[00:00.000 --> 00:05.580]  Technical production team at KPFA in Berkeley includes Eric Klein and Pauline Bartolom.
[00:05.720 --> 00:07.420]  She's sitting in for Antonio Ortiz.
[00:07.620 --> 00:14.320]  You can listen to this newscast in its entirety online at www.fsrn.org.
[00:14.700 --> 00:17.140]  That's fsrn.org.
[00:17.560 --> 00:21.140]  We also welcome your comments, questions, and story ideas.
[00:21.140 --> 00:24.360]  You can just email us at comments at fsrn.org.
[00:24.780 --> 00:27.820]  From KPFK in Los Angeles, this is Aura Bogado.
[00:34.420 --> 00:37.660]  And you're listening to Radio Station WBAI in New York.
[00:38.000 --> 00:40.100]  It's 7 o'clock on a Wednesday night.
[00:40.440 --> 00:41.740]  That can only mean one thing.
[00:41.980 --> 00:43.240]  It's time for Off the Hook.
[01:16.330 --> 01:17.370]  And good evening to everybody.
[01:17.470 --> 01:18.570]  The program is Off the Hook.
[01:18.790 --> 01:20.490]  Emmanuel Goldstein here with you for the next hour.
[01:20.890 --> 01:22.790]  A special fundraising edition of the program.
[01:23.910 --> 01:26.010]  And our, uh...
[01:26.010 --> 01:28.690]  I guess last show for the next two weeks at least.
[01:29.610 --> 01:30.370]  Maybe longer.
[01:30.570 --> 01:30.870]  I'm not sure.
[01:31.990 --> 01:34.430]  Joining me today in the studio is, uh, Jim.
[01:34.850 --> 01:35.210]  Hello.
[01:36.130 --> 01:37.090]  And, uh, Redbird.
[01:37.290 --> 01:37.750]  Good evening.
[01:38.630 --> 01:38.990]  Mike.
[01:39.370 --> 01:39.630]  Hi.
[01:39.910 --> 01:40.270]  Arseny.
[01:40.990 --> 01:41.230]  Hello.
[01:41.710 --> 01:43.770]  And, uh, trying to get all the microphones to work here.
[01:44.210 --> 01:46.490]  And over on the other corner is not Kevin.
[01:46.990 --> 01:47.350]  Hello.
[01:47.970 --> 01:48.570]  Uh, Bernie S.
[01:48.670 --> 01:49.450]  joins us from Philadelphia.
[01:50.070 --> 01:51.210]  Greetings from Philadelphia.
[01:51.510 --> 01:52.730]  Mike, is my microphone working?
[01:52.910 --> 01:53.930]  Uh, seems to be so far.
[01:54.490 --> 01:56.670]  Hold it close to your face, and I'm sure we'll be fine.
[01:56.930 --> 01:59.970]  And also joining us in the studio, uh, tonight is Phil from Make Magazine.
[02:00.230 --> 02:00.550]  Hello.
[02:01.370 --> 02:04.350]  Uh, well, you know, I don't know if you guys have been following the story all day long.
[02:04.350 --> 02:06.550]  This has been, this has been one incredible day of news.
[02:06.830 --> 02:10.990]  Uh, and it's just, it's fun sometimes to turn on a news channel and watch what's going on.
[02:11.270 --> 02:13.370]  Today was a day of utter panic.
[02:13.610 --> 02:17.630]  Utter panic in Boston as they kept finding these mysterious boxes.
[02:17.950 --> 02:21.230]  And I was asking myself while they were doing this, they're finding suspicious packages.
[02:21.890 --> 02:24.050]  How did they know where to look for the suspicious packages?
[02:24.150 --> 02:25.270]  They found one under a bridge.
[02:25.390 --> 02:26.970]  They found one by, uh, by a highway.
[02:27.190 --> 02:31.330]  Are there people walking around looking for little tiny packages that look suspicious?
[02:31.750 --> 02:40.490]  Well, as the day progressed, it became obvious these things weren't bombs, even though, uh, they treated them as if they were, uh, and, um, people were saying this is a hoax.
[02:40.610 --> 02:41.390]  It's not a very funny hoax.
[02:41.470 --> 02:45.090]  And when they find the people who did it, they're going to pay a heavy penalty.
[02:45.930 --> 02:55.030]  Ironically enough, the very network that I was watching this on, CNN, turns out to be indirectly responsible for the devices.
[02:55.810 --> 03:00.970]  Turns out they're a promotional item from Adult Swim for Aqua Teen Hunger Force.
[03:01.410 --> 03:04.270]  And our friends at Adult Swim have some explaining to do, apparently.
[03:04.450 --> 03:07.410]  But, uh, man, this, this thing just was unbelievable.
[03:07.950 --> 03:14.950]  Apparently, it's, um, it's a little, um, LED, um, readout, uh, display of one of the Mooninites.
[03:15.110 --> 03:15.850]  You know what the Mooninites are?
[03:16.030 --> 03:16.870]  Do I have to explain this?
[03:16.910 --> 03:18.650]  It's a, it's a character from Aqua Teen Hunger Force?
[03:18.890 --> 03:19.190]  Okay.
[03:19.370 --> 03:21.290]  And originally, it was reported as SpongeBob.
[03:21.390 --> 03:23.470]  Now, if you know the two characters, they look nothing alike.
[03:23.490 --> 03:24.830]  So, I don't know how that even got started.
[03:24.870 --> 03:26.830]  I think you have to explain this to me, because...
[03:26.830 --> 03:27.210]  Oh, really?
[03:27.350 --> 03:28.610]  Yeah, I don't know what a Mooninite is.
[03:28.610 --> 03:29.730]  You don't know what a Mooninite is?
[03:29.930 --> 03:30.210]  Okay.
[03:30.470 --> 03:30.970]  Do you know, Bernie?
[03:31.610 --> 03:35.870]  Well, I'm slightly familiar with the characters, but they look like one of the Space Invaders characters.
[03:35.870 --> 03:37.590]  Yeah, they look sort of, they're two-dimensional beings.
[03:37.750 --> 03:38.030]  Oh, yeah.
[03:38.030 --> 03:38.430]  Yes, they do.
[03:38.470 --> 03:42.030]  Hold that up to the microphone so the people, uh, on the other end of the radio can see.
[03:42.050 --> 03:42.650]  They're from the Moon.
[03:42.910 --> 03:47.330]  And, uh, well, uh, you have to watch Aqua Teen Hunger Force, and I guess a lot of people will from now on.
[03:47.850 --> 03:51.510]  Uh, but boy, you know, I think this demonstrates more than anything how stupid people are.
[03:51.690 --> 03:56.010]  They find something that was part of an advertising campaign that they don't know what it is.
[03:56.070 --> 03:57.990]  Right away, they have to assume, yeah, this has to be a bomb.
[03:58.070 --> 03:59.630]  Those little guys, they look like bombs.
[03:59.730 --> 04:00.330]  They look like bombs.
[04:00.330 --> 04:04.710]  I actually blame 24, because that has taught us that all bombs have LED displays.
[04:04.710 --> 04:05.250]  Exactly.
[04:05.510 --> 04:12.750]  You know, 24 has injected so much paranoia into our society that everybody sees something they don't understand, and right away, they have to call the authorities.
[04:12.870 --> 04:15.330]  Before Sutherland is Canadian, I mean, really.
[04:15.330 --> 04:16.050]  How did they know?
[04:16.150 --> 04:19.850]  How did they know where to look for all the other ones that just happened to be these devices?
[04:20.010 --> 04:24.290]  It's like people were calling saying, yeah, I saw that strange little creature over there as well.
[04:24.490 --> 04:26.070]  But were they actual LEDs?
[04:26.330 --> 04:28.110]  It's not every day you see a box with a bunch of LEDs.
[04:28.110 --> 04:29.010]  It wasn't a box with LEDs.
[04:29.010 --> 04:33.030]  It was a little blinking, happy, smiley guy that was just stuck against the wall.
[04:33.030 --> 04:37.190]  It used to be that you'd see a little happy, smiley guy with LEDs, and you'd smile too.
[04:37.330 --> 04:39.430]  And now, all of a sudden, we have to assume the worst.
[04:39.510 --> 04:41.550]  Now, Phil, I understand somehow you got blamed for this?
[04:41.690 --> 04:41.950]  Yeah.
[04:42.170 --> 04:44.330]  So, I was at my office unpacking...
[04:44.330 --> 04:44.450]  Yeah.
[04:44.790 --> 04:46.490]  Somehow, you know, that's the default...
[04:46.490 --> 04:46.950]  You're so low-key about it.
[04:47.010 --> 04:47.770]  Yeah, yeah, I got blamed.
[04:47.770 --> 04:49.290]  I'm the default blame.
[04:49.570 --> 04:53.030]  But I'm at my office, and all of a sudden, I get like 15 IMs and a couple phone calls.
[04:53.030 --> 04:53.650]  I'm like, what's going on?
[04:53.770 --> 04:55.950]  They're like, Phil, Meg was just mentioned on CNN.
[04:55.950 --> 04:56.750]  I'm like, oh, neat.
[04:56.910 --> 04:57.910]  They're like, no, it's not neat.
[04:59.390 --> 05:00.390]  Why were you mentioned?
[05:00.530 --> 05:01.370]  Why not 2,600?
[05:01.610 --> 05:02.590]  This is like something we do.
[05:02.710 --> 05:02.910]  Yeah, I know.
[05:03.050 --> 05:06.230]  Like, no, we can probably compete to get the most trouble on CNN.
[05:06.230 --> 05:07.070]  Not that we did this.
[05:07.190 --> 05:09.430]  We're having anything to do with it or are planning anything in the future.
[05:09.490 --> 05:11.290]  I kind of wish we were responsible, but we really weren't.
[05:11.890 --> 05:16.130]  So, what CNN said was that make shows you how to make these.
[05:17.890 --> 05:26.270]  Oh, I heard that somebody printed something saying how you could do this and that this was part of a grassroots advertising campaign.
[05:26.270 --> 05:26.590]  We didn't.
[05:26.750 --> 05:30.410]  So, what bothered me was, and again, I don't have the transcripts and I don't have the recording.
[05:30.510 --> 05:31.450]  This is all secondhand.
[05:31.550 --> 05:37.110]  But apparently, this is what was said, that make, was showing people how to make these and we had something to do with what was going on.
[05:37.330 --> 05:42.350]  Now, meanwhile, the truth was, Turner, who owns the Cartoon Network and Adult Swim, by the way...
[05:42.350 --> 05:43.390]  And CNN, who was reporting all this.
[05:43.390 --> 05:44.430]  And CNN, who was reporting it.
[05:44.650 --> 05:45.850]  They, it was all of them.
[05:46.510 --> 05:47.970]  Why they mentioned us, I'm not sure.
[05:48.450 --> 05:50.710]  We do write about things like LEDs.
[05:50.950 --> 05:52.410]  We do write about things like art.
[05:52.410 --> 06:00.150]  And we also teach people about responsibility and our readers and your 2600 readers and our collective audience, I think, is pretty responsible.
[06:00.450 --> 06:03.930]  Turns out, a big advertising campaign wasn't so responsible.
[06:04.030 --> 06:05.550]  And that being said, I think this was a cool project.
[06:05.650 --> 06:06.770]  I think it was really neat.
[06:06.810 --> 06:13.530]  I think to bring out the crazy robots that, quote, diffuse the LEDs, like there's photos of these big, scary robots.
[06:13.730 --> 06:16.650]  They put big, scary robots out to diffuse the Mooninites?
[06:16.730 --> 06:16.850]  Yeah.
[06:16.990 --> 06:17.610]  Oh, that's perfect.
[06:17.690 --> 06:18.110]  Police robots?
[06:18.110 --> 06:18.550]  That's part of the show.
[06:18.750 --> 06:19.230]  Police robots.
[06:19.390 --> 06:19.770]  Yeah, or whatever.
[06:19.890 --> 06:21.150]  The bomb killing robots.
[06:21.270 --> 06:22.270]  Now, this is a promo for a movie.
[06:22.270 --> 06:23.710]  I didn't even know a movie was coming out till today.
[06:23.830 --> 06:24.930]  So it really worked, I guess.
[06:25.270 --> 06:27.050]  And the thing that's funny is like, so this is Boston.
[06:27.230 --> 06:28.910]  It has some of the best technical schools in the world.
[06:29.370 --> 06:35.090]  Any student, anyone would probably say, oh, that's just a bunch of blinking LEDs.
[06:35.350 --> 06:36.070]  Right, of course.
[06:36.330 --> 06:37.970]  They were saying that this is tied to college students.
[06:38.070 --> 06:39.610]  I don't know how they knew that from the start.
[06:39.710 --> 06:41.350]  They were making all sorts of weird accusations.
[06:41.650 --> 06:42.870]  Other cities have had these and no one's concerned.
[06:42.890 --> 06:43.390]  That's the thing.
[06:43.490 --> 06:44.150]  They've been on display.
[06:44.290 --> 06:47.390]  In fact, if anybody knows where they are in New York City, I'd love to see them later on.
[06:47.430 --> 06:49.310]  There was one under the Brooklyn Bridge a couple weeks ago.
[06:49.470 --> 06:50.110]  No freak outs.
[06:50.930 --> 06:52.950]  It's just this thing was under the Brooklyn Bridge.
[06:52.970 --> 06:54.490]  Yeah, someone took a photo and they sent it to us.
[06:54.550 --> 06:55.630]  They're like, hey, cool, look, LEDs.
[06:55.970 --> 06:56.750]  On the Manhattan side?
[06:56.770 --> 06:57.970]  We can run over there after the show.
[06:58.210 --> 06:59.290]  Yeah, I don't know if it's still there.
[06:59.350 --> 06:59.970]  This was a week ago.
[07:00.050 --> 07:02.010]  Well, it won't be there after tonight, I can tell you that.
[07:02.150 --> 07:03.810]  How does it get under the Brooklyn Bridge?
[07:04.110 --> 07:05.710]  They probably threw it up with magnets or something.
[07:05.850 --> 07:06.310]  Oh, okay.
[07:06.390 --> 07:07.310]  Are these like throwies?
[07:07.750 --> 07:13.150]  Well, it's a piece of cardboard or a circuit board with LED sticking through it to make a design which looks like the Moon and Night.
[07:13.290 --> 07:13.810]  I have to think.
[07:13.810 --> 07:17.750]  Maybe the people with the LED throwies at Hope might have had a hand in this.
[07:17.750 --> 07:18.870]  GRL did issue a statement.
[07:19.270 --> 07:19.910]  I have it.
[07:19.970 --> 07:20.750]  Graffiti Research Labs.
[07:20.930 --> 07:21.250]  Yes.
[07:21.570 --> 07:21.870]  Oh, boy.
[07:22.070 --> 07:23.130]  I can load it up here.
[07:23.430 --> 07:24.050]  Redbird, you had something.
[07:24.190 --> 07:27.190]  Yeah, before this discussion, would anyone have considered this irresponsible?
[07:27.490 --> 07:29.670]  I mean, for instance, people do this all the time.
[07:29.790 --> 07:31.310]  I mean, advertising people do this all the time.
[07:31.410 --> 07:34.530]  Didn't Microsoft a couple of years ago put butterflies all over the city?
[07:34.530 --> 07:35.570]  Do you remember the sewer lizards?
[07:35.770 --> 07:35.910]  Right.
[07:36.090 --> 07:37.190]  So how is this different?
[07:37.230 --> 07:38.610]  It's just lights instead of stickers.
[07:38.650 --> 07:42.230]  It's different in that people no longer have a sense of humor, adventure, or curiosity.
[07:42.230 --> 07:43.830]  Everything is suspicion and danger.
[07:43.930 --> 07:44.370]  Bernie, yes.
[07:45.190 --> 07:49.690]  I saw a photo of one of these things apparently being broadcast.
[07:49.970 --> 07:55.130]  It looked like it was a snapshot of the TV news broadcast of one of these things.
[07:55.230 --> 08:02.010]  And it's actually pretty large, about the size of a small pizza box, you know, maybe 12 by 15 inches or so.
[08:02.010 --> 08:07.230]  And it had all the LEDs, you know, laid out, probably a couple hundred LEDs on it.
[08:07.370 --> 08:13.070]  It looked like jumbo LEDs laid out in the profile of one of these cartoon characters.
[08:13.410 --> 08:15.130]  So it was just a circuit board.
[08:16.150 --> 08:17.790]  And this wasn't like a tiny thing.
[08:17.950 --> 08:18.790]  You could just toss it with a magnet.
[08:18.890 --> 08:25.390]  This was a pretty big, well, not big as a car, but I mean big as a pizza box, hanging down in different places.
[08:26.070 --> 08:27.990]  So I don't remember whether you were...
[08:27.990 --> 08:30.630]  The URL that one of our listeners sent, I don't know if somebody could read it over the...
[08:30.630 --> 08:32.110]  Actually, I do have that.
[08:32.230 --> 08:32.690]  No, I don't have that.
[08:32.690 --> 08:37.550]  The thing is, it starts with one jackball who doesn't know what the cartoon character is.
[08:37.590 --> 08:42.990]  And he has to say, oh my God, it has to be something evil, calls all the SWAT teams and everybody else.
[08:43.090 --> 08:46.230]  And then they just launch an entire city into panic.
[08:46.350 --> 08:46.870]  That's what happened.
[08:47.070 --> 09:00.210]  Even if you didn't know what the cartoon character was, anyone that had just the most basic, smattering knowledge of electronics, which you'd think that someone trained to diffuse bobs would have to have as a prerequisite, they would look at this thing and say,
[09:00.310 --> 09:02.510]  oh, it's a circuit board with a bunch of LEDs on it.
[09:02.550 --> 09:03.870]  Because you can see the other side of it.
[09:04.030 --> 09:07.470]  There's nothing but, you know, there's just nothing there.
[09:08.610 --> 09:09.610]  So I don't know.
[09:09.650 --> 09:11.230]  I just think there's a gross overreaction.
[09:11.390 --> 09:21.110]  And I think the real terrorists out there who are probably watching this kind of stuff thinking, these people are just out of their minds, overreacting to everything.
[09:21.110 --> 09:27.830]  We don't have to lift our fingers and they panic and go into terror, terroristic frenzy over, over nothing that we're even doing.
[09:28.070 --> 09:35.330]  Now, what, what if, what if I wasn't familiar with the Christian religion and I saw a big neon cross on a mountain somewhere, what would I make of that?
[09:35.490 --> 09:36.890]  You know, this is suspicious.
[09:37.110 --> 09:38.370]  Send the robots to diffuse that right away.
[09:38.410 --> 09:40.530]  You have to destroy it because who knows what it could be.
[09:40.810 --> 09:45.390]  Thing is, if you're going to plant explosives under a bridge, why are you going to make it look like a moon a night?
[09:45.510 --> 09:52.730]  You could just make it look like a box that you can't see because isn't that the point of blowing things up that you get away with it and people don't know it's coming?
[09:52.870 --> 09:55.290]  It'd be much more productive to diffuse crosses than...
[09:55.290 --> 09:57.610]  We should, we should start a campaign to do that.
[09:58.070 --> 10:00.730]  All right, folks, we, we, uh, do you have the, um, something there, Phil?
[10:00.850 --> 10:02.470]  Well, the GRL issued a statement.
[10:02.670 --> 10:02.770]  Yeah.
[10:03.010 --> 10:05.070]  They probably are getting blamed too, so...
[10:05.070 --> 10:06.190]  There's a nifty little video of these things too.
[10:06.190 --> 10:08.950]  Yeah, there's a video of one of these being made and put around Manhattan.
[10:09.210 --> 10:09.690]  It's, uh, graffiti...
[10:09.690 --> 10:11.770]  Oh, so they actually made these things and put them around?
[10:11.810 --> 10:13.990]  Um, no, they did film someone doing it though in Manhattan.
[10:14.190 --> 10:18.690]  So it's, uh, graffitiresearchlab.com and, uh, their statement is as follows.
[10:18.690 --> 10:21.290]  You may have heard about the most recent terror attacks in Boston.
[10:21.490 --> 10:23.390]  This is not the work of the graffiti research lab.
[10:23.650 --> 10:25.450]  We just downloaded this link from YouTube.
[10:25.730 --> 10:29.270]  It's just more mindless corporate vandalism from a guerrilla marketer who got busted.
[10:29.570 --> 10:30.310]  Interfere and sink.
[10:30.510 --> 10:34.010]  Welcome to the world of misunderstood, scapegoated, demonized, and wanted by the law.
[10:34.110 --> 10:35.190]  Still want to be a graffiti artist?
[10:35.370 --> 10:44.490]  For more on this most recent terrorist attack from the Axis of Evil, corporations, advertisers, marketers, check out the civic-minded citizens post on Flickr.
[10:44.870 --> 10:45.230]  Flickr.
[10:45.230 --> 10:45.290]  Okay.
[10:45.390 --> 10:49.130]  And there's a link to Flickr about, um, these particular things.
[10:49.290 --> 10:51.970]  The graffiti research lab gave an excellent talk at Hope.
[10:52.150 --> 10:52.850]  Yes, that's right.
[10:52.970 --> 10:58.110]  They showed them, they were actually doing all kinds of interesting things, none of which got mistaken for bombs.
[10:58.370 --> 10:59.930]  Well, they had, they had the throwies.
[11:00.070 --> 11:04.010]  They had the LED throwies that we were, we were chucking onto buildings and ceilings and things like that.
[11:04.090 --> 11:05.910]  Nobody reported anything from, from there.
[11:06.150 --> 11:07.190]  And it was a ton of fun.
[11:07.290 --> 11:07.890]  Very popular.
[11:08.130 --> 11:14.510]  I was throwing these things all around Times Square at them, you know, three in the morning during the conference, and I was never even asked about it.
[11:14.670 --> 11:15.750]  Well, you can't do that now.
[11:16.050 --> 11:16.290]  Why not?
[11:16.290 --> 11:18.990]  We live in a post-Boston panic world now.
[11:19.150 --> 11:19.270]  Yeah.
[11:19.430 --> 11:21.030]  Uh, you can, but it's just Boston.
[11:21.190 --> 11:25.130]  So today we'll start saying, uh, never forget, uh, what, 131?
[11:25.810 --> 11:26.170]  131.
[11:26.390 --> 11:26.750]  131.
[11:26.810 --> 11:28.070]  The last day of January.
[11:29.370 --> 11:30.630]  Tomorrow's the first day of fear.
[11:30.930 --> 11:32.050]  Where can I go for counseling?
[11:32.290 --> 11:32.870]  I need...
[11:32.870 --> 11:43.810]  The thing, the thing that really gets me is that these things were everywhere, all around the country, and they, they didn't even know, uh, they, they couldn't tell that, uh, this was part of some sort of, uh, uh, publicity campaign.
[11:44.030 --> 11:44.830]  Whole thing is silly.
[11:44.950 --> 11:48.050]  Okay, but we have to get to, um, to some, uh, business here.
[11:48.370 --> 11:54.990]  On the subject of Hope, though, we have a special deal for people tonight, uh, for people who call up and, um, and pledge to the radio station.
[11:55.150 --> 12:05.030]  We have the entire, yes, the entire Hope DVD collection for half what it normally cost for people who call and pledge to the radio station.
[12:05.670 --> 12:10.230]  Normally, you'd have to shell out 400 bucks to get, uh, the 70 plus DVDs.
[12:10.370 --> 12:10.810]  70?
[12:10.950 --> 12:11.750]  70, yes.
[12:11.770 --> 12:28.850]  Seven zero plus DVDs that, that were made during that weekend, including the Graffiti Research Labs people, uh, and, um, now we're offering it for 200, for people who call 212-209-2950 and pledge $200 for the radio station, uh, help keep us going here at Off the Hook,
[12:28.890 --> 12:31.850]  and, uh, you'll get a, an Off the Hook t-shirt as well.
[12:31.850 --> 12:32.910]  Can't beat that.
[12:33.130 --> 12:36.250]  What we're going to do now is play an excerpt from the Hope Conference.
[12:36.650 --> 12:43.850]  Um, I, I, I would have put something together with the Graffiti Research Lab if this had only happened yesterday, but, uh, unfortunately, we don't have a clip from them.
[12:44.250 --> 12:53.210]  However, this is actually something, uh, something extra, a bonus, uh, set of DVDs that you'll get in addition because this didn't actually take place during the conference.
[12:53.330 --> 12:54.450]  It took place after the conference.
[12:54.550 --> 13:03.730]  If you recall, one of our speakers was arrested during the conference, wasn't able to give his talk, and we gave it, uh, in November over at, um, Stevens Institute in New Jersey.
[13:04.570 --> 13:06.370]  And, uh, we have those DVDs as well.
[13:06.470 --> 13:11.610]  So here's an excerpt from Steve Rambam's talk, uh, in November, part of the Hope Conference.
[13:11.710 --> 13:14.030]  Remember, 212-209-2950.
[13:14.270 --> 13:17.190]  That's the number to call to pledge support to the radio station.
[13:17.190 --> 13:21.290]  $200 will get you the full DVD set of the Hope Conference.
[13:21.870 --> 13:22.690]  Here's an excerpt.
[13:25.270 --> 13:27.610]  Okay, well, the, uh, the CD player...
[13:27.610 --> 13:28.850]  Oh, I'm sorry, I played the wrong thing.
[13:28.970 --> 13:29.250]  I'm sorry.
[13:29.570 --> 13:30.210]  My fault.
[13:30.670 --> 13:31.770]  I'm gonna press the right button now.
[13:31.870 --> 13:33.430]  Here's an excerpt from the Hope Conference.
[13:33.610 --> 13:41.870]  Now, here's a real-world example, which, when we do this for law enforcement and, and governmental agencies, I'm very big on real-world examples.
[13:42.470 --> 13:52.770]  Riverside County, California, if you are a DWI, if you are convicted of DWI, they make you wear an ankle bracelet when you're not in jail.
[13:54.150 --> 13:56.310]  They make you wear it for your entire sentence.
[13:56.550 --> 13:57.670]  You have to agree to that.
[13:57.850 --> 13:59.390]  If you don't agree, they say, no problem.
[13:59.630 --> 14:01.730]  If we want to know where you are, it's not gonna be a problem.
[14:01.830 --> 14:02.450]  We'll put you in jail.
[14:02.770 --> 14:04.910]  Would you rather have the tracking bracelet or would you rather have jail?
[14:05.330 --> 14:06.670]  I'll take the tracking bracelet.
[14:06.950 --> 14:11.490]  Now, they have a program set up using off-the-shelf stuff.
[14:11.870 --> 14:23.830]  That tells if your GPS location is a bar, is a car rental agency, is a strip club, is anything on a list of, I think it's 14 or 16 prohibited type places.
[14:24.070 --> 14:25.590]  This is the real-world, folks.
[14:25.830 --> 14:26.950]  It's that easy.
[14:27.110 --> 14:34.670]  And by the way, the GPS trackers that they put on the guy's ankle is the same one that's in almost all cell phones.
[14:37.490 --> 14:40.990]  More personal information that you give up for convenience.
[14:41.830 --> 14:44.050]  TV, TiVo, cable.
[14:44.630 --> 14:47.710]  Everything you watch, when you watch it.
[14:48.630 --> 14:54.230]  You know, there's nothing that you do with your TiVo machine that is not sent back to the mothership.
[14:56.250 --> 14:57.550]  What your likes are.
[14:57.610 --> 14:59.450]  Do you watch sporting shows?
[14:59.650 --> 15:01.490]  Do you watch porno?
[15:01.890 --> 15:05.530]  Do you watch, you know, I TiVo the Shield?
[15:08.050 --> 15:08.910]  They can...
[15:08.910 --> 15:10.870]  I'm sure they can deduce something from that.
[15:11.050 --> 15:15.310]  Either I'm a cop fan or a drug dealer.
[15:15.470 --> 15:16.110]  You know, one or the other.
[15:16.210 --> 15:16.570]  I don't know.
[15:16.570 --> 15:26.270]  But all of these, all of these services, supposedly for marketing purposes, index and record everything you do.
[15:26.370 --> 15:35.030]  And I've got to tell you, what you watch on TV, especially what you pay for to watch on TV pay-per-view, is a terrific window into your personality.
[15:36.310 --> 15:46.830]  Now, mind you, there's a great deal now of people mixing and matching businesses.
[15:47.150 --> 15:52.810]  Cable companies not only know what you watch on cable, but maybe you get your phone service from them.
[15:53.550 --> 15:55.730]  Maybe you get other services from them.
[15:56.130 --> 15:59.350]  Verizon is now going to be selling broadband TV.
[16:00.210 --> 16:08.530]  It's not going to just be that, in the past, if I wanted to find something out about someone, I had to go to multiple sources for multiple types of information.
[16:08.990 --> 16:10.490]  It's one-stop shopping now.
[16:10.970 --> 16:16.350]  They know who you talk to on the phone, when you're in the house, what you watch on TV, and so on and so forth.
[16:18.570 --> 16:18.970]  Money.
[16:20.910 --> 16:23.830]  Anything that you do of any interest involves money.
[16:25.710 --> 16:26.890]  You go to a restaurant.
[16:27.270 --> 16:28.250]  You buy a book.
[16:28.250 --> 16:30.330]  You travel somewhere.
[16:30.770 --> 16:33.990]  You pay a parking meter.
[16:34.670 --> 16:41.570]  Every time you do anything with money, unless it's cash, it's tracked.
[16:42.250 --> 16:44.350]  Everything, everywhere, every time.
[16:44.730 --> 16:54.490]  Now, by the way, it's not only tracked, but it is now kept for far, far, far greater lengths of time, and it's kept in one location.
[16:54.770 --> 16:56.550]  Now, there is a good reason for that.
[16:56.550 --> 16:58.290]  They want to track terrorist activity.
[16:58.550 --> 17:00.630]  They want to track wire transfers.
[17:00.630 --> 17:06.310]  If a guy gets three transfers from a terrorist base in Yemen, they want to be able to find him.
[17:07.250 --> 17:17.130]  I don't know why Department of Homeland Security thinks that terrorists don't know how to use ATMs, but they record everything.
[17:17.430 --> 17:23.370]  And because of the Patriot Act, it's kept forever, and it's immediately available to the U.S.
[17:23.470 --> 17:23.730]  government.
[17:23.910 --> 17:25.750]  And by the way, that includes PayPal.
[17:26.710 --> 17:40.430]  PayPal just had to search all their records for people who use PayPal in the United States, but have bank accounts that are connected to that PayPal account outside the United States.
[17:41.960 --> 17:43.310]  How many terrorists have been caught?
[17:43.550 --> 17:44.110]  Zero.
[17:44.970 --> 17:49.930]  How many people with foreign bank accounts that didn't declare them on their taxes have already been arrested?
[17:49.930 --> 17:50.750]  140.
[17:51.270 --> 17:51.970]  140.
[17:53.210 --> 17:55.530]  Everything that you do, it's recorded.
[17:55.830 --> 18:00.410]  And everything that you do, other information can be extrapolated out from that.
[18:04.520 --> 18:09.800]  InfoUSA is a perfect example of the stealth amalgamator.
[18:09.800 --> 18:13.380]  This is a company, just that again, how many of you have heard of InfoUSA?
[18:15.480 --> 18:19.160]  Okay, I want to say less than 5% of the room raised their hands.
[18:19.820 --> 18:23.360]  This company has more information on you than almost anybody on the planet.
[18:24.300 --> 18:31.940]  They buy up every motor vehicle record, every driver's license, every real property record, every telephone record, every business record.
[18:33.240 --> 18:35.800]  They have marketing lists like you can't imagine.
[18:36.440 --> 18:38.060]  Doctors, lawyers, engineers.
[18:38.060 --> 18:45.260]  Everything that you do, they suck it into their system, and they prepare targeted marketing files.
[18:45.740 --> 18:47.340]  It's astounding.
[18:48.020 --> 18:51.980]  Bankruptcies, court judgments, criminal records, everything.
[18:53.740 --> 19:00.260]  They are estimated to have close to 100 individual records on every American.
[19:02.820 --> 19:08.800]  Here's examples of some of the stuff that they have just in their basic service that they make available.
[19:09.200 --> 19:10.920]  National change of address records.
[19:11.180 --> 19:18.620]  They have enhancement services where they attach not just demographic records, but psychographic records, which we're going to go into a second.
[19:19.120 --> 19:20.020]  Email appending.
[19:20.160 --> 19:28.400]  They attach your email from one source to your name, address, telephone number, date of birth, social security number, et cetera, et cetera, from other sources.
[19:30.360 --> 19:31.720]  Penetration reports.
[19:32.400 --> 19:33.540]  Penetration reports.
[19:33.540 --> 19:36.620]  Penetration reports are what can be sold to you easily.
[19:37.180 --> 19:39.460]  In other words, what your likes and dislikes are.
[19:42.750 --> 19:46.310]  Let's talk about target marketing.
[19:47.630 --> 19:50.510]  This is the most insidious gatherer of information.
[19:51.830 --> 20:05.250]  Every time that you do something commercially, it's recorded one way or the other, either through a credit card purchase, or through a warranty card, or through a rebate, or what have you.
[20:06.130 --> 20:21.730]  People know what type of computer you use, what type of wine you drink, or if you drink wine, what type of books you read, have you contributed to a charity, have you contributed to a political campaign, so on and so on and so on.
[20:22.270 --> 20:38.810]  Things that can allow a third party to accurately and immediately deduce exactly who you are, what your personality is, what your likes, dislikes, religion, sexual orientation, politics, et cetera, et cetera, are about you.
[20:39.450 --> 20:42.770]  These guys buy this up by the trainload.
[20:43.950 --> 20:47.030]  Every magazine subscription, think about it.
[20:47.830 --> 20:56.930]  If I stood by your mailbox and saw every magazine that you receive, would it tell me a lot about your personal character?
[20:56.930 --> 20:58.050]  Sure, it would.
[20:58.770 --> 21:01.610]  Every magazine subscription is sold.
[21:02.450 --> 21:10.610]  No such thing as a private subscription to Newsweek, or a private subscription to Cat Fancier Journal.
[21:11.890 --> 21:19.330]  Every time you call an 800 number or an 888 number, it logs who you are, who you're calling.
[21:19.330 --> 21:25.670]  Are you calling tech support for your new ultraviolet grow light?
[21:27.130 --> 21:28.210]  It's locked.
[21:29.050 --> 21:31.690]  Every product survey, every product registration.
[21:34.110 --> 21:39.990]  And this is what every target marketer wants to know about you and does know about you.
[21:41.810 --> 21:46.410]  And this is part of the HOPE DVD set that we're playing here on the radio station.
[21:47.330 --> 21:53.390]  Steve Rambam gave a talk at Stevens Institute after the HOPE conference with all kinds of scary information.
[21:53.470 --> 21:53.710]  Redbird?
[21:53.810 --> 21:58.750]  What's so cool about these talks is that these people actually know what they're talking about.
[21:58.870 --> 22:01.450]  For instance, Steve Rambam, he's a private investigator.
[22:01.450 --> 22:05.850]  He's probably one of the best private investigators, and he's been doing this for a lot of years.
[22:05.850 --> 22:07.390]  And he knows this stuff firsthand.
[22:07.390 --> 22:10.810]  It's not some, you know, it's not some kid who knows that all this stuff.
[22:10.990 --> 22:13.130]  Sure, it's technically possible, but he actually sees it.
[22:13.210 --> 22:17.010]  He gets to experience firsthand how much information you can actually get on people.
[22:17.130 --> 22:20.370]  So this sort of advice that you're getting is pretty worthwhile.
[22:20.590 --> 22:25.090]  And you really get to experience an adventure here because, as we mentioned, he was supposed to give a talk at HOPE.
[22:25.170 --> 22:33.630]  You'll see the whole unfolding incident where we talked about how he wasn't able to give that panel because he was arrested by the FBI.
[22:33.630 --> 22:40.610]  And he'll tell that whole long story at the second set of DVDs that you'll get for the Steve Rambam talk.
[22:40.790 --> 22:41.950]  But that's only one.
[22:42.030 --> 22:45.670]  That's only one of so many other talks that we have on this set.
[22:45.830 --> 22:52.350]  The HOPE conference took place last July, and we went for three days and three nights.
[22:52.350 --> 22:55.690]  And in the end, we had close to 100 speakers.
[22:55.930 --> 23:05.130]  And we have over 70 DVDs with all sorts of highlights and talks, questions, forums, things like that.
[23:05.270 --> 23:12.590]  All available to people calling to pledge support to the radio station for the cut rate price of $200.
[23:12.590 --> 23:15.590]  Yeah, for more than 70 DVDs.
[23:15.690 --> 23:17.010]  Even if they're blank, that's a good deal.
[23:18.010 --> 23:19.970]  But these are anything but blank.
[23:20.130 --> 23:24.990]  They are chock full of all sorts of interesting information with fascinating people.
[23:25.290 --> 23:26.710]  212-209-2950.
[23:27.490 --> 23:29.830]  Again, these are only available during this hour.
[23:29.970 --> 23:30.990]  We already had a few of them go.
[23:31.430 --> 23:33.950]  And once this hour is over, that's it.
[23:33.950 --> 23:35.170]  We are not offering them again.
[23:35.290 --> 23:45.250]  And I'll tell you this, since we sell these things for double that price, and we sell quite a few of them for double that price, we're not going to be doing this again because, well, it wouldn't make any sense.
[23:45.350 --> 23:50.530]  We're donating them to start with, and now we're selling them for half of what we normally sell them for.
[23:50.690 --> 23:57.350]  So 212-209-2950, take advantage of what can only be described as an amazing deal for this hour.
[23:57.750 --> 24:10.630]  And the nice thing is, you know, you may have heard these talks before on the CDs, but now you get to see all the accoutrements, all the supporting information, the stuff that's on the chalkboards, the whiteboards.
[24:10.790 --> 24:11.830]  You get to see what we look like.
[24:11.970 --> 24:12.910]  Oh, that's scary.
[24:13.150 --> 24:14.510]  Maybe not us, but other people.
[24:14.690 --> 24:16.170]  Law enforcement, please don't buy these.
[24:17.310 --> 24:21.590]  Yeah, and, you know, there are demonstrations in many of these talks.
[24:21.850 --> 24:24.070]  You'll get to experience what the HOPE Conference was like.
[24:24.170 --> 24:28.030]  Even if you were at the HOPE Conference, there's no way, how many of us actually went to talks?
[24:28.030 --> 24:33.970]  We were involved in every facet of the event, but we didn't have time to go to the talks.
[24:34.070 --> 24:36.310]  Yeah, I went to two talks, both of which were amazing.
[24:36.530 --> 24:39.750]  And anyone who gets the DVD set, I highly recommend they watch them.
[24:39.790 --> 24:40.590]  Which talks did you go to?
[24:40.630 --> 24:51.190]  I went to a talk called Hack the Palate, which was about new ways of preparing food with all kinds of crazy equipment and chemicals and whatnot.
[24:51.190 --> 24:53.250]  How does that tie into the hacker world?
[24:53.570 --> 24:56.610]  You have to watch it to find out, but it's really...
[24:57.130 --> 24:57.810]  It is amazing.
[24:57.930 --> 24:58.290]  It is.
[24:58.430 --> 25:01.010]  It was an amazing talk, and it was in the hacker spirit.
[25:01.010 --> 25:05.110]  It wasn't just some random food talk that we included because, you know, we know the guy.
[25:06.490 --> 25:14.890]  He does relate, and it talks about the sort of some of the people who keep their methods secret and others who are more willing to share.
[25:15.090 --> 25:16.410]  And it was really fascinating.
[25:16.410 --> 25:21.850]  Hack the Palate, that's done by our friend Guides, and it's one of the most popular talks.
[25:22.110 --> 25:25.950]  And it was something we had never tried before, and I wasn't sure how it was going to go.
[25:26.030 --> 25:27.570]  But wow, that was received really well.
[25:28.050 --> 25:32.290]  There was another talk, Coupon Hacking, that I know was very, very popular, that we weren't sure how that was going to go.
[25:32.970 --> 25:36.830]  So we try a lot of different things, and we get all sorts of neat responses.
[25:36.930 --> 25:38.170]  What was the second talk, Mike, you went to?
[25:38.210 --> 25:41.570]  The second talk was the one we were talking about earlier with the Graffiti Research Lab.
[25:41.790 --> 25:43.350]  And this is one that we didn't excerpt.
[25:43.490 --> 25:46.290]  We didn't know about this chaos that they were sort of being involved.
[25:46.290 --> 25:46.590]  Only.
[25:47.250 --> 25:48.990]  Because you really have to see that talk.
[25:49.150 --> 25:54.730]  They show video, they show photos of all their cool projects with lights and whatnot.
[25:55.630 --> 25:57.970]  And on the DVD, of course, you see all this.
[25:58.010 --> 26:02.410]  Maybe if more people had seen this DVD, there wouldn't be such panic in the streets of Boston today.
[26:02.630 --> 26:05.510]  I don't know, the people who are panicking, kind of dumb.
[26:05.690 --> 26:08.110]  They probably don't even have DVD players, they probably think those are suspicious.
[26:08.110 --> 26:09.890]  It's 212-209-2950.
[26:10.070 --> 26:17.410]  And in addition to this, we also have some remaining from our last fundraiser, the TV Be Gone for pledges of $50.
[26:17.850 --> 26:24.350]  So if you want to have a device that you can use to turn off a TV set anywhere in your range, this is the device for you.
[26:24.350 --> 26:30.550]  A pledge of $50, 212-209-2950, courtesy of Mitch Altman, the inventor of TV Be Gone.
[26:30.770 --> 26:33.770]  These things have been causing chaos and mayhem all throughout the world.
[26:34.150 --> 26:36.670]  I guess that's the theme of our show, chaos and mayhem.
[26:37.490 --> 26:38.870]  212-209-2950.
[26:38.870 --> 26:43.370]  And of course, everybody who pledges $25 or more will get an off-the-hook t-shirt.
[26:43.550 --> 26:46.910]  I just had an interesting and obscure thought.
[26:47.430 --> 26:49.470]  What's the country code on these DVDs?
[26:50.190 --> 26:51.090]  Region free, of course.
[26:51.250 --> 26:52.450]  Region free, of course.
[26:52.670 --> 26:54.290]  You think we'd put a region code on them?
[26:54.290 --> 26:54.970]  I didn't think so.
[26:54.990 --> 26:55.990]  I just wanted to check.
[26:56.090 --> 27:13.290]  So that means no matter where you are in the world, listening to us on the internet or via shortwave, you can pledge and get these DVDs and see them without kowtowing to the powers that be that put region codes on DVDs in order to force people to segregate themselves.
[27:13.370 --> 27:13.690]  That's right.
[27:13.810 --> 27:15.790]  So it's sort of like a political statement just by watching the things.
[27:15.890 --> 27:17.430]  212-209-2950.
[27:18.070 --> 27:19.930]  Again, over 70 DVDs.
[27:20.050 --> 27:23.590]  You'll never, no matter how long you live, you'll never see a deal as good as this.
[27:23.830 --> 27:33.630]  But the best part about it though, the best part is that you're supporting non-commercial radio here in New York City and shows like Off the Hook that come your way and that would not be possible in any other place.
[27:33.810 --> 27:40.890]  And really, they're not because, you know, we've asked people, hey, do you think this radio station would be interested in a program like this?
[27:40.990 --> 27:42.910]  And, you know, it's very, very difficult.
[27:43.110 --> 27:46.330]  Certainly a station in the middle of New York City, in the middle of the commercial band.
[27:46.490 --> 27:55.830]  For those of you tuning in for the first time or maybe tuning in on the internet not realizing, yes, this is a radio station, a 50,000-watt radio station with our transmitter on top of the Empire State Building.
[27:55.830 --> 28:00.010]  We reach four different states at various times, Pennsylvania, New York, New Jersey, Connecticut.
[28:00.550 --> 28:03.370]  And not only that, we have no commercials.
[28:03.510 --> 28:04.510]  We've been around since 1960.
[28:04.930 --> 28:13.710]  We're at 99.5, which if you know anything about the FM spectrum in the United States, there's sort of a ghetto of non-commercial radio below 92.
[28:13.710 --> 28:18.510]  That's where the FCC has mandated that non-commercial radio stations will be.
[28:18.630 --> 28:19.850]  But there are some exceptions.
[28:19.950 --> 28:22.390]  And those are stations that have been around for a while.
[28:22.850 --> 28:23.910]  And we're one of them.
[28:24.070 --> 28:25.710]  We're right in the middle of the FM dial.
[28:25.870 --> 28:32.110]  And that means so much because all these people tuning from one commercial station to another stumble upon us.
[28:32.230 --> 28:34.730]  They have no idea what it is that they're listening to.
[28:34.910 --> 28:35.970]  And they can't leave.
[28:36.190 --> 28:36.970]  They're stuck.
[28:37.170 --> 28:38.390]  They have to hear more.
[28:38.390 --> 28:40.770]  And we've gotten many, many listeners that way.
[28:41.010 --> 28:47.490]  And it's important to realize that the only reason the station remains here is because of listeners like you who call up and support us.
[28:47.590 --> 28:49.470]  212-209-2950.
[28:49.630 --> 28:50.450]  We don't have commercials.
[28:50.730 --> 28:56.310]  We don't have sponsors to offend, which will keep us from talking about all the things we talk about here.
[28:56.930 --> 28:59.230]  We just have you, our listeners.
[28:59.490 --> 29:02.990]  So please invest in this place and get something really neat in return.
[29:03.150 --> 29:04.830]  212-209-2950.
[29:04.830 --> 29:08.330]  Whether it's the t-shirt, whether it's the TV Be Gone, whether it's the full DVD set.
[29:08.450 --> 29:08.730]  Jim?
[29:08.850 --> 29:11.290]  I want to make it appeal to a small class of our listeners.
[29:11.790 --> 29:13.810]  We have regular listeners who hate us.
[29:13.950 --> 29:15.570]  They hate what we stand for.
[29:15.730 --> 29:17.270]  They hate what the radio station stands for.
[29:17.290 --> 29:18.070]  Oh, the go to Cuba guy, yeah.
[29:18.250 --> 29:22.170]  The go to Cuba guy, the as long as you support Mumia, which I don't.
[29:22.290 --> 29:22.990]  Hey, go to Cuba guy.
[29:23.070 --> 29:24.090]  We did go to Cuba, okay?
[29:24.170 --> 29:25.010]  So you're a little late.
[29:25.190 --> 29:26.170]  But the point is this.
[29:26.350 --> 29:30.150]  This is a great opportunity for you to pledge.
[29:30.490 --> 29:30.850]  Why?
[29:30.850 --> 29:34.790]  We're selling these or giving away these DVDs for a pledge.
[29:34.870 --> 29:40.710]  And the price of these is 70% less than what they would normally be at full price.
[29:40.950 --> 29:46.610]  You have an opportunity to hurt us financially if you pledge the $200 and get the DVDs.
[29:46.790 --> 29:48.150]  We're out the DVDs.
[29:48.230 --> 29:49.890]  You have them for a mere $200.
[29:49.890 --> 29:53.590]  We have so many calls that we have to send people down the hall to help.
[29:53.830 --> 29:58.930]  If anybody along the way, drag them down to Tally as well because we need all the help we can get.
[29:59.050 --> 30:02.030]  If the phone is ringing and not picking up, please don't give up.
[30:02.130 --> 30:03.630]  It doesn't mean we're not interested in picking up.
[30:03.670 --> 30:05.830]  It just means we might be a little bit overwhelmed at the time.
[30:05.850 --> 30:07.590]  I don't think I've ever seen that board so lit up before.
[30:07.590 --> 30:08.250]  It's pretty lit up.
[30:08.450 --> 30:09.350]  That's pretty good.
[30:09.370 --> 30:10.490]  Well, you know, it's a good deal.
[30:10.630 --> 30:12.170]  And people are smart to take advantage of this.
[30:12.250 --> 30:18.130]  But remember, it only holds for another half hour because after that, you know, we can't afford to donate this much.
[30:18.130 --> 30:20.370]  We're donating this for free to the radio station.
[30:20.790 --> 30:26.550]  And every single one of those is 70 or more DVDs that we have to produce for nothing.
[30:26.570 --> 30:29.190]  And we're willing to do that because we believe in this place.
[30:29.510 --> 30:31.150]  212-209-2950.
[30:31.290 --> 30:31.810]  I pledge you $200.
[30:32.070 --> 30:34.770]  Gets you every single Hope DVD from the last Hope Conference.
[30:34.950 --> 30:35.710]  More than 70 of them.
[30:36.230 --> 30:37.730]  $50 gets you the TV Be Gone.
[30:37.810 --> 30:39.770]  You'll be able to turn TVs off wherever you are.
[30:40.410 --> 30:42.910]  25 and above gets you the Off The Hook t-shirt.
[30:43.070 --> 30:44.430]  It's a phenomenal opportunity.
[30:44.630 --> 30:50.150]  If you like us or if you're interested in this, you can learn an awful lot from watching those DVDs.
[30:50.250 --> 30:56.810]  And if you hate us, you know, you have an opportunity to burn, destroy, mangle, mutilate, shred those DVDs.
[30:56.810 --> 30:57.730]  All right, let's not give them ideas.
[30:57.970 --> 30:58.690]  Even send us a tape of that.
[30:58.850 --> 30:59.330]  I mean...
[30:59.330 --> 31:06.590]  You're really pandering to the people who hate us, but I'm interested in also hearing from the people who don't hate us and really want the content on these DVDs.
[31:07.050 --> 31:11.550]  There's always people who don't hate us, who like us, who listen to our show, and they don't listen to it live.
[31:11.550 --> 31:15.030]  And they always email us and they say, how can I get that?
[31:15.230 --> 31:15.410]  Yeah.
[31:15.410 --> 31:17.610]  And unfortunately for them, we can't.
[31:17.670 --> 31:18.710]  We try to notify you.
[31:18.850 --> 31:20.690]  We put notices up all throughout the internet.
[31:21.210 --> 31:23.610]  And if you were on the internet today, you would have seen it.
[31:24.010 --> 31:24.370]  But...
[31:24.370 --> 31:34.990]  So the people who are listening live, which I think is a lot of people, if they call now 212-209-2950, they only have about 29 minutes left...
[31:34.990 --> 31:35.650]  Yeah.
[31:35.930 --> 31:37.350]  ...to do it, and they should, you know...
[31:37.350 --> 31:39.870]  And if you're not listening live and you still want to contribute, you can.
[31:40.070 --> 31:44.250]  You just won't get this package, but there are plenty of other packages that the radio station does offer.
[31:44.450 --> 31:46.270]  212-209-2950.
[31:46.570 --> 31:51.490]  Let's play another clip from the Hackers on Planet Earth conference from last July.
[31:51.490 --> 31:55.910]  And again, for a pledge of $200, you'll get this DVD, plus many, many others.
[31:56.270 --> 31:59.010]  We were talking about the FCC and their various regulations.
[31:59.850 --> 32:03.910]  This comes from our friends over at the Prometheus Radio Project.
[32:03.910 --> 32:06.630]  Bernie, you want to say something about these guys, what they stand for?
[32:07.150 --> 32:07.910]  Yeah, it's a group...
[32:07.910 --> 32:12.310]  I was actually involved with them back in the late 90s.
[32:13.470 --> 32:19.550]  They grew out of a pirate radio station in Philadelphia called Radio Mutiny, or West Philly Pirate Radio, WPPR.
[32:19.850 --> 32:25.090]  And we got a lot of donations from the community because the community loved the station.
[32:25.450 --> 32:29.390]  And then the FCC, after five visits, finally sent armed U.S.
[32:29.510 --> 32:30.750]  Marshals to shut the station down.
[32:31.030 --> 32:32.450]  So we couldn't be on the air anymore.
[32:32.450 --> 32:48.310]  So we took a vote and decided to start a non-profit organization called the Prometheus Radio Project, which would be a grassroots organization that would get other people from around the country to lobby Congress to allow communities to start their own radio stations,
[32:48.410 --> 32:50.030]  low-power, non-commercial stations.
[32:50.370 --> 32:56.130]  And so far, the Prometheus Radio Project is responsible for several barn raisings around the country.
[32:56.130 --> 33:00.330]  In fact, in other parts of the world, even Tanzania, starting low-power radio stations.
[33:00.770 --> 33:02.530]  And it's a great community project.
[33:02.530 --> 33:04.830]  It's a very worthwhile group, Prometheus.
[33:04.970 --> 33:07.330]  And they gave a great talk at Hope, so maybe we can listen.
[33:07.330 --> 33:10.910]  Here is a bit from Hannah Sassman from Prometheus Radio Project.
[33:11.050 --> 33:12.630]  212-209-2950.
[33:13.190 --> 33:32.610]  The last thing I want to talk about, which is going to lead in a little bit to some stuff that Dharma is going to say, is that one thing that Prometheus did was we were able to sue the FCC and win when the Federal Communications Commission tried to deregulate media ownership in the United States.
[33:32.610 --> 33:33.590]  And so what does that mean?
[33:33.810 --> 33:44.590]  So that means that a big company like Clear Channel, or a big company like Viacom, in 2002-2003, they were fighting so they could own even more stuff in your hometown.
[33:44.810 --> 33:46.510]  So they could own the newspaper.
[33:46.790 --> 33:50.710]  So they could own both, like two major television stations.
[33:51.030 --> 33:57.570]  So they could own many more radio stations in a market where the FCC was keeping them just at a certain number.
[33:57.570 --> 34:10.830]  And so because activists like you guys, because people who understood technology, but also understood that it was important for that technology to get into the hands of community groups, you know, you guys are hackers on planet Earth.
[34:11.070 --> 34:14.510]  You're not hackers on planet bedroom or hackers in planet basement.
[34:14.750 --> 34:20.090]  You're here to make sure that this technology helps all of us to really have like a better world.
[34:20.350 --> 34:23.310]  So, you know, hackers on planet basement doesn't have as good a ring.
[34:23.310 --> 34:48.130]  But so because of that, like because people just like you who really wanted low power radio stations told the FCC in 2002 and 2003 that if there was media consolidation that they wouldn't be able to put their stations on the air, we were able to have standing in federal court to sue them because they hadn't listened to us and they hadn't listened to the two million people who had sent in comments.
[34:48.130 --> 34:59.250]  And so because we were able to be there, we, along with many other allies, especially the Media Access Project, public interest law firm in DC, were able to sue the FCC and win.
[34:59.530 --> 35:01.010]  So that was really awesome.
[35:01.130 --> 35:06.130]  That means that Clear Channel doesn't suck as much as they possibly could right this second.
[35:06.350 --> 35:11.190]  However, the FCC is going to be trying to deregulate again this year in 2006.
[35:11.190 --> 35:28.070]  So if you want to make sure that they do not own everything in your town and they do not also own the nuclear power plant, the concert venue and all of the tours of the worst musicians and just some terrible stuff, then you should also go to StopBigMedia.com.
[35:28.170 --> 35:30.990]  And Prometheus is going to continue to be involved in that fight as well.
[35:31.150 --> 35:34.190]  So that's all the stuff about legislation and regulation.
[35:34.190 --> 35:35.910]  I can answer questions later on.
[35:36.430 --> 35:38.690]  Okay, but you're not going to because we're done with that excerpt.
[35:38.850 --> 35:40.090]  Wow, that was awesome.
[35:40.190 --> 35:41.190]  I really like that quote.
[35:41.330 --> 35:41.850]  Wasn't that what?
[35:41.990 --> 35:42.550]  The Clear Channel?
[35:42.690 --> 35:44.990]  Could not suck as much as they possibly could at this moment.
[35:45.250 --> 35:47.410]  No, you can't say that on commercial radio.
[35:47.950 --> 35:48.670]  You can't.
[35:48.750 --> 35:51.010]  And that's the kind of thing that we talk about all the time.
[35:51.590 --> 35:53.110]  212-209-2950.
[35:53.490 --> 35:56.970]  Get the entire Hope DVD set for a pledge of $200.
[35:57.130 --> 35:58.830]  You'll get over 70 DVDs.
[35:58.950 --> 36:01.170]  And I got to say, a lot of people are jumping at this.
[36:01.330 --> 36:04.190]  We're over $2,000 already just a half hour into the program.
[36:04.190 --> 36:06.570]  So thanks to all those people who have been calling in.
[36:06.650 --> 36:07.430]  We have a full switchboard.
[36:08.030 --> 36:09.530]  Please keep those calls coming in.
[36:09.630 --> 36:11.350]  212-209-2950.
[36:11.590 --> 36:15.090]  Again, for a pledge of $200, you'll get more than 70 DVDs.
[36:15.370 --> 36:21.890]  The entire Hope Conference, it took place last July here in New York City at the Hotel Pennsylvania, a building we're currently trying to keep from being demolished.
[36:22.430 --> 36:31.270]  And for a pledge of $50, you'll get the TV Be Gone device, which allows you to take control of the media around you, immediately around you.
[36:31.470 --> 36:35.110]  And if you see a TV set that's annoying you, well, you can just turn it off.
[36:35.970 --> 36:38.790]  And, of course, a pledge of 25 and above gets you the Off The Hook t-shirt.
[36:38.890 --> 36:39.030]  Phil?
[36:39.210 --> 36:40.530]  I have a Hope story.
[36:40.830 --> 36:40.950]  Okay.
[36:40.950 --> 36:48.990]  So last night around 3 in the morning, my phone rang, and someone said, oh, hi, I'm listening to the Hope shows that I bought.
[36:49.510 --> 36:50.250]  They called you?
[36:50.390 --> 36:53.550]  Yeah, I gave out my phone number because I was showing a homemade rotary cell phone.
[36:53.670 --> 36:53.790]  Okay.
[36:54.450 --> 36:54.770]  And...
[36:54.770 --> 36:55.990]  Oh, you mean in the talk you gave?
[36:56.010 --> 36:56.530]  In the talk I gave.
[36:56.610 --> 36:57.570]  I gave out my cell phone.
[36:57.630 --> 36:59.450]  They're like, I told people to call me, so this person did.
[36:59.610 --> 37:01.010]  But it's time shifted, so...
[37:01.010 --> 37:02.410]  To this day, they're calling you.
[37:02.410 --> 37:02.930]  You're still calling.
[37:03.030 --> 37:03.590]  So it was 3 in the morning.
[37:03.690 --> 37:07.470]  He's like, I just want to let you know, I'm going to get into electronics now because of your talk.
[37:07.490 --> 37:09.210]  I really want to do electronics for a living.
[37:09.210 --> 37:09.950]  See what you did to me?
[37:10.010 --> 37:11.630]  You turned me into somebody into electronics.
[37:11.750 --> 37:12.510]  I hope you're happy.
[37:12.650 --> 37:12.810]  Wow.
[37:12.810 --> 37:15.990]  Yeah, I told him to go make a lot of LEDs and put them around major cities.
[37:16.310 --> 37:17.090]  Or maybe I should know.
[37:17.270 --> 37:17.410]  Wait.
[37:17.650 --> 37:18.750]  In the next 24 hours.
[37:18.890 --> 37:19.130]  Wow.
[37:19.550 --> 37:21.190]  See how you can affect society around you.
[37:21.210 --> 37:21.750]  It's incredible.
[37:21.890 --> 37:22.750]  I didn't realize that would happen.
[37:22.870 --> 37:24.130]  212-209-295.
[37:24.190 --> 37:25.310]  We have four calls on the line.
[37:25.390 --> 37:27.190]  It's actually a lot less than we had a few minutes ago.
[37:27.190 --> 37:28.150]  So there is room.
[37:28.230 --> 37:29.110]  There are people down there.
[37:29.110 --> 37:30.270]  What's the mood down there, Mike?
[37:30.270 --> 37:30.890]  I was just...
[37:30.890 --> 37:31.730]  They're hectic.
[37:31.890 --> 37:32.310]  They're crazy.
[37:32.450 --> 37:32.990]  They're running around.
[37:33.110 --> 37:34.010]  They're picking up the phones.
[37:34.650 --> 37:35.730]  Hanging up each other's phones?
[37:35.890 --> 37:36.210]  No.
[37:36.390 --> 37:37.450]  No, they're picking up the phones.
[37:37.690 --> 37:38.470]  Hasn't gotten to that stage yet.
[37:38.470 --> 37:40.850]  They only hang them up when they're done taking the people's pledge.
[37:41.130 --> 37:42.010]  That's the idea, yeah.
[37:42.130 --> 37:43.470]  212-209-2950.
[37:43.610 --> 37:44.530]  There are people waiting now.
[37:44.670 --> 37:45.210]  They're resting.
[37:45.350 --> 37:46.030]  They're catching their breath.
[37:46.150 --> 37:48.570]  But we still have the offer up until 8 o'clock.
[37:50.630 --> 37:52.170]  $200 for all the DVDs.
[37:52.350 --> 37:53.230]  50 for the TV be gone.
[37:53.330 --> 37:54.070]  25 for the shirts.
[37:54.270 --> 37:55.010]  Now we have people to thank.
[37:55.390 --> 37:57.390]  There's a few people who did already pledge.
[37:58.110 --> 38:00.410]  One of them is Mary from Ashbury, New Jersey.
[38:01.630 --> 38:02.550]  George from Brooklyn.
[38:03.430 --> 38:04.650]  Bobby also from Brooklyn.
[38:06.570 --> 38:09.250]  Michael from Winnetica, Illinois.
[38:09.690 --> 38:10.010]  I don't know where that is.
[38:10.070 --> 38:10.730]  Winnetica, Illinois.
[38:11.350 --> 38:12.390]  Well, it's on the map now.
[38:12.650 --> 38:12.970]  Winnetica.
[38:13.210 --> 38:13.970]  You know of this place?
[38:14.050 --> 38:14.790]  I know of this place.
[38:14.790 --> 38:15.390]  You know this place.
[38:15.490 --> 38:16.650]  Tell us everything you know about it, Jim.
[38:16.830 --> 38:17.450]  It's in Illinois.
[38:18.410 --> 38:19.110]  All right, then.
[38:19.910 --> 38:20.550]  It's Winnetica.
[38:20.790 --> 38:22.630]  There's no vowel between the T and the K.
[38:22.790 --> 38:24.310]  Well, what if there is one where there is a vowel?
[38:24.410 --> 38:25.050]  You don't know about that.
[38:25.050 --> 38:25.610]  It might be smaller.
[38:25.610 --> 38:26.870]  There's no vowel on the card.
[38:26.870 --> 38:28.670]  I was just mispronouncing it.
[38:28.750 --> 38:28.910]  I'm sorry.
[38:28.990 --> 38:29.310]  I apologize.
[38:29.610 --> 38:30.010]  It's okay.
[38:30.110 --> 38:32.430]  To Michael and all the other people from that place.
[38:32.530 --> 38:33.290]  Please don't be offended.
[38:33.290 --> 38:36.430]  We didn't mean to malign your town's name.
[38:36.530 --> 38:38.830]  We just aren't very good at saying new words here.
[38:38.970 --> 38:39.270]  Go ahead.
[38:39.410 --> 38:40.970]  We also want to thank Josh 12.
[38:41.490 --> 38:42.210]  Josh 12?
[38:42.410 --> 38:42.830]  Josh 12.
[38:43.050 --> 38:44.470]  Where are all the other 11 Joshes?
[38:44.470 --> 38:45.570]  Is his last name 12?
[38:45.830 --> 38:46.530]  T-W-E-L-V-E?
[38:46.530 --> 38:47.530]  That's how he wants to thank.
[38:47.690 --> 38:47.790]  Okay.
[38:47.790 --> 38:48.850]  It's written right here in red pen.
[38:49.010 --> 38:49.910]  Thank as Josh 12.
[38:50.250 --> 38:50.590]  All right.
[38:50.750 --> 38:51.870]  Well, thank you, Josh 12.
[38:52.470 --> 38:56.730]  And there's all these other people who don't want us to say their name on the air, but we thank them anyway.
[38:56.870 --> 38:59.270]  Understandably so, because the authorities do listen and they take notes.
[38:59.970 --> 39:00.490]  All right.
[39:00.670 --> 39:02.710]  212-209-2950.
[39:02.930 --> 39:06.410]  The phone lines are opening up a little bit more, but wow.
[39:06.610 --> 39:07.370]  Good response.
[39:07.950 --> 39:16.670]  Again, we're offering an amazing package here this week and only this week of DVDs from our Hackers on Planet Earth conference.
[39:16.830 --> 39:18.690]  The sixth conference that we've had.
[39:18.850 --> 39:20.410]  We had our first one in 1994.
[39:20.910 --> 39:23.390]  And from that point on, we've been having them every couple of years.
[39:24.030 --> 39:26.930]  And wow, it's resulted in a lot of traditions.
[39:26.930 --> 39:29.970]  One of them being the Hotel Pennsylvania, which is where we have these things.
[39:30.190 --> 39:39.430]  And as we've been talking about the last few weeks, the hotel has been slated for demolition by Vornado, who wants to build some crazy financial tower.
[39:39.630 --> 39:47.030]  We got a hold of a picture, since we were on the air last, we got a hold of an artist rendering of what it is they want to put there.
[39:47.150 --> 39:49.130]  And my God, this thing is so ugly.
[39:49.270 --> 39:57.810]  What they want to replace our hotel with is a big advertising billboard, five-story advertising billboard, which will look like something in Times Square.
[39:58.010 --> 39:59.090]  That's what they want to put there.
[39:59.210 --> 40:05.530]  The actual skyscraper, the actual financial tower, they want to build in the middle of the block between Broadway and 7th Avenue.
[40:06.170 --> 40:17.330]  So basically, what they're looking at, they're looking at people coming out of Penn Station, and instead of seeing an old hotel built in 1919, they'll see Nike ads and McDonald's being flashed in their face.
[40:17.990 --> 40:23.150]  And basically that area, right around 33rd, 32nd Street and 7th Avenue, will be the new Times Square.
[40:23.250 --> 40:24.170]  That's what they want to do.
[40:24.370 --> 40:25.490]  We're trying to fight this.
[40:25.650 --> 40:28.850]  We've started a forum talking about this issue and other things.
[40:29.070 --> 40:30.510]  Talk.hope.net.
[40:30.850 --> 40:33.070]  T-A-L-K.hope.net.
[40:33.570 --> 40:36.070]  And you can participate in the forums there.
[40:36.190 --> 40:42.870]  If you know something that you'd like to share with us, if you want to volunteer some efforts, or just give your commentary, that's the place to go.
[40:42.870 --> 40:48.310]  So it's been up for a few weeks now, and we've met a lot of new people and accomplished quite a bit already.
[40:48.410 --> 40:51.230]  We're going to have a website to save the hotel as well.
[40:51.330 --> 40:52.970]  So expect more on that front.
[40:53.870 --> 40:59.030]  But for now, for now we are in the midst of a fundraiser at WBAI for Off The Hook.
[40:59.670 --> 41:01.970]  212-209-2950 is our phone number.
[41:02.490 --> 41:06.230]  And we're asking people to call in and pledge support to the radio station.
[41:08.030 --> 41:10.530]  The number is 212-209-2950.
[41:10.530 --> 41:13.490]  A lot of people have already pledged, but it's not too late to join them.
[41:13.970 --> 41:15.830]  And it really helps this...
[41:15.830 --> 41:16.910]  It doesn't really help.
[41:16.970 --> 41:19.710]  It is what makes this station keep going on the air.
[41:19.850 --> 41:25.330]  As we've said before today and countless times before, this station is a unique resource.
[41:25.710 --> 41:31.690]  Without your pledges, which we want to thank you for if you've already made, this station would not remain on the air.
[41:31.870 --> 41:36.530]  The commercial stations, what they're selling is not content.
[41:37.090 --> 41:38.990]  What they're selling is your ears.
[41:39.210 --> 41:40.450]  They have customers.
[41:40.650 --> 41:42.110]  The customers are big corporations.
[41:42.430 --> 41:44.650]  And the customers buy advertising spots.
[41:44.810 --> 41:46.570]  The product is your time.
[41:46.850 --> 41:48.170]  We don't sell your time.
[41:48.370 --> 41:50.310]  We give you the content that you want to hear.
[41:50.810 --> 41:52.590]  But we can't do it without your support.
[41:52.830 --> 41:54.990]  212-209-2950.
[41:54.990 --> 42:01.270]  And some of the companies, just to make what Mike said, to prove what he said, they have names like captive audience.
[42:01.910 --> 42:03.790]  You couldn't get any more blatant than that.
[42:04.370 --> 42:05.810]  Your ears are the product.
[42:05.930 --> 42:06.190]  Absolutely.
[42:06.450 --> 42:13.290]  Read an advertising magazine and they will talk about the demographics and how much you can sell your ad for on this particular radio station.
[42:13.390 --> 42:14.130]  That's what it's all about.
[42:14.350 --> 42:17.750]  The music, the DJs, the news, it's all incidental to that.
[42:17.750 --> 42:27.610]  But in an environment where you don't have that kind of pressure, where you just have people who speak their minds and take phone calls and debate things, you get other kinds of craziness.
[42:27.610 --> 42:28.110]  That's true.
[42:28.130 --> 42:29.650]  But you don't get that.
[42:29.910 --> 42:33.570]  And I think that is so fundamental in the fight to have freedom of speech.
[42:33.730 --> 42:35.010]  212-209-2950.
[42:35.750 --> 42:37.210]  Can you believe that number?
[42:37.350 --> 42:38.510]  We're at $5,000.
[42:39.270 --> 42:39.710]  Wow.
[42:39.810 --> 42:40.750]  Thank you very much.
[42:40.770 --> 42:43.510]  I'm almost scared because of all the DVDs we're going to have to produce.
[42:43.510 --> 42:45.650]  But we'll do it because we said we would.
[42:45.750 --> 42:46.330]  But my God.
[42:46.330 --> 42:48.210]  Whoa, $5,000.
[42:48.850 --> 42:50.390]  The hour is not even over yet.
[42:50.570 --> 42:53.570]  And those DVDs are such a resource in so many ways.
[42:53.790 --> 43:02.670]  You not only learn things about, quote, hacking, technical things, but you also learn a lot about the sociology of hackers.
[43:03.010 --> 43:10.370]  And we had a panel on hacker spaces, such as The Loft or NotWork.
[43:10.630 --> 43:14.830]  We gave advice on how to approach a 2600 meeting.
[43:15.850 --> 43:17.390]  The nebulous creature that it is.
[43:17.590 --> 43:18.430]  Well, yes, yes.
[43:19.210 --> 43:19.930]  All sorts of things.
[43:20.010 --> 43:20.970]  I don't have the printout in front of me.
[43:20.990 --> 43:21.410]  That was stupid.
[43:21.490 --> 43:23.090]  I should have brought the printout of all different talks.
[43:23.210 --> 43:25.450]  But what I will do, I'm going to play another clip now.
[43:26.190 --> 43:37.090]  This is from our dear friend, Jello Biafra, who has been at the last H2K, H2K2, Fifth Hope, and Hope Number 6, the last four conferences we've had Jello Biafra.
[43:37.230 --> 43:42.310]  He was the surprise keynote at H2K in 2000, and he can't keep away now.
[43:42.310 --> 43:46.110]  Before you play that, let me say, that's another thing that you have here.
[43:46.310 --> 43:49.510]  There's the interesting little counterculture.
[43:49.910 --> 43:53.350]  We have Jello Biafra year after year, it seems.
[43:53.690 --> 43:56.390]  We've had Aaron McGruder, who draws boondocks.
[43:57.550 --> 43:59.370]  We've had... who else have we had?
[43:59.430 --> 44:00.230]  Don't forget Robert Steele.
[44:00.230 --> 44:03.990]  Oh, I'm sorry, Robert Steele, who also is a yearly or bi-yearly...
[44:03.990 --> 44:06.010]  Our very first keynote at the First Hope.
[44:06.190 --> 44:07.970]  Right, and has come back every time since.
[44:08.450 --> 44:11.510]  So there's a lot of interesting counterculture stuff there as well.
[44:11.890 --> 44:16.470]  It's a testament, too, that people always are coming back because it's fascinating.
[44:16.470 --> 44:17.030]  It's interesting.
[44:17.190 --> 44:23.250]  And now you can experience that yourself without even leaving your house or having to wait until 2008 when the next Hope Conference will be.
[44:24.270 --> 44:25.670]  212-209-2950.
[44:25.870 --> 44:29.870]  Again, the pledge of $200 will get you all the DVDs, more than 70 of them.
[44:30.390 --> 44:32.630]  And a pledge of $50 will get you a TV Be Gone.
[44:32.770 --> 44:35.190]  A pledge of $25 and above will get you the Off The Hook t-shirt.
[44:35.310 --> 44:38.450]  But again, we only have 17 minutes left.
[44:38.450 --> 44:40.570]  So you've got to call between now and then.
[44:41.370 --> 44:43.190]  212-209-2950.
[44:43.350 --> 44:44.510]  Let's take a listen to Jell-O.
[44:45.130 --> 44:46.850]  It was just not having to fear.
[44:47.130 --> 44:55.030]  Always fear that someone who really doesn't like you and knows all your worst secrets and could break down your door at any time and your life is over.
[44:55.030 --> 45:06.130]  However, that is what we fought the Nazis and the communists for to keep from happening so privacy or at least dignity and human rights could stay alive.
[45:06.350 --> 45:23.390]  Whatever the technology, it's important to draw the line in the dirt via the laws on the books that this sort of total surveillance state, sabotage, COINTELPRO, police state stuff, on anybody who's against a war is automatically a terrorist.
[45:23.630 --> 45:26.310]  This is not cool.
[45:32.900 --> 45:37.840]  And the only people standing in the way of more and more and more of this is us.
[45:37.840 --> 45:47.000]  There was a lot of discussion at the privacy panel yesterday on whether or not polygraph tests are any good and how to circumvent those.
[45:47.180 --> 45:49.000]  But a lot of employers, oh, those are expensive.
[45:49.000 --> 45:49.880]  They're machines.
[45:50.480 --> 45:52.260]  They don't need a polygraph test.
[45:52.360 --> 45:56.540]  They just cut off a lock of your hair to test you for drugs.
[45:57.000 --> 45:59.720]  Some of them even have you pee in a jar.
[45:59.720 --> 46:04.620]  But maybe that went out of favor because of the temptation just to say, you want me to pee in a jar?
[46:04.820 --> 46:05.020]  Fine.
[46:05.260 --> 46:06.940]  Piss in their face instead.
[46:07.360 --> 46:11.160]  You won't get to work there, but maybe that's a good thing.
[46:11.360 --> 46:12.620]  But now, no.
[46:12.900 --> 46:17.820]  We are protecting our precious faces from your precious bodily fluids.
[46:18.000 --> 46:24.340]  And if you really want to work here, it's understood we even own your hair here.
[46:24.720 --> 46:27.280]  You have no rights at all.
[46:27.440 --> 46:35.740]  And here's the company phone that you will use that has a GPS thing in it so we can tell where you are at every hour of every day.
[46:36.600 --> 46:43.560]  Parents use locks of hair too to send away to mail order labs to test their own kids for drugs and all.
[46:43.740 --> 46:45.340]  But take your Ritalin.
[46:45.980 --> 46:50.580]  You know, if you start getting belligerent, you must have attention deficit disorder.
[46:52.140 --> 47:02.060]  And phones can be tracked and they have the radio frequency IDs in your clothes, in the passports, even in library books sometimes.
[47:02.440 --> 47:10.560]  One school district in Sutter, California, wanted to have every kid always have to have an ID badge on that had one of the tracking things in it.
[47:10.560 --> 47:18.120]  Well, that way maybe no molester will kidnap you, but we've kidnapped all of you instead, basically.
[47:18.540 --> 47:25.900]  And then Sony BMG was even selling CDs to people of popular recording artists without telling anybody.
[47:25.900 --> 47:34.080]  You put that into your computer, there's some little rootkit spyware that gets installed that monitors your Windows media software.
[47:34.680 --> 47:36.940]  And you wonder, where does that info go?
[47:37.260 --> 47:41.140]  To help them determine whether you've been file sharing?
[47:41.560 --> 47:46.720]  I mean, if anybody has turned file sharing into a scam, it's the major labels.
[47:46.720 --> 47:51.160]  It's the RIAA who've sued over 16,000 people now.
[47:54.940 --> 48:08.840]  Even told one woman trying to put herself through MIT and didn't have a lot of money, well, you should just drop out and go to community college so you can pay blood money to your friendly neighborhood major label narcs.
[48:09.420 --> 48:10.520]  Not cool.
[48:10.760 --> 48:13.840]  They've gotten 40 million bucks from these lawsuits.
[48:14.180 --> 48:16.700]  Where has the money gone?
[48:16.860 --> 48:17.620]  To the artists?
[48:18.080 --> 48:18.760]  No.
[48:19.680 --> 48:21.720]  Especially not the independent artists.
[48:21.720 --> 48:26.580]  Grokster shuts down, pays another 50 million dollars blood money to the major labels.
[48:27.040 --> 48:29.540]  You know, did the artists get any of that?
[48:30.140 --> 48:30.740]  Doubtful.
[48:31.120 --> 48:39.620]  And if the Santa Claus at the NSA, being the omnipresent everywhere, isn't enough, you'll love Oprah.
[48:41.260 --> 48:44.620]  I mean, she reminds me more and more of Kim Jong Il.
[48:44.920 --> 48:48.660]  Her own picture is on the cover of every single one of Oprah magazines.
[48:48.660 --> 48:56.020]  We have to have our Oprah picture properly displayed in our home or bad things may happen to us.
[48:56.220 --> 49:02.040]  I mean, she's even gone beyond Kim Jong Il and marketing herself as a drug now.
[49:02.260 --> 49:04.700]  A feel-good mood enhancer.
[49:04.800 --> 49:08.280]  If you're down, you just turn on the TV or a DVD or an Oprah magazine.
[49:08.520 --> 49:13.750]  Oprah will soothe you with the answers to all the world's problems.
[49:16.310 --> 49:24.970]  Same time as they claim they're entitled to know more and more and more about us, we're allowed to know less and less and less about them.
[49:24.970 --> 49:36.530]  In 2004, the Bush mob spent $7.2 billion stamping documents top secret.
[49:37.090 --> 49:38.710]  That's a lot of documents.
[49:38.950 --> 49:44.090]  Even classifying documents that had been public for years.
[49:44.330 --> 49:51.770]  So now if you're caught with them and you got it from a library, oh, you're possessing classified documents, off to Gitmo you go.
[49:52.330 --> 50:04.850]  And they even in the Pentagon even censored a video on how to help citizens navigate Freedom of Information Act requests, which they all stall on now anyway.
[50:05.330 --> 50:19.150]  And then a while back, a journalist I'd known for years from the music censorship wars called me up and saying she was trying to write a book on FBI harassment of musicians and wanted permission to get my FBI file.
[50:19.310 --> 50:22.510]  I thought, oh, this ought to make interesting reading.
[50:24.430 --> 50:29.030]  Then the FBI got back to her, oh, we don't have a file on him.
[50:30.910 --> 50:34.610]  And we don't have a file on the other one you just requested us for either.
[50:34.730 --> 50:35.810]  And guess who that was?
[50:36.130 --> 50:37.410]  Rosa Parks.
[50:37.410 --> 50:44.490]  So something's being black boxed over there in a very, very, very big way.
[50:45.010 --> 51:00.650]  Meanwhile, you know, what also didn't help New Orleans or the rest of us is Homeland Security dog and pony show at the airport and spying on people in Patriot Act or not has become as corrupt as the Pentagon in less than five years.
[51:01.050 --> 51:08.150]  Tom Ridge, the first director, you know, that goofy car, 54, where are you, kind of cop-looking guy that Bush put in?
[51:08.870 --> 51:19.190]  He left with his tail between his legs after a couple years there to go work for a company called Savvy Technologies and be on the board.
[51:19.430 --> 51:28.090]  They make the radio frequency IDs that the Homeland Security now requires be put in your passport to track you.
[51:28.350 --> 51:34.270]  Ridge writes it into law, then makes all the money as a monopoly selling the equipment to the government.
[51:34.530 --> 51:39.850]  Ninety other Homeland Security officials have followed suit into the private sector.
[51:40.290 --> 51:42.750]  Ooh, terrible tragedy on September 11th.
[51:42.850 --> 51:46.010]  How can we scam on this one, basically?
[51:46.950 --> 51:50.490]  So, sure, you do have the dog and pony show at the airport.
[51:50.630 --> 52:01.350]  A lot of people who are groping you, they've never checked their background at all to see if they're ex-cons or might actually be a sleeper for some terrorist organization we should be afraid of.
[52:01.470 --> 52:06.030]  I just keep getting tempted with those people to show up, put through a carry-on bag.
[52:06.230 --> 52:08.190]  They open it up and there's a smaller one inside.
[52:08.470 --> 52:10.670]  They open it up, there's a smaller one inside.
[52:10.850 --> 52:12.710]  And a smaller one, and a smaller one.
[52:12.770 --> 52:17.570]  Then the little one out jumps a jack-in-the-box that looks just like Osama Bin Laden.
[52:17.570 --> 52:20.790]  Ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho, ho.
[52:21.070 --> 52:24.950]  Or a bush in the box saying, don't mess with Texas, don't mess with Texas.
[52:25.870 --> 52:35.770]  But meanwhile, they're that serious about Homeland Security, why is 90% of our shipping cargo totally uninspected?
[52:36.310 --> 52:40.950]  It's not as though technology ain't there, it just doesn't look as fun on television.
[52:41.250 --> 52:46.730]  Not so much Kiefer Sutherland macho going on, if you're looking at them big shipping containers.
[52:46.730 --> 52:48.250]  But those are big things.
[52:48.250 --> 53:03.250]  If you can want to bring in a surface-to-air missile to shoot down an airliner, material to make a real dirty bomb and everything, although all you'd have to do is steal a shell coated with depleted uranium like we're using to poison the Iraqis and our own soldiers.
[53:03.510 --> 53:05.150]  Anyway, you could bring that in.
[53:05.270 --> 53:12.570]  You could even bring Osama Bin Laden himself in in a shipping container and have a 90% chance of success.
[53:13.630 --> 53:18.670]  He could be driving a cab downstairs in Manhattan right now.
[53:19.350 --> 53:22.490]  Or is he the ice cream man?
[53:23.690 --> 53:24.550]  Oh, yeah.
[53:24.950 --> 53:26.790]  Jello Biafra at the HOPE No.
[53:26.870 --> 53:27.570]  6 conference.
[53:27.950 --> 53:29.870]  Part of what we're offering here tonight.
[53:30.030 --> 53:31.630]  212-209-2950.
[53:31.790 --> 53:31.930]  Jim.
[53:31.930 --> 53:36.950]  I love Jello and his calm, reasoned analysis of the events of the day.
[53:37.250 --> 53:41.070]  Well, I think it's a good counterpoint to all the other perspectives.
[53:41.830 --> 53:43.050]  Well, you think he's insane?
[53:43.050 --> 53:46.970]  I think he adds so much life and pep and excitement.
[53:47.290 --> 53:48.230]  It is an experience.
[53:48.390 --> 53:48.630]  It is.
[53:48.730 --> 53:49.050]  It is entertaining.
[53:49.250 --> 53:51.310]  It's like a ride you have to go on at least once.
[53:51.450 --> 53:53.010]  212-209-2950.
[53:53.010 --> 53:54.050]  So pledge of $200.
[53:54.310 --> 53:57.270]  You'll get all 70 plus DVDs of the HOPE No.
[53:57.350 --> 53:59.510]  6 conference taking place last year.
[53:59.710 --> 54:00.630]  Talks like Jello's.
[54:00.710 --> 54:01.890]  Talks like Steve Rambam's.
[54:01.950 --> 54:02.670]  Talks like Prometheus.
[54:03.010 --> 54:04.650]  Radio people.
[54:04.990 --> 54:06.690]  And gosh, just so many more.
[54:06.810 --> 54:08.010]  We were talking about it during the break.
[54:08.390 --> 54:10.410]  All the different talks that took place.
[54:10.790 --> 54:11.210]  The highlights.
[54:12.210 --> 54:13.670]  And what people have said.
[54:14.110 --> 54:15.490]  212-209-2950.
[54:15.490 --> 54:17.470]  We only have seven minutes left.
[54:17.590 --> 54:18.790]  And I gotta say, this is incredible.
[54:18.990 --> 54:20.210]  We're over $6,000.
[54:21.030 --> 54:23.010]  We missed the $2,600 point.
[54:23.090 --> 54:23.910]  We always like to do this.
[54:24.030 --> 54:24.970]  We missed $2,600 point.
[54:25.170 --> 54:28.850]  And so I said, okay, you know, we'll get the double $2,600 point.
[54:28.950 --> 54:29.330]  $5,200.
[54:29.570 --> 54:31.630]  No, we missed that too because that happened in the middle of Jello.
[54:32.030 --> 54:35.530]  So Mike, you had the idea of $2,600 backwards of $6,200.
[54:35.930 --> 54:35.990]  Yes.
[54:36.310 --> 54:37.550]  Okay, we're at $6,180.
[54:37.810 --> 54:39.050]  So we're almost there.
[54:39.290 --> 54:40.190]  Well, we can't get that.
[54:40.230 --> 54:41.090]  Oh my God.
[54:41.190 --> 54:41.810]  Did you see that?
[54:42.710 --> 54:44.150]  $6,670 we're at now.
[54:44.670 --> 54:46.950]  We've exceeded basically any goal we could set.
[54:47.150 --> 54:52.370]  But any more, the radio station still benefits even when we can't make up numbers to aim for.
[54:53.430 --> 54:55.850]  It's 212-209-2950.
[54:56.150 --> 55:02.890]  There's still about six minutes left in the hour to get this premium and to support the station at the same time.
[55:02.950 --> 55:04.650]  We're not making up the number we're looking at right now.
[55:04.730 --> 55:07.750]  $6,670 brought in in 54 minutes.
[55:07.950 --> 55:08.350]  Incredible.
[55:08.550 --> 55:09.450]  Thank you to so many people.
[55:09.610 --> 55:10.810]  Here are some people to thank specifically.
[55:11.010 --> 55:12.170]  We do have some people to thank for that.
[55:12.170 --> 55:14.150]  William from Greenvale, New York.
[55:14.430 --> 55:16.030]  Demetrius from Bayside, New York.
[55:16.430 --> 55:18.210]  Bernice from Plainfield, New Jersey.
[55:18.750 --> 55:20.870]  Jamal from Missoula, Montana.
[55:21.210 --> 55:22.190]  Missoula, Montana.
[55:22.270 --> 55:22.870]  What a great place.
[55:23.050 --> 55:24.870]  And Joseph from Lindhurst, New Jersey.
[55:25.510 --> 55:25.850]  Okay.
[55:26.130 --> 55:27.430]  Thank you so much to all those people.
[55:27.510 --> 55:31.030]  And to the people calling now, we have five phone lines lit up.
[55:31.250 --> 55:32.370]  More on the way.
[55:32.570 --> 55:34.550]  212-209-2950.
[55:36.590 --> 55:37.990]  And Mike, are those more names for you?
[55:38.130 --> 55:40.150]  No, these are people who wish to remain nameless.
[55:40.330 --> 55:41.050]  So why'd you bring them in?
[55:41.510 --> 55:44.170]  They give them to me, I bring them in, and then I bring them back.
[55:44.170 --> 55:44.850]  It's kind of fun.
[55:45.310 --> 55:45.590]  Wow.
[55:45.810 --> 55:46.510]  But I do want to thank them.
[55:46.510 --> 55:47.170]  But there are many of them, yes.
[55:47.330 --> 55:48.190]  I was just looking.
[55:48.290 --> 55:48.730]  There's so many.
[55:48.830 --> 55:53.930]  All the people who pledge to our show always want to remain anonymous, even though we just read the first name and city.
[55:54.090 --> 55:55.370]  Well, many subscribers do as well.
[55:55.470 --> 55:56.290]  They want to remain anonymous.
[55:56.450 --> 55:57.590]  But you know, it's getting harder and harder.
[55:57.710 --> 56:03.490]  If you listen to Steve, if you listen to Jello, listen to all the people that we have at the Hope Conference, you'll realize how difficult it is to be anonymous.
[56:03.630 --> 56:04.830]  We could thank them by zip code.
[56:05.110 --> 56:05.390]  No.
[56:05.650 --> 56:07.310]  That's probably worse than saying their first name.
[56:07.430 --> 56:07.530]  Well, no.
[56:07.630 --> 56:10.790]  I mean, if it's a zip code like 10021, there are thousands of people there.
[56:10.910 --> 56:12.130]  No, they say they don't want to be identified.
[56:12.150 --> 56:12.370]  All right.
[56:12.410 --> 56:13.290]  And we respect that.
[56:13.390 --> 56:14.870]  And we're not going to identify a shred.
[56:15.030 --> 56:18.030]  What we'll maybe do is just wave the card in front of the microphone.
[56:18.270 --> 56:19.230]  And if you can...
[56:19.230 --> 56:21.790]  You know, there's probably devices that can read the ink off of that.
[56:21.850 --> 56:22.490]  No, stop doing that.
[56:22.590 --> 56:22.910]  Stop doing that.
[56:22.930 --> 56:25.770]  But you can be sure that this is not one of the databases that will be sold.
[56:25.990 --> 56:26.910]  No, definitely not.
[56:27.030 --> 56:28.570]  And Rambam will not have access to it.
[56:28.570 --> 56:28.790]  No.
[56:29.410 --> 56:32.110]  Well, he can get access to anything, but I don't think he's going to get access to this.
[56:32.770 --> 56:33.670]  212-209-2950.
[56:34.310 --> 56:35.410]  We only have a few minutes left.
[56:35.410 --> 56:42.210]  So, if you really haven't called yet, you know, you might just propel us over the 7,000 mark, which is something I never thought I'd see.
[56:42.730 --> 56:45.870]  But boy, I guess this shows there's interest out there.
[56:45.950 --> 56:47.490]  A lot of interest in this kind of thing.
[56:48.110 --> 56:50.270]  And it's going to keep us doing this in the future.
[56:50.610 --> 56:52.450]  So, keep the radio station going.
[56:52.610 --> 56:54.050]  Keep interest in the HOPE conferences going.
[56:54.050 --> 56:58.710]  I would say now we can die happy, but I'm afraid that we'll go past the wrong LED later.
[57:00.890 --> 57:01.290]  Yes.
[57:01.510 --> 57:02.170]  What a day.
[57:02.310 --> 57:02.690]  What a day.
[57:02.770 --> 57:04.210]  A day of sheer panic in Boston.
[57:04.630 --> 57:05.590]  Horrible, horrible joke.
[57:05.750 --> 57:07.590]  Aqua Teen Hunger Force being implicated.
[57:08.950 --> 57:10.530]  And Jim, you made an interesting comment during the break.
[57:10.630 --> 57:11.330]  Do you want me to mention this?
[57:11.350 --> 57:13.170]  Which you had in the past?
[57:13.590 --> 57:15.290]  Jim, somehow it fell into your hands.
[57:15.490 --> 57:18.410]  You had the full plans to Logan Airport in Boston.
[57:18.410 --> 57:19.170]  Ah, yes.
[57:19.170 --> 57:19.390]  Years ago.
[57:19.390 --> 57:23.930]  Back in the days before we were paranoid about everything, why would you have something like this in your hand?
[57:23.990 --> 57:24.790]  Was it that easy to get?
[57:24.990 --> 57:27.290]  It was being thrown out from an architectural firm.
[57:27.450 --> 57:28.150]  But what's the big deal?
[57:28.290 --> 57:28.730]  It's an airport.
[57:28.970 --> 57:29.310]  Yeah, what's the big deal?
[57:29.370 --> 57:29.530]  Exactly.
[57:29.770 --> 57:30.150]  No, wait, wait.
[57:30.210 --> 57:32.450]  But what do you have that normal people don't have access to?
[57:32.450 --> 57:36.970]  Well, actually, I've lost this because it was in a storage room that I no longer own.
[57:37.070 --> 57:37.790]  You didn't pay the rent.
[57:38.310 --> 57:38.630]  Yeah.
[57:38.630 --> 57:42.350]  It's somewhere with Paris Hilton's secret diaries, I guess, now.
[57:43.030 --> 57:50.450]  But yeah, it was in giant books, bigger than coffee tables, several hundred pages each.
[57:50.590 --> 57:57.290]  And we had like 50 or 60 of these that they threw out one night from an architectural firm within three blocks of here, no less.
[57:57.310 --> 58:02.090]  But what Redbird is asking is, what is it that you would have that everyday people can't get a hold of?
[58:02.330 --> 58:06.470]  Locations of the vents, locations of tunnels, locations of fuel lines.
[58:06.470 --> 58:08.690]  You think this is something people shouldn't have access to?
[58:09.270 --> 58:10.430]  You know, it doesn't bother me.
[58:10.510 --> 58:11.150]  Just don't blow it up.
[58:11.410 --> 58:12.090]  Yeah, exactly.
[58:12.090 --> 58:17.610]  Because you don't need those architectural plans to just drop a bomb on the floor and blow it up or just open fire.
[58:18.170 --> 58:18.930]  That's the thing.
[58:19.630 --> 58:22.930]  It's easy to cause mayhem and panic and chaos.
[58:24.390 --> 58:29.590]  It's a lot harder to completely destroy our society by making things more and more secretive and allowing that to happen.
[58:29.770 --> 58:31.110]  And that's what, unfortunately, we seem to be doing.
[58:31.650 --> 58:33.770]  And also, unfortunately, we seem to be out of time.
[58:33.770 --> 58:38.770]  So, again, you have just over two minutes to take advantage of this amazing offer.
[58:38.910 --> 58:40.910]  212-209-2950.
[58:41.370 --> 58:45.150]  The pledge of $200 gets you all the HOPE DVDs from...
[58:45.150 --> 58:45.450]  Or more.
[58:45.570 --> 58:46.250]  You could pledge more.
[58:46.590 --> 58:47.030]  Yeah.
[58:47.250 --> 58:48.690]  Nothing's stopping you from pledging more.
[58:48.890 --> 58:51.190]  Bring us over the $10,000 mark if you can.
[58:51.270 --> 58:51.750]  That'd be great.
[58:52.570 --> 58:55.970]  $50, you get the TV Begons, nifty little devices, 25 and above.
[58:55.970 --> 58:58.550]  You'll get a HOPE, not HOPE, an off-the-hook t-shirt.
[58:58.550 --> 58:59.430]  Yeah.
[58:59.710 --> 59:01.550]  Any final words from anyone else?
[59:02.010 --> 59:05.790]  Any words of encouragement for those people that might not have called in yet?
[59:05.790 --> 59:10.490]  I just want to thank the people who have called in also to thank our volunteers who have been mad hopping.
[59:10.870 --> 59:11.790]  Yes, really.
[59:11.970 --> 59:12.490]  Mad hopping.
[59:12.710 --> 59:17.330]  We want to thank them and also apologize to them at the same time for all the activity we've subjected them to.
[59:17.810 --> 59:19.190]  But we couldn't do it without you.
[59:19.570 --> 59:20.410]  We couldn't do it without our listeners.
[59:20.590 --> 59:21.490]  We couldn't do it without our volunteers.
[59:21.770 --> 59:23.630]  Couldn't do it without this place, WBAI.
[59:23.950 --> 59:25.510]  I want to thank everybody involved.
[59:25.510 --> 59:28.810]  And again, 212-209-2950.
[59:28.990 --> 59:34.370]  If you call in the next two minutes or so, you'll be able to take advantage of the special Hope DVD offer.
[59:34.610 --> 59:37.210]  If you call after that, you can still donate to the radio station.
[59:37.310 --> 59:38.650]  212-209-2950.
[59:39.010 --> 59:40.650]  We'll see you hopefully in two weeks.
[59:40.910 --> 59:41.610]  Have a good night.
[01:01:16.350 --> 01:01:18.090]  Ah, yes, yes, yes.
[01:01:18.430 --> 01:01:20.370]  You know, the Rastaman and Ting, you know.
[01:01:21.010 --> 01:01:21.690]  All right.
[01:01:22.370 --> 01:01:26.570]  Hey, you're listening to WBAI 99.5 FM.