs selling this is www.magnetamerica.com.
[46:03.230 --> 46:11.670]  And I don't know if they sell other things as well, but that's something to... When I looked online, I found things that were also just like the decals.
[46:11.930 --> 46:15.530]  Not sticky, but you know, they kind of like statically cling to the window.
[46:15.750 --> 46:17.470]  So you can put that on the inside.
[46:17.750 --> 46:18.030]  Yeah.
[46:18.250 --> 46:19.350]  There's all kinds of possibilities.
[46:19.510 --> 46:20.810]  So people need to use their imagination.
[46:21.350 --> 46:24.710]  Now, before we take phone calls, Mike, you had a problem with your phone, I believe.
[46:24.950 --> 46:25.910]  With my phone bill.
[46:26.110 --> 46:27.350]  The phone is just fine.
[46:27.430 --> 46:27.630]  Okay.
[46:27.870 --> 46:35.650]  But I have the Verizon local and Verizon long distance.
[46:35.930 --> 46:47.050]  And I noticed that this month, my Verizon long distance bill was $1.60 or $0.70, which is unusual because I usually don't make any long distance calls.
[46:47.330 --> 46:49.810]  And so normally my bill is zero.
[46:50.590 --> 47:01.790]  But they have decided without informing me, except in some, possibly in some small print that I never read, to start charging $1.50 a month for the e-values plan, which I had.
[47:04.070 --> 47:07.510]  And this is kind of a ripoff to not make any calls.
[47:07.610 --> 47:08.490]  What is e-values?
[47:08.810 --> 47:13.010]  I don't... It means I pay $0.10 a minute, which is not a great deal, but it's okay.
[47:13.010 --> 47:13.670]  Not really, no.
[47:13.870 --> 47:16.130]  $0.10 a minute long distance, that's not a great deal at all.
[47:16.150 --> 47:17.150]  It's $0.05 at night, $0.10 a day.
[47:17.170 --> 47:18.790]  I pay less to call England.
[47:19.010 --> 47:19.370]  Right.
[47:19.610 --> 47:20.610]  It's not a great deal.
[47:20.610 --> 47:20.830]  Okay.
[47:20.870 --> 47:23.630]  But it's an okay deal if I use it only once every month.
[47:23.630 --> 47:25.050]  So now they want to charge you a monthly fee.
[47:25.250 --> 47:25.430]  Right.
[47:25.430 --> 47:27.450]  So I called up to say, what is this fee?
[47:27.590 --> 47:28.850]  I don't want to pay it anymore.
[47:30.310 --> 47:33.690]  And was told that... They claim to have sent me a note.
[47:34.510 --> 47:35.930]  I guess I just didn't read it.
[47:36.250 --> 47:39.090]  That there's now a monthly fee for the e-values plan.
[47:40.110 --> 47:43.090]  And so I said, you know, all right, enough of this.
[47:43.230 --> 47:44.010]  I never use it anyway.
[47:44.170 --> 47:45.870]  I want to cancel my long distance service.
[47:46.310 --> 47:48.050]  And there's a $5 fee for that.
[47:48.850 --> 47:49.750]  Yeah, that's right.
[47:49.930 --> 47:59.970]  So the only thing I could do was switch to the standard plan, which if I were to ever actually make a long distance call, it costs $0.30 a minute, which is a ripoff.
[47:59.970 --> 48:01.710]  It's those retro rates from the 80s.
[48:01.950 --> 48:02.390]  Seriously.
[48:03.090 --> 48:07.430]  Well, now you know how phone companies make money, you know, by ripping people off in various ways.
[48:07.570 --> 48:09.690]  Charging you not to have your phone listed.
[48:09.950 --> 48:11.810]  In the old days, charging you for touch tones.
[48:12.030 --> 48:14.010]  Charging you to have no long distance company.
[48:14.830 --> 48:20.130]  You know, I think there's even a monthly charge to keep having no phone company as your long distance company.
[48:20.290 --> 48:23.650]  Last I checked, they still charge you for touch tones.
[48:23.870 --> 48:24.590]  Bell South does.
[48:24.810 --> 48:25.310]  Do they really?
[48:25.310 --> 48:26.030]  Yes, they do.
[48:26.370 --> 48:27.930]  That is $4 a month.
[48:28.130 --> 48:28.990]  That's amazing.
[48:29.270 --> 48:30.250]  Now, where does that money go?
[48:30.570 --> 48:31.370]  Where does that money go?
[48:31.450 --> 48:32.250]  You ever ask yourself that?
[48:32.730 --> 48:33.250]  It's a Bell South.
[48:33.450 --> 48:38.750]  You should call them up and tell them you want to cancel your touch tone service, and they'll do it.
[48:38.830 --> 48:40.750]  And I bet you anything, your touch tones will still work.
[48:41.050 --> 48:41.250]  No.
[48:41.330 --> 48:41.850]  He's probably right.
[48:41.910 --> 48:46.950]  No, my grandmother does not pay it, and you have to do the rotary dial thing.
[48:46.970 --> 48:52.090]  The old days, what you said was correct on a crossbar system, because they didn't have the technology to differentiate.
[48:52.090 --> 48:57.250]  But now, with the digital systems and electronic systems, they can say, this person hasn't paid, cut them off.
[48:57.490 --> 48:58.730]  They could do the same thing.
[48:58.890 --> 49:04.630]  They could say, this person didn't pay for his four key this month, so he can't use fours.
[49:04.870 --> 49:05.730]  They can do that.
[49:05.870 --> 49:09.250]  With computers, you can do all kinds of things like that, so you better believe they will cut you off.
[49:09.350 --> 49:13.470]  My father had this experience, and it still works to this day, as far as I know.
[49:13.470 --> 49:17.070]  Well, I imagine that day is about to come to an end, now that you've announced it over the radio.
[49:17.690 --> 49:18.110]  All right.
[49:18.570 --> 49:29.310]  Mike does have an alternative to his long-distance service plate, and that is, Mike, if you elect to have the... I don't use Verizon, but you said there's a standard plan where the long distance is like 30-some cents a minute.
[49:29.550 --> 49:32.670]  Why don't you just go buy one of those prepaid calling cards?
[49:32.990 --> 49:34.930]  I could do that, or use my cell phone.
[49:35.790 --> 49:36.330]  Oh, yeah.
[49:36.570 --> 49:37.010]  You can do that.
[49:37.030 --> 49:37.830]  I have many options.
[49:37.830 --> 49:39.770]  I don't think long-distance is the problem.
[49:39.910 --> 49:42.710]  I think not paying for something you're not using is the problem.
[49:43.130 --> 49:43.590]  Right.
[49:43.750 --> 49:43.830]  That's true.
[49:43.970 --> 49:47.070]  That's the issue here, and it's getting increasingly difficult for people to actually manage this.
[49:47.070 --> 49:51.810]  I did learn one thing, though, and it may be useful information for people in similar situations.
[49:52.350 --> 49:55.210]  Canceling your telephone service altogether is still free.
[49:55.510 --> 50:00.150]  Yeah, that's something that they always do permit, and they don't charge you for it.
[50:01.590 --> 50:05.430]  By the way, also, these services no longer are offered by Verizon.
[50:05.950 --> 50:08.650]  Verizon, call waiting ID number only.
[50:09.690 --> 50:13.310]  That's if you have caller ID coming in, and you don't want the name.
[50:13.410 --> 50:15.090]  You just want the number on call waiting.
[50:15.230 --> 50:16.110]  They don't offer this anymore.
[50:16.250 --> 50:19.890]  They don't offer call waiting ID deluxe number only, whatever that is.
[50:22.030 --> 50:24.530]  Custom... It says here they don't offer custom calling packages.
[50:24.690 --> 50:26.530]  I imagine they would have to still offer those.
[50:26.730 --> 50:29.630]  They don't offer gold and silver variety packages, whatever those were.
[50:30.110 --> 50:36.650]  So I guess a lot of things have come to an end All right, 212-209-2900 is our phone number.
[50:36.790 --> 50:40.030]  Let's take some phone calls, see if anybody knows what the 516 scandal is.
[50:40.070 --> 50:43.810]  I wouldn't call it a scandal, just kind of a not very well-known fact.
[50:44.050 --> 50:45.830]  But we'll see if people have that.
[50:45.850 --> 50:47.530]  If not, we'll just announce it at the end of the hour.
[50:48.310 --> 50:49.570]  And good evening, you're on the air.
[50:50.190 --> 50:50.550]  Hello.
[50:50.850 --> 50:51.270]  How are you doing?
[50:51.730 --> 50:53.790]  I think you got arrested on purpose.
[50:54.210 --> 50:57.250]  All right, we're not going to entertain such notions.
[50:57.370 --> 50:58.070]  Good evening, you're on the air.
[50:58.350 --> 50:59.870]  Yes, sir, let me lower my radio.
[51:01.650 --> 51:02.010]  Hello?
[51:02.010 --> 51:02.670]  Yes, go ahead.
[51:03.030 --> 51:08.550]  Yes, I'm not sure what the 516 is, but from what I know...
[51:09.130 --> 51:10.250]  Yes, sorry, go ahead.
[51:10.470 --> 51:19.150]  Yes, from what I know, New York City was built on very fundamental spiritual laws.
[51:19.610 --> 51:21.250]  And perhaps the whole country was.
[51:21.690 --> 51:27.370]  And you can also listen, I mean, looking at the $1 bill with the pyramid and all that stuff.
[51:27.370 --> 51:28.950]  Oh, no, you're not going to get into that, are you?
[51:28.990 --> 51:29.550]  No, no, no.
[51:30.530 --> 51:31.150]  Oh, boy.
[51:31.610 --> 51:33.430]  This is our phone system's fault, I'm sorry.
[51:33.470 --> 51:45.770]  Right, but one thing I know, the number 5 is a very serious number as far as, you know, what it does spiritually, which has also some effect on the physical world.
[51:45.770 --> 51:52.790]  And now, you were mentioning the 212, which is the 5, I guess, 5 beeps.
[51:53.550 --> 51:58.030]  So, that has a very serious significance, which I'm not sure exactly what it is.
[51:59.210 --> 51:59.610]  Okay.
[52:01.610 --> 52:03.510]  I'm glad you were able to clear that up for us then.
[52:03.610 --> 52:03.790]  Yeah.
[52:03.950 --> 52:12.610]  But it could be that the 516, I don't know, maybe the number 5 has some kind of...
[52:12.610 --> 52:13.450]  No, no.
[52:13.850 --> 52:14.990]  Way off base there.
[52:15.090 --> 52:17.490]  It's got nothing to do with the number of digits or anything like that.
[52:17.490 --> 52:19.290]  But, you know, A for effort there.
[52:19.570 --> 52:19.710]  Thanks.
[52:20.010 --> 52:21.050]  Thanks for your...
[52:21.050 --> 52:26.890]  For those people listening, the author Robert Anton Wilson has all the answers in the Illuminatus trilogy.
[52:27.710 --> 52:28.050]  All right.
[52:28.990 --> 52:29.910]  Let's take another phone call.
[52:30.370 --> 52:30.950]  Good evening.
[52:31.050 --> 52:31.410]  You're on the air.
[52:31.510 --> 52:33.110]  Thank you for reading my letter about voting.
[52:47.490 --> 52:47.910]  What's on that address?
[52:48.290 --> 52:48.350]  All right.
[52:48.410 --> 52:48.670]  Okay.
[52:48.670 --> 52:49.050]  Go ahead.
[52:49.370 --> 52:50.210]  What's on your mind, Rebel?
[52:50.550 --> 52:53.070]  So is all the other letters that you've been reading.
[52:53.550 --> 52:54.890]  All the letters are from you, you're saying?
[52:55.030 --> 52:55.530]  Yeah, exactly.
[52:56.090 --> 52:56.750]  You don't take...
[52:56.750 --> 52:57.350]  You didn't take my...
[52:57.350 --> 52:59.590]  When you used to not take my phone calls, I used to...
[52:59.590 --> 53:00.190]  Anyway...
[53:00.190 --> 53:01.390]  So, you've written...
[53:01.390 --> 53:04.790]  Every piece of mail we're getting is from you now, is what you're implying here.
[53:04.850 --> 53:05.750]  Including the one about fortune?
[53:05.990 --> 53:06.930]  Because I spoofed the address.
[53:06.930 --> 53:07.190]  All right.
[53:07.370 --> 53:07.730]  You know what?
[53:07.930 --> 53:09.310]  Let's speed this up a little bit.
[53:09.430 --> 53:10.110]  What's happening?
[53:10.870 --> 53:11.950]  Now, what did I want to mention?
[53:12.030 --> 53:13.330]  I wanted to mention something about phones.
[53:13.830 --> 53:14.150]  Yes.
[53:14.310 --> 53:14.730]  What a surprise.
[53:14.730 --> 53:18.230]  New Jersey and Pennsylvania, they still charge $1 a month for touchstone.
[53:18.430 --> 53:20.810]  And the way they'll get around that is by...
[53:20.810 --> 53:27.450]  The way they'll get around that fee is by saying, if you want basic service, it includes your dial tone, your touchstone, your this and that.
[53:27.910 --> 53:30.210]  So, in other words, they'll say, oh, it's $11 a month.
[53:30.310 --> 53:35.230]  But if you say, oh, I don't want touchstone, they'll say, okay, it's $10 a month.
[53:35.450 --> 53:37.710]  In other words, they'll say, it's $11 a month.
[53:37.810 --> 53:39.590]  That includes your touchstone and this and that.
[53:39.890 --> 53:40.350]  You know what I mean?
[53:40.390 --> 53:42.090]  They'll sort of disguise the fact that...
[53:42.090 --> 53:44.710]  This echo problem has been going on at this radio.
[53:50.250 --> 53:53.130]  All right, well, they'll disguise the fact that they're fixed.
[53:53.930 --> 53:54.870]  It's like a feedback.
[53:57.350 --> 53:59.550]  And then that happens sometimes, you know?
[53:59.850 --> 54:02.750]  I'm trying to press all the different buttons to see if it goes away.
[54:02.950 --> 54:03.410]  Keep talking, Rebel.
[54:03.930 --> 54:05.990]  No, it's still there.
[54:07.210 --> 54:08.530]  I finally found the purpose for Rebel.
[54:09.190 --> 54:09.570]  All right.
[54:10.530 --> 54:12.490]  Now, you see, if I press that button, it goes away entirely.
[54:13.430 --> 54:14.390]  You can still hear me.
[54:16.190 --> 54:19.690]  I've tried pressing every button, and I can't get rid of it no matter what.
[54:19.950 --> 54:21.490]  Wait, I'm going to press this one.
[54:22.070 --> 54:24.690]  It only happens, I think, when there's more than one person on the phone.
[54:24.750 --> 54:26.550]  Although I was noticing it with Bernie a little bit earlier.
[54:27.450 --> 54:32.090]  And I don't know if anybody out there understands how phones work in relation to radio stations.
[54:32.330 --> 54:35.710]  It might be a handy thing for us because, boy, this is a real pain.
[54:35.870 --> 54:36.950]  It sounds awful, too, doesn't it?
[54:37.150 --> 54:39.350]  It just sort of takes away from a radio show when you hear noises like that.
[54:40.170 --> 54:41.190]  And the feedback, too.
[54:41.190 --> 54:41.790]  Yeah.
[54:42.030 --> 54:42.110]  Yeah.
[54:42.830 --> 54:43.250]  All right.
[54:44.210 --> 54:44.810]  Good evening.
[54:44.950 --> 54:45.370]  You're on the air.
[54:46.630 --> 54:47.030]  Go ahead.
[54:47.290 --> 54:47.570]  Yes.
[54:48.070 --> 54:48.310]  Hey.
[54:48.510 --> 54:48.710]  Hi.
[54:50.410 --> 54:51.130]  I'm calling...
[54:52.530 --> 54:53.510]  Oh, get out of the street.
[54:53.650 --> 54:53.970]  No, no.
[54:54.130 --> 54:54.910]  Stand on the sidewalk.
[54:55.030 --> 54:55.850]  Wait, don't stand on the sidewalk.
[54:55.890 --> 54:56.510]  That's dangerous, too.
[54:57.930 --> 54:59.150]  Just go into your house.
[54:59.230 --> 55:00.130]  Make a phone call from there.
[55:00.510 --> 55:02.670]  I almost ran someone over.
[55:02.950 --> 55:04.010]  They were talking to you guys.
[55:04.230 --> 55:04.710]  Uh-huh.
[55:06.570 --> 55:07.370]  You know how to fix this?
[55:07.990 --> 55:10.610]  You said I'm glad you came back with the riffle.
[55:10.770 --> 55:13.090]  See, I can make this noise just by turning it a little too loud.
[55:13.530 --> 55:13.890]  Oh.
[55:14.490 --> 55:16.790]  But they're too low, which is why I have to turn it loud.
[55:16.930 --> 55:18.010]  Oh, I don't know.
[55:18.010 --> 55:19.230]  But you take one of them down.
[55:19.630 --> 55:20.870]  Oh, you only take one down?
[55:20.930 --> 55:21.130]  Yeah.
[55:21.130 --> 55:21.170]  Yeah.
[55:21.330 --> 55:21.550]  Okay.
[55:21.890 --> 55:22.650]  All right, guys.
[55:23.030 --> 55:23.390]  I'm sorry.
[55:23.750 --> 55:25.250]  See, now it happened with just one up.
[55:25.770 --> 55:26.470]  Oh, my God.
[55:27.170 --> 55:27.690]  All right.
[55:28.470 --> 55:29.190]  He's hammered.
[55:29.270 --> 55:31.090]  I don't remember me not.
[55:31.850 --> 55:33.470]  But I just want to say two quick comments.
[55:33.730 --> 55:37.870]  I'm glad you came back with the riffle, being friends again, even though I don't like that.
[55:38.070 --> 55:38.330]  Uh-huh.
[55:38.530 --> 55:42.210]  And number two, this show is about computer, not neurology.
[55:42.370 --> 55:44.070]  I mean, this guy, the one who called that before...
[55:44.070 --> 55:46.090]  Well, numbers are part of computers, though, you know?
[55:46.430 --> 55:46.610]  Wait.
[55:46.850 --> 55:47.390]  Ah, no, no, no.
[55:47.670 --> 55:48.750]  It's a few and one.
[55:49.250 --> 55:50.210]  Let's not forget that.
[55:50.210 --> 55:50.830]  Mm-hmm.
[55:51.430 --> 55:51.710]  Okay.
[55:52.090 --> 55:52.390]  Thanks.
[55:52.990 --> 55:54.690]  Thanks for your thoughts.
[55:55.170 --> 55:57.630]  Although I missed most of them because I'm trying to analyze this phone problem.
[55:58.250 --> 55:58.610]  Good evening.
[55:58.730 --> 55:59.010]  You're on the air.
[55:59.850 --> 56:00.130]  Okay.
[56:00.250 --> 56:02.330]  I'm sorry you didn't hear me because of the feedback.
[56:02.490 --> 56:03.690]  Oh, that's okay because we're not.
[56:03.950 --> 56:04.550]  Good evening.
[56:04.710 --> 56:05.490]  You're on the air.
[56:05.730 --> 56:05.970]  Okay.
[56:06.090 --> 56:06.630]  I was telling you...
[56:06.630 --> 56:07.910]  Well, you want every single phone line?
[56:08.310 --> 56:09.150]  This is ridiculous.
[56:09.390 --> 56:09.670]  Good evening.
[56:09.830 --> 56:10.230]  You're on the air.
[56:10.290 --> 56:10.970]  You better not be rebel.
[56:12.130 --> 56:12.490]  Hello?
[56:13.290 --> 56:13.650]  Hello?
[56:14.070 --> 56:14.370]  Yep.
[56:14.710 --> 56:15.210]  Yes, okay.
[56:15.210 --> 56:15.670]  You're not rebel.
[56:15.790 --> 56:16.810]  That's all it takes.
[56:16.810 --> 56:16.850]  Thanks.
[56:16.890 --> 56:17.230]  Good evening.
[56:17.410 --> 56:17.770]  You're on.
[56:19.150 --> 56:22.190]  This is IP Relay Operator 7328 with a relay call.
[56:25.010 --> 56:26.150]  You're relaying a call.
[56:26.470 --> 56:26.710]  Yes.
[56:26.890 --> 56:30.230]  You know, normally I would jump at the opportunity but we just don't have time right now.
[56:30.430 --> 56:30.730]  I'm sorry.
[56:30.730 --> 56:33.330]  Tell the person we regret not being able to take the call.
[56:34.630 --> 56:35.470]  Relay operators.
[56:35.630 --> 56:36.390]  That's all I need right now.
[56:37.050 --> 56:37.710]  Good evening.
[56:37.890 --> 56:38.550]  You're on the air.
[56:39.130 --> 56:39.610]  Oh, hi.
[56:39.770 --> 56:40.270]  How are you doing?
[56:40.350 --> 56:42.390]  This is concerning the DEA Museum.
[56:42.850 --> 56:43.270]  Okay.
[56:43.410 --> 56:53.070]  I was reading about that and it seemed that most of the problems that they discussed in that DEA Museum wouldn't be there if it wasn't for prohibition.
[56:53.070 --> 56:57.950]  And so people should keep that in mind when they go in there, the overdoses, the crime.
[56:57.950 --> 57:01.050]  I mean, all prohibition-induced stuff, not drug-induced.
[57:01.270 --> 57:06.110]  They just, you know, maybe there should be some sort of advertisement that points that out.
[57:07.050 --> 57:07.490]  Okay.
[57:07.830 --> 57:08.390]  All right, thanks.
[57:08.650 --> 57:08.910]  Thanks.
[57:09.890 --> 57:11.050]  And let's take another phone call.
[57:11.110 --> 57:11.370]  Good evening.
[57:11.490 --> 57:11.690]  You're on.
[57:12.570 --> 57:13.530]  Yeah, hi there, Emmanuel.
[57:13.730 --> 57:14.070]  How are you doing?
[57:15.610 --> 57:18.310]  The problem with your phone and the feedback...
[57:18.310 --> 57:18.530]  Yes.
[57:19.070 --> 57:26.070]  In John's office, they're listening to you on the radio also, besides listening and tapping into your telephone.
[57:26.370 --> 57:28.770]  Yes, but this is definitely coming from the board here.
[57:28.870 --> 57:29.990]  It's not coming from the phone.
[57:30.590 --> 57:34.850]  Well, you know how you get feedback from somebody who doesn't turn down their radio?
[57:35.510 --> 57:37.110]  Um, no.
[57:38.030 --> 57:38.330]  No?
[57:38.610 --> 57:40.590]  I mean, it's a feedback problem.
[57:40.590 --> 57:43.130]  Your phone is being tapped and John Ashcroft's off.
[57:43.610 --> 57:44.750]  Well, we know that.
[57:45.010 --> 57:47.710]  But listen, it sounds like you have an answer to the area cut question.
[57:49.130 --> 57:49.530]  No.
[57:49.730 --> 57:49.950]  Oh.
[57:50.570 --> 57:51.510]  I was hoping.
[57:54.850 --> 57:56.570]  Okay, anything else to add?
[57:57.570 --> 57:59.010]  No, just say hello to John.
[57:59.310 --> 58:00.250]  Okay, I will.
[58:00.370 --> 58:00.770]  Hi, John.
[58:01.050 --> 58:02.270]  All right, John Ashcroft there.
[58:02.510 --> 58:03.350]  Good evening, you're on the air.
[58:05.030 --> 58:06.030]  Okay, that's a nice sound.
[58:06.110 --> 58:06.830]  Good evening, you're on.
[58:07.610 --> 58:08.250]  Go ahead.
[58:09.050 --> 58:10.150]  These buttons aren't working either.
[58:10.330 --> 58:11.030]  Good evening, you're on the air.
[58:11.890 --> 58:12.290]  Hello.
[58:12.590 --> 58:12.770]  Yes.
[58:13.130 --> 58:24.770]  Okay, a few months back, I saw a notice in my phone bill that said that they were charging a $1.50 monthly fee for the values plan that I was on.
[58:24.990 --> 58:25.470]  Uh-huh.
[58:25.790 --> 58:26.230]  So...
[58:26.230 --> 58:27.930]  You saw a notice, in other words.
[58:28.030 --> 58:29.630]  It was printed as part of the phone bill.
[58:29.890 --> 58:41.250]  And so I canceled it and they gave me the one which was, you know, the regular plan for long distance, which would cost a lot if I actually used it.
[58:41.450 --> 58:41.810]  Uh-huh.
[58:41.810 --> 58:42.690]  Let me see.
[58:43.110 --> 58:43.430]  Okay.
[58:43.730 --> 58:44.710]  Well, thanks for that info.
[58:44.910 --> 58:47.970]  Bernie, I'm gonna have to try an experiment here which involves dropping you.
[58:48.470 --> 58:48.910]  Dropping you.
[58:49.390 --> 58:49.710]  Because...
[58:49.710 --> 58:51.450]  Well, actually, you're one person now.
[58:51.510 --> 58:52.810]  Let me see if I get the feedback with...
[58:53.430 --> 58:54.370]  No, you see, I don't get it.
[58:54.490 --> 58:56.170]  I hear no feedback now.
[58:56.170 --> 58:58.590]  Yeah, it's only when we conference that this happens.
[58:58.930 --> 58:58.950]  Mm-hmm.
[58:59.050 --> 59:01.130]  All right, so we've diagnosed that much of the problem.
[59:01.290 --> 59:02.390]  That's how I was taking him down.
[59:02.590 --> 59:02.830]  Yeah.
[59:03.050 --> 59:03.450]  And then...
[59:03.450 --> 59:04.970]  But it doesn't happen every week.
[59:05.070 --> 59:06.030]  It only happens some weeks.
[59:06.730 --> 59:09.630]  So that caller reads their phone bill more carefully than I do.
[59:09.670 --> 59:11.030]  Well, let me go and take some callers.
[59:11.030 --> 59:12.890]  Well, I think we all have to go because we're out of time.
[59:13.210 --> 59:16.370]  But I apologize to all the listeners for all the crazy noises that we heard.
[59:16.430 --> 59:19.310]  But, you know, it's part of how we learn, you know?
[59:19.450 --> 59:22.530]  We learn by experimenting and by finding the problem.
[59:22.530 --> 59:29.550]  And one day, one day, we will find the problem here and stop this nasty feedback from occurring over our airwaves.
[59:31.010 --> 59:33.290]  In the meantime, stay alert.
[59:33.650 --> 59:34.490]  Let us know if you...
[59:34.490 --> 59:35.110]  The secret to 516.
[59:35.610 --> 59:36.290]  Oh, yes.
[59:36.290 --> 59:36.610]  I'm sorry.
[59:36.670 --> 59:37.290]  The secret to 516.
[59:37.450 --> 59:37.990]  Thanks for reminding me.
[59:38.730 --> 59:46.010]  Turns out, and I did not know this as a native of 516, that 516 used to be part of the 914 area code.
[59:46.110 --> 59:47.390]  Did you know that, Red Hack?
[59:47.470 --> 59:48.270]  You're from 914.
[59:48.410 --> 59:50.610]  Did you know that you guys used to occupy us?
[59:50.730 --> 59:50.910]  Nope.
[59:50.910 --> 59:52.430]  Well, it's true, apparently.
[59:52.630 --> 59:58.610]  And it made it the first area code, the only area code that was separated by land, by another area code.
[59:58.750 --> 59:59.670]  It was separated by 212.
[59:59.950 --> 01:00:01.050]  So they were both 914?
[01:00:01.270 --> 01:00:01.550]  Yeah.
[01:00:01.750 --> 01:00:11.090]  And it wasn't until a couple of years after area codes were introduced that 516 was introduced and Long Island was rid of the 914 occupation.
[01:00:11.190 --> 01:00:12.290]  I had no idea.
[01:00:12.650 --> 01:00:14.890]  And apparently, this is something that we're not taught in schools.
[01:00:15.250 --> 01:00:20.150]  This is the kind of thing I think they'd rather forget on Long Island that we ever were part of that.
[01:00:21.350 --> 01:00:22.670]  But we're here to...
[01:00:22.670 --> 01:00:28.130]  Well, we have to expose the truth, and we have to let people know what's going on in the world, and that's what we're here for.
[01:00:29.810 --> 01:00:30.390]  All right.
[01:00:30.770 --> 01:00:31.970]  That's it for us this week.
[01:00:32.250 --> 01:00:33.770]  Stay tuned for the Personal Computer Show.
[01:00:33.950 --> 01:00:35.330]  We'll be back again next week.
[01:00:35.650 --> 01:00:36.370]  Have a good night.
[01:03:20.260 --> 01:03:21.380]  Ah, yes.
[01:03:21.840 --> 01:03:25.240]  That was a great song there by the Fun Boy 3.
[01:03:25.820 --> 01:03:28.200]  And you're listening to WBAI.
[01:03:28.400 --> 01:03:31.120]  Stay tuned for the Personal Computer Show coming up next.
[01:03:31.120 --> 01:03:31.700]  Bye.
[01:03:31.820 --> 01:03:32.220]  Bye.