[00:01.920 --> 00:04.040]  What are you listening to?
[00:04.280 --> 00:05.500]  What you were listening to.
[00:05.740 --> 00:08.140]  Yeah, but I... I don't know what it is.
[00:09.750 --> 00:10.950]  It's WBAI.
[00:11.810 --> 00:13.640]  Wow, sounds weird.
[00:14.700 --> 00:16.360]  Weird, but I like it.
[00:17.700 --> 00:18.990]  I like it.
[00:19.260 --> 00:20.180]  What is it?
[00:20.540 --> 00:22.560]  It's WBAI.
[00:22.980 --> 00:23.940]  I like it.
[00:24.840 --> 00:27.620]  Did you honor your pledge?
[00:27.940 --> 00:29.380]  To go low carb?
[00:30.120 --> 00:32.760]  Hmm, to send money to WBAI.
[00:32.820 --> 00:34.020]  Oh, you mean write a check?
[00:34.170 --> 00:35.460]  Yeah, I mean write a check.
[00:35.670 --> 00:36.340]  I wrote it.
[00:36.460 --> 00:37.300]  Well, now send it.
[00:37.490 --> 00:38.760]  Oh, send it.
[00:41.780 --> 00:42.660]  To WBAI.
[00:42.940 --> 00:44.080]  120 Wall Street.
[00:44.360 --> 00:45.380]  New York, New York.
[00:45.780 --> 00:48.180]  One, triple, zero, five.
[00:49.340 --> 00:49.780]  WBAI.
[00:50.000 --> 00:50.960]  I like it.
[00:51.100 --> 00:51.480]  Yeah!
[00:56.050 --> 00:57.470]  And if you don't like it, you can lump it.
[00:57.610 --> 00:58.730]  It's WBAI New York.
[00:58.830 --> 00:59.550]  Time for Off the Hook.
[01:00.630 --> 01:01.070]  Okay.
[01:01.070 --> 01:03.870]  Time for this machine to work properly this time.
[01:08.910 --> 01:10.870]  The telephone keeps ringing.
[01:11.190 --> 01:13.390]  So I ripped it off the wall.
[01:14.370 --> 01:16.370]  I cut myself while shaving.
[01:16.970 --> 01:18.950]  Now I can't make a cough.
[01:19.530 --> 01:21.750]  We couldn't get much worse.
[01:24.520 --> 01:27.180]  Fun diddly bump, but the best is back from worst.
[01:27.760 --> 01:29.680]  I hope that's understood.
[01:29.880 --> 01:30.680]  Fun diddly bump!
[02:02.700 --> 02:03.540]  And good evening, everybody.
[02:03.660 --> 02:04.520]  The program is Off the Hook.
[02:04.580 --> 02:08.440]  Emmanuel Goldstein here with you on this Wednesday evening with a full house tonight.
[02:08.860 --> 02:09.880]  We have Mike.
[02:10.220 --> 02:10.580]  Hi.
[02:10.800 --> 02:11.280]  Red Hacked.
[02:12.020 --> 02:12.200]  Hello.
[02:13.200 --> 02:13.400]  Hi.
[02:13.520 --> 02:14.820]  Pick up your cues faster next time.
[02:15.160 --> 02:15.740]  Not Kevin.
[02:16.060 --> 02:16.320]  Hello.
[02:16.680 --> 02:17.040]  Rob T.
[02:17.220 --> 02:17.640]  Firefly.
[02:17.800 --> 02:18.160]  Good evening.
[02:18.160 --> 02:18.700]  Dot Red.
[02:18.980 --> 02:19.440]  Oh, hi.
[02:19.560 --> 02:20.500]  Down in Philadelphia.
[02:20.720 --> 02:21.320]  Bernie S.
[02:21.840 --> 02:22.940]  Greetings from Philadelphia.
[02:23.220 --> 02:28.540]  And Bernie, I understand some of your information was hacked again.
[02:28.880 --> 02:29.900]  What's up with this?
[02:29.940 --> 02:37.060]  I'm holding in my hand here a letter from Wyndham Hotel and Resorts that doesn't refer to you specifically.
[02:37.060 --> 02:38.140]  It does have your name on it.
[02:38.200 --> 02:39.540]  I think you got this letter.
[02:40.260 --> 02:41.160]  Do you want to tell us something about it?
[02:41.320 --> 02:42.880]  It's not a letter of accusation.
[02:43.060 --> 02:51.160]  It's just a letter of letting me know that my credit card information was exposed by Wyndham Hotels and Resorts.
[02:51.260 --> 02:53.060]  Remember when we went to Nauticon last April?
[02:53.180 --> 02:54.720]  I have dim recollections, yes.
[02:55.080 --> 02:55.860]  Yes, well...
[02:55.860 --> 02:57.420]  I checked in under an assumed name.
[02:58.580 --> 03:00.520]  With an assumed credit card, I hope?
[03:00.640 --> 03:01.500]  I assume so, yeah.
[03:02.080 --> 03:02.460]  Okay.
[03:03.600 --> 03:05.640]  Yeah, well, I got this letter.
[03:05.780 --> 03:11.080]  Dear Wyndham customer, we're ready to inform you of a data security incident involving your personal information.
[03:11.320 --> 03:11.960]  And it goes on.
[03:12.120 --> 03:21.220]  It just says they promptly retained an external examiner to conduct a thorough forensic investigation.
[03:22.000 --> 03:24.840]  And they say their investigation is now substantially complete.
[03:24.840 --> 03:29.900]  And it's confirmed that a sophisticated hacker penetrated their computer systems.
[03:31.380 --> 03:32.140]  Sophisticated hacker.
[03:32.140 --> 03:34.020]  This is one that likes fine wines, or what?
[03:34.500 --> 03:38.980]  Apparently, he dresses well, and he's just very, very snappy.
[03:39.700 --> 03:49.800]  It says the hacker was able to access the customer transaction files at a number of Wyndham Hotels and create a unique file containing credit card numbers of certain hotel guests.
[03:49.860 --> 03:51.380]  What does that mean, create a unique file?
[03:52.040 --> 03:53.720]  I don't know, and it gets weirder.
[03:53.840 --> 04:08.220]  It says, in addition, the hacker was able to download transactional information that was captured by the memories of servers at certain hotels on a real-time basis for transactions that occur between March 29th and May 10th.
[04:08.300 --> 04:08.680]  Wait a minute.
[04:09.180 --> 04:11.620]  I want to read that again, because it's just, it's so precious.
[04:11.820 --> 04:21.320]  The hacker was able to download transactional information that was captured by the memories of servers at certain hotels on a real-time basis for transactions that occur.
[04:22.200 --> 04:24.080]  That's obviously written by an expert, right?
[04:24.080 --> 04:25.860]  Do we have any idea what that means in English?
[04:26.160 --> 04:27.060]  Memories of a...
[04:27.060 --> 04:28.920]  That's such a poetic sound to it, doesn't it?
[04:28.920 --> 04:30.680]  I know what a server memory is.
[04:30.800 --> 04:31.780]  I know what memory is.
[04:31.840 --> 04:32.620]  I know what a server is.
[04:32.640 --> 04:34.300]  But, well, you're aware that servers have memories of their own.
[04:34.320 --> 04:38.800]  I'm aware that servers have memory in them, but I still don't know what that sentence means.
[04:39.700 --> 04:40.140]  Wow.
[04:40.640 --> 04:47.540]  Okay, so apparently, Bernie, your credit or debit card number, expiration date, and possibly your name were accessed, according to this letter.
[04:48.040 --> 05:03.300]  Further, magnetic stripe information from your credit card may have been accessed, underline the may, depending upon whether the hotel swiped your card for a transaction or manually entered your credit card number, although, due to the sophisticated nature of the hack,
[05:03.500 --> 05:08.120]  we have not been able to determine precisely what magnetic stripe information, if any, was accessed.
[05:08.320 --> 05:11.660]  The hotel's computer system did not store your social security number, probably because you never gave it to them.
[05:11.960 --> 05:14.260]  So, fortunately, the hacker did not access such information.
[05:14.440 --> 05:19.060]  Did they print the full number and expiration date and the letter so that you know which credit card to cancel?
[05:19.220 --> 05:19.920]  No, but you know what?
[05:20.100 --> 05:32.940]  I don't know, Bernie, if you saw this on the letter, but this letter says on the very top, promotion code, and they give a big number afterwards, how is this letter telling you that your credit card information was accessed a promotion?
[05:33.740 --> 05:52.620]  Well, that promotion code is useful when you log on to the free Equifax Credit Watch 3-in-1 alert product, which they're going to give me for 12 months, which will supposedly email me if there have been any changes to my credit file over the next 12 months.
[05:52.620 --> 06:07.720]  Of course, if this is really a sophisticated hacker, as they're claiming, why wouldn't that person just sort of sit on this information for 12 months and then just go crazy with it after they know that none of the customers will be alerted to the fact that their credit file has been accessed?
[06:07.900 --> 06:10.680]  But, Bernie, the thing that strikes me about this letter is that it seems to be defined...
[06:10.680 --> 06:16.200]  The letter itself seems to be defining itself as a promotion rather than a warning, because it's right there up on top, promotion code.
[06:16.200 --> 06:17.820]  It's not referring to the offer.
[06:17.960 --> 06:20.300]  It's referring to the letter itself as a promotion.
[06:20.540 --> 06:20.980]  Isn't that kind of weird?
[06:20.980 --> 06:27.100]  Well, maybe they're promoting their own negligence and competence and poor English language.
[06:27.100 --> 06:31.360]  Well, maybe nothing happened, and this is just part of their promotion to get people to sign up for that other service.
[06:32.600 --> 06:37.980]  Well, after the 12 months, I am able to continue subscribing for $4.95 a month, they say.
[06:38.120 --> 06:40.080]  Yeah, but I think it's an interesting kind of...
[06:40.080 --> 06:41.880]  I mean, we see this a lot.
[06:42.140 --> 06:50.480]  There's personal information that's stolen, and then the party at fault says, oh, we're going to give you a year of whatever Equifax or some other credit tracking thing.
[06:51.860 --> 06:57.840]  But it's kind of like you've done nothing wrong, but they still have this bait and hook tactic to get you into signing up for now this credit monitoring service.
[06:57.900 --> 06:59.780]  Yeah, and if you don't do it, bigger fool you for not taking them up.
[06:59.980 --> 07:00.380]  Right, exactly.
[07:00.380 --> 07:04.160]  Great, but then a year later, you're still with it, and oh, well, maybe it's $5 a month.
[07:04.160 --> 07:04.960]  I wonder why I didn't get a letter.
[07:05.100 --> 07:10.580]  I wish I had jumped in on the business of credit monitoring, because it's great, because everybody screws up, and then you get lots of customers as a result.
[07:10.740 --> 07:16.560]  I mean, my assumed name will get mail, and I did not see any mail come in saying anything about this, so that's kind of weird.
[07:16.960 --> 07:18.560]  I stayed in the same hotel at the same time.
[07:18.960 --> 07:25.720]  I called Windham, because I logged in to sign up for the free credit monitoring, but it wanted my credit card information.
[07:25.920 --> 07:29.640]  Not just, it's supposed to let you know anything that changes with your credit file at all.
[07:30.460 --> 07:31.940]  Not just that one credit card.
[07:32.800 --> 07:38.620]  And it wouldn't let me proceed to subscribe unless I gave them credit card information, so I called Windham back.
[07:39.080 --> 07:42.360]  Actually, I called Equifax back, so they put that number in the letter here.
[07:42.680 --> 07:44.880]  And I said, I'm not going to give you my credit card number.
[07:44.940 --> 07:48.700]  This is supposed to be free for 12 months, and they pulled some strings, and they made it work.
[07:48.820 --> 07:50.140]  They gave me the access to that given month.
[07:50.260 --> 07:51.720]  But you're right.
[07:51.720 --> 08:03.780]  It sounds like a bait-and-switch kind of thing, and I just really resent the assumption that after 12 months, I will have no possibility of this information that's been allegedly stolen from being misused.
[08:03.780 --> 08:06.880]  I think there should be free credit monitoring for life.
[08:07.020 --> 08:07.580]  I called Windham.
[08:07.680 --> 08:17.740]  I even spoke with her vice president of corporate communications, and she flat out refused to discuss any details about this with me on the phone, let alone on the air.
[08:17.740 --> 08:21.040]  I was hoping to get them on the air and ask them, hey, what's the deal here?
[08:21.160 --> 08:22.660]  Why are you trashing hackers?
[08:23.260 --> 08:27.920]  You're hosting a hacker conference called Nauticon, which they made a lot of money on, I'm sure.
[08:27.920 --> 08:29.780]  There were a lot of drinks consumed at that hotel.
[08:30.860 --> 08:35.980]  And, you know, it was clearly a blame game thing.
[08:36.080 --> 08:38.840]  They're blaming a sophisticated hacker, and they were so sophisticated.
[08:38.840 --> 08:50.100]  And, you know, what's ironic is I did some research online, and this same letter was sent out early this year in January, because they had a previous incident.
[08:50.100 --> 08:51.240]  It was almost identical.
[08:51.500 --> 08:53.620]  They used the same boilerplate language in the letter.
[08:53.740 --> 08:56.240]  It was the same kind of mag-straight attacks.
[08:56.420 --> 08:57.980]  Apparently, they had two separate attacks.
[08:58.480 --> 09:02.120]  Windham has not learned anything, apparently, because they keep making the same mistake.
[09:02.340 --> 09:05.960]  They keep sending out the same boilerplate letter over multiple incidents.
[09:05.960 --> 09:12.180]  And, I don't know, I'm going to have strong qualms about staying at a Windham hotel again.
[09:14.100 --> 09:22.940]  It might cost them less to simply give out promotion for Equifax or whatever service they use, rather than fixing their system.
[09:23.220 --> 09:24.380]  Well, that's what I wanted.
[09:24.500 --> 09:26.140]  Like you said, it's a boilerplate letter.
[09:26.340 --> 09:27.580]  They have promotion codes.
[09:28.320 --> 09:33.240]  You have to wonder if they really care that much about fixing the system and more about promoting that service.
[09:33.240 --> 09:41.080]  One thing, Froggy and Tiger, the lovely people who run Nauticon, have been quick to point out is that this breach was solely on Windham's end.
[09:41.220 --> 09:43.640]  It was nothing to do with the Nauticon organization or anything like that.
[09:44.880 --> 09:49.040]  But, I just wanted to say that, and now let's...
[09:49.040 --> 09:49.720]  Go ahead, Mike.
[09:49.920 --> 09:50.200]  What?
[09:50.800 --> 09:51.180]  Okay.
[09:51.360 --> 09:54.260]  I think, Bernie, that you actually don't have to worry too much.
[09:54.260 --> 10:05.980]  I think you will end up with free credit reporting for life, because at the rate these cases are occurring, sometime within the next year, someone else will get access to a different database with your credit card number in it, and you'll get another year,
[10:06.000 --> 10:06.740]  and so on.
[10:06.800 --> 10:08.000]  But how come it always seems to happen to Bernie?
[10:08.140 --> 10:08.980]  I never get these letters.
[10:09.180 --> 10:11.080]  Because you have so many names, they can't find you.
[10:11.080 --> 10:11.680]  So...
[10:12.180 --> 10:12.900]  It's not...
[10:12.900 --> 10:13.900]  You know what you want to say, Don?
[10:14.000 --> 10:14.120]  Okay.
[10:14.260 --> 10:14.740]  I remember now.
[10:14.740 --> 10:14.920]  All right.
[10:15.020 --> 10:28.360]  What's interesting about this whole kind of security thing, in terms of people fixing things or just kind of selling or promoting credit services to cover their mistakes, I mean, a lot of times, it is not worth it to them to fix their system.
[10:28.420 --> 10:33.320]  I mean, obviously, in this case, they're probably going to try, okay, well, we'll close that hole, but they're not going to probably do a whole audit.
[10:33.420 --> 10:40.880]  It's kind of the same thing happens with the credit card systems now in the States, and with our banking cards and our credit cards, we have MagStripe still.
[10:40.880 --> 10:42.460]  That's how you access things.
[10:42.480 --> 10:45.120]  It's just your number on a magnetic stripe.
[10:45.460 --> 10:47.360]  And in Europe, they have more sophisticated systems.
[10:47.480 --> 10:51.300]  They have chips that do challenge response and stuff like that that are much harder to copy.
[10:51.400 --> 10:52.140]  A chip and pin system.
[10:52.300 --> 10:52.600]  Exactly.
[10:52.820 --> 11:01.700]  And so the reason that we don't have that here is because to upgrade all of those point of sale terminals all over the country is just too expensive.
[11:01.700 --> 11:05.960]  And it's cheaper to just let a few people get their information and credit cards and so on stolen.
[11:05.960 --> 11:10.860]  And okay, well, we'll just pay for that or give them credit monitoring or whatever.
[11:11.340 --> 11:17.500]  Well, it's a shocking story, but just part of what we report here on Off the Hook.
[11:17.600 --> 11:19.020]  So we'll keep watching that.
[11:19.360 --> 11:21.100]  But another story happened yesterday.
[11:21.100 --> 11:21.980]  How did it affect you guys?
[11:22.080 --> 11:22.940]  The Gmail adage.
[11:23.140 --> 11:24.800]  Boy, that was something, wasn't it?
[11:25.260 --> 11:26.060]  Didn't affect me.
[11:26.220 --> 11:26.920]  Didn't affect me at all.
[11:26.920 --> 11:29.820]  I mean, a couple of people I mailed didn't get back to me right away.
[11:30.080 --> 11:33.400]  Yeah, it was amazing how many people were using this as an excuse not to get anything done yesterday.
[11:33.580 --> 11:34.880]  They couldn't access their email.
[11:35.080 --> 11:36.380]  They couldn't access all kinds of things.
[11:36.440 --> 11:43.680]  And it just makes me wonder, how clueless can you possibly be to keep everything on a remote server that is not necessarily trustworthy?
[11:44.320 --> 11:45.640]  Because it's the wave of the future.
[11:45.640 --> 11:47.640]  We'll all be computing over the cloud very soon.
[11:48.600 --> 11:50.460]  You want to explain what you mean by that, the cloud?
[11:50.640 --> 11:51.540]  Because I've been hearing that a lot.
[11:51.860 --> 11:56.500]  The cloud is just a very simple term for doing stuff over the web.
[11:56.500 --> 11:59.320]  Stuff that you're not doing locally on your own machine.
[12:00.000 --> 12:02.000]  Taking advantage of, say, Google servers.
[12:03.060 --> 12:06.260]  And that's what a lot of people seem to be doing, is keeping all their mail on...
[12:06.260 --> 12:10.160]  I mean, it's one thing if you forward it someplace else as well, and use that as a backup.
[12:10.280 --> 12:10.740]  That's fine.
[12:11.420 --> 12:13.880]  Although, it's not fine if it's confidential information.
[12:13.880 --> 12:15.020]  You don't want other people to read.
[12:16.160 --> 12:17.620]  But people who depend on it.
[12:17.680 --> 12:24.580]  But even so, I mean, even if you had it backed up, you know, up to whatever point the servers went down, that doesn't mean that you're going to get anything new until they come back up.
[12:24.600 --> 12:25.000]  That's true.
[12:25.000 --> 12:28.680]  Although, I think that it was only the web interface that was down.
[12:28.780 --> 12:31.500]  And if you accessed it via POP or IMAP, it was still working.
[12:31.540 --> 12:33.000]  I was told that that was working.
[12:33.040 --> 12:35.180]  But then I saw another notice saying that it wasn't working.
[12:35.300 --> 12:37.640]  But then all kinds of rumors were running rampant.
[12:37.820 --> 12:42.900]  But it's interesting because, you know, nowadays, when something goes down, the first place you can check is Twitter.
[12:43.060 --> 12:46.320]  And if it's a trending topic, then you know it must be down.
[12:46.460 --> 12:47.180]  Yes, absolutely.
[12:48.620 --> 12:49.100]  Okay.
[12:49.460 --> 12:50.600]  So, yes, Barney, you had something?
[12:50.840 --> 12:52.300]  I just want to say, there's one...
[12:52.300 --> 12:57.760]  If people insist on doing all their email on the web, there's an easy free solution to what happened.
[12:57.760 --> 13:07.800]  And you could have multiple free webmail accounts, like one from Gmail, then another one from Yahoo or Microsoft's Hotmail or something like that.
[13:07.900 --> 13:13.980]  And just forward one to the other all the time, like the content of one to the other and the other one to the other.
[13:14.780 --> 13:23.500]  And yes, there'll be redundant messages on both mail servers, but at least you'll be able to access one or the other to at least send mail.
[13:23.940 --> 13:26.380]  So, you know, that's one thing people could do.
[13:26.780 --> 13:26.960]  Yeah.
[13:27.060 --> 13:31.740]  It is getting harder to not use a web-based email client.
[13:31.740 --> 13:35.720]  I mean, the average person almost has no choice as far as that goes.
[13:35.720 --> 13:44.980]  And I think a lot of ISPs, too, although you can still connect using, you know, whatever your local client is, a lot of them are pushing that you use IMAP, which is also stored on the server.
[13:44.980 --> 13:45.840]  So you're not really...
[13:45.840 --> 13:50.380]  You're downloading messages locally, but they're still stored somewhere else.
[13:50.600 --> 13:50.740]  Right.
[13:50.920 --> 13:57.840]  You know, or they'll have webmail clients because, you know, a lot of people don't really want to deal with configuring, you know, their thing.
[13:57.940 --> 13:59.900]  And that's good for a lot of people.
[13:59.900 --> 14:06.260]  I mean, you know, some people just don't have the energy or time or the need to have constant access to email.
[14:06.440 --> 14:08.100]  And webmail works fine for them.
[14:08.220 --> 14:11.000]  But, you know, it still has its downfalls.
[14:11.540 --> 14:15.080]  But if you think about it, though, most people really don't have any other option.
[14:15.220 --> 14:24.580]  They either are going to an external service such as webmail or maybe whatever ISP they have for that period of time.
[14:24.580 --> 14:38.360]  But otherwise, unless you're going to put a server in your house, properly configure it, get internet access, an internet plan that will allow you to even do that, because not all service providers will allow you to do that.
[14:38.440 --> 14:40.900]  I remember back in the 90s, everybody would do things like that.
[14:40.980 --> 14:47.320]  They'd set up their own machines, put some distribution of Linux on it, and run mail clients and all kinds of things like that.
[14:47.320 --> 14:51.360]  And now it's... everyone's setting up their machine, but they're getting their email from Gmail instead.
[14:51.560 --> 14:56.940]  Well, now when I look through a lot of the terms of services, I see certain limitations placed on things like running servers out of your home.
[14:57.340 --> 14:58.300]  Well, two points.
[14:58.440 --> 15:04.400]  One thing is that compared to the 90s, a lot more people are on the internet who don't want to set up their own server.
[15:04.540 --> 15:04.660]  Yeah.
[15:04.820 --> 15:05.320]  And second of all...
[15:05.320 --> 15:07.040]  I'm referring to people that do set up their own machines, though.
[15:07.220 --> 15:07.560]  Fair enough.
[15:07.640 --> 15:11.940]  They put Ubuntu on their laptop, but then they're checking Gmail and Twitter all the time.
[15:12.120 --> 15:12.280]  Right.
[15:12.760 --> 15:20.660]  But another point is that at least Gmail offers kind of the... it seems like it's something that you're not going to lose.
[15:20.800 --> 15:21.660]  You know, like Hotmail and Yahoo.
[15:21.740 --> 15:26.020]  People have email accounts there, and they're not... they don't think Yahoo or Hotmail or Gmail are going to go anywhere.
[15:26.080 --> 15:26.360]  It seems like...
[15:26.360 --> 15:34.380]  Versus if you have an email address with your current ISP, and then, you know, next week some other one has a better offer, and you switch to them, you're going to lose your email address.
[15:34.520 --> 15:41.860]  So I think that's a big draw also for these web-based mail services, because they offer some sort of stability in terms of a way to reach you.
[15:42.280 --> 15:47.780]  Now, see, I think that's true, because as I just said, a lot of people... that's pretty much the only choice for most people.
[15:48.120 --> 15:52.580]  Now, you know, obviously, the model that Google was using didn't just come out of nowhere.
[15:53.320 --> 16:00.720]  People were obviously using web mail before them, and they simply... you could... arguably did it better, and that's why everyone started switching over to them.
[16:00.960 --> 16:04.540]  They already had the client... the market to take advantage of.
[16:04.580 --> 16:14.260]  The thing that bugs me most about Gmail, though, is the fact that they read through your email, not themselves personally, but their computer system does and gives you targeted ads based on words that are in your email.
[16:14.480 --> 16:14.560]  Yeah.
[16:14.560 --> 16:15.520]  That's just from their MO.
[16:15.740 --> 16:15.940]  Yeah.
[16:16.320 --> 16:20.360]  It's amazing to me how that doesn't bother people who are usually concerned about privacy.
[16:20.360 --> 16:26.720]  Yeah, it's amazing to me as well, because the big three, Microsoft, Google, and Yahoo, these are the three big web mail providers.
[16:26.880 --> 16:30.340]  They're also the three agencies on the internet that I'm least interested in giving my information to.
[16:30.400 --> 16:30.620]  Not anymore.
[16:30.740 --> 16:31.540]  Now it's two.
[16:32.320 --> 16:32.720]  Correct.
[16:32.940 --> 16:33.080]  Correct.
[16:33.840 --> 16:37.100]  Well, there's nothing saying that all three of those companies aren't also looking through your email.
[16:37.440 --> 16:37.760]  Mm-hmm.
[16:37.840 --> 16:38.800]  I think they are.
[16:38.920 --> 16:49.240]  I mean, I think people have a choice either to trust their data to a corporation whose only interest is profit or to an entity that they trust and that deserves their trust.
[16:49.900 --> 16:53.580]  And very few people consider that choice carefully.
[16:53.800 --> 16:55.300]  Which entity might that be?
[16:56.080 --> 16:58.200]  People trust and that deserves their trust.
[16:58.380 --> 17:01.500]  I mean, there's collectives that do this sort of thing.
[17:01.600 --> 17:03.020]  Rise Up is the biggest one.
[17:03.860 --> 17:11.300]  There's, you know, I'm sure even people who don't bother to run their own mail servers might have friends that have more time on their hands than they do.
[17:11.300 --> 17:11.700]  Mm-hmm.
[17:12.340 --> 17:15.200]  There's options for people who are concerned about their privacy.
[17:15.260 --> 17:16.680]  I like the ones that don't keep logs.
[17:17.160 --> 17:26.200]  Like, you know, Google keeps logs, as was proven with that blogger case a few weeks ago, where the information was turned over to the authorities and the identity of an anonymous person was given out.
[17:26.280 --> 17:34.140]  Google has made it very clear that it's not interested in retaining enough lawyers to fight for its subscribers' privacy.
[17:35.480 --> 17:38.640]  And if you called them up, I'm sure they'd say as much.
[17:38.780 --> 17:40.100]  It's just, it's not what they do.
[17:40.220 --> 17:40.860]  It's not what they're for.
[17:40.860 --> 17:42.000]  They're a corporation.
[17:42.200 --> 17:44.200]  The goal of the corporation is to make money.
[17:44.480 --> 17:53.780]  If it's going to cost them tens of thousands of dollars in legal fees to protect the privacy of one subscriber who's making them, you know, whatever, 25 cents a year in advertising...
[17:53.780 --> 17:54.820]  And not paying anything themselves.
[17:55.020 --> 17:55.140]  Right.
[17:55.180 --> 17:56.860]  They're going to get rid of that subscriber.
[17:57.220 --> 17:57.620]  Absolutely.
[17:57.800 --> 17:57.920]  Yeah.
[17:58.040 --> 17:59.060]  I mean, you shouldn't be surprised.
[17:59.380 --> 18:00.580]  I think we all agree on that.
[18:01.080 --> 18:01.380]  Okay.
[18:01.840 --> 18:07.540]  Speaking of surprises, this is something that surprises a lot of people and might surprise some of us yet who have traveled overseas.
[18:07.880 --> 18:21.600]  But there have been some articles appearing lately now that summer is ending about, well, phone bill surprises when people travel overseas and get hit with all kinds of horrible fees and surprises.
[18:22.960 --> 18:28.440]  I guess maybe this might be a good time to go over the various things that we did when we traveled.
[18:28.720 --> 18:34.480]  Now, Redhack, Mike, Bernie, myself, is that everybody in this area that went overseas?
[18:34.480 --> 18:37.320]  We all did something different with our phones.
[18:37.580 --> 18:38.480]  Redhack, you did something?
[18:38.620 --> 18:38.880]  Well, hang on.
[18:38.960 --> 18:47.840]  First of all, I don't know how you could go across the ocean and use your cell phone that was given to you by a US provider and be surprised that it's going to cost you a lot of money.
[18:47.960 --> 18:48.000]  Ah.
[18:48.000 --> 18:55.400]  Well, you can be surprised because some people unwittingly have their phone constantly polling for email.
[18:56.100 --> 18:58.700]  And the phenomenal charge that you get for that.
[18:58.780 --> 19:02.820]  I mean, some people have paid $8,000 for being away for a couple of weeks to the phone company.
[19:02.860 --> 19:02.980]  Right.
[19:03.060 --> 19:05.620]  This came up, I remember, a year, maybe a year and a half ago.
[19:05.740 --> 19:10.080]  There were some iPhone users who went to Greece, I think, and this was happening in the background.
[19:10.080 --> 19:19.540]  And now, at least on the iPhone, there's a data roaming switch where you basically have to tell it that, yes, I'm willing to pay the extra fees because I'm off network.
[19:19.700 --> 19:24.080]  But when I was in Europe, I had, well, I had two phones, two cell phones with me.
[19:24.900 --> 19:28.260]  But when I got there, I bought a SIM there.
[19:28.400 --> 19:37.300]  I basically had a jailbroken iPhone and unlock and a developer phone, Android phones, just in case my jailbroken iPhone didn't work.
[19:38.140 --> 19:39.440]  And I didn't have any problem.
[19:39.440 --> 19:41.020]  I just, you know... Have you gotten your bill yet?
[19:41.580 --> 19:44.840]  Well, no, because I took the AT&T SIM out of my phone.
[19:44.860 --> 19:46.260]  Okay, so it was definitely not even connected.
[19:46.520 --> 19:47.080]  Yeah, I took it out of my phone.
[19:47.080 --> 19:49.360]  The SIM card was taken out of the iPhone.
[19:49.560 --> 19:49.760]  Okay.
[19:50.060 --> 19:53.420]  And then put in a prepaid SIM that I bought there.
[19:53.440 --> 19:54.320]  And it was, you know, it was really easy.
[19:54.360 --> 19:55.340]  Just walked into the store.
[19:55.520 --> 19:56.720]  I think I had to give them my name.
[19:57.100 --> 19:57.980]  And then... Really?
[19:58.300 --> 19:59.040]  Yeah, I don't remember.
[19:59.100 --> 19:59.600]  I don't remember.
[19:59.680 --> 20:01.080]  I always get away with not doing that somehow.
[20:01.180 --> 20:02.000]  Depends on the country.
[20:02.120 --> 20:02.400]  I think it depends.
[20:02.540 --> 20:04.120]  Yeah, I was in Ireland.
[20:04.820 --> 20:07.140]  Okay, but now you have to do this for every country you go to, then.
[20:07.200 --> 20:09.960]  You have to get a different SIM card that has good rates.
[20:10.160 --> 20:19.360]  Well, I got one that... Well, I knew that I was going to be in the Netherlands and Scotland and Ireland, so I got one that covered Ireland and Scotland because the company just had home networks in both places.
[20:19.480 --> 20:19.720]  I see.
[20:19.880 --> 20:26.240]  Although, interestingly enough, when I got to Scotland, because I guess it was an Irish SIM, I had to force it to do data roaming, although it didn't cost me anything.
[20:26.360 --> 20:27.860]  It just was a different network.
[20:28.200 --> 20:30.260]  Now, the Irish system I use was very simple.
[20:30.380 --> 20:31.700]  I just put a SIM in my...
[20:31.700 --> 20:32.320]  I had two phones.
[20:32.400 --> 20:35.300]  I had my regular phone, and I have this travel phone I take with me.
[20:35.400 --> 20:38.700]  The regular phone I just keep in case somebody doesn't know I'm away and messages me.
[20:38.860 --> 20:40.020]  I can at least reach them that way.
[20:40.080 --> 20:44.620]  But I always keep the calls to a minimum, and the bill is very low.
[20:45.260 --> 20:56.320]  The Irish SIM, I think it cost me about a 10 euro or something like that, and it allowed me to call back to the United States for a fairly good price, like something like a 15 euro cents a minute or something cheap like that.
[20:56.380 --> 21:00.780]  And of course, you can receive calls for nothing if somebody is willing to call an Irish phone number.
[21:00.920 --> 21:05.960]  I had similar systems in England later on, and in the Netherlands.
[21:05.960 --> 21:07.260]  I have a bit of a story to tell.
[21:07.360 --> 21:09.180]  But first, I'd like to give other people a chance.
[21:09.360 --> 21:09.980]  Well, I just want to finish.
[21:10.140 --> 21:16.660]  Another thing that I did, and I know that Junst did, and I think Redbird did over there, is we all got data plans with it.
[21:16.760 --> 21:27.080]  So it was a prepaid thing, and then you could say, well, take whatever it was, 8 euros out of my account, and I get for that 8 euros maybe a gig of traffic, or unlimited traffic, or whatever plan we happened to be on.
[21:27.240 --> 21:33.060]  So that way we could use the smartphone thing and not worry about spending money on the data, because it was... came with it...
[21:33.060 --> 21:38.200]  Well, you mentioned Junst did this, but he wasn't able to read his email the entire trip, so I don't think he really had the best plan there, did he?
[21:38.280 --> 21:41.080]  Oh, I don't think he'd try... I mean, he had access to it, he just didn't try to.
[21:41.260 --> 21:42.560]  Okay, well, all right.
[21:42.840 --> 21:48.080]  But one other thing I wanted to say is, I did use my AT&T SIM for a little bit.
[21:48.340 --> 21:53.220]  I used it at HAR on the local GSM network, where I knew it wouldn't...
[21:53.220 --> 21:54.800]  That's not going to charge you anything.
[21:55.040 --> 21:56.560]  Right, and you needed a SIM to connect.
[21:57.200 --> 22:02.920]  So I used it for that, but obviously that was not connected to anywhere, or even remotely to AT&T, so...
[22:02.920 --> 22:03.720]  You hope not.
[22:04.540 --> 22:05.340]  I mean...
[22:05.340 --> 22:14.960]  Well, no, that was part of the agreement that they... so they set up a test network, and that was kind of the license they were operating under, and that provision of that license was they could not connect to any other network.
[22:15.160 --> 22:26.380]  Okay, I heard some stories of phones either being recycled or something, and going back on to KPN, the Dutch network, instead of NL42, which was the HAR network.
[22:26.380 --> 22:26.640]  Yeah.
[22:27.160 --> 22:27.880]  If you didn't force...
[22:27.880 --> 22:32.720]  That resulted in some confusion, especially once when somebody tried to call security at 112 and wound up calling the Dutch police.
[22:33.140 --> 22:33.500]  Right.
[22:33.640 --> 22:35.280]  That's a whole big thing there, but...
[22:35.280 --> 22:42.960]  Well, I mean, at least with my phone, I was able to say, once I picked the network, you know, and I didn't have it on automatic, then it stuck with that network, so...
[22:42.960 --> 22:43.260]  Okay.
[22:43.500 --> 22:43.620]  Yeah.
[22:43.620 --> 22:43.940]  Mike?
[22:44.140 --> 22:44.800]  Is there...
[22:44.800 --> 22:50.300]  I mean, we've had this discussion every time any of us have traveled for the past, I don't know, four, six, eight years.
[22:50.700 --> 22:52.320]  The technology is not new.
[22:52.580 --> 22:53.020]  Mm-hmm.
[22:53.040 --> 22:57.140]  I'm not really sure why the article is pretending that high roaming bills are new.
[22:57.480 --> 22:59.660]  Well, articles are read by different people.
[22:59.820 --> 23:02.720]  I mean, they do say different things to different audiences.
[23:02.720 --> 23:12.600]  I mean, one thing that's exciting in Europe is that the European Commission has noticed that roaming rates do not bear any relation to the actual cost of providing roaming service.
[23:12.600 --> 23:13.100]  Oh, of course not.
[23:13.240 --> 23:13.300]  Yeah.
[23:14.540 --> 23:25.780]  So, within Europe, so if you are a Dutch person and you travel to, say, Britain, your roaming rates will, in the future, be much lower than they historically have been.
[23:25.960 --> 23:26.060]  Right.
[23:26.200 --> 23:28.280]  But this, of course, doesn't apply to Americans.
[23:28.520 --> 23:34.380]  The thing that gets me is that, well, roaming is something that one company charges another company for using their network.
[23:34.640 --> 23:38.940]  But if I have T-Mobile and I'm using T-Mobile over there as well, it's the same company.
[23:38.940 --> 23:42.440]  So why am I paying T-Mobile roaming charges for them using their own network?
[23:42.440 --> 23:43.820]  Because they can get away with it.
[23:43.960 --> 23:44.100]  Yeah.
[23:44.280 --> 23:50.700]  And they figure people who are traveling overseas are not quite as cost sensitive as people who aren't.
[23:52.780 --> 23:56.320]  And, but basically, it comes down to charging you as much as they can get away with.
[23:56.420 --> 23:59.220]  And in this case, it's, you know, usually a couple of bucks a minute.
[23:59.340 --> 24:08.740]  The thing we have to remember, most people, and it is true, most people are not really phone savvy as far as knowing exactly what to do when they get overseas and how not to get ripped off.
[24:08.860 --> 24:09.860]  Now, there's a couple of things.
[24:09.960 --> 24:14.480]  First of all, if you have Verizon, if you have Sprint, you're out of luck because it's not going to work over there anyway.
[24:14.560 --> 24:16.420]  Or maybe you're in luck because it won't work over there anyway.
[24:16.600 --> 24:17.880]  Except in Canada, where it will work.
[24:18.060 --> 24:19.400]  But Canada's not in Europe, last I checked.
[24:19.440 --> 24:20.180]  Well, but it's over there.
[24:20.280 --> 24:23.020]  It's as far out of the country as many Americans ever get.
[24:23.320 --> 24:24.780]  Overseas, over the Atlantic Ocean.
[24:25.680 --> 24:35.160]  So, basically, you would need to either use something different when you get over there or use your existing GSM phone and put a different SIM in it, which is what I think most of us did.
[24:35.220 --> 24:36.180]  Now, Mike, you went to Morocco.
[24:36.720 --> 24:36.980]  Yes.
[24:36.980 --> 24:37.720]  How did that work?
[24:38.060 --> 24:38.520]  The same.
[24:38.600 --> 24:39.320]  The same story.
[24:39.480 --> 24:39.880]  Same story.
[24:40.100 --> 24:41.320]  To Morocco for whatever country you went to.
[24:41.320 --> 24:42.140]  And did you get a good rate?
[24:42.240 --> 24:42.680]  Decent rate?
[24:43.240 --> 24:46.980]  So, the rate is actually not normally a particularly good rate.
[24:47.100 --> 24:50.820]  It's a little less than a dollar a minute to call the states.
[24:51.040 --> 24:51.080]  Oh, that's horrible.
[24:51.080 --> 24:52.060]  To call the states.
[24:52.260 --> 24:53.440]  Local calls, much less.
[24:53.580 --> 24:55.680]  But, while I was there, they were having a three-for-one promotion.
[24:55.680 --> 24:58.200]  So, it brought it down to like 30 cents or something.
[24:58.360 --> 24:58.580]  Uh-huh.
[24:58.880 --> 25:00.800]  Which is about what it costs.
[25:00.980 --> 25:06.420]  Now, when I went to Malaysia, there was some special code you could dial and route your call voice over IP.
[25:06.700 --> 25:10.600]  And it brought the rate down to like 5 cents a minute from Malaysia to the United States.
[25:10.720 --> 25:11.480]  And that was incredible.
[25:11.720 --> 25:13.180]  But how do you find things like that?
[25:13.600 --> 25:15.480]  You have to ask around, I would imagine.
[25:16.240 --> 25:16.560]  Yeah.
[25:16.840 --> 25:20.980]  I mean, if you have sufficient time on your hands, you can ask the internet for help.
[25:21.080 --> 25:21.760]  With these questions.
[25:22.160 --> 25:23.560]  You need to find the internet first.
[25:24.200 --> 25:24.600]  Emanuel.
[25:24.880 --> 25:25.420]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[25:26.240 --> 25:28.920]  I just want to say, there's something that we haven't mentioned yet.
[25:28.980 --> 25:32.160]  It's a trick I've used on multiple trips to Europe.
[25:32.160 --> 25:37.280]  I have an unlocked GSM phone, a cheap Samsung piece of crap.
[25:37.520 --> 25:39.660]  But, you know, basic phone functions.
[25:39.880 --> 25:44.140]  And I buy a prepaid SIM card for the country in the United States.
[25:44.140 --> 25:50.720]  You know, although I was one of the hackers on a plane 1.6 trip, which went to Austria and then across Germany and then the Netherlands.
[25:50.720 --> 25:55.780]  I knew I'd be spending at least a good part of my time in the Netherlands.
[25:55.780 --> 26:06.440]  So I bought a Dutch SIM from KPN through Aussie, our chef there at Haar.
[26:06.440 --> 26:11.120]  And it was like $10 for the SIM, or €10 anyway.
[26:11.860 --> 26:13.560]  And I gave them all the time I needed.
[26:13.740 --> 26:33.760]  And I also, on the way, I purchased a prepaid call to USA voice over IP card, which allows you to call a number in the Netherlands, a local number, to out-dial to the US for just pennies a minute.
[26:33.760 --> 26:42.040]  So I programmed that number into the phone and basically was able to call the US for pennies a minute, as opposed to $2 a minute.
[26:42.300 --> 26:44.340]  Now, did you have to pay to call that Dutch number?
[26:44.660 --> 26:45.340]  I did.
[26:45.340 --> 26:53.460]  But it wasn't a lot, because it was part of the prepaid KPN SIM that I purchased in the Netherlands.
[26:53.680 --> 26:55.200]  So it really wasn't a lot.
[26:55.360 --> 27:01.660]  It was, you know, it was far cheaper than any alternative I could have used except Skype, which I did try Skype as well.
[27:01.660 --> 27:03.920]  And that worked, but that has its own disadvantages.
[27:04.260 --> 27:08.360]  But in any case, that is an alternative that I think a lot of people miss out on.
[27:08.500 --> 27:09.500]  You can buy these cards.
[27:09.600 --> 27:10.780]  They look like a credit card.
[27:10.860 --> 27:15.420]  You can buy them at any, you know, like a place to sell cigarettes or whatever.
[27:15.420 --> 27:17.440]  And they're usually like 5 or 10 Euro.
[27:17.920 --> 27:18.280]  Yeah.
[27:18.720 --> 27:21.160]  And they said, like, they called Call USA cards.
[27:21.860 --> 27:25.680]  And, you know, for a few Euro cents a minute, you can call the US.
[27:25.800 --> 27:28.060]  And you can use it on a hotel phone.
[27:28.420 --> 27:32.800]  You can use it on a pay phone, but you have to pay a surcharge, just like you do in the US for those kinds of cards.
[27:33.120 --> 27:39.120]  But you can use that in conjunction with a prepaid SIM card, I think, to save a lot of money.
[27:39.120 --> 27:41.280]  And that's something that a lot of people don't take advantage of.
[27:41.440 --> 27:43.660]  Well, you had a much better experience than I did.
[27:43.760 --> 27:46.120]  I went to one of those stores in the Netherlands.
[27:46.480 --> 27:52.540]  And I asked for a SIM that would, a prepaid SIM that would have a decent rate to the United States.
[27:52.700 --> 27:59.160]  And I was told that this company called Labara, L-E-B-A-R-A, was a good option.
[27:59.160 --> 28:04.980]  And for 15 Euro, I would get a SIM card that I could put into my phone.
[28:04.980 --> 28:15.380]  And I'd have 750 credit, and the rate would be something like 15 Euro cents, I think, is what the rate was to the United States.
[28:15.420 --> 28:16.280]  And I thought that was pretty good.
[28:16.920 --> 28:18.280]  Get the SIM for that amount.
[28:18.280 --> 28:20.080]  I have a phone number, and I'm able to...
[28:20.080 --> 28:21.220]  I have 750 credit.
[28:22.120 --> 28:24.040]  And then I started checking...
[28:24.040 --> 28:26.460]  When I was making the phone calls, I started checking the balance.
[28:26.600 --> 28:30.140]  You can dial little numbers, or sometimes it displays on your screen how much you have left.
[28:30.140 --> 28:37.120]  And I realized that it was taking away 30 Euro cents for every call per minute.
[28:37.740 --> 28:41.140]  And I called customer service just to ask...
[28:41.140 --> 28:42.880]  I thought maybe this was just a mistake.
[28:43.180 --> 28:44.760]  Maybe it billed me for two minutes once.
[28:44.900 --> 28:51.320]  And I called customer service, and it said, you will be billed some amount of money, like 50 cents for this call.
[28:52.000 --> 28:53.760]  And then it gave me a chance to hang up.
[28:53.840 --> 28:55.280]  And I kind of panicked and hung up.
[28:55.360 --> 28:59.560]  And then I checked again, and it had already deducted 50 cents for that call, even though I had hung up before the deadline.
[28:59.940 --> 29:01.360]  So I was really mad at this point.
[29:01.440 --> 29:02.360]  So I called it again.
[29:02.620 --> 29:03.940]  And I said, look...
[29:03.940 --> 29:05.540]  And it rang with a British ring.
[29:05.780 --> 29:09.540]  And some guy picked up, and I said, look, this is the problem I'm having here.
[29:09.680 --> 29:13.020]  It's charging me 30 Euro cents a minute instead of 15.
[29:13.760 --> 29:16.400]  And the guy's answer to this was, yes, we billed double.
[29:17.820 --> 29:20.440]  He actually said, yes, we billed double.
[29:21.000 --> 29:27.500]  And I gave him every opportunity to explain exactly what he meant by that without making it sound like they were blatantly ripping me off.
[29:27.560 --> 29:29.240]  And he really didn't do it.
[29:29.300 --> 29:30.480]  It was very difficult.
[29:30.700 --> 29:31.200]  I said, so wait a minute.
[29:31.240 --> 29:37.480]  You're saying you're billing me twice the amount that you claim you're going to bill me when I buy the car.
[29:37.520 --> 29:38.340]  I said, yes, that's correct.
[29:38.480 --> 29:39.000]  See you, Emmanuel.
[29:40.680 --> 29:45.280]  So laid back and friendly saying, yes, we're totally screwing you here.
[29:45.280 --> 29:50.740]  So eventually, I was able to get this out of him by asking lots and lots and lots of questions.
[29:53.540 --> 29:56.100]  Apparently, they billed double for some crazy reason.
[29:56.160 --> 30:01.600]  But if I enter a particular code, that also doubles the amount of credit I have.
[30:01.740 --> 30:07.460]  So 750 turns into 15, and then I get billed 30 instead of 15 for 750.
[30:07.460 --> 30:08.820]  It's the most ridiculous thing ever.
[30:08.980 --> 30:10.560]  So I asked him, okay, how do I do this?
[30:10.660 --> 30:17.900]  He said, oh, you have to go onto the website, which is a pain in the ass if you don't have internet access, which fortunately I did, and enter some kind of code there.
[30:18.240 --> 30:23.940]  Well, it turns out I went on the internet, and I checked out exactly what it was I had to do.
[30:24.100 --> 30:26.700]  And sure enough, there was something to get a 750 credit.
[30:27.160 --> 30:30.720]  I clicked English, and as soon as I entered the 750 credit, it went back to Dutch.
[30:30.760 --> 30:32.260]  So I had to get a Dutch person to help me.
[30:32.500 --> 30:36.800]  And it turns out that, yes, you enter the code, and you get the 750 credit in the mail.
[30:36.980 --> 30:40.320]  It gets mailed to you, which was completely useless to me.
[30:40.320 --> 30:43.820]  So I got totally ripped off by this company called Libera.
[30:43.920 --> 30:45.040]  Never use these people.
[30:45.180 --> 30:47.680]  They will rip you off if you use them in the Netherlands.
[30:47.700 --> 30:48.700]  It was horrible.
[30:48.800 --> 30:48.960]  Rob?
[30:49.140 --> 30:52.060]  You seem a bit baffled in saying there's some crazy reason they build you double.
[30:52.200 --> 30:53.180]  It's not that crazy a reason.
[30:53.220 --> 30:54.800]  They like your money, and they wish to take it from you.
[30:54.840 --> 30:54.960]  Yeah.
[30:55.100 --> 30:57.320]  Well, they certainly have no qualms about saying so.
[30:58.940 --> 31:03.740]  Incidentally, one of the biggest ways companies get clients is through word of mouth.
[31:03.740 --> 31:05.680]  So I'm sure...
[31:05.680 --> 31:09.940]  I just let my mouth do the talking now, and I hope it gets back to them.
[31:10.100 --> 31:15.140]  But, you know, I did have somebody fill it out for me, and I'm told the credit arrived.
[31:15.300 --> 31:20.520]  So, yes, they do send you the credit, but it's useless to people who are traveling who don't have addresses and can't speak Dutch.
[31:20.700 --> 31:23.280]  It sounds like a very strange rebate that they didn't tell you about.
[31:23.280 --> 31:32.140]  There's a simple solution to your problem, and it's don't travel in countries where English is widely spoken for you to call them up on the phone and get it explained to you at all.
[31:32.320 --> 31:34.480]  If you didn't know what was going on, you'd be much happier.
[31:35.040 --> 31:41.220]  No, you know, I was pretty sure that I was being ripped off from the start, as soon as I started seeing how things were working.
[31:41.220 --> 31:43.740]  The phone I bought in Morocco, I somehow pressed the wrong button.
[31:43.760 --> 31:45.560]  It would only ever speak Arabic to me.
[31:45.620 --> 31:46.860]  I didn't know what was going on.
[31:46.940 --> 31:47.700]  They could have ripped me off.
[31:47.760 --> 31:48.400]  I'd never know.
[31:48.560 --> 31:49.960]  I used O2 in England.
[31:49.980 --> 31:52.180]  I was very happy with them because it was very...
[31:52.180 --> 31:54.880]  You know, it took a while to figure out how to enter all the codes and things like that.
[31:54.900 --> 31:57.000]  It was a lot of advertising when you called them up.
[31:57.240 --> 32:00.580]  But once you finally did that, it worked exactly as they said it would work.
[32:00.580 --> 32:03.380]  And after every call, it would display on your phone how much was left.
[32:03.380 --> 32:04.780]  And it all worked out.
[32:04.980 --> 32:09.680]  So the company that I used for my SIM in Ireland and Scotland was called 3.
[32:10.940 --> 32:18.080]  And my only complaint was that when I was in Isla, their coverage map on their website clearly indicated that I should have service there.
[32:18.500 --> 32:20.140]  But as soon as I got there, I did not.
[32:20.340 --> 32:21.640]  Isla, the scotch drinking island.
[32:21.760 --> 32:22.160]  Isla, yeah.
[32:22.200 --> 32:25.500]  I mean, I can't entirely blame them for not having coverage there.
[32:25.500 --> 32:27.980]  I can blame them for having it on their coverage map.
[32:29.420 --> 32:31.700]  But other than that, it was pretty good.
[32:31.820 --> 32:37.020]  And what was interesting to me was that they said that you could basically make Skype calls for free.
[32:38.060 --> 32:44.620]  Unfortunately, I couldn't because none of the handsets I had with me were supported in terms of the software they had available for Skype.
[32:44.720 --> 32:46.680]  But I thought that was kind of neat.
[32:46.680 --> 32:49.720]  So I guess if you have a compatible handset, you could do that.
[32:49.720 --> 32:51.660]  Which, I don't understand how that makes them any money.
[32:51.740 --> 32:55.940]  But I guess they don't really make a lot of money off of foreign bound calls.
[32:56.020 --> 33:04.580]  Well, I guess the lesson to be learned here is to speak to a lot of people, check before you buy, and try not to make too many phone calls.
[33:04.580 --> 33:10.080]  Because I think, you know, that's where people really miss out on traveling in the first place by talking on the phone too much, right?
[33:10.080 --> 33:12.300]  Yeah, go on vacation, get away from your people at home.
[33:12.300 --> 33:18.140]  Get away from the computer, get away from the phone, and just try not to get ripped off in other ways.
[33:18.700 --> 33:20.640]  Oh, oh, you know what this is, right?
[33:24.770 --> 33:26.390]  We haven't heard this feature in a while.
[33:28.850 --> 33:30.910]  This is, of course, .gov of the week.
[33:34.620 --> 33:42.200]  Where we go out and find a .gov website that is filled with all kinds of fascinating, interesting information that you might not know is out there.
[33:50.020 --> 33:58.840]  Yeah, it's this week, we venture out and visit the friendly people over at FEMA, who I understand have a brand new website for children.
[33:59.240 --> 34:01.780]  It's called fema.gov slash kids.
[34:02.440 --> 34:04.900]  And let's just look at a little bit of this.
[34:05.060 --> 34:11.420]  And I think we'll all learn something and feel a lot better about disasters and various things like that, in the way that it's explained.
[34:12.040 --> 34:12.960]  Disasters can happen.
[34:13.080 --> 34:15.060]  They often happen quickly and without warning.
[34:15.240 --> 34:17.120]  And they can be scary for you and your parents.
[34:17.120 --> 34:21.460]  For example, you may have to leave your home and you may not be able to go to school.
[34:21.800 --> 34:22.740]  That's pretty scary.
[34:23.260 --> 34:26.880]  You may not be able to sleep in your own bed and things may be confusing for a while.
[34:27.480 --> 34:29.340]  There are six important things to remember.
[34:29.740 --> 34:30.320]  Six things.
[34:30.420 --> 34:32.860]  Number one, disasters don't last very long.
[34:33.100 --> 34:35.220]  Soon, things will be back to normal.
[34:35.420 --> 34:36.180]  It's not true.
[34:37.340 --> 34:38.220]  I mean...
[34:38.220 --> 34:38.420]  Quiet!
[34:38.740 --> 34:42.960]  The disaster itself doesn't last long, but did you see what FEMA did to New Orleans?
[34:43.160 --> 34:43.540]  I mean...
[34:43.540 --> 34:44.540]  Well, I'm going to get to that.
[34:45.060 --> 34:48.600]  Now, number two, you can get a new routine if you can't go home for a while.
[34:49.200 --> 34:52.820]  You will settle down into a new place and you will meet new friends.
[34:53.440 --> 34:56.860]  You will also meet some pretty formidable new enemies, too, but we'll get into that later.
[34:57.420 --> 35:00.920]  Number three, look to your parents or other adults for help when you feel scared or confused.
[35:01.180 --> 35:03.000]  They will help you understand what is happening.
[35:03.620 --> 35:04.300]  Fat chance.
[35:04.300 --> 35:07.960]  Don't be afraid to ask questions like, how long will we be in the shelter?
[35:08.140 --> 35:09.880]  Or when will I go back to school?
[35:10.340 --> 35:11.900]  Is this a page per tip?
[35:12.520 --> 35:14.320]  Yeah, they waste a lot of pages.
[35:14.320 --> 35:16.200]  And I waste a lot of paper by printing them.
[35:16.440 --> 35:17.240]  I'm sorry, but I had to.
[35:17.840 --> 35:22.340]  Number four, sometimes it helps to write about your experiences or to draw pictures about what has happened.
[35:22.520 --> 35:24.480]  You can describe what happened and how you feel.
[35:24.620 --> 35:27.460]  The FEMA for Kids website can post your projects.
[35:27.640 --> 35:29.800]  And that way you're helping the FEMA website more than anybody.
[35:30.260 --> 35:33.040]  Number five, it's okay to cry during a disaster.
[35:33.520 --> 35:35.780]  But remember, it will get better.
[35:35.900 --> 35:36.960]  They put that in caps.
[35:37.140 --> 35:38.480]  So I think you're supposed to shout that part.
[35:39.380 --> 35:41.500]  And number six, finally, you may be able to help out.
[35:41.680 --> 35:49.260]  Children of all ages can help in the shelter by working hard labor and doing various other tasks that ordinarily couldn't pay people to do.
[35:49.380 --> 35:53.780]  Now, can help in the shelter by babysitting other children or cleaning up or serving food.
[35:53.980 --> 35:54.920]  Assuming there is food.
[35:55.120 --> 35:59.860]  You can even help with sandbagging or cleaning up your house after a tornado or hurricane or earthquake.
[35:59.920 --> 36:01.700]  Because FEMA sure is not going to do that.
[36:02.560 --> 36:03.680]  All right, so...
[36:03.680 --> 36:13.640]  I want to see some examples of work that kids who had bigger stresses than dealing with the FEMA website, where's their work?
[36:15.020 --> 36:17.340]  I'm sure there's a section that goes into detail.
[36:17.340 --> 36:19.160]  You said, right here, number four, I think it was.
[36:19.160 --> 36:25.260]  I like how your idea of browsing the website right now is flipping through a stack of papers.
[36:25.260 --> 36:27.640]  I can't go onto the computer and then click things.
[36:28.420 --> 36:30.860]  Now, there's a map of the United States here.
[36:31.320 --> 36:36.320]  And what you do is you click on any state to find out what natural disasters are possible there.
[36:37.220 --> 36:39.920]  And to see what disasters have happened there recently.
[36:40.740 --> 36:41.260]  Yeah.
[36:41.600 --> 36:41.700]  Yeah.
[36:41.700 --> 36:44.420]  And basically, I clicked on New York.
[36:44.640 --> 36:51.400]  And New York, we had a severe winter storm March 4th, 2009.
[36:51.400 --> 36:55.340]  And we had another severe winter storm on December 18th, 2008.
[36:55.500 --> 36:56.580]  We had two winter storms last winter.
[36:56.660 --> 36:56.980]  I didn't know that.
[36:57.420 --> 36:59.960]  And we can have these kinds of disasters.
[37:00.140 --> 37:06.420]  Earthquake, fire, flooding, hurricane slash tropical storm, mudslide slash landslide, severe storm or winter storm.
[37:06.420 --> 37:09.280]  I think they just put every single disaster on every single state.
[37:09.860 --> 37:10.380]  You know what?
[37:10.400 --> 37:11.620]  I think you might be right there, actually.
[37:11.740 --> 37:12.420]  Because I think...
[37:13.000 --> 37:13.720]  No, that's not true.
[37:13.820 --> 37:14.240]  That's not true.
[37:14.260 --> 37:17.220]  Because I'm looking at California now, and they do not have hurricane slash tropical storm.
[37:17.320 --> 37:19.360]  Even though a hurricane right now is heading for California.
[37:19.500 --> 37:20.960]  Well, it's a typhoon if it's in the Pacific.
[37:21.480 --> 37:23.300]  No, it's a hurricane heading for Baja, California.
[37:23.320 --> 37:23.860]  Well, that might change the website.
[37:23.860 --> 37:24.440]  As if they don't have enough trouble.
[37:25.160 --> 37:25.700]  It might.
[37:25.740 --> 37:26.300]  This might change.
[37:26.460 --> 37:27.420]  We'll be watching history.
[37:27.560 --> 37:30.580]  A wildfire was declared on November 18th, 2008.
[37:30.820 --> 37:33.200]  But apparently nothing recently has been declared in California.
[37:33.400 --> 37:34.680]  When was the last New York mudslide?
[37:34.680 --> 37:35.120]  I want to know.
[37:35.120 --> 37:35.620]  I don't know.
[37:35.700 --> 37:37.420]  Probably at Stony Brook University.
[37:37.600 --> 37:39.980]  Well, who can remember when the last earthquake was?
[37:40.980 --> 37:43.240]  I'm sure some people might have that in their minds.
[37:43.320 --> 37:46.920]  Okay, so disasters that happened this month.
[37:47.520 --> 37:48.520]  There's a calendar.
[37:49.240 --> 37:57.900]  And what I did was I went through various dates just so that we could have anniversaries and see what kinds of disasters happened in this time.
[37:57.960 --> 37:59.040]  This is now, what, September 2nd?
[37:59.340 --> 38:03.460]  So August 26, 1998, Hurricane Bonnie hits North Carolina.
[38:03.560 --> 38:04.220]  Remember Hurricane Bonnie?
[38:04.220 --> 38:05.620]  That's when we were filming Freedom Downtime.
[38:05.740 --> 38:08.120]  Hurricane Bonnie was the hurricane we were in the midst of.
[38:08.680 --> 38:11.260]  Hanging over parts of North Carolina for many hours.
[38:11.440 --> 38:16.440]  Preventive measures taken after Hurricane Fran helps reduce the expected storm damage.
[38:16.440 --> 38:30.660]  August 27, I'm sorry, it's at 1883, the volcanic island of Krakatoa explodes and collapses, generating tsunami that killed 36,000 people in nearby Sumatra and Java.
[38:30.780 --> 38:35.960]  I guess I'm not sure how FEMA is keeping track of things in other countries, but I guess they didn't have anything on that date.
[38:35.960 --> 38:39.440]  Things in other countries before FEMA was created.
[38:39.720 --> 38:40.780]  I mean, that's really...
[38:40.780 --> 38:41.000]  Yeah.
[38:41.900 --> 38:42.020]  Yeah.
[38:42.840 --> 38:46.440]  Do they cover only natural disasters or all kinds of disasters?
[38:46.440 --> 38:47.340]  We'll get to the other...
[38:47.340 --> 38:48.820]  I think it's only natural disasters.
[38:48.960 --> 38:49.980]  I think chemical spills are covered.
[38:49.980 --> 38:53.200]  Did they not cover the great Boston molasses flood of 1919?
[38:53.200 --> 38:54.760]  No, I think they might have missed that.
[38:55.000 --> 38:58.620]  But let me move on to more important dates in this particular time of the year.
[38:58.740 --> 39:06.660]  September 1, 1923, an 8.3 earthquake hits Japan, spurring raging fires that kill 140,000.
[39:07.020 --> 39:12.380]  September 3, 1961, Hurricane Carla devastates Texas cities, killing 46.
[39:12.700 --> 39:16.940]  September 4, 1960, Hurricane Donna kills 615 people in the U.S.
[39:16.940 --> 39:17.540]  and Puerto Rico.
[39:17.540 --> 39:25.020]  September 5, 1996, Hurricane Fran, as we mentioned before, hits the Carolinas, taking 24 lives in states from South Carolina to Pennsylvania.
[39:25.360 --> 39:33.600]  September 6, 1975, a 6.8 earthquake in eastern Turkey leaves 2,300 dead from the quake, aftershocks, and falling buildings.
[39:34.280 --> 39:35.000]  Interesting thing.
[39:35.000 --> 39:36.580]  Look at this calendar here, all right?
[39:36.580 --> 39:40.300]  You see every single one of these icons here represents a disaster that took place.
[39:40.320 --> 39:41.420]  And I'm looking at the month of August.
[39:41.420 --> 39:43.380]  You see little swirling things for hurricanes.
[39:43.380 --> 39:47.580]  You see houses for, I guess, earthquakes.
[39:48.600 --> 39:49.460]  But you know what?
[39:49.660 --> 39:52.960]  August the 28th is empty.
[39:53.380 --> 39:55.080]  That's the day Katrina hit.
[39:55.260 --> 39:58.200]  They don't have that as a list of disasters.
[39:58.880 --> 40:00.660]  They want to forget about this.
[40:00.900 --> 40:01.820]  Isn't that incredible?
[40:01.840 --> 40:02.740]  It's not there at all.
[40:02.840 --> 40:05.020]  Is there only one disaster per day as well?
[40:06.100 --> 40:07.820]  Apparently, that's all they can handle at the moment.
[40:08.660 --> 40:11.900]  And that's fair, because in real life, that's more than the way they can handle at the moment.
[40:12.920 --> 40:13.280]  Yes?
[40:13.460 --> 40:18.100]  And this is meant to be a kiddie-friendly site, but they've got those listings with the death counts in the thousands.
[40:18.120 --> 40:21.500]  You know, right after you're told to draw crayon drawings and clean your room.
[40:21.520 --> 40:22.780]  Well, only if it's in a foreign country.
[40:22.940 --> 40:27.000]  You see, the reason why they don't have Katrina is because death counts were in the thousands in our own country.
[40:27.400 --> 40:31.040]  Or, you know, very far away in the past when we didn't know what we were doing.
[40:31.640 --> 40:31.960]  Emmanuel?
[40:32.140 --> 40:32.620]  Yes, Bernie?
[40:33.520 --> 40:36.900]  Besides them not having any information about Katrina, which is just gross...
[40:37.920 --> 40:38.920]  At least on that page.
[40:38.920 --> 40:41.340]  I'm not sure about all the other pages, but definitely not on that page.
[40:41.340 --> 40:43.480]  There's no information there about dikes.
[40:44.000 --> 40:48.320]  You know, there should be information about dikes, because that was what caused all the flooding there.
[40:48.520 --> 40:57.220]  The Army Corps of Engineers failed to build appropriately designed dikes, and it flooded all of New Orleans.
[40:57.220 --> 41:03.100]  Well, I don't know if you want to be casting blame in front of children and pointing fingers, but...
[41:03.100 --> 41:04.440]  I'm not blaming dikes.
[41:04.440 --> 41:05.480]  I'm not blaming dikes.
[41:05.540 --> 41:07.260]  I'm blaming the Army Corps of Engineers.
[41:07.740 --> 41:09.420]  You're blaming somebody, is my point.
[41:09.840 --> 41:22.560]  And FEMA should say that, you know, dikes, or poorly designed dikes by the Army Corps of Engineers, should be listed there as a potential disaster vector, even though it's a man-made disaster.
[41:22.560 --> 41:24.080]  All right, all right, all right.
[41:24.440 --> 41:25.500]  Now, we have...
[41:25.500 --> 41:25.820]  Go ahead.
[41:26.120 --> 41:30.340]  I was just going to say, in terms of what Bernie was covering, you know, back...
[41:30.340 --> 41:31.740]  I think it was in the Netherlands, right?
[41:31.800 --> 41:33.160]  They had a big problem with flooding, too.
[41:33.240 --> 41:35.080]  They had storms that would come in and flood cities.
[41:35.240 --> 41:41.320]  And so they built walls that were able to withstand, you know...
[41:41.320 --> 41:41.920]  And they did it right.
[41:42.240 --> 41:42.960]  They did it correctly.
[41:43.100 --> 41:43.540]  Yes, yes.
[41:43.660 --> 41:47.980]  And, you know, here in the States, we just throw stuff up hodgepodge, and then, oh, well, now there's a big problem.
[41:48.040 --> 41:54.340]  Okay, we have a little quiz here, and I'm going to ask people to answer these questions and hopefully get them right, and hopefully we can get 100%.
[41:54.340 --> 41:56.280]  I know what the answers are, so I'm not going to answer them.
[41:56.380 --> 41:57.040]  First one, C.
[41:58.040 --> 42:00.220]  They don't have letters, so you're wrong right away, okay?
[42:00.760 --> 42:03.380]  All right, which one is not a natural disaster?
[42:04.820 --> 42:10.340]  Flood, tornado, hurricane, breaking your leg, earthquake, or wildfire?
[42:10.780 --> 42:11.100]  Anybody?
[42:11.100 --> 42:11.820]  They're not serious.
[42:12.600 --> 42:13.420]  Oh, they're serious.
[42:13.460 --> 42:16.540]  I mean, a flood is a combination of components.
[42:16.540 --> 42:20.700]  All right, you know, we're not going to have time if every single one of these is analyzed.
[42:20.860 --> 42:21.440]  Yes, not Kevin.
[42:21.580 --> 42:22.380]  What if the wildfire is arson?
[42:22.540 --> 42:23.620]  Does it count as a natural disaster?
[42:23.760 --> 42:23.800]  Yeah.
[42:23.980 --> 42:24.580]  That's a good question.
[42:24.580 --> 42:25.480]  That happened in Greece.
[42:25.700 --> 42:27.060]  They arrested people for that.
[42:27.060 --> 42:27.580]  Yeah, yeah.
[42:27.680 --> 42:29.460]  Well, I think once it becomes a wildfire...
[42:29.460 --> 42:29.760]  People have died.
[42:29.900 --> 42:32.460]  Well, people can start hurricanes too, so you never really know.
[42:32.860 --> 42:35.500]  All right, number two, what is the name of floods that happen very quickly?
[42:35.500 --> 42:40.200]  Flash floods, quick floods, flood and fast, or water world?
[42:42.060 --> 42:42.880]  I saw that film.
[42:42.920 --> 42:43.520]  It was a disaster.
[42:43.780 --> 42:44.020]  Yeah, it was.
[42:44.240 --> 42:45.440]  But was it quick?
[42:45.600 --> 42:47.480]  I seem to recall it being way too long.
[42:47.500 --> 42:50.820]  Number three, true or false, it's okay to touch and drink flood waters?
[42:51.640 --> 42:52.340]  Oh, no.
[42:53.420 --> 42:55.380]  All right, well, I'm sure it's not good to do that.
[42:55.380 --> 42:56.440]  What is an earthquake?
[42:56.960 --> 42:57.980]  The turtle tail?
[42:58.220 --> 42:59.080]  I didn't know what that is.
[42:59.740 --> 43:02.460]  Shaking, rolling, or a sudden shock of the earth's surface?
[43:02.900 --> 43:06.120]  High winds and seas, or the same as electrocution?
[43:07.200 --> 43:07.640]  Yeah.
[43:08.280 --> 43:09.280]  Isn't it a game?
[43:09.360 --> 43:10.900]  What should you do during an earthquake?
[43:11.620 --> 43:12.780]  This actually I got wrong.
[43:13.260 --> 43:13.980]  Stop dropping wrong.
[43:14.140 --> 43:18.340]  Run outside, get in bed, drop and cover, or take a vacation.
[43:18.540 --> 43:19.140]  What's the answer?
[43:19.760 --> 43:20.080]  Take a vacation.
[43:20.080 --> 43:20.440]  Drop and cover.
[43:21.140 --> 43:22.160]  Okay, what's the answer?
[43:22.220 --> 43:22.860]  Anybody serious?
[43:23.200 --> 43:23.740]  Drop and cover.
[43:23.740 --> 43:27.180]  Drop and cover, I think is correct, because I said run outside, because that's what everybody always does.
[43:27.180 --> 43:28.520]  They run outside when there's an earthquake.
[43:28.680 --> 43:29.840]  I just figured that was the right thing to do.
[43:29.900 --> 43:38.760]  Well, inside, I've heard that being inside of a doorway frame is the safest place in the house, but I would think, I mean, I would run outside.
[43:38.920 --> 43:40.280]  Yeah, outdoors is probably better than being inside of an earthquake.
[43:40.560 --> 43:42.000]  Where nothing can fall on me.
[43:42.100 --> 43:42.320]  Uh-huh.
[43:42.600 --> 43:43.220]  Except buildings.
[43:43.580 --> 43:46.760]  No, except where nothing can fall on me, like in the middle of the street.
[43:46.900 --> 43:53.340]  You know, I hear that door frame thing repeated a lot, but when you see the devastation after a huge earthquake, you see like rubble, rubble, rubble, doorway.
[43:53.620 --> 43:54.520]  Rubble, rubble, doorway.
[43:54.800 --> 43:54.940]  Yeah.
[43:55.000 --> 43:58.460]  Which is why I say outside, like in a park.
[43:58.940 --> 43:59.160]  All right.
[43:59.160 --> 44:00.400]  What is an aftershock?
[44:00.620 --> 44:01.540]  Static electricity?
[44:01.860 --> 44:02.780]  A candy bar?
[44:03.040 --> 44:04.400]  A new shoe by Nike?
[44:04.680 --> 44:06.880]  Or a smaller earthquake that follows the main earthquake?
[44:06.880 --> 44:08.160]  That candy bar tastes awesome.
[44:08.160 --> 44:08.500]  So obvious.
[44:08.660 --> 44:09.220]  I want to go with all the above.
[44:09.220 --> 44:10.560]  I know, it is pretty obvious, isn't it?
[44:10.740 --> 44:13.560]  Because only one of them has anything to do with the FEMA website.
[44:13.640 --> 44:14.980]  Yeah, this isn't like one silly answer.
[44:15.120 --> 44:17.160]  It's like three silly answers and one sensible answer.
[44:17.620 --> 44:17.640]  Yeah.
[44:17.800 --> 44:19.000]  Tornadoes have what kind of shape?
[44:19.100 --> 44:21.180]  Funnel, square, heart-shaped, or red?
[44:23.080 --> 44:25.880]  I think the site is just designed to make kids feel smart.
[44:26.040 --> 44:26.240]  Yeah.
[44:26.380 --> 44:27.400]  When they're really not doing anything.
[44:27.500 --> 44:28.760]  A really angry tornado, perhaps.
[44:29.520 --> 44:30.440]  Here's more on tornadoes.
[44:30.440 --> 44:31.760]  If a tornado is coming, what should you do?
[44:31.840 --> 44:32.440]  Drive away?
[44:33.120 --> 44:36.560]  Seek shelter underground if possible, or in a room on the first floor without windows?
[44:36.560 --> 44:38.680]  Go swimming, or fly a kite?
[44:39.000 --> 44:41.560]  Who has a room on the first floor without windows?
[44:42.380 --> 44:43.400]  How is it possible?
[44:43.400 --> 44:46.260]  I just found myself a new extreme sport.
[44:46.880 --> 44:47.080]  Yeah.
[44:47.560 --> 44:48.060]  All right, you know what?
[44:48.120 --> 44:52.140]  There's just too many of these, and they're too silly, and we don't have enough time.
[44:52.140 --> 44:55.580]  But I do want to just go over a couple of other things very quickly.
[44:56.220 --> 44:59.900]  You can become a FEMA Disaster Action Kid and get a certificate.
[45:00.700 --> 45:08.920]  Disaster Action Kids also get to be part of a special email group, and we'll receive exciting news and information directly from FEMA on a regular basis, and your parents won't even know about it.
[45:09.020 --> 45:11.260]  So, kids, it's all safe.
[45:11.660 --> 45:13.100]  But they have a section here.
[45:13.180 --> 45:16.920]  FEMA for Kids has a subsection called For the Little Ones.
[45:17.300 --> 45:27.460]  And inside For the Little Ones, they have all these other little features, and one of them is the FEMA Wrap for Kids.
[45:27.460 --> 45:28.340]  I have to interrupt.
[45:28.480 --> 45:30.480]  How much ink did you spend on this project?
[45:30.480 --> 45:31.620]  Listen, it wasn't my idea.
[45:31.740 --> 45:33.560]  Look how brightly colored these trees did you kill.
[45:33.740 --> 45:36.040]  It wasn't my idea to print the thing in color.
[45:36.140 --> 45:37.000]  That's just how it came out.
[45:37.140 --> 45:39.160]  But do you guys want to hear the FEMA for Kids Wrap?
[45:39.300 --> 45:40.140]  I mean, this is important.
[45:40.360 --> 45:40.760]  You got to see it.
[45:40.820 --> 45:41.520]  You got to wrap it, though.
[45:42.200 --> 45:43.100]  You got to say it right.
[45:43.520 --> 45:45.300]  You know, I've never done anything like this before in my life.
[45:45.340 --> 45:45.740]  It's for the kids.
[45:45.760 --> 45:46.520]  On air or off air.
[45:46.940 --> 45:47.340]  All right.
[45:47.560 --> 45:49.640]  No, please don't do that, because it's going to make me laugh.
[45:50.320 --> 45:50.660]  All right.
[45:50.940 --> 45:52.880]  Anybody wants to blame anyone for this?
[45:53.020 --> 45:53.420]  Scott J.
[45:53.560 --> 45:54.920]  Wilson apparently is the person who wrote it.
[45:54.920 --> 45:55.780]  All right.
[45:55.920 --> 45:56.060]  Ready?
[45:58.000 --> 45:58.400]  Disaster.
[45:58.600 --> 45:59.540]  It can happen anywhere.
[45:59.540 --> 46:01.760]  But we've got a few tips so you can be prepared.
[46:01.900 --> 46:05.740]  For floods, tornadoes, or even a quake, you've got to be ready so your heart don't break.
[46:06.060 --> 46:09.600]  Disaster prep is your responsibility, and mitigation is important to our agency.
[46:10.340 --> 46:11.880]  Helping people is what we do.
[46:11.980 --> 46:13.580]  And FEMA is there to see you through.
[46:13.780 --> 46:14.860]  To help see you through, I'm sorry.
[46:15.060 --> 46:18.960]  When disaster strikes, we are all at our best, but we're ready all the time, because disasters don't rest.
[46:19.540 --> 46:20.260]  There you go.
[46:21.320 --> 46:24.220]  That's what FEMA is doing, and that's what FEMA is doing for kids.
[46:24.220 --> 46:27.340]  I really don't get what the point of having...
[46:27.340 --> 46:28.340]  Go ahead, go ahead.
[46:28.340 --> 46:29.680]  What the point of having these sites are.
[46:30.300 --> 46:32.440]  So that we can expose them, that's why.
[46:32.640 --> 46:34.220]  Who actually reads these?
[46:34.440 --> 46:35.120]  I mean...
[46:35.120 --> 46:37.680]  Well, we do, and I'm sure kids out there everywhere...
[46:37.680 --> 46:44.060]  You did not mention that the FEMA for Kids website, which is normally spelled correctly, becomes the FEMA for K-I-D-Z on the map.
[46:44.100 --> 46:46.820]  Yeah, I was going to mention that, actually, but I think it would embarrass him enough.
[46:46.900 --> 46:49.500]  But the website, FEMA.gov slash kids.
[46:49.920 --> 46:52.140]  Kids, go out there and enjoy and learn.
[46:57.560 --> 47:01.280]  You mainly learn how not to design a website, I suppose, and how not to be so wasteful.
[47:01.460 --> 47:03.220]  I wonder how much my tax money went to this.
[47:03.320 --> 47:03.600]  A lot.
[47:03.600 --> 47:04.260]  A lot did.
[47:04.440 --> 47:04.740]  Yeah.
[47:04.900 --> 47:07.680]  Compared to the other stuff the government does, this is just fine.
[47:07.800 --> 47:09.520]  Yeah, it's a good bit of fun.
[47:09.820 --> 47:10.640]  Don't encourage them.
[47:10.640 --> 47:10.820]  Yeah.
[47:11.040 --> 47:12.080]  Bernie, any comments from you?
[47:13.840 --> 47:14.240]  Um...
[47:14.240 --> 47:14.400]  No?
[47:15.360 --> 47:26.240]  I think, like you said, if our tax dollars are going to something like this, I would prefer that than going to spend, you know, billions of dollars on invading other countries.
[47:26.460 --> 47:26.900]  All right.
[47:27.060 --> 47:28.580]  I'm really disappointed that they left out...
[47:28.580 --> 47:29.320]  Sorry, start it again.
[47:29.380 --> 47:32.660]  I'm really disappointed that they left out the Boston molasses flood, though.
[47:32.780 --> 47:32.900]  Yeah.
[47:33.000 --> 47:33.860]  That's a fun one.
[47:34.280 --> 47:34.540]  Okay.
[47:34.840 --> 47:36.100]  We want to take some phone calls.
[47:36.180 --> 47:38.620]  212-209-2900 is our telephone number.
[47:38.620 --> 47:43.340]  I don't know if people have any questions or comments or various things like that.
[47:43.860 --> 47:47.680]  We've gotten a lot of email over the past week, and we like to get lots of email.
[47:47.860 --> 47:50.520]  OTH at 2600.com is our website.
[47:51.920 --> 47:56.700]  This person, Dirk, writes in saying, I just listened to last week's episode, the guy that called up about crime in Japan.
[47:57.060 --> 47:58.300]  I was there a few months ago.
[47:58.360 --> 48:00.160]  It's insane how void of crime it is.
[48:00.240 --> 48:02.820]  We were at a three-day music festival, so people were camping.
[48:03.020 --> 48:05.280]  It was raining, so people had their clothes hung up.
[48:05.380 --> 48:09.740]  Someone had gotten their 5,000-yen note wet and had it pegged up unattended next to their clothes.
[48:10.320 --> 48:11.040]  Absolutely crazy.
[48:11.200 --> 48:12.220]  Well, you know, the same thing in Germany.
[48:12.400 --> 48:16.140]  People leave things unattended, and nobody touches them at heart.
[48:16.280 --> 48:17.640]  Nobody touched anything.
[48:17.780 --> 48:18.860]  I don't think anything was ripped off.
[48:18.940 --> 48:21.340]  You just kind of had your tent there with all your stuff in it.
[48:21.460 --> 48:22.120]  Yeah, yeah.
[48:22.220 --> 48:23.280]  I didn't hear about anything.
[48:23.440 --> 48:30.720]  Steven writes in to say, I was advised to call 888-382-1212 to block my cell phone from getting advertising phone calls.
[48:30.840 --> 48:31.600]  What do you think?
[48:31.700 --> 48:32.560]  Bernie, is that a good idea?
[48:33.080 --> 48:35.320]  No, it's just a piece of spam going around.
[48:35.560 --> 48:40.920]  It's actually that number, if you call that, it unblocks you from the do not call list.
[48:41.600 --> 48:42.960]  How does it do that exactly?
[48:43.680 --> 48:44.880]  Well, you can call...
[48:44.880 --> 48:51.180]  You know, you would think that it would say that when you call it, you would hear something saying that you've been unblocked from the list.
[48:51.300 --> 49:00.320]  But anyhow, I had some co-workers a while ago get that piece of spam, and they were going around telling each other, oh, yeah, you've got to call this number from your cell phone.
[49:01.080 --> 49:05.260]  If you've got a piece of unsolicited email to call some 800 number, don't call it.
[49:05.300 --> 49:14.460]  In fact, if you just plug in the number from that, which is what I did into a search engine, you can see all kinds of information about what that number really does.
[49:14.600 --> 49:18.880]  So that's what I did, and I responded to the listener saying, don't call that number, and he thanked me.
[49:19.000 --> 49:21.600]  But he could have done the same thing, so could any of our other listeners.
[49:21.860 --> 49:24.720]  What if you call that number and spoof your caller ID?
[49:24.720 --> 49:27.560]  Can you not effectively take somebody off the do not call list?
[49:27.840 --> 49:28.860]  You probably could.
[49:29.060 --> 49:29.160]  Uh-huh.
[49:29.160 --> 49:30.300]  That's a really interesting question.
[49:30.520 --> 49:30.980]  That's... wow.
[49:31.160 --> 49:32.620]  And we've just given out the phone number.
[49:32.700 --> 49:34.660]  Now, we have to erase that before it goes on the archives.
[49:35.120 --> 49:35.320]  All right.
[49:35.980 --> 49:36.840]  Don't want that to happen.
[49:36.960 --> 49:44.240]  But if you want to block your number, the only real way to do it, at least to their website, is to go to donotcall.gov, and you'll see...
[49:44.240 --> 49:44.460]  The manual.
[49:45.020 --> 49:45.520]  The manual.
[49:45.680 --> 49:50.680]  It's already illegal for telemarketers to call cell phones because it costs you to receive them.
[49:50.720 --> 49:50.980]  Okay.
[49:51.020 --> 49:52.940]  That's not much consolation, though.
[49:53.060 --> 49:55.320]  I mean, I get spam calls all the time on my cell phone.
[49:55.320 --> 49:56.020]  What do I do about it?
[49:56.260 --> 50:02.200]  Yeah, but the companies that are going to call cell phones are already criminals.
[50:02.500 --> 50:09.980]  So, if you put your name, if you put your cell phone number on a do not call list, the criminals are going to ignore that anyway because they're criminals.
[50:10.440 --> 50:10.840]  Okay.
[50:11.160 --> 50:11.380]  So there's no point.
[50:11.560 --> 50:14.520]  But maybe the companies that aren't criminals won't ignore it.
[50:14.920 --> 50:15.300]  You're saying...
[50:15.300 --> 50:19.940]  Yeah, they generally do because there's all kinds of fines and stuff if you sue them and it just...
[50:19.940 --> 50:26.500]  Okay, but Bernie, this is a company that wants you to do business with them, and if they're calling you illegally and you know who they are, can't you do something about it?
[50:27.060 --> 50:30.320]  Well, if you have an established business relationship with you, they are allowed to call.
[50:30.320 --> 50:30.680]  No, they are.
[50:30.820 --> 50:31.280]  I know that.
[50:31.320 --> 50:31.840]  That's what I'm talking about.
[50:31.960 --> 50:40.200]  I'm talking about if there's, as you say, a criminal company calling you and they're calling your cell phone and they want to do business with you, it seems like they're sort of defeating their own purpose.
[50:40.720 --> 50:41.020]  Right?
[50:41.560 --> 50:49.440]  Yeah, well, I'm sure they get a certain percentage of people to make it worthwhile for them to patronize them and do business with them.
[50:49.740 --> 50:51.200]  There's a sucker born every minute.
[50:51.340 --> 50:59.500]  But people out there should be aware that if you get an unsolicited phone call from a business on your cell phone, that caller is breaking the law.
[50:59.800 --> 50:59.960]  Yeah.
[51:00.020 --> 51:06.720]  Not only should you not do business with them, you should try to find out what that company is, and you could probably make some money out of it by suing them.
[51:06.840 --> 51:08.720]  You could either sue them or at least report them.
[51:08.980 --> 51:10.460]  Don't just, you know, don't just hang up.
[51:10.560 --> 51:11.760]  Find out at least who they are.
[51:11.840 --> 51:16.200]  Even if you have to act interested in their product, just to get the name of the company.
[51:17.000 --> 51:17.320]  Yeah.
[51:17.560 --> 51:17.800]  Okay.
[51:18.860 --> 51:20.980]  And one more letter we're going to read, then we're going to take some phone calls.
[51:21.060 --> 51:22.280]  212-209-2900.
[51:22.860 --> 51:26.840]  Dear Emmanuel, I'm a taxi driver slash hacker slash activist in Redding, Pennsylvania.
[51:27.400 --> 51:32.140]  And I just wanted to tell you that once a week, I subject my passengers to both off the hook and off the wall.
[51:32.740 --> 51:36.480]  I've had many a good conversation and also many larger tips because of your shows.
[51:36.660 --> 51:39.260]  Thanks, and keep doing what you're doing for all of us intelligent people.
[51:39.440 --> 51:47.260]  Signed, Jay from Redding, Pennsylvania driving in a taxi and I guess hooking up into the internet while you're driving around, which is great.
[51:47.460 --> 51:51.460]  So if you're a taxi driver and you're looking for ways to make more money, now you know how.
[51:51.840 --> 51:52.160]  Yes.
[51:52.480 --> 51:58.500]  Tell your taxi driver to listen to WBAI and broadcast these particular radio programs and who knows?
[51:58.560 --> 52:00.440]  Who knows what kind of conversations you'll wind up having.
[52:00.520 --> 52:01.080]  Let's take a phone call.
[52:01.140 --> 52:01.440]  Good evening.
[52:03.100 --> 52:03.620]  Hi.
[52:03.620 --> 52:10.060]  I just wanted to comment about getting a good cellular phone while you're over in the UK.
[52:10.440 --> 52:10.700]  Mm-hmm.
[52:11.080 --> 52:20.840]  I go over there a couple of times a year and what I've found is I just get one of the prepaid cellular calls that phones that still have a SIM card usage.
[52:22.080 --> 52:31.620]  and, you know, just buy the card for the length of time that I'm there, give it to somebody before I leave, but have the phone available so when I go back again, all I have to do is pay for another card.
[52:31.840 --> 52:32.100]  Okay.
[52:32.760 --> 52:34.160]  Yeah, so you just have to leave it there.
[52:34.160 --> 52:40.040]  I mean, I could go back to the Netherlands and claim my 750 euros and use that phone again.
[52:40.440 --> 52:42.020]  I won't feel happy about it, but I could do it.
[52:42.100 --> 52:45.960]  And yeah, if you go, if you travel enough, I guess that does work out for you.
[52:46.580 --> 52:49.480]  Yeah, it's a one-time purchase and then that way you're just using the card.
[52:49.480 --> 52:52.660]  But if you're going over for one time, it's the initial layout.
[52:52.920 --> 52:53.280]  Uh-huh.
[52:54.260 --> 52:56.660]  My preference is Carphone Warehouse over in the UK.
[52:57.060 --> 52:58.160]  I've seen them everywhere.
[52:58.380 --> 52:59.580]  They're on every block, it seems.
[52:59.700 --> 53:00.440]  Carphone Warehouse.
[53:00.520 --> 53:00.980]  Yeah, it's...
[53:00.980 --> 53:03.400]  We don't have them over here, but they seem to be very popular.
[53:04.240 --> 53:04.620]  All right, thanks.
[53:05.120 --> 53:08.760]  And on their credit card, it would be nice if we went to a chip and pin system also.
[53:09.240 --> 53:13.820]  Yeah, you know, I've heard rumors that we are, but I'm not sure yet if that's actually going to happen.
[53:13.920 --> 53:15.100]  But yeah, it does make a lot of sense.
[53:15.200 --> 53:16.460]  It seems to be a whole lot more secure.
[53:16.580 --> 53:19.020]  Again, it comes down to the kind of the point of sale terminals.
[53:19.280 --> 53:31.780]  But what I remember being interested in was a few years ago when they started introducing RFID systems, which you would think would be even less secure, rather than replacing these terminals with something more secure, like a chip and pin system.
[53:31.960 --> 53:33.540]  So that's just how it is, I guess.
[53:33.680 --> 53:40.220]  Chances are, we're going to wait till the systems need to be replaced simply for maintenance reasons.
[53:40.460 --> 53:42.540]  And that's when you'll see them being getting upgraded.
[53:42.820 --> 53:43.100]  Okay.
[53:43.180 --> 53:43.840]  Let's take the phone call.
[53:44.580 --> 53:45.240]  Good evening.
[53:45.380 --> 53:46.020]  You're on off the hook.
[53:46.020 --> 53:47.440]  I think that's it.
[53:47.620 --> 53:48.260]  I've done something.
[53:48.720 --> 53:49.120]  Let me think.
[53:49.620 --> 53:50.200]  Last week.
[53:50.200 --> 53:50.820]  Okay, you know what?
[53:50.880 --> 53:52.740]  You've got to be prepared to get on the radio.
[53:52.860 --> 53:53.120]  Good evening.
[53:53.240 --> 53:54.020]  You're on off the hook.
[53:54.680 --> 53:55.020]  Yes.
[53:55.420 --> 54:05.220]  Do you guys know anything about the supposedly Lifeline free cell phone that was going to be done through TrackPhone?
[54:05.220 --> 54:06.940]  Bernie, do you have anything about this?
[54:07.740 --> 54:09.080]  That's pretty interesting, though.
[54:09.880 --> 54:11.520]  I don't know what you mean, Lifeline.
[54:11.660 --> 54:13.500]  You mean just being able to make 911 calls?
[54:13.700 --> 54:14.620]  No, no, no, no.
[54:14.640 --> 54:18.600]  It's like my landline because I'm a disabled senior citizen.
[54:18.600 --> 54:22.780]  I have a Lifeline phone that costs me a dollar a month for service.
[54:23.420 --> 54:23.960]  That's interesting.
[54:24.100 --> 54:32.840]  I know Verizon is required by maybe state or federal law to provide a Lifeline service at a discount for people that are you know, on SSI.
[54:32.960 --> 54:33.120]  Right.
[54:33.200 --> 54:34.440]  That's what I'm talking about.
[54:34.600 --> 54:36.080]  But this is for cellular, right?
[54:36.220 --> 54:39.840]  This is a TrackPhone with supplying the thing and it was...
[54:39.840 --> 54:49.000]  I know it's in place in Minnesota or a couple other states out west, but I haven't found out what's going on here in this area.
[54:49.220 --> 54:51.540]  Supposedly, it's over the entire country.
[54:51.540 --> 54:57.120]  It's federally funded the same as the service you know, that you were just talking about.
[54:57.560 --> 54:58.080]  But it's free.
[54:58.440 --> 54:59.320]  It's totally free.
[54:59.780 --> 55:02.360]  It's actually paid for by all of us under with that thing.
[55:02.480 --> 55:08.740]  If you look at an item by the universal service fund, USF, tax, that's what pays for the...
[55:08.740 --> 55:11.920]  for this Lifeline type services and some other things.
[55:12.100 --> 55:16.240]  It subsidizes a telephone service for underprivileged folks.
[55:16.480 --> 55:18.460]  But I think it's an interesting idea.
[55:18.460 --> 55:20.180]  I'm gonna check into that because it's...
[55:20.180 --> 55:24.340]  You know, not everybody needs to have a physical landline installed at their location.
[55:24.720 --> 55:28.880]  And sometimes a mobile phone would make more sense.
[55:28.880 --> 55:29.960]  So we'll look into that.
[55:30.060 --> 55:37.700]  What is true, what is true, however, is that you can with any cell phone down 9-1-1 always and it has to let you go through.
[55:37.900 --> 55:46.240]  So if you do need a phone, a cell phone to just call 9-1-1 and you know somebody who has one they're getting rid of or something like that, that's a solution also.
[55:46.540 --> 55:48.660]  Okay, let's take one more phone call.
[55:48.820 --> 55:49.240]  Good evening.
[55:49.780 --> 55:50.580]  You're on...
[55:50.580 --> 55:51.160]  Off the hook.
[55:51.480 --> 55:51.780]  Hi.
[55:51.780 --> 55:52.500]  Hi.
[55:52.780 --> 55:55.040]  I have two questions and an answer.
[55:55.300 --> 55:55.840]  Okay, make it quick.
[55:56.040 --> 56:03.480]  The lifeline thing, if you have a lifeline with a landline, you can't get the cell phone.
[56:03.580 --> 56:05.020]  You can get one or the other.
[56:05.380 --> 56:08.780]  And the cell phone comes with a certain limited number of minutes.
[56:09.200 --> 56:11.780]  So I have my lifeline.
[56:12.340 --> 56:14.920]  Wow, that's a quick answer to a previous caller's question.
[56:15.020 --> 56:15.480]  All right, great.
[56:15.840 --> 56:16.320]  That's a question.
[56:16.420 --> 56:18.460]  Can you get DSL if you have the lifeline?
[56:19.040 --> 56:20.600]  All right, let's not complicate things, Bernie.
[56:20.600 --> 56:23.040]  Okay, my two questions are...
[56:23.040 --> 56:23.600]  Yes.
[56:23.600 --> 56:25.240]  I'll just ask them both together.
[56:25.760 --> 56:29.180]  More information about the molasses flood.
[56:29.620 --> 56:32.660]  And also, are the trip glasses ever coming?
[56:33.160 --> 56:33.680]  Yes.
[56:33.940 --> 56:37.040]  We've just gotten those shipped to us and they are being sent out this week.
[56:37.160 --> 56:37.800]  So yes, they are.
[56:37.840 --> 56:38.580]  They are definitely coming.
[56:39.220 --> 56:42.440]  And the molasses thing, very quickly, you have 15 seconds.
[56:42.620 --> 56:51.940]  In 1919, there was some, I guess, molasses factory or a container that ruptured in Boston, flooded, killed 21 people and injured 150.
[56:52.320 --> 56:54.960]  And if you look for it online, you'll be able to find it, I'm sure.
[56:55.240 --> 56:55.420]  Okay.
[56:55.860 --> 56:58.360]  And just a reminder, this Friday, come to the 2600 meeting.
[56:58.560 --> 56:58.940]  That's right.
[56:59.020 --> 56:59.320]  That's right.
[56:59.380 --> 56:59.940]  All over the world.
[56:59.940 --> 57:01.040]  All right, we're out of time.
[57:01.160 --> 57:02.440]  And you know what starts this week?
[57:02.680 --> 57:05.980]  This week, remember we did 52 weeks of phone-related songs?
[57:06.500 --> 57:09.600]  This week, we start 52 weeks of computer-related songs.
[57:09.760 --> 57:14.180]  So send your suggestions to OTH at 2600.com.
[57:14.320 --> 57:18.500]  Let's start with Kraftwerk and Computer World, the German version.
[57:19.020 --> 57:19.240]  Good night.
[57:53.160 --> 57:55.440]  Good night.
[57:56.500 --> 57:57.240]  Good
[58:01.020 --> 58:10.480]  night.
[58:41.060 --> 59:06.590]  Gnade One, two, three, go.
[59:21.150 --> 59:22.630]  I love that song.
[59:30.970 --> 59:34.810]  I am alone, once again, very alone.
[59:38.380 --> 59:40.580]  I'm on the TV show,
[59:54.110 --> 59:57.410]  but a rendezvous, rendezvous.
[01:00:39.770 --> 01:00:42.710]  All right, that was excellent.
[01:00:43.170 --> 01:00:45.590]  Talking about computers in German?
[01:00:45.970 --> 01:00:54.450]  All right, so this is WBAI New York 99.5 FM, also streaming on the web at WBAI.org.