[00:04.040 --> 00:05.780]  And we're back.
[00:09.120 --> 00:10.480]  We're back.
[00:14.170 --> 00:22.930]  You are tuned to 99.5 on the FM Dow in New York City, streaming live on the World Wide Web at WBAI.org.
[00:23.370 --> 00:29.650]  Education at the Crossroads, produced by Bashir and Chowley, heard Thursday evenings at 7 a.m.
[00:29.990 --> 00:35.930]  can be downloaded at www.archive.wbai.org.
[00:35.930 --> 00:39.910]  Thank you for your continued financial support.
[01:21.600 --> 01:22.240]  I hope they would.
[01:22.520 --> 01:25.140]  But the best, expect the worst.
[01:25.660 --> 01:27.640]  I hope that's understood.
[01:27.640 --> 01:28.700]  Funding it more.
[02:02.210 --> 02:04.050]  And giving it to everybody, the program is off the hook.
[02:04.150 --> 02:09.170]  Emmanuel Goldstein here with you on this Wednesday evening, joined tonight by Jim.
[02:09.370 --> 02:10.050]  Oh, hi.
[02:10.810 --> 02:11.630]  Dot Rhett.
[02:11.910 --> 02:12.330]  Hello.
[02:12.710 --> 02:13.130]  Rob T.
[02:13.270 --> 02:13.770]  Firefly.
[02:14.130 --> 02:14.470]  Good evening.
[02:14.850 --> 02:15.130]  Mike.
[02:15.510 --> 02:15.690]  Hi.
[02:16.130 --> 02:16.650]  Oh, I'm sorry.
[02:16.770 --> 02:17.230]  Say it again.
[02:17.730 --> 02:18.190]  Hi.
[02:18.370 --> 02:18.790]  Yeah, that's better.
[02:19.110 --> 02:20.910]  And from somewhere, Bernie S.
[02:21.710 --> 02:22.870]  Somewhere in Philadelphia?
[02:23.290 --> 02:23.530]  Greetings.
[02:23.530 --> 02:26.090]  Well, actually, somewhere in telephony land.
[02:26.090 --> 02:28.550]  I understand you're trying out a new way of calling us today.
[02:28.870 --> 02:33.170]  Well, we tried to establish a Skype connection, but it wasn't that reliable, so we gave up.
[02:33.210 --> 02:35.670]  And now I'm on good old, unreliable Sprint GPS.
[02:35.890 --> 02:37.150]  Well, how unreliable was it?
[02:37.670 --> 02:39.010]  Well, it dropped out.
[02:39.370 --> 02:39.950]  Dropped out?
[02:41.050 --> 02:42.030]  That's all I can say.
[02:42.230 --> 02:43.630]  So, here we are again.
[02:43.770 --> 02:48.730]  Are you sure you don't want to try it on the air so that we can demonstrate the marvellessness of Skype and how well it works?
[02:49.030 --> 02:50.710]  That's exactly what I was trying to avoid.
[02:52.090 --> 02:53.530]  Well, instead we're going to talk about it.
[02:53.630 --> 02:58.410]  So, the idea here was to have your voice sound better, but in fact, apparently we can't.
[02:58.410 --> 03:00.030]  Well, it did sound better, but then it dropped out.
[03:00.210 --> 03:02.170]  So, we can't have it both ways, I guess.
[03:03.110 --> 03:06.230]  Unless we don't like what you have to say, then it might have been perfect.
[03:06.250 --> 03:06.350]  Yeah, there you go.
[03:06.570 --> 03:07.590]  Yeah, that's a possibility.
[03:08.390 --> 03:16.010]  Okay, well, tonight's an interesting night because we thought we were going to be preempted and we're not preempted because of the Obama speech, which is taking place at 8 o'clock.
[03:16.650 --> 03:20.750]  We asked them to move it up an hour, so only the personal computer people will be preempted tonight.
[03:20.970 --> 03:22.610]  So, that's the way it goes, folks.
[03:23.190 --> 03:25.050]  But we'll be on until 8 o'clock.
[03:25.190 --> 03:26.330]  And then I advise people to listen.
[03:26.490 --> 03:27.370]  Keep listening afterwards.
[03:27.710 --> 03:31.550]  And I'm sure it'll be interesting, entertaining, enlightening, informative, all that kind of thing.
[03:32.250 --> 03:36.170]  We have all kinds of topics to talk about tonight, as we always do.
[03:37.270 --> 03:39.870]  And, well, this is a bit of a crisis.
[03:39.870 --> 03:46.850]  I don't know if you folks have been following this, but apparently there's another royal scandal going on over in England.
[03:47.330 --> 03:48.130]  There's evidence.
[03:48.430 --> 03:56.750]  There is evidence that the phones of Princes William and Harry were hacked into by a reporter, a News of the World reporter.
[03:56.850 --> 03:59.010]  News of the World is one of these tabloid papers they have over there.
[03:59.010 --> 04:01.610]  Now, royal reporter Clive...
[04:02.250 --> 04:04.010]  I don't think he's a royalty himself.
[04:04.750 --> 04:07.310]  I think his beat is the royalty, I think, is what that means.
[04:07.450 --> 04:15.010]  Royal reporter Clive Goodman was jailed for four months in 2007 for plotting to hack into Royal AIDS voice mailboxes.
[04:16.510 --> 04:21.470]  Now, apparently, this also extends to the Princes as well.
[04:22.170 --> 04:28.350]  The newspaper said it knew of no evidence to back the claims and said the police had not mentioned them earlier.
[04:28.350 --> 04:36.270]  The police had not brought up the allegations during their original investigation, but for some reason, they're now being brought up.
[04:36.490 --> 04:49.390]  The newspaper revealed that the head of the Professional Footballers Association, Gordon Taylor, had received 700,000 pounds in damages and court costs last year in a case against the News of the World, but on condition that details of the case were not made public.
[04:49.910 --> 04:51.970]  The police already knew about the Taylor case.
[04:51.970 --> 05:01.650]  And basically, the Guardian, which is another newspaper, apparently printed all this as a whole bunch of old stories conflated into one.
[05:01.850 --> 05:07.370]  And I guess the Prince's voicemail boxes being compromised was one of those stories.
[05:07.530 --> 05:09.110]  This is so confusing and crazy.
[05:09.110 --> 05:11.210]  It's poorly written, and also...
[05:11.210 --> 05:11.870]  It's all over the place.
[05:11.870 --> 05:14.210]  I've already lost interest when you told me it was about royalty.
[05:14.790 --> 05:18.270]  Well, yeah, but royal mailboxes, royal voicemail, you know, you have to wonder.
[05:18.530 --> 05:18.970]  You have to wonder.
[05:19.190 --> 05:24.010]  I keep reading about MPs, and I keep wanting to say MP3s on the committee, but they're actually...
[05:24.010 --> 05:25.330]  No, it's MPs.
[05:26.350 --> 05:27.210]  Members of Parliament.
[05:27.210 --> 05:28.990]  But this is back in 2006.
[05:29.450 --> 05:31.050]  Now, basically...
[05:31.050 --> 05:37.790]  It's all about a phone message left by Prince William imitating Chelsea Davey, who was his brother's then-girlfriend, on Prince Harry's phone.
[05:37.890 --> 05:38.690]  Now, that's pretty much it.
[05:39.090 --> 05:39.910]  That's the scandal.
[05:41.490 --> 05:42.190]  I don't know.
[05:42.450 --> 05:44.290]  Bernie, I know you're fascinated by this kind of stuff.
[05:44.870 --> 05:45.850]  Well, not at all.
[05:45.950 --> 05:47.830]  This is really one of those stories that...
[05:47.830 --> 05:52.870]  There was a new story that came out this week that just sort of rehashed that.
[05:52.870 --> 06:12.190]  So, I don't know if there's any particular new news about it, but it's certainly not new news that it's not difficult for anybody to bribe someone at one of the various mobile carriers to give you access to a customer's account and listen to their voicemail messages and do other things.
[06:12.330 --> 06:14.550]  So, this is not very difficult for anybody to do.
[06:14.550 --> 06:20.070]  It all takes a little money or some skill, and I'm assuring this royal reporter just used money.
[06:20.390 --> 06:20.750]  Mm-hmm.
[06:20.750 --> 06:29.390]  Well, you know, skill isn't that hard to come by either as far as figuring out default passwords or social engineering or just taking advantage of the numerous security flaws.
[06:29.630 --> 06:30.570]  It's not that difficult.
[06:30.810 --> 06:31.370]  Certainly true.
[06:32.070 --> 06:38.710]  But, yeah, it's easy to rehash old stories and get them into the newspaper again, and apparently that's what happened, and here we are talking about it.
[06:38.930 --> 06:39.230]  Incredible.
[06:39.930 --> 06:40.390]  All right.
[06:40.450 --> 06:46.570]  A better story, a more interesting story, a fascinating question to be asked.
[06:46.570 --> 06:51.750]  First, who is sending unsolicited laptop computers to governor's offices and why?
[06:52.150 --> 06:57.390]  Yeah, the FBI is investigating the unexpected deliveries that were sent to governor's offices in at least 10 states.
[06:57.890 --> 07:04.230]  According to media reports, investigators are trying to determine if the machines contain malware or...
[07:04.230 --> 07:06.350]  Why would they care if the machines contain malware?
[07:06.510 --> 07:07.930]  They're laptops on their own.
[07:08.070 --> 07:09.150]  They're infecting themselves.
[07:09.510 --> 07:12.550]  Or programming that would allow someone remote access to secure networks.
[07:12.550 --> 07:15.310]  Well, if you're dumb enough to plug it into a secure network, I suppose that's possible.
[07:15.710 --> 07:22.570]  Governors in the states of West Virginia, Vermont, Wyoming, and Washington received three to five laptops each.
[07:22.710 --> 07:24.230]  It's according to the Associated Press.
[07:24.790 --> 07:27.690]  Shipments to governors in six other states were intercepted.
[07:28.330 --> 07:35.410]  West Virginia Governor Joe Menken received four compact computers in Hewlett Packard boxes on August 5th.
[07:35.970 --> 07:40.790]  His office turned the computers over to the West Virginia State Police, who are also involved in the investigation.
[07:40.790 --> 07:45.110]  HP officials are aware of the orders and said they are linked to fraud.
[07:45.170 --> 07:47.630]  In other words, they were ordered with credit card fraud.
[07:47.830 --> 07:53.710]  Our expectation is that this is not a gesture of good will, said the Chief Technology Officer of West Virginia.
[07:54.150 --> 07:57.130]  People don't just send you five laptops for no good reason.
[07:57.630 --> 07:59.230]  Well, I'd like to prove him wrong.
[07:59.550 --> 08:04.330]  I'd like to invite our listeners to send us as many laptops as they possibly can for no good reason at all.
[08:04.470 --> 08:06.170]  Happens to me all the time at my old job.
[08:06.310 --> 08:06.550]  Yeah.
[08:06.730 --> 08:09.990]  People send all kinds of things for no good reason just because they feel like it.
[08:09.990 --> 08:12.910]  Oftentimes, it was no good technology, but sometimes...
[08:12.910 --> 08:13.110]  Yeah.
[08:13.550 --> 08:13.750]  Yeah.
[08:13.890 --> 08:14.170]  Definitely.
[08:14.450 --> 08:14.790]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[08:15.350 --> 08:18.130]  There's an old phrase.
[08:18.690 --> 08:19.810]  It goes like this.
[08:20.090 --> 08:21.210]  I think it goes like this.
[08:21.410 --> 08:22.930]  Beware of geeks bearing gifts.
[08:24.010 --> 08:28.170]  I don't think anyone's ever said that phrase before tonight, but fine.
[08:28.990 --> 08:30.210]  There's some variation thereof.
[08:30.370 --> 08:36.750]  But I don't notice that all four of these states, West Virginia, Vermont, Wyoming, and Washington, they're at the very end of the alphabet.
[08:36.750 --> 08:46.610]  So I'm wondering if the targeters, if the attackers were starting from the end of the state alphabet and it'll be a long time before Alabama gets attacked.
[08:47.390 --> 08:49.410]  Well, now, did you check that?
[08:49.510 --> 08:51.070]  They're all literally at the end of the alphabet?
[08:51.210 --> 08:51.870]  There's no gaps?
[08:52.330 --> 08:55.430]  Well, I don't see any West Virginia, Vermont, Wyoming, and Washington.
[08:55.430 --> 09:00.330]  Can you pick another state that's farther into the end of the alphabet?
[09:00.870 --> 09:03.670]  Well, I wasn't expecting to be quizzed on geography tonight.
[09:03.890 --> 09:04.370]  Is there a year?
[09:04.790 --> 09:05.770]  So I use not a state.
[09:06.530 --> 09:08.170]  No, I don't think so.
[09:08.250 --> 09:09.470]  I think you might have something there.
[09:09.590 --> 09:11.010]  Has anyone else pointed that out?
[09:12.890 --> 09:14.330]  It could be just a coincidence.
[09:14.550 --> 09:16.510]  It could be, but I'd like to know what the other six states are then.
[09:16.770 --> 09:18.290]  Because that would certainly prove it.
[09:18.810 --> 09:19.070]  Yeah.
[09:19.370 --> 09:21.110]  So, well, we'll find out more about this.
[09:21.310 --> 09:21.410]  Yeah.
[09:21.410 --> 09:22.810]  I wish they sent them to me instead.
[09:23.370 --> 09:26.530]  Well, become a state and you just might get five laptops in the mail.
[09:26.890 --> 09:27.930]  All kinds of weird things.
[09:28.070 --> 09:28.430]  That's B for Bernie.
[09:28.630 --> 09:29.370]  He'd never get it.
[09:29.370 --> 09:30.390]  That's very true.
[09:31.110 --> 09:33.770]  Okay, here's some new policy being laid out.
[09:33.990 --> 09:47.070]  A new chairwoman of the National Transportation Safety Board, known as the NTSB, announced at her swearing-in ceremony yesterday that board employees could no longer text or make phone calls while driving unofficial business.
[09:47.150 --> 09:52.430]  She also said they could not use wireless devices issued by the board while driving their own cars.
[09:52.750 --> 09:55.710]  How can she tell people what they can and cannot do like that?
[09:55.830 --> 09:56.650]  They can.
[09:56.790 --> 09:58.170]  They shouldn't, but they can.
[09:58.930 --> 10:00.030]  Deborah A.P.
[10:00.410 --> 10:09.230]  Hirschman, who became chairwoman on July 28th but was ceremonially sworn in yesterday, said the board should be setting an example for others.
[10:10.030 --> 10:11.650]  She's been a member of the board for five years.
[10:11.770 --> 10:16.070]  She said she used to view her one-hour trip to and from the office as an opportunity to talk on the phone.
[10:16.070 --> 10:19.770]  There's a reason why they call them crackberries, she said.
[10:19.930 --> 10:23.990]  But she said that increasing evidence of the dangers of distracted driving had led her to stop.
[10:24.170 --> 10:27.790]  The risk of catastrophic consequences is just too great.
[10:29.050 --> 10:29.850]  So that's interesting.
[10:30.570 --> 10:31.210]  What do you guys think of that?
[10:31.430 --> 10:37.010]  I think if she were really concerned about transportation and safety, she'd take public transit, then she could use her crackberry all she wants.
[10:37.010 --> 10:37.290]  Okay.
[10:37.450 --> 10:41.150]  Well, yeah, maybe if she has public transportation where she has to be.
[10:41.150 --> 10:41.490]  She's in D.C.
[10:42.050 --> 10:43.130]  Well, she's in D.C.
[10:43.130 --> 10:43.790]  when she's working.
[10:43.850 --> 10:44.770]  Who knows where she's coming from?
[10:44.890 --> 10:45.890]  She's the head of this board.
[10:45.990 --> 10:47.050]  She could get a line built.
[10:47.370 --> 10:48.690]  She could get a line built?
[10:48.690 --> 10:49.210]  Why not?
[10:49.630 --> 10:50.190]  All right.
[10:50.350 --> 10:51.950]  Well, that's something.
[10:52.170 --> 10:52.290]  Okay.
[10:52.730 --> 10:55.370]  Well, you know, I should point out, Mike, you didn't take mass transit to come here.
[10:55.490 --> 10:55.910]  That's true.
[10:56.030 --> 10:56.210]  Yeah.
[10:56.250 --> 10:58.910]  And I had my cell phone in my bag.
[10:59.050 --> 10:59.330]  Uh-huh.
[10:59.630 --> 11:02.970]  Not even in my pocket to be really indistracted by it.
[11:03.090 --> 11:03.290]  Right.
[11:03.470 --> 11:05.450]  So, you know, practice what you preach.
[11:05.790 --> 11:06.150]  All right.
[11:06.350 --> 11:06.790]  Yes, Bernie.
[11:06.930 --> 11:07.230]  Manuel.
[11:07.430 --> 11:12.970]  I just wanted to say that the National Transportation Safety Board, I think they really are setting a good example.
[11:13.130 --> 11:27.210]  I mean, they're the federal government agency responsible for investigating the causes of all kinds of vehicular accidents, like airplane crashes, even though the FAA is involved with that too, but the NTSB is as well.
[11:27.530 --> 11:34.330]  Train crashes, several of which recently were caused by engineers using their cell phones to talk or...
[11:34.330 --> 11:35.470]  Several or just one?
[11:35.610 --> 11:36.690]  I don't recall more than one.
[11:36.830 --> 11:38.430]  There was two, I know.
[11:38.570 --> 11:41.830]  One was like a light rail recent.
[11:41.970 --> 11:42.930]  So maybe two isn't several.
[11:43.050 --> 11:43.150]  Okay.
[11:43.150 --> 11:44.070]  But it's happened repeatedly.
[11:45.210 --> 11:49.970]  Buses have crashed as a result of their drivers using their cell phones to talk or text.
[11:50.190 --> 11:53.150]  So this is the government agency responsible for investigating this.
[11:53.210 --> 12:02.250]  And they have found, I think, probably accurately, that it's really very distracting to use a cell phone to talk or text, whether or not it's hands-free.
[12:03.150 --> 12:11.510]  And especially if you're using it to... using that vehicle to transport other people, especially a lot of people, like in a bus or train or something.
[12:11.670 --> 12:17.290]  So I think this is a really good example they're setting, although I would like to know how they're going to enforce it.
[12:17.390 --> 12:27.070]  I mean, they could do it technologically by logging... if their cell phones they're issuing to the employees are the kind that have location-based tracking.
[12:27.430 --> 12:39.470]  They could actually log data and see if the cell phone's traveling at a high rate of speed, like if they were driving, and see if they're being used during that time period.
[12:39.590 --> 12:43.110]  Now, it doesn't guarantee that the user was driving, but it means that they were in the vehicle.
[12:44.130 --> 12:48.190]  But it's still a good... I think it would be a good way to investigate it, whether they're going to go that far or not.
[12:48.290 --> 12:49.050]  But I'd like to see that.
[12:49.050 --> 12:53.870]  It almost sounds like you're in support of these Orwellian ways of watching what people are doing.
[12:54.270 --> 12:57.770]  Well, if they're my employees, as federal employees...
[12:57.770 --> 12:58.690]  Your employees, okay.
[12:58.950 --> 13:04.270]  Well, I pay... my federal taxes pay their wages.
[13:04.590 --> 13:13.230]  So I would like them to follow rules, just as an experiment, to see if it's any safer with them not using their cell phones at all while driving.
[13:13.230 --> 13:16.910]  Well, then should citizens also be subjected to the same way of surveillance?
[13:17.770 --> 13:19.730]  Well, it's not surveillance necessarily.
[13:19.750 --> 13:22.790]  It's just seeing if the phones are being used while driving.
[13:22.970 --> 13:24.290]  Now, that's an interesting question.
[13:24.690 --> 13:34.710]  If it becomes illegal in some states to use your cell phone while driving at all, and no states have passed such a law, just doing it while... you can't text in some states.
[13:34.910 --> 13:37.430]  I think New York just passed a law just what, a week or two ago?
[13:37.590 --> 13:39.310]  You cannot text while driving anymore?
[13:39.310 --> 13:41.050]  Well, you can use your phone while driving too.
[13:41.190 --> 13:42.790]  I'm not sure what you mean by... no state has done that.
[13:42.790 --> 13:44.610]  You can use it hands-free while driving.
[13:44.610 --> 13:45.770]  Oh, hands-free, yes, you can do that.
[13:46.170 --> 13:56.790]  There was a new law just passed a week or two ago in New York, I believe, that makes it a criminal offense to text from a phone while you are driving, whether or not it's hands-free.
[13:56.810 --> 14:04.070]  I understand that a lot sooner than I understand phone calls because it's very distracting to be typing and looking at a screen.
[14:04.270 --> 14:08.250]  But there is no law against typing on a computer while you're driving.
[14:08.410 --> 14:13.790]  There's no law against changing a TV channel, even having a TV in your car, while driving.
[14:13.790 --> 14:18.530]  There's no law against getting into a big heated argument with somebody sitting next to you, which is also quite distracting.
[14:18.710 --> 14:20.350]  There are all kinds of things that are very distracting.
[14:21.010 --> 14:25.950]  That's a good point, and we have to figure out where we're going to regulate this and where we're going to make it illegal.
[14:26.110 --> 14:43.730]  But I think... I've talked to police officers now who have told me that they have found that the incident of vehicular accidents by people using cell phones is now greater than the incidence of people driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs.
[14:43.890 --> 14:47.490]  And if that's true, then that's a serious problem that needs to be looked at.
[14:47.690 --> 14:48.510]  It's a public safety problem.
[14:48.790 --> 15:00.530]  Well, we have a chicken-in-the-egg kind of question here because is it that the technology is causing the accidents or just that it's so prevalent that now they're in the hands of almost anyone who's getting into a car accident?
[15:00.750 --> 15:01.350]  Interesting point.
[15:01.490 --> 15:01.910]  Stupidity.
[15:02.490 --> 15:02.870]  Sorry?
[15:03.590 --> 15:05.210]  It's stupidity that's causing accidents.
[15:05.390 --> 15:08.190]  Really careless people can't pass laws against stupidity.
[15:08.190 --> 15:09.130]  That's always been the case.
[15:09.230 --> 15:10.870]  Stupidity usually plays a part in it.
[15:10.990 --> 15:15.370]  If we try using laws to defend ourselves against stupidity, we're going to have a very big problem.
[15:16.310 --> 15:20.470]  I think there actually are laws involving the driver seeing television while he's driving.
[15:20.690 --> 15:24.370]  I think if they install a TV in a vehicle, it can't be within view of the driver.
[15:24.470 --> 15:26.150]  I think there's some kind of law like that, at least in this state.
[15:26.530 --> 15:28.330]  But what I also think is interesting is...
[15:28.330 --> 15:29.910]  So then they have to crane their neck to see it.
[15:30.010 --> 15:30.170]  Yeah.
[15:30.530 --> 15:32.710]  They have to lean over the back of the seat to see what's on TV.
[15:32.870 --> 15:45.010]  But then if you drive through the middle of this city, you'll pass by buses now that have full-color TV-like displays on the sides that are out on the road to distract drivers and stuff like that.
[15:45.190 --> 15:45.210]  Yeah, exactly.
[15:45.470 --> 15:52.130]  How about we make advertising illegal, too, because that's distracting, and that makes people avert their eyes from the road ahead.
[15:52.930 --> 16:02.310]  I mean, you drive past these advertising billboards that have multiple words and messages.
[16:02.470 --> 16:09.310]  Even the road hazard signs, they time them so that you don't see the entire message before you pass it.
[16:09.330 --> 16:12.530]  So you have to keep looking behind to see if the road is closed ahead.
[16:12.530 --> 16:16.850]  And it creates a traffic hazard just by timing it badly.
[16:17.450 --> 16:18.290]  So all these little distractions.
[16:18.470 --> 16:18.590]  Yes.
[16:19.210 --> 16:20.850]  I do think there are rules.
[16:21.010 --> 16:29.190]  I don't know if there are actual laws, but I think there's at least rules prohibiting these video billboards from having live motion video.
[16:29.190 --> 16:32.330]  I haven't seen any billboards on highways.
[16:32.330 --> 16:35.830]  You see them in Times Square, but I think it's a little different situation.
[16:36.050 --> 16:43.450]  But I haven't seen any video billboards, and I've seen a lot of them, but I haven't seen any on highways where there's live moving video.
[16:43.450 --> 16:47.130]  There's just stills that change every few seconds.
[16:47.170 --> 16:51.850]  And I think live moving video on the side of the road would be very, very distracting.
[16:52.190 --> 16:55.230]  Well, first of all, Times Square definitely has live moving video.
[16:55.230 --> 17:07.810]  And if you go to the Long Island Expressway heading into Manhattan right by the Midtown Tunnel, I believe there's a big billboard there with a big motion picture that's practically displaying a film for everybody to enjoy.
[17:08.650 --> 17:15.790]  Well, that may just be an unspoken rule between the ad agencies or various municipalities.
[17:16.110 --> 17:25.970]  But I would think that if there wasn't some rule prohibiting them from doing it, that virtually all video billboards would have live moving video, because it's more distracting.
[17:25.970 --> 17:28.570]  And you want advertising to be distracting.
[17:28.590 --> 17:29.850]  You want it to draw the eye.
[17:31.110 --> 17:35.870]  But I have yet to see any on a major highway where there's live motion video.
[17:36.030 --> 17:36.910]  And I think that's a good thing.
[17:37.750 --> 17:38.230]  Yeah.
[17:38.390 --> 17:58.090]  Well, the thing is, what I really wish we would do, rather than continue making all these laws about every possible way you can behave, is simply to somehow instill common sense in people so that they behave like adults, so that they don't wait for a law to exist to tell them not to do something,
[17:58.210 --> 18:02.390]  and then it's assumed that they, you know, doing that is the proper way of behaving.
[18:03.090 --> 18:06.510]  You know, that's my wish.
[18:06.590 --> 18:06.850]  I don't know.
[18:06.930 --> 18:08.650]  Rob, do you think that's something that's unreasonable?
[18:08.850 --> 18:14.430]  All I can say to that is good luck with that, because trying to instill common sense in the general public is a goal, I think.
[18:14.570 --> 18:16.790]  It's a worthy goal, but I don't think it's an achievable one.
[18:16.790 --> 18:17.630]  Mm-hmm.
[18:18.490 --> 18:18.790]  Okay.
[18:18.910 --> 18:19.890]  Bernie, any last words on this?
[18:21.170 --> 18:24.610]  No, I think we've covered the subject enough, but it's definitely food for thought.
[18:24.770 --> 18:31.490]  We should really consider our own use of cell phones while driving, and be aware that it doesn't affect us.
[18:31.490 --> 18:34.250]  It could really affect other people if we lose control of our cars.
[18:34.410 --> 18:34.730]  Oh, yeah.
[18:34.810 --> 18:36.530]  That's true if you drive your car, to start with.
[18:36.770 --> 18:39.950]  But personally, you know, I have no trouble driving and talking on the phone.
[18:39.970 --> 18:42.990]  If I see a distraction, I can drop my phone very easily.
[18:43.090 --> 18:44.010]  It's never had a problem with that.
[18:44.090 --> 18:44.930]  Texting is another thing.
[18:44.930 --> 18:54.390]  Texting takes a lot of concentration, and I've seen people using hands-free that have almost wrecked their cars because they're trying to figure out why it's not working and various things like that.
[18:54.470 --> 19:02.270]  So I think with everybody, there's different skill sets, and you can't really dictate to everybody the exact same level of...
[19:02.270 --> 19:03.830]  Some people can't drive stick shift.
[19:03.990 --> 19:06.470]  You know, trying to do that is going to make them go off the road.
[19:07.430 --> 19:08.310]  So it's...
[19:08.310 --> 19:08.950]  I don't know.
[19:09.090 --> 19:09.910]  It's complicated.
[19:10.450 --> 19:10.650]  Okay.
[19:11.170 --> 19:13.950]  We have a guest joining us right now.
[19:13.950 --> 19:20.330]  Now, Evan Koblenz of the Vintage Computer Festival, which I believe is taking place this weekend coming up.
[19:20.390 --> 19:21.010]  Evan, are you with us?
[19:21.210 --> 19:21.690]  Yes, I am.
[19:21.850 --> 19:22.030]  Hello.
[19:22.270 --> 19:22.530]  Hi.
[19:22.610 --> 19:22.930]  How are you doing?
[19:23.050 --> 19:24.130]  Tell us something about this.
[19:24.610 --> 19:25.530]  Well, first, I'd like to...
[19:25.530 --> 19:26.970]  I wish I had a little more common sense myself.
[19:28.030 --> 19:28.650]  Ah, yeah.
[19:28.790 --> 19:29.270]  Let's see.
[19:29.330 --> 19:35.670]  The Vintage Computer Festival is an annual celebration of computers from, say, the 1940s to 1980s.
[19:36.770 --> 19:37.570]  Wow, 1940s?
[19:38.390 --> 19:41.510]  Yeah, once in a while, some people actually bring...
[19:41.510 --> 19:45.870]  In our museum, for example, here, we actually have a board of vacuum tubes from a Univac computer.
[19:46.130 --> 19:46.450]  Oh, yeah.
[19:46.510 --> 19:51.010]  You know, Univac is the computer that my university used when I first went there, and that was back in the 70s.
[19:51.150 --> 19:53.750]  And last year, somebody exhibited some parts of SAGE.
[19:54.170 --> 19:54.550]  Uh-huh.
[19:55.490 --> 19:55.870]  Wow.
[19:57.410 --> 19:58.210]  That's amazing.
[19:58.210 --> 20:00.370]  So, tell us what's going to be happening at this event.
[20:00.650 --> 20:01.410]  Well, let's see.
[20:01.450 --> 20:02.750]  It's a Saturday and a Sunday this weekend.
[20:03.270 --> 20:07.710]  And the mornings are lectures and special events, and the afternoon is an exhibit hall.
[20:08.510 --> 20:12.050]  This year's lectures, our keynote lecture, is a guy named Ted Hurwitz.
[20:12.570 --> 20:15.030]  Ted worked on RCA in the 1950s.
[20:15.110 --> 20:20.190]  He worked on the 501 vacuum tube computer and the Bismack computer as well.
[20:21.270 --> 20:25.330]  This year, at noon on Saturday, we're having an 8-bit music concert.
[20:26.110 --> 20:27.350]  Oh, I've seen those.
[20:27.470 --> 20:27.830]  Those are great.
[20:28.210 --> 20:32.610]  And that's sponsored by the Philadelphia Hactory, an 8-Static, of which Bernie's part of.
[20:33.830 --> 20:34.270]  And then...
[20:34.270 --> 20:35.110]  I actually contacted...
[20:35.110 --> 20:51.070]  I knew Evan from the Vintage Computer Festival from way back, and being involved with the Hactory here in Philadelphia, we have several members of the Hactory who were involved with creating really cool music and video with vintage computer and video games from the 70s and 80s.
[20:51.190 --> 20:55.410]  And I told Evan, hey, why don't we collaborate and do a concert?
[20:55.410 --> 21:06.790]  So at noon on Saturday, we'll be a concert sponsored by the Hactory and 8-Static with various local artists performing some really wild computer music and video.
[21:07.030 --> 21:09.610]  And Evan, don't we have a special opening act?
[21:09.770 --> 21:10.130]  We do.
[21:10.210 --> 21:10.990]  You're in my mind.
[21:11.190 --> 21:13.250]  This definitely directly ties into hacking.
[21:13.650 --> 21:24.290]  There's a famous story that in 1975 at the Homebrew Computer Club in California, Steve Stompier played the song Fool on the Hill on his Altair.
[21:24.490 --> 21:28.650]  And he discovered he can do that by accident, by induction, and programming the Altair a certain way.
[21:29.150 --> 21:35.910]  So we're going to recreate that moment and play Fool on the Hill on a real Altair computer as a warm-up act at the 8-Bit Concert.
[21:36.430 --> 21:36.870]  Wow.
[21:37.170 --> 21:42.150]  That's something that I imagine people listening to this show will realize the significance of.
[21:42.230 --> 21:43.150]  That's pretty cool.
[21:43.150 --> 21:48.970]  And then on Sunday at 1 o'clock is a lecture by David Hall of Creative Computing Magazine.
[21:50.250 --> 21:55.010]  Meanwhile, the exhibit hall, I'm sure many of the readers at some point in their lives have been to a car show.
[21:55.570 --> 21:59.370]  Now, car shows are fun, but you can't touch anything and you certainly can't drive anything.
[22:00.330 --> 22:05.010]  If you go to a car show and ask for a test drive, they would just think you're absolutely nuts.
[22:06.250 --> 22:10.790]  So we require at the VCF that all the exhibitors have everything turned on and working.
[22:11.310 --> 22:15.250]  Otherwise, you're just saying, you know, imagine these computers doing something and that's not much fun.
[22:16.850 --> 22:18.190]  Evan, aren't there about...
[22:18.190 --> 22:22.230]  There's like a couple of dozen exhibits with people this year.
[22:22.370 --> 22:25.270]  And I've been to the Vintage Computer Festival before and I really recommend it.
[22:25.310 --> 22:26.070]  It's a lot of fun.
[22:26.190 --> 22:43.170]  If you were involved with computers in the early days or just want to see what it was like in the early days when it wasn't just a few big companies controlling everything, the exhibitors at the Vintage Computer Festival really spend a huge amount of time and effort and it's a labor of love seeing these exhibits that these people put on.
[22:43.310 --> 22:44.650]  They're not making money on this.
[22:44.730 --> 22:49.410]  This is just to really show off their collection in a really cool way.
[22:49.610 --> 22:50.030]  That's right.
[22:50.090 --> 22:51.110]  A couple of things I'd like to emphasize.
[22:51.510 --> 22:55.190]  For example, this is certainly not just a microcomputer event by any means.
[22:55.550 --> 22:57.870]  One person is bringing in a DEC PDP-8.
[22:58.250 --> 22:59.190]  One person...
[22:59.190 --> 23:04.070]  We're doing a live restoration of an IBM 029 key punch on the show floor.
[23:05.230 --> 23:07.710]  One person is bringing in a Prime minicomputer.
[23:08.390 --> 23:09.270]  So all...
[23:09.270 --> 23:13.310]  And of course, all sorts of homebrew era systems as well, inside, out there, et cetera.
[23:13.570 --> 23:15.410]  So it's not just Apples and Commodores.
[23:15.570 --> 23:16.210]  It's things that give...
[23:16.210 --> 23:18.390]  Apples and Commodores are about the newest of what you'll see there.
[23:21.130 --> 23:21.570]  Also...
[23:21.570 --> 23:26.130]  You know, we're going to be selling T-shirts and custom punch, punch cards.
[23:26.370 --> 23:28.950]  Another thing we're doing this year, we're having a programming event.
[23:29.230 --> 23:31.210]  We're calling it the Basic Programming Challenge.
[23:32.110 --> 23:39.990]  And if any readers remember the children's game of telephone, where one person tells a story and passes it on, and by time comes full circle, it's a completely different story.
[23:40.150 --> 23:41.210]  Yeah, it's called the media now.
[23:41.790 --> 23:42.310]  What's it called?
[23:42.470 --> 23:43.590]  The mass media, but...
[23:43.590 --> 23:44.610]  Right, right, right.
[23:45.130 --> 23:47.270]  Anyway, we're going to play telephone, so to speak.
[23:47.830 --> 23:56.290]  You're going to sit down with a keyboard under the guidance of one of our programming experts, and we'll give you, say, 20, 30 minutes to put in your code and hand the keyboard to the next person.
[23:56.710 --> 23:59.470]  The catch is, don't tell the next person what you had in mind.
[23:59.890 --> 24:03.310]  So the first person might say, okay, I'm going to sit down and write some code for a video game.
[24:03.590 --> 24:06.910]  The next person might think, oh, this is clearly a spreadsheet, etc.
[24:07.990 --> 24:11.130]  So the program will keep evolving with no sense of what it might be.
[24:11.430 --> 24:15.870]  And on day two, we're going to attempt to execute the code and see how far we can get without a syntax error.
[24:16.030 --> 24:17.470]  And the winner gets hired by Microsoft.
[24:19.530 --> 24:19.850]  Wow.
[24:19.850 --> 24:20.290]  We get respect.
[24:20.930 --> 24:22.190]  That's... have you done that before?
[24:22.510 --> 24:23.590]  That would be a first for us.
[24:23.650 --> 24:23.950]  Really?
[24:24.110 --> 24:24.290]  Okay.
[24:24.890 --> 24:25.770]  That sounds like fun.
[24:25.930 --> 24:27.510]  How many people do you expect at this thing, Evan?
[24:27.510 --> 24:31.450]  Usually, we, you know, get a low couple hundred.
[24:31.750 --> 24:33.790]  This year, we have a record of 23 exhibitors.
[24:34.630 --> 24:37.750]  Now, somebody wrote to me the other day and said, 23 of that sounds like a pretty small event.
[24:37.850 --> 24:39.550]  But there's a lot more to the VCF than just that.
[24:39.790 --> 24:42.550]  There's the lectures, the programming contests.
[24:43.190 --> 24:46.350]  There's a company called Breel Computers in Cleveland.
[24:46.830 --> 24:50.670]  And Vince Breel is famous for making the Apple I replica computer a couple of years ago.
[24:50.690 --> 24:52.570]  He also makes the Kim I replica computer.
[24:53.090 --> 25:00.330]  This year, he's doing a workshop where you can buy and solder together, under his guidance, a pocket-sized terminal system as well.
[25:00.470 --> 25:01.750]  So we're going to have that to offer.
[25:01.990 --> 25:05.830]  And then we're going to have guided tours of our bricks-and-mortar computer museum.
[25:06.370 --> 25:10.990]  We also have other tours here at the InfoAid Science Center, where we host the VCF in our computer museum.
[25:11.430 --> 25:14.390]  It's formerly a Marconi wireless telegraphy base.
[25:14.670 --> 25:16.250]  And it was formed in a U.S.
[25:16.330 --> 25:17.650]  Army Syndical Corps lab as well.
[25:17.870 --> 25:21.830]  So there's all sorts of science and hacking that happened here long before it was invoked.
[25:21.830 --> 25:26.970]  So now, this is... you're talking about the InfoAid Center, which I believe is in Wall, New Jersey?
[25:27.170 --> 25:27.470]  Correct.
[25:27.570 --> 25:28.830]  And that's where the VCF is being held.
[25:29.210 --> 25:33.890]  Now, okay, so how long has... you talked about the brick-and-mortar museum.
[25:34.030 --> 25:34.790]  How long has that been there?
[25:35.130 --> 25:38.150]  We've had our computer museum here since about 2006.
[25:39.090 --> 25:48.890]  And we're kind of the opposite of the... everyone knows about the Computer History Museum in Silicon Valley, which is a beautiful facility, Smithsonian-like, professional curators, full-time staff, etc.
[25:49.370 --> 25:51.090]  But you can't touch very much.
[25:51.490 --> 25:56.390]  And we're all about hands-on, you know, more common computers people actually used.
[25:56.630 --> 25:59.290]  Very few people ever actually got to use an IBM 1401.
[26:00.530 --> 26:03.930]  Whereas you come here and you can hack away on our commoners, who's e-vores, etc.
[26:05.170 --> 26:06.990]  Have you ever hooked these things up to the net?
[26:08.050 --> 26:13.070]  Well, last year, somebody exhibited an Apple II using the Contiki browser hooked up to the net.
[26:13.550 --> 26:14.250]  Oh, wow.
[26:15.050 --> 26:16.330]  That's... that's cool.
[26:17.430 --> 26:20.510]  Okay, well, how can... how can people get involved?
[26:20.970 --> 26:23.010]  Well, the website is vintage.org.
[26:23.570 --> 26:26.490]  And just go there and click on a link for VCF East 6.
[26:27.510 --> 26:29.650]  This year, the exhibit hall is sold out.
[26:29.950 --> 26:31.830]  But tickets are very, very cheap.
[26:32.010 --> 26:34.370]  Only $10 for one day or $15 for a weekend.
[26:34.550 --> 26:35.290]  Free for kids.
[26:36.370 --> 26:37.750]  People go to vintage.org.
[26:37.750 --> 26:43.210]  They can email me at evan, E-V-A-N, at snark, S-N-A-R-C, dot net.
[26:43.690 --> 26:45.070]  Or they can even call my cell phone.
[26:45.070 --> 26:45.910]  I'll answer anytime.
[26:47.150 --> 26:49.090]  646-546-9999.
[26:50.010 --> 26:50.410]  Wow.
[26:50.530 --> 26:54.010]  I imagine you're getting all kinds of errant calls with a number like that to start with.
[26:54.030 --> 26:55.350]  I do get respect for Steve Wozniak.
[26:55.450 --> 26:57.110]  Apparently, he's a big fan of repeating digits.
[26:57.670 --> 26:58.890]  And he was impressed with my number.
[26:59.490 --> 26:59.890]  Okay.
[27:00.050 --> 27:02.670]  Now, you mentioned this is an East Coast thing.
[27:02.670 --> 27:06.010]  That implies that there are other such conferences in other parts of the country.
[27:06.410 --> 27:10.110]  Almost every year, there is a VCF California as well.
[27:10.330 --> 27:12.630]  This year, it was canceled because of the economy.
[27:13.410 --> 27:17.430]  Also, every year in the springtime, there's a VCF Europa held in Munich, Germany.
[27:18.550 --> 27:22.350]  And some years, there's a VCF Midwest held in Indiana.
[27:23.070 --> 27:23.310]  Okay.
[27:23.670 --> 27:26.970]  And I do know that we do things at the HOPE conferences.
[27:26.970 --> 27:32.770]  So, I hope to see you guys participating in some way next July.
[27:33.030 --> 27:34.070]  Oh, we love the HOPE conference.
[27:34.230 --> 27:37.490]  We've been going there the last few times it happened and talk about our prime audience.
[27:38.090 --> 27:44.390]  You know, we go to the trending computer show every year, and that show is getting smaller and smaller every year, whereas HOPE seems to be growing.
[27:44.850 --> 27:48.570]  And anybody who saw our vintage computer exhibit at HOPE should come to the VCF.
[27:48.870 --> 27:51.470]  Imagine that exhibit times 20.
[27:51.670 --> 27:52.070]  Wow.
[27:52.190 --> 27:53.550]  That does sound cool.
[27:53.550 --> 27:55.850]  And it's happening all weekend?
[27:55.850 --> 27:59.810]  Yep, it starts Saturday 10 to 6 and Sunday 10 to 5.
[28:00.070 --> 28:05.890]  We are about a mile and a half from the train station in Belmar, New Jersey, for New York, for Philadelphia people.
[28:06.190 --> 28:07.770]  Now, how would you get there if you didn't have a car?
[28:08.870 --> 28:10.430]  The train would be your only option.
[28:10.650 --> 28:13.450]  We are a little bit off the beaten path, but you would take the...
[28:13.450 --> 28:19.410]  For New York, for example, you would just go to New Jersey Transit and take the New Jersey coastline to Belmar.
[28:20.110 --> 28:20.470]  Okay.
[28:20.710 --> 28:24.110]  But then, once you get off the train, are you close to where it is, or do you have to...
[28:24.110 --> 28:25.490]  You're about a mile and a half walk.
[28:25.490 --> 28:28.910]  It's a nice walk along the harbor, and we are expecting good weather this weekend.
[28:29.150 --> 28:29.430]  Okay.
[28:29.650 --> 28:30.710]  And one final question.
[28:30.730 --> 28:35.010]  As far as your attendees, are they mostly cranky old guys, or do you get kids?
[28:35.150 --> 28:36.670]  Do you get a variety?
[28:37.250 --> 28:39.290]  Well, obviously, males are demographic.
[28:40.670 --> 28:41.550]  We get...
[28:41.550 --> 28:45.970]  You know, our accordion to say male 25 to 65.
[28:46.710 --> 28:52.250]  You know, it's mostly people who, much like ourselves, people who grew up with this and now are starting to reminisce about the good old days.
[28:52.510 --> 28:58.870]  Well, maybe we can break down that barrier and have all kinds of other people show up as well and take an interest and learn some history.
[28:59.790 --> 29:00.390]  That'd be great.
[29:00.850 --> 29:03.850]  And, Emmanuel, I hope you can come and be our keynote speaker one year.
[29:04.170 --> 29:05.810]  Yeah, definitely keep that in mind.
[29:06.090 --> 29:06.990]  That sounds like fun.
[29:07.530 --> 29:12.250]  I don't know what I'd say about old computers, because I, you know, there might have been some I accessed by accident over the years.
[29:13.690 --> 29:14.310]  Accident, right.
[29:14.350 --> 29:16.510]  Yeah, I might already know some of them, personally.
[29:16.830 --> 29:16.990]  Yeah.
[29:17.110 --> 29:18.930]  Well, you know, we've had some great speakers in the past.
[29:19.090 --> 29:21.890]  A couple years ago, we had Chuck Petal of Moss and Commodore fame.
[29:22.070 --> 29:24.050]  And by the way, that's on YouTube in four parts.
[29:25.110 --> 29:26.830]  One year, we had David All.
[29:26.950 --> 29:28.490]  He's coming back this year, creative computing.
[29:29.510 --> 29:30.690]  Last year was my favorite.
[29:30.830 --> 29:34.610]  Last year, we had Bill Mockley, who's the son of John Mockley of ENIAC fame.
[29:35.090 --> 29:35.570]  Oh, wow.
[29:35.690 --> 29:36.290]  That was interesting.
[29:36.750 --> 29:36.910]  Cool.
[29:36.970 --> 29:37.670]  Now, Bernie, you had something?
[29:38.250 --> 29:44.730]  Yeah, I just wanted to mention, for our listeners that want more information about the Vintage Computer Festival, the website, they've got a great domain name here.
[29:44.850 --> 29:53.710]  It's vintage.org slash 2009 slash east is the website for the Vintage Computer Festival East.
[29:53.710 --> 29:56.970]  So it's vintage.org slash 2009 slash east.
[29:57.150 --> 30:01.290]  And on that slide, you also find a two-minute YouTube video montage of last year's show.
[30:01.890 --> 30:02.510]  Oh, cool.
[30:02.630 --> 30:02.810]  Okay.
[30:04.150 --> 30:04.590]  Great.
[30:05.010 --> 30:07.510]  Well, Evan Koblenz, thanks so much for joining us.
[30:07.510 --> 30:12.450]  And best of luck with Vintage Computer Festival happening this weekend in Wall, New Jersey.
[30:12.630 --> 30:16.130]  Again, www.vintage.org.
[30:16.770 --> 30:18.290]  And just click around.
[30:18.290 --> 30:22.310]  You'll find the information about the East Conference happening this week.
[30:22.370 --> 30:22.710]  Well, thanks for having me.
[30:22.870 --> 30:25.050]  And, Emmanuel, we will be sending you a VCF T-shirt.
[30:25.290 --> 30:25.710]  All right.
[30:25.790 --> 30:26.030]  Great.
[30:26.770 --> 30:27.250]  Awesome.
[30:27.390 --> 30:27.630]  Thanks.
[30:27.810 --> 30:28.110]  Thank you.
[30:28.590 --> 30:28.950]  Okay.
[30:29.310 --> 30:33.190]  We have other stories, and we have letters to read from our listeners.
[30:33.450 --> 30:40.570]  You can email us, O-T-H at 2600.com, if there are things that you'd like to find out about.
[30:40.710 --> 30:43.850]  Now, Bernie, I understand you're going to be going down to the Vintage Computer.
[30:44.450 --> 30:44.650]  Yep.
[30:44.650 --> 30:49.130]  I'm helping out with the Hactory 8 Static Vintage Computer Music Festival.
[30:49.130 --> 30:50.190]  I'll be helping out with that.
[30:50.250 --> 30:51.870]  But it's just a really, a lot of fun.
[30:52.030 --> 30:55.710]  It's just a very friendly, small event, and maybe a couple, 300 people.
[30:56.210 --> 31:03.030]  And anybody that's been involved with computers over the years would really, it's really a walk-through memory lane.
[31:03.190 --> 31:07.750]  And you get to, as Evan pointed out, you get to get your hands on this stuff and really play with these really old computers.
[31:07.750 --> 31:09.030]  And it's just a lot of fun.
[31:09.190 --> 31:09.810]  So come on down.
[31:10.010 --> 31:13.470]  I'll be there, and a lot of other people will be there, too.
[31:13.950 --> 31:14.150]  Okay.
[31:15.090 --> 31:15.750]  All right.
[31:15.850 --> 31:18.490]  Jim brought us this story about China.
[31:18.950 --> 31:28.090]  Apparently, news websites in China complying with secret government orders are requiring that new users log on under their true identities to post comments.
[31:28.090 --> 31:33.350]  A shift in policy that the country's Internet users and media have fiercely opposed in the past.
[31:33.990 --> 31:34.790]  That's interesting.
[31:35.550 --> 31:44.770]  I don't know how many of you read news sites in this country, but it's kind of annoying all the people that just post ignorant comments, and anybody can just do it.
[31:44.850 --> 31:46.630]  Wouldn't it be nice if you knew exactly who these people were?
[31:46.730 --> 31:51.530]  Well, in China, they're actually realizing that dream and requiring people to identify themselves.
[31:51.650 --> 31:58.930]  But I think what's interesting about this story is the fact that, yes, there is fierce opposition from Internet users and media in China.
[31:58.930 --> 32:08.710]  And that sort of flies against the way that we're taught that China exists, that everybody has to follow the rules and nobody can speak up and say that things are wrong.
[32:08.770 --> 32:11.010]  Apparently, people are speaking up and fighting against this.
[32:11.430 --> 32:18.830]  Now, until recently, users could weigh in on news items on many of the affected sites more anonymously, more often without registering at all.
[32:19.210 --> 32:24.730]  Those sites were obligated to screen all posts, and the posts could still be traced via the IP addresses.
[32:24.730 --> 32:41.270]  But in early August, without notification of a change, news portals like NetEase and Sohu and Sina and scores of other sites began asking unregistered users to sign in under their real names and identification numbers.
[32:41.690 --> 32:47.230]  And a staff member at Sina confirms that that that was, in fact, a change.
[32:47.230 --> 32:59.850]  The editors said the sites were putting into effect a confidential directive issued in late July by the State Council Information Office, one of the main government bodies responsible for supervising the Internet in China.
[32:59.910 --> 33:01.370]  Now, this new step is not foolproof.
[33:01.730 --> 33:09.450]  It was possible for a reporter to register successfully on several major sites under falsified names and IDs and cell phone numbers.
[33:09.450 --> 33:18.050]  But the requirement adds a critical new layer of surveillance to mainstream sites in China, which were already heavily monitored.
[33:18.600 --> 33:23.270]  And further regulations of the same nature also appeared to be in the pipeline.
[33:23.450 --> 33:29.430]  You mentioned how surprising all the resistance seemed to be to you.
[33:29.630 --> 33:34.190]  Well, yeah, they can resist, but will it matter?
[33:34.190 --> 33:42.930]  Well, the fact that people speak up at all is something that I think surprises anybody who reads the papers here, where you just assume that everyone's living under a police state.
[33:43.050 --> 33:45.690]  It's not necessarily that black and white, you know?
[33:46.590 --> 33:46.950]  Yeah.
[33:47.910 --> 33:51.570]  I'm really torn on this one because I'm all for people being able to do what they want online anonymously.
[33:51.570 --> 33:56.970]  But on the other hand, when I read the comments on American news sites, a little piece of my soul dies every time.
[33:57.150 --> 33:57.810]  So, I mean...
[33:57.810 --> 33:57.990]  Yeah.
[33:57.990 --> 33:59.350]  And that's why I don't read those comments.
[33:59.350 --> 33:59.950]  Well, yeah.
[34:00.110 --> 34:05.110]  But, you know, sometimes they're plastered up there as if they're as important as the person being quoted in the news story.
[34:05.270 --> 34:07.390]  And they're really oftentimes very ignorant.
[34:07.550 --> 34:10.810]  Now, Newsday in particular was the worst offender ever.
[34:11.530 --> 34:12.170]  Don't get me started.
[34:12.350 --> 34:14.770]  But they've changed over the past month or two.
[34:14.850 --> 34:15.710]  They've redesigned their website.
[34:15.710 --> 34:17.790]  And now you have to just log in.
[34:17.890 --> 34:21.750]  You don't have to identify yourself, but you do have to log in before you leave any comments.
[34:21.750 --> 34:31.530]  And that alone, that one step, has just brought a lot of the racism and stupidity down that was just there by default for every single story imaginable.
[34:31.970 --> 34:33.930]  So sometimes you just need to take a little bit of a step.
[34:34.050 --> 34:36.470]  But this in China, of course, they're taking a very big step.
[34:36.550 --> 34:43.410]  I'm just curious if this means that people who are not Chinese citizens who don't have the proper ID number now are forbidden from commenting on these sites at all.
[34:43.470 --> 34:44.010]  It could very well be.
[34:44.010 --> 34:52.270]  Yeah, I mean, it's not a hard thing to simply say you have to have a Chinese IP in order to be able to post a story, even read the story.
[34:52.890 --> 34:54.610]  Whatever the secret ID number.
[34:55.170 --> 34:57.090]  Yeah, they could limit it to citizens.
[34:57.370 --> 34:58.670]  I mean, that kind of thing has happened before.
[34:58.810 --> 35:02.130]  But what happens if they extend it to everybody all around the world?
[35:02.330 --> 35:04.430]  Well, they can't force us to identify ourselves.
[35:04.630 --> 35:07.210]  Well, in order for us to go onto their websites, then they can start to watch everybody.
[35:07.890 --> 35:11.950]  I don't know if they'd like me because my actual legal name is Free Tibet Tiananmen Square.
[35:12.050 --> 35:13.150]  Yeah, I don't think they'd like you at all.
[35:13.270 --> 35:13.810]  I'm pretty sure.
[35:14.710 --> 35:18.690]  Okay, and here's another story Jim gave to us concerning Amazon.
[35:18.870 --> 35:30.010]  Amazon.com is offering free books or $30 to Kindle customers whose copies of the George Orwell novels 1984 and Animal Farm were deleted from their electronic reading devices back in July.
[35:30.370 --> 35:37.830]  When Amazon erased the books from Kindles, citing a problem with the rights to the works, the company issued refunds to buyers.
[35:37.830 --> 35:47.230]  But the episode startled many Kindle customers who didn't know Amazon had the Neo Orwellian ability to erase content that had already been purchased and downloaded to their devices.
[35:47.230 --> 36:00.090]  It prompted an apology from Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos, who said deleting the books from Kindles to address the rights question was, quote, quote, stupid, thoughtless, and painfully out of line with our principles, unquote.
[36:00.470 --> 36:02.670]  But here's 30 bucks.
[36:02.790 --> 36:02.830]  What?
[36:02.970 --> 36:03.790]  But they retain the...
[36:03.790 --> 36:05.090]  They haven't actually fixed the problem.
[36:05.210 --> 36:12.250]  They give the affected people 30 bucks or a copy of 1984 so they can see what Amazon's going to do next or whatever they have.
[36:12.250 --> 36:19.410]  But they didn't fix the fundamental problem, which is that you buy the device from Amazon, and yet they still retain complete control over it.
[36:19.770 --> 36:21.870]  They could delete something for another reason.
[36:21.870 --> 36:24.350]  They could change a word in a book without you knowing.
[36:24.450 --> 36:24.970]  That's the thing.
[36:25.150 --> 36:26.690]  Yeah, that really worries me that they could do that.
[36:26.790 --> 36:27.970]  Is there a...
[36:27.970 --> 36:34.070]  I don't have a Kindle myself, but is it possible for you to have your Kindle alert you if something changes?
[36:34.450 --> 36:35.650]  Kindle is a closed device.
[36:35.670 --> 36:37.730]  It does whatever Amazon tells it to do.
[36:37.870 --> 36:38.090]  Really?
[36:38.270 --> 36:39.830]  So what we need is an open device.
[36:39.830 --> 36:42.890]  Yeah, yeah, an open Kindle or somebody needs to hack it.
[36:43.550 --> 36:46.130]  All right, well, we want to hear from people who do things like that.
[36:46.990 --> 36:50.590]  Okay, let's read some letters and take some phone calls.
[36:50.750 --> 36:53.770]  Our phone number, 212-209-2900.
[36:54.430 --> 36:57.830]  And hopefully by the time we go through these letters, we'll have a full switchboard.
[36:59.130 --> 37:00.110]  Here's a letter from a listener.
[37:00.190 --> 37:03.070]  I will be traveling to Norway, Sweden, and Denmark in the next week.
[37:03.110 --> 37:06.830]  And I'm looking for a good SIM that offers unlimited 3G data across borders.
[37:07.350 --> 37:13.010]  There are many good voice SIMs for travelers, but I was wondering if anyone knew of a single SIM that would be good for 3G data in the EU.
[37:13.290 --> 37:13.870]  Signed, Reid.
[37:14.010 --> 37:15.790]  Anybody have suggestions here?
[37:15.790 --> 37:20.850]  I suspect he's going to need a separate SIM in each country if he wants cheap data.
[37:21.850 --> 37:23.690]  Even Scandinavia, even though they're all pretty much...
[37:23.690 --> 37:25.010]  I mean, you might be able to find something.
[37:25.010 --> 37:29.730]  You could go to, like, a cell phone shop and ask them if they can recommend something.
[37:31.270 --> 37:33.690]  But I wouldn't guarantee success.
[37:34.190 --> 37:34.670]  Emmanuel?
[37:34.830 --> 37:35.330]  Yes, go ahead, Bernie.
[37:36.010 --> 37:46.170]  I saw some amazing deals when I was just recently on my tour of Austria, Germany, and the Netherlands to check out PlumberCon and Haar and the various hacker spaces.
[37:46.170 --> 37:49.110]  I saw a lot of advertisements for a...
[37:49.110 --> 37:52.550]  Basically, it's a little USB 3G modem.
[37:53.130 --> 37:58.710]  It plugs into your USB port of your laptop, and it's assigned...
[37:58.710 --> 38:01.730]  It's fixed to one particular wireless carrier.
[38:01.930 --> 38:11.150]  It allows you unlimited data, or maybe it's like a large amount of data, like 5 gigs or 10 gigs a month or something, for a very reasonable price.
[38:11.150 --> 38:15.170]  I saw prices like 10 euro, which is like a dollar...
[38:15.170 --> 38:15.590]  What is it?
[38:15.810 --> 38:17.070]  What's 10 euro worth now?
[38:17.150 --> 38:17.850]  Like a dollar...
[38:17.850 --> 38:19.010]  15 or something?
[38:19.230 --> 38:19.590]  15.
[38:19.710 --> 38:20.230]  15, yeah.
[38:20.770 --> 38:21.430]  $1.15.
[38:22.910 --> 38:23.330]  $15.
[38:23.790 --> 38:25.750]  Yeah, 10 euro is worth about $15.
[38:26.490 --> 38:26.910]  Yeah.
[38:27.130 --> 38:27.330]  Okay.
[38:27.330 --> 38:34.350]  So for about $15, you have pretty much unlimited data through your laptop, at least in one country.
[38:34.470 --> 38:36.970]  Now, if you're touring several countries, I'm not sure how that works with roaming.
[38:36.970 --> 38:51.210]  But it was far cheaper than similar deals offered here in the U.S., where you typically have to subscribe for two years to have that kind of broadband wireless data, and it's a lot more per month.
[38:51.390 --> 38:52.770]  So that's one thing that might be...
[38:52.770 --> 38:59.410]  Even if it may only work in one country, it still may be pretty cheap, so they could just buy one of these things for each country and do it.
[38:59.490 --> 39:00.410]  So it's worth checking out.
[39:00.870 --> 39:01.310]  Okay.
[39:01.310 --> 39:10.690]  And our friend RiskTaker writes in to say the recent EU court ruling requiring mobile phone companies to reduce their roaming rates has actually resulted in some strange effects here in Europe.
[39:10.930 --> 39:19.110]  Since the ruling applies only to roaming rates, it is now often cheaper to use your phone outside the country in which it's registered than inside it.
[39:19.210 --> 39:25.990]  When I recently traveled to France, I paid $0.13 to send an SMS, whereas in Germany, where I live and the phone is registered, it's $0.20.
[39:26.810 --> 39:27.170]  Wow.
[39:27.850 --> 39:29.130]  I wasn't expecting that.
[39:29.130 --> 39:31.710]  It sounds like he needs a new SIM card with better rates.
[39:32.030 --> 39:33.530]  Yeah, yeah, probably a better phone company.
[39:33.570 --> 39:34.850]  $0.20 per SMS.
[39:35.170 --> 39:35.650]  That's a lot.
[39:35.750 --> 39:37.070]  He could get that down.
[39:37.350 --> 39:38.110]  Yes, yes.
[39:39.390 --> 39:42.370]  And here's one more letter from somebody who works in the industry.
[39:42.390 --> 39:44.730]  I work for the company 3 in the UK.
[39:44.730 --> 39:47.270]  I believe we were talking about that last week.
[39:47.570 --> 39:50.470]  I'm pleased that you liked using our network in the UK and Ireland.
[39:50.690 --> 39:52.430]  Sorry you didn't get coverage in Islay.
[39:53.070 --> 39:57.050]  This is probably because you are using a phone that only supports the 2G service.
[39:57.050 --> 40:02.570]  The 3 network only supports 3G phones, but 2G is used for coverage hauls via a national roaming agreement.
[40:02.770 --> 40:05.130]  You would have got coverage with a 3G phone.
[40:05.310 --> 40:09.930]  You were talking about being charged roaming rates for using essentially the same company's network in different countries.
[40:10.070 --> 40:18.510]  Well, first, although these may have the same brand and the same parent company, they're all run as separate businesses, those businesses each setting their own tariffs and roaming charges.
[40:19.050 --> 40:23.630]  Yes, I know, inside big companies, they actually compete against each other inside the same building.
[40:24.250 --> 40:25.370]  Radio is like that too.
[40:25.510 --> 40:25.950]  But you know what?
[40:25.990 --> 40:27.050]  It's still the same company.
[40:27.250 --> 40:28.370]  I don't care what anybody says.
[40:29.010 --> 40:30.650]  Anyway, at 3, we have fun...
[40:30.650 --> 40:33.830]  We have run, rather, free roaming between all the three networks.
[40:34.190 --> 40:39.270]  This worked by each network not charging for inbound roamers from other three networks.
[40:39.370 --> 40:40.870]  It's very complicated when...
[40:40.870 --> 40:42.150]  Or confusing when you say three.
[40:42.750 --> 40:46.070]  Okay, I thought you meant three different networks, but it's the network called 3.
[40:46.790 --> 40:53.630]  Okay, so at the company called 3, we have run free roaming between all the three networks, which are networks called 3.
[40:54.230 --> 40:55.190]  This worked...
[40:55.190 --> 40:56.090]  I don't know how many of them there are.
[40:56.630 --> 40:57.430]  This worked by each...
[40:57.430 --> 40:57.790]  Probably three of them.
[40:57.890 --> 41:01.470]  Each network not charging for inbound roamers from other three networks.
[41:02.130 --> 41:03.630]  Who decided that name?
[41:03.630 --> 41:04.330]  That's insane.
[41:04.670 --> 41:13.050]  This was recently dropped because so many customers were finding that their phones had roamed onto another network in a foreign country and were faced with a huge bill as a result.
[41:13.530 --> 41:22.130]  It's possible to lock your phone onto a particular network, but most customers are not able to understand the necessity of doing this and the consequences of roaming onto another network for their bank balance.
[41:22.670 --> 41:27.230]  Mostly, we resolve these issues by giving the customer a refund, but that doesn't make a sustainable business.
[41:28.010 --> 41:28.750]  Signed, Stuart.
[41:28.910 --> 41:30.510]  Thanks, Stuart, for that informative letter.
[41:30.710 --> 41:36.850]  You know, it reminds me, I heard of a case where somebody in Detroit had a huge phone bill because, well, what happened?
[41:36.930 --> 41:38.510]  Their phone started to roam in Canada.
[41:38.510 --> 41:42.930]  Canada, yes, in Windsor, Ontario, I believe.
[41:43.170 --> 41:49.430]  Well, there's probably people in Canada that need cell phones, and from what I hear, Detroit is depopulating.
[41:49.970 --> 41:52.630]  Yeah, yeah, but big surprise.
[41:52.730 --> 41:53.990]  Big surprise when the phone bill comes.
[41:54.070 --> 41:56.510]  All right, 212-209-2900 is our phone number.
[41:56.590 --> 41:58.170]  Let's see how many phone calls we can take today.
[41:58.710 --> 41:59.370]  Good evening.
[41:59.370 --> 42:00.430]  You're on off the hook.
[42:01.330 --> 42:03.270]  Yeah, I wanted to ask.
[42:03.270 --> 42:04.290]  I got a new monitor.
[42:04.450 --> 42:04.710]  Uh-huh.
[42:06.130 --> 42:06.770]  And, um...
[42:06.770 --> 42:07.630]  Hold on, let me turn on.
[42:07.630 --> 42:08.490]  Yeah, turn on your radio, please.
[42:08.710 --> 42:09.710]  I got a new monitor.
[42:09.890 --> 42:10.170]  Yes.
[42:10.270 --> 42:11.550]  Yeah, and it doesn't work.
[42:11.670 --> 42:12.150]  I got a...
[42:12.150 --> 42:13.990]  I had a G3, a Mac G3.
[42:14.890 --> 42:15.210]  Okay.
[42:15.210 --> 42:16.790]  And what happens when I plug the new monitor in?
[42:16.790 --> 42:21.010]  Yeah, this sounds like a personal computer question, and we're not that show.
[42:21.310 --> 42:22.090]  Does anybody here...
[42:22.090 --> 42:28.010]  They're not on tonight, so maybe we can do a courtesy answer of this question if anybody knows the answer, but I don't think any of us do.
[42:28.090 --> 42:28.790]  We're all shaking our heads.
[42:28.890 --> 42:29.890]  Bernie, do you know the answer to this?
[42:30.530 --> 42:33.450]  I think he was saying you bought a new monitor, and it doesn't work with the Mac.
[42:33.970 --> 42:34.950]  If it doesn't work...
[42:34.950 --> 42:37.650]  Well, you can't both talk at the same time, otherwise you'll never hear the question.
[42:38.150 --> 42:40.490]  Finish asking the question, and we'll see if...
[42:40.490 --> 42:42.170]  I plug it in, I get...
[42:42.170 --> 42:46.190]  It doesn't work, and what comes up is input not supported.
[42:46.890 --> 42:47.390]  Mm-hmm.
[42:47.790 --> 42:55.590]  So a friend of mine said it's because it's so new and my computer's so old that it's not receiving what it needs from the...
[42:55.590 --> 42:56.690]  All right, Dot Red has a theory.
[42:56.690 --> 43:01.690]  If you know anybody that has an older computer, try an older monitor to troubleshoot.
[43:02.170 --> 43:03.390]  Where would I get an older monitor?
[43:03.510 --> 43:05.190]  I'm saying if you know anyone who has one.
[43:05.190 --> 43:06.370]  Yeah, you'd have to know somebody who...
[43:06.370 --> 43:08.050]  Bernie, you have a suggestion at all?
[43:08.590 --> 43:14.510]  If I heard all of his question, I thought he said he bought a new monitor and he was trying to use it with a Mac, is that right?
[43:14.730 --> 43:15.930]  Yeah, a Mac G3.
[43:16.510 --> 43:18.050]  Okay, it could be that...
[43:18.050 --> 43:26.150]  I have seen monitors sold with little adapters, like little DB15 sub-mini adapters.
[43:26.330 --> 43:27.910]  The pinouts are different on some of these.
[43:28.510 --> 43:30.550]  Some of these monitors are different computers.
[43:30.730 --> 43:36.410]  So I would recommend contacting the monitor manufacturer and say, hey, I need to use it with an older computer.
[43:36.410 --> 43:38.470]  Do you have an adapter that will let me use it that way?
[43:38.690 --> 43:40.730]  That could be the solution to your problem.
[43:40.850 --> 43:44.910]  It's just a little handheld thing, I mean, the size of a DB15 connector.
[43:44.910 --> 43:46.130]  So give that a try.
[43:46.330 --> 43:51.470]  Yeah, and if that doesn't work out, give the personal computer people a call next week from 8 to 9 when they're on the air.
[43:51.570 --> 43:52.890]  Thanks for that call.
[43:53.030 --> 43:54.250]  Let's take another one.
[43:54.390 --> 43:55.130]  And good evening.
[43:55.270 --> 43:55.870]  You're on Off the Hook.
[43:56.510 --> 43:57.170]  Yes, gentlemen.
[43:57.470 --> 44:04.630]  I'm interested in the validity of these ethical hacking training courses.
[44:04.810 --> 44:05.150]  Yeah.
[44:05.910 --> 44:06.930]  Recommendations from you guys?
[44:07.050 --> 44:11.910]  Not a whole lot of validity in my eyes, I don't think, because I just think it's silly.
[44:11.910 --> 44:19.630]  I think this whole thing of ethical hack, it's just a way of making money off something that's in the news.
[44:19.870 --> 44:20.410]  And go ahead.
[44:20.530 --> 44:24.350]  So your claim is that the ethical hacking course is in itself unethical.
[44:24.590 --> 44:28.110]  Well, I don't know about unethical, but just I don't think you're going to...
[44:28.110 --> 44:30.190]  What is it you hope to gain from it exactly?
[44:30.530 --> 44:36.930]  Well, just more literacy with computing and actually exploring a possible career.
[44:37.510 --> 44:41.910]  Yeah, you can do that in any number of ways by reading, by taking all kinds of courses.
[44:42.930 --> 44:47.290]  It's just this moniker of ethical hacking is something that just rubs me the wrong way.
[44:47.410 --> 44:48.850]  It's hard to really explain.
[44:49.090 --> 44:49.290]  Yes, not right.
[44:49.290 --> 44:54.410]  Well, by saying it's ethical hacking, it implies other hacking is, well, unethical.
[44:54.770 --> 44:55.050]  Yeah, that's probably it.
[44:55.250 --> 44:56.190]  So it's definitely going to be kind of...
[44:56.190 --> 44:58.450]  The term is kind of insulting to a lot of people.
[44:58.590 --> 44:59.050]  Yeah, yeah.
[44:59.470 --> 45:00.750]  It rubs us the wrong way.
[45:00.750 --> 45:08.270]  Well, if you had an opportunity to explore to become a hacker, what would you guys do from zero?
[45:08.550 --> 45:16.750]  Well, I can only speak from personal experience, but I simply went online and when I wanted to know about a topic, I looked it up and...
[45:16.750 --> 45:18.610]  Or you talk to people, you meet people...
[45:18.610 --> 45:23.810]  Like, for instance, in today's world, it's easier with, say, Wikipedia if you're looking at a properly sourced article.
[45:24.030 --> 45:30.310]  And it'll give you links to several different topics so you can then explore the topics that you don't understand.
[45:31.290 --> 45:31.610]  Okay.
[45:32.150 --> 45:32.590]  And Rob T.
[45:32.690 --> 45:33.110]  Firefly, go ahead.
[45:33.330 --> 45:38.830]  Yeah, and I would also suggest a lot of places have sort of adult education courses in your local high schools or colleges.
[45:39.330 --> 45:41.930]  And they could have introductions to various computer subjects.
[45:42.110 --> 45:46.650]  And if you find something you're interested in, you know, just go in, learn all you can about it, and go from there.
[45:46.710 --> 45:52.150]  As far as hacker culture, though, if you're interested in that, read various books that have come out over the years.
[45:52.250 --> 45:53.730]  I mean, some will be tainted, some won't be.
[45:54.290 --> 45:56.830]  But you'll get a sense as to what the culture is all about.
[45:57.050 --> 46:03.290]  And explore online and try to read as much history as you possibly can, because there is an awful lot out there.
[46:03.410 --> 46:03.930]  And you know what?
[46:03.950 --> 46:09.790]  Not to toot our own horn, but listen to some of the shows, some of the older shows, and you'll hear a lot of hacker history that's happened over the years.
[46:09.790 --> 46:11.750]  And you'll see how the world has evolved.
[46:11.750 --> 46:14.490]  And, of course, old publications that we're also involved in.
[46:14.870 --> 46:17.430]  There's all kinds of firsthand sources out there.
[46:17.550 --> 46:17.750]  Darred.
[46:18.450 --> 46:29.370]  Another prime way that people get a hold of information, I don't know if, I'm assuming that there might be a Barnes & Nobles or Borders or some sort of bookstore nearby where you are or within reach.
[46:30.010 --> 46:34.790]  Going into one of those stores and simply sitting down in one of their chairs and reading some of the tech books.
[46:34.810 --> 46:35.570]  Yeah, they encourage that.
[46:36.350 --> 46:36.910]  That's good.
[46:37.930 --> 46:39.830]  Plus2600.com you guys recommend, obviously.
[46:39.830 --> 46:49.970]  Well, yeah, I mean, it's basically, we just have the radio shows there and various other news bits, but you really have to expand well beyond that to really get the full picture.
[46:50.170 --> 46:54.790]  Also, not to toot our own horn further, but if there's a 2600 meeting near you, check that out.
[46:54.910 --> 46:57.310]  If you want to learn about the culture, meet people.
[46:57.370 --> 46:58.790]  That's the best way to meet people.
[46:58.870 --> 47:00.070]  What part of the world are you in?
[47:00.370 --> 47:00.690]  Brooklyn.
[47:00.890 --> 47:01.190]  Brooklyn.
[47:01.310 --> 47:02.290]  Okay, that's not too far away.
[47:02.390 --> 47:05.610]  You come to the monthly meetings at Citigroup Center here in New York City.
[47:05.850 --> 47:06.810]  That sounds good.
[47:06.930 --> 47:07.710]  All right, we'll see you there.
[47:07.710 --> 47:08.330]  Thanks a lot, buddy.
[47:08.450 --> 47:08.770]  Take care.
[47:09.090 --> 47:09.270]  Okay.
[47:09.830 --> 47:11.490]  All right, yeah, you know, people are always curious.
[47:11.570 --> 47:15.410]  That's the question we get asked more than anything at the magazine is, how do I start?
[47:15.730 --> 47:16.570]  How do I hack?
[47:16.590 --> 47:17.430]  How do I become a hacker?
[47:17.530 --> 47:19.170]  And you don't become a hacker with a course.
[47:19.290 --> 47:21.910]  You don't become a hacker by somebody teaching you everything.
[47:22.070 --> 47:32.830]  You become a hacker by asking a lot of questions and exploring and figuring things out on your own and having the mindset and being willing to sort of break the rules a little bit without causing harm.
[47:33.010 --> 47:35.090]  Yeah, the mindset is a very important thing.
[47:35.750 --> 47:43.070]  But, yeah, it definitely is a problem that some people, if they don't know much about a particular topic, knowing where to start is usually the scariest.
[47:43.070 --> 47:50.530]  But once you jump in, you don't necessarily need to have these courses that are designed for you because once you jump in, you'll start seeing.
[47:51.950 --> 47:53.010]  It'll be clearer.
[47:53.230 --> 47:58.310]  You look at the price of the courses, too, and that'll tell you right there that this is on the level or not.
[47:58.370 --> 48:13.330]  If it costs a huge amount of money, you know, somebody is making a buck off of this and basically using fear tactics to get a lot of people to pay attention to what they're saying, which probably you can hear from anybody at a meeting for a fraction of the price or nothing at all.
[48:13.330 --> 48:19.050]  Well, that's why I like the policies of these bookstores that allow you to read the books in the store.
[48:19.210 --> 48:27.770]  You can evaluate the merchandise very thoroughly before you even decide to buy it if you even need to buy it.
[48:28.210 --> 48:30.310]  You might get everything you need to know right then and there.
[48:30.510 --> 48:32.610]  It's nice to buy the book if somebody writes a book.
[48:32.830 --> 48:37.210]  But if it's a massive book, yeah, also it's ethical to buy the content if it's worth it.
[48:37.210 --> 48:44.330]  So again, I mean, we've had libraries for, you know, many years and people are encouraged to go to the libraries and read books and not have to pay for books.
[48:44.430 --> 48:46.430]  So, you know, it's an important thing.
[48:46.550 --> 48:48.970]  Knowledge is very important in sharing of information.
[48:49.430 --> 48:51.890]  Okay, 212-209-2900.
[48:52.070 --> 48:52.750]  Good evening.
[48:52.890 --> 48:53.570]  You're on Off the Hook.
[48:54.030 --> 48:54.510]  Hello.
[48:54.770 --> 48:59.510]  I just have a quick comment about the open source e-book reader.
[49:00.250 --> 49:04.470]  And I just want to say, well, there is actually a device.
[49:05.170 --> 49:10.610]  It's made in, like, I guess, South Korea or somewhere around that area.
[49:10.610 --> 49:17.490]  And it is, it's called Hanlin, but it's rebranded under, like, a thousand different names in every different country.
[49:17.550 --> 49:25.750]  And there's actually a free and open source firmware project for it called Open Inkpot.
[49:27.630 --> 49:28.090]  Okay.
[49:28.130 --> 49:29.150]  And, I mean, that's all I had.
[49:29.410 --> 49:31.590]  Where can people go to find out about it?
[49:32.670 --> 49:40.470]  I just search in your favorite search engine, Hanlin V3, or just search Open Inkpot.
[49:41.650 --> 49:42.110]  Okay.
[49:42.110 --> 49:42.570]  Thanks.
[49:42.650 --> 49:43.230]  Thanks for the information.
[49:43.370 --> 49:43.690]  No problem.
[49:44.930 --> 49:52.830]  Also, more information that I'd like to give out to our listeners that we talked about over the last couple of weeks about Lifeline service for cell phones.
[49:52.830 --> 49:57.950]  A listener sent us a link to safelinkwireless.com.
[49:58.450 --> 49:59.390]  Safelinkwireless.com.
[49:59.510 --> 50:05.690]  It's a government-supported program that provides a free cell phone and airtime each month for income-eligible customers.
[50:05.990 --> 50:14.310]  And if you go to that website, you'll find out all kinds of things about, I guess, frequently asked questions and also how it differs from state to state.
[50:14.310 --> 50:20.170]  So, I didn't really probe into it all that deeply, but it looks easy enough to understand.
[50:20.990 --> 50:35.950]  One thing that we didn't mention last week that I want our listeners to know about is if you're British, and apparently only British people are eligible to participate, there's a petition going on on the Prime Minister's website, I guess he takes petitions on the internet,
[50:35.970 --> 50:41.070]  I don't really understand, to issue a posthumous apology to Alan Turing.
[50:41.890 --> 50:44.490]  People may have heard of Alan Turing.
[50:44.670 --> 51:05.970]  He was probably the first computer scientist, later went to work to crack the German codes during World War II, and then, after the war, was convicted of homosexuality, which was illegal at the time, and given estrogen in an attempt to cure him, and this caused him to commit suicide.
[51:07.510 --> 51:12.730]  So, there's a petition to ask the British government to issue an apology for that.
[51:12.790 --> 51:16.230]  So, I would encourage British people to go online and sign that.
[51:16.390 --> 51:17.590]  Do you have an address for that?
[51:17.770 --> 51:17.990]  No.
[51:18.170 --> 51:18.350]  Oh.
[51:18.790 --> 51:19.170]  Okay.
[51:19.470 --> 51:21.550]  Well, hopefully one of our listeners will tell us what the address is.
[51:21.550 --> 51:21.830]  People can find it.
[51:21.990 --> 51:22.290]  Yes.
[51:22.590 --> 51:22.810]  Okay.
[51:22.930 --> 51:25.110]  That's a worthy cause.
[51:25.670 --> 51:26.150]  All right.
[51:26.230 --> 51:27.830]  202-209-2900.
[51:27.930 --> 51:28.230]  Good evening.
[51:28.370 --> 51:29.130]  You're on Off the Hook.
[51:29.670 --> 51:30.150]  Yeah.
[51:30.350 --> 51:34.350]  The guy who called in about the old G3, and he bought a new monitor.
[51:35.010 --> 51:46.850]  Well, if there's anybody who can help him out, there's an outfit called Operator Head Gap, who are MAC Rebuilders and other things, and down, I think, around Memphis, Tennessee.
[51:47.170 --> 51:51.110]  If he punches Operator Head Gap into a search engine, he'll find them.
[51:51.110 --> 51:55.050]  They have adapters that can handle just about anything.
[51:55.950 --> 51:56.270]  Okay.
[51:56.390 --> 51:56.990]  Very reasonably praised.
[51:57.130 --> 51:57.790]  Very nice people.
[51:57.870 --> 51:58.650]  He should give them a holler.
[51:59.030 --> 51:59.250]  Okay.
[51:59.490 --> 51:59.990]  Thanks for the info.
[52:00.110 --> 52:00.290]  Peace.
[52:00.550 --> 52:00.930]  All right.
[52:01.670 --> 52:02.330]  And good evening.
[52:02.510 --> 52:03.090]  You're on Off the Hook.
[52:03.230 --> 52:04.170]  He should give them a holler.
[52:04.570 --> 52:04.790]  Okay.
[52:04.910 --> 52:05.690]  Turn down your radio, please.
[52:06.230 --> 52:06.490]  All right.
[52:06.770 --> 52:07.150]  Speak up.
[52:07.170 --> 52:07.330]  Hello.
[52:07.470 --> 52:07.970]  Yes, go ahead.
[52:09.390 --> 52:09.930]  You're on the air.
[52:09.990 --> 52:10.210]  Go ahead.
[52:10.930 --> 52:17.810]  You had a show some months ago, and a person was asking about the sensors along the highway on 78.
[52:17.970 --> 52:19.350]  I don't know if you remember that.
[52:19.530 --> 52:20.870]  Oh, that was a long time ago, wasn't it?
[52:21.310 --> 52:21.630]  Yes.
[52:21.890 --> 52:24.230]  Some kind of weird sensors on the highway along 70.
[52:24.290 --> 52:24.390]  Yeah.
[52:24.470 --> 52:25.030]  What were they?
[52:25.110 --> 52:25.330]  Do you know?
[52:26.070 --> 52:32.510]  They now, what they do is they read your tow, the tow, what's that, the easy pass?
[52:32.590 --> 52:32.970]  Easy pass.
[52:33.070 --> 52:33.250]  Okay.
[52:33.570 --> 52:38.190]  They read the easy pass and gives the information that how long it's going to take you to get from point A to point B.
[52:38.330 --> 52:41.530]  So now they're reading everybody's easy pass at different points along the highway.
[52:41.670 --> 52:41.910]  Okay.
[52:42.010 --> 52:45.950]  Well, we have that system on Long Island, but I haven't seen any kind of weird looking sensors.
[52:46.090 --> 52:47.310]  I guess I just have to look a little harder.
[52:47.410 --> 52:51.550]  But then again, if I'm looking for them, I'm not looking at the road, and I'm probably breaking the law by not paying attention.
[52:52.910 --> 52:54.790]  Pay attention to what you're doing, but that's what now.
[52:55.330 --> 52:56.510]  Now they got you wherever you go.
[52:56.670 --> 52:57.270]  Yeah, that's true.
[52:57.410 --> 52:57.830]  That is true.
[52:58.090 --> 52:58.390]  All right.
[52:58.470 --> 52:59.230]  Thanks for the info.
[52:59.690 --> 53:00.330]  All right, Emmanuel.
[53:00.710 --> 53:01.110]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[53:01.590 --> 53:19.750]  I just want to point out that if you put your easy pass in a small metal box or wrap it in tinfoil, except for when you're just about to go through a toll gate, then you're not going to get spied on by being pinged without your permission.
[53:19.990 --> 53:20.510]  That is true.
[53:20.510 --> 53:35.670]  But at the same time, by being pinged and by having your whereabouts monitored, you're also helping your fellow drivers by telling them how long it's going to take them to get to their location, because that's what all that information is based on, is how long people are taking to get from point A to point B.
[53:36.450 --> 53:39.370]  True, but you don't have to necessarily be part of the data set.
[53:39.370 --> 53:44.010]  Well, by not participating, you're hurting the community, and you'll be condemned by the community.
[53:44.490 --> 53:44.850]  Okay.
[53:45.270 --> 53:45.630]  Go ahead.
[53:45.830 --> 53:56.170]  By not participating, you might also be putting out information that maybe you don't want to be put out there, because they'll notice when you become unreachable until you get to wherever you need it again.
[53:56.290 --> 53:59.010]  And maybe they'll flag you and put you on some sort of a watch list.
[53:59.010 --> 54:10.490]  I would just love to be able to hack these systems so that you could, say, get from New York to Albany in like three seconds and just see what their machines do when your E-ZPass transponder suddenly shows up there.
[54:10.750 --> 54:17.410]  Or just maybe have it on the system on the highway for maybe six months or something, something like a New Jersey turnpike.
[54:18.030 --> 54:19.510]  Things like that would be a lot of fun.
[54:19.550 --> 54:30.150]  I would crack a whole bunch of them so that way they all identify themselves with the exact same E-ZPass tag, put them inside of tinfoil bags, and have people strung along the road, taking them out, putting them back in really fast.
[54:30.250 --> 54:33.190]  So you have a vehicle going at like impossible speeds.
[54:33.410 --> 54:36.710]  If we were in Germany, we'd be expected to do things like this, because that's what people do.
[54:36.810 --> 54:40.470]  They have fun and they experiment with technology and nobody gets hurt and everyone has fun.
[54:40.630 --> 54:43.030]  So let's not be afraid to do these things.
[54:43.350 --> 54:45.430]  That's what we're here for, is to play with technology.
[54:45.730 --> 54:49.550]  I'd just like to offer a tip for criminals and unfaithful spouses.
[54:50.570 --> 54:53.830]  If you must drive, pay your tolls in cash.
[54:54.490 --> 54:54.890]  Yeah, okay.
[54:54.930 --> 54:56.090]  That probably does make a bit of sense.
[54:56.390 --> 54:57.390]  Let's take one more phone call.
[54:57.450 --> 54:57.730]  Good evening.
[54:57.850 --> 54:58.490]  You're on Off the Hook.
[54:59.750 --> 55:00.230]  Speak up.
[55:00.250 --> 55:00.890]  Yes, go ahead.
[55:01.170 --> 55:01.670]  Yeah, hi.
[55:01.790 --> 55:02.330]  Good evening.
[55:02.590 --> 55:03.630]  I'm enjoying the show.
[55:04.390 --> 55:05.910]  A two-part question.
[55:06.230 --> 55:09.190]  And first, I tuned in.
[55:09.270 --> 55:22.710]  I hadn't heard your show recently, but I'm wondering, has there been any discussion around Google basically somehow getting control of all our books, okay?
[55:23.290 --> 55:25.190]  Have you tackled that?
[55:25.370 --> 55:35.270]  Well, there is a bit of controversy in the media recently about a settlement with Google and with books.
[55:35.510 --> 55:40.430]  And I know the EFF is dead set against this because it involves a bit of monitoring.
[55:40.430 --> 55:44.910]  You'll be able to see what people are reading, and logs will be kept someplace.
[55:45.210 --> 55:46.710]  And it's also a question of...
[55:46.710 --> 55:47.150]  Go ahead.
[55:47.410 --> 55:53.410]  And the libraries seem to have given up certain rights without Lincoln.
[55:53.550 --> 55:54.890]  It's really amazing.
[55:54.890 --> 55:58.110]  But I'd like to suggest that we get into...
[55:58.110 --> 56:03.970]  If you could have some guests on and get into a real good look at what's going on.
[56:04.090 --> 56:04.230]  Yeah.
[56:04.290 --> 56:05.430]  Because it's all under the radar.
[56:05.430 --> 56:11.930]  And the other part is, what do you guys think of this new search engine?
[56:12.090 --> 56:13.870]  Started out calling itself IxQuick.
[56:14.470 --> 56:18.590]  And you can still reach it through that too, I-X, and then the word quick.
[56:18.750 --> 56:23.930]  And now, because people can't figure out what that is, it's start page also.
[56:23.930 --> 56:27.870]  But it doesn't track your searches.
[56:28.410 --> 56:30.070]  And I'll listen over the air.
[56:30.170 --> 56:30.650]  Thank you.
[56:30.670 --> 56:31.550]  Thanks for your call.
[56:32.350 --> 56:32.890]  Know the answer.
[56:33.090 --> 56:33.790]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[56:33.790 --> 56:36.190]  Yeah, I think her name is Catherine Albright.
[56:36.370 --> 56:44.190]  She's a group of anti-RFID abuse people called spychips.org, I think.
[56:45.210 --> 56:48.550]  She's one of the representatives behind this...
[56:48.550 --> 56:53.730]  IxQuick, I think, is a new search engine that guarantees they will not log any information about you.
[56:53.770 --> 56:55.090]  Of course, you're trusting them to do that.
[56:55.270 --> 56:57.870]  But she is personally certifying that they are not doing that.
[56:59.490 --> 57:05.750]  Regarding her first part of her question, I think we did have a guest on a month or two ago talking just about the Google Books program.
[57:06.050 --> 57:09.470]  So if she goes back through the archives, how long ago was that?
[57:09.510 --> 57:10.230]  About a month or two ago?
[57:10.230 --> 57:10.810]  About a month ago.
[57:10.830 --> 57:12.650]  But I know there have been developments since then.
[57:12.790 --> 57:17.910]  I know the EFF just released a statement saying this settlement should not be agreed to.
[57:18.290 --> 57:22.590]  And, you know, I'd like to talk about this more because it really does deserve to be talked about.
[57:22.870 --> 57:24.530]  But unfortunately, we're out of time now.
[57:25.330 --> 57:27.870]  So we'll have to do this in a future week.
[57:28.770 --> 57:32.430]  Again, write to us, OTH at 2600.com.
[57:32.910 --> 57:37.030]  And, oh, look, we're going to go out with another computer-related song.
[57:37.190 --> 57:40.850]  And thanks, everybody, for sending in suggestions of computer-related songs.
[57:41.390 --> 57:42.790]  OTH at 2600.com.
[57:42.890 --> 57:43.950]  We're doing it for the next year or so.
[57:44.910 --> 57:46.150]  And this is ancient.
[57:46.290 --> 57:47.530]  This is something I haven't heard for a while.
[57:47.530 --> 57:55.930]  Now, stay tuned to WBAI New York for the Obama speech on health care coming up on the top of the hour, special Pacifica coverage.
[57:56.270 --> 57:58.010]  Personal Computer Show will not be on this week.
[57:58.070 --> 57:59.070]  We'll be back again next week.
[57:59.190 --> 57:59.930]  We'll see you then, too.
[58:00.010 --> 58:00.210]  Good night.
[58:57.230 --> 59:02.330]  We'll see you then, too.
[01:01:03.130 --> 01:01:10.350]  This is a special presentation of Pacifica Radio's live coverage of President Barack Obama's address to a joint session of Congress.
[01:01:10.630 --> 01:01:13.050]  The topic of the day, health care.
[01:01:13.350 --> 01:01:17.490]  Tonight could be a pivotal moment in Obama's campaign for health care reform.