[00:00.000 --> 00:10.880]  Leahy, along with several human rights groups, says the Mexican military is not effectively prosecuting military and police officers who violate human rights, which is one of the stipulations for Merida funding.
[00:11.300 --> 00:14.680]  Tamara Teresiuk is Mexico researcher for Human Rights Watch.
[00:14.680 --> 00:22.980]  Mexico is certainly not meeting one of the conditions that requires that civilian authorities are investigating and prosecuting army abuses.
[00:23.340 --> 00:33.460]  The practice in Mexico is that the military routinely takes over the investigation of these cases, and the result in the vast majority of these cases is impunity.
[00:33.820 --> 00:37.720]  In 2006, President Calderon began employing the military...
[00:37.720 --> 00:40.040]  And you're listening to WBAI New York.
[00:40.200 --> 00:42.000]  The time is just about 7 p.m.
[00:42.240 --> 00:44.480]  Time for another exciting edition of Off the Hook.
[00:52.410 --> 00:56.810]  The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[00:57.850 --> 01:02.310]  I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
[01:03.010 --> 01:10.590]  We couldn't get much worse, but from diddly-bom, but the best is back the worst.
[01:11.230 --> 01:14.150]  I hope that's understood, from diddly-bom!
[01:49.250 --> 01:50.710]  And a very good evening to you.
[01:50.790 --> 01:51.090]  Rob T.
[01:51.170 --> 01:52.030]  Firefly here with you.
[01:52.110 --> 01:52.970]  The show is Off the Hook.
[01:53.150 --> 01:55.190]  I am joined in the studio today by Gus.
[01:55.710 --> 01:56.370]  Oh, hi.
[01:57.570 --> 01:59.550]  And, uh, let's try that again.
[01:59.570 --> 02:00.730]  I'm joined in the studio by Gus.
[02:00.890 --> 02:01.510]  Oh, hi!
[02:02.390 --> 02:03.330]  And, uh, Dot Red.
[02:03.630 --> 02:04.070]  Hey, hello.
[02:04.550 --> 02:05.210]  Jim is here.
[02:05.430 --> 02:05.670]  Hi.
[02:06.210 --> 02:06.610]  Eyeball.
[02:06.990 --> 02:07.450]  Hey, what's up?
[02:08.230 --> 02:09.250]  And Red Hacked.
[02:09.370 --> 02:09.570]  Hello.
[02:11.290 --> 02:13.150]  And, uh, let's see.
[02:13.930 --> 02:17.010]  We are joined on the telephone by, I believe, Emmanuel.
[02:18.970 --> 02:21.310]  Greetings from, uh, Western Ireland.
[02:22.930 --> 02:26.210]  Now, Emmanuel, you're in Western Ireland, which explains why I'm here in your seat.
[02:26.430 --> 02:27.470]  Um, what brings you out there?
[02:29.170 --> 02:38.510]  Uh, well, uh, I decided, uh, to, uh, just sort of wander around, uh, in the, in the, uh, weeks before horror and explore some parts of, uh, some countries I haven't explored before.
[02:38.510 --> 02:41.710]  And I actually, uh, thought to, uh, come out here as well.
[02:42.270 --> 02:44.790]  Um, in addition, I just want to say, uh, Voltaire is here with me.
[02:44.890 --> 02:47.830]  I'm gonna hand the, uh, telephone phone over to him, so he can say hello as well.
[02:48.430 --> 02:49.290]  Hello as well.
[02:49.770 --> 02:50.530]  Hello, Voltaire.
[02:52.790 --> 02:53.690]  So, what are you doing?
[02:53.870 --> 03:02.050]  I don't think he wants to say much more to that because it's, uh, it's, it's midnight here, so, uh, actually, I'm gonna give him the phone and give him the chance to say whatever he wants to say because I know he doesn't want to stay up much longer.
[03:02.590 --> 03:02.950]  That's it.
[03:03.110 --> 03:06.850]  I'm going to sleep, uh, in the British house.
[03:07.150 --> 03:08.470]  Uh, goodnight, everybody in the States.
[03:09.770 --> 03:10.730]  Uh, yes.
[03:11.230 --> 03:11.990]  Follow me on Twitter.
[03:12.830 --> 03:13.650]  Uh, V-O-L-T-O-R.
[03:13.670 --> 03:16.390]  V-O-R-T-O-R-I-R-E.
[03:17.450 --> 03:17.850]  Yes.
[03:18.570 --> 03:20.150]  Okay, that was exciting.
[03:20.430 --> 03:21.270]  Uh, thanks, Voltaire.
[03:21.650 --> 03:24.130]  Go to sleep, and, uh, we'll talk to you tomorrow.
[03:24.610 --> 03:33.090]  Uh, yeah, sorry, um, um, yeah, but I'm here in, um, in, uh, the western part of our life at the Clips of Moher, actually, and, uh, it's, uh, spectacular.
[03:33.370 --> 03:38.150]  Right now I'm sitting in a car, uh, in the middle of, um, I guess it's called a bog.
[03:38.610 --> 03:41.230]  It's kind of this, um, it's not barren landscape.
[03:41.510 --> 03:43.750]  It's very, very colorful, but it's extremely windy.
[03:44.110 --> 03:50.590]  Uh, we're near the ocean, and, um, I was to, to wander around from very small communities.
[03:50.810 --> 03:55.910]  And actually, um, honestly, I was, I was tracking down some old relatives I had never heard of.
[03:56.190 --> 03:56.410]  Okay.
[03:59.910 --> 04:00.770]  I'm losing you.
[04:00.770 --> 04:01.990]  Uh, back down people.
[04:02.330 --> 04:10.450]  Uh, get this, by, uh, by going into a pub and asking for somebody by name, and they knew who the person was.
[04:10.690 --> 04:11.230]  This person was.
[04:13.790 --> 04:15.370]  Okay, we're kind of losing you a little bit.
[04:18.930 --> 04:19.330]  Thanks.
[04:20.190 --> 04:21.990]  I believe, I believe Emmanuel's on a cell phone.
[04:22.790 --> 04:23.610]  Are you on a cell phone?
[04:23.610 --> 04:27.810]  I'm on a cell phone because, I'm on a cell phone because there's no landlines here, unfortunately.
[04:29.090 --> 04:29.850]  Can you hear me?
[04:30.010 --> 04:32.050]  Uh, yeah, you were breaking up, up before.
[04:32.150 --> 04:34.190]  What are you saying about finding, uh, finding relatives?
[04:35.330 --> 04:38.630]  Uh, you're breaking up again?
[04:40.090 --> 04:40.810]  Oh, I'm sorry.
[04:40.990 --> 04:42.370]  Look, there's nothing I can do about this.
[04:42.570 --> 04:45.370]  Uh, there's no landlines here, and I'm on a cell phone in a car, and I'm not moving.
[04:45.970 --> 04:49.070]  Did you, are you, were you by any chance looking for your relatives in the bog?
[04:49.230 --> 04:54.770]  Because I hear, you know, sometimes when your ancestors fall into the bog, they get preserved, and they just stay there for years and years and years.
[04:57.510 --> 04:58.750]  Yes, they were not in the bogs.
[04:58.810 --> 05:00.950]  They, they, they were, uh, in a pub, actually.
[05:01.610 --> 05:07.510]  Uh, and, ha, I was able to find them there simply by asking for them by name, and, and they knew which pub a certain person went.
[05:08.110 --> 05:10.230]  So you, so you've actually met your relatives by now?
[05:11.490 --> 05:12.650]  Uh, pretty much, yeah.
[05:12.770 --> 05:16.170]  I, I, I met at least one of them, and, and, uh, got linked into a whole bunch of others.
[05:16.550 --> 05:19.390]  Uh, just by, it, it, it's, it's strange how things work here.
[05:19.430 --> 05:20.910]  People live here their entire lives.
[05:21.170 --> 05:24.690]  Uh, they live in the same houses that have existed for generations.
[05:25.250 --> 05:26.750]  They don't move around all the time.
[05:27.050 --> 05:28.470]  It's very small, contained.
[05:28.630 --> 05:29.370]  People know each other.
[05:29.830 --> 05:30.650]  Very scenic.
[05:30.990 --> 05:33.170]  Uh, I should also point out, I've rented a car.
[05:33.930 --> 05:36.490]  And what that means is I have to drive on the left side of the road.
[05:36.690 --> 05:37.670]  That's the easy part.
[05:37.810 --> 05:39.490]  The driving on the left side of the road is very easy.
[05:39.990 --> 05:43.130]  Uh, shifting with your left hand instead of your right hand, that's easy, too.
[05:43.690 --> 05:46.990]  I imagine for those people who don't know how to use stick shift, that would be the hard part.
[05:47.330 --> 05:57.890]  The hardest part for me, though, is driving on these incredibly narrow roads that have absolutely no shoulder whatsoever, uh, that border cliffs, oftentimes, that have brick walls exactly on, on the edge of the road.
[05:58.050 --> 06:02.710]  And of course, you're passing cars and buses that are going a hundred kilometers an hour in the opposite direction.
[06:02.870 --> 06:09.790]  So it's really, uh, that to me is a challenge, but it's an incredible change of lifestyle just to be here and to see the way people live here.
[06:10.390 --> 06:15.190]  Now, in terms of, uh, finding people, did you somehow figure out their names ahead of time?
[06:15.250 --> 06:18.990]  Or did you show up and say, where are you, are you the grandson of so-and-so or the great-grandson?
[06:19.210 --> 06:21.910]  He just said, you know, I have the, the good old Irish name Goldstein.
[06:22.190 --> 06:23.070]  Um, where are my relatives?
[06:24.830 --> 06:26.470]  Yeah, no, it wasn't anything like that.
[06:26.550 --> 06:28.050]  Basically, I, I knew the name.
[06:28.150 --> 06:31.050]  It was, uh, you know, a family name that, that, uh, went back.
[06:31.210 --> 06:35.210]  But the question was, were there still people here from that particular family?
[06:35.670 --> 06:39.730]  And I was told that all you have to do is walk into a pub and ask for that name.
[06:39.750 --> 06:43.410]  And they'll say, oh yes, down the road on this farm is where that family lives.
[06:43.550 --> 06:44.830]  I didn't think it would be that easy.
[06:44.970 --> 06:46.430]  It actually sort of happened in reverse.
[06:46.910 --> 06:55.510]  Uh, we were kind of walking around town and asking people and they directed us to the pub and said, uh, this guy drinks there, uh, at, on, in evenings.
[06:55.670 --> 06:56.690]  And that's just how people are known.
[06:56.890 --> 06:59.970]  That is known as which pub they drink in at a particular time of night.
[07:00.490 --> 07:03.470]  And it was that simple walking in saying, where's this person over there?
[07:03.610 --> 07:03.850]  Thank you.
[07:03.910 --> 07:04.730]  Hey, I'm your relative.
[07:05.870 --> 07:06.630]  That's how it went.
[07:06.790 --> 07:08.650]  Now, are people in Ireland used to this happening?
[07:08.810 --> 07:12.310]  Because I'm under the impression that a lot of Americans do go back and try to find their roots.
[07:12.450 --> 07:17.130]  So is this something where they're like, oh, hum, yeah, all our other cousins have come and looked for us too, or is this a completely new thing for them?
[07:18.290 --> 07:27.270]  Well, I suspect it might be because as soon as I started the conversation in the pub, uh, with, with, with the gentleman sitting there and I said, uh, you know, I might be your relative, uh, from the United States.
[07:27.430 --> 07:29.550]  The guy sitting next to him said, okay, it's going to take a while.
[07:29.550 --> 07:30.930]  He got up and offered me his seat.
[07:31.650 --> 07:32.730]  I think I used to it.
[07:34.730 --> 07:35.050]  Excellent.
[07:36.030 --> 07:36.950]  So are they like you?
[07:37.030 --> 07:39.110]  Yeah, we all had pints and everybody's, uh, I'm sorry, what?
[07:39.290 --> 07:41.050]  Are they, are they like you, the relatives that you've met?
[07:42.630 --> 07:43.990]  Uh, well, I don't know.
[07:44.230 --> 07:45.850]  I, I'm the last one to judge that.
[07:46.570 --> 07:50.250]  But, um, suffice to say, it's, it's a very interesting change of culture here.
[07:50.470 --> 07:55.450]  Uh, even if you don't have relatives, just to be in a place like this where all the rules are turned around.
[07:55.630 --> 07:58.990]  And I, I just kind of like doing that and seeing how things are, are different.
[07:59.430 --> 08:00.970]  Uh, tomorrow I'm off to Wales.
[08:01.410 --> 08:05.950]  Uh, I'm not exactly sure where in Wales I'm winding up, but I'll, I'll be there for a day and then it's over to London.
[08:05.950 --> 08:08.290]  I think I'm going to be in London for the 2600 meeting on Friday.
[08:08.410 --> 08:09.050]  So that's going to be fun.
[08:09.610 --> 08:10.190]  Very cool.
[08:10.190 --> 08:12.290]  So any, any listeners out there, take note.
[08:13.050 --> 08:19.650]  Um, so we have to actually do a couple of things, Emmanuel, uh, today besides speak to you in Ireland.
[08:19.850 --> 08:20.930]  We have a lot of things on our plate.
[08:21.390 --> 08:26.090]  Um, we should probably start with, uh, bringing up what, uh, kind of show today, uh, is.
[08:26.270 --> 08:27.790]  It's a pledge drive show.
[08:28.130 --> 08:29.450]  It's a pledge drive show.
[08:30.190 --> 08:30.830]  Yes, indeed.
[08:30.870 --> 08:31.710]  It's a fundraiser.
[08:32.750 --> 08:34.070]  Yeah, it's a crazy show.
[08:34.290 --> 08:38.570]  Uh, and, uh, not only are we going to, uh, be doing, uh, fundraising.
[08:38.690 --> 08:40.350]  We're going to try and reach people all over the world.
[08:40.610 --> 08:40.610]  Yep.
[08:41.270 --> 08:45.070]  Uh, now do you, uh, do you have somebody, uh, we're going to try to reach?
[08:45.210 --> 08:49.970]  Uh, I'm going to attempt to reach Mike, who I believe is in Morocco right now.
[08:50.230 --> 08:54.330]  That should be in, he might not be, he might not be there anymore, but his, his, his phone number is certainly in Morocco.
[08:54.370 --> 08:59.030]  So I'm going to call that number, um, and, uh, try to get in touch with him.
[08:59.210 --> 08:59.530]  But he promised.
[09:00.030 --> 09:01.590]  He promised that he'd be in Morocco.
[09:01.830 --> 09:03.290]  So if he left Morocco, that's breach of contract.
[09:03.290 --> 09:05.370]  Well, I assume he's there, but I don't really know his itinerary.
[09:06.050 --> 09:08.970]  So, uh, I'll try to reach him.
[09:09.170 --> 09:10.570]  Uh, why don't you all talk about fundraising?
[09:12.170 --> 09:13.530]  Well, okay, we can do that.
[09:13.810 --> 09:17.530]  Um, basically we're at that particular point, uh, in the summer.
[09:17.750 --> 09:19.030]  Usually this happens in July.
[09:19.470 --> 09:22.490]  Uh, so for those people rolling your eyes saying, hey, we're doing it again.
[09:22.630 --> 09:23.070]  You know what?
[09:23.090 --> 09:24.510]  We had a month reprieve here.
[09:24.910 --> 09:36.190]  Unfortunately, that month reprieve landed the mini fund drive in the middle of the most hectic show that off the hook does, uh, which is when we go over to Europe and, uh, and broadcast from various hacker conferences.
[09:36.410 --> 09:41.570]  We have hacking at random coming up next week and we'll be broadcasting from there live next Wednesday.
[09:41.850 --> 09:44.850]  Uh, but unfortunately we, uh, we also have to raise funds.
[09:44.970 --> 09:46.550]  So it's going to be a lot of things going on at once.
[09:46.710 --> 09:57.550]  You can help make this whole process a lot easier on everybody, uh, simply by supporting the station, supporting the show and making us feel like we're actually, uh, reaching you and making a difference.
[09:58.050 --> 10:08.790]  And, uh, you know, staying up until all hours of the night in different parts of the world, uh, so that we can talk to people back in New York and actually, uh, who call in the station and, and, and support us.
[10:09.110 --> 10:11.810]  Our phone number is 212-209-2950.
[10:12.570 --> 10:18.330]  And, uh, we have, I guess we, uh, Red Hack, would you just give out the information as far as, uh, what we're offering tonight?
[10:18.650 --> 10:27.230]  Uh, I believe for a pledge of $75, uh, we're offering a, uh, five-year subscription to 2,600 as well as a 2,600, uh, sweatshirt.
[10:27.390 --> 10:28.210]  And that's for $75.
[10:28.450 --> 10:28.730]  $75.
[10:28.910 --> 10:29.150]  $75.
[10:29.290 --> 10:29.390]  $75.
[10:29.610 --> 10:30.490]  And for $25?
[10:30.950 --> 10:31.230]  Hang on.
[10:31.370 --> 10:41.390]  You mean, you mean we have, we have to give five years of 2,600 magazine to people calling and pledge $75 and a 2,600 sweatshirt?
[10:41.490 --> 10:44.550]  The, the, the black pullover ones with the, uh, government seal?
[10:44.650 --> 10:45.330]  Is that what you're telling me?
[10:45.430 --> 10:46.410]  I believe that's what you said.
[10:48.650 --> 10:49.670]  Oh, is that what you said?
[10:49.890 --> 10:51.950]  And if you have a problem with that, it's, um, tough.
[10:52.110 --> 10:53.430]  You're in Europe right now, and we're here.
[10:53.610 --> 10:55.870]  Yeah, the inmates are running the asylum here, so, uh, you know.
[10:56.250 --> 11:03.490]  Well, can I just, can I just say that that deal, that's kind of insane, because that's, you know, that's, it's much more expensive to buy those things.
[11:04.110 --> 11:07.690]  And, uh, we've got to cough up these, these premiums for all the people that call in.
[11:07.830 --> 11:12.590]  So, wow, okay, well, I guess that's kind of, uh, generous for all this.
[11:12.590 --> 11:18.210]  Generous, and, and also generous for the pledgers, because they, once again, support the, the radio station.
[11:19.410 --> 11:20.210]  Which is important.
[11:20.310 --> 11:21.270]  All right, well, how can they do that?
[11:21.570 --> 11:27.130]  They can, uh, do that by calling 212-209-2950.
[11:27.130 --> 11:27.570]  Five zero.
[11:27.810 --> 11:27.930]  Five zero.
[11:28.190 --> 11:28.410]  There we go.
[11:28.530 --> 11:30.210]  Between the three of us, I think we have that number down.
[11:31.550 --> 11:32.830]  Let's, let's try that again.
[11:32.950 --> 11:33.150]  Yes.
[11:34.370 --> 11:37.230]  212-209-2950.
[11:37.790 --> 11:38.250]  There we go.
[11:39.010 --> 11:39.310]  Okay.
[11:39.550 --> 11:41.650]  Well, uh, how many calls are coming in right now?
[11:41.730 --> 11:43.930]  It must be a lot, because that's, that's what I'm saying.
[11:44.030 --> 11:47.490]  Yeah, five years subscription, that's, that goes until 2014.
[11:48.150 --> 11:51.490]  Yeah, our plan is basically to bankrupt you, um, while you're out of town, out of the country.
[11:51.970 --> 11:52.430]  So, yeah.
[11:52.570 --> 11:52.810]  For God's sake.
[11:52.930 --> 11:56.150]  I mean, yeah, this is, this is, and a, and a sweatshirt on top of that.
[11:56.250 --> 11:59.870]  That's to keep people warm while they read 212-209 for the next five years.
[12:00.750 --> 12:05.190]  I'm, I'm almost loath to tell you this, but it appears we, oh, here, we have one call now.
[12:05.550 --> 12:06.270]  We didn't a moment ago.
[12:06.390 --> 12:10.290]  Speaking of calls, uh, I believe we have, uh, Mike on the line.
[12:11.690 --> 12:12.930]  Yes, I believe that as well.
[12:13.350 --> 12:14.110]  Hello, Mike.
[12:14.630 --> 12:15.430]  Mike, how are you?
[12:15.610 --> 12:17.430]  Greetings from the west coast of Ireland.
[12:19.210 --> 12:20.990]  Uh, greetings, greetings as well.
[12:21.190 --> 12:23.410]  I'm in, in Fez, which is in Morocco.
[12:23.850 --> 12:27.810]  And, uh, there's no people walking around with funny hats as far as I've seen.
[12:28.270 --> 12:34.810]  Uh, but, but I'm listening to these, uh, to these pledge levels that you can get by calling 212-209-2950.
[12:35.370 --> 12:40.230]  And, and I'm thinking that the last thing in the world I want right now is, uh, a sweatshirt.
[12:40.450 --> 12:42.930]  It's about 40 degrees here, uh, Celsius.
[12:43.490 --> 12:48.470]  Uh, so, so are there other pledge levels as well, or, or is that the one tonight?
[12:48.690 --> 12:53.550]  I, I think the other one is at $25, uh, you get a, uh, off the hook t-shirt.
[12:54.030 --> 12:56.830]  The exclusive off the hook t-shirt, which you cannot get anywhere else.
[12:56.990 --> 12:58.590]  It'll probably do you better in the warmer climes.
[12:59.630 --> 13:06.450]  I, I think, and of course, with any pledge, you get the, the radio station, which is something that's, that's unique.
[13:07.490 --> 13:07.930]  Right.
[13:08.010 --> 13:13.030]  And that's, that's very important because, um, you know, we have to do this because we don't have advertising on the station.
[13:13.190 --> 13:14.830]  I personally am not a big fan of advertising.
[13:15.110 --> 13:28.930]  Um, the only way you can continue to run a station like this that says things that maybe would piss off a lot of people that, um, want to, um, advertise is, um, is, is, uh, by funding, funding them.
[13:28.930 --> 13:29.410]  Yeah.
[13:29.550 --> 13:36.310]  We're, we're not, uh, keeping the lights on here by selling you soft drinks or, uh, you know, telling you what, uh, what bands to listen to where this is it.
[13:36.390 --> 13:39.610]  This is all that, uh, keeps us going is you, you listening right now.
[13:39.850 --> 13:49.750]  And, uh, when you call 212-209-2950 and, uh, speak with one of our wonderful pledge volunteers, um, you, you're the one that's, uh, keeping the station going.
[13:51.130 --> 13:51.750]  Here's the thing.
[13:51.870 --> 13:52.030]  Okay.
[13:52.030 --> 13:54.230]  Now I know what 2600 Magazine is.
[13:54.350 --> 14:08.730]  I know what five years of putting out 2600 Magazine can do to somebody, but the listeners, some of the listeners might not know what 2600 Magazine is and what they can get for a pledge of $75, five years of the magazine, plus the sweatshirt, plus the t-shirt,
[14:09.110 --> 14:10.950]  212-209-2950.
[14:11.650 --> 14:16.710]  Can anyone there, uh, describe in a better quality voice than what I have, uh, what they'd be getting for that?
[14:19.910 --> 14:21.690]  Uh, that's, uh, sorry.
[14:22.250 --> 14:25.570]  Uh, five, I mean, five years, uh, of, of 2600 is about what?
[14:25.570 --> 14:26.870]  20, 20 issues.
[14:27.050 --> 14:27.550]  20 issues.
[14:27.690 --> 14:34.810]  Um, this is a quarterly and that's 20 issues packed full of, uh, uh, articles written by hackers, uh, out there.
[14:35.010 --> 14:41.950]  Um, and it's five years from, it's, it's five years worth of the magazine and five years is a long time in, uh, in our community.
[14:42.230 --> 14:49.550]  And in terms of like the technical world, I mean, as, as far as you'll, you'll still be getting this machine, uh, this machine, this magazine in 2014.
[14:50.250 --> 14:52.530]  Um, I don't even know what I'll be doing in 2014.
[14:52.830 --> 15:01.610]  I don't even buy green bananas, but if you call 212-209-2950 and, uh, pledge $75, you will still be getting this magazine in 2014.
[15:03.050 --> 15:06.570]  Well, I guess that means I've got to keep working on it for the next five years.
[15:06.730 --> 15:09.250]  But let me just ask a question that some of our listeners might have.
[15:09.410 --> 15:14.610]  Uh, you say it's a magazine for hackers, about hackers, surely such a thing must be illegal.
[15:19.050 --> 15:19.470]  No.
[15:19.470 --> 15:23.510]  We have this thing called freedom of speech and freedom of the press at the moment.
[15:23.630 --> 15:23.790]  Yes.
[15:24.250 --> 15:24.650]  For now.
[15:25.270 --> 15:25.790]  At the moment.
[15:26.010 --> 15:26.210]  Okay.
[15:26.290 --> 15:27.450]  In five years, who knows?
[15:28.390 --> 15:29.430]  But, um, wow.
[15:29.610 --> 15:29.830]  Okay.
[15:29.990 --> 15:39.590]  So, um, so five years, uh, it's a quarterly magazine about, uh, what, uh, 68 pages per issue, uh, and all kinds of articles from the hacker community about various things.
[15:39.910 --> 15:49.730]  And, uh, sort of the reason why we're on the air, because, uh, we started with the magazine, moved on to radio and pretty much cover a lot of the same topics on the radio, uh, that we cover in the magazine.
[15:49.870 --> 15:54.630]  So it's an amazing way to get, um, uh, to get introduced to the whole hacker world and the whole hacker spirit.
[15:54.790 --> 16:05.150]  And if, if you already get a subscription or you already read the magazine, or if you don't care and don't want to read it or are afraid to get it delivered to your home, you can always order it for somebody else.
[16:05.290 --> 16:09.710]  You can have it sent, uh, to, to someone you, you like a lot or somebody you don't like a lot.
[16:09.950 --> 16:11.090]  Uh, it's very simple.
[16:11.230 --> 16:13.990]  All you have to do is Call 212-209-2950.
[16:14.330 --> 16:15.350]  You get the five years.
[16:15.490 --> 16:21.810]  You also get the toasty warm sweatshirt, which I know, if you're in Morocco, I'm sure a lot of people in Morocco aren't calling us right now.
[16:22.070 --> 16:34.910]  But if you're in New York or if you're in the States anywhere or if you're on the western coast of Ireland, I can tell you, at some point you're going to need a jacket because things get pretty cold or pretty windy, and it's really good not to be underdressed.
[16:34.910 --> 16:36.310]  And this is a quality jacket.
[16:36.470 --> 16:46.350]  This is something that many of us have worn, and we can attest that it keeps you anonymous in many ways when you pull the hoodie up, and it keeps you warm on those windy days.
[16:46.750 --> 16:57.090]  And in addition to that, for the nice hot summer days, which I guess you people are experiencing in New York, you get the stylish off-the-hook t-shirt, which shows that you're a listener and a supporter.
[16:57.310 --> 16:59.690]  212-209-2950.
[17:00.070 --> 17:02.250]  Our goal tonight is something like $1,000.
[17:02.250 --> 17:06.290]  So that means basically, I think, 12 or 13 people calling in.
[17:06.370 --> 17:07.310]  That will get us to the goal.
[17:07.650 --> 17:08.750]  And that's a success.
[17:08.750 --> 17:11.570]  That means we can move on and do all kinds of other subject matter.
[17:11.690 --> 17:16.690]  We have people spread out all throughout the world tonight, and we'd like to be able to talk about some of the things that we're doing.
[17:17.070 --> 17:22.430]  But the most important thing is to keep the station on the air because we can't talk about anything if there's no station.
[17:22.890 --> 17:26.810]  Speaking of people around the world, Mike, what exactly are you doing in Morocco?
[17:28.470 --> 17:34.490]  I'm just traveling around a little bit before I head up to the Netherlands for Haar.
[17:35.390 --> 17:38.530]  It's a very fascinating country here.
[17:40.610 --> 17:41.350]  I don't know.
[17:41.590 --> 17:44.750]  Let's talk about the trains because we always talk about trains on this show.
[17:44.990 --> 17:50.210]  And the thing that's surprising me is that the trains run every hour or two, and they run on time.
[17:50.210 --> 17:57.830]  So this country, which is in the northwest corner of Africa, is able to run trains better than Amtrak.
[17:58.070 --> 18:00.590]  And I don't really understand how that's possible.
[18:02.870 --> 18:05.470]  Well, I mean, isn't it really easy?
[18:05.630 --> 18:08.170]  I don't think I've found any train system that's been run worse.
[18:08.270 --> 18:09.350]  Maybe in Russia.
[18:09.750 --> 18:10.930]  I've never been to Russia.
[18:11.150 --> 18:13.290]  I mean, Emmanuel, you could maybe enlighten us on that.
[18:14.710 --> 18:17.910]  Well, I mean, you know, it depends what part of Amtrak you're using.
[18:18.330 --> 18:20.170]  Some parts are a lot worse than others.
[18:20.410 --> 18:23.630]  I have seen worse in some places.
[18:24.230 --> 18:29.890]  But most of the people in Europe who complain about the trains running, they're talking about things that are maybe five minutes late.
[18:30.390 --> 18:33.210]  Their standards are just so much higher than ours.
[18:33.590 --> 18:40.690]  So while they're complaining vigorously about something, they really don't know what that is until they experience the American train system.
[18:40.770 --> 18:41.590]  Hopefully that will change.
[18:41.590 --> 18:48.670]  Hopefully we'll see improvements and we'll have mass transit going all over the country the way we should, because that really does make a difference.
[18:49.030 --> 18:52.550]  But out here in Ireland, for instance, the trains are rather sparse.
[18:52.710 --> 18:55.230]  They run a little bit late, but they do run well.
[18:55.730 --> 19:07.550]  But there are so many places you can't get to by train, which is why I rented a car, and also just for the challenge of it, driving on the other side and dealing with all the craziness of a herd of sheep crossing the road and things like that.
[19:08.610 --> 19:10.250]  So there are places where it is.
[19:10.250 --> 19:12.130]  I'm surprised to hear Morocco is so good.
[19:12.330 --> 19:15.450]  But, Mike, how many different lines do they have in Morocco?
[19:16.910 --> 19:33.290]  There's sort of one main line that runs from Marrakesh in the south of the country up to Casablanca and over towards Fez, where I am, and then beyond to some cities, which I can't really pronounce.
[19:34.570 --> 19:36.190]  And then there's some branches.
[19:36.450 --> 19:41.210]  There's one that runs north to Tangiers, and some commuter branches.
[19:41.210 --> 19:43.410]  One runs towards the airport.
[19:43.670 --> 19:57.870]  And one thing that I'm actually curious to find out about is there seems to be a brand-new branch that goes to Malia, which is this part of Spain, which is actually in Morocco.
[19:58.350 --> 20:03.410]  And I actually have to go there to catch a boat to Europe.
[20:03.950 --> 20:06.970]  And I've heard that as of one month ago...
[20:08.070 --> 20:09.030]  Sorry, go ahead.
[20:09.110 --> 20:11.010]  I'm going to try to get Emmanuel back on the line.
[20:11.430 --> 20:11.710]  Okay.
[20:12.150 --> 20:16.070]  As of one month ago, I've heard that there's a brand-new train line.
[20:17.170 --> 20:23.470]  This seems kind of strange to me, because the rumors are that it wasn't supposed to open until 2010 or 2011.
[20:23.950 --> 20:35.890]  So if, in fact, this rumor is true and it does exist now, then it means that the line opened a year or two ahead of schedule, which is something that I've never heard of before in any country.
[20:38.710 --> 20:42.870]  But other than that, I've just been traveling around a bit.
[20:42.870 --> 20:52.450]  But I was, as I said, in Marrakesh before and in a place called Aswarya, which is by the Atlantic Ocean.
[20:54.290 --> 21:00.910]  And it was filled with Moroccans on holiday from other parts of Morocco.
[21:02.630 --> 21:09.730]  Very calm place, unlike some of the other cities here, which are just full of people, full of life.
[21:09.730 --> 21:12.970]  It's about a little past midnight now.
[21:13.130 --> 21:22.890]  And just before the show, I went down to the street because I needed to get a recharge card for my telephone.
[21:23.430 --> 21:27.490]  And there's just all kinds of people about, all kinds of things still going on.
[21:28.310 --> 21:31.250]  And it's very, very exciting, very lively.
[21:33.530 --> 21:35.670]  And what time of the day is it where you are?
[21:37.870 --> 21:39.290]  It's just past midnight.
[21:40.670 --> 21:44.650]  Whatever, however many minutes past the hour it is, it's that many minutes past midnight.
[21:47.330 --> 21:49.730]  Okay, we're still trying to get Emmanuel back on the line.
[21:50.590 --> 21:57.330]  Well, while we do that, it's been a couple of minutes since we asked our listeners to pledge their support.
[21:57.510 --> 22:00.710]  212-209-2950 is the number.
[22:00.710 --> 22:03.090]  And I don't know how my connection is.
[22:03.210 --> 22:06.970]  Maybe someone who's on a good connection wants to explain why that's important.
[22:07.810 --> 22:08.890]  You sound very good.
[22:09.270 --> 22:10.310]  Probably better than I do.
[22:11.470 --> 22:13.730]  I would say it's like democracy of the radio.
[22:13.970 --> 22:15.610]  You know, your vote is by pledging.
[22:15.750 --> 22:20.610]  If you really want the station to remain, the only way to do it is by calling that number, which is...
[22:20.610 --> 22:23.250]  212-209-2950.
[22:23.830 --> 22:24.570]  So call now.
[22:25.470 --> 22:26.290]  Come on, you people.
[22:26.370 --> 22:27.230]  You've got to get with the program.
[22:27.230 --> 22:29.430]  I'm 212-209-2950.
[22:29.750 --> 22:30.590]  It's the number.
[22:30.690 --> 22:36.330]  Country code 1, if you're either normally overseas or temporarily overseas, dial that.
[22:36.830 --> 22:41.070]  And it's really your pledges that keep the radio station on the air.
[22:41.170 --> 22:45.490]  I know we say that every time, but we say it every time because it's true.
[22:46.530 --> 22:53.670]  Without your support and the support of your fellow listeners, WBAI and Off the Hook would simply cease to exist.
[22:54.350 --> 23:05.610]  And in addition to keeping us on the air, maybe you don't really care that much, you get the wonderful premiums, the sweatshirt, the t-shirt, the magazine subscription.
[23:06.650 --> 23:07.690]  So give us a call.
[23:07.810 --> 23:09.850]  212-209-2950.
[23:11.970 --> 23:18.050]  And of course, once again, for a pledge of $25 or more, you will get the exclusive Off the Hook t-shirt.
[23:18.610 --> 23:21.110]  Not available anywhere else or anyhow else.
[23:21.110 --> 23:30.390]  And for a pledge of $75 or more, you will also get the 2600 sweatshirt along with a five-year subscription to 2600 The Hacker Quarterly.
[23:30.810 --> 23:32.670]  And I believe we have manual back on the air.
[23:33.870 --> 23:34.630]  Yeah, wow.
[23:34.730 --> 23:35.650]  That was epic.
[23:35.910 --> 23:37.610]  I don't know what's happening with the phone.
[23:37.950 --> 23:44.270]  Maybe RedHack, you can explain what we're going through to get the phone to work tonight because we had a particular challenge.
[23:44.270 --> 23:46.930]  I'm using a cell phone with an Irish SIM.
[23:47.150 --> 23:54.810]  And apparently, the service we usually use, which is a toll-free number that can go anywhere in the world, for some reason, it doesn't support Irish mobiles.
[23:54.910 --> 23:57.450]  So we can't use an Irish cell phone on this system.
[23:57.530 --> 23:58.170]  We have to use...
[23:58.170 --> 23:58.630]  What are we using?
[23:59.750 --> 24:03.250]  So we're using, actually, Google Voice to connect.
[24:03.490 --> 24:09.750]  So what's happening is that it's calling the studio and calling you at the same time and then kind of patching us together.
[24:10.510 --> 24:14.250]  The problem that we just faced was me not knowing how to operate the phone in the studio.
[24:14.790 --> 24:16.390]  Google Voice was doing a fine job.
[24:17.590 --> 24:18.090]  Well, wait.
[24:18.170 --> 24:19.410]  Why did it disconnect in the first place?
[24:19.530 --> 24:20.370]  Oh, that was it.
[24:20.370 --> 24:21.650]  That was it, just disconnecting.
[24:21.790 --> 24:25.470]  But the two times after that were me hanging up on you.
[24:26.730 --> 24:28.350]  Okay, well, it's just disconnecting.
[24:28.410 --> 24:29.990]  I don't think it means it's doing a fine job.
[24:30.010 --> 24:30.770]  Well, it could be...
[24:30.770 --> 24:31.470]  It could have been...
[24:31.470 --> 24:33.190]  On this side, it could have been with your mobile.
[24:33.330 --> 24:34.230]  It could have disconnected also.
[24:34.570 --> 24:35.410]  We may never know.
[24:36.690 --> 24:37.650]  Don't blame my mobile.
[24:37.750 --> 24:38.630]  My mobile's just fine.
[24:38.730 --> 24:39.830]  Google Voice is on notice.
[24:40.010 --> 24:41.270]  We don't expect this to happen again.
[24:41.450 --> 24:41.690]  Okay.
[24:42.370 --> 24:43.570]  And how are we connecting to Mike?
[24:43.670 --> 24:43.950]  Same way?
[24:43.950 --> 24:44.530]  Uh, no.
[24:44.710 --> 24:47.350]  We were connecting to Mike via the number.
[24:47.490 --> 24:53.370]  That one, that one for some reason we'll call a Moroccan cell phone but not an Irish one.
[24:54.310 --> 24:54.890]  You should get that.
[24:54.890 --> 24:55.470]  That is so weird.
[24:55.550 --> 24:56.290]  I don't know why that is.
[24:57.410 --> 24:58.130]  But, um...
[24:59.310 --> 25:04.870]  Actually, I think that we were going to try to reach Vienna next, which means we'll have to...
[25:04.870 --> 25:05.190]  Oh, yeah.
[25:05.190 --> 25:05.690]  Why not?
[25:05.870 --> 25:06.290]  You know what?
[25:06.350 --> 25:09.190]  Let's try the whole world together so we can totally confuse ourselves.
[25:09.330 --> 25:09.870]  I'm up for that.
[25:10.050 --> 25:16.010]  But, you know, the thing that's not confusing here that we need to make very straight and clear is that we need phone calls to come in.
[25:16.170 --> 25:20.010]  And I'm sitting here in the middle of the darkness in the wilderness in Ireland.
[25:20.190 --> 25:24.130]  I get this feeling, this sense that we're not getting enough phone calls.
[25:24.210 --> 25:29.130]  Is that something that I'm just imagining or is that gloominess something that actually is real?
[25:29.750 --> 25:31.930]  Unfortunately, your spider sense is correct.
[25:31.930 --> 25:35.050]  We have no phone calls and that's pretty inexcusable.
[25:35.570 --> 25:37.890]  Yes, we want to see the switchboard light up.
[25:37.890 --> 25:41.690]  We don't call Vienna until we get some phone calls.
[25:41.850 --> 25:44.770]  What I'm hearing is an amazing deal here and we're only offering it tonight.
[25:44.910 --> 25:46.110]  This is not going to be offered next week.
[25:46.230 --> 25:47.890]  This is not going to be offered ever again.
[25:48.010 --> 25:51.730]  So as soon as I get home, I'm going to make sure this kind of offer is never offered again.
[25:51.870 --> 25:58.970]  My God, five years of 2600 magazine and a 2600 sweatshirt and an off-the-hook t-shirt for a pledge of $75.
[25:59.190 --> 26:00.430]  Are we out of our minds?
[26:01.190 --> 26:02.110]  It's quite possible.
[26:04.050 --> 26:06.930]  Well, 212-209-2950.
[26:06.930 --> 26:11.770]  We should have every single phone line lit for something amazing like that.
[26:11.950 --> 26:26.510]  And the thing is, not only do you get all of that, but then we can get back to the subject at hand, which is talking about the upcoming HART conference, connecting to a special mystery person in Vienna, I believe, and moving out with the program.
[26:27.050 --> 26:30.630]  But guys, give out the phone number a few more times in case my voice isn't coming through well.
[26:30.990 --> 26:33.570]  212-209-2950.
[26:35.630 --> 26:38.290]  Mike, maybe a Moroccan tone would help.
[26:39.790 --> 26:40.610]  I don't know.
[26:40.650 --> 26:47.490]  I don't know that I can pull off a Moroccan accent, but the phone number 1-212-209-2950.
[26:48.130 --> 26:51.390]  And you need to call it now to pledge your support.
[26:51.930 --> 26:55.190]  This deal, as Emmanuel said, is not going to last forever.
[26:55.430 --> 26:58.590]  And without your support, the radio station is not going to last forever.
[26:58.810 --> 27:00.010]  So give us a call.
[27:00.010 --> 27:01.510]  There are two calls on the line.
[27:01.550 --> 27:03.170]  212-209-2950.
[27:04.550 --> 27:06.290]  Mike, your voice is very effective.
[27:07.830 --> 27:09.190]  I want to hear four calls.
[27:09.250 --> 27:10.710]  I want to hear that four calls are coming in.
[27:10.810 --> 27:11.650]  We have two now that's good.
[27:12.010 --> 27:13.630]  212-209-2950.
[27:13.910 --> 27:17.690]  By the way, Mike, I understand you're also in a different 212 area code.
[27:17.770 --> 27:18.850]  Do you want to explain what that's all about?
[27:20.090 --> 27:20.530]  Yes.
[27:20.790 --> 27:32.470]  So one of the maybe more amusing coincidences is that I left, of course, from area code 212, which is part of the United States, Manhattan, in fact.
[27:33.090 --> 27:35.330]  And I'm now in country code 212.
[27:35.810 --> 27:42.950]  So people in the United States dial 0 and 1, 212, and then a whole bunch more digits to reach people in this country.
[27:44.430 --> 27:44.830]  Okay.
[27:44.950 --> 27:46.050]  Well, we very briefly...
[27:46.050 --> 27:46.430]  What I...
[27:46.850 --> 27:47.410]  I'm sorry.
[27:47.530 --> 27:49.010]  We have four calls on the line right now.
[27:50.310 --> 27:50.710]  Okay.
[27:50.850 --> 27:51.230]  That's good.
[27:51.410 --> 27:51.990]  Thank you, people.
[27:52.190 --> 27:55.370]  Please keep calling in because your support makes all of this possible.
[27:55.550 --> 28:00.670]  We wouldn't have done a single show were it not for listeners like you, and we've done so many of them now from all over the world.
[28:01.250 --> 28:02.590]  I was talking to Mike about this.
[28:05.230 --> 28:05.610]  Okay.
[28:05.730 --> 28:10.150]  You know, with cell phones, with cell phones, you don't have to dial...
[28:22.850 --> 28:25.010]  What were you saying about cell phones?
[28:25.070 --> 28:25.790]  We missed that part.
[28:29.870 --> 28:32.470]  Something that the cell phone company does not want us to know.
[28:33.830 --> 28:34.310]  Yes.
[28:35.570 --> 28:38.470]  Apparently, they're cheating and keeping us from knowing it.
[28:39.810 --> 28:41.110]  Listen, I'll tell the story.
[28:41.310 --> 28:42.530]  I'll tell the story one way or another.
[28:44.690 --> 28:45.090]  Wow.
[28:45.190 --> 28:47.570]  It appears we actually have now...
[28:47.570 --> 28:48.250]  Many, many calls.
[28:48.370 --> 28:49.790]  Many, many calls coming in, which is good.
[28:50.010 --> 28:53.410]  And guys, if you don't get a pickup right away, just hold on.
[28:53.570 --> 28:54.970]  Somebody will get to you.
[28:55.330 --> 28:55.570]  Yes.
[28:56.030 --> 28:57.370]  Yes, one of our wonderful volunteers.
[28:58.770 --> 29:01.630]  Maybe one of us needs to go charging down the hall and pick up some phones.
[29:01.690 --> 29:02.050]  I might be.
[29:06.790 --> 29:08.190]  Well, you're in Europe right now.
[29:08.510 --> 29:09.130]  Mike is in Morocco.
[29:09.330 --> 29:13.550]  But we're all planning on convening in one place next Wednesday or Thursday, I believe.
[29:13.830 --> 29:14.190]  That's right.
[29:16.270 --> 29:17.110]  Can you hear me now?
[29:17.210 --> 29:18.010]  I'm planning on it.
[29:18.330 --> 29:18.570]  Yes.
[29:20.670 --> 29:21.650]  Can anybody hear me?
[29:21.770 --> 29:22.450]  Am I allowed?
[29:22.470 --> 29:23.010]  Yes, we can.
[29:23.370 --> 29:24.530]  Yes, we can hear you both now.
[29:25.370 --> 29:25.670]  Okay.
[29:25.950 --> 29:27.450]  Let me quickly tell my story.
[29:27.850 --> 29:28.610]  So, okay.
[29:29.150 --> 29:30.430]  I was talking to Mike about this.
[29:30.550 --> 29:31.830]  He's in the 212 country code.
[29:31.890 --> 29:33.050]  We're in the 212 area code.
[29:33.170 --> 29:33.330]  Correct?
[29:33.450 --> 29:34.110]  You hear that so far?
[29:34.270 --> 29:34.470]  Yes.
[29:35.710 --> 29:36.070]  Okay.
[29:36.790 --> 29:40.190]  You know how on a cell phone you don't have to dial the 1 before the area code.
[29:41.110 --> 29:41.510]  Right.
[29:42.830 --> 29:43.190]  Okay.
[29:43.370 --> 29:52.150]  And you know how on a cell phone there's a plus key and if you hold down the star long enough sometimes it shows up as a plus or sometimes you hit the star twice and it shows up as a plus.
[29:52.670 --> 29:56.010]  And what that is used for is when you're dialing internationally.
[29:56.450 --> 30:04.330]  So you could dial plus and then 1 plus a phone number and you'd call anybody in the United States because 1 happens to be the country code of the United States.
[30:04.570 --> 30:05.070]  You follow.
[30:05.390 --> 30:05.670]  Right.
[30:05.930 --> 30:06.330]  Okay.
[30:06.790 --> 30:23.070]  Now if you were to accidentally leave out that 1 and dial plus 212 your phone would say hey this is a national call I'm calling country code 212 and I just wonder how many people accidentally dial like that and they think they're dialing 212 and they reach somebody in Morocco.
[30:23.070 --> 30:27.090]  Well the thing is that I think in general cell phones in the U.S.
[30:27.430 --> 30:30.650]  don't do the plus thing or at least it's not touted very much.
[30:30.770 --> 30:35.310]  Most people here don't dial a number before the area code.
[30:35.610 --> 30:41.990]  So even though the actual phone number is 1-2-1-2 most people would probably just dial 2-1-2 but without anything in front of it.
[30:42.570 --> 30:58.850]  Now Emmanuel there is a safety catch which is that phone numbers here in Morocco have 9 digits they had 8 digits until February now they have 9 so you won't actually reach anyone only by dialing 7 digits after the 212.
[30:59.750 --> 31:02.110]  So that's 212 plus 9 digits Mike?
[31:03.090 --> 31:03.510]  Yes.
[31:04.870 --> 31:08.670]  Strange how a smaller country seems to have longer numbers.
[31:10.210 --> 31:11.250]  Well the U.S.
[31:11.310 --> 31:15.550]  this includes the city code so the U.S.
[31:15.650 --> 31:21.990]  number is 10 numbers that's even more numbers than here in Morocco but so it goes.
[31:23.510 --> 31:50.450]  But if you dial 212 you'll have to dial 7 more digits in the United States and those digits are 209-2950 and you can join all the people online right now who are taking advantage of this one time special offer only available for this hour this week of all the next 5 years of 2600 magazine and a 2600 hooded sweatshirt plus an off-the-hook t-shirt all for a pledge of $75.
[31:50.950 --> 31:52.630]  I mean that's just insane.
[31:52.910 --> 32:02.350]  And of course everybody who calls and pledges $25 and above by default gets the off-the-hook t-shirt to prove that you actually are a supporter of this particular radio program.
[32:02.430 --> 32:09.110]  There are people who call in every single pledge drive and they have an entire closet filled with off-the-hook t-shirts.
[32:09.270 --> 32:21.710]  I've seen this personally and it's kind of scary to know that there are people out there who do this who collect entire wardrobes and they have nothing but off-the-hook t-shirts because they've pledged for every single fundraiser that we've had.
[32:21.810 --> 32:26.290]  And we will send you a t-shirt even if we've sent you one before we'll keep doing it.
[32:26.750 --> 32:30.430]  And we'll thank you for it for pledging at every single fundraiser.
[32:32.010 --> 32:38.370]  212-209-2950 please join those people on the line and we'll be happy to send you all of that.
[32:38.510 --> 32:41.830]  Well maybe not happy but we'll do it because we committed to doing it.
[32:42.670 --> 32:47.210]  And of course you get the radio station which is the most important part of this entire conversation.
[32:48.990 --> 32:50.050]  It really is.
[32:50.170 --> 33:11.530]  You know I'm sitting here in the dark in Ireland looking at a full moon and it's just so cool to know that we're all in communication we're all talking to each other we have common interests we're all previewing the conference that's coming up next week and spreading out across the world but we're also talking about various cultural differences things with the communication system and the
[33:11.530 --> 33:33.850]  technological system that happens all throughout the world and we wouldn't be able to do any of that without WBAI and that's why it's so important to support the place no radio program like Off the Hook could exist anyplace but WBAI and we certainly owe it to the station to make sure that it remains strong that we continue to open the door for all kinds of future programs with people who have not
[33:33.850 --> 33:37.450]  yet We need that resource.
[33:37.750 --> 33:43.930]  And if you look around, you know, I've traveled around quite a bit, and there are so many countries where that is just not possible.
[33:43.950 --> 33:48.150]  You just cannot go on the radio and experiment and do something different.
[33:48.170 --> 33:49.590]  It's all very rigidly controlled.
[33:49.930 --> 33:54.370]  The United States is getting like that in a way because of all the commercialization of radio.
[33:54.690 --> 33:59.410]  And WBAI has always stood out in New York City as the exception to the rule.
[33:59.410 --> 34:06.870]  And that's why I help people call in and continue to support the station because they're the people who make it possible in the first place.
[34:07.250 --> 34:08.810]  212-209-2950.
[34:09.090 --> 34:13.310]  Let's get a whole flurry of calls because we do have to call Vienna, don't we?
[34:13.450 --> 34:15.290]  Two questions, Emmanuel.
[34:15.530 --> 34:16.790]  One came from the pledge room.
[34:16.990 --> 34:21.870]  The question was, if there are already subscribers to 2600, is the five years added on to their subscription?
[34:23.150 --> 34:25.190]  I believe that that would be the case, yes.
[34:25.190 --> 34:29.610]  Or they could have the five years sent to somebody else at their choosing.
[34:30.910 --> 34:34.270]  And then, we've had a flurry of calls.
[34:34.410 --> 34:35.790]  Would you like to give Vienna a try?
[34:35.850 --> 34:39.070]  I don't know what the total is right now because they tend not to update it very quickly.
[34:39.250 --> 34:47.730]  But I've definitely been watching the call-in board light up and stay lit for many, many different calls.
[34:48.710 --> 34:51.990]  Well, Redhack, my only concern is that there aren't enough people down there.
[34:52.770 --> 34:55.090]  Because, you know, sometimes it gets really crazy.
[34:55.350 --> 34:58.430]  People have to talk to three different phone calls at the same time.
[34:58.630 --> 35:01.470]  We want to make sure that enough people are down there supporting them.
[35:02.390 --> 35:05.850]  I believe Gus has gone down there and Eyeball is down there.
[35:07.210 --> 35:07.650]  Okay.
[35:07.850 --> 35:08.590]  Hopefully that's enough.
[35:08.750 --> 35:11.970]  And if not, tell them to scream really loudly and we'll send more people down.
[35:12.870 --> 35:17.050]  Well, Gus came to tell me, to ask me that question, and she didn't seem to indicate they need help right now.
[35:17.210 --> 35:20.250]  But we'll make sure to send more people if more people call.
[35:20.250 --> 35:23.350]  312-209-2950.
[35:23.670 --> 35:25.210]  Now, okay, we're going to call Vienna.
[35:25.490 --> 35:28.390]  So, we're going to have to say goodbye to Mike, then.
[35:29.350 --> 35:29.830]  All right.
[35:29.910 --> 35:32.350]  Well, goodbye, and I'll see you all in a week.
[35:32.550 --> 35:33.330]  See you next week.
[35:34.470 --> 35:35.150]  All right, Mike.
[35:35.250 --> 35:36.630]  We'll see you in Holland.
[35:38.130 --> 35:38.490]  Indeed.
[35:39.130 --> 35:39.490]  Cheers.
[35:41.130 --> 35:41.490]  Cheers.
[35:50.020 --> 35:50.420]  Okay.
[35:50.820 --> 35:53.000]  And while we're working telephone magic to make...
[35:53.000 --> 35:55.840]  Well, we've lost both of them now because I still don't know how to work this phone.
[35:55.940 --> 35:56.860]  Mike is actually the expert.
[35:57.070 --> 36:03.280]  But in the meantime, while I get both parties on the line, why don't we discuss some news that came to OTH?
[36:03.520 --> 36:06.980]  Yes, this is a very interesting story that came to us from the UK.
[36:07.520 --> 36:10.900]  There will be CCTV surveillance in the worst homes in the UK.
[36:12.710 --> 36:15.000]  This has been going around Twitter and some other things.
[36:16.170 --> 36:16.710]  Let's see.
[36:17.210 --> 36:21.590]  Thousands of the worst families in England are to be put in sin bins in a bid to change their bad behavior.
[36:24.250 --> 36:24.900]  Let's see.
[36:25.300 --> 36:29.800]  The children's secretary set out £40 million plans to put $20,000...
[36:29.800 --> 36:35.210]  I'm sorry, 20,000 problem families under 24-hour CCTV supervision in their own homes.
[36:37.230 --> 36:38.610]  Yep, in their own homes.
[36:38.800 --> 36:40.860]  They'll be under CCTV supervision.
[36:41.050 --> 36:45.090]  They'll be monitored to ensure that children attend school, go to bed on time, and eat proper meals.
[36:45.720 --> 36:51.380]  Private security guards will also be sent around to carry out home checks, while parents will be given help to combat drug and alcohol addiction.
[36:51.690 --> 36:55.000]  Around 2,000 families have gone through these family intervention projects so far.
[36:55.210 --> 37:05.040]  But ministers want to charge £20,000 more in the next two years, with each costing between £5,000 and £20,000, a potential total bill of £400 million British pounds.
[37:05.550 --> 37:11.900]  Now, CCTV surveillance in your own home to make sure you go to school and eat good meals.
[37:12.460 --> 37:13.780]  That, right, what do you think about this?
[37:13.920 --> 37:15.550]  I think this is very startling.
[37:15.590 --> 37:16.050]  I'm sorry.
[37:17.190 --> 37:18.590]  Now tell me, what do you think about this?
[37:19.260 --> 37:21.130]  I think this is a very startling prospect.
[37:22.150 --> 37:30.540]  The first two questions that pop in my mind are, what is the criteria for judging a parent being bad enough to warrant this?
[37:31.050 --> 37:35.460]  And how do they handle the private nature of the footage they're going to collect?
[37:35.760 --> 37:37.500]  Because this is inside people's homes.
[37:39.250 --> 37:46.900]  Yeah, and just justifying the fact that, I mean, the UK is already known for being among the most covered by CCTV.
[37:49.550 --> 37:51.110]  But that's in public spaces.
[37:51.210 --> 37:55.460]  And, you know, people can argue that that's acceptable or that's not acceptable.
[37:55.610 --> 38:02.780]  But inside your own home, I mean, every time you, you know, get an itch and scratch it or pick your nose or something, that's on CCTV.
[38:04.170 --> 38:05.920]  Can I just break in here?
[38:06.090 --> 38:08.570]  Because this is what's known as a sin bin.
[38:09.300 --> 38:14.050]  The British also love all kinds of little catchphrases like that.
[38:14.730 --> 38:17.000]  But, you know, there's something on British TV.
[38:17.040 --> 38:24.520]  I'm sure our friend Jims, who archives all the shows and makes it possible for us to broadcast over the Internet, would love this.
[38:26.210 --> 38:30.210]  The program Big Brother, you're all familiar with the program Big Brother, even if you don't watch it, right?
[38:30.650 --> 38:31.300]  Of course.
[38:31.500 --> 38:32.050]  Be grudgingly.
[38:32.920 --> 38:33.110]  Okay.
[38:33.520 --> 38:33.940]  Yes.
[38:34.090 --> 38:40.550]  Well, they have something known as Big Brother Live on a digital channel in the UK.
[38:40.780 --> 38:47.880]  And what that means is you can turn on your TV set at, say, 2 o'clock in the morning, and you get to watch people sleeping in the Big Brother house.
[38:50.210 --> 38:51.360]  Okay, you're breaking up a little.
[38:53.180 --> 39:01.610]  I'm sorry, you see people occasionally moving, you don't hear any dialogue, and you're watching someone sleeping live.
[39:01.820 --> 39:03.040]  That is what they consider.
[39:03.360 --> 39:03.840]  Okay.
[39:04.040 --> 39:05.960]  And this is on television?
[39:18.980 --> 39:20.050]  Okay, let's see.
[39:20.540 --> 39:22.240]  I believe we may have...
[39:23.340 --> 39:23.960]  Vienna.
[39:24.160 --> 39:25.340]  We may have Vienna on the line.
[39:26.300 --> 39:26.760]  Hello?
[39:27.070 --> 39:27.680]  Hello, Rob.
[39:28.160 --> 39:28.680]  Hello.
[39:29.040 --> 39:29.720]  You sound familiar.
[39:30.340 --> 39:31.480]  Yeah, it's Bernie S.
[39:31.550 --> 39:33.380]  I'm here in Vienna at Maeda Lab.
[39:34.400 --> 39:38.640]  This is the first time I've been at this amazing hackerspace here in Vienna.
[39:38.860 --> 39:45.140]  I'm over here with a bunch of other people that came over with the first Hackers on a Plane group, thanks to Nick Farr.
[39:46.460 --> 39:48.800]  We got here via Heathrow yesterday.
[39:48.800 --> 39:50.960]  I don't think any of us have slept for a couple, three days.
[39:51.110 --> 39:53.610]  But it's a fascinating hackerspace.
[39:53.760 --> 39:55.960]  This is one of the best hackerspaces I've seen, and I've seen a few.
[39:57.090 --> 40:02.200]  And people here have been putting together an amazing conference just prior to H.A.R.
[40:02.200 --> 40:03.020]  that's coming up.
[40:03.140 --> 40:04.740]  It's called PlumberCon.
[40:05.700 --> 40:10.590]  And she's going to have dozens of speakers on all kinds of interesting topics.
[40:11.090 --> 40:12.400]  We have Astora here.
[40:12.520 --> 40:14.760]  She's one of the core organizers of PlumberCon.
[40:15.380 --> 40:21.720]  And you want to talk a little bit about some of the topics they're going to discuss at this conference that's leading into H.A.R.?
[40:21.720 --> 40:23.040]  Probably I should, yeah.
[40:23.340 --> 40:24.280]  Hello, everyone.
[40:26.140 --> 40:30.140]  So, we're still fighting, actually, with some technical issues.
[40:30.440 --> 40:38.110]  But what is almost set up, I would say, is the schedule, which you can easily find on the internet.
[40:38.380 --> 40:40.140]  I'm not going to read it out.
[40:40.740 --> 40:42.740]  Where would they find it on the internet?
[40:43.070 --> 40:46.640]  They would find it at HTTP or HTTPS.
[40:46.640 --> 40:50.500]  So, find PlumberCon.org slash schedule.
[40:52.000 --> 40:56.590]  So, there's a couple of information about the talks as well.
[40:56.800 --> 40:58.610]  And they're kind of shifting still.
[40:58.840 --> 41:19.050]  But I think what you would see, like, the first thing you would realize is that it's a mix of a whole bunch of different interesting topics, ranging from hardware workshops, that deal with microcontrollers, that deal with phone-breaking, actually.
[41:20.120 --> 41:28.840]  So, we have three people coming over from the Swedish Hackerspace that is called something like Forskingsingsalsingen.
[41:30.080 --> 41:34.860]  I can't really pronounce it, I think, but I'm giving my best.
[41:35.000 --> 41:35.590]  What is it?
[41:36.600 --> 41:39.090]  It's a very new Hackerspace, actually.
[41:39.680 --> 41:42.480]  The kids are coming over pretty young, actually.
[41:42.480 --> 41:46.140]  They're really into phone-breaking, like all techniques.
[41:46.300 --> 41:55.660]  They're also going to show how they take apart a very, very usual, modern, kind of in-use, Vietnamese telephone.
[41:56.460 --> 42:05.420]  And we'll also reverse-engineer one of those very, very old 1960s original telephones that they have here.
[42:05.920 --> 42:06.820]  So, I found one.
[42:07.020 --> 42:08.820]  We're going to turn it into a voice device.
[42:08.820 --> 42:16.700]  One of the other talks that's going on, there's both a presentation and a workshop on DNA analysis.
[42:16.840 --> 42:17.200]  Is that right?
[42:17.420 --> 42:18.440]  This is correct.
[42:18.610 --> 42:19.680]  Almost correct.
[42:19.940 --> 42:23.800]  So, we have a speaker, Lisa Talham.
[42:24.000 --> 42:29.260]  She is very much into biotechnologies and biohacking.
[42:29.800 --> 42:48.050]  The workshop, she's holding, will actually not take place at the med lab or at the conference location, but that's a Vienna open lab, which is a lab where you could also, as a group of a bunch of people, book a workshop and they would show you around the lab and show you their technique,
[42:49.040 --> 42:54.680]  one of which is the DNA lab day, kind of thing.
[42:55.360 --> 42:58.520]  So, extracting DNA and then analyzing DNA.
[42:59.240 --> 43:01.200]  This is going to happen on Friday.
[43:01.200 --> 43:03.680]  It's like a five and a half hours workshop.
[43:03.900 --> 43:04.640]  It's really epic.
[43:05.380 --> 43:14.940]  And then on Sunday, she'll give a talk on more general points of biohacking.
[43:15.180 --> 43:17.160]  This is not going to focus on DNA only.
[43:17.720 --> 43:27.160]  Rob, one of the things that fascinates me about these smaller conferences, I mean, there's big conferences like Hope and DEF CON and HAR and, you know, the other larger conferences.
[43:27.340 --> 43:37.220]  But there's a lot of smaller hacker conferences going on around the world that are really great information exchanges in their own right that, you know, people don't just exchange information online.
[43:37.460 --> 43:41.220]  You get a lot of synergy, as you know, when you get a group of people together.
[43:41.340 --> 43:45.780]  You're expecting, what, maybe a hundred some people coming to this conference, maybe more?
[43:46.560 --> 43:47.640]  Yeah, probably.
[43:47.960 --> 43:52.420]  I'm looking forward to around something between 80 and 100.
[43:53.460 --> 43:56.600]  So this is the first time that this conference is happening.
[43:56.820 --> 43:58.560]  I think this is a pretty nice decision number.
[43:59.100 --> 44:01.000]  And we'll have it very snugly.
[44:02.400 --> 44:12.260]  There's another thing that comes into this, which is actually the, right now, the kind of economic situation.
[44:12.600 --> 44:20.860]  So we have a lot of people from the states that just couldn't afford to fly over, neither too hard, nor to someone can.
[44:22.180 --> 44:32.980]  And for these people, actually, we're right now, since two days, actually, setting up live video streaming so that they could watch these talks remotely.
[44:33.300 --> 44:46.900]  On the other hand, since we're a very, very small conference, we don't have any budget, basically, we're just, yeah, kind of sorting out the location, the food, some of the requisites we need, cables.
[44:49.240 --> 44:57.840]  Besides that, we, of course, can't afford to pay speakers to get them plane tickets.
[44:58.760 --> 45:07.540]  So we have four speakers that do very, very interesting things that will give us a call in.
[45:08.100 --> 45:13.140]  So via iChat, they will call in to the conference and give their talk remotely.
[45:14.080 --> 45:15.880]  So are you still with us, Rob?
[45:16.140 --> 45:16.660]  Yes, indeed.
[45:17.520 --> 45:32.220]  I just want to say that these are really amazing information exchanges that you get the kind of synergy when you get a hundred or more people in a space with dozens of people giving presentations that you're just not going to get online.
[45:32.480 --> 45:35.860]  it's exactly 23 speakers.
[45:36.060 --> 45:42.300]  I just found it out minutes ago, but this is really a good turnout.
[45:43.020 --> 45:50.320]  I encourage our listeners to check out the website for PlumberCon, which is plumbercon.org.
[45:50.520 --> 45:56.920]  And the hackerspace here we're calling from that website is metalab.at.
[45:57.760 --> 46:01.800]  But the most important thing we're talking about tonight, of course, is the fund drive.
[46:02.480 --> 46:05.420]  WBAI needs money to stay on the air.
[46:05.580 --> 46:14.240]  And we don't like having to get on the air and beg for money, but frankly it's important because the station doesn't have any commercial supporters, there are no underwriters.
[46:14.480 --> 46:32.380]  It's solely supported by listeners who not only enjoy the station, but realize the promise and potential of a station in the middle of New York City, in the middle of the FM broadcast band, that broadcast information that no commercial station would touch.
[46:33.000 --> 46:46.740]  Of course, it's online too, but the fact that it's actually a real radio station with a serious listenership is really amazing in this day and age when there's this conglomeration of media outlets.
[46:47.260 --> 46:52.600]  So I encourage our listeners to please call 212-209-2950.
[46:52.740 --> 46:55.800]  I know there's a lot of premiums being offered tonight.
[46:55.920 --> 46:57.040]  Can you go over those again, Rob?
[46:57.840 --> 46:59.700]  There are two premium levels.
[46:59.980 --> 47:07.980]  For a pledge of $25 or more, you would receive an off-the-hook t-shirt, which you can only get by pledging to WBAI.
[47:08.700 --> 47:20.860]  For a pledge of $75 or more, you would receive a five-year subscription to $2600 as well as the $2600 sweatshirt and, as usual, an off-the-hook t-shirt.
[47:21.680 --> 47:25.180]  Yes, and it is my sad duty to report that we have no calls on the line now.
[47:25.750 --> 47:27.880]  So please call in and support the station.
[47:28.080 --> 47:29.940]  Any amount helps.
[47:30.120 --> 47:37.280]  You don't have to, you know, if $25 is too much, as little or as much as you can give would help because we really...
[47:37.280 --> 47:37.900]  Yes?
[47:39.500 --> 47:48.380]  Well, let me just point out, we are currently, or we were, on the air from three different continents tonight, asking listeners to support WBAI.
[47:48.480 --> 48:02.600]  And, you know, WBAI isn't paying us a penny for any of this, and we're going to all these places at our own expense, but it's important enough for us to remind people worldwide that WBAI is a precious commodity and deserves to be supported and deserves to flourish.
[48:03.020 --> 48:05.720]  And it's a new day and age at the station.
[48:05.720 --> 48:10.300]  We have all kinds of new projects starting and all kinds of hope for the future.
[48:10.500 --> 48:14.360]  I've really seen a lot of good things coming out of the place recently.
[48:14.640 --> 48:23.500]  But all of that, all of that is mostly dependent, completely dependent on listeners calling in and supporting us by calling 212-209-2950.
[48:23.780 --> 48:28.320]  Now, Bernie was just talking about the smaller hacker conferences, and yes, they are amazing.
[48:29.000 --> 48:30.840]  PlumberCon is just one example.
[48:31.680 --> 48:40.860]  It brings back memories, and actually, we should point out PlumberCon is spelled as the guy who comes to fix your pipes when things go badly.
[48:41.240 --> 48:56.600]  It reminds me of something that sounds similar called SummerCon, which used to happen every year in St. Louis or various parts of the United States, and you only had about 75 people showing up to these things, but it was the most amazing gathering because you met all the people that you were talking to,
[48:56.880 --> 49:04.640]  you found people with similar lines and shared all kinds of information, and it makes me think all these smaller conferences happening.
[49:09.980 --> 49:11.400]  Are we losing Emmanuel?
[49:11.960 --> 49:16.200]  Yeah, he's been cutting in and out, but I had a question...
[49:16.200 --> 49:17.620]  I'm about to make a good point.
[49:17.980 --> 49:18.140]  Yeah.
[49:18.680 --> 49:22.160]  I had a question for the people in Austria.
[49:23.080 --> 49:35.380]  For those, obviously, if we're not there right now, and for a lot of our listeners, we're probably not going to be able to attend PlumberCon, but what is the kind of steps you go through to set up a small conference like this?
[49:35.440 --> 49:36.680]  If someone in the U.S.
[49:36.740 --> 49:44.160]  was interested in setting up a local kind of conference for people in their area or in their bordering states to come to, how would you advise them on that?
[49:45.340 --> 50:00.120]  Actually, as of the states, they should probably get in touch with Travis Goodspeed, who put together a very, very decent small conference called NeighborCon, him being the inventor basically of the word neighborly.
[50:02.320 --> 50:06.820]  I think he holds some sort of a copy left on that.
[50:08.860 --> 50:16.740]  Not only that, I think you've seen the B-slides, the Security B-slides, something?
[50:17.160 --> 50:17.640]  Yes, indeed.
[50:17.740 --> 50:19.800]  A conference just a couple of days ago.
[50:20.140 --> 50:21.720]  That was around Black Hat.
[50:22.000 --> 50:23.680]  Yes, I was actually at that one.
[50:23.920 --> 50:25.620]  And a couple of the NeighborCon follow-up.
[50:26.240 --> 50:27.400]  You were at Rob, you were there?
[50:27.600 --> 50:33.080]  Yes, I was at Security B-slides right between Black Hat and DEF CON, and it was quite an event.
[50:33.300 --> 50:41.020]  It took place in a small rented house, and it was a nice intimate setting and some really good presentations and events were going on there.
[50:42.340 --> 51:00.200]  Rob, what I think you were asking, Astro, is if someone anywhere, it doesn't necessarily have to be in the United States, wanted to put together one of these smaller hacker conferences and get together a few dozen people, Astro, what made you want to do this conference here?
[51:00.380 --> 51:03.760]  And what are some of the main steps you went through to pull this together?
[51:03.820 --> 51:05.820]  Because it looks like it's really going to be an amazing conference.
[51:05.820 --> 51:07.040]  It's going to be all weekend.
[51:07.080 --> 51:07.860]  Yeah, but I'm surprised myself.
[51:07.980 --> 51:12.000]  I wouldn't tell anyone to go through the same steps that I did.
[51:12.060 --> 51:12.520]  But it works.
[51:13.320 --> 51:17.060]  It kind of does, but I don't have any clue why.
[51:18.280 --> 51:25.320]  It started up with a joke that actually people took seriously, and I was like, well, I'm going to set up a website and a Twitter account, right?
[51:26.480 --> 51:29.200]  people handed in their submissions.
[51:30.140 --> 51:32.140]  And I was like, well, this is funny.
[51:33.440 --> 51:36.020]  Probably we're just going to play this game a little further.
[51:36.320 --> 51:39.680]  And all of a sudden I realized it wasn't a game anymore after like two weeks.
[51:39.820 --> 51:42.480]  So this started as a joke, and then it turned into a real conference.
[51:42.740 --> 51:43.880]  It totally did, yes.
[51:44.000 --> 51:44.780]  Well, there you go.
[51:44.860 --> 51:45.500]  That's one...
[51:45.500 --> 51:47.080]  You've got to start with a sense of humor, Rob.
[51:47.240 --> 51:57.240]  And speaking of humor, we, several of us that came over and the hackers on a plane 1.6 to see both Medalab and PlumberCon and the HAR conference.
[51:57.400 --> 52:00.480]  We had to get some Austrian sims for unlocked GSM phones.
[52:01.340 --> 52:10.960]  And we went to the store to get our sims, and the sales incentive they had for these sim cards is each sim card came with a free kazoo.
[52:11.580 --> 52:12.580]  Like, you know, like this...
[52:14.120 --> 52:17.420]  So it was bizarre combining of the technology.
[52:19.200 --> 52:21.760]  Both telecommunications and musical instruments.
[52:21.980 --> 52:22.360]  I don't know.
[52:22.500 --> 52:23.480]  I had to put that in there.
[52:24.040 --> 52:24.900]  Mitch is here.
[52:25.920 --> 52:32.080]  All of our listeners are familiar with Mitch Altman's work with the TV Begon inventions and some of his other amazing creations.
[52:32.300 --> 52:37.840]  And as they know, he's in San Francisco and one of the founders of Noise Bridge, another great hacker space there.
[52:37.980 --> 52:41.400]  And you're going to have to have a conference out there, aren't you, Mitch, one of these days?
[52:43.200 --> 52:47.100]  That's not actually in the plans at this moment, but it would be a really cool idea.
[52:47.340 --> 52:48.120]  But there's some big news.
[52:48.280 --> 52:49.940]  There's some big news today about Noise Bridge, isn't there?
[52:50.120 --> 52:58.920]  Yeah, Noise Bridge has, you know, we're getting on close to 100 members and there's way more people who aren't members who show up because we're totally open to the public all the time.
[52:59.740 --> 53:04.260]  We outgrew our little space of 1,000 square feet a few months ago.
[53:04.260 --> 53:18.300]  And just this weekly meeting on Tuesday, we consented, that's our consensus process, to having a new space, which is 5,200 square feet near the corner of 19th and Mission in San Francisco.
[53:18.900 --> 53:24.260]  So that's a big step for us to quintuple our amount of space.
[53:24.780 --> 53:29.320]  And there's a lot of work for us to do to get the space ready, but everyone's really excited about it.
[53:29.320 --> 53:30.300]  Wow, that's great.
[53:30.980 --> 53:32.640]  I know we just have a few more questions.
[53:34.180 --> 53:34.820]  Yes, Emmanuel.
[53:35.420 --> 53:36.580]  Can I just point out one thing?
[53:36.860 --> 53:37.040]  Yeah.
[53:37.240 --> 53:47.000]  For those people that are interested in maybe telling a joke and having it turn into a conference, which, you know, there's always a danger of that happening, you can email us.
[53:47.020 --> 53:51.260]  I will be happy to list your conference so that more people can get in on the joke and become part of it.
[53:51.980 --> 53:56.120]  The address, a special address for this, happenings at 2600.com.
[53:56.120 --> 54:13.280]  What we do is we list all the happenings coming up in the next year in the hacker world that don't cost a fortune, that will be of interest to people in the hacker community, and then 100,000 people can read this in the magazine, and you might get all kinds of turnout that you would never get otherwise.
[54:13.460 --> 54:15.860]  The address, again, happenings at 2600.com.
[54:15.940 --> 54:17.260]  We'd like to hear from a lot of people on this.
[54:17.580 --> 54:18.180]  Yes, indeed.
[54:18.320 --> 54:21.360]  And once again, that's happenings at 2600.com.
[54:22.300 --> 54:30.300]  I'll just point out, there's a lot of resources that we have available as hackers and just people on our wonderful, bizarre, little planet of ours.
[54:30.860 --> 54:36.580]  At Noisebridge, we have what we call, as in many hacker communities, a duocracy.
[54:36.880 --> 54:40.120]  So if you want to do something, see something happen, just do it.
[54:40.280 --> 54:40.920]  See what happens.
[54:41.260 --> 54:42.060]  It's pretty amazing.
[54:42.260 --> 54:49.780]  That's the idea I had in starting Noisebridge along with my friend Jake after coming back from 2007 chaos camp.
[54:50.160 --> 54:51.960]  And look what happened.
[54:52.140 --> 54:54.160]  It's amazing what happens if you just do it.
[54:54.160 --> 54:55.300]  This is very true.
[54:55.480 --> 55:04.180]  Actually, if I could make a request here to all the 2600 readers, as well as listeners, off the hook.
[55:04.940 --> 55:15.280]  I would really be interested in, if you probably watch the recordings or watch the stream, what you were most interested in or what you would like to see.
[55:15.540 --> 55:18.900]  Probably we can still reach some sort of happening.
[55:18.900 --> 55:22.700]  Like, the Church of Security was a very much last-minute event on Saturday.
[55:23.140 --> 55:29.900]  So, I would really be interested in what people would like to see, because that's probably not my pace to talk.
[55:30.040 --> 55:31.960]  And how would they reach us here?
[55:32.880 --> 55:35.460]  Probably by email.
[55:35.760 --> 55:37.060]  Yeah, but at what address?
[55:37.400 --> 55:42.420]  Oh, well, pretty much anything you can think of at plumbercom.org.
[55:42.560 --> 55:44.300]  So, just go to plumbercom.org.
[55:44.420 --> 55:45.780]  Probably mail at plumbercom.org.
[55:45.800 --> 55:46.060]  There you go.
[55:46.140 --> 55:47.520]  Mail at plumbercom.org.
[55:48.060 --> 55:49.720]  We failed at plumbercom.org.
[55:49.940 --> 55:50.580]  That would work, too.
[55:50.860 --> 55:57.060]  Hey, I know there's just a couple seconds to go left, but we really have to raise a few more dollars for WBAI to keep this station on the air.
[55:57.300 --> 55:59.480]  No other station is going to broadcast this kind of information.
[55:59.720 --> 56:03.080]  So, it's 212-209-2950.
[56:03.140 --> 56:08.520]  Please, in the last few minutes, call 212-209-2950.
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[56:16.380 --> 56:18.200]  Want to go over the premiums one more time?
[56:19.200 --> 56:19.560]  Sure.
[56:19.800 --> 56:30.160]  For a pledge of $25 or more, you will get an off-the-hook t-shirt, which you can only get by pledging to WBAI, and you can wear it proudly, and everyone who sees you wearing it will know that you pledged to WBAI.
[56:30.340 --> 56:38.280]  And you can get, for $75 or more, a five-year subscription to 2,600, as well as a nice 2,600 sweatshirt.
[56:39.790 --> 56:41.260]  So, there's only a few minutes left.
[56:41.260 --> 56:42.560]  You can't pledge tomorrow.
[56:42.560 --> 56:48.000]  You can't pledge next week for these things, just in the next about three and a half minutes.
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[56:49.800 --> 56:50.720]  Please support the station.
[56:52.210 --> 56:54.980]  And, you know, we appreciate it very much down here.
[56:56.160 --> 56:56.520]  Yes, indeed.
[56:57.160 --> 56:58.960]  212-209-2950.
[57:00.820 --> 57:02.500]  212-209-2950.
[57:03.060 --> 57:06.180]  And on that note, it looks like we're just about out of time.
[57:06.420 --> 57:07.540]  Thank you all for joining us.
[57:07.780 --> 57:10.800]  Join us again next week for another special edition of Off the Hook.
[57:10.800 --> 57:15.500]  And thanks to those of you who are in other countries who put up with all the phone fiascos.
[57:16.000 --> 57:19.580]  And a very special thanks to everyone who's called tonight and donated.
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[58:44.230 --> 58:47.710]  WBAI New York 99.5 FM And then...
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