From bilb@eskimo.com Mon Oct 27 14:17:57 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA19373 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 14:17:56 -0700 Received: from matrix.eden.com (root@matrix.eden.com [199.171.21.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA19355 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 14:17:53 -0700 Received: from net-1-111.austin.eden.com (net-1-111.austin.eden.com [199.171.21.111]) by matrix.eden.com (8.6.12/8.6.12.1) with SMTP id QAA08087 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 16:17:49 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 16:17:49 -0500 Message-Id: <199510272117.QAA08087@matrix.eden.com> X-Sender: little@eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: TOMI device test X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: TOMI DEVICE ENERGY BALANCE TEST 27OCT95 Scott Little EarthTech Int'l Austin TX 78759 A TOMI track was constructed according to instructions provided by the inventor, Pat Harris. This device consists of two cylindrical magnets fixed on opposite sides of an inclined track and an identical cylindrical magnet that serves as a roller on the track. In operation, the roller is placed at the lower end of the track even with the ends of the track magnets and given the slightest nudge upwards. The roller then races up the track between the track magnets and travels beyond their upper ends with significant kinetic energy. Measurements were made of the energy imparted to the roller by the track and the energy required to place the roller at the beginning of the track. These two quantities were found to be identical within the precision of the measurement. Apparatus The track and roller magnets were each assembled from 10 annular ceramic magnets (Radio Shack type) encased in heat shrink tubing. A long straight ramp (35" long, 5" wide) was constructed from furniture-grade plywood which provides a very smooth surface. The track magnets were clamped to this ramp near its center. Procedure For the energy output measurements, this ramp was propped up at a known angle, typically 4-10 degrees. The roller magnet was carefully introduced to the lower end of the track and pushed very slowly upwards past the neutral force point which is located very near the point where the center of the roller is even with the lower end of the track magnets. Once the roller has been nudged past this point, it takes off and rolls up the ramp past the upper ends of the track magnets. The highest point reached by the roller was recorded in each test. Several tests were made at 4 different track angles. In each case, the highest point the roller reached was taken as the height value for that track angle. The total length of the roll varied between 5" and 10" along the track. The sine of the track angle was used to compute the height gain for each test. The roller magnet was accurately weighed and the output energy was computed by: E = mgh where m is the roller mass, g is the acceleration due to gravity, and h is the vertical height gain that occurred during the roll. The input energy was measured by numerically integrating the product of force and distance while moving the roller magnet to the starting point of the track from a distant location on the entrance side of the track from the (6" away from the starting point). The force vs location data for this integration was obtained with a fixture that held the roller on the track at a specific location. This fixture captured the roller in a confined space which allowed a very small amount of rolling movement to occur. With the roller thus contained at a known location along the path towards the starting point of the TOMI track, the ramp was tilted until the angle was found that generated the necessary gravitational force resultant (in the track direction) to balance the magnetic repulsion force. The sine of the track angle was used to compute the force resultant. These force determinations were made at 1/2" intervals over the first four inches, 1/4" intervals over the next inch, and 1/8" intervals over the last inch of the path. Results The output energy measurements: track angle (degrees) E (millijoules) 4.86 31.8 6.07 33.0 8.73 34.0 5.05 32.2 The mean output energy was 32.8 millijoules and the observed standard deviation was .001 millijoules...about 3% relative. The input energy measurement consisted of 18 separate data points taken as described above. The sum of F*dx was 32.9 millijoules. Since this procedure was conducted only once, an observed standard deviation cannot be computed. However, an estimate of the error in determining the correct track angle for each location along the path indicates that the relative error in the integration result is probably about 2%. The ratio of the measured output energy to the measured input energy is 0.99. The errors in each measurement are independent and combine in quadrature to yield an overall expected error of 3.6%. In other words, Eout ------- = 0.99 +/- 0.0036 Ein Conclusion Within the measurement precision of this experiment, the energy required to place the roller magnet at the start of the track is equal to the energy delivered to the roller when released from the start of the track. The apparent anomaly in the TOMI track is presumably due to the difficulty one has in correctly perceiving the work done on the roller when it is placed at the start of the track by hand. The maximum repulsive force that occurs as the roller is placed is only about 1/2 the weight of the roller. Thus the roller only seems to get a little lighter as it is placed. When the roller is released, the output energy is dramatically demonstrated by the motion of the roller. As a result, the TOMI device appears to involve an energy gain but these measurements show that it does not. It is possible that the TOMI device exhibits a small anomalous behavior that would not have been detected by these measurements. With the precision obtained in these tests, such an anomaly would have to be less than 5% relative. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Oct 27 17:28:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA14022 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:49 -0700 Received: from obrien.msoe.edu (obrien.msoe.edu [155.92.10.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA13916 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:37 -0700 Received: from warp.msoe.edu by obrien.msoe.edu (MX V4.1 AXP) with SMTP; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:32 EDT Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:43 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:22 GMT+6 From: "GEISER IAN R" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:11 CST6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; boundary=Message-Boundary-6046 X-finfo: DOS,"figure1.bmp",,,,Unknown Subject: Re: Devices? X-Confirm-Reading-To: "GEISER IAN R" X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-ID: <17277E33A9@warp.msoe.edu> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: --Message-Boundary-6046 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-description: Information about this message. This message contains a file prepared for transmission using the MIME BASE64 transfer encoding scheme. If you are using Pegasus Mail or another MIME-compliant system, you should be able to extract it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for help. ---- File information ----------- File: figure1.bmp Date: 27 Oct 1995, 15:54 Size: 10430 bytes. 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Oct 27 13:59:56 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA13967 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:42 -0700 Received: from odo.msoe.edu (root@odo.msoe.edu [155.92.10.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA13922 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:37 -0700 Received: by odo.msoe.edu; id AA15892; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:34 -0500 Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:46 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:22 GMT+6 From: "GEISER IAN R" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:12 CST6 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Devices? X-Confirm-Reading-To: "GEISER IAN R" X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-Id: <17277F637C@warp.msoe.edu> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A > Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 12:32:34 -0700 (PDT) > From: William Beaty > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > Cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Devices? > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > On Thu, 26 Oct 1995, Chuck Knight wrote: > > > > hey i'm currently working on the "gravity capacitor." it looks like > > > a take off of a townsend/brown device. if any one has any > > > information on it i would like it. > > > > I'm interested in this capacitor, too. By "working" on it, do you mean > > that you're building one? If so, I'm extremely interested in your > > results...ie, *are* there any positive results, like a thrust? i have started taking measurment and cutting patterens for the "Gravity Capacitor" I do have some questions though would there be a differance between and in their effect on the entire appuratus? Figure 1 one solid foil plate Figure 2 many seperate plates (like the specified design) sorry for .BMP but i don't have a .GIF writer available to me right now. ian gieser . /_\ when the going gets weird the weird turn pro...... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Oct 27 17:34:55 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA14015 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:49 -0700 Received: from obrien.msoe.edu (obrien.msoe.edu [155.92.10.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA13932 for ; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 13:59:38 -0700 Received: from warp.msoe.edu by obrien.msoe.edu (MX V4.1 AXP) with SMTP; Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:33 EDT Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:45 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 27 Oct 95 15:59:22 GMT+6 From: "GEISER IAN R" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 27 Oct 1995 15:59:12 CST6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; boundary=Message-Boundary-31296 X-finfo: DOS,"figure2.bmp",,,,Unknown Subject: Re: Devices? X-Confirm-Reading-To: "GEISER IAN R" X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-ID: <17277F35AC@warp.msoe.edu> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: --Message-Boundary-31296 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-description: Information about this message. This message contains a file prepared for transmission using the MIME BASE64 transfer encoding scheme. If you are using Pegasus Mail or another MIME-compliant system, you should be able to extract it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for help. ---- File information ----------- File: figure2.bmp Date: 27 Oct 1995, 15:56 Size: 10430 bytes. 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//+P///////////////j///4AAPAAAAH////////8AAAAH7///8f///////////////z///w wAeAAAAB///////+MAAAAB////8////////////////5///x4A8AAAAAP//////wOAAAAAf/ //5////////////////4///j8B4AAAAAH/////+AOAAAAAf///x////////////////8f//D +DwAAAAAOH////gAHAAAAA////j////////////////+P//H/HgAAAAAeAH//gAAHAAAAB// //H/////////////////P/+P/vAAAAAA8AAAYAAADAAAAD////P/////////////////n/8P /+AAAAAA4AAAYAAADgAAAH///+f/////////////////j/4f/8AAAAABwAAAYAAADgAAAf// /8f/////////////////x/4//+AAAAADwAAAYAAABgAAA////4//////////////////4/x/ //AAAAADgAAAYAAABwAAB////x//////////////////8fh///gAAAAHAAAAYAAABwAAD/// /j//////////////////+Pj///4AAAAPAAAAYAAAAwAAP////H///////////////////HH/ //8AAAAOAAAAYAAAA4AAf///+P///////////////////iH////AAAAcAAAAcAAAA4AB//// 8f///////////////////wP////gAAA8AAAAcAAAAYAD////4////////////////////4f/ ///4AAB4AAAAMAAAAcAP////x////////////////////4f////8AABwAAAAMAAAAcAf//// j////////////////////wP/////AADgAAAAMAAAAOB/////H////////////////////xH/ ////wAHgAAAAMAAAAOH////+P////////////////////jh/////8AHAAAAAMAAAAGf////4 f////////////////////D4//////AOAAAAAMAAAAH/////x/////////////////////H8f /////weAAAAAMAAAAH/////j////////////////////+P+P/////+cAAAAAMAAAA//////H ////////////////////8P/D//////4AAAAAMAAAD/////8P////////////////////4f/x //////8AAAAAMAAAf/////4/////////////////////4//4///////gAAAAMAAD//////x/ ////////////////////x//8P//////+AAAAMAA///////D/////////////////////h/// H///////8AAAMAf//////+P/////////////////////j///h////////+AAM////////4f/ ////////////////////H///4f///////////////////h/////////////////////+H/// 8P///////////////////D/////////////////////8P////D//////////////////8P// ///////////////////8f////w//////////////////w//////////////////////4//// /8P/////////////////D//////////////////////w//////D////////////////8P/// ///////////////////x//////g////////////////wf//////////////////////j//// //8P///////////////D///////////////////////D///////B//////////////4P//// //////////////////+H///////wf/////////////g///////////////////////+P//// ///8D////////////8D///////////////////////8f////////gf///////////gf///// //////////////////8f////////8D//////////8D////////////////////////8///// /////gP/////////Af///////////////////////////////////8A////////wD/////// //////////////////////////////wA//////wA//////////////////////////////// ///////AAP///AAP////////////////////////////////////////AAAAAAP///////// /////////////////////////////////wAAA/////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////P4cz///// ///////////////////////////////////////PzMz///////////////////////////// ///////////////PzMz////////////////////////////////////////////PzMz///// ///////////////////////////////////////PzMz///////////////////////////// ///////////////AzMz////////////////////////////////////////////P4cz///// ///////////////////////////////////////P//z///////////////////////////// ///////////////P/8z////////////////////////////////////////////Af8z///// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// //////////8= From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Oct 28 12:45:45 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA17819 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 12:45:43 -0700 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA17798 for ; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 12:45:40 -0700 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id MAA09093; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 12:45:40 -0700 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 12:45:39 -0700 (PDT) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: EMP weapons Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I found an interesting message dealing with Electromagnetic Weapons and put it on WEIRD SCIENCE down in the textfile area. Capacitor-bank microwave pulsers! I tend to steer clear of UFO stuff, but check out the photos associated with the file on the Art Bell show. They could simply be a searchlight and a microwave link on a tower. But if alien spacecraft really fill our skies, the military certainly must be trying to shoot them down! ;) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Oct 28 20:48:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA07118 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 20:48:04 -0700 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA07095 for ; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 20:47:59 -0700 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id UAA17554; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 20:47:58 -0700 Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 20:47:57 -0700 (PDT) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: Devices? In-Reply-To: <17277F637C@warp.msoe.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, GEISER IAN R wrote: > i have started taking measurment and cutting patterens for the > "Gravity Capacitor" I do have some questions though would there be a > differance between and in their effect on the > entire appuratus? No one knows but the author of the article, and he doesn't respond. If you build the device using one solid foil plate and it doesn't work, you won't know if it WOULD have worked if built with multiple foil plates. But if you build the device exactly as described in the article and it doesn't work, you can tell the world about it and we can all get on to other things. And if it DOES work... .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Oct 28 22:51:18 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA03338 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 22:50:31 -0700 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA03319 for ; Sat, 28 Oct 1995 22:50:26 -0700 Message-Id: <199510290550.WAA03319@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 28 Oct 1995 23:03:02 -0700 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: TOMI device test Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 04:17 PM 10/27/95 -0500, you wrote: >TOMI DEVICE ENERGY BALANCE TEST 27OCT95 >Scott Little >EarthTech Int'l >Austin TX 78759 > > Many thanks to Scott Little. The TOMI inventor asked for a detailed test, and got it. For those who didn't take the time to read his post... ...here is part of it in a nutshell... ------------------------------------ >Conclusion > >... the energy required to place the roller magnet at the start of >the track is equal to the energy delivered to the roller >when released from the start of the track. > >... As a result, the TOMI device appears to involve an energy gain >but these measurements show that it does not. > __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 04:04:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA20444 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 04:03:54 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA20430 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 04:03:51 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA00530 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 06:03:44 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id GAA29947; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 06:03:45 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Something called Alpha Torque Date: Sun, 29 Oct 1995 10:50:58 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199510271655.JAA28910@mail.eskimo.com> In-Reply-To: <199510271655.JAA28910@mail.eskimo.com> Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <199510271655.JAA28910@mail.eskimo.com>, you wrote: > > >Does anyone know where to find the following book?.... > >>.... Peter Graneu had a new book out about his >>Alpha Torque work. The Electro Dynamics of Metals. > The full title is "Ampere-Neumann Electrodynamics of Metals" by Peter Graneau's. Don't know where to get it tho. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 09:54:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA13504 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:54:28 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA13479 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:54:22 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id MAA17619 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 12:40:58 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA815088752 Mon, 30 Oct 95 13:32:32 Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 13:32:32 From: "reim" Encoding: 2107 Text Message-Id: <9509308150.AA815088752@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[4]: T. T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: yes I would be interested in seeing his patents. I already have his patent on his disk that flies around a pole but I would like to see any others that relate to electrogravitics. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Re[2]: T. T. Brown Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 10/25/95 10:24 AM I'm going to be making a run to the Sunnyvale Patent office next week (1st of Nov or there abouts). I'm doing research on the Meyers hydrogen generator. However, with all this TT Brown info flying around, I can't resist checking out the patent s. If any one is interested, I will gladly send copies. Send me a line. You'll ha ve to cover postage (I'll know how much when I get the patents). Sorry I don't ha ve a scanner so I can't make Soft Copies. -T > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Oct 25 09:27:40 1995 > Encoding: 866 Text > To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net > Subject: Re[2]: T. T. Brown > Sender: owner-freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Reply-To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Content-Length: 851 > X-Lines: 17 > > > That was great info on T.T. Brown. I have the audio tapes from that > conference, 11 tapes in all, and I got a lot of good information from > it. Do you know if/when they are having another conference? > > I am not sure if I have Emailed you about my research on Brown. I am > trying do duplicate (somewhat) his work on high voltage caps. I am > currently getting some barium titinate caps made for my research. > That caps are about 10 inches in diameter and shaped like a saucer. I > designed a 90 KV power supply with an adjustable pule rate and wave > form. I hoping that the biefield-brown effect is frequency related. > > I would like to find out how I can get a copy of Brown's work. Also is > there a summary of the patients you listed on the NET? > > Bob Reim > Orlando FL > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 07:44:38 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA03399 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:44:37 -0800 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA03355 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:44:30 -0800 Received: from [198.69.104.151] (pm4_19.digital.net [198.69.104.151]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA24929 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:43:03 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:42:19 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: Tesla Coil/Townsend-Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: If the Townsend-Brown experiments were performed with high voltage, would it be possible to re-create his experiments with a Tesla coil? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley || tilleyrw@digital.net || "Once upon a time..." | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | http://www.digital.net/~tilleyrw | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 21:57:36 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA19712 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:11:35 -0800 Received: from escape.com (escape.com [198.6.71.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA19662 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:11:29 -0800 Received: (from chope@localhost) by escape.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA24548; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 13:12:59 -0500 Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 13:12:58 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: Devices? In-Reply-To: <9509238144.AA814472055@irout.advantor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 23 Oct 1995, reim wrote: > > I sure had a lot of Email this morning from this group. To answer a > few items, no I have not tried my high voltage caps in a vacuum yet > since I am having problems making the caps. They tend to crack in the > drying process before they get fired but I am still working on it. Why don't you instead start using any available dielectric and vary the air pressure? This will give much-needed information about the cause of the Biefeld-Brown effect. I did not attend the 1994 conference but I have not seen solid research done as to the real physics behind the phenomenon. As far as I know, the ion wind hypothesis hasn't been soundly tested since the 1950s, when the Navy commissioned that famous and somewhat lame report on the topic. Charles From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 10:29:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA26270 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:29:24 -0800 Received: from escape.com (escape.com [198.6.71.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA26057; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 10:28:49 -0800 Received: (from chope@localhost) by escape.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA27174; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 13:30:21 -0500 Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 13:30:19 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: vortex-l@eskimo.com cc: Free Energy Discussion List Subject: Re: Introducing myself. In-Reply-To: <951025213458_100063.244_EHK61-1@CompuServe.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 25 Oct 1995, Peter Unwin wrote: > > I accept that CF or rather "various anomalous reactions" are possible > because I am far from happy that either Einstein's relativity, QM and even > standard electrical theory are complete. I therefore reject all statements > that CF is impossible made on the basis of what I regard as incomplete > theories. I subscribe to Apeiron, to the essense of Petr. Beckmanns ideas > on relativity and am particularly interested in electro-magnetic models of > particles. Speaking of Petr Beckmann, in his book _Einstein Plus Two_, he started by attacking Einstein's General Relativity because he claimed it asserted that inertia was due to the gravity of distant stars. However, in the _ZPF-Induced Inertia and Gravitation Q&A_ paper so kindly sent me by Bernhard Haisch's office, on page 1 it states "Einstein attempted to incorporate the Machian view so that the gravitational influence of the whole universe would give rise to the inertia of a particle of matter at any given point. As Einstein himself admitted, GR failed to do this...." Assuming I did not misread Beckmann will anyone jump to his defense or have I caught him in error? > Regards: Peter J. Unwin > > (I am cross-posting this to both vortex-l and free-nrg-l because the original message was posted on vortex-l, but I feel this digression may be more appropriate for free-nrg-l.) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 17:30:20 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA26441 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 17:29:15 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA26424 for ; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 17:29:11 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA24844; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 17:29:09 -0800 Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 17:29:08 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: electric rocket article (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: Brian O'Neill > Bill, > > First, Great Pages!, some really interesting stuff here. Glad you found them useful! > On the gravity > capacitor/electric rocket article, you say you tried contacting author to > no avail. There was an article in Omni Mag. a few years back, on an > 'Anti-gravity' air cleaner or dehumidifier. I don't remember exactly, but > it was something to do with the air, and it was for in-home use. They > stated that, again memory is foggy, either the device or the capacitor > which it operated on, actually got measureably lighter, when operating. > The principle was something to the effect of running a DC current through > the cap, the plates I believe, were aluminum foil, and it seems like > rubber was the dielectric, but it could of been air. Very interesting if it was the capacitor which got lighter. I've never heard of this one. There is howeever a classic demonstration involving an air cleaner and a grid of needles, where the needles act lighter because they emit charged wind when powered by the air cleaner high voltage. This is simply ion thrust though, nothing unexplained. I've subscribe to Omni on and off, but have no idea of where to look for such an article. > Anyway, I thought I > would tell you about that, because considering the fact that the > principle apparently works, it is plausible that this man was taken out > of commission in one form or fashion, ie paid off, scared off, or just > offed. Have you tried finding any of the publicly available information > about the kid and buy out that he referenced? Nope. I did do a cursory patent search, but turned up nothing called "electric rocket" in the decade mentioned. The author talks as if he haadd the paatent docs in hand, so it may still be there somewhere, I just didn't spend enough time searching (and the CASSIS disk ends in 1970!) Too bad he didn't simply include the patent no. in the article. Makes me suspect a hoax, but it also could be a "nyaa nyaa, I'm the expert and you aren't" ego issue. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Oct 30 19:13:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA27187 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 19:13:23 -0800 Received: from mail.annex.com (youjaes@mail.annex.com [204.74.67.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA27149; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 19:13:14 -0800 Received: (from youjaes@localhost) by mail.annex.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA12875; Mon, 30 Oct 1995 19:13:08 -0800 Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 19:13:07 -0800 (PST) From: James Youlton To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Tesla's CEG device In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi all, I've been wondering if anyone around here knows anything about the CEG device that was discovered at Tesla's compound after his death, and subsequently bulldozed over. The device in question was studied by a group of three people at the Department of the U.S. Navy in the sixties and was found to be a device that uses the rotation of the earth as a power source using a simple mechanical effect. The Navy, after determining the nature of the device, was ordered to sequester all documents and information from the public that would lead one to the discovery of how this device works, or even it's very existence. The Navy project was call "Turtle Island" and was shut down at the same time, along with a number or other military and government projects. Two of the three investigators met with an untimely demise a short time later and the third was not heard from again, though there is a report that he was later seen. Recently, after the declassification of this project, did I learn some of what I just mentioned, and have recently found out about Tesla's device as the project's impetus. The device is a simple tank of water with a bouyant cylinder floating in it. The unrestricted cylinder tends to naturally rotate at a rate of two revolutions per day. By placing a resistance to the rotation of the cylinder, useful power can be generated. Any and all comments are welcome. Thanks in advance, J Youlton From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 01:57:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA19842 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 01:57:10 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id BAA19831 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 01:57:05 -0800 Message-Id: <199510310957.BAA19831@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 03:08:35 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Tesla Coil/Townsend-Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 10:42 AM 10/30/95 -0500, you wrote: > If the Townsend-Brown experiments were performed with high voltage, would >it be possible to re-create his experiments with a Tesla coil? > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- >| "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | >| and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | >|--------------------------------------------------------------------| >| Robert Tilley || tilleyrw@digital.net || "Once upon a time..." | >|--------------------------------------------------------------------| >| http://www.digital.net/~tilleyrw | >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > DC vs. AC. Brown was working with direct current at high voltage. A Tesla Coil puts out alternating current. You might think "Well then, what if I put a Tesla Coil under oil, with a wire from its output terminal to a high voltage diode that can handle the voltage, and connect that to a Brown type device." Two drawbacks: 1. Minor: The Brown type "craft" would become part of the circuit of the Tesla Coil, changing its tuning, and would have to be accounted for. 2. Major: Even if you can come up with a diode at the voltages that a typical Tesla Coil can generate, or a string of them in series to handle that voltage, they are not likely to be able to do the switching fast enough, at the frequencies, since a Tesla Coil of a very large size is still going to be operating somewhere in the 50 Khz neighborhood, and I think that is too high for HV diodes. If the Tesla Coil were not under oil, attaching a diode -- the discharge would simply avoid it, preferring the air instead, because Brown's device relied on NOT allowing a discharge from one grid to the other, ie. taking the voltage as high as it can go without any discharge occuring. Gary Hawkins btw I really like that quote: >| "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | >| and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | I like to say, "Show me 99 people who say something can't be done, and I'll show you one who will do it, and he's the only one that counts." (Give it a shot if you want, but ask plenty of questions first). From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 02:21:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA21879 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 02:21:15 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA21866 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 02:21:09 -0800 Message-Id: <199510311021.CAA21866@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 03:32:49 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 07:13 PM 10/30/95 -0800, you wrote: > >Hi all, > >I've been wondering if anyone around here knows anything about the CEG >device that was discovered at Tesla's compound after his death, > Tesla had a compound? Where did you get that? Compound implies an organization, security, lots of people, multiple buildings, etc. I'd say if you build one of the devices you refer to about the size of Colorado, you might obtain some useful work out of it. Why not mount a rotor a couple of miles long on top of Pike's Peak as a test. Sorry to be so snide, but you sound all too much like a disinformation specialist to me. Hey, just being straightforward about it. You could probably change my mind. Gary Hawkins From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 02:25:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA22300 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 02:25:41 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA22290 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 02:25:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199510311025.CAA22290@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 03:37:19 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Re[2]: Devices? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 01:12 PM 10/30/95 -0500, you wrote: > > >... As far as I know, the ion >wind hypothesis hasn't been soundly tested since the 1950s, when the Navy >commissioned that famous and somewhat lame report on the topic. > > >Charles > > I tested it and found its effects to be minimal. I think another element must be there. I might redo those tests, plot the results, and in some way make them available, because they were actually pretty interesting, even though very little force was produced under a wide variety of configurations, gaps between the grids, voltages, power supplies, polarities, etc. Gary Hawkins From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 05:22:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id FAA13301 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 05:22:00 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id FAA13292 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 05:21:58 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id FAA21130; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 05:21:57 -0800 Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 05:21:57 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Pons/Fleischmann Patent to be Granted in Eur. (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: 30 Oct 95 21:01:49 EST From: Eugene Mallove <76570.2270@compuserve.com> To: BlindCopyReceiver: ; Subject: Pons/Fleischmann Patent to be Granted in Eur. Dr. Eugene F. Mallove, Editor-in-Chief and Publisher INFINITE ENERGY Cold Fusion Technology P.O. Box 2816 Concord, New Hampshire 03302-2816, USA Phone: 603-228-4516, Fax: 603-224-5975 October 30, 1995 Dear Colleagues: INFINITE ENERGY Magazine has received the following announcement from ENECO of Salt Lake City. The Magazine will be providing coverage of this and other fast-breaking stories in its Issue #4, which will be out by mid-November. Sincerely, Eugene F. Mallove ENECO RECEIVES NOTICE OF INTENT OF PATENT GRANT FROM EUROPEAN PATENT OFFICE ON ORIGINAL PONS-FLEISCHMANN COLD FUSON INVENTION Salt Lake City, Utah October 30, l995 -- Fred Jaeger, President of ENECO, Inc. today announced, "The European Patent Office has issued a Notice of Intent of patent grant on the original Pons-Fleischmann cold fusion patent." ENECO acquired the exclusive world-wide license rights to the Pons-Fleischmann cold fusion technology from the University of Utah in November, 1993, and has been pursuing patents in the U.S. and abroad on these technologies. "The notice of intent of grant of the European patent is a significant milestone on ENECO's path of commercializing cold fusion devices," says Jaeger. "A significant amount of private and governmental cold fusion research continues to be aggressively pursued throughout Europe. Once the European patents issue, ENECO plans to capitalize on the economic strength of the European community through the sale of research and development licenses that will evolve into manufacturing licenses. The Pons/Fleischmann patents will be the pioneering patents in the cold fusion field." #### END From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 07:11:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA08272 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 07:11:11 -0800 Received: from lobster.wellfleet.com (lobster.wellfleet.com [192.32.253.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA08259 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 07:11:07 -0800 Received: from BayNetworks.com (pobox.wellfleet.com) by lobster.wellfleet.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA13992; Tue, 31 Oct 95 10:09:55 EST Received: from nibiru.engeast by BayNetworks.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA10751; Tue, 31 Oct 95 10:10:59 EST Date: Tue, 31 Oct 95 10:10:59 EST From: juban@baynetworks.com (Jim Uban) Message-Id: <9510311510.AA10751@BayNetworks.com> To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: book Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Graneau's book Ampere-Neumann Electrodynamics of Metals is published by Hadronic Press in Newton, Mass. You should be able to order it through any technical bookstore, if it's still in print. It was printed maybe 4 or 5 years ago. Jim From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 07:28:54 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA12630 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 07:28:38 -0800 Received: from odo.msoe.edu (root@odo.msoe.edu [155.92.10.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA12511 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 07:28:14 -0800 Received: by odo.msoe.edu; id AA01323; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 09:26:15 -0600 Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 31 Oct 95 09:26:05 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 31 Oct 95 09:25:58 GMT+6 From: "GEISER IAN R" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 09:25:57 CST6 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Devices? Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-Id: <719C080B9F@warp.msoe.edu> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: well okay i guess i'm off ot my workshop again...... see you sometime in mid-february ian gieser . /_\ when the going gets weird the weird turn pro...... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 11:40:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA06639 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 11:40:16 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA06625 for ; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 11:40:14 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #6) id m0tAMXc-001W00C; Tue, 31 Oct 95 13:40 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 13:40:10 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: from "James Youlton" at Oct 30, 95 07:13:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4931 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Frm: Robert Stirniman To: James Youlton Date: Octobert 31, 1995 Hi James. Interesting post. I also have some older ones by you from the newsgroup alt.sci.physics which are related to the same subject -- that is, tapping power from the earth's inertial rotation. I believe it is possible to do this, but it would be an extremely unwise practice for ecological reasons. >I've been wondering if anyone around here knows anything about the CEG >device that was discovered at Tesla's compound after his death, and >subsequently bulldozed over. First I've heard of it. What do the letters CEG stand for? > The device in question was studied by a group of three people at the > Department of the U.S. Navy in the sixties and was found to be a device > that uses the rotation of the earth as a power source using a simple > mechanical effect. > The Navy, after determining the nature of the device, was ordered to > sequester all documents and information from the public that would lead > one to the discovery of how this device works, or even it's very existence. > The Navy project was call "Turtle Island" and was shut down at the same > time, along with a number or other military and government projects. Two > of the three investigators met with an untimely demise a short time later > and the third was not heard from again, though there is a report that he > was later seen. Where did you get this information -- are there any documents relating to this? There are persistent rumors that the Navy is engaged in suppression and hoarding of new science information. I don't know if there is any truth to it -- but if so, I believe it is way past time to let loose of some of this stuff. But this particular technology may be rightly considered to be dangerous, because it's use would result in slowing down the earth's rotation. >The device is a simple tank of water with a bouyant cylinder floating in >it. The unrestricted cylinder tends to naturally rotate at a rate of two >revolutions per day. By placing a resistance to the rotation of the >cylinder, useful power can be generated. This might work if the bouyant cylinder contains a rotating flywheel (gyroscope). It may be easiest to view operation of the device, with the tank at the earth's equator. The axis of rotation of the gyroscope would be located in a plane parallel to the earth's surface, and the gyroscope could be fixed in the bouyant cylinder so that it is mechanically prevented from precessing in the vertical/polar direction, while the bouyancy of the tank would allow limited movement and precession torque in the vertical/polar direction. In inventions of this type, it is necessary to avoid the "polar axis alignment problem", because once the gyroscope precesses in the polar direction and becomes aligned with the earth's axis of rotation -- no further output torque results from the earth's rotation. In this invention, the entire buoyant cylinder would end up precessing/floating around an axis parallel to the ground. But it seems to me that this would occur ONCE per day -- rather than twice. The above is speculation. Do you have any details of how this thing works? A US patent was awarded in May 1994, for a similar device -- patent #5,313,850 entitled "Earth/Gyro Power Transducer." It is an entirely mechanical device, with a gyroscope mounted in a three degree of freedom gimbal, which is mounted in an enclosure which is fixed to the earth's surface. Power output torque comes from the vertical gimbal axis, which rotates once per day. In this invention, the gyroscope is allowed to precess in the polar direction -- i.e. the "polar alignment problem" occurs, but when the gyroscope reaches polar alignment it is re-precessed to an anti-polar alignment, in an innovative fashion which requires very little power input. In my opinion, use of inventions of this type must be absolutely prohibited. The rate of rotation of our planet slows down naturally due to tidal friction in the earth-moon system. But recently, more "leap seconds" must be added each year, than would be expected from natural causes. If the only method available for preventing the nearly irrestible inclination that people will have to use an invention like this, which supplies "free" energy from the earth's rotation, is to attempt to keep the knowledge secret -- then we are destined to fail. There must be a way to detect/sense the operation of this type of machine, and shut it down. The energy in the rotation of the earth belongs only to prosperity. But don't get me started about who might police something like this -- and the paranoid knee jerk reactions people have about the inherent evils of world government, no matter what its form and function. Fate dictates that we all play together, or we won't be playing at all. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Oct 31 23:55:36 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA13918 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 18:12:23 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA13731; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 18:11:54 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA15387; Tue, 31 Oct 1995 18:11:52 -0800 Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 18:11:51 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: taoshum-l@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: New Hum Info Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: 31 Oct 95 20:37:54 EST From: Sara T. Allen <72164.3606@compuserve.com> To: billb@eskimo.com Subject: Message from Internet Bill, Please put this out on the net! I just received a document from Schatzie Hubbell who lives in Fort Worth Texas. She has compiled a listing of people who contacted Unsolved Mysteries after the airing of the segment on the Taos Hum in May 1995. There were 383 phone call responses. It seems that about half were from people (scattered throughout the US) who "hear" the hum. I will get permission from her to enter the data she supplied to me on line in file form so that it will be available for all. She put in an incredible amount of work!! It is also available directly from her for a small fee (not required) to help her defray her copying and mailing costs.) You may write to her requesting the report at: Schatzie Hubbell 10201 Highway 80 W. Fort Worth, Texas 76116 She asks that you enclose $3.29 per request. ( a very small fee). The report is 34 pages and includes a paper by Anne C. Arnold Silk of Great Britain on "Biomagnetism and Electrical Allergy." Here is a list of Common Symptoms of Hearers in the US. 1. Sense/hear a buzz, hum. 2. Temple and head pressure. 3. Ear pressure to ear pain at times sharp and shooting. 4. A greatly reduced ability to concentrate in the presence of the "hum". 5. Pain in joints at what appears to be certain intensities (of the hum.) 6. Feeling of burning skin on face, arms, hands, legs, bottoms of feet. (occasional occurences were reported.) 7. Unusual hair loss. 8. Nausea and/or vertigo. 9. Sleep disruption, or not being able to sleep at all in the presence of the hum. 10. Severe headaches. 11. Reports of nosebleeds. 12. Heart palpitations (racing). 13. Tension along neck and back pain. (Stress type) 14. Muscle spasms. 15. Agitation and anxiety. 16. Often "feel" vibrations associated with the hum. 17. Has been noted to deplete energy, have noted that when intensity lessens, energy returns. A person can have on to several of the above symptoms at the same time, often depending on the intensity of the hum or frequency. I myself experience symptoms #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12, #13, #14, #15, #16, and #17! I have had a recent physical exam which indicates that I am in excellent health. My blood tests are all normal ranges. I have had an MRI of my head and brain. I have seen a Eye, Ears, Nose and Throat specialist who told me he can find nothing wrong with my sinuses or anything else. I have had eye exams and my hearing has been checked with no abnormalities. I use Imitrex tablets to control the severity of the headaches. Sometimes Actifed or a similar anti-histamine helps. Most of the time the headache pain is centered behind the right eye and feels as if someone is poking a stick into my eye socket. It is accompanied by nausea and blurring of the vision. I also see particles of light. My neurologist says that they are "cross-over migraines" of a type about which little is understood. I believe they are being triggered and aggravated by the presence of the hum. I've said it before and I will say it again that I believe that the hum is being caused by military and defense operations, not just in the US but abroad as well. I believe that most of the players on the world's stage have similar communications systems capable of disrupting the Alpha wave region of the brain (around 7.5 hertz) which coincides with the Schumann resonance of the planet. In other words, the very space where our souls reside is being polluted by non ionizing radiation which I believe is mostly man made. It is my stated purpose to ring the alarm bells here that there is a health threat associated with the incredible amount of electro magnetic energy being transmitted on this planet. That' all for now. Sara T. Allen E-mail from: Sara T. Allen, 31-Oct-1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 1 06:32:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA02480 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:32:06 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA02440; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:31:59 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id GAA01724; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:31:57 -0800 Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:31:56 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: neotech@world.std.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Taos Hum and Schumann (Tesla!) Resonance Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: anon Dear Bill, FYI, annotated below, see ************** I believe that most of the players on the > world's stage have similar communications systems capable of disrupting the > > > ##### Alpha wave region of the brain (around 7.5 hertz) > ####### The alpha responce, as it is called in humans is generally > between 8 cps, and this is considered EXTREMELY low and 12 cps .... which > is considered equally high ............ nowwhere near 7.5 cps #### > > which coincides > with the > Schumann resonance of the planet. $$$$$$$$$$######### Schumann resonances is not at 7.5 cps ..... in fact it moves around quite a bit because it is dependent on the condtion of the ionosphere , the photosphere and the magnetosphere, in genral, and on manifold other effects. We have a VERY dynamic system here. Anyone who gives you a hard and fast Schumann frequency has never measured it.... We took readings for months with a SQUID .... moves all around anywhere from 5 to 25 cps, in general ..... Post if you want, but not my name, thanks. > In other words, the very space where our > souls reside is being polluted by non ionizing radiation which I believe is > mostly man made. It is my stated purpose to ring the alarm bells here that > there is a health threat associated with the incredible amount of electro > magnetic energy being transmitted on this planet. > > That' all for now. > > Sara T. Allen -> Posted by: William Beaty .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 1 06:33:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA02879 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:33:32 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA02865 for ; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:33:29 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id GAA02022; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:33:29 -0800 Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:33:29 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: seeking investigations for TV show (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: 31/10/1995 11:04 AM Regarding the following request, please respond directly to Randy Quinn (rquinn@telerama.lm.com). -------- Forwarded Message Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 15:09:43 -0600 To: fitz@iquest.com From: rquinn@telerama.lm.com Message sent via server on www.csicop.org: I'm researching a show on the scientific investigation of paranormal phenomena for PBS/Discovery Channel. Currently, I'm looking for late-breaking stories (e.g., crop circles, aliens, ghosts, esp) and locations for shooting. Any suggestions? Your quick response would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Randy Quinn WQED/TV Pittsburgh From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 1 13:06:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA00176 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 13:06:21 -0800 Received: from escape.com (escape.com [198.6.71.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA00161 for ; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 13:06:18 -0800 Received: (from chope@localhost) by escape.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA22993; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 15:43:29 -0500 Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 15:43:27 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: Devices? In-Reply-To: <199510311025.CAA22290@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Gary Hawkins wrote: > At 01:12 PM 10/30/95 -0500, you wrote: > > > > > > >... As far as I know, the ion > >wind hypothesis hasn't been soundly tested since the 1950s, when the Navy > >commissioned that famous and somewhat lame report on the topic. > > > > > >Charles > > > > > > I tested it and found its effects to be minimal. I think another element > must be there. I might redo those tests, plot the results, and in some > way make them available, because they were actually pretty interesting, > even though very little force was produced under a wide variety of > configurations, gaps between the grids, voltages, power supplies, > polarities, etc. I would be very interested in seeing the reports on your lab work. Perhaps you could post them to the list, or if they are not computer-readable then possibly summarize what convinced you that ion-wind is not the operative effect here? Charles > > Gary Hawkins > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 2 02:36:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA26958 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 12:56:23 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA26936 for ; Wed, 1 Nov 1995 12:56:19 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #6) id m0tAkCY-001VzdC; Wed, 1 Nov 95 14:56 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 14:56:01 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2080 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Angular Mometum and the Barnett Effect (astronmers see last parag) A body which is spinning within a larger macroscopic body which is also spinning will tend to align the axis of its angular momentum with the angular momentum of the larger body. For example, a gyroscope located on the earth, unless it is in a frictionless gimbal, with always try to precess due to the rotation of the earth into alignment with the earth's polar axis, at which point it will no longer precess due to earth rotation. Also, a cylinder of magnetic material spinning around its longitudinal axis will develop a magnetic field proportional to is angular velocity (Barnett Effect), because the angular momemtum of the electrons in the material will attempt to precess and come into alignment with the macroscopic axis of the spinning cylinder, which also brings into alignment the magnetic moment of the electrons, some of which have unpaired spins (ferromagnetic), resulting in generation of a macroscopic magnetic field. Similarly, it is know that a static magnetic field itself contains angular momentum -- and spinning the source of the static field, whether a magnet or DC current loop, will result in a corresponding increase or decrease in the field strength. Maybe I've missed it, but I've looked seriously, and there seems to be no information in undergraduate or graduate level physics reference books which mentions the relationship between macroscopic and microscopic angular momentum -- much less provides any analysis or explanation linking quantum angular momentum to macroscopic angular momentum. Why not? How does quantum angular momentum become organized from a microscopic to a macroscopic level? Has anyone ever published any work about this? I can't find any. Lastly, some cosmological-gravitational theories suggest that the universe itself is spinning. Would this be detectable through measurement of an average net alignment of the spin of a statistical sample of very large objects -- such as galactic clusters? Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 2 00:03:35 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA18432 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:03:02 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA18411; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:02:54 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id AAA12261; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:02:46 -0800 Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:02:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: sciclub@halcyon.com, ghawk@mail.eskimo.com, cynthiaa@microsoft.com, gpaddock@halcyon.com, brussell@u.washington.edu, rtc2299@eeepf006.ca.boeing.com, nickb@microsoft.com, knuke@aa.com, mwm@aa.com, Christopher Nielsen , Robert Dinse , deLisle@mail.eskimo.com, freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: WEIRD SCIENCE MEETING! (New date) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Meetings of Seattle's "weird science" hobby group take place the first Friday of each month at 7pm, at 22025 Redmond/Fall-city Rd. The next one is this friday, 11/3/95 Travel: From I-5 take 520 east until it ends at a stop light. Turn right onto Redmond/Fall-City Rd. (rt. 202) Go 3.5 miles (into farmland.) We're the house on the right with the small roadside "internet classes" sign. THIS MEETING: Weird Science Tour (this time really!) Making electricity visible Mark Hendershot visit (maybe!) Glass bead powder and sidewalk rainbows Strange Videos Stranger conversations anyone have anything else good? Bring it! EVERYONE FEEL FREE TO BRING MUNCHIES BRING STUFF TO SWAP/SELL... CLEAN OUT YOUR JUNKBOX, GET BRAND NEW JUNK! TO THINK ABOUT: If everyone ponied up some bucks, the group could buy interesting things that an individual couldn't afford. For example, anyone want to go in on a Virtual-I/O head- tracking stereo set, and try out some real VR? I think they're about $900. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 02:58:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA26082 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 11:44:45 -0800 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA26000 for ; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 11:44:32 -0800 Received: from usr6ip21.azstarnet.com (usr6ip21.azstarnet.com [169.197.7.21]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id MAA21262 for ; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 12:42:59 -0700 Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 12:42:59 -0700 Message-Id: <199511021942.MAA21262@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: bclymer@azstarnet.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: bclymer@azstarnet.com (William Clymer) Subject: Re: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Angular Mometum and the Barnett Effect (astronmers see last parag) > >A body which is spinning within a larger macroscopic body >which is also spinning will tend to align the axis of its >angular momentum with the angular momentum of the larger body. > >For example, a gyroscope located on the earth, unless it is >in a frictionless gimbal, with always try to precess due to >the rotation of the earth into alignment with the earth's polar >axis, at which point it will no longer precess due to earth >rotation. Also, a cylinder of magnetic material spinning >around its longitudinal axis will develop a magnetic field >proportional to is angular velocity (Barnett Effect), because The (Barnett Effect) is the effect of a change in volume of a magnetic material in response to a change in it's magnetization strength. If a ferrite material is exposed to a highter magnetization field (more current through the coil) the ferrit will change in volume. I'm not aware that this has anything to do with alignment to a spinning axis. Ref. Handbook of Magnetic Phenomena, Harry S Burk, Van Nostrand Reinhold , 1986 Page 262. I would like to know the correct name for the effect you describe. Can you provide further reference. I am investigating the "Orgone Energy" effect and this may be connected. End. Bill >the angular momemtum of the electrons in the material will >attempt to precess and come into alignment with the macroscopic >axis of the spinning cylinder, which also brings into alignment >the magnetic moment of the electrons, some of which have unpaired >spins (ferromagnetic), resulting in generation of a macroscopic >magnetic field. Similarly, it is know that a static magnetic field >itself contains angular momentum -- and spinning the source of the >static field, whether a magnet or DC current loop, will result >in a corresponding increase or decrease in the field strength. > >Maybe I've missed it, but I've looked seriously, and there seems >to be no information in undergraduate or graduate level physics >reference books which mentions the relationship between >macroscopic and microscopic angular momentum -- much less >provides any analysis or explanation linking quantum angular >momentum to macroscopic angular momentum. Why not? > >How does quantum angular momentum become organized from a >microscopic to a macroscopic level? Has anyone ever published >any work about this? I can't find any. > >Lastly, some cosmological-gravitational theories suggest that >the universe itself is spinning. Would this be detectable >through measurement of an average net alignment of the spin of >a statistical sample of very large objects -- such as galactic >clusters? > >Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 02:57:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA08046 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 14:01:49 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA08015 for ; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 14:01:45 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #6) id m0tB7ha-001W2oC; Thu, 2 Nov 95 16:01 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Weight Changes in Spinning Masses To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 16:01:38 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2617 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Quoting Ian Mcbride to Robert Stirniman: >Have you ever heard someone relate angular momentum to an apparent >decrease in mass in the spinning body? I remember NPR reporting >something like this in the early 80's, then hearing it was a >measurement error, then hearing they were right the first time. >I'd like to know its status now. Hi Ian. There have been studies on and off about this. Some experiments have found that if you spin a flywheel/gyroscope it gets slightly lighter in weight, other experiments find that it gets slightly heavier, and most find that it has no measurable effect. Curious, eh? A theory is circulating now on the internet, the gravitational-dipole theroy by Dr EueJin Jeong, which may explain the apparent contradictions of these experiments. Dr Jeong demonstrates, in theory, that if you spin a physical body that is axially asymetric -- such as a half-spheroid, it's center of mass will shift in the direction of the greater mass of the body, causing a linear force in the direction of the larger diameter area. In a gravitational field this would manifest iteself as an increase or decrease in weight, depending on the orientation of the half-spheroid. So looking back at the original experiments -- if you perfectly balance your flywheel, you will find no effect due to spin. But, if your flywheel is axially unsymmetric, you will find a reduction or increase in weight, depending on it's orientation. Dr Jeong has the strength of his convictions and seems to be holding his own on the internet against predominant cries of quackery and crackpotism. The main problem I have with his theory is that it should be relatively easy to test. It takes a fairly massive weight (10s of kilograms) spinning fairly fast (30 thousand rpm), to get a measurable effect. But I think it's possible to test this fairly easily, with existing instrumentation and electronic motor drives, such as a high-speed machine-tool spindle-motor. He claims it is impractical and too expensive to test this theory. I don't think so. In fact, his theory may have been tested already, indirectly, in some of the above mentioned experiments. Dr Jeong has a patent pending, and might be in a posturing mode. My guess is the thing works, and he knows it works. Interestingly, Dr Jeong is an invited speaker at the Second Optical SETI conference, and coincidentally is presenting his gravitational dipole theory today (November 2). These scientists are "in-the-know". Dr Jeong's credibility is rising and his theories bear watching. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 2 22:31:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA12242 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:30:26 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA12216; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:30:22 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA16382; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:30:19 -0800 Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:30:18 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: neotech@world.std.com cc: alex , freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: Article by Alex. Frolov In-Reply-To: <199511030555.XAA01021@firefly.prairienet.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 2 Nov 1995, Zack Widup wrote: > Hi! > Quite some time ago I received the following from Alexander Frolov > who is doing research in Russia. I recently dug it out and read it again, > and I thought some of you might find it interesting. Feel free to e-mail > Alex about it. Same here, and I finally put it (and several others from Alex) on Weird Science website. -Bill B. > To: w9sz@prairienet.org > Organization: Alexander V. Frolov, Private Account > From: "alex" > Date: Sat, 29 Jul 95 21:05:30 +0400 > Subject: Article from Alexander Frolov > > Dear Zack, > please look it and comment if you'll find something interesting here. > Can you help me to publish it in any local press where you are living? > I'll grateful for it. > > Best regards, > Alexander V. Frolov > alex@frolov.spb.su > > THREE-SIDED EFFECT > > by Alexander V. Frolov > > INTRODUCTION > > The Theory for gravity as an induced effect that exists as > superposition of another forces of Nature is developed mainly for the ... .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 2 22:44:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA15739 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:42:47 -0800 Received: from matrix.eden.com (root@matrix.eden.com [199.171.21.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA15711 for ; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:42:43 -0800 Received: from net-1-221.austin.eden.com (net-1-221.austin.eden.com [199.171.21.221]) by matrix.eden.com (8.6.12/8.6.12.1) with SMTP id AAA13002; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 00:42:40 -0600 Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 00:42:40 -0600 Message-Id: <199511030642.AAA13002@matrix.eden.com> X-Sender: little@eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com, freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 04:55 PM 11/3/95 +0900, freenrg-list@eskimo.com wrote: >Given that a large power station has a capacity on the order of >one gigawatt, we could run 1000 such power stations from 1% of the >rotational energy of the earth for 80 million years. Lots of energy available but can we get at it. I have done the calcs for a flywheel CEG device using a pretty big, dangerous wheel. With a 60 inch dia 6 inch thick steel wheel weighing about 5000 lbs spinning about 5000 rpm (stress at 1/2 yield strength), you could extract 0.5 milliwatts from the earth's rotational energy by loading the wheel so it appeared to precess at 0.5 revs/day instead of the 1 rev/day that it would go at if not loaded. Perhaps needless to say, the bearing losses for such a wheel would greatly exceed that feeble power. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 2 21:59:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA02234 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 21:56:45 -0800 Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA02070 for ; Thu, 2 Nov 1995 21:56:13 -0800 Received: from dialup-a45.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a45.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.45]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7/8.7) with SMTP id QAA23340 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:53:08 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511030553.QAA23340@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:55:38 +0900 Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Robert Stirniman, on 31 Oct 95 at 13:40, you wrote: [snip] > Where did you get this information -- are there any documents relating > to this? There are persistent rumors that the Navy is engaged in > suppression and hoarding of new science information. I don't know if > there is any truth to it -- but if so, I believe it is way past time > to let loose of some of this stuff. But this particular technology > may be rightly considered to be dangerous, because it's use would > result in slowing down the earth's rotation. [snip] > A US patent was awarded in May 1994, for a similar device -- > patent #5,313,850 entitled "Earth/Gyro Power Transducer." It is > an entirely mechanical device, with a gyroscope mounted in a three > degree of freedom gimbal, which is mounted in an enclosure which > is fixed to the earth's surface. Power output torque comes from > the vertical gimbal axis, which rotates once per day. In this > invention, the gyroscope is allowed to precess in the polar > direction -- i.e. the "polar alignment problem" occurs, but when > the gyroscope reaches polar alignment it is re-precessed to an > anti-polar alignment, in an innovative fashion which requires > very little power input. > > In my opinion, use of inventions of this type must be absolutely > prohibited. The rate of rotation of our planet slows down > naturally due to tidal friction in the earth-moon system. But > recently, more "leap seconds" must be added each year, than would > be expected from natural causes. Robert, Please consider the following: Assumptions: The mass of the Earth = 5.9E24 kg. w = 2* PI radians/day. radius of earth about 6366 km. density = 5.459 kg/liter. energy of solid rotating sphere = (4/15)*PI*density*w^2*radius^5 (formula may be wrong I had to work it out from scratch). This yields a rotational energy for the earth of 2.5E29 joule. or 8E9 terrawatt years. 1% of this is 80 million terrawatt years. (1 terrawatt = 1000 gigawatts). Given that a large power station has a capacity on the order of one gigawatt, we could run 1000 such power stations from 1% of the rotational energy of the earth for 80 million years. I think that if in this time mankind hasn't found other sources of energy, and hasn't found a way off the planet, then he probably doesn't deserve to. (If he's still around in 80 million years). Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 07:26:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA07106 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:24:52 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA07060 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:24:46 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id HAA23531; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:24:45 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:24:44 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Electrogravitics (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Someone here was asking about T.T. Brown and later works. The book discussed below is said to contain significant material, but I haven't seen it myself. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 12:20:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Stirniman To: neotech@world.std.com Subject: Open Letter to Dr LaViolette -> SearchNet's neotech Mailing List Background Information: About six weeks ago I posted an article and article entitled, "The US Antigravity Squadron" to one of the usenet newsgroups. The article was written by Dr Paul LaViolette, and discusses in detail the use of electrogravitics and anti-gravity technology in the B-2 Stealth Bomber. The article by Dr LaViolette appears as a chapter in the book "Electrogravitic Systems: Reports on a New Propulsion Technology", edited by Tom Valone, and published by Integrity Research Institute. Anyone who would like to receive more information about this book, as well as a long list (210 Kbytes as of October 20) of other references and information about electrogravitics and anti-gravity, please send an email request to: robert@wwa.com I posted Dr LaViolette's article in a public forum, without regard to copyright law. Two days ago, I received an angry email message from Dr LaViolette concerning copyright violations. ==================================================================== Open Letter to Dr LaViolette (gravity@aol.com) Dear Dr LaViolette, I apologize for causing you bad feelings, and regret posting the article "The US Antigravity Squadron" on a public forum. I gave no thought whatsoever to copyright issues, and frankly was of a mind that this article probably originated with you or your publisher for purposes of publicity. It is obvious now that this is not true, and in any case I should have verified this with you before posting. Thoughtless is as thoughtless does. I am most sorry, as well as surprised, to hear that you have only sold one copy of this book in the last three months. The book contains an incredible amount of "real" information, especially compared with some other books in this field which sell better. Many people are hungry for this kind of information. Based on your letter, it is evident that you believe that low sales volume is due in large part to copyright violations, and in this belief your anger is understandable. In my opinion, there is a much more basic reason why your book is not selling well. It has not been marketed -- apparently not at all. Have you visited any large retail book distributors lately, such as: Barnes and Noble, Borders, or the like? They offer a large variety of books, in both the science/physics and UFO/paranormal sections of their stores. You can find books on-the-shelf, available for purchase, such as: "The Anti-Gravity Handbook", and books about the lost inventions of Tesla, etc. I have personally seen people buy these books, and these stores generally only keep things on the shelf which will move with the public. I don't want to make light of books such as "The Anti-Gravity Handbook" -- and don't know if you've ever seen it, but in my opinion it is trite, and like most of the books which are readily available about this subject, it contains very little in the way of substantive information. Compared to the books that are available in the stores, your book stands out as authentic and meaningful. Of course, this assumes that people might ever have the opportunity to see it, and select it for purchase. The fact is this -- your book is not available in retail stores, and furthermore retail stores can not order your book even if requested by a customer, because it is also not available at any large wholesale warehouse locations. I have looked. You like math. Here's a simple equation about book marketing. No Publicity + No Distribution = No Sales Your book required substantial effort and attention to detail, and it is understandable that you could become frustrated and angry about the failure to develop significant sales. I suggest you direct your anger at those responsible for marketing and distributing your work. I also suggest that it is possible that your work is being intentionally suppressed from public view, and that you take a hard look in the direction of the jackals who have set your mind on my trail, as a likely faction that does not really want people to see your book. I respect your work -- it's great, and I wish only the best for you. If you desire to sue me, it's fine by me. You would have to get in a long line to try to collect anything, but a lawsuit could provide you substantial benefit in the way of publicity, provided that you ever succeed in getting your book into any distribution channels. But, here's my guess -- the same folks who are stirring you up to attack me, will relatively quickly develop the opinion that a real lawsuit is "not a good idea". Political suppression of scientific knowledge retards human advancement. I will continue whenever possible to promote interest in your book, as well as other information about electrogravitics and anti-gravity technology. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) -> Posted by: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 08:07:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA09338 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:32:16 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA09322 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:32:14 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id HAA24372; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:32:13 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:32:13 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: TT Brown Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Here's a message from A. Frolov I found in my personal inbox. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 29 Oct 95 23:15:12 +0300 From: alex To: billb@eskimo.com Subject: Electrogravity Larry Adams ( ladams@got.net ) wrote: positive Look at the Figure here: ______I_______ /I I I I\ / I I I I \ / I I I I \ / I I I I \ / I I opened I I \ /dielectricI I cylinder I Idielectric\ /____________I I I I____________\ ______________ ______________ ring ring I-----------> negative Positive charged cylinder and negative charged ring are two plates for simple asymmetrical capacitor. Forces from ring to cylinder are perpendicular to its surface and sum of forces is equal to zero. Forces from cylinder to ring are perpendicular to ring and its sum is not equal to zero. Asymmetrical capacitor move up here. For T.T.Brown version was used asymmetry form for dielectric body like this: ----------------- positive plate ____ / \ / \ /____________\ --------------------- negative plate It is cross-section of dielectric body, the view from the butt-end. It is clear that forces are asymmetrical here since lines of electrical field are curved. Let's try show it here: metal plate of capacitor /positive/ . ------.-------.-------.---------.-.-.-.- . . . . _._._._._ . . . / . . . ./ . . / . / . . / ./ / dielectric body . / / /__________________________________ ------------------------------------------------ metal plate of capacitor /negative/ The rule is that line of field always is perpendicular to surface. It is reason to create the asymmetry for forces here. I am ready for joint experimental work or patent work in this direction if you can offer some help in funds for equipment for it. Please, have contact with my partner for discussion of conditions: David Rogers / rogersda@direct.ca / The calculations I made show that 1000 Volts can create force in several Kg for capacitor 1 m diameter. It is defined by distance between plates and by material of dielectric. Microtechnology that can create submilimeter size shape for dielectric decribed above allow built it. IF ONE WISH MAKE THIS EXPERIMENT AND BUILD REAL ELECTROGRAVITY MACHINE CONTACT WITH ME OR WITH DAVID ROGERS. --------------------------------------- Alexander V. Frolov Engineer --- Alexander V. Frolov email: alex@frolov.spb.su P. O. Box 37, St.-Petersburg, 193024, Russia """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 16:33:25 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA08592 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:32:31 -0800 Received: from fun.direct.ca (root@fun.direct.ca [199.60.228.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA08577 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:32:27 -0800 Received: from van04097.direct.ca (van04097.direct.ca [204.174.243.97]) by fun.direct.ca (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA02448 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:27:41 -0800 Message-Id: <199511040027.QAA02448@fun.direct.ca> X-Sender: kbreslau@Direct.CA X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 03 Nov 1995 16:34:40 -0800 To: Freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: kbreslau@direct.ca (Klaus Breslauer) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Dear Pat, I would like to thank you for posting your TOMI device description and diagrams. If only more people were as open and honest as you in presenting their ideas as experiments for review. The TOMI does work as advertised, but my experiments with it does not leave me with the optimism that you have discovered something fundamentally new. In some of the posts about the TOMI, some people talked of "pumping" device. I think that what is happening, because there is a strong repulsion at the very bottom of the first ramp, so one must "align the runner where the repulsion is a bit weaker, but still strong enough to force it up the ramp towards the attraction end. To show that one is putting energy into an unstable configuration: try suspending the runner with a loop of string so that it can rotate and dropping it into place. It immediately flips to the stable condition of locked attraction. The 'pumping is preventing the magnet to flip to its stable state. Being heavy and with weak magnets, it takes too much energy to flip the runner around against the I would like to thank you for posting your TOMI device description and diagrams. If only more people were as open and honest as you in presenting their ideas as experiments for review. The TOMI does work as advertised, but my experiments with it does not leave me with the optimism that you have discovered something fundamentally new. In some of the posts about the TOMI, some people talked of "pumping" device. I think that what is happening, because there is a strong repulsion at the very bottom of the first ramp, so one must "align the runner where the repulsion is a bit weaker, but still strong enough to force it up the ramp towards the attraction end. To show that one is putting energy into an unstable configuration: try suspending the runner with a loop of string so that it can rotate and dropping it into place. It immediately flips to the stable condition of locked attraction. The 'pumping is preventing the magnet to flip to its stable state. Being heavy and with weak magnets, it takes too much energy to flip the runner around against the friction of the cardboard, so it rolls it uphill, where the total energy is lower. As well, if one makes the decline after the top very shallow, the runner becomes stuck at the top end. A steep decline allows the gravitational force to overcome the sharp attraction, drop down and get placed into the next 'starting spot. Your TOMI demo is a very neat desk toy, but I will not spend much more money on it. 50 magnets were a fun way to spend an evening, and will give it to my nephew Tyson for a science fair exhibit. Some posts did touch on a way to 'test the TOMI as a non-energy conserving device, which I will try. Instead of hand placing the runner, have a gentle decline roll the runner from 'away from the magnetic field, down a small steep decline to the first 'start spot, where it will be carried up the and over to a steep decline to break the magnetic attraction, and then a gentle incline to move to 'away from the magnetic field. If the track was made of hard enough material, and the runner wheels sticky enough to prevent spinning and the runner ended up higher up than where it started, and at least as far away from the ramp as it started, you would have something for sure. Will play with it a bit a let you know how it goes. Best wishes, Klaus From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 18:19:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA08645 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:19:56 -0800 Received: from mail.annex.com (youjaes@mail.annex.com [204.74.67.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA08627; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:19:52 -0800 Received: (from youjaes@localhost) by mail.annex.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA10888; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:19:48 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:19:48 -0800 (PST) From: James Youlton To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device In-Reply-To: <199510311021.CAA21866@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Gary Hawkins wrote: > At 07:13 PM 10/30/95 -0800, you wrote: > > > >Hi all, > > > >I've been wondering if anyone around here knows anything about the CEG > >device that was discovered at Tesla's compound after his death, > > > > Tesla had a compound? Where did you get that? Compound implies > an organization, security, lots of people, multiple buildings, etc. I'll give the same advice that was given to me when I raised the same objection - there was a group of structures surrounded by a fence, so get over it. It's a little blunt, but it shut me up at the time. > I'd say if you build one of the devices you refer to about the size of > Colorado, you might obtain some useful work out of it. Why not > mount a rotor a couple of miles long on top of Pike's Peak as a test. I'm just looking for any additional facts about a tank about 10 feet wide and six feet high with what appears to be a generator on it. As far as a test, you could do one with household items on a coffee table, albiet you won't see much power from it, but at least you could demonstrate the principle. Btw, mine ran fast. Instead of two rotations per day, my rotor ran at four rotations per day. It appeared that the water was rotating at two rotations per day and the rotor was rotating twice per day with respect to the water. > Sorry to be so snide, but you sound all too much like a disinformation > specialist to me. > > Hey, just being straightforward about it. You could probably change my mind. You're right, I probably could. J Youlton From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 3 23:20:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA25920 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 23:18:39 -0800 Received: from mail.annex.com (youjaes@mail.annex.com [204.74.67.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA25870 for ; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 23:18:33 -0800 Received: (from youjaes@localhost) by mail.annex.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA14366; Fri, 3 Nov 1995 23:18:29 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 23:18:28 -0800 (PST) From: James Youlton To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Robert Stirniman wrote: > > Frm: Robert Stirniman > To: James Youlton > Date: Octobert 31, 1995 > > Hi James. Interesting post. I also have some older ones by you > from the newsgroup alt.sci.physics which are related to the same > subject -- that is, tapping power from the earth's inertial > rotation. I believe it is possible to do this, but it would be > an extremely unwise practice for ecological reasons. A while back, I asked for some discussion on the subject in alt.sci.physics.new-theories, since hardly anyone had ever heard of such a device for somewhat obvious reasons. Btw, I don't see much in the way of ecological backlash, except for the construction of a very large, ocean based device. Such a device would noticably raise the level of the ocean, which might negatively impact the shoreline of coastal cities, but then again, the global shipping fleet is already doing that. ;-) > >I've been wondering if anyone around here knows anything about the CEG > >device that was discovered at Tesla's compound after his death, and > >subsequently bulldozed over. > > First I've heard of it. What do the letters CEG stand for? CEG is an acronym for 'Coriolis Effect Generator'. > > The device in question was studied by a group of three people at the > > Department of the U.S. Navy in the sixties and was found to be a device > > that uses the rotation of the earth as a power source using a simple > > mechanical effect. > > The Navy, after determining the nature of the device, was ordered to > > sequester all documents and information from the public that would lead > > one to the discovery of how this device works, or even it's very existence. > > The Navy project was call "Turtle Island" and was shut down at the same > > time, along with a number or other military and government projects. Two > > of the three investigators met with an untimely demise a short time later > > and the third was not heard from again, though there is a report that he > > was later seen. > > Where did you get this information -- are there any documents relating > to this? There are persistent rumors that the Navy is engaged in > suppression and hoarding of new science information. I don't know if > there is any truth to it -- but if so, I believe it is way past time > to let loose of some of this stuff. But this particular technology > may be rightly considered to be dangerous, because it's use would > result in slowing down the earth's rotation. There are documents. The original project docs were classified as 'Need to know' and were so restricted that they weren't even cataloged. When the Dept. of the Navy became part of the DoD, and the docs, along with a pile of others, were simply moved over to the DoD and no one even looked at them for a couple decades. Recently, when the manual directives were satisfied, the project docs were declassified and ordered built. The docs made there way to Lockheed Corp a couple of years ago, shortly before the Martin-Marrieta merger took place. (The Martins would NEVER pass up an engineering contract like this, especially when it was originally a NAVY project!) > >The device is a simple tank of water with a bouyant cylinder floating in > >it. The unrestricted cylinder tends to naturally rotate at a rate of two > >revolutions per day. By placing a resistance to the rotation of the > >cylinder, useful power can be generated. > > This might work if the bouyant cylinder contains a rotating flywheel > (gyroscope). It may be easiest to view operation of the device, with > the tank at the earth's equator. The axis of rotation of the gyroscope > would be located in a plane parallel to the earth's surface, and the > gyroscope could be fixed in the bouyant cylinder so that it is > mechanically prevented from precessing in the vertical/polar direction, > while the bouyancy of the tank would allow limited movement and > precession torque in the vertical/polar direction. In inventions of > this type, it is necessary to avoid the "polar axis alignment problem", > because once the gyroscope precesses in the polar direction and > becomes aligned with the earth's axis of rotation -- no further > output torque results from the earth's rotation. In this invention, > the entire buoyant cylinder would end up precessing/floating around > an axis parallel to the ground. But it seems to me that this would > occur ONCE per day -- rather than twice. > > The above is speculation. Do you have any details of how this > thing works? The floating cylinder *is* a gyroscope, and I agree, it *should* only rotate once per day or perhaps even less. Observation indicates that it rotates twice per day, but it doesn't work at the equator. Rather it works best at around 30 degrees north or south latitude, as I recall. By connecting the cylinder to a gearing mechanism such that the total angular momentum of the system equals the angular momentum of the unrestricted cylinder, useful work can be performed. For example, a two meter wide cylinder or disk that is one meter high and rotating at two rotations per day has the equivalent angular momentum as a twenty centimeter disk that is one centimeter thick rotating at 2E6 rotations per day or approximately 1350 rpm, constantly. > A US patent was awarded in May 1994, for a similar device -- > patent #5,313,850 entitled "Earth/Gyro Power Transducer." It is > an entirely mechanical device, with a gyroscope mounted in a three > degree of freedom gimbal, which is mounted in an enclosure which > is fixed to the earth's surface. Power output torque comes from > the vertical gimbal axis, which rotates once per day. In this > invention, the gyroscope is allowed to precess in the polar > direction -- i.e. the "polar alignment problem" occurs, but when > the gyroscope reaches polar alignment it is re-precessed to an > anti-polar alignment, in an innovative fashion which requires > very little power input. Thanks for the input. Btw, do you happen to know the name on the patent? > In my opinion, use of inventions of this type must be absolutely > prohibited. The rate of rotation of our planet slows down > naturally due to tidal friction in the earth-moon system. But > recently, more "leap seconds" must be added each year, than would > be expected from natural causes. > If the only method available for preventing the nearly irrestible > inclination that people will have to use an invention like this, > which supplies "free" energy from the earth's rotation, is to > attempt to keep the knowledge secret -- then we are destined to > fail. There must be a way to detect/sense the operation of this > type of machine, and shut it down. The energy in the rotation of > the earth belongs only to prosperity. The use of a CEG doesn't slow the rotation of the earth, but counterintuitively, the opposite. A generator connected to the floating cylinder serves to increase it's angular momentum about the earth, which in turn is dissipated by applying a torque in the direction of the earth's rotation, so the earth speeds up in it's rotation when a load is removed from the system. > But don't get me started about who might police something like > this -- and the paranoid knee jerk reactions people have about > the inherent evils of world government, no matter what its form > and function. Fate dictates that we all play together, or we won't > be playing at all. Interesting you should say that. The original project called for the construction of a single large device, since an economy of scale works as square of the size of the device, i.e. a 10 meter wide cylinder one meter high requires 100 times the cost to build as a 1 meter wide cylinder one meter high but has 10,000 times the angular momentum. From a community standpoint, the more shared resources devoted to single device, the greater the return for each of the participants, though there is nothing stopping a tinkerer such as Tesla or any one else from building one for their own use and education. It was the economy of scale factor, coupled with the prevailing cold war of the era that forced it into secrecy. It was a dirty shame that when it was originally figured out that the development would have caused a social disaster. J Youlton From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 01:47:37 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA20552 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 01:47:32 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id BAA20536 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 01:47:27 -0800 Message-Id: <199511040947.BAA20536@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 04 Nov 1995 03:14:45 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >> >> Hey, just being straightforward about it. You could probably change my mind. > >You're right, I probably could. > > >J Youlton > > And you did indeed. Nice going. __________________________________________________ Tidbit o' the day: Lester Hendershot was paid $25,000 to not work on his device for 17 (?) years. That payment came from [the envelope please...] Standard Oil of New York (SONY). That was a very large sum of money at the time. Gary Hawkins From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 03:24:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA03472 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 03:24:09 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA03451 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 03:23:56 -0800 Received: from harti.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (harti.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA16378 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 12:23:13 +0100 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 12:23:13 +0100 Message-Id: <199511041123.MAA16378@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net Subject: Enhanced TOMI: PM_Square ! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: PM_Square enhanced : The new free energy generation device ! ============================================================ Latest news: ------------ 1. MPEG movie now available at: 194.77.35.1 in pub/harti/energy/PM_Square/pm_sqlin.mpg about 485 KBytes. Shows, how the Linear Mode works with multiple stator tracks ! Could be used to proppel a train along a railway ! 2. A new Enhanced Linear version shown down there ! ===================================================================== Hi, do you remember the TOMI (also called TMI) device ? Well, I have worked together with the inventor and another "magnet freak" during the last weekend on the design and we found the solution how to power a motor just via using Permanent Magnets ! I will call this design from now on: PM_Square = (PM)^2 Permanent Magnet Powered Motor ! = = = = Well, here it is how it is working: I will first describe a Linear Motor design and later post a few MPEG movies of the enhanced rotor version experiments... I will publish all my results and findings, so you are ready to duplicate it yourself and prove me right or wrong. This way the basic design goes to the Public Domain and can't be bought out or will be suppressed... I just claim the inventor rights on the Angle Steel add-on design ! Please copy this file to all people, which care about environment pollution and want to have a so called "free energy" machine. For the full understanding of this PM_Square design you should have read the TOMI description ! Here the PM_Square design goes: The most important enhancements over the TOMI design are introduced via 2 angle steel plates at the endings on each track-magnet (in the TOMI description called: Runner-magnet) I will call these "Runner-Magnets" from now on Stator Track-magnets, because they don't "run" , but are just the Stator-Magnets, which build the track ! Okay, so how are these 2 Angle Steel plates fitted to the Track-Magnets ? Here is a simple ASCII drawing: Top View ======== ____ ____ | track magnets (stator) | <-----Angle Steel |_____ _____ ___________ _____ ______ ______| at each ending ! | | | | | | | | |N S|N S|N S|N S|N S|N S|N S| |_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|______|______| ------->| Roller Magnet dropped into the track from above at 90 degrees at this place ! ----- | N | | S | ----- | N | | S | Roller Magnet, ----- rolls this way --------> | N | along out of the track ! | S | ----- | N | | S | ----- ------->| Roller Magnet dropped into the track from above at 90 degrees at this place ! _____ _____ _____ _____ _____ ______ ______ | | | | | | | | |S N|S N|S N|S N|S N|S N|S N| |_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|______|______| | | <------Angle Steel |____ track magnets (stator) _____| at each ending ! This is the Top View of the Linear Motor design ! All magnets used are circular magnets. So the Roller Magnet can roll through the track ! The number of stator track magnets can vary, but should not be too many , cause it weakens the flux inside the track. Go for around 7 to 10 magnets first. (7 are shown over here !) By using Angle Steel plates of ST37 or ST100 (thickness of about 1 to 2.5 mm), one can force the magnetic flux at the endings of the permanent magnet Stator Track to be going the right way! In this case it prevents to pull the Roller Magnet back into the track, when it leaves the track at the right side ! You can also try to use a "V"-shaped placement of the Stator Track magnets (not putting them in parallel as shown, but at an opening angle of maybe 5 to 10 degrees), which I can't draw over here with this simple ASCII-"art"! This enables the Roller magnet to get out of the Stator Track at the ending even better and the killing force at the end of the track is far more weaker ! One has to drop the Roller Permanent Magnet for the best performance (acceleration) into the track at around 90 degrees (also 45 degrees would still work!) at around 1/5 to 1/4 length of the track. This way, the Roller Magnet is just pulled into the track and don't have to go via the slight repulsion gate at the entrance of the track at the very left side ! With using the steel plates fitted to the end of the track magnets you can also try to push the Roller Magnet into the track at the left side, but it will almost kill the received acceleration force from the previous track ! But with using the Angle Steel plates, this killing effect is much less, than without using the Angle Steel plates... So the secret to a Real Working Linear PM_Square motor are just these Angle Steel Magnetic Flux guidance plates ! The best design to get the Roller going through an unlimited number of Magnet Stator tracks would be the following design: Side View: ========== Roller Magnet climbing the hills -----> going this direction --> | | wooden cardboard downhill track | | (without any stator magnets !) | | | __ | __ | / \ | / \ \ | /--. \ \|/ /--. \ \ | / ; \ / ; \ \ \|/ / / \ / / \ \ / \ / \ \ o / ^ ^ \ / \ \ / | | \ / \ / / | | / / / | | / / / | | / / <___ | | <___ <__ | | ^ | | | | Angle Steel Angle Steel | Stator magnet track ______________________________________________________________________ This Linear Motion Permanent Magnet Motor design should really work. It uses the gravitational force to go downhill into the next magnetic Stator Track. In this Side View only the front Stator magnet is shown with the Angle Steel at each end with the "wrong" angle drawn, due to the bad perspectivic drawing view !(I am not able to draw it better with using this ASCII- "art" ! Normally in the Side View the Angle Steel Plates would point into direction of your face and not downwards ! But I have drawn it downwards to make it clear, where the placement of the Angle Steel is located !) Have a look again above to the Top View and it will getting clear to you, how the Angle Steel has to be placed ! Enhanced Linear Motion version: =============================== Side View: ---------- Roller Magnet climbing the hills -----> going this direction --> | | wooden cardboard downhill track | | (without any stator magnets !) | | | | | # # | # # | / / | / / | /\ /\ | /\ /\ \|/ / \ / \ | / \ / \ o/ \ / \ \|/ / \ / \ \ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ / / / / / # # # # # /|\ |_______ Angle Steel plates at each ending of the Stator Magnets ! In this enhanced Linear version you use only the "phase" inside the stator track, that really accelerates the roller magnet. The fields at the beginning and ending of the Stator magnet track are not used ! The roller magnet can thus come into and out of the accelerating Stator Track without any killing force. The roller will just be accelerated each time it goes into the next hill ! Okay, so far for now. Please try to duplicate this Linear Motion design of PM_Square and let me know, if it will work for you. If you have any question, please drop a note to my email account at: harti@contrib.de or harti@b-2.de.contrib.net You can also have a look at my FTP site at: ftp://ftp.b-2.de.contrib.net in pub/harti/energy/pm_square (194.77.35.1) or into pub/incoming There will be soon a few MPEG movies of my experiments with this PM_Square device ! Theoretical explanation: ======================== I received this from an "anonymous" friend. Please read it and let me know what you think about this theory for the explanation of the TOMI and PM_Square effect ! I believe, that with using Permanent Magnets the Zero Point Energy can be tapped ! (See Dr. Harraold Putthof's explanation of Zero Point Energy) Irreversible Processes in Fields ================================ It is well known theory that the thermodynamic potentials go to an extremum. This is regarded as equivalent to Planck's 2nd law although the complete equivalence between both formulations of the second law never have been proved generally, especially if we apply the extremum principle of the thermodynamic potentials to electromagnetic fields. In this article we investigate this question. I. Irreversible Processes in Vapour-Liquid Mixtures We begin here with a well known and quite trivial example. We regard two cylinder volumes connected by a tap in the middle. Both the volumes can be set by moving a piston up and down into or out of the volume. With this experimental setup we proceed the following isothermic irreversible cycle, comp fig.1a):We take a fluid (for example water) being at the dew line of the phase diagram. We expand both the pistons isothermically from point 1 to point 2. So liquid condenses and is collected in the lower cylinder. Now the tap is closed and both the volumes are recompressed at equal pressures until the starting volume is reached again. Now we regard the question whether Planck's law is fulfilled. This question can be answered by writing the 2nd law for free energy which states that the free energy F tends to be a minimum. Therefore, if we leave the minimum in doing the cycle Fstart-Fend = - circle integral P dV > 0 must hold because the cycle is isothermal (dT=0) with no matter exchange (dn=0). The orientation of the integral shows that Planck's second law holds, comp. fig.1b). II. Irreversible Processes in Fields a) General According Landau and Lifshitz (1) the free energy of a system including electric fields and linear dielectrics is defined by F'(V,T,D) = F(V,T) + 1/(8*Pi*eps) Int D^2 dV The Legendre transform of this potential is F''(V,T,E) = F(V,T) - eps/(8*Pi) Int E^2 dV Both these definitions are not useful for thermodynamics because they are non-homologous functions regarding the molar ratios. Therefore, the following definitions are used and specified for constant dielectrics f'(V,T,P) = f (V,T) + 1/(8*Pi) Int E dP = f + 1/(8*Pi*Xi) P^2 f''(V,T,E) = f(V,T) - 1/(8*Pi) Int P dE = f - Xi/(8*Pi) E^2 Regarding the 2nd derivative of the electric variable of both these potentials we see that for a constant homogene dielectrics f'(V,T,P) approaches a minimum and f''(V,T,E) approaches a maximum in the equilibrium state, if Xi > 0. Similar considerations hold for magnetic fields as well. b) Mixing Processes Now, similar like in section I, we investigate an isothermic and isochoric cycle if an intense field is applied to a non ideal - non linear binary dielectric liquid (2). We start at the phase separation line at low field and apply a stronger field. Then demixing of the solution occurs. We close the tap and discharge the field. In the endpoint of the cycle at lower field we reopen the tap and return to equilibrium. Because we leave the equilibrium in performing the cycle the unequality df'' = - circle integral P dE < 0 holds according the last lines of section II a). Regarding the orientation of this integral we realize that it is a negative hysteresis relative to the usual ferroelectric hysteresis. Therefore, our consideration predicts a violation of Planck's second law for electrically induced irreversibilities. The irreversibility goes the other way round according to the Gibbs formalism contrary to Planck's 2nd law. c) Permanent Magnet Motors In Landau/Lifshitz (1) there exists a proof which shows that if we introduce a para- or ferromagnetic body into a fixed magnetic field (j=constant) the following relation holds: df' = - M dH Because df' approaches a maximum we interprete this equation that a self accelerating perpetual motion is possible in a magnetic field as an irreversibility. Therefore, in order to find an example we first rule out the conditions under which a perpetuum mobile is impossible. This is always the case if the magnetic field can be described as a potential field. According Jackson(3) a magnetic field of a closed loop or the field of a hard permanent ferromagnet can formally be decribed by a potential. This means that rot B vanishes. This has as a consequence that a perpetuum mobile acceleration of a magnetic charge is impossible.Therefore, the question arises whether there exists the possibility to break this zero rot B - field. The question can be answered positively. Using by Mu metal shieldings a non zero rot B field can be generated from a potential field by shielding off the unwanted parts of the field . We illustrate this idea by the following axial motor construction proposal which is derived by us from the linear Harris TMI set up (4), comp. fig.3)+b), which works and which has been confirmed and discussed by different persons(4,5). We do not claim that our proposal is a perpetuum mobile. We use a cylindrical tube of Mu metal as housing for the motor. In the housing tube we have a tube of lower diameter made from conducting material having the same axis as the housing tube. A current flows in the inner tube along the length equally distributed across the thicknell of the wall.The common axis of both these cylinders consist of a wire carrying a current flowing in the opposite direction relative to the current tube. If we look at the configuration of the field we have a circular non vanishing rot B field in one direction near the wall and a circular B field in the opposite direction near the central wire. Now we use the wire as an axis of a rotor which carries at least two symmetrically balanced permanent magnets rods whose north poles point radially and the south poles axially. The north poles are standing under the influence of the B field near the wall, the south pole feels the opposite field near by the wire. So a permanent torque is exerted on the rotor which begins to spin around the central wire as the axis. We see that our motor works only with permanent fields and needs no brushes. Therefore, the question arises: Is it not possible to use permanent magnets + Mu metal shields to replace the current wires by permanent magnets generating circular non vanishing rot B fields of opposite orientation to get the rotor spinning, comp. fig.5a). Similar constructions are already patented and can be found in the literature (6), comp. fig. 5b). Furthermore, we emphasize that until today there exist no generally accepted magnetic force law between differential current loops. Only for closed current loop the situation is clear, because all the different differential form coincide in one. Different forms have been proposed by Biot Savart (7), Ampere (7) (includes actio and reactio and conservation of angular momentum), Whittaker (8) (includes only action=reaction), Aspden (7) (includes only conservation of angular momentum) , and Marinov (9). Marinov claims that he would have proved experimentally his form as the correct one. Therefore, there seems to be an interesting field where important questions can be solved. Bibliography: 1) Landau L.D., Lifshitz E.M. Electrodynamics of Continous Media Pergamon, Oxford, 1984 2) Wirtz D., Fuller G.G. Phys.Rev.Lett.71, 2236, (1993) Debye P., Kleboth K. J.Chem.Phys.42, 3155, (1965) 3) Jackson,J.D. Classical Electrodynamics 2nd edition John Wiley, New York, 1975 4) Decker, J. BBS Keelynet PO-Box Mesquite Texas USA 75187 Modem ..214 324 3501 Filename: TOMIBILD.ASC harti@shb.contrib.de TMI device, free energy device ? 24.2.95 in ALT.SCI.PHYSICS.NEW-THEORIES 5) anff@qvwp.demon.co.uk TMI device, free energy device? 26.2.95 in ALT.SCI.PHYSICS.NEW-THEORIES harti@shb.contrib.de TMI + MRA updates, free energy 25.2.95 in ALT.SCI.PHYSICS.NEW-THEORIES harti@shb.contrib.de TOMI enhanced ! Free emergy device ! 31.3.95 in CL.ENERGY.ALTERNATIVEN prebys@puhep1.princeton.edu TMI device, free energy device ? 25.2.95 in SCI.ENERGY 6) Johnson, H.R. Permanent magnet motor U.S.Patent No. 4.151.431 Apr.24,1979 7) Aspden, Harold Physics without Einstein Southampton 1969 Aspden, Harold Modern Aether Physics Southampton 1975 8) Whittaker, Edmund Sir A history of the theories of Aether and Electricity Vol I The classical theories Humanities Press New York 1975 9) International Glasnost Journal of Fundamental Physics Vol.3, No.11, Marinov, Stefan; p.18 _________________________________________________________________ Figures: || || || | || | |======| | || | |======| | | |======| | | | | | | --- --- --- --- --- --- | | | | | | | |---| |--|-| |--|-| | | | | | | --- --- --- --- --- --- | | | | |//////| |======| |//////| |======| | || | |======| | || | || || || 1 2 3 fig. 1a): Isothermal cycle of a simple fluid with irreversibility 1 starting a the dew line 1-2 expansion, condensation of liquid 2 separating volumes by closing the tap 2-3 recompression 3 opening the tap, work has to be added to proceed the cycle P ^ 3 ._ r | | |_ e | | |_ s | | |_ 3 s | 1 ._ |_ u | |_ |< r | |__ |_ e | |_>_ |__ | |___.| | 2 | | | | | -----------------------------------------> Volume fig. 1b): Isothermal cycle of a simple fluid with irreversibility Pressure-volume diagram: 1 starting a the dew line 1-2 expansion, condensation of liquid 2 separating volumes by closing the tap 2-3 recompression 3 opening the tap, work has to be added to proceed the cycle ^ P | o | l | a | r | 2 i | -------. s | __| ____| a | 1 _>_| _<_| t | .__| __| i | | __| o | .__| n | 3 | | | -----------------------------------------> electric field fig.2: isothermal cycle with electrically induced irreversibility 1 starting at the phase separation line with low field 1-2 applying a field 2 closing the tap 2-3 dicharging of the high field 3 opening of the tap and returning to starting point 1A negative hysteresis is predicted according the Gibbs formalism. _ _ _ _ _ Top view S |_|_|_|_|_| N <--------moveable ROLLER magnet direction S |<--track-->| N of ROLLER ____________|____________ | | ___| | |___ | | | |___| (start) |___| | | | |___| |___| | RUNNERS | | |___| incline |___| <--------roll of magnets,positioned at | | |___| |___| | the same angle as the slope of | | |___| |___| | the incline \|/ | |___| |___| | | |___|____________|___| | | N | | S | | | decline | |<-------no magnets here, but not as much | S | | N | space between the rolls as shown | ___|____________|___ | | |___| |___| | | |___| |___| | | |___| incline |___| | | |___| |___| | | |___| |___| | | |___| |___| | | |___|____________|___| | | | | | | N | decline | S | | | | | | |____________| | | (finish) |<-------ROLLER winds up here |________________________| fig.3a) the TMI device, top view the two magnets along the incline are stationary, the magnet in the middle begins to roll standing under the influence of the stationary magnets. It is drawn over the fulcrum. There it rolls down under the influence of gravitation until it reaches the bottom of the second hill. Side view ! (enhanced version !) =========== ROLLER starts here \|/ | ----------------> direction of moveable magnetic ROLLER | /\ /\ | / \ / \ | / \ / \ / \ / \ /-------------- / -------------- <--------Magnetic ROLLER ends up / / here fig.3b) the TMI device, side view comp. textthe two magnets along the incline are stationary, the magnet in the middle begins to roll standing under the influence of the stationary magnets. It is drawn over the fulcrum. There it rolls down under the influence of gravitation until it reaches the bottom of the second hill. ___________________________ / \ / \ Mu metal / \ housing / \ / \ / \ / _______________ \ / / -------> \ \ | current / B-fields \ | | tube / | \ | | / | \ | | | /---------|----------\ | | | | / _______ <-- ________ \ | | | | ||S N| /-\ |N S|| | | | | ||_______| \-/ |________|| | | | | \ axis wire / | | | | \--------------------/ | | | \ rotor / | | \ \ / | | \ \----> / | \ \ ___________________/ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \_____________________________/ fig.4 magnetic motor with no brushes; top view the magnet charges on the rotor are spinning around the axis wire in the stationary double circular and opposite rot B fields of the wire and the current tube. fig.5a) our magnetic motor proposal using only permanent magnetsthe central wire is replaced by an inner ring consisting of permanent magnets and Mu metal shields generating an non vanishing B-field; the current tube is replaced by an outer ring of permanent magnets and Mu metal shields. the rotor is the same as in fig. 4. The field configuration seen by the rotor is in effect the same as in fig.4., only both the opposite non vanishing rot B fields of the stator are generated by permanent magnets. Unwanted parts of the field are shielded by Mu metal. It is clear that the configuration can be multiplied to enforce the power by taking more circles. Magnets similar as used by Johnson are recommended for the stator fields, comp fig.5b). Using electromagnets instead of permanent magnets would enhance power. fig.5b) the Johnson motor, US Patent Nr. 4,151,431 permanent magnets as stator, rotor with non vanishing rot B -field , see original patent _________________________________________________________________ disclaimer regarding employer Anti-Copyright - can be copied by everybody for nothing Berlin, Germany, on the 4th of April 1995. Best regards, Stefan Hartmann. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30 344 23 66 FAX: ++ 49 30 344 92 79 email: harti@contrib.de harti@b-2.de.contrib.net Web access: http://www.b-2.de.contrib.net/harti/harti.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 03:27:55 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA03835 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 03:27:54 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA03820 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 03:27:49 -0800 Received: from harti.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (harti.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA16384 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 12:27:17 +0100 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 12:27:17 +0100 Message-Id: <199511041127.MAA16384@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net Subject: Grigg´s overunity device, what happened ? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi, what happened with the Grigg heating device lately ? Were tests done by some professors from universities to prove its uverunity function ? Please let me know. email to: harti@bbtt.com Regards, Stefan. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 07:49:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA11509 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 07:49:36 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA11479 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 07:49:31 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tBkqR-001W2JC; Sat, 4 Nov 95 09:49 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Re: Weight Changes in Spinning Masses To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 09:49:23 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 6733 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Originally From: alt.alien.visitors By: sphinx@world.std.com (John Sangster, SPHINX Technologies) Subject: Weight Reduction in Spinning Masses Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 06:04:35 GMT Robert Stirniman wrote: >There have been studies on and off about this. Some experiments >have found that if you spin a flywheel/gyroscope it gets slightly >lighter in weight, other experiments find that it gets slightly >heavier, and most find that it has no measurable effect. Curious, eh? Most recently (except for the work of E. Jeong mentioned below), Hideo Hayasaka and Sakae Takeuchi of the Engineering Faculty at Tohoku University in Japan have published an experimental result of this sort. They found that gyroscopes spinning clockwise as seen from above, at their location, exhibited a decrease in relative mass of 5.07 x 10^-5 and 4.22 x 10^-5 respectively for the two gyroscope configurations studied. (Weight was multiplied by 1-e where e is the relative factors given above, if I haven't botched up in my arithmetic.) The effect as plotted in the paper I saw appears to be perfectly linear to within reasonable experimental error, thus giving a rotational velocity at which the weight would go to zero which I made out to be 3.27 MHz (million rotations per second) in the first case and 3.95 MHz in the second. That was with CLOCKWISE rotation as seen from above. With COUNTERclockwise rotation, the same experimental setup showed ZERO EFFECT. Zip. Nada. Nichts. Nyechevo. You get the idea. For one thing, this result makes it almost certain that they are NOT dealing with bad lab technique. Not to mention the fact that they spent nearly a year and a half going over and over their setup and trying to answer all objections by the reviewers of their Physical Review Letters paper (it eventually appeared in PRL (63 2701). As far as I know, nobody has published a theoretical model that accounts for these observations. The idea of a physical phenomenon that appears only in one direction of rotation is rather unprecedented. I know of only one other mathematical/physical phenomenon that does this, and I'm trying to understand how the two might be related, but without success as yet. I hadn't heard about the earlier reports that made it to NPR. Interesting. Now Dr. Jeong has come up with another example, this time based on theory, which appears to predict such an effect. Apparently, there are some VERY interesting clues to the nature of the universe that are related to the phenomenon of SPIN. It might get very interesting if someone were to make a project of assembling in one place all the information that has been observed, alleged, suspected, or speculated about concerning unexpected effects related to spin, along with all the traditional Newtonian results, stir, add some seasoning, and see what comes out. For example, in quantum mechanics, if you want to measure the spin axis of an electron, you do an experiment in which you ASSUME an axis, make a measurement of the correlation (the dot product) of that axis with the actual axis of spin for that electron, and theory says you can determine at least how close your guess was. It was a major surprise for the first expermienters with this to find that the guess was always right: whatever spin axis you assume turns out to be correct, exactly dead accurate. You must be a VERY good guesser. Out of this experimental result came the concept of "isospin". Which in itself is kind of weird in that objects with zero radius can still exhibit spin. But I find the idea that the spin is wherever you guess it might be to be even weirder and to need a better model that predicts this result. But I'm not a quantum mechanic, so maybe one of the readers who has really deep knowledge of the subject will put down his or her quantum wrenches and comment further. >A theory is circulating now on the internet, the gravitational-dipole >theroy by Dr EueJin Jeong, which may explain the apparent contradictions >of these experiments. Dr Jeong demonstrates, in theory, that if you spin >a physical body that is axially asymetric -- such as a half-spheroid, >it's center of mass will shift in the direction of the greater mass >of the body, ... and this much is pretty much un-controversial, coming straight out of special relativity that is taught even to high-schoolers these days. > ... causing a linear force in the direction of the larger >diameter area. This is less obvious and bound to generate some controversy from physicists, but as Dr. Jeong pointed out to me in private communications, the physical situation is much more complex than it might at first appear. For example, it is not just that there is a relativistic mass increase at the rim of the spinning hemisphere that is larger than at the points of smaller diameter. There is also a change in apparent SIZE of the elements of length spinning at the rim which is greater than that at smaller radius. In fact the radius of the rim would appear to shrink. He says that the resulting distortion of spacetime is what produces the externally observable gravitational field distortion. >In a gravitational field this would manifest iteself >as an increase or decrease in weight, depending on the orientation >of the half-spheroid. >So looking back at the original experiments -- if you perfectly >balance your flywheel, you will find no effect due to spin. But, >if your flywheel is axially unsymmetric, you will find a reduction >or increase in weight, depending on it's orientation. > >Dr Jeong has the strength of his convictions and seems to be >holding his own on the internet against predominant cries of >quackery and crackpotism. The main problem I have with his theory >is that it should be relatively easy to test. It takes a fairly >massive weight (10s of kilograms) spinning fairly fast (30 thousand >rpm), to get a measurable effect. But I think it's possible to test >this fairly easily, with existing instrumentation and electronic >motor drives, such as a high-speed machine-tool spindle-motor. Clearly, it's going to take such a test to prove or disprove Dr. Jeong's theoretical prediction, just as with any theory. >Interestingly, Dr Jeong is an invited speaker at the Second Optical >SETI conference, and coincidentally is presenting his gravitational >dipole theory today (November 2). These scientists are "in-the-know". >Dr Jeong's credibility is rising and his theories bear watching. It will be interesting to hear the reaction of this body of knowledgeable scientists. But we'll still need to hear Mother Nature's opinion, too! -John Sangster Wellesley Hills, MA -------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 10:02:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA09336 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 10:02:57 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA09308 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 10:02:53 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tBmvZ-001W07C; Sat, 4 Nov 95 12:02 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Re: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 12:02:49 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1597 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Quoting William Clymer to Robert Stirniman: >The (Barnett Effect) is the effect of a change in volume of a >magnetic material in response to a change in it's magnetization >strength. If a ferrite material is exposed to a highter >magnetization field (more current through the coil) the >ferrite will change in volume. >I'm not aware that this has anything to do with alignment to a >spinning axis. >Ref. Handbook of Magnetic Phenomena, >Harry S Burk, >Van Nostrand Reinhold, 1986 Page 262. >I would like to know the correct name for the effect you describe. >Can you provide further reference. Thanks for the info, I haven't seen it this way. Copied below are a few references about the Barnett effect, of which the first two come from the horse's mouth. Barnett, S. J., "Magnetization By Rotation," The American Physical Society, Second Series, vol. VI, No. 2, Jun., 1915, pp. 171-172. Barnett, S. J., "Magnetization By Rotation," The Physical Review, Second Series, vol. VI., No. 4, Oct., 1915, pp. 239-270. "In the Barnett effect a long iron cylinder, when rotated at high speed about its longitudinal axis, is found to develop a measurable component of magnetization, the value of which is proportional to the angular speed. The effect is attributed to the influence of the impressed rotation upon the revolving electronics systems due to the mass property of the unpaired electrons within the atoms." -- Henry Wm Wallace US Patent #3626605, Method and Apparatus for Generating a Secondary Gravitational Force Field Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 11:11:35 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA27750 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 11:11:24 -0800 Received: from newciv.org (root@newciv.org [198.68.36.114]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA27739 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 11:11:20 -0800 Received: from s2 (s2 [200.42.42.11]) by newciv.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA22266 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 11:10:55 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 11:10:55 -0800 Message-Id: <199511041910.LAA22266@newciv.org> X-Sender: jhs@200.42.42.66 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.1.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: JHS Subject: ftp of: Enhanced TOMI: PM_Square ! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >1. MPEG movie now available at: > >194.77.35.1 in pub/harti/energy/PM_Square/pm_sqlin.mpg about 485 KBytes. this server replies: 530 User anonymous access denied.. Btw, if you need ftp or Web space, I'm running the New Civilization Network (http://www.newciv.org/) and provide services free of charge for contributions that improve life today and/or the future Joachim From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 21:05:07 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA06054 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 21:05:05 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA06035 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 21:05:02 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id VAA27818; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 21:05:01 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 21:05:01 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: The Hendershot Generator In-Reply-To: <199511050415.UAA23600@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sat, 4 Nov 1995, Gary Hawkins wrote: ... > It was a real surprise to me that Charles Lindberg played a role > in that whole scenario. There is more information on that in > Mark Hendershot's new book on it. Do you have Mark's book-order address? The book is available elsewhere, but he says that the other mailorder companies put a 100% markup on the price. (Note to all: he says that there are some serious errors in the Hendershot Generator plans which are currently being sold elsewhere by mailorder, and these errors don't appear in the plans in his book.) If he gives permission, we should scan in some photos from the book and start a little web page for him, even before he gets online. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 20:45:18 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA23632 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 20:16:05 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA23600 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 20:15:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199511050415.UAA23600@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 04 Nov 1995 21:52:32 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: The Hendershot Generator Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A I had an opportunity to speak to Mrs. Hendershot last night. She feels that he did actually commit suicide. She said they had talked about it just before, that he had commented that he was a millstone around her neck. He had received some injuries from an accident that were not healing, had to wear a cover around his left hand when in public, could not push a lawnmower or do other such things, and had a lot of head pain. One could postulate about psychotronic weapons being used against him to cause the head pain. But I tend to think she is right. (Medical bills, etc, as part of the reason). The device he built was used to power a TV set for a couple of weeks, she said. But that is certainly not all there was. There might actually be a video tape out soon that will provide a lot of insight into the life of Lester Hendershot, and his generator, through interviews with those who knew him. It was a real surprise to me that Charles Lindberg played a role in that whole scenario. There is more information on that in Mark Hendershot's new book on it. Gary Hawkins From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 22:10:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA22389 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:10:27 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA22379 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:10:25 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA06257; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:10:14 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:10:11 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: More Hendershot Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Mark Hendershot made a somewhat-suprise visit to the "weird science" meeting Friday in Seattle. That's why we're suddenly discussing the Hendershot device. For those unfamiliar, this device was created by Lester Hendershot in the (30s? 40s?) while he was working on aviation compasses for the military. It is composed of a couple of large single-layer basketweave coils wound around layers of foil and paper as capacitors, cross connected with some standard transformers and a vibrating part near a permanent magnet. It is apparantly a self-acting coil/capacitor oscillator, and is claimed to have run banks of lightbulbs at up to 500W total, and ran Hendershot's TV set for two weeks. Hendershot believed that he was tapping into the relative motion of the earths magnetic field produced as the earth turns. By conventional physics this is not possible, so there must be something more to the device than would be revealed by conventional electromagnism. (Also, if it's earth-powered, Hendershot Generators will slow down the earth over time, no?) The 'secret' to the generator has been lost, though 99% of the design is known. Hobbyists have been building them for years, with occasional rumors of sucess but nothing reliable or repeatable. The goal is to mess with the connections, capacitor shape and compression, etc., while plucking the vibrating part, and if you're lucky the light bulb bank will suddenly come to life. And after a while, the electrolytic capacitors in the circuit (at least in Skilling's) will blow up, since they are supporting several amps, and the electrolyte boils. There is also a less-known motor version of the device. Hendershot was making national news headlines with his "magnetic motor," but the headlines suddenly disappeared (very probably suppressed, according to Mark) and Mr. Hendershot was paid by Standard Oil to drop all further research. The Keelynet file PEA1.ASC says that a Dr. Ed Skilling of Columbia University built a successful Hendershot machine in 1961 and got 300 watts at 500KHz. Skilling had worked with Hendershot? Mark Hendershot says that Skilling is the source of the mailorder plans with the errors (like wrong numbers of turns, wrong coil winding direction, etc.) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 22:46:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA00837 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:46:04 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA00830 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:46:01 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA09549; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:46:00 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 22:45:59 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Bag that puppy! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Fri, 3 Nov 1995, William Beaty wrote: > From: alex > To: billb@eskimo.com > Subject: Electrogravity > > > I----------------------> positive > Look at the Figure here: ______I_______ > /I I I I\ > / I I I I \ > / I I I I \ > / I I I I \ > / I I opened I I \ > /dielectricI I cylinder I Idielectric\ > /____________I I I I____________\ > ______________ ______________ > ring ring I-----------> > negative > The skeptical arguement is that the above device works entirely by ion wind. So, why didn't the experimenters put the darn thing inside a plastic bag to eliminate most of the emitted wind? You could put it in a vacuum chamber. But if the whole assembly is sealed in a drycleaning bag, and if the bag is far enough away from all sharp metal parts that ionization can't break out in the air outside the bag, then all ion-wind thrust forces will be totally eliminated. If doing so does not reduce the output thrust, then that thrust is NOT from ion wind. "Vacuum" chamber costing $.01? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 4 20:06:00 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA16715 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 19:50:42 -0800 Received: from bos1b.delphi.com (SYSTEM@bos1b.delphi.com [192.80.63.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA16683 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 1995 19:50:36 -0800 Received: from delphi.com by delphi.com (PMDF V5.0-5 #10880) id <01HX9G23ZJFK99G76A@delphi.com> for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 04 Nov 1995 22:49:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 1995 22:49:32 -0500 (EST) From: Pat Harris Subject: Enhanced TOMI: PM_Square ! To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Message-id: <01HX9G23ZJFM99G76A@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: INTERNET"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 4-NOV-1995 06:25:11.1 freenrg-list said to PATHARRIS >Side View: >========== >Roller Magnet climbing the hills -----> going this direction --> >| >| wooden cardboard downhill track >| | (without any stator magnets !) >| | >| __ | __ >| / \ | / \ >\ | /--. \ \|/ /--. \ >\ | / ; \ / ; \ >\ \|/ / / \ / / \ >\ / \ / \ >\ o / ^ ^ \ / \ >\ / | | \ / \ / >/ | | / / >/ | | / / >/ | | / / ><___ | | <___ <__ >| | >^ | | >| | Angle Steel >Angle Steel | >Stator magnet track >______________________________________________________________________ >This Linear Motion Permanent Magnet Motor design should really work. >It uses the gravitational force to go downhill into the next magnetic >Stator Track. Stefan, It does and did 20 years ago. John Brawley, in December of 1993, with my first specs and instructions, built a four-inclince model. I am glad to see you put to use the information I gave you a long time ago with regard to eliminating the repulsion effects by causing the runner to enter the track at 45 degrees or better. But there is a much simpler way to do what you have done, which was in my original patent. But you have overcome the first hurdle. Regards Stewart PatHarris@Delphi.Com `[1;34;45mRainbow V 1.19.4 for Delphi - Registered From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 09:01:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA18972 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 09:00:16 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA18933 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 09:00:07 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tC8QM-001W2BC; Sun, 5 Nov 95 11:00 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Re: Tesla CEG Device To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:00:00 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3335 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Quoting James Youlton to Robert Stirniman about the Tesla CEG Device: >There are documents. The original project docs were classified as 'Need >to know' and were so restricted that they weren't even cataloged. When >the Dept. of the Navy became part of the DoD, and the docs, along with a >pile of others, were simply moved over to the DoD and no one even looked at >them for a couple decades. Recently, when the manual directives were >satisfied, the project docs were declassified and ordered built. The >docs made there way to Lockheed Corp a couple of years ago, shortly >before the Martin-Marrieta merger took place. (The Martins would NEVER >pass up an engineering contract like this, especially when it was >originally a NAVY project!) Hi James. I'd like to see the details. Are copies of any of these documents available anywhere? >The floating cylinder *is* a gyroscope, and I agree, it *should* only >rotate once per day or perhaps even less. Observation indicates that it >rotates twice per day, but it doesn't work at the equator. Rather it >works best at around 30 degrees north or south latitude, as I recall. >By connecting the cylinder to a gearing mechanism such that the total >angular momentum of the system equals the angular momentum of the >unrestricted cylinder, useful work can be performed. For example, a two >meter wide cylinder or disk that is one meter high and rotating at two >rotations per day has the equivalent angular momentum as a twenty >centimeter disk that is one centimeter thick rotating at 2E6 rotations >per day or approximately 1350 rpm, constantly. The name of the device, Coriolis Effect Generator, and the fact that it works best at a latitude of 30 degrees rather than at the equator, suggests to me that it is much different than the gyrosopic device which I described. A coriolis force, although related to rotation, is a different animal. >Thanks for the input. Btw, do you happen to know the name on the patent? US Patent # 5313850, Earth/Gyro Power Transducer, Awarded to Rodger C. Finvold of San Diego CA and E. Humphrey of Lemon Grove CA, May 24 1994. Here's the abstract: This specification describes a completely new and different concept, method, mechanization, appartaus configuration, and sequenccing procedure for obtaining commercially useful energy and power, namely: the use of a gyroscope to generate output power from the earth's stored inertial rotational (flywheel) energy by fixing the housing of the gyroscope to the earth and using the rotation of the earth relative to the gyroscope's spatially stable rotor/gimbal assembly to rotate the inpurt shaft stroke over a near 180 degree precession excursion (near pole-to-pole alignment) until the rotor spin axis of the gyroscope is nearly aligned with the polar axis of the earth. Re-precession torques are then created on the inner gimbal within the gyroscope to re-orient the rotor spin by somewhat more than 180 degrees to the near polar alignment direction required for the resumption of power output in a manner requiring essentially zero energy and power to provide relatively continuous, but intermittent power output generation, along with a multi-unit assembly for producing continuous uninterupted power output. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 09:09:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA20659 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 09:08:14 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA20631 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 09:08:08 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tC8Y8-001W2BC; Sun, 5 Nov 95 11:08 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Tesla CEG Device To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:08:04 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1497 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Quoting Scott Little about the Tesla CEG Device: >Lots of energy available but can we get at it. I have done the calcs >for a flywheel CEG device using a pretty big, dangerous wheel. With a >60 inch dia 6 inch thick steel wheel weighing about 5000 lbs spinning >about 5000 rpm (stress at 1/2 yield strength), you could extract >0.5 milliwatts from the earth's rotational energy by loading the >wheel so it appeared to precess at 0.5 revs/day instead of the 1 >rev/day that it would go at if not loaded. Perhaps needless to say, >the bearing losses for such a wheel would greatly exceed that feeble >power. Hi Scott. I don't know how the CEG thing is supposed to work, and can't react to your numbers. You're probably right, and assuming that you are, it means the device is basically useless. But then it's odd that the Navy would ever bother to confiscate it, assign the code name Turtle Island, and classify the information at such a high level. Also, Lockheed has some sharp guys that can do the math -- so it's also odd that they would ever bother to build a model of the thing. Maybe you think that these are just rumors? Have you looked at gyroscope devices for tapping the earth's power -- such as patent #5313850? There were some calculations done on the internet a few months ago, indicating that the useful power output of the gyroscope device is many magnitudes more than what you have calculated for the CEG device. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 11:56:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA29876 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:56:00 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA29862; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:55:57 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id LAA26832; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:55:56 -0800 Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:55:55 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: alex cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: bag that puppie! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sun, 5 Nov 1995, alex wrote: > //> > //> I----------------------> positive > //> Look at the Figure here: ______I_______ > //> /I I I I\ > //> / I I I I \ > //> / I I I I \ > //> / I I I I \ > //> / I I opened I I \ > //> /dielectricI I cylinder I Idielectric\ > //> /____________I I I I____________\ > //> ______________ ______________ > //> ring ring I-----------> > //> negative > //> > // > //The skeptical arguement is that the above device works entirely by > //ion wind. > > Just not! Device above have not ion wind at all. Electric field is > asymmetrical inside of device. It is main idea. I have not possibility to > explane it once more. > Best Regards, > > Alexander V. Frolov > P.S. Soon I'll close email address alex@frolov.spb.su. Write by post if you > are interested in contact with me. > > Alexander V. Frolov email: alex@frolov.spb.su > P. O. Box 37, St.-Petersburg, 193024, Russia > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Sorry Alex, I wasn't entirely clear. We've been recently discussing on freenrg-list the possibility of performing the TT Brown experiments in a vacuum chamber to remove all doubt that the effect is caused by generated gravity forces and not by ion wind. If we don't prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that ion wind plays no part, then many people will suspect that we are deluding ourselves. And we ourselves will never be entirely sure. The purpose of my message was to point out that a vacuum chamber is not necessary. If the device produces thrust while incased in a plastic bag, then this is proof that ion wind plays little or no part. Have you verified that the ion wind contribution to total thrust is zero? If so, what method did you use? If there is any exposed metal in the device, there will be a chance of ion wind thrust arising, if even from dust on a charged metal surface. If the total thrust is measured while the device is in the bag (or in the vacuum chamber), and then the total thrust is measured with the device in free air, then the difference between measurements gives a rough indication of the percentage of force contributed by electrogravity and by ion wind. Do you know if this experiment has been done recently? If so, how close to zero was the ion wind contribution? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 11:59:28 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA00743 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:59:26 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA00728; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:59:22 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id LAA27098; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:59:19 -0800 Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:59:19 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com cc: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sun, 5 Nov 1995, alex wrote: > P.S. Soon I'll close email address alex@frolov.spb.su. Write by post if you > are interested in contact with me. > > Alexander V. Frolov email: alex@frolov.spb.su > P. O. Box 37, St.-Petersburg, 193024, Russia > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Sorry to hear that you will be unable to participate in this forum. Is there any way that we can help you retain internet connection? There are other users on Vortex-L and Freenrg-L in Russia who may be able to give advice if you need it. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 16:03:05 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA04887 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 16:03:03 -0800 Received: from mail.annex.com (youjaes@mail.annex.com [204.74.67.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA04865 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 16:02:57 -0800 Received: (from youjaes@localhost) by mail.annex.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA05137; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 16:02:50 -0800 Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 16:02:50 -0800 (PST) From: James Youlton To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Wed, 1 Nov 1995, Robert Stirniman wrote: > Angular Mometum and the Barnett Effect (astronmers see last parag) > [snip] > > Maybe I've missed it, but I've looked seriously, and there seems > to be no information in undergraduate or graduate level physics > reference books which mentions the relationship between > macroscopic and microscopic angular momentum -- much less > provides any analysis or explanation linking quantum angular > momentum to macroscopic angular momentum. Why not? You're catching on. The subject of compound angular momentum, or internal and external angular momentum, or intrinsic and extrinsic angular momentum was been a repressed subject for about 2 and half decades. Add to that list, spherical pendulums, Coriolis effect, except as applied to balistics and meteorology as used by the US military, and Shafer's pendulum, that neat little device used as the artifical horizon of aircraft. > How does quantum angular momentum become organized from a > microscopic to a macroscopic level? Has anyone ever published > any work about this? I can't find any. There isn't any that I know of, though back in the late fifties, there was a fellow named Edward Condon at the University of Colorado who was fairly proficient on the subject. So much so that he wrote the rotational dynamics section, called noninertial dynamics at the time, of the reference "The Handbook of Physics" which he also co-edited (Chapter 5). I don't recall offhand who the publisher was (Harcourt/Brace?), though it was endorsed by the American Institute of Physics. Later, when Mr Condon was the head of the USAF project 'Blue Book', he labored to supress his own work when the directive was handed down from the Turtle Island project. Fortunately, I made a photocopy of what I thought was the most pertinate section of Mr. Condon's Handbook the last time I laid hands on a copy as I currently know of only three in my area, so if you'd like, I can type it up into a post, or I can send you a copy of a copy if you send me a SASE (self addressed stamped envelope) and I'll cover the copy cost since it is only a few pages. Please send me private e-mail for my mailing address if you are interested. J Youlton From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 17:39:36 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA01137 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 17:39:34 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA01125 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 17:39:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199511060139.RAA01125@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 18:50:11 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: The Hendershot Book Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >Do you have Mark's book-order address? The book is available elsewhere, >but he says that the other mailorder companies put a 100% markup on the >price. (Note to all: he says that there are some serious errors in the >Hendershot Generator plans which are currently being sold elsewhere by >mailorder, and these errors don't appear in the plans in his book.) > >If he gives permission, we should scan in some photos from the book and >start a little web page for him, even before he gets online. > I'm planning to do that real soon. The book is available here, for $44.95. But I'll sell it to anyone on this list for $35.00. It has 42 pages, 19 of which are illustrations. It straightens out an error in plans that were being sold by Ed Skilling, which a lot of people used to build units, having to do with the number of turns on the basket weave coils. Gary Hawkins Horizon Technology 2442 NW Market St #274 Seattle, WA 98107 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 5 20:35:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA12634 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 20:35:32 -0800 Received: from matrix.eden.com (root@matrix.eden.com [199.171.21.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA12621 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 20:35:30 -0800 Received: from net-2-126.austin.eden.com (net-2-126.austin.eden.com [204.177.170.126]) by matrix.eden.com (8.6.12/8.6.12.1) with SMTP id WAA08595; Sun, 5 Nov 1995 22:35:27 -0600 Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 22:35:27 -0600 Message-Id: <199511060435.WAA08595@matrix.eden.com> X-Sender: little@eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com, freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: Tesla CEG Device calcs X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Robert I don't know whether the Navy or Lockheed had something going or not... Here's what I did: First I assumed that a flywheel (i.e. gyroscope) would offer the highest angular momentum to "work with". I did the calculations for a 6" thick 62" diameter steel disc spinning at around 5000 rpm. The wheel would weigh about 5000 pounds and would have 75000 psi stress at the center when spinning at that speed. If made out of 4340 high-strength low-alloy steel and properly heat-treated it could have a yield strength of 150000 psi...thus a safety factor of two...not great but tolerable with appropriate precautions. Now, obviously if you let this wheel's axle precess without loading it, it would do ZERO work. Also, if you locked the axle down, the earth's rotation would just exert a torque on the axle but, since there's no movement, there would also be ZERO work. However, if you loaded things so the axle rotated at 1/2 revolution per day, the maximum available work would be extracted from the thing. For a spinning object, the precession torque is given approximately by: T = JwW where T is the torque required to rotate the axle about an axis perpendicular to the objects axis of rotation; W is the angular velocity of the rotation caused by T; w is the angular velocity of the spinning object; and J is the rotational inertia of the object (for a disk it's 1/2*M*r^2). When you compute this torque for the wheel I describe you get something like 10 ft-pounds at W = 1/2 rev/day. WHen you multiply that torque by that W to get power, you get 0.5 milliwatt. Dismal ain't it. Check it yourself...maybe I made a big mistake. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 6 02:18:45 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA13891 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 02:18:43 -0800 Received: from acad.suffolk.edu (acad.suffolk.edu [192.80.92.251]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA13883 for ; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 02:18:40 -0800 From: lee02016@acad.suffolk.edu Received: by acad.suffolk.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA49139; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 05:18:26 -0500 Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 05:12:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > decades. Add to that list, spherical pendulums, Coriolis effect, except > as applied to balistics and meteorology as used by the US military, > and Shafer's pendulum, that neat little device used as the artifical > horizon of aircraft. > Please, please tell us more about these. I for one would love to hear more. I bought a gyroscope from the science museum to play with. It wasn't a very good one however. Does anyone know where to get a good one. Let's try some of these experiments. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 04:29:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA02804 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:38 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA02766 for ; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:29 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id IAA17820; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:25 -0800 Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:24 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Patent? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 6 Nov 95 12:38:50 +0300 From: alex To: billb@eskimo.com Hello, Are you know patent number for Hendershot's generator? Please, send mail directly. I'll send for you list for free energy and gravity patents I saw in Debver Report'94 and in other Newsletters also. Best regards, Alexander --- Alexander V. Frolov email: alex@frolov.spb.su P. O. Box 37, St.-Petersburg, 193024, Russia """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 04:29:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA02866 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:57 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA02850 for ; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:50 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id IAA17850; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:49 -0800 Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:03:48 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: gravitonics Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 6 Nov 95 12:26:45 +0300 From: alex To: billb@eskimo.com Hello, I wrote already about Poliakov's book "Experimental Gravitonics". He wrote it in 1991 and published in Russian. Now he have English version as MSDOS text on diskett. If you wish help for Dr.Poliakov, write for him and buy book in Russian or copy of text in English. He don't speak in English. I am his partner in deal regards publication of book in English. You can have agreement with me about purshase. ........................................................................... "Experimental Gravitonics" Spartak M. Poliakov, Oleg S. Poliakov Russia 141120 Moscow area, Friazino, 60-let SSSR str., 1 - 167. In search fro new ways of solving the problem of high-power laboratory sources of gravitational radiation Chapter 1 New notions of things forgotten long ago @1 Is the "light barrier" penetrable? p.7 @2 Energy relations and the mechanism of "C-barrier" penetration. p.10 Chapter 2 Microstructural models of the photon and electron @1 What do we know about the photon, an electromagnetic-radiation quantum? p.21 @2 Uniquanta parameters p.23 1. Uniquanta spin ( postulated ) p.23 a. Linear polarization Fig.8a p.25 b. Circularly polarized nonrotating photon Fig.8b. p.26 c. Circularly polarized rotating photon. P.26 2. Magnetic moment of a uniquantum (postulated) p.27 3. Uniquantum gravitational mass ( postulated ) p.27 4. Equivalent charge and radius of a uniquantum. p.27 5. Tangential velocity of uniquantum rotation p.29 6. Uniquantum magnetic field p.30 7. Gravitational constant of the uniquantum p.30 8. Gravitational field of the uniquantum p.31 @3 Photon model p.32 @4 Phenomenological microstructural model of the electron p.35 @5 Derivation of approximate gravitational equations of practical interest p.45 part 2 Experimental verification of new gravitational equations p.55 Chapter 1 Experimental verification of mechanical gravitational equations @1 Problems pertaining to the velocity of gravitational-radiation propagation p.56 @2 Principles of determining the propagation velocity of the unknow radiation from the measured momentum of recoil. p.59 @3 Description of the experimental set-up p.64 @4 Gyroscopic multipole "Buket" (Bouget) p.68 @5 Investigation of the effects of dummy shock rotation p.77 @6 The effect of shock braking of the rotating gyroscope p.79 @7 Quadrupole generator of directional gravitational radiation "Yoilka" (Fir) p.80 1. Swing of dummies p.82 2. Swing of gyroscopes p.83 3. Precession of dummies p.84 4. Precession of gyroscopes p.85 @8 Experimental results for the quadrupole generator p.86 @9 Mathematical model of the quadrypole generator p.89 @10 Questions of practical application of the results p.107 Chapter 2 Experimental verification of the natural relation between magnetism and gravitation, corollaries from the microstructural model of electron p.111 @1 Gravitational interpretation of magnetostriction p.114 Experimental results p.117 @2 Magnetostrictive curvature of optical beam p.118 Choice of the material for magnetogravioptical investigations p.121 Magnetic-gap parameters p.123 Experimental methods p.123 @3 Gravioptical effects in GRT p.126 @4 Gravitational frequency shift of optical relation in a nonhomogeneously - magnetized ferromagnetic material p.128 @5 Quadratic gravioptical effect p.130 @6 Some fantastic possibilities opening for modern fundamental science p131 @7 Generator of short gravitational pulses ( by ferromagnetics ) p.134 @8 Problem of gravitational receiver p.137 Conclusion p.139 ................................... For proposal to publish "Experimental Gravitonics" in English contact with Alexander V. Frolov: Russia, 193024, St.-Petersburg, P.O.Box 37. --- Alexander V. Frolov email: alex@frolov.spb.su P. O. Box 37, St.-Petersburg, 193024, Russia """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 04:29:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA10121 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:44:02 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA10100 for ; Mon, 6 Nov 1995 08:43:56 -0800 Message-Id: <199511061643.IAA10100@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 06 Nov 1995 10:01:59 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Angular Momentum and the Barnett Effect Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 05:12 AM 11/6/95 -0500, you wrote: > >>... gyroscope from the science museum to play with. It wasn't a >very good one however. Does anyone know where to get a good one. Let's >try some of these experiments. > > > > > I've seen them at auctions on the Force Lewis Air Force Base south of Tacoma. I would suppose that other bases also have auctions. Gary From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 00:44:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA22581 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 00:43:41 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA22559 for ; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 00:43:36 -0800 Message-Id: <199511070843.AAA22559@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 02:09:40 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: Tesla's CEG device Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 01:40 PM 10/31/95 -0600, you wrote: >to let loose of some of this stuff. But this particular technology >may be rightly considered to be dangerous, because it's use would >result in slowing down the earth's rotation. There's far too little time in a day. LET'S DO IT! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 01:41:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA04673 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 08:45:25 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA04622; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 08:45:17 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id IAA21543; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 08:45:12 -0800 Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 08:45:09 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com, freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com, taoshum-l@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Wanna start your own listserv? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: For those who don't know yet, it is possible to start your own listserve discussion group for $5/month through the eskimo.com service here in Seattle. The ability to telnet to a distant account is required (unless you happen to live in Seattle!) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 01:44:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17524 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:49:36 -0800 Received: from ix2.ix.netcom.com (ix2.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA17424 for ; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:49:18 -0800 Received: from by ix2.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id KAA25861; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:48:02 -0800 Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:48:02 -0800 Message-Id: <199511071848.KAA25861@ix2.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: fnrg: Ferrite bead blocking EMF/RFI for neon transformers To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: 11/7/95 Over the past few months I have been placing ferrite beads on both the secondary leads of my neon transformers to reduce counter EMF/RFI kick back. The idea is to block HV spikes that short out the windings in the secondary while permitting easy and free conduction of the 60 Hz 15 kV . Basically, I use 15 kV neon hook up wire and apply a small 2 - 3 inch teflon sleeve over it. I then snap a ferrite device around the teflon sleeve. The ones I have are two halves in a plastic case. They fit snuggly around the teflon sleeve. I have not burned a neon since. This is purly anecdotal, as I have not been able to test the efficacy of this arrangement. I suspect counter EMF/RFI could be measured with a scope and some kind of antenna or pick up. A secondary lead without the ferrite bead could be measured. Then the bead applied and measured on both sides of the bead. My problem is that I am not sure how to design the pick up or antenna and I don't want to distroy my scope. Any suggestions? Also, anyone so interested, please test this idea and let us know. It could make our lives a little easier and cheaper. Richard Wall From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 11:05:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA23108 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 11:05:51 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA22870; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 11:05:14 -0800 Received: from localhost (harti.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA05303; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:04:35 +0100 Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:04:35 +0100 Message-Id: <199511071904.UAA05303@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net Subject: fnrg: Re: The Hendershot Book Cc: ghawk@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >> >>Do you have Mark's book-order address? The book is available elsewhere, >>but he says that the other mailorder companies put a 100% markup on the >>price. (Note to all: he says that there are some serious errors in the >>Hendershot Generator plans which are currently being sold elsewhere by >>mailorder, and these errors don't appear in the plans in his book.) >> >>If he gives permission, we should scan in some photos from the book and >>start a little web page for him, even before he gets online. >> >I'm planning to do that real soon. The book is available here, for $44.95. >But I'll sell it to anyone on this list for $35.00. It has 42 pages, 19 of >which >are illustrations. It straightens out an error in plans that were being >sold by >Ed Skilling, which a lot of people used to build units, having to do with the >number of turns on the basket weave coils. > >Gary Hawkins > >Horizon Technology >2442 NW Market St #274 >Seattle, WA 98107 I would like to buy this book for 35 US$. Can I pay via MASTERCARD ? Please let me know. email to: harti@bbtt.com > > > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 7 19:21:30 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA09275 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 19:21:27 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA09241 for ; Tue, 7 Nov 1995 19:21:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199511080321.TAA09241@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 20:32:39 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: The Hendershot Book Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >I would like to buy this book for 35 US$. >Can I pay via MASTERCARD ? > >Please let me know. > >email to: > >harti@bbtt.com > > No sir, I'm sorry, I am not able to process a card order. By the way, if you do order, it will be signed by Mark Hendershot. Thanks, Gary Hawkins >>Horizon Technology >>2442 NW Market St #274 >>Seattle, WA 98107 __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home.** -- James Madison From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 06:20:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA22698 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 06:19:37 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA22690 for ; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 06:19:35 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id JAA13302 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 09:11:33 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA815850444 Wed, 08 Nov 95 09:07:24 Date: Wed, 08 Nov 95 09:07:24 From: "reim" Encoding: 3167 Text Message-Id: <9510088158.AA815850444@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: bag that puppie! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi bert, this is from bob reim I have also been doing some experimenting with T.T. Browns work. I designed and built a 90KV power supply and am still trying to make some saucer shaped caps out of barium titinate. I originally tried to use a neon sign transformer and build a doubler and tripler. The problem is finding some high voltage diodes at a low cost. At the voltages you are working at I don't believe you will have much luck finding these or the resistors and caps that will be needed to do this. Also I have simulated the doubler and tripler circuit in spice to see how it responds. This circuit only does well if there is very little load and don't expect to get double the voltage. Your leakage value on what ever caps you use will probable not make the circuit work. Back in the 1980's the Navy sponsored a company ( I forget the name) to do research on this. Dr. Tally was assigned this project. I spoke with him a few years ago and the told me that they could not get much over 20KV due to arcing problems. They were prepared to go to 250 KV. His results were given at the last conference on T.T. Brown. I also had arcing problems when I got over 20KV. I would be interested in getting a 100KV power supply, let me know is you run across another one. Please keep me informed about you progress. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: fnrg: Re: bag that puppie! Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/8/95 7:10 AM > If the total thrust is measured while >the device is in the bag (or in the vacuum chamber), and then the total >thrust is measured with the device in free air, then the difference >between measurements gives a rough indication of the percentage of force >contributed by electrogravity and by ion wind. > >Do you know if this experiment has been done recently? If so, how close >to zero was the ion wind contribution? > > Bill, I'm soon to become the proud owner of a 100 kv X-ray transformer unit. I plan on building a diode/cap array to act as voltage doubler. My Tesla coil experience should come in very handy while working with this monster as I attempt to do some serious T.T. Brown replication work in the near future. I was reading LaViolette's "Electrogravitic Situation Update, 1994", and found references to the "Electrogravitics Systems" paper that you have on your Web Page, as well as several other interesting citations. I believe most experimenters who attempt to prove Brown's work miss the boat by using low voltage (50 kv or less) power supplies. Brown started with 50 kv and went up to at least 250 kv. Everything I see in graphs appears to show that the effect is non-linear, and doesn't really begin to really do much until way past 100 kv, then it takes off. Literally. Who else in this group is seriously putting together a setup to test Brown's non-linear capacitor results? bert From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 02:32:55 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA13625 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 02:32:53 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA13617 for ; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 02:32:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199511081032.CAA13617@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 08 Nov 1995 03:47:15 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Ferrite bead blocking EMF/RFI for neon transformers Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >My problem is that I am not sure how to design the pick up or antenna >and I don't want to distroy my scope. Any suggestions? Also, anyone >so interested, please test this idea and let us know. It could make >our lives a little easier and cheaper. > > >Richard Wall > > I could be wrong, but I think that simply a high voltage resistor might do it. A 200 megohm resistor (which I have a ton of) would give your scope 75 microamps. A couple in series would protect it better. Since all you want to do is look for spikes I think, you could, instead of piping that directly into your scope, run it from the high voltage resistors to an ordinary 1 ohm resistor to ground, and put your scope leads across the 1 ohm resistor. That way, if one of the 200 megs break down, it's going to send current through the 1 ohm resistor to ground, instead of through your scope, which is likely a very high impedance. SASE for some of those resistors. Somebody please correct me quick if the above is at all dangerous to his scope. I was going to suggest an ordinary current clamp around the high voltage output wire, well insulated of course, but they have frequency limitations, and the spikes you are looking at might not get through I suppose. Curious to know what the load is, if you can talk about it. Gary Hawkins __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home.** -- James Madison From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 04:04:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA27420 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 10:17:54 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA27394 for ; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 10:17:48 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id LAA23768 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 11:51:58 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA815860044 Wed, 08 Nov 95 11:47:24 Date: Wed, 08 Nov 95 11:47:24 From: "reim" Encoding: 699 Text Message-Id: <9510088158.AA815860044@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: fnrg: Re: TT Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The doubler that I built and others that I have seen require an AC source. Is your 100KV x-ray power supply AC or DC? I thought x-ray power supplys are DC. If it is DC or full wave bridge DC then your typical doubler circuit will not work. also how much current does this power supply put out? I gave up on my doubler circuit due to the expense of the diodes and caps and arcing problems even when the whole circuit was put in oil. I blew many caps and diodes before I decided to build a 90 KV pulsed DC supply. This supply works well and I am waiting for my caps to get completed so I can continue my research. bob reim reim@advantor.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 02:39:20 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA14594 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 02:39:19 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA14583 for ; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 02:39:14 -0800 Message-Id: <199511081039.CAA14583@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 08 Nov 1995 03:53:43 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: bag that puppie! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 05:59 PM 1/1/91 -0500, you wrote: >> If the total thrust is measured while >>the device is in the bag (or in the vacuum chamber), and then the total >>thrust is measured with the device in free air, then the difference >>between measurements gives a rough indication of the percentage of force >>contributed by electrogravity and by ion wind. >> >>Do you know if this experiment has been done recently? If so, how close >>to zero was the ion wind contribution? >> >> >Bill, I'm soon to become the proud owner of a 100 kv X-ray transformer unit. >I plan on building a diode/cap array to act as voltage doubler. My Tesla >coil experience should come in very handy while working with this monster as >I attempt to do some serious T.T. Brown replication work in the near future. >I was reading LaViolette's "Electrogravitic Situation Update, 1994", and >found references to the "Electrogravitics Systems" paper that you have on >your Web Page, as well as several other interesting citations. I believe >most experimenters who attempt to prove Brown's work miss the boat by using >low voltage (50 kv or less) power supplies. Brown started with 50 kv and >went up to at least 250 kv. Everything I see in graphs appears to show that >the effect is non-linear, and doesn't really begin to really do much until >way past 100 kv, then it takes off. Literally. Who else in this group is >seriously putting together a setup to test Brown's non-linear capacitor >results? > >bert > > > If you need layouts for various doublers, the Varo Semiconductor catalog might still have them in the back. Or I could send a copy. Just add another stage for a tripler. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home.** -- James Madison From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 04:15:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA20706 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 15:55:33 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA20664 for ; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 15:55:26 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tDKKw-001VyLC; Wed, 8 Nov 95 17:55 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: fnrg: Neon XFMRs for Biefeld-Brown Experiments To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 17:55:21 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <199511081627.KAA11024@fastlane.net> from "Bert Pool" at Jan 2, 91 10:29:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1847 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Use of Neon Transformer for Biefeld-Brown Experiments Neon transformers have high voltage outputs, and offer the advantages of ready availability and relatively low cost. This type of transformer may or may not be suitable for testing the Biefeld-Brown effect. A neon transformer is fundamentally different than a conventional transformer. A neon tube is a non-linear device, which offers high impedance up to the point of gas breakdown, and then switches rapidly to a low impedance once the neon gas begins to ionize. This happens twice each cyle +/- of the 60 Hz power source. The magnetic core of a neon transformer contains a separate flux path which has an airgap -- called a shunt -- which provides current limiting during the time of the cycle when the neon tube is ionized. The equivalent circuit can be viewed as a relatively large value of inductance in series with a conventional transformer. However, this inductance is not linear, and varies with output voltage and current. I don't know if this "series inductance" is good, bad, or indifferent as far as use in Biefeld-Brown experiments. Due to non-linearities, neon transformers are prone to spurious resonances and chaotic behavior -- often exhibited as peak overvoltages and transformer burnout. If you try to use neon transformers from beer signs, you will be inevitably frustrated by burn-out. These transformers are the cheapest of the cheap -- and are essentially a throw away item. Hence, they are readily available and low in cost. Ferrite beads and output chokes might very well prevent or limit the peak value of the voltage in spurious resonances, and could avoid transformer burn out. But what about the experiment itself? What does added inductance do for the Biefeld-Brown effect? My guess is -- it's not good. Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 8 18:03:52 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA06058 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 18:03:48 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA06030; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 18:03:43 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA22767; Wed, 8 Nov 1995 18:03:39 -0800 Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 18:03:38 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: Hans Schoonekamp cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >On Wed, 8 Nov 1995, hans schoonekamp wrote: > >On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, hans schoonekamp wrote: > > > >> --- comments --- > >> comment on Tom Kennedy,s capacitor warp drive (8-12-1991). I did have > >> called Tom but Tom senior replied that his son had an accident.End of > >> story? Tom senior didnt know much about the invention. > > > >Hi Hans! I'm glad to hear you managed to contact someone. Did he die in > >the accident? > > Yes ,I guess so ,his father did sound serious about that. I have the > 13 page invention from Chris Sianis, NE. > PS I actually build it,no working result so far. You built it?!! Sorry to hear about the lack of results. What range of voltage have you applied to it? How are you testing for thrust? If you would like to discuss this with other interested parites, please feel free to subscribe to the freenrg-list discussion group. Our usual topics are free-energy, gravity, physics anomalies, etc. Past discussion can be found on the FREENRG-LIST web page (see the link at the top of Weird Science.) To subscribe, send this one-line message to majordomo@eskimo.com subscribe freenrg-list pulse8@digiface.nl To send email to the group, send it to freenrg-list@eskimo.com (or simply reply to messages from the group.) To unsubscribe, send this one-line message to majordomo@eskimo.com unsubscribe freenrg-list Message traffic is low, a few messages per day at maximum. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 06:15:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA00686 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 06:15:41 -0800 Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA00657 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 06:15:36 -0800 Received: by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA23009; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 08:15:44 -0600 Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 08:08:55 -600 (CST) From: Mark Mansfield Subject: fnrg: Left and Right hand wound coils. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I've been asked about right and left hand wound coils and how it effects certain processes. I have not noticed nor can find any difference in a "scalar" sense. I can readily see where one would need to know which way to wind them when interaction is needed with other coils, but even this would depend on which way current was flowing through the coils. Correct phasing would depend on the direction of current flow as well. So I guess my real question is, has anyone any information why you need to wind a standard coil in a left or right handed direction? The left hand rule applies to all coils regardless of the direction in which it is physically wound. Anyone have any ideas? Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:32:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA14334 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:44:55 -0800 Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA14292 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:44:49 -0800 Received: by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA69401; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:44:55 -0600 Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:41:19 -600 (CST) From: Mark Mansfield Subject: Re: fnrg: Left and Right hand wound coils. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <199511091550.HAA22170@ix11.ix.netcom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, dennis lee wrote: > Hi Mark; > > I believe Patrick Flannigan did work on left and right handed mobius > coils. Basically, left handed mobius coils make you feel better. Right > handed mobius coils make you sick. Hence L-Tryptophan etc. > > Dennis > I have heard of this Dennis, but I have wound many coils for different uses and have not had any different results with a oppsite wound coil. Things I'm refering to are bifilar, two coils in opposion, etc. When winding toroids, I have never been able to say that one does something different just because of the direction it is wound. I would like for some comformation on this if anyone else has experimented with these. Thanks, Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 07:53:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA03290 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 07:53:17 -0800 Received: from ix11.ix.netcom.com (ix11.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.11]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA03251 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 07:53:13 -0800 Received: from by ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id HAA22170; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 07:50:25 -0800 Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 07:50:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199511091550.HAA22170@ix11.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Left and Right hand wound coils. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Mark; I believe Patrick Flannigan did work on left and right handed mobius coils. Basically, left handed mobius coils make you feel better. Right handed mobius coils make you sick. Hence L-Tryptophan etc. Dennis You wrote: > >I've been asked about right and left hand wound coils and how it effects >certain processes. I have not noticed nor can find any difference in a >"scalar" sense. I can readily see where one would need to know which way >to wind them when interaction is needed with other coils, but even this >would depend on which way current was flowing through the coils. Correct >phasing would depend on the direction of current flow as well. So I guess >my real question is, has anyone any information why you need to wind a >standard coil in a left or right handed direction? The left hand rule >applies to all coils regardless of the direction in which it is physically >wound. > >Anyone have any ideas? > >Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:35:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA27188 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:03:55 -0800 Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA27180 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:03:53 -0800 Received: from dal35.fastlane.net (dal35.fastlane.net [204.251.16.135]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA27348 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:02:41 -0600 Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:02:41 -0600 Message-Id: <199511091802.MAA27348@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: TT Brown X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > > > > >The doubler that I built and others that I have seen require an AC source. Is >your 100KV x-ray power supply AC or DC? I thought x-ray power supplys are DC. >If it is DC or full wave bridge DC then your typical doubler circuit will not >work. also how much current does this power supply put out? I gave up on my >doubler circuit due to the expense of the diodes and caps and arcing problems >even when the whole circuit was put in oil. I blew many caps and diodes before >I decided to build a 90 KV pulsed DC supply. This supply works well and I am >waiting for my caps to get completed so I can continue my research. > >bob reim reim@advantor.com > > > > > To Bob: I have not brought the 100 kv supply home yet - got to get two or three strong brutes to help me load it! The transformer is in an oil filled case, and I suspect some sort of diode resides inside. The transformer case and control cabinet are painted this horrible orange color, and the design looks to be 1930's. Buck Rodgers would have loved it! Being that old, the rectifier would HAVE to be a vacuum tube, yes? They had selenium rectifiers, but surely not one that could handle 100 kv?! I'll post more on this when I get it home. I'm building a solid state Tesla coil in exchange for this thing, so I expect I'm making a pretty good deal. What kind of caps were you using that you blew up? What diodes? Bert From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 10:37:03 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA10899 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:37:00 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA10813 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:36:48 -0800 Message-Id: <199511091836.KAA10813@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 12:06:04 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: bag that puppie! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 11:07 AM 1/2/91 -0500, you wrote: > >Thanks for the suggestion. Bill Beaty, I believe, sent me an excellent >article on cascaded voltage multipliers, which shows layout. When you get >into hundreds of kv, layout and insulation become extremely important! > >Bert > > > A simple way to insulate everything is to drop it all in a pan of motor oil. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:33:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA12296 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:40:31 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12261 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:40:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199511091840.KAA12261@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 12:09:42 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: bag that puppie! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >lab at one of the Texas universities some time back. He also got 60 of the >biggest capacitors I've ever seen. Lord only knows what those diodes are >worth! Anyway, I'm thinking about building high voltage mercury vapor >rectifier tubes. Ron Kovac has done some work in the area of high voltage >rectification, so I may try to tap his experiences in this area. > >Bert > > > > You covered the oil thing I see. Here is Seattle, there is a company that replaces x-ray equipment with new stuff. They have to pay for getting rid of the old transformers, etc, and are a great source of high voltage equipment. They also wind up with high voltage diodes. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:38:00 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA14794 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:46:05 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA14743 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:45:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199511091845.KAA14743@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 12:15:17 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A > >I am seeking information on a vortex gun that was being developed >just prior to WW-II by a Dr. Philips at Westinghouse in Pittsburgh. >He built hand-held models and gave nation-wide demonstrations >shooting out candles. Under an army contract, he was reported to >be building large versions. Before the work disappeared in war-time >secrecy, the largest gun was said to have knocked down a brick wall >at a large distance. He originally was interested in peaceful uses >including shooting closed vortices of polluted air high into the >atmosphere. > >The archivist at Westinghouse Pittsburgh can find no information >on Dr. Philips' work. If anyone has come across anything about his >experiments, please let me know, or post it here. > >Lou Puls >lpuls@nyx.cs.du.edu > > > > Very interesting. Probably the smoke ring type thing, which is startlingly efficient at moving through the air, retaining its form, and travelling in a straight line. It's a toroid rotating in on itself, like Stan Deyo talks about as far as early versions of flying saucer technology he worked on with groups in this country, like Stan Tenan talks about with his theories on--well, you'd just have to hear them, and like, I would postulate, out on a limb here, is quite possibly the form of an electron. For those of you who would like to take a look at what I think could be close to what an electron looks like: http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/electron.gif This is an image I found in an ad and scanned, the cover of a book. I'd like to contact the author of the book, in case anyone can help there, and ask permission to use the graphic. For now it is just for those of you on this list. Bill Beaty has a lot of experience with the subject. I trust he will chime in. Btw, on the 4th of July, we set off a massive M-80 of some kind, and because of how it landed on the ground, it sent up a toroidal ring into the air I swear at least 100 feet before finally dissipating. Gary Hawkins __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:34:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA19845 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:58:09 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA19752 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 10:57:56 -0800 Message-Id: <199511091857.KAA19752@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 12:27:21 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: TT Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 11:47 AM 11/8/95, you wrote: > > > > >The doubler that I built and others that I have seen require an AC source. Is >your 100KV x-ray power supply AC or DC? I thought x-ray power supplys are DC. >If it is DC or full wave bridge DC then your typical doubler circuit will not >work. also how much current does this power supply put out? I gave up on my >doubler circuit due to the expense of the diodes and caps and arcing problems >even when the whole circuit was put in oil. I blew many caps and diodes before >I decided to build a 90 KV pulsed DC supply. This supply works well and I am >waiting for my caps to get completed so I can continue my research. > >bob reim reim@advantor.com > > > > > > Remember, if there is an arc across the load, and you have no high voltage resistors in front of it, it will send a current pulse through precious high voltage diodes that will kill them. You'll need some resistors in a range that will protect the diodes if you have any chance at all of arcing. If the x-ray transformer is set up for DC, the diodes inside can be bypassed, taken out, and used in the multiplyer stages externally. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:38:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA11398 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:55:44 -0800 Received: from picard.msoe.edu (picard.msoe.edu [155.92.10.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA11354 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 12:55:38 -0800 Received: from warp.msoe.edu by obrien.msoe.edu (MX V4.1 AXP) with SMTP; Thu, 09 Nov 1995 14:55:32 EST Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 9 Nov 95 14:55:05 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 9 Nov 95 14:54:39 GMT+6 From: "Bane" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 14:54:37 CST6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: fnrg: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-ID: <884A1B43CD@warp.msoe.edu> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A > Yes ,I guess so ,his father did sound serious about that. I have the > 13 page invention from Chris Sianis, NE. > PS I actually build it,no working result so far. hey could i get a text copy of that paper? so far i have constructed about eight layers of the capacitor. also i think there has to be actual current flow through the capacitor fo rit to emit any force. i think tha tthe eq: F=(k*Q1*Q2)/r^2 in my DC Circut Analisis class we are studing capacitors. The eqasion states that the Force is equal to k(a value of a charged electron?) times the charge of object 1 in Coulums and the charge of object 2 all divided by the distance of the two objects squared. now i have no proof that this is the case, it jsut looked like it make sence. I was always under the impression that electrons only caused force when they were in action. PLEASE SOME ONE CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG. you will save me hours of botched up calculations. thanks ian geiser geiseri@warp.msoe.edu ian gieser . /_\ If only time could tell it would be a very quiet world... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 04:07:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA08481 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 04:05:13 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA08472 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 04:05:10 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA24156 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 06:05:04 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id GAA00725; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 06:05:04 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) Newsgroups: list.freenrg To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Measuring High Voltage Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 21:47:30 -0500 Message-ID: Lines: 24 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Heres some thing that some one might want to look into, seeing how several of you are talking about high voltage supplies. I'm going from memory here, so I might not have this %100 right, but I hope it gives you a starting point. There is a sever inaccuracies the conventional wisdom that fiber optic cable is immune from "interface" (EMI/RFI ect)... Among other things there are three effects, Kerr, Brag, and Faraday, that can be exploited to measure high voltage potentials. In theory, at lease as I don't know how to build the hardware (yet), you take some fiber optic cable and wrap it around the conductor that you want to measure. Coil it like you are making a inductor. Place a known light source of a stable phase as a source, at the destination end of the cable you measure the difference in phase of the light angle. The angle of the light changes with the voltage potential. Sort of like a electron gun in a CRT. A big advantage of this system is your measuring instrument is totally isolated from what your measuring by the virtue of the fact that the fiber optic cable is not conducting (with in limits, any thing will conduct at some point), so you can measure with total isolation. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 9 23:35:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA15198 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:35:07 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA15172 for ; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:35:03 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA09477; Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:35:02 -0800 Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:35:01 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, Hans Schoonekamp wrote: > I have build the"correktive" version (the plates in series with an input > and output plate at top and bottom.Perhaps I should try the original version > ,a lot of manual labour!I have a 40kV elektronic ignition coil(should be > enough?) > Tom kennedy double-checked with a man named Gerry Vassilator , I have > address and phone nr. Want it? Sure! The name sounds familiar. Isn't he an electrogravity experimenter? NOTE: all of the below is speculation, since the device may not work in the way I imagine. But this does suggest some other possible tests. If the gravity thrust effect is real and increases with voltage, then the series version you describe will be extremely weak. If it has 1000 layers (for example,) the 40KV will appear as 40 volts per layer. If you instead wire it as the original, there will be 40KV/layer, 1000 times higher! (If the wax paper doesn't arc throught.) However, the e-field vector will be directed alternately in adjacent layers and I would suspect that any effects would then cancel, so the 'series' version makes more sense. After all, what determines from which end of the device any possible thrusting is directed? If the device is symmetrical, would it not experience compression but no linear force? Your 'series' version: (-) ------------------------------------------ =================================== ------------------------------- =================================== FOIL: ------ ------------------------------- WAX PAPER: ==== =================================== ------------------------------- =================================== ------------------------------- =================================== ------------------------------------------(+) Original version from Tom Kennedy: (-) ------------------------------------------ =================================== ------------------------------------------(+) =================================== (-) ------------------------------------------ =================================== ------------------------------------------(+) =================================== (-) ------------------------------------------ =================================== ------------------------------------------(+) If T.T. Brown is right, and capacitors create gravity forces, then a standard stacked-plate capacitor would NOT exhibit these effects, because this type of capacitor is really a stack of separate capacitors with the +- and -+ facing opposite in alternate layers. Alternate layers would thrust in opposite directions. And if the capacitor were connected in series, with voltage applied to the ends and intermediate plates left unconnected, then the intermediate plates really have no function and can be removed. The result is simply a pair of plates with a thick dielectric, such as the usual TT Brown devices, and extremely high supply voltage would be necesary (well over 100kv.) The extra layers of foil or of wax paper do not amplify the effect unless the voltage is raised as more layers are added. However, here's an idea: if a stack of individual +- capacitor layers is constructed but with *space between each capacitor layer*, then the thrust contribution from each pair of layers might be additive even if the supply voltage is kept low. Space between plates within one capacitor layer would be small, space between pairs of capacitors would be large, space would be adjusted by adding layers of dielectric film. The capacitor would look like this: (-) --------------------------------------- =================================== <-- one capacitor. ------------------------------------------(+) =================================== =================================== <-- space between. =================================== (-) --------------------------------------- =================================== <-- one capacitor. ------------------------------------------(+) =================================== =================================== <-- space between. =================================== (-) --------------------------------------- =================================== <-- one capacitor. ------------------------------------------(+) I admit I don't understand the need for segmented foil rings for each layer or the need for a central hole. Perhaps the original inventor achieved the necessary asymmetry in this way by accident, and did not realise that there were simpler ways. The capacitor diagram immediately above might not need the segments or the hole, since it achives asymmetry differently. So, an efficient T.T.Brown thruster might involve thin disks of BaTi with foil layers, with a space between each disk, so that each foil/disk/foil layer contributes thrust in the same direction and the foil/air/foil layers do not. Then, rather than applying 300KV across a 20cm block of BaTi, the same effect could be had from a 1000-layer device running at below 1kv. And if BaTi produces much higher thrust than other dielec- trics, the stack could be: +foil, BaTi, -foil, plastic, +foil, BaTi, -foil, plastic, etc. If inexpensive materials still produce the effect, then a stacked-plate capacitor might be possible if made like this: +foil, paper, -foil, plastic, +foil, paper, etc. And put it in a bucket of oil, and STILL run it at 100KV. Electric rocket indeed! ------------------------------- Is your 40Kv power supply an AC induction coil, or does it have high-volt recitifer on the output? If AC, then the voltage will drop to a much lower value than 40KV when the capacitor device is connected. Also, if it is AC the thrust vector might alternate back and forth and the average thrust would be zero. So, if the device is based upon asymmetrical e-field forces, then a DC power supply might be required. Try a DC supply if you haven't already done so? Tom Kennedy mentioned that the device was patented. Any idea of the patent number? I looked for it years ago, but didn't have time to do a thorough search. By the way Hans, welcome to freenrg-list! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 06:12:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA10535 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 11:30:41 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA10417 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 11:30:23 -0800 Message-Id: <199511101930.LAA10417@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 12:46:44 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Measuring High Voltage Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 09:47 PM 11/9/95 -0500, you wrote: > > A big advantage of this system is your measuring instrument is >totally isolated from what your measuring by the virtue of the fact >that the fiber optic cable is not conducting (with in limits, any thing >will conduct at some point), so you can measure with total isolation. > > I wish I had the equipment to wrap a coil of fiber optic cable around a plant and see if it has any effect on growth, by using a control nearby. Just one of those loose thoughts that got jostled free. Electrons moving in a wire make magnetism, photons moving make ???. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 07:23:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA13815 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 14:09:10 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA13707 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 14:08:56 -0800 Received: from localhost (harti.bbtt.com [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA23044 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 23:08:15 +0100 Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 23:08:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199511102208.XAA23044@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: fnrg: Re: FTP site address for PM_Square ! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi, in my earlier message about PM_Square I had listed a false FTP site number, cause this message was already a little bit older ! To access the FTP site at our server log into: ftp.bbtt.com in pub/harti/energy There are also 2 MPEG movies about the Methernitha Testatitka free energy machine ! Regards, Stefan. P.S.: By 1/1/96 I should have my new Free Energy WEB site running. Stay tuned ! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 07:22:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA27393 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 13:28:23 -0800 Received: from digiface.digiface.nl (digiface.digiface.nl [194.151.12.96]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA27099 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 13:27:45 -0800 Received: from modem23.digiface.nl by digiface.digiface.nl via SMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI.AUTO) for id WAA05503; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 22:25:24 GMT Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 22:25:24 GMT Message-Id: <199511102225.WAA05503@digiface.digiface.nl> X-Sender: pulse8@digiface.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: pulse8@digiface.nl (Hans Schoonekamp) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, Hans Schoonekamp wrote: > >> I have build the"correktive" version (the plates in series with an input >> and output plate at top and bottom.Perhaps I should try the original version >> ,a lot of manual labour!I have a 40kV elektronic ignition coil(should be >> enough?) >> Tom kennedy double-checked with a man named Gerry Vassilator , I have >> address and phone nr. Want it? > >Sure! The name sounds familiar. Isn't he an electrogravity >experimenter? *** Yes! Here is the info :He (in 1991) runs an information service called "MUUDO Experimental Videos" ,Delmar Ave., Staten Island, NY 10312.Phone (718)356-9373. Remember info from 1991!Check it out! Let me know. > > >Is your 40Kv power supply an AC induction coil, or does it have high-volt >recitifer on the output? If AC, then the voltage will drop to a much >lower value than 40KV when the capacitor device is connected. Also, if it >is AC the thrust vector might alternate back and forth and the average >thrust would be zero. So, if the device is based upon asymmetrical e-field >forces, then a DC power supply might be required. Try a DC supply if you >haven't already done so? >*** The 40Kv power supply is an DC induction coil (12V) ,the spark gap is replaced with two high voltage power transistors.Works smooth! >Tom Kennedy mentioned that the device was patented. Any idea of the >patent number? I looked for it years ago, but didn't have time to do a >thorough search. *** Just the T.T Brown patents:app. date,aug 15,1927. No.21,452/27 Accepted:Nov,15, 1928. No.300,311 We all know about that already?? >By the way Hans, welcome to freenrg-list! *** Oke! hans. > > >. > > pulse8@digiface.nl "Dancing Spirits Never Die" From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 06:01:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA05100 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:41:27 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA05069 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:41:21 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA15817; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:41:15 -0800 Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:41:13 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor In-Reply-To: <884A1B43CD@warp.msoe.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, Bane wrote: > hey could i get a text copy of that paper? The html version is on my Weird Science page under GRAVITY CAPACITOR or some similar title. > so far i have constructed about eight layers of the capacitor. And 2000 more to go? The drawing shows it as being about 8" thick! > also i think there has to be actual current flow through the > capacitor fo rit to emit any force. This is true of magnetism but not of e-fields, and for gravity, who knows? Electrons always have repulsion force between them, and attraction force to protons, even when not moving. If the gravity effect is real and the device conserves energy, then there would have to be a current when the capacitor moves forward under thrust, since a voltage alone does not require energy to exist. But if the capacitor generates thrust continuously without requiring current or losing its net-charge, then energy conservation is violated and the capacitor can push itself forward forever without needing a fuel source. Put a couple on the rim of a flywheel, charge 'em up, and hook it to a generator! If the T.T.Brown devices really work, then free energy is easy to attain, since a well-insulated Brown thruster should stay charged up for ages. > > i think tha tthe eq: > > F=(k*Q1*Q2)/r^2 > > in my DC Circut Analisis class we are studing capacitors. > The eqasion states that the Force is equal to k(a value of a charged > electron?) times the charge of object 1 in Coulums and the charge of > object 2 all divided by the distance of the two objects squared. > > now i have no proof that this is the case, it jsut looked like it > make sence. I was always under the impression that electrons only > caused force when they were in action. The equation is correct. It only applies to tiny charged objects with large distances between. 'k' is a fudge-factor which adjusts coulombs of charge and meters of distance to relate to newtons of force (if newtons or coulombs were defined differently, 'k' wouldn't be required). But the equation, when applied to groups of electrons and protons in a capacitor, says that the + and - plates attract each other, but the 'thrust' forces are zero. If a capacitor can generate a gravity thrust effect, then the equations it obeys aren't in normal textbooks! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 04:01:48 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA11283 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:59:03 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA11247; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:58:56 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA17567; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:58:52 -0800 Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:58:51 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com cc: lpuls@nyx.cs.du.edu Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? In-Reply-To: <199511091845.KAA14743@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, Gary Hawkins wrote: > > > > >I am seeking information on a vortex gun that was being developed > >just prior to WW-II by a Dr. Philips at Westinghouse in Pittsburgh. > >He built hand-held models and gave nation-wide demonstrations > >shooting out candles. Under an army contract, he was reported to > >be building large versions. Before the work disappeared in war-time > >secrecy, the largest gun was said to have knocked down a brick wall > >at a large distance. He originally was interested in peaceful uses > >including shooting closed vortices of polluted air high into the > >atmosphere. > > > >The archivist at Westinghouse Pittsburgh can find no information > >on Dr. Philips' work. If anyone has come across anything about his > >experiments, please let me know, or post it here. > > > >Lou Puls > >lpuls@nyx.cs.du.edu > > > > > Very interesting. Probably the smoke ring type thing, which is > startlingly efficient at moving through the air, retaining its form, > and travelling in a straight line. It's a toroid rotating in on itself, > like Stan Deyo talks about as far as early versions of flying saucer > technology he worked on with groups in this country, like Stan Tenan > talks about with his theories on--well, you'd just have to hear them, > and like, I would postulate, out on a limb here, is quite possibly the > form of an electron. > > For those of you who would like to take a look at what I think could > be close to what an electron looks like: > > http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/electron.gif > > This is an image I found in an ad and scanned, the cover > of a book. I'd like to contact the author of the book, in case anyone > can help there, and ask permission to use the graphic. For now it is > just for those of you on this list. > > Bill Beaty has a lot of experience with the subject. I trust he will chime in. There was an article on this in the magazine AMERICAN HERITAGE: INVENTION AND TECHNOLOGY. It was only about 1-page. I think it showed that vortex-gun toy, but it was from pre-WWII, with Buck-Rogers-type artwork on it. It said that the aircraft-shooting version was abandoned by the military. If you put a loudspeaker in the base of a vortex-launcher shape, you can electrically 'thump' it to produce smoke rings, etc. Repetitive vortices and some perfume in the chamber constitue an Invisible Stench-ray Projector which can stink up a distant target. > Btw, on the 4th of July, we set off a massive M-80 of some kind, and > because of how it landed on the ground, it sent up a toroidal ring into > the air I swear at least 100 feet before finally dissipating. Ever notice that a-bomb picture with the bright streak across the black mushroom cloud? Project Sedan, from the 50s? The photo captions sometimes say that the streak is the "edge of the fireball" or something. But think about it. Once an a-bomb fireball starts to rise, it changes shape, and becomes a ring-vortex! Just like dropping blue food-color into a glass of water. I wonder what becomes of the rising fireballs from atmospheric a-bomb tests? The ring-vortex effect would keep them from dissipating for quite a while. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 03:58:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA05157 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 16:18:50 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA05119 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 16:18:44 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id TAA07339 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 19:18:39 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511110018.TAA07339@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: hi To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 19:18:38 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi i'm new to this listserv. I'm intrested in wierd science, know any good pages? -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 05:56:57 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA14839 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 16:44:33 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA14794 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 16:44:26 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id TAA08177 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 19:44:19 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511110044.TAA08177@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: sound To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 19:44:18 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I've been thinking about making small objects float with sound. If you create sound waves under an object, will the higher pressure created by them give it lift? I tryed it with a large speaker, but it was to big. Has any one heard about anything like this? -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 04:11:26 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA08141 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 04:10:39 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA08116 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 04:10:34 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA18151 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 06:10:27 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id GAA19247; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 06:10:28 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) Newsgroups: list.freenrg To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: High Voltage Cap Patens Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 21:01:30 -0500 Message-ID: <6PApwUQy8cYU085yn@execpc.com> Lines: 36 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: U.S. Patent # 5,426,561 "High Energy Density And High Power Density Ultracapacitors and Supercapacitors" [NPO-18568] March 31, 1994. Refers to some other patents that some one might want to look up: 4,179,812 Rayno 4,313,084 Hosokawa et al 4,323,950 Bernard 4,327,400 Muranaka et al 4,442,473 Holtzman et al 4,480,286 Whitman et al 4,480,290 Constanti et al 4,538,208 Shedigian 4,670,814 Matsui et al 4,731,705 Velasco et al 4,734,821 Morimoto et al 4,768,130 Bernard et al 5,047,899 Bruder 5,055,975 Behrend 5,079,674 Malaspina 5,086,374 MacFarlane et al. "...4,313,084, to Hosokawa et al is directed to several embodiments of laminated capacitor structures comprising a plurality of double layer unit capacitor cells, each having a high withstand voltage..." "...4,670,814, to Matsui et al is directed to a high-voltage capacitor constructed from a plurality of circular or flatly formed capacitor elements arranged in tows. The capacitor elements are insulated with synthetic resin before or at the time of molding the insulation layer. The reference is of interest in that it discloses a high-voltage bank of capacitor elements." From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 10 18:26:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA19920 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 18:25:56 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA19901 for ; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 18:25:52 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id VAA12603 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Fri, 10 Nov 1995 21:25:40 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511110225.VAA12603@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: table To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 21:25:39 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I just thoght this would be usefull: 1A 2A 3A 4A 5A 6A 7A 8A ----- ----- 1 | H | |He | |---+---- --------------------+---| 2 |Li |Be | | B | C | N | O | F |Ne | |---+---| |---+---+---+---+---+---| 3 |Na |Mg |3B 4B 5B 6B 7B | 8B |1B 2B |Al |Si | P | S |Cl |Ar | |---+---+---------------------------------------+---+---+---+---+---+---| 4 | K |Ca |Sc |Ti | V |Cr |Mn |Fe |Co |Ni |Cu |Zn |Ga |Ge |As |Se |Br |Kr | |---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---| 5 |Rb |Sr | Y |Zr |Nb |Mo |Tc |Ru |Rh |Pd |Ag |Cd |In |Sn |Sb |Te | I |Xe | |---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---| 6 |Cs |Ba |LAN|Hf |Ta | W |Re |Os |Ir |Pt |Au |Hg |Tl |Pb |Bi |Po |At |Rn | |---+---+---+------------------------------------------------------------ 7 |Fr |Ra |ACT| ------------- ------------------------------------------------------------- Lanthanide |La |Ce |Pr |Nd |Pm |Sm |Eu |Gd |Tb |Dy |Ho |Er |Tm |Yb |Lu | |---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+---| Actinide |Ac |Th |Pa | U |Np |Pu |Am |Cm |Bk |Cf |Es |Fm |Md |No |Lr | ------------------------------------------------------------- -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 01:02:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA14478 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 01:02:25 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id BAA14469 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 01:02:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199511110902.BAA14469@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 02:25:06 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: table Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Thanks for that periodic table. For those with web access, there are several periodic tables. This one: http://www.cchem.berkeley.edu/Table/ ...has clickable elements. If you click on Ag for example, you get: Atomic number: 47 Standard atomic weight: 107.8682 Symbol: Ag Group number: 11 silver General information Standard state: solid Colour: white Discoveror: Known to ancients Date discovered: -3000 (circa) Discovered at: Meaning of name: Anglo-Saxon, Seolfor siolfur. Ag; L. argentum Radii /pm Atomic: 144.5 van der Waals: Covalent: 134 Metallic: 134 Valence shell orbital Rmax s: 153.1 p: d: 54.6 f: Ionic radii Ion Coordination number and geometry 4(tet) 4(sq pl) 6(oct,ls) 6(oct,hs) 8 Pauling M(-III) M(-II) M(-I) M(I) 126 M(II) M(III) 89 M(IV) M(V) M(VI) 57 70 56 M(VII) M(VIII) Electronegativities Pauling: 1.93 Sanderson: 1.72 Allred Rochow: 1.42 Effective nuclear charge Slater: 4.2 Clementi: 8.03 Froese-Fischer: 11.35 Bond enthalpies /KJ per mol Single bond enthalpies M-F M-Cl M-Br M-I M-M Diatomics bond enthalpies in MM and MX MM X X X 163 N O 53.7 F 354.4 P S 217.2 Cl 341.4 As Se 202.5 Br 293 Sb Te 195.8 I 234 Bi Temperatures /K melting: 1235.1 boiling: 2485 critical: 7460 Debye: 228 superconduction: m.p. hydride: b.p. hydride: m.p. fluoride: 708.15 Enthalpies /kJ per mol fusion: 11.3 vaporisation: 257.7 atomisation: 284.6 bond: 163 Ionization enthalpies /kJ per mol 1st 731 2nd 2074 3rd 3361 Isotopic abundances In the below list, the first number is the nominal mass number, the second the percentage abundance of that isotope, and the third is the accurate mass for that isotope. 107 51.84 106.905092 109 48.16 108.904757 110m 0 109.906111 111 0 110.905295 WebElements version 1.1.1 ======================================== Also, there is an excellent windows program for the periodic table. For those who would like to try it out, I have placed it at: http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ptable.zip ...for downloading there. Just address your browser to that URL, and it will prompt you to save to disk. (321K) Thanks again Andrew for the thoughtfullness. Great idea. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 23:25:17 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA00602 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 09:48:26 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA00562 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 09:48:18 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id MAA29334 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:48:10 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511111748.MAA29334@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: where To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:48:09 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Dose any one know where to find info on ways to make ion propulsion systems? Plasma will work too. -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 23:37:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA21365 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 10:54:02 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.bbtt.com [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA21312 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 10:53:52 -0800 Received: from localhost (harti.bbtt.com [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA25080; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:53:03 +0100 Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:53:03 +0100 Message-Id: <199511111853.TAA25080@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: JEDROTHWELL@delphi.com From: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: fnrg: Re: Cold Fusion News Cc: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >I do not know of any self sustaining machines yet, and I know of no >kits. Sorry. I see, well it would be interesting to try a selfpowering device... When I have more time next year I might try something like this. BTW, there is a new success by our Workshop for decentral energy research over here in Berlin, Germany. Mr. Bernhard Schaeffer nor finally can say, that he has violated the Second "Law" of Thermodynamics with his Retrogrdae condensation experiment, where he could prove, that the Russian Inventur Serogodsky is right, that 2 media gas mixtures can be used to make a machine, that just runs on a hot pole and does not need a cold pole and can convert surroundings heat back to mechanical work. Temperature range is 26 to 29 degrees Celsius and they are trying to look for media to use colder temperatures like about 0 degrees Celsius, so that you can also use it during winter time to get energy out of the surrounding air. When I have online my upcoming Free Energy WEB Server by 1/1/96 I will post more on it there. Best regards, Stefan Hartmann. http://www.bbtt.com/harti/harti.html > >- Jed > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 23:36:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA28125 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:44:49 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (root@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA28076 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:44:40 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id OAA02192 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 14:26:49 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511111926.OAA02192@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: phaser To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 14:26:48 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In Star-trek thay have Phasers. The Phasers are like lasers, but thay do not burn. Thay are more like a force beam. Dose any one know of any thing like this now? Or is it all science fiction? Andrew Cantino -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 16:20:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA08876 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:20:46 -0800 Received: from fun.direct.ca (root@fun.direct.ca [199.60.229.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA08853 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:20:42 -0800 Received: from Klaus (van-pm-1216.direct.ca [204.174.244.106]) by fun.direct.ca (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA06634 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:15:38 -0800 Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:15:38 -0800 Message-Id: <199511120015.QAA06634@fun.direct.ca> X-Authentication-Warning: fun.direct.ca: Host van-pm-1216.direct.ca claimed to be Klaus X-Sender: kbreslau@direct.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: Klaus Breslauer Subject: Re: fnrg: Are You Preapred? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 10:39 PM 11/10/95 -0700, you wrote: > > >The Problem: > > Most companies require a pre-employment drug test. > If you are seeking employment, on probation, or in > the military, you will have to take a drug test. > >Another Problem: > > Eating the wrong breakfast, or using certain over-the- > counter pain relievers will falsely identify you as > a drug user. > >The Real Problem: > > Public and private employers spend 1.2 billion > dollars each year (1992 figures) on drug tests that > are unreliable and inaccurate. Even hard working > employees that do not use drugs are at risk. > > > > The Solution: > > ================================ > > >Know the Facts. > > Know what foods and over the counter medicines are routinely > mistaken for common illegal drugs. Simply eating a poppy seed > bagel before a drug test can identify you as an opiate user. > > Know how long different illicit drugs can be detected in your > system. Marijuana can be detected for more than a month if > nothing is done to conceal its use. > > Know the different types of drug tests, especially the ones > you are likely to face. GC/MS tests are almost impossible to > beat, but are seldom used. The more common EMIT test is > much easier to fool -- if you know how. > >Be Prepared! > > Know when the test is coming. Do not use illicit drugs, or > ingest cross-reactive substances before the test. > > Clean your system of drug metabolites and cross-reactive > substances. > > Drink plenty of water and urinate as often as possible before > the test. Do NOT give them your first urine of the day! > >Use Clean 'n Clear. > > > Clean 'n Clear is a three phase system designed to Clean out > your body, so you will give Clear urine and Clear the test. > > The unique Clean 'n Clear Package includes: > > > 1. Simple step-by-step instructions > > 2. All natural blood purifiers > > 3. All natural urine flow stimulators > > 4. Coloring vitamins to put 'yellow' back in your clear urine > > 5. Information you need about drug testing > > 6. A guarantee! > > >This is not a simplistic "tea" or golden seal approach to the problem! >This amazing three phase system is guaranteed! > >And not just guaranteed ... > >We are so sure our unique three phase system will work for you >that we are including a DOUBLE YOUR MONEY BACK GUARANTEE!!! > > > Everyone has a friend who needs this information! > =================================================================== > > -------------------------------- > P R I N T and S A V E ! ! > -------------------------------- > > Be prepared. Stop worrying now! You will pass. We guarantee it!! > > Order your guaranteed Clean 'n Clear package now by > sending $19.95 along with your name and address to: > > Clean 'n Clear > 2809 East Hamilton Av #121B > Eau Claire, WI 54701 > > Most companies require pre-employment drug screens. You may only > have a few days notice of a drug test. Be Prepared. Order Now! > > =================================================================== > Sorry, Clean 'n Clear is not legal in Texas, > and will NOT be mailed to Texas addresses. > > Distributor inquires welcome. I am not worried, nor prepared, because I live in Canada, a land that respects the right of people to enjoy in their own privacy, substances that may be harmful or enjoyable. Fuck off and die you miserable piece of shit scum. Sincerely, Klaus From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 23:41:37 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA11887 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:31:07 -0800 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA11859 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:30:59 -0800 Received: from [198.69.104.159] (pm4_27.digital.net [198.69.104.159]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA21540 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:29:07 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:28:38 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: Re: fnrg: Kennedy, Gravity Capacitor Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I think that a theoretical foundation should be formed here. If this "Gravity Capacitor" functions as described, why does it do so? What is there about the flow of electricity that would oppose/negate the flow of gravity? As there is no real "science" to describe this, what are some of the ideas about this? I don't care if it may be a "wild-sounding" description, I'm just looking for ideas. (You can tell I have not the experience or learning to theorize in this area...) tilleyrw@digital.net P.S. This has come from somone who has become dis-illusioned with science and the elitist attitude it takes towards theories that do not agree with the "great god Einstein". ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley || tilleyrw@digital.net || "Once upon a time..." | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | **** -- ***** -| http://www.digital.net/~tilleyrw |- ***** -- **** | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 16:40:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA00220 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:38:56 -0800 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA00141 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:38:44 -0800 Received: from [198.69.104.159] (pm4_27.digital.net [198.69.104.159]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA21832 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:36:39 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 19:36:10 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: fnrg: RE: T. T. Brown and what causes this? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Can anyone say what it is about "electricity" that causes the T. T. Brown effect? I have heard that it is not until voltages over 250 kV are used that any effects are observed, but I'm missing something. To my knowledge, there are two components of current: Voltage and Amplitude. Just because you have 250 kV, what kind of amplitude is required? Or am I just suffering from a conceptual difficulty? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley || tilleyrw@digital.net || "Once upon a time..." | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | **** -- ***** -| http://www.digital.net/~tilleyrw |- ***** -- **** | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 20:22:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA08234 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 20:20:52 -0800 Received: from phoenix.net (root@phoenix.phoenix.net [199.3.232.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA08213 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 20:20:48 -0800 Received: from rumgod.phoenix.net (dial8.phoenix.net [199.3.234.39]) by phoenix.net (8.6.10/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA21139 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 22:20:40 -0600 Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 22:20:40 -0600 Message-Id: <199511120420.WAA21139@phoenix.net> X-Sender: rumgod@phoenix.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: rumgod@phoenix.net (A J Interests, Inc) Subject: fnrg: Water Drop Spark Generator Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Hi Everyone, Some years ago I saw plans for making a high voltage spark generator using falling drops of water from a distance of about 30 inches or so. It was an interesting project and I would like to build one at this time if I could get the plans again. It seems to me it was in Radio Electronics or Popular Electronics Magazine, Unfortunitly I don't have access to the back issues of those magazines. Thanks, Art From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 21:24:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA25850 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 21:23:27 -0800 Received: from natashya.eden.com (root@natashya.eden.com [199.171.21.14]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA25836 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 21:23:24 -0800 Received: from net-1-188.austin.eden.com (net-1-188.austin.eden.com [199.171.21.188]) by natashya.eden.com (8.7.1.1/8.7.1.1) with SMTP id XAA19858 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 23:23:20 -0600 (CST) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 23:23:20 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511120523.XAA19858@natashya.eden.com> X-Sender: little@mail.eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >He built hand-held models and gave nation-wide demonstrations >> >shooting out candles. My dad showed me how to make these. Take a standard old-fashioned cardboard oatmeal container (the cylinder). Cut a round hole the size of a penny in the center of the lid. Tape the lid onto the container. Set up your candle across the kitchen table. Aim the hole at the candle and thump the bottom of the container hard with your finger. The hardest part is aiming right..the vortex is quite intense and rather small and will put out the candle at a distance of 5 feet or so. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 21:59:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA06450 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 21:57:46 -0800 Received: from natashya.eden.com (root@natashya.eden.com [199.171.21.14]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA06437 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 21:57:42 -0800 Received: from net-1-188.austin.eden.com (net-1-188.austin.eden.com [199.171.21.188]) by natashya.eden.com (8.7.1.1/8.7.1.1) with SMTP id XAA20776 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 23:57:38 -0600 (CST) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 23:57:38 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511120557.XAA20776@natashya.eden.com> X-Sender: little@mail.eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: fnrg: Water Drop Spark Generator X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 10:20 PM 11/11/95 -0600, freenrg-list@eskimo.com wrote: >Some years ago I saw plans for making a high voltage spark generator >using falling drops of water from a distance of about 30 inches or >so. This is a Kelvin Generator. I've made several. You need a water reservoir mounted up high with a pipe leading from it that tees into two pipes each with needle valves in them leading to drip nozzles spaced, say, 10" apart...some 20-30" off the table. Then sitting on the table or better or plastic blocks you need two metal cans such as quart coffee cans to catch the drips from the two nozzles. To the rim of each can attach (i.e. solder) a heavy Cu wire and arrange each wire to lead up towards the nozzle over the OTHER can. The wires must cross each other. Bend them so they don't touch. Form small loops in the ends of each wire and positio these loops just below the tips of the nozzles so the drops have to fall thru the loops. That's it. Get enerything as dry as possible. Start the nozzles dripping. Use the valves to adjust for fastest possible dripping and wait a minute or so. If it's working well, you can see the streams of drops deflected by Coulomb forces on them. When that starts happening, you can try shorting the two cans together to observe a tiny spark...or you can connect a NE2 neon bulb between the two cans a get a relatively bright flash. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 20:17:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA06558 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 20:14:53 -0800 Received: from ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (ns.bbtt.com [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA06521 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 20:14:47 -0800 Received: from localhost (harti.bbtt.com [194.77.35.75]) by ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA26100; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 05:14:12 +0100 Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 05:14:12 +0100 Message-Id: <199511120414.FAA26100@ns.B-2.de.Contrib.Net> X-Sender: harti@b-2.de.contrib.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) From: harti@B-2.de.Contrib.Net (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: fnrg: Re: TOMI? Cc: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Have you done any further investigation into the TOMI experiment? Or are >you waiting till New Years for Mr. Stewart to release his secret to the >world? Well, have not had any time to play around with it yet. But a friend of mine tried a rotary version without steel shileding (angle steel) and it did not work. He is now trying to get MU-metal to build up a good shielding. If there will be any success in the rotary version I will post it to the list. Regards, Stefan. email to: harti@bbtt.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 11 22:46:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA19659 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 22:46:53 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA19612 for ; Sat, 11 Nov 1995 22:46:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199511120646.WAA19612@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 00:19:18 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: RE: T. T. Brown and what causes this? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 07:36 PM 11/11/95 -0500, you wrote: > Can anyone say what it is about "electricity" that causes the T. T. Brown >effect? I have heard that it is not until voltages over 250 kV are used >that any effects are observed, but I'm missing something. > > To my knowledge, there are two components of current: Voltage and >Amplitude. Just because you have 250 kV, what kind of amplitude is >required? > > Or am I just suffering from a conceptual difficulty? > > Seems anyone's guess on why it occurs if it really does. There is very little current (amperage). The easiest way to think of amplitude is that when you turn up the volume on your stereo, you are increasing the amplitude of the sound, and the amount of both voltage and amperage to the speakers. But you can have voltage, without much current at all. Voltage is "pressure", electrical pressure. If the load has a very high resistance, such as a capacitor has (because of the dielectric [insulator]), then voltage is there without much current (amperage). A nine volt battery measures nine volts across the terminals, but virually no current is flowing, because air has a very high resistance. A high voltage power supply is like an electron vacuum cleaner, in this case pulling electrons out of one side of a capacitor, and forcing them into the other. Someone decided to call the area where there are a deficit of electrons (relative to normal conditions) "positive", and the area where the electrons are being forced to - "negative". (I know, it seems backwards sometimes.) Maybe atoms are being blown up like little baloons on one side, and crunched down on the other, changing the densities, but unevenly, so the overall density of the unit lessens. . Gary Hawkins __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 02:10:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA04435 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 02:10:26 -0800 Received: from bos1f.delphi.com (SYSTEM@bos1f.delphi.com [192.80.63.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA04427 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 02:10:24 -0800 Received: from delphi.com by delphi.com (PMDF V5.0-5 #10880) id <01HXJLCKVCMO9I941P@delphi.com>; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 05:09:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 05:09:24 -0500 (EST) From: Pat Harris Subject: fnrg: Re: TOMI? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com, tilleyrw@digital.net Message-id: <01HXJLCKVM9U9I941P@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: INTERNET"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" X-VMS-Cc: INTERNET"tilleyrw@digital.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 11-NOV-1995 23:18:44.0 freenrg-list said to PATHARRIS >> Have you done any further investigation into the TOMI experiment? >Or are >you waiting till New Years for Mr. Stewart to release his >secret to the >world? Mr. Stewart is really Mr. Harris. Stewart is his first name. It is not a matter of any secret. What has been doone is with the same information which is available to all. When you have a mass at a height, it is simple to put it to work. Now if you are unable to do this, that is another matter. But please do not put it off to some magic secret. >Well, have not had any time to play around with it yet. >But a friend of mine tried a rotary version without steel >shileding (angle steel) and it did not work. >He is now trying to get MU-metal to build up a good >shielding. >If there will be any success in the rotary version >I will post it to the list. >Regards, Stefan. >email to: >harti@bbtt.com Pat Harris aka Stewart Harris PatHarris@Delphi.Com `[1;37;45mRainbow V 1.19.4 for Delphi - Registered From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 10:45:14 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA12955 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 10:45:06 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (root@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA12934 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 10:45:02 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id LAA25488 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 11:56:53 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511121656.LAA25488@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: push-pull To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 11:56:51 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I heard once that some guy made a beam that would push or pull an object. Dose any one know how this could be? Has any one made a beam like this? I think the beam would magnitize the object, then pull (or push) it in. -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 09:20:52 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA19042 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 09:20:46 -0800 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA19005 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 09:20:37 -0800 Received: from usr2ip13.azstarnet.com (usr2ip13.azstarnet.com [169.197.3.13]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id KAA09168 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 10:18:56 -0700 Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 10:18:56 -0700 Message-Id: <199511121718.KAA09168@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: bclymer@azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: bclymer@azstarnet.com (William Clymer) Subject: Re: fnrg: RE: T. T. Brown and what causes this? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Can anyone say what it is about "electricity" that causes the T. T. Brown >effect? I have heard that it is not until voltages over 250 kV are used >that any effects are observed, but I'm missing something. > > To my knowledge, there are two components of current: Voltage and >Amplitude. Just because you have 250 kV, what kind of amplitude is >required? > > Or am I just suffering from a conceptual difficulty? > There are many componets to electricity. The two primary being electro and magnetic. Water can act as an anology for electricity. Voltage is like water pressure. Current is like gallons of flow per minute. Both have "amplititude". The "amplititude" of voltage is measured in volts. The amplititude of current is measures in amps. It's possiable to have voltage ( sometimes very high 250 kv ) and no current. This is like tire pressure. The pressure is high buth there is no air flow. It's aso possiable to have current flow without voltage. This occures in "superconductors". Resistance "really conductance" is like the pipe that carries the water. A very small diameter will (high resistance) pipe will allow little water to flow even with high pressure. A large diameter pipe will all much water to flow even at low pressure. Volts, Amps and Resistance are the three main prameters consicerec in electric energy. Capacitance and inductance effect alternating current. I'v never heard of the T.T. Brown effect. What is it? Bill From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 16:41:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA02390 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:41:46 -0800 Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA02342 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:41:39 -0800 From: markman@UTM.Edu Received: from dialup04.utm.edu by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA21703; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 18:41:42 -0600 Message-Id: <9511130041.AA21703@unix1.utm.edu> Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 18:42:14 Subject: Re: fnrg: where To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Dose any one know where to find info on ways to make ion propulsion >systems? Plasma will work too. -- There was plans from a early to mid 70's article in Popular Science or Popular Mechanics. I don't have a copy of it anymore and it's been years since I even thought about that. Best I remember, it used a neon sign transformer and a homemade bridge rectifier assembly, a filter capacitor (your standard HV power supply). It used some small nails or brads as emitters and a wire screen to collect the electrons. The nails and the screen was placed inside of a clear plastic cylinder. It was quite a simple device. I hope this is what you were looking for, it will give you some place to start anyway From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 13:03:00 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA25115 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 13:02:56 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ab506@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA25091 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 13:02:51 -0800 Received: (from ab506@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id QAA02452 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:02:44 -0500 (EST) From: Benjamin Lachman Message-Id: <199511122102.QAA02452@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: hi To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:02:43 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi, i'm new on this listserv. I'm intrested in anti-gravity. Dose any one know about this? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 15:00:21 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA11212 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 13:56:41 -0800 Received: from sashimi.wwa.com (root@sashimi.wwa.com [198.49.174.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA11163 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 13:56:32 -0800 Received: by sashimi.wwa.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tEkNW-001W3DC; Sun, 12 Nov 95 15:55 CST Message-Id: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Water Drop Spark Generator To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 15:55:54 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <199511120557.XAA20776@natashya.eden.com> from "Scott Little" at Nov 11, 95 11:57:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1334 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Scott. Pretty neat gizmo. What makes it work? > At 10:20 PM 11/11/95 -0600, Scott Little wrote: > > This is a Kelvin Generator. I've made several. You need a water reservoir > mounted up high with a pipe leading from it that tees into two pipes each > with needle valves in them leading to drip nozzles spaced, say, 10" > apart...some 20-30" off the table. Then sitting on the table or better or > plastic blocks you need two metal cans such as quart coffee cans to catch > the drips from the two nozzles. To the rim of each can attach (i.e. solder) > a heavy Cu wire and arrange each wire to lead up towards the nozzle over the > OTHER can. The wires must cross each other. Bend them so they don't touch. > Form small loops in the ends of each wire and positio these loops just > below the tips of the nozzles so the drops have to fall thru the loops. > > That's it. Get enerything as dry as possible. Start the nozzles dripping. > Use the valves to adjust for fastest possible dripping and wait a minute or > so. If it's working well, you can see the streams of drops deflected by > Coulomb forces on them. When that starts happening, you can try shorting > the two cans together to observe a tiny spark...or you can connect a NE2 > neon bulb between the two cans a get a relatively bright flash. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 16:16:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA24368 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:15:55 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA24330 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:15:48 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id TAA07641 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:14:38 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511130014.TAA07641@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: hologram To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:14:37 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Has any one made the hologram work? I could not. Any tricks? Andrew P.S. You can find out how in the NOT YOUR AVERAGE CONSTRUCTION PROJECT area. -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 19:04:38 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA18123 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:04:33 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA18062 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:04:24 -0800 Message-Id: <199511130304.TAA18062@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 20:14:43 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: phaser Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 02:26 PM 11/11/95 -0500, you wrote: >In Star-trek thay have Phasers. The Phasers are like lasers, but thay do >not burn. Thay are more like a force beam. Dose any one know of any >thing like this now? Or is it all science fiction? > Andrew Cantino > -- > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > /----------------\ > _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ > \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / > \------------------------------/ > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ > > > Not confirmed with my own eyes, but supposedly if you build a cylinder with a conductive rod thru it, and discharge a capacitor bank at a high voltage from the rod to the cylinder, it sends out a bundle of electrons along the axis of the rod. Or was that also a positive pulse the other direction. You want to be careful how you aim this thing. Gary __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 12 19:25:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA24891 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:25:47 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA24845 for ; Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:25:38 -0800 Message-Id: <199511130325.TAA24845@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 20:36:04 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: push-pull Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 11:56 AM 11/12/95 -0500, you wrote: >I heard once that some guy made a beam that would push or pull an object. >Dose any one know how this could be? Has any one made a beam like this? >I think the beam would magnitize the object, then pull (or push) it in. -- > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > /----------------\ > _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ > \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / > \------------------------------/ > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ > > > Hmmm. Tractor beam. I heard of a device a guy had on a table that ran on a nine volt battery that would attract any metal objects nearby, as in copper, gold, aluminum, etc, conductive stuff. He'd flip a switch and everything at the other end of the table would fwooop/smack against it with a lot of force. It's hearsay for now though. He kind of disappeared. Gary Hawkins __________________________________________________ Horizon Technology -- Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA **The VCR was invented in 1956 by AmPax.** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 08:11:03 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA12161 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 08:11:00 -0800 Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA12135 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 08:10:55 -0800 Received: by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA45116; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:10:53 -0600 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:08:44 -600 (CST) From: Mark Mansfield Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <9510138162.AA816287257@irout.advantor.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > > > > I am currently doing research on Browns work. I have a high voltage pulse power > source and I am trying to make some disk shaped barium titinate caps. > I am having problems in getting the caps not to crack during the drying > process before they go into the furnace. Has anyone done work in this > area? I would like to keep the barium titinate pure and not dilute it > with regular clay material. > How do you know they (the caps) are barium titinate? I would like to find out how to identify barium titinate caps from other ceramics. I understand there is some weird effects with barium titinate caps in some circuit configurations. Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 07:44:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA02832 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 07:44:01 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA02808 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 07:43:57 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id KAA10349 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:31:26 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816287257 Mon, 13 Nov 95 10:27:37 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 95 10:27:37 From: "reim" Encoding: 899 Text Message-Id: <9510138162.AA816287257@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I am currently doing research on Browns work. I have a high voltage pulse power source and I am trying to make some disk shaped barium titinate caps. I am having problems in getting the caps not to crack during the drying process before they go into the furnace. Has anyone done work in this area? I would like to keep the barium titinate pure and not dilute it with regular clay material. Next week I may be able to get a surplus 125KV X-Ray power supply. I would like to talk to anyone who has experimented with potentials in this range. Particularly the safety issues at these levels. Even with my 90 KV pulse supply I have gotten small shocks just by touching a drill press 3 feet away from the supply and I have seen sparks jumping across my plywood work bench. Also is there a problem in producing X-Rays at these levels when not working in a vacuum? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 16:51:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA04607 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:23:15 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA04498 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:22:56 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id NAA20222 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 13:01:44 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816296257 Mon, 13 Nov 95 12:57:37 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 95 12:57:37 From: "reim" Encoding: 1270 Text Message-Id: <9510138162.AA816296257@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[2]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: mark I had a ceramic manufacture sample me 10 pounds of high purity barium titinate in power form. I was surprised they did that since the high grade stuff is not that cheap but since I told them it was for research they didn't mind. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/13/95 11:38 AM On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > > > > I am currently doing research on Browns work. I have a high voltage pulse powe r > source and I am trying to make some disk shaped barium titinate caps. > I am having problems in getting the caps not to crack during the drying > process before they go into the furnace. Has anyone done work in this > area? I would like to keep the barium titinate pure and not dilute it > with regular clay material. > How do you know they (the caps) are barium titinate? I would like to find out how to identify barium titinate caps from other ceramics. I understand there is some weird effects with barium titinate caps in some circuit configurations. Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 06:42:40 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA13137 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 06:42:26 -0800 Received: from natashya.eden.com (root@natashya.eden.com [199.171.21.14]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA13090 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 06:42:20 -0800 Received: from net-1-179.austin.eden.com (net-1-179.austin.eden.com [199.171.21.179]) by natashya.eden.com (8.7.1.1/8.7.1.1) with SMTP id IAA29200 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 08:42:15 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 08:42:15 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511131442.IAA29200@natashya.eden.com> X-Sender: little@mail.eden.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: little@eden.com (Scott Little) Subject: Re: fnrg: Water Drop Spark Generator X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Hi Scott. Pretty neat gizmo. What makes it work? By chance a drop falls with an excess of electrons into, say, the left can. That negative charge in the left can is conducted up the wire to the loop that's under the right nozzle. The presence of that negatively-charge loop induces a positive charge (i.e. repels the electrons) on the drops that form at the right nozzle. When they fall, they fall into the right can. The resulting positive charge on the right can is conducted up its wire to the loop that's under the left nozzle. That positive loop induces negative charge (i.e. attracts electrons) on the drops falling from the left nozzle. The process is "run-away" and proceeds until leakage or breakdown occurs or until Coulomb forces on the streams of drops forces them to miss their cans, which I have observed on very dry days. Scott Little EarthTech International, Inc. 4030 Braker Lane West Austin TX 78759 USA 512-346-3848 (voice) 512-346-3017 (FAX) little@eden.com (email) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 07:22:40 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA25733 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 07:22:35 -0800 Received: from obrien.msoe.edu (obrien.msoe.edu [155.92.10.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA25704 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 07:22:29 -0800 Received: from warp.msoe.edu by obrien.msoe.edu (MX V4.1 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 09:22:24 EST Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 13 Nov 95 09:21:40 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 13 Nov 95 09:21:22 GMT+6 From: "Bane" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 09:21:16 CST6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: fnrg: where Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-ID: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Dose any one know where to find info on ways to make ion propulsion >systems? Plasma will work too. -- Try Information Unlimited, they usually have advertisements in the back of magazines like Popular Electronics and Electronics Now....a few years ago i saw they had an ad of an ion propelled hover craft... it has been a year since i have seen any of their ads so i am not sure if they 're still in business. P.S. if anyone comes across their adress pleas post it. I do remember they had a lot of stuff on anti-gravity and Tesla... ian geiser ian gieser . /_\ If only time could tell it would be a very quiet world... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 16:22:17 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17122 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:40 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16940 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:17 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA10218 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:10 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id MAA03350; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:00 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Measuring High Voltage Newsgroups: list.freenrg Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:11:52 -0500 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Lines: 30 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article , you wrote: > > Heres some thing that some one might want to look into, seeing >how several of you are talking about high voltage supplies. I'm going >from memory here, so I might not have this %100 right, but I hope it >gives you a starting point. > > There is a sever inaccuracies the conventional wisdom that fiber >optic cable is immune from "interface" (EMI/RFI ect)... > > Among other things there are three effects, Kerr, Brag, and >Faraday, that can be exploited to measure high voltage potentials. > Now I'm talking to my self... :-( I want to fix a error I made, the Faraday Effect is used to measure current not voltage. A couple of other effects that can be exploited are Pockels Cell, Piezoactive Stress that to cause phase shifts, a Magnetostrictive Coating on the fiber, ect. From NASA's Tech Brief: "Review of Fiber-Optic Electric-Field Sensors" 4/1989 Vol 13, #4, Item #130 NPO-17242/6750. "Electro-Optical High-Voltage Sensors" Vol 16, #11, Item #98 NPO-18311/7706. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 15:54:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17213 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:52 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA17018 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:27 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA10224 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:15 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id MAA03382; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:05 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: RE: T. T. Brown and what causes this? Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:27:06 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199511120646.WAA19612@mail.eskimo.com> In-Reply-To: <199511120646.WAA19612@mail.eskimo.com> Lines: 11 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <199511120646.WAA19612@mail.eskimo.com>, you wrote: >At 07:36 PM 11/11/95 -0500, you wrote: >> Can anyone say what it is about "electricity" that causes the T. T. Brown >>effect? I have heard that it is not until voltages over 250 kV are used >>that any effects are observed, but I'm missing something. > >There is very little current (amperage). Some thing I read by Brown specified 50W, but I don't remember the voltage, it was over 50 kVDC. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 15:53:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17157 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:45 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16996 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:24 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA10227 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:17 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id MAA03412; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:11 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: table Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:31:11 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199511110225.VAA12603@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> In-Reply-To: <199511110225.VAA12603@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Lines: 9 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <199511110225.VAA12603@ra.cs.ohiou.edu>, you wrote: >I just thoght this would be usefull: [Periodic table deleted.] Yes it was, thank you. It reminds me of a question. What elements are Diamagnetic? Bismuth is one. T.T.Brown loved to use Diamagnetic stuff in his devices.... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 16:16:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17149 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:44 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA17017 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:53:27 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA10229 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:19 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id MAA03444; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:53:16 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: where Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 12:34:53 -0500 Message-ID: <9G4pwUQy84BK085yn@execpc.com> References: <9511130041.AA21703@unix1.utm.edu> In-Reply-To: <9511130041.AA21703@unix1.utm.edu> Lines: 21 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <9511130041.AA21703@unix1.utm.edu>, you wrote: >>Dose any one know where to find info on ways to make ion propulsion >>systems? Plasma will work too. -- NASA Tech Briefs has had several blurbs about this over the years. >There was plans from a early to mid 70's article in Popular Science or >Popular Mechanics. I don't have a copy of it anymore and it's been years >since I even thought about that. Best I remember, it used a neon sign >transformer and a homemade bridge rectifier assembly, a filter capacitor >(your standard HV power supply). It used some small nails or brads as >emitters and a wire screen to collect the electrons. The nails and the >screen was placed inside of a clear plastic cylinder. It was quite a >simple device. I hope this is what you were looking for, it will give >you some place to start anyway Be careful that you don't also make Ozone. Not good to breath. Tho it does have other useful medical effects if used in other ways. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 16:25:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA06662 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:28:07 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA06395 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:27:24 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id NAA03447 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 13:26:58 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511131826.NAA03447@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 13:26:57 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199511120523.XAA19858@natashya.eden.com> from "Scott Little" at Nov 11, 95 11:23:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A > > > > >He built hand-held models and gave nation-wide demonstrations > >> >shooting out candles. > > My dad showed me how to make these. Take a standard old-fashioned cardboard > oatmeal container (the cylinder). Cut a round hole the size of a penny in > the center of the lid. Tape the lid onto the container. Set up your candle > across the kitchen table. Aim the hole at the candle and thump the bottom > of the container hard with your finger. The hardest part is aiming > right..the vortex is quite intense and rather small and will put out the > candle at a distance of 5 feet or so. > > Wow! I just made one, and it works *well*! Dose any one know how to make one that is powered by electricity? An atomatic candle 5 foot candle puter outer! (-: Andrew -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 15:53:14 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA02795 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:19:06 -0800 Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA02223 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 10:17:53 -0800 Message-Id: <199511131817.KAA02223@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 11:31:15 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: where Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 09:21 AM 11/13/95 CST6, you wrote: > >Try Information Unlimited, they usually have advertisements in the I wonder what happened to their efforts to rebuild a magnifying transmitter. They had poured a cement slab for it, and then I didn't hear anymore on it. Gary _______________________________________________ Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 22:49:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA11669 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:48:20 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA11641; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:48:14 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA12704; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:48:10 -0800 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:48:08 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com cc: William Beaty Subject: Re: fnrg: Water Drop Spark Generator Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sat, 11 Nov 1995 rumgod@phoenix.net wrote: > Some years ago I saw plans for making a high voltage spark generator > using falling drops of water from a distance of about 30 inches or > so. It was an interesting project and I would like to build one at > this time if I could get the plans again. It seems to me it was in > Radio Electronics or Popular Electronics Magazine, Unfortunitly I > don't have access to the back issues of those magazines. Called "Kelvin's Thunderstorm", or Kelvin's water-drop generator. The basic idea is this: | | | | Grounded | | Water | | Dripper | | | | \ / || _ + + + + + + + -o- + -------------- + - + | | + + | | + _ + | Charged | + -o- + | Object | + - + | | + + | | + + -------------- + _ + + + + + + + -o- - The positively charged object draws an excess of negative ions into the tip of the water dripper, then when the drop detaches, it carries away negative charge, leaving the earth slightly positive. Interesting in that the positive object need never lose its charge, and the energy is all created by the work that gravity does in pulling the negative droplet away from the grounded dripper. If the "object" was negative, the droplets would be positive. It need not be a "dripper", it can be a high velocity spray, as long as the jet divides into droplets, not a contiguous stream. And multiple jets can be used, sort of like a shower head. Kelvin's complete device looks like this: \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ || || || || || || || || || || drippers (need not be metal) || || == == == == metal disks with holes, or wire rings (supported by insulating rods) | | | | | | | | | | | | metal cans on insulators (styrofoam?) | | | | |____| |____| | | | | | | | | | | | | Then wires are used to cross-connect the cans and the wire rings: \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ || || || || || || drippers (need not be metal) || || o o o o o o == ==----\ /---== == metal disks with holes, or wire rings o \ / o (supported by insulating rods) \ / o C/ o (crossed wires don't touch!) | | / \ | | | o | / \ | o | | |_____/ \_____| | metal cans on insulators (styrofoam?) |----| |----| |____| |____| | | | | | | | | | | | | The dripping system is electrically unstable, and if one side is a tiny bit more positive and the other a bit negative, these charges will amplify and grow as the water drips. Eventually the charged drops falling into the like-charged cans will be repelled, and they will start bending their paths, even occasionally falling upwards! How to get the water out of the cans without discharging them? By using the "faraday ice pail" effect where a conductive hollow object always has no charge inside. Connect an exit tube inside each lower can like this, so the water DRIPS out (if it falls in a solid stream, the cans will discharge) || || || || || || || || ||/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/|| || || For best results, no sharp edges or || || burrs anywhere. || WATER || || || || __ __ || || | | | | || || | | | | || || | U | || || | O | || ====== ====== O Uncharged drops O exit from bottom With a little catcher-tray and a fountain pump, you can make the system recirculate. I've always wanted to build a version that goes like this, with hollow metal toroids (halves of VandeGraff spheres, the halves with the holes: \\ \\ \\ \\ \\ \\ || || || || || || drippers || || ___ ___ ___ ___ / \ / \ / \ / \ | | | | | | | | Four torii \___/ \___/ \___/ \___/ (shown cross- sectional) ___ ___ ___ ___ / \ / \ / \ / \ | |\ /| | | |\ /| | \___/ \_/ \___/ \___/ \_/ \___/ conical screens in lower torii touch droplets and release, discharging them. Entire screen assy must be deep within the "hole" of each donut so the torus shields it from the field on the outside. High-velocity waterjets and hollow-pipe conductors complete the scene. A "VandeGraaff Generator" version of Kelvin's Thunderstorm apparatus! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 22:52:36 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA12902 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:52:34 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA12883 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:52:31 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA12959; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:52:28 -0800 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:52:28 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: hologram In-Reply-To: <199511130014.TAA07641@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sun, 12 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > Has any one made the hologram work? I could not. Any tricks? > Andrew Try tilting the compass so it doesn't "chatter" as you drag it. Try dragging the point along VERY lightly to make a very slight scratch. ALso, try making lots of curved scratches and examine them in sunlight. Each one should have a little highlight of sunlight which moves around as you tilt the plate. If they do not, then your scratch is not smooth enough. The little $2 compasses in drug stores are far too wobbly, you really need the $10 kind with the screwthread adjustment. Once you figure out how to make smooth scratches with little highlights, you'll be able to harness the "hilight" effect to generate 3D images (made of little glowing points, of course.) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 13 22:56:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA14088 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:56:42 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA14049 for ; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:56:34 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA13174; Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:56:32 -0800 Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 22:56:31 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? In-Reply-To: <199511131826.NAA03447@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > > My dad showed me how to make these. Take a standard old-fashioned cardboard > > oatmeal container (the cylinder). Cut a round hole the size of a penny in > > the center of the lid. Tape the lid onto the container. Set up your candle > > across the kitchen table. Aim the hole at the candle and thump the bottom > > of the container hard with your finger. The hardest part is aiming > > right..the vortex is quite intense and rather small and will put out the > > candle at a distance of 5 feet or so. > > > > > Wow! I just made one, and it works *well*! Dose any one know how to make > one that is powered by electricity? An atomatic candle 5 foot candle > puter outer! (-: Get a loudspeaker. Build an enclosure around the front, with the usual hole. Tap the speaker leads breifly to a 1-1/2v battery (or higher, but don't blow your speaker!) and it will generate vortex rings. A computer, an A/D card, a power amp, and some software should let you DESIGN the impulse waveform and possibly generate super-vortices. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 06:28:30 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA17491 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 06:27:23 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA17473 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 06:27:19 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id JAA28140 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 09:11:41 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816368866 Tue, 14 Nov 95 09:07:46 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 09:07:46 From: "reim" Encoding: 1873 Text Message-Id: <9510148163.AA816368866@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[2]: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/14/95 7:24 AM On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > > My dad showed me how to make these. Take a standard old-fashioned cardboard > > oatmeal container (the cylinder). Cut a round hole the size of a penny in > > the center of the lid. Tape the lid onto the container. Set up your candle > > across the kitchen table. Aim the hole at the candle and thump the bottom > > of the container hard with your finger. The hardest part is aiming > > right..the vortex is quite intense and rather small and will put out the > > candle at a distance of 5 feet or so. > > > > > Wow! I just made one, and it works *well*! Dose any one know how to make > one that is powered by electricity? An atomatic candle 5 foot candle > puter outer! (-: Get a loudspeaker. Build an enclosure around the front, with the usual hole. Tap the speaker leads breifly to a 1-1/2v battery (or higher, but don't blow your speaker!) and it will generate vortex rings. A computer, an A/D card, a power amp, and some software should let you DESIGN the impulse waveform and possibly generate super-vortices. ....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page This sounds interesting, has anyone seen any equations relating the diameter and length of the cylinder to the size of the hole in the opening? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 20:16:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA26436 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:10:43 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA26336 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:10:26 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id OAA18023 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:01:32 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816385972 Tue, 14 Nov 95 13:52:52 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 13:52:52 From: "reim" Encoding: 2681 Text Message-Id: <9510148163.AA816385972@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A bill, Thanks for the insight. I would have to review my fluid theory from college since its been 15 years since I graduated but I remember a little bit about the Reynolds number. Can you get much force out of one of these things? It would be interesting if the output force is a linear function to the input force but I would imagine frictional losses would start to add up at high ower levels. I was just interested, you know make a toy for my kids. I am still looking for people who has worked with high voltage, over 100 KV ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/14/95 12:10 PM On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > Get a loudspeaker. Build an enclosure around the front, with the usual > hole. Tap the speaker leads breifly to a 1-1/2v battery (or higher, but > don't blow your speaker!) and it will generate vortex rings. A computer, > an A/D card, a power amp, and some software should let you DESIGN the > impulse waveform and possibly generate super-vortices. > > > This sounds interesting, has anyone seen any equations relating > the diameter and length of the cylinder to the size of the > hole in the opening? > From experience I'd say that the hole diameter must be much smaller than the cylinder diameter (maybe 5x smaller or more) and the cylinder length must be somewhat longer than the hole diameter (2x or more,) and that the particular ratios aren't too important. What is important is the ratio of hole diameter to total air transport. A large pulse applied to a small hole simply generates an air jet. A small pulse applied to a large hole simply generates slight turbulence at the hole edge. The entire process probably involves Reynold's number effects. I suspect that the pulse applied to the loudspeaker can be tailored to produce vortices with fast or slow spin, and fast or slow velocity. An extremely fast vortex which travels very slowly would be very interesting. Now REALLY advanced amateurs could experiment with tailored *shockwave* effects rather than simple loudspeaker impulses! ....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 08:17:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA20639 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 08:16:49 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA20573 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 08:16:40 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id IAA02927; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 08:16:39 -0800 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 08:16:38 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? In-Reply-To: <9510148163.AA816368866@irout.advantor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > Get a loudspeaker. Build an enclosure around the front, with the usual > hole. Tap the speaker leads breifly to a 1-1/2v battery (or higher, but > don't blow your speaker!) and it will generate vortex rings. A computer, > an A/D card, a power amp, and some software should let you DESIGN the > impulse waveform and possibly generate super-vortices. > > > This sounds interesting, has anyone seen any equations relating > the diameter and length of the cylinder to the size of the > hole in the opening? > >From experience I'd say that the hole diameter must be much smaller than the cylinder diameter (maybe 5x smaller or more) and the cylinder length must be somewhat longer than the hole diameter (2x or more,) and that the particular ratios aren't too important. What is important is the ratio of hole diameter to total air transport. A large pulse applied to a small hole simply generates an air jet. A small pulse applied to a large hole simply generates slight turbulence at the hole edge. The entire process probably involves Reynold's number effects. I suspect that the pulse applied to the loudspeaker can be tailored to produce vortices with fast or slow spin, and fast or slow velocity. An extremely fast vortex which travels very slowly would be very interesting. Now REALLY advanced amateurs could experiment with tailored *shockwave* effects rather than simple loudspeaker impulses! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 20:15:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA00454 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:20:18 -0800 Received: from obrien.msoe.edu (obrien.msoe.edu [155.92.10.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA00381 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:20:08 -0800 Received: from warp.msoe.edu by obrien.msoe.edu (MX V4.1 AXP) with SMTP; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 13:19:59 EST Received: from WARP/MAILQUEUE by warp.msoe.edu (Mercury 1.21); 14 Nov 95 13:19:11 GMT+6 Received: from MAILQUEUE by WARP (Mercury 1.21); 14 Nov 95 13:18:47 GMT+6 From: "Bane" Organization: Milwaukee School of Engineering To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 13:18:41 CST6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: fnrg: where Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-ID: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > I wonder what happened to their efforts to rebuild a magnifying > transmitter. They had poured a cement slab for it, and then > I didn't hear anymore on it. i did some looking last night and i couldn't find anything on them at all... i think they might have gone out of business > ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** court papers back this one up!!! ian gieser . /_\ If only time could tell it would be a very quiet world... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 20:22:21 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA07217 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:04:15 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA07094 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:03:59 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id OAA06299; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:03:35 -0800 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:03:35 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: How much interest would there be? (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: See below. If interested, respond directly to Bob Shannon. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 10:42:01 EST From: Robert A. Shannon To: neotech@world.std.com Subject: How much interest would there be? -> SearchNet's neotech Mailing List How much interest would there be in a construction project for an electronic device which could detect and measure phenomena ranging from the human energy field to "ley lines" and other "esoteric" energies? The device in question is know as a Scalar Electrostatic Gradiometer. The device in question already exists, and it's operation is well proven. These devices have been used to map neolithic sites, and detected the original path of alignment of stone markers even though some had shifted from their original possition due to frost-thaw cycles, and incorrect modern reconstruction of the neolithic site. This same device has recently been shown to provide objective evidence of the shamantic practice of "charging" crystals actually effecting the electrostatic field around the crystal in a directly measureable way. Other appications range from paranormal investigation and crop circle verification to the testing of other scalar electromagnetic devices. If there is sufficient interest, the inventors of this device would be willing to release this design through Neotech. Exactly how to distribute the schmatic diagram remains to be decided though, perhapse a GIF file could be made, as the device in not very complex. So, just how much interest is there for such a device? I must give a single warning, this devce may start you out into a much larger world, and open new phenomena to objective investigation. If you are skeptical of any claims made of this device so far, then it's operation may be harmful to your world view. On the other hand, if you seek such phenomena, and a greater understanding of the nature of reality, this toy is just the ticket. -> Posted by: "Robert A. Shannon" From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 19:44:19 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA01142 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 19:44:04 -0800 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA01067 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 19:43:56 -0800 From: sphere@ddi.digital.net Received: from sphere (pm9_0.digital.net [198.69.104.164]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA15002 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 22:42:02 -0500 Message-Id: <199511150342.WAA15002@ddi.digital.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 22:42:21 +0000 Subject: fnrg: Re: Ozone X-Confirm-Reading-To: sphere@ddi.digital.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Date: Tue, 08 Jan 1991 19:53:38 -0500 > To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool) > Subject: Re: fnrg: where > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Back in high school I built my first Tesla coils. I ran a medium size one > in my workshop, a very small building (about 8 by 10 feet). It was raining, > and I had the door closed. I finished up after a couple of hours of high > voltage experiments, and after breating a LOT of ozone. Starting that > afternnoon, I had the Grand-Daddy of all migrane headaches which lasted for > about TEN days! I learned the hard way: Always use good ventilation when > working with high voltage devices which produce ozone. > > Bert Bert, You've misunderstood what has happened in your body. The highly reactive triatomic oxygen supercharged you bloodstream with oxygen, causing a rapid detoxification of your tissues. Much of the cytoplasmic waste ends up in the lymphatic system, but some of it enters the bloodstream where it causes transient inflammation of the vascular tissue in the lining of the brain (headache). This continues and gradually abates until the kidneys finish filtering the sludge from your blood, placing the waste in your bladder and sweat glands for elimination. In a highly congested tissue matrix (the average civilized human body) this process can take several days. Something similar will occur during the eating of highly vital foods (live fruits and vegetables), herbs, or during a fast. Cleansing one's tissues at an extremely high rate can be uncomfortable but is ultimately healthful. Cleansing/fasting too fast or too long without cycling (graduating) the tissues can kill you. Wishing you health and clear vision, Sphere > > > > >In article <9511130041.AA21703@unix1.utm.edu>, you wrote: > >>>Dose any one know where to find info on ways to make ion propulsion > >>>systems? Plasma will work too. -- > > > > NASA Tech Briefs has had several blurbs about this over the > >years. > > > > > >>There was plans from a early to mid 70's article in Popular Science or > >>Popular Mechanics. I don't have a copy of it anymore and it's been years > >>since I even thought about that. Best I remember, it used a neon sign > >>transformer and a homemade bridge rectifier assembly, a filter capacitor > >>(your standard HV power supply). It used some small nails or brads as > >>emitters and a wire screen to collect the electrons. The nails and the > >>screen was placed inside of a clear plastic cylinder. It was quite a > >>simple device. I hope this is what you were looking for, it will give > >>you some place to start anyway > > > > Be careful that you don't also make Ozone. Not good to breath. > >Tho it does have other useful medical effects if used in other ways. > > > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 18:11:07 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA26794 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 18:11:05 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA26755 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 18:10:59 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id VAA15320 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 21:10:53 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511150210.VAA15320@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 21:10:52 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "William Beaty" at Nov 14, 95 08:16:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A This all sound good, execpt that the speaker is vary loud. Will this run on an ultrasonic transducer? I have some. Andrew -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 20:31:54 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA22968 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 18:01:13 -0800 Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA22862 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 18:00:59 -0800 Received: from dp2-008.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tFWkh-0003B3C; Tue, 14 Nov 95 20:35 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 21:40:13 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Well I currently experiment with Tesla coils and electrostatic devices, When I saw the plan on Bill B's home page I knew I had to try it. Thus far I have drawn a CAD drawing of what I thought the capacitor plate should look like, collected enough mylar skraps for a 2500 plate system and looking for a tool and die maker that doesn't charge 4000.00 dollars to stamp out the darn plates. Hopefully I will post the results in a few months. Powering the device presents a small problem, How do I go about producing very high voltage high current DC power in an appartment environment without killing myself or the other tenents. I am in the process of obtaining a 480v AC to 40KV DC transformer from an electronic air percipitator.. If anyone has any ideas that you may think to be helpfull please email me clipper@iglou.com.. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 14 23:01:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA06572 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 23:01:13 -0800 Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA06514 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 23:01:02 -0800 From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Received: from Lottoman by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id WAA27933; Tue, 14 Nov 1995 22:59:35 -0800 Message-Id: <199511150659.WAA27933@ix3.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: jdavid28@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 00:55:14 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On the subject I to am attempting to build the thing. From the disciption it calls for tin foil. How thick is tin foil? So far I am using tin plates that are .008" thick. Is this to thick? Also for the dielectric I'm using plastic, probably .002". I would have no idea where to start looking for someone to stamp the plates. I wouldn't think that the local sheet metal shop couldn't do it. Can you suggest where I should start looking for someone to do this. If you plan to assemble 2500 plates what would you estimate the high will be? I plan to build so many then test them then build some more and so on. Do you really think that it will require that much power? That would be alot of car batterys. Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 00:31:52 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA01042 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 00:30:10 -0800 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (root@bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA01019 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 00:30:06 -0800 Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (w9sz@firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id CAA07978 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 02:22:35 -0600 (CST) Received: (from w9sz@localhost) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) id CAA09149; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 02:30:00 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 02:30:00 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511150830.CAA09149@firefly.prairienet.org> From: w9sz@prairienet.org (Zack Widup) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: push-pull Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >At 11:56 AM 11/12/95 -0500, you wrote: >>I heard once that some guy made a beam that would push or pull an object. >>Dose any one know how this could be? Has any one made a beam like this? >>I think the beam would magnitize the object, then pull (or push) it in. -- >> >Hmmm. Tractor beam. I heard of a device a guy had on a table that >ran on a nine volt battery that would attract any metal objects nearby, >as in copper, gold, aluminum, etc, conductive stuff. He'd flip a switch >and everything at the other end of the table would fwooop/smack against >it with a lot of force. It's hearsay for now though. He kind of disappeared. > >Gary Hawkins Maybe he got sucked up into it too?!? :-) I've wanted to play around with caduceus-wound coils. Supposedly when the beam paths of 2 caduceus coils cross paths, strange and different things happen. Who out there knows anything about this phenomenon? Zack From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 06:37:05 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA17961 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 06:35:24 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA17950 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 06:35:21 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id JAA22604 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 09:21:37 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816455580 Wed, 15 Nov 95 09:13:00 Date: Wed, 15 Nov 95 09:13:00 From: "reim" Encoding: 2235 Text Message-Id: <9510158164.AA816455580@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[4]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi bert is bob reim. I was the one inquiring about the ceramic material. right now I am working with a lady who runs a ceramic class and she is trying to create the caps her self. I should know how it turns out in one to two weeks. I'll let you know bob reim reim@advantor.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Re[2]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/15/95 7:06 AM Mark, I'm involved with a large art organization here in Texas. Several of the members work with ceramics. If you'd like, I can contact some of them, and see if they have any suggestions. Perhaps they might even work with a small sample of your material first hand, and see if they can resolve your cracking problem. What say ye? Bert > > mark > > I had a ceramic manufacture sample me 10 pounds of high purity > barium titinate in power form. I was surprised they did that since > the > high grade stuff is not that cheap but since I told them it was for > research they didn't mind. > > >______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ >Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown >Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet >Date: 11/13/95 11:38 AM > > > >On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > >> >> >> >> I am currently doing research on Browns work. I have a high voltage pulse >powe r >> source and I am trying to make some disk shaped barium titinate caps. >> I am having problems in getting the caps not to crack during the drying >> process before they go into the furnace. Has anyone done work in this >> area? I would like to keep the barium titinate pure and not dilute it >> with regular clay material. >> > >How do you know they (the caps) are barium titinate? I would like to find >out how to identify barium titinate caps from other ceramics. I understand >there is some weird effects with barium titinate caps in some circuit >configurations. > >Mark > > > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 16:26:48 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA04766 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 16:26:02 -0800 Received: from phoenix.net (root@phoenix.phoenix.net [199.3.232.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA04699 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 16:25:51 -0800 Received: from rumgod.phoenix.net (dial121.phoenix.net [199.3.234.156]) by phoenix.net (8.6.10/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA17949 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 18:25:27 -0600 Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 18:25:27 -0600 Message-Id: <199511160025.SAA17949@phoenix.net> X-Sender: rumgod@phoenix.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: rumgod@phoenix.net (A J Interests, Inc) Subject: fnrg: Counter Wave energy saving device Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hello all, Has anyone heard of this device? Supposedly you hook it up to the refridgerator or washing machine and it will use considerably less power. > COUNTER WAVE > >Single Phase or Three Phase Inductive Energy Recycling system > >"...advanced electronic technology designed to significantly reduce your >energy consumption, instantly." From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 22:56:58 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA11943 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 16:43:49 -0800 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (root@bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA11822 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 16:43:34 -0800 Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (w9sz@firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id SAA03891 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 18:31:20 -0600 (CST) Received: (from w9sz@localhost) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) id SAA24398; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 18:39:21 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 18:39:21 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511160039.SAA24398@firefly.prairienet.org> From: w9sz@prairienet.org (Zack Widup) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Counter Wave energy saving device Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >Hello all, >Has anyone heard of this device? Supposedly you hook it up to the refridgerator >or washing machine and it will use considerably less power. > > > >> COUNTER WAVE > >> > >>Single Phase or Three Phase Inductive Energy Recycling system > >> > >>"...advanced electronic technology designed to significantly reduce your > >>energy consumption, instantly." > > > > > > I have an Intel Microcontroller Handbook from several years back which had a circuit for an 8022-based controller (it has an on-chip A/D converter) that read the voltages of the AC waveform to an AC motor. It then used a triac to turn off the current during a part of the cycle, saving a lot of energy for just a slight degradation in performance. The basic idea was designed by NASA, according to the article. Zack w9sz@praireient.org From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 22:00:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA06879 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 21:59:58 -0800 Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA06848 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 21:59:53 -0800 Received: from dp1-001.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tFtGN-00038vC; Wed, 15 Nov 95 20:37 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 20:42:26 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: Re: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >On the subject I to am attempting to build the thing. From the disciption it >calls for tin foil. How thick is tin foil? So far I am using tin plates that >are .008" thick. Is this to thick? Also for the dielectric I'm using >plastic, probably .002". I would have no idea where to start looking for >someone to stamp the plates. I wouldn't think that the local sheet metal >shop couldn't do it. Can you suggest where I should start looking for >someone to do this. If you plan to assemble 2500 plates what would you >estimate the high will be? I plan to build so many then test them then build >some more and so on. Do you really think that it will require that much >power? That would be alot of car batterys. > >Todd >jdavid28@ix.netcom.com > > > Well the design I decided to use will be made from 4 mil mylar as the dielectric and 10 mil aluminum roof flashing. I believe the original design made use of tin foil because of the ability to solder the connections together. As far as having it stamped by a machine shop it will be expensive I've recieved price quotes as high as $4000.00 to make the die and stamp out 1,000 conductor plates. I have contacted vocational schools in my area and the teachers have said they could make the making of the die a class project and if I supply the materials they would manufacture the die and stamp out the plates. The cost I have estimated is around $300.00 for the grade steel plate used for the making of the die and $23.00 per roll of roof flashing. Now for your dielectric I would suggest polyethalene sheet plastic 6 mil thick which is real cheap (around $30.00 for a 10' x 100' roll). I have decided to use an AC powered high voltage power supply rectified to DC. I have included a rough plate picture it's name is rocket.jpg. P.S. I haven't any professional experiance only trial and error. This device can store enough power to kill you or anyone coming into contact with it.. In other words you accept any responsibility for damages incurred by this device. The original design of this object can be found on Bill Beaty's homepage. If anyone has any suggestions I welcome them.. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 15 22:00:19 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA06959 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 22:00:09 -0800 Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA06890 for ; Wed, 15 Nov 1995 21:59:59 -0800 Received: from dp1-001.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tFtJk-00039FC; Wed, 15 Nov 95 20:40 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=====================_816511555==_" Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 20:45:55 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: fnrg: electric rocket conductor plate . 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AKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgA oAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACgAoAKACg AoAKAP/Z --=====================_816511555==_-- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 06:47:55 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA05065 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 06:47:51 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA05042 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 06:47:45 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id JAA20548 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 09:41:37 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816543318 Thu, 16 Nov 95 09:35:18 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 95 09:35:18 From: "reim" Encoding: 3573 Text Message-Id: <9510168165.AA816543318@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[2]: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I have made some high voltage caps and did a bit of research in this area. how high of a voltage is your power supply? What kind of diodes will you use in your rectifier? I would check ( forget the values) the dielectric strength of the plastic you plan to use for your caps. I don't believe .002 plastic has the breakdown voltage required for this, I am assuming you are using a neon transformer? As a note if your plastic is rated say at 500 volts per mil, you cannot use a 100 mil thick plastic to get a 50,000 breakdown because the dielectric strength is NOT a linear function of the thickness of the plastic. Also the same goes true with diodes you cannot hook up 25 1000 volt diodes and expect to get a 25,000 volt diode. Also look at the equation for a parallel plate capacitor to compute the capacitance and then you can calculate the joules it can provide. I have a degree in Electrical Engineering and can be of assistance in your design. My specialty is analog design. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/16/95 7:18 AM >On the subject I to am attempting to build the thing. From the disciption it >calls for tin foil. How thick is tin foil? So far I am using tin plates that >are .008" thick. Is this to thick? Also for the dielectric I'm using >plastic, probably .002". I would have no idea where to start looking for >someone to stamp the plates. I wouldn't think that the local sheet metal >shop couldn't do it. Can you suggest where I should start looking for >someone to do this. If you plan to assemble 2500 plates what would you >estimate the high will be? I plan to build so many then test them then build >some more and so on. Do you really think that it will require that much >power? That would be alot of car batterys. > >Todd >jdavid28@ix.netcom.com > > > Well the design I decided to use will be made from 4 mil mylar as the dielectric and 10 mil aluminum roof flashing. I believe the original design made use of tin foil because of the ability to solder the connections together. As far as having it stamped by a machine shop it will be expensive I've recieved price quotes as high as $4000.00 to make the die and stamp out 1,000 conductor plates. I have contacted vocational schools in my area and the teachers have said they could make the making of the die a class project and if I supply the materials they would manufacture the die and stamp out the plates. The cost I have estimated is around $300.00 for the grade steel plate used for the making of the die and $23.00 per roll of roof flashing. Now for your dielectric I would suggest polyethalene sheet plastic 6 mil thick which is real cheap (around $30.00 for a 10' x 100' roll). I have decided to use an AC powered high voltage power supply rectified to DC. I have included a rough plate picture it's name is rocket.jpg. P.S. I haven't any professional experiance only trial and error. This device can store enough power to kill you or anyone coming into contact with it.. In other words you accept any responsibility for damages incurred by this device. The original design of this object can be found on Bill Beaty's homepage. If anyone has any suggestions I welcome them.. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 02:13:00 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA10231 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:54 -0800 Received: from service.agate.net (service.agate.net [199.191.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA10187 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:39 -0800 Received: from greatoz.sdi.agate.net (greatoz.sdi.agate.net [204.117.4.28]) by service.agate.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA21816 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 Message-Id: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> X-Sender: jbell@agate.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jbell@agate.net (John Bell) Subject: fnrg: Seiko Watch Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi. I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which would be false advertising. Thoughts? Thanks, _______________________________________________________________________ | | |John Bell "Any sufficiently advanced technology is| | indistinguishable from magic." | |jbell@greatoz.sdi.agate.net -Clarke's Third Law. | | "Any sufficiently retrograde magic is | |http://trio.ume.maine.edu/ indistinguishable from technology." | | ~ubrmsc/johnbell.html -Bell's Law of Reversal. | |_______________________________________________________________________| From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 02:28:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA13003 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:28:29 -0800 Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA12998 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:28:27 -0800 From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Received: from Lottoman by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id CAA19512; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:26:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199511161026.CAA19512@ix3.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: jdavid28@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 04:22:33 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 05:11 AM 11/16/95 -0500, you wrote: >Hi. > >I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They >claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From >the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning >half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other >things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything >about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or >have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which >would be false advertising. Thoughts? > >Thanks, > > _______________________________________________________________________ >| | >|John Bell "Any sufficiently advanced technology is| >| indistinguishable from magic." | >|jbell@greatoz.sdi.agate.net -Clarke's Third Law. | >| "Any sufficiently retrograde magic is | >|http://trio.ume.maine.edu/ indistinguishable from technology." | >| ~ubrmsc/johnbell.html -Bell's Law of Reversal. | >|_______________________________________________________________________| > > > > I heard about it the other day I didn't know it was Seiko. They said you would never have to replace the battery. It wasn't a commercial I saw, I think it was on CBS UTTM or ABC Nightline. But they did say much more about it. Have you heard a price on it yet? Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 02:32:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA13744 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:32:05 -0800 Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA13731 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:32:02 -0800 From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Received: from Lottoman by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id CAA19788; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:30:33 -0800 Message-Id: <199511161030.CAA19788@ix3.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: jdavid28@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 04:26:08 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: My test of the Electric Rocket so far Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Tonight I applied 12V DC to the 30 or so discs I have made so far. I'm maken them the same size as descibed on Bill's web page. 2" inside,4" outside. I know that I am far from finished, I just had to see if anything would happen. And nothing did happen. But after thinking about it some more I have decided to change up the design I'm trying a little. I measured a piece of aluminum foil at 0.0008". Or 1/10 as thick as the metal I'm using. Also after reading a few other articles on inventions like this one. I understand that the thicker the plates the higher the voltage required. I am now wondering if carbon would work and if I can find it in sheets thin enough, but not to fragile. I haven't decided on the dielectric just yet I would like to use something stiff like a circuit board, but I'm not even sure what would be like that. If I find the carbon I want I might just use ink jet paper. Of hand I can't think of how thick a mil is what would it be in inchs. And by the way I'm far from a professional. Let me know what you think of this design. Also how will it hold a charge? Is this really how a capacitor works? Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 04:24:56 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA03292 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 04:24:52 -0800 Received: from tom.compulink.co.uk (tom.compulink.co.uk [194.153.0.51]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA03264 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 04:24:47 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by tom.compulink.co.uk (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA05638 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 12:23:30 GMT Date: Thu, 16 Nov 95 12:22 GMT From: nic@cix.compulink.co.uk (Nic Landmark) Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Message-Id: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In-Reply-To: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> John Bell wrote: > Hi. > > I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. > They > claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). > From > the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning > half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other > things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard > anything > about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either > that or > have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, > which > would be false advertising. Thoughts? > No, it's just an ordinary generator that depends on the movement of your arm to make it work. Not that different from an ordinary self-winding watch in principle. Nic From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 12:53:26 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA17053 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:08:51 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16936 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:08:33 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id MAA06038 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 12:51:39 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816554733 Thu, 16 Nov 95 12:45:33 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 95 12:45:33 From: "reim" Encoding: 1738 Text Message-Id: <9510168165.AA816554733@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[2]: fnrg: Seiko Watch Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: yes I one had one of those watches about 20 years ago. I have seen a new long life lithium battery with a life span of 20 years. Perhaps this new watch uses one of these. After all the watch will probable not last that long but the battery will. It could be a marketing idea to sell more watches. As an example I have a digital pressure gauge that the manufacture claims a lifetime battery. I took it apart and is has your typical 7 to 10 year lithium battery in it. Obvious the device will not last forever but its good marketing. bob reim reim@advantor.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/16/95 11:55 AM On Thu, 16 Nov 1995, John Bell wrote: > Hi. > > I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They > claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From > the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning > half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other > things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything > about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or > have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which > would be false advertising. Thoughts? > A long time ago, there were watches that were "rewound" by the action of your arm during walking and normal use. They stored up energy as it moved... Perhaps this is a new interpretation of this principle... -- Chuck Knight From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 07:44:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA23405 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 07:44:43 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA23368 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 07:44:37 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id HAA27177; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 07:44:34 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 07:44:33 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Scalar detector circuit Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Check out the schematic for the Scalar Gradiometer on WEIRD SCIENCE, in the construction projects section. Text will follow, but anyone for now can start gathering parts if interested. This is the device described (and contributed!) by Bob Shannon below. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 10:42:01 EST From: Robert A. Shannon To: neotech@world.std.com Subject: How much interest would there be? -> SearchNet's neotech Mailing List How much interest would there be in a construction project for an electronic device which could detect and measure phenomena ranging from the human energy field to "ley lines" and other "esoteric" energies? The device in question is know as a Scalar Electrostatic Gradiometer. The device in question already exists, and it's operation is well proven. These devices have been used to map neolithic sites, and detected the original path of alignment of stone markers even though some had shifted from their original possition due to frost-thaw cycles, and incorrect modern reconstruction of the neolithic site. This same device has recently been shown to provide objective evidence of the shamantic practice of "charging" crystals actually effecting the electrostatic field around the crystal in a directly measureable way. Other appications range from paranormal investigation and crop circle verification to the testing of other scalar electromagnetic devices. ... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 08:22:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA06256 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 08:22:40 -0800 Received: from utdallas.edu (utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA06211 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 08:22:34 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by utdallas.edu (8.6.11/8.6.11) id KAA05211; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:22:25 -0600 Received: from infoserv.utdallas.edu by utdallas.edu (Brelay v6.01) with BLIMP; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:22:24 CST Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:22:23 -0600 (CST) From: Chuck Knight To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch In-Reply-To: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 16 Nov 1995, John Bell wrote: > Hi. > > I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They > claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From > the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning > half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other > things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything > about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or > have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which > would be false advertising. Thoughts? > A long time ago, there were watches that were "rewound" by the action of your arm during walking and normal use. They stored up energy as it moved... Perhaps this is a new interpretation of this principle... -- Chuck Knight From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 12:14:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA20621 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:17:40 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA20541; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:17:28 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15296; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:17:19 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:17:18 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com cc: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The US Patent & Trademark Office has just put an online patent searcher on their homepage at http://www.uspto.gov. It does real keyword searches and comes back with the abstract of the patents you select. Lots like CASSIS. It only searches one year at a time, and only goes back to 1985 presently. But who cares! Desktop patent searching for free! For me, this means no more commuting to the U of Wash Engineering library, paying for parking, walking through the rain, only to find the search machines all booked up for the night. Yippee! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 12:51:50 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA20864 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:18:15 -0800 Received: from HNLV4.VERIFONE.COM (hnlv4.VERIFONE.COM [148.5.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA20807 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:18:06 -0800 Received: from SFOV1 by verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5449) id <01HXPCZT879S8WYCKK@verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 08:16:06 -1000 Received: from sfov1.verifone.com by sfov1.verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5451) id <01HXPH4ZVXB40008WL@sfov1.verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:13:47 -1000 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:13:47 -1000 From: "Laszlo Nemes SMF1(916)823-0200" Subject: fnrg: Re: Seiko Watch To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Message-id: <01HXPH4ZX9J60008WL@sfov1.verifone.com> Organization: VeriFone X-PS-Qualifiers: /FONT=Courier-Bold/LINES=66/LEFT_MARGIN=36/CALCULATE/TOP_MARGIN=36/BOTTOM_MARGIN=36 X-VMS-To: IN%"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" X-VMS-Cc: LASZLO_N1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: IN%"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" 16-NOV-1995 02:33:26.89 To: IN%"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" CC: Subj: fnrg: Seiko Watch Hi. I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which would be false advertising. Thoughts? Thanks, _______________________________________________________________________ | | |John Bell "Any sufficiently advanced technology is| | indistinguishable from magic." | |jbell@greatoz.sdi.agate.net -Clarke's Third Law. | | "Any sufficiently retrograde magic is | |http://trio.ume.maine.edu/ indistinguishable from technology." | | ~ubrmsc/johnbell.html -Bell's Law of Reversal. | |_______________________________________________________________________| Return-path: Received: from HNLVX by sfov1.verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5451) id <01HXP0Z3ZRS00003I6@sfov1.verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:33:12 -1000 Received: from SFOV1 by verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5449) id <01HXOWHB90AO8WY8VX@verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 00:24:45 -1000 Received: from mail.eskimo.com by sfov1.verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5451) id <01HXP0M2DL340003GA@sfov1.verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:19:58 -1000 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA10231 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:54 -0800 Received: from service.agate.net (service.agate.net [199.191.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA10187 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:39 -0800 Received: from greatoz.sdi.agate.net (greatoz.sdi.agate.net [204.117.4.28]) by service.agate.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA21816 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 From: jbell@agate.net (John Bell) Subject: fnrg: Seiko Watch Sender: owner-freenrg-list@eskimo.com X-Sender: jbell@agate.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Message-id: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 10:28:25 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA24815 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:28:20 -0800 Received: from HNLV4.VERIFONE.COM (hnlv4.VERIFONE.COM [148.5.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA24745 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:28:11 -0800 Received: from SFOV1 by verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5449) id <01HXPDC8IMRK8WY244@verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 08:26:33 -1000 Received: from sfov1.verifone.com by sfov1.verifone.com (PMDF V4.3-7 #5451) id <01HXPH60GH520008WL@sfov1.verifone.com>; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:20:23 -1000 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:20:23 -1000 From: "Laszlo Nemes SMF1(916)823-0200" Subject: fnrg: Re: Seiko Watch To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Message-id: <01HXPH60GH540008WL@sfov1.verifone.com> Organization: VeriFone X-PS-Qualifiers: /FONT=Courier-Bold/LINES=66/LEFT_MARGIN=36/CALCULATE/TOP_MARGIN=36/BOTTOM_MARGIN=36 X-VMS-To: IN%"freenrg-list@eskimo.com" X-VMS-Cc: LASZLO_N1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: There is nothing mysterious about these. My father had one 30 years ago, only then they were called self-winding watches. The idea is that the half plate is on a ratchet that allows it to spin only in the 'winding' direction. It is the motion of your arm that is the energy source. If the watch was left sitting it would stop once the mainspring unwound. Laszlo ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ John Bell wrote: Hi. I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which would be false advertising. Thoughts? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 14:28:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA00212 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 14:27:59 -0800 Received: from l2.conline.com (root@l2.conline.com [204.96.7.69]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA29983 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 14:27:41 -0800 Received: from dal1-20.conline.com (dal1-20.conline.com [204.96.7.116]) by l2.conline.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA25620 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 16:28:01 -0600 Message-Id: <199511162228.QAA25620@l2.conline.com> X-Sender: lorri@l1.conline.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 16:26:22 -0600 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: lorri@conline.com (Lorri Payton) Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >In-Reply-To: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> >John Bell wrote: >> Hi. >> >> I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. >> They >> claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). >> From >> the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning >> half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other >> things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard >> anything >> about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either >> that or >> have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, >> which >> would be false advertising. Thoughts? >> > >No, it's just an ordinary generator that depends on the movement of your >arm to make it work. Not that different from an ordinary self-winding >watch in principle. > >Nic > > Does this mean that if it is left to sit in a drawer for an extended period of time it will no longer function? Lorri From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 13:36:13 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA09163 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 13:35:57 -0800 Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA09090 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 13:35:45 -0800 Received: from dialup-a21.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a21.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.21]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id IAA14561 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 08:32:59 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511162132.IAA14561@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 08:36:44 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Getting ready to Build electric rocket Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 14 Nov 95 at 21:40, S.G. wrote: > Well I currently experiment with Tesla coils and electrostatic devices, > When I saw the plan on Bill B's home page I knew I had to try it. Thus far I > have drawn a CAD drawing of what I thought the capacitor plate should look > like, collected enough mylar skraps for a 2500 plate system and looking for > a tool and die maker that doesn't charge 4000.00 dollars to stamp out the > darn plates. Hopefully I will post the results in a few months. Powering > the device presents a small problem, How do I go about producing very high > voltage high current DC power in an appartment environment without killing Why do you need high current? I would have thought that once the capacitor was charged, it would require almost none. Given that the charging can take as long as you like, surely you don't need high current. > myself or the other tenents. I am in the process of obtaining a 480v AC to > 40KV DC transformer from an electronic air percipitator.. If anyone has any > ideas that you may think to be helpfull please email me clipper@iglou.com.. > > > Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 18:36:58 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA04092 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 18:36:47 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA04026 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 18:36:36 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA08100; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 18:36:31 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 18:36:30 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! In-Reply-To: <9510168165.AA816568519@irout.advantor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 16 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > > I tried it about two weeks ago and I could not find out what menu you > need to be in to do a search. I tried , I thought, all of them. > Please tell me what menu you have to be in for the search Two weeks ago it didn't exist. It only came online four days ago. Look again. It says something like "bibliographic databaase patent search" .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 04:14:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA02309 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 04:11:59 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA02303 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 04:11:57 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA21012 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:10:48 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id GAA28731; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:11:48 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Counter Wave energy saving device Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 20:51:02 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199511160039.SAA24398@firefly.prairienet.org> In-Reply-To: <199511160039.SAA24398@firefly.prairienet.org> Lines: 26 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <199511160039.SAA24398@firefly.prairienet.org>, you wrote: > > >> >>Hello all, >>Has anyone heard of this device? Supposedly you hook it up to the refridgerator >>or washing machine and it will use considerably less power. >> >>> COUNTER WAVE >> >>>Single Phase or Three Phase Inductive Energy Recycling system >> >>>"...advanced electronic technology designed to significantly reduce your >> >>>energy consumption, instantly." >> They are known as Power Factor Correction devices. They get the current in phase with the voltage when driving inductive loads like motors. I had experience with a Zmos unit, all of it bad. On small motors the cost of the device probably would take a long time to repay its cost. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 04:14:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id EAA02323 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 04:12:02 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id EAA02311 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 04:12:00 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA21016 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:10:49 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id GAA28735; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:11:48 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: My test of the Electric Rocket so far Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 21:04:51 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199511161030.CAA19788@ix3.ix.netcom.com> In-Reply-To: <199511161030.CAA19788@ix3.ix.netcom.com> Lines: 5 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article <199511161030.CAA19788@ix3.ix.netcom.com>, you wrote: >I haven't decided on the dielectric just yet... T.T.Brown seemed to like Bismuth, which is diamagnetic. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 19:06:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA14771 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 19:05:59 -0800 Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA14761 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 19:05:56 -0800 Received: from dp2-072.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tGGr8-0003DKC; Thu, 16 Nov 95 21:48 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 21:53:57 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Well I managed to get that 480 volt ac to 40 KV dc transformer it is a bit large, oil filled and heavy about 250 lbs. The engineer said that it should work with standard 240 volt and get about 18 KV or so dc. Also I should be able to use an autotransformer to get variable voltage output. I know this thing is large but just thing of the fun you could have with this puppy :). I also found a vocational school that would make the steel die and stamp out 3000 conductor plates for around $400.00 before I spend this amount and get killed by my wife I plan to search out metal gasket designs that may be suitable for this application. Another possible alternative may be the use of lithographic negatives. Just have 3000 negetives made of the plate making the object solid on the film clear on the outside using the silver nitrate as the conductor and the mylar as the dielectric. Can someone tell me if silver nitrate is conductive enough for this possible purpose. Lithographic film is .006 inches thick with a silver nitrate coating of about .001 inch thick. If I'm using too much bandwidth please let me know or I'll never shutup... Thanks From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 23:34:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA08565 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:34:06 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA08553 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:34:03 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA04653; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:33:59 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:33:57 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: capacitor plate matters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 16 Nov 1995, S.G. wrote: > Well I managed to get that 480 volt ac to 40 KV dc transformer it is a > bit large, oil filled and heavy about 250 lbs. The engineer said that it > should work with standard 240 volt and get about 18 KV or so dc. Also I > should be able to use an autotransformer to get variable voltage output. I > know this thing is large but just thing of the fun you could have with this > puppy :). Yeah, big mother tesla coils, or jacob's ladders with 6ft arcs (but use a big variac or heater-as-ballast in series with the 240V side!) Check out the H&R Co. catalog. They usually have various little bitty 20KV supplies that run off 120Vac or 24Vdc, for $30 or less. I have one (not offered any more) that runs off two 9v cells in series and puts out about 20KV. > I also found a vocational school that would make the steel die and > stamp out 3000 conductor plates for around $400.00 before I spend this > amount and get killed by my wife I plan to search out metal gasket designs > that may be suitable for this application. How about trying a die-cutting print shop? They may be able to handle foil of a few mil thick. Their dies, if precision is not required, tend to be slotted wood with razor blades. They're cheap if all you want is some simple round-corner square shapes. Way under $100, I would expect. Copper foil is somewhat available, not too expensive, thin, and solderable. I think I still have a 20ft roll in my mass of basement junk. It's carried by Alaskan Copper and Brass here in Seattle. Anyone find some actual *tin* foil yet? > Another possible alternative may > be the use of lithographic negatives. Just have 3000 negetives made of the > plate making the object solid on the film clear on the outside using the > silver nitrate as the conductor and the mylar as the dielectric. Can someone > tell me if silver nitrate is conductive enough for this possible purpose. > Lithographic film is .006 inches thick with a silver nitrate coating of > about .001 inch thick. I suspect that the silver itself isn't conductive because it's suspended in gelatin. The gelatin is conductive if humidity is kept high. Realize of course that if nothing happens, we'll blame the silver nitrate. It's always a good idea to follow plans exactly. Then if they don't work, the blame can be put on the inventor rather than on the variations. Maybe. ;) If the plates of the device are simply stamped out whole, then we'll blame this process if the effect fails, since the instructions clearly state that the plates are supposed to be made of little metal squares. The process of stacking the squares may play a larger part than does the voltage in making the capacitor asymmetrical. If the capacitor acts symmetrically, it will simply compress itself and have no reason to thrust in one direction or another. The + and - voltage may control the thrust direction. But then again, maybe the stacks of little squares do it. India ink is VERY conductive (at least as far as DC Hi Voltage goes.) If you painted both sides of paper with it, you could have it die-cut in a print shop. But then if it doesn't work, there's always the niggling doubt that the element tin plays some role in the claimed effect. There's always this: if you build the thing of soldered metal, you'll end up with a very nice low-impedance discharge capacitor, even if there's no gravity thrust effect. Rail guns, tesla coils, exploding water, high freq maglev, home lithotripsy tanks (ha.), all become possible. And if you dunk it in oil, I bet that even a paper dielectric can withstand quite high a voltage. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 23:36:30 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA09050 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:36:24 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA09022 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:36:17 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA04885; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:36:14 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:36:13 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Seiko Watch In-Reply-To: <1995Nov17.075708+0100@[139.79.69.152]> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 17 Nov 1995, Christian Korfmacher wrote: > In fact there is a little difference to the principle you described; > Until recently automatic rewinding was done like you described it, > with a ratchet and two special cogwheels winding up a spring for > storing of the energy. This principle can only be used for mechanical > watches. > > In an electronic watch you need some electrical energy; You know how > to get mechanical energy (description above); now we need to transform > the mechanical energy into electrical energy. One of the oldest and > still one of the best ways to do so is an electrical GENERATOR just > like the dynamo on your bycicle. Now connect the ratchet and the > cogwheels to the generator and you will get electrical energy which > you can store in a rechargeable battery or even in a capacitor. Oh boy! Just me, my desk full of floppies, and a little permanent magnet spinning around on my wrist... :) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 00:19:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA15060 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:57:11 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA14912 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:56:52 -0800 From: William Beaty Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA06686; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:56:37 -0800 Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 23:56:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199511170756.XAA06686@eskimo.com> To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Experiments in Unconventional Physics Requested Newsgroups: alt.sci.physics.new-theories Organization: Eskimo North (206) For-Ever X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The following from newsgroups, from kbreslau@direct.ca. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page In article <48b1lo$s7g@grid.direct.ca> you wrote: : Was looking for information on experiments in unconventional physics, 'Orgon : Energy' (the work of Wilhelm Reich), 'Scalar Field Potential (Telsa, : Bearden..) and in improbable coincidence. : Not really interested in theories or opinions, but in experimental design, with : appartus, methodology and results. It seems to me that the quackery of theory : without suggestions of experimental predictions that can confirm, deny or : demolish theories is a poor use of the human mind and of the scientific method. : If anyone has information about, or suggestions of quantitative experiments or : would like to participate as experimenters, on experiments that can be perfomed : on a reasonable budget of scientific inquiry please post. : Hear are some sample experiments, please comment freely on ways to do them, or : other experiments that will confirm, deny or demolish the theory on which : they are based. : 1) Growing sets of seedlings under the double-blind condition that some : that may be on top of an orgon accumulator, but that the tender of the plants : does not know which one may or may not be under the influence of the : accumulator(a layered, organic, inorganic pillow of steel wool and cotton). : : 2) If any experiments have been performed on whether a 'Cloud-buster or : any imposed condition or appartus can accelerate the radio-acitve decay rate of : a known isotope. Observing the beta and alpha decay of a pitchblend sample : under the double-blind influence of a 'cloud-buster, which is a set of : metallic tubes connected conductively to running water (unsure if being part : of an ecosystem matters). : 3) I have a recollection of a story of an experiment, where people where : placed at a computer keyboard and asked to press a key whenver they felt like : it, and the computer would generate a pseudo-random number using the time, key : pressed as variables to determine the random number seed. One group was asked : to conciously wish for even numbers, another odd numbers and the third given no : explicit instruction. The results from dozens of were supposedly a very : slight shifting of the even/odd distribution in the direction of the desired, : but that is was 'statistically significant at a very high confidence level : because many subjects pressed the keys so many times.... : Is this merely a psychic myth, or can anyone point to a researcher who did this : experiment, or source of the story. : To reproduce it, I suggest an MS Windows/Visual Basic program, given over the : Internet that flashes the desired result on a screen and then generates the : result on the next key-stroke, recording the variables used to determine the : seed number & desired result, encoding it for storage, transmission and : collecting a large group of users ~ 1500 who spent at least an hour each : playing with probability. : 4) Determine the speed of travel of a 'scalar wave created by a caduceus : coil, and recieved byan aligned caduceus coil by measuring the time delay on a : high performance oscilloscope with equal lengths leads between the signal at : the beginning of the transmitter coil and the end of the recieving coil. : If persons would like to participate in experiments, or once interesting : results that can be duplicated are then interested in developing or shooting : down theories, please e-mail to kbreslau@direct.ca : Sincerely, Klaus Breslauer -- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 16 22:59:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA28645 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 22:58:13 -0800 Received: from hslrswi.hasler.ascom.ch (hslrswi.hasler.ascom.ch [139.79.129.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA28584 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 22:58:00 -0800 Received: from ens.ascom.ch by hslrswi.hasler.ascom.ch (8.7.1/6.33) id HAA24540; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:56:39 +0100 (MET) Received: from stva99.ens.ascom.ch by ens.ascom.ch (4.1/SMI-4.1-DNI-7.0.1) id AA12340; Fri, 17 Nov 95 07:58:37 +0100 Received: from [139.79.69.152] (ptva52) by stva99.ens.ascom.ch (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA01361; Fri, 17 Nov 95 07:56:38 +0100 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: Christian Korfmacher Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Seiko Watch X-Originating-Host: [139.79.69.152] In-Reply-To: <01HXPH60GH540008WL@sfov1.verifone.com> Message-Id: <1995Nov17.075708+0100@[139.79.69.152]> Date: 17 Nov 1995 07:57:08 +0100 X-Mailer: BWMail for Windows Version 3.1 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A In <01HXPH60GH540008WL@sfov1.verifone.com>, Laszlo Nemes SMF1(916)823-0200 wrote: >There is nothing mysterious about these. My father had one 30 years ago, only >then they were called self-winding watches. The idea is that the half plate is >on a ratchet that allows it to spin only in the 'winding' direction. It is the >motion of your arm that is the energy source. If the watch was left sitting it >would stop once the mainspring unwound. > >Laszlo > In fact there is a little difference to the principle you described; Until recently automatic rewinding was done like you described it, with a ratchet and two special cogwheels winding up a spring for storing of the energy. This principle can only be used for mechanical watches. In an electronic watch you need some electrical energy; You know how to get mechanical energy (description above); now we need to transform the mechanical energy into electrical energy. One of the oldest and still one of the best ways to do so is an electrical GENERATOR just like the dynamo on your bycicle. Now connect the ratchet and the cogwheels to the generator and you will get electrical energy which you can store in a rechargeable battery or even in a capacitor. Thats it, all for now CHK -- Christian Korfmacher Ascom Business Systems Voice:+41 (0)65 24 27 16 Fax: +41 (9)65 24 31 56 You know, we learn by making mistakes. You'll learn a lot today! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 06:22:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id GAA29208 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:22:27 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA29171 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 06:22:21 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id JAA16484 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 09:11:36 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816627922 Fri, 17 Nov 95 09:05:22 Date: Fri, 17 Nov 95 09:05:22 From: "reim" Encoding: 10140 Text Message-Id: <9510178166.AA816627922@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[6]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: wow what a great article. I have not heard about alot of that but I am interested. I will be sending a large envelope for some info, when I get around to it. I also know that barium titinate K value change from about 2000 to 10,000 with increase temperature. I am still working on getting my caps made but so far no success yet. One thing the barium titinate I have is in power form and it is bright white and not transparent. How would light pass through it? I'll keep in touch. bob reim reim@advantor.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Re[4]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/17/95 7:08 AM Bob, this is Bert. I'm very much interested in seeing how the barium titanate works out. B.T. is a nonlinear material, both optically and electrically. For example, barium titanate has a "k" of several thousand, versus glass which has a k factor of about 8. BUT, as you apply a d.c. voltage to b.t., its k factor changes! James S. Fink wrote an excellent article in the February 1954 (yes, 1954) Radio Electronics on "Introducing the Dielectric Amplifier" which used, of all things, barium titanate! It seems you can build an AMPLIFIER using a b.t. capacitor as an amplifier.... really! These amps are extremely rugged. Barium titanate changes its capacitance when voltage is applied. This feature can be used so that a an a.c. signal is fed into the capacitor which has been biased with d.c. to the optimum point where its CHANGE of k is maximum, and so can be used to amplify the signal. Magnetic amplifiers, using saturated magnetic coils have long been used as amplifiers, but dielectric amps are almost unheard of. Until just a few months ago, I had NEVER in my ancient 43 years even heard of such a thing as a dielectric amplifier. Anyway, the bulk of this article is based upon a more in-depth article written by Lt. Commander A.M. Vincent, U.S.N., in "Electronics", Dec. 1951. Vincent goes into more detail about some of the different materials used in dielectric materials by researchers, charts, etc. BTW, guys, I have photocopies of both these articles, if anyone is interested (hint, hint). Oh yes, don't you find it interesting that papers on barium titanate dielectric amplifiers disappeared from the literature, abut the same time that the government started suppressing information on barium titanate capacitors in T.T. Brown's work? I'll bet it was just a coincidence.... right? I've also found that barium titanate crystals are used in non-linear optics. It seems that the crystals change their refractive index, dependent upon the intensity of the beam of light passing thru them. So what, you may ask?? Think about it, for a moment. If you shine a laser thru a glass prism, the beam will refract and shine on a spot on the wall of your garage, excuse me, I mean lab. No matter how dim or bright the laser beam, the dot will always hit the same spot. (yes, I know different color beams would hit different spots). BUT, change out the glass prism with barium titanate, and the atoms in the b.t. REACT or INTERACT with the photons, and the atoms change their properties! Their refractive index changes, and the spot on the wall moves! Changing the intensity of the light causes the beam to move. Researchers have used this effect to build real "phase conjugate mirrors". Now you want to know what the hell is a phase conjugate mirror? Tom Bearden went overboard in his use of the phrase, but sure enough, it is a real effect. You can take a barium titanate crystal, a beam splitter, a wedge-mirror, and a laser, and send a beam of light through a frosted glass window...you know the kind that are used so you can't see into bathrooms? Well, anyway, the phase conjugate light (pcl) hits the glass and starts scattering all-to-hell because of the tiny pits in the frosted glass....by the time the coherent beam makes it thru the glass, it's no longer coherent. The wildly scattered photons bounce off the walls and bathtub and sink and naked women (or men, as the case may be) and then the WEIRD stuff starts happening! If we had shown a flashlight thru the frosted window, some of the photons are gonna bounce off the naked dude or dudette and come BACK trough the glass, taking completely different paths, by the way, and we'd see a big white blur. BUT if the light came from a phase conjugate mirror, the photons RETRACE their path back through the frosted glass, taking EXACTLY the SAME original path that they used going INTO the room! Thus, the image you see is NOT blurred, but perfectly clear! Yep, we are no longer safe in our bathrooms. Another thing that happens is weird too. If you take a laser beam and shine it on a wall 100 feet away, you will find that the beam has DIVERGED, or spread out, and will be perhaps an inch in diameter. Shine it on a wall TWO HUNDRED feet away, and the beam will have diverged some more and will be TWO inches across. Now let's put a MIRRON on the first wall, which is one hundred feet away. The laser beam is one inc across when it hits the mirror. It bounces back to us and we measure the diamter of the beam shining on the front of our white lab smock, and guess how wide it is? yep, TWO inches, exactly. Now we do exactly the same experiment, but we use a laser beam which has passed thru our phace conjugate mirror. How wide will the beam be when it bounces back? It damn sure won't be two inches!!!! First of all, the PCL beam will NOT be shining on our lab coat... the pcl photon will EXACTLY retrace their original paths BACK to the laser source. AND instead of DIVERGING light regular light, they will CONVERGE back to their source! Physicists claim that this effect of the photons retracing their paths and reconverging can best be described as the photons traveling backward in time! If you shot a photon out of a laser to a target, and at the moment the photon touched th target and reflected, if at that moment you coud send the photon BACKWARD in time, it would retrace it's path exactly back to the source, which is what we see happening! If you think photons don't exist outside our time frame reference, check out the physics echos some time... Now if you don't think photons traveling backward in time (or an effect which mimicks this precisely) isn't absolutely incredible, then you're logged into the wrong Web page!........ but it gets even better! (do I sound excited about this stuff ? ) See Scientific American, July 1985 (I'm pretty sure this is the issue) for a very good article on phace conjuate light applications, with some good color pictures (unfortunately, not of naked people - o.k., I'm a pervert, I have to admit it ). The U.S. government has spent BILLIONS of dollars utilizing another property of PCL in the SDI Star Wars fiasco. See the April, May, June time frame of "Nuts and Volts Magazine" for some EXCELLENT articles on how pcl can be used to build a laser device which can track an incoming ICBM, or maybe a bullet travelling 1200 ft. per second and vaporize it in mid air.... and the tracking system uses NO MOVING PARTS! Heck, you could build a laser device that would lock onto and follow an intruder in your back yard - again, no moving parts, i.e., can track VERY fast. Think about what can be done with a pcl beam which LOCKS onto a target and tracks it, and there are no moving parts! The author, Anthony Charlton goes on to show you how to build a demo device of your own (and I have copies of these articles I can send to interested Beatyites). And all of this comes back to barium titanate, T.T. Brown, and guess what? Brown's effect HAS to be tied in with the fact that barium titanate is non-linear, and changes capacitance in step with applied voltages. The effes IS non-linear, and that would explain why the Biefied-Brown effect is small at voltages of 50,000, and increases rapidly (i.e., non-linearly) with increasing voltage. Of course, the last is all my own hypothesis, but I believe it to be true. And there's only one way to verify it, and several of us are trying to get to that point. It's a hard place to reach, that's for sure! I encourage you and the other private researchers to keep on working on this area, because every indication is that our government has done EXACTLY that same research. Dr. Paul LaViolette has contacts that have leaked information that the B2 stealth bomber uses not only electrified leading edges on the wings to reduce air drag, but the B2 very likely charges the aircraft with positive electrons and the EXHAUST with negative ions, developing a total voltage potential across the aircraft of over 15,000,000 volts, causing the Biefied-Brown effect to kick in, providing at least a substantial loss of weight, helping the aircraft to stay aloft and increasing it's range (maybe even providing ALL the aircraft's lift!) Anyway, those of you wanting copies of this stuff can send me a large sase envelope with about $1.50 of stamps affixed, and I'll be glad to make additional copies of the stuff I've found, and stuff it in and send it back to you. Bert Pool 633 Reveille Rd. Fort Worth, TX 76108 O.K., I've used up enough bandwidth here, and I hope some of you find this of use in your areas of research! Bert > > Hi bert is bob reim. I was the one inquiring about the ceramic > material. right now I am working with a lady who runs a ceramic class > and she is trying to create the caps her self. I should know how it > turns out in one to two weeks. I'll let you know [bunches deleted after this] From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 00:17:09 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA21631 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 00:17:07 -0800 Received: from ix6.ix.netcom.com (ix6.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA21621 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 00:17:04 -0800 From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Received: from Lottoman by ix6.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id AAA27501; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 00:15:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199511170815.AAA27501@ix6.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: jdavid28@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 02:11:05 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re:S.G. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Another possible alternative may >be the use of lithographic negatives. Just have 3000 negetives made of the >plate making the object solid on the film clear on the outside using the >silver nitrate as the conductor and the mylar as the dielectric. Can someone >tell me if silver nitrate is conductive enough for this possible purpose. >Lithographic film is .006 inches thick with a silver nitrate coating of >about .001 inch thick. > > > If I'm using too much bandwidth please let me know or I'll never >shutup... Thanks > > SG can you explain this a little better for me. The negative will have the silver nitrate on one side or embedded in the mylar. While I've heard of the stuff I can't say that I have ever seen it. Currently I'm still looking for a carbon sheet material. Does anyone know if carbon would be very conductive at a thickness of .001? I am also looking for a way to desolve it with out breaking it down. Then I might be able to saturate a paper material with it, since I can't find any real carbon paper. I'm not sure if heat will be a problem, but if it does when it burns I won't have much to show for proof. I had planned to follow the plans, but It has taken me about two weeks to build 30 plates that way. Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 00:13:48 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA20738 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 00:13:42 -0800 Received: from mbyte2.eng.aat.co.za (IS-txeng.ISnet.net [196.4.161.238]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA20663 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 00:13:30 -0800 Received: from dev2.eng.aat.co.za ([196.6.183.25]) by mbyte2.eng.aat.co.za (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA00802; Fri, 17 Nov 95 10:14:52+020 Received: from TELEMATICS/MAILQUEUE by dev2.eng.aat.co.za (Mercury 1.21); 17 Nov 95 10:19:00 +2 Received: from MAILQUEUE by TELEMATICS (Mercury 1.21); 17 Nov 95 10:18:44 +2 From: "chris kleynhans" Organization: Alcatel Altech Telecoms To: jbell@agate.net (John Bell), freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 10:18:35 +2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch X-Confirm-Reading-To: "chris kleynhans" X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.22 Message-Id: <37030F72EED@dev2.eng.aat.co.za> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Received: from MAILQUEUE by TELEMATICS (Mercury 1.21); 16 Nov 95 12:19:57 +2 > Return-path: > Received: from mail.eskimo.com by dev2.eng.aat.co.za (Mercury 1.21); > 16 Nov 95 12:19:50 +2 > Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA10231 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:54 -0800 > Received: from service.agate.net (service.agate.net [199.191.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA10187 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 02:11:39 -0800 > Received: from greatoz.sdi.agate.net (greatoz.sdi.agate.net [204.117.4.28]) by service.agate.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA21816 for ; Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 > Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 05:11:32 -0500 > Message-Id: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> > X-Sender: jbell@agate.net > X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > From: jbell@agate.net (John Bell) > Subject: fnrg: Seiko Watch > Sender: owner-freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > X-PMFLAGS: 34078848 > > Hi. > > I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the 'kinetic'. They > claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). From > the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a spinning > half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among other > things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard anything > about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either that or > have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for years, which > would be false advertising. Thoughts? > > Thanks, > > _______________________________________________________________________ > | | > |John Bell "Any sufficiently advanced technology is| > | indistinguishable from magic." | > |jbell@greatoz.sdi.agate.net -Clarke's Third Law. | > | "Any sufficiently retrograde magic is | > |http://trio.ume.maine.edu/ indistinguishable from technology." | > | ~ubrmsc/johnbell.html -Bell's Law of Reversal. | > |_______________________________________________________________________| > > > Hi There The principle is simple! Kinetic means movement and that is exactly how it works. It is similar to the old "Automatic" Mechanical watches of earlier. The disk rotates occasionally under the influence of your wrist and movement and generates electricity in the process that is stored in some charge storage device such as a battery. Which confirms again that there is no such thing as free energy, just a transfer from one form to the other. The free energy that we are searching for does exist as a river flowing past us. All we got to discover are ways of utilising it! Your Southernly friend Chris Kleynhans In lovely South Africa From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 19:30:29 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA08920 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:16:47 -0800 Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA08875 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:16:41 -0800 Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA20037 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 14:16:29 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7/8.7) id OAA14062; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 14:16:27 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[4]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:39:36 -0500 Message-ID: References: <199511170346.VAA03913@fastlane.net> In-Reply-To: <199511170346.VAA03913@fastlane.net> Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >I encourage you and the other private researchers to keep on working on this >area, because every indication is that our government has done EXACTLY that >same research. Dr. Paul LaViolette has contacts that have leaked >information that the B2 stealth bomber uses not only electrified leading >edges on the wings to reduce air drag, but the B2 very likely charges the >aircraft with positive electrons and the EXHAUST with negative ions, >developing a total voltage potential across the aircraft of over 15,000,000 >volts, causing the Biefied-Brown effect to kick in, providing at least a >substantial loss of weight, helping the aircraft to stay aloft and >increasing it's range (maybe even providing ALL the aircraft's lift!) Look up the Dudley Paten as well, it fits here perfectly. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 09:59:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA16282 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 09:59:18 -0800 Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA16239 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 09:59:11 -0800 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id MAA02019 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:51:33 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA816641121 Fri, 17 Nov 95 12:45:21 Date: Fri, 17 Nov 95 12:45:21 From: "reim" Encoding: 2192 Text Message-Id: <9510178166.AA816641121@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: Re[4]: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Thanks for the info. I haven't been on it since this past weekend. I was going to post a message to this group about it last week but since I could not figure out how to do a patent search I figured it was pretty worthless. I will try again this weekend. Its to bad that TT Brown patents are over 20 years old. talk to you latter. bob reim reim@advantor.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Re[2]: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! Author: magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list at ~Internet Date: 11/17/95 11:25 AM On Fri, 17 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > I will have to look for that menu but that title does not sound > familiar. As for the time frame I was on it last wednesday if I > recall. I got the address from one of my engineering magazine that > was over 1 month old with an article about it. I think its been there > over 4 days. I saw it in ELECTRONIC DESIGN I think. It said that the site would open on 11/9. I tried it just a few minutes before sending out my message about it. If the PTO was a little late with opening the site, there might not have been anything until even LATER than 11/9. I, also, went looking for the site when I first saw the magazine article, found absolutely nothing, then noticed the later date. I figured that I was there early, then tried again. I also figured that THOSE WWW PEOPLE AT THE USPTO ARE TOTAL FOOLS, EVERYONE WHO READS THE ARTICLE WILL DO THE SAME THING I DID, AND ENCOUNTER A HUGE SET OF WEB PAGES WITH *NOT ONE MENTION* OF THE FUTURE OPENING OF A PATENT SEARCH!!!! The patent search is now on the USPTO top page, a few screens down, next to a link for patents involving AIDS research. ....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 07:59:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA00720 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:59:02 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA00684 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:58:54 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id HAA15595; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:58:45 -0800 Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 07:58:43 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! In-Reply-To: <9510178166.AA816626721@irout.advantor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Fri, 17 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > I will have to look for that menu but that title does not sound > familiar. As for the time frame I was on it last wednesday if I > recall. I got the address from one of my engineering magazine that > was over 1 month old with an article about it. I think its been there > over 4 days. I saw it in ELECTRONIC DESIGN I think. It said that the site would open on 11/9. I tried it just a few minutes before sending out my message about it. If the PTO was a little late with opening the site, there might not have been anything until even LATER than 11/9. I, also, went looking for the site when I first saw the magazine article, found absolutely nothing, then noticed the later date. I figured that I was there early, then tried again. I also figured that THOSE WWW PEOPLE AT THE USPTO ARE TOTAL FOOLS, EVERYONE WHO READS THE ARTICLE WILL DO THE SAME THING I DID, AND ENCOUNTER A HUGE SET OF WEB PAGES WITH *NOT ONE MENTION* OF THE FUTURE OPENING OF A PATENT SEARCH!!!! The patent search is now on the USPTO top page, a few screens down, next to a link for patents involving AIDS research. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 19:17:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA16723 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 10:00:33 -0800 Received: from clark.dgim.doc.ca (root@crc.doc.ca [142.92.39.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA16642 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 10:00:17 -0800 Received: from Steckly.Gary.dgrr000.ic.gc.ca by clark.dgim.doc.ca (4.1/SMI-4.1.tee) id AA24073; Fri, 17 Nov 95 13:00:01 EST Date: Fri, 17 Nov 95 13:00:01 EST Message-Id: <9511171800.AA24073@clark.dgim.doc.ca> X-Sender: gsteckly@clark.dgim.doc.ca Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: gsteckly@clark.dgim.doc.ca (Gary Steckly) Subject: Re: Re[2]: fnrg: Hooray! Free patent search! X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Regarding Bill Beaty's note where he said (in part): >The patent search is now on the USPTO top page, a few screens down, next >to a link for patents involving AIDS research. > If you want to go directly to the site that maintains the USPTO search facility, the URL is: http://patents.cnidr.org:4242/ It works pretty well. Especially if used in conjunction with some of the commercial electronic services for delivering the complete patents via the net, once you know the patent number. For example, I recently subscribed to a service that will deliver the entire patent at 25 cents a page via the net. They also allow you to download for free a copy of the first page of any patent, just so can be certain that it is in fact the one you want before you pay up. Their archives currently go back to 1974. They use some proprietary software called "PatentImage Viewer" , which is distributed for free, that employs CCITT group 4 compression, so you get a great resolution image that doesn't take a lot of storage space or net bandwidth for transmission. If anyone is interested, check out this url: http://www.micropat.com/ regards Gary From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 12:24:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA11667 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:23:36 -0800 Received: from metronet.com (Usdf@mail.metronet.com [192.245.137.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA11586 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:23:22 -0800 Received: by metronet.com id AA29817 (5.67a/IDA1.5hp for eskimo.com!freenrg-list); Fri, 17 Nov 1995 15:22:30 -0500 Received: from SDF.LONESTAR.ORG with uucp; Fri, 17 Nov 95 14:13:44 Received: by SDF.LONESTAR.ORG (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tGXAJ-0000R0C; Fri, 17 Nov 95 14:13 CST Message-Id: From: chuck@sdf.lonestar.org (Chuck Knight) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re:S.G. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 14:13:38 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <199511170815.AAA27501@ix6.ix.netcom.com> from "jdavid28@ix.netcom.com" at Nov 17, 95 02:11:05 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2121 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > > >Another possible alternative may > >be the use of lithographic negatives. Just have 3000 negetives made of the > >plate making the object solid on the film clear on the outside using the > >silver nitrate as the conductor and the mylar as the dielectric. Can someone > >tell me if silver nitrate is conductive enough for this possible purpose. > >Lithographic film is .006 inches thick with a silver nitrate coating of > >about .001 inch thick. This may actually work...photographic developer reduces the exposed silver nitrate crystals to metallic silver...the unexposed ones remain soluble and are washed away. My concern would be with d-max...can you get a continuous coating of metallic silver? Or would it be mere closely spaced grains? Check for the film with the highest d-max... (maximum density value) and keep us informed. If this works...it'd be quite interesting. > SG can you explain this a little better for me. The negative will have the > silver nitrate on one side or embedded in the mylar. While I've heard of > the stuff I can't say that I have ever seen it. Actually, the silver nitrate is the light sensitive part...converted to metallic silver during development. The devloped grains are suspended in the emulsion (gelatin) on one side of the film base. > Currently I'm still looking for a carbon sheet material. Does anyone know if > carbon would be very conductive at a thickness of .001? I am also looking > for a way to desolve it with out breaking it down. Then I might be able to > saturate a paper material with it, since I can't find any real carbon paper. > I'm not sure if heat will be a problem, but if it does when it burns I won't > have much to show for proof. I don't know if it would remain conductive, but carbon transfer paper for the carbon photographic process is avaialble at Photographer's Formulary...they specialize in materials for alternative processes. Another possibility would be Porter's Camera. Both have 800 numbers, so you can get the phone numbers from 800-555-1212, directory assistance. Hope this helps... -- Chuck Knight From eskimo.com!freenrg-list-owner Fri Nov 17 22:32:45 1995 remote from apollo.is.co.za Received: from mail.eskimo.com by apollo.is.co.za (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4tmp8) id WAA26586; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 22:32:42 +0200 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA11667 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:23:36 -0800 Received: from metronet.com (Usdf@mail.metronet.com [192.245.137.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA11586 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:23:22 -0800 Received: by metronet.com id AA29817 (5.67a/IDA1.5hp for eskimo.com!freenrg-list); Fri, 17 Nov 1995 15:22:30 -0500 Received: from SDF.LONESTAR.ORG with uucp; Fri, 17 Nov 95 14:13:44 Received: by SDF.LONESTAR.ORG (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tGXAJ-0000R0C; Fri, 17 Nov 95 14:13 CST Message-Id: From: apollo.is.co.za!sdf.lonestar.org!chuck (Chuck Knight) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re:S.G. To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 14:13:38 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <199511170815.AAA27501@ix6.ix.netcom.com> from "jdavid28@ix.netcom.com" at Nov 17, 95 02:11:05 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2121 Sender: apollo.is.co.za!eskimo.com!owner-freenrg-list Precedence: bulk Reply-To: apollo.is.co.za!eskimo.com!freenrg-list Status: RO X-Status: > > >Another possible alternative may > >be the use of lithographic negatives. Just have 3000 negetives made of the > >plate making the object solid on the film clear on the outside using the > >silver nitrate as the conductor and the mylar as the dielectric. Can someone > >tell me if silver nitrate is conductive enough for this possible purpose. > >Lithographic film is .006 inches thick with a silver nitrate coating of > >about .001 inch thick. This may actually work...photographic developer reduces the exposed silver nitrate crystals to metallic silver...the unexposed ones remain soluble and are washed away. My concern would be with d-max...can you get a continuous coating of metallic silver? Or would it be mere closely spaced grains? Check for the film with the highest d-max... (maximum density value) and keep us informed. If this works...it'd be quite interesting. > SG can you explain this a little better for me. The negative will have the > silver nitrate on one side or embedded in the mylar. While I've heard of > the stuff I can't say that I have ever seen it. Actually, the silver nitrate is the light sensitive part...converted to metallic silver during development. The devloped grains are suspended in the emulsion (gelatin) on one side of the film base. > Currently I'm still looking for a carbon sheet material. Does anyone know if > carbon would be very conductive at a thickness of .001? I am also looking > for a way to desolve it with out breaking it down. Then I might be able to > saturate a paper material with it, since I can't find any real carbon paper. > I'm not sure if heat will be a problem, but if it does when it burns I won't > have much to show for proof. I don't know if it would remain conductive, but carbon transfer paper for the carbon photographic process is avaialble at Photographer's Formulary...they specialize in materials for alternative processes. Another possibility would be Porter's Camera. Both have 800 numbers, so you can get the phone numbers from 800-555-1212, directory assistance. Hope this helps... -- Chuck Knight From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 17:34:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA14860 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 17:33:15 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA14808 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 17:33:08 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA17649; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 17:33:06 -0800 Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 17:33:05 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: homepage In-Reply-To: <199511172219.RAA24416@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Fri, 17 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > Dose any one know how to get there own homepage? I want one. > Andrew > -- You'll have to contact the people who own the ohiou.edu system and ask. If you can use telnet, you can sign up with eskimo.com for a year at $5 per month, with 10megs of space for a web page. Then you just put .html files in your public_html directory and tell people your URL. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 17 21:42:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA10029 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 21:42:38 -0800 Received: from halcyon.com (coho.halcyon.com [198.137.231.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA09997 for ; Fri, 17 Nov 1995 21:42:33 -0800 Received: by halcyon.com id AA01368 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for freenrg-List@eskimo.com); Fri, 17 Nov 1995 21:42:28 -0800 Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 21:42:28 -0800 From: The Science Club Message-Id: <199511180542.AA01368@halcyon.com> To: freenrg-List@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: (fwd) Artifical life meets lasers... Newsgroups: sci.optics Organization: Northwest Nexus, Inc. - Professional Internet Services Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Path: news1.halcyon.com!nwnews.wa.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!news.mathworks.com!hookup!noc.tor.hookup.net!gatewest!usenet From: Christopher McKinstry Newsgroups: sci.optics Subject: Artifical life meets lasers... Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 16:27:49 -0600 Organization: Gate West Communications, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Lines: 25 Message-ID: <30A52365.6202@clickable.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp100.gatewest.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b1J (Windows; I; 32bit) Here's something Very fun to try in you spare time: Ingredents: 1 - laser 1 - computer controlled x/y driver for laser 1 - video camera 1 - frame grabber 1 - little bit of hacking Method: - aim laser out a window (used my third floor window). - aim video camera in same general direction (back lane in my case... centered on the base of a telephone pole). - now write a little program to move the laser, using feedback from the camera (in my case, i had it follow contours) - sitback and watch people... they think they've dicovered some form of lightform (pun intended) -add a little ramdomness to your little laser pixel... make it sniff about shadows... make it chase cars... people are just amazed. -- K. Christopher McKinstry -Credo Elvem ipsum etian vivere. -Tibi gratias agimus quod nihil fumas. -- **************************************************************************** Jim Burrows THE SCIENCE CLUB sciclub@halcyon.com School Outreach Programs Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 18 03:33:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA22442 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:33:04 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA22433 for ; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:33:02 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id DAA13318; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:33:01 -0800 Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:33:00 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Printed capacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Another "gravity" capacitor idea... If india ink is conductive, and if printing the ink onto both sides of paper tends to connect the two layers and act like areas of conductive paper supported by insulating paper, then maybe the entire capacitor could be made in a printing press. The "small squares" issue could even be solved by printing two sheets for each conductive layer: one composed of a ring of separate squares, the other composed of a ring of short lines. Each sheet would of course be a double sided printout, with identical aligned patterns on both sides of each sheet. When these two sheets were stacked together, the short lines would connect the separate squares. A side-tab could even be printed and then trimmed so it stuck out the side of the completed stack. All the side-tabs could then be glued together with conductive epoxy or nickel-paint (or more india ink!) Wax paper could still be used for the dielectric. And a die-cutting print shop could even stamp these paper/conductor sheets out in the form of rings with holes in the middle, alignment holes, and side tabs pre-cut! I bet that an 8" stack would still cost a couple of hundred bucks. Now if only the effect will work with carbon and not require tin. Unless a source of conductive ink based upon tin powder could be found? I know that such things exist based on nickel and on silver. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 18 03:35:57 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA22852 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:35:56 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA22846 for ; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:35:54 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id DAA13488; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:35:53 -0800 Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 03:35:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: where In-Reply-To: <199511150250.UAA17041@fastlane.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Tue, 8 Jan 1991, Bert Pool wrote: > Back in high school I built my first Tesla coils. I ran a medium size one > in my workshop, a very small building (about 8 by 10 feet). It was raining, > and I had the door closed. I finished up after a couple of hours of high > voltage experiments, and after breating a LOT of ozone. Starting that > afternnoon, I had the Grand-Daddy of all migrane headaches which lasted for > about TEN days! I learned the hard way: Always use good ventilation when > working with high voltage devices which produce ozone. I think I put someone's ozone headache story on my Tesla web page. The effect sounds familiar, but fortunately I haven't encountered it personally. Boy Bert, it sure took your message awhile to get here (see 1/91 date above!) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 18 08:03:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA04269 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 08:02:44 -0800 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA04224 for ; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 08:02:36 -0800 Received: from [198.69.104.132] (pm4_0.digital.net [198.69.104.132]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA17468 for ; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 11:00:33 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 11:00:16 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Another "gravity" capacitor idea... May I remind everyone that, in my opinion, the ORIGINAL experiment needs to be performed first -- and then modifications made. Let's use tin-foil and wax paper first, if we can find some that approximate tin-foil and waxpaper of that era, before moving on. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley || tilleyrw@digital.net || "Once upon a time..." | |--------------------------------------------------------------------| | **** -- ***** -| http://www.digital.net/~tilleyrw |- ***** -- **** | ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 18 12:25:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA19646 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 12:24:57 -0800 Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA19597; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 12:24:49 -0800 Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id MAA21891; Sat, 18 Nov 1995 12:24:48 -0800 Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 12:24:47 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Interesting textfiles... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I just found a couple of good text files and placed them on Weird Science, under TEXT FILES... One link says "russian plasma arc", the other says "small CF explosion." Chris T., I think you were asking about the second one a few weeks back. I've tried contacting the author but without results plasmafe.txt Chernetski's self-acting plasma device. (NOT the one from the guy in canada, this one is at huge current levels and I think doesn't involve water. It accidentally blew up a megawatt power plant. plasbang.txt Report of a small explosion associated with D2O and ultrasonic cavitation. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:09:20 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA12446 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:07:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12416 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:07:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15065; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:07:29 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:07:28 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 16:48:44 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > This all sound good, execpt that the speaker is vary loud. Will this run > on an ultrasonic transducer? I have some. > Andrew -- Actually it is silent if you use a computer-generated impulse. The speaker moves suddenly, and at worse should make a "thump" sound. You could of course tailor the impulse waveshape for the best vortex effects while still staying silent. They'll never know what "stunk" them. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:09:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA12635 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12618 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15134; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:06 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:06 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 16:57:58 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: (fwd) Dr.Philips vortex gun? On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, reim wrote: > > bill, > Thanks for the insight. I would have to review my fluid theory from > college since its been 15 years since I graduated but I remember > a little bit about the Reynolds number. Can you get much force out of > one of these things? The hand-operated ones can blow out a candle at 10ft or more, or knock down little cardboard targets. I imagine that an enormous one with kilojoule energy impulses could slam cars and stave in building walls. Air has considerable mass (even though it seems weightless, since we're immersed in it) and so a huge blob of air, if it travels frictionlessly across the sky at high velocity, could do some damage if it hit a large fragile object like a house or a non-military plane. If a huge oxyacetlyne vortex ring was launched so a plane flew through it, the effect would be like being hit by an invisible fuel-air bomb. But of course the launching device would be huge as well, not small and portable like a conventional cannon. > It would be interesting if the output force is > a linear function to the input force but I would imagine frictional > losses would start to add up at high ower levels. I was just > interested, you know make a toy for my kids. > I am still looking for > people who has worked with high voltage, over 100 KV For what purpose? I've messed with VandeGraaff stuff, which is high voltage but at miniscule current and power levels. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:09:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA12801 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12785 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15185; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:49 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:08:48 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Printed capacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 20:24:15 -0500 Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) > >Another "gravity" capacitor idea... > >If india ink is conductive, and if printing the ink onto both sides of >paper tends to connect the two layers and act like areas of conductive >paper supported by insulating paper, then maybe the entire capacitor could be >made in a printing press. The "small squares" issue could even be solved >by printing two sheets for each conductive layer: one composed of a ring >of separate squares, the other composed of a ring of short lines. Each >sheet would of course be a double sided printout, with identical aligned >patterns on both sides of each sheet. > >When these two sheets were stacked together, the short lines would connect >the separate squares. A side-tab could even be printed and then trimmed >so it stuck out the side of the completed stack. All the side-tabs could >then be glued together with conductive epoxy or nickel-paint (or more >india ink!) Wax paper could still be used for the dielectric. > >And a die-cutting print shop could even stamp these paper/conductor sheets >out in the form of rings with holes in the middle, alignment holes, and >side tabs pre-cut! I bet that an 8" stack would still cost a couple of >hundred bucks. > >Now if only the effect will work with carbon and not require tin. Unless >a source of conductive ink based upon tin powder could be found? I know >that such things exist based on nickel and on silver. > >.....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. >William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 >EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ >Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page > > > > You can call any production printshop and they will help you find the ink that you are looking for. Tell them you are looking for a metal dust based ink. The only problem I can see is most metal based ink has a large petrolium base the others are mostly rubber based.. Tell the print shop that you would like a sample to test. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:10:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA13001 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12954 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15245; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:20 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:20 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: valve Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: Andrew Cantino Subject: valve To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 20:40:02 -0500 (EST) I'm useing a valve called a diode valve, it will pul air from the side but not from the front. I was wondering if anyone knows how to make one work better. It looks like this: __() ()__ / \ / \ Air flows up the middle. When air is sucked in it comes over the bumps at the sides and slides in. That way no air is sucked strate in. Andrew /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:10:57 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA13107 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA13094 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15313; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:53 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:09:52 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: rocket.txt (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: Andrew Cantino Subject: rocket.txt (fwd) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 21:17:51 -0500 (EST) Forwarded message: > From ac817 Sat Nov 18 21:10:08 1995 > Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 21:10:05 -0500 (EST) > From: Andrew Cantino > Message-Id: <199511190210.VAA02666@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> > X-within-URL: gopher://wiretap.spies.com/00/Library/Untech/rocket.txt > To: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu > Subject: rocket.txt > > > Path: uuwest!spies!apple!news.bbn.com!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watm > ath!descartes!cpbeaure > From: cpbeaure@descartes.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) > Newsgroups: rec.pyrotechnics > Subject: Home built rocket engines - long > Keywords: Rocket > Message-ID: <1991Oct21.212228.26484@descartes.waterloo.edu> > Date: 21 Oct 91 21:22:28 GMT > Organization: University of Waterloo > Lines: 454 > > > This is that information on home constructed rocket engines I > mentioned I would put together. I hope I've covered everything you > could possibly need to put something together, but if anyone has any > additions they might want to suggest, please mail them to me (or post > them). If you have any flames, mail then too. But make sure anything > you say is worth reading... > I'll warn you now that this is not the safest method (there are no > safe methods to make anything using potentially explosive stuff), but > this version is, I hope, safer than others. This is the product of > about three years of experimentation with home-built engines. Out of > the various methods we've tried, this causes the fewest explosions, is > the simplest to make, and flies the straightest. Just remember one > thing. Before you really start playing with these things, TEST them. > TEST THEM MANYMANYMANYMANY TIMES. Know how they work, how to get the > best performance. Make one so that it explodes on the ground, just to > see how close you don't want to be. Learn how to run quickly. Learn > how to take cover quickly. Then you can start using them. > > Before you actually decide to build something, I'd like you to > consider this. When rockets were first built, they were not used by > the military because they were dangerous and unreliable. And when the > military calls something dangerous, it's agood idea to take the hint. > > Thanks to Greg Deer for his large part in this information. Not to > mention for dragging me to emergency when one of MY brilliant ideas > blew up on me. > My apologies for any spelling/grammar that might > offend any English students out there. My apologies for any diagrams > which might offend any Artsies/Engineers out there. And my apologies > for any factual errors which may offend any Chemists out there. > Requests for any other apologies may be mailed my way. I'll > apologise if they're valid. > > > -------------------------------------------+-------------------------------+ > Chris Beauregard |Any ideas and/or opinions | > cpbeaure@descartes.waterloo.edu |expressed here are solely mine.| > "If you can't beat 'em, take 'em with ya!" +-------------------------------+ > > > --- Chop Here > > > Okay, first a little history of our experimentation with rocket > engines. > > The first method we ever tried was the good old fashioned paper tube > with clay nozzles and packed gunpowder. We found, for several > reasons, that this simply did not work. Explosions were _very_ common, > and when they did fly, they flew all over the place. We created > various forms of them, but the one form that we did stick with was a > type with a hollow core. This has been used throughout all our various > types. > After a while, and a lot of research, we discovered out number one > problem. Gunpowder. We managed to come up with a formula for some > very nice rocket fuel, and this cut down on misfires tremendously. > Unfortunately, we had a tough time finding tubes for the engines, and > making them was too much trouble. > About then we were experimenting with pipe bombs. We were using > copper pipe with the ends brazed closed. We decided to try this as > an engine tube, and it worked. Somewhat. We could put an engine > together rather quickly, but they still exploded a lot. With the force > of a typical pipe bomb. A little more experimentation later, we > discovered that brazing the pipe weakened it considerably. A > non-brazed method was them used rather well for a while. > Then we discovered PVC pipe. And our most successful form was born. > > Now, on to the good stuff. > > One of the most important points about making these rockets is the > powder used. The thing about gunpowder is that when it's burned > under pressure, it burns at a tremendous speed. Rocket fuel, on the > other hand, burns very quickly, but at a more or less constant rate, > regardless of how much pressure it's under. > Here are the formulas for gunpowder and rocket fuel, using either > sodium or potassium nitrate. > > nitrate carbon sulphur > KNO3 gunpowder 75% 15% 10% > NaNO3gunpowder 71% 18% 11% > KNO3 rocket fuel 72% 24% 4% > NaNO3 rocket fuel 69% 27% 4% > > These percentages are by weight. > > The first thing you'll note is that the rocket fuel mixtures use much > more carbon than their gunpowder counterparts. The second thing > you'll note is that they use much less sulphur. I'm not completely > sure why it works, but after a lot of experimentation and analysis of > the components of Estes rocket fuel, those are the numbers we've come > up with. > If you try to make the powder yourself, refer to some kind of manual > on how it's done. For optimum performance, the powder should be > milled. If you don't have a mill, just mix it to the best of your > ability. (by the way, you should mix this stuff with about 10% of its > mass in water. It's much safer). > You could also modify store bought powder by adding more carbon. > Rocket fuel will work with up to about 12% sulphur. You should use > carbon from softwood. Hardwood works, but it burns much slower. > Willow, pine or spruce will work (from my experience). Spruce is the > easiest and cheapest to get. Just burn a couple two-by-fours. I'll > leave it as an execise for the reader to figure out how much to add. > > The Engine > > Materials needed > Powder (rocket fuel recommended) > 1/2" PVC pipe > 1/2" dowel > > Tools Needed > Drill and 1/8" bit and one to match nails (below) > Some nails. The smaller, the better > Hammer > Saw > A bar that fits into the PVC pipe. > Plastic is best, but you can get away with metal or wood. > Sandpaper, or a something else that you can use to shape wood > A hot plate, or stove > A metal plate. Sheet metal, aluminum, > something like that. > > Procedure > 1. Put the metal plate on the burner of the hot plate, and turn it > up to max. This should be done in a well ventilated area, because > you're going to be melting plastic on it. > > 2. Cut a length of PVC. the specific length depends on how long you > want the engine to burn, but 5" is a good start. > > 3. Cut two 1/2" lengths of the dowel. The dowel should not be able > to slide easily into the PVC. It should be larger that the inside > diameter of the PVC. Take each dowel, and sand one end end the edges > somewhat, until it looks sort of like this: > > +-------+ > | | > | | > \-------/ > > 4. Take one piece of the dowel, and pound it into the piece of PVC. > You should sink it in about 1/8", so you get this: > > ------------------------------------- > | | > | <------- Dowel > | | > ------------------------------------- > ^ > | > PVC > > 5. By now the hot plate should be warm enough. Take the pipe, and > place it so that the end with the dowel in it is on the piece of > metal. Press slightly. The PVC at the bottom should melt. If it > doesn't, the plate isn't hot enough. What you want to do is melt down > the end of the pipe so that the dowel CANNOT slide out. The excess > melted plastic on the ouside of the tube can be removed, by sanding, > cutting, or whatever. > make sure that when you melt the end, that you don't press really > hard. One of the properies of the plastic being melted under these > circumstances is it slide on the metal plate really easily. If you're > preesing down really hard and the pipe slides away, you hand usually > moves downwards very quickly. > A sort of diagram of what heppens is: > > || || > ||-----|| > PVC ==>|| || > || <======dowel > || || > ||-----|| > @||@ @||@ > > Where the '@' stands for melted plastic. WARNING: Platics are, as a > general rule, not healthy or pleasant to breath. > > 6. Take the powder, and add about 10% of its mass of water. Mix > well. > > 7. Take this powder, and fill the PVC with it. Now take the rod and > hammer, and pound the powder down. Do this very hard. What we're > trying to do is turn the powder into a single grain. What you have is > this. > > > | | > | |<===== Rod > | | > | | > || || > || || > |----| > | | > | <===== powder > PVC ==>| | > |----| > | <==== dowel > |----| > > Keep adding and pressing the powder until there's about 3/4" of free > space in the top of the PVC. > WARNING: IF YOU'RE USING FRICTION SENSITIVE ROCKET FUEL, DON'T TRY > THIS. > > 8. Take the remaining pience of dowel, and pound it into the top. > > 9. Take the drill and the very small bit, and drill two holes > through the PVC and top dowel. The holes should be perpendicular to > each other, and should not meet in the wood. A top view looks like > this: > > --- > / | \ > / | \ > |---+---| > \ | / > \ | / > --- > > 10. Take one of the nails, and put it through one of the holes. The > nail should go through the hole and have extra left over. > Preferably, the nail should ablso be a bit bigger than the hole, so you > have to use the hammer. Bend the ends of the nail over, or cut them > off. > > 11. Repeat with the other hole. > > 12. Now, take the enngine, and clamp it to something. > > 13. Take the drill with the 1/8" bit, and drill through the melted > end into the middle of the engine. It should look like this: > > |----| > | <==== top wood plug > |----| > | | > PVC ==>| | > | <=== powder > | | | > | |<=== hole > |--|-| > bottom plug =====> | | > |--|-| > > The hole should be as close to the center as possible. Only drill > about 2" into the rocket. You'll have to build a few rockets and > experiment with different depths because of the variation in powder, > but 2" ia`s a good start. If the hole is too deep, the engine will > probably explode. If it's too shallow, well, it'll sit there and make > a nice shower of sparks. > Don't try to drill the entire hole at once. Drill about a 1/4" to > 1/2", then romove the drill and clean the powder off it. Powder > tends to build up on the bit, and this cuts down on the efficiency of > the drilling. It also builds up some heat. If the powder is wet, this > shouldn't be a worry. Make sure you have plenty of room around you > though, in case the powder is set off. DON'T TRY THIS IF YOU USE > FRICTION SENSITIVE ROCKET FUEL!!!!! YOU WILL IN ALL PROBABILITY SET IT > OFF. > > 14. Okay, now you have an engine, but the powder is wet. The safest > way to dry the engine is to leave it in the sun for a number of > hours. Applying a constant, gentle heat from a variety of sources will > also do. For example, you might set up a hair dryer, set on low or > medium, to heat the engines for a few hours. Make sure the heat source > isn't too hot, or the plastic will melt and possibly, the powder will > ignite. > > > > Alternative Building Methods > I'll outline a few other methods that CAN be used. They really > shouldn't be, though, because they are not, by any means, safe. Try > the basic engine before you attempt any of these. > > The first is that the rocket fuel does not have to be moistened. It > can be pounded in and drilled while it's completely dry. As you can > imagine, this is considerably faster, but a little bit sarcasm here> more dangerous. Black powder is not considered > friction or shock sensitive, but impure chemicals can alter this > tremendously. As well, while friction isn't normally a problem, the > heat generated by drilling into this stuff can be. If you're going > to try this, make sure you have plenty of room, and a friend > nearby...but not too close. He's there to take you to the > hospital/bury you in case of accident. > > The engine can be set up to ignite something on the end of them. > This can be easily accomplished by drilling a hole through the top > plug. Make sure you don't drill through the nails, though, because > they're there to keep the thing together. If they're weakened, the > top of the rocket has a nasty tendency to leave without the rest. It > generally looks like... > > ============== > ------------------------ | > | | | | whatever | > ==== engine ==== you want | > | | | | to blow | > ------------------------ | > ============== > > A delay can be added by sticking a slow burning powder into the hole > (like a lot of sulphur with a little BP). It should be packed in > fairly tightly. If you want it to go right away, it's not really > necessary to put anything in. We like to add a little loose powder > though, just in case. > > > It's very easy to modify one of these things for explosions. The > easiest method is to simply add a little extra tube somewhat larger > than the engine, and fill it with whatever you want. However, > there's a much cleaner way. It makes a very powerful explosion, > however, so make sure it's going to go where you want it to go. > Meaning, if you can't get a rocket to fly straight, don't try this. > What you do is add about two inches to the engine. When you put the > top plug on, put it about 2" into the tube. Drill a hole in it as > outlined above, and fill the resulting cavity with whatever you want > to use. Then add a second plug in a manner similar to the first. > The result looks like > > ============================================== > | | | | | | > | | regular portion | | explosive| <=== extra plug > | ^ | | ^ | | | > ===|=========================|================ > | | > first plug second plug > > It you want more of a shower than shattering explosion, leave the > nails out of the top plug. This will cause it simply to pop out. > Note that your powder in the top has to be able to blow that top part. > This method would also be nifty for a parachute flare, assuming that > the parachute was insulated. > IF YOU'RE USING FRICTION SENSITIVE POWDER FOR THE EFFECTS, BE EXTRA > CAREFUL PUTTING THAT TOP PLUG IN. Preferably, the powder should be > put into some kind of paper cartridge, so that none of it gets on the > wall where the plug is inserted. > > > > Launch Techniques > The first thing you should do, after making your first engine, is > test it. Now, you probably don't want to go through the trouble of > putting together a nice rocket, complete with fins and nose cone, so > this is one simple way of getting it up there. It's quite possibly > the oldest method ever used. Take a stick, about 1/4" diameter and > 2' long. TGhe specific dimensions don't matter that much, nor does > the exact shape. Round or square does it well. It MUST be a > straight as possible. Some gardening stores sell some very nice > bamboo sticks used for holding up plants. These work very well. > Anyway, take the rocket engine, and tape it on near the top, with the > nozzle facing down the length on the stick. Tape it very securely. > Good. Now, to launch it, put the stick into the ground, and make > sure it stays pointing up. Make sure it also slides out of the > ground easily. Now fire the rocket. The stick will keep the rocket > more or less straight as it flies (assuming it's a decent engine). > It's arcs somewhat though, depending on which side of the stick the > engine is one before launch. It will arc away from that side. > Remember this. It's easy to get into the habit of "Oh, we're safe > behind the rocket, it'll go that way." when some day you forget and > put it backwards. And these things can move very fast. > > Conventional methods for launching are outlined in various model rocketry > books. Check your local library. > > One neat way of launching rockets that we've been experimenting with > is a cylindrical stabilizer. Take a light cylinder with open ends > and attach it to the end of the engine in such a way that air passes > it. This method is very nice for tube launched rockets. It looks > roughly like > > > -------------- > ^ \ > | \ > =================== > | | | > cylinder | Engine | > | | | > | =================== > | / > v / > -------------- > > We've successfully used popsicle sticks and hot glue to hold a piece > of pop can onto the engine. It can be fired from a tube. We've also > managed to fire it by simply sitting it on the ground. It's also > used in commercial parachute flares to get the flare up there. One > model we examined used a large aluminum cartridge for both the > engine, flare, and guide. About 3" of space was left at the bottom > end, and large holes punched out. > > > > Ignition Techniques > The simplest way of igniting a rocket is to insert a piece of fuse > into the hole, light it, and run. You should have a minimum of 15sec > running time. More is preferred if you acutally want to turn around, > catch your breath, and watch the rocket launch. And you can see it > coming should it decide to go your way. However, 15 seconds will > normally get you far enough. 50' is about the minimum distance. I > get farther myself though. Another method is to use the good old > fashioned Estes Solar Igniters and a battery. There are a variety of > other lectrical fire methods, but this is our favorite. First of > all, find a unused and un-needed camera flash. Open it up, and look > at the capacitor (there should be a big cylider somewhere in there. > It's probably the capacitor). You want one with a rating of over > 300v. Less can be used, but it doesn't give the same oomph as a > bigger one. Now disconnect the flash bulb, and wire it up somehow to > your ingition wires. You should also have a safety switch of some > kind in there. Now take the fart that plug into the camera, and > rewire it into a push button. This method will allow you to put that > 300+ volts through your ignition wire. As an alternative, other type > of light flashers can be used (sirens, strobe lights, etc). Make > sure you know what you're doing though, because 300+ volts can really > hurt. > The actual fuse varies. A small wire attached between two > larger wires and put into the end of the engine does a nice job. > Even better, however, is a small resistor. Take a 1/8 watt resistor > (I think the higher the resistance, the better, but with 300+VDC, it > doesn;t really matter). Attach this between two wires and solder it > on. Now, you're probably asking yourself "Why?". This allows you to > get MULTIPLE FIRES from that little resistor. I'm not sure how > many. We tried it with one, and we got about 200 nice big sparks > from it before our push button welded itself. > > > General Safety Stuff > One of these things exploding tends to be a rather awesome effect. > It can also be a tad dangerous. When they explode, they have the > distinct advantage of breaking into fairly large pieces (unlike > glass, which is really nasty about little pieces). Two of the pieces > are generally the top half and the bottom half. As you can guess, > the top half goes more or less up and the bottom down. However, the > pieces in between are smaller, fly outward more or less horizontally, > and because they are smaller, they are faster. They normally fly > about a max of forty or fifty feet. A rocket with a random flight > path is dangerous as well. The sheer speed that these things fly can > easily kill you. If it doesn't, it will hurt you. There is of > course the little flame at the end to consider as well. > > That little flame is also very capable of setting fire to many things. > Namely houses and trees. Fire it in a desert or over a lake if you > can help it. > > Whatever you do, make sure there are no people nearby > (within a mile of its supposed flight path is a good mumber to go by) > aside from yourself. > > > > > That about covers it. Enjoy. > . > > -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ /----------------\ _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / \------------------------------/ /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:12:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA13499 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:11:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA13487 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:11:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15469; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:11:20 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:11:20 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Gravity-emitting capacitor! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: james rye To: "'BILL BETYS NEWS GROUP'" Subject: Gravity-emitting capacitor! Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:02:15 +-1300 Hi i'm new to this news group and what i see i like. I read the page on to Gravity-emitting capacitor and was quite interested. I here that one of you has put together 40 layers of one so far. any way i was thinking that you would need about 1000 to 1500 layers to make this thing work. now if each layer uses 9 trapeziums with rounded edges that is 9000 to 13500 of these, so I figered nobody os going to sit down and cut them all out so i made a budjet die that can cut through 25 - 40 pieces of foil at once, Not bad ha, the hardest part is to clear the tool all of 5 seconds. The problem is that i live in New Zealand and our shops don't sell tin foil only aluminum foil and the document said not to use aluminum. so if anybody has any ideas on where to go from here reply to this mesage From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:13:28 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA13707 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:12:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA13694 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:12:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA15944; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:12:25 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:12:24 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 01:14:24 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor First thing monday morning I'm going to try to locate a die cutting paper shop to get a rough estimate. Maybe they will know if there are any other inks that maybe conductive. The closest thing I have found to tin foil is tin plates they measure .008 and are found at hobby shops and hardware stores. I might try to contact the company that makes them to see if they do custom work. Some of you may have seen there displays. They carry just about 40 different styles of metal from 1/8" angle brass to rectangle aluminum. The company is: K&S Engineering, Chicago,Illinos 60638. Thats all the info I have. I try to contact them monday as well. I doubt they will sell the foil, but they may know someone who does. What is the conductive material in indian ink? Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:17:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA14427 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA14410 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA17033; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:05 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:04 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <199511190720.XAA26666@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com > Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 01:14:24 -0700 > To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor > > What is the conductive material in indian ink? > > Todd > jdavid28@ix.netcom.com India ink is made of soot, so its mostly carbon. I think modern India ink also has silver nitrate. I tried to use india ink painted onto painted plastic in order to make my own 1000meg resistors. The ink turned out to be WAY too conductive, and I had to dilute it way down to get the resistance up. WARNING: if the capacitor needs AC, india ink may not be conductive enough, since it acts like a resistor more than like a wire. But if the capacitor needs DC (like the article suggests) then the ink resistance should just slow the initial charging but not affect anything else. But we should try tin first! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 10:18:03 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA14666 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:17:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA14645 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:17:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA17105; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:59 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 10:16:59 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: fnrg : Impulse Sensor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 08:16:10 -0800 From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: re: fnrg : Impulse Sensor To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com 11/19/95 Currently, I am trying to measure energy output from an "O/U" device I am constructing. I need an electronic device to measure mechanical impulse (change of momentum / change of time). Preferrably a solid state sensing device. Time interval is in milliseconds. I am aware of acelerometers, but cannot locate info on impulse measuring devices. Do they exist? Any suggestions? Richard Wall rwall@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:18:40 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA06061 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06039 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25601; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:14 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:13 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 09:30:04 -0500 In article , you wrote: > >Another "gravity" capacitor idea... > Each >sheet would of course be a double sided printout, with identical aligned >patterns on both sides of each sheet. >When these two sheets were stacked together, the short lines would connect >the separate squares. A side-tab could even be printed and then trimmed >so it stuck out the side of the completed stack. All the side-tabs could >then be glued together with conductive epoxy or nickel-paint (or more >india ink!) Wax paper could still be used for the dielectric. Sounds to me like your just described making raw (uneched) Printed Circuit Boards. Copper FR4 (Glass/Resion) Copper You can get down to 0.032" that I know of. There is a NASA Tech Brief article on such a capacitor, I'll see if I can find it. I feel I missed some thing? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:19:07 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA06174 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:19:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06154 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25637; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:54 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:18:54 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Energy Storage In a Capacitor? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) Newsgroups: list.freenrg To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Energy Storage In a Capacitor? How much energy is stored in a capacitor? / / / / *-----------* *------------*-------* *----------* | S1 | S2 | + | | | -------- __|__ __|__ ---- _____ C1 _____ C2 -------- Vdc | | ---- | | -------- | | ---- | | | | | *----------------------------*-----------------------* According to my basic electronics text book, the energy stored in the electrostatic field in the dielectric of a capacitor can be computed by the formula: J = (C(V*V))/2 or J = .5C(V*V) where: J = Energy, in wattseconds (Joules) C = Capacitance, in Farads V = Voltage, in Volts Since we are using ideal math (?) lets assume we are using ideal parts, no wire resistance, and no dielectric loses, no ESR, ect. Let Vdc = 1000 V, C1 = 10 uF, C2 = 10 uF. Initial circuit conditions are Energy in C1 & C2 are zero, and S1 & S2 are open. Close S1 and allow the voltage across C1 to reach a static value, then open S1. Calculate the energy stored C1: J = (.5C)(V*V) C = 10 uF, V = 1000 5 = (.5(10))(1000*1000) C1 now has 5 Joules of energy. Close S2 and allow the voltages across the capacitors to reach a static state. Open S2. Each capacitor will have 500V [See Note #1]. J = (.5C)(V*V) C = 10 uF, V = 500 1.25 = (.5(10))(500*500) So we end up with 1.25 Joules of energy on each cap, for a total of: 1.25 + 1.25 = 2.5 J It seems to my math that 2.5 Joules of energy are now "missing"? [Remember we are assuming idea parts & conditions here.] Can some one please explain this to me? Note #1: Some one told me the caps would equalize to 700 volts, but did not explain why. So I charged up a 660uF Photo Flash Cap to 100 VDC (Didn't have 1k VDC), then disconnected the power supply. I connected the charge cap to a identical discharged cap. I then had 47 VDC (Lost the other 3V in the arc when I connected the discharged cap) across the paralleled caps. Note #2: Eggs On The Wall? By Richard Markell From the Editors Page of Linear Technology's Magazine August 1995, Volume V Number 3 "I was in the lunch room several weeks ago calmly eating my lunch, when suddenly a large "BOOM" sounded behind me. (No, it wasn't an underrated tantalum capacitor.) I turned around (slowly) to find that one of our physicists had tried to hard boil an egg in the microwave without first putting a vent hole in the eggshell. My first reaction was to exclaim that any physicist should know that when most things get hot, they expand (go boom!). Sure, we could plot the size of the vent hole versus the "time to go boom". The conservative engineer might do this. Both the analytical approach and trying things to see what happens are useful, but maybe we need more "booms". It seems that, in today's business atmosphere, there is too much conservatism and too few people just trying things to see what happens." From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:19:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA06373 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:19:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06343 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:19:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25684; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:19:28 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:19:27 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re[4]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[4]: fnrg: T.T. Brown Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 16:59:29 -0500 In article <199511180556.XAA15928@fastlane.net>, you wrote: > >> Look up the Dudley Paten as well, it fits here perfectly. >> > >Thanks - I'll see what I can find. I've not seen this name before. Thought some here might be interested in some of this junk: >Subject: Gravity generating capacitive device (electric rocket) > I'm also interested in the possible o/u effects in capacitive >discharge through electromagnets or solenoids. On one of the lists I read the question was raised: They wanted to know why they didn't see more Gravity stuff in the literature. Maybe they did not look for the right things. Like "Kontrabaric Effect" or "Contrabaric Effect". Also you have T.T.Browns "Stress In Dielectrics". Here are a couple of papers that link Gravity and Electricity: "An Electrically Charged Torque Pendulum" by Dr. Erwin J. Saxl; Pin Hill, Harvard, Mass. In "Nature" July 11, 1964, Vol 203. pg 138->140. The Dudley Patent: "Apparatus for the Promotion and Control of Vehicular Flight" by H.C. Dudley. 3,095,167. June 25,1963. Its shows that when you reach a -350KV electrostatic charge you should get levitation. At lower potentials you get a reduction in fuel consumption to leave Earth in a rocket. "Electrostatic Levitator With Feedback Control" NASA Tech Briefs Summer 1983. Vol. 7, No. 4, Item #69. NPO-15553/5225 If you want to play with high voltage [Poor choice of words. You are dealing with potentials that *ARE* !!*LETHAL*!!] check these out for some simple schematics: "Battery-Operated High-Voltage Power Supply" NASA Tech Briefs, Spring 1984. Vol. 8, No. 3, GSC-12818 This one has two different titles depending on its source: "Remotely-Adjustable Solid-State High-Voltage Supply". NASA Tech. Briefs Summer 1985. NPO-15719 Or "Adjustable Solid State High Voltage Source" Case number 5184, IR # 15719. JPL 2688-2 (Rev 5-69) 0->5VDC in give 0->20KVDC out. "High-Voltage Isolation Transformer" NASA Tech Briefs, Fall 1984. NASA Tech Briefs, Fall 1984. Vol 9, No. 1 GSC-12817. Some indirectly related things: A report for Hugues Science/Scope, date unknown (early 1980's?): "The electronic rocket engine is ready to be tested aboard a satellite to see how well it functions in the company of other space hardware. Hugues has delivered two engines, called mercury ion thrusters, for installation on a U.S. Air Force research satellite. The goal of the flight test is to qualify the system in space for performing such auxiliary propulsion functions as stationkeeping [Keep from moving], attitude control, and orbit maneuvering of spacecraft. The system is designed to replace tranditional chemical and gas propulsion systems, saving hundreds of pounds of weight. In operation, the thrusters are powered by the satellite's solar cells, which convert sunlight into electricity." See also: "Ion Engine with Solid-Electrolyte Ion Generator" for Winter 1983 NASA Tech Brief Vol. 8, No. 2, Item #27. NPO-15809/5265 "Correcting for Background in Flowing Plasma Measurements: Langmuir-probe end effects allows measurements independent of background plasma" NASA Tech Briefs, Spring 1981 NPO-15332 Some other NASA Ion junk: "Ionic Refrigerator" NASA Tech Brief Fall 1983 Vol. 8, No. 1, Item #69 NPO-15288/4799 "Zero-Net-Charge Air Ionizer" NASA Tech Brief for Spring 1984, Vol. 8, No. 3, Item #23. NPO-15937/5389. "Improved Electronic Control for Electrostatic Precipitators" LAR-13273. "Ion Mass/Velocity/Charge Spectrometer" NASA Tech Brief Vol. 7, No. 2, Item #16. NPO-15423/4910. Have fun, and BE CAREFUL! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:20:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA06571 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:20:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06541 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:20:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25753; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:20:07 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:20:06 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: fnrg : Impulse Sensor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: Andrew Cantino Subject: Re: fnrg: fnrg : Impulse Sensor To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 17:37:24 -0500 (EST) > > Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 08:16:10 -0800 > From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) > Subject: re: fnrg : Impulse Sensor > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > > 11/19/95 > > Currently, I am trying to measure energy output from an "O/U" device I > am constructing. I need an electronic device to measure mechanical > impulse (change of momentum / change of time). Preferrably a solid > state sensing device. Time interval is in milliseconds. I am aware of > acelerometers, but cannot locate info on impulse measuring devices. Do > they exist? Any suggestions? > > Richard Wall > > rwall@ix.netcom.com > > > In the Electronic Goldmine Catalog there are airbag sensers. Thay might work. Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:23:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA07266 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:23:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA07252 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:22:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25932; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:22:54 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:22:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: re: scalar gradiometer Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:41:49 -0600 From: Mark Mansfield To: William Beaty William Beaty wrote: > Aha! I'm familiar with that device, and it's another example of an > e-field meter. Your design looks much better, with a low frequency > response going much closer to DC, and filters to keep RF > transmitters from messing up the readings. > > The physics term for this device is a sky-field electrometer. > As far as conventional science is concerned, they're only for > measuring the vertical clear-weather field of the earth. But > something weird is truly going on, because on flat ground the > clear weather field should be perfectly uniform. Unless the > ground was totally nonconducting, there would be enough > surface resistivity in the dirt that the surface of the ground > should act like a smooth conductor, and the sky field should be > boring and uniform, with no details as one walks around. And if > your meter worked only off conventional electrostatics, then a > standing stone would display a distorted sky-field around it, but > this distorted field would stay forever with the stone and move as > the stone moved, and empty places on the ground should definitely > NOT show any interesting responses. > > That's the conventional view. If the fields don't behave this way, > it's wonderful! Incredible! It means that the conventional > understanding is wrong, and we're dealing here with something > radically strange. > I agree completely. There are things that alter the "static" electric field and this device was designed to measure just that. I have found some very slow (occurs every 15 minutes or so) changing gradient if you just sit the thing on something outside and leave it alone and just watch for several minutes. What this changing electrostatic gradient is or where it orginates, I have not been able to nail down yet. > Have you seen those "aura camera" photos on my web page? From the > text description, I'd say the experimenter has discovered a way to > directly photograph the same field patterns that your device is > detecting, by exciting them with tesla coil output so they become > visible in microwave and IR spectrum, then photographing them > indirectly in this way. > I'll look at those. I'm curious how the device above rates with the devices Dr. Flanagan has worked on. He claimed that a modified neurophone would do the same thing (map aura's). Also there is a gentlemen named Hiroshi Motoyama that developed and sold devices in Europe that detected the human aura. He also sold them as orgone detectors. (This info is from Dr. Flanagan). Are you familiar with any of these devices? I'm very interested in them, and would like to build one. I'm presently working on a electrometer coupled to a bifiliar wound coil in which one of the wires is connected to the electrometer and a bias supply is applied to the other wire. Grounds are common to both the bias supply and the electrometer. Dr. Flanagan states that the insulation between the two wires acts like a translator and responds to the chakras of the human body. This is my present research. Any help you might lend would be great. > Also: is this intended to be a private-only conversation, or can I > crosspost it to freenrg-list? > Yes, feel free to cross post this on freenrg-list. Others might want to know of these things and try them out for themselves. That would be great actually, as maybe some new uses would be found for the device. Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:24:28 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA07651 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:24:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA07624 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:24:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA26008; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:24:16 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:24:16 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: rocket.txt (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 17:40:47 -0800 From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: rocket.txt (fwd) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com You wrote: > >From: Andrew Cantino >Subject: rocket.txt (fwd) >To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com >Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 21:17:51 -0500 (EST) > >Forwarded message: >> From ac817 Sat Nov 18 21:10:08 1995 >> Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 21:10:05 -0500 (EST) >> From: Andrew Cantino >> Message-Id: <199511190210.VAA02666@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> >> X-within-URL: gopher://wiretap.spies.com/00/Library/Untech/rocket.txt >> To: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu >> Subject: rocket.txt >> >> >> Path: uuwest!spies!apple!news.bbn.com!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!watserv1!wat m >> ath!descartes!cpbeaure >> From: cpbeaure@descartes.waterloo.edu (Chris Beauregard) >> Newsgroups: rec.pyrotechnics >> Subject: Home built rocket engines - long >> Keywords: Rocket >> Message-ID: <1991Oct21.212228.26484@descartes.waterloo.edu> >> Date: 21 Oct 91 21:22:28 GMT >> Organization: University of Waterloo >> Lines: 454 >> >> >> This is that information on home constructed rocket engines I >> mentioned I would put together. I hope I've covered everything you >> could possibly need to put something together, but if anyone has any >> additions they might want to suggest, please mail them to me (or post >> them). If you have any flames, mail then too. But make sure anything >> you say is worth reading... >> I'll warn you now that this is not the safest method (there are no >> safe methods to make anything using potentially explosive stuff), but >> >> Whatever you do, make sure there are no people nearby >> (within a mile of its supposed flight path is a good mumber to go by) >> aside from yourself. >> >> >> >> >> That about covers it. Enjoy. >> . >> >> > > >-- > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > /----------------\ > _______/- Andrew Cantino -\_______ > \ E-mail: ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu / > \------------------------------/ > /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ > \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ > > > 11/19/95 Andrew, Years ago I made rockets as a hobby and used powdered zinc and sulfur for fuel. We found it superior to black powder fuels. RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:25:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA07968 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA07954 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA26199; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:32 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:32 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Scalar gradiometer Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Subject: Scalar gradiometer Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 17:46:25 -0600 From: Mark Mansfield To: William Beaty William Beaty wrote: > > Hi Mark! Bob Shannon says you're interested in how I rendered his > hand-drawn schematic into GIF. I used Paintshop Pro to blur, Sounds like a pretty neat way of importing graphics into transferable files. [snip] > > Isn't this device just a fieldstrength meter for e-fields? Comb >your hair at it on a dry day fifty feet away and deflect the needle? >Use it to "feel" where someone has touched fur to a plexiglas >window? What non-conventional effects does it exhibit? > > ALso: check out my Science Demonstrations page, and look under > Electrometer Array. I've had great fun with numerous voltage- > detecting devices in my museum work. > Yes it can be used as a field strength meter for e-fields. I guess the closest thing to it was that "cyber-probe" thingy that appeared in Nuts and Volts magazine a few years back. Our device works on a similar principle I would say. It is quite sensitive however. We were successful in mapping lay lines up in New Hampshire a couple of years back. The place is called "America's Stonehenge". I was very scheptical of the place having any signifigance, in a "lay line" way until I went back to the car and got out the gradiometer just for fun. I had done pegged this place's only signifigance was to line someones pocket with tourist money. Much to my supprise and dismay, I was able to map very accuratly the lay lines by walking around in a circle where they said on "their" maps was the central point which we found to be approxmatly 50 feet off. The actual central point of the layout was on a large slap of granite which had very large areas of pink quartz imbeaded in it. Taking our new central point, I walked around a circle and would stop each time the meter made a radical swing. Someone standing on the center spot would confirm a marker stone on the outer circle of stones. We were able to locate several lay lines and marker stones that did not appear on their maps by walking in the direction of the reading. One of the markers was off by about 5 feet and we noticed that it had moved over time. I would guess by earthquake or freeze/thaw cycles. It was a very large rock, and I doubt anyone would have purposely moved it as it was out a ways in the woods and was not marked on their maps. Oh well, it was a fun day anyway and very educational. It made the hair stand up on the back of my neck when we first started using the thing. That's for another time though. Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 19 18:30:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA09408 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA09370 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA26560; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:13 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:11 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Duplicate messages fixed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sat, 18 Nov 1995, William Beaty wrote: > A dead computer, in New Zealand I think, has set up a pingpong game with > freenrg-list, echoing all messages back to the list, which of course > sends both copies back, which bounce to four, eight, etc. I've fixed > this temporarily by setting the list to Moderated mode, meaning that > received messages will only go to the list once a day or so, rather than > continuously as they are received. This should only be required for a > few days until the "mailstorm" abates, and shouldn't affect anything else. > > Sorry for all the duplicates people were receiving. I thought they were > only going to listowner, but suddenly noticed today that they were going > to everyone. It's still going on, so the list is still in moderate mode, and I'm manually forwarding all messages once a day or so. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:20:25 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA25713 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:19:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA25705 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:19:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA18072; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:19:16 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:19:15 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: PCB Capacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:33:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) > In article , you wrote: > > > >Another "gravity" capacitor idea... > > > Each > >sheet would of course be a double sided printout, with identical aligned > >patterns on both sides of each sheet. > > > Sounds to me like your just described making raw (uneched) > Printed Circuit Boards. > > Copper > FR4 (Glass/Resion) > Copper > > You can get down to 0.032" that I know of. > > There is a NASA Tech Brief article on such a capacitor, I'll > see if I can find it. > > I feel I missed some thing? Yeah, the price! And the amount of etchant required. How cheap can you make about five thousand 8" square etched plates, compared to india ink on paper? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:20:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA26171 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:20:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA26119 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:20:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA18155; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:20:09 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:20:08 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: grav. copacitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: james rye To: "'BILL BETYS NEWS GROUP'" Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 19:25:15 +-1300 hello being a draftsperson I work with ploters a bit a mate that i know has a special ploter made to cut stickers for sign righting now if we could get a conductive sticker then it could cut the shape leaving the waxed backing to be used as the dialect. I have no idea how much the rool of sticker might cost if ther is such stuff. what do you think?!? james From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:45:45 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA04217 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:45:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA04209 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:45:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA21399; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:45:37 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:45:36 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Energy Storage in a Capacitor? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 22:34:05 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: neotech@europe.std.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <199511200614.AAA14068@firefly.prairienet.org> On Mon, 20 Nov 1995, Zack Widup wrote: > -> SearchNet's neotech Mailing List > > > >Try this. Put two shot glasses in a microwave oven. Put H2O in one > >and liquid cooking oil in one... Here's a possible anomaly discovered by Fred Sparber on the Vortex-L discussion list: If various water-based overunity devices could be explained by some unknown mechanism by which water stores solar energy and then is triggered to dump it, then perhaps water will become hotter than it should when first heated in a microwave oven, and will become less hot when the same water is used again. So, try heating a jar of water in a microwave oven for one minute, measure the temperature, and let it cool back to near room temperature. Repeat the experiment (maybe with some drops of oil on the water to prevent evaporation!) Does the water heat up to the same temperature the second time? He just thought up this test yesterday, and when he tried it the water was significantly hotter the first time, and heated less and less when the same water was used in repeated tests. This was water from a well. If this effect is real and is not just from effervescence of dissolved gases changing the heat capacity or something, then water from various sources might contain various amounts of this stored energy. And various dissolved substances in the water might enhance or spoil the effect. Hey, maybe those mythical "water fueled cars" are real after all? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:46:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA04446 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA04416 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA21485; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:12 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:12 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Invention of the VCR -- the Real Scoop Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 02:10:07 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins As a result of my recent signiture file on the invention of the VCR, someone graciously corrected me on the details, and added this inside view of it: ***If I am not mistaken, it was in fact Ampex, of Redwood City., CA. They had a business built up in audio tape recorders that has been based on some captured German WWII machines. The company had its start in the war years, making among other things small motors for radar displays. The Russian immigrant who built up Ampex was Alexander M. Poniatoff. His initials, combined with the first two letters of the word "excellence", formed the company name. A friend of mine who knew him, both as an Ampex employee and also as someone who did odd jobs on his Atherton, CA house, reports that he was a meticulous, particular man who demanded the finest out of himself and those around him. Ampex went on to build a series of quadrature machines which used two-inch video tape, many models of which I have operated or repaired. They then pioneered the development of 1-inch type-C VCRs, which revolutionized television production. I attended an Ampex training class on the service of these machines. Ampex developed a digital cartridge tape format, marketed today as D-2. and a data compression version of the same called DCT. The computer equivalent of DCT is DCC, and it is where Ampex has placed their marketing muscle, having walked away form most of their recording industry history after the second change of ownership after Poniatoff died. ========== The individual who wrote this is on the freenrg list, but I'm not sure if he would want his name attached to this, will leave that to him. gary _______________________________________________ Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:47:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA04782 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:47:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA04720 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:47:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA21589; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:58 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:46:57 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: re: scalar gradiometer Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 02:17:49 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins >> should act like a smooth conductor, and the sky field should be >> boring and uniform, with no details as one walks around. And if Maybe it's picking up Trevor Constable's sky blobs, forget what he called them. Gary _______________________________________________ Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:52:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA06290 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:51:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA06242 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:51:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22126; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:51:46 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:51:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 02:22:36 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins >transfer from one form to the other. The free energy that we are >searching for does exist as a river flowing past us. All we got to >discover are ways of utilising it! > > >Your Southernly friend >Chris Kleynhans >In lovely South Africa > > > And would someone kindly tell me how that water gets to the top of a mountain? Water is heavy. Capillary action? Earth's rotation? Orgonomic draw from the sky? It can't be just pressure from below, or we would have geisers everywhere. Gary Hawkins _______________________________________________ Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:54:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA07001 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA06971 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22486; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:53:54 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:53:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Server crashed; bead on wire; TT Brown Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 05:58:10 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: Vortex Discussion List cc: Free Energy Discussion List My Internet provider went and crashed hard, bouncing mail all around for a while. Then it stored some up so I was faced with megabytes greeting me when the doors finally opened. My apologies to those with whom I was corresponding. If these messages are archived immediately I can certainly refer to what I missed to pick up the threads where they left. In any case, if there was any response to the bead-on-wire example of why solid grounding in the concepts of physics is necessary, I'm available for discussion. This assumes, of course, that the original message actually made it out of my system! I find this T. T. Brown interest most exciting! I have been theorizing about the phenomenon for years now, and I've wanted to experiment many times but lacked experience with high voltage, or a reliable partner with same. So far as I can tell, none of you are in the greater New York metro area. I did see the address of a Gerry V. of Staten Island float by as a contact. What sort of research does he do, or does he simply sell videotapes? Is he net-less? In honor of the efforts being made here, I will dig out my old notes and see what I was thinking. I do recall, however, that my approach was more basic. I did not concern myself with the acquisition of special materials. I was focused on testing the cause of the effect: ion wind, or what? For this, not much voltage is needed; only (!) about 20KV, I guesstimated. This would be driving an object of little mass. The baggie idea is good; I was not convinced by my theoretical considerations that an ion wind effect would decrease as the gas pressure decreased, until of course a state of virtual evacuation existed. There is a time delay noted in Brown's early writings, which is entirely consistent with and suggestive of the buildup of charged gases, as I remember. Even a very crude theoretical treatment of the forces imposed by an ion wind setup was sobering. The existing theory was gapingly incomplete when I researched this (1994). I am not surprised, therefore, that people could for decades be mystified by an effect that, in my opinion, really will turn out to be ion wind. However, I would be willing to delve back into that morass of guesses and approximations as part of a distributed research effort. Assuming it to be ion wind doesn't satisfy my craving to, at long last, debunk or verify this most venerable of mysteries. Charles From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:54:50 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA07218 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA07179 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22566; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:31 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:54:30 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Neon XFMRs for Biefeld-Brown Experiments Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 06:06:02 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com On Wed, 8 Nov 1995, Robert Stirniman wrote: > Use of Neon Transformer for Biefeld-Brown Experiments > > Neon transformers have high voltage outputs, and offer > the advantages of ready availability and relatively low > cost. This type of transformer may or may not be suitable > for testing the Biefeld-Brown effect. > > A neon transformer is fundamentally different than a > conventional transformer. A neon tube is a non-linear > device, which offers high impedance up to the point > of gas breakdown, and then switches rapidly to a low > impedance once the neon gas begins to ionize. This > happens twice each cyle +/- of the 60 Hz power source. > The magnetic core of a neon transformer contains a Cycles, ack. I can't say that I like the idea of using AC. Brown used DC, at least in the earlier experiments with which I am familiar. Fluctuating currents will add all kinds of complications to an arrangement which is really supposed to be electrostatic: the only current expected in that which drains away into corona. > > Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) > Charles From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:55:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA07544 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:55:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA07476 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:55:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22702; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:55:15 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:55:13 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: fnrg : Impulse Sensor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:24:19 -0500 >Currently, I am trying to measure energy output from an "O/U" device I >am constructing. I need an electronic device to measure mechanical >impulse (change of momentum / change of time). Preferrably a solid >state sensing device. Time interval is in milliseconds. I am aware of >acelerometers, but cannot locate info on impulse measuring devices. Do >they exist? Any suggestions? Check with Analog Devices they have several app. notes on applications of their acelerometer IC's. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:56:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA07820 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:56:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA07773 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:56:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22803; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:56:09 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:56:08 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: valve Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:57 -0500 >I'm useing a valve called a diode valve, it will pul air from the side but >not from the front. I was wondering if anyone knows how to make one work >better. It looks like this: > > __() ()__ > / \ > / \ >Air flows up the middle. When air is sucked in it comes over the bumps at >the sides and slides in. That way no air is sucked strate in. Try looking at the works of Condon. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 17:58:30 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA08386 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA08322 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA22977; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:57:32 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:57:31 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: KARLA TURNER (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 12:24:39 GMT From: Bufo Calvin To: billb@eskimo.com Subject: KARLA TURNER Dr. Karla Turner, UFO abduction researcher and author of INTO THE FRINGE, TAKEN and MASQUERADE OF ANGELS (with Ted Rice), has contracted a very dangerous form of cancer. Her doctors believe it will be fatal without treatment, which is expensive. Dr. Turner's own finances have already been depleted, so she needs your help. A nonprofit fund has been set up. Please send your donations to the Karla Turner Fund; c/o Boatmen's Bank; P.O. Box 1681; Little Rock, AR 72203-1681. Don't let this fearless investigator who has fought against government coverups and exposed so much of the abduction mystery perish for lack of a helping hand. Remember, the Bible says that gifts will be repaid threefold. And many contactees have reported that they have been told by extraterrestrials that we "Earthlings" need to learn to love one another unconditionally. Please pass this message on to all your friends, internet web sites, etc. Thank you for your help. (Original request posted by Marc Davenport) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 22:51:09 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA08735 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:59:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA08655 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA23030; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:18 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:17 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT Has anybody done, or does anybody know if there is a T.T. Brown FAQ in existance? It seems like there's a lot of good info floating around on here about the materials and methods he's used, but no references....Incidentally, whoever posted it- where did you find out about the fact that Brown used barium titanate in his capacitors? It's stuff like this that, if compiled into an FAQ, would truly be a boon for all of us trying to duplicate his feats. After all, why reinvent the wheel? Regards, Jim jim_dietzel@toen.win.net From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 23:24:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA09003 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:59:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA08957 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:59:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA23108; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:52 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:58:51 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: static elec. circuit Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT Can anybody out there tell me if this would work? I've thought up a "perpetual" HV device, but it almost seems too simple to work. From what I understand, if a static charge is applied to the inside of a dome or sphere, then the charge will migrate to the outside of said dome or sphere. Also, if you were to attach a pointed probe to the outside of the dome or sphere, the charge would leak off. Bearing these two facts in mind, what is to keep us from doing this... /---------------------------------------------------\ [ ] [ ) ] [ ) ] [ / ) ] [ / / ) ] \------------------------ )------------------------/ \ \ ) \ ) ) ) In doing this, you feed the probe from the outside of the dome into the inside of the dome. Provided we initially ground the inside of the dome to remove the initial opposite net charge, the charge is still travelling from the area of highest concentration to the area of lowest concentration. If you use a high voltage potting material inside the dome to surround the leads to avoid the production of ozone, and reduce sparkover, than it should theoretically work, right? Any and all correspondence appreciated... Regards, Jim jim_dietzel@toen.win.net From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 23:03:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA09218 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:00:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA09162 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:00:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id RAA23201; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:59:31 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:59:30 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Egg of Columbus Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:33:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: LabUser cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com On Mon, 20 Nov 1995, LabUser wrote: > I am wondering if you know of anyone who > has built a replica of Tesla's Egg of Columbus, a copper-plated egg > which rotated in the center of a two-phase magnetic winding of wire. Hi Brad! What's this for? Physics Dept. hall exhibit? The one I saw at the Musee' Decoubert in France used three-phase. The egg was about 5" long, solid iron, and spun in a wide glass dish. I suppose that a *heavy* copper layer (like 1/4" thick) would improve the torque output. The coils were wound on laminated iron cores about 3" x 3" on the end, L-shaped, and the end of each core went under the dish to join with the others. The core faces were an inch or two from the egg, slightly below it, and tilted about 45deg to cup around the egg. The coils looked like they were made of about #22 magnet wire, maybe 5 to 10 lbs. each. I suspect there must have been a 3-phase variac somewhere, to match the coils to the 220v or 440v threephase power line. When the button was pressed, the egg started spinning, stood on end, then spun up to a *very* high RPM. If you must use 2-phase, a 4-coil system would be best. Another idea: build a crossed-loop coil pair, drive it with 1-Hz twophase at a couple of amps, then leave some slowly-spinning compasses near it. Mysterious "Bermuda Triangle" effects! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 18:14:26 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA13924 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:14:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA13867 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:14:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA24987; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:14:04 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:14:03 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT Has anybody done, or does anybody know if there is a T.T. Brown FAQ in existance? It seems like there's a lot of good info floating around on here about the materials and methods he's used, but no references....Incidentally, whoever posted it- where did you find out about the fact that Brown used barium titanate in his capacitors? It's stuff like this that, if compiled into an FAQ, would truly be a boon for all of us trying to duplicate his feats. After all, why reinvent the wheel? Regards, Jim jim_dietzel@toen.win.net From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 18:17:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA15067 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:17:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA15053 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:17:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25273; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:17:23 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:17:22 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Gravity Capacitor Info... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 15:56:10 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Ok I contacted K&S Engineering, no luck. And news to me the plates I bought from them are tin coated steel. I have tried several business, Renolds Metals never made tin foil they just used the name. But they informed me that tin foil hasn't been used for about 100 years. I might have found one distributor out of Ohio. All Foil deals in all metals. But if I can't tag onto another order then I will end up with about 990lbs left over. And a big whole in my pocket. They are going to let me know tuesday. As for having plates stamped out of paper I have found one local business. I will have to go up there with a drawing for an estimate. But they said it would be in the $100-200 area. Good guess Bill. Can I get a count of how many would like any tin foil? As with most metal companys they only deal in bulk, Renolds sells 10 ton rolls of aluminum foil, And it would be cheaper with every one if we all ordered at the same time. Here's what I asked info on:1mil(.001) tin foil(it won't be solid tin,some alloy). For a 4" circle and 2500 plates you would need 218sq.ft. I also found Laser Fab Inc. the specialize in cutting metal of all types. But this maybe going overboard. I didn't get a price. Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com BTW has anybody else tried to find the tin? All Foil said that they had someone else looking for tin, I don't know if it was foil or not? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 18:23:40 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA16996 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:23:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA16980 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA25815; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:23:19 -0800 Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 18:23:17 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Egg of Columbus Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:33:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: LabUser cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com On Mon, 20 Nov 1995, LabUser wrote: > I am wondering if you know of anyone who > has built a replica of Tesla's Egg of Columbus, a copper-plated egg > which rotated in the center of a two-phase magnetic winding of wire. Hi Brad! What's this for? Physics Dept. hall exhibit? The one I saw at the Musee' Decoubert in France used three-phase. The egg was about 5" long, solid iron, and spun in a wide glass dish. I suppose that a *heavy* copper layer (like 1/4" thick) would improve the torque output. The coils were wound on laminated iron cores about 3" x 3" on the end, L-shaped, and the end of each core went under the dish to join with the others. The core faces were an inch or two from the egg, slightly below it, and tilted about 45deg to cup around the egg. The coils looked like they were made of about #22 magnet wire, maybe 5 to 10 lbs. each. I suspect there must have been a 3-phase variac somewhere, to match the coils to the 220v or 440v threephase power line. When the button was pressed, the egg started spinning, stood on end, then spun up to a *very* high RPM. If you must use 2-phase, a 4-coil system would be best. Another idea: build a crossed-loop coil pair, drive it with 1-Hz twophase at a couple of amps, then leave some slowly-spinning compasses near it. Mysterious "Bermuda Triangle" effects! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 20 19:15:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id TAA02430 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 19:15:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA02396 for ; Mon, 20 Nov 1995 19:15:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from dp1-025.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tHiRp-0003BfC; Mon, 20 Nov 95 21:28 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 21:34:16 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: fnrg: Electric Rocket ect. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Well I have to say that I agree that someone should build the original design first, Just tell me where one might find tin foil. I've looked for it in Louisville Kentucky without much luck. How thick was wax paper back when this thing was made?? I would guess much thicker. I am still trying to find a machinist to make that plate design I posted a couple days ago, the vocational school whimped out. I thought about getting a paper stamping die made with stiff foam inserted between the blades so that I could stamp out the plates myself, but the die would only be good for .004 to .007 inch thick foil I think this would be very difficult. The die would cost around $180.00 dollars. I don't think any printshop that respects it's machinery would stamp aluminum foil out the thin metal probably would not feed to well and would get creased and tear. It doesn't sound very good I know I guess I'm just lazy. If some kid made the thing we should be able to also... I also went off a tangent I called and got a price on 500g of Barium titanite. The 99.9 percent cost 180.00 while the 99.995 cost 250.00 how hard is it to make large caps with this stuff.... I'm very interested. Also can anyone tell me what would happen if a large cap, multi-plate around .25 ufd was super cooled with say helium I know what super conductors do but what about a cap.. Thanks.. By the way if someone needs help drawing something email me I would cad draft it for you for free if it follows a discussion on this list and if it isn't vary large ( I don't have much free time) and post the file in almost any format.. ie. dwg, jpg, gif ect ...... clipper@iglou.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 21 06:46:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id GAA16540 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 06:44:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from comtch.iea.com (comtch.iea.com [198.17.249.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA16514; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 06:44:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by comtch.iea.com (8.6.10/SMI-4.1) id OAA21915; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 14:44:38 GMT Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 06:44:38 -0800 (PST) From: Peter Deacon X-Sender: peterd@comtch To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Energy Storage in a Capacitor? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > explained by some unknown mechanism by which water stores solar energy and > then is triggered to dump it, then perhaps water will become hotter than > it should when first heated in a microwave oven, and will become less hot > when the same water is used again. > > So, try heating a jar of water in a microwave oven for one minute, measure > the temperature, and let it cool back to near room temperature. Repeat > the experiment (maybe with some drops of oil on the water to prevent > evaporation!) Does the water heat up to the same temperature the second > time? He just thought up this test yesterday, and when he tried it the > water was significantly hotter the first time, and heated less and less > when the same water was used in repeated tests. This was water from a > well. > If this effect is real and is not just from effervescence of dissolved > gases changing the heat capacity or something, then water from various > sources might contain various amounts of this stored energy. And various > dissolved substances in the water might enhance or spoil the effect. > Hey, maybe those mythical "water fueled cars" are real after all? One small note, if you are going to do this experiment make sure you place the glass of water in the same place inside your microwave each time. Virtually all microwaves nowadays, especially if you have an older one do not dish out microwaves evenly throughout. Peter From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 21 06:49:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id GAA17549 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 06:49:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA17527 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 06:49:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA11690; Tue, 21 Nov 95 09:38:31 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Tue, 21 Nov 95 9:48:48 -0500 Date: Tue, 21 Nov 95 9:46:27 EST Message-Id: <4F06+1NSgkA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Biefield-Brown Experementers, here's your power su pply! X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: For those interested in hard core Biefield-Brown experimentation : Neon transformers may be rectified and filtered to generate the needed high DC voltages, but... On the other hand, if your really hard core, and know exactly what your doing, I mey be willing to part with just the set of spark plugs you need for your new hot-rod. I have a AC multiplier stack, input is 220 vac, 50-60 cycles, as 20 amps, two phase. Output is rated at 200kv, 20 ma. mac, DC. This is a two foot tall assembly with anti-corona rings fed from tapped multipler stages to control the electrostatic field near the device, and prevent arcing. It's designed to be air cooled by a high powered muffin fan, which is currently not present. Use 120 V and half the output voltage, or use a large variac for vairiable voltage. Should this not be just what you wanted for Chrismas, I can also supply a regulated and adjutable power supply good up to 10 kv at 2.0 amps, but you will need 3-phase power for this puppy. It;s a 19 inch rack, custom made for plasma research at a university (MIT Plasma Research lab?) This baby has full saftey interlocks and logic controls. Just right for that hard core Sci-fi look! Just the indicators alone out class many older props seen in films! For data collection, I can also offer a electrostatic kilovolt meter, with 0-10 and 10-20 kv ranges, it's a Beckman top of the line unit, with a large linear mirrored scale. In the transformer department, we have a custom made high voltage transformer, with a 220 volt input, and something like 75 to 100 kv, 20 mil outputs, two of them in fact, out of phase for real the sickos out there, or those who aspire to becomming James Bond villians. An assortment of high voltage caps are also available, and a few hv rectifiers, including some rare fast recovery time devices good up well past 25 khz at tens of kv. Interested persons should email me directly, here at uncle Bob's Used Scary Stuff Emporium. All this equimpment is in one of two locations in Mass, The 3 phase supply or transformer would demand a lift gate truck and a good set of strong backs, but the multiplier stack could be shipped. Ive scared myself enough times to know that this equipment needs a new home, I've had my fun already. This stuff in not hobbiest grade equipment, it is as hard core as you can get. I'm not interested in extracting a lot of money for this stuff, if you really need it, and seam like you know what your doing, we'll work something out. None of this equipment is available in designer colors. Please just remember, never become part of an electrical circuit, and have fun. From ddavidso@huachuca-sec4.army.mil Tue Nov 21 09:03:58 1995 Received: from huachuca-sec1.army.mil (HUACHUCA-SEC1.ARMY.MIL [138.27.209.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA02563 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 09:03:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by host.huachuca-sec1.army.mil id aa18095; 21 Nov 95 9:50 MST Received: from [138.27.209.254] by host.huachuca-sec1.army.mil id aa18011; 21 Nov 95 9:39 MST Received: by huachuca-sec1.army.mil with Microsoft Mail id <30B20EAD@huachuca-sec1.army.mil>; Tue, 21 Nov 95 09:38:53 PST From: "Davidson, Dan" To: freenrg-list-owner Subject: RE: fnrg: Biefield-Brown Experementers, here's your power su pply! Date: Tue, 21 Nov 95 09:30:00 PST Message-ID: <30B20EAD@huachuca-sec1.army.mil> Encoding: 14 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Status: RO X-Status: I'd be interested in the ES meter. No email was included in the memo. Dan Davidson ddavidso@huachuca-sec4.army.mil For data collection, I can also offer a electrostatic kilovolt meter, with 0-10 and 10-20 kv ranges, it's a Beckman top of the line unit, with a large linear mirrored scale. Interested persons should email me directly, here at uncle Bob's Used Scary Stuff Emporium. All this equimpment is in one of two locations in Mass, The 3 phase supply or transformer would demand a lift gate truck and a good set of strong backs, but the multiplier stack could be shipped. From ddavidso@huachuca-sec4.army.mil Tue Nov 21 07:36:52 1995 Received: from huachuca-sec1.army.mil (HUACHUCA-SEC1.ARMY.MIL [138.27.209.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA03119 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 1995 07:36:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from [138.27.209.254] by host.huachuca-sec1.army.mil id aa17532; 21 Nov 95 8:35 MST Received: by huachuca-sec1.army.mil with Microsoft Mail id <30B1FFA5@huachuca-sec1.army.mil>; Tue, 21 Nov 95 08:34:45 PST From: "Davidson, Dan" To: freenrg-list-owner Subject: RE: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ Date: Wed, 22 Nov 95 08:25:00 PST Message-ID: <30B1FFA5@huachuca-sec1.army.mil> Encoding: 44 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Status: RO X-Status: With all this talk of the T.T.Brown effect I would like to input some info I got from Paul Stowe. Paul has develped a complete aether theory which is based on treating the aether as a hydrodynamic superfluid. My paper a couple years ago at the International Tesla Society annotated Paul's breakthrough discoveries. He manages to very nicely derive the basic universal atomic constants which have never been explained. The gist is that the results show there is a very simple way to increase the efficiency of the TTB effect and he claims to have done it experimentally. The theory is that the aether is basically a DEL E-field in 3-space. The experiment allows one to use either AC or DC since a DEL E accomplished quite simply by having two conductive plates separated by an insulator with the caveat that the plates be different size. Paul sez that he tried 1/4th and 1/8 ratio plates. You need at least 50KV to get anything and 200 KV is much better. I tried it with 25KV and couldn't see anything with my 0.1g scale. Apparently the effect is exponential with DEL E so maybe my voltage was too low. If any of you have a hopped up Tesla coil maybe you would run this experiment and tell me the results. Dan Davidson ---------- From: freenrg-list-owner To: freenrg-list Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ Date: Monday, November 20, 1995 6:14PM From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT Has anybody done, or does anybody know if there is a T.T. Brown FAQ in existance? It seems like there's a lot of good info floating around on here about the materials and methods he's used, but no references....Incidentally, whoever posted it- where did you find out about the fact that Brown used barium titanate in his capacitors? It's stuff like this that, if compiled into an FAQ, would truly be a boon for all of us trying to duplicate his feats. After all, why reinvent the wheel? Regards, Jim jim_dietzel@toen.win.net From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:06:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA16221 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:42:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16182 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:42:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA28080 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:32 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7.1/8.7) id MAA08608; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:31 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: re: scalar gradiometer Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 17:18:17 -0500 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Lines: 18 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >William Beaty wrote: > >> Aha! I'm familiar with that device, and it's another example of an >> e-field meter. Your design looks much better, with a low frequency >> response going much closer to DC, and filters to keep RF >> transmitters from messing up the readings. A cople of Analog Device App. Notes might help "things go right for a change" when they try to construct this circuit: AN-202 "An I.C. Amplifier User's Gide to Decoupling, Grounding, and Making Things, Go Right for a Change" by Paul Brokaw. AN-206 "Op Amps as Electrometers, or 'The World of fA'". Maybe you can contact AD's lititure office and get copies to post on your WEB site. Their voice phone number is (708) 519-1777. FAX: (708) 519-1868. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 22:55:50 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA18467 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:55:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA18456 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:55:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA20619; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:55:00 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:54:58 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Biefield-Brown Experementers, here's your power su pply! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 13:09:14 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Hope To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com On Tue, 21 Nov 1995, Robert A. Shannon wrote: > For those interested in hard core Biefield-Brown experimentation : > > .......... > > I have a AC multiplier stack, input is 220 vac, 50-60 cycles, as 20 amps, > two phase. Output is rated at 200kv, 20 ma. mac, DC. This is a two foot > tall assembly with anti-corona rings fed from tapped multipler stages to > control the electrostatic field near the device, and prevent arcing. It's > designed to be air cooled by a high powered muffin fan, which is currently > not present. All of the equipment you list sounds really amazing! I personally wouldn't mind getting a jpegged snapsot of this rig. Theoretical me, I'm surrounded totally by books and more books. I don't get out much. I certainly hope that one of our number has the interest and the transportation wherewithal to take you up on your offer and inherit what sounds like the perfect equipment to test the Biefeld Brown at voltages high enough either lay to rest the rumors at long last, or discover the odd phenomena unseen at 20KV! Charles From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 22:56:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA18690 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA18676 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA20816; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:10 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:08 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re:sympathetic vibration Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: sphere@ddi.digital.net To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 13:11:17 +0000 > Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 17:51:45 -0800 (PST) > From: William Beaty > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 02:22:36 -0800 > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > From: Gary Hawkins > > > >transfer from one form to the other. The free energy that we are > >searching for does exist as a river flowing past us. All we got to > >discover are ways of utilising it! > > > > > >Your Southernly friend > >Chris Kleynhans > >In lovely South Africa > > > > > > > And would someone kindly tell me how that water gets > to the top of a mountain? Water is heavy. Capillary action? > Earth's rotation? Orgonomic draw from the sky? > > It can't be just pressure from below, or we would have geisers > everywhere. > > Gary Hawkins Hills and moutains usually have vegetation growing on them. Let's say we have a mountain covered with trees. The trees' leaves are warmed by the SUN and continuously pump water vapor into the atmosphere (this is called 'transpiration'). Evaporating water molecules VIBRATE much faster than liquid ones. Slowly vibrating molecules move symphathetically toward more rapidly vibrating ones as they spill out into the atmosphere. The resulting temperature gradient (vibration speed gradient) produces a molecular traction that extents from the water in the leaf cells to the water in the xylem cells comprising the flow channels leading back to the main trunk to the water in the root cells that extend deep down into the ground to the water in the bacteria that grow on the roots to the water that has settled deep into the rocks after a heavy RAIN. Using an electrical analogy, the sun is the voltage source, the trees and soil are the wire and its resistance, the temperature gradient in the trees and soil is the voltage, and the water flowing up thru them is the current. When the sky (the capacitor) fills up it breaks open (discharges) and spills its water back into the earth. The sun eventually returns and pumps the water out of the ground and back up into the sky. The sun returns sinusoidally with each passing day. Our 'eco-voltage' is pulsating DC with an even slower seasonal modulation. It's important to realize that the path the water follows up to the sky is vortical. The water spins as it moves thru all that rock, protoplasm (soil), and cytoplasm (tree). These are very fine, molecule-sized (and slightly larger) vortical streams (orgonotic motion; capillary action). They converge as springs, forming lakes and rivers. The rivers are the path down the mountain and are also vortical. The Earth sweats too. Sphere ______________________________________________ > Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today > http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA > > ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** > > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 22:57:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA18860 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:57:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA18838 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA21028; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:56 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:56:55 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Electric Rocket ect. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 11:56:41 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins At 09:34 PM 11/20/95 -0500, you wrote: > Well I have to say that I agree that someone should build the original >design first, Just tell me where one might find tin foil. Pacific Iron and Building Materials in Seattle has a 6" wide by 3" diameter roll of what they THINK MIGHT be tin foil. The guy I talked to doesn't think it is aluminum. He said it is real thin. (not like they've heard of micrometers or anything). I think this is a job for...Bill Beaty. Betcha he would recognize it. Their number is 206 628-6232. Gary Hawkins _______________________________________________ Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA ***Tesla invented radio, not Marconi*** From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 22:59:13 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA19429 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:59:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA19422 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:59:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id WAA21373; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:59:05 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:59:04 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: old 'steam table' message Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 11:18:38 -0800 (PST) From: "Eaton/Cutler-Hammer Corp." To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Cc: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Remember this (below) from last December? Fred Sparber microwave oven experiment suggests that the boil/condense cycle mentioned below isn't needed, and that new water must be used each time or the "loop" will close and o/u will not be displayed. (Actually, in his phone conversation with me on Saturday he mentioned that the water seems to "recharge" overnight, so it again displays more temp. rise on the first cycle of heating.) ===================================+================================== Bill Beaty Design Engineer Eaton/Cutler-Hammer Corp. Industrial Optoelectronics 720 80th St. SW voice: 1-800-426-9184 Everett, WA 98203-6299 fax: 1-206-347-0544 From: mdudley@brbbs.brbbs.com (MARSHALL DUDLEY) Subject: Another theory for Griggs device Date: Sat, 17 Dec 1994 12:14 -0500 (EST) In a previous post I hinted at another possibility of what may be happening in the Griggs device when I mentioned "non-linearities in the steam table" as one of several things that should be looked at. Since I did not get any bites on that, let me outline a discussion I had with a scientist from Oak Ridge National Labs about the Griggs device several months ago. This dicsussion is off the record, and most likely will not be collaborated, just as some of the results of their CF cell experiments are. I had an occasion to meet with this person and begun describing the Griggs device to him. After telling him how it worked I ended it with, "and it is reported to produce more steam or hot water than then the input power should produce". His response was "that's not surprising". I was almost floored. He then told me that is is a fairly well known fact among some researchers that the published steam tables are wrong. The original team which made up the steam tables found that toward the extremes (high pressure high temperature and low pressure and temperature) there are unexplained non-linearities. Since these non-linearities could not be explained, and were shown to not obey the conservation of energy, they fudged the tables to get rid of the non-linearities. They had assumed that there must be an error in their measurements or equipment since it did not jive with theory. Since then others have found the same thing, but none of them will stick their neck out to declare that steam tables which have been in use for decades are wrong, especially since there seems to be no theory to explain these non-linearities. Anyway, he said that if you go through a cycle of vaporization at one pressure and condensation at a higher pressure and temperature, when you get back to the original temperature and pressure the "corrected" steam table does not close. That is to say accoring to the measurements there is steam left over which should not be there, and by conservation of energy cannot be there. Anyway, he said that it seems that such a device such as Griggs would enhance this non-linearity effect and therefore produce more energy than is supplied. He does not have the foggiest idea where the excess energy could come from, but simply that given what he knows about the non-linearities in the (corrected) steam tables, that seems like a good place to start looking. I find the idea intriguing, but as with so many other theories, it leaves one with as many questions as it gives answers. Marshall From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:00:13 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA19692 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA19672 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21466; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:00 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 22:59:59 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: page Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: Andrew Cantino To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 21:00:15 -0500 (EST) I got a new science page, want to come? http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:00:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA19816 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA19805 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21540; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:32 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:00:31 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Hi Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 20:12:46 -0800 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: PGB@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) I'm new to this list. Just seeing if this works. Dr. Patrick Bailey President, Institute for New Energy www.padrak.com/ine/ Just updated today! Check it out!!! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:01:26 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA20004 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA19993 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21609; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:18 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:17 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: India Ink update... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Date: Tue, 21 Nov 1995 22:39:48 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Well I purchased to brands of India ink today. One claims 100% carbon pigment,no dyes. The other has no ingredents. I tested both, painting one side and soaking the paper. Neither brand nor method proved to be conductive on paper. I then tested the ink itself by sticking the probes in the ink bottle. Hunt's brand measured 6K ohms dropping to 10K ohms in about 10 seconds. The second brand measured 5K ohms dropping to 8K ohms in about the same time. Why would the readings drop? Bad ohm meter or is the particles of carbon moving around because of the voltage used for measuring ohms? I haven't heard back about the tin foil, I will probably call them tomorrow. Some one said they had used India ink as a conducter before. This ink isn't as thick as I thought it would be. I also noticed that when you buy ink if it's black they will call it India ink.I'm going to call Hunt Manufacturing tommorrow and see what all is in there ink. Maybe I can get the concentrated carbon liquid they use to make the ink instead. Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:01:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA20123 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA20099 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21649; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:48 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:01:47 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Seiko Watch Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Wed, 22 Nov 95 11:58 GMT From: nic@cix.compulink.co.uk (Nic Landmark) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <199511162228.QAA25620@l2.conline.com> > >In-Reply-To: <199511161011.FAA21816@service.agate.net> > >John Bell wrote: > >> Hi. > >> > >> I saw an ad today for a new watch by Seiko they called the > > 'kinetic'. >They > >> claimed that it used no batteries (I assume you don't wind it, too). > > >From > >> the picture they had in the commercial, it looked like it had a > > spinning > >> half-plate (like you'd find in a hard drive) and two coils, among > > other > >> things I couldn't identify before the ad ended. Has anyone heard > >> anything > >> about this? I'd think it would have to be perpetual motion. Either > >> that or > >> have a built in power supply with some way to make it last for > > years, >which > >> would be false advertising. Thoughts? > >> > > > >No, it's just an ordinary generator that depends on the movement of > your >arm to make it work. Not that different from an ordinary > self-winding >watch in principle. > > > >Nic > > > > Does this mean that if it is left to > sit in a drawer for an extended period of time > it will no longer function? > > Lorri > Yes, that's what it means. Nic From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:03:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA20466 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA20443 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21863; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:13 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:12 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: INE Web Page Updated - Read It! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 10:56:15 -0800 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: PGB@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) The Institute for New Energy Web Page has been updated, and now includes the October 1995 issue of New Energy News as a sample issue. This NEN issue covers the recent advances and current status of cold fusion devices, as well as the other usual topics. Enjoy: www.padrak.com/ine/ Do something to promote a better world for all! I'd be Thankful for that. Patrick Bailey. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:03:52 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA20598 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA20590 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21917; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:45 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:03:44 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: AntiGrav Report - Janes's 1995 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 15:55:22 -0600 (CST) Anti-Gravity for Real -- Discussed in Jane's Defence Weekly Jane's Defence Weekly of 10 June 1995, has an article about advanced aerospace technologies, written by Nick Cook. The idea of anti-gravity is taken seriously and is auspicously present throught the article -- including three artist renditions of future anti-gravity based craft. The Jane's article commences with a mention of anti-gravity technology, and also ends with a few paragraphs discussing anti-gravity. In between is the bulk of the article, which consists of discussion of "conventional" subjects, including: Hypersonics, Gas Turbine Inrements, The Super Cockpit, and Stealth. At the start of the Jane's article there is some information from the Gravity Rand Report on Electrogravitics which was done for the USAF in 1956, and was recently declassified. Here's an excerpt from the beginning of the Jane's article. Take this example from a specialist US aviation magazine in 1956. "We're already working with equipment to cancel out gravity," Lawrence D Bell, founder of the company that bears his name was quoted as saying. Bell, apparently, was not the only one working in this field. Others said to be seeking to master this arcane 'science' included the Glenn L Martin Company, Convair, Lear, and Sperry Gyroscope. Within a few years we were assured, aircraft, cars, submarines and power stations would all be driven by this radical new propulsion technology. Sadly it was not to be. Here's the ending section of the Jane's article. BEYOND 2001 Groom Lake Nevada is the epicentre of classified USAF research into Stealth and other exotic aerospace technologies. Several years after the collapse of the Soviet threat, activity and investment at this remote, highly secret air base (so secret its prescence is, as yet, unacknowledged by the US government) is still on the increase. While research into less sensitive technologies such two-dimensional thrust-vectoring and advanced short take-off and vertical landing (ASTOVL) are pursued in the open at nearby Edwards AFB in California, Groom Lake is set to hang onto its secrets. The USAF's recent confiscation of 1600 acres of public land bordering the facility is consistent with the Pentagon's desire to maintain its lead in quantum leap technologies -- some of which, according to well qualified observers in and around the Nevada area, defy current thinking into the predicted direction of aerospace engineering. That aerospace ocmpanies continue to look at highly radical alternative air vehicle concepts is evidence of the ongoing quest for breakthrough designs. Glimpses into this world are rare, but provide some insight into likely 21st century research activity. The 1990 unclassified 'Electric Propulsion Study' (a quest for antigravity propulsion system by another name) conducted by the USA's Science Application International Corp (SAIC) on behalf of USAF's then Astronautics Laboratory at Edwards AFB shows that USAF visionaries are still being given free reign. Until recently BAe (British Aerospace) also provided internal resources for its own anti-gravity studies and even went so far as to outline this thinking with artists' concepts -- a case of Lawrence Bell's vision perhaps being not so wide of the mark after all. Before he died, Ben Rich, who headed Lockheed's Skunk Works from 1975-1991, was quoted as saying: "We have some new things. We are not stagnating. What we are doing is updating ourselves, without advertising. There are some new programmes, and there are certain things -- some of them 20 to 30 years old -- that are still breakthroughs and appropriate to keep quiet about. Other people don't have them yet. Thirty years from now, we may still not know the half of what is currently being tested in and around Groom Lake. Copyright 1995, Jane's Defence Weekly, All rights reserved. /* This file is transmitted under the "Fair Use" rulings regarding the 1976 Copyright Act for NON-profit academic and general information purposes. */ I have attained a copy of the table of contents from the 'Electric Propulsion Study' which is mentioned in the Jane's article. This study was prepared for the USAF by a scientist at SAIC. It has some familiar names and ideas to those of us who have been researching the fringe science of anti-gravity. I am looking forward to attaining a copy of the report. Regards, Robert Stirniman (robert@wwa.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:04:35 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA20772 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:04:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA20752 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:04:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA21988; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:04:21 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:04:20 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: AntiGrav Report - USAF 1990 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 15:56:38 -0600 (CST) USAF Report on Anti-Gravity Technologies Copied below is the table of contents from a report which provides summary information about a wide variety of advanced science and technologies, and approaches to anti-gravity. The report was prepared by Dr Dennis Cravens of SAIC for Edwards AFB and was recently declassified. At this time, I have neither a full copy of the report, nor information about how to attain it. These may be forthcoming. The experimental section of this report may be of special interest for "amateur" researchers in antigravity. A number of familiar names and ideas can be found, such as: Section 3.3 Biefeld-Brown Effects, Section 3.7 Non- Inductive Coils (possibly related to Hooper invention), and Section 3.6 Spin Aligned Nuclei (possibly related to Wallace Inventions). ================================================================= TABLE OF CONTENTS Page PREFACE ........................................... 1 I. INTRODUCTION ...................................... 2 1.1 Background and Theoretical Developments ....... 4 1.2 Measurement ................................... 6 1.3 Force Fields .................................. 8 1.4 Chirality - Odd Number Space-Like Dimensions .. 11 II. THEORIES .......................................... 13 2.1 Introduction .................................. 13 2.2 General Framework of Theory ................... 14 2.2.1 Born - Infield ............................ 17 2.2.2 Lande' .................................... 19 2.2.3 Podolsky .................................. 20 2.2.4 Corben .................................... 21 2.2.5 Flint ..................................... 21 2.2.6 Ingraham .................................. 21 2.2.7 Arctan Potential .......................... 23 2.2.8 Milne ..................................... 24 2.2.9 Williams .................................. 25 2.3 Development of 5-D EM Equations ............... 27 2.3.1 Modifications to Maxwell's Equations ...... 33 2.3.2 Lorentz Forces in 5-D ..................... 36 2.3.3 Wave Propagation in 5-Space ............... 38 2.3.4 Limits to Conversion Rates ................ 40 2.3.5 Reduction to Newton's Laws - PPN .......... 41 2.3.6 Thermoelectric Potentials in Gravity Field. 43 2.3.7 Field Vectors and Equations in 5-D ........ 44 2.4 Conservation Laws ............................. 47 2.4.1 Conservation of Energy .................... 48 2.4.2 Conservation of Linear Momentum ........... 50 2.4.3 Conservation of Angular Momentum .......... 51 2.4.4 Conservation of Parity .................... 53 2.4.5 Conservation of Pseudovectors ............. 54 2.4.6 Conditions for Non-Conservations .......... 58 2.5 Vacuum Fluctuations ........................... 60 2.6 Quantum Considerations ........................ 62 2.7 Compatibility of 10-D String Theories ......... 68 2.8 Mach's Principle .............................. 69 2.9 Rosen's Bi-Metric Theory ...................... 72 2.10 Non-Conservation .............................. 74 2.11 Particles in 5-D Spaces ....................... 76 III. EXPERIMENTS 3.1 Approach to Selection of Experiments .......... 78 3.2 Radiation Pressure ............................ 80 3.3 Biefeld-Brown Effects ......................... 83 3.4 Conductive Submarine .......................... 88 3.5 Gravitational Rotor ........................... 89 3.6 Spin Aligned Nuclei -- Magnetic and Rotational Alignment ............ 90 3.7 Non-Inductive Coils ........................... 94 3.8 EM Transparency of Conductive Media ........... 100 3.9 Magnetic Loop ................................. 101 3.10 Speed of Light in a Mass Flow ................. 103 3.11 Charged Torque Pendulum ....................... 105 3.12 Thermoelectric/Gravitational Effects .......... 107 3.13 Binary Pulsar ................................. 107 3.14 Proton Scattering ............................. 107 3.15 Inertial Mass Variation ....................... 107 3.16 An Improper Experiment ........................ 108 IV. CONCLUSIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS .................. 110 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:07:14 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA21469 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:07:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA21432 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:06:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA22257; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:06:54 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:06:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Ink info... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 21:11:45 -0700 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Since I have heard nothing from the list do to mail problems on my end I well let you know what I found out today. I talked to the chemist at Hunt's Manufacturing, producers of one of the india ink samples I picked up the other day. He explained how the ink has powdered carbon in it as well as shilack and varnish of some kind to suspend the carbon and keep it from just brushing off when it dries. He gave me a rough estimate of .7 lbs of carbon powder to a gallon of the liquid to make the ink. I explained that I needed the ink to be conductive. So he's going to mix up a little of what he thinks will work, pretty much just consentrate the carbon,and send it to me. I haven't heard back from the person who had used india ink for a cap before, but I'm wondering how they where able to get 0 ohms right out of the bottle. If you can get a brand name of it. Thanks. No word on the tin, should know more next week. Todd jdavid28@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 22 23:17:54 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA24488 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:17:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA24451 for ; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:17:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id XAA23136; Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:17:36 -0800 Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:17:35 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: India Ink update... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com > Well I purchased to brands of India ink today. One claims 100% carbon > pigment,no dyes. The other has no ingredents. > I tested both, painting one side and soaking the paper. Neither brand nor > method proved to be conductive on paper. Depends on what you mean by "conductive." If the capacitor ends up to be about .0001uF per plate, what resistance of plate will significantly slow down the charging? Well, charging time is roughly R x C, so if "slow" means one second, then R equals... 10,000 MEGohms! For this capacitor, thousands of megohms means "conductive" and tens of thousands of megohms means "resistive." You'd need a 'megger' (insulation meter) before you could measure the ink and see if its conductive enough. Most meters can't measure over 100Meg, and 100 megohms would look like a superconductor to this thing. > I then tested the ink itselfby sticking the probes in the ink bottle. > Hunt's brand measured 6K ohms dropping to 10K ohms in about 10 seconds. The > second brand measured 5K ohms dropping to 8K ohms in about the same time. > Why would the readings drop? Bad ohm meter or is the particles of carbon > moving around because of the voltage used for measuring ohms? When wet, the conductivity is probably from water, meaning electrolysis, meaning micro-bubbles and chemical corrosion on your meter leads changing the resistance as you watch. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 03:27:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id DAA18509 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 03:27:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA18487 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 03:27:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a12.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a12.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.12]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id WAA26514 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 22:24:59 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511231124.WAA26514@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 22:27:22 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Energy Storage In a Capacitor? Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 19 Nov 95 at 18:18, William Beaty wrote: > From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) > Newsgroups: list.freenrg > To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Subject: Energy Storage In a Capacitor? > > > How much energy is stored in a capacitor? > [snip] > It seems to my math that 2.5 Joules of energy are now "missing"? > [Remember we are assuming idea parts & conditions here.] > > Can some one please explain this to me? > [snip] Well isn't _anyone_ going to spring into the breach? Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 06:09:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id GAA11252 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 06:08:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix6.ix.netcom.com (ix6.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.6]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA11242 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 06:08:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix6.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id GAA24843; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 06:07:32 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 06:07:32 -0800 Message-Id: <199511231407.GAA24843@ix6.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: fnrg: Tesla Patent To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Would anyone know if Tesla's "Apparatus For Transmitting Electrical Energy" Patent #1,119,732 a free energy device? It doesn't seem to have any power input. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 14:18:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id OAA01746 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 14:18:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from procyon (procyon.pmc-sierra.bc.ca [134.87.115.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA01732 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 14:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by procyon (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA04101; Thu, 23 Nov 95 14:15:35 -0800 Message-Id: Date: 23 Nov 1995 14:19:00 U From: "carr" Subject: fnrg: Re: fnrg- Scalar gradiometer To: "freenrg-list@eskimo.com" X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.2 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Reply to: RE>fnrg: Scalar gradiometer Was as description of this device put on www.eskimo.com? I vaguely remember a message about it, but must have deleted it. Larrie. -------------------------------------- Date: 19/11/95 6:49 PM From: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Scalar gradiometer Date: Sat, 18 Nov 1995 17:46:25 -0600 From: Mark Mansfield To: William Beaty William Beaty wrote: > > Hi Mark! Bob Shannon says you're interested in how I rendered his > hand-drawn schematic into GIF. I used Paintshop Pro to blur, Sounds like a pretty neat way of importing graphics into transferable files. [snip] > > Isn't this device just a fieldstrength meter for e-fields? Comb >your hair at it on a dry day fifty feet away and deflect the needle? >Use it to "feel" where someone has touched fur to a plexiglas >window? What non-conventional effects does it exhibit? > > ALso: check out my Science Demonstrations page, and look under > Electrometer Array. I've had great fun with numerous voltage- > detecting devices in my museum work. > Yes it can be used as a field strength meter for e-fields. I guess the closest thing to it was that "cyber-probe" thingy that appeared in Nuts and Volts magazine a few years back. Our device works on a similar principle I would say. It is quite sensitive however. We were successful in mapping lay lines up in New Hampshire a couple of years back. The place is called "America's Stonehenge". I was very scheptical of the place having any signifigance, in a "lay line" way until I went back to the car and got out the gradiometer just for fun. I had done pegged this place's only signifigance was to line someones pocket with tourist money. Much to my supprise and dismay, I was able to map very accuratly the lay lines by walking around in a circle where they said on "their" maps was the central point which we found to be approxmatly 50 feet off. The actual central point of the layout was on a large slap of granite which had very large areas of pink quartz imbeaded in it. Taking our new central point, I walked around a circle and would stop each time the meter made a radical swing. Someone standing on the center spot would confirm a marker stone on the outer circle of stones. We were able to locate several lay lines and marker stones that did not appear on their maps by walking in the direction of the reading. One of the markers was off by about 5 feet and we noticed that it had moved over time. I would guess by earthquake or freeze/thaw cycles. It was a very large rock, and I doubt anyone would have purposely moved it as it was out a ways in the woods and was not marked on their maps. Oh well, it was a fun day anyway and very educational. It made the hair stand up on the back of my neck when we first started using the thing. That's for another time though. Mark ------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------ Received: by pmcmac.pmc-sierra.bc.ca with SMTP;19 Nov 1995 18:40:41 U Received: by procyon (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA15494; Sun, 19 Nov 95 18:32:12 -0800 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA07968 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA07954 for ; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id SAA26199; Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:32 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:25:32 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Scalar gradiometer Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 07:21:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA24909 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 07:20:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from acad.suffolk.edu (acad.suffolk.edu [192.80.92.251]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA24893 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 07:20:47 -0800 (PST) From: lee02016@acad.suffolk.edu Received: by acad.suffolk.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA21922; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:20:30 -0500 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:16:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <199511231407.GAA24843@ix6.ix.netcom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 23 Nov 1995, dennis lee wrote: > Would anyone know if Tesla's "Apparatus For Transmitting Electrical > Energy" Patent #1,119,732 a free energy device? It doesn't seem to have > any power input. > > The book, 'Tesla : the Lost Inventions' describes it as a magnifying transmitter. I believe its aim is to act as a transformer (or antenna, if you will) to interface the power source (generator, Hoover Dam, etc) to the the Earth's ionosphere for long distance transmission. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 08:18:45 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA08417 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:18:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA08384 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:18:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw55.fastlane.net (fw55.fastlane.net [204.251.17.155]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA10337 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:16:34 -0600 Message-Id: <199511231716.LAA10337@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:17:32 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: AntiGrav Report - USAF 1990 X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >From Bert to Robert: Robert, this looks like a golden nugget! I hope you can get the paper in its entirety! Bert >From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) >To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com >Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 15:56:38 -0600 (CST) > >USAF Report on Anti-Gravity Technologies > >Copied below is the table of contents from a report which >provides summary information about a wide variety of advanced >science and technologies, and approaches to anti-gravity. >The report was prepared by Dr Dennis Cravens of SAIC >for Edwards AFB and was recently declassified. At this >time, I have neither a full copy of the report, nor >information about how to attain it. These may be forthcoming. > >The experimental section of this report may be of special >interest for "amateur" researchers in antigravity. A >number of familiar names and ideas can be found, such >as: Section 3.3 Biefeld-Brown Effects, Section 3.7 Non- >Inductive Coils (possibly related to Hooper invention), >and Section 3.6 Spin Aligned Nuclei (possibly related >to Wallace Inventions). >================================================================= > > TABLE OF CONTENTS > Page > PREFACE ........................................... 1 > > I. INTRODUCTION ...................................... 2 > 1.1 Background and Theoretical Developments ....... 4 > 1.2 Measurement ................................... 6 > 1.3 Force Fields .................................. 8 > 1.4 Chirality - Odd Number Space-Like Dimensions .. 11 > >II. THEORIES .......................................... 13 > > 2.1 Introduction .................................. 13 > > 2.2 General Framework of Theory ................... 14 > 2.2.1 Born - Infield ............................ 17 > 2.2.2 Lande' .................................... 19 > 2.2.3 Podolsky .................................. 20 > 2.2.4 Corben .................................... 21 > 2.2.5 Flint ..................................... 21 > 2.2.6 Ingraham .................................. 21 > 2.2.7 Arctan Potential .......................... 23 > 2.2.8 Milne ..................................... 24 > 2.2.9 Williams .................................. 25 > > 2.3 Development of 5-D EM Equations ............... 27 > 2.3.1 Modifications to Maxwell's Equations ...... 33 > 2.3.2 Lorentz Forces in 5-D ..................... 36 > 2.3.3 Wave Propagation in 5-Space ............... 38 > 2.3.4 Limits to Conversion Rates ................ 40 > 2.3.5 Reduction to Newton's Laws - PPN .......... 41 > 2.3.6 Thermoelectric Potentials in Gravity Field. 43 > 2.3.7 Field Vectors and Equations in 5-D ........ 44 > > 2.4 Conservation Laws ............................. 47 > 2.4.1 Conservation of Energy .................... 48 > 2.4.2 Conservation of Linear Momentum ........... 50 > 2.4.3 Conservation of Angular Momentum .......... 51 > 2.4.4 Conservation of Parity .................... 53 > 2.4.5 Conservation of Pseudovectors ............. 54 > 2.4.6 Conditions for Non-Conservations .......... 58 > > 2.5 Vacuum Fluctuations ........................... 60 > 2.6 Quantum Considerations ........................ 62 > 2.7 Compatibility of 10-D String Theories ......... 68 > 2.8 Mach's Principle .............................. 69 > 2.9 Rosen's Bi-Metric Theory ...................... 72 > 2.10 Non-Conservation .............................. 74 > 2.11 Particles in 5-D Spaces ....................... 76 > >III. EXPERIMENTS > > 3.1 Approach to Selection of Experiments .......... 78 > 3.2 Radiation Pressure ............................ 80 > 3.3 Biefeld-Brown Effects ......................... 83 > 3.4 Conductive Submarine .......................... 88 > 3.5 Gravitational Rotor ........................... 89 > 3.6 Spin Aligned Nuclei -- > Magnetic and Rotational Alignment ............ 90 > 3.7 Non-Inductive Coils ........................... 94 > 3.8 EM Transparency of Conductive Media ........... 100 > 3.9 Magnetic Loop ................................. 101 > 3.10 Speed of Light in a Mass Flow ................. 103 > 3.11 Charged Torque Pendulum ....................... 105 > 3.12 Thermoelectric/Gravitational Effects .......... 107 > 3.13 Binary Pulsar ................................. 107 > 3.14 Proton Scattering ............................. 107 > 3.15 Inertial Mass Variation ....................... 107 > 3.16 An Improper Experiment ........................ 108 > > IV. CONCLUSIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS .................. 110 > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 08:27:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA10943 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:27:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA10919 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:27:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw55.fastlane.net (fw55.fastlane.net [204.251.17.155]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA10658 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:25:32 -0600 Message-Id: <199511231725.LAA10658@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:26:30 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Would anyone know if Tesla's "Apparatus For Transmitting Electrical >Energy" Patent #1,119,732 a free energy device? It doesn't seem to have >any power input. > Richard Hull, of "Tesla Coil Builders of Richmond" VA has built many versions of Tesla's Magnifying transmitter, though on a smaller scale. These devices do have a power input, usually 220 volts at currents of 50 amperes or higher. Rob Kovak also did some impressive work on trying to figure out how Tesla might have used the magnifying transmitter to broadcast power. The device was used to broadcast electrical power, and no one that I've seen has claimed to see any over-unity effects. You might want to prowel trough some of the past issues of Electric Spacecraft Journal and Extraoedinary science for more specific info. Bert > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 07:29:01 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA26709 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 07:28:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA26690 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 07:28:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id KAA27397 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:28:38 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511231528.KAA27397@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: Electric Rocket ect. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:28:37 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "William Beaty" at Nov 22, 95 10:56:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A I keep getting messages about a Electric Rocket. How do I make one, what dose it do? I missed the start of this topic, so i'm lost. Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 08:42:59 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA14950 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:42:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA14928 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 08:42:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw74.fastlane.net (fw74.fastlane.net [204.251.17.74]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA11420 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:40:49 -0600 Message-Id: <199511231740.LAA11420@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:41:47 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool, Leslie Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: Biefield-Brown Experementers, here's your power su pply! X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >From Bert Pool to Robert Shannon I am interested in your high voltage capacitors. What values and voltage ratings do you have on hand? Bert nikki@fastlane.net >For those interested in hard core Biefield-Brown experimentation : > >Neon transformers may be rectified and filtered to generate the needed high >DC voltages, but... > >On the other hand, if your really hard core, and know exactly what your >doing, I mey be willing to part with just the set of spark plugs you need >for your new hot-rod. > >I have a AC multiplier stack, input is 220 vac, 50-60 cycles, as 20 amps, >two phase. Output is rated at 200kv, 20 ma. mac, DC. This is a two foot >tall assembly with anti-corona rings fed from tapped multipler stages to >control the electrostatic field near the device, and prevent arcing. It's >designed to be air cooled by a high powered muffin fan, which is currently >not present. > >Use 120 V and half the output voltage, or use a large variac for vairiable >voltage. > >Should this not be just what you wanted for Chrismas, I can also supply a >regulated and adjutable power supply good up to 10 kv at 2.0 amps, but you >will need 3-phase power for this puppy. It;s a 19 inch rack, custom made >for plasma research at a university (MIT Plasma Research lab?) This baby >has full saftey interlocks and logic controls. Just right for that hard >core Sci-fi look! Just the indicators alone out class many older props >seen in films! > >For data collection, I can also offer a electrostatic kilovolt meter, with >0-10 and 10-20 kv ranges, it's a Beckman top of the line unit, with a large >linear mirrored scale. > >In the transformer department, we have a custom made high voltage >transformer, with a 220 volt input, and something like 75 to 100 kv, 20 mil >outputs, two of them in fact, out of phase for real the sickos out there, >or those who aspire to becomming James Bond villians. > >An assortment of high voltage caps are also available, and a few hv >rectifiers, including some rare fast recovery time devices good up well >past 25 khz at tens of kv. > >Interested persons should email me directly, here at uncle Bob's Used Scary >Stuff Emporium. All this equimpment is in one of two locations in Mass, The >3 phase supply or transformer would demand a lift gate truck and a good set >of strong backs, but the multiplier stack could be shipped. > >Ive scared myself enough times to know that this equipment needs a new home, > I've had my fun already. This stuff in not hobbiest grade equipment, it >is as hard core as you can get. I'm not interested in extracting a lot of >money for this stuff, if you really need it, and seam like you know what >your doing, we'll work something out. None of this equipment is available >in designer colors. > >Please just remember, never become part of an electrical circuit, and have >fun. > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:09:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA16246 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:42:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16205 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:42:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA28095 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:38 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7.1/8.7) id MAA08651; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:36 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: static elec. circuit Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:56:32 -0500 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Lines: 36 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article , you wrote: >From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net >To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com >Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT >Can anybody out there tell me if this would work? I've thought up a >"perpetual" HV device, but it almost seems too simple to work. From what >I understand, if a static charge is applied to the inside of a dome or >sphere, then the charge will migrate to the outside of said dome or >sphere. Also, if you were to attach a pointed probe to the outside of >the dome or sphere, the charge would leak off. Bearing these two facts >in mind, what is to keep us from doing this... > > /---------------------------------------------------\ > [ ] > [ ) ] > [ ) ] > [ / ) ] > [ / / ) ] > \------------------------ )------------------------/ > \ \ ) > \ ) > ) > ) > >In doing this, you feed the probe from the outside of the dome into the >inside of the dome. Provided we initially ground the inside of the >dome to remove the initial opposite net charge, the charge is still >travelling from the area of highest concentration to the area of lowest >concentration. If you use a high voltage potting material inside the >dome to surround the leads to avoid the production of ozone, and reduce >sparkover, than it should theoretically work, right? Any and all >correspondence appreciated... You just reinvented T.T.Browns "Fluid Pump". Staked four or five of them vertically. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:13:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA16300 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:43:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA16253 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:43:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA28099 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:38 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7.1/8.7) id MAA08656; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:42:36 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:35:37 -0500 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Lines: 292 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In article , you wrote: >From: jim_dietzel@toen.win.net >To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com >Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 13:58:00 GMT >Has anybody done, or does anybody know if there is a T.T. Brown FAQ in >existance? I've never seen such a thing, would be nice. A lot of Brown stuff can be found at: Rex Research P.O. Box 19250 Jean NV 89019 USA For example NR 046-BT2/B17-BRV "T. Brown: Petro-Voltaics" (Gravito-Electirc Conversion). Most people think Brown was just into flying capacitors he was into much much more... >It seems like there's a lot of good info floating around on >here about the materials and methods he's used, but no >references....Incidentally, whoever posted it- where did you find out >about the fact that Brown used barium titanate in his capacitors? It's >stuff like this that, if compiled into an FAQ, would truly be a boon for >all of us trying to duplicate his feats. After all, why reinvent the >wheel? The definitive works would be Brown's hand written lab note books, of which there where at least six. Any one know where to get all six? Here are some titles that I've collected: "The Wizard of Electro-Gravity: The Man Who Discovered how UFOs are powered." by William L. Moore. In UFO Report magazine. Unfortunately the issue date is not on this copy, and the magazine is at work. A lot of the same information can be found in the book "The Philadelphia Experiment: Project Invisibility" by William L. Moore with Charles Berlitz. Chapter 10 "The Force Fields of Townsend Brown". These two items are the same, I just don't know which one came first. Also there is more than one book with the title "The Philadelphia Experiment". You want the one with ISBN 0-449-20526-6. "The Townsend Brown Electro-Gravity Device: A Comprehensive Evaluation by the Office of NAVAL Research" 15 September 1952. Such as "How I Control Gravity by T. Townsend Brown" from Science and Invention Magazine Aug. 1929. And it is: + ------------ ---- ------------ ---- ------------ ---- ------------ ---- - Not: + ------------ - ---- + ------------ - ---- + ------------ - ---- + ------------ - ---- [In reference to a message one the list from last week.] "Townsend Brown and his Anti-Gravity Discs" by Gaston Burridge in Fate Magazine. No issue date is visible. "Electrical Self-Potential in Rocks" by T.Townsend Brown, some time after 1/1976, but again no source is visible. "Another Step Toward Anti-Gravity" by Gaston Burridge in The American Mercury, June 1958, p77. "Towards Flight without Stress or Strain... or Weight" by Intel, Washington, D.C. [Doesn't make since but that is what it says.] Some one just on the list here just reinvented "The Fluid Pump" by T.Townsend Brown for the Whitehall-Rand Group, Washition, D.C. -------- Worth noting are a letter from SRI to a unknonw party dated 12/20/82 that reads in part... "SRI International has never sponsored the work of Mr. Brown..." ect.. In a letter to Moore from Brown dated 12/17/76, that reads in part: "I am still working on petroelectricity and the project is housed largely at Stanford Research Institute with additional assistance being provided by the University of California - Berkeley and the Ames Research center of NASA. Unfortunately, under the circumstances, while this project is being evaluated for funding by ERDA we should not and cannot publish details..." "Your next question concerns the airfoils. As far as I am aware, no rf is radiated. There is, of course, a static d.c. field which accompanies the airfoils in flight." -------- I don't want to go into the Brown Publishing biz. But I don't want to keep them to my self either. I'll see if I can get some thing worked out with some one, or send them off to Rex. "All Information Should Be Free" - The Hackers Ethic This is a bulletin posted on my BBS in Franklin PA [(814) 678-1321] that explains how I got involved with this mess. If any one has any other info please let me know. "The Philadelphia Experiment" and it's Franklin Reno connection: Welcome to the area; a most interesting area indeed... :-) FRANKLIN 8 RENO 3 The Philadelphia Experiment By William L.Moore in consultation with Charles Berlitz Author of the Bermuda Triangle Published By Ballantine Books Cover Up - Or Uncanny Truth? "Are you saying that the Navy tried to make you invisible, in some sort of experiment?" "Electronic camouflage," came the answer. "Some sort of electrical camouflage produced by pulsating energy fields...We couldn't take it-none of us. Though it affected us in different ways. Some only saw double, others began to laugh and stagger like they were drunk, and a few passed out. Some even claimed that they had passed into another world and had seen and TALKED to strange alien beings. And in some cases the effects weren't temporary. I was told later that several had died...But as for the rest of us who survived-well, they just let us go. Disability, they called it. Discharged as mentally unbalanced and unfit for further service...That way, if the Navy ever got questioned about it, they could just chalk it up as a story cooked up by a bunch of nuts..." "The Philadelphia Experiment" A bizarre excursion into the unknown >From chapter 9, pg 173: The Unexpected Key "....The reader will recall that early in his second letter to Dr. Jessup, Allende made an assertion to the effect that not only was Einstein's Unified Field Theory completed between 1925 and 1927, but an entire theory was subjected by the Navy to a "complete (Group math) recheck...with a view to any and every possible quick use of it...in a very short time." If Allende is to be believed, then it was the results of this mathematical process which supposedly provided the theoretical basis for what was eventually to become the Philadelphia Experiment." PG 174: " the name of the scientist allegedly in charge of this "recheck." This man is identified as Dr. Franklin Reno," {TAKE NOTE OF THAT NAME!} "a man whom Allende refers quite offhandedly as "my friend." "Obviously if this Dr. Reno could be found, and if he could be convinced to add his testimony...." "Now, after several years of persistent research into this aspect of the affair, the authors at last feel that the riddle surrounding the identity of the elusive Dr. Reno has been solved! And with it comes a fantastic tale which seems to provide for the first time some substantial insights into the mystery which for so long has enshrouded the so-called Philadelphia Experiment...." PG 175: "The substance of that story is that man referred to by Allende as Dr Franklin Reno was not only a very real person but, before his death only a little more than a year before this writing, he personally verified to Moore the substantial truth of Allende's statements concerning the beginnings of the project which came to be known as the Philadelphia Experiment." The book was copyrighted in 1979. "the reason why earlier researchers were completely unsuccessful in their efforts to find this Franklin Reno is easily explained by the simple fact that they were looking for a man whose name was not Franklin Reno, although a clue to the name and the whereabouts of the man was on a road map of the state of Pennsylvania! In the oil-producing region of northwestern Pennsylvania, along U.S. Route 62 not far from Oil City, lies the city of Franklin, Pennsylvania-a peaceful little trading center of about 8,000 population and the county seat of Venango County. Five miles to the east, still on the same road and about midway between Franklin and Oil City, lies the village of Reno, home of a large refinery of the Wolf's Head Oil Company. Just outside this same Oil City, on the west bound side of Route 62, stood, until a few years ago, the road sign that explains why so many diligent researchers have been so consistently unsuccessful in their efforts to identify Allende's mysterious "friend." Printed on this sign were the words FRANKLIN 8 RENO 3 -the same words which inspired a very real scientist over thirty years ago to create a very effective pseudonym. [If you saw the Penzoil Fire in Rousevill PA on the National News this fall you saw the location of this sign.] But if "Franklin Reno: is nothing more than a pseudonym, then the question now become: (1) Who is the real person? (2) What is (or was) his connection with Carlos Miguel Allende? (3) What, if anything, can he add to the story? Unfortunately the matter is so sensitive that these questions cannot be entirely answered even yet for reasons which the reader will come to understand as the story progresses. For even though the man Allende knew as Dr. Reno has since died, we have been enjoined to be discreet by those still living who are very interested in maintaining the status quo. Consequently, we have chosen to refer to this individual as Dr. Rinehart, the name given to him in a fictionalized version of the Philadelphia Experiment published recently, representing yet another indication of increasing public interest and awareness in the "impossible" experiment." PG 177: "...Dr rinehart, who, when he began to suspect he knew too much for his own good (and perhaps his survival), chose to hide himself away from the segments of society that seemed to threaten him the most." "They still watch over me, you know. In fact, it's actually come to the point where I try to avoid going certain places in the town because of the sudden interest my appearance there seems to create-especially around certain buildings down at the university." PG 194: "Do you recall what the code name of this project might have been?" Rinehart: "Rainbow" or "Mirage". From Inter-Service Code-Word Index 9/1/1941 7470 RAINBOW 334 PG 198: "No one at this point had ever considered the possibility of interdimensional effects or mass displacement.".... I've talked with Mr Moore about his "Great Detective" work, he went to collage at Teil (Spelling?) in Greenville, and knew of this area because he travailed through it to go to Titusville basket ball games. Some thing I've always wondered about: with the exception of the now infamous FRANKLIN 8/RENO 3 sign, all of the signs list at least the next two places down the road, a few list up to the next four places down the road. The RENO sign now stands alone as "RENO x", conspicuous in its singularity.....any one know where the original sign is???? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 10:20:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA10722 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:20:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix11.ix.netcom.com (ix11.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.11]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA10706 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:20:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id KAA07804; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:17:51 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 10:17:51 -0800 Message-Id: <199511231817.KAA07804@ix11.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > The device was used to broadcast electrical power, and no one that I've seen has >claimed to see any over-unity effects. I can't see why J.P. Morgan would want to stop progress on Wardenclyffe if Tesla intended to broadcast power from conventional sources. Tesla would still have to buy power from Morgan. The patent does say that G may be an alternator or condenser. In the interview for the radio patent (Work with Alternating Currents and Their Application to Wireless Telegraphy, Telephony, and Transmission of Power) Tesla does state that G represents any method of getting continuous waves (p.146). What ever that means. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:01:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA20637 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:01:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA20599; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:01:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id LAA23691; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:01:03 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:01:02 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-L@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Altering of half-lives Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Below is an interesting message regarding macroscopic electrostatics having an effect on nuclear decay rates. I can't recall if I forward this to the list last month. If there are some undiscovered "windows" of interaction with the nucleus, maybe there are many hidden routes for extracting nuclear energy, causing low-enery transmutation, breeding chicken which lay self-warming eggs with palladium-fiber yolks, etc. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 3 Aug 1995 01:15:16 -0400 (EDT) From: John Schnurer To: William Beaty Subject: Post this .... Dear bill, Post on Keely net and Internet. Don't put my name on it until I have done last tests. Patent numbers for Barker 5,076,931 and 4,91.880. I have a copy of the latter nd here is some form it. Firm: Skjerven, Morrill, MacPherson, Franklin and Friel. William A. Barker Aug 31, 1988 filed Date of patent Oct 9 1990 "Electrostatic Voltage Excitation Apparatus" Some stuff, in no order. missing some pages, will call it up again. Am 241 was closed 54.2 uCurie alpha emitter. Embedded in 6 mm thick plastic cylider so as to block alphas. "The radiation which penetrates the cylider is a discrete gamma spectrum consisting of nine gamma lines ranging from 11.871 to 59.5364 ke V. ....... Pre excitation counts 595 cps. 4 weeks after excitation up to 734, "and then it rose rather quickly to 1,490 cps and 2,508 cps ... 4 times its initial value I later dropped to about 1576 cps, a reasonably steady value" The source was examined by Dr. Peter Englert with an x ray spectrometer t San Jose State U., a radiation chemist. Several plots, diagrams. This is substantially what we have observed. One perfoms the excitation [ 16 hours in our case ] and then NO MORE IS NEEDED! The stuff just does its thing. "The poential energy of the Coulomb barrier, resisting particle escape, is lowered by 2 | e0 | from 2 Ze sq./r Some materials: Thallium 204 and Lead 210 Thorium 230 Polonium 210 were tested. get the patent. J. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:13:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA23825 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:13:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA23792; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:13:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id LAA24511; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:12:59 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:12:58 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: OOps! Altering of half-lives In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 23 Nov 1995, William Beaty wrote: > Below is an interesting message regarding macroscopic electrostatics > having an effect on nuclear decay rates. I can't recall if I forwarded > this to the list last month. Ooops! He didn't want his name on the message so I stripped his .sig, but missed the "From:" field. Please don't bother Mr. Schnurer until I contact him, OK? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 11:35:38 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA29407 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:35:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from oroboros.demon.co.uk (oroboros.demon.co.uk [158.152.100.96]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA29367 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 11:35:21 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 19:22:45 GMT From: CRSM@oroboros.demon.co.uk (Chris Morriss) Message-Id: <11977@oroboros.demon.co.uk> To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Energy Storage In a Capacitor? X-Mailer: PCElm 1.10 Lines: 12 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: No, I really don't think this is worth explaining for the n'th time. The lost energy is easily explained if the wires linking the capacitors are given a specified resistance value and consideration is given to what is actually happening as the resistance value tends to zero. (assume the the capacitors have no internal ESR) I have seen the apparent paradox explained in a number of textbooks as an update to the old "immovable object versus irresistable force" question. Hint. As r tends to zero, i tends to infinity. -- Chris Morriss From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 12:14:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id MAA01978 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:12:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA01965 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:12:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id MAA28797; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:12:31 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:12:29 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Energy Storage in a Capacitor? (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 07:23:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: neotech@europe.std.com Subject: Re: Energy Storage in a Capacitor? On Tue, 21 Nov 1995, Bob Paddock wrote: > Bill Beaty billb@eskimo.com wrote: > >On Sun, 19 Nov 1995, Bob Paddock wrote: > >> It seems to my math that 2.5 Joules of energy are now "missing"? > >> [Remember we are assuming idea parts & conditions here.] > >> > >> Can some one please explain this to me? > > > >This is a famous old trick question which sometimes appears on > >engineering or physics exams. If you use zero-ohm wire, then when you > >close S2 the charge will forever oscillate between the two capacitors. > >The circuit is a high-freq LC resonant circuit, with a one-turn coil in > >series with the capacitors. > > I don't see why an ideal wire automatically becomes a one turn > inductor? So lets remove the wire from consideration then. Can't. It's not the ideal wire that does it, it's *any* wire. Any closed circuit is a one-turn inductor: ________________ | | | | | | One-turn inductor | | | | |________________| ________________ | | | | __|__ __|__ One-turn inductor with two _____ _____ capacitors in series | | | | |________________| If the wire and plates are made of 'zero ohm' metal, then when the switch is closed the circuit will oscillate forever. During this oscillation, the netcharge on the capacitor plates will have a DC average as you say: half the charge on the initally-charged capacitor. The rest of the energy will be stored as the AC component. If a real circuit is constructed, then the time that the oscillation continues depends on the wire resistance and the dielectric losses in the capacitor, and the oscillation will probably be strongly damped, and its energy will go into raising the temperature of the wires and the dielectric. The mechanical analog of the 2-capacitor system is a flywheel (which corresponds to the wire circuit) with two springs attached to its perimeter, with one spring stretched and the other not. The springs are capacitor-analogs, of course The open switch is a "brake" on the flywheel. When the switch is released, the stretched spring starts the flywheel moving, it unstretches but the other spring stretches, the other spring pulls the flywheel to a stop, and when the flywheel stops, the first spring is relaxed but the OTHER one is now stretched. In a real spring/flywheel system, the flywheel will rotate back and forth, with each excursion getting less and less, until it stops. When it stops, each spring will have equal stretch, which will calculate out to be an enegy violation, but the missing energy is now in spring heat (corresponds to dielectric heating) and in flywheel-bearing heat (corresponds to wire resistance heating.) Another possibility here: if you put a large resistor in series with S2, you will totally damp out any oscillation. When the circuit has settled after S2 closing, the two capacitors will have half the initial net-charge, but the resistor will have been heated. > If we combine the charged dielectrics from each capacitor to > form one 20 uF capacitor the math says: But at the start, one dielectric is charged and the other is not, so you can't combine them. > Since the my whole point was to go back an review the basics, > this is what the text book says (Which I think we all already know): Your textbook version is just fine. > >Another thing you can do: close the switch for a few microseconds, and > >the entire charge will move from C1 to C2, whereupon you open the > >switch. This is just catching the "sloshing" before it can repeat the > >cycle over and over. Sort of like releasing a pendulum bob, only to > >catch it at the far side at the top of its swing. > > Sounds like the Brandent-Tesla Switch (Not sure of spelling of > Brandent?). I've built a couple but never got them to do any thing > of interest. Yeah, I guess it's very similar. The (Brandt?)/Tesla switch used two batteries to charge one, then used a *different* two batteries to charge another one, etc., making the stored energy slosh around. Any o/u effects must have arisen because of the high-frequency AC in that system. > > For those that just tuned in this is my original question: > > > How much energy is stored in a capacitor? > > / / > / / > *-----------* *------------*-------* *----------* > | S1 | S2 | > + | | | > -------- __|__ __|__ > ---- _____ C1 _____ C2 > -------- Vdc | | > ---- | | > -------- | | > ---- | | > | | | > *----------------------------*-----------------------* > > > According to my basic electronics text book, the energy stored > in the electrostatic field in the dielectric of a capacitor can be > computed by the formula: > > > J = (C(V*V))/2 or J = .5C(V*V) > > where: > > J = Energy, in wattseconds (Joules) > C = Capacitance, in Farads > V = Voltage, in Volts > > Since we are using ideal math (?) lets assume we are using ideal > parts, no wire resistance, and no dielectric loses, no ESR, ect. > > Let Vdc = 1000 V, C1 = 10 uF, C2 = 10 uF. > > Initial circuit conditions are Energy in C1 & C2 are zero, > and S1 & S2 are open. > > Close S1 and allow the voltage across C1 to reach a static value, > then open S1. Calculate the energy stored C1: > > J = (.5C)(V*V) C = 10 uF, V = 1000 > 5 = (.5(10))(1000*1000) > > C1 now has 5 Joules of energy. > > Close S2 and allow the voltages across the capacitors to reach a > static state. Open S2. Each capacitor will have 500V [See Note #1]. > > J = (.5C)(V*V) C = 10 uF, V = 500 > 1.25 = (.5(10))(500*500) > > So we end up with 1.25 Joules of energy on each cap, for a total > of: > 1.25 + 1.25 = 2.5 J > > It seems to my math that 2.5 Joules of energy are now "missing"? > [Remember we are assuming idea parts & conditions here.] > > Can some one please explain this to me? > > Note #1: > > Some one told me the caps would equalize to 700 volts, but did > not explain why. So I charged up a 660uF Photo Flash Cap to 100 VDC > (Didn't have 1k VDC), then disconnected the power supply. I connected > the charge cap to a identical discharged cap. I then had 47 VDC (Lost > the other 3V in the arc when I connected the discharged cap) across the > paralleled caps. > .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 12:41:09 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id MAA09506 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:41:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA09468 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:40:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id MAA01266; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:40:54 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 12:40:54 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: BOUNCE freenrg-list: Message too long (>40000) In-Reply-To: <199511222157.NAA28902@mail.eskimo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Bob Stirniman posted a USAF Gravity report from 1956, but it was too big for freenrg-list and bounced. I've put it on the list's webpage at http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/flist.html .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page > From: robert@wwa.com (Robert Stirniman ) > Subject: AntiGrav Report - USAF 1956 > To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 15:56:03 -0600 (CST) > > The following article was prepared for the USAF in 1956, and > discusses the state of the electrogravitics industry at that > time. The article was found by an independent researcher on > a library shelf at Wright Patterson, and was declassified > in 1990. > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > 13-1-00034-5879 > > ELECTROGRAVITIC SYSTEMS > > An examination of elecrostatic motion, > dynamic counterbary and barycentric control. > > TL > 565 > A9 > > Bar Code: 3 1401 00034 5879 > > Due dates omitted. > > Shield with Logo: > AF WRIGHT AERONAUTICAL LABORATORIES > TECHNICAL LIBRARY > Wright-Patterson > Air Force Base, Ohio 45433 > > Inner Cover: > ELECTROGRAVITICS SYSTEMS > > An examination of electrostatic motion, > dynamic counterbary and barycentric control. > > Prepared by > Gravity Research Group > Aviation Studies (International) Limited, London > 29-31 Cheval Place. Knightsbridge > LONDON S.W. 7 England > > Report GRG 013/56 February 1956 > > > TL 565 A9 > > CONTENTS > > Page > Introductory Notes...............1 > Discussion.......................3 > Conclusions.....................18 > > APPENDIX > > I - Aviation Report extracts....21 > I - Electrostatic Patents.......33 > > > * * * > > > > PROPERTY OF USAF > > -1- > > ELECTROGRAVITICS SYSTEMS > > An examination of electrostatic motion, dynamic > counterbary and barycentric control > > It has been accepted as axiomatic that the way to offset the > effects of gravity is to use a lifting surface and considerable > molecular energy to produce a continously applied force that, > for a limited period of time, can remain greater than the effects > of gravitational attraction. The original invention of the glider, > and evolution of the briefly self-sustaining glider, at the turn of > the century led to progressive advances in power and knowledge. > This has been directed to refining the classic Wright Brothers' > approach. Aircraft design is still fundamentally as the Wrights > adumbrated it, with wings, body, tails, moving or flapping > controls, landing gear and so forth. The Wright biplane was a > powered glider, and all subsequent aircraft, including the > supersonic jets of the nineteen-fifties are also powered gliders. > Only one fundamentally different flying principle has so far been > adopted with varying degrees of success. It is the rotating wing > aircraft that has led to the jet lifters and vertical pushers, > coleopters, ducted fans and lift induction turbine propulsion > systems. > > But during these decades there was always the possibility > of making efforts to discover the nature of gravity from cosmic > or quantum theory, investigation and observation, with a view > to discerning the physical properties of aviation's enemy. > > -2- > > It has seemed to Aviation Studies that for some time > insufficient attention has been directed to this kind of research. > If it were successful such developments would change the > concept of sustentation, and confer upon a vehicle qualities > that would now be regarded as the ultimate in aviation. > > This report summarizes in simple form the work that has > been done and is being done in the new field of electrogravitics. > It also outlines the various possible lines of research into the > nature and constituent matter of gravity, and how it has changed > from Newton to Einstein to the modern Hlavaty concept of > gravity as an electromagnetic force that may be controlled like > a light wave. > > The report also contains an outline of opinions on the > feasibility of different electrogravitics systems and there is > reference to some of the barycentric control and electrostatic > rigs in operation. > > Also included is a list of references to electrogravitics in > successive Aviation Reports since a drive was started by > Aviation Studies (International) Limited to suggest to aviation > business eighteen months ago that the rewards of success are > too far-reaching to be overlooked, especially in view of the > hopeful judgement of the most authoritative voice in micro- > physics. Also listed are some relevant patents on electrostatics > and electrostatic generators in the United States, United Kingdom > and France. > > Gravity Research Group > --------------------- > > 25 February 1956 > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 18:36:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA26150 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:36:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix2.ix.netcom.com ([199.182.120.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA26129 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:36:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix2.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id SAA05395; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:35:28 -0800 Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:35:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199511240235.SAA05395@ix2.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: 11/23/95 For years I've felt that resonance is the key for several phenomena including superconduction and over unity energy capture. Resonance has been around a long time. Tesla was a master of resonance, both electrically and mechanically. There are many types of resonating systems composed of infinite types of materials. Moreover, there are many types of resonant drivers. A few examples are mechanical (bell), electrical (LC tank), nuclear magnetic (MRI), etc. Now, we know that an oven microwave is tuned to excite and resonate H-O bonds in H2O. Query: Can an ordinary microwave be safely modified so that it can be tuned to resonate other materials at other frequencies? If so, it will provide a convienent driver which can provide moderate to large amounts of energy to resonate a system. Not only may various chemical bonds be resonated, but various nucleii may also be resonated. An immediate idea that comes to mind is a modification of Tom Bearden's phase conjugate mirror - ie. resonating nucleii with microwaves instead of a scalar electrostatic field to capture O/U energy. RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 17:07:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA07034 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 17:06:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA07022 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 17:06:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from dp2-007.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tImA2-0003HbC; Thu, 23 Nov 95 19:38 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 19:43:55 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >From: jdavid28@ix.netcom.com >Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 01:14:24 -0700 >To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com >Subject: Re: fnrg: Printed capacitor > >First thing monday morning I'm going to try to locate a die cutting paper >shop to get a rough estimate. Maybe they will know if there are any other >inks that maybe conductive. > >The closest thing I have found to tin foil is tin plates they measure .008 >and are found at hobby shops and hardware stores. I might try to contact the >company that makes them to see if they do custom work. Some of you may have >seen there displays. They carry just about 40 different styles of metal from >1/8" angle brass to rectangle aluminum. The company is: K&S Engineering, >Chicago,Illinos 60638. Thats all the info I have. I try to contact them >monday as well. I doubt they will sell the foil, but they may know someone >who does. > >What is the conductive material in indian ink? > >Todd >jdavid28@ix.netcom.com > > > > I believe I believe I found a solution to the plate making problem.. I one could use aluminized mylar (the kind used in the production of long lasting helium balloons) I then called a printshop in Louisville Kentucky named Masonic Home Journal, they have miller hot type printing machines capable of die cutting this material they said they could do it for around $200.00 dollars if I had the die made. I haven't called about the material yet. I believe I'm going to make the original first, I just wanted to tell you about the material.. Good luck.. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 17:57:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id RAA17786 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 17:57:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA17756 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 17:57:22 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id UAA10761 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 20:57:15 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511240157.UAA10761@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: mouse To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 20:57:14 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi, I have an old Mac Computer mouse. I took off the cover, but if I connect it up, it will work. To get it to work, all I have to do is turn two rods, and hit a switch. Dose any body know how I could use this as a computer interface? Could I make a program that can understand the movement of the mouse, and tell me what my invention is doing? Will this work? Do you know how to make a good interface with the computer with out a mouse? It can be IBM or Mac. Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 18:06:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA19511 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:06:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA19486 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 18:06:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id VAA10938 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 21:05:57 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511240205.VAA10938@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: ion To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 21:05:55 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ION-THRUSTER OPERATION The first electron-bombardment thruster was conceived and tested by Dr. Harold R. Kaufman in 1959 at the NASA Lewis Research Center (ref. 1). The thruster operates by flowing a gaseous propellant into a discharge chamber. The propellant may be any gas, but mercury, cesium, and the noble gases are the most efficient for propulsion applications. Propellant atoms are ionized in the discharge chamber by electron bombardment in a process similar to that in a mercury arc sunlamp. This ionization occurs when an atom in the discharge loses an electron after bombardment by an energetic (40-eV) discharge electron. The electrons and the ions form a plasma in the ionization chamber. The electric field between the screen and the accelerator draws ions from the plasma. These ions are then accelerated out through many small holes in the screen and accelerator electrode to form an ion beam. A neutralizer injects an equal number of electrons into the ion beam. This beam of electrons allows the spacecraft to remain electrically neutral and is a requirement for successful thruster operation. A more complete description of the mercury-bombardment ion thruster is given in the appendix. Laboratory testing of thrusters must be done in a moderately large vacuum facility in order to simulate the environment of space. Facilities are thus required for laboratory testing. Typically, these facilities are capable of simulating altitudes of more than 300 kilometers, where the background air pressure is less than 1/100 000 000 of sea-level pressure. The development of the mercury-bombardment thruster has continued through the 1960's to the present time. Thrusters 2.5 to 150 centimeters in diameter have been successfully tested. These thrusters require power of 50 watts to 200 kilowatts and produce thrust of 0.4x10(-3) to 4 newtons (0.1x10(-3) to 1 lb). Two of the most advanced bombardment thrusters, the 8-and 30-centimeter-diameter thrusters, are described in the sections AUXILIARY PROPULSION and PRIMARY PROPULSION, respectively. Thrusters of these two sizes fulfill the requirements of present-day missions. Many laboratories in this country, Europe, and Japan have worked on a wide variety of electric thrusters. These include colloid thrusters using a doped-glycerine propellant, a pulsed-plasma thruster using ablation of a Teflon propellant block (ref. 2), and a bombardment thruster using cesium propellant. In Germany, France, and England, numerous laboratories and universities are at work on electric thrusters for both auxiliary and primary propulsion. The electric propulsion effort by the Soviet Union includes flights of Zond, Meteor, and Yantar spacecraft with ion thruster experiments onboard. The mercury-bombardment thruster technology developed at the NASA Lewis Research Center has been used worldwide. Englund has developed the T-4 thruster based on this technology (ref. 3). The T-4 thruster is a 10-millinewton (2.2mlb) thruster proposed as one of two possible ion thrusters to be flight tested by the European Space Agency in late 1980. The other thruster, the RIT-10, is a radiofrequency mercury-bombardment ion thruster developed by Germany. It has a similar thrust level of 10 millinewtons (2.2 mlb) (ref. 4). The Lewis technology has also been used by Japan. That country has built and tested a 5-centimeter-diameter, 5-millinewton-thrust, mercury-bombardment thruster for possible flight qualification in 1982 (ref. 5). Both the European and Japanese ion thrusters are proposed for auxiliary electric propulsion applications. Two spacecraft have been flown by the United States specifically for the purpose of testing ion thrusters in space. These tests, SERT I and SERT II, are described in the next two sections. ION PROPULSION THEORY In an Ion Propulsion Engine, the Sun provides energy, which is converted into electric power by solar cells. The power is then conditioned to the current and voltage needed by the ion thruster. Propellant is ionized in the thruster and electrically exhausted to produce thrust. For many missions, the power source can serve the dual roles of providing both thruster power and power for mission objectives subsequent to the thrusting period. The thruster will be of appropriate size to satisfy the thrust requirements for the particular propulsion task. The main advantage of using electric propulsion is that the electric energy added to the exhaust propellant greatly increases its velocity, or specific impulse; and hence more thrust is produced with the same propellant flow rate. The mass of propellant required to produced a given thrust decreases with increasing specific impulse. The saving in propellant mass, however, is offset by the increasingly massive powerplant required to accelerate the exhaust to higher velocities. The maximum payload of a spacecraft is achieved at the optimum specific impulse. At low specific impulse the propellant mass can be excessively large, while at high specific impulse the powerplant mass becomes excessive. Between these two extremes is a broad useful range where sufficient payload remains for design of a practical spacecraft. Payload includes the mass of the spacecraft itself and the useful payload. The optimum value of specific impulse to maximize payload usually is between 2000 and 5000 seconds, and thus the optimum value of exhaust velocity is between 20 000 and 50 000 meters per second. This range of exhaust velocity is easily achieved with ion thrusters and, as is discussed later, results in large increases in spacecraft payload over a large variety of missions. APPENDIX THRUSTER CONFIGURATION AND OPERATING CHARACTERISTICS A general description of a 30-centimeter-diameter thruster is presented. Because many characteristics of hollow-cathode electron-bombardment thruster geometry and operation are independent of thruster size, the description can apply to bombardment thrusters of any size. Mercury is introduced into the thruster discharge chamber and the neutralizer as a vapor. For a thruster using mercury as the propellant, the phase separator between the liquid propellant and the vapor is a vaporizer made of porous tungsten. This vaporizer blocks the liquid mercury and passes the vapor at a rate dependent on the vapor pressure (temperature) of the liquid mercury. Typically, the vaporizers are used in a closed-loop control system to control the ion-beam current, the neutralizer discharge, and, in the case of the 30-centimeter-diameter thruster, the discharge voltage. Propellant flow electrical isolators are located immediately downstream of the vaporizers. The isolators can be used to isolate electrically the high-voltage parts of the thrster from the main propellant system. The vapor is passed through a series of metallic screens. The spacing of these screens is such that the minimum Pashen breakdown voltage for mercury is not obtained in any space. In this fashion, large voltage can be maintained simply by selecting the appropriate number of screens. This feature allows multiple-thruster operation for a common tankage system and provides large savings in propellant supply weight. The mercury vapor is then passed into the discharge or the neutralizer cathode. (In the 30-cm thruster the bulk of the propellant is passed directly into the discharge chamber, while in the 8-cm thruster the bulk of the propellant is passed through the main cathodes.) The cathodes are hollow. They consist of a tantalum tube with a welded tungsten plug containing an orifice attached to the end. The orifice size is scaled to the electron emission requirements. Inside the tantalum tube there is an insert which provides a supply of low-work-function material. This material (Bao) aids in the emission process. A separate discharge, higher in pressure than the main discharge, is established inside the hollow cathode: this discharge serves as a source of electrons. Electrons are emitted from the cathode and pass through the discharge chamber to the anode. For reasons of efficiency and lifetime, the applied discharge voltage is usually between two and four times the ionization potential of the propellant used. Propellant is ionized and excited by electron bombardment. An axially divergent magnetic field is maintained in the discharge chamber to improve ionization efficiency and to help control the voltage-current characteristics of the discharge. The magnitude of the magnetic field is controlled by either the number of permanent magnets or the current through the electromagnets. Typically, the optimum maximum magnetic field strength is such that an electron gyro-radius calculated for the high-energy electrons in the discharge is less than the anode radius. The magnetic field is shaped by soft-ion magnetic pole pieces at the front and rear of the discharge chamber. Three fairly distinct plasmas are maintained: inside the hollow cathode, in the region between the cathode and the cathode baffle, and in the main discharge chamber. Sheaths are maintained between these plasmas and the thruster components and between the individual plasma regions. These sheaths have a strong impact on overall plasma characteristics and thruster performance. Some of the ions formed in the discharge are extracted by the multiple-aperture accelerator grid system. The grid systems presently in use are dished and, as described previously, provide long-term stability and high performance. The energy of the ion beam is set by the positive high voltage applied to the anode, which is typically near the screen grid or cathode potential. The beam intensity is adjusted by varying the discharge plasma density. The plasma density can be increased by increasing either the propellant flow or the discharge power. The negatively biased accelerator grid is placed downstream of the screen grid in order to help focus the ion beam and prevent electrons from being drawn back to the positively biased screen grid. The neutralizer cathode emits an electron current equal to the ion beam and provides for the space charge and current neutralization of the ion beam. A perforated screen at ground potential is placed over the thruster body; this screen allows outgassing of thruster components and prevents interactions between the ambient plasma and the thruster body. -------HAS ANYBODY MADE ONE LIKE THIS?-------- Will you tell me *HOW* to make something like this? Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 22:35:55 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA24048 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 22:35:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA24007 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 22:35:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511240635.WAA24007@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Nov 1995 23:54:03 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re:sympathetic vibration Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >> > >> And would someone kindly tell me how that water gets >> to the top of a mountain? Water is heavy. Capillary action? >> Earth's rotation? Orgonomic draw from the sky? >> >> It can't be just pressure from below, or we would have geisers >> everywhere. >> >> Gary Hawkins > >Hills and moutains usually have vegetation growing on them. Let's >say we have a mountain covered with trees. The trees' leaves are >warmed by the SUN and continuously pump water vapor into the >atmosphere (this is called 'transpiration'). Evaporating >water molecules VIBRATE much faster than liquid ones. Slowly [cut] Well then, it explains why clearing all of the trees on a mountain causes the streams to stop flowing. Gary Hawkins From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 21:43:52 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id VAA10542 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 21:43:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA10512 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 21:43:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a2-13.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a2-13.mel.netspace.net.au [203.17.100.13]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id QAA04606 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 16:41:08 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511240541.QAA04606@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 16:43:28 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 23 Nov 95 at 10:17, dennis lee wrote: > You wrote: > > > The device was used to broadcast electrical power, and no one that I've seen has > >claimed to see any over-unity effects. > > I can't see why J.P. Morgan would want to stop progress on Wardenclyffe if Tesla > intended to broadcast power from conventional sources. Tesla would still have to > buy power from Morgan. The patent does say that G may be an alternator or Yes, but no one would have to buy it from Tesla. Anyone would be able to collect it free of charge. Thus any venture in that direction was foredoomed. Morgan being a banker understood this all too well. > condenser. In the interview for the radio patent (Work with Alternating Currents > and Their Application to Wireless Telegraphy, Telephony, and Transmission of > Power) Tesla does state that G represents any method of getting continuous waves > (p.146). What ever that means. > > Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 23 23:45:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA08532 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 23:45:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA08503 for ; Thu, 23 Nov 1995 23:45:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511240745.XAA08503@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 01:04:07 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Charge on an Electron Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Time and time again throughout history, cherished beliefs have been found to be incorrect. Because of them, and because there are still so many things we observe that do not make sense, and because, for example, we do not even know what makes up a magnetic field, there is sometimes good reason to question what might be taken for granted. So... Would someone like to take the time to explain why it is thought that an electron has an electrical charge? Wait! Sounds silly right, let me explain: If you use a high voltage power supply to force zillions of electrons into a metal sphere, you can then measure the ion charge from some distance, see the meter go negative, and it all looks rather straightforward. If you then reverse the high voltage charge and start pumping electrons out of that sphere, your electrostatic meter goes positive. But what have you done in either case that would prove that electrons have any charge at all? Nothing. In the first case you have pumped electrons into the sphere to such high electrical pressures that they have migrated through the air to your meter, been forced through the wires of the meter, and their movement through those wires in a particular direction has created a magnetic field which has caused the needle on the meter to move proportionally to the amount of current. Negative electrostatics only means that a preponderance of electrons are forced into an area under a great deal of pressure, with a lot of resistance around where they are, to resist their "desire" to normalize the pressure. We assume that electrons have a negative charge, and that protons have a positive charge, and that the electron is attracted in orbit around the proton because of that charge. Satellites fall to earth. What keeps an electron from smashing into a proton and neutralizing the supposed charge on each of them? I saw an electrostatic experiment demonstrated where two positively charged pith balls or something of different material makeup attracted each other. Is there any solid evidence that electrostatic charge is anything more than an excess or deficit of electrons? Or is the letter 'e' with the minus sign next to it merely our precursors best efforts to find a way to communicate concepts to each other, or a mistaken assumption on the part of many of them somewhere along the way? Gary Hawkins >Much of the accepted mathematics of particles would be wrong >if the anti-proton was proved to be non-existent. Earlier >Eddington has listed the fundamental particles as:- > > e The charge of an electron. > > m the mass of an electron. > > M the mass of a proton. > > h Planck's contant > > c The velocity of light. > > G The constant of gravitation, and > > L The cosmological constant > > It is generally held that no one of these can be inferred from >the others. But electrons may well disappear from among the >fundamental particles, though, as Russell says, it is likely that >e and m will survive. The constants are much more established >than the interpretation of them and are among the most solid of >achievements in modern physics. > Their constants (values) are established, but their interpretation is not. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 18:38:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA00755 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:38:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix12.ix.netcom.com ([199.182.120.12]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA00720 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:38:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix12.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id SAA10435; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:38:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199511250238.SAA10435@ix12.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com To: Richard Wayne Wall From: Jim Potter Subject: fnrg: Re: Microwave Resonance Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 05:59:50 -0800 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I guess I misunderstood your original post somewhat. Generally speaking it is not possible to modify a microwave oven to different frequencies. It may be possible to shift the frequency somewhat by varying the voltage or the load cavity tuning, but the magnetron frequency is primarilyt determined by its internal construction. By the way, I don't think a microwave oven is especially tuned to the any molecular resonance, but depends on the dielectric losses of the material exposed to the microwave energy. This may be related to molecular resonances, but it is a very broad effect, not critically dependent on frequency. If you look at books on microwave transmission through air you will find some frequencies where absorption is strong due to the presence of water vapor. I believe thes frequencies are much higher than 2.4 GHz, more like 10 Ghz, but I don't remember exactly. Jim -- James M. Potter, President E-mail: jpotter@jpaw.com JP Accelerator Works, Inc. URL: www.jpaw.com/jpaw/ 2245 47th Street Voice: 505-662-5804 Los Alamos, NM 87544-1604 FAX: 505-662-5210 From zaxfri@hol.gr Fri Nov 24 04:14:12 1995 Received: from prometheus.hol.gr (prometheus.hol.gr [193.92.136.42]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id EAA16590 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 04:13:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by prometheus.hol.gr (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA26302; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 14:10:59 -0200 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 14:10:59 -0200 Message-Id: <199511241610.OAA26302@prometheus.hol.gr> X-Sender: zaxfri@prometheus.hol.gr X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com From: zaxfri@hol.gr (Zachary Fridman) Subject: Energy Storage in a Capacitor? Status: RO X-Status: Hello I am Zachary , a new one in this list. I read the problem for the Energy Storage in a Capasitor , and my opinion is : I don' t know what happens really , but in real math(?) you must think differently . The first time you charge the capasitor , you have an energy of J=(C*V*V)/2=5J When you connect the second capasitor ,THE ENERGY OF THE SYSTEM IS THE SAME , because the energy can't be DESTROYED. (don't reed Bearden, De Palma, William Beaty or Machiavelli they gonna destroy your mind HA!HA!HA!) Now the energy of the system (two capasitors) is the same.Let's look what happens whith the voltage . We must use the same equation , but the unknown now is the voltage: (be carefull , now the capasity is double) V=SQR(2*J/2C)=SQR(J/C)=707.1068 Volt This is the correct(???!!!) answer like your friends told you. REMEMBER THIS IS ONLY REAL MATH(?) , IT'S NOT THE REALLY THINGS. The correct answer in my opinion is what William Beaty says. Footnote: Please forgive my Englich .I translate from Greek with the help of my cousin and all this maybe be strange. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 08:18:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA02305 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 08:18:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA02278 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 08:18:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup02.utm.edu by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA40800; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:18:24 -0600 Message-Id: <30B5F08A.C6F@UTM.Edu> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:19:22 -0600 From: Mark Mansfield Organization: Univ. of Tenn at Martin X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b2 (Windows; I; 32bit) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Cc: markman@UTM.Edu Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: fnrg- Scalar gradiometer References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Yes Larrie, it is on www.eskime.com Mark From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 13:24:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id NAA04265 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:23:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA04232 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:23:46 -0800 (PST) From: sphere@ddi.digital.net Received: from sphere (pm4_15.digital.net [198.69.104.147]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA12873 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 16:21:31 -0500 Message-Id: <199511242121.QAA12873@ddi.digital.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 16:22:23 +0000 Subject: Re: fnrg: Charge on an Electron X-Confirm-Reading-To: sphere@ddi.digital.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 01:04:07 -0800 > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > From: Gary Hawkins > Subject: Re: fnrg: Charge on an Electron > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > Time and time again throughout history, cherished beliefs have > been found to be incorrect. Because of them, and because there > are still so many things we observe that do not make sense, and > because, for example, we do not even know what makes up a > magnetic field, there is sometimes good reason to question what > might be taken for granted. So... > > Would someone like to take the time to explain why it is thought > that an electron has an electrical charge? Wait! Sounds silly right, > let me explain: > > If you use a high voltage power supply to force zillions of electrons > into a metal sphere, you can then measure the ion charge from some > distance, see the meter go negative, and it all looks rather straightforward. > If you then reverse the high voltage charge and start pumping electrons > out of that sphere, your electrostatic meter goes positive. But what have > you done in either case that would prove that electrons have any charge > at all? Nothing. In the first case you have pumped electrons into the > sphere to such high electrical pressures that they have migrated through the > air to your meter, been forced through the wires of the meter, and their > movement through those wires in a particular direction has created > a magnetic field which has caused the needle on the meter to move > proportionally to the amount of current. Negative electrostatics only > means that a preponderance of electrons are forced into an area under > a great deal of pressure, with a lot of resistance around where they are, > to resist their "desire" to normalize the pressure. > > We assume that electrons have a negative charge, and that protons have > a positive charge, and that the electron is attracted in orbit around the > proton because of that charge. Satellites fall to earth. What keeps an > electron from smashing into a proton and neutralizing the supposed > charge on each of them? > > I saw an electrostatic experiment demonstrated where two positively > charged pith balls or something of different material makeup attracted > each other. Is there any solid evidence that electrostatic charge is > anything more than an excess or deficit of electrons? Or is the letter > 'e' with the minus sign next to it merely our precursors best efforts to > find a way to communicate concepts to each other, or a mistaken > assumption on the part of many of them somewhere along the way? > > Gary Hawkins 'Charge', like most of our physics, is a fiction, a poor excuse for real knowledge, understanding, and non-mystical clear observation. As you suggested, the phenomenon of charge is a numbers game. A high concentration of electrons (of anything) causes them to spread-out/leave a region/ jet out along a sharp projection from one fluid (metal) into another (air). The greater the concentration, the greater the pressure to separate. This true as long a no HIGHER-ORDER RESONANCES are at work. Observe that electrons become co-resonant (cooperative) at extremely low temperatures; they pair up. Low temperature is not the only way to achieve such resonance; nor is this particular mode of resonance an extremely deep (high-order) one. An example of room-temperature high-order electron-ic resonance in metal and semiconductor lattices is that seen in the Moray device. Observe that packing many people into a small room produces under non-resonant conditions a desire to leave the room. Alter the vibrations of the people in the people-matrix with alcohol and something interesting to talk about, and observe further that partial resonance (willingness to stick around under crowded conditions) is achieved. Alter the people-matrix still further by pairing males and females and watch co-resonance move to a higher level as sexual interests develop (they pair up). Want more resonance or different kinds? How about the resonance between the members of a united angry mob? family members on good terms? an orgy between strangers? an orgy between long-time lovers. It goes on. The point of all this is that electrons and the resonant situations in which you might find them or might want to place them are no simpler than those we find in human society. Electrons are not the simplistic, algebraic point-charges the books make them out to be. Were your senses fine enough and your body small enough, you could visit the surface of an electron and discover that it has as much texture as the planet you live on! Planets are of different sizes, ages, health-states, terrains. Some are hotter that hell, some unbearably cold, and some have Pizza Huts. What can we say about electrons? All of the above and more. Remember that you are much larger that an electron and as such have little interest in their finer details. To you and me, Earth and Mars are very different places to live. The nearest galaxy does its best to sense the nature of our Earth and Mars (way over here), fails terribly, and concludes that a planet is a planet is a planet. What do we think of electrons? We need to be conscious of how out sensory limitations affect our ability to be interested in new phenomena. ALWAYS: As above so below. ALWAYS. Since you cannot see an electron or its smallest activities and textures, this principle is the single best TOOL you have to build an integrated vision of nature. Applying it to your observations will advance you rapidly toward a WORKING UNDERSTANDING of null-gravity resonance. Don't confuse yourself with physics terminology that you and its creators don't understand. Study nature not physics. Nature is not so difficult; physics is miserable, like man. Focus your energy toward general wave behavior, ratio, and music. Sphere > > > >Much of the accepted mathematics of particles would be wrong > >if the anti-proton was proved to be non-existent. Earlier > >Eddington has listed the fundamental particles as:- > > > > e The charge of an electron. > > > > m the mass of an electron. > > > > M the mass of a proton. > > > > h Planck's contant > > > > c The velocity of light. > > > > G The constant of gravitation, and > > > > L The cosmological constant > > > > It is generally held that no one of these can be inferred from > >the others. But electrons may well disappear from among the > >fundamental particles, though, as Russell says, it is likely that > >e and m will survive. The constants are much more established > >than the interpretation of them and are among the most solid of > >achievements in modern physics. > > > > Their constants (values) are established, but their interpretation is not. > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 08:32:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA06062 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 08:32:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from unix1.utm.edu (unix1.utm.edu [192.239.144.18]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA06033 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 08:32:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup02.utm.edu by unix1.utm.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA39768; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:32:38 -0600 Message-Id: <30B5F3E0.6334@UTM.Edu> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:33:36 -0600 From: Mark Mansfield Organization: Univ. of Tenn at Martin X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b2 (Windows; I; 32bit) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Cc: markman@UTM.Edu Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: fnrg- Scalar gradiometer References: <30B5F08A.C6F@UTM.Edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Mark Mansfield wrote: > > Yes Larrie, it is on www.eskime.com > > Mark Opssss, That's www.eskimo.com NOT eskime. Sorry, Mark (with egg on my face!) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 09:31:09 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA22015 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:31:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.indirect.com (root@ns1.indirect.com [165.247.1.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA22005 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:30:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from indirect (s146.phxslip4.indirect.com [165.247.24.146]) by ns1.indirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA03409 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:31:10 -0700 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:31:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199511241731.KAA03409@ns1.indirect.com> X-Sender: xaq@mail.indirect.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: xaq@indirect.com (Zach Radding) Subject: Re: fnrg: mouse Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Do you know how to make a good interface with the computer with out >a mouse? It can be IBM or Mac. > Andrew -- > ((( > (O,O) > (-) > -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- > I I > I Andrew Cantino I > I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I > I I > ---------------------------------- > My home page is at: > http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html > > Andrew, If you are just trying to record motion, the quickest and easiest way to make an input device to an IBM compatible, is by using your game card.(The place where you could plug in a joystick) Buy the least expensive joystick you can find, and open it up. It will consist of two potentiometers(pots) connected to the x and y axis. Remove them from the plastic housing and use them for your input. If you don't have a game card, they only cost around $15 to $20. You will have to do a little programming to actually record the data. It is not real hard, but if you need help let me know. Good Luck, Zach Radding (xaq@indirect.com) From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 09:53:37 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA28886 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:53:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA28859 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:53:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id JAA00987; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:51:44 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 09:51:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199511241751.JAA00987@ix3.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Richard Wayne Wall wrote: > > 11/23/95 > > For years I've felt that resonance is the key for several phenomena > including superconduction and over unity energy capture. Resonance has > been around a long time. Tesla was a master of resonance, both > electrically and mechanically. There are many types of resonating > systems composed of infinite types of materials. Moreover, there are > many types of resonant drivers. A few examples are mechanical (bell), > electrical (LC tank), nuclear magnetic (MRI), etc. Now, we know that > an oven microwave is tuned to excite and resonate H-O bonds in H2O. > > Query: Can an ordinary microwave be safely modified so that it can be > tuned to resonate other materials at other frequencies? > > If so, it will provide a convienent driver which can provide moderate > to large amounts of energy to resonate a system. > > RWW Sure linear accelerators (and other types of accelerators, as well) use rf power in resonant cavities to accelerate particle beams to high energies. But they all take energy (power) in. Some gets converted to beam energy (power) and some to heat. -- James M. Potter, President E-mail: jpotter@jpaw.com JP Accelerator Works, Inc. URL: www.jpaw.com/jpaw/ 2245 47th Street Voice: 505-662-5804 Los Alamos, NM 87544-1604 FAX: 505-662-5210 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 13:40:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id NAA01744 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:17:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix9.ix.netcom.com (ix9.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.9]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA01625 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:16:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id NAA13874; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:14:43 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:14:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199511242114.NAA13874@ix9.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A You wrote: > The definitive works would be Brown's hand written lab note >books, of which there where at least six. Any one know where to get >all six? Stan Deyo has them. His email is standeyo@iinet.net.au He also mentioned a company in the States that sells them. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 13:36:19 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id NAA08289 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:36:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix8.ix.netcom.com (ix8.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.8]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA08248 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:36:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix8.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id NAA03680; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:34:41 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 13:34:41 -0800 Message-Id: <199511242134.NAA03680@ix8.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: >Yes, but no one would have to buy it from Tesla. Anyone would be able >to collect it free of charge. Thus any venture in that direction was >foredoomed. Morgan being a banker understood this all too well. So Tesla was expecting Morgan to provide power to the magnifying transmitter which would then be given away? Wouldn't the system make more sense if the transmitter was tuned to the Earth's resonant frequency? Then a high voltage would kind of just form at the top. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 18:27:08 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA28020 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:26:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix5.ix.netcom.com (ix5.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA28009 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:26:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix5.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id SAA19841; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:25:14 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:25:14 -0800 Message-Id: <199511250225.SAA19841@ix5.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: Article: 42640 Newsgroups: sci.energy From: al255@yfn.ysu.edu (Lance Rodberg) Subject: Re: Microwave Resonance Date: 24 Nov 1995 20:27:04 GMT > >Query: Can an ordinary microwave be safely modified so that it can be >tuned to resonate other materials at other frequencies? > > >Not only may various chemical bonds be resonated, but various nucleii >may also be resonated. An immediate idea that comes to mind is a >modification of Tom Bearden's phase conjugate mirror - ie. resonating >nucleii with microwaves instead of a scalar electrostatic field to >capture O/U energy. > No, a microwave magnetron has a fixed resonant cavity. But they do make communications magnetrons and such for other frequencies. Probably variable freq ones as well From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 19:26:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id TAA12780 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 19:26:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA12766 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 19:26:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id TAA28291; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 19:26:36 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 19:26:35 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Electric Rocket ect. In-Reply-To: <199511231528.KAA27397@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Thu, 23 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > I keep getting messages about a Electric Rocket. How do I make one, what > dose it do? I missed the start of this topic, so i'm lost. The whole thing is on WEIRD SCIENCE under NOT YOUR AVERAGE CONSTRUCTION PROJECT, under Gravity Capacitor I think. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 05:45:14 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id FAA04544 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 05:45:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from execpc.com (mailgate.execpc.com [204.29.202.21]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id FAA04532 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 05:45:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.execpc.com (bpaddock@earth.execpc.com [204.29.202.50]) by execpc.com (8.7.1/8.6.11) with ESMTP id HAA05644 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:44:55 -0600 (CST) Received: (from bpaddock@localhost) by earth.execpc.com (8.7.1/8.7) id HAA00052; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:44:55 -0600 (CST) From: bpaddock@execpc.com (Bob Paddock) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: PCB Capacitor Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 19:38:43 -0500 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Lines: 69 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >> >Another "gravity" capacitor idea... >> >> >Each >> >sheet would of course be a double sided printout, with identical aligned >> >patterns on both sides of each sheet. >> >> >> Sounds to me like your just described making raw (uneched) >> Printed Circuit Boards. >> >> Copper >> FR4 (Glass/Resion) >> Copper >> >> You can get down to 0.032" that I know of. >> >> There is a NASA Tech Brief article on such a capacitor, I'll >> see if I can find it. >> >> I feel I missed some thing? > > >Yeah, the price! And the amount of etchant required. How cheap can you >make about five thousand 8" square etched plates, compared to india ink on >paper? What do you need the echant for? I must not understand, I thought you where trying to make a 4,000 layer capacitor, which has now become 5,000 layers? Besides Milling is better environmentally than eching. What pattern needs to be made on these things? Double sided, or better yet multilayer, P.C.B. material is by definition a capacitor, tho the capacitance is normally thought of as a parasitic component. Any why india ink, instead of some thing like conductive paint? Conductive paint is easy to come by, and has known, reproducible, electric characteristics. Many companies involved Static Prevention, and companies involved in EMI/RFI sell the stuff. A couple related items that came in the mail this week: "Electrically Conductive White Thermal-Control Paint" NASA Tech Brief Vol 19, #8, Item #65, 8/95, NPO-19243. Summery: This report describes the "development of a white thermal-control paint intended for use on spacecraft. The paint was required to exhibit a combination of high emmitance (>= 0.90), low absorptance (<= 0.20), and electrical conductivity sufficient to prevent the charging with static electricity to potentials beyond the range of +/- 10V. In test, it exhibited an average measured emittance of 0.91 and an average measured absorptance of 0.20." Reference One sights "M. C. Shai, 'Formulation of Electrically Conductive Thermal-Control Coatings," NASA Technical Paper 1218, April, 1978. JPL Library Refernce Microfiche #78 N-21216. Also in todays mail a catalog from RPT Co. Imagineering Plastics for their "Conductive Thermoplastics". Page 7 has "Index of RTP Company Conductive Materials" such as Carbon Black/Carbon Fiber/Stainless Steel/NCG (Don't know what that stands for) with/on Resin(s) of Polpropylene, Naylon 6/6 11 6/12 12 ect, Polycarbonate, Polystyrene, Acylonitrite Butadiene Styrene, and about a dozen more. Contact (800) 433-4787, (507) 454-6900, FAX (507) 454-8130. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 20:00:48 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id UAA21776 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 20:00:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA21748; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 20:00:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id UAA00400; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 20:00:32 -0800 Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 20:00:31 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com cc: standeyo@iinet.net.au Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ? In-Reply-To: <199511242114.NAA13874@ix9.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Fri, 24 Nov 1995, dennis lee wrote: > You wrote: > > > The definitive works would be Brown's hand written lab note > >books, of which there where at least six. Any one know where to get > >all six? > > Stan Deyo has them. His email is standeyo@iinet.net.au > > He also mentioned a company in the States that sells them. Think Stan would be interested in joining freenrg-list? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 18:34:05 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA29720 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:33:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA29700 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:33:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id SAA13059; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 18:32:09 -0800 Message-Id: <199511250232.SAA13059@ix3.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Article: 6940 Newsgroups: sci.physics.electromag From: somlo@zeta.org.au (Peter Somlo) Subject: fnrg: Re: Microwave Resonance Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 00:06:38 GMT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) wrote: >11/23/95 >For years I've felt that resonance is the key for several phenomena >including superconduction and over unity energy capture. Resonance has >been around a long time. Tesla was a master of resonance, both >electrically and mechanically. There are many types of resonating >systems composed of infinite types of materials. Moreover, there are >many types of resonant drivers. A few examples are mechanical (bell), >electrical (LC tank), nuclear magnetic (MRI), etc. Now, we know that >an oven microwave is tuned to excite and resonate H-O bonds in H2O. >Query: Can an ordinary microwave be safely modified so that it can be >tuned to resonate other materials at other frequencies? >If so, it will provide a convienent driver which can provide moderate >to large amounts of energy to resonate a system. >Not only may various chemical bonds be resonated, but various nucleii >may also be resonated. An immediate idea that comes to mind is a >modification of Tom Bearden's phase conjugate mirror - ie. resonating >nucleii with microwaves instead of a scalar electrostatic field to >capture O/U energy. >RWW It is a common misconception that a microwave oven heats food because the water molecules RESONATE at 2.45 GHz. THIS IS NOT SO (as I repeatedly teach it to my students.) The water molecules have no resonance at these frequencies, but because they are polarised molecules, they'll try to align themselves with the impressed field, so instead of a resonance, we should talk about a FORCED OSCILLATION. (If I have a [heavily damped] pendulum, but I move it not at its natural frequency, I have a similar situation.) Have a look in a suitable book at the Cole-Cole description of the complex dielectric constant of water and you'll see that there is nothing peculiar happening at the `cooking frequency'. Cheers, Peter ------------- Dr Peter I Somlo FIEEE | M1: "Every coin has 3 sides - at least" Microwave Consultant | M2: "The wind ain't gonna blow from where it tel/fax: 61-2-451-2478 | ought'a, it'l blow from where it can" http://www.zeta.org.au/~somlo From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Nov 24 22:50:54 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id WAA06702 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 22:50:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA06678 for ; Fri, 24 Nov 1995 22:50:37 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511250650.WAA06678@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 00:18:02 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >It is a common misconception that a microwave oven heats food because >the water molecules RESONATE at 2.45 GHz. THIS IS NOT SO (as I >repeatedly teach it to my students.) The water molecules have no >resonance at these frequencies, but because they are polarised >molecules, they'll try to align themselves with the impressed field, >so instead of a resonance, we should talk about a FORCED OSCILLATION. >(If I have a [heavily damped] pendulum, but I move it not at its >natural frequency, I have a similar situation.) > >Have a look in a suitable book at the Cole-Cole description of the >complex dielectric constant of water and you'll see that there is >nothing peculiar happening at the `cooking frequency'. > >Cheers, Peter Is it then like hitting a bell with a hammer every couple of seconds? The bell (water) rings at its natural frequency, even though the hammer (2.45 GHz) is slower. Yea or nay. Gary Hawkins --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 02:48:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id CAA13727 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 02:48:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from peg.apc.org (peg.apc.org [192.131.13.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA13686 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 02:48:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from t6.dialup.peg.apc.org (t6.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.134]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id VAA29632 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 21:47:48 +1000 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 21:47:48 +1000 Message-Id: <199511251147.VAA29632@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: fnrg: PK/Psychotronic Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I'm involved in PK research and have become interested in Pavlita's Psychotronic generator. I assume there is some research team somewhere involved in this psychotronic field and would like to contact them. It occurs that one of your many readers may have the answer but I do not know if this is the right forum to ask such a question. Perhaps you could enlighten me. Many thanks Jim Francis PS I've spent the last 2 nights searching your site - fascinating!! From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 03:26:18 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id DAA17778 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:26:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from peg.apc.org (peg.apc.org [192.131.13.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id DAA17759 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:26:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from t6.dialup.peg.apc.org (t6.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.134]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id WAA03135 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 22:25:39 +1000 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 22:25:39 +1000 Message-Id: <199511251225.WAA03135@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: Re: fnrg: PK/Psychotronic Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >I'm involved in PK research and have become interested in Pavlita's >Psychotronic generator. I assume there is some research team somewhere >involved in this psychotronic field and would like to contact them. It >occurs that one of your many readers may have the answer but I do not know >if this is the right forum to ask such a question. >Perhaps you could enlighten me. >Many thanks >Jim Francis > >PS I've spent the last 2 nights searching your site - fascinating!! > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 04:54:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id EAA27717 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:54:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix5.ix.netcom.com (ix5.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id EAA27693 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:54:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix5.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id EAA06134; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:52:49 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:52:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199511251252.EAA06134@ix5.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Bill; You wrote: >Think Stan would be interested in joining freenrg-list? Probably. Dennis From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 04:29:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id EAA24538 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:29:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from peg.apc.org (peg.apc.org [192.131.13.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id EAA24492 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 04:29:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from t6.dialup.peg.apc.org (t6.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.134]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id XAA11153 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 23:28:47 +1000 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 23:28:47 +1000 Message-Id: <199511251328.XAA11153@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: Re: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A > > I talked to a person from a company called laser >sheet metals about geting plates cut out for the >electric rocket he said at that thicknes thay may >be able to cut 3 or 4 sheets at a time the only problem being that they might weld together. > the way they charge is by linear meters cut, I worked >out that there is about 740mm in each plate and this place charged at 5 dolars a meter. I could probably >bargin him down to $2 but when we need 2000 plates >thats still not a nise number. so we can count that one >out. > > James Don't think this message was for me - I was asking about Pavlita's PSYCHOTRONIC GENERATORS. Jim Francis From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 06:27:07 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id GAA09965 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 06:27:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix12.ix.netcom.com (ix12.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.12]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA09955 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 06:27:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix12.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id GAA14390; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 06:27:07 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 06:27:07 -0800 Message-Id: <199511251427.GAA14390@ix12.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > >Hi Bill; > >You wrote: > >>Think Stan would be interested in joining freenrg-list? > >Probably. > >Dennis > > Well, how about inviting him. Preferrably someone acquainted with him. RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 08:12:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA27640 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 08:11:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA27626 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 08:11:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw41.fastlane.net (fw41.fastlane.net [204.251.17.141]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA12092 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:10:07 -0600 Message-Id: <199511251710.LAA12092@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:10:55 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool, Leslie Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >You wrote: >> >> >>> >>>It is a common misconception that a microwave oven heats food because >>>the water molecules RESONATE at 2.45 GHz. THIS IS NOT SO (as I >>>repeatedly teach it to my students.) The water molecules have no >>>resonance at these frequencies, but because they are polarised >>>molecules, they'll try to align themselves with the impressed field, >>>so instead of a resonance, we should talk about a FORCED OSCILLATION. >>>(If I have a [heavily damped] pendulum, but I move it not at its >>>natural frequency, I have a similar situation.) >>> >>>Have a look in a suitable book at the Cole-Cole description of the >>>complex dielectric constant of water and you'll see that there is >>>nothing peculiar happening at the `cooking frequency'. >>> >>>Cheers, Peter >> >> >>Is it then like hitting a bell with a hammer every couple of seconds? >>The bell (water) rings at its natural frequency, even though the >>hammer (2.45 GHz) is slower. Yea or nay. >> >>Gary Hawkins > >11/25/95 > >I say Yea. Hit it hard at 2.45 GHz (or an alternate frequency) and >listen. Better yet hit it with short bursts or pulses and listen. Or, >use the 2.45 Ghz microwave as a carrier wave and modulate it at what >ever frequency or wave form you desire. The best bet would be finding >a lower harmonic of the H-O bond resonate frequency. > >The bottom line is delivery of ENERGY to the resonate system by what >ever method that allows natural resonace. The system must be hit >sharply (fast rise time) and hard (intensely) with a lot of energy to >make it ring. To provide enough energy to resonate H2O would require >much, much, more energy from a lower harmonic driver. The >attractiveness of the common microwave as a driver is that it's cheap, >available and delivers quite a lot of energy. > >RWW > Just jumping in for a moment, I'd like to quote a bit of an article by G.L. Strong on "building a proton precession magnetometer", Scientific American, exact issue unknown, back in the seventies sometime. Anyway, this magnetometer is based upon the fact that protons in water are normally in step, but line up in a magnetic field. >> "Unfortunately a magnetic field of more than a billion Oersteds would be needed to line up all the protons at room temperature. This is much larger than the largest magnetic field ever produced. However, much smaller fields which can be produced easily by a dry battery and coil of wire can cause slightly more protons to point one way than the other. The difference is sufficient to produce a detectable signal in the coil when they are released. The precession frequency and hence the frequency of the signal induced in the coil is about 2,025 cycles per second." << The protons want to precess, or spin together at 2,025 cycles per second. You should be able to capitalize on this fact to torque the heck out of the little suckers! As you can see, water molecules want to vibrate at a relative LOW frequency! I don't think an outside frequency source of in the gigahertz range is absolutely necessary to mess with the molecules. Bert From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 07:22:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA18503 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:22:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix5.ix.netcom.com (ix5.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA18492 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:22:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix5.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id HAA22137; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:21:13 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 07:21:13 -0800 Message-Id: <199511251521.HAA22137@ix5.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > > >> >>It is a common misconception that a microwave oven heats food because >>the water molecules RESONATE at 2.45 GHz. THIS IS NOT SO (as I >>repeatedly teach it to my students.) The water molecules have no >>resonance at these frequencies, but because they are polarised >>molecules, they'll try to align themselves with the impressed field, >>so instead of a resonance, we should talk about a FORCED OSCILLATION. >>(If I have a [heavily damped] pendulum, but I move it not at its >>natural frequency, I have a similar situation.) >> >>Have a look in a suitable book at the Cole-Cole description of the >>complex dielectric constant of water and you'll see that there is >>nothing peculiar happening at the `cooking frequency'. >> >>Cheers, Peter > > >Is it then like hitting a bell with a hammer every couple of seconds? >The bell (water) rings at its natural frequency, even though the >hammer (2.45 GHz) is slower. Yea or nay. > >Gary Hawkins 11/25/95 I say Yea. Hit it hard at 2.45 GHz (or an alternate frequency) and listen. Better yet hit it with short bursts or pulses and listen. Or, use the 2.45 Ghz microwave as a carrier wave and modulate it at what ever frequency or wave form you desire. The best bet would be finding a lower harmonic of the H-O bond resonate frequency. The bottom line is delivery of ENERGY to the resonate system by what ever method that allows natural resonace. The system must be hit sharply (fast rise time) and hard (intensely) with a lot of energy to make it ring. To provide enough energy to resonate H2O would require much, much, more energy from a lower harmonic driver. The attractiveness of the common microwave as a driver is that it's cheap, available and delivers quite a lot of energy. RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 09:21:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA11955 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:21:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA11923 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:21:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id MAA22170 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:21:20 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511251721.MAA22170@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: glow To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:21:19 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I know that old watches, have a radioactive substance on them, to make them glow. Dose anyone know if the new glowing things do to? There are lots of toys at the stores that glow. I have some chalk that glows too. I'm wondering how safe this stuff is, if it is radioactive too. Please let me know. I would think it is not, but you can never be too carefull. Andrew ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 09:23:35 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA12468 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:23:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA12451 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:23:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id MAA22201 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:23:21 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511251723.MAA22201@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: program To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:23:21 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I made a new computer game, it is shareware. Dose anyone know any good places on the web to put it? How do I FTP it? Andrew P.S. If you have a place for me to give it to you, I will give it to you. -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 09:30:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA14138 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:30:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from bob.indirect.com (root@bob.indirect.com [165.247.1.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA14120 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:30:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from indirect (s162.phxslip4.indirect.com [165.247.24.162]) by bob.indirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA04006 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:30:39 -0700 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:30:39 -0700 Message-Id: <199511251730.KAA04006@bob.indirect.com> X-Sender: xaq@mail.indirect.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: xaq@indirect.com (Zach Radding) Subject: Re: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > I talked to a person from a company called laser >sheet metals about geting plates cut out for the >electric rocket he said at that thicknes thay may >be able to cut 3 or 4 sheets at a time the only problem being that they might weld together. > the way they charge is by linear meters cut, I worked >out that there is about 740mm in each plate and this place charged at 5 dolars a meter. I could probably >bargin him down to $2 but when we need 2000 plates >thats still not a nise number. so we can count that one >out. > > James I may be able to help. My name is Zach and I just recently joined this group, but I have seen a few posts like this one, where someone needs pieces cut to build an electric rocket. I have access to a cutting laser. The only problem is it is only a 25 watt, which is fine for cutting up to 1/4 inch plastics or woods, but it has a hard time with metals. I did see someone talking about using the metal coated mylar. There shouldn't be any problem cutting that, but I don't know how it would react to the heat. The edges might curl just a little. The other problem is that the laser doesn't belong to me. And I would have to pay the person that owns it. (by the sounds of it, it might take a whole day to cut 2000 pieces, but it depends on the size and shape). He most likely would let me do it for a couple hundred dollars. I will need all the exact specs for what we are cutting and a sample of the mylar, to test it out. If anyone is interested let me know. I am interested to find out if anyone has tried to build the rocket and to what success did they achieve. Zach From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 09:45:18 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA17475 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:45:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix7.ix.netcom.com (ix7.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA17455 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:45:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id JAA08564; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:43:45 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 09:43:45 -0800 Message-Id: <199511251743.JAA08564@ix7.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: fnrg: Re : fnrg : H2O Arc O/U Proposed Mechanism To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: 11/25/95 There appears to be anomalous excessive energy production in H2O arc explosions. Currently much work is in progression on proving or disproving O/U energy capture in H2O arc explosions. Research is being independently carried out by many including, but not limited to, the Graneaus, Hall, Hathaway and myself. Assuming that there is O/U energy capture in H2O arc explosions, I propose the following mechanism. Based on the theory that water H-O bonds or nucleii (either O or H) have natural resonate frequencies, if a proper energy driver is chosen, then these resonances will occur naturally. This ringing is in all spatial dimensions, allowing cohering of noncoherent energy (ZPE ?) in other dimensions that we are not privileged to sense. A tremendous amount of "new" coherent energy will enter the resonating system and express itself in our "limited" physical space. A similar idea is Tom Bearden's "phase conjugate mirror", where I believe he postulates a scalar electrostatic mechanism vibrates nucleii. I propose the capacitors discharge energy is the hammer that rings the natural resonance(s) in H20 and allows the above mechanism to occur. The capacitor discharge energy is not in a single energy block, but in fact, rings itself. Richard Hull has demonstrated this quite nicely. (see ESJ Issue 14) The frequency of this discharge is not only a function of the LC tank, but quite likely coupled to the resonating frequency of the H2O system. Probably at a lower harmonic. I express a similar mechanism for exploding wires. No doubt we will find the number of resonating systems is infinite. The trick is to find a less violent means of transferring this "new" energy to our "limited" physical space. RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 10:26:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA27168 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:25:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA27122 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id NAA23922 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:25:30 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511251825.NAA23922@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:25:29 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199511251730.KAA04006@bob.indirect.com> from "Zach Radding" at Nov 25, 95 10:30:39 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > > You wrote: > > I talked to a person from a company called laser > >sheet metals about geting plates cut out for the > >electric rocket he said at that thicknes thay may > >be able to cut 3 or 4 sheets at a time the only problem being that they > might weld together. > > the way they charge is by linear meters cut, I worked > >out that there is about 740mm in each plate and this place charged at 5 > dolars a meter. I could probably > >bargin him down to $2 but when we need 2000 plates > >thats still not a nise number. so we can count that one > >out. > > > > James > > > I may be able to help. My name is Zach and I just recently joined this > group, but I have seen a few posts like this one, where someone needs pieces > cut to build an electric rocket. I have access to a cutting laser. The > only problem is it is only a 25 watt, which is fine for cutting up to 1/4 > inch plastics or woods, but it has a hard time with metals. I did see > someone talking about using the metal coated mylar. There shouldn't be any > problem cutting that, but I don't know how it would react to the heat. The > edges might curl just a little. > > The other problem is that the laser doesn't belong to me. And I would have > to pay the person that owns it. (by the sounds of it, it might take a whole > day to cut 2000 pieces, but it depends on the size and shape). He most > likely would let me do it for a couple hundred dollars. I will need all the > exact specs for what we are cutting and a sample of the mylar, to test it > out. If anyone is interested let me know. > > I am interested to find out if anyone has tried to build the rocket and to > what success did they achieve. > > > Zach > > About how thick can the metal be, so it can cut it? I *MIGHT* have a use, but don't get your hopes up. Also, the price would have to be lower. -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 11:03:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA07173 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:03:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA07137 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:03:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id OAA24809 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 14:03:20 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511251903.OAA24809@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: program To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 14:03:19 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199511251827.KAA27802@mail.eskimo.com> from "Gary Hawkins" at Nov 25, 95 12:01:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > > At 12:23 PM 11/25/95 -0500, you wrote: > >I made a new computer game, it is shareware. Dose anyone know any good > >places on the web to put it? > > > > http://www.law.indiana.edu/misc/ftp-cica.html > > ** Uploading Software > > Please place all uploads in the pub/pc/win3/uploads subdirectory. The > same rules apply to uploading as downloading: if the file is binary, > type "tenex" (or "binary" or "quote type L") first before doing a "put > filename". > > Ftp activity at CICA is relentless: Approximately 48,000 logins per month > (or, an average of 1,625 ftp logins that fetch over one gigabyte of data per > day). > > > --------------------------------------------------- > Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today > http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA > > THERE IS ONE BIG PROBLEM, THAT PLACE IS FOR WINDOW SOFTWARE. MY PROGRAM IS MAC SOFTWARE. PLEASE TELL ME ANY MAC PLACES YOU KNOW. ANDREW -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 11:50:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA20366 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:49:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA20313 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:49:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id LAA12846; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:49:47 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:49:47 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: vtx: Altering of half-lives (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:21:07 -0600 (CST) From: John Logajan To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: vtx: Altering of half-lives William Beaty wrote: > John Logajan wrote: > > Hate to say this, but I smell a hoax. > > Aha! Its 1991, not 1990 as the message said. And there's a typo in the > patent number. This for the 5076,971 (not as above) Thanks, Bill. I've eaten my words. :-) I just got the patent downloaded via the http://www.micropat.com/ service (25 cents per page. Usually more expensive than the $2 fixed charge of the patent office, but orders of magnitude faster! You do need a PC to run the free but proprietary patent viewer.) Wowzer! Barker sticks radioactive elements inside the sphere of a Van de Graaff generator, runs it at a negative potential for several minutes/hours/days -- and claims that the rate of radioactive decay is extremely enhanced -- with some relationship to the magnitude of the negative potential. In fact, a positive potential is said to slow the radioactive decay rate. Barker gives these numbers: Potential 350kV +or- 75kV maintained for 12 hours. After the 12 hour "treatment" three samples were monitored for their radioactivity. Depletion at Depletion at Normal Half-life three days seven days Half-life accelerated by Tl 204 1% 5.3% 3.8y 15x Po 210 7% 55.3% 138.4d 15.3x Th 230 2.6% 81.8% 80000y 48900x Note that the "treatment" was for 12 hours only, the samples continued to decay at an accelerated rate with no further exposure to the negative potential. Barker also warns, "High voltages may be hazardous. For example, 2MV predicted to convert the half-life of U238 to one second." Well anyhow, that's what the patent says. :-) -- - John Logajan -- jlogajan@skypoint.com -- 612-633-0345 - - 4248 Hamline Ave; Arden Hills, Minnesota (MN) 55112 USA - - WWW URL = http://www.skypoint.com/members/jlogajan - From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 12:00:19 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA23101 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:59:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix8.ix.netcom.com ([199.182.120.8]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA23076 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:59:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix8.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id LAA19360; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:58:28 -0800 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 11:58:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199511251958.LAA19360@ix8.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: T.T. Brown FAQ? To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: >Well, how about inviting him. Preferrably someone acquainted with him. O.K. I'll email Stan. Dennis From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 10:27:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA27850 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:27:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA27802 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 10:27:40 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511251827.KAA27802@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 12:01:09 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: program Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 12:23 PM 11/25/95 -0500, you wrote: >I made a new computer game, it is shareware. Dose anyone know any good >places on the web to put it? http://www.law.indiana.edu/misc/ftp-cica.html ** Uploading Software Please place all uploads in the pub/pc/win3/uploads subdirectory. The same rules apply to uploading as downloading: if the file is binary, type "tenex" (or "binary" or "quote type L") first before doing a "put filename". Ftp activity at CICA is relentless: Approximately 48,000 logins per month (or, an average of 1,625 ftp logins that fetch over one gigabyte of data per day). --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 13:21:57 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id NAA14861 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:21:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from peg.apc.org (peg.apc.org [192.131.13.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA14807 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:20:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from t4.dialup.peg.apc.org (t4.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.132]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id IAA18298 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:20:32 +1000 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 08:20:32 +1000 Message-Id: <199511252220.IAA18298@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: fnrg: Robert Pavlita Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Has anyone got any info on Robert Pavlita's PSYCHOTRONIC GENERATORS? If so, please email me direct at jfrancis@peg.apc.org AUSTRALIAN MIND-CONTROL RESEARCH CENTRE From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 20:52:36 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id UAA13547 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 20:52:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.indirect.com (root@ns1.indirect.com [165.247.1.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA13540 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 20:52:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from indirect ([165.247.24.72]) by ns1.indirect.com (8.6.12/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA12773 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 21:52:11 -0700 Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 21:52:11 -0700 Message-Id: <199511260452.VAA12773@ns1.indirect.com> X-Sender: xaq@mail.indirect.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: xaq@indirect.com (Zach Radding) Subject: fnrg: Laser cutting Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The laser I have access to now can cut woods and plastics without any problem. I have never tried cutting metal, and neither has the person that owns it. (He uses it to make wooden earings, and I have used it to cut plastic pieces for a robot I am building) I don't think it will cut anything thicker than foil, it is only 25 watts(you need at least 100watt to cut any sheet metal). There is a slight chance that I may be getting a larger laser for my self in the next few months. In that case I wouldn't have to pay this guy to use his. But I wont know for a few weeks. As for what sort of input file I need, the easiest would be dxf. The laser is currently setup using CorelDraw5.0 as its input, but I usualy import dxf files into Corel and they work great. I live in Phoenix, Az, so if you want to let me know where to get the mylar, or can send me a small piece I will test it out. Zach PS The guy who owns the laser lives about 90 miles north from where I live. So, I can't make too many trips there. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 03:31:00 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id DAA18238 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:30:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from iprolink.co.nz (gateway.iprolink.co.nz [202.36.121.249]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id DAA18224 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:30:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ts2-12.iprolink.co.nz (ts2-12.iprolink.co.nz [202.36.121.79]) by iprolink.co.nz (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA26662 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:30:41 +1300 Received: by ts2-12.iprolink.co.nz with Microsoft Mail id <01BABB97.2D026F20@ts2-12.iprolink.co.nz>; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:36:07 +-1300 Message-ID: <01BABB97.2D026F20@ts2-12.iprolink.co.nz> From: james rye To: "'BILL BETYS NEWS GROUP'" Subject: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:35:19 +-1300 Encoding: 12 TEXT Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I talked to a person from a company called laser sheet metals about geting plates cut out for the electric rocket he said at that thicknes thay may be able to cut 3 or 4 sheets at a time the only problem being that they might weld together. the way they charge is by linear meters cut, I worked out that there is about 740mm in each plate and this place charged at 5 dolars a meter. I could probably bargin him down to $2 but when we need 2000 plates thats still not a nise number. so we can count that one out. James From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 15:44:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id PAA23366 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 15:44:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from peg.apc.org (peg.apc.org [192.131.13.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA23349 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 15:44:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from t4.dialup.peg.apc.org (t4.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.132]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id KAA04594 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:43:56 +1000 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:43:56 +1000 Message-Id: <199511260043.KAA04594@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: Re: fnrg: Robert Pavlita Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Has anyone got any info on Robert Pavlita's PSYCHOTRONIC GENERATORS? If so, please email me direct at jfrancis@peg.apc.org AUSTRALIAN MIND-CONTROL RESEARCH CENTRE From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 18:28:53 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA06400 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 18:28:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA06245 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 18:27:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a1-59.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a1-59.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.59]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id NAA02780 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:25:31 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511260225.NAA02780@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:27:36 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 24 Nov 95 at 13:34, dennis lee wrote: > You wrote: > > >Yes, but no one would have to buy it from Tesla. Anyone would be able > >to collect it free of charge. Thus any venture in that direction was > >foredoomed. Morgan being a banker understood this all too well. > > So Tesla was expecting Morgan to provide power to the magnifying transmitter which > would then be given away? Wouldn't the system make more sense if the transmitter was > tuned to the Earth's resonant frequency? Then a high voltage would kind of just form at > the top. > > I don't think Tesla was trying to capture free energy. He was trying to develop an effficient means of energy distribution for the masses. Robin van Spaandonk Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 00:23:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id AAA00895 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:22:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA00886 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:22:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id AAA19533; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:22:45 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 00:22:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: from Stan Deyo Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The below from Stan... .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 25 Nov 1995 19:12:42 +0800 From: Stan Deyo To: William Beaty Subject: TT Brown Lab Notes William, I would be interested as long as my email isn't clogged with freenrg-list traffic. If it means that I will be swamped with long articles and waffling discussions then, I would kindly decline the invitation. If, on the other hand, it means serious, succinct reporting and discussions on alternate, cheaper energy conversions,.... then "yes" I am interested in joining the group. I have the FIVE (5) lab books of TT Brown's R&D at the Bahnson Co. in Salem, N. Carolina 1958-9. I also have some other letters and drawings of the lab plus the only surviving 16mm colour film of the various stages of his work at Bahnson Labs. I was in contact with Dr Brown in 1983 by phone and by mail. He died of lung cancer not long after in Oct of 1985. He told me that a lot of people including Bill Morre had attributed more to his work than he had really done. In particular, he was only marginally connected with the Philadelphia Experiment as such. His main theme of R&D was dielectrics and the Biefeld-Brown effect. He was not an electromagnetics man... only electrostatics. >From 1983 to 1991 or so I was in frequent communication with J. Frank King who was TT Brown's boss at the Bahnson Co. J. Frank was a good man and a good friend of mine. He, too, died in Dec 1989. Before he died I was given rights to reproduce and share letters, files, drawings, patent submissions, films etc from his personal files on TT Brown, George Adamski, Dr Ilka, T Henry Moray and others. J Frank warned me a long time ago to take what TT Brown said with a 'grain of salt' because Townsend had a habit of 'stretching the truth' a bit to get funding which he was always in need of.... So, I warn you now in good faith: If you seek lost or hidden technology in Brown's lab notes, I don't think you will find it there; however, I am prepared to make photocopies available to you. There are about 750 pages in all. I would need to charge you AUS$50 per notebook which would include the air mail charges as well. In US$ that would be about US$38 per notebook. The film is available as are the notebooks (I think) from The Electric Spacecraft Journal in the US (Charles Yost on 704-252-8083, FAX 202-683-3511. Hope this helps..... Stan Deyo >On Fri, 24 Nov 1995, dennis lee wrote: >> You wrote: >> >> > The definitive works would be Brown's hand written lab note >> >books, of which there where at least six. Any one know where to get >> >all six? >> >> Stan Deyo has them. His email is standeyo@iinet.net.au >> >> He also mentioned a company in the States that sells them. > >Think Stan would be interested in joining freenrg-list? =========================== L'Falcon Bleu d'Bourg The French Texan in "OZ-trailya" http://www.iinet.net.au/~standeyo/ =========================== From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sat Nov 25 13:38:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id NAA19268 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:38:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from iprolink.co.nz (gateway.iprolink.co.nz [202.36.121.249]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA19243 for ; Sat, 25 Nov 1995 13:38:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from ts2-26.iprolink.co.nz (ts2-26.iprolink.co.nz [202.36.121.93]) by iprolink.co.nz (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA05397 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:38:12 +1300 Received: by ts2-26.iprolink.co.nz with Microsoft Mail id <01BABBEC.166B0BA0@ts2-26.iprolink.co.nz>; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:43:56 +-1300 Message-ID: <01BABBEC.166B0BA0@ts2-26.iprolink.co.nz> From: james rye To: "'freenrg-list@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:34:12 +-1300 Encoding: 30 TEXT, 50 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I may be able to help. My name is Zach and I just recently joined this group, but I have seen a few posts like this one, where someone needs pieces cut to build an electric rocket. I have access to a cutting laser. The only problem is it is only a 25 watt, which is fine for cutting up to 1/4 inch plastics or woods, but it has a hard time with metals. I did see someone talking about using the metal coated mylar. There shouldn't be any problem cutting that, but I don't know how it would react to the heat. The edges might curl just a little. The other problem is that the laser doesn't belong to me. And I would have to pay the person that owns it. (by the sounds of it, it might take a whole day to cut 2000 pieces, but it depends on the size and shape). He most likely would let me do it for a couple hundred dollars. I will need all the exact specs for what we are cutting and a sample of the mylar, to test it out. If anyone is interested let me know. I am interested to find out if anyone has tried to build the rocket and to what success did they achieve. Zach I can get drawings done on autocad and could foward the file to you in either dwg, dxf or sld I don,t know what format your laser might use cheres James Rye james_r@iprolink.co.nz begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(CD5`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$-@ 0` M`@````,``P`!!) &`# !```!````# ````,``# #````"P`/#@`````"`?\/ M`0```$T`````````@2L?I+ZC$!F=;@#=`0]4`@````!F@```P`&$)/T$\8#``<0T@,``!X`"! !````90`` M`$E-05E"14%"3$543TA%3%!-64Y!345)4UI!0TA!3D1)2E535%)%0T5.5$Q9 M2D])3D5$5$A)4T=23U50+$)55$E(059%4T5%3D%&15=03U-44TQ)2T542$E3 M3TY%+%=(15)%4T\``````@$)$ $```!M! ``:00``/,&``!,6D9U2*"O>O\` M"@$/`A4"J 7K`H,`4 +R"0(`8V@*P'-E=#(W!@`&PP*#,@/%`@!P)S M=&5M`H,S=P+D!Q,"@'T*@ C/"=D[\18/,C4U`H *@0VQ"V!@;F=AP`$; )\!P0(&8'T=QP;Q/ !" 9 MT&L<41_!ZB "(&4@L'<H&_Z8R*P=!S@(08`T"3Q!"!7''$AT"61= N M9R* 8?41L'(G@50L;$1PQ;1UR:05 (P,?$?"]'8%F'V$AX 6Q*.8@()#Q'&(Q+S0*A0N '=$+44\3P";P(Q$%P'=O M!'!S_R"T*X$1@ 0@(= 1@1^1!W&?(W K@!W@!X !D&QS)X-\9&D>("&!"H4C MYC+Q:_\I(@&@"& %0!YP*2(?L!P`FS+3)8!O+) ?@6UY"V W*:$IX2.R: A@ M)C!N)_,%0!OR;GD*A2K6*.8?L!LLD""V9 (@.'%K;F__!^ X$ ?@*X$PH#@Q M'J$`T+\ELS8B'* LD"F["8!G!Y&P;6EG: 5 )9!R`R#?'F,AT!G0`D <0"X* MA0J%_RGA(R V(3E8'8$Z">2%A M:7HXLC.A$8!',"G]'.!(-D$B00J%(I(?$3Q4_QQ 2?$<`#LP*W(MPBC!(('= M'$%H22$6$3LA;#=1,R'_15$#$ ,@)&(<$%0Q-B$^)OIX/-)S1S P02W"(X!" MT;YW' $CL2CF'@(AT',=0/]2HDEQ-B,W0B"P/1('D#$R_RH6(.!3T4F .-$D M(BM2`C#_(Z$3P5$G.Y) ?1N0'4!;JO\<<2UQ'B U@@:06P8Q@B;1_U[4)@0V M(B0 M&X%C`Y$^L$UQ$F [06Q00@4GDJ!@R"'E!S\E\< M; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 01:37:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from t5.dialup.peg.apc.org (t5.dialup.peg.apc.org [192.203.176.133]) by peg.apc.org (8.6.9/Revision: 1.7 ) with SMTP id UAA10203 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:37:40 +1000 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 20:37:40 +1000 Message-Id: <199511261037.UAA10203@peg.apc.org> X-Sender: jfrancis@pop.peg.apc.org X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: William Beaty From: jfrancis@peg.apc.org (Jim Francis) Subject: Re: fnrg: lasers cutting plates. Status: RO X-Status: A >Hi Jim! When you subscribe to freenrg-list, you get *all* the message >traffic. Usually several discussions are going on simultaneously. > >I recalled a mention of Pavlita in the "Radionics" packet from >"Infolios," but upon checking I don't see much there. It's mostly about >the Heironymous device and similar stuff. > >Anyone: isn't there an American Psychotronics Society or something >similar which deals with Pavlita's stuff? Thanks Bill ...sorta figured that after the dozenth message!! Bill, I don,t know whether psyc gentrs interest you personally but I wrote a basic report on what they were, for my MIND POWER newsletter subscribers. Was the most popular report this year! If this knowledge would be of any interest, I'll Em you a copy. Cheers Jim Francis Editor - AUTRALIAN LATERAL THINKING NEWSLETTER From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 06:47:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id GAA18220 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 06:47:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA18209 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 06:47:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id JAA15592 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:46:58 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511261446.JAA15592@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Altering of half-lives (fwd) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 09:46:57 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: from "William Beaty" at Nov 25, 95 11:49:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Is there a vortex listserve? If there is, then let me know, I want to join. Andrew -- ((( (O,O) (-) -----oOOo-----oOOo---------------- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 10:07:44 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA29494 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:07:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA29455; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:07:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA09977; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:07:24 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:07:23 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > The conduction band (rather than the individual orbitals) becomes > stretched out, and at a certain field-strength it extends out into free > space and electrons begin to escape. If a sudden voltage pulse was applied to a needle, perhaps the entire conduction band extends out into space, necks down and breaks off, and a glob of quantum "electric fluid" flys free. For this to occur the ZPE would have to smoothly take over the role of the copper ions as the conduction band extended, keeping the electron-matter compressed, otherwise the electrons would spray out as a 'gas' of individual particles. If the Casmir forces are strong enough to compress a cloud of electrons, then I'd expect there to be some dependance of this force on the density of electron-gas, because (I think!) a sparse cloud of free electrons would act much less condutive than a dense cloud. Or perhaps the Casmir force is stronger for a denser cloud of electrons because they act as a better shield for the higher frequencies of ZPE? If I could take a bunch of electrons and compress them into an increasingly small cloud, at some point the cloud would be so conductive that the Casmir forces would take over and continue the compression. What then would limit it? The electron-cluster would shrink to a point! Maybe unknown quantum effects limit the (presumed!) process. Or perhaps the frequency distribution of the ZPE makes the Casmir forces drop off as the electron cluster falls below a certain size. Now I see where Shoulders gets his "Jupiter" stuff. If electron clusters exist, their effects should be seen in many places, and if they conduct ZPE into the macroscopic world, maybe they play a part in chemistry, stellar physics, etc., as well as CF effects. The discovery of the century? Some wild speculation: would an electron cluster swallow up free electrons and grow? Shoulders' patent implies that the clusters are disrupted by contact with solid matter. But what would happen if they touched the plasma of an electric arc? Would they feed off its electrons? The Corum paper on ball lightning production says that the tiny 'sparks' that arise when a Tesla coil arc strikes a carbon electrode ARE THEN STRUCK BY LATER ARCS AND "INFLATED" IN SIZE. Maybe the Corum's ball lightnings are not carbon aerogels as they postulate, but are electron clusters after all. If so, then thunderstorm ball lightning would arise when a tiny charge-cluster had the opportunity to feed off of the arc plasma for quite awhile, during multiple restrikes or during "hot" long-dwell lightning strikes. If applying a pulse to a needle can produce invisibly-small charge clusters, what happens when a pulsed needle is used with an arc source or an e-field source? (Shield the needle from the arc or the e-field, and just launch charge clusters out into it?) If injected between the plates of a capacitor with air dielectric, they might grow into detectable, measurable entities. A small (conductive) charge cluster might also grow into a ball lightning if it found itself in the highly charged mist within a thunderstorm. It would then induce corona and small lightning discharges in the same way that a conductive aircraft actually induces the lightning which "strikes" it. In a thundercloud a charge cluster would essentially be sending out branching plasma filaments and using the ambient e-field to feed off the electrons of air and water. Cool image, eh? Star Trek "plasma lifeforms!" .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 10:40:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA08098 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:40:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix3.ix.netcom.com (ix3.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.3]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA08085 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:40:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id KAA29252; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:38:21 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:38:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199511261838.KAA29252@ix3.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Tesla Patent To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: >I don't think Tesla was trying to capture free energy. He was trying >to develop an effficient means of energy distribution for the masses. If the Magnifying Transmitter (interesting name) was tuned to the Earth's resonant frequency, how would it respond I wonder? I think Tesla had enough business sense to know that if one gave something away that one had to pay for, one would not last long in that business. Tesla probably had the forsight not to start heavy development on an energy transmission system without having the energy source problem figured out. If there's anyone ever on this planet qualified to develop free energy, it's Tesla. Dennis From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 10:49:19 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA10721 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:49:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.iglou.com (relay.iglou.com [192.107.41.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA10695 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:49:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from dp1-043.ppp.iglou.com by mail.iglou.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #8) id m0tJm2S-0003aLC; Sun, 26 Nov 95 13:42 EST Message-Id: X-Sender: clipper@iglou.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 13:48:30 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: clipper@iglou.com (S.G.) Subject: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the discussions here Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I will be glad to CAD draft designs if it would be of help investigating subjects from this list. I will not charge a fee. Just keep in mind it may take a while for turn around. I can make the drawing file any format you wish except mac. I'm a CAD drafter be trade. If you wish to get in touch via email my email add is clipper@iglou.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 10:57:39 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA12934 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12888; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id KAA13737; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:23 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 10:57:22 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: vortex-l@mail.eskimo.com cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Shielding the ZPE? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Casmir-force questions. (Actually more like Casmir force brainstorming.) Casmir forces are radiation pressure, right? All metals must be feeling this pressure to some extent. Do thicker metal plates display enhanced Casmir force effects, or is a thin metal foil as good a shield? Would polished superconductor plates work much better than thinfilm gold? If thicker is better, then a metal object inside a thick-walled shielding container would experience reduced Casmir force. Might this have a small effect on chemistry? If it affected certain electronic devices, then ZPE would be directly measurable. If the shielding alters even the short wavelengths of ZPE, might it affect radioactive decay processes? Metal shields probably would have no effect, but a great huge cloud of protons might do something. Maybe take a GM counter and a radioactive source down a mineshaft to put lots of protons between you and the sky, and see if the activity is altered? I'd think someone would have noticed such an effect, even if small. (and does the terminal of a charged VandeGraaff machine have enhanced ZPE shielding properties and cause Barker's effect?) Variable-conductivity materials should display varying Casmir force effects. Would cryo-cooled (insulating) parallel semiconductor plates have a different Casmir compression force than when heated and conductive? If the parallel-plates Casmir force experiment is continuously monitored in real time, does the force respond to the presence of shielding objects? Would this experiment constitute a ZPE telescope and detect a 24hr variation as the earth acted as a shield for various portions of the sky? Hodowanec claims that capacitor noise varies like this. A faraday cage is not the only type of electrical shield. Simple proximity to metal objects exerts a shielding effect. So, does our proximity to the Earth cause some tiny changes to the ZPE background which would not exist for a spacecraft halfway to the moon? If the ZPE spectrum could be dynamically measured (by parallel-plate forces? Howadnec's capacitors?), perhaps it would become possible to detect nearby objects by the ZPE shadows they cast. Or to send signals by flipping big flat plates of dense matter around. Or manipulating big arrays of charge-cluster material. Charged-cluster matter should make an excellent ZPE shield. A hollow sphere of condensed charge would become a ZPE camera if a hole was made in the wall and a detector array placed inside! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 12:41:04 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id MAA11532 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:40:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA11454 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 12:40:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511262040.MAA11454@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:06:40 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the discussions here Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 01:48 PM 11/26/95 -0500, you wrote: > I will be glad to CAD draft designs if it would be of help >investigating subjects from this list. I will not charge a fee. Just keep in >mind it may take a while for turn around. I can make the drawing file any >format you wish except mac. I'm a CAD drafter be trade. > >If you wish to get in touch via email my email add is clipper@iglou.com > > > > What program would you recommend for the PC? I've worked with "Design Cad", and a friend just bought one called I think -- "AutoCad". Thanks. Gary --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 14:50:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id OAA19929 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:50:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA19867 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:49:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id OAA06224; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:49:54 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 14:49:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Altering of half-lives (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199511261446.JAA15592@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Sun, 26 Nov 1995, Andrew Cantino wrote: > Is there a vortex listserve? If there is, then let me know, I want to join. Take a look at the vortex-l webpage in WEIRD SCIENCE under OTHER WEBSITES: COLD FUSION, or go to http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/weird/wvort./html You can read the old messages there, and find subscription instructions (which are the same as for freenrg-list) .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 18:25:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA24487 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:25:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA24469 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 18:25:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from [198.69.104.137] (pm4_5.digital.net [198.69.104.137]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA07194 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:22:52 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:22:47 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: fnrg: Potential Differences Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A I have read that a potential difference exists between a wire held at an altitude and one that is at ground level. I am making an assumption that this is something that can be measured with something simple, such as a digital multimeter. Does anyone on this list know about this area of investigation? If so, please leave e-mail to the address given below. --------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley * tilleyrw@digital.net * "Once upon a time..." | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | **************** http://ddi.digital.net/~tilleyrw *************** | --------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 23:14:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA14793 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:14:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix12.ix.netcom.com (ix12.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.12]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA14780 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:13:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix12.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id XAA04732; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:14:08 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:14:08 -0800 Message-Id: <199511270714.XAA04732@ix12.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the discussions here To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > > I will be glad to CAD draft designs if it would be of help >investigating subjects from this list. I will not charge a fee. Just keep in >mind it may take a while for turn around. I can make the drawing file any >format you wish except mac. I'm a CAD drafter be trade. We are Autocad drafters also. We specialize in 3D; perhaps we can take up any slack in the solid modelling department. 3D Studio experience also. I will foward a description of the Virtual Reality project we are working on which will be shown at VR World - Boston Nov. 29-30. Dennis & Veredith From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 23:49:05 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA21269 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix2.ix.netcom.com (ix2.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA21148 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:48:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix2.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id XAA06678; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:47:04 -0800 Date: Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:47:04 -0800 Message-Id: <199511270747.XAA06678@ix2.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Cc: hic@world.std.com Cc: leep@world.std.com Cc: erg@world.std.com Cc: ahannan@eris.cs.umb.edu Cc: ives@ccs.neu.edu Cc: olevine@meceng.coe.neu.edu Cc: bmaher@world.std.com Cc: umwelt@world.std.com Cc: mourant@meceng.coe.neu.com Cc: number@tiac.net Cc: ejp@world.std.com Cc: csepulv@husc.harvard.edu Cc: standeyo@iinet.net.au Cc: 75330.62@compuserve.com Cc: tcapizzi@world.std.com Cc: prs@autodesk.com Cc: hjbinner@ingr.com Cc: john.ison@autodesk.com Cc: kevin.blaker@autodesk.com Cc: bruce.pardoe@autodesk.com Cc: robm@autodesk.com Cc: blau@siggraph.org Cc: kpallist@matrox.com Cc: cls@ENGA.BU.EDU Cc: frank.galdes@autodesk.com Cc: psion@gateway.ecn.com Cc: deadnuts@deadnuts.com Cc: alex@frolov.spb.su Cc: reim@advantor.com Cc: ohl@world.std.com Cc: 73577.123@compuserve.com Cc: bgh@win.ionics.com Cc: bso@acm.org Cc: digibson@nmsu.edu Cc: crc@ENGA.BU.EDU Cc: 71650.60@compuserve.com Cc: RKeirn@aol.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Robin; Veredith Keller and I have patented a device called "Concentric Tori". As the name suggest, "Concentric Tori" is composed of two individual toroids. The device uses (we believe) a heretofore unknown mechanical principal which enables the two toroids to 'click' and lock into a concentric position relative to each other. We've suspected that this mechanism may play a role in subatomic particle physics but you are the first person that seems to have a knowledge of the connection. We would appreciate any and all info on this line of theory. Dennis Lee & Veredith Keller You wrote: > >On 26 Nov 95 at 10:07, William Beaty wrote: >[snip] >> If the Casmir forces are strong enough to compress a cloud of electrons, > >According to Boyer, the Casimir force causes a sphere to expand not >contract. I seem to remember that a torus on the other hand is forced >contract. (Hal?) This would imply that such a cloud could not form as >a sphere, but could as a torus. Now coincidentally(?) the magnetic >force scenario that I described for the buildup of clusters, would >seem to give rise to torus shaped clusters. (Actually wheels within >wheels within wheels, many tori (sp?) within one another). >[snip] >Robin van Spaandonk > >Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, >Learns all his life, >And leaves knowing nothing. >Robin Feb. 1995 > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 19:28:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id TAA14134 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:28:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA14109 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 19:28:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a1-25.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a1-25.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.25]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id OAA09153 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:26:04 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511270326.OAA09153@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 14:28:28 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 26 Nov 95 at 10:07, William Beaty wrote: [snip] > If the Casmir forces are strong enough to compress a cloud of electrons, According to Boyer, the Casimir force causes a sphere to expand not contract. I seem to remember that a torus on the other hand is forced contract. (Hal?) This would imply that such a cloud could not form as a sphere, but could as a torus. Now coincidentally(?) the magnetic force scenario that I described for the buildup of clusters, would seem to give rise to torus shaped clusters. (Actually wheels within wheels within wheels, many tori (sp?) within one another). [snip] Robin van Spaandonk Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Sun Nov 26 23:54:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id XAA22212 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:54:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA22188 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 1995 23:53:53 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511270753.XAA22188@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:26:30 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 02:28 PM 11/27/95 +0900, you wrote: >[snip] >> If the Casmir forces are strong enough to compress a cloud of electrons, > >According to Boyer, the Casimir force causes a sphere to expand not >contract. I seem to remember that a torus on the other hand is forced >contract. (Hal?) This would imply that such a cloud could not form as >a sphere, but could as a torus. Now coincidentally(?) the magnetic >force scenario that I described for the buildup of clusters, would >seem to give rise to torus shaped clusters. (Actually wheels within >wheels within wheels, many tori (sp?) within one another). >[snip] >Robin van Spaandonk > Interesting. We know how a torroidal shape moves so efficiently through the air in the form of a smoke ring, An etheric torroid moving through a wire (which we call electricity) would seem to match the scenario here somehow. And if an electron itself is a torus shape, your wheels within wheels. Incidentally, if you picture an innertube rotating in upon itself fast enough to pump air through the hole in the middle, note that the direction of movement of the surfaces would mesh if you had two of them going, face to face, and if you were to get them close to each other with the proper sides facing, they would stick together like a couple of suction cups. Anyone for talking about electron pairs? Gary Hawkins --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 00:26:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id AAA28964 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:25:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA28942 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 00:25:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511270825.AAA28942@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:58:41 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 11:47 PM 11/26/95 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Robin; > > Veredith Keller and I have patented a device called "Concentric Tori". As the >name suggest, "Concentric Tori" is composed of two individual toroids. The device >uses (we believe) a heretofore unknown mechanical principal which enables the two >toroids to 'click' and lock into a concentric position relative to each other. >We've suspected that this mechanism may play a role in subatomic particle >physics but you are the first person that seems to have a knowledge of the >connection. We would appreciate any and all info on this line of theory. > >Dennis Lee & Veredith Keller > > 'Concentric' would be one inside the other, no?. I hope you will also do some modelling of face to face rotating toroids. [Going on the pet theory that electrons could be shaped like toroids], since it requires cooling of a material for electron pairs to form, you might be able to come to an understanding of a macrocosmic counterpart to *temperature*, that is, some amount of rattling of the air around two torroids stuck face to face that would cause them to break free of each other. Out on a limb, Gary Hawkins --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 02:11:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id CAA15973 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:11:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA15958 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 02:11:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a1-21.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a1-21.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.21]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id VAA05447 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:09:03 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511271009.VAA05447@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:11:45 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 26 Nov 95 at 23:47, dennis lee wrote: > Hi Robin; > > Veredith Keller and I have patented a device called "Concentric Tori". As the > name suggest, "Concentric Tori" is composed of two individual toroids. The device > uses (we believe) a heretofore unknown mechanical principal which enables the two > toroids to 'click' and lock into a concentric position relative to each other. > We've suspected that this mechanism may play a role in subatomic particle > physics but you are the first person that seems to have a knowledge of the > connection. We would appreciate any and all info on this line of theory. > > Dennis Lee & Veredith Keller [snip] Dennis, In an attempt to get a handle on this, lets try some info exchange. Question 1: Does your device exhibit any magnetic properties? Q2: Could you make a photo available in GIF or JPEG format? Q3: What is the patent nr? >From my side, you might like to start by taking a look at my web page: http://server.netspace.net.au/~rvanspaa then we can progress from there. Robin van Spaandonk Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 09:32:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id JAA29430 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:32:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA29399 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:32:00 -0800 (PST) From: sphere@ddi.digital.net Received: from sphere (pm2_4.digital.net [198.69.104.104]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA02065 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:17:45 -0500 Message-Id: <199511271717.MAA02065@ddi.digital.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:18:42 +0000 Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc X-Confirm-Reading-To: sphere@ddi.digital.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Here's a fragment of a recent message from Dennis Lee: ... If the Magnifying Transmitter (interesting name) was tuned to the Earth's resonant frequency, how would it respond I wonder? I think Tesla had enough business sense to know that if one gave something away that one had to pay for, one would not last long in that business. Tesla probably had the forsight not to start heavy development on an energy transmission system without having the energy source problem figured out. If there's anyone ever on this planet qualified to develop free energy, it's Tesla. Dennis He mentions the word 'business' twice in a single sentence. I think that this shows a marketing/business bias. I bet he's the one. I'm going to send him the following: Hi Dennis, I am one of your principal investors (Conserve Financial Services, 1991-92). Where does our low-termperature phase change technology stand today? What is the current marketing plan, if any? What of my investment? What do you think? I wait to hear from you before I send it. Lee From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 23:25:35 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA26316 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:53:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA26089 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:52:25 -0800 (PST) From: sphere@ddi.digital.net Received: from sphere (pm2_4.digital.net [198.69.104.104]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA06394 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:49:52 -0500 Message-Id: <199511271849.NAA06394@ddi.digital.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 13:50:49 +0000 Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters X-Confirm-Reading-To: sphere@ddi.digital.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 01:26:30 -0800 > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > From: Gary Hawkins > Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > At 02:28 PM 11/27/95 +0900, you wrote: > >[snip] > >> If the Casmir forces are strong enough to compress a cloud of electrons, > > > >According to Boyer, the Casimir force causes a sphere to expand not > >contract. I seem to remember that a torus on the other hand is forced > >contract. (Hal?) This would imply that such a cloud could not form as > >a sphere, but could as a torus. Now coincidentally(?) the magnetic > >force scenario that I described for the buildup of clusters, would > >seem to give rise to torus shaped clusters. (Actually wheels within > >wheels within wheels, many tori (sp?) within one another). > >[snip] > >Robin van Spaandonk > > > > Interesting. We know how a torroidal shape moves so efficiently > through the air in the form of a smoke ring, An etheric torroid > moving through a wire (which we call electricity) would seem > to match the scenario here somehow. And if an electron itself > is a torus shape, your wheels within wheels. > > Incidentally, if you picture an innertube rotating in upon itself > fast enough to pump air through the hole in the middle, note that > the direction of movement of the surfaces would mesh if you > had two of them going, face to face, and if you were to get them > close to each other with the proper sides facing, they would > stick together like a couple of suction cups. Anyone for talking > about electron pairs? > Right. Electron topology is toroidal but it's shape varies between spherical and toroidal, usually closer to spherical. Note that the Earth is a spherical toroid (slightly flattened) with a vortical funnel at each pole. An apple is also a spherical toroid (slightly flattened) with vortical funnels at each pole. The apple's shape usually favors a larger north pole funnel (the one attached to the tree) and a smaller south pole with a newtating ripple running around its lip. Note also the human body is a spherical toroid with even more specialized (shape-motion modulated) voritcal funnels at its poles-- mouth and anus. Notice again that because the human body must deal with complex, non-radially-symmetric patterns of motion, its shape is even more finely contoured/modulated that the apple's and has several off-axis, slender subspheres (arms and legs). The body's various voritcal inlets/outlets move fluids of different densities. The mouth-to-anus conduit moves viscous food and waste in and out of the body's fluid systems via the alimenary mucosa. The so called 'chakras' pump extremely fine fluids that you cannot usually feel with you hands. With some practice, however, you can see these fluids with your eyes (another subject). The topmost voritcal funnel on your body is your crown chakra. It lies on top of your head near the back. If your hair is short enough you can see it spiral around the point. If you have enough inflection in your skeleton, you can feel the lip and depression of the vortical cup in the shape of the cranial bones. So what's the shape of an electron? It's similar to that of a planet or apple. Are all electrons the same? Are all planets and apples the same? Do extremely small things have less texture than big things. No. Do electrons play suck-face when they get extremely cold. Yes. Can we learn as much about electrons by trying to decipher their patterns of motion in high-voltage circuits, or by making love to the theories in our heads, as we can by watching things we can actually see? No. As above so below. Sphere > Gary Hawkins > --------------------------------------------------- > Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today > http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 07:03:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA08945 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:02:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA08934 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:02:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA25425; Mon, 27 Nov 95 09:51:18 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Mon, 27 Nov 95 10:01:33 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 95 9:52:33 EST Message-Id: <4F06+l0RikA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Altering of half-lives. X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The inside surface of a Van de Graff Generator is chock full of virtual particles. There is a pure virtual particle charge inside any charged, closed conductor. (Lentz's law). The same effect can be produced by exposing an isotope to a scalar field, such as that produced by a simple bifiliar scalar translator. Whis is interesting in that specific set of frequancies will produce differing degrees of decay accelleration. Increases greater than 15% are easily obtained in this manner. If attempting this, please be sure to have the translator electrically ballanced, with the common point of the two windings grounded, and a two phase signal supply. Do not use an unballanced scalar translator. Great care is demanded in such work, please be carefull! From tilleyrw@digital.net Mon Nov 27 08:21:13 1995 Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA04480 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 08:21:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from [198.69.104.124] (pm2_24.digital.net [198.69.104.124]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA29347 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:18:49 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:18:46 -0500 To: William Beaty From: tilleyrw@digital.net (Robert Tilley) Subject: Re: fnrg: Potential Differences Status: RO X-Status: >Dr Jefimenko (The electrostatic motors guy) Is this the same Dr. Jeffmenko that wrote "Causality" (among others)? I have his book, from the Tesla Company. --------------------------------------------------------------------- | "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, | | and why. Then do it." -- Lazarus Long | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | Robert Tilley * tilleyrw@digital.net * "Once upon a time..." | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| | **************** http://ddi.digital.net/~tilleyrw *************** | --------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 23:24:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA18824 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:31:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix.ix.netcom.com ([199.182.120.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA18726 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:30:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id KAA12341; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:28:37 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:28:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271828.KAA12341@ix.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I think you have the wrong Dennis Lee. If you are refering to the gentleman featured in Extraordinary Science on the critical temperature thermodynamic process, I am not him. Dennis You wrote: > >Here's a fragment of a recent message from Dennis Lee: > > >... >If the Magnifying Transmitter (interesting name) was tuned to the Earth's >resonant frequency, how would it respond I wonder? I think Tesla had enough >business sense to know that if one gave something away that one had to pay for, >one would not last long in that business. Tesla probably had the forsight not to >start heavy development on an energy transmission system without having the >energy source problem figured out. If there's anyone ever on this planet >qualified to develop free energy, it's Tesla. > >Dennis > >He mentions the word 'business' twice in a single sentence. I think >that this shows a marketing/business bias. I bet he's the one. > >I'm going to send him the following: > >Hi Dennis, > > I am one of your principal investors (Conserve Financial Services, >1991-92). Where does our low-termperature phase change technology >stand today? What is the current marketing plan, if any? What of my >investment? > > > > > > >What do you think? I wait to hear from you before I send it. > >Lee > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 23:30:34 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA04278 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:17:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix7.ix.netcom.com (ix7.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.7]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA03931 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:16:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id LAA09225; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:12:01 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:12:01 -0800 Message-Id: <199511271912.LAA09225@ix7.ix.netcom.com> From: atech@ix.netcom.com (dennis lee ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Some one has sent me a letter about patent infringement. I'm going to have to sort this out before I can continue this thread. Dennis You wrote: >In an attempt to get a handle on this, lets try some info exchange. >Question 1: Does your device exhibit any magnetic properties? >Q2: Could you make a photo available in GIF or JPEG format? >Q3: What is the patent nr? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 23:30:41 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id MAA19642 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:03:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA19469 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 12:02:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA01581; Mon, 27 Nov 95 14:50:28 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Mon, 27 Nov 95 15:00:53 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 95 14:26:27 EST Message-Id: <4F06+X1VikA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >If the Magnifying Transmitter (interesting name) was tuned to the Earth's >resonant frequency, how would it respond I wonder? I think Tesla had enough >business sense to know that if one gave something away that one had to pay for >one would not last long in that business. Tesla probably had the forsight not >to start heavy development on an energy transmission system without having the >energy source problem figured out. If there's anyone ever on this planet >qualified to develop free energy, it's Tesla. Common misconception here, Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter" was NOT intended to transmit electromagnetic power over distances. As proof of this, I'll use Tesla's own words on this device. This was discussed on the Neotech list server some time ago, I'll repost the article here to make my point : -> SearchNet's neotech Mailing List There has been some discussion of Tesla's works, both the known and the less known devices. Some say Tesla "discovered" scalar waves and engineering principals. There is evidence from Tesla's own hand that this is in fact the case. >From the book "Experiments with Alternate Currents of High Potential and high Frequancy", the 1904 "new" edition (reprinted 1979, Omni Publications) in the appendix "Transmission of Electric Energy without Wires", on page 156, in the second paragraph we find the following : "I attacked vigorously the development of my magnifying transmitter, now, however, not so much with the original intention of producing one of great power, as with the object of learning how to produce the best one. This is, essentially, a circuit of very high self induction and small resistance which in it's arrangement, mode of excitation and action, may be said to be the diametrical opposite of a transmitting circuit typical of telegraphy by Hertzian or electromagnetic radiations. ...The electromagnetic radiations being reduced to an insignificant quantity, and the proper conditions of resonance maintained, the circuit acts like an immense pendulem, storing indefinitely the energy of the primary exciting impulses and impressions..." High self induction and low resistance are what we now call a "high Q" circuit. The voltage rise in a Tesla coil is due to the Q ratios, not the turns ratios as in other transformers. Electromagnetic radiations being reduced to insignificant quantities can only imply destructive interferance. How is resonance maintained if the electromagnetic energy is destructively reduced to insignificant quantities? In a scalar translator, the secondary system will have no electromagnetic energy, but will still "load" or draw power from the electromagnetic input or "primary" circuit. In my opinion, there can be no mistake, Tesla was indeed refering to what we now know as scalar technology in this paragraph. The magnifying transmitter was in fact a scalar device. This sheds now light on Tesla's "extra" coils. Re-read the old Tesla works after reading this key brings new levels of meaning to his works. There's a lot said in this paragraph if you understand basic electromagnetic theory well. -> Posted by: "Robert A. Shannon" If the Magnifying Transmitter was intended to transmit power without wires by electromagnetic waves, as is most often assumed, why would he work to "reduce electromagnetic radiations to an insignificant quantity"? Tesla had something else in mind with this device. The odd representation of a capacitor in place of a "dynamo" is not consistant with his other drawings. Tesla was well know for having "hidden agenda's" which put him at odds with his backers, eventually ending his career. Very few have tracked back through Tesla'a surviving notes, and fewer still have done so after gaining an solid working understanding of scalar enginering. As is often true, there's more than meets the eye. Tesla was a quite brillient inventor, but was also a totaly paranoid loon, suffering from a series of phobias. When looking back at his work, we must keep this in mind. It's too easy to say that the Magnifying Transmitter was a simple case of power transmission by electromagnetic induction, while nothing could be further from the truth. A bit of objective research will show Tesla's grasp of business was far below his grasp of technology. Business was not his interest, as it was Edisons. Had Tesla had some real business acumen, Marconi would not be know today as the father of radio. Tesla had "bigger ideals" than simple commercialisim. These misconceptions are the only barrier to understanding the Magnifying Transmitter. We must approach this device with an open mind to understand it's actual intent and function. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 23:22:47 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA14108 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:15:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA13983 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:15:25 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511271815.KAA13983@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:54:14 -0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >He mentions the word 'business' twice in a single sentence. I think >that this shows a marketing/business bias. I bet he's the one. > >I'm going to send him the following: > >Hi Dennis, > > I am one of your principal investors (Conserve Financial Services, >1991-92). Where does our low-termperature phase change technology >stand today? What is the current marketing plan, if any? What of my >investment? > > > > > > >What do you think? I wait to hear from you before I send it. > >Lee > > No, no, no, no. Don't just assume you are right. It's better to first ask if he is the same one, because if he isn't you'll just look foolish. Would be interesting to see what he says if you just ask. I'm sure if he is not, that he has heard of him, and will consider the question a natural one. Gary --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 28 00:22:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id AAA09281 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:22:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA09250 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 00:22:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511280822.AAA09250@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 01:48:16 +0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: fnrg: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >... Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter" was NOT >intended to transmit electromagnetic power over distances. >"... essentially, a circuit of very high self induction and small resistance >which in it's arrangement, mode of excitation and action, may be said to be >the diametrical opposite of a transmitting circuit typical of telegraphy by >Hertzian or electromagnetic radiations. ...The electromagnetic radiations >being reduced to an insignificant quantity, ..." >How is resonance maintained if the electromagnetic energy is destructively >reduced to insignificant quantities? Top dome coated with an insulator? Who said 'destructively'? >If the Magnifying Transmitter was intended to transmit power without wires >by electromagnetic waves, as is most often assumed, why would he work to >"reduce electromagnetic radiations to an insignificant quantity"? Terms have gone through changes since then. You might find that there are many people who consider what he said here as meaning 'electrical discharge', i.e. the streamers usually coming from the terminal on top, which would have been a loss of energy. To state that he did not intend to transmit electromagnetic power over distances is, in my view, quite a stretch, but of course you are saying that what he intended to transmit was scalar energy instead, in which case, I would ask that we start at square one -- how does a Tesla Coil produce scalar waves? Couldn't it simply have been a reference to delivering the energy to the ground instead of the air? Telegraphy would have meant 'radio'-wave type transmission through the air, no? [My further head-scratching about scalar waves deleted.] Gary --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Mon Nov 27 18:34:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id SAA19199 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:33:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix9.ix.netcom.com (ix9.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.9]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA19172 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:32:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id SAA27190; Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:31:31 -0800 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:31:31 -0800 Message-Id: <199511280231.SAA27190@ix9.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Resonance To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >Thank you for your reply. I have a few more questions, if I may. > >Can a common microwave at 2.45 GHz be focused similar to a laser. Is >the microwave in phase and coherent similar to a maser. If incoherent >and out of phase can it be put into phase and cohered? Can it be used >as a carrier wave and modulated. pulsed? > >Gad! Seems as if I need your course. > >Thanks, > >RWW > >If you may wish to reply by Email > >rwall@ix.netcom.com > Hello! JUst a few quick answers: 1. The wavelength of the `cooking frequency' is about 12 cm, so to focus it, you need an antenna several wavewlength large (i.e. a microwave dish), so inside the oven this is not possible. Anyway cooking is done by multiple re-reflections of the oven wall passing through the food-item many times.. 2. Coherency: Being a single frequency, you'd think the microwave signal is coherent, but if the power supply is only roughly smoothed (regarding the AC component of the mains), the magnetron sniffs out and restarts 120 times a second (in the US with a 60 Hz mains freq.), so the magnetron IS pulsed in that sense, so the signal is not phase coherent. 3. In principle, you could pulse modulate the magnetron (a la radar) and send messages, but please don't tinker with your oven, they can be potentially lethal (1 kW is a sizeable microwave energy...) Cheers, Peter ------------- Dr Peter I Somlo FIEEE | M1: "Every coin has 3 sides - at least" Microwave Consultant | M2: "The wind ain't gonna blow from where it tel/fax: 61-2-451-2478 | ought'a, it'l blow from where it can" http://www.zeta.org.au/~somlo From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 28 04:32:17 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id EAA28032 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:32:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (bilb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id EAA28007 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:32:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id EAA06865; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:32:03 -0800 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 04:32:02 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: vtx: Electron clusters In-Reply-To: <199511271912.LAA09225@ix7.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 27 Nov 1995, dennis lee wrote: > Some one has sent me a letter about patent infringement. I'm going to have to sort this > out before I can continue this thread. ...meaning that you've been selling the device? .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 28 05:04:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id FAA03821 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:04:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id FAA03814 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:04:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id FAA09525; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:04:06 -0800 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 05:04:06 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Gray motor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: old message, forwarded to the list. .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 08 Oct 95 00:18:41 -700 From: 7nz8znda roamer To: billb@eskimo.com Subject: Gravity generating capacitive device (electric rocket) Hi there! I was just wondering if you might know of anyone who has built one of these devices and would be willing to demonstrate it on video. Better yet, a live demo! I'd hate to take the time and $$ to manufacture one of these things just to discover that it really doesn't work. I'm also interested in the possible o/u effects in capacitive discharge through electromagnets or solenoids. Apparently, a company in Indiana is selling F/E engine kits that are based in principle on the Edwin Gray motor design. Their address is : Creative Science and Research P.O. box 8001 New Albany, IN 47150 They have kits available for three sizes of motor, 5hp, 20hp, and 100hp. I ordered one set of plans from them which is part gravity activated and part HV (ala Gray patent). I wish someone would check these people out besides just myself. It seems that anyone genuinely interested in F/E would be at least curious about a commercial organization that allegedly sells true F/E engine kits and plans. Later... From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 01:07:26 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA19498 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:41:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from magicnet.magicnet.net (magicnet.magicnet.net [204.96.116.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA19443 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:41:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by magicnet.magicnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id NAA29345 for magicnet.magicnet.net!eskimo.com!freenrg-list; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:21:46 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by irout.advantor.com id AA817593547 Tue, 28 Nov 95 13:19:07 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 95 13:19:07 From: "reim" Encoding: 759 Text Message-Id: <9510288175.AA817593547@irout.advantor.com> To: eskimo.com!freenrg-list@magicnet.magicnet.net Subject: fnrg: T.T. Brown Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I just wanted anyone who may have been sending messages to me over the past week on TT Brown that I am back on line. I was on vacation and unsubscribed from this group for the past week. One good thing came from my vacation is that I was able to pick up a used X-Ray power supply. It's suppose to put out 125 KV but unfortunately the manufacture is out of business and I have no specification on it. I will post the manufacture model number here tomorrow to see if anyone may know anything about it. As for my Barium Titinate Caps I am still waiting to see if this next batch will hold together during the drying process before its gets fired. bob reim reim@advantor.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 01:21:49 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA21004 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:45:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddi.digital.net (ddi.digital.net [198.69.104.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA20931 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 10:45:35 -0800 (PST) From: sphere@ddi.digital.net Received: from sphere (pm2_17.digital.net [198.69.104.117]) by ddi.digital.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA04292 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:42:24 -0500 Message-Id: <199511281842.NAA04292@ddi.digital.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:43:31 +0000 Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc X-Confirm-Reading-To: sphere@ddi.digital.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 11:54:14 -0800 > To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com > From: Gary Hawkins > Subject: Re: fnrg: I will design some things pertaining to the disc > Reply-to: freenrg-list@eskimo.com > > > > >He mentions the word 'business' twice in a single sentence. I think > >that this shows a marketing/business bias. I bet he's the one. > > > >I'm going to send him the following: > > > >Hi Dennis, > > > > I am one of your principal investors (Conserve Financial Services, > >1991-92). Where does our low-termperature phase change technology > >stand today? What is the current marketing plan, if any? What of my > >investment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > >What do you think? I wait to hear from you before I send it. > > > >Lee > > > > > > No, no, no, no. Don't just assume you are right. It's better to first > ask if he is the same one, because if he isn't you'll just look foolish. > Would be interesting to see what he says if you just ask. I'm sure if > he is not, that he has heard of him, and will consider the question a > natural one. > Please excuse the indiscretion. Lee > Gary > --------------------------------------------------- > Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today > http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA > > From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Tue Nov 28 07:14:24 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA05313 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:14:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA05274 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 07:13:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA11493; Tue, 28 Nov 95 10:03:13 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Tue, 28 Nov 95 10:13:35 -0500 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 95 9:00:38 EST Message-Id: <4F06+4MlikA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On the subject of Tesla's magnifying transmitter, I wrote: "How is resonance maintained if the electromagnetic energy is destructively reduced to insignificant quantities?" Gary Hawkins replied: "Top dome coated with an insulator? Who said 'destructively'?" Simply coating the top dome will not reduce the electromagnetic radiations to an "insignificant quantity" as Tesla wrote. It would not do in a simple electrostatic case, and most definately does not in a radio frequancy system such as is discussed. As to who said destructivly, look into the material, and refer back to Tesla's earlier works on the subject. While terms have indeed changed, Tesla's use of the terms "electromagnetic radiations" in this case is in line with the current useage if these terms. Remember that Tesla went on to say that this was the "dimetrical opposite" of Hertzian waves. This is quite specific and clear, no differances in accepted usage of terminology addresses his true meaning. Gary also wrote: "You might find that there are many people who consider what he said here as meaning 'electrical discharge', i.e. the streamers usually coming from the terminal on top, which would have been a loss of energy." Some may well beleive that, but there is no referance to insulating the dome in the material. Quite the opposite is true in fact. A loss of EM energy from the device would imply power transmission by EM waves, how would insulating the dome enhance this? Clearly this makes no sense. "To state that he did not intend to transmit electromagnetic power over distances is, in my view, quite a stretch..." Tesla stated this himself. I refer again to that same quote. Dimetrical opposite to telegraphy by Hertzian radiations most strongly implies what we now know as "scalar waves". If he was refering to something else, we know not what he was refering to. Clearly scalar techology fits this description very well. "I would ask that we start at square one -- how does a Tesla Coil produce scalar waves?" An excellent question, but I must point out that Tesla's magnifying transmitter is not a simple Tesla coil. A simple Tesla coil may produce scalar waves through several different translation methods of differing efficiencies. First, in a slightly off resonance condition, the currents induced in the secondary circuit will oppose the primary EM field, and there by produce a scalar result by direct field interferance. Secondly, the corona on the capacitance hat (dome) reaches a high electrostatic charge, with the radio frequancy electormagnetic energy oscillating that electrostatic charge. The EM component modulates the electrostatic field, providing a second translation mechanisim. Tesla spent great effort in tuning the capacitance of this corona into the magnifying transmitter design, as is clearly documented in the Colorado Springs notebooks. A single shorted turn, or metal anti-corona ring (the cap at the top of the secondary, inside the extra coil) will generate a high current by induction that is out of phase to the apppied EM field from the secondary. This will also produce a scalar product by destructive field interferance. The original remaining materials on the magnifying transmitter lack details in several important areas, it is less than clear just what phasing is used between the secondary and extra coils. Referances are made this this phasing in the Colorado Springs notes, showing that Tesla did experiment with sum-zero high ration transformation, a very efficient method of scalar translation. Most importantly, we know nothing of the waveforms used to excite the primary circuit, or the exact tuning of the secondary and extra coils. Practical work in this area appears to show that this is likley to be the most important area of interest, as out of phase components of the EM fields do interfear and produce a scalar component in the electromagnetic output. A spark gap excited Tesla coil is quite rich in harmonics, simple single frequancy excitation does not produce the range of effects that the more complex primary currents exhibit. "Couldn't it simply have been a reference to delivering the energy to the ground instead of the air? Telegraphy would have meant 'radio'-wave type transmission through the air, no?" No, "diametrical opposite" to transmission by "Hertzian" wave transmission, this is quite clear and explicit. If tramsmission via ground currents were the issue, why would we have the elevated terminal, a direct result from the earlier work done in Colorado Springs. This produces a charge relitive to the ground, not witnin the ground. Clearly the magnifying transmitter (originally developed at Colorado Springs) is not designed to produce telluric currents. I'm no expert in Tesla history,and I am not a Tesla "fan", but I do have some experiance in applied electromagnetic and scalar engineering. My research in this area has lead to a deeper understanding of Tesla's original works. Many theories have gone back and forth, debating the idea that Tesla had developed scalar technology of some form. In my opinion, there can no longer be any doubt on this subject, Tesla put his cards on the table in the paragraph I quoted. Read this paragraph in it's proper context, and it is explicit just what he is refering to. All the clues are present, and at no point do you have to make any assumptions to reach this conclusion. Imperical evidence, and the easily available documentation shows that the magnifying transmitter is not what is commonly thought to be. Pay close attention to the change in direction from the earlier work on the magnifying transmitter at Colorado Springs as compared to the description in this paragrah. We can now get an idea of just when (chronologicaly) he developed this technology. Many current researchers have looked into "scalar technology", and most who missed the mark did so for the same reason, they looked too hard, and made things far too complex. This may be due in part to T.E. Beardens approach in presenting some of the basic theory in the terminology of modern physics. It does not need to be that complex in practice, we must keep in mind that electromagnetic engineering is only a special case of scalar engineering, they are in fact quite inseperable. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 01:22:31 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id PAA04690 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:23:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns.bbtt.com (ns.bbtt.com [194.77.35.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA04525 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:23:16 -0800 (PST) From: harti@bbtt.com Received: from localhost (harti.bbtt.com [194.77.35.75]) by ns.bbtt.com (8.6.9/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA09288 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:21:30 +0100 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 00:21:30 +0100 Message-Id: <199511282321.AAA09288@ns.bbtt.com> X-Sender: harti@bbtt.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Success! Violation of Second Law ! Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi, today I was at a meeting of the Berlin, Germany based Workshop for Decentral energy research lab. Their head physician Berhard Schaeffer now finally has found the solution to build a machine that prooves, that the second "law" of thermodynamics is not a law at all, but can be overcome with his special Retrogade Condensation experiment ! Mr. Schaeffer has build a measurement apparatus, that contains a gas mixture= of 90 % CO2 (carbondioxide) and 10 % N2 (Nitrogen).=20 This gas mixture is at a pressure between 55 to 85 bar and if you measure= the=20 pressure versus volume diagramm at 26 to 29 degrees Celsius you can see, that there is a positive circular process, which can convert just heat to mechanical energy on a 100 % conversion process ! This is a heat engine that just needs a hot pole but no cold pole. Heat is converted directly=20 to mechanical energy. Carnot equation is dead ! By using this retrogrdae condensation process it is now possible to build enignes, that just cool down their environment and run on their own energy, like ships that cool down the seewater to propel themself ! Or think about a refrigerator that does not need any electrical power to run, but just generates electrical energy and cools down the food inside it ! Now, after this success in the prototype measurement unit, we need support to build the final prototype engine to show the effect to the world and to the many sceptic people, who say, this can=B4t be done. We need your help. Please try to contact us and let us know, how you could help to make this engine come true. As we don=B4t get any funding from the normal research funds we need urgently funding from independant supporters and we need other universities to verify the results. Mr. Schaeffer has put about 30 years of his life into this thermodynamic research and has spent all his money on this invention, so please try to help us to make it come true. Please call directly Mr. Bernhard Schaeffer at: ++49 30 802 23 02 (voice) or ++49 30 821 62 88 (fax) That=B4s in Berlin, Germany. Or you can send an email to his son Kai Schaeffer at: schaeffer@krypta.snafu.de In January, I will have my new Free Energy WEB server online and then I will have a full description of all this technolgy and his measurement results online. Stay tuned for more ! regards, Stefan. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 01:07:27 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id QAA07305 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:50:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from tornado.netspace.net.au (root@netspace.net.au [203.10.110.110]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA03232 for ; Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:39:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-a1-41.mel.netspace.net.au (dialup-a1-41.mel.netspace.net.au [203.12.52.41]) by tornado.netspace.net.au (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id LAA20556 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:33:59 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199511290033.LAA20556@tornado.netspace.net.au> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Robin van Spaandonk" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:36:59 +0900 Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.0-WB3) Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On 28 Nov 95 at 9:00, Robert A. Shannon wrote: > Secondly, the corona on the capacitance hat (dome) reaches a high > electrostatic charge, with the radio frequancy electormagnetic energy > oscillating that electrostatic charge. The EM component modulates the > electrostatic field, providing a second translation mechanisim. Tesla I know that a capacitor transfers the energy of an alternating current from one plate to the other by the effect of a charge on one plate on the induced charge on the other plate. But is the actual energy transfer between the plates done electromagnetically by photons, or is this the equivalent of energy transfer by a scalar field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a scalar field something else again? Robin van Spaandonk Man is the creature that comes into this world knowing everything, Learns all his life, And leaves knowing nothing. Robin Feb. 1995 From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 01:45:23 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA28440 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:30:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from 204.122.16.4 (ghawk@tia1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.40]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA28348 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:30:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199511291930.LAA28348@mail.eskimo.com> X-Sender: ghawk@mail.eskimo.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 12:49:43 +0800 To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com From: Gary Hawkins Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a >scalar field something else again? >Robin van Spaandonk If there is anyone out there who **really** understands scalar waves/fields/energy, and isn't just fancying to themselves that they do, then they would be able to explain it in terms that almost anyone would be able to understand, with simple examples instead of obscure rhetoric. That's my opinion, the cold harsh truth about it. Gary --------------------------------------------------- Horizon Technology Tomorrow's Technology Today http://www.eskimo.com/~ghawk/ Seattle, WA From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 08:37:02 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA24043 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:36:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA24012 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:36:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA28601; Wed, 29 Nov 95 11:25:25 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Wed, 29 Nov 95 11:35:34 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 11:07:56 EST Message-Id: <4F06+QJ6jkA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Robin van Spaandonk asked: "I know that a capacitor transfers the energy of an alternating current from one plate to the other by the effect of a charge on one plate on the induced charge on the other plate. But is the actual energy transfer between the plates done electromagnetically by photons, or is this the equivalent of energy transfer by a scalar field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a scalar field something else again?" An excellent set of questions! As far as i understand, while charge is in motion, the transfer of energy is electromagnetic in nature. once the charge is equal, and current is not flowing, it is a scalar potential. Modulate this potential, and it will produce a "scalar wave". A scalar field would describe the area around an electron in the absence of any other particles near by, pure potential, but no realized field. The field only exists (is realized) by the presence of another charged particle interacting with the potential by virtual particle exchange. A scalar field is a polarization of the virtual particle flux. A scalar wave is the propogation of a polarization of the virtual particle flux, without any realized fields. Scalar fields will follow electrostatic gradients as described by T.E. Bearden. This effect has also been addressed by Dr. Flanagans works, and is described to a limited degree in the transcripts of his communications on CompuServe that are avaialbe via several Keelynet mirrors. This effect may shed some new light on the Electrostatic Gradiometer's operation in detecting "esoteric" energies. It becomes less cleat when we have a mixture of scalar and electromagnetic waves in a single situation, yet this is quite common in practice. for example, a single electron would have a scalar field, but the particle is always in motion due to the interactions with virtual particles from the quantum vaccum, so the potential is relaized to some degree. This is why the Gradiometer device includes an electromagnetic field strength meter as well as the differnetial electrometer system. In the magnifying transmitter, quite alot of charge is trapped in the capacitance hat. So in effect, there is an electrostatic bias on which the oscillations ride. Just what the major scalar translation mode was intened is unclear, only a detailed physical investigation could discover this, although some feel that a good deal of insight can be gained from Tesla's notes in the Colorado Springs notebooks. This trapped charge condition has been verified in several duplications of Tesla's works as reproduced by Bob Golka. Mr. Golka apparently does nout grasp the fundementals of scalar theory, but has done quite a lot of duplication of Tesla's larger devices. I had the opertunity to make some measurments and observations with some of these reconstructed devices, and found much higher degrees of scalar translation than had been expected to be the case. With the extral coil phased and tuned "correctly", quite interesting results were observed and documented. The scalar levels were high enough to saturate the sensitive scalar detectors used, limiting the data collected to a degree. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 14:00:51 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id IAA24797 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:38:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (billb@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA24749 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:38:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by eskimo.com (8.6.12) id IAA27649; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:37:53 -0800 Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 08:37:53 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Seattle WEIRD SCIENCE Meeting this Friday Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Meetings of Seattle's "weird science" hobby group take place the first Friday of each month, 7pm-12pm, at 22025 Redmond/Fall-city Rd. The next one is this Friday, 12/1/95 Travel: From I-5 take 520 east until it ends at a stop light. Turn right onto Redmond/Fall-City Rd. (rt. 202) Go 3.5 miles (into farmland.) We're the house on the right with the small roadside "internet classes" sign. TONIGHT: - Bill B. on lightning physics - Fun with 1/2 dead 9v batteries - Internet WEIRD SCIENCE - Misc Videotapes - have neat toys to show off? Bring 'em along! - trying to leave the meeting but winding up talking out in the driveway for several more hours... BRING STUFF TO SWAP/SELL... CLEAN OUT YOUR JUNKBOX, GET BRAND NEW JUNK! .....................uuuu / oo \ uuuu........,............................. William Beaty voice:206-781-3320 bbs:206-789-0775 cserv:71241,3623 EE/Programmer/Science exhibit designer http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/ Seattle, WA 98117 billb@eskimo.com SCIENCE HOBBYIST web page From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 01:47:22 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id LAA24250 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:19:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (root@bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA23663 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:17:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id NAA19612 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:02:35 -0600 (CST) Received: (from w9sz@localhost) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.7.1/8.7.1) id NAA05329; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:36 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 13:11:36 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199511291911.NAA05329@firefly.prairienet.org> From: w9sz@prairienet.org (Zack Widup) To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: > >On 28 Nov 95 at 9:00, Robert A. Shannon wrote: > >> Secondly, the corona on the capacitance hat (dome) reaches a high >> electrostatic charge, with the radio frequancy electormagnetic energy >> oscillating that electrostatic charge. The EM component modulates the >> electrostatic field, providing a second translation mechanisim. Tesla > >I know that a capacitor transfers the energy of an alternating >current from one plate to the other by the effect of a charge on one >plate on the induced charge on the other plate. But is the actual >energy transfer between the plates done electromagnetically by >photons, or is this the equivalent of energy transfer by a scalar >field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a >scalar field something else again? >Robin van Spaandonk There are 2 excellent papers related to this. 1) "Significance of Electromagnetic Potentials in the Quantum Theory", D. Bohm and Y. Aharonov, PHYSICAL REVIEW Second Series, vol. 115, No. 3, p. 485 2) "The Quantum Effects of Electromagnetic Fluxes", S. Olariu and I. Popescu, REVIEWS OF MODERN PHYSICS Vol. 57, No. 2, April 1985, pg. 339 (Long!) Happy Reading! Zack w9sz@prairienet.org From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 19:25:45 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id TAA06853 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:24:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA06819 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 19:24:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw35.fastlane.net (fw35.fastlane.net [204.251.17.135]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA17051 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 22:20:55 -0600 Message-Id: <199511300420.WAA17051@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:23:18 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool, Leslie Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >Robin van Spaandonk asked: > >"I know that a capacitor transfers the energy of an alternating >current from one plate to the other by the effect of a charge on one >plate on the induced charge on the other plate. But is the actual >energy transfer between the plates done electromagnetically by >photons, or is this the equivalent of energy transfer by a scalar >field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a >scalar field something else again?" > >An excellent set of questions! > >As far as i understand, while charge is in motion, the transfer of energy >is electromagnetic in nature. once the charge is equal, and current is not >flowing, it is a scalar potential. Modulate this potential, and it will >produce a "scalar wave". > >A scalar field would describe the area around an electron in the absence of >any other particles near by, pure potential, but no realized field. The >field only exists (is realized) by the presence of another charged particle >interacting with the potential by virtual particle exchange. > >A scalar field is a polarization of the virtual particle flux. A scalar >wave is the propogation of a polarization of the virtual particle flux, >without any realized fields. Scalar fields will follow electrostatic >gradients as described by T.E. Bearden. This effect has also been >addressed by Dr. Flanagans works, and is described to a limited degree in >the transcripts of his communications on CompuServe that are avaialbe via >several Keelynet mirrors. > >This effect may shed some new light on the Electrostatic Gradiometer's >operation in detecting "esoteric" energies. > >It becomes less cleat when we have a mixture of scalar and electromagnetic >waves in a single situation, yet this is quite common in practice. for >example, a single electron would have a scalar field, but the particle is >always in motion due to the interactions with virtual particles from the >quantum vaccum, so the potential is relaized to some degree. > >This is why the Gradiometer device includes an electromagnetic field >strength meter as well as the differnetial electrometer system. > >In the magnifying transmitter, quite alot of charge is trapped in the >capacitance hat. So in effect, there is an electrostatic bias on which the >oscillations ride. Just what the major scalar translation mode was intened >is unclear, only a detailed physical investigation could discover this, >although some feel that a good deal of insight can be gained from Tesla's >notes in the Colorado Springs notebooks. > >This trapped charge condition has been verified in several duplications of >Tesla's works as reproduced by Bob Golka. Mr. Golka apparently does nout >grasp the fundementals of scalar theory, but has done quite a lot of >duplication of Tesla's larger devices. I had the opertunity to make some >measurments and observations with some of these reconstructed devices, and >found much higher degrees of scalar translation than had been expected to >be the case. > >With the extral coil phased and tuned "correctly", quite interesting >results were observed and documented. The scalar levels were high enough >to saturate the sensitive scalar detectors used, limiting the data >collected to a degree. > > Bob, I have a question. Exactly what type of scalar detectors were used? I have never seen a demonstration that shows the existance of a scalar field from a mobius coil, a Hooper coil, a cadeuceus coil, a bifilar coil, or even a Tesla coil. I can demonstrate the existance of an electrostatic field, magnetic field, electromagnetic emission, photon emission, radio wave, light wave, light particle even, but never has anyone shown me proof that scalar fields, as being discussed here even exist! How do I create and MEASURE a scalar field from, say, a simple bifilar coil which produces no measurable magnetic field when connected to a battery? I've been told that the two opposing fields produced by the two coil windings cancel, but then again I've also been taught that cancellation or negation of energy is impossible, and that the energy is instead converted to a scalar potential. I want to wind a simple bifilar coil, power it up, and measure this scalar component. If it exists, it can be measured. So how is the measurement done? How about a simple workshop demo that will convince me that scalar potential is real? Bert From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Wed Nov 29 21:58:40 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id VAA27172 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:58:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from cnct.com (root@cnct.com [165.254.118.51]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA27140 for ; Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:58:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from @cnct.com (knagel@cnct.com [165.254.118.51]) by cnct.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id BAA18616 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:04:47 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 01:04:47 -0500 Message-Id: <199511300604.BAA18616@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: knagel@cnct.com (Keith Nagel) Subject: fnrg: Scalar and Vector Potentials Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Greetings : I am really suprised to hear that people still do not accept the validity of the potential field. Wait, before you flame, listen. Aharnonov and Bohm proved the existance of the magnetic !vector! potential field some 30 years ago... The detector used was a device which interferes two phase coherent electron waves. The interference pattern changes based on the presense ( or absense ) of the potential field. Later, the electric scalar potential was also demonstrated, but I suggest you read Feynmanns lectures series ( vol #2 I believe ) for relevant backround information. I remember a few years back reading an article in Physics Today ( can't seem to find it now, sorry ) by a japanese researcher who was working with a phase coherent electron microscope. He reproduced the experiment, although what really blew me away was his imaging of a single quanta of magnetic flux. But I digress. The problem is, how fast does this field propagate? The original experiments were done with interferometers which are by nature static detectors, they require a significant amount of time to accumulate enough electrons to create an image. A dynamic, preferably high frequency ( > 100 MHz ) detector would be required to resolve velocity over a reasonable experimentally achievable distance. Ray Gelinas tried this in the mid 80's, don't know how well he fared though. Anyone with a pair of SQUIDS should be able to do this... So how about someone picking up this thread? K. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 07:21:11 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA02050 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:20:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA01986 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:20:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA14692; Thu, 30 Nov 95 10:09:39 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Thu, 30 Nov 95 10:19:44 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 95 10:17:29 EST Message-Id: <4F06+7gQjkA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: neotech@world.std.com Cc: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: More construction projects? X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In response to the posting of the gradiometer plans and other posts, I have received a number of requests for additional information: "If you know of any other "neat" scalar EM stuff in the way of equipment, experiments, documents etc, etc I would surely like to learn about them." And: "I want to wind a simple bifilar coil, power it up, and measure this scalar component. If it exists, it can be measured. So how is the measurement done? How about a simple workshop demo that will convince me that scalar potential is real?" So I see that there is a good deal of intertest in more construction projects. Indeed I have a number of other designs and devices I could post, but if anyone could clear up a small question for me, it would help. I have an incomplete manuscript entitled "Practical Scalar Engineering" which is a series of construction projects that illustrate working devices that demonstrate scalar theory and effects. The manuscript is not quite complete, and I currently have higher priorities, is it possible for mt to release some of the designs in this work over the net without loosing the ability to include them in a copyrighted work at a later date? I've been told that once released into the public domain, I give away future rights on thoses designs. Many of the devices are patentable, and represent the combined efforts of several people. Is there a way I can make these devices available now, and not loose the rights to the intellectual property in doing so? If so, I will release the construction plans for a small, practical scalar detector with excellent sensitivity almost immediately. This device will produce proof of a great many different "theories" overnight. It's an excellent mind twister for hard core skeptics, it's been demonstrated to many physists, including the hard core skeptics, and has prevaild in every encounters so far. I'd go so far as to say this design will survive the most intense flames of alt.sci.physics.new-therories or alt.sci.skeptic totaly unscortched! (A bold statement to say the least?) While not the "best" detector design I know of, it is the most solid, reliable, airtight-proof design easily constructed by hobbiests. It is however a bit more envolved than the Gradiometer, but only in mechanical assembly, the electronics are a bit simpler though. Some special materials are needed, but these can be provided fairly easily at minimal cost to builders. (In the order of a few dollars) Find a good way for me to protect the rights to the designs, and I'll release this one and maybe a few others as well. I know there have been some changes in the copyright laws and proceedures, but I'm not current on this subject, and do have an obligation to protect the work of others who contributed to the unfinished manuscript. We do intend to finish the manuscript someday, and will need to recoup some fraction of the costs of it's production. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 07:27:07 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id HAA03929 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:26:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from ix9.ix.netcom.com (ix9.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.9]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id HAA03899 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:26:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from by ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id HAA27749; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:25:03 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:25:03 -0800 Message-Id: <199511301525.HAA27749@ix9.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: You wrote: > > >>field? (I.e. by electric field, with no magnetic component). Or is a >>scalar field something else again? >>Robin van Spaandonk > >If there is anyone out there who **really** understands >scalar waves/fields/energy, and isn't just fancying to themselves >that they do, then they would be able to explain it in terms that >almost anyone would be able to understand, with simple examples >instead of obscure rhetoric. > >That's my opinion, the cold harsh truth about it. > >Gary 11/30/95 I wholely concur. I have read Bearden and others and admit I remain totally confused about scalar electrodynamics. I apologise in advance to the group for such simplistic and basic questions, but: 1. Just what are scalar waves and fields? 2. What are the terms used an how are they defined? 3. Are they in all media or a special medium? Any medium? 4. How are they propagated? 5. What is the speed of propagation? 6. How do they differ from EM? Are they connected to EM or totally separate? 7. What is the mechanism by which they transfer energy? 8. Is there a simple physical or mechanical analogy? 9. Are there any simple experiments demonstrating them? 10. And the biggy ... How are they related to free energy? Thanks, RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 23:43:06 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA06334 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:15:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA06181 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:15:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA17772; Thu, 30 Nov 95 13:04:51 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Thu, 30 Nov 95 13:14:59 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 95 10:38:28 EST Message-Id: <4F06+ozQjkA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Re: Mag. Xmitter, and Obscure rhetoric. (long!) X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Gary Hawkins wrote: "If there is anyone out there who **really** understands scalar waves/fields/energy, and isn't just fancying to themselves that they do, then they would be able to explain it in terms that almost anyone would be able to understand, with simple examples instead of obscure rhetoric." If the majority of scientists have missed scalar theory for as long as has been the case, is'nt it a bit much to expect that if a person has some understanding of scalar technology that they automatically should be able to explain it to almost anyone? Is this true for any other science or technology? I understand how to fly a plane, but I cannot explain it to just anyone. Now if a person understands a bit of basic physics, I can then explain a bit of airodynamics, and then the theory of airodynamic stability and control, and eventually how to fly a plane. On the other hand, if I took that person on a flight, and handed them the controls, they will often learn all this on their own far faster and better than any explainations I could ever give. But not just any person can learn this, a good percentage ot student pilots never complete their training, or ever reach their first solo. That's just the way it is. Even highly motivated students "wash out". You have to learn to extend what you do know and synthisize the correct actions for situations you have never encountered before. This is not that easy to do. Now I could post pages and pages of theory and equations and crud, or I could teach a few people how to build this or that, but not everyone has the skills and knowlage to build electronics projects, and fewer still will grasp all the implications of the devices actions. Some will "get it", while others will not. Again, that's just the way it is. In my opinion, the cold harsh truth of the matter is, anyone who beleives that just anyone can grasp "abstract theories" is fancying to themselves that anything true must be easily understood by almost anyone. Were that true, the world would be a quite different place than it is today. More people would understand conventional electromagnetics than do today for a start. When I have to teach someone something about flying, I take them up in my plane. To show people something about scalar technology, we have to have them build and experiment, but for them to grasp the subject, they must synthisize in their own minds what is happening based on their observations and results, and be able to extend that to cover new situations. Not just anyone can do this, and very few people are willing to try. Build the projects, conduct the experiments, and synthisize you own understanding, then try to explain that others. See how easy or difficult that is to do. Real understanding is not easy to come by in any field, including conventional electromagnetics and scalar theory. A really good teacher is a rare and special person. People who **really** unserstand a subject are often not good teachers, yet they still understand their subject. It's unreasonable to expect that almost anyone could grasp quantum mechanics, why should scalar theory be somehow different? Another posted agreed with Gary, Richard Wayne Hall apologises for asking ten basci question on scalar theory. I see no reason to apologise for asking at all, quite the opposite in fact. I'll take a crack at these questions: "What are scalar fields and waves?" Scalars descrive situations where two or more forces oppose each other, and apparently cancel themselves out, violating the old idea that energy cannot be created or destroyed. "What are the terms and how are they defined?" Sadly, there is no one set of terms or definitions in use. Current electromagnetic theory has flaws in it's basic definitions of terms, so we must use the existing terms from electromagnetic theory very carefully, and question the accepted defintions where experimetnal evidence shows weak spots in current understandings. "Are they in all media or a special medium?" It appears that scalars can be constructed from electromagnetic waves, mechanical forces, and perhaps several other forms. The nature of teh original waves specifies the medium, except for electromagnetic waves, where current theory holds there is no medium, but this is debated to a degree still. "How are they propogated?" Again this is a function of the meduim. Scalars appear to have several modes of propogation not yet well understood. "What is the speed of propogation?" For scalar waves generated by electromagnetic destructive interferance, the speed of propogation is controlled by the degree fo cancellation. A pure scalar signal can indeed travel in excess of the speed of light. "How do they differ from EM? Are they connected to EM or totaly seperate?" They differ from EM waves in that EM waves are in fact a pair of scalars. EM theory is a special case of scalar theory as Bearden has stated. They are interchangable as shown in E.T. Whittakers papers cited by Bearden. "What is the mechanisim by which they transfer energy" Trick question, what definition of energy are you using? I'll address this question by refering to the answer above, EM waves are a special case of scalar theory. Scalars are exchanged between systems, there is absorption for every emission, the standard concepts of transmission and reception are not easily seperated. "Is there a simple physical or mechanical analogy?" Yes, but only to a limited degree. Imagine that we are each holding one end of a rope under light tension. If I move my end up and down quickly, a wave will ptopogate down that line towards you. Lets cal this an electromagnetic wave propogating at c. Now, instead of moving my und verticaly, i pull sharply on it. You now feel a tug nearly as soon as I yank on the line. This is a scalar, it's tension on the meduim itself, it propogates, but is not a normal "wave" at all. This model explains the meains fo tranverse and longitudinal waves well enough. "Are there any simple experimetns demonstrating them?" Yes, but "simple" is a relitive term. There are practical experiments which demonstrate them, as well as published work from main-stream physists that prove some of these effects, suhc as the Aharnov-Bohm effect as an example. "And the biggy...How are thay related to free energy?" That's a bit envolved, but I will go so far as to again point out that current physics has issues in it's definitions and terminology, especially the lack of a true definiton of energy. The old trueisim that energy is the ability to do work is not suffieient. What keeps electrons circling their nucli? The ability to do work? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 23:41:48 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id KAA17956 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:45:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from nectech.com (root@milkyway.nectech.com [128.191.16.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA17809 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:45:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs010.NECTECH.COM by nectech.com with SMTP (5.65/29-nectech) id AA18310; Thu, 30 Nov 95 13:34:41 -0500 Received: by cs010.NECTECH.COM; Thu, 30 Nov 95 13:45:04 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 95 13:23:54 EST Message-Id: <4F06+uOTjkA@cs010.NECTECH.COM> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) From: "Robert A. Shannon" To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Subject: fnrg: Patents and copyrights. X-Incognito-Sn: 320 X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=2.00 ENCRYPTED=NO Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A Several people agreed that a good laywer would need to be contacted on the release of information and intellectual property rights. Quite some time ago, I did pose this question, and after detailing the nature of the material and it's applications, I was advised that it would be "quite unwise" to release the material. Electronic publishing being a grey area, I am forced to either release nothing, or assume that anything I do release is no longer my (or our) intellectual property. Ther are still designs which are my sole intellectual property that I could choose to forfit, but apparently I could no longer put thoses into a copyrighted work, as they were already in the public domain. Catch 22. Give it out now, and drop it from the manuscript. Each device builds on the earlier devices, so ths would destroy the flow of the work totaly. Unacceptable! I'll have to give this some detailed though, and consult with others on this end before I make any choice on the matter. A patent itself offers no useful protection, as I am not envolved in commercial applications of the devices in question, and could not afford enforcment of the patents anyway if I were. A copyright would do a bit better in this situation, that was the most helpful suggestion I could buy on this subject. I'm being oppressed by archaic rules, and made into the suppressor of the technology, or forfit my the intellectual property rights to the work.! No acceptable option presents itself that I can see. There must be some alternitive available. Partial release of copyrighted material can destroy the copyright protection, as it becomes your responsbility to prove that any boundries between what was and was not released were known to the other party, and this is expensive. I'd loose this in court, so there would be no protection what so ever. I'd probably do better to keep the material circulating "underground". Any other options? From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 12:09:32 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) id MAA19536 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:06:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.1/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA19363 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 12:06:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id PAA18595 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:03:03 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199511302003.PAA18595@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: Re: fnrg: Re: Magnifying Transmitter. To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:03:00 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199511301525.HAA27749@ix9.ix.netcom.com> from "Richard Wayne Wall" at Nov 30, 95 07:25:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Tell me too! Andrew -- ((( ((( (O,O) (O,O) (-) (-) ----oOOo-----oOOo---oOOo---oOOo--- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 13:20:43 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA19769 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:20:06 -0800 Received: from fastlane.net (fastlane.net [204.251.16.10]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA19680 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:19:50 -0800 Received: from dal56.fastlane.net (dal56.fastlane.net [204.251.16.156]) by fastlane.net (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA21192 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:16:05 -0600 Message-Id: <199511302216.QAA21192@fastlane.net> X-Sender: nikki@mail.fastlane.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:16:39 -0500 To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: nikki@fastlane.net (Bert Pool) Subject: Re: fnrg: More construction projects? X-Mailer: Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >In response to the posting of the gradiometer plans and other posts, I have >received a number of requests for additional information: > >"If you know of any other "neat" scalar EM stuff in the way of equipment, >experiments, documents etc, etc I would surely like to learn about them." > >And: > >"I want to wind a simple bifilar coil, power it up, and measure this scalar >component. If it exists, it can be measured. So how is the measurement >done? How about a simple workshop demo that will convince me that scalar >potential is real?" > >So I see that there is a good deal of intertest in more construction >projects. > >Indeed I have a number of other designs and devices I could post, but if >anyone could clear up a small question for me, it would help. > >I have an incomplete manuscript entitled "Practical Scalar Engineering" >which is a series of construction projects that illustrate working devices >that demonstrate scalar theory and effects. > >The manuscript is not quite complete, and I currently have higher >priorities, is it possible for mt to release some of the designs in this >work over the net without loosing the ability to include them in a >copyrighted work at a later date? > >I've been told that once released into the public domain, I give away >future rights on thoses designs. Many of the devices are patentable, and >represent the combined efforts of several people. > >Is there a way I can make these devices available now, and not loose the >rights to the intellectual property in doing so? > >If so, I will release the construction plans for a small, practical scalar >detector with excellent sensitivity almost immediately. This device will >produce proof of a great many different "theories" overnight. It's an >excellent mind twister for hard core skeptics, it's been demonstrated to >many physists, including the hard core skeptics, and has prevaild in every >encounters so far. > >I'd go so far as to say this design will survive the most intense flames of >alt.sci.physics.new-therories or alt.sci.skeptic totaly unscortched! > >(A bold statement to say the least?) > >While not the "best" detector design I know of, it is the most solid, >reliable, airtight-proof design easily constructed by hobbiests. It is >however a bit more envolved than the Gradiometer, but only in mechanical >assembly, the electronics are a bit simpler though. Some special materials >are needed, but these can be provided fairly easily at minimal cost to >builders. (In the order of a few dollars) > >Find a good way for me to protect the rights to the designs, and I'll >release this one and maybe a few others as well. I know there have been >some changes in the copyright laws and proceedures, but I'm not current on >this subject, and do have an obligation to protect the work of others who >contributed to the unfinished manuscript. > >We do intend to finish the manuscript someday, and will need to recoup some >fraction of the costs of it's production. Well, Bob, I'm a techno-nut, not an attorney (there ARE some things I won't stoop to!). Question: So what is preventing you from going ahead and deciding this "scalar 101" manuscript could be considered to be finished right now? Maybe it's kind of like trying to write the definitive book on aircraft: there's always one more plane on the drawing boards than could be added if you wait long enough? You can always write a follow-up book... Stephen King didn't put all of his books into one manuscript! Looking at it from another angle, did you know the Egyptians had dry cell batteries over 2,000 years ago, and used them to electroplate jewelry? (Popular Electronics, July 1965) Kind of makes one wonder whatever happened to that electrical and electrochemical knowledge, and why it disappeared for over 200 centuries? My guess is it was written down in a papyrus manuscript that somehow never got published, or is still awaiting patent approval tongue deep in cheek). If this stuff works, and is useable, I doubt if the powers-that-be would allow a public patent to be issued anyway. If you doubt that statement, chat with Phillip Zimmerman, author of "PGP" data encryption software. He'll give you a good view on how close-fisted our government is on technology that gives individuals any kind of parity. I'm not a conspiracist, that's just the way government is. But it's your manuscript, your device(s). You'll have to decide what you'll do. But I do so want to see magic! Bert From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Dec 1 00:43:42 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA04143 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:09:37 -0800 Received: from arl-img-5.compuserve.com (arl-img-5.compuserve.com [198.4.7.5]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA03966 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:09:06 -0800 Received: by arl-img-5.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id RAA13341; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:32:50 -0500 Date: 30 Nov 95 17:26:53 EST From: Rick Monteverde <76216.2421@compuserve.com> To: Subject: fnrg: Hello Message-ID: <951130222652_76216.2421_HHB74-1@CompuServe.COM> Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hello everyone, I just joined up here and wanted to introduce myself. My name's Rick Monteverde, and I live in Honolulu, HI. My interest is in hombuilt gadgets that exhibit extraordinary properties like scalar effects, anomolous inertia or mass changes, OU, etc. My current project underway is a high-voltage generator to be used for experiments to try to see the Biefeld-Brown effect. It's one of those transistor driven flyback transformer rigs with a 12 stage Walton-Cockcroft (diode/capacitor) multiplier. It's in the final assembly and potting stage now, and I've gotten some sparks over 1" with only a wire stub output. Has anyone on the list here done or is anyone contemplating doing BB experiments? I'm looking for ideas on flat-plate caps in both a single large plate pair type, or a more compact laminated type. I'm also looking for a supplier of metal foil _other_ than aluminum, like tin or copper which can be soldered, in experimenter's small quantities or rolls. In the alternative, has anyone had any success soldering to or conductively gluing wire leads to aluminum foil in a nice non-lossy connection? I'm looking forward to participating here. My usual hangout is Compuserve in the Encounters forum. Thanks and aloha, - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI 76216.2421@compuserve.com From majordomo-owner@mail.eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 15:55:12 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA22297; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:55:04 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:55:04 -0800 Message-Id: <199511302355.PAA22297@mail.eskimo.com> To: freenrg-list-approval@eskimo.com From: majordomo@mail.eskimo.com Subject: APPROVE freenrg-list Reply-To: majordomo@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: -- emilio@carajas.homeshopping.com.br (Emilio T. da Silva Jr.) requests that you approve the following: subscribe freenrg-list emilio@br.homeshopping.com.br If you approve, please send a message such as the following back to majordomo@mail.eskimo.com (with the appropriate PASSWORD filled in, of course): approve PASSWORD subscribe freenrg-list emilio@br.homeshopping.com.br If you disapprove, do nothing. Thanks! majordomo@mail.eskimo.com From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 17:58:10 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA10744 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:57:17 -0800 Received: from ix8.ix.netcom.com (ix8.ix.netcom.com [199.182.120.8]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA10502 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:56:42 -0800 Received: from by ix8.ix.netcom.com (8.6.12/SMI-4.1/Netcom) id RAA13286; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:55:20 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 17:55:20 -0800 Message-Id: <199512010155.RAA13286@ix8.ix.netcom.com> From: rwall@ix.netcom.com (Richard Wayne Wall ) Subject: fnrg: EM waves To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A 11/30/95 In EM transverse transmission both the electric & magnetic wave are _in phase_, so there are points where both vanish together. But in this case, where is the energy stored for the wave to keep propagating? Could it appear in a hyperspatial demension OR perhaps transiently become longitudnal scalar transmission? RWW From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Dec 1 00:50:16 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA17779 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:38:33 -0800 Received: from cnct.com (root@cnct.com [165.254.118.51]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA17572 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:38:00 -0800 Received: from @cnct.com (knagel@cnct.com [165.254.118.51]) by cnct.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA10422 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:54:33 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:54:33 -0500 Message-Id: <199512010154.UAA10422@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: knagel@cnct.com (Keith Nagel) Subject: fnrg: More on Phi and A fields Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Here's the rub though : By definition, a time changing A or phi field gives rise to an associated vector magnetic or electric field. These fields ( at least you will agree, the transverse oscillation ) are limited by speed C. So it is unlikely that anything out of the ordinary will be noticed by making a time delay measurement with dynamic scalar detectors. This opinion is expressed well in the formulation of the Lorentz gauge for electrodynamics. Static field conditions are best described by the Coulomb gauge, which assumes zero propagation delay. Again, nothing exotic here, once the field is established it is not suprising that all points feel the effect of the field. An important point to bear in mind is that these fields affect the phase of the electron wave. They do not cause force to be exerted on electrons. That occurs due to the E and B ( ordinary vector electric and magnetic ) fields. I am wary of so called "scalar" field detectors which seem only to sense the ordinary E & B fields in some manner. There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding all of these fields, perhaps due to the woefully inadequate job Mr. Tom Beardon has done in popularizing them. People always seem to connect this person to the concept, which makes it difficult to discuss amongst the more, shall we say, level headed? Be that as it may, I encourage you all out there in virtualville to discuss this further. Additionally, it is my fondest wish that if a researcher wants to discuss some other sort of new field or wave phenomena, that the words scalar not be applied to hastily. A large body of work exists regarding the A and Phi fields, why confuse matters by lumping some new thing under this name? To the gentleman who posted regarding his manuscript on scalar fields; excellent, please share with us some small portion. By releasing it into the public domain, you will have established a date of priority for your patent applications. Also, you have up to a year I believe to begin the patent process. Best consult your lawyer, but I don't think the laws have changed that drastically. Best Wishes, K. From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Fri Dec 1 00:56:15 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA19468 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:07:20 -0800 Received: from fun.direct.ca (root@fun.direct.ca [199.60.229.1]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA19372 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:06:57 -0800 Received: from Klaus (van-pm-1518.direct.ca [204.174.244.198]) by fun.direct.ca (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA14916 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:59:39 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:59:39 -0800 Message-Id: <199512010459.UAA14916@fun.direct.ca> X-Authentication-Warning: fun.direct.ca: Host van-pm-1518.direct.ca claimed to be Klaus X-Sender: kbreslau@direct.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com From: Klaus Breslauer Subject: Re: fnrg: More construction projects? Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: At 10:17 AM 11/30/95 EST, you wrote: >In response to the posting of the gradiometer plans and other posts, I have >received a number of requests for additional information: > >"If you know of any other "neat" scalar EM stuff in the way of equipment, >experiments, documents etc, etc I would surely like to learn about them." > >And: > >"I want to wind a simple bifilar coil, power it up, and measure this scalar >component. If it exists, it can be measured. So how is the measurement >done? How about a simple workshop demo that will convince me that scalar >potential is real?" > >So I see that there is a good deal of intertest in more construction >projects. > >Indeed I have a number of other designs and devices I could post, but if >anyone could clear up a small question for me, it would help. > >I have an incomplete manuscript entitled "Practical Scalar Engineering" >which is a series of construction projects that illustrate working devices >that demonstrate scalar theory and effects. > >The manuscript is not quite complete, and I currently have higher >priorities, is it possible for mt to release some of the designs in this >work over the net without loosing the ability to include them in a >copyrighted work at a later date? > >I've been told that once released into the public domain, I give away >future rights on thoses designs. Many of the devices are patentable, and >represent the combined efforts of several people. > >Is there a way I can make these devices available now, and not loose the >rights to the intellectual property in doing so? > >If so, I will release the construction plans for a small, practical scalar >detector with excellent sensitivity almost immediately. This device will >produce proof of a great many different "theories" overnight. It's an >excellent mind twister for hard core skeptics, it's been demonstrated to >many physists, including the hard core skeptics, and has prevaild in every >encounters so far. > >I'd go so far as to say this design will survive the most intense flames of >alt.sci.physics.new-therories or alt.sci.skeptic totaly unscortched! > >(A bold statement to say the least?) > >While not the "best" detector design I know of, it is the most solid, >reliable, airtight-proof design easily constructed by hobbiests. It is >however a bit more envolved than the Gradiometer, but only in mechanical >assembly, the electronics are a bit simpler though. Some special materials >are needed, but these can be provided fairly easily at minimal cost to >builders. (In the order of a few dollars) > >Find a good way for me to protect the rights to the designs, and I'll >release this one and maybe a few others as well. I know there have been >some changes in the copyright laws and proceedures, but I'm not current on >this subject, and do have an obligation to protect the work of others who >contributed to the unfinished manuscript. > >We do intend to finish the manuscript someday, and will need to recoup some >fraction of the costs of it's production. > I am from Canada, nor am I a Lawyer, and am unsure of American Law, but it seems to me that you could e-publish your plans that are coded with an encryption key, along with a text file explaining that this file is: for independent verification purposes only, that a confidentiality agreement is automatically in force once the file is decrypted, and that unauthorized distribution is not permissible, and that a payment of $10,000 is agreed to for any breach of this contract. Any resulting patent, copyright or commercialization rights belong to so and so.. That this agreement is under the laws of the state of ..., and that if any clause is declared invalid the remainder of the clauses and the spirit of the invalid clause be maintained with full force. and that the decryption key is something of the effect that "I acknowledge, without reservation or recourse, that the information contained within the file scalarblueprint.txt, dated 95/11/29 12:00 is the intellectual property of so and so, and my use of said information is limited under an lectronically executed confidentiality agreement, such that I waive all rights and claims said device or information." which has to be executed from the DOS prompt. If this approach seems promising to both your objective of having the material reviewed, retaining proprietary status yet allowing a select few have limited access to the material, I will volunteer to help with the wording of the protection files and system, and will check out the concept with the Law librarian at UBC. Sincerely, Klaus Breslauer From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 18:19:46 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA18917 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:18:25 -0800 Received: from ra.cs.ohiou.edu (ac817@ra.cs.ohiou.edu [132.235.1.101]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA18770 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 18:17:54 -0800 Received: (from ac817@localhost) by ra.cs.ohiou.edu (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11) id VAA05696 for freenrg-list@eskimo.com; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:15:23 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199512010215.VAA05696@ra.cs.ohiou.edu> Subject: fnrg: Wepon To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com (Wierd) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 21:15:22 -2900 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I've been thinking about forcefields. (Not like the inpenertrable walls in StarTrek.) More like a magnetic field that not only repels Iron and steel, but also every element. I'm trying to build something like this. Think about how it could be used....Space propulsion, medical, and scientific uses. What if you made a field around the earth, it would repell small meters and space junk. It would keep out subatomic space particals that cause cancer. The cancer levels would drop to a record low. I would appreciate any info on this subject. If anybody has any info of *ANY* kind, it would be usefull. Thank you. Andrew Cantino Programer, Inventer,etc. -- ((( ((( (O,O) (O,O) (-) (-) ----oOOo-----oOOo---oOOo---oOOo--- I I I Andrew Cantino I I ac817@seorf.ohiou.edu I I I ---------------------------------- My home page is at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/andrew.html From freenrg-list-owner@eskimo.com Thu Nov 30 20:13:33 1995 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA29678 for freenrg-list-outgoing; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:13:07 -0800 Received: from JIMI.CS.UNLV.EDU (jimi.CS.UNLV.EDU [131.216.22.2]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA29628 for ; Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:12:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199512010412.UAA29628@mail.eskimo.com> Received: from lil-ed.CS.UNLV.EDU by JIMI.CS.UNLV.EDU id aa15314; 30 Nov 95 20:02 PST To: freenrg-list@eskimo.com In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:16:39 EST." <199511302216.QAA21192@fastlane.net> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:02:54 -0800 From: Frank T Lofaro Sender: owner-freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: freenrg-list@mail.eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In message <199511302216.QAA21192@fastlane.net>, Bert Pool writes: >If this stuff works, and is useable, I doubt if the powers-that-be would >allow a public patent to be issued anyway. If you doubt that statement, Very true. Here is something people on this list should keep in mind: Patent Secrey Law. Basically, if you apply for a patent, and the details of the invention are not publically known, they can prevent it from ever being published! Read the statues and/or consult a lawyer. See 35 USC Chapter 17 (35 USC 181-188) It's on the web at: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/35/ch17.html Be careful.