[00:02.700 --> 00:03.180]  Hi.
[00:03.460 --> 00:08.140]  And so you know, the WBAI Fall Membership Drive begins Wednesday, October 5th.
[00:08.320 --> 00:11.820]  We are preparing new programs to educate, entertain, and enlighten.
[00:11.980 --> 00:14.800]  Please tune in and support your radio station during the drive.
[00:15.060 --> 00:17.840]  Also, you may come down to the station and help with the pledge phones.
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[00:32.100 --> 00:34.120]  212-209-2800.
[00:34.400 --> 00:38.920]  Call to register entry into the building at 120 Wall Street, the 10th floor.
[00:39.080 --> 00:41.400]  We will be waiting for you with gratitude and thanks.
[00:45.410 --> 00:46.290]  There's a reason.
[00:46.430 --> 00:47.050]  There's a reason.
[00:47.170 --> 00:48.310]  There's a reason for this.
[00:48.450 --> 00:50.370]  There's a reason education sucks.
[00:50.530 --> 00:54.290]  It's the same reason that it will never, ever, ever be fixed.
[00:54.530 --> 00:55.710]  It's never going to get any better.
[00:55.910 --> 00:56.890]  Don't look for it.
[00:57.150 --> 00:58.370]  Be happy with what you got.
[00:58.690 --> 01:01.910]  Because the owners of this country don't want that.
[01:02.150 --> 01:04.110]  I'm talking about the real owners now.
[01:04.230 --> 01:10.170]  The real owners, the big, wealthy businesses that control things and make all the important decisions.
[01:10.370 --> 01:11.630]  Forget the politicians.
[01:11.970 --> 01:15.270]  The politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice.
[01:15.270 --> 01:16.450]  You don't.
[01:16.830 --> 01:18.110]  You have no choice.
[01:18.310 --> 01:19.330]  You have owners.
[01:19.590 --> 01:20.690]  They own you.
[01:21.070 --> 01:22.370]  They own everything.
[01:22.790 --> 01:24.330]  They own all the important land.
[01:24.690 --> 01:26.430]  They own and control the corporations.
[01:26.710 --> 01:30.030]  They've long since bought and paid for the Senate, the Congress, the state houses, the city halls.
[01:30.110 --> 01:31.670]  They've got the judges in their back pockets.
[01:31.670 --> 01:33.570]  And they own all the big media companies.
[01:33.630 --> 01:36.770]  So they control just about all of the news and information you get to hear.
[01:36.930 --> 01:38.550]  They got you by the balls.
[01:38.850 --> 01:42.030]  They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying.
[01:42.770 --> 01:45.510]  Lobbying to get what they want.
[01:46.030 --> 01:47.710]  Well, we know what they want.
[01:47.830 --> 01:50.330]  They want more for themselves and less for everybody else.
[01:50.470 --> 01:52.070]  But I'll tell you what they don't want.
[01:52.070 --> 01:55.850]  They don't want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking.
[01:55.990 --> 01:59.790]  They don't want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking.
[01:59.910 --> 02:00.830]  They're not interested in that.
[02:01.010 --> 02:02.070]  That doesn't help them.
[02:02.270 --> 02:03.790]  That's against their interest.
[02:04.330 --> 02:04.730]  That's right.
[02:06.830 --> 02:07.470]  WBAI.
[02:07.790 --> 02:08.710]  Wall Street.
[02:09.210 --> 02:09.350]  WBAI.
[02:09.350 --> 02:09.550]  Wall Street.
[02:21.030 --> 02:22.970]  The telephone keeps ringing.
[02:23.430 --> 02:25.490]  So I ripped it off the wall.
[02:26.470 --> 02:28.490]  I cut myself while shaving.
[02:29.090 --> 02:31.010]  Now I can't make a call.
[02:31.670 --> 02:33.830]  We couldn't get much worse.
[02:36.570 --> 02:39.290]  Bum-dilly-bum for the best, expect the worst.
[02:39.870 --> 02:41.790]  I hope that's understood.
[02:42.010 --> 02:42.770]  Bum-dilly-bum!
[03:27.660 --> 03:28.780]  And good evening, everybody.
[03:28.820 --> 03:29.760]  The program is off the hook.
[03:29.760 --> 03:30.880]  Emmanuel Goldstein here with you.
[03:30.980 --> 03:33.940]  Very special two-hour edition of the program tonight.
[03:34.360 --> 03:36.080]  Joined tonight by Mike.
[03:36.280 --> 03:36.600]  Hello.
[03:36.940 --> 03:37.220]  Kyle.
[03:38.020 --> 03:38.380]  Hi there.
[03:38.860 --> 03:39.400]  Voltaire.
[03:39.620 --> 03:39.820]  Hey.
[03:40.000 --> 03:40.260]  Jim.
[03:40.540 --> 03:40.720]  Hello.
[03:41.060 --> 03:41.480]  Bernie S.
[03:41.600 --> 03:42.360]  down in Philadelphia.
[03:43.300 --> 03:44.320]  Greetings from Philadelphia.
[03:44.840 --> 03:59.240]  And before we actually get things underway tonight with a series of special guests and things like that, we do have a rather urgent message that we've been asked rather fervently to send out to the masses.
[03:59.740 --> 04:01.080]  So please listen to this.
[04:01.160 --> 04:02.380]  We'll be right back.
[04:21.910 --> 04:24.390]  Greetings, institutions of the media.
[04:24.670 --> 04:25.590]  We are anonymous.
[04:26.050 --> 04:29.590]  The events transpiring within Wall Street have caught our eye.
[04:29.830 --> 04:34.950]  It seems that the government and federal agencies enjoy enforcing the law a little too much.
[04:34.950 --> 04:41.150]  They instant unjust laws as mindless automatons, blindly following orders with soulless precision.
[04:41.390 --> 04:51.350]  We witness the government enforcing the laws that punish the 99%, while allowing the 1% to escape justice, unharmed, for their crimes against the people.
[04:51.350 --> 04:57.850]  We have observed this same government failing to enforce even the minimal legal restraints of Wall Street's abuses.
[04:58.090 --> 05:05.530]  This government who has willingly ignored the greed at Wall Street has even bailed out the perpetrators that have caused our crisis.
[05:05.810 --> 05:10.290]  We will not stand by, and watch the system take over our way of life.
[05:10.410 --> 05:13.710]  We the people shall stand against the government's inaction.
[05:14.150 --> 05:18.110]  We the people will not be witnesses to your corruption and ill-gotten profits.
[05:18.390 --> 05:20.530]  We will not labor for your leisure.
[05:20.530 --> 05:22.930]  We will not assist you in any way.
[05:23.130 --> 05:27.710]  This is why we choose to declare our war against the New York Stock Exchange.
[05:28.050 --> 05:33.990]  We can no longer stay silent, as the population is being taken advantage of for the sake of profit.
[05:34.270 --> 05:37.390]  We will show the world that we are true to our word.
[05:37.730 --> 05:41.510]  On October 10th, NYSE shall be erased from the Internet.
[05:41.810 --> 05:46.210]  On October 10th, expect a day that shall never, ever, be forgot.
[05:46.210 --> 05:48.530]  Vox Populi, Vox Anon.
[05:48.750 --> 05:51.230]  The voice of the people is the voice of Anonymous.
[05:51.590 --> 05:52.570]  We are legion.
[05:52.790 --> 05:54.390]  We are the 99%.
[05:54.390 --> 05:55.990]  We do not forgive.
[05:56.330 --> 05:57.450]  We do not forget.
[05:58.070 --> 05:59.610]  Wall Street, expect us.
[06:02.590 --> 06:04.310]  Okay, can we have control of the transmitter back?
[06:04.350 --> 06:04.850]  Okay, good, good.
[06:04.910 --> 06:05.370]  We got it back.
[06:06.330 --> 06:11.050]  Yeah, they come in here occasionally and somehow the signal is overpowered by that message.
[06:12.130 --> 06:12.970]  Anonymous, wow.
[06:12.970 --> 06:16.530]  Well, so that's, well, supposedly the official message.
[06:16.690 --> 06:17.570]  But then again, it's anonymous.
[06:17.570 --> 06:19.150]  So you don't know what's official and what's not official.
[06:19.250 --> 06:21.470]  There's another message out there saying that's not the official message.
[06:21.510 --> 06:22.050]  Here's another one.
[06:23.130 --> 06:24.310]  What do you guys think of this?
[06:25.750 --> 06:27.070]  You're all shaking in terror.
[06:27.290 --> 06:28.210]  You can speak freely.
[06:28.270 --> 06:28.570]  Go ahead.
[06:28.830 --> 06:29.750]  Just don't say the wrong thing.
[06:29.830 --> 06:30.170]  Go ahead, Kyle.
[06:31.030 --> 06:32.090]  It's very interesting.
[06:33.270 --> 06:44.470]  The alternate story is that one of these messages, there were two that were put out and then I saw a transcript in a news article of another message where they're claiming basically that other messages are imposters.
[06:45.050 --> 06:51.010]  So this call for erasing New York Stock Exchange from the internet is a fake.
[06:51.510 --> 07:01.190]  There's a fake anonymous now and it's perpetrated by cyber crime units and the government to run their good name through the mud or something.
[07:01.450 --> 07:06.310]  But whatever, anonymous has spoken and who knows exactly how it'll go down.
[07:06.310 --> 07:21.130]  Another interesting point I wanted to raise about that is that it won't necessarily affect trading because the New York Stock Exchange's public website is supposedly separate from any of the trading systems.
[07:21.130 --> 07:23.910]  Those are in a data center in Jersey, I believe.
[07:24.030 --> 07:25.330]  The website is separate from trading.
[07:25.530 --> 07:25.650]  Yes.
[07:25.650 --> 07:26.990]  Well, that's smart, I guess.
[07:27.670 --> 07:29.130]  Yeah, until Anans gets into that.
[07:29.130 --> 07:30.310]  They said they're going to wipe them off.
[07:31.190 --> 07:31.530]  What exactly?
[07:31.990 --> 07:34.710]  They're going to erase the New York Stock Exchange from the internet.
[07:35.030 --> 07:35.670]  From the internet.
[07:35.670 --> 07:36.150]  Yeah.
[07:36.530 --> 07:37.130]  That's interesting.
[07:38.010 --> 07:43.010]  I think, basically, that means that there won't be an online presence.
[07:43.150 --> 07:44.030]  But, you know, the other thing...
[07:44.030 --> 07:44.290]  Oh, go ahead.
[07:44.490 --> 07:44.710]  Oh, no.
[07:44.750 --> 07:46.790]  I was just going to say, it might be refreshing, you know, start over.
[07:46.970 --> 07:47.450]  I don't know.
[07:47.510 --> 07:49.090]  I don't know exactly how it's going to play out.
[07:49.310 --> 07:55.030]  I don't know if they realize this or if this is the reason this date was chosen, but that's a holiday, Columbus Day.
[07:55.330 --> 07:56.150]  It's sort of a holiday.
[07:56.290 --> 07:59.410]  It's not a holiday for the stock exchange, but it is a holiday for the banks.
[07:59.410 --> 08:02.070]  And it's very unusual when you have the stock market open and the banks closed.
[08:02.330 --> 08:08.110]  So I don't know if that makes it easier to confuse people or to launch some kind of attack or something like that.
[08:08.170 --> 08:14.190]  Or it could just be, the whole thing could just be a way to get people concerned and talking about it.
[08:14.410 --> 08:15.070]  Who knows?
[08:15.570 --> 08:17.950]  Let's not detract from what's going on in Wall Street, actually.
[08:19.410 --> 08:20.370]  I've been down there.
[08:20.430 --> 08:21.130]  You've been down there.
[08:21.370 --> 08:23.130]  Anyone else in here down there?
[08:23.210 --> 08:23.930]  Volta, you've been down there?
[08:24.050 --> 08:24.130]  Yeah.
[08:24.310 --> 08:24.890]  What are your impressions?
[08:25.650 --> 08:26.250]  I love it.
[08:26.450 --> 08:26.830]  You love it?
[08:26.910 --> 08:27.110]  Okay.
[08:27.390 --> 08:28.030]  Well, good.
[08:28.250 --> 08:30.950]  Maybe we'll go after the show then and hang out again like we did last week.
[08:31.330 --> 08:33.710]  I got to say, though, we just went by there before the show.
[08:33.850 --> 08:34.910]  It's gotten so much bigger.
[08:35.030 --> 08:36.590]  Of course, today the unions joined in.
[08:36.870 --> 08:37.550]  And the students.
[08:37.810 --> 08:38.790]  Yeah, and students.
[08:40.010 --> 08:45.050]  And it's incredible because I actually, I was trying to maneuver around in a car.
[08:45.570 --> 08:48.050]  And that was not a wise thing to do, obviously.
[08:48.250 --> 08:49.570]  But it looked like the road was open.
[08:49.570 --> 08:55.030]  And the road was open, but the cops couldn't figure out how to make traffic on Maiden Lane cross Broadway.
[08:55.210 --> 08:57.850]  They had all the buses going down Broadway, but they were blocking that.
[08:58.170 --> 08:59.470]  We looked over at what they were doing.
[08:59.550 --> 09:00.710]  They had no idea what they were doing.
[09:00.790 --> 09:04.150]  It took actual citizens going out directing traffic to fix it.
[09:04.430 --> 09:07.230]  The cops did not have any idea how to handle the situation.
[09:07.230 --> 09:08.870]  Now, Bernie, you're down in Philadelphia.
[09:08.870 --> 09:11.710]  What kind of response have you been seeing?
[09:12.650 --> 09:19.790]  Well, as many of our listeners are aware, this movement is spreading to other cities, including Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
[09:20.750 --> 09:32.250]  And there was a big meeting last night here with, I believe, 800 or so people attending, planning what they're going to be doing.
[09:32.250 --> 09:42.530]  And they will be camping in and settling out at City Hall, the seat of our city government, at Broad and Market Streets.
[09:42.890 --> 09:45.590]  So this is going to be pretty interesting to see what happens.
[09:46.170 --> 09:53.190]  Philadelphia police have a reputation for being rather ham-fisted and strong-armed.
[09:53.190 --> 09:56.030]  No, no, wait, wait, Bernie, that's our cops have that reputation.
[09:56.790 --> 09:59.570]  Surely two cities can't have that same...
[10:01.370 --> 10:07.810]  Well, I guess they can fight it out, who's the most ham-fisted and strong-armed police department.
[10:07.830 --> 10:11.310]  Oh, I'd pay to see that, the two police departments fighting it out to see who's...
[10:11.310 --> 10:13.670]  We'll put them both in a cage and see what happens.
[10:14.030 --> 10:17.610]  Well, the different police departments are strong-armed in different ways.
[10:17.610 --> 10:19.910]  It might be interesting to make those sorts of comparisons.
[10:19.910 --> 10:21.350]  They each have their strengths, that's true.
[10:22.330 --> 10:28.550]  NYPD, they specialize in leading people into streets and trapping them and then arresting them.
[10:28.650 --> 10:38.470]  And I think Philadelphia, they sort of specialize on having other police departments from different cities come in and do the dirty work and then leave and make it seem like they were never there.
[10:39.210 --> 10:49.830]  Well, sort of, yeah, because there's a city ordinance, actually, it's been on the books for quite a few years, prohibiting Philadelphia police officers from engaging in political surveillance.
[10:49.830 --> 11:17.970]  But, of course, during the RNC 2000, the Republican National Convention 2000 protests here in Philadelphia, when the Republican Convention was here in the city of Brotherly Love, the Philadelphia police conveniently circumvented the law and enlisted police officers from outlying communities and also Pennsylvania state police to perform their political surveillance and arrested hundreds of people,
[11:18.610 --> 11:26.230]  almost all of whom those cases ended up being really a whole lot of nothing and a lot of cases were just dropped altogether.
[11:26.790 --> 11:31.350]  But it took a lot of years for these cases to wind down into nothing.
[11:31.350 --> 11:36.290]  So that's what I expect something similar to happen here.
[11:36.530 --> 11:37.430]  Now, it's interesting.
[11:37.790 --> 11:43.550]  I'd like to just address this for a moment because a lot of people ask, well, OK, what's what's this all about?
[11:43.550 --> 11:46.470]  These guys, they don't have any any cohesive demands.
[11:46.470 --> 11:47.950]  They seem so disorganized.
[11:48.050 --> 11:49.330]  They're from all over the place.
[11:49.650 --> 12:02.290]  And I think that's one of the one of the advantages of the state that things are in right now is that there are so many people down there and they haven't yet completely focused on exactly what it is they want.
[12:02.410 --> 12:04.170]  They just know that there is a big problem.
[12:04.330 --> 12:05.290]  They agree on that.
[12:05.970 --> 12:12.110]  And what better time to go down and become a part of it and help steer the ship and figure out just what it is that needs to be done.
[12:12.210 --> 12:25.470]  Right now, it's an expressive type of demonstration that people are very unhappy with the way things are going, people losing their homes, not having health insurance, the many, many things that are going wrong with society right now.
[12:25.470 --> 12:29.850]  And at least a different perspective than what we always hear about in the mass media.
[12:30.090 --> 12:34.070]  Now, the media is something that I've I've seen a lot of interesting changes in the last week.
[12:34.210 --> 12:35.170]  There's definitely more attention.
[12:35.630 --> 12:37.210]  Last week, we were talking about how there was no coverage.
[12:37.970 --> 12:41.430]  And now there is a lot of coverage, albeit not the best coverage.
[12:42.550 --> 12:47.290]  Kyle, we were watching Russia Today, of all things, yesterday, and it was really weird because they had the best coverage of anybody.
[12:47.490 --> 12:49.510]  Russia Today covering New York City protests.
[12:49.510 --> 12:56.270]  And it's funny because people ask, well, do they cover their own protest as fairly as they cover New York City protests?
[12:56.350 --> 12:57.130]  Of course they don't.
[12:57.270 --> 12:57.970]  Of course they don't.
[12:58.030 --> 13:00.530]  But the lesson here is that we don't either.
[13:00.530 --> 13:02.510]  We don't cover our own protest fairly.
[13:02.590 --> 13:06.830]  It takes watching a Russian news agency to find out what's really going on.
[13:06.970 --> 13:10.330]  Well, I mean, yeah, the New York Times often has very good coverage of dissent in Russia.
[13:11.030 --> 13:15.190]  And, you know, someone's got to do it and someone's got to cover dissent in New York.
[13:15.390 --> 13:18.110]  It would just be perhaps nice if they would switch beats.
[13:18.110 --> 13:18.890]  Wouldn't that be nice?
[13:19.410 --> 13:20.650]  Is there anyone we can give...
[13:20.650 --> 13:21.410]  One second, Bernie.
[13:21.670 --> 13:27.410]  Anyone we can give positive marks to, local media-wise or national media-wise?
[13:27.570 --> 13:27.710]  Anyone?
[13:27.890 --> 13:30.950]  Apart from BAI, we know we've been doing a pretty good job, I think.
[13:31.410 --> 13:32.090]  Democracy now?
[13:32.350 --> 13:33.930]  Well, that's a show, but...
[13:33.930 --> 13:34.330]  Okay, yeah.
[13:34.530 --> 13:34.930]  Pacifica.
[13:35.450 --> 13:36.050]  So there you go.
[13:36.110 --> 13:37.170]  Same place, basically.
[13:37.710 --> 13:38.390]  Anyone else?
[13:38.570 --> 13:38.830]  Bernie?
[13:39.650 --> 13:39.950]  No?
[13:40.710 --> 13:41.370]  NPR, maybe?
[13:41.750 --> 13:42.530]  Al Jazeera.
[13:42.750 --> 13:43.350]  Al Jazeera.
[13:43.510 --> 13:43.610]  Okay.
[13:43.790 --> 13:47.350]  I haven't really seen much of their coverage, but I believe they're probably doing okay.
[13:47.350 --> 13:48.690]  We're talking about their radio coverage.
[13:48.930 --> 13:49.530]  Okay, okay.
[13:49.530 --> 13:51.590]  Which comes on right before this program.
[13:51.730 --> 13:53.350]  Unfortunately, I didn't hear it this week.
[13:54.210 --> 13:54.790]  So, yeah.
[13:54.930 --> 14:01.790]  And the other thing, and this will be pretty much the last thing we say on this subject, a lot of people like to make fun of the demonstrators.
[14:01.890 --> 14:04.050]  They like to say, oh, this is a bunch of hippies down there.
[14:04.190 --> 14:05.410]  And yet, you know, you can laugh.
[14:05.410 --> 14:08.290]  You can laugh at all sorts of things that go on down there.
[14:08.430 --> 14:16.970]  It's easy to laugh at people who are somewhat different and maybe deal with issues in a different way.
[14:17.010 --> 14:19.050]  But I think that's also an opportunity to learn.
[14:19.250 --> 14:33.690]  You know, we were down there the other day, about a week ago, and we noticed that they have this amplification system, which is actually quite ingenious, where they're forbidden from having PA systems or any kind of electrical amplification whatsoever.
[14:34.090 --> 14:37.670]  So, obviously, if you stand up and speak, nobody can hear you or very few people can.
[14:37.830 --> 14:45.370]  So what they do is they have everybody around that person repeat what they say sentence by sentence so the entire park can hear what is being said.
[14:45.370 --> 14:48.410]  And it sounds really kind of crazy, but it works.
[14:48.410 --> 14:50.310]  And it's a very smart thing to do.
[14:50.530 --> 14:51.370]  There are other things.
[14:51.790 --> 14:52.650]  What do you call that?
[14:52.710 --> 14:54.970]  When people don't clap their hands, they wave their fingers instead.
[14:55.190 --> 14:56.170]  You're talking about twinkling?
[14:56.290 --> 14:57.070]  Twinkling, okay.
[14:57.070 --> 14:59.470]  Yeah, you know, I get a good laugh out of that.
[14:59.470 --> 15:00.090]  It's funny.
[15:00.530 --> 15:03.130]  But, you know, so is clapping your hands.
[15:03.130 --> 15:04.650]  When you think about that, that's funny, too.
[15:05.010 --> 15:07.010]  So let's just have an open mind about this.
[15:07.050 --> 15:09.830]  And also, people who are involved, laugh at yourselves, too.
[15:10.130 --> 15:12.190]  You know, we're all ridiculous in one way or another.
[15:12.430 --> 15:15.850]  The thing is, go down there, join, make it stronger, make it better.
[15:16.150 --> 15:20.110]  If you agree with some aspects of it, but not others, focus on the aspects you do agree with.
[15:20.210 --> 15:23.750]  And you might actually have some power that you don't think that you have.
[15:24.370 --> 15:24.730]  Emmanuel?
[15:24.910 --> 15:25.310]  Yes, go ahead, Bernie.
[15:25.310 --> 15:34.050]  I just wanted to stress the importance to our listeners of diversifying your media sources when stuff like this happens.
[15:34.050 --> 15:54.910]  Because I learned a valuable lesson way back about three decades ago when I was an avid shortwave listener and listening to both the BBC and Radio Argentine, both two different state media broadcast outlets, who were both covering the Falkland Islands War,
[15:54.910 --> 15:59.550]  where Argentina was defending their islands against Britain.
[15:59.550 --> 16:04.470]  And it was very interesting coverage from two very different perspectives.
[16:04.810 --> 16:14.470]  So it's really important that you look to foreign media outlets for coverage about this, because you're not going to get a lot of unbiased...
[16:14.470 --> 16:19.490]  Well, you're not going to get... you're just not going to get the kind of coverage you want, probably, from just domestic media outlets.
[16:19.490 --> 16:21.130]  I noticed you picked a side in that war, though.
[16:22.410 --> 16:23.990]  Well, they were defending their islands.
[16:24.490 --> 16:25.890]  Well, not from the British perspective.
[16:25.890 --> 16:28.490]  I'm not going to... I'm just saying there were two sides to the issue.
[16:28.610 --> 16:32.650]  But as there are with any issue, we just have to keep that in mind.
[16:32.650 --> 16:36.790]  Okay, so we're obviously... I'd love to talk about this for the entire two hours that we're on tonight.
[16:36.950 --> 16:41.630]  But this is a fundraising program, and we're going to try and tie things in as much as we possibly can.
[16:42.110 --> 16:46.230]  How much we're able to do that depends on our listeners and how much support we're able to get.
[16:46.310 --> 16:48.330]  We're supposed to raise $5,000 in the next two hours.
[16:48.770 --> 16:50.490]  Let's see if we can get anywhere close to that.
[16:50.550 --> 16:51.670]  It would be amazing if we could.
[16:51.770 --> 16:56.970]  Now, one thing that I find really cool is photography.
[16:57.270 --> 16:59.230]  And Kyle, you're a professional photographer.
[16:59.470 --> 16:59.710]  Yes.
[16:59.710 --> 17:05.770]  You have your pictures out in the Hacker Calendar, which is now out in various places.
[17:05.770 --> 17:08.970]  Go to thehackercalendar.com to see some samples of that.
[17:09.090 --> 17:13.810]  But you've been taking some photos down at the demonstrations at Wall Street.
[17:14.370 --> 17:18.730]  And what we're doing tonight, we're going to have a bunch of different things.
[17:18.750 --> 17:27.630]  But for every pledge above $100, Kyle will be donating a picture, an autographed picture, 11 by 17, is it?
[17:27.750 --> 17:28.630]  11 by 17, yeah.
[17:28.630 --> 17:30.190]  Tell us something about the shot.
[17:30.490 --> 17:32.730]  Yeah, so I snapped one shot.
[17:32.870 --> 17:48.030]  I had mentioned this last week, how when we drove by and looked initially, that everybody's posters were laid out and it looked a bit like an art installation, you know, because people would walk by and just take it in and kind of absorb like what each of the signs,
[17:48.210 --> 17:49.110]  what their message was.
[17:49.330 --> 17:52.230]  And this is when they weren't actively doing a march or anything like that.
[17:52.230 --> 17:55.270]  So I went back and I captured a bit of this.
[17:56.030 --> 18:04.090]  It's a nighttime shot of a huge part of the park with all of these posters laid out edge to edge.
[18:04.090 --> 18:12.210]  Behind it, you can see in the darkness, a huge group of people actually in a general assembly meeting.
[18:12.490 --> 18:20.250]  And then there's a bit of the street lit sidewalk with the fence and a little police officer way in the background.
[18:20.250 --> 18:28.070]  And in the mid-ground, there's a gentleman sort of with his smartphone and he's just looking at all of these posters.
[18:28.250 --> 18:29.250]  It's an interesting juxtaposition.
[18:29.950 --> 18:34.510]  So it's sort of light and it's got some darkness of all the people in the background with the general assembly.
[18:34.650 --> 18:36.510]  So it's a really nice balanced shot.
[18:36.670 --> 18:39.830]  And so I'd like to offer it for those pledges.
[18:40.850 --> 18:44.210]  It's basically going to be an 11 by 17 archival digital print.
[18:44.390 --> 18:45.950]  And I'll number it and sign it for people.
[18:46.150 --> 18:49.530]  And it'll come to you in a protected package so that it's not...
[18:49.530 --> 18:49.770]  Yeah, we'll roll it up.
[18:49.910 --> 18:52.230]  We'll figure out a way to get it to you so it's undamaged.
[18:52.390 --> 18:55.810]  And you can have it to kind of remember the scene.
[18:55.810 --> 19:02.210]  Because I remember we also spoke last week about how we really were interested in maybe getting a little bit more support services down there.
[19:03.650 --> 19:04.010]  Sanitation.
[19:04.270 --> 19:05.210]  They want to keep things clean.
[19:05.350 --> 19:07.030]  They want to keep things organized.
[19:07.030 --> 19:16.890]  And I was saying, you know, if anybody can do anything, if, you know, the Verizon guys can put out an extra cone or two, whatever they can in their small ways to kind of show a little bit of resistance, especially with the transit workers.
[19:17.050 --> 19:20.090]  Well, now we're seeing a lot of that and we can't even get into the area.
[19:21.910 --> 19:23.010]  It's really, really difficult.
[19:23.270 --> 19:27.870]  They've got half the street fenced off for the marches going on right now.
[19:28.030 --> 19:28.690]  At this moment.
[19:28.890 --> 19:34.150]  And I really couldn't even get a chance to get up to the actual park on the way here.
[19:34.310 --> 19:35.610]  So the scene is much different.
[19:35.610 --> 19:36.770]  You're seeing unions there.
[19:37.050 --> 19:48.390]  A lot of people are really seeing the impact and the power of raising your voice and sort of addressing these issues in a unified way.
[19:48.590 --> 19:51.150]  So this is a piece of history that Kyle's offering here.
[19:51.390 --> 19:55.010]  212-209-2950 for every pledge $100 or more.
[19:55.710 --> 20:01.610]  And if you just want the picture and nothing else, then call now, 212-209-2950, and say that.
[20:01.710 --> 20:03.730]  And we'll make sure that comes your way.
[20:04.130 --> 20:12.930]  But also, in addition, for the things that we offer later on in the program, we'll have the picture for any pledge $100 or above in addition to other premiums.
[20:12.930 --> 20:13.230]  Yes, Mike?
[20:13.230 --> 20:14.550]  That's totally not right.
[20:14.670 --> 20:21.630]  In addition to the print and the other premiums we'll discuss later, you also get to ensure the continuation of WBAI and of this radio program.
[20:21.630 --> 20:22.630]  Oh, did I neglect to mention that?
[20:22.710 --> 20:23.030]  Yeah, okay.
[20:23.170 --> 20:23.890]  That's true, too.
[20:23.970 --> 20:33.930]  In fact, that's why we do this so that the radio station continues to move on and do the things it's doing and cover this story, which nobody else is covering.
[20:33.930 --> 20:43.270]  You tune into WBAI and you hear this, no matter what time of day or night somebody is talking about, somebody has a different perspective, and that's what really matters.
[20:43.450 --> 20:45.750]  That's what a community radio station should be all about.
[20:46.070 --> 20:48.930]  We've been on Wall Street now for well over 10 years.
[20:48.950 --> 20:50.170]  This is where our home is.
[20:50.690 --> 20:56.730]  We occupy Wall Street in a very different type of a way, but we are tied into these demonstrations.
[20:57.690 --> 21:05.770]  And we've broadcast information basically of interest to people that realize things aren't quite right out there.
[21:05.890 --> 21:08.430]  We've been doing that ever since we went on the air back in 1960.
[21:09.090 --> 21:15.930]  So, yeah, it's ironic that we're on Wall Street, but it's also a very good thing that we're on Wall Street, especially now.
[21:16.290 --> 21:17.830]  212-209-2950.
[21:18.310 --> 21:22.190]  But let's move on to our special guest for today.
[21:22.930 --> 21:26.370]  We have actually three special guests in the studio right now.
[21:26.590 --> 21:27.890]  We have Farah McCann.
[21:28.590 --> 21:29.210]  Did I say that right?
[21:29.390 --> 21:29.510]  Yeah.
[21:29.750 --> 21:30.050]  Okay, good.
[21:30.390 --> 21:31.030]  Matt Griffin.
[21:31.250 --> 21:32.270]  I'm pretty sure I can say that right.
[21:32.370 --> 21:32.490]  Okay.
[21:32.750 --> 21:34.170]  And Matt Richardson.
[21:34.830 --> 21:34.930]  Yep.
[21:35.070 --> 21:35.250]  Okay.
[21:35.370 --> 21:35.690]  Two Mats.
[21:35.750 --> 21:35.850]  Good.
[21:35.970 --> 21:36.150]  Okay.
[21:36.550 --> 21:42.410]  So, Farah, Matt, and Matt, you guys are with something known as the MakerBot.
[21:42.650 --> 21:45.790]  Who would like to tell us what a MakerBot is, what that's all about?
[21:45.790 --> 21:52.030]  We'll also say that Matt Richardson is a guest of ours from MakeLive.
[21:52.430 --> 21:52.810]  Okay.
[21:53.090 --> 21:53.810]  What's MakeLive?
[21:54.710 --> 21:57.950]  MakeLive is Make Magazine's live streaming DIY show.
[21:58.090 --> 21:58.750]  It's a show and tell.
[21:58.870 --> 22:00.010]  We show people how to make stuff.
[22:00.170 --> 22:05.150]  We have a theme every show, every two weeks, all about making DIY.
[22:05.630 --> 22:08.150]  Last time we covered MakerBot and 3D printing in general.
[22:08.330 --> 22:08.490]  Okay.
[22:08.830 --> 22:10.010]  So, 3D printing.
[22:10.190 --> 22:12.170]  Tell us something about what 3D printing is all about.
[22:12.170 --> 22:14.110]  Well, yeah.
[22:14.230 --> 22:18.450]  So, Farah and I are here from MakerBot, and we provide 3D printers.
[22:18.450 --> 22:20.130]  They're your provisions for the future.
[22:20.950 --> 22:26.510]  So, 3D printing is not like printing things you need 3D glasses to understand.
[22:26.930 --> 22:32.110]  It's actually creating solid objects using digital files.
[22:32.890 --> 22:34.410]  So, this is a...
[22:34.410 --> 22:35.390]  It sounds like something out of Star Trek.
[22:35.630 --> 22:38.370]  You mean, just create something physical.
[22:38.810 --> 22:39.130]  Yeah.
[22:39.790 --> 22:40.430]  The replicator?
[22:40.570 --> 22:41.290]  We have that.
[22:41.750 --> 22:42.070]  Okay.
[22:42.470 --> 22:43.550]  This is not science fiction.
[22:43.630 --> 22:44.030]  This is real.
[22:44.170 --> 22:44.290]  Okay.
[22:44.450 --> 22:45.090]  Tell us...
[22:45.090 --> 22:48.590]  Give us an example of what kinds of things you can make with a 3D printer.
[22:48.890 --> 22:55.930]  A great example is some folks recently were looking for a toy for their kids, and they liked Barrel of Monkeys, but they thought it wasn't quite cool enough.
[22:56.250 --> 23:00.150]  So, they went out and they designed an octopus that hooked together like the Barrel of Monkey does.
[23:00.630 --> 23:01.770]  And they just said, hey, you know what?
[23:01.770 --> 23:02.530]  Let's just design this.
[23:02.570 --> 23:03.030]  Let's make this.
[23:03.070 --> 23:03.810]  Let's make it for our kids.
[23:03.810 --> 23:05.890]  And they put out the...
[23:05.890 --> 23:06.370]  What is it?
[23:06.410 --> 23:07.130]  Pile of octopus?
[23:07.430 --> 23:13.890]  And it's basically Barrel of Monkeys, but it's just been redesigned by someone who, you know, wanted a unique toy that nobody else in the world had.
[23:14.870 --> 23:15.270]  Wow.
[23:15.830 --> 23:15.930]  Yeah.
[23:16.050 --> 23:16.870]  Barrel of octopi.
[23:17.070 --> 23:19.070]  And they connect from all the sides.
[23:19.170 --> 23:21.430]  So, you can do like a whole wall hanging of them.
[23:21.830 --> 23:22.030]  Yeah.
[23:22.230 --> 23:22.490]  Uh-huh.
[23:22.690 --> 23:24.710]  And how long does it take to print that?
[23:25.230 --> 23:28.070]  A single octopi takes probably about 10 minutes, 15 minutes.
[23:28.310 --> 23:30.810]  You can squeeze several of them together and print several at a time.
[23:30.810 --> 23:34.510]  So, you know, maybe four at a time and 15 minutes for each batch of four.
[23:34.670 --> 23:35.630]  So, it takes a little while.
[23:35.870 --> 23:41.090]  And so, the trick is that essentially it's like a glue gun married to a pen plotter.
[23:41.330 --> 23:49.910]  You're melting a little bit of plastic and you're tracing out each layer, layer by layer, moving up through the form until the physical object is sitting there.
[23:50.150 --> 23:55.490]  So, you have a lot of control over how big you scale it and how dense you make the object.
[23:55.490 --> 24:03.390]  So, you can kind of... you have a lot of control over whether it takes a long time or a little time by making little bitty octopi.
[24:03.710 --> 24:07.170]  Though, actually, apparently, octopi is the...
[24:07.170 --> 24:08.250]  Yeah, isn't it octopodes?
[24:08.490 --> 24:09.250]  Octo... yeah.
[24:09.710 --> 24:10.190]  Podes?
[24:10.410 --> 24:15.930]  So, these are the debates that must be going on well into the night while you're printing objects and making strange things.
[24:16.270 --> 24:16.550]  Yeah.
[24:16.730 --> 24:23.410]  Besides the pearl of octopus, what other kinds of things have people made with MakerBots?
[24:24.330 --> 24:31.970]  Well, one really popular item that constantly people are printing and sort of using is a little bottle opener.
[24:32.230 --> 24:42.690]  And the trick is you put a coin in a little catch and that's what actually catches the lid to lift it off a can or a bottle.
[24:42.850 --> 24:46.850]  But it takes less time to print it than to go to the store and get one.
[24:47.170 --> 24:47.670]  Wow.
[24:47.870 --> 24:50.390]  There's also a great Yoda head that has become really popular lately.
[24:50.390 --> 24:54.370]  Someone got a very high-res scan of Yoda and was like, oh, dudes, I can print this.
[24:54.530 --> 24:57.590]  And suddenly, the count just keeps going up of people who...
[24:57.590 --> 25:01.130]  They kind of want a little Yoda bust, but they would never run by one because that's way too geeky.
[25:01.210 --> 25:03.010]  But it's not too geeky if they print one.
[25:03.150 --> 25:07.030]  So, all you have to do is get a high-res scan of something and you can replicate...
[25:07.030 --> 25:08.230]  This sounds really kind of scary.
[25:08.590 --> 25:10.050]  You can just replicate things with a high-res.
[25:10.150 --> 25:12.490]  I guess if you get a scan of your own head, you can do that.
[25:12.610 --> 25:13.250]  Yeah, exactly.
[25:13.250 --> 25:18.230]  So, did they put Yoda in some kind of scanner and scan him that way?
[25:18.370 --> 25:24.230]  No, the creation of that piece is really interesting because the guy who put it up, he modeled it from scratch.
[25:24.910 --> 25:34.510]  This is not something where he processed other images to generate it or actually had Yoda sitting there and being very patient and being scanned.
[25:34.850 --> 25:37.330]  He did that work using...
[25:37.330 --> 25:41.150]  He's a 3D artist and he created it and now we can physically have it.
[25:41.150 --> 25:46.130]  Okay, well, let's cut to the chase here before we talk more about what you guys are up to and what you've done.
[25:46.570 --> 25:53.670]  What we're offering tonight as part of this special MakerBot feature is what we call the MakerBot package.
[25:54.050 --> 26:00.430]  And you will get an object, some kind of an object that was actually made by a MakerBot.
[26:00.590 --> 26:03.370]  We can't say specifically what it will be.
[26:03.410 --> 26:04.670]  It will be something pretty cool though.
[26:04.810 --> 26:08.710]  You'll actually get a 3D object that was created by this device.
[26:09.330 --> 26:12.570]  In addition to that, you'll get a special MakerBot t-shirt.
[26:13.410 --> 26:14.950]  Do you want to describe the t-shirt at all?
[26:15.170 --> 26:15.850]  Is there anything...
[26:15.850 --> 26:19.810]  Yeah, the t-shirt is a special edition t-shirt we did for MakerFair about a week ago.
[26:19.950 --> 26:20.150]  Okay.
[26:20.370 --> 26:25.590]  We built some little road racers, completely 3D printed all except for the drive train, which is electrical.
[26:26.030 --> 26:27.610]  So little kids could race them around.
[26:27.830 --> 26:30.170]  And as part of this, we made some limited edition t-shirts.
[26:30.670 --> 26:36.470]  And we thought that would be a great thing to offer people is, you know, 2011 only limited edition MakerBot t-shirts.
[26:36.810 --> 26:37.350]  Very cool.
[26:37.510 --> 26:37.630]  Okay.
[26:37.710 --> 26:38.270]  But that's not all.
[26:38.350 --> 26:38.730]  That's not all.
[26:38.790 --> 26:42.370]  You get the 3D object, you get the t-shirt, you also get an Arduino.
[26:42.590 --> 26:43.770]  Now, what in the world is an Arduino?
[26:44.930 --> 26:45.930]  Well, okay.
[26:46.650 --> 26:56.450]  For folks who are, you know, they're curious about electronics, but they've always been intimidated by getting all the little specific pieces, putting them together in a particular order.
[26:56.650 --> 27:10.130]  This is a means of getting right into, like, creating electronic projects that move motors, that have sensors, et cetera, with a lot of, you know, standing on the shoulder of a kit that gets you pretty close there.
[27:10.130 --> 27:19.210]  This is a tool that people are using to learn about electronics, but also just immediately putting into objects that where they want to, you know, add another feature.
[27:19.350 --> 27:24.310]  They want to add, you know, a microphone, they want to add, you know, a bit of movement.
[27:25.510 --> 27:33.270]  You basically have the ability to connect it to your computer and send patches in that will give it the features you need.
[27:33.450 --> 27:35.790]  So basically anyone could figure out how to use this.
[27:35.790 --> 27:36.670]  Yes.
[27:36.850 --> 27:41.890]  And we're including the O'Reilly book introduction to Arduino.
[27:42.250 --> 27:44.010]  So that makes it even easier.
[27:44.150 --> 27:44.710]  A fourth item.
[27:44.870 --> 27:45.070]  Okay.
[27:45.190 --> 27:46.350]  So there's a book on Arduinos.
[27:46.530 --> 27:47.410]  There's an Arduino itself.
[27:47.410 --> 27:50.830]  There's a t-shirt and there's a three-dimensional object created by a MakerBot.
[27:50.950 --> 27:53.550]  If you call now, 212-209-2950.
[27:53.950 --> 27:58.550]  And if you throw in another 25 bucks, you'll get Kyle's picture from Wall Street.
[27:58.890 --> 27:59.650]  11 by 17.
[27:59.950 --> 28:02.630]  So the implication is that that whole package is $75?
[28:02.630 --> 28:04.270]  That whole package is $75, yes.
[28:04.410 --> 28:05.950]  212-209-2950.
[28:05.950 --> 28:07.050]  But you have to call now.
[28:07.190 --> 28:11.190]  The object, the t-shirt, the Arduino, which is, you know, a pretty fancy thing.
[28:11.190 --> 28:11.490]  It is.
[28:11.630 --> 28:12.470]  And the book.
[28:12.670 --> 28:13.230]  And the book.
[28:13.270 --> 28:14.170]  All four things.
[28:14.370 --> 28:16.330]  And the radio station and off the hook.
[28:16.490 --> 28:17.010]  And what's that, Bernie?
[28:18.270 --> 28:18.990]  And WBAI.
[28:19.010 --> 28:19.750]  And WBAI.
[28:19.790 --> 28:20.490]  You get all of that.
[28:20.590 --> 28:22.090]  212-209-2950.
[28:22.090 --> 28:23.550]  But we have no calls on the line now.
[28:23.550 --> 28:26.090]  And we need to fix that.
[28:26.150 --> 28:28.070]  We need to get a lot of people calling in.
[28:28.150 --> 28:32.510]  Because this really is an incredible package that the MakerBot folks have come up with here.
[28:32.810 --> 28:35.490]  And it's something that I think...
[28:35.490 --> 28:37.610]  You don't have to be technical to appreciate this, correct?
[28:38.290 --> 28:41.770]  I mean, what kind of people do you see appreciating this the most?
[28:42.870 --> 28:44.390]  It's used a lot in education.
[28:44.730 --> 28:45.070]  Uh-huh.
[28:45.630 --> 28:48.250]  High schoolers can prototype with it.
[28:48.450 --> 28:49.230]  Even middle schoolers.
[28:49.390 --> 28:55.770]  We were speaking to someone on MakeLive recently who had third graders actually prototyping.
[28:56.430 --> 28:57.370]  They were actually doing 3D.
[28:57.370 --> 28:57.390]  Third graders.
[28:57.690 --> 28:59.630]  Doing a little bit of prototyping.
[28:59.950 --> 29:01.830]  They're doing 3D printing and modeling.
[29:02.110 --> 29:03.390]  Third graders are doing prototyping.
[29:03.570 --> 29:05.890]  You see, folks, it's not something that's out of reach.
[29:05.950 --> 29:09.470]  Although some third graders today really are up there as far as intelligence.
[29:09.470 --> 29:12.570]  But I think it's something that we can all wrap our heads around.
[29:12.730 --> 29:14.370]  We just have to be willing to do that.
[29:14.770 --> 29:20.130]  The Arduino itself, I think, is worth the cost of pledging to the radio station.
[29:20.810 --> 29:24.110]  And you get a book explaining how it works and what that's all about.
[29:24.130 --> 29:24.990]  You get the object.
[29:24.990 --> 29:25.830]  You get a t-shirt.
[29:26.010 --> 29:27.350]  It's a great package.
[29:27.350 --> 29:31.090]  But as Mike and Bernie have been saying, you get the radio station as well.
[29:31.210 --> 29:33.170]  212-209-2950.
[29:33.170 --> 29:42.690]  Remember, for an extra $25, you'll get an 11 by 17 picture of the events going on down at Wall Street suitable for framing and a real piece of history right there.
[29:43.070 --> 29:45.410]  212-209-2950.
[29:45.410 --> 29:47.130]  Tell us a little bit about the history of MakerBot.
[29:47.310 --> 29:48.910]  Like, how long has it been around?
[29:49.250 --> 29:54.470]  Well, MakerBot was started in 2009 by Brie Pettis, Adam Mayer, and Zach Smith.
[29:54.470 --> 30:02.910]  And they were all cohorts, you know, they're all working together at NYC Resistor, a hackerspace there in Brooklyn.
[30:03.130 --> 30:05.710]  And they wanted a 3D printer.
[30:06.110 --> 30:09.270]  This technology exists, but they're really, really expensive.
[30:09.870 --> 30:13.530]  So they set to make one so that they could use it.
[30:13.870 --> 30:15.430]  And they succeeded.
[30:15.650 --> 30:17.470]  And they thought, well, we have this.
[30:17.690 --> 30:18.770]  Other people are going to want this.
[30:19.230 --> 30:27.430]  And they started putting together what they thought would be a small part-time business of offering these 3D printer kits.
[30:28.270 --> 30:38.830]  Then, once they started actually doing this, they couldn't basically meet the demand until they made it a more involved, full-time business and started pulling in people.
[30:39.230 --> 30:44.270]  Now it's 2011 and they're, I believe, 55 employees.
[30:45.190 --> 30:50.230]  And we're shipping as much internationally as to the United States.
[30:51.010 --> 30:52.050]  3D printer kits.
[30:52.410 --> 30:55.530]  Because people want it for whatever projects they're working on.
[30:55.670 --> 30:55.850]  Uh-huh.
[30:55.990 --> 30:58.730]  So in two years, it's grown to 55 employees.
[30:59.110 --> 31:02.110]  And do people mostly buy the kits?
[31:02.130 --> 31:04.370]  Or do they buy the fully assembled MakerBots?
[31:04.870 --> 31:08.270]  Well, we only recently started offering the fully assembled.
[31:08.410 --> 31:10.210]  And that's been really popular.
[31:10.230 --> 31:13.330]  We've been selling out every single one we offer of that.
[31:13.330 --> 31:15.490]  But for the most part, it's the kits.
[31:15.730 --> 31:17.050]  And we love the kits.
[31:17.250 --> 31:20.990]  Because when you build it, you know how to do this kind of work.
[31:21.070 --> 31:22.230]  You know how to mod your machine.
[31:22.470 --> 31:23.570]  You know how to tune it.
[31:24.150 --> 31:25.730]  So my heart is still with the kits.
[31:25.910 --> 31:26.070]  Uh-huh.
[31:26.650 --> 31:27.970]  212-209-2950.
[31:27.970 --> 31:29.270]  We have two calls on the line.
[31:29.450 --> 31:33.570]  And if you call now and pledge $75, you'll get four items.
[31:33.570 --> 31:35.030]  You'll get an Arduino.
[31:35.610 --> 31:38.050]  You'll get the book on Arduinos.
[31:38.230 --> 31:40.850]  You'll get the 3D object created by a MakerBot.
[31:40.970 --> 31:42.570]  And you'll get a MakerBot t-shirt.
[31:43.490 --> 31:45.090]  I'd like to talk a little bit more about Arduinos.
[31:45.170 --> 31:48.610]  What are some of the things that people have built with those?
[31:49.130 --> 31:51.790]  I recently did a project that got a lot of attention.
[31:52.210 --> 31:53.670]  I called it the Enough already.
[31:53.750 --> 31:57.150]  And what it did was it listened to the closed captioning track of the television.
[31:57.310 --> 31:57.610]  Uh-huh.
[31:57.750 --> 31:59.170]  And it listened for certain keywords.
[31:59.390 --> 32:02.830]  And in my case, it was keywords like Trump, Kardashian, Palin.
[32:02.830 --> 32:03.190]  Oh, wow.
[32:03.210 --> 32:06.670]  Whenever it heard those words, it would actually mute the TV for 30 seconds.
[32:06.670 --> 32:10.330]  So I didn't have to listen to any of that drivel anymore.
[32:10.670 --> 32:11.050]  Wow.
[32:11.230 --> 32:12.350]  It's like the...
[32:12.350 --> 32:13.890]  I have a version of that.
[32:14.070 --> 32:18.470]  I went to a Christian bookstore once in Tennessee because I could.
[32:18.610 --> 32:20.310]  Because it was there and I just had to walk in.
[32:20.510 --> 32:21.730]  And I walked out of there.
[32:21.930 --> 32:22.510]  I paid for it.
[32:22.550 --> 32:25.770]  I walked out of there with a device called NoCurseTV.
[32:26.210 --> 32:29.950]  It uses the same basic principle where it looks for certain foul words.
[32:30.070 --> 32:31.170]  And other words, too.
[32:31.170 --> 32:35.670]  You can put it in religious mode and it'll look for God and the Lord's name in vain and things like that.
[32:35.790 --> 32:40.150]  It just replaces it with things like Gosh and Golly and various other things on closed captioning.
[32:40.190 --> 32:42.130]  It also mutes the audio.
[32:42.430 --> 32:44.850]  But you've built something like that with an Arduino.
[32:45.350 --> 32:45.590]  Yes.
[32:45.950 --> 32:46.690]  That's incredible.
[32:46.690 --> 32:49.390]  Yeah, you don't have to wait for someone to go and make it for you.
[32:49.510 --> 32:51.670]  You can make it yourself and customize it any way you want.
[32:51.770 --> 32:57.770]  Anyone can put in any keyword they want to mute or to shut off the TV or to change the channel even.
[32:58.310 --> 32:58.670]  Wow.
[32:58.850 --> 33:04.390]  Yeah, I think the key difference with this project is that he made it himself and he gets to choose his own curse words.
[33:04.390 --> 33:06.730]  It's not the FCC's 7 curse words.
[33:06.890 --> 33:08.710]  It's the celebrities he mentioned.
[33:08.970 --> 33:16.770]  And that's the sort of thing that the DIY ethic behind the Arduino and behind the MakerBot really make possible.
[33:16.770 --> 33:19.390]  But this is only one thing you can do with an Arduino.
[33:19.910 --> 33:23.030]  It's literally infinite, the amount of things you can build.
[33:23.210 --> 33:25.810]  One of the fantastic things about Arduino is that it's open source.
[33:26.090 --> 33:34.910]  And these people have gone out and built boards that plug into it, that have designed boards that they play MP3s, they do light shows, they control projectors.
[33:35.350 --> 33:38.570]  And because the design is so open, you can just plug it right on there.
[33:38.630 --> 33:41.510]  In fact, believe it or not, the MakerBot is built around an Arduino.
[33:41.850 --> 33:43.770]  The MakerBot is the guts of the Arduino.
[33:43.950 --> 33:45.190]  It's the brain inside of this thing.
[33:45.190 --> 33:48.350]  And this whole little printing robots built around this board.
[33:48.930 --> 33:50.890]  And these guys were not electrical engineers.
[33:51.030 --> 33:53.570]  They were just some guys that wanted to print some cool stuff.
[33:53.730 --> 33:56.810]  And, you know, they could use the Arduino to make that happen.
[33:57.130 --> 33:58.030]  That's incredible.
[33:58.310 --> 34:01.790]  Though now working with the Arduino, they're becoming electrical engineers.
[34:02.010 --> 34:05.410]  It's pretty impressive seeing this whole progression from the beginning.
[34:05.630 --> 34:08.450]  And this is kind of an interesting Arduino story.
[34:08.610 --> 34:11.670]  I just brought on a 15-year-old.
[34:11.810 --> 34:14.550]  I think actually he's about to turn 15-year-old.
[34:14.550 --> 34:29.710]  And to use as an electrical engineer on a project to do an Arduino project for a zoetrope, a turntable for a zoetrope for a project for the artist Takeshi Murata.
[34:30.730 --> 34:32.090]  And he's outstanding.
[34:32.390 --> 34:39.410]  He's an example of somebody who had Arduino available to him as soon as he was curious enough to look for it.
[34:39.630 --> 34:44.930]  And chased through all those projects and now can do like any kind of project he wants.
[34:44.930 --> 34:46.030]  Wow, that's amazing.
[34:46.230 --> 34:56.610]  And if you know somebody who's young and intuitive of various technological things, just curious, wants to develop some skills, this is a perfect package for them.
[34:57.250 --> 35:10.650]  For $75, you'll get the Arduino, you'll get the O'Reilly book on Arduinos, and you'll get an example of what a MakerBot can do as well as a t-shirt to show the world that you're somebody in tune with what MakerBots are all about.
[35:10.650 --> 35:13.950]  All for a pledge of $75, 212-209-2950.
[35:14.210 --> 35:18.810]  We have one call on the line, another call coming in, 212-209-2950.
[35:18.990 --> 35:22.710]  Again, we're in the middle of a fun drive, the autumn fun drive.
[35:22.710 --> 35:29.770]  It's necessary to keep this radio station on the air so that we can talk about even things like this uncovered in commercial media.
[35:30.150 --> 35:32.010]  We're talking about what's going on at Wall Street.
[35:32.110 --> 35:35.530]  We're talking about all kinds of controversial things happening throughout the world.
[35:35.770 --> 35:39.610]  And it's vital that there be a voice here for that kind of a thing.
[35:39.610 --> 35:50.450]  People who develop technology, people who are trying new and different ways of doing things, they need a voice, they need a place where they can express themselves, where they can call in, ask questions, things like that.
[35:50.710 --> 35:52.990]  That's what WBAI is here for.
[35:53.030 --> 35:54.370]  It's here for people like you.
[35:54.730 --> 35:58.270]  And your pledge is what keeps it here for people like you in the future.
[35:58.270 --> 36:02.890]  We've been going on like this since 1960, and a lot of history has been made in these studios.
[36:03.530 --> 36:05.150]  You can help the process.
[36:05.350 --> 36:06.230]  You can help us continue.
[36:06.230 --> 36:08.470]  212-209-2950.
[36:08.570 --> 36:14.590]  Get the four items from the MakerBot folks with your pledge of $75.
[36:14.970 --> 36:23.390]  Pledge of $100, you'll get that, plus Kyle's 11x17 historical photo from Wall Street, from the demonstrations just down the block.
[36:23.550 --> 36:24.790]  Real history being made here.
[36:25.870 --> 36:29.030]  Now, Bernie, have you ever played with a MakerBot yourself?
[36:29.970 --> 36:30.370]  Yes.
[36:30.570 --> 36:41.050]  In fact, I was playing with them just, what, a week or two ago up at Maker Faire, in Queens at the old World's Fair grounds.
[36:41.270 --> 36:43.610]  And they are really amazing machines.
[36:43.750 --> 36:47.050]  I think, isn't the technical name for this machine called the Thing-O-Matic?
[36:48.290 --> 36:51.190]  I guess that's the name of our latest 3D printer.
[36:51.570 --> 36:52.810]  The first one's called the Cupcake.
[36:53.630 --> 36:54.970]  Cupcake and Thing-O-Matic, okay.
[36:56.110 --> 36:58.650]  A great, great name, you know, like the Bass-O-Matic, whatever.
[36:58.790 --> 37:03.650]  This will just automatically make a thing for you that you tell it to make for you.
[37:04.210 --> 37:05.830]  It's just a mind-blowing concept.
[37:06.050 --> 37:07.450]  I mean, I've seen these things for a few years.
[37:07.590 --> 37:13.290]  Going way back, these things cost tens of thousands of dollars and require very expensive materials.
[37:13.530 --> 37:18.370]  But now, you can buy one for, you know, for the price of a, you know, a decent personal computer.
[37:18.370 --> 37:25.330]  You can buy a machine that plugs into your computer that will make anything your mind can imagine, any three-dimensional object.
[37:25.590 --> 37:30.510]  And there's this whole universe of files you can download, too, isn't there?
[37:30.690 --> 37:32.990]  It's called Thingiverse, isn't that right?
[37:33.390 --> 37:35.310]  Yeah, Thingiverse is an amazing website.
[37:35.570 --> 37:39.130]  It's basically, it's like Wikipedia for things.
[37:39.450 --> 37:41.250]  You can design anything you want.
[37:41.250 --> 37:43.890]  If it's a physical object, we encourage you to throw it up there.
[37:43.890 --> 37:45.530]  And it's really amazing.
[37:45.910 --> 37:49.010]  People have done things to fix their house, to fix their blender.
[37:49.350 --> 37:53.130]  Like, the cord comes loose on their shades, and they design a little shade replacement.
[37:53.130 --> 37:56.730]  They're like, well, I'll just put this on Thingiverse, because somebody else might break the same thing.
[37:56.970 --> 37:58.670]  It's really, it's really, really cool.
[37:59.030 --> 37:59.430]  Wow.
[37:59.530 --> 38:05.310]  It's a whole new paradigm shift, I think, where, you know, people used to share, well, they still do, share music files, video files.
[38:05.550 --> 38:12.350]  Now you can share three-dimensional objects, except you can, you know, replicate them online.
[38:13.310 --> 38:23.390]  You can just download the instructions to make a device, and you just tell your device, your Thing-O-Matic, or your MakerBot to construct it, and it will make it for you.
[38:23.510 --> 38:28.870]  You can even tell it what color you want it to be, and it'll even make things that you couldn't possibly sculpt.
[38:30.230 --> 38:34.390]  You couldn't, like, for instance, you could not, you could not sculpt a hollow sphere.
[38:34.950 --> 38:37.790]  But you can make that with a MakerBot machine, can't you?
[38:40.150 --> 38:41.110]  Yeah, I believe so.
[38:41.190 --> 38:44.590]  I'm sorry, we're just a little bit flustered here.
[38:44.650 --> 38:48.670]  We just got some very sad news that Steve Jobs has, in fact, passed away.
[38:49.210 --> 39:05.470]  And that's something that definitely affects a lot of us in the technical world, because, I don't know, even if you weren't an Apple owner, there's something about the company, the way that it was sort of personified through the eyes of dreamers.
[39:06.290 --> 39:08.970]  So that's... and we had heard, of course, that he was sick.
[39:09.110 --> 39:11.210]  He had left his position at Apple recently.
[39:11.410 --> 39:13.390]  And, of course, very sad news that we just received tonight.
[39:14.470 --> 39:14.910]  Wow.
[39:15.750 --> 39:16.050]  So...
[39:16.050 --> 39:18.150]  Well, a long-respected hacker.
[39:18.610 --> 39:19.750]  Yeah, definitely, definitely.
[39:19.990 --> 39:22.370]  That's what the hacker world is all about.
[39:22.510 --> 39:23.630]  People like Steve Jobs.
[39:23.770 --> 39:25.170]  People like Steve Wozniak.
[39:25.170 --> 39:39.950]  People like the kind of folks you meet in various places, at hacker conferences, at 2600 meetings, at hackerspaces, MakerBot, and places like that, you know.
[39:41.250 --> 39:42.330]  Anyways, I'm sorry.
[39:42.510 --> 39:44.410]  That's just... I wasn't expecting something like that.
[39:46.090 --> 39:51.530]  What kind of people go to MakerBot?
[39:52.510 --> 39:54.590]  Are there MakerBots in many hackerspaces?
[39:55.230 --> 39:57.570]  You mentioned NYC Resistor in Brooklyn.
[39:58.250 --> 39:59.890]  Do they have a MakerBot of their own?
[40:00.130 --> 40:00.210]  No.
[40:00.350 --> 40:02.330]  Do hackerspaces, as a rule, tend to have these things?
[40:02.930 --> 40:03.410]  Yes.
[40:03.790 --> 40:04.850]  That's exactly it.
[40:05.270 --> 40:07.090]  You find them all over the place.
[40:07.930 --> 40:14.490]  In fact, I mean, like at MakerFair, it's interesting going around to all the various teams of, you know, hacker...
[40:14.490 --> 40:23.870]  either hackerspaces or other special projects, and you'd see them popping up from the corner everywhere because they're tools people use to do whatever it is they do.
[40:24.690 --> 40:34.090]  And, you know, you can make, like, something that is plastic with it or you can use it to make the armature for something else or a tool to allow you to make something else.
[40:34.450 --> 40:39.770]  So it tends to be, you know, a tool that you will put in your belt if you can.
[40:41.070 --> 40:46.710]  And we find that our, you know, our MakerBot operators are a pretty broad group.
[40:47.810 --> 40:54.190]  It's, initially, I think we probably thought it was, like, focusing on robotics and people making machines.
[40:54.190 --> 40:56.170]  But these days, it's everybody.
[40:56.390 --> 40:59.170]  It's individuals wanting to learn how things work.
[40:59.430 --> 41:07.290]  It's educators wanting to show, you know, how the machine works, but also to empower the students to make something that they specifically actually want.
[41:07.290 --> 41:09.570]  Do many schools have MakerBots?
[41:09.910 --> 41:10.550]  Oh, quite a few.
[41:10.910 --> 41:11.410]  Schools are buying these.
[41:11.470 --> 41:28.030]  We are really focused on education in particular and have been developing curriculum to put online because, you know, you can teach the machine or you can use the machine for what else you're teaching.
[41:28.030 --> 41:30.150]  And we've seen it at work.
[41:30.930 --> 41:32.630]  And that gets us really excited.
[41:32.810 --> 41:45.630]  So we're trying to kind of meet the requests from all the, you know, hundreds and hundreds of education customers we have to make sure they have the tools they need to, you know, share these tools with their students.
[41:45.890 --> 41:50.510]  It's a lot like computers if you go back to the 1970s where this is a new technology.
[41:50.650 --> 41:52.090]  It's still in its infancy.
[41:52.210 --> 41:53.530]  It's still just figuring out what it's doing.
[41:53.530 --> 41:59.110]  But the ability to think of something or design something on a computer and just say, I want one and spit it out.
[41:59.230 --> 42:01.030]  Like, that's a very powerful thing.
[42:01.170 --> 42:05.850]  And this is the leading edge of that becoming just something that everyday people have access to.
[42:06.130 --> 42:17.630]  One thing that you touched on and I've really found is cool with these devices is when people fix things, like everyday things in their house, like that funny little wheel on your dishwasher or something like that.
[42:17.630 --> 42:33.950]  Yeah, and I know I've heard some of the talks about the MakerBot and I know you guys are kind of proud of these kinds of hacks where, you know, you find something that's broken, the replacement part is $16.99 or something ridiculous plus $5 shipping for like,
[42:33.990 --> 42:35.090]  you know, a tiny piece of plastic.
[42:35.230 --> 42:38.970]  So somebody takes the broken piece, glues it together, scans it, and prints it out.
[42:39.450 --> 42:42.190]  And then from there they can do whatever else they want with it.
[42:42.270 --> 42:46.130]  Maybe they want to make a bunch or cast it or all kinds of things like that.
[42:46.130 --> 42:46.690]  Yeah.
[42:46.810 --> 42:51.930]  I heard a great story about somebody had a baby carriage and it has a spring in it that's a little plastic spring and it broke.
[42:52.090 --> 42:52.170]  Sure.
[42:52.270 --> 42:54.710]  And they called the company and the company said, it's a $45 spring.
[42:54.990 --> 42:55.310]  Absolutely.
[42:55.570 --> 42:57.630]  And I was like, no, it's a $2 plastic spring.
[42:58.330 --> 43:05.370]  Went to, I think it went to a hackerspace he just had never seen or heard before in his town, just looked it up on the internet, went there, printed out a replacement part for it.
[43:05.770 --> 43:05.870]  Yeah.
[43:05.870 --> 43:10.030]  And, you know, for $0.75 replaced what would have been a $30 replacement part.
[43:10.570 --> 43:10.730]  Yeah.
[43:11.070 --> 43:12.490]  That's the power of technology.
[43:12.490 --> 43:19.430]  When you were able to build something, to actually get a device to create things for you.
[43:19.590 --> 43:21.450]  Where do you see this going in the future?
[43:21.610 --> 43:23.290]  Say, 10 years from now, what do you think will be?
[43:24.350 --> 43:25.950]  I think people will have it in their homes.
[43:26.110 --> 43:31.810]  I mean, my theory is it will be in the kitchen with the other appliances that you're used to having running all the time.
[43:31.810 --> 43:43.650]  And people will use it for projects they're doing, but they'll also use it for, you know, things that, you know, they need, but, you know, they don't know they need it till just then.
[43:44.390 --> 43:50.330]  I mean, you make that replacement stove knob, which, you know, those always break and are so annoying.
[43:51.110 --> 43:55.430]  So, you might as well go further and put, like, your dog's face on it.
[43:55.530 --> 43:55.890]  Why not?
[43:56.870 --> 43:57.150]  Yeah.
[43:57.570 --> 44:05.570]  You're actually making what you want, which is much, you know, earlier in the food chain as far as manufacturing is concerned.
[44:06.630 --> 44:14.850]  So, you know, you're not getting a piece that's been sitting in a store being, you know, air-conditioned that has traveled across the world.
[44:14.910 --> 44:21.970]  You're making something with, you know, pretty primitive stuff that is just what you need right then.
[44:21.970 --> 44:22.870]  Mm-hmm.
[44:23.130 --> 44:27.630]  Okay, again, the phone number, 212-209-2950.
[44:29.230 --> 44:36.110]  That's to get the items we're offering today, MakerBot-related items, an object created by a MakerBot.
[44:36.270 --> 44:37.170]  It's gonna be cool.
[44:37.270 --> 44:43.030]  We can't tell you exactly what it is because I think it's gonna be a variety of different ones, and you're just gonna get something cool.
[44:43.150 --> 44:48.090]  We don't know exactly which cool thing you're gonna get, but you're gonna say when you get it, wow, that's cool, guaranteed.
[44:48.650 --> 44:51.090]  You'll also get a MakerBot t-shirt.
[44:51.090 --> 45:04.770]  You'll get an actual Arduino device that you can use to create all kinds of wild and crazy things, or maybe your toddler can do that for you and show you various things that you never knew technology could do.
[45:04.810 --> 45:13.830]  And you also get a book explaining what Arduinos are all about and how you too can join in this rapidly growing crowd of people.
[45:14.230 --> 45:16.090]  212-209-2950.
[45:16.090 --> 45:22.090]  And I understand, and this seems to be a tradition at fundraisers here at WBAI, that there's something wrong with the phones.
[45:22.190 --> 45:22.670]  Is that right, Mike?
[45:22.830 --> 45:26.690]  Yeah, the phone systems, they've been giving busy signals and they're being rebooted and all this stuff.
[45:26.770 --> 45:32.070]  So the summary is, if you have trouble reaching, we really want to hear from you.
[45:32.170 --> 45:34.890]  Please give us a call, 212-209-2950.
[45:35.230 --> 45:37.930]  But if you have trouble, try again in a minute or so.
[45:37.930 --> 45:42.830]  I was wondering, because I was watching the little graphical display that we have, and it would never go above 2.
[45:43.110 --> 45:45.410]  2 seemed to be, at 2 it busied out.
[45:45.610 --> 45:45.770]  Yeah.
[45:45.990 --> 45:47.190]  And then we lost the connection altogether.
[45:47.190 --> 45:48.590]  It says connection lost, right?
[45:48.750 --> 45:49.690]  And it's down the hall.
[45:49.910 --> 45:51.770]  We lost the connection to our own studios.
[45:52.450 --> 45:56.090]  Well, it lost the connection to the world, I think, is more the summary.
[45:56.430 --> 45:58.630]  Oh, so the phones aren't talking to the world right now.
[45:58.630 --> 45:59.610]  They got rebooted.
[45:59.950 --> 46:01.490]  Apparently you can reboot phones now.
[46:01.630 --> 46:05.410]  You know, guys, talking about technology, you know, sometimes it doesn't go well.
[46:05.550 --> 46:07.670]  Like digital TV, I was complaining about that last week.
[46:07.670 --> 46:11.410]  And how it's almost impossible to watch now because of the signal quality.
[46:11.710 --> 46:15.390]  But sometimes people get new phone systems, and they don't quite work out very well.
[46:15.530 --> 46:17.910]  And I've heard this complaint many times in office buildings.
[46:19.070 --> 46:21.330]  Sometimes technology doesn't march forward.
[46:21.430 --> 46:22.510]  Sometimes it falls backwards.
[46:22.990 --> 46:25.650]  And well, it doesn't seem like you guys are doing that, at least.
[46:25.790 --> 46:29.930]  It seems like you're actually experimenting, coming up with new and really cool things.
[46:30.730 --> 46:31.010]  Yeah.
[46:31.110 --> 46:35.270]  And our, I mean, the people using these tools are pushing them even further.
[46:35.270 --> 46:47.090]  It's, you know, we'll go on Thingiverse and see things that people have made, you know, like an hour earlier, like modifications to MakerBots or any sort of tools they use.
[46:47.170 --> 46:48.790]  And it's just, it's kind of mind blowing.
[46:49.410 --> 46:49.710]  Absolutely.
[46:49.990 --> 46:53.630]  There's a great example of these octopodes, the octopuses.
[46:54.310 --> 46:55.570]  Someone designed these for their kids.
[46:55.850 --> 46:57.710]  And someone else saw it and said, hey, that's really cool.
[46:57.710 --> 46:58.950]  I want it, but I want a little bit larger.
[46:59.050 --> 47:00.430]  They printed one a little bit larger.
[47:00.830 --> 47:02.390]  Then someone said, oh, I want it with a cat head.
[47:02.690 --> 47:05.110]  So somebody designed a little cat's face, and they put it on the octop.
[47:05.150 --> 47:06.830]  So now you have this octa-cat.
[47:07.050 --> 47:09.590]  And then someone else is like, well, actually Yoda's head would be even cooler.
[47:10.570 --> 47:12.170]  And these things just keep going.
[47:12.270 --> 47:14.670]  If you actually go to Thingiverse, you can look at an object.
[47:14.670 --> 47:18.890]  And you can see all of the things that were our mashups of that object.
[47:18.910 --> 47:22.310]  And all of the things that people created, sort of mixing it with random things.
[47:22.810 --> 47:26.250]  And there's a whole universe of just wacky, nifty things people are making.
[47:26.450 --> 47:28.450]  And then sharing back to the world for free.
[47:28.850 --> 47:31.150]  And you can be a part of that by giving a call.
[47:31.250 --> 47:34.230]  And again, please be patient if the phones aren't quite working right.
[47:34.530 --> 47:38.730]  We're sorry, but we guarantee that the Arduino will work better once you get that.
[47:38.770 --> 47:44.390]  And so will the t-shirt and the book, because there's nothing technologically involved in that at all.
[47:44.570 --> 47:53.310]  And you'll also have an object, which is the fruit of all this genius at work, putting together the MakerBots and creating objects.
[47:54.730 --> 47:56.670]  It's really something...
[47:56.670 --> 48:06.410]  I mean, I struggle to get my head around it, but I do realize the value of what is being done here, the creations, the steps forward in technology that are happening.
[48:06.610 --> 48:09.890]  Again, 212-209-2950.
[48:09.890 --> 48:13.450]  Bernie, you know, I'm going to ask you to get another call in.
[48:14.430 --> 48:19.730]  And even though it might not be working, I know you'll get people to start dialing.
[48:19.810 --> 48:21.070]  Hopefully, the call will be completed.
[48:21.190 --> 48:21.850]  Do you want me to give it a shot?
[48:22.650 --> 48:22.930]  Sure.
[48:23.070 --> 48:25.150]  Actually, I became aware that the lines are busy.
[48:25.290 --> 48:28.270]  A friend of mine tried to pledge, and so I just texted...
[48:28.270 --> 48:34.090]  While we're talking on the phone, I texted Mike saying, hey, the lines are busy, so tell people to keep calling.
[48:34.190 --> 48:37.510]  So please keep calling, 212-209-2950.
[48:37.510 --> 48:42.090]  This is really an amazing technology package you can get tonight.
[48:43.830 --> 48:49.030]  A three-dimensional sculpture created by a robot that looks really cool.
[48:49.230 --> 48:50.650]  And it's going to be a neat surprise when you get it.
[48:50.730 --> 48:55.390]  You'll be like, this is amazing, and it was made by a robot, by a hacker.
[48:55.970 --> 48:59.050]  You get the sculpture made by a MakerBot machine.
[48:59.270 --> 49:01.110]  You get a MakerBot t-shirt.
[49:01.470 --> 49:09.390]  You get a whole Arduino kit where you can make something that will control objects in real space.
[49:10.830 --> 49:13.710]  And you get a book on how to do Arduino projects.
[49:13.730 --> 49:15.270]  It's a great package for $75.
[49:15.270 --> 49:17.590]  It would probably cost you more just to buy that all separately.
[49:17.830 --> 49:23.030]  But you get the radio station, WBAI, with that, which is really what this is all about.
[49:23.150 --> 49:25.370]  212-209-2950.
[49:25.750 --> 49:37.770]  And for an extra $25, you will get an 11x17 photo print created by our beloved Kyle, who took a great picture of the Occupy Wall Street protest.
[49:37.970 --> 49:39.170]  So this is really a piece of history.
[49:39.290 --> 49:41.710]  212-209-2950.
[49:41.710 --> 49:43.610]  If the line is busy, keep calling, please.
[49:44.270 --> 49:44.410]  Okay.
[49:44.550 --> 49:47.330]  And we're going to move into another section of the program.
[49:47.430 --> 49:48.090]  We're going to come back to this.
[49:48.230 --> 49:49.890]  We're going to come back to MakerBots in just a little bit.
[49:50.550 --> 49:55.850]  But right now, we're going to be joining a couple of other people on the phone.
[49:56.990 --> 49:57.470]  Let's see.
[49:57.590 --> 50:02.030]  Do we have John Baitstill on the line?
[50:03.550 --> 50:03.870]  No?
[50:03.990 --> 50:04.730]  We don't seem to have them.
[50:04.930 --> 50:05.310]  Oh, okay.
[50:05.390 --> 50:06.070]  Mikey, I pushed the buttons.
[50:06.450 --> 50:07.430]  John, are you with us?
[50:07.750 --> 50:08.070]  Yes.
[50:08.210 --> 50:08.410]  Hello.
[50:08.410 --> 50:08.870]  Hi.
[50:09.110 --> 50:11.210]  And Joe, are you with us?
[50:12.130 --> 50:12.870]  Yes, I am.
[50:13.030 --> 50:13.690]  Joe Mano.
[50:13.810 --> 50:14.010]  Okay.
[50:14.990 --> 50:18.630]  You two have written a book on Legos.
[50:18.710 --> 50:20.770]  It's called The Cult of Lego.
[50:21.890 --> 50:24.230]  And it's coming out, I believe, next month.
[50:24.250 --> 50:24.810]  Is that correct?
[50:25.830 --> 50:26.470]  Yes, it is.
[50:26.730 --> 50:26.990]  All right.
[50:27.070 --> 50:29.150]  What inspired you to do such a thing?
[50:31.630 --> 50:33.810]  Actually, John should be the one to answer that question.
[50:34.070 --> 50:34.690]  Go ahead, John.
[50:34.690 --> 50:43.890]  Well, it seemed to me that there had never been a really, like, definitive book about adult fans of Lego.
[50:44.050 --> 50:48.670]  And since then, a couple others have come out since we started working on this book.
[50:48.670 --> 50:57.230]  But when we started, you know, it was kind of a new idea that this was a very important group of people that needed to be covered.
[50:57.510 --> 51:07.070]  And Joe, who has his own Lego magazine, was, like, totally tuned into the scenes.
[51:08.370 --> 51:08.930]  Okay.
[51:09.290 --> 51:09.490]  Wow.
[51:09.750 --> 51:15.330]  Now, I've noticed that, for some reason, the hacker community is very into Legos.
[51:15.870 --> 51:20.370]  Every time we offer anything Lego-related in this program, the phones just light up.
[51:20.490 --> 51:22.290]  And hopefully, that'll be the case tonight.
[51:22.290 --> 51:34.350]  Because what we're offering, we're offering the new book, Cult of Lego, by you two, you two guys, for a pledge of $50 to 212-209-2950.
[51:34.350 --> 51:43.330]  And that means if you add it all together, you can get the whole MakerBot package, and the Lego book, and Kyle's photo for a pledge of $125 to 212-209-2950.
[51:43.330 --> 51:53.010]  But before we really get into that, let me ask you guys, what kinds of things make this Lego book different than the other ones that we might have seen in the past?
[51:54.730 --> 51:57.870]  Well, this book actually is a coffee table-level book.
[51:58.290 --> 52:00.890]  And it's a great overview of the community.
[52:01.470 --> 52:07.810]  It talks about some of the things that the community people build, and the background of the company.
[52:08.090 --> 52:12.010]  And what makes it neat is just that it also has a lot of great photos.
[52:13.210 --> 52:19.850]  Most of the other books I've seen out there won't... they'll have pictures, they'll have a little copy.
[52:19.850 --> 52:25.050]  We actually have a little bit more to talk about what's going on with the community and the people behind it.
[52:26.090 --> 52:26.710]  I see.
[52:27.050 --> 52:30.070]  What are some of the examples of the things that you show in the book?
[52:31.490 --> 52:36.530]  Well, one of my favorites is Brian Darrow's Blacktron Intelligence Agency.
[52:36.530 --> 52:52.390]  It is just an enormous, sinister intelligence-gathering base, and it's just grown with every convention until it's, like, enormous and has all sorts of space domes and stuff.
[52:52.390 --> 52:56.570]  And it's all done in black and translucent.
[52:56.810 --> 52:57.350]  What is it, gold?
[52:58.590 --> 53:00.030]  Actually, translucent yellow.
[53:00.210 --> 53:02.350]  Those are the colors of the old Blacktron theme.
[53:03.190 --> 53:07.570]  And he decided to place a homage to it.
[53:08.090 --> 53:09.470]  And yes, it's gigantic.
[53:09.750 --> 53:12.410]  It's grown to... it used to be only two tables.
[53:12.490 --> 53:15.090]  It's gone to about four tables now, and no signs of stopping.
[53:16.650 --> 53:17.130]  Wow.
[53:18.010 --> 53:18.910]  That's pretty incredible.
[53:20.410 --> 53:24.010]  Now, what kinds of people these days are into Legos?
[53:24.010 --> 53:30.630]  I seem to see everybody, from small children to very old people, into these devices.
[53:30.830 --> 53:32.550]  Do you know anything about the magic of it?
[53:35.070 --> 53:36.810]  Ooh, that's a loaded question.
[53:37.750 --> 53:38.470]  Oh, great.
[53:38.550 --> 53:39.550]  Okay, I want to know how it's loaded.
[53:41.350 --> 53:46.190]  Well, it's a nice in-between thing, for lack of a better term.
[53:46.650 --> 53:49.590]  Engineers use it, and there's a lot of engineers in the community.
[53:49.790 --> 53:51.930]  They use it to build artistic things.
[53:51.930 --> 53:56.290]  And artistic people tend to use it to make technical things.
[53:56.550 --> 53:58.010]  So it's a great in-between.
[53:58.050 --> 54:08.830]  For most of us who don't have, like, artistic skills, you know, like drawing or anything, this is a prefabricated 3D building medium.
[54:09.110 --> 54:12.430]  So basically, you just have some parts and you build something with it.
[54:12.930 --> 54:16.930]  And everybody latches on to the base idea of building things.
[54:16.930 --> 54:20.950]  So you can have a 3-year-old building by stacking bricks to make a tower.
[54:21.310 --> 54:29.150]  Or you can have one of us building, basically, the Tower of Isengard from the Lord of the Rings, which I saw this past weekend.
[54:30.310 --> 54:36.670]  So it's a universal thing to build, and this lets it be very easy for anyone.
[54:37.290 --> 54:42.070]  Now, we have three folks from MakerBot in the studio.
[54:42.070 --> 54:45.510]  I want to ask you guys, have you ever played around with Legos?
[54:45.810 --> 54:46.530]  And be honest.
[54:46.530 --> 54:48.010]  Oh, absolutely.
[54:48.370 --> 54:48.570]  Uh-huh.
[54:48.830 --> 54:49.350]  And...
[54:49.350 --> 54:49.950]  There is a connection.
[54:50.170 --> 54:55.010]  I kind of think that, at least, you know, our community skews way, way Lego.
[54:56.790 --> 55:01.730]  And, in fact, the plastic that we use in MakerBot is ABS plastic.
[55:01.890 --> 55:02.550]  It's the same plastic.
[55:02.850 --> 55:08.610]  So we've seen projects where people make parametric tools so they can generate any Lego they want.
[55:09.870 --> 55:15.950]  Because the love of Legos continues after, you know, your first taste of it when you're growing up.
[55:15.950 --> 55:18.910]  Now, let me ask you Lego guys on the phone.
[55:18.910 --> 55:21.490]  Have you heard of MakerBots at all?
[55:22.690 --> 55:26.430]  Yeah, I've played around with one at my local hackerspace.
[55:26.630 --> 55:28.910]  And I've even printed Lego bricks with them.
[55:29.610 --> 55:30.150]  So...
[55:30.150 --> 55:30.190]  Wow.
[55:30.530 --> 55:31.070]  Wow.
[55:31.310 --> 55:31.590]  Nice.
[55:32.190 --> 55:32.450]  They're terrible.
[55:32.450 --> 55:34.130]  I know somebody in Florida.
[55:35.070 --> 55:39.970]  There's a guy in Florida who's trying to make a MakerBot out of a Lego Mindstorm set.
[55:40.650 --> 55:41.590]  You can do that?
[55:42.710 --> 55:44.150]  Well, he's finding out.
[55:44.470 --> 55:45.130]  Yeah, why not?
[55:45.530 --> 55:47.930]  One of the great things about MakerBot is all of our designs are open.
[55:48.110 --> 55:49.670]  All of our designs are available for anyone to use.
[55:50.230 --> 55:51.450]  They can buy one from us.
[55:51.510 --> 55:53.450]  We certainly like that because it keeps our research going.
[55:53.730 --> 56:01.290]  But if they can't afford it, if they really want to figure it out themselves, they can just download the files and start from scratch and build everything from the ground up.
[56:01.290 --> 56:04.490]  And that's our dedication to openness.
[56:04.490 --> 56:07.250]  That's our dedication to keeping the world moving forward is to share.
[56:07.250 --> 56:08.410]  That's incredible.
[56:08.910 --> 56:08.990]  That's incredible.
[56:09.190 --> 56:17.030]  I mean, just the way people share information and knowledge here, it's one of the true great things about the hacker community.
[56:17.290 --> 56:21.230]  And very happy to see all of this coming forth together.
[56:22.370 --> 56:25.650]  Let me just once again give out the phone number, 212-209-2950.
[56:25.650 --> 56:26.690]  I sure hope it's working.
[56:27.210 --> 56:28.290]  Please give it a try.
[56:28.290 --> 56:30.170]  If it's busy, try right back.
[56:30.310 --> 56:33.330]  And we have amazing premiums tonight.
[56:33.330 --> 56:42.010]  And these guys are donating this to help keep the radio station going so we can talk about things like that, like these items, all year long.
[56:42.190 --> 56:49.830]  212-209-2950 for a pledge of $50, you'll get the latest book on Legos, The Cult of Lego.
[56:50.390 --> 56:54.850]  And you'll learn all kinds of things that you probably never knew about Legos.
[56:54.850 --> 57:04.410]  For a pledge of $75, you'll get the MakerBot package that we've been talking about, the MakerBot object, the t-shirt, the Arduino, the book on the Arduino.
[57:04.910 --> 57:14.790]  And if you get both of them as an extra added incentive, you'll get an historic picture of the events going on down the block on Wall Street, photographed by our own Kyle.
[57:15.910 --> 57:17.870]  212-209-2950.
[57:17.870 --> 57:19.510]  Again, this is only being offered tonight.
[57:19.870 --> 57:23.670]  And hopefully the phones are cooperating so that we can offer this tonight.
[57:23.670 --> 57:27.210]  I'm just looking at some of the sample pages of this book that are online.
[57:27.370 --> 57:29.070]  There's a life-sized Stegosaurus?
[57:30.470 --> 57:34.890]  Yeah, it's pretty gigantic.
[57:35.230 --> 57:37.230]  And the guy made it in his living room.
[57:37.370 --> 57:39.670]  I don't know what he intended to do with it.
[57:39.830 --> 57:41.250]  How big is his living room?
[57:41.310 --> 57:41.410]  Yeah, really?
[57:41.470 --> 57:42.330]  What kind of living room is that?
[57:42.450 --> 57:43.870]  It must live in a coliseum or something.
[57:45.990 --> 57:46.670]  I don't know.
[57:47.210 --> 57:47.650]  Wow.
[57:47.970 --> 57:53.690]  Well, Stegosauruses were pretty big for my recollection of education about them, not them themselves.
[57:54.030 --> 57:57.210]  But yeah, that's something.
[57:57.370 --> 57:58.450]  You saw this where, Mike?
[57:58.810 --> 58:04.710]  This is on O'Reilly's website, which I guess distributes the book, even though it's published by our friends at Nostarch.
[58:04.710 --> 58:05.310]  Right.
[58:05.810 --> 58:07.870]  I hope he planned for moving it.
[58:08.030 --> 58:13.190]  You know, it would be a shame to build the entire thing and then try to get out the door and have to disassemble it and reassemble it.
[58:13.850 --> 58:15.090]  What are some of the...
[58:15.410 --> 58:16.230]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[58:16.330 --> 58:17.010]  You go first.
[58:17.570 --> 58:20.330]  I just wanted to say, there's a lot of overlap here.
[58:20.490 --> 58:21.970]  It's really kind of a common thread.
[58:21.970 --> 58:32.470]  A similar theme, making 3D sculptures and devices, objects, with a MakerBot, and making things out of Legos.
[58:32.950 --> 58:36.170]  And it's just this amazing crossover.
[58:36.170 --> 58:47.570]  You can actually make Lego pieces with a MakerBot, and you could... somebody could probably use Legos as part of making their own MakerBot machine.
[58:47.570 --> 58:53.490]  It's just... it's like such an amazing symbiosis, and it pulls the same creative energies out of people.
[58:53.770 --> 58:57.930]  At the HOOP conferences, we have the table set up with the Lego stuff.
[58:58.130 --> 59:03.990]  And I'm sure next year for HOOP number 9, which is July 13th, 14th, 15th, put a plug in there.
[59:04.210 --> 59:10.290]  We'll have... I'm sure we'll have a MakerBot set up there for people to see it and play with it and make things.
[59:10.290 --> 59:21.010]  It's just a really amazing creative energy that hackers are pulling together to make things that you really couldn't make before.
[59:21.250 --> 59:24.750]  So I encourage you all to call 212-209-2950.
[59:25.610 --> 59:31.910]  You can get this great book called The Cult of Lego by John and Joe from our friends at No Starts Press for $50.
[59:31.910 --> 59:34.270]  But for $125, you can get the whole package.
[59:34.430 --> 59:40.350]  You can get that, and you can get an amazing three-dimensional object made by MakerBot.
[59:40.470 --> 59:41.770]  You can get a MakerBot t-shirt.
[59:42.070 --> 59:48.250]  You can get a whole Arduino kit, which you can, you know, make it to do anything you want.
[59:49.750 --> 59:58.450]  And because the pledge will be over $100, you get a free 11x17 print of the Wall Street occupation by our own Kyle.
[59:58.650 --> 01:00:01.930]  212-209-2950 for this amazing package.
[01:00:02.090 --> 01:00:03.250]  And let me just correct you there, Bernie.
[01:00:03.350 --> 01:00:04.510]  It's not an Arduino kit.
[01:00:04.630 --> 01:00:07.810]  It's an actual Arduino one that's been put together.
[01:00:07.890 --> 01:00:09.390]  Well, let's look at the clarification on that.
[01:00:10.450 --> 01:00:13.210]  Oh, I just clarified, but you want someone else to clarify.
[01:00:13.310 --> 01:00:13.530]  Go ahead.
[01:00:13.530 --> 01:00:19.170]  Yeah, you get the basic Arduino, which involves, you know, you have the book, and then you have the Arduino and power supply.
[01:00:19.350 --> 01:00:22.830]  So it's kind of a kit because it comes packaged with, you know, a couple small things to get you started.
[01:00:23.510 --> 01:00:24.130]  I just...
[01:00:24.130 --> 01:00:25.370]  It's a British term, kit.
[01:00:25.550 --> 01:00:26.710]  You get the kit.
[01:00:27.070 --> 01:00:28.810]  All right, whatever is a kit and whatever isn't.
[01:00:28.990 --> 01:00:29.690]  I've got a British term for you, Bernie.
[01:00:31.290 --> 01:00:41.270]  When you mentioned, Bernie, the idea of a MakerBot being made out of Legos, there was much nodding in the studio, and you couldn't see that because you're on the phone and our audience couldn't see that because they're on the radio.
[01:00:41.270 --> 01:00:44.430]  But I saw the nodding, and I want more details.
[01:00:46.670 --> 01:00:48.410]  It's awesome to make stuff.
[01:00:48.730 --> 01:00:54.370]  I mean, that's all it comes down to is making MakerBots out of Legos or making Legos out of MakerBots.
[01:00:54.770 --> 01:01:02.210]  Like, it's just all about creative energy and doing what you want with the tools you have and making that decision yourself.
[01:01:02.210 --> 01:01:08.970]  Not taking the world as somebody else hands it to you, but, you know, but to determine what you want out of the world and do it yourself.
[01:01:08.970 --> 01:01:19.190]  I think if you really want to get an idea of what this is, what the impact of this is, what was life like before these kinds of technologies where you can make something?
[01:01:19.470 --> 01:01:26.250]  I mean, what would it take to get an object made out of plastic before there was a thing such as a MakerBot?
[01:01:26.250 --> 01:01:43.030]  If you didn't have access to, like, a very expensive laboratory equipment, you know, making things yourselves involved being a company, you know, pitching a toy or a device of some kind and then sending it to a factory and then having it prototyped and then cast and injection mold,
[01:01:43.130 --> 01:01:43.450]  all that.
[01:01:43.450 --> 01:01:47.950]  I mean, that's a very cumbersome, big, old style process.
[01:01:48.330 --> 01:02:02.670]  So, I mean, in just the last couple of years, we've seen this explosion of people simply having the ability and what we're witnessing now is the people taking the tool itself and building more tools or rapid prototyping their own ideas and projects.
[01:02:02.670 --> 01:02:18.810]  And I think this device, the Arduino, and the information about the MakerBot, just getting a sample of what it can do, what it's capable of, is inspiration for people that might be able to contribute to this and might push this to the next level.
[01:02:18.810 --> 01:02:27.070]  Because it's really exploding and going in an awesome direction as far as empowering people to make whatever they can think of.
[01:02:27.070 --> 01:02:30.550]  Now, again, we were talking about making things.
[01:02:30.770 --> 01:02:32.450]  One of the really cool things to make is radio.
[01:02:32.450 --> 01:02:33.970]  We do this week after week.
[01:02:34.170 --> 01:02:40.290]  And the communities are built based on this particular place, the many things that are talked about in any particular broadcast day.
[01:02:40.750 --> 01:02:50.250]  And you can help make that continue by calling 212-209-2950, pledging whatever you can afford to keep WBAI on the air, to keep us going.
[01:02:50.250 --> 01:02:51.650]  We have different pledge levels.
[01:02:52.030 --> 01:02:55.270]  We have $50 for the Lego book.
[01:02:55.270 --> 01:02:58.350]  We have $75 for the MakerBot material.
[01:02:58.590 --> 01:03:04.890]  We have anything 100 and above for the photograph of the events down at Wall Street.
[01:03:05.290 --> 01:03:10.370]  And I understand we also have, for $50, we have a full off-the-hook archive.
[01:03:10.970 --> 01:03:18.530]  That's every single show we've ever done on DVDs that you can listen to in full broadcast quality.
[01:03:19.610 --> 01:03:20.990]  212-209-2950.
[01:03:21.030 --> 01:03:25.430]  We have been having trouble with the phones, but I think we're working on well over $1,000.
[01:03:25.770 --> 01:03:26.670]  So that's great.
[01:03:26.690 --> 01:03:30.190]  But we have to have closer to $5,000 by the end of two hours.
[01:03:30.370 --> 01:03:32.810]  So, you know, we're kind of well behind where we need to be.
[01:03:32.910 --> 01:03:33.850]  But we know people are out there.
[01:03:33.910 --> 01:03:34.890]  We know they're trying to get through.
[01:03:35.330 --> 01:03:36.530]  Please continue trying to call.
[01:03:36.650 --> 01:03:38.290]  212-209-2950.
[01:03:38.290 --> 01:03:46.990]  I just want our audience to know if they're expecting the personal computer show at this time here on WBAI New York, they will be on the air at the regular time next week.
[01:03:47.090 --> 01:03:49.450]  This is a special extended edition of Off the Hook.
[01:03:49.810 --> 01:03:54.110]  And that reminds me, we do have to take a station break because it is the top of the hour.
[01:03:54.730 --> 01:03:57.210]  This is WBAI on Wall Street.
[01:03:57.510 --> 01:03:58.590]  Yes, that's our new ID.
[01:03:58.750 --> 01:03:59.430]  We're on Wall Street.
[01:03:59.950 --> 01:04:01.950]  We've been standing on Wall Street for many years now.
[01:04:01.950 --> 01:04:05.870]  But the legal ID was WBAI New York.
[01:04:06.010 --> 01:04:07.250]  We'll be back in just a moment.
[01:04:11.030 --> 01:04:12.230]  Hi, I'm Danny Glover.
[01:04:12.330 --> 01:04:13.570]  This is Saul Williams.
[01:04:13.830 --> 01:04:15.370]  And this is Michael Fried from Spearhead.
[01:04:15.470 --> 01:04:20.250]  And this is WBAI, listener-supported, non-commercial radio in New York.
[01:04:20.510 --> 01:04:23.190]  This is Reverend Jesse Jackson of the Rainbow Push Coalition.
[01:04:23.470 --> 01:04:28.630]  Please call and support WBAI, non-commercial peace and justice radio in New York.
[01:04:28.630 --> 01:04:30.030]  People moving out.
[01:04:30.170 --> 01:04:31.890]  People moving in wide.
[01:04:32.150 --> 01:04:34.470]  Because of the color of the skin.
[01:04:34.890 --> 01:04:37.970]  Run, run, run, put your show in high.
[01:04:40.270 --> 01:04:42.570]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:04:47.410 --> 01:04:50.410]  People of America, this is the President of the United States.
[01:04:50.410 --> 01:04:54.450]  You are listening to George Galloway and the mother of all talk shows.
[01:04:54.870 --> 01:04:58.490]  George is a Scotsman, unlike me, an Irishman.
[01:04:58.490 --> 01:05:03.650]  Last year, Mubarak declared George Galloway a persona non grata and threw him out of Egypt.
[01:05:03.990 --> 01:05:07.110]  Months later, he predicted the overthrow of the Egyptian regime.
[01:05:07.310 --> 01:05:12.730]  And now he foresees the fall of what he calls the Arab world's puppet presidents and corrupt kings.
[01:05:13.010 --> 01:05:19.410]  He wowed a WBAI audience at the New York Society for Ethical Culture with a speech on international politics.
[01:05:19.410 --> 01:05:27.670]  Now, he will be on the air coming to you live and taking your calls with a brand-new, hour-long program called the Mother of All talk shows.
[01:05:27.890 --> 01:05:30.010]  Tune in every Wednesday at 9 a.m.
[01:05:30.090 --> 01:05:34.090]  on WBAI 99.5 FM, following Democracy Now!
[01:05:34.470 --> 01:05:37.770]  Log on to WBAI.org for more information.
[01:05:45.630 --> 01:05:51.070]  Hi, and so you know, the WBAI Fall Membership Drive begins Wednesday, October 5th.
[01:05:51.230 --> 01:05:54.750]  We are preparing new programs to educate, entertain, and enlighten.
[01:05:54.890 --> 01:05:58.070]  Please tune in and support your radio station during the drive.
[01:05:58.330 --> 01:06:01.150]  Also, you may come down to the station and help with the pledge phones.
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[01:06:03.790 --> 01:06:07.750]  During the drive, call our pledge number, 212-209-2950.
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[01:06:17.790 --> 01:06:22.210]  Call to register entry into the building at 120 Wall Street, the 10th floor.
[01:06:22.370 --> 01:06:24.750]  We will be waiting for you with gratitude and thanks.
[01:06:28.280 --> 01:06:32.440]  And we're back, listening to Off the Hook, not the personal computer show.
[01:06:32.440 --> 01:06:33.840]  It's not on this week.
[01:06:33.880 --> 01:06:36.060]  We'll be back next week at its regular time.
[01:06:36.060 --> 01:06:42.760]  We're on for another hour, and we've got a whole bunch of people here.
[01:06:43.320 --> 01:06:46.760]  We've got John Batesall, am I pronouncing that right?
[01:06:47.120 --> 01:06:47.900]  That's correct.
[01:06:48.140 --> 01:06:50.140]  And Joe Maino, am I pronouncing that right?
[01:06:50.600 --> 01:06:51.520]  Yes, you are.
[01:06:51.740 --> 01:06:52.400]  Okay, great.
[01:06:52.400 --> 01:06:57.260]  And you guys have written the book on Legos.
[01:06:57.460 --> 01:07:01.300]  The Cult of Lego is what it's called.
[01:07:01.900 --> 01:07:05.140]  We also have our friends from MakerBot here in the studio.
[01:07:05.440 --> 01:07:13.140]  We'll get back to them in just a moment, but I want to talk to you guys more right now because your book is coming out next month for one thing.
[01:07:13.840 --> 01:07:15.140]  It's called The Cult of Lego.
[01:07:15.340 --> 01:07:17.460]  Now, how did that title come about?
[01:07:17.460 --> 01:07:20.520]  Is there, in fact, something resembling a cult surrounding Legos?
[01:07:22.980 --> 01:07:23.700]  Well, yeah.
[01:07:23.700 --> 01:07:37.360]  I just think just because you have a group of adults who are all very, very focused on something that seems a little different than what people are expecting, you know, the word could be described.
[01:07:37.360 --> 01:07:41.300]  But we certainly don't mean it in a pejorative sense.
[01:07:41.700 --> 01:07:51.740]  It's just the idea of this kooky to some group of people who are super creative and doing something amazing with these Lego bricks.
[01:07:53.280 --> 01:07:53.920]  Absolutely.
[01:07:54.560 --> 01:07:57.140]  What was your first experience with Legos?
[01:07:57.140 --> 01:07:58.540]  I'd like to ask each of you that question.
[01:08:01.240 --> 01:08:04.480]  My first experience was way back when I was much younger.
[01:08:04.640 --> 01:08:10.020]  And I am an army brat, and my dad was stationed in Germany.
[01:08:10.440 --> 01:08:12.400]  And I started playing with sets then.
[01:08:12.620 --> 01:08:16.110]  And once I came back to the States, I got out of the hobby.
[01:08:16.340 --> 01:08:17.230]  It wasn't a hobby.
[01:08:17.300 --> 01:08:17.920]  It was play.
[01:08:18.240 --> 01:08:20.990]  But I got back into the hobby in 2000.
[01:08:22.610 --> 01:08:24.610]  And since then, I haven't looked back.
[01:08:24.610 --> 01:08:27.540]  I've been building and watching ever since then.
[01:08:29.410 --> 01:08:30.040]  Incredible.
[01:08:30.280 --> 01:08:39.030]  And when did you guys realize that there were a whole lot more people like you that also had a passion for this kind of thing?
[01:08:41.530 --> 01:08:44.940]  Probably the early 2000s with the convention starting.
[01:08:45.400 --> 01:08:48.070]  There was a convention in Washington, D.C.
[01:08:48.070 --> 01:08:49.380]  that started around 2000.
[01:08:49.380 --> 01:08:51.300]  I actually attended in 2002.
[01:08:51.880 --> 01:08:56.230]  And from there, some other events started popping up around the country.
[01:08:56.230 --> 01:08:59.780]  And it became just a giant outreach for the community.
[01:09:00.320 --> 01:09:02.190]  And it continues on to now.
[01:09:02.340 --> 01:09:07.030]  In fact, I was at one of those conventions this past weekend in Seattle, Washington.
[01:09:07.400 --> 01:09:08.070]  Great time.
[01:09:08.240 --> 01:09:08.860]  Lots of people.
[01:09:10.610 --> 01:09:11.160]  Awesome.
[01:09:11.440 --> 01:09:11.690]  Okay.
[01:09:11.840 --> 01:09:21.620]  Well, again, we're offering the Lego book, The Cult of Lego, for a pledge of $50, 212-209-2950.
[01:09:21.620 --> 01:09:23.920]  How many pages is this book?
[01:09:24.730 --> 01:09:25.780]  It's over 300.
[01:09:26.660 --> 01:09:26.920]  Nice.
[01:09:27.110 --> 01:09:27.320]  Okay.
[01:09:27.990 --> 01:09:34.270]  And it's just one of a whole bunch of different Lego books that have come out over the years.
[01:09:34.270 --> 01:09:35.530]  But this is the most recent one.
[01:09:35.530 --> 01:09:38.740]  And it's also fairly comprehensive.
[01:09:38.740 --> 01:09:42.190]  And you guys obviously have a real passion for what Legos are all about.
[01:09:42.750 --> 01:09:46.960]  And I can just picture people tuning in, wondering, why are we talking about Legos?
[01:09:47.410 --> 01:09:52.270]  Well, Legos have this allure to people in the hacker community.
[01:09:52.270 --> 01:09:53.960]  It's very hard to explain.
[01:09:54.690 --> 01:09:59.150]  It's just, I guess, because you have the ability to create things, create all kinds of different things.
[01:09:59.370 --> 01:10:00.750]  And it's just very flexible.
[01:10:01.160 --> 01:10:06.160]  And go to any hacker conference and you'll find grown men and women playing with Legos.
[01:10:06.270 --> 01:10:07.190]  I don't exaggerate.
[01:10:07.250 --> 01:10:07.540]  Right, guys?
[01:10:07.770 --> 01:10:08.960]  That's really the truth.
[01:10:09.290 --> 01:10:09.830]  No, not at all.
[01:10:09.910 --> 01:10:10.500]  That's really the truth.
[01:10:10.700 --> 01:10:15.290]  So this book would definitely be a great gift for anybody who shares that kind of passion.
[01:10:15.340 --> 01:10:18.660]  Or it'd be great for yourself if you're curious about these things.
[01:10:19.150 --> 01:10:20.770]  But again, we're just offering it tonight.
[01:10:20.910 --> 01:10:22.450]  212-209-2950.
[01:10:22.660 --> 01:10:23.920]  I understand the phones are working now.
[01:10:24.080 --> 01:10:29.830]  So now is a great time to call in and pledge for $50 to get the copy of that brand new book.
[01:10:29.910 --> 01:10:30.860]  212-209-2950.
[01:10:31.490 --> 01:10:35.460]  And again, for $75, we have the MakerBot material.
[01:10:35.530 --> 01:10:36.960]  We'll be getting back into that a little bit later on.
[01:10:37.290 --> 01:10:38.770]  Four items MakerBot related.
[01:10:39.120 --> 01:10:48.190]  If you want to combine them, obviously, $125 will get you everything, including the historic picture of the events on Wall Street by Kyle.
[01:10:48.800 --> 01:10:54.200]  That will be coming your way, too, for a pledge of $125, 212-209-2950.
[01:10:54.200 --> 01:10:56.790]  Now, I understand we have some people we want to thank, Mike.
[01:10:56.920 --> 01:11:00.920]  Yeah, we want to thank Matthew, who's from Brooklyn.
[01:11:01.420 --> 01:11:02.730]  And Kyle, you have some people, too?
[01:11:03.190 --> 01:11:06.920]  Yeah, I'd like to thank Othul from Jamaica.
[01:11:07.490 --> 01:11:07.920]  Uh-huh.
[01:11:08.700 --> 01:11:09.450]  Jamaica, Queens?
[01:11:10.010 --> 01:11:10.990]  Yeah, that's in New York.
[01:11:11.230 --> 01:11:11.580]  Oh, okay.
[01:11:12.540 --> 01:11:16.620]  Michael, who's from, I'm going to pronounce this wrong, Yucaipa, California.
[01:11:18.580 --> 01:11:21.460]  I'd like to thank Harris from Staten Island.
[01:11:22.030 --> 01:11:24.450]  We want to thank Brenda from Teaneck, New Jersey.
[01:11:25.560 --> 01:11:28.500]  Also, Melissa from Dover, New Jersey.
[01:11:31.230 --> 01:11:35.540]  You have more papers than I do, so let's thank them all.
[01:11:36.120 --> 01:11:36.610]  Okay, yeah.
[01:11:36.730 --> 01:11:37.270]  Last two.
[01:11:37.650 --> 01:11:40.000]  Bruce from Bayonne, New Jersey.
[01:11:40.870 --> 01:11:42.770]  And Rolf from Sanford, Connecticut.
[01:11:43.330 --> 01:11:45.960]  And, of course, we also want to thank the people who always...
[01:11:45.960 --> 01:11:48.110]  There's always people who don't want us to say their name on the air.
[01:11:48.200 --> 01:11:48.750]  I don't know why.
[01:11:48.750 --> 01:11:50.840]  It's just their first name, but we thank you anyway.
[01:11:51.330 --> 01:11:51.570]  Yes.
[01:11:52.250 --> 01:11:55.960]  Anonymous people have kept us going, maybe they're from Anonymous.
[01:11:56.610 --> 01:11:56.920]  Maybe.
[01:11:57.450 --> 01:11:57.750]  Yeah.
[01:11:57.920 --> 01:11:58.830]  Are we supposed to play that again?
[01:11:59.000 --> 01:12:00.830]  I don't know if we're supposed to play the message again from Anonymous.
[01:12:00.830 --> 01:12:03.080]  The orders weren't clear.
[01:12:03.270 --> 01:12:03.420]  Yeah.
[01:12:03.580 --> 01:12:06.330]  They'll just come in unannounced if they want us to do that.
[01:12:07.090 --> 01:12:07.410]  Okay.
[01:12:07.570 --> 01:12:11.790]  And again, there might have been a little confusion now in the tally room as to whether the book was 50 or 75.
[01:12:11.950 --> 01:12:13.030]  I believe we're offering it for 50.
[01:12:13.160 --> 01:12:16.000]  So if you pledged 75, we'll let you know that.
[01:12:16.490 --> 01:12:17.330]  212-209-2950.
[01:12:17.330 --> 01:12:19.380]  You can always pledge more than the minimum amount.
[01:12:19.380 --> 01:12:20.290]  You can pledge more.
[01:12:20.420 --> 01:12:20.910]  That is true.
[01:12:21.200 --> 01:12:24.570]  And obviously every bit counts and it all goes to a good cause.
[01:12:24.650 --> 01:12:27.150]  212-209-2950.
[01:12:28.860 --> 01:12:34.070]  Guys, as far as the Lego book goes, how did the two of you get together to collaborate on this?
[01:12:37.020 --> 01:12:55.920]  Well, Bill Pollack, who's the publisher and owner of NoStarch, brought us together because I was a, well, am a writer and blogger interested in Lego and he had his own Lego magazine and was like deeply immersed in the community.
[01:12:56.160 --> 01:12:57.660]  So it seemed like a natural fit.
[01:12:59.490 --> 01:13:00.160]  Uh-huh.
[01:13:01.160 --> 01:13:01.460]  Great.
[01:13:03.140 --> 01:13:08.750]  And have you two actually met in person or is this a collaboration from different parts of the country?
[01:13:09.420 --> 01:13:10.790]  No, we definitely haven't met.
[01:13:11.190 --> 01:13:11.580]  Really?
[01:13:12.340 --> 01:13:12.910]  Wow.
[01:13:13.000 --> 01:13:13.650]  That's interesting.
[01:13:13.650 --> 01:13:15.990]  So you've put together a whole book and never actually met.
[01:13:16.570 --> 01:13:20.450]  Actually, my second book, which is about hackerspaces, sorry to plug that here.
[01:13:20.660 --> 01:13:21.160]  No, go ahead.
[01:13:21.250 --> 01:13:22.540]  You're writing a book on hackerspaces.
[01:13:22.650 --> 01:13:22.870]  Awesome.
[01:13:23.070 --> 01:13:23.300]  Yes.
[01:13:24.830 --> 01:13:25.840]  And it's done.
[01:13:25.990 --> 01:13:28.700]  But my editor, I never even spoke to on the phone.
[01:13:29.430 --> 01:13:31.410]  Our relationship is solely by email.
[01:13:31.790 --> 01:13:32.330]  Very strange.
[01:13:33.050 --> 01:13:37.700]  You know, a few years ago that would have been seen as incomprehensible that that can actually happen.
[01:13:37.700 --> 01:13:41.960]  But now I think it's almost the norm as far as the way people communicate and collaborate.
[01:13:42.250 --> 01:13:45.450]  And I guess it's also a testament to the way change can be made.
[01:13:45.540 --> 01:13:46.340]  It can be made electronically.
[01:13:46.340 --> 01:13:50.730]  You don't have to actually meet in person to change things.
[01:13:50.800 --> 01:13:55.880]  And I think that's a message that a lot of people today are carrying in many different ways.
[01:13:57.170 --> 01:13:58.870]  So that's really awesome, though.
[01:13:58.910 --> 01:14:01.230]  That's a real accomplishment to put that together.
[01:14:02.230 --> 01:14:09.200]  And it must feel amazing to actually have the thing in print, to actually have a book out, and to see it coming to fruition.
[01:14:09.990 --> 01:14:11.200]  I haven't actually seen it yet.
[01:14:11.570 --> 01:14:12.750]  I haven't even seen the book yet.
[01:14:12.790 --> 01:14:14.580]  It's that new that the authors have not seen it yet.
[01:14:14.830 --> 01:14:15.190]  Yeah.
[01:14:15.500 --> 01:14:16.080]  I saw it.
[01:14:16.830 --> 01:14:22.770]  It's awful neat to see something nice, a real book sitting in your hands.
[01:14:22.770 --> 01:14:25.290]  And I was very impressed with it.
[01:14:25.610 --> 01:14:25.800]  Uh-huh.
[01:14:25.920 --> 01:14:34.230]  Well, hopefully the both of you will get to hold one in your hands and feel that because it's a great feeling, obviously, when something comes out that you've worked hard on.
[01:14:35.050 --> 01:14:36.620]  So, wow.
[01:14:36.880 --> 01:14:38.990]  Anything else that you want to impart to our listeners?
[01:14:38.990 --> 01:14:44.870]  Any kind of websites or ways people can get more involved in the LEGO community?
[01:14:48.970 --> 01:14:53.950]  You can take a look at the website for the magazine, which is brickjournal.com.
[01:14:54.030 --> 01:14:56.660]  That's one word, brickjournal.com.
[01:14:57.570 --> 01:14:59.730]  If you want to see what's going on with the community.
[01:15:00.040 --> 01:15:02.500]  Also, I'm trying to think of a community place.
[01:15:02.730 --> 01:15:05.610]  Right off the bat, that would be a good place to go to.
[01:15:07.530 --> 01:15:08.410]  Brothersbrick.com.
[01:15:08.830 --> 01:15:13.570]  If you really want to see what's going on in terms of what's being built, go there.
[01:15:13.570 --> 01:15:20.380]  And that's brothers-brick.com.
[01:15:21.410 --> 01:15:21.990]  Okay.
[01:15:22.190 --> 01:15:25.200]  And John, it looks like from your area code, you're from Minnesota.
[01:15:25.200 --> 01:15:26.840]  And Joe, you're from North Carolina.
[01:15:26.840 --> 01:15:27.330]  Am I correct?
[01:15:27.660 --> 01:15:28.190]  That's correct.
[01:15:28.190 --> 01:15:28.570]  That's correct.
[01:15:28.790 --> 01:15:34.960]  And do you guys find any differences in the hacker communities or the LEGO communities in those two places?
[01:15:37.030 --> 01:15:38.150]  No, not really.
[01:15:38.150 --> 01:15:41.620]  What's interesting is that the LEGO communities...
[01:15:41.620 --> 01:15:42.160]  Oh, man.
[01:15:42.410 --> 01:15:46.410]  Over here on the East Coast, the convention I went to was on the West Coast.
[01:15:46.770 --> 01:15:48.410]  There is a difference.
[01:15:48.770 --> 01:15:58.460]  And it appears that the West Coast, by being isolated from the other side of the country, they tend to be more daring in their building.
[01:16:00.670 --> 01:16:14.030]  From my travels over in Chicago and elsewhere for other conventions, most of the models are outstanding, mind you, but there's an entirely new and different level over in the West Coast.
[01:16:14.250 --> 01:16:17.030]  And it's really, really eye-opening to see that happen.
[01:16:17.030 --> 01:16:22.500]  Now, Kyle here is from Seattle, and he seems to be cheering that on, saying that that is, in fact, true.
[01:16:22.660 --> 01:16:23.490]  Yeah, I'm sorry.
[01:16:23.580 --> 01:16:24.540]  I'll sit down.
[01:16:24.690 --> 01:16:25.880]  I'm jumping around a little bit.
[01:16:26.000 --> 01:16:26.570]  Yeah, he's jumping around as soon as he heard that.
[01:16:26.570 --> 01:16:27.450]  And waving my arms.
[01:16:27.750 --> 01:16:28.040]  Yeah.
[01:16:28.410 --> 01:16:29.700]  Well, it's a force of habit.
[01:16:29.830 --> 01:16:31.120]  Honestly, I'm not surprised, D.
[01:16:31.290 --> 01:16:31.910]  I mean, really.
[01:16:32.630 --> 01:16:33.410]  Yeah, well, no.
[01:16:33.540 --> 01:16:36.420]  I mean, people on the West Coast do tend to take things to a new extreme.
[01:16:36.420 --> 01:16:39.270]  I've noticed that, so I guess LEGOs would be no exception on that.
[01:16:39.330 --> 01:16:40.300]  I'm really excited about this.
[01:16:40.370 --> 01:16:44.920]  I want to check out the book, because I grew up on LEGOs, and at one point, they were gone.
[01:16:44.920 --> 01:16:46.490]  I don't know what happened to them.
[01:16:46.570 --> 01:16:47.960]  The LEGOs were taken from your life.
[01:16:48.190 --> 01:16:48.620]  Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
[01:16:48.700 --> 01:16:55.530]  I guess somebody decided and said, hey, you've outgrown this, and you have to read, and you have to write.
[01:16:55.750 --> 01:16:57.250]  Yeah, something happened in my house.
[01:16:57.270 --> 01:16:59.750]  There was not a LEGO shortage worldwide or anything like that.
[01:16:59.880 --> 01:17:00.120]  Yeah, exactly.
[01:17:00.290 --> 01:17:01.000]  And I don't know.
[01:17:01.040 --> 01:17:02.530]  I think this is really interesting.
[01:17:02.870 --> 01:17:13.120]  I've heard about this community a little bit, and seeing LEGO installations and various things at hacker conventions, and obviously there's kids there.
[01:17:13.650 --> 01:17:15.270]  So it's very cool.
[01:17:15.300 --> 01:17:15.960]  I want to check out the book.
[01:17:16.030 --> 01:17:25.910]  And I think it's a great intersection for play and for relating to young hackers, too, because they've got crazy imaginations, and they're building, and they want to be doing stuff that the big guys are doing.
[01:17:26.230 --> 01:17:32.750]  And I think for older people that maybe, like myself, that got lost touch, something happened.
[01:17:33.300 --> 01:17:36.990]  Someone took their LEGOs and said you had to learn cursive, or whatever it was.
[01:17:37.080 --> 01:17:37.800]  Oh, that's so sad.
[01:17:38.230 --> 01:17:38.570]  Yeah.
[01:17:38.730 --> 01:17:41.070]  I mean, it's a way for you to maybe get back into it.
[01:17:41.370 --> 01:17:42.620]  I don't know if you guys can relate.
[01:17:43.450 --> 01:17:43.920]  Yeah, totally.
[01:17:45.360 --> 01:17:52.690]  At MyHackerSpace, a lot of the guys, and women too, bring in LEGOs and stuff to work on.
[01:17:52.770 --> 01:17:57.110]  I mean, it's not like a huge thing, but there's definitely stuff going on.
[01:17:57.110 --> 01:18:04.950]  And we had a clothesline race, where it's like a cord stretched 100 feet, and you have to build a robot that goes back and forth.
[01:18:05.120 --> 01:18:13.840]  And one guy built a Mindstorms, which is a LEGO sub-brand robot that did pretty well.
[01:18:15.330 --> 01:18:15.880]  Amazing.
[01:18:16.190 --> 01:18:18.250]  Guys, one final question.
[01:18:18.730 --> 01:18:19.880]  Foreign LEGOs.
[01:18:19.950 --> 01:18:22.830]  Are LEGOs big in other countries that you know of?
[01:18:23.800 --> 01:18:24.370]  Yes.
[01:18:25.410 --> 01:18:26.650]  You seem pretty certain.
[01:18:26.650 --> 01:18:27.730]  Particularly Denmark.
[01:18:27.830 --> 01:18:28.070]  Yes.
[01:18:28.730 --> 01:18:29.910]  Particularly Denmark, yes.
[01:18:30.080 --> 01:18:30.450]  And Germany.
[01:18:31.250 --> 01:18:32.620]  Germany is the biggest market.
[01:18:33.130 --> 01:18:35.080]  Germany is the biggest market for LEGOs.
[01:18:35.300 --> 01:18:38.340]  Well then, I expect to see at least one German call in the back room.
[01:18:39.410 --> 01:18:42.290]  Are foreign LEGOs compatible with American LEGOs?
[01:18:42.290 --> 01:18:44.270]  Is there a region coding or anything like that?
[01:18:44.370 --> 01:18:44.460]  Oh, boy.
[01:18:44.460 --> 01:18:44.770]  Here we go.
[01:18:44.790 --> 01:18:45.730]  They're all in the metric system.
[01:18:46.430 --> 01:18:47.150]  Absolutely not.
[01:18:48.430 --> 01:18:48.910]  Wow.
[01:18:49.190 --> 01:18:49.990]  Absolutely not.
[01:18:50.120 --> 01:18:52.110]  Everything is compatible with everything else.
[01:18:52.250 --> 01:18:55.040]  Wouldn't it be nice if the world worked that way in other things?
[01:18:55.040 --> 01:18:58.040]  So, maybe LEGOs will lead us into more reason.
[01:18:58.910 --> 01:18:59.070]  All right.
[01:18:59.630 --> 01:19:01.650]  John, Joe, congratulations on the book.
[01:19:01.750 --> 01:19:05.340]  Thanks so much for being on the show today and for donating those copies to us.
[01:19:05.410 --> 01:19:08.270]  And I think our listeners will get great joy out of this.
[01:19:08.920 --> 01:19:09.770]  Well, thank you.
[01:19:10.000 --> 01:19:13.000]  And spread the cult of LEGO to one and all throughout the globe.
[01:19:13.890 --> 01:19:14.330]  Thank you.
[01:19:14.330 --> 01:19:14.870]  Thank you very much.
[01:19:15.030 --> 01:19:15.380]  All right.
[01:19:15.450 --> 01:19:16.290]  You guys take care then.
[01:19:16.950 --> 01:19:17.160]  All right.
[01:19:17.250 --> 01:19:17.410]  Bye.
[01:19:17.580 --> 01:19:23.700]  It's John and Joe who've both written a book on LEGOs, the cult of LEGO.
[01:19:24.080 --> 01:19:27.230]  It's pretty dramatic, pretty impressive.
[01:19:27.230 --> 01:19:32.250]  And it's yours for a pledge of $50, 212-209-2950.
[01:19:32.250 --> 01:19:34.110]  It's 212-209-2950.
[01:19:34.110 --> 01:19:36.610]  We can only offer it for the remainder of this hour.
[01:19:36.610 --> 01:19:42.960]  And we also are offering the MakerBot package for a pledge of $75.
[01:19:43.420 --> 01:19:48.920]  The two together, obviously a pledge of $125, 212-209-2950.
[01:19:48.920 --> 01:19:50.650]  All pledges $100 and above.
[01:19:51.070 --> 01:19:52.990]  Get a picture from you, Kyle.
[01:19:53.330 --> 01:19:53.500]  Yes.
[01:19:53.700 --> 01:19:54.450]  And it's a...
[01:19:54.450 --> 01:19:56.370]  Describe the picture to the folks who might not have heard it.
[01:19:56.370 --> 01:20:00.330]  I'm going to print an 11 by 17 archival digital photo.
[01:20:00.330 --> 01:20:11.420]  The content is basically a shot I took at night of every single protest poster lined up edge to edge.
[01:20:11.960 --> 01:20:18.490]  And various spectators, people walking by, sort of taking notice of them, reading them, finding out what was going on.
[01:20:18.610 --> 01:20:22.290]  And in the background, you can see the General Assembly, sort of some silhouettes.
[01:20:22.830 --> 01:20:28.690]  So it's got a good balance of dark and light and the street light sort of shining over a fence.
[01:20:28.840 --> 01:20:32.150]  You can just barely see one of the officers in the background.
[01:20:32.710 --> 01:20:34.960]  And I thought it was particularly beautiful.
[01:20:35.030 --> 01:20:37.380]  So I'm happy to share that with everyone.
[01:20:37.540 --> 01:20:41.030]  And basically, I'm going to print however many we need.
[01:20:41.070 --> 01:20:43.420]  And I'll number them and sign them.
[01:20:43.420 --> 01:20:50.110]  And they'll be your unique gift before this protest really, really got big.
[01:20:50.270 --> 01:21:00.770]  And we're thrilled to have more unions and more representation, you know, little service support people from the city, you know, sanitation crews out there keeping things clean.
[01:21:00.950 --> 01:21:07.950]  Everything's, you know, we want it to be a healthy and positive protest that's peaceful and actually makes the change people are after.
[01:21:08.810 --> 01:21:11.380]  And so this was last week when it was a bit quieter.
[01:21:11.450 --> 01:21:13.990]  And now there's just much more people out there.
[01:21:14.160 --> 01:21:17.990]  So please grab this piece of history that I've captured for you.
[01:21:18.190 --> 01:21:21.490]  Now, it's interesting because we've been visiting the site several times.
[01:21:21.690 --> 01:21:26.300]  First time we went down there, it was fairly subdued and rather small, but it still seemed to have some promise.
[01:21:26.660 --> 01:21:31.080]  Second time last week, obviously, much bigger starting to get attention.
[01:21:31.290 --> 01:21:32.340]  And that's what you captured.
[01:21:32.570 --> 01:21:33.200]  Way bigger, yeah.
[01:21:33.330 --> 01:21:35.080]  It grew substantially.
[01:21:36.110 --> 01:21:40.040]  And now, of course, it's mayhem, a good kind of a mayhem.
[01:21:40.160 --> 01:21:42.960]  But wow, the people today just simply unbelievable.
[01:21:43.110 --> 01:21:44.700]  We're going to check it out after the program as well.
[01:21:45.470 --> 01:21:47.950]  But we were looking at a bunch of shots earlier.
[01:21:48.160 --> 01:21:50.070]  Actually, we were looking at it downstairs on top of the car.
[01:21:50.230 --> 01:21:50.420]  Yes.
[01:21:51.010 --> 01:21:53.450]  On your laptop, going through various pictures.
[01:21:54.610 --> 01:21:57.500]  And I didn't tell you which one I thought you liked.
[01:21:57.500 --> 01:21:59.290]  You didn't tell me which one you thought you liked.
[01:21:59.290 --> 01:21:59.540]  Mm-hmm.
[01:21:59.540 --> 01:22:00.770]  And we both picked the same picture.
[01:22:01.040 --> 01:22:02.230]  And that's the one we're offering tonight.
[01:22:02.460 --> 01:22:07.110]  Because it just captured the essence of what was going on down there.
[01:22:07.270 --> 01:22:15.460]  The spirit of rebellion and organization and the law kind of keeping an eye from the background.
[01:22:15.660 --> 01:22:16.500]  So it really...
[01:22:16.500 --> 01:22:17.160]  It's cool.
[01:22:17.200 --> 01:22:18.040]  And it's taken at night, too.
[01:22:18.120 --> 01:22:18.910]  So it's a night photo.
[01:22:19.530 --> 01:22:19.950]  And it's...
[01:22:19.950 --> 01:22:22.620]  I think it's something that you'll remember for a very, very long time.
[01:22:22.620 --> 01:22:23.840]  212-209-2950.
[01:22:24.660 --> 01:22:27.200]  Any pledge over $100 gets you this picture.
[01:22:27.580 --> 01:22:27.910]  Yeah.
[01:22:28.000 --> 01:22:29.250]  I enjoy editing that way.
[01:22:29.420 --> 01:22:31.160]  And, you know, kind of getting what somebody else thinks.
[01:22:31.200 --> 01:22:32.750]  And doing sort of a blind vote.
[01:22:33.290 --> 01:22:34.830]  And then comparing notes.
[01:22:35.080 --> 01:22:37.110]  And it's a very quiet photo.
[01:22:37.530 --> 01:22:47.120]  It's not, you know, people shouting and screaming, you know, and some sort of dichotomy between force and protest.
[01:22:47.450 --> 01:22:48.380]  It's a bit quieter.
[01:22:48.380 --> 01:22:53.410]  It's sort of the nighttime kind of, you know, the slowness that it takes.
[01:22:53.650 --> 01:22:56.790]  And just a slice of their life and sort of in my own aesthetic.
[01:22:56.870 --> 01:22:57.290]  Well, it was...
[01:22:57.290 --> 01:22:58.270]  It was pretty active.
[01:22:58.650 --> 01:22:58.800]  Absolutely.
[01:22:58.800 --> 01:23:00.660]  It wasn't just people mellowing out.
[01:23:00.790 --> 01:23:01.620]  It was...
[01:23:01.620 --> 01:23:04.160]  Yeah, like you say, it wasn't a lot of chanting and confrontation.
[01:23:04.200 --> 01:23:06.410]  It was basically what it always is.
[01:23:06.540 --> 01:23:11.750]  A community of people just gathered together, sharing information, and open to the public.
[01:23:12.370 --> 01:23:17.410]  And, yeah, it's, again, yours, 11x17 print for a pledge of 100 or above.
[01:23:17.910 --> 01:23:21.490]  Or the Cult of the Lego book, Cult of the Lego for a pledge of 50.
[01:23:22.010 --> 01:23:24.120]  The MakerBot package, pledge of 75.
[01:23:24.850 --> 01:23:25.950]  The Off the Hook archive.
[01:23:25.950 --> 01:23:26.990]  Yes, we are offering that.
[01:23:27.190 --> 01:23:33.300]  Every program we've done from 1988 on through 2010 for a pledge of $50.
[01:23:33.580 --> 01:23:35.380]  212-209-2950.
[01:23:35.380 --> 01:23:38.120]  Again, any pledge 100 or above gets the photograph as well.
[01:23:38.120 --> 01:23:47.830]  Coming back to the studio now, we are once again joining Farrah McCann, Matt Griffin, Matt Richardson from the MakerBot Project.
[01:23:48.160 --> 01:23:53.800]  And also joining us on the phone to talk about the MakerBot Project is Michael Weinberg.
[01:23:54.040 --> 01:23:55.030]  Michael, are you with us?
[01:23:55.540 --> 01:23:55.990]  I am.
[01:23:56.080 --> 01:23:56.270]  Hello.
[01:23:56.270 --> 01:24:05.540]  Now, you wrote a paper, a rather celebrated paper, I believe, on the legal issues regarding 3D printing.
[01:24:05.920 --> 01:24:07.800]  You want to tell us something about what that's all about?
[01:24:08.400 --> 01:24:08.920]  Sure.
[01:24:09.200 --> 01:24:20.830]  So, my organization, Public Knowledge, we're in Washington, and we're thinking a lot about policy issues, and especially policy issues that would get in the way of amazing, innovative things.
[01:24:21.190 --> 01:24:36.420]  And so, when we saw all this awesome 3D printing stuff starting to bubble up, we thought, well, this is so good that at some point in Washington, someone's going to come in and say, this is bad, it needs to be stopped, just as it's happened, you know,
[01:24:36.530 --> 01:24:38.270]  any number of times in the past.
[01:24:38.570 --> 01:24:53.620]  And so, the first step of getting ahead of something like that is first to kind of sit down and think, well, what does this mean, and how would this go wrong, how would this go right, and what can we do to make sure that it goes right and doesn't go wrong?
[01:24:55.230 --> 01:24:55.650]  Okay.
[01:24:57.410 --> 01:25:00.110]  And now, when was this paper you wrote?
[01:25:00.250 --> 01:25:00.910]  When was that put out?
[01:25:00.910 --> 01:25:06.250]  The paper was put out actually about this time last year, I think November of last year.
[01:25:06.420 --> 01:25:15.160]  And it was designed really to think through some of the intellectual property issues, so the copyright issues, the trademark issues, a little bit of the patent issues.
[01:25:15.300 --> 01:25:19.950]  I mean, as you can imagine, these MakerBots, these 3D printers are amazing, but they reproduce things.
[01:25:20.250 --> 01:25:25.030]  And so, computers, when they reproduce things, get people a little bit concerned.
[01:25:25.030 --> 01:25:31.110]  And the 3D printers have the possibility of getting people a little bit concerned by reproducing things.
[01:25:31.110 --> 01:25:41.540]  Well, I can only imagine, because look at all the fuss that's being raised over reproducing music, reproducing film, TV shows, copying files from one place to another.
[01:25:41.750 --> 01:25:46.750]  And now you guys are going on copying actual physical objects.
[01:25:47.610 --> 01:25:49.690]  I can only imagine where this is going to lead.
[01:25:49.690 --> 01:26:00.990]  What, so far, have been some of the most egregious examples of things that people might be asking questions about, whether or not this could be legal?
[01:26:01.910 --> 01:26:02.080]  Farr?
[01:26:02.500 --> 01:26:03.190]  Go ahead.
[01:26:03.490 --> 01:26:04.270]  Farr, go ahead.
[01:26:05.170 --> 01:26:05.830]  Farr, go ahead.
[01:26:05.990 --> 01:26:06.150]  Farr, go ahead.
[01:26:06.150 --> 01:26:12.150]  There's actually, there's an interesting discussion going right now on the Thingiverse website, where people, you know, they can upload anything they want.
[01:26:12.340 --> 01:26:16.200]  Well, recently, some people have started uploading models of weapons.
[01:26:16.420 --> 01:26:18.420]  Some people have started uploading models of locks.
[01:26:18.990 --> 01:26:27.230]  And right now, there's a poll open, there's a rolling discussion in the community of, do we want people to be able to model weapons and just put them up on our website to share with other people?
[01:26:28.030 --> 01:26:30.420]  And, you know, you get to some interesting areas there.
[01:26:30.420 --> 01:26:34.110]  And these aren't just, you know, models that look like.
[01:26:34.270 --> 01:26:43.830]  These are actually things that can be used as, you know... I remember reading that one user was saying, oh, I use this cartridge in my gun.
[01:26:44.270 --> 01:26:44.830]  Okay.
[01:26:45.490 --> 01:26:46.040]  Wow.
[01:26:46.460 --> 01:26:51.530]  So does that kind of thing bug you as far as what people might use MakerBots for?
[01:26:51.840 --> 01:26:53.120]  Well, it's complicated.
[01:26:53.410 --> 01:27:00.120]  It's actually been a posted guideline from the very beginning of Thingiverse, which actually slightly predates MakerBot.
[01:27:00.830 --> 01:27:04.830]  Saying, you know, the world has enough weapons, don't post them here.
[01:27:06.790 --> 01:27:14.990]  So, I mean, particularly, you know, the architects of Thingiverse were not super excited about that and have, in the past, encouraged people to pull them down.
[01:27:15.450 --> 01:27:19.250]  Some users really want to put them up because they say, this is what we're doing, this is what we're excited about.
[01:27:20.170 --> 01:27:30.500]  It's a complicated debate, not just because of, you know, what, you know, that these are weapons, but also, like, what kind of distribution is this?
[01:27:30.600 --> 01:27:33.000]  What is that saying to the world about these kind of tools?
[01:27:33.020 --> 01:27:37.950]  Is that going to kind of skew the discussion into unhelpful territory?
[01:27:38.790 --> 01:27:39.480]  I see.
[01:27:39.700 --> 01:27:40.000]  Wow.
[01:27:41.070 --> 01:27:46.080]  These are discussions, I guess, we're looking at for the future, things that will be talked about for decades.
[01:27:46.250 --> 01:27:51.760]  I mean, MakerBot is bound to just keep improving as far as the way that you produce things.
[01:27:51.760 --> 01:27:55.290]  Like, right now, what are the raw materials that you need to create things with MakerBots?
[01:27:56.260 --> 01:28:06.800]  Well, we have ABS plastic and PLA, which is a biodegradable cornstarch-based plastic, as the sort of feedstock.
[01:28:06.800 --> 01:28:13.920]  And we have it manufactured in filaments at two different gauges, 3mm and 1.75mm.
[01:28:14.060 --> 01:28:18.600]  This is a pretty common approach to how to do additive 3D printing.
[01:28:19.620 --> 01:28:20.600]  Also, frosting?
[01:28:20.600 --> 01:28:23.080]  Oh, there are also...
[01:28:23.080 --> 01:28:28.420]  Well, these tools are designed to be hacked and extended, and there are a number of other toolheads.
[01:28:28.560 --> 01:28:33.580]  There's a pinplotter toolhead, and there's a frostrooter, a frosting toolhead that...
[01:28:33.580 --> 01:28:36.960]  It's a syringe hooked to an air compressor.
[01:28:37.180 --> 01:28:40.100]  You can actually print in any sort of gel you want.
[01:28:40.300 --> 01:28:44.580]  Yes, frosting, which was sort of the first idea because we had a cupcake printer.
[01:28:44.580 --> 01:28:49.910]  But also, you can use precious metal clays, ceramics, Nutella.
[01:28:50.520 --> 01:28:54.260]  You know, I think I saw the cupcake printer at NYC Resistor.
[01:28:54.380 --> 01:28:55.290]  They had one there, didn't they?
[01:28:55.500 --> 01:28:56.960]  And they were making cupcakes with it, right?
[01:28:57.260 --> 01:28:58.330]  Is that what you can do with these things?
[01:28:58.330 --> 01:29:07.220]  It gets confusing because you can bake cookies on it and frost them, actual cookies to eat, though maybe it's not advised.
[01:29:08.020 --> 01:29:11.100]  You can make plastic cupcakes that are really cool.
[01:29:11.290 --> 01:29:18.370]  And now you can make two-color, you know, these multicolor prints, frosted cupcakes on a thing-o-matic.
[01:29:18.370 --> 01:29:24.250]  So, yes, you can make cupcakes and baked goods in a manual.
[01:29:24.500 --> 01:29:25.140]  Yes, go ahead.
[01:29:25.870 --> 01:29:33.680]  I just wanted to point out that the ABS plastic material that a maker bot can use is an extremely strong and resilient material.
[01:29:33.680 --> 01:29:39.220]  People may remember the old desktop telephone sets made by Wessner Electric that were, like, virtually indestructible.
[01:29:39.870 --> 01:29:40.340]  They were...
[01:29:40.340 --> 01:29:42.040]  Those were...
[01:29:42.040 --> 01:29:44.800]  Externally, they were made out of ABS plastic.
[01:29:44.800 --> 01:29:48.680]  So, you can make some really strong things with a maker bot.
[01:29:48.840 --> 01:29:56.920]  I mean, as you heard, there's different materials you can use, but ABS is one of them, and it's an interesting material, and it can be very strong.
[01:29:58.030 --> 01:30:07.460]  Now, what do you guys see as far as new materials that might be used in years, decades ahead as far as the evolution of maker bots?
[01:30:07.620 --> 01:30:12.620]  Like, what kinds of things can't we make now that perhaps we're looking towards making?
[01:30:13.960 --> 01:30:15.160]  Not including weapons.
[01:30:15.460 --> 01:30:35.500]  Well, I mean, the main hope with the maker bot 3D printers has been to make a tool for, you know, individuals to have on their desktop to create things and have, like, really fast feedback loops so they can, you know, prototype something or they can make something and use it right there.
[01:30:36.480 --> 01:30:45.840]  And we stuck with a smaller build envelope of basically, like, 5 inches by 5 inches by 5 inches because that's the easiest sort of scale to work at.
[01:30:45.950 --> 01:30:53.560]  You can actually have an open bot that's, you know, you can watch all the workings and not get too upset about drafts.
[01:30:53.640 --> 01:30:59.120]  So, you want to get it out of the air conditioner if you can help it, not get it sort of slammed with drafts.
[01:30:59.120 --> 01:31:13.830]  Well, you could perhaps use in the future, you know, metals and all sorts of other substances, higher temperature plastics, you know, acrylic, et cetera.
[01:31:13.830 --> 01:31:26.680]  But right now, those require such different heating environments and are so much more toxic on your desktop than ABS and PLA that we haven't really been focusing on those.
[01:31:26.760 --> 01:31:28.120]  But we look into everything.
[01:31:28.560 --> 01:31:30.790]  I mean, that's sort of the spirit of maker bot.
[01:31:30.950 --> 01:31:34.870]  We're constantly investigating all the elements and trying to fold things in.
[01:31:34.980 --> 01:31:37.300]  And, hey, our users are going even further.
[01:31:37.520 --> 01:31:41.790]  Will the day come where a maker bot can make another maker bot?
[01:31:42.630 --> 01:31:44.960]  Well, that day came quite a while ago.
[01:31:45.220 --> 01:31:46.040]  Oh, we missed it.
[01:31:46.870 --> 01:31:48.520]  The maker bots are replicating themselves.
[01:31:48.790 --> 01:31:49.960]  Oh, boy, this is kind of scary.
[01:31:50.300 --> 01:31:57.380]  In fact, one of our users just gave us his 3D-printed cupcake that he, you know, took a couple of weeks to put together.
[01:31:57.890 --> 01:32:01.380]  But that model's been up for, I guess, over a year and a half now?
[01:32:01.620 --> 01:32:02.380]  Yeah, I think so.
[01:32:02.520 --> 01:32:05.700]  So, it's really amazing that he made a cupcake on a cupcake in little pieces.
[01:32:05.960 --> 01:32:07.660]  And they all slot together and all fit together.
[01:32:07.700 --> 01:32:08.750]  And then he glued them all together.
[01:32:09.020 --> 01:32:10.250]  And then he had two cupcakes.
[01:32:10.710 --> 01:32:11.960]  Now, we're not talking about cup.
[01:32:12.040 --> 01:32:13.760]  We're talking about the model called the cupcake.
[01:32:14.000 --> 01:32:14.040]  Yeah, the model of the cupcake model.
[01:32:14.080 --> 01:32:15.140]  Okay, I don't want to confuse people here.
[01:32:15.220 --> 01:32:16.980]  You're talking about frosting and all kinds of things like that.
[01:32:17.060 --> 01:32:20.870]  But you're talking about an actual maker bot created another maker bot.
[01:32:20.980 --> 01:32:25.880]  Now, wouldn't that put you guys out of business because everyone's making their own instead of buying them?
[01:32:26.600 --> 01:32:28.220]  You know, there is that threat.
[01:32:28.250 --> 01:32:31.910]  But I think the more interesting thing is we want everybody to have one of these.
[01:32:32.060 --> 01:32:34.880]  And if we're doing our job right, we're making the best and the coolest one.
[01:32:35.120 --> 01:32:40.640]  And if we stop making the best and coolest one and somebody else beats us to it, that's, you know, that's sort of our ball to drop.
[01:32:40.640 --> 01:32:41.620]  Are you listening, record companies?
[01:32:41.750 --> 01:32:51.460]  Because this is the kind of philosophy that I think is the business model for the future, basically being open and sharing and not worrying so much about the bottom line.
[01:32:51.460 --> 01:32:57.460]  Because I think you guys seem to be doing all right as far as getting out there and having people respond enthusiastically.
[01:32:57.700 --> 01:33:01.080]  Yeah, there are a lot of companies that are following the lead of maker bot.
[01:33:01.250 --> 01:33:05.660]  And where I work at makezine.com, we've been following companies like maker bot.
[01:33:05.880 --> 01:33:07.200]  For example, OpenPCR.
[01:33:07.410 --> 01:33:09.980]  It's just like maker bot except it's for DNA replication.
[01:33:10.380 --> 01:33:13.450]  You can get a kit to replicate DNA in your home.
[01:33:14.260 --> 01:33:18.520]  OpenROV, which is an open source underwater remote operated vehicle.
[01:33:18.520 --> 01:33:24.380]  If you've got underwater area you want to explore, you've got an open source plan to do it.
[01:33:24.450 --> 01:33:26.540]  I think people are following the lead of maker bot.
[01:33:26.660 --> 01:33:28.480]  And they're going out and they're putting their stuff out there.
[01:33:28.560 --> 01:33:30.920]  And they're selling it and also just giving away the plans.
[01:33:31.180 --> 01:33:33.600]  I think people are starting to realize this is not just kid stuff here.
[01:33:33.720 --> 01:33:35.300]  Yeah, this is the real thing.
[01:33:35.410 --> 01:33:38.000]  We can do all kinds of DNA underwater.
[01:33:39.690 --> 01:33:40.960]  It boggles the imagination.
[01:33:41.220 --> 01:33:43.600]  I did want to loop Michael Weinberg back into the conversation.
[01:33:43.620 --> 01:33:46.680]  What are the legal implications of people building their own submarines?
[01:33:48.520 --> 01:33:50.040]  There's going to be fun everywhere.
[01:33:50.290 --> 01:33:52.720]  Everyone will be enjoying themselves and exploring the ocean.
[01:33:52.870 --> 01:33:53.910]  There's no problem, right?
[01:33:54.660 --> 01:33:56.870]  Yeah, well, it's like exploring the universe.
[01:33:56.870 --> 01:33:58.420]  In fact, it's more mysterious than what I hear.
[01:33:59.300 --> 01:34:00.370]  I guess now we'll find out.
[01:34:00.800 --> 01:34:01.520]  Go ahead, Bernie.
[01:34:02.260 --> 01:34:05.830]  Michael, I just wanted to ask, what do you see as some of the challenges ahead?
[01:34:05.830 --> 01:34:20.880]  And how do we can, you know, circumvent them with regard to, you know, corporations trying to influence our lawmakers into outlawing people's ability to replicate three-dimensional objects?
[01:34:21.840 --> 01:34:24.680]  What are some of the big issues that we need to be concerned about?
[01:34:25.370 --> 01:34:29.100]  You know, I mean, I think there are two things that you need to think about first.
[01:34:29.260 --> 01:34:31.980]  And the first thing is actually from the community standpoint.
[01:34:31.980 --> 01:34:50.870]  And the problem that the community will have, at least in this context, is after, you know, a decade, two decades of thinking about disruptive things happening online, almost everyone thinks about the world through this copyright lens, where once something is created,
[01:34:51.020 --> 01:34:59.950]  that sort of a digital object, you know, a song or an article or a picture or a movie, there's automatically, it's automatically wrapped up in this copyright protection.
[01:34:59.950 --> 01:35:05.660]  So if anyone else wants to use it or access or do anything with it, they need to ask permission.
[01:35:06.180 --> 01:35:10.220]  But copyright doesn't always extend to the physical world.
[01:35:10.290 --> 01:35:13.580]  That's the world that we're talking about with these MakerBots and with the 3D printing.
[01:35:13.870 --> 01:35:19.370]  So if I write a song, the second it's made, it's created, it's protected by copyright.
[01:35:19.640 --> 01:35:28.760]  If I build an object, especially an object that does something useful, it is not at birth protected by some sort of IP right.
[01:35:28.960 --> 01:35:35.180]  And that means I don't even need to get permission from the guy who made it in order to use it.
[01:35:35.330 --> 01:35:44.300]  So there is automatically this loosening of all these legally binding things around creation.
[01:35:44.680 --> 01:35:47.520]  And that's going to be a big deal going forward.
[01:35:47.520 --> 01:36:01.450]  But the first people that need to wrap their mind around that, and it's hard, it's hard even for me, because I worry about copyright stuff all the time at work, is to remember that sometimes with the physical objects, you don't need to get permission for that.
[01:36:02.370 --> 01:36:03.160]  And the other...
[01:36:03.160 --> 01:36:03.680]  Oh, go ahead.
[01:36:03.790 --> 01:36:04.140]  Go ahead.
[01:36:04.250 --> 01:36:04.540]  No, go ahead.
[01:36:04.540 --> 01:36:24.370]  And the other thing that is going to be a big deal, and this is actually something that we did earlier in the spring, we held an event called 3DDC that was bringing all these 3D printers to DC and introducing them to policymakers, is that there are going to be a lot of questions that are raised by 3D printing,
[01:36:24.370 --> 01:36:27.000]  like the guns that we were talking about earlier.
[01:36:27.420 --> 01:36:33.080]  And those questions, sometimes they're new, because they have to do with 3D printing.
[01:36:33.370 --> 01:36:39.080]  And sometimes they're not new, but they're just, they're hard questions anyway, right?
[01:36:39.180 --> 01:36:46.300]  I mean, right now, today, I can, for better or worse, I can download the schematics for a machine gun.
[01:36:46.420 --> 01:36:50.140]  And if I have access to a machine shop, I can make that gun.
[01:36:50.420 --> 01:37:05.460]  So the fact that I can download those schematics and print them on my MakerBot, which there, I'm sure there are fewer MakerBots in the world than there are machine shops in this country, then that is not necessarily a fundamentally new question.
[01:37:05.910 --> 01:37:12.500]  But it freaks people out sometimes, and because it involves MakerBot and 3D printing, it kind of gets brought up again.
[01:37:12.700 --> 01:37:29.290]  So to remind people that some of these big deals are going to be big deals, but some of them are big deals that have been around for a long time, and they aren't necessarily new, and they don't necessarily require new special rules around MakerBots and what 3D printers are allowed to print.
[01:37:29.790 --> 01:37:33.520]  That's very interesting points, Michael, as far as that goes.
[01:37:33.660 --> 01:37:42.290]  And yeah, I think any form of technology that is developed can be used for good, can be used for bad, can be used for important things or trivial things.
[01:37:42.450 --> 01:37:56.980]  It's the nature of technology, and I don't want to get too bogged down worrying about what might people do, because I hear that all the time, of what someone could have done had they destroyed all the files in the computer system they were on or with the computer or with the phone they were using.
[01:37:57.410 --> 01:38:04.220]  And we need to not live in the what ifs so much and focus on the potential, the good potential.
[01:38:04.520 --> 01:38:13.880]  One of the things I worry about, and I'm glad groups like Public Knowledge are around dealing with, are what happens when somebody sends me a DMCA notice for printing out replacement parts for my blinds.
[01:38:14.120 --> 01:38:20.840]  That's kind of what my concern is, that some companies are going to realize, hey, we can make this lamp, but they can make it at home for the same price.
[01:38:21.020 --> 01:38:22.060]  Where'd our profit go?
[01:38:22.260 --> 01:38:23.290]  Hey, let's do this.
[01:38:23.380 --> 01:38:25.830]  Let's outlaw making any lamp that looks like ours.
[01:38:25.980 --> 01:38:26.790]  Yeah, that's going to happen.
[01:38:26.920 --> 01:38:32.500]  I mean, we live in a world filled with crazy patents and and takedown notices and things like that.
[01:38:32.600 --> 01:38:40.450]  So they're going to say that you can't print this particular spiral thing because we did that and that's ours and it's our intellectual property or our real property or whatever.
[01:38:40.920 --> 01:38:42.450]  So yeah, there are going to be some battles ahead.
[01:38:42.540 --> 01:38:49.380]  Have there been any legal types that have sprung forward to stand with you guys when that day comes?
[01:38:50.410 --> 01:38:53.120]  You don't have to name their names, but I see you're not.
[01:38:53.340 --> 01:38:54.060]  Yeah, definitely.
[01:38:54.620 --> 01:39:04.200]  You know, this is a really interesting issue for a lot of folks, you know, lawyers, et cetera, policymakers.
[01:39:04.840 --> 01:39:09.380]  And there are folks probably on both sides really itching for a fight.
[01:39:09.580 --> 01:39:15.830]  We're hoping to kind of protect the rhetoric and try to not send this into a kind of place.
[01:39:15.830 --> 01:39:21.910]  If you look at something like the strange rhetoric around like video game, you know, ratings, that kind of thing.
[01:39:22.000 --> 01:39:34.580]  That's what we want to prevent happening so that there's like an intelligent discussion about, you know, what it means to make an object, what it means to have control over a tool to make something you need.
[01:39:34.980 --> 01:39:41.300]  Okay, I'm told I'm being remiss in not giving out the phone number and not letting people know the amazing deal that we're offering tonight.
[01:39:41.480 --> 01:39:42.260]  I'm sorry about that.
[01:39:42.370 --> 01:39:43.980]  Let's get back to work here.
[01:39:44.560 --> 01:39:46.960]  The number is 212-209-2950.
[01:39:46.960 --> 01:39:53.870]  What the good folks here with MakerBot have done is put together a package for WBI listeners for a pledge of $75.
[01:39:54.450 --> 01:39:57.620]  You will get an object that was made by a real life MakerBot.
[01:39:57.880 --> 01:39:58.540]  That's right.
[01:39:59.000 --> 01:40:03.790]  All kinds of fascinating, interesting things are created every day on MakerBots.
[01:40:03.960 --> 01:40:07.480]  And I'm learning it could be ruled one day that that object that you'll get is illegal.
[01:40:07.480 --> 01:40:08.800]  You won't be able to get another one.
[01:40:08.950 --> 01:40:09.920]  That's possible.
[01:40:10.460 --> 01:40:12.600]  Well, you're assuming that we lose this battle.
[01:40:12.960 --> 01:40:15.880]  Hopefully, we'll win the battle and you can make all kinds of things on MakerBot.
[01:40:15.960 --> 01:40:21.060]  Imagine making a new heart for yourself to replace one if it gives out, you know, things like that.
[01:40:21.250 --> 01:40:28.060]  It looks like science fiction, but imagine how this would look to somebody who lived back in 1986, you know, back in the caveman neighbors.
[01:40:28.950 --> 01:40:30.600]  They are printing organs right now.
[01:40:30.750 --> 01:40:31.720]  They're printing organs.
[01:40:31.870 --> 01:40:31.880]  Oh, yeah.
[01:40:32.080 --> 01:40:33.250]  Let's pick that up in a second.
[01:40:33.340 --> 01:40:36.180]  Let me finish with what the MakerBot package includes.
[01:40:36.340 --> 01:40:40.620]  Okay, so you get something that was created by a MakerBot.
[01:40:41.100 --> 01:40:48.220]  You also get a MakerBot t-shirt, not created by a MakerBot, created by a human somewhere or a machine somewhere, but not a MakerBot.
[01:40:48.560 --> 01:40:55.140]  You also get the Arduino, which allows you to build all kinds of cool, unique devices.
[01:40:55.420 --> 01:40:57.140]  Your imagination is the only limit.
[01:40:57.460 --> 01:41:05.180]  And in case your imagination is limited in your eyes, you have a book that explains what you can do with an Arduino.
[01:41:05.830 --> 01:41:13.870]  So you get four items, a book about Arduinos, you get the Arduino itself, you get an item made by a MakerBot, and you get a MakerBot t-shirt.
[01:41:14.020 --> 01:41:15.950]  212-209-2950.
[01:41:16.250 --> 01:41:18.100]  Pledge of $75 gets you that.
[01:41:18.260 --> 01:41:21.560]  Pledge of $50 gets you the Cult of Lego book we were talking about earlier.
[01:41:22.000 --> 01:41:30.100]  And a pledge of $125 gets you both of the above, plus the historic picture of the events on Wall Street by our own Kyle.
[01:41:30.540 --> 01:41:32.450]  212-209-2950.
[01:41:32.450 --> 01:41:37.080]  I cannot see how many calls are coming in or how many calls are not coming in, because that part of the system is down.
[01:41:37.250 --> 01:41:41.560]  But I understand that the phones themselves are working, and we're just over the 1,000 mark.
[01:41:41.950 --> 01:41:43.380]  We need to build that number up.
[01:41:43.450 --> 01:41:45.500]  We need to multiply that by at least two, maybe three.
[01:41:45.950 --> 01:41:48.140]  212-209-2950.
[01:41:48.140 --> 01:41:50.660]  This is indeed a unique thing that we're offering here tonight.
[01:41:50.750 --> 01:41:51.560]  Never done this before.
[01:41:51.840 --> 01:41:56.410]  And it's really an incredible thing to be talking about this.
[01:41:56.540 --> 01:41:59.830]  I feel like I'm on the border between fact and fiction.
[01:42:00.060 --> 01:42:02.020]  212-209-2950.
[01:42:02.340 --> 01:42:09.580]  The other thing I want to let our listeners know is that the folks from MakerBot donated their package, and the folks from NoStarch donated the book.
[01:42:09.910 --> 01:42:14.200]  And 19 minutes from now, we won't be able to ask them for any more.
[01:42:14.330 --> 01:42:18.500]  So if you're listening and you're on the fence, you can't think, oh, I'll decide tomorrow.
[01:42:18.790 --> 01:42:21.800]  If you're listening in the future, then sorry, you missed it.
[01:42:22.040 --> 01:42:26.760]  If you're listening in the present, 212-209-2950, that's the number to call.
[01:42:27.020 --> 01:42:29.840]  And you really should hurry up and do so.
[01:42:29.950 --> 01:42:32.160]  People get very angry at us for a number of reasons.
[01:42:32.290 --> 01:42:38.800]  But one of the reasons they get angry at us is when we can't offer these deals to people who listen to us on delay.
[01:42:39.330 --> 01:42:42.620]  In other words, they're listening to us sometime tomorrow, Thursday.
[01:42:42.830 --> 01:42:43.560]  If it's Thursday, hello.
[01:42:44.450 --> 01:42:45.480]  Happy Thursday to you.
[01:42:45.620 --> 01:42:49.750]  But unfortunately, it's going to be a sad Thursday because you can't get these items.
[01:42:49.880 --> 01:43:02.500]  The reason for that, the reason for that is because, imagine, if we offered this all the time, it would just be like sand going through one of those things that sand goes through, whatever that time capsule.
[01:43:02.500 --> 01:43:03.020]  An hourglass?
[01:43:03.220 --> 01:43:03.560]  Hourglass.
[01:43:03.680 --> 01:43:03.920]  Thank you.
[01:43:04.000 --> 01:43:04.790]  I haven't used one in a while.
[01:43:05.250 --> 01:43:10.100]  And it was just... everything would just disappear because it's such an amazing offer.
[01:43:10.560 --> 01:43:18.080]  And this way, we know that the people are actually listening to the radio program and not simply everybody in the world because that could happen.
[01:43:18.580 --> 01:43:21.480]  And it's really hard to keep track of.
[01:43:21.580 --> 01:43:22.700]  It could happen weeks from now.
[01:43:22.840 --> 01:43:27.580]  You know, if we give it out to somebody tomorrow, well, why not somebody next week?
[01:43:27.660 --> 01:43:28.640]  Why not somebody next month?
[01:43:29.290 --> 01:43:31.500]  We have to have some kind of boundary.
[01:43:31.500 --> 01:43:33.100]  And this is the boundary.
[01:43:33.370 --> 01:43:36.800]  You know, it's sad if you live on the other side of the world.
[01:43:37.020 --> 01:43:38.880]  And our daytime is your nighttime.
[01:43:39.700 --> 01:43:43.450]  But, you know, sometimes sacrifices need to be made.
[01:43:43.540 --> 01:43:48.790]  And you could listen live or just call live or have somebody call for you and pledge.
[01:43:48.950 --> 01:43:49.840]  That's how it works.
[01:43:50.140 --> 01:43:51.680]  212-209-2950.
[01:43:51.950 --> 01:43:55.720]  There's lots of nocturnal hackers who are up now in other parts of the world.
[01:43:55.870 --> 01:43:56.450]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:43:56.830 --> 01:44:01.120]  And we have this thing called a stream so you can listen live even if you're not in New York.
[01:44:01.120 --> 01:44:03.680]  Yeah, that's an amazing thing we didn't have years ago.
[01:44:03.910 --> 01:44:05.520]  It used to be only people in New York could listen.
[01:44:05.840 --> 01:44:11.580]  We were one of the first radio programs that you could download on the internet and listen to at your leisure.
[01:44:11.720 --> 01:44:14.680]  And that was considered, like, really radically amazing at the time.
[01:44:14.840 --> 01:44:18.910]  And now we're talking about building organs, which we're going to get into in just a moment.
[01:44:18.960 --> 01:44:19.910]  I haven't forgotten about that.
[01:44:20.060 --> 01:44:21.700]  But let's see some phone calls come in.
[01:44:21.830 --> 01:44:23.840]  212-209-2950.
[01:44:24.290 --> 01:44:26.080]  We're offering items from MakerBot.
[01:44:26.180 --> 01:44:27.790]  We're offering items about Legos.
[01:44:27.790 --> 01:44:29.520]  We're offering historic photographs.
[01:44:29.520 --> 01:44:31.640]  We're even offering the Off the Hook archive.
[01:44:31.870 --> 01:44:40.300]  You can ask the friendly tally person at the other end of 212-209-2950 for a rundown of the various items that we're offering.
[01:44:40.620 --> 01:44:44.960]  It's really an incredible thing that we're doing here in these two hours.
[01:44:45.140 --> 01:44:48.290]  212-209-2950.
[01:44:48.750 --> 01:44:52.380]  Now, Matt, I believe you said something about making organs.
[01:44:53.380 --> 01:44:55.330]  Tell us, please, what that's all about.
[01:44:56.550 --> 01:44:57.180]  Kyle, yes.
[01:44:57.290 --> 01:45:02.040]  No, I want to know about this, because I heard that open PCR was mentioned.
[01:45:02.260 --> 01:45:06.700]  And I actually got the opportunity a while ago to sit in on an interview with those guys.
[01:45:07.120 --> 01:45:14.910]  And I'm interested in, you know, you're talking about gels and the resolutions of your ability to print.
[01:45:15.120 --> 01:45:16.660]  Is this something guys are really, like, entertaining?
[01:45:16.910 --> 01:45:19.380]  Will we be able to, like, print skin graphs at some point?
[01:45:19.450 --> 01:45:21.260]  Because I know this is happening, right?
[01:45:21.420 --> 01:45:23.100]  It's something that's done in labs.
[01:45:23.100 --> 01:45:26.600]  But is this going to be democratized, kind of, in the way you've democratized things?
[01:45:27.220 --> 01:45:28.300]  Oh, that's interesting.
[01:45:28.480 --> 01:45:31.020]  Well, there's a lot of biohacking going out there.
[01:45:31.020 --> 01:45:33.960]  And there's a lot of, you know, research.
[01:45:35.040 --> 01:45:55.100]  And in fact, there are some of the cupcakes, early cupcakes, apparently were purchased and retrofitted for doing this kind of, like, develop, you know, stem cell experiments and work with developing tissues, though they didn't tell us at all what they did.
[01:45:55.290 --> 01:46:00.160]  I don't know how democratized that stuff is going to be for a while.
[01:46:00.380 --> 01:46:07.160]  But, but what's really exciting about it is you can, you know, you can learn about how this stuff works.
[01:46:07.260 --> 01:46:11.880]  And you can, you can jump in and, you know, try this kind of stuff.
[01:46:11.880 --> 01:46:14.920]  I don't think you want to necessarily try an organ you can print.
[01:46:14.920 --> 01:46:32.000]  But it's the kind of solutions people are finding are things like, you know, either you're, you're printing organs by, you know, building tissues, or you're printing the art, the structure within which skin can develop and tissue can develop.
[01:46:32.260 --> 01:46:43.920]  There's just so much happening in that space that you can kind of play along at least in metaphor with, you know, a DIY, you know, 3d printer.
[01:46:44.290 --> 01:46:47.140]  And more and more people are doing this kind of thing.
[01:46:47.300 --> 01:47:00.120]  They're printing, you know, like organ models from, you know, science classes, they're printing out, you know, United States maps with the, you know, the states that you can like separate.
[01:47:00.500 --> 01:47:06.790]  They're, they're using the tool to, to learn about how the things work and how they fit together.
[01:47:07.290 --> 01:47:23.160]  So I think it's certainly possible, as long as, you know, we keep things open, and a lot of our users do, that you'll see this kind of stuff, you know, come at least a little bit more into the, you know, the, the mass world and out of the closed proprietary laboratory.
[01:47:23.520 --> 01:47:27.370]  There was a great conference here in New York, just a couple weeks ago, called the Open Hardware Summit.
[01:47:28.100 --> 01:47:31.920]  A lot of people in town are involved, a lot of people from New York City Resistor, things like that.
[01:47:32.160 --> 01:47:39.520]  And the whole goal is to basically have all these people that understand science moves, fastest when you open up your design, science moves, fastest when you share your designs.
[01:47:39.950 --> 01:47:52.080]  And now there's a conference for all these people that understand this, and whose goal isn't necessarily to make a huge profit, they want to make a profit, yeah, but they also want to move the world forward, rather than designing something, locking it behind a firewall,
[01:47:52.300 --> 01:47:55.200]  and, you know, just squeezing it until the money pours out.
[01:47:56.050 --> 01:47:59.370]  That's, that's scary for corporate America to be talking like this.
[01:47:59.460 --> 01:48:03.370]  I mean, you could be cutting into a lot of profit lines by opening things up to the imagination.
[01:48:03.370 --> 01:48:08.840]  Yeah, but I think the people outside might, you know, be in that crowd of people that maybe think that's not the best way to run things.
[01:48:09.370 --> 01:48:10.880]  Yeah, I see that.
[01:48:11.580 --> 01:48:17.520]  So now, on the subject of organs, you think one day actual organs could be made with devices like this?
[01:48:17.800 --> 01:48:18.720]  Could be somehow...
[01:48:18.720 --> 01:48:19.410]  Oh, definitely.
[01:48:20.520 --> 01:48:22.920]  You know, it's going to, it's a complicated issue.
[01:48:23.220 --> 01:48:30.330]  Like, are you making organs that will, can survive in a body unaided?
[01:48:30.560 --> 01:48:31.200]  Who knows?
[01:48:31.410 --> 01:48:33.450]  I mean, that might be further down the body.
[01:48:33.450 --> 01:48:45.370]  You might need more stuff to protect 3D-printed organs, or there might be a way to use tissue from one body to create organs that will, you know, happily be placed in that body.
[01:48:45.540 --> 01:48:49.750]  But I think a lot of this work right now is very early.
[01:48:50.300 --> 01:49:03.250]  There are tests that are pretty darned impressive, but, you know, it's not necessarily... the hard details are not getting out necessarily to the public for how far you can go.
[01:49:03.410 --> 01:49:05.840]  I suspect it's a lot further than any of us have guessed.
[01:49:06.080 --> 01:49:09.830]  Well, I think we're on the cusp of real history being made.
[01:49:10.020 --> 01:49:15.380]  These are the early days of MakerBot and this type of technology and thought behind it.
[01:49:15.620 --> 01:49:27.830]  So I think it's pretty indisputable that somewhere down the road, whether it be years, decades, centuries from now, people are going to look back at these days very beginning of something huge.
[01:49:28.420 --> 01:49:34.480]  And, boy, wouldn't it be cool to have something from that particular time?
[01:49:34.480 --> 01:49:54.330]  And that's what we're offering tonight is an object made by one of the early MakerBots, an object just for you, and also a shirt that proclaims that you're part of the MakerBot community, an Arduino, and a book about Arduinos, so that you can actually experiment and build cool things.
[01:49:54.750 --> 01:49:56.600]  All yours for a pledge of only $75.
[01:49:56.870 --> 01:49:58.410]  212-209-2950.
[01:49:58.410 --> 01:49:59.520]  Let's get those phones lit up.
[01:49:59.580 --> 01:50:00.720]  We only have 10 minutes left.
[01:50:01.260 --> 01:50:04.950]  And I know there's a lot of people out there that will be fascinated by this.
[01:50:05.020 --> 01:50:07.410]  This is the kind of thing that the hacker community lives for.
[01:50:07.620 --> 01:50:12.870]  It's the kind of thing that the WBAI audience lives for because it's new, it's innovative, it's different, it's open.
[01:50:13.460 --> 01:50:18.140]  And it's something that the status quo sees as a potential threat.
[01:50:18.290 --> 01:50:21.960]  They always look at things with suspicion.
[01:50:23.110 --> 01:50:25.120]  And, I don't know, do you get much of that?
[01:50:25.180 --> 01:50:31.410]  You get much... you must get some ignorant remarks and people who assume things about what you guys are up to.
[01:50:31.890 --> 01:50:32.680]  Well, definitely.
[01:50:32.870 --> 01:50:39.640]  I've actually been, like, actively demonstrating how a MakerBot works and have somebody come up and say, oh, this isn't happening.
[01:50:39.960 --> 01:50:40.950]  This is a trick.
[01:50:41.120 --> 01:50:42.300]  No, you're not doing that.
[01:50:42.480 --> 01:50:45.480]  And then walking away, like, with these sort of angry gestures.
[01:50:46.560 --> 01:50:47.830]  So it's all smoke and mirrors.
[01:50:48.250 --> 01:50:48.760]  But that's actually rare.
[01:50:49.020 --> 01:50:52.840]  Most of the time, people come up and look at a MakerBot printing.
[01:50:53.020 --> 01:50:54.840]  It's completely, like, the case is open.
[01:50:54.840 --> 01:50:56.420]  You can see all its inner workings.
[01:50:56.700 --> 01:50:58.450]  And they sit there and they watch it.
[01:50:58.540 --> 01:51:00.290]  And after a little bit, they get it.
[01:51:00.410 --> 01:51:01.260]  They know how it works.
[01:51:01.370 --> 01:51:08.620]  They know that it's really not, you know, that much further along than a very, very smart hot glue gun.
[01:51:09.040 --> 01:51:17.080]  And I've seen kids watch entire, like, 15-minute prints and then explain to their parents how it works and bring them over.
[01:51:17.600 --> 01:51:22.870]  So, you know, they're... people who encounter it get it.
[01:51:23.000 --> 01:51:31.680]  But, you know, it's still, like, the language around it is a little bit weird in that some people can't understand what 3D printer means.
[01:51:31.920 --> 01:51:33.840]  And they ask where the ink is.
[01:51:34.140 --> 01:51:39.600]  And they ask if they need glasses, even when you're handing them an object.
[01:51:39.870 --> 01:51:42.370]  They say, oh, okay, this was made in China.
[01:51:42.830 --> 01:51:44.480]  But what are you talking about?
[01:51:44.680 --> 01:51:44.840]  Yeah.
[01:51:44.840 --> 01:51:45.600]  Like, no, no, this.
[01:51:45.790 --> 01:51:46.560]  We made this.
[01:51:46.720 --> 01:51:49.520]  It's a gap that has to be bridged at some point.
[01:51:49.620 --> 01:51:58.340]  But I think you touched upon a very interesting thing when you mentioned kids, because they seem to really take a shining to new technology, new ideas, things like that.
[01:51:58.410 --> 01:52:04.450]  They haven't been polluted with all the assumptions and what-if scenarios and things like that.
[01:52:04.840 --> 01:52:06.980]  And I think you guys were at Maker Fair.
[01:52:07.910 --> 01:52:11.330]  You see the enthusiasm that kids show in a place like that.
[01:52:11.480 --> 01:52:23.830]  And this, what we're offering tonight, I think, is the perfect gift for any kid who you think might get something out of it, might actually explore and design something someday.
[01:52:23.830 --> 01:52:30.880]  This could be the starting point right here, seeing what MakerBots can do, playing with an Arduino, reading something about it.
[01:52:31.300 --> 01:52:33.540]  It's a real door opener.
[01:52:33.720 --> 01:52:35.260]  212-209-2950.
[01:52:35.790 --> 01:52:43.870]  And one thing that is, I think, important to mention is that for the most part, this is introducing sort of new business and new opportunities.
[01:52:44.720 --> 01:52:50.460]  We're not seeing a lot of people being angry that we're doing this kind of work because they're afraid we're going to replace them.
[01:52:50.460 --> 01:52:59.580]  It really, typically, you know, they see opportunities or how they could, you know, people who are making things see how, oh, they can use this in-house to make things.
[01:53:00.120 --> 01:53:08.300]  And it's, you know, in this kind of climate, you know, we're hiring and we're, you know, doing pretty well.
[01:53:08.460 --> 01:53:13.760]  And there are people who are our customers who are making businesses around their 3D printers.
[01:53:14.000 --> 01:53:24.980]  So it's kind of exciting that way that it's, it's a, it's sort of built, you know, it's adding a new opportunity for business, you know, in, especially locally throughout the country and throughout the world.
[01:53:25.160 --> 01:53:27.660]  Your imagination is really the only limitation here.
[01:53:28.480 --> 01:53:30.370]  Again, 212-209-2950.
[01:53:30.370 --> 01:53:31.160]  Pledge is $75.
[01:53:31.200 --> 01:53:32.460]  You get the MakerBot item.
[01:53:32.560 --> 01:53:34.060]  You get the MakerBot shirt.
[01:53:34.060 --> 01:53:34.880]  You get the Arduino.
[01:53:35.080 --> 01:53:36.100]  You get the book about Arduinos.
[01:53:36.680 --> 01:53:38.260]  And we have other pledge levels, too.
[01:53:38.380 --> 01:53:40.950]  Please give a call now, 212-209-2950.
[01:53:40.950 --> 01:53:41.080]  Zero.
[01:53:41.520 --> 01:53:44.720]  And a pleasure that you can afford to get us closer to our goal.
[01:53:44.880 --> 01:53:51.370]  Very important that we keep WBAI going so we can talk about new innovations of all sorts, social, technical, you name it.
[01:53:51.540 --> 01:53:54.520]  It all gets talked about here at, at some point.
[01:53:55.060 --> 01:53:58.290]  Bernie, any, any last comments to try and get some calls in?
[01:53:59.020 --> 01:54:01.790]  We've really heard some great information tonight on the show.
[01:54:01.880 --> 01:54:15.680]  This is really at the cutting edge or bleeding edge of a new realm in, in our lives where, where ordinary people can, can manufacture three-dimensional objects without having to be genius.
[01:54:16.000 --> 01:54:18.950]  You can just, I mean, it can't be a genius, but you wouldn't have to be.
[01:54:19.040 --> 01:54:25.000]  You can just plug in this appliance and download a plan and modify it to your heart's content and create it.
[01:54:25.060 --> 01:54:28.330]  This is really, you know, science fiction stuff not too long ago.
[01:54:28.540 --> 01:54:36.220]  But this is the kind of stuff this radio station covers that no other radio station I know of really goes into all the issues about this.
[01:54:36.220 --> 01:54:43.800]  So, I just want to make one last appeal for our listeners to call 212-209-2950 and get a great premium package.
[01:54:43.980 --> 01:54:48.640]  It's sort of on the cutting edge of this historic moment where these things are possible.
[01:54:48.760 --> 01:54:51.600]  And it's really a great opportunity.
[01:54:51.870 --> 01:55:05.700]  Also, I wanted to invite our guests from MakerBot Industries and Michael Weinberg to give a little more information about where they can get more information about MakerBot Industries and about Michael's organization.
[01:55:05.700 --> 01:55:07.340]  Michael, what's your organization's name again?
[01:55:07.910 --> 01:55:09.950]  My organization is Public Knowledge.
[01:55:10.200 --> 01:55:12.460]  And we're at publicknowledge.org.
[01:55:12.680 --> 01:55:15.100]  I'd like to put a plug in for these Arduino boards.
[01:55:15.200 --> 01:55:15.800]  They're amazing.
[01:55:16.120 --> 01:55:21.160]  I don't have a technical background, but I have one of these Arduino boards in the book on my desk.
[01:55:21.460 --> 01:55:28.290]  And they are an unbelievable way to enter this super awesome hacking world if you're kind of like, well, I don't really know.
[01:55:28.450 --> 01:55:31.180]  I hear about this stuff a lot, but I don't know if it's for me.
[01:55:31.370 --> 01:55:34.450]  It's a really accessible way to kind of test the waters.
[01:55:34.750 --> 01:55:37.880]  So if you're thinking of these Arduino boards, I would say go with it.
[01:55:38.120 --> 01:55:41.290]  And that's only one of four items that you get for the $75 pledge.
[01:55:41.460 --> 01:55:47.290]  So it's certainly something, if you're at all interested in what we've been talking about, it's definitely worthwhile.
[01:55:47.420 --> 01:55:49.660]  212-209-2950.
[01:55:49.660 --> 01:55:53.880]  You get the four separate items from the MakerBot people.
[01:55:54.330 --> 01:55:57.410]  And again, the $50 pledge, you'll get the Lego book.
[01:55:57.500 --> 01:56:01.330]  $125, you get both, plus the photograph of what's going on down at Wall Street.
[01:56:01.800 --> 01:56:03.580]  212-209-2950.
[01:56:03.800 --> 01:56:05.410]  We only have a minute or two left.
[01:56:05.520 --> 01:56:06.760]  So we'd like to see a flurry of calls.
[01:56:06.830 --> 01:56:11.020]  Of course, we can't see the calls from here, but we see that there's progress going down in the tally room.
[01:56:11.180 --> 01:56:15.250]  So please make us happy when we walk down there and find out how we did tonight.
[01:56:15.480 --> 01:56:18.060]  212-209-2950.
[01:56:18.060 --> 01:56:20.330]  Any last words from you guys?
[01:56:20.720 --> 01:56:26.660]  If you get that Arduino kit, if you get that Arduino board and you're looking for inspiration, there's so much inspiration out there.
[01:56:26.950 --> 01:56:27.980]  Check out Make Magazine.
[01:56:28.370 --> 01:56:32.100]  They've got plenty of inspiration for Arduino projects, makezine.com.
[01:56:32.600 --> 01:56:33.180]  Absolutely.
[01:56:33.800 --> 01:56:35.480]  And MakerBot, the website?
[01:56:35.720 --> 01:56:37.000]  Yeah, MakerBot.com.
[01:56:37.180 --> 01:56:40.680]  And also, we have a weekly video series, MakerBot.tv.
[01:56:41.250 --> 01:56:44.290]  Do you just want to spell MakerBot for people?
[01:56:44.640 --> 01:56:45.060]  Sure.
[01:56:45.520 --> 01:56:48.560]  M-A-K-E-R-B-O-T.com.
[01:56:49.000 --> 01:56:49.380]  Yes.
[01:56:49.560 --> 01:56:50.600]  And tell us about the TV program?
[01:56:50.600 --> 01:56:56.660]  Well, MakerBot.tv is a weekly show about all the things happening in the MakerBot world.
[01:56:57.430 --> 01:57:02.580]  We have interviews and time lapses and latest things from Thingiverse.
[01:57:02.830 --> 01:57:06.800]  It's a really neat way to get a quick three-minute taste of what's going on.
[01:57:07.250 --> 01:57:07.830]  Really cool.
[01:57:07.910 --> 01:57:09.540]  You guys are up to a lot of really cool things.
[01:57:09.720 --> 01:57:13.250]  And we want to thank you for that because it's inspiration.
[01:57:13.370 --> 01:57:26.560]  And we hope to see you at our next conference next July, showing people, kids, adults, how it all works, and some of the possibilities of what technology can do for them with your imagination.
[01:57:27.120 --> 01:57:30.760]  And to our listeners, thank you so much for calling in and supporting us.
[01:57:30.870 --> 01:57:34.480]  And if you have not yet, please, 212-209-2950.
[01:57:34.910 --> 01:57:37.910]  Again, terrific MakerBot package tonight.
[01:57:38.300 --> 01:57:46.080]  And we also have the Lego book, and we have all kinds of other items that our tally people will be happy to tell you about.
[01:57:46.260 --> 01:57:49.450]  212-209-2950.
[01:57:49.830 --> 01:57:50.980]  It's Emmanuel for Off the Hook.
[01:57:51.080 --> 01:57:53.800]  We'll be back again next week with a regular one-hour show.
[01:57:53.880 --> 01:57:57.460]  The Personal Computer Show will be back at this time for their regular one-hour show.
[01:57:57.920 --> 01:58:02.290]  And once again, that phone number, 212-209-2950.
[01:58:02.640 --> 01:58:03.800]  Thanks, Michael, on the phone.
[01:58:03.980 --> 01:58:07.100]  And we will see you again next week on the air.
[01:58:07.260 --> 01:58:07.500]  Good night.
[01:58:18.310 --> 01:58:24.230]  If you get a busy signal when you call 212-209-2950, call again.
[01:58:24.490 --> 01:58:27.270]  Some people are getting through and some people are getting a busy signal.
[01:58:27.470 --> 01:58:28.070]  So keep trying.
[01:58:28.270 --> 01:58:28.490]  Thanks.
[02:00:23.400 --> 02:00:25.700]  Once again, the Clash is incredibly appropriate.
[02:00:26.680 --> 02:00:33.180]  You're listening to WBAI New York 99.5 FM and WBAI.org.
[02:00:33.180 --> 02:00:36.740]  If you missed any of Off the Hook, the first hour is already available.
[02:00:37.080 --> 02:00:42.120]  The second hour will be there in about 10 to 15 minutes by going to WBAI.org.