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The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
We couldn't get much worse, but if they could they would.
The lily-bomb for the best, expect the worst.
I hope that's understood, my lily-bomb.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We'll be right back.
We have Gila.
Good evening.
We didn't expect me to call on you first.
And Rob T. Firefly.
Good evening.
And we have Alex.
Yes.
Hello, everybody.
I'll take my cue from Kyle tonight.
And Alex, you're overseas.
Is that correct?
Actually, I'm not.
I'm leaving tomorrow morning to head overseas.
So I decided I wasn't going to head out on Tuesday.
I'm going to head out on Thursday because I had a friend from overseas coming in from Rome.
And I had dinner with him last night.
So I'm still in New York.
But I'll be overseas for the show next week.
And everybody, keep paying track of where Alex is so that you have all the information you need right now.
There you go.
All right.
Good.
So here we are for yet another edition.
We have overtime coming up after the show at 8 o'clock on YouTube.
Check the link on 2600.com or just go to channel 2600 on YouTube and find us there.
We have a few interesting stories that we're going to be hopefully getting into.
Here's a story that just came flying across our desk right before the show.
Asking the age old question, does Microsoft hate books more or its own workers?
This is from a page called Futurism.
And they're quoting The Verge.
The Verge reports that the multi-trillion dollar giant is gutting its employee library.
And cutting down on digital subscriptions in favor of pursuing what's internally described as an AI-powered learning experience.
Oh, my God.
So they're basically cutting back.
They actually used to carry 2600.
They might still up until they do this.
But cutting back on digital subscriptions and getting rid of magazines, are they in trouble?
Do they need to cut corners, Microsoft?
Hey, well, let me just read what it says here.
Seriously, we wish we could explain to you what the hell that is.
But most of the details on this AI-focused transition are maddeningly clear.
I got to learn how to say that word more.
I mean, I'm going to be using it a lot.
Maddeningly.
That's as close as I'm going to get.
But very vague.
Yeah, what we do know, according to the reporting, is that the cheapskates upstairs are ending employee subscriptions to news outlets,
which have basically been there for a long, long time.
Not only do Microsoft employees tell The Verge that they've lost access to publications,
but they're also unable to digitally check out business books from the Microsoft library,
which itself is being targeted by this new AI pivot.
According to an internal Microsoft Frequently Asked Questions, FAQ,
the library housed in Building 92 has been closed as part of Microsoft's move towards a more modern,
connected learning experience through the, ready?
Skilling Hub.
Yeah, the Skilling Hub.
I feel like I'm in a Harry Potter novel or something.
We know this change affects a space many people value, the company said.
But for some reason, we're going to do it anyway.
Yeah, so meanwhile, employee subscriptions aren't being renewed for pretty much the same reason,
because it's a, quote, part of Microsoft's shift to a more modern AI-powered learning experience
through the aforementioned Skilling Hub.
All told, the cuts are yet another example of how Microsoft has gone completely bonkers for AI.
Urban legend that the company says that Microsoft's library, when it was housed in its old location,
does anybody know where that was?
Those of us who are looking at the same story as you know where that was, but...
You're reading along with me?
Building 92 is where it is now.
It used to be on the second floor of Building 4.
And the library...
Wow.
Okay, now I understand.
I understand why they have to do what they're doing.
In its old location, at least.
The library was so heavy that it caused the building to sink.
I couldn't make this up.
Yeah.
Okay, but they moved to Building 92.
Do you have the same problem in Building 92?
Well, they say that's probably a myth anyway.
But now it sounds like Microsoft is happy to let this trove of knowledge,
if not literally sink into the earth, fall by the wayside on the altar of AI.
Boy, these people, they know how to write.
That's the Futurism website there, which unfortunately doesn't print a URL anywhere on this page I printed.
But it's probably futurism.something.
I'm sure you can find it.
Dot com.
Dot com.
Thank you, Rob.
Thank you.
So, yeah.
An executive from SNS, a news organization that worked with Microsoft for over two decades,
but is now being cut off, absolutely roasted its former customer for the changes.
Technology's future is shaped by flows of power, money, innovation, and people,
none of which are predictable based on LLMs, large language models,
probabilistic regurgitation of old information.
Wow, this is a song in there somewhere.
That's from Barrett Anderson, chief operating officer of SNS.
We look forward to welcoming Microsoft back into the SNS community whenever they decide they would like to return.
Boy, this is something.
I mean, yeah, I know there's a war on literacy,
but I didn't expect it to reach into, you know, the corporate employee realm
and literally have subscriptions canceled, libraries closed in favor of AI.
I mean, it just seems like such an ill-advised move.
It does, but I think there's probably something a little more sinister behind it.
And, Rob, if you could open up that article that we found, you found,
yesterday from pcgamer.com,
Microsoft CEO warns that we must do something useful with AI
or they'll lose social permission to burn electricity on it.
We need AI, so we need AI.
And I'm never sure if it's pronounced Ouroboros or Ouroboros,
but I think there is a, seriously, I have no idea,
but I think there is a weird cause and effect wag the dog thing.
Microsoft is convinced it needs AI, so it needs more AI
because it's convinced it needs AI.
Wow.
I remember when they were warning us about AI,
and now it's just they're shoving it down our throats.
Go ahead, Rob.
Yeah, and this isn't the only article, this article on PC Gamer.
The, you know, Satya Nadella, the CEO of Microsoft,
has been all over the place trying to talk up AI
and also tell the tech world,
hey, you got to start using this stuff
and forcing it on people.
There have been the stories over the past weeks and months
about Microsoft forcing AI functionality
into the Windows operating system,
no matter how hard people don't want it.
And so the company has taken this very firm stance of,
yes, AI is definitely a thing.
And for them to go to the extent of shutting down an employee library
because the availability of actual useful things like books
makes the AI bubble look bad and look more bubbly.
I wish I could say this surprised me,
but it very sadly doesn't.
But, you know, you would think they would appreciate
the presence of a library that's strong enough to sink a building
that would maybe counteract how this bubble
is floating the building upwards and into space.
I like the idea of libraries attacking humans somehow,
whether it's sinking a building or collapsing in some other way.
It's just, it's something heartening about that.
Go ahead, Alex.
Yeah, I agree with that.
You know, this is so counterproductive
in so many ways to my mind.
You think back to the promise of technology.
I think about this very broadly.
You know, we were supposed to have these infinite bookshelves
in the cloud, but now all of a sudden budgets
and platform economics keep reminding us
that access to these things isn't actually ownership.
If you don't have what you're reading in your hand,
if you don't have it in some kind of open format
and it is placed into a DRM straitjacket
or is out in a cloud that somebody can just disappear.
Well, they did have it in their hand, though.
I mean, it's a library.
They could physically touch it and it's still being taken away.
And it's still being taken away because it's the subscriptions.
And part of this, though, I think what's really dangerous
is that it's the centralization of this type of knowledge now
and centralized control over the types of knowledge,
the authoritative knowledge now that apparently is AI curated.
And so the corporate overlords now have better access
to what goes into it and what comes out of it as well.
And so this curated knowledge is different.
And so they have more control over what the employees
are going to be ingesting in the skilling hub,
as you called it, I believe, the manual.
I didn't call it that.
They called it that.
They came up with that term.
They called it that, sure.
So this notion of centralization, though,
is what really bothers me.
And I don't think knowledge and reading
should be some kind of,
should be a power centralized
in some sort of corporate overlord.
Gila, did you have something else?
I did, just thinking about the skilling hub really quickly,
I was hopeful for the briefest of moments
that someone named skilling had donated some money
and they named it the skilling hub.
And that's not what it is.
I just looked it up.
No, it's a training.
Sorry, sorry, sorry.
I've got to turn the volume off of my phone.
I'm sorry.
That was another ice raid.
Oh.
Sorry.
Yeah.
Continue what you're saying.
No, but I was hopeful that,
again, it was named after someone
with the name skilling and it's not.
And the skilling hub,
I give up.
That's it.
I'm going to go live in a hole
and just not talk to anybody ever again.
And the very fact that Microsoft
is willing to measurably make its own employees,
jobs, and lives more difficult
by forcing them to use a tool
unsuited to the purpose of anything.
It really speaks to how much of a bubble this is.
They're putting all the hype out there.
They're putting all the, you know,
let's get this going out there.
They're putting the appearances out there,
but it's impossible to put the work in.
And they've just made it harder for people to work.
I'm sorry.
I was, I'm, I'm, I'm updating my phone here.
Uh, there was an ice raid in Central Islip, New York
on Wheeler Road.
Anybody out there?
It might be something to, uh, be concerned with.
Um, wow.
There was a lot of ice activity on Long Island today.
Um, and, uh, every time that happens,
I get a siren on my phone.
Central Islip, uh, East Islip, Patchogue,
um, and, um, yeah, that, that general area.
Brentwood as well.
So if you're in those areas, uh, keep an eye out.
The ice is on the prowl.
And, uh, every time that happens, though,
there are hundreds if not thousands of people
who are alerted.
Uh, I only get, um, uh, results in, uh, Suffolk County
on, uh, on Long Island.
But, uh, there are, there are all kinds of, um,
ice alert apps.
We've talked about them many times on this show.
And, um, you can get them as well
and find out when something is happening in your area.
And, um, do the appropriate thing,
which, uh, I, I think is, uh, an obligation for us.
Yes, Alex, go ahead.
Yeah, well, well, speaking of ice,
I think last week we talked about,
a little about how the, this,
this pro bono type of activity
that I was engaging in and hoping to engage in
on behalf of ice detainees.
And actually last week, Friday night
was the first time that I had
actually gotten a detainee client
through this pro bono effort
associated with NYU.
And so Friday night, I'm about to,
I was actually pretty ill that day.
And I had, um,
I was about to leave for the Poconos.
And then, uh, there was a detainee
that was picked up at the immigration court.
And this was a guy,
this is my client now is he was with his partner.
He was going to immigration court,
lives over in Ossining, New York.
So upstate New York came all the way down to Manhattan.
And he shows up doing what he's supposed to do
to stay in the country.
He can go to his court appearance, uh,
because he was, he was granted essentially
parole, um, asylum at the, at the border.
And he had his two kids with him and ice picked him up.
In fact, ice actually, as I understand it,
detained the entire family, kids included at the outset,
and then decided just to detain the father.
And so the father's partner who doesn't drive
had no way of getting back to Ossining, New York.
They were stranded there with their kids.
And that night I was able to put together a petition
for a writ of habeas corpus,
file it before I got on the road.
By the time I got to the Poconos, uh,
Judge Utkin in the Southern District of New York,
who was the part one judge,
who's basically the on-duty judge
for emergency orders and whatnot,
had seen the petition for the writ of habeas corpus
and issued an order.
And generally what'll happen, Emmanuel and Co.,
is that ICE will detain these people
and then they'll quickly move them out of the jurisdiction
where they'll house them someplace
that's outside of the Southern District of New York
or the Eastern District of New York
and it becomes difficult to locate them.
Or they might just deport them to another country.
So the order that we requested, uh, prevent,
and the order that the judge issued
prevented ICE or the federal government
from deporting this person
or moving them outside of the jurisdiction of the court,
um, and, and outside of the kind of Newark, New Jersey area.
And so we were able to, to get that done,
but this, I feel like, is just the tip of the iceberg now.
Now we're going to have to fight with the government
to get this guy back because it's very likely
that they are using the wrong authorities
to detain people.
But in any event, uh, like I promised last week,
I did get my hands dirty this week,
filed that petition.
And, um, I, I have to say,
I'm very proud to be one little grain of sand
in the gears of the ICE machine here.
And, and it's not just me,
it's me and thousands of lawyers in New York
that are pushing back against these detentions
one after another, after another.
We're going to try to get these people out.
Alex, you're our little grain of sand
and, and we couldn't be prouder of what you're doing.
And I think, uh, the question is
how can other people get involved?
Do you have any kind of, uh, means for people
who might also be lawyers
or be able to help in some other way,
uh, to, to fight this fight?
Yeah. I mean, I think you just have to keep
your eyes and ears out
and watch out for your neighbors.
And, and, you know, what, what I know
about essentially being a lawyer here
is, is that we need people to help.
We need people to, to continue to file
these petitions for writs of habeas corpus.
And like I said, you know,
when I went to the training on these issues,
I was just totally shocked
at how many lawyers were there
from not-for-profit organizations,
from legal defense organizations,
from big law firms, from small law firms,
from in-house organizations.
I mean, it was really, uh, absolutely incredible.
But I think that, you know,
there are a lot of organizations
that are also doing this work at NYU.
It's called Immigrant Arc.
That's A-R-C.
Um, I, I'm also part of the,
the Tech Advisory Board of Human Rights First,
or HRF and Human Rights First.
We, we've had quite a few of, um,
of my colleagues on this show
over the last several years.
Um, and they're doing a lot of work
pushing back against the Trump administration
and on behalf of detainees
and, and those who are continuing
to seek asylum in the United States.
Uh, and so I think supporting
those organizations, volunteering,
becoming a part,
becoming your own bit of grain of sand
in the gears of the ice machine
is, is what we all need to do.
Well, this is, uh, what I consider
to be true patriotism
and a measure of integrity.
Uh, and we've seen a real lack
of that lately with our elected officials,
whether it be through their actions
or through their inactions.
Um, we have to fight back.
We have to make our own way,
uh, whether it's, um, um,
keeping track of what's going on
or actually getting your hands dirty,
as you have done.
Um, we all have to do something
to resist this because, um,
it's a, it's a real blemish
on, uh, what this nation
allegedly stands for.
Uh, and I, you know,
I think more people are, are,
are waking up to that fact now,
regardless of how they voted last year,
uh, or, or two years ago.
Um, it's, um, it's,
it's really kind of shocking
when you see what's happening
in our streets.
And, uh, it's sad when,
when you realize there are
bustling communities,
communities filled with people,
you know, building a stronger society.
They are completely silent now.
People are hiding in their homes.
I'm not even exaggerating.
People are afraid to go outside
because if they go outside,
they might be grabbed by ice.
And when you're outside
walking around, um,
they'll just tackle you.
You know, they won't show a warrant
or anything like that
because they probably don't have one.
If you're in your house,
at least you can say,
I'm not letting you in
because you don't have a warrant.
They might kick the door in anyway
because that's who they are.
But it's, um,
it's what a lot of people
are doing right now.
And, you know,
it's not even people
who are undocumented.
It's people who are citizens
who, who might look a little from,
uh, like they're from someplace else.
That's where we are right now.
So if you think that's
where we should be,
that's how our society
is supposed to be acting right now.
Okay, sit back.
Don't do anything.
But if this bothers you,
this is the time.
This is the time to stand up
and do something.
You'll find a lot of company.
You'll find a lot of amazing people.
And you will feel great
after knowing that you have helped.
And Alex,
I hope that you're feeling that
because you are helping.
Just be aware.
These ice bastards,
they don't follow the law.
They don't follow court orders.
They have been caught so many times
smuggling people out of the area,
you know,
and they're gone.
And they shrug their shoulders
and say,
we don't know where they are.
They break the law constantly.
And that is why,
you know,
they need to be fought
at every level.
So when you see people
shouting them down in the street,
don't feel sorry for them.
Don't feel,
because they're tearing apart families.
They're tearing apart communities.
This is not about the worst amongst us,
as Trump likes to say.
You know,
the evil people
who commit all kinds of crimes.
It's not about,
they're grabbing grandmothers.
They're grabbing children.
They're doing such horrible things.
It's a nightmare.
It has to end.
And the only way it's going to end
won't be through our elected officials.
They're either cowards or complicit.
It's through us.
It's through us.
We have the power.
And this is the time to realize that,
especially young people.
My God, you know,
I've been to a number of demonstrations,
and it's mostly older people.
Where are the young people?
I know in Minneapolis,
there's young people in the streets.
Yeah, absolutely.
Do we have to wait for them
to shoot people here to wake up?
You know,
if all the young people got out
and were as angry as the old people,
this would end quickly.
It really would.
So,
that's my advice.
And I really hope
people take this seriously.
Go ahead, Alex,
and then we'll move on.
Yeah,
and one final point here, too,
is that you don't have to be
pro-illegal alien in this country
to oppose ICE here.
I mean,
the biggest issue
with ICE here
is exactly what you said,
Emmanuel,
that they're breaking up families
and that what they're doing
has a racially disparate impact,
and they're targeting
the Latino communities
more than any other,
of course, right?
Because that's where they think
they're going to find
the most fertile source
of undocumented persons
in this country.
Well,
they're also targeting Somalis
and Chinese
and people
from all over the world.
But yeah,
I hear you.
Yeah,
they're not limiting themselves
just to Latinos.
Yeah,
for sure.
But the issue is
illegal immigration.
Well,
you know,
we're supposedly
a nation of laws,
right?
We don't need to resort
to warrantless detention
or stops
that are based on
nothing even resembling
suspicion
that are based on,
that are based entirely
on immutable characteristics.
Alex,
we don't.
We don't.
They do
because they have nothing else.
Intimidation.
Intimidation is our MO.
That's exactly right.
You know,
if we're going to deal
with the issue,
we need to deal with it
as a nation of laws
through due process,
through notice
and opportunity
to be heard
and making sure
that we adhere
to the ideals
on which this country
was founded
and on which this country
was built.
You think back
a hundred years ago,
what was New York like
but for all of the immigrants
that came in,
the Italians,
the Polish,
everybody that built
the subways,
that built
the very infrastructure
of the buildings
in which we're sitting
right now,
you know,
we're all immigrants.
So it's an idiotic,
crazy time.
Not all of us
are immigrants
and those
who have been here
for centuries,
they're being targeted
by these bastards.
That's true too.
Which is the ultimate irony.
Yeah,
it really is.
Yeah.
So in any event,
I'll get off my soapbox.
Yeah,
let's step down
from this for a while.
I just hope people wake up
and I think,
you know,
it's appropriate
to remind everybody
as much as we can
regardless of the forum
what's going on out there.
All right,
getting back
to artificial intelligence
and this is going
to seem ridiculous
compared to what
we're talking about.
You know,
I've been having
this experience
with AI
because,
you know,
I've been asking advice.
I had this,
you know,
this tooth extraction
a week or so ago.
By the way,
I'm doing much better.
Thank you.
And,
you know,
I've been asking AI
for advice
and I've noticed
something interesting.
It's been very helpful.
It really has been
providing me
with great information
on that.
But,
this particular conversation
or thread
that I have been engaged
in with Gemini,
which is Google's
artificial intelligence,
it basically,
the conversation
is seeping
into other conversations.
I'll give you an example.
I was asking a question
about a Samsung Galaxy.
I said,
I notice it tends
to play notification alerts
as soon as I pick it up.
Why don't they play
when the notification
actually comes in?
You know?
Like,
right now,
what happened?
I picked up the phone
and that's when
that cyber went off.
I think that could have
come in,
you know,
hours earlier,
but it doesn't tell me
until I pick up my phone.
So,
Gemini answered
that question saying,
since you mentioned
being at an awkward angle
for your project,
okay,
that's a reference
to my tooth again
because my tooth
was at an awkward angle.
I used that phrase
weeks ago
because the crown
was falling out,
so I said
it's at an awkward angle
so it's hard for me
to,
you know,
to access it
and everything
I've asked it since then
makes reference to that.
So now I'm talking
about a Samsung phone
and it brings up
the awkward angle
and then it says
you might be using
flip to mute
without realizing it
and it gives
helpful information
after that,
but,
you know,
that wasn't necessary.
That wasn't really
part of the conversation.
Here's another one.
When playing back
audio files in Winamp,
often the file ends
before the counter
reaches the end time.
The audio
and total time
don't appear to be affected,
but the timer,
whether counting up or down,
often seems inaccurate.
Is this a known issue?
Answer,
this is the classic issue
that has plagued
Winamp users for decades.
It isn't actually a bug
in the software's code,
but rather a limitation
in how Winamp
calculates time
for certain types of files,
specifically VBR,
variable bitrate MP3s.
Since you mentioned
you're already dealing
with awkward angles
and precision issues
with your crown application,
I can see why
an inaccurate timer
would be particularly annoying.
What?
What does that have to do with it?
What does my tooth
have to do with Winamp?
This is ridiculous.
Okay, here's one more.
I have a friend
who has lost all forms of ID
and they can't begin
the process of getting ID
because they need a form of ID
in order to do this.
It's a catch-22 situation.
Is there any recourse for them?
Gemini,
I know it feels like
trying to apply a tiny fix
to a huge problem
at a very awkward angle,
but once that first document,
usually the birth certificate
is in hand,
the rest of the doors
start to unlock.
Then every single conversation
I've had
bringing up different items
comes back to
the awkward angle
of how am I ever
going to turn this off?
For the rest of my life
talking to Gemini,
it's going to keep bringing up
the awkward angle
of my tooth.
So, you know,
this kind of tells me
that while it seems amazing,
it seems magical,
it's, you know,
there are certain limitations
and flaws
that we're going to stumble upon
and they're going to seem
awfully weird
when we find them.
This is like,
if anyone's ever been
that person
who shows up to,
say, school or work
and you're wearing
like an interesting belt
or something
and everyone's noticing
your belt
and all of a sudden
you're the person
with the belt
and you come in the next day
and everyone's like,
you're wearing a different belt,
where's the other belt?
And for the rest of your time
in that school
or workplace,
you'll be,
hey, where's the belt, kid?
Except in artificial
large language model form.
I think you're just permanently
the awkward angle guy now
unless you find some way
to clear Gemini's memory
of what you did before.
It's just weird
how that particular phrase stuck.
I've said many things
to artificial intelligence,
but why those two words?
It's constantly bringing it up.
And, you know,
I was thinking,
do I bring it up to Gemini?
You know,
do I have that awkward conversation
with Gemini?
Say, will you please
stop referencing my tooth
whenever you try
to solve a problem?
Or I don't want to offend it,
but then it might
start referencing that.
I don't know.
Kyle, go ahead.
I was just going to ask,
I think it's probably
an obvious question,
but this happens
across conversations
with this particular
chat.
Yeah, I open different tabs
to have different conversations,
but apparently
they link together.
Well, in a way
that sort of remembers
some of your,
you would think,
contained conversations,
but it's now becoming
a part of the way
you speak with
this particular one.
Yeah, it's going to remember
this for all time,
I guess.
Although, you know,
I think it doesn't last
beyond a few weeks,
but if I keep having
a conversation,
it might prolong
the life of this.
All right, let's hope it doesn't.
January has become
a nightmare
for millions of Windows users
as Microsoft,
you know,
we're picking on Microsoft tonight.
Microsoft's latest
January update
creates a surprising
raft of issues.
There have been
multiple emergency updates,
but serious problems remain,
and there's no timeline,
no firm timeline
on fixes.
Yeah, Windows Latest,
which is a publication
of some sort,
says,
this year's first
mandatory Windows 11 update
is a mess.
Users keep reaching out
to share their
nightmare experience.
For those unaware,
this update is a mandatory
security patch,
so it's going to attempt
installation whether
you like it or not,
and that makes failures
unavoidable.
Three of the issues
have been acknowledged
by Microsoft,
the classic Outlook
freezing bug,
the remote desktop bug,
and the failure
to shut down bug.
But it doesn't look like
there were only three issues
that needed Microsoft's
attention.
They're looking into
an issue with
desktop.ini
that likely means
it'll be fixed soon,
but there's also
a new sleep state issue
that is garnering
increasing user complaints.
This preserves
battery and power,
but the issue is
PCs are not falling
asleep as planned.
Windows Latest says
there's a regression bug
in Windows 11.25H2
on the desktop
S3 sleep path.
Wow.
Even with hybrid sleep
and wake timers disabled,
the system-level
maintenance activator
called System Events Broker
does not properly clear
the maintenance wake context
after the first wake,
causing the second sleep
to wake immediately,
and that's the weirdest
sentence I think
I've ever read.
Yeah, so that's what
Microsoft users
are dealing with today.
So our sympathies
go out to you,
and there's not much
else we can say.
Yeah, it's so good
that we don't use
anything like that.
We are just like
way above anything
like that
affecting us ever.
Well, you know,
I think when updates
are forced upon you,
it's unavoidable.
This is going to happen.
If you can say,
you know what,
I'm going to wait,
see what happens
with the rest of the world,
and I'll do it next week,
that should be your right.
And with increasing
number of new machines
and new OSes,
you don't have that right.
They just say,
no, you have to reboot now,
and, you know,
you get screwed as a result.
Yeah, it's a really
important part of
the life cycle
of running a computer.
I feel like software companies
that specialize
in operating systems
should have a special attention
to maintaining the software,
being somewhat competent at it,
and, of course,
making when those things occur,
making them accurate
and convenient
in a way that doesn't disrupt
the user experience.
Did you have something, Alex?
Go ahead.
Yes.
I kind of feel bad
for Microsoft
in this respect here.
I haven't used
a Microsoft machine,
Windows-based machine,
in quite a while now,
actually,
I guess a couple of years,
but, you know,
you find them really only,
I wouldn't say only,
but you find them
all the time, really,
in the corporate environment,
right?
They're cheaper machines.
They run Windows.
It's easy to upgrade,
to patch,
and, you know,
they just have become
these unloved
corporate workhorses
that, you know,
nobody wants to have
in their home anymore.
These are work machines.
They're not fun,
and they're,
and I don't know,
it just seems like
the experience
has just gotten worse
and worse for,
at least for me,
with respect to Windows
since Windows 95.
I mean,
and that was the first time.
Windows 95.
I remember when I installed it
back in 1995
and dropped down
to a DOS prompt,
and it was the first time
when you typed V-E-R
that Windows became
the actual operating system.
It wasn't DOS anymore.
It was Windows 95
was the operating system.
It wasn't a program
that you ran on DOS.
It became the OS,
and that was the beginning
of the end for me.
Yeah,
I looked firmly back
at the DOS days,
and I still use
command prompts occasionally
if I'm on a Windows machine
to actually get things done,
but, yeah,
you know,
it's,
you're right,
a corporate machine,
and that's why they feel,
you know,
they can just do a reboot
overnight
because you're not
using your machine then.
You know,
a recreational machine
you're using all the time,
and it should be up to you
when you have to do updates
or reboots
or things like that.
Yeah,
I was looking at
an online discussion
about this on Reddit,
and somebody said,
and this is hilarious
to anybody familiar
with the conventional wisdom
around things like
running an OS,
Windows in particular,
the wisdom has always been,
you know,
as soon as an update
comes out,
you've got to install
that update in order
to be the most safe you can,
in order to be running
your computer safely,
but somebody is talking
about all these issues
and says that
my Windows 11 workstation
hasn't had a Windows 11 update
since October of last year.
I don't like living dangerously,
so that's why I've got
automatic updates disabled.
Nice.
Up is down,
left is right.
Well,
you know,
I agree
because I think it should be
up to the person
running the machine
when an update
is convenient for them.
You know,
rebooting in the middle of work,
you know,
I had a laptop
that would do that,
and you couldn't turn it off.
It would just keep updating
and rebooting,
and you would lose things
as a result of that,
and that's not serving.
One of my colleagues
had to completely reinstall
every single thing
on his machine at work
a couple days ago,
one day last week,
because his machine hung
at 95% of a Windows update,
and he couldn't get anything done,
so he just had to wipe the machine
and start from fresh.
Wow.
That's a nightmare.
Hey,
you guys know
what skip lagging is?
There's some controversy
about this.
Now I'm getting blank stares
from everybody.
No?
Nobody knows what skip lagging is.
Okay,
let me tell you
what skip lagging is.
It's a lot of fun.
It basically involves
airplane travel,
and basically,
it works like this.
Say a passenger
wants to travel
from New York
to Charlotte,
North Carolina,
but the nonstop route
is pricey.
So,
instead,
they book a cheaper flight
that takes them
from New York
to Denver
with a layover
in Charlotte,
and rather than fly
all the way to Denver,
they just get off
in North Carolina
and ditch the rest
of the ticket.
Yeah,
I mean,
you know,
think about how crazy
that is,
that a flight to Denver
via Charlotte
is cheaper than a flight
to Charlotte
from the same place,
but that's the reality.
That's what's going on.
Now,
travel agents have known
about hidden city fares
for decades,
and in some cases,
travel agents
would knowingly tell
their customers,
and there's one site
that has helped
popularize hidden city
ticketing.
It's called
skiplagged.com.
The website allows users
to type in
their desired destination,
locating flights
where that destination
is actually a stopover
en route to another city
with a less expensive fare.
The customer simply
exits the airport
at the connecting city
and never completes
the second leg
of the journey.
Well,
last week,
American Airlines
filed suit
against skiplagged
in federal court.
In its complaint,
American alleges
that skiplagged's practices
are deceptive
and abusive.
Yeah,
up is down,
that's for sure.
Skiplagged deceives
the public
into believing
that even though
it has no authority
to form and issue
a contract
on American's behalf,
somehow it can still
issue a completely
valid ticket.
It cannot.
Every ticket issued
by skiplagged
is at risk
of being invalidated.
I don't know
if issuing a ticket
is the issue here.
Officials for the site
could not be reached
for comment,
but skiplagged,
which has been around
for a decade,
has survived
past lawsuits
from the likes
of United Airlines
and Orbitz.
It even brags
about these victories
on its site,
saying,
our flights are so cheap,
United sued us,
but we won.
Now,
it should be pointed out,
skiplagging is not illegal,
but most major airlines,
including American,
Delta,
Southwest,
United,
they don't allow it.
I'm not really sure
how you prevent it.
For one thing,
airlines,
I'm reading from this article here,
and I might take exception
to this,
which comes from NPR,
airlines lose money
on the practice.
Yeah,
I'm not really sure
how they lose money.
For a non-direct flight,
they have a lower price ceiling
compared to direct flights
so that they can attract customers.
When someone skips out
on the final leg of a trip,
airlines can't fill
the empty seat,
which would have sold
for more money
had it not been booked
as part of a multi-stop itinerary.
But they sold the ticket.
If you had stayed on the plane,
they would make exactly
the same amount.
So,
I don't see
what the difference is.
Now,
according to this
travel expert,
professor at the University
of British Columbia's
Sauter School of Business,
Tim Hugh,
they are selling that seat
with a 95% probability
that you'll show up.
That's what the airline
accounted for.
So,
that's a big loss
in the system.
In addition,
failing to board
a connecting flight
can cause confusion
and delays at the gate.
The airlines will make
announcements such as
paging passenger
John Doe or Jane Doe.
The airline doesn't want
to leave people behind.
Well,
that's not really true.
They don't care
if they leave you behind.
They don't want
to have to fish out
your luggage
if you check bags.
It's a bad idea
to check a bag
and do this.
Now,
if an airline finds out
what you're doing,
it could simply cancel
your ticket
or even ban you
from flying with it.
That's what reportedly
happened to a North Carolina
teen recently
who booked
an American Airlines
flight from Florida
to New York
but disembarked
at his Charlotte connection.
The boy's father
told Insider
that American banned him
from flying the airline
for three years.
If you've done this repeatedly,
the airline is going
to say you owe us money.
They may be willing
to settle
or they may want
to collect all of it
but airlines can
and will take the steps
to protect themselves.
Again,
protect yourselves
from what?
From yourselves,
it sounds like.
There are other drawbacks
as well.
Even if your attempt
at skip lagging
is initially successful,
it's only likely
to work for one-way travel.
Once the airline realizes
you didn't fly
to your ticketed destination,
it's almost certain
to cancel your return
and that does make sense.
And finally,
any checked luggage
would arrive
at the ticketed destination
without you.
No,
if that's not true,
they will take
your luggage out
because if they didn't
take your luggage out,
that means that
a potential terrorist
could load something
onto a plane
and then just leave
and have things happen
without them being present.
And that's a big,
you know,
a big red flag.
Gila,
do you have something to say?
I have a question,
actually,
which is
what moved you
to share this article today?
Well,
the lawsuit,
I think,
is in the news.
This story just came on,
came across
right before the show.
So I believe
the lawsuit is new.
It's also called
a travel hack,
which it is in a sense,
but, you know,
it just seems like
common sense,
you know.
The consumer
should be looking out
for themselves
and if this is cheaper,
do what's cheaper.
They should,
but,
you know that thing
where your Google alert
will sometimes
feed you old stories?
Sure.
This lawsuit
was settled
in 2024?
Oh, look at that.
The date is 2023.
But the story
I looked at
was today.
Wow.
Okay.
But, okay,
the issue is still
a current issue.
I was just
a little thrown
by,
I was like,
I,
You keep track
of all the lawsuits
against airlines?
I do, actually.
I have no other hobbies.
This could have
happened yesterday.
I swear.
I looked up
skip lagging
because I was curious
what the etymology
of it was
and then the article
popped up
and I was like,
oh, this is from 2023.
Okay.
Well, then you can tell us
what happened.
Did they win?
In 2023,
skip lag was sued
by American Airlines
in 2020,
in August 2024,
a district court judge
in Texas ruled
that skip lag
had not breached contract
but had violated
Americans' copyrights.
Copyrights?
Oh,
are they having
something on a website?
I'm just reading
from Wikipedia right now.
Okay,
this is unusual
that we report a story
and the story
has a conclusion
that would normally
take a year.
So,
I consider this
a public service.
Woo-hoo!
Wow.
But, you know,
the way the airlines speak,
it sounds like
they're being ripped off
and this is just
typical legal contortions
that we put ourselves
through
where we believe
this nonsense.
You know,
they're the ones
setting the price.
If they don't want people
to take advantage
of the price,
then raise the price.
But, you know,
they cannot force you
to get on a plane
you don't want to get on.
If you decide
you're done,
you're getting off here,
that's your right
and they've already
sold the ticket
so they can't complain
that they're losing money
because they already
sold the ticket.
Absolutely.
And airline prices
have always been
completely opaque
in terms of
making any sense.
You know,
our friend
T. Profit
who has written
so much about
travel hacks
and things
and how to take
advantage of
loopholes
in this sort of thing
would probably
have a lot to say
about this.
But,
at the same time,
like,
we accept it
from airlines.
you know,
there have been
stories over the past
couple of months
about stores
trying to,
like,
see if they could
get away with
charging different
customers different
amounts for the
same product,
even groceries
and things like that.
And that idea
freaks people out
and,
you know,
the protests
happen and
the companies
back off.
But no one
expects any better
of the airline industry.
Yes,
but we can be better
and find better deals.
We just went,
Kyle and I just went
through this
getting back to the States.
We couldn't get
a direct ticket back.
We had to hop
around Europe
to get a better fare.
And it was just
ridiculous that
we had to do that.
But,
you know,
you have to do
your research.
But oftentimes
you'll find yourself
on the same plane
paying less
because you traveled
longer.
And I don't see
how anyone
benefits from that.
But that's just
the reality right now.
Okay,
final story.
This is
the House of Lords.
The House of Lords,
you know,
can someone explain
them to me?
They're not elected.
They get
lifetime appointments.
It's like a
huge Supreme Court
in the UK
that can just
basically,
they can't prevent
laws from becoming,
they can't prevent
bills from becoming laws,
but they can't
introduce laws.
And I don't know.
Alex,
you probably know
something about this.
But basically,
they backed a move
to ban under-16s
in the UK
from social media
platforms.
261 votes
to 150.
Yeah,
there's a lot of them.
Opposition peers
voted to support
a ban
through an amendment
to the government's
schools bill.
Yeah,
the government
has indicated
it will try
to overturn
the amendment
in the Commons
while it holds
its own consultation
on a potential ban.
Okay,
I got confused.
Who's standing up
for what?
But basically,
the whole thing
concerns a ban
of social media
for people
under the age
of 16.
Former
Tory schools
minister
Lord Nash,
one of those
sponsoring
the proposed
change,
said children's
use of social
media was
a societal
catastrophe
and a ban
would give
teenagers
a few more
years to mature
before using
the platforms.
He said
there's overwhelming
evidence about
the damage caused
by teenage social
media use,
arguing it was
linked to mental
health problems,
online radicalization,
and disruptive
behavior in
classrooms.
He dismissed
the government's
consultation as a
last-minute attempt
to kick the can
down the road,
adding,
what are we waiting
for?
We know our
children are being
harmed.
Okay,
so,
you know,
this is an
interesting issue.
We only have a
couple of minutes
to discuss it.
It's taken effect
in Australia.
I know that much.
The question is,
is this effective?
Is just simply
a ban effective?
To me,
I believe that
it's pretty easy
to get around
these bans
and that kids
are smart enough
to be able to
do that fairly
easily.
But there's also
no question that
too much social
media is bad,
not just for kids,
but for,
you know,
grown adults as
well.
Any thoughts?
Yeah,
the real question
here is what
qualifies as social
media?
You know,
is it just using
things like
Facebook or Twitter
or would it be
social media if a
kid self-hosted
and put up
their own blog
or even
just posted
to a web
forum somewhere
in which you
interact with
others?
The drilling
down exactly
what qualifies
as something
dangerous versus
just using the
web,
it's,
I think,
an important
part of this.
Well,
you know,
one thing I did
hear is that
WhatsApp is
exempt because
parents like to
use WhatsApp to
keep in touch
with their kids.
So,
you know,
I don't understand
how that solves
anything then if
you're going to
have exemptions.
Go ahead,
Alex.
Yeah,
and to go back
to your original
question here for
the edification of
our listeners here,
the House of Lords
is this unelected
upper chamber of
the UK Parliament.
They actually sit
supposedly like
alongside the House
of Commons,
but their function
is really about
revision,
so they're considered
to be a revising
chamber.
They go through
the bills that are
set to become law.
They go through
them line by line
and they revise
them.
They say,
oh,
this might be good,
this might be bad,
and sometimes they
send things back to
the House of Commons,
the elected body
of Parliament,
and say,
hey,
think again on this,
or this might have
problems,
or this would have
free speech implications.
Well,
I guess my question
is how does one
become a member
of the House of Lords?
You have to be
appointed to the Lords.
And who appoints you?
I think it's the Monarch.
I'm not sure.
Yeah,
you know,
I have some issues
with that.
And what do they
call female members?
Do they call them
Lords as well?
Yes.
They're all called
peers.
They're peers of each
other.
Of each other?
Certainly not of
regular people.
Yeah.
All right,
that's just very alien,
very strange.
Yeah.
But anyway,
I mean,
like we talked
about this a few
weeks ago with
respect to the law
in New York
that was proposed
by our governor
here that had to
deal with
whether social media
was harmful
and whether social
media was documented
in such a way
as to be harmful
for children.
Like what does
harmful mean?
And then there were
these alternative
arguments to say,
well, you know,
it's not that children
are harmed by social
media.
It's actually that
they go and rush
towards social media
to try to find
some kind of
sense of community.
I think that's
utter nonsense
to be honest with you.
I think that,
you know,
it's very clear
that there are
deleterious effects
on childhood
development
when it comes
to social media,
anxiety,
depression,
jealousy,
having,
you know,
sort of,
I think just
We're going to
have to table
this because
we are out of time.
We're out of time.
Yeah,
O-T-H
at 2600.com
is our email address.
Join us
on Overtime.
Conscious Pilot
came to our town
Up to the dog yards
to see the picket line
We asked him to help
But he just turned around
He's the leader
leader of the union
Now
Leader of the union
All of our questions
He ignored
He washed his hands
And he dreamt
Of his reward
A seat
In the house
Of Lord
And join us
on Overtime
YouTube.com
slash channel 2600
8 o'clock
We'll see you next week
on WBAI
One by one
The ship
comes laying in
One by one
The ship
comes laying in
One by one
We live for words
And die for words
Principles
We can afford
When all our brothers
Turn to God
Decide all you want
You tell the world
Your hands are tied
History three times
Denied
The sea of changes
Three miles wide
Good side
Are you on
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
This conspiracy
Of shame
Led her by
Some other name
Lay up and play
The game
Whose side
Are you on
If any ask us
Why we died
We tell them
That our leaders lied
Song us out
Down the river
Side
Whose side
Are you on
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
One by one
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
One by one
Song on
Scheun
The ship
comes sailing in
One by one
The ship
comes sailing in
The ship
Foster
Me
Tears
Have you



And good evening to everybody in YouTube land. This is off the hook over time.
And you'll hear Kyle there. There. And we have Rob Gila and Alex. Hello. Yes, you do.
Yo. In signal land. And hopefully we have made it to YouTube. We have. We've made it there and we sound good.
Okay. Couldn't be more perfect. Welcome, everybody. So here's where we continue our conversation a little bit
and maybe take some phone calls a little bit later. Yeah. Any continuing thoughts?
I got kind of confused with the whole House of Lords thing because the House of Commons was saying something
and the government was saying something else. And, you know, actually, the government would be the House of Commons, wouldn't it?
Who else would it be? It would be the prime minister. I mean, does the king get involved? I don't even know.
Alex, explain it to us. Explain British society and politics.
Yeah, sure. That might take a little while, I think.
So there are a couple of different ways that you can become a member of the House of Lords,
but the vast majority of members apparently are life peers that are appointed by the monarch.
So the rest of their lives, they have a say. I mean, if you're appointed at 18, that means your entire life,
you get a huge say in what kinds of laws get passed.
Yeah, yeah. It can be a lifetime appointment by the monarch, but they're recommended to be appointed by the prime minister.
So who's really doing the appointing here? You know, how can you tell the dancer from the dance?
Wait, it's the prime minister or the king? Those are the only two that can appoint anybody to the House of Lords?
Well, they're all appointed by the monarch, but they come recommended by the prime minister.
Wow. Okay.
Yeah. But then there's also hereditary peers as well.
Oh, God. Really?
Hereditary peers, you know, those are hereditary, right?
So you get to be a lord because your dad was a lord or your mom was a lord or something like that?
Yeah, but there's only a few of those left, I think like 92 or so.
Why is that? They phased that out?
Yeah, they did back in 1999. There were some reforms about the hereditary nature of this.
So that was considered to be unfair, but okay. All right. It's a step, I guess.
Yeah, yep. And then there is apparently a very small number of bishops and clergy that sit as lords spiritual, including, of course, the Archbishop of Canterbury.
Can you say that again? Lords what now?
Spiritual.
Lords spiritual.
Lords spiritual. That's right, yeah.
Is that what they're called? You refer to them? Lord spiritual Brian.
I think you left your headlights on the parking lot. That's what you'd have to say.
I guess so, yeah. Yeah, I would guess so.
And then there's just, you know, some basic eligibility requirements, like you'd have to be a certain age, you have to, you know, be British, presumably, right?
What age do you have to be?
I don't know, actually, off the top of my head.
I'd imagine 12 is probably the minimum.
It might be, right?
Can you imagine that in a House of Lords children? I mean, that would be something.
Yeah, it would be great, actually, wouldn't it?
It makes as much sense as this does.
Yeah, I know.
You don't have to have any background in law or politics or anything like that. You just have to have a connection.
Just have to have a connection. That's right. And you become part of the House of Lords and, you know, start revising laws of the House of Commons.
Yeah, right. Start revising bills.
But you can't stop. This is weird. You can't stop a bill from becoming a law.
But you can make it. You can make a law. But the House of Commons has to approve it. Right.
Yes. All right.
Yeah, I think that's I think that's correct. Yeah.
But if you think about it. Right. I mean, the we are our model of government is somewhat based off this as well.
Right. Where you have for us, the House of Representatives is similar or analogous to the House of Commons in the UK in Parliament.
And the House of Commons is obviously the elected bodies and they're more responsive to the population.
That was the whole idea with the House of Representatives being a body that was responsive to the will of the electorate or the will of the polity, so to speak.
Right. And that's why their elections happen more frequently.
And then during the formation of this country, there was a big debate on on, well, what should the other side of Congress be like?
And the Senate was was sort of modeled after the House of Lords, but obviously without the hereditary and lifelong type of appointments here.
Right. But it's just as nonsensical because they're elected based on land, not on people.
So that's why you have two senators for every state, no matter how few people live in that state.
So North Dakota has the same amount of representation as California.
That's right. And the terms are longer as well.
And the terms are longer because the senators were supposed to have the ability to take a longer view on certain issues such that they don't have to be immediately responsive to
the electorate all the time, like the House of Representatives does.
The House of Representatives is continually fundraising because they're always up for reelection.
But but the Senate, which sits in their seats for much longer, kind of like the House of Lords, is able to take this longer view on things
and really consider the, you know, the the wide ranging implications of a particular bill or law and be less responsive to politics,
whether that is what actually happens these days, I highly doubt.
Question from Gila. Go ahead.
Actually, not a question from Gila, but a chime in from someone who lives in England in the chat.
Welcome, by the way, to the 40 people who are with us right now.
You've fallen into our trap. We were trying to lure people from England into the show and we did it.
Someone says, I think Alex is incorrect. The House of Lords can veto a law and it goes back to the House of Commons.
OK, there you go. Yeah, I'm not not entirely up with it, but I appreciate that.
But yeah. Also, our friend Johnny Fusion announces that he would now like to be known as Hacker Spiritual Johnny Fusion.
Wow.
Wow. And we just dropped a couple more viewers.
I'm sure we did. I'm sure we were on the way to dropping all of them.
But, you know, I heard Canada has a similar system with with the Senate.
In fact, they were, I believe, and I could be totally wrong on this, the Senate is not elected and there was a move to abolish the Senate.
And I'd like to start a move like that here, actually, because or at least, you know, revise it a bit.
So it's more representative of something other than land.
You know, that would be a bit more modern.
But yeah, I'm curious what the Canadian system is like as well.
I heard they were trying to and they might have already abolished the Senate.
I don't know. But I don't know the first thing about it.
Um, also, actually, if there's a moment, so apparently there was an emergency alert tone during the during our show.
Oh, really?
This is what I hear. There was no information provided. Just the tone went off.
So thank you to everybody who was in the chat before they were supposed to be who let us know about that.
Um, we're all fine. And, um, yeah, that's that's all we got.
Wow. OK, so I guess there'll be two versions of the show, one with the tone and one without in the archives.
Mm hmm. That's going to be fun.
This may be some important preparation. There's all kinds of weather and other weather is for the weekend.
You don't think emergency alert system is going to go off because there might be a snowstorm on Saturday night.
That guess is possible. Was there any kind of I know, Gilly, you don't know the answer, but maybe you could ask.
Was there any kind of announcement or did they just play a tone and not say what it was?
What we're hearing is that the tone happened and there was no follow up information.
So apparently, basically, they heard us talking.
They heard the emergency alert tone.
They heard us talking.
Um, I was trying to do a little bit of research because old habits die hard.
I can't find anything.
Um, so I don't know.
Did someone at the station lean on a button?
They shouldn't have how it works.
It's not supposed to work.
It's an automated interruption.
So it did not originate from our end.
And we did not have anything like that happen here.
So we can definitely go back and collect what versions of the recording we have and definitely share what we have.
I know the old EBS system, emergency broadcast system, uh, that was generated at the station.
And you'd push a button and you'd play an announcement and the tone would go off right when the announcement ended if you did it right.
I don't know if the EAS works the same way.
If that's, if that's true, then I guess it's possible somebody triggered it at the station mistakenly.
But it doesn't seem like that kind of thing.
We'll find out.
We'll find out what happened.
Um, if, if anybody else knows, it's more likely, it's more likely a call to, uh, stock up on popcorn.
Oh, you're funny.
You're very funny.
Uh, people are telling us that at least over, I'm assuming most of the folks based on what I know of where you folks are, we're listening to, uh, the website and not over the air.
So can't speak to anybody who was listening over the air for now, but that just the tone went off.
Um, and no, this was a test or anything.
And then just to clarify and answer a listener question.
Yes.
Rebel is still banned this week.
Oh, yes.
Uh, on that, assuming rebels listening rebel, please do not call this week or the perma ban might come into effect.
And that would be unfortunate for everybody.
Uh, and also, um, everybody is advised not to call next week when we take calls on WBAI, because that's for the over the air listeners.
And they don't get to speak at nearly as much because many of them don't listen to this show.
Uh, and, uh, everything goes back to normal in two weeks unless somebody doesn't play by the rules.
Yes.
Also part of the, one of the listeners who asked about whether rebel was banned said that they were listening to the 2000 MP3 when he was banned for three to six months.
Now I lived on the, I lived on the other coast at that time.
I didn't know.
I'm sorry.
What is that story?
I have no memory of this.
Wow.
So we've, we've done this before three to six months.
What did he do?
Wow.
That's something.
That's so many questions.
Um, at Amparo Rod.
I'm sorry.
Amparo.
Whatever.
Dude.
Who's talking about the, um, listening to that 2000 MP3.
Could you give us a date so that we can know this?
I mean, how did you find this?
Our listeners are so well-researched.
They, they, they look at, if we say something and we contradict ourselves 10 years later, they're on us.
They know, they know that you said that, that kids under four should not be on the internet.
And now you're advocating for it and saying, you know, okay, you know what?
I'm human.
I'm going to, I'm going to contradict myself occasionally, or maybe I won't.
I don't know that like comment neatly encapsulates that as well as like this, uh, overarching, uh, uh, need to, uh, correct things in general.
But wow.
That that's, that's astonishing.
Someone on the internet was wrong and I have to talk about it.
It does, it does make you, uh, feel for like a person up on stage at a sci-fi convention where they were in Star Trek, like back in the nineties.
And someone gets up in the audience and goes now in scene 17 of episode two of season four, you did this thing.
Well, it also makes, makes us realize that, uh, we, we, this is, that's nothing for, for rebel.
Like with, he's not even doing like, that's not like hard time.
Okay.
Okay.
That's like, that is a nothing rebel band.
One or two weeks.
You said we're talking about rebel while he's pinned, we're defeating ourselves.
Do you see it's I'm waiting for that call.
Did you give the number?
No, I haven't given a number and it's not even working yet.
So nobody should be calling anything.
Just stay away from the phone.
Uh, but that's, that's the word not this week.
And next week is, is by definition, uh, an off week and then two weeks, everything goes back to normal, but, uh, okay.
So, uh, we were talking about, uh, uh, British politics and Canadian politics and, uh, maybe American politics, um, and, um, mostly the systems and how kind of crazy they all are.
I don't know.
I, you know, I, I, I'd like to, I'd like to just sort of like the way Microsoft does updates, maybe not force a reboot, but, you know,
seriously consider some updates, some, uh, you know, like we talked about last week.
Uh, it's, it's like an OS that really is woefully out of date, like windows 95, which, you know, Alex was, um, very positive about tonight.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, the, the other thing too, you know, speaking of, of updating things, I forgot that originally, you know, senators were not elected.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
They were appointed by the state legislature, I believe.
So it sounds exactly the same.
Well, not exactly the same, very similar to the British system.
Yeah.
Very similar.
And they've only been elected in this country since 1913.
And it was the 17th amendment that changed the way in which senators were appointed.
So now they're elected by the population, but still.
Hold on.
They're not elected by the population.
They're elected by land masses.
I'm sorry.
I'm not going to let this go because, you know, they don't represent the people on an equal level.
You know, when you have North Dakota, South Dakota, you know, two sparsely populated states.
And now the two of them together have double what New York has as far as representation.
That's not representation.
Well, it's not proportional representation.
It's representation of a different sort.
It's equal representation by being virtue, by the virtue of being a state.
I mean, this is.
That's not equal.
As far as representation, how is that equal?
This was, you know, the great compromise here between, you know, the houses here, that there would be two senators.
And you didn't want to have the more populated states having the entire say over how the country is governed.
Why not?
That's a popular vote.
That's how it should work.
It should.
I mean, sometimes they'll make mistakes for sure.
But, OK, if that was true, why don't we do that on a state level?
Why don't sparsely populated counties have the same representation as Manhattan?
I mean, that's a state by state choice.
I guess, you know, maybe some states do.
No state has chosen that because it's stupid.
Yeah, I guess.
I don't know.
Kila looks like she had she had she wanted to chime in on this debate, didn't you?
Not on this debate.
I'm sorry.
I have more clarification on Rebels previous ban.
Oh, Lord.
Boy.
OK, so here's what I'm I'm just going to read what what we got.
We just during the break.
We just can't.
No, we really can't.
OK, go ahead.
During the rain, Emmanuel was driving in the rain.
He said it was unsafe and Rebel was trying to call him like he's trying to call you on
your personal phone.
Oh, really?
Wow.
You probably had it forwarded or something.
I might have.
I might have.
Wow.
Wowzers.
Well, you know, I wouldn't do that today because that's banning for a personal reason.
And that's that's, you know, people should be banned for reasons that affect the show.
Well, I guess me veering off the road might affect the show.
I don't know.
I just I have to re-listen to this.
That sounds interesting.
How did it end?
I don't know.
I'm actually looking for trying to find out when in a year it was so I can go back into
the archive myself and see what I can dig up.
All right.
All right.
Let's all listen to the show from years ago.
Any other?
Alex, you're in the middle of a sentence, I believe.
I'm so sorry, Alex.
Was I?
I wasn't in the middle of a sentence.
Well, I thought you were telling us something about.
Oh, no.
We were debating the.
Yeah.
Well, this is the great compromise, this whole idea of two senators, you know, let me put
it in different terms.
The Senate selects the Supreme Court.
So this this compromise that that you say it is, that's why we're where we are now with
the Supreme Court.
Does it seem fair now?
Well, yeah, I mean, so if you go back to the 18th century here, though, I mean, this was
like the bigger states that had lower population city were threatening to leave the United States
of America if they didn't have some kind of equal measure of representation.
So this should have taken them up on that offer.
Then we really should have.
Yeah.
I mean, if you think about it, what would this country be like if we did?
It would be really quite interesting.
I picture it all the time.
And I picture it like you remember when the bell system broke up.
I picture it as the same exact pieces like we would be 9x.
All right.
Maybe the country isn't called 9x, but it's comprised of New England and New York and X,
whatever that is.
So not Twitter.
And then you have the Bell Atlantic area and then you got Bell South, you know, and they
can do their thing or whatever.
You see, it all kind of makes sense then.
But if you try to merge us all together into one, well, you know, look around you.
That's what we get.
Yeah, that's my bell.
You would rather have the regional Bell operating companies, each as sovereign states?
Yeah, the United States of our box.
Why not?
Yes.
Exactly.
That'd be really cool, actually, wouldn't it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's not too late.
We can still do this.
You can still do it.
We can still do it.
But look, I mean, look, there's merit to both of these systems, right?
When you have representation by population or equal state representation.
And what we have is a bicameral legislature that embodies both and doesn't work at all.
Well, you know, I guess it's a question of how much power you give to each.
And if you give something as serious as electing lifetime members of a court that's going to decide every single issue that defines our democracy, maybe you don't give that to the body that doesn't fairly represent individuals in this country.
Yeah, maybe.
I mean, it's also a matter of logistics, right?
I mean, we know that there's only 100 senators, so to get a Supreme Court justice appointed, they have to go through, you know, the smaller chamber of Congress as opposed to, you know, the entire House.
So, I don't know, maybe there's an administrative reason why that's better.
But also, I think that the notion that senators are able to take a longer view on things is more consistent with the appointment of Supreme Court justices.
Well, when they start doing that, I'd be like, I'd be very curious just to witness it.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't want to be mean, but, you know, I could just name some names of current sitting U.S. senators.
And I think you'd see my point, you know, as far as this is not necessarily the high exalted body that we wish it were.
There's a lot of ignorant people in these positions, and they have way too much influence.
I wonder if the backlash from some of the judicial changes will double some of the other reasons people are unhappy with Congress in senators and some of those positions.
And if there will be a real change and people will vote that way, it's kind of interesting because that court has stood for a while and has a lot of rulings and the sort of faith in the judiciary has been something that I think is being called into question.
Well, it's been abused.
That's why all these systems are being abused.
And it's just like an operating system because if it's open to abuse, you either stop using it or you fix it.
And we're not doing either.
Right, and that's what I mean, like, the check conceivably, I guess, the way the system is supposed to work is that you go back to Congress, really, and there's pressure there because that's the only other body, especially if the executive is, you're out of a cycle for that.
So it's really more pressure on the way they vote.
There's one more body, and that's the body that encompasses all of our bodies.
Well, that too.
We have the final say.
That's not what's standing.
I'm not talking about elections.
I'm talking about, you know, getting outside and getting some fresh air.
The streets.
I am with that as well.
I think there's a lot to be said for that at this moment.
That doesn't mean violence.
It doesn't mean violence.
Bull voices.
Sometimes it's inevitable if you have a particularly horrible regime.
I hope we're not there yet, but you've got to voice your opinions, assuming your opinions are strong enough that you want to voice them.
And, you know, I can't imagine what else would have to happen for people to actually, you know, find their voices.
But, you know, we'll see.
I'm going to open up the phone lines.
802.
I forgot the phone number.
You can call your senator.
You can call.
You can call us.
You can call.
Oh, my God.
Call things out in the streets.
802.
321-4225.
I'm sorry.
I had a.
Slowly this time.
Yeah.
802-321-HACK.
That's our telephone number.
And phone lines are open.
Operators are standing by.
All that stuff.
So, Rebel call in two weeks.
Don't call now.
And everything will be fine.
And don't have people call for you.
We'll see right through that.
802-321-4225
I think it's working
sometimes Google Voice doesn't work
when you turn it on
so
I blame the libraries
I was really sad by that
that story just like
yeah it's tragic actually
the physical books like that's
part of citations and
even if these models
even if the models are going to use the
knowledge with impunity
like you should have the physical
repository of it at least
the shared one
not everyone has to have every book
but it'd be nice to have a place to go
and say okay I actually want to
read what this
conclusion or
result from some inquiry
what it's based on
we have a phone call
and let's go to that phone call
good evening you're on off the hook over time
go ahead
yes Emmanuel
well Rebel that's it
you're banned
forever
I have seen it yeah
what's this
unless you're the fake one
this is the deep fake Rebel
is it
I don't want someone getting Rebel
how do you know that
because of the lag
okay
I noticed that
I demonstrated this last time
about the
the fact that
sometimes
I remember
I've been listening to the old
off the hooks
lately
you know
Rebel
can I just ask you one question
Rebel can I ask you one question
see the lag
they're generating a response
right
and I remember
I just like the way you like
call different places
and entities
and operators
how do I fight this
how do we ever win
I was just noticing
this is
this is some kind of
science fiction nightmare
right now
so we have a fake Rebel
that's harassing us
almost as much as the real Rebel
and there's no way to tell
the difference between them
but okay
I'm doing about like
800
we can't stop him
but here's the thing
we can't stop him
when it's really him either
well yeah
at least you know
it's a human being
now it's like
there's an infinite number
of him
all right
you put a three month
moratorium
on his calling
I am living through
a black mirror here
how do I get out
September 19th
2000
Emmanuel imposes
a three month moratorium
on calls from Rebel
and then you extended it
the following week
wow
what happened for me
to do that
I can't listen
to the shows right now
I don't know
but I want to listen
to them
wow
but in the meantime
thank you for having
the really good summaries
by the way
in the meantime
and the chat is
yeah
the chat is kind of
up in arms over
like don't
don't frame Rebel
don't ban Real Rebel
because of fake Rebel
no I don't want to
as soon as I realized
I was
but you know
what if it's Real Rebel
controlling fake Rebel
do you ever think of that
oh my god
no you didn't
think of that
did you
okay I'm not
going to be sleeping
we'll take a look
at that
and I'm never
going to pick up
the phone again
I mean it's just
you know
how
sorry
there's just no way
you can't talk
to anybody
I can try to screen
a little bit
who are you
are you real
are you Rebel
I don't even know
nobody knows
we are all Rebel
on this blessed day
however if I could
point this out
years ago
friends of mine
tried to call me
using a
Miss Cleo soundboard
and
they
actually wound up
laughing too hard
to hit the buttons
so
all I heard
was
call me now
and then
like hysterical laughter
so kudos to whoever
set up the Rebel
soundboard
because at least
you're not giggling
well
yeah
but I mean
they can have a mute button
and they could be
like you know
screaming with laughter
when they press it
and maybe that's
where the lag is
yeah
that's probably
what it is
okay
everybody
we've all had our fun
can we
can we move on
to serious phone calls
now
just you know
just try something
different
802-321-4225
yeah
this is a serious
show
it starts out
that way
and just somehow
veers off
again
and let's
take this phone call
good evening
you're on
off the hook
over time
please be a serious
call
it's a serious
call
oh good
I was listening
over the air
and I heard
the
alert
sound
blotting out
okay
so you
are the missing
link here
because we
weren't sure
anybody
was actually
listening to the
radio
over the radio
and you confirm
now that
there was
an EAS
tone
in the middle
of the show
correct
wow
okay
and there was
no explanation
there was no
explanation
and I
never
quite figured
out what
she was asking
you know
well
it's impossible
for us to know
when exactly
in the show
that happened
but
there will be
an archive
posted
that will have
the complete
uninterrupted show
but we'll also
have
the snippet
that has
the interruption
just so
people can hear
what that sounded
like too
because I know
people want to
okay
I thought
I would
share
a nightmare
I had
please do
yes
I was
on the subway
and
there were
almost no
regular civilians
on the subway
because
the subways
were full
of Trump's
troops
being shuttled
around
and
the real
people who
live here
thought it
was safer
not to be
on the subway
hang on
hang on
hang on
you're saying
that ICE
agents
take the subway
to get around
I'm saying
that
Trump
had
called in
troops
to supplement
the ICE
agents
and they were
in camo
and stuff
like that
in troops
being shuttled
around
and there
were
announcements
over
about
where
they
should
go
and
so
you know
regular
people
wait a minute
hang on
is this
a nightmare
or has this
really happened
this is a
nightmare
I haven't
been in
the subway
for quite
some time
I'm disabled
so I
haven't
actually
physically
been in
the subways
for quite
some time
there are
many accessible
stations though
just so you know
but this was
my nightmare
wow
that
people who
live here
civilians
didn't think it
was safe
to take
the subway
anymore
because it
was just
overwhelmingly
filled with
troops being
shuttled here
and there
that's a good
nightmare
it's believable
you had me
believing it
for a second
but we're
not quite
there yet
I hope
and I hope
we never
get there
you are
off mic
no I'm
not
I'm speaking
right into
a microphone
well I'm
barely hearing
you
I'm sorry
about that
okay
maybe somebody
else can talk
if I can't
be heard
now I can
hear you
I didn't
move
I'm in the
same place
I didn't
do anything
okay
wow
I just
talked a
little bit
more
animatedly
so
I'll be
a huge
difference
okay
well it was
a good
nightmare
it was a
good nightmare
and you
know
let's
try to
keep it
from
happening
yes
anything
else
you say
there's
an app
that I
could find
out on
my computer
if
Trump
sends
in the
troops
well as
far as
ice
tracking
in
Manhattan
you guys
who are
in
New York
City
do you
use
anything
or do
you know
of
anything
not
offhand
there are
some
chats
and stuff
but
those
aren't
easily
findable
if
anybody
out
there
has
an
app
or
is
using
an
app
that
works
in
New
York
City
please
email
us
OTH
at
2600
dot com
we'd
love
to
spread
the word
about
that
I know
we've
we've
talked
about
you know
various
apps
in the
past
I need
something
that works
on a
Mac
because
I don't
have a
cell phone
well
yeah
the
well
the
Joshua
Aaron's
app
does
anybody
remember
what it
was
called
Iceblock
yeah
that was
for
Macs
except
the
Apple
store
basically
stopped
providing
it
and I
don't
think
you can
install
it
if
they
don't
provide
it
because
that's
how
Macs
operate
they're
very
closed
if
you
already
had
it
though
it
still
works
no
I
don't
have
it
yeah
so
I
don't
have
a
solution
but
you
know
what
we
can
reach
out
to
him
and
see
if
he
has
a
solution
and
again
any
listeners
out
there
who
know
of
an
app
that
will
work
on
a
Mac
in
New
York
City
OTH
at
2600
dot com
please
email
us
thanks
all
right
thanks
for
calling
bye
bye
yeah
Joshua
Aaron's
app
site
was
iceblock
dot
app
and
he's
posted
on there
that
you know
it
doesn't
work
I
mean
you
can't
you
can't
get
the
app
from
the
Apple
store
because
they've
taken
it
down
but
if
you
have
it
already
installed
it
still
works
but
there
is
no
way
to
get
the
app
installed
and
there
are
lots
for
people
looking
for
one
that
they
can
still
install
so
you
know
be
very
wary
don't
install
a
fake
iceblock
but
if
you
find
any
other
we
would
love
to
hear
about
other
legit
apps
and
sites
and
stuff
for
the
purpose
yeah
this
is
a
problem
that
we're
going
to
run
into
with
apps
and
basically
getting
information
out to
people
there
will
be
those
people
out
there
who
are
trying
to
sabotage
those
efforts
whether
it be
by
putting
up
fake
apps
or
by
putting
out
fake
information
you know
and
we
have
to
learn
how
to
see
past
that
figure
out
a
way
to
get
the
information
out
there
make
sure
it's
accurate
information
and
that's
the
challenge
that
we
all
face
and
working
together
we can
definitely
do
that
there
are
more
of
us
than
there
are
people
trying
to
thwart
the
efforts
so
that's
why
it's
important
to
keep
trying
I
assume
Kyle
that
call
was
not
a
legit
call
that's
why
we
didn't
pick
it
up
okay
and
there's
lots
of
ways
to
make
the
public
transportation
system
safer
and
there's
all kinds
of
changes
and
things
to
observe
and
hopefully
that
nightmare
doesn't
come
true
I
can't
imagine
them
riding
the
subway
they'd
have
to
pay
you know
what
they
don't
they
break
all
the
laws
they'll
just
jump
the
turnstile
although
that's
getting
harder
it's
getting
harder
they're
changing
some
of the
doors
I
heard
I
saw
a
news
story
about
that
I'm
sure
we'll
be
covering
some
of
that
in
the
future
but
yeah
we
shouldn't
have
those
kinds
of
nightmares
but
it's
good
to
sit
with
it
and
evaluate
it
and
think
about
the
ways
that
we
would
not
accept
that
in
our
community
and
actually
have
a
hopeful
ideal
of
using
public
transit
that
it
is
a
system
that
has
its
perils
but
is
you
know
not
not
something
that
can't
improve
and
that
can't
be
a
better
experience
802-321-4225
is our phone number
yes
Gila
yes
Lou
ratio
has
stepped
forward
and
taken
credit
for
fake
rebel
okay
so
last
week
when we
said it
was
him
he
said
it
wasn't
him
right
and
this
week
it
is
him
even
though
it
sounds
exactly
the same
I guess
they all
would
sound
exactly
the same
but
I don't
know
do you
buy
it
well
Lou Ray
Chu
is
provably
already
we know
a wizard
so
I
believe
that
I believe
Lou Ray
Chu
claiming
responsibility
is legitimate
the problem
the problem
the problem
is that
you
you know
we don't
know
who
we're
gonna
get
and
we
have
to
kind
of
keep
moving
we
want
to
open
up
the
lines
talk
about
different
things
get
people's
ideas
if
they
have
you
know
ways
of
making
transit
secure
or
ways
it's
not
secure
or
you
know
something
cool
with
telephones
and
we need
we need
to be
able
to
verify
you
know
different
calls
so
I
don't
know
we
can
accept
that
and
move
on
I
think
and
we'll
we'll
check
again
next
we'll
reset
next
week
with
everybody
except
for
whatever
the
current
policy
dictates
but
we
don't
want
to
have
that
what
was
that
you
just
I'm
sorry
I'm
so
sorry
Alex
control
yourself
there
wow
that
was
loud
I'm
I'm
so
sorry
I
our
microphone
is
really
good
apparently
um
Alex
I
cannot
believe
you
yeah
this
this
is a
visual
thing
and
our
listeners
will
not
know
what
we're
on
about
unless
we
explain
this
um
Alex
stepped
away
from
camera
for a
second
and
came
back
wearing
a
sweater
printed
with
the
word
rebel
why
Alex
why
are you
doing
this
you know
it
it actually
is
coincidental
that I'm
wearing
this
it's
uh
what
universe
you would
have a
reason to
walk around
with a
sweater that
says rebel
like five
or six
times
yeah rebel
rebel rebel
so I
I go
I go to
this
this uh
this like
this kind
of weird
wholesale
clothing place
on 28th
street
between uh
6th and
broadway
called
shaheem
and they
sell all
kinds of
uh
rather
interesting
clothes
like a
lot of
um
a lot
of djs
and stuff
will go
there
because they
get like
kind of
wacky
stuff
in in
some respects
but like
one of the
brands that
they have
is rebel
minds
and they
carry a lot
of their
their clothing
from rebel
minds
and one of
the tish
one of the
tish
one of the
sweaters
actually
is just
printed with
the word
rebel over
and over
and over
again
and it's
actually
really quite
a comfy
sweater here
so yeah
I'm wearing
that today
I took it
off before
the show
because it
was so
goddamn hot
in this
office
so I'm
putting it
on now
because I
have to peel
off in a
few minutes
um
I have a
really early
flight tomorrow
uh guys
and I have
to see my
kids before
I go
so um
I'll hang
around for a
little bit
but I'm
I'm uh
I'm packing
it up here
okay all
right fair
enough uh
we're we're
packing it
up too I
think do we
have a phone
call Kyle
yes okay
we have a
phone call
good evening
you're on
off the hook
overtime
go ahead
hello
hello
um
well
first I
want to
spend a
couple of
words on
rebel
I think
that whoever
was uh
parroting him
was doing
it in
in the
irreverent
spirit of
OTH
not to
say that I
condone this
I think
you're right
to ban him
and not
because I
have personal
antipathy
simply because
what he
says is
very self
referential
and very
rarely does
he add
anything to
the show
so
just
dovetailing
with what
the last
speaker said
this is about
innovation
it's about
stimulating
things
about
things that
need to
be discussed
on to
bags do
travel
solo
it happened
to me
I was
I don't
remember
because it's
been
it was
after
September
11th
and I
was at
JFK
I was
going to
Europe
I had
checked
my bag
and the
airline
probably
oversold
told me
at the
gate
that I
couldn't
get on
and I
said okay
and they
would rebook
me for the
day after
I said okay
I'll take
my bag
and they
said no
the bag
is already
being checked
it's been
secured
you'll pick
it up
at your
destination
so I
was very
surprised
and I
should have
made a
huge stink
but this
happened to
me personally
so I
know first
time
well you
know the
conditions
might be a
little different
because they
rebooked you
they're in
control of the
situation
if you're in
control of the
situation and
you don't show
up and your
bag did I
think they
might take
that a
little bit
more seriously
I could be
wrong but
that's my
understanding is
that bags
aren't supposed
to go without
the person
who's attached
to them
well their
ground was
that it
had been
screened
it had been
declared
secure
so it
would have
been the
same
identical
situation
whether I
was there
or not
on this
ground
which to
me are
preposterous
because I
am with
you and
this is what
they taught
us in
terms of
security
practices
that's what
they tell
us but
as I said
I had this
happen to me
personally and
I wanted to
brush my
teeth that
night so
I couldn't
right
that
the other
thing I
wanted to
say
and this
is the
last one
on the
list
for our
legal expert
there it's
not the
first time I
spar with you
Alex
does it
say we
the people
or we
the states
and one
of the
first
parameters
of the
constitution
which is
in the
initial
phrase
is to
get a
more
perfect
union
so we
know
perfectly
well
that
when
the
declaration
of
independence
which is
the founding
document
of this
wobbly
state
that we
all love
somehow
was made
that's what
it said
we the
people
then the
constitution
was passed
and
amongst
many other
things it
said that
only
three-fifths
of a
man
is what
a slave
counted
and only
for population
counting
which meant
representation
in the
lower
chamber
that's
what it
said in
1787
there had
to be
a war
there had
to be
almost a
century
of
sanctioned
slavery
for it
to be
changed
and there
has been
a continuous
progress
so I
don't see
it as
if
you know
there have
been
many
many
many
hypocrisies
and quite
frankly
bullshit
to
maintain
control
by the
elite
whatever
the elite
was at
that
particular
moment
but I
think
that
the
time
that we're
going
through
speaks
for
itself
and
although
I do
know
that
Alex
was
just
repeating
rota
legal
arguments
that are
taught in
law school
well
I think
the root
needs to
be
analyzed
and again
it's
we the
people
not
we the
state
I will
hang up
and listen
to your
answers
and thank
you so
much
keep up
the great
work
thanks for
the call
and Alex
explain
yourself
explain
our
system
you're
responsible
for it
you know
I love
this caller
and I
I like
to spar
with him
but in
this particular
instance
I don't
disagree
with him
and he's
right
the preamble
to the
constitution
says we
the people
of the
United
States
in order
to form
a more
perfect
union
establish
justice
and ensure
domestic
tranquility
etc
etc
but sure
it is
this
we the
people
we're
supposed
to have
democracy
here
that's
responsive
to the
people
we have
elected
representatives
that are
supposed to
encapsulate
our interests
within Congress
within the
state
legislatures
etc
but we
don't
necessarily
have
direct
democracy
though
right
I mean
the people
don't
directly
vote for
what it
is they
want
we elect
representatives
to do
that work
for us
in certain
parts of
Vermont
what I
always found
it really
interesting
is you
know when
I lived
up there
there was
like a
state
holiday
called
town hall
day
and all
these little
these little
towns in
Vermont
people would
literally go
to the
town hall
and there
was no
representative
there
it was
direct
democracy
it was
an example
of the
people
going and
discussing
the issues
and proposing
to do
something
and then
voting
on it
and the
majority
of the
population
was all
there
voting
and
participating
directly
in
democratic
processes
and it's
something that
in Vermont
is still
taking
incredibly
seriously
and it's
a really
cool thing
to watch
and to be
a part
of
is direct
democracy
as well
so there's
all different
types of
democracy
all different
forms of
it
it's
not
perfect
and I
tend to
agree
with
Emmanuel
here
that
we do
need
some
kind
of
reboot
if you
were
listening
last
week
this
was
like
the
germ
of
my
next
article
for
2600
was
about
the nature
of democracy
as being
this
system
that
has a lot
of uptime
but may
have a
tremendous
amount of
vulnerabilities
inherent to
it
that need
to be
patched
and maybe
we need
to
it's
kind
of
weird
how
I
brought
it
up
somehow
it
wound
up
being
your
column
exactly
I was
already
writing
it
and you
brought
it
up
I
mean
I
guess
it's
just
kind
of
the
zeitgeist
at the
moment
right
people
are
thinking
it
was
very
strange
almost
as if
you
might
have
been
accessing
my
files
or like
you're
accessing
my
thoughts
it's
in the
consciousness
it's
in the
consciousness
one
more
thing
Alex
that
I'm
going
to
hold
you
accountable
for
is
this
phrase
a
more
perfect
union
now
I
don't
know
much
about
perfection
but I
do
know
that
you
can't
be
more
perfect
you're
either
perfect
or
you're
not
so
what
do
you
mean
I'm
more
perfect
union
what
the
hell
there
was
some
form
of
government
before
the
constitution
where
there
was
the
articles
of
confederation
right
but they
weren't
great
and
and
it's
union
capitalized
so
it's
in
order
to
form
a
more
perfect
union
you know
as in
like
a
defined
term
as
being
but
there's
no
more
perfect
or
less
perfect
it's
perfect
perfect
is
the
goal
you're
done
if
you're
perfect
well
I
think
the
implication
there
is
a
more
perfect
well
I
see
what
you're
saying
yeah
but
a
more
perfect
union
or
a
more
closer
to
perfect
union
say
a
better
union
a
nicer
union
you know
a
cooler
union
it's
that
it
will
never
be
perfect
no
it'll
never
be
perfect
well
I mean
they have
to go
with the
words
that they
had
they
thought
they
were
perfect
and
not
only
were
they
perfect
they
could
be
more
perfect
I
mean
who
are
these
people
more
perfect
I
I
understand
the
founding
fathers
less and
less
with every
passing
day
we
have
wait
are you
leaving
safe
travels
yeah
I gotta
go
I gotta
go
say hello
to our
next
caller
and then
leave
good
evening
you're
on
off
the
cover
time
go ahead
oh
no
listen
we
can't
possibly
do
all
the
dancing
we
did
last
week
again
because
we're
still
recovering
from
that
good
yeah
good
good
I
like
this
it
sounds
like a
craft
work
type
theme
good
good
yes
if
you'd
like to
talk to
us
please
we're
going to
turn
you
down
for
a
little
bit
and
then
we'll
turn
you
back
up
again
and
if
you're
still
doing
that
we're
going
to
talk
to
people
it's
kind
of a
nice
thing
we
do
sometimes
well
I'll
say
good
night
to
everybody
have
safe
travel
yeah
and
talk
to
you
all
next
week
don't
don't
not
travel
on
flights
you
need
to
be
on
you
know
I'll
try
yeah
there's
a
direct
flight
so
no
skip
lagging
is
bad
don't
do
that
exactly
copyright
infringement
as
well
poor
airlines
trying
to
make
a
living
all
right
all
right
good
night
well
I guess
that's
a
version
of
the
last
call
too
all
right
all
right
let's
let's
take
this
phone
call
good
evening
you're
on
off
the
hook
over
time
go
ahead
hi
hi
what's
on
your
mind
this
is
Johnny
Fusion
Johnny
Fusion
it's
been
a
while
it's
been
a
minute
yeah
I
believe
you
hacker
spiritual
Johnny
Fusion
yes
oh
that's
right
say
properly
yeah
I already
forgot
my
self-given
title
so
what's
what's
going
on
what's
what's
happening
well
I got
the new
issue
of the
magazine
ah
yes
and
for the
first
time
someone
actually
wrote
a letter
about
one
of my
articles
that'll
happen
that does
happen
people do
read and
comment
and
um
but the
response
to the
letter
I think
his name
was
David
Libertas
something
Libertas
and he
was very
very upset
that I
characterized
President
Trump as
an
authoritarian
well a lot
of people do
get upset
when you
when you
say things
like that
that's why
it's important
to say
things like
that
yeah
and
and then
what I
really
liked
about
that
letter
column
was
the
long
reply
from
the
editor
I
don't
know
if
you
wrote
it
or
someone
else
wrote
it
basically
laying out
all
the ways
that
Trump
is an
authoritarian
while
saying that
speaking
for the
author
which
would be
me
that's
not very
hard
to do
that's
not very
hard
to point
out
all the
ways
he's
an
authoritarian
it's
just
basically
you know
watch the
news
and you'll
see
right
and
and
and
the
funny
thing
is
the
magazine
got
in my
hands
the
day
the
night
before
he bombed
Venezuela
yeah
so I
guess that
didn't get
included
no
that didn't
get
included
but I
mean
it's
right
there
for
anyone
who
was
reading
that
letter
column
along
with
me
so I
just
want to
express
my
gratitude
for
consistently
publishing
me
and
and that
long
response
well we
we stand
up for
our
writers
you know
we
we fight
for you
I appreciate
it
I appreciate
it
so much
but you
know
it's really
kind of
a conservative
running into
the point
and you
know
and still
missing it
when he
said well
if Trump's
an authoritarian
then all
these other
presidents
were
authoritarians
and I'm
like
of the
opinion
yeah
you're
probably
right
you know
we pride
ourselves
on being
you know
a free
country
based on
liberty
but really
that liberty
has always
been very
narrow
for who
can enjoy
it
mostly
white
protestant
straight
men
get all
the benefits
and anyone
else with
any kind
of marginalization
kind of
struggles
and
eventually
gets more
and more
civil rights
but
now
you know
fascism
to the point
where it's
affecting
everybody
and everybody
can see it
it's so
obvious
but
this is what
people of
color
and other
minorities
have gone
through the
entire
history
of European
contact
on this
continent
well it's
it's a false
narrative that
conservatives like
to push
for instance
racism is over
it's solved
therefore you
don't need
Martin Luther King
Day anymore
and you know
that's what
Trump is doing
not even
acknowledging
for most of
the day
and you know
taking away
silly things
like free
entry to
public park
national parks
on that
holiday
bona fide
holiday
and if he
had his
way he'd
take away
the holiday
completely
but the
justification
is that
we don't
need it
anymore
you know
it doesn't
take much
imagination
to realize
that he
really just
resents the
fact that
there's this
acknowledgement in
the first
place and
it's no
different than
the people
of the past
that that
basically were
the problem
in the first
place this
is them
rising up
again and
bringing the
same problems
back and we
have to recognize
that we have to
realize that you
know I keep I
keep hearing the
phrase that
for the first
time I don't
have to apologize
for being white
when have any
of us ever
had to apologize
for being white
you know not
once in my
life has that
ever been an
issue and
and people have
been remarkably
welcoming and
open considering
how they could
be if they
judge me based
on the color
of my skin
but I don't
have I don't
have that happen
to me like
other people
have that
happen to
them and
you know for
people not to
be able to
see that it's
it's got to be
intentional to
be to be that
blind to to
the reality but
this is the kind
of thing they do
they they come up
with these
narratives that
people latch on
to and they
almost sound
believable until
you start analyzing
it and and and
you know throwing
in a bit of
history and maybe
some of their own
track records as
well and then
you get the
truth pretty
fast yeah
when it comes
to Trump and
Martin Luther
King Day I'm
not surprised
when a racist
participates in
racism I mean
this is this is
expected behavior
really that he's
going to be a
racist so it's
not shocking to
me it's just
like it's more
like oh yeah
I figure you
know that's on
brand but you
know whiteness
was created to
establish a
racial hierarchy
with white people
at the top I
mean that's the
only reason why
it exists and
no one has had
to apologize for
being white in
the history of
it because we've
always made sure
we were the ones
in charge and
all white people
benefit from white
supremacy whether
we want to
participate in it
or not we get
that privilege by
the color of our
skin and
participating in
whiteness
well I just I
find it incredible
that the people
who have been
victims throughout
the course of the
history of this
country they're
not more angry
at people who
you know are
represented by that
unfairness you
know by by white
people you know
I don't know if
I could be I
could be as
composed if I
saw this this
unfairness that I
was the victim of
constantly that my
family was a victim
of you know so
what I'm saying is
I haven't I
haven't ever had to
apologize for being
white and and
I'm a little
surprised that I've
never had to but
that speaks to that
speaks to who
people are people
with integrity
people without
integrity you know
it's right here it's
not an individual
thing this is well
here's the thing
this is another
privilege of being a
white person is
that no matter what
we do we're seen as
an individual and
not a representation
of all white people
right and people
belong to different
marginalized identities
and minorities don't
have that privilege
you know if if if
one person of color
does something
outlandish white
people will hold
the entire race
accountable for the
for the actions of
one person they're
not given the same
opportunity to be a
good or bad
individual but they're
all representing their
entire group
yeah
well thank you I
think I'll I think
I'll get off the
line it's it's about
that time yes I just
and I actually have
two articles in the
hopper that I'm working
on going back and
forth on one taking a
lot more research and
I'm having yet another
AI take
fantastic
thank you we look
forward to that yes
and I'm sure our
readers do as well and
there will be more
discussions to have
in the future thanks
for thanks for
listening
yes
and oh the AI is a
path is a path to
ethical AI where I
address the common
moral panic and
ethical concerns of the
current AI models and
how to do something
outside of that model
that's ethical that
doesn't steal that
isn't a plagiarism
machine stuff like
that
all right we will talk
to you again next time
all right thank you very
much all right take care
and I think that's going
to do it for us tonight
because we've just about
done an hour and I
think that's enough
indeed
sorry sorry I agree
with you I was
commenting we got a
comment that was hidden
and I am I'm going to
continue hiding it
okay that's very
mysterious but but
we'll leave it at that
and I'm we're not we're
not taking another call
want to take this one
last call yeah sure
what the hell
good evening you're on
off the cover time
go ahead
okay a few remarks
based on what people
said I mean people said
basically the right thing
in a lot of cases
Trump did get
inaugurated on Martin
Luther King's day last
year and and he paid
lip service to it he
did acknowledge it he
said it was a good
thing or something like
that I don't know the
exactly and he
acknowledged it this year
too but only after most
of the day was over and a
lot of people were
clamoring for him to do
that so it didn't seem
very sincere
right something more
perfect than perfection
is pluperfect
I'm sorry say that
again
something more perfect
than perfection is
pluperfect
oh pluperfect
yeah you know I've
heard that word
yeah it has to do
with grammar
okay
pluperfect
and
and I think that
that
you were talking about
the Macintosh being
locked down
it was it's actually
more the iPhone and
iPad that's locked
down
okay
in terms of
what you can do
with it
so
so I think that
the
the iSpock or
whatever app was
for the iPhone
not for the Mac
you're right yes
I tend to use those
terms interchangeably
and that's not
correct
right
okay I'll let you
go
okay thanks for your
call
you're welcome
take care
and that's going to do
it for us
if you have any
comments for us
oth at 2600 dot com
is our email address
we'd certainly love to
hear from you
and any
any final words
from out in
signal land
sorry about the
buzzer at our
house
and you could get
a less harsh
sounding buzzer
you know that's
that wakes the
dead that thing
I would
love
to get
a less harsh
buzzer
we were in charge
of that
my grandparents
had a buzzer
like that
and it was
like it would
your spine
would just
you know
it would resonate
throughout the entire
house whenever
somebody rang that
bell
everything else
was so comforting
and welcoming
you should fix the
squeak to on the
door
but that sound
just it would
it would wake
the dead
it really would
I actually did
sleep through it
once
which was
okay
we just did get
one comment
I challenge
OTH in overtime
to go one week
without mentioning
Trump
we can't
nope
hey I know
a good way
we can do
that
get rid of
Trump
we'll stop
talking about
him
all right
seriously
he keeps
screwing things
up
I mean this
week alone
for God's sake
it's threatening
NATO
threatening allies
and you know
we had somebody
murdered the week
before that
that he was
celebrating
you know
and God forbid
you say anything
about Charlie
Kirk
give me a break
yeah we're gonna
talk about it
because it's
happening
because there's
a shit storm
out there
and you know
somebody has
to stand up
to it
otherwise we're
just giving
everything up
and I don't
think we're
gonna do that
Rob
yeah some
some show
we would be
if we like
flat out
ignored one
of the most
destructive forces
active in the
world today
especially one
who wants to
crack down on
so many of the
things that we
hold dear
exactly
it's
we're not
doing it
because we
think it's
fun
well and
it's also
occurring with
a background
of a whole
lot of
other
technological
and commercial
forces
and the
whole
environment
the whole
information
like networked
environment
is itself
kind of
precarious
and in a
perilous
state
and I think
everyone
there's a
information
sharing
there's a
there's a lot
of things
to be learned
and said
to one
another
in the
midst
of all
of that
and just
like trying
to make
sense of
it
and understand
how to
move forward
how to
act
and in
that kind
of environment
is crucial
you know
sharing
information
getting
alerts
however
intrusive
or you
know
how much
they mean
business
you know
shout out
to alerts
stay alert
the world
needs more
alerts
I guess
that's a
good note
to end
on
we will
see you
next week
next week
next week
there is
not going
to be an
overtime
because next
week is
the call
in show
on WBAI
and again
we ask
that people
who call
into overtime
don't call
that show
that way
it gives
people
who listen
to the
radio
a chance
to call
in
and if
you did
call in
this week
please don't
call in
next week
because there's
so many
other people
out there
and we
want to
hear from
them as
well
we'll be
back
during overtime
in two
weeks
all clear
everyone knows
okay
we'll see you
next week
on BAI
bye YouTube
bye
goodnight