By: Eric "Loki" Hines
Regarding: Recent News Post Regarding Myself and Fate Research Labs inaccurately detailed by 
#phrack.



I will not be addressing every single detail and statement made in this article released by a
supposed "ex-fate labs" member in a recent #phrack news post. This is because the news post
was full of so many distortions of truth that replying to each one would be overly time consuming
than what I plan for this response. I find it funny that the individual was too cowardice to name
himself in this article. Anonymity is for individuals who are slinging mud that is based on
oppinion rather than factual information. Does this individual know the intimacies of my life 
and my intentions, no he obviously does not.

First of all, I consider [RaFa] to not only be a friend, but family as well. The conversation
I had with [RaFa] and the reasons I mentioned in that conversation for him having to "lay low" was
to somehow separate him from involvement with Fate Labs due to the accidental defacement he had
made and apologized for publicly. I felt telling him "you are bringing bad publicity to Fate Labs"
or "several members no longer want you in Fate" would have been too harsh and insensitive. I felt
the reason I came up with, although not true, was the best way we could have dissolved that
relationship. Is this anyone elses business? No..

My claims of working for the FBI and NIPC in past attacks on a Military web server is in fact true.
(See my whitepaper, Broken Walls).
What your statement in the news article actually is relevant to, I have no clue. However, this is
because the IRC conversation you tied it to has no meaning whatsoever, nor is any of the statements
I made to [RaFa] true. Again refer to my previous statement.

Ok, this is my confusion. What exactly does me being a self-confessed "non-programmer" have anything
to do with my career in the Security Industry or even Fate Labs? How does this make me a bad person?
I've never admitted to anyone that I was a programmer, nor have I stuck my name on anyones source
code and called it mine. What exactly does your statement have any relevancy to anyway? 

Quote: "Eric Hines cannot write code in any programming language, therefore he 
relies on help from other programmers he has recruited into Fate Labs"

Lets see.. That's how businesses survive, right?.. The CEO can program, do the cohesive marketing and sales
campaigns, and can even write all the code he needs for the product. That's how organizations work, 
isnt it? Please get a better sense of reality kid. Fate Labs has been broken down into a heiarchal structure
where departments for Development, Research, and Management have been created. Each person with their own
strengths contributing to research.

Regarding our advisories, several advisories were mistakenly released without further research. This
has happened in the past and will continue to happen with anyone that posts in Open Disclosure. It goes
with the territory. That is the reason why we no longer posted it on the Fate Labs web site, so what 
exactly are you trying to say here?

My position in open disclosure and the security industry has nothing to do with programming or 
being able to write code. You obviously have some issues to work out as an incredibly
egotistical programmer who has issues with anyone that can not program. Do all security 
researchers have to be programmers? I believe I was the one who authored an advisory on 
circumventing VPNet appliances without having to know a single line of code. You have a 
lot to learn in this world as well as a lot of growing up to do. So we all can't be elite programmers
like yourself, how terrible is that? Think about it this way, programmers are what makes advisories
and vulnerabilities possible. A little one-sided are we kid?

The opinions you've stated in this article can also get you in a great deal of trouble. Claiming
no researchers within Fate Research Labs have an active MBI Secret, or TS/SCI clearance is defamation
and since it is not supported by facts, would love to see you identify yourself for further action. 
It is quite funny that you would say something like this when I recently completed my Secret 
Clearance application process. Again, another point to your "news article" being full of nothing 
but opinions rather than facts. Other members also hold active clearances that I'm sure you obviously 
would not know about since you are no longer a member. Or were you ever?

In closing, it is apparent to me that you obviously have way too much time on your hands, along with
the other 12 year olds in #phrack that by the looks of their grammatical and spelling abilities are
not much older than 15. Reading your several page rant or "news post" more closely, I realize that
it wasn't full of any factual information, rather, distortions of the truth. BTW, if this is who
I think it is, my quotes in the Wired Magazine article remain true.. Several of the #phrack
members are already contradictions of your message and "mission". You guys are a fad that will
very quickly die out once several of you continue to get jobs within the security field. I find
your whole "manifesto" to be quite humorous. Be careful with whom you burn bridges, one day
all of you will have to all grow up and get real jobs. 


+ ESH