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Cogeneration Buyers Guide
Cogeneration Buyers Guide
Cogeneration, or combined heat and power, is an enormous and growing mark=
et, which has littlepresence on the internet. This buyers guide will pro=
vide information about products and servicesof interest to the cogenerati=
on industry. Be sure to check out the IDEA Buyers' Guide and theCHPA Buy=
ers' Guide, too.
Prime Movers
The common fe=
ature in all cogeneration systems is the prime mover, which will either c=
onvertwaste heat into power or generate heat and power from a single ener=
gy input. Prime movers caneither be reciprocating engines (such as an au=
tomobile engine, which produces both power andheat) or a turbine. Turbin=
es can be powered by steam, hot air, and occasionally other media. Combus=
tion turbines have a compressor, combustor, and hot air turbine in a sing=
le unit. Primemovers can be combined in a variety of ways to increase en=
ergy utilization. One commonmethod is to use the waste heat from an engi=
ne or combustion turbine to generate steam, which isthen used to power a =
steam turbine. A simple cycle plant has a single prime mover, and acombi=
ned cycle plant will have two in series.
Reciprocating Engines
=
- Aegis Energy Services Fu=
ll service modular cogeneration developer (30-250 kW)
- Alturdyne - 25 to 2500 kW =
- Caterpillar - 100 kW to 3,000 kW, plus engine driven chillers from 400 to 2,100 ton=
s. =
- CMG-Sourcing International We=
are a supplier of used and reconditioned cogeneration equipment (diesel =
and gas reciprocating engines and turbines)and parts from approx. 100KW -=
40MW in 50Hz and 60Hz. We =
presently have more than 230 systems available. =
- Coast Intelligen Our c=
ompany produces a very reputable and reliable micro cogenerator unit, wit=
h 60 kWh, 120 kWh, and 150 kWh manufactured in our plant in San Marcos, C=
alifornia. Custom units are available, as are references. =
- Cogeneration Consultants
- Cogeneration =
Systems, Inc. - 5 kW Residential unit =
- Conservation Technologies, Inc. -=
10-125 kW cogen units in New Jersey area. =
- Cooper Energy Services =
- Deutz MWM =
- Eqtec Nederland B.V. produces cogenerat=
ion units from 50 KWe up to several MW. =
- Fairbanks Morse Engine Divi=
sion - 1,200 - 21,400 kW =
- Gen Pro Energy Systems - 10 - 100 kW =
- George S. Drummey Co.. 55 - 10=
0 kW package cogen units for sale.
- GM Electro-Motive
- GMT Fincantieri - 500 - 22,000 kW =
- Holec, Inc. - 80-1760 kW =
- International Power Technology<=
/a> providing complete OM&M services to the
power industry. IPT specializes in smaller (15MW) cogeneration plants. =
IPT has recently become a distributor for Jenbacher recriprocating engine=
s.
- ISI Cogene=
ration Systems by MagneTek - 35, 60, and 120 kW =
- Jenbacher Energiesysteme - 250 kW - 2,00=
0 kW =
- Katolight Corp. - 10-1,600 kW =
- Kohler Power Systems - 3 - 1,600 kW =
- MAN Diesel - 400 kW to 51,50=
0 kW =
- Magrath Cogeneration=
a> is a full service cogeneration company, providing
design, procurement, packaging, construction, start-up and financial
services. Magrath specializes in the development of power generation and=
cogeneration projects in the 250 kilowatt to 10 megawatt range.
Headquartered in Calgary, Alberta, Magrath serves Western Canadian compan=
ies in the energy, industrial =
and institutional sectors. =
- Mirrlees Blackstone, Inc. - 600 - 10,000 kW =
- Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Inc. =
- Nedalo BV Sells CHP (combined heat & p=
ower units from
50 kW up to 800 kW). Nedalo is the Dutch dealer of Perkins Engines (gas =
and diesel), Pratt &
Whitney Gasturbines, and Kohler standby generating sets. Nedalo BV is lo=
cated in Holland and in England (Nedalo UK).
- New Sulzer Diesel =
- Niigata Engineering Co. Ltd. 750 - 5,000 kW =
- O'Brien Energy Services Co. - 30 - 15,000 kW=
reconditioned and rentals to 50 MW.
=
- pbi - The dynamic database of Pow=
er Industry Equipment. =
- Quantum Dynam=
ics Group, a full service turn-key micro-cogen marketing, manufacturi=
ng company. =
- Ruston Diesel - 500 - 5,000 kW =
- SPP Energy - 54 kW unit based on Ford BSG666 Engine =
- Spruyt Energiesystemen builds cogenera=
tion units from 60 kWe till about 3 Mwe.
- Tecogen - 60-75 kW =
- Valley Air Conditioning - Microcogeneration=
for small businesses. =
- VES, LLC. A leading developer, own=
er and operator of small
cogeneration systems (1 to 10 megawatts) using internal combustion genset=
s and heat recovery systems including absorption chilling. [In spite of =
their ".org" address, this appears to be a profit-making company.]
- Wabash Power Equipment - 60 - 100,000 kW =
- Wärtsilä Diesel - 300 -16,000 kW=
=
- Waukesha Engine Div. -=
75 - 2,400 kW
Combustion Turbines
For general information on gas turbines, check out International Gas Turbine Institute
Steam Turbines
Fuel Cells
Fuels cells provide an excellent cogeneration opportunity. Several proto=
types are being used in cogeneration applications, and may prove to be co=
mmercially viable.
Heat Recovery Apparatus
Although the heat from an engine can sometimes be used directly, such as =
using hot water from an engine cooling jacket, recovering heat from hot e=
xhaust air usually requires some form of heat recovery apparatus.
Heat Recovery Steam Generators (HRSG)
Consultants, Contractors & Developers
Cogeneration projects range from the very simple to the enormously comple=
x. While some organizations have the skills and resources to do some or =
all of the required work in-house,others will need to contract for some o=
r all of this work from one or more outside firms. As this list grows, i=
t will be divided into subsections, which may include:
=
- Initial evaluation =
- Engineering =
- Economic & financial evaluation =
- Financing
- Construction
- Fuel Selection and Procurement =
- Alternatives to cogeneration (i.e. retail wheeling, etc.)
=
- Maintenance
=
- Ownership options
In the meantime:
- Gaz de Strasbourg Gaz de Strasbourg is involved in cogeneration through its subsidiary Rh=
inco.
- Onsite Energy Corporation
- GateCycleTM=
predicts design and off-design performance of combined=
-cycles, fossil boiler plants, cogeneration systems, combined heat-and-po=
wer plants, advanced gas turbine cycles and many other
energy systems.
- TLV, Fluid control and steam-rela=
ted products.
- BPS, Inc.
- Waldron Engineering, Inc.
- The Electrical Generating Systems As=
sociation
- Propane residenti=
al cogeneration
- Catamount Energ=
y Corporation
- Independent Energy Partners
- SEBRA Envotec AB - Energy consulting a=
nd marketing services. =
- International Power Technology<=
/a> providing complete OM&M services to the
power industry. IPT specializes in smaller (15MW) cogeneration plants. =
- FVB - Fjärrvärmebyrån ab - Comp=
rehensive consulting services for cogeneration, district heating and dist=
rict cooling in North America, Europe, and Asia.
=
- NEPCO National Energy Production=
Corporation. NEPCO is a full service engineering and construction compan=
y with 60 years of experience in the design, construction, operation and =
maintenance of high efficiency power and cogeneration plants,
as well as waste-fueled power generating facilities.
- Vokes Filtration for Cogen=
eration Plants
- Gaspower, Inc. install=
s packaged gas turbine units on a turnkey basis worldwide.
=
- INDECK is a family of companies=
involved in the design, construction, ownership andoperation of cogen fa=
cilities.
- Turbine Serv=
ices Engineering, Inc. specializes in gas turbine cogeneration.
=
- Western Turbine=
Users, Inc. GE Aeroderivative Gas Turbines
- Randal K. Walker Fuel Procurement
Legal Services
Electric generation, in particular, is a highly regulated industry, but q=
ualified legal assistance can be of assistance to all parties throughout =
the various phases of a cogeneration project.
Please contact Morris A. Pie=
rce to add products or services to this list. =
Links to or from other relevant web sites are welcome.
Last updated 19 May 1998
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From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Thu May 6 20:41:07 1999
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From: VCockeram aol.com
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Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 23:06:17 EDT
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration
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All,
Finished construction of the shield sensor assembly and first test
showed up some minor problems.
The approx 1 inch insulation is not good enough for calorimetry as
the outside of the can gets too hot to touch (~90 C estimated) at a
tube temperature of 250 C.
Electrical noise greatly minimized but not yet eliminated. Will add
shielded cable for all high voltage wiring. I have a supply of 40 kV
cable which I will enclose in braided shield.
Adding ground bonds to the various parts of the system will
take care of noise, not to mention safety.
Regards,
Vince Cockeram
Las Vegas
702-254-2122
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 00:12:33 1999
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To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: knuke LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman)
Subject: H2K: H2 Calibration/Calorimetry Electronics
Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 03:14:31 -0400
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Ahoy!
I ran across some interesting stuff the other day while searching
for something totally unrelated to this subject. This website includes a
section devoted to calorimetry electronics at:
http://d0server1.fnal.gov/users/huffman/
The author of the site is named David Huffman, and I have a brother
named David that lives in that same area. I'll have to give my brother a
call to see if he is living some kind of double life. Last I heard, he
wasn't into particle physics, but then, you never know with my family 8^)
While doing another search a while back, I ran across my other
brother's name, Jim Huffman. My has spent his entire working career at
United Airlines. He is in charge of ground crews, plane maintenence crews,
and ticketing personnel. When I checked out the website that was listed in
his name, up popped this photo of a guy that looked remarkably like my
brother, standing on a tarmac in Alaska. He looked so much like my brother
that it was downright spooky. Same hair, build, glasses, and goofy smile.
At one time, my brother had been responsible for the Alaskan airport ground
crews, as well as all the other United ground crews in airports on the West
Coast. This Jim Huffman who had authored the site that I was looking at,
had spent his entire working career as a ground crew specialist in the Air
Force. He was looking for a job in the private sector.
On another weird search, I ran across a Museum of Bicycle History.
At one time, the museum notes, bicycles were considered by many to be crazy
and useless inventions. In the museum were some photos of classic bicycles,
and to my surprise, some of the earliest ones were Huffys. My Dad, George
Huffman, had always given us Huffy bicycles when we were kids. My
grandfather's nickname was Huffy, and my Dad just thought it was a cute idea
that we should all ride Huffy bicycles. When I read up on the bicycles that
were listed in the museum, I found that they were manufactured by the
Huffman Manufacturing Company in Ohio. The company was founded by a George
Huffman in 1888. They even were a government supplier during WW2. They
made a rugged bicycle that was used around military bases to deliver mail
and messages to save precious fuel. When I last talked to my Dad, I asked
him if he had any knowledge of this, and he said it was all news to him. He
said that he knew that his family had come from Ohio and settled in Indiana,
where he was born, but beyond that, he didn't know.
Then there is that business with the Wright brothers (bicycle
mechanics extraordinaire) flying their first airplanes on Huffman Flats or
Huffman Prairie, depending on which history you read, in Ohio. It just made
me wonder if there was some kind of weird, pioneering technology gene that
the Human Genome Project hasn't identified yet that compels certain people
to be interested in certain endeavors. Or maybe it's a thought wavelength,
or a name-based projection or association/expectation of some kind. Who
knows? It's kind of interesting though, huh? Just thought I'd wing that
one at you 8^)
Knuke
Michael T. Huffman
Huffman Technology Company
1121 Dustin Drive
Lady Lake, Florida 32159
(352)259-1276
knuke LCIA.COM
http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 04:17:48 1999
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Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 05:12:48 -0600
From: Frederick Sparber
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Subject: Re: Neutrino Collisions And Cold Fusion Heat?
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To: Vortex
In a CF reaction: Deuteron-Neutrino + Deuteron ----> He4 + Neutrino +
23 Mev sans Gammas or Neutrons, due to it's Large Size, R = kq^2/Eo
(about 28 angstroms) the Neutrino having a charge the same as an
Electron and as much as 23 Mev kinetic energy can collide with hundreds
or thousands of Local Electrons At Once, thus giving each electron a few
thousand ev to a few hundred thousand ev in "Thermalizing".
IOW, The "where did it go?" syndrome, changes from Neutrinos being
"neutral" and able to penetrate "light years of lead without detection",
are stopped in a few angstroms and hang around as "Static
Electricity". :-)
On the Sun where they experience a gravitational force, Fg =
6.67E-11*2E30*9.1E-37/(7E8)^2 = 2.5E-34 nt, and an Electrostatic Force,
Fes = k*q*e-/(7E8)^2 if the Sun's gravity is collecting Neutrinos from
the estimated 2E8 Neutrinos/Meter^3 from the surrounding Space, a
balance of Gravitational Force Fg = Electrostatic Force Fes: q =
2.5E-34*R^2/k*e- = 8.4E-8 coulombs.
If you go beyond this balance force, the Sun becomes a "Neutrino
Accelerator" and fires them into the Earth's Atmosphere as "Solar Cosmic
Rays" and they are "thermalized" in the upper atmosphere where they
attach to O2/O3 as "small ions" (about 5,000/cm^3 at 20 km). Some
arrive as small ions at sea level (about 500/cm^3) as well as attaching
to cat fur as Static Electricity. :-)
TGIF!
Regards, Frederick
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 09:15:11 1999
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Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 07:26:14 -0900
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration
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At 11:57 PM 5/5/99, VCockeram aol.com wrote:
[snip]
>Not calorimetry yet, but yes, gravity coolant flow if it gets too hot.
>Small pump in a pan on the floor feeding a can w/valve hung from the ceiling.
>Won't get much flow though through the 1/8 _OD_ tubing. May have to run
>with a fluidic pressure intensifier (a pump :-)
This is an excellent configuration for calorimetry, IMHO, because the fluid
flow rate is determined by first principles, the measuring of time and
volume, and not dependent on the assumed flow rate of a constant rate pump.
The only additional things needed for calorimetry are inlet and outlet
thermometers, and a convenient place to break into the water flow, on the
down side from the cooling jacket, to measure flow rate by timing the
filling of a known volume. A simple way to do this is to let the water
fall the last couple feet or so. Doing this avoids pressure changes when
you "cut in" to measure fluid flow, plus gives you visual and auditory
feedback regarding flow rate.
The 1/8 OD tubing should be OK, but you can find out by running the water
through it into a container of known volume and measuring the fill time.
The supply lines should be a larger size, though. If the supply lines are
plastic or rubber, care must be taken to hold them rigidly in place to
maintain a constant flow resistance. Once the reactor tube stabilizes at a
constant operating temperature you can measure the flow rate and it should
remain constant in stable thermal conditions, so spot checks of flow rate
should be sufficient. A low water (but consistant) flow rate can actually
help, provided the water does not boil. You get a larger temperature
difference, thus a more accurate measurement of the temperature difference.
If you have the above calorimtery, then the reactor tube surface
temperature is only ancillary information. The only data that really
counts is fluid flow rate and inlet and outlet fluid temperature, and power
input. Assuming the copper jacket is well grounded, and the power leads
shielded, you will not have to worry so much about additional shielding
just to measure the water temperatures.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 10:24:24 1999
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Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 12:24:41 -0500
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: Scott Little
Subject: H2K: gravity flow
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At 07:26 5/7/99 -0900, Horace wrote:
>This is an excellent configuration for calorimetry, IMHO, because the fluid
>flow rate is determined by first principles, the measuring of time and
>volume, and not dependent on the assumed flow rate of a constant rate pump.
This is how my first calorimeter worked and it was pretty stable...usually.
Several times, however, the flow rate would drop noticeably because some
tiny piece of debris got lodged in the small lines somewhere. Thus the
bottom line is the same as with a "constant" rate pump: You still have to
check the flow rate periodically.
Your idea for the "falling zone", where a vessel may be inserted to capture
the flow with zero perturbation of the rest of the system is very good.
Scott Little, EarthTech Int'l, Inc. http://www.eden.com/~little
Suite 300, 4030 Braker Lane West, Austin TX 78759, USA
512-342-2185 (voice), 512-346-3017 (FAX), little eden.com (email)
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 11:01:04 1999
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From: Ross Tessien
Subject: Case, IE Video: "1 ATM 200 C" ??????
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On the Infinite Energy Video, "Cold Fusion: Fire From Water"
Les Case is showing his device and the thermometer gauge which reads 215 C
or so. Then, he says that it is novel to have nuclear reactions going on
in such a device, ie it is cold by nuclear reaction standards. But, water
boils at 100 C.
Is this an error, ie, is Case's device pressurized rather than at 1 atm? I
would question whether the instrument was really at 215 F, except that it
showed the F temp which was much higher, and it showed that the 200+ temp
was clearly labeled C degrees.
What is up?
Confused ME
rt
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 11:39:26 1999
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From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: Re: Case, IE Video: "1 ATM 200 C" ??????
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rt asks:
Is this an error, ie, is Case's device pressurized rather than at 1 atm?
It's a gas cell, not liquid. Yes, it has to be pressurized but the boiling
point of water (or D2O) is irrelivant. When there is oxygen trapped in the
catalyst you do get a buildup of steam, which has to be vented. You have to
cycle it 3 to 5 times, I think.
- Jed
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Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 16:51:43 -0700
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From: Ross Tessien
Subject: Re: Case, IE Video: "1 ATM 200 C" ??????
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At 02:38 PM 5/7/99 -0400, you wrote:
>rt asks:
>
>Is this an error, ie, is Case's device pressurized rather than at 1 atm?
>
>It's a gas cell, not liquid. Yes, it has to be pressurized but the boiling
>point of water (or D2O) is irrelivant.
Case said that it was at one atmosphere in the video. Does he do it
sometimes presurized and sometimes atmospheric pressure?
Also, if it is a gas cell, is the gas D2 or D2O or other or not disclosed?
And he showed the carbon catalyst in his hand. Is the inside of the cell
filled up with that stuff, plus the gas, and then just heated, or is there
current passed through the stuff like in the Patterson cell?
Thanks. rt
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Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:29:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Schaffer
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration/Calorimetry Electronics
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Michael T Huffman wrote:
> I ran across some interesting stuff the other day while searching
>for something totally unrelated to this subject. This website includes a
>section devoted to calorimetry electronics at:
>http://d0server1.fnal.gov/users/huffman/
[snip]
This is a different kind of calorimetry than we usually talk about here.
I don't know much about it, but I'll share what I know.
Particle accelerators (this web page is at Fermilab) have one or more
"detectors" to analyze the particles produced by the collision between the
high energy primary and target particles. A detector is actually a large
array of many kinds of instruments making different measurements.
"Calorimeters" are one class of instruments. I don't actually know about
the usage, but I suspect that in experimental particle physics the word
"calorimeter" means an instrument that measures the energy of product particles.
===
Michael J. Schaffer
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Fri May 7 21:14:24 1999
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Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 23:14:34 -0500
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From: Scott Little
Subject: H2K: H2 Calibration/Calorimetry Electronics
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At 06:29 PM 5/7/99 -0700, Michael Schaffer wrote:
>...I suspect that in experimental particle physics the word
>"calorimeter" means an instrument that measures the energy of product
particles.
That's what I got out of it, too. If that's the case, I've been working
with "calorimeters" longer than I thought. In x-ray fluorescence, one
strives to achieve a detector which will faithfully and precisely reveal
the energy of each detected x-ray. Examples (in order of increasing
precision) include: NaI scintillators, proportional counters, HgI2, and
Si(Li) solid-state detectors. All of these detectors could be called
calorimeters under the definition the particle physicists are using.
Scott Little
EarthTech International, Suite 300, 4030 Braker Lane West, Austin TX 78759
512-342-2185 (voice) 512-346-3017 (FAX)
little eden.com http://www.eden.com/~little
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From: VCockeram aol.com
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Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 04:14:48 EDT
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration
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In a message dated 05/07/1999 09:14:42 Pacific Daylight Time,
hheffner mtaonline.net writes:
> At 11:57 PM 5/5/99, VCockeram aol.com wrote:
> [snip]
> >Not calorimetry yet, .....
>
> This is an excellent configuration for calorimetry, IMHO, because the fluid
> flow rate is determined by first principles, the measuring of time and
> volume, and not dependent on the assumed flow rate of a constant rate pump.
I stumbled into what may be a decent calorimeter? OK, I'll take it! I
think adding additional insulation ( which will be easy) will help too.
The test I ran night before last where I stated that the can got too
hot
to touch was an artifact. A set of small leaf springs grip the tube at
the
top and bottom of the sensor can and the lower spring was near the
bottom of the tube where there was poor contact between the lower
carbon electrode and the stub of the lower electrical contact.
This caused a high temperature area right where the lower leaf
springs were gripping the tube and the springs transferred the heat
to the can itself.
Problem solved by insuring the lower carbon electrode is in _tight_
contact with the lower tube internal electrical connection.
> The only additional things needed for calorimetry are inlet and outlet
> thermometers, and a convenient place to break into the water flow, on the
> down side from the cooling jacket, to measure flow rate by timing the
> filling of a known volume. A simple way to do this is to let the water
> fall the last couple feet or so. Doing this avoids pressure changes when
> you "cut in" to measure fluid flow, plus gives you visual and auditory
> feedback regarding flow rate.
Looks like I have to scout for some good thermometers,
plastic tubing, "T's", buckets and a small pump for the return line.
I do have graduated beakers and assorted valves.
>
> The 1/8 OD tubing should be OK, but you can find out by running the water
> through it into a container of known volume and measuring the fill time.
> The supply lines should be a larger size, though. If the supply lines are
> plastic or rubber, care must be taken to hold them rigidly in place to
> maintain a constant flow resistance. Once the reactor tube stabilizes at a
> constant operating temperature you can measure the flow rate and it should
> remain constant in stable thermal conditions, so spot checks of flow rate
> should be sufficient. A low water (but consistent) flow rate can actually
> help, provided the water does not boil. You get a larger temperature
> difference, thus a more accurate measurement of the temperature difference.
>
> If you have the above colorimetry, then the reactor tube surface
> temperature is only ancillary information.
I am not measuring reactor tube surface temperature with the new setup,
The thermocouple is attached to the wall of the 1/2 inch copper pipe that
encloses the quartz tube and has approx. 1/8 inch air space between the
ID of the copper pipe and the OD of the quartz tube. The copper pipe is
necked down to a tight fit to the quartz tube at a point 1 inch above
the upper electrode and 1 inch below the lower electrode, electrode
gap is 1 inch and the copper pipe is 3 inches in length.
> The only data that really counts is fluid flow rate and inlet and outlet
fluid
> temperature, and power input.
Agreed.
> Assuming the copper jacket is well grounded, and the power leads
> shielded, you will not have to worry so much about additional shielding
> just to measure the water temperatures.
Yes, I spent all day Friday just working on eliminating electrical noise
from the rig. (This was one of my specialties when I was working with
IBM)
A good solid ground buss, Shielded cable throughout and a good
low impedance path to earth. I also remounted the HV transformer
so now the cables are 4 inch 40kV shielded wire well grounded.
(They were orig. hookup wire about a foot long)
(What I had was a Marconi transmitter)
A quick test with full power input to the setup showed I had eliminated
the jittery readings on the digital thermometer and the pressure readout
module.
Thanks for the tips Horace.
> Regards,
> Horace Heffner
>
Regards,
Vince Cockeram
Las Vegas
702-254-2122
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From: knuke LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman)
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration/Calorimetry Electronics
Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:21:39 -0400
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Mike wrote:
> This is a different kind of calorimetry than we usually talk about here.
>I don't know much about it, but I'll share what I know.
>
> Particle accelerators (this web page is at Fermilab) have one or more
>"detectors" to analyze the particles produced by the collision between the
>high energy primary and target particles. A detector is actually a large
>array of many kinds of instruments making different measurements.
>"Calorimeters" are one class of instruments. I don't actually know about
>the usage, but I suspect that in experimental particle physics the word
>"calorimeter" means an instrument that measures the energy of product
particles.
>===
>Michael J. Schaffer
Hi Mike,
Yeah, I know, and it certainly differs from the "let's put a
dime-store thermometer over here" kind of heat measurements that I was
doing. There were some articles on isolating and eliminating electrical
noise on this webpage, though, that I thought you might be interested in.
Much data from Vince's exeriment will be meaningless if it is later found
that the signal wasn't properly isolated. Your input and Scott's have
helped a lot in this regard, but I've found that sometimes reading outside
of the field can be illuminating and helpful, as well. As it is, I think
that Vince's experiment is quite well constructed, actually, and I just
thought that I'd throw the Fermilab URL at you or anybody else that was
interested in the broader field of calorimetry. You won't find that URL if
you do a normal websearch search on the subject, I guarantee you, and there
is some good stuff in there. Now, back to the regularly scheduled programming:)
Knuke
Michael T. Huffman
Huffman Technology Company
1121 Dustin Drive
Lady Lake, Florida 32159
(352)259-1276
knuke LCIA.COM
http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sat May 8 05:34:14 1999
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Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 03:46:50 -0900
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration
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At 4:14 AM 5/8/99, VCockeram aol.com wrote:
> Looks like I have to scout for some good thermometers,
> plastic tubing, "T's", buckets and a small pump for the return line.
> I do have graduated beakers and assorted valves.
You already have a fairly good one? Your thermocouple thermometer? You
just don't want to waste the input on measuring the jacket temperature.
I can send you some (free) teflon coated thermistors accurate to +- 0.02 C
relative, and they are good in the 0 C to 100 C range, if memory serves me.
If you epoxy them to the inlet and outlet and insulate around them, it
should work OK. Scott Little uses similar thermocouples in his
calorimeter, but unfortunately mine are 100 K and his are 10 K, I think, so
if you wanted to use his data aquisition stuff dierectly some modification
to the software or hardware would be required. If you simply used an
ohmmeter, there is a formula that converts resistance to temperature that
can be used in a spreadsheet to calculate your values. If the serial
interface is hooked up on your Radio Shack meter, you could convert to
temperature by computer.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
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This kind of "calorimeter" is used in high-energy physics to record the energy of
individual subatomic particles. The term arises because, in principle, one could
measure the energy of a particle (a proton or gamma ray, for example) by slamming it
into a block of inert material and measuring the change in the block's temperature.
In practice, the material is a stack of steel or lead plates. The particle
interacts with the plates to form a shower of secondary particles of successively
lower energy, until their energies become too low to cause further reactions.
Ionization detectors or scintillation detectors interspersed with the plates are
used to measure the number of charged particles in the shower, and this serves as a
measure of the original particle's energy. Typically you'd be looking at individual
particles having an energy of at least 100 MeV with such a device.
Michael Schaffer wrote:
> Michael T Huffman wrote:
>
> > I ran across some interesting stuff the other day while searching
> >for something totally unrelated to this subject. This website includes a
> >section devoted to calorimetry electronics at:
> >http://d0server1.fnal.gov/users/huffman/
> [snip]
>
> This is a different kind of calorimetry than we usually talk about here.
> I don't know much about it, but I'll share what I know.
>
> Particle accelerators (this web page is at Fermilab) have one or more
> "detectors" to analyze the particles produced by the collision between the
> high energy primary and target particles. A detector is actually a large
> array of many kinds of instruments making different measurements.
> "Calorimeters" are one class of instruments. I don't actually know about
> the usage, but I suspect that in experimental particle physics the word
> "calorimeter" means an instrument that measures the energy of product particles.
> ===
> Michael J. Schaffer
>
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get your free yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
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Subject: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
Date: Sat, 8 May 99 09:52:13 -0000
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*** ANNOUNCEMENT ***
Now available for immediate purchase and prompt delivery:
"Cold Fusion: Fire From Water"
Copyright 1999
A Documentary Videotape (70-minutes) about one of the most
controversial scientific discoveries of all time.
Appearing in this program:
"I've become convinced, from my original skepticism, to 99% certainty that
[cold fusion] is for real. The evidence now is really overwhelming."
- Sir Arthur C. Clarke
A 70 Minute Videotape, NOW AVAILABLE!
See: http://www.infinite-energy.com
>From the back of the videotape box:
THE BIRTH OF THE WATER FUEL AGE?
In this fascinating documentary narrated by James Doohan, "Scotty" of Star
Trek fame, find out what happened to the Cold Fusion discovery in the
years
since the announcement at the University of Utah. On March 23, 1989,
respected chemists Drs. Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons claimed that a
table-top, glass cell filled with heavy water, fitted with a palladium
electrode, produced so much heat beyond the power put in that the
mysterious energy source had to be nuclear. They said it was probably
related to nuclear fusion, which powers the stars. The new "fire" from
water could not be coming from ordinary chemical reactions; it was far too
much energy. Nuclear reactions in a jar of water, producing heat but no
deadly radiation? If the shocking claim was real, the world might have a
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* What Fleischmann and Pons discovered in the mid-1980s was probably
merely the tip of an iceberg of a much larger discovery that might be
called "Modern Alchemy."
* Dozens of scientific theories have been put forth by top scientists to
explain Cold Fusion.
* Cold Fusion is very much alive. It has been confirmed in hundreds of
experiments done in many countries. Commercial activity is underway to
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it
inspired...such as the potential to neutralize radioactive waste!
* This real discovery will drastically change the world early in the 21st
Century. By exploring the history of the discovery and witnessing people
working in the field today in laboratories and companies, decide for
yourself whether Cold Fusion is one of the greatest discoveries of all
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- really a "miracle" in water.
"It could be the end of the fossil fuel age: the end of oil and coal.
And
the end, incidentally, of many of our worries about global pollution and
global warming." - Futurist and author, Sir Authur C. Clarke.
This outstanding and informative tape features the appearance of no less
than 22 cold fusion scientists and technologists. Four prominent
"skeptics" also appear.
View this program and make up your own mind about cold fusion.
Infinite Energy Magazine
P.O. Box 2816
Concord, NH 03302-2816
PH: 603-228-4516 FX: 603-224-5975
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
Available postpaid in the U.S. , Canada, and Mexico for $34.95 (USD)
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* And more information!!!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 07:54:56 -0600
From: Frederick Sparber
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To: Vortex
With the thought that there should be Light Leptons (Solar Neutrinos)
with a mass of 0.51 ev or less (9.1E-37 kg) bouncing around in a Tv
Picture tube or Computer Monitor, modification of a Junker might show
these Leptons as they hit the Phosphor.
At 20 Kv the LL Relativistic mass will be 9.1E-37[(20,000/0.51)+1] kg
and moving very close to the speed of light c. Regular Electrons will be
moving at a velocity :
v = (2*20,000*1.6E-19/9.1E-31)^1/2.
Using the horizontal or vertical deflection coils (about 400 ohms and
0.3 amps normally) with a variable D.C. power supply in place of the
Vertical or Horizontal oscillator output, with enough D.C. input for a
1.0E-4 Tesla (1.0 Gauss) Or More, the regular electrons should sweep a
radius R = m*v/q*B of about 15 feet and the LLs a radius R = Mrel*c/q*B
of about 1/2 ft.
Now the question. Can you disconnect the output of the Horizontal
Oscillator and still excite the High Voltage output from the flyback
transformer? And what can be done to the Vertical Oscillator out put to
compensate for disconnecting the Vertical Deflection coils? It might be
fun to leave them connected. :-)
Next: the filament voltage can be lowered to cut down on Regular
electron emission. etc. and Ion traps should be removed (If they still
use them).
All ideas appreciated, (if the price is right) :-)
Regards, Frederick
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Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 07:29:00 -0700
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
Subject: Re: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
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At 09:52 AM 5/8/99 -0000, Gene Mallove wrote:
>
> *** ANNOUNCEMENT ***
>
>Now available for immediate purchase and prompt delivery:
>
> "Cold Fusion: Fire From Water"
> Copyright 1999
>
>A Documentary Videotape (70-minutes) about one of the most
>controversial scientific discoveries of all time.
>
Vo,
Everyone I know who has viewed this video has been very favorably
impressed. It is a remarkable piece of work. Excellent photography,
original music and brilliant editing. A documentary of a quality rarely
achieved. Gene & Jed wrote the script and deserve several rounds of
applause. It is well worth the price. I was so impressed I ordered
several additional copies.
Mark Goldes, Magnetic Power Inc.
>Appearing in this program:
>
>"I've become convinced, from my original skepticism, to 99% certainty that
>[cold fusion] is for real. The evidence now is really overwhelming."
> - Sir Arthur C. Clarke
>
>A 70 Minute Videotape, NOW AVAILABLE!
>
>See: http://www.infinite-energy.com
>
>
>>From the back of the videotape box:
>
>THE BIRTH OF THE WATER FUEL AGE?
>
>In this fascinating documentary narrated by James Doohan, "Scotty" of Star
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>------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sat May 8 11:19:41 1999
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: Tv/Computer Monitor Consultants Sought
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At 7:54 AM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
[snip]
>
>All ideas appreciated, (if the price is right) :-)
You could use an old style oscilloscope in x-y mode and impose a magnetic
field on the beam using a couple coils, or just a big magnet. If the spot
separates into two distinct spots you have a positive result.
If this experiment were positive it should have been noticed years ago.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Experiment report re: light leptons on oscilloscope
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To look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred Sparber an electron beam
style oscilloscope was placed in x-y mode and centered the spot in the
middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about a 1/2
inch halo was produced.
A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B) was
imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to
distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at a
distance of 3 feet. When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam moved
in unison with the spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The
experiment was repeated by diverting the beam in various directions
including vertical and horizontal.
The result of the experiment is negative with regard to a sufficient number
of light leptons being present to visibly affect the tube phosphor.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sat May 8 13:44:06 1999
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From: Frederick Sparber
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Thanks Horace. You just walked past the haystack looking for the proverbial
needle. :-)
What is the voltage on your scope? What was the voltage on the deflection
plates wrt to the gun?
An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than 0.035 ev)
at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B field
which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics of an
electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this experiment.
If I was looking for stupid experiments, I would do it myself. :-)
Regards, Frederick
Horace Heffner wrote:
> To look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred Sparber an electron beam
> style oscilloscope was placed in x-y mode and centered the spot in the
> middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about a 1/2
> inch halo was produced.
>
> A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B) was
> imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to
> distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at a
> distance of 3 feet. When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam moved
> in unison with the spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The
> experiment was repeated by diverting the beam in various directions
> including vertical and horizontal.
>
> The result of the experiment is negative with regard to a sufficient number
> of light leptons being present to visibly affect the tube phosphor.
>
> Regards,
>
> Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sat May 8 15:07:20 1999
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: Experiment report re: light leptons on oscilloscope
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At 2:37 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
>Thanks Horace. You just walked past the haystack looking for the proverbial
>needle. :-)
>
>What is the voltage on your scope?
Don't know offhand.
>What was the voltage on the deflection
>plates wrt to the gun?
Why is deflection plate voltage wrt to the gun important? The important
thing is obtaining zero deflection voltage, right? The beam was centered,
so deflection voltage should be about zero.
What I didn't do is establish a null magnetic environment. However, I was
able to rotate the magnetic field through the zero point and no second spot
showed up, so that should be sufficient?
>
>An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than 0.035 ev)
>at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B field
>which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics of an
>electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this experiment.
My objective was to avoid electrostatic deflection at all. That's why I
used x-y mode instead of t-y, so as to get a stationary spot.
>
>If I was looking for stupid experiments, I would do it myself. :-)
Not likely. You're a theory guy, remember? 8^)
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sat May 8 16:11:40 1999
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Horace Heffner wrote:
> At 2:37 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
> >Thanks Horace. You just walked past the haystack looking for the proverbial
> >needle. :-)
> >
> >What is the voltage on your scope?
>
> Don't know offhand.
If you don't get the voltage up Before The Deflection Plates ( Mrel =
Mo[(eV/eVo)+1] most likelyif these exist, and are not stuck to the metal or glass
parts (Electron Affinity 0.5 to 2.0 ev) they will go into the gun assembly or the
deflection plates. Or they could be sticking to residual atoms/molecules in the CRT
which might explain the mysterious "Negative Ions" and the Negative Ion Burn spot
on the center of the tube that has plagued CRT designs since day one. This is why a
bent gun and/or an ion trap is used.
If this experiment is Carefully Controlled and the Electron Spot is Masked over
with tape, In a darkened room one might see a few scintillations from these in a
matter of hours.
> >What was the voltage on the deflection
> >plates wrt to the gun?
>
> Why is deflection plate voltage wrt to the gun important? The important
> thing is obtaining zero deflection voltage, right? The beam was centered,
> so deflection voltage should be about zero.
If you are dealing with particles millionths of the mass of an electron and
millions of times larger, the deflection plates floating at some potential wrt the
gun is a problem.
> What I didn't do is establish a null magnetic environment. However, I was
> able to rotate the magnetic field through the zero point and no second spot
> showed up, so that should be sufficient?
Can't be done unless you exclude the Earth's B field also. What I posted was a
question relating to MODIFICATION OF THE VERTICAL & HORIZONTAL CIRCUITS Of A TV
TUBE so that the 21+ inch tubes on an existing chassis would give some leeway in a
CAREFUL experiment. I have over 50 years experience with CRTs of all types and I
know what I am looking for and how to go about it.
> >
> >An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than 0.035 ev)
> >at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B field
> >which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics of an
> >electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this experiment.
>
> My objective was to avoid electrostatic deflection at all. That's why I
> used x-y mode instead of t-y, so as to get a stationary spot.
Not workable.
Regards, Frederick
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 01:24:57 1999
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: Experiment report re: light leptons on oscilloscope
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At 5:06 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
>Horace Heffner wrote:
>
>> At 2:37 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
>> >Thanks Horace. You just walked past the haystack looking for the proverbial
>> >needle. :-)
>> >
>> >What is the voltage on your scope?
>>
>> Don't know offhand.
>
>If you don't get the voltage up Before The Deflection Plates ( Mrel =
>Mo[(eV/eVo)+1] most likelyif these exist, and are not stuck to the metal
>or glass
>parts (Electron Affinity 0.5 to 2.0 ev) they will go into the gun assembly
>or the
>deflection plates. Or they could be sticking to residual atoms/molecules
>in the CRT
>which might explain the mysterious "Negative Ions" and the Negative Ion
>Burn spot
>on the center of the tube that has plagued CRT designs since day one. This
>is why a
>bent gun and/or an ion trap is used.
All the above applies similarly to a TV tube. There is a potential
gradient in the tube due to the surroundings and tube geometry, and the
walls of the glass vacuum envelope are probably charged.
>
>If this experiment is Carefully Controlled and the Electron Spot is Masked over
>with tape, In a darkened room one might see a few scintillations from
>these in a
>matter of hours.
If they are so sparse they do not seem a likely candidate to account for CF
reactions.
>
>> >What was the voltage on the deflection
>> >plates wrt to the gun?
>>
>> Why is deflection plate voltage wrt to the gun important? The important
>> thing is obtaining zero deflection voltage, right? The beam was centered,
>> so deflection voltage should be about zero.
>
>If you are dealing with particles millionths of the mass of an electron and
>millions of times larger, the deflection plates floating at some potential
>wrt the
>gun is a problem.
The neck of a TV tube will float at some potential too.
>
>> What I didn't do is establish a null magnetic environment. However, I was
>> able to rotate the magnetic field through the zero point and no second spot
>> showed up, so that should be sufficient?
>
>Can't be done unless you exclude the Earth's B field also.
The geomagnetic and local fields superposition. By moving through zero on
various axes all small values for net field intensity are obtained.
>What I posted was a
>question relating to MODIFICATION OF THE VERTICAL & HORIZONTAL CIRCUITS
>Of A TV
>TUBE so that the 21+ inch tubes on an existing chassis would give some
>leeway in a
>CAREFUL experiment.
>I have over 50 years experience with CRTs of all types and I
>know what I am looking for and how to go about it.
How are you going to tell a few stray flickers from cosmic rays or stray
electrons?
>
>> >
>> >An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than
>>0.035 ev)
>> >at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B field
>> >which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics
>>of an
>> >electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this
>>experiment.
I suppose the deflection plates could be tied to the gun, but I am not too
eager to take a chance on messing up the scope for a non-definitive test.
I still think the large tunneling distance is the best discriminator of
light leptons. A wide slit or wide spaced diffraction grating might work
also if enough hits could be tallied to get an interference pattern.
>>
>> My objective was to avoid electrostatic deflection at all. That's why I
>> used x-y mode instead of t-y, so as to get a stationary spot.
>
>Not workable.
If that is the case, a TV should then also be marginal at best.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 03:12:46 1999
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From: Frederick Sparber
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Horace Heffner wrote:
> At 5:06 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
> >
> >If you don't get the voltage up Before The Deflection Plates ( Mrel =
> >Mo[(eV/eVo)+1] most likelyif these exist, and are not stuck to the metal
> >or glass
> >parts (Electron Affinity 0.5 to 2.0 ev) they will go into the gun assembly
> >or the
> >deflection plates. Or they could be sticking to residual atoms/molecules
> >in the CRT
> >which might explain the mysterious "Negative Ions" and the Negative Ion
> >Burn spot
> >on the center of the tube that has plagued CRT designs since day one. This
> >is why a
> >bent gun and/or an ion trap is used.
>
> All the above applies similarly to a TV tube. There is a potential
> gradient in the tube due to the surroundings and tube geometry, and the
> walls of the glass vacuum envelope are probably charged.
True, but a 21 to 25 inch TV tube has a lot more surface area of phosphor and a lot
less gradient at higher voltages.>
> >If this experiment is Carefully Controlled and the Electron Spot is Masked over
> >with tape, In a darkened room one might see a few scintillations from
> >these in a
> >matter of hours.
>
> If they are so sparse they do not seem a likely candidate to account for CF
> reactions.
The air that came out of those tubes contained about 500 small ions/cm^3 (in 2.69E19
molecules/cm^3) so when you evacuate the tube to 10E-6 Torr or so, there are not
many of these small ions (electrons or LLs sticking to atoms/molecules?) left, but
there could be many sticking to the tube parts and surfaces.
A Light Lepton acting as a "Catalyst" doesn't need to be available in large
numbers to effect CF phenomena. Millikan measured the charge on whatever is
sticking to oil drops (electrons or Solar Neutrinos-LLs?) without having to bother
explaining Jovian Thunderbolts. The Oil he used probably had a breakdown strength
of a thousand volts/mil and yet here were "free electrons" made available merely by
atomizing the oil? :-) yet he could "photo detach them with soft x-rays.
> >
> >If you are dealing with particles millionths of the mass of an electron and
> >millions of times larger, the deflection plates floating at some potential
> >wrt the
> >gun is a problem.
>
> >
> >Can't be done unless you exclude the Earth's B field also.
>
> The geomagnetic and local fields superposition. By moving through zero on
> various axes all small values for net field intensity are obtained.
>
> >What I posted was a
> >question relating to MODIFICATION OF THE VERTICAL & HORIZONTAL CIRCUITS
> >Of A TV
> >TUBE so that the 21+ inch tubes on an existing chassis would give some
> >leeway in a
> >CAREFUL experiment.
> .
> >
> How are you going to tell a few stray flickers from cosmic rays or stray
> electrons?
One problem at a time, Horace. If you want set on your butt and explain away the
workings of nature based on your bottomless cess-pool of knowledge Y2K will be the
start of the new "Stone Age". :-)
> If that is the case, a TV should then also be marginal at best.
Beats staring at the ceiling counting fly specks. :-)
Regards, Frederick
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 05:37:15 1999
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Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 08:40:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Schnurer
To: Vortex ,
John Schnurer
Subject: Re Send ....Energy (fwd)
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Dear Vo.,
How about some vortex and energy stuff and writing? OK? Don't
get me wrong.... but I like real experiments and energy.
UUU FFF OOOO !!!!
Please post hardware designs of "UFO Detectors".
To "get the ball rolling" I will start out with one of many many
types.
Will anyone who knows the originator of this idea please ask if he
will E mail me off line. Thanks....
Detector
No claims are made for this detector type, but the idea is nice.
1] An electric field sensor is set up to monitor 60 cps, or
50 cps in Europe. The sensor is set up to monitor the field of an
electric power transmission line.
NOTE: Some people think "visitors" either DO [!] or will come
near electric power lines and DO [!] or can or might alter the magnitude
of the field surrounding the power transmission line.
2] The output of the sensor is rectified and filtered to
yield a signal proportional to the electric field near the electric power
line. The "antenna" length and type are up to the investigator and the
gain is an arbitrary value.
________________________ WARNING DANGER ______________________________
CAUTION Potentially lethal voltages on power lines!!
Electric power lines are dangerous. An investigator does not need
to be any closer than about 50 yards from a line directly below the power
line to be monitored.
LIGHTNING CAN BE A VERY REAL HAZARD. CONSULT QUALIFIED SAFETY
PERSON WHO CAN USUALLY BE FOUND THROUGH FIRE DEPARTMENT, POWER COMPANY,
HAM RADIO OPERATORS, ANTENNA INSTALLERS, TELEPHONE COMPANY INSTALLERS
_____________________________________________________________________
Electric power line noise is quite a nice easy signal.
"One person's noise can be another person's signal" !! :)
SO: DO NOT GET ANYWHERE NEAR THE POWER LINE ..... WE NEED YOU
TO REPORT THE SIGNAL, NOT READ A REPORT ABOUT AN INCAUTIOUS INVESTIGATOR !!
____________________________________________________________________
3] MONITOR THE SIGNAL AND LET US ALL KNOW WHAT HAPPENS.
Should anyone want a custom or more sophisticated sensor or
sensors, please contact me off line.
John Schnurer
PS: Let's find one.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 08:03:42 1999
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: Experiment report re: light leptons on oscilloscope (fwd)
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At 8:35 AM 5/9/99, John Schnurer wrote:
> Dear H.,
>
> I seem to have been 'de subscribed' for a while.... what is the
>experiment, below, about?
It's about Fred's interest in using a TV to detect light leptons, but more
specifically about his following questions:
At 7:54 AM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
>Now the question. Can you disconnect the output of the Horizontal
>Oscillator and still excite the High Voltage output from the flyback
>transformer? And what can be done to the Vertical Oscillator out put to
>compensate for disconnecting the Vertical Deflection coils? It might be
>fun to leave them connected. :-)
>
>Next: the filament voltage can be lowered to cut down on Regular
>electron emission. etc. and Ion traps should be removed (If they still
>use them).
>
>All ideas appreciated, (if the price is right) :-)
Regards,
Horace Heffner
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From: Tstolper aol.com
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Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:27:43 EDT
Subject: Re: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
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Is there anything in the video about Mills or Thermacore or BLP, or any other
light water or hydrogen work, or deuterium work (like Notoya's) using a
Mills-type cell?
Tom Stolper
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Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 12:23:14 -0600
From: Frederick Sparber
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Subject: Re: Molecular Collisions and Light Lepton-DiNeutron Production?
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To: Vortex
Intuitively a Deuterium-Potassium Gas pressure of 7.6 to 76 Torr at
500 Deg K would give the Potassium Vapor-Deuterium molecular
collisions more "elbow room" to collide and form the
Neutral Electron-Neutrino-AntiNeutrino-Deuteron entity, The short-lived
DiNeutron (apparently catalyzed by the Potassium Atoms).
Then when this "particle" interacts with the other Deuteron in the D2
Molecule it can react:
Deuteron-Electron-Neutrino-AntiNeutrino + D ----> He4 + e- +
Neutrino-AntiNeutrino + 23 Mev Heat sans Neutrons or Gammas.
One can speculate that the Resonance Energy Necessary to form the Entity
is predicated by the molecular collisions at around 0.4 ev which should
come out of a collision of D2 molecules at around 500 K (about 0.043
ev).
When formed "in situ" the Neutrino-AntiNeutrinos along with the
Electron,"Shrink" to form the Neutral "Dineutron". Neutron and/or
Tritium emission pathways are also possible.
This may or may not, be enhanced in a Pd or Carbon (Activated Charcoal)
Lattice.
Once ejected during the reaction the Large Neutrinos and AntiNeutrinos
can dissipate their energy within fractions of Microns travel distance
in the medium.
Regards, Frederick
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 13:04:44 1999
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From: "Mike Carrell"
To:
Subject: Re: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 14:55:00 -0400
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Tom Stolper wrote, re: Fire from Water videotape:
>Is there anything in the video about Mills or Thermacore or BLP, or any
other
>light water or hydrogen work, or deuterium work (like Notoya's) using a
>Mills-type cell?
There are brief excerpts from the program "Too Close to the Sun", produced
in Canada but never aired in the US. They show Mills at his desk and shots
inside Thermacore, with engineers discussing the OU yield of these light
water cells. That material is several years old. The narration provides a
separation between Mills and CF, but following commentary by (I think Bush)
links Mills to CF; I think this is also old material, before Mills set forth
explicit statements about the orbital collapse scenario.
Gene could clarify this; he edited the tape.
Mike Carrell
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 20:29:03 1999
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Subject: Re: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
Date: Sun, 9 May 99 23:26:31 -0000
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>Is there anything in the video about Mills or Thermacore or BLP, or any
>other
>light water or hydrogen work, or deuterium work (like Notoya's) using a
>Mills-type cell?
>
>Tom Stolper
Tom,
Mills appears in the video as does Shaubach of Thermacore. We also
mentioned briefly the hydrino hydride development of 1999.
Gene
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Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 23:35:46 -0400
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From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: News from Mizuno
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Tadahiko Mizuno called me today with continued good news about the Ohmori
plasma electrolysis experiments. He is now using flow calorimetry, and he
continues to see considerable excess heat. Input is typically ~100 watts
and output is ~250 watts, and it continues for days. This experiment only
works at high temperatures, above 80 deg C. This make it a good candidate
for high energy technology, as opposed to low energy applications like
space heating.
Three attempts were made in the U.S. and Canada to replicate this
experiment, including ours, but all three failed to produce excess heat.
Mizuno thinks the temperature near the cathode and the materials may
explain these failures, although it is difficult for him to diagnose other
people's experiments by long distance, just as it is difficult for us to
replicate him without first-hand knowledge. This has been the main problem
with cold fusion from day one: people do not fully grasp what other people
are doing. In solid state physics or catalysis a tiny error or an
undetected difference in materials can wreck an experiment. Experts in
these fields, who know nothing about CF per se, have often told me, "there
are thousand ways to make it fail and only one way to make it work." Some
of Mizuno's own cells failed to produce heat and his excess heat levels
still vary, but he thinks he has now achieved better control. Our
suspicions about his calorimetry -- possible artifacts with foam, heat
retention and so on -- are no longer an issue because he is using flow
calorimetry. There might be a new problem with the flow calorimetry, but at
these power levels I think that is unlikely.
Mizuno is writing papers about this in Japanese. He will send me the
Japanese manuscripts, sample data, and information about the calorimeter
including flow rates type of temperature sensor and so on, and I will
prepare an English version. We plan to do a great deal more. Mizuno and I
agree that this experiment deserves a "manual" (as he put it) and
demonstration kits. Sometime during summer vacation at Hokkaido U., July
and August, I plan to go to the lab and spend a week or two learning
everything I can about the experiment. I will write it down in as much
detail as I can muster for the magazine. I hope to produce a report as
detailed as the Storms paper "How to Produce the Pons-Fleischmann Effect,"
which I regard as a model of expository writing and required reading in
this field. I would not know enough chemistry and electrochemistry to do
this on my own, but I can translate into English and organize the material.
(I translated the technical papers and wrote the glossary in the Mizuno
book.) I will pack one or two cells complete with materials, reagents and
whatnot into my suitcase and bring them to our lab in Bow, New Hampshire
for an independent test. We want to put an end to guesswork and Simon Says
replications. A couple of Japanese corporations have sent researchers to
visit Mizuno and Ohmori recently. They insist on doing the replication the
hard way, on their own, starting from scratch instead of borrowing
materials or bringing instruments into the lab, so it will take them a long
time to develop the know-how. Mizuno and I agree they are making life
difficult for themselves.
In the last few months other mainstream cold fusion scientists have at last
agreed to open up their research, write detailed manuals, and work towards
demonstration kits. We are working hard to bring these efforts to fruition
by August. Many people are eagerly waiting for a chance to test these cells
out in their own labs, and I will be thrilled to give them an opportunity
to do so. The first 3 or 4 demo kits out of the gate will have a chance of
success; other systems which are held back will quickly be marginalized,
made obsolete, and then forgotten. In the early, formative period of a
technology, people with superior ideas sometimes fail to compete, and
mediocre products become the standard. The IBM PC is a classic example. The
hardware and software were obsolescent when the machine was introduced.
Operating systems like Data General RDOS and USCD Pascal were miles ahead
of MS-DOS, and if they had been marketed quickly and aggressively,
Microsoft would have been blown out of the water.
If CF kits work reasonably well, they will ignite a revolution and make
their inventors multimillionaires at least. They will end the cold fusion
controversy in a few months. This should have been done years ago, and it
is largely the cold fusion scientist's fault that it was not. Their
obsessive secrecy has not accomplished what they hoped. They have made
little progress; they have not received patents or industry support; they
are nowhere near to making practical devices; they have no significant head
start over others. After years of wretched failure, you would think these
people would learn from experience, read about elementary business and
marketing, and try a conventional business strategy, but they never do. One
of them told me recently he has no money and no prospect of getting any. He
has zero credibility and after years of work he is on the verge of giving
up. I offered $6,000 immediately for a demonstration kit, and hundreds of
thousands, perhaps millions of dollars more within months if he will file
for a patent and license us to sell kits. He thought about it for a few
weeks and then he told me no, that would be too risky. Someone might steal
his ideas. Too risky!?! No strategy could be more risky than the one he is
pursuing.
- Jed
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Sun May 9 21:23:41 1999
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Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 21:23:30 -0700
From: Lynn Kurtz
Subject: Re: News from Mizuno
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At 11:35 PM 5/9/99 -0400, you wrote:
> The IBM PC is a classic example. The
>hardware and software were obsolescent when the machine was introduced.
>Operating systems like Data General RDOS and USCD Pascal were miles ahead
>of MS-DOS, and if they had been marketed quickly and aggressively,
>Microsoft would have been blown out of the water.
>
UCSD Pascal was even implemented in hardware ( the Pascal Microengine).
What killed all versions of UCSD Pascal was the release of Borland's Turbo
Pascal for under $100, which was indeed priced and marketed aggressively at
the time.
--Lynn
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 00:05:17 1999
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 03:03:49 -0400
From: Norman Horwood <100060.173 compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: News from Mizuno
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Jed said:
>> I will pack one or two cells complete with materials, reagents and
whatnot into my suitcase and bring them to our lab in Bow, New Hampshire
for an independent test. <<
Well done!
Please keep back samples of EACH set of materials for analysis, just in
case some sets works and others fail. At least you will be able to analyse
in detail the separate sets - not like the Patterson balls-up (to coin a
phrase.
Good luck!
Norman Horwood
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 03:37:16 1999
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Subject: flux linkage and energy
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Dear All,
I have a question regarding flux linkage and energy. I kind of know the
answer for one scenario where it makes physical sense, but the other seems
absurd to me.
Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low
resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage.
We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux
collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the same
flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we
have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules electrical
power.
The above I can believe if the flux exists temporarily - say from a cooled
ferromagnet rising above its Curie point. To me, any flux change would
induce a current in the coils to prevent that flux change; the dipoles
would have a harder job randomising back to zero net magnetisation. In
effect, the heat capacity of the sample has been increased. I can believe
that this would be overunity.
Now what I find difficult is if the mechansim of the flux collapse is not
by heat, say some metastable state as the system momentarily sat in a
higher energy level. Where does the energy come from, what is the
mechanism?
Remi.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 04:48:14 1999
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From: Frederick Sparber
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Subject: Re: H2K: Potassium Vapor Pressure
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For your info, Vince,
The vapor pressure of melted Potassium (M.P. = 336.35 K) is published as
follows:
T in degrees Kelvin
Log p (Pascals) = 5.006 + A + B*T^-1
Log p (Atm) = A + B*T-1
A = 4.402
B = - 4453
Pascals* 7.50062E-3 = Torr
At 500 K I get 3.133 Pascals = 2.3499E-3 Torr, say 24 millitorr.
>From this, you shouldn't use up much Potassium. :-)
Regards, Frederick
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From: "Ed Wall"
To:
Subject: RE: News from Mizuno
Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 08:04:03 -0400
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Jed,
> Three attempts were made in the U.S. and Canada to replicate this
> experiment, including ours, but all three failed to produce excess heat.
> Mizuno thinks the temperature near the cathode and the materials may
> explain these failures, although it is difficult for him to diagnose other
> people's experiments by long distance, just as it is difficult for us to
> replicate him without first-hand knowledge.
Tadayoshi Ohmori wrote in his brief article on p. 20 of IE #24 regarding the
high voltage tungsten cathode experiment that the cell is very simple, but
contamination is a major issue. I don't know about Earthtech's efforts, but
NERL's would not be well described as "clean." It would certainly be
premature to base any conclusions based on work done here. I can remember
wondering about this when we were preparing the tungsten cathodes
> There might be a new problem with the flow
> calorimetry, but at
> these power levels I think that is unlikely.
>
It would seem unlikely, if the o/u ratio is consistent.
> Mizuno is writing papers about this in Japanese. He will send me the
> Japanese manuscripts, sample data, and information about the calorimeter
> including flow rates type of temperature sensor and so on, and I will
> prepare an English version. We plan to do a great deal more. Mizuno and I
> agree that this experiment deserves a "manual" (as he put it) and
> demonstration kits. Sometime during summer vacation at Hokkaido U., July
> and August, I plan to go to the lab and spend a week or two learning
> everything I can about the experiment. I will write it down in as much
> detail as I can muster for the magazine. I hope to produce a report as
> detailed as the Storms paper "How to Produce the Pons-Fleischmann Effect,"
> which I regard as a model of expository writing and required reading in
> this field. I would not know enough chemistry and electrochemistry to do
> this on my own, but I can translate into English and organize the
> material.
This is great news, Jed! Please bring a video camera.
>
Of course, I agree that proliferation of reliable demonstration kits is
essential to the vitality of this field. People like me have to be able to
see some success. I would like to be able to repeat the experiment with the
same exact materials and method. BTW, is the flow calorimeter circulating
the electrolyte solution or just circulating water, such as through a
tempering breaker?
Ed Wall
New Energy Research Laboratory
Cold Fusion Technology, P.O. Box 2816, Bow, NH 03302-2816
(603) 226-4822 fax 224-5975
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To: Vortex
Ancillary to Vince's work, 304 or 316 Stainless tubes about a centimeter
I.D. x 20 cm long can be filled with a few cm^3 or less, of Potassium,
evacuated to the millitorr range and filled with H2 or D2 to a few Torr
and sealed or valved off.
Several of these can be heated in an oil bath (vacuum diffusion pump oil
or such) with a cartridge heater or a flame to a few hundred degrees K.
The potassium vapor pressure: Log p (Pascals) = 5.006 + 4.402 + -
4453*T^-1 should be about 25 millitorr at 500 deg K.
With some tricky calorimetry one should see if there is any exotherm
heat generated in the tubes.
Regards, Frederick
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 05:32:38 1999
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All,
I am very confused here because I ought to be able to make one big
equivalent coil and that would see the J joules of field energy. The
inductance would stay the same if we put them in parallel on the same
former but the resistance would lower.
All of this is odd because on step 2-3 of the cycle I posted a few weeks
ago, the excitor coil sees zero net flux change and does zero electrical
work. The power coils are switched in at the right moment in the cycle
when no current exists in the excitor coil (or primary) and the flux falls
due to the sample rising in temperature.
The excitor sees the J joules or energy come back, the power coil sees the
same flux change too and should get J joules. The other argument says gang
them into one parallel coil - there is only one coil and it sees the flux
change and generates j joules of energy dissapated in the effective
impedance (the impedance of the two coil circuits alone put in parallel).
If the p.d. of the induced current is partitioned between the two
resistances in proportion to their (G1/(G1 + G2), G2/(G1 + G2) ) how can
the primary, excitor ever experience the full flux change and hence
'return to xero'.
Remi.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 06:14:18 1999
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http://www.exergyinc.com/54series.html
A little Potassium and H2 or D2 in the tubes and your ready to
Commercialize! :-) FJS
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Shell and Tube 54 Series
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Typical Pressure Loss for Water
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The 54 Series is our largest standard shell and tube heat exchanger.
Operating Limitations
Maximum Operating Pressure for Non-Shock Service: |
Shell Side Tube Side |
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At 23:35 5/9/99 -0400, Jed Rothwell wrote:
>If CF kits work reasonably well....They will end the cold fusion
>controversy in a few months. This should have been done years ago, and it
>is largely the cold fusion scientist's fault that it was not. Their
>obsessive secrecy has not accomplished what they hoped.
Well stated.
I agree that it seems unlikely that a 100 watt heat output could be
mistakenly interpreted as ~250 watts...but nevertheless the possibility is
very real.
I would like to offer for discussion (it needs to be discussed at this end,
too!) a slight modification to your excellent promotional plan, Jed:
I would accompany you to Japan this summer with my portable water-flow
calorimeter. Using the same equipment that showed a perfect power balance
on my own incandescent W cell, I would measure the power balance on
Mizuno's own cell, while Mizuno himself operates it. If this on-site test
produces positive results you could plow ahead without reservation with the
rest of your plan...with a free testimonial of positive results from
EarthTech. If negative results were obtained...well, I could help Mizuno
resolve the problems with his calorimetry...and you could save yourself a
lot of money and trouble.
Scott Little, EarthTech Int'l, Inc. http://www.eden.com/~little
Suite 300, 4030 Braker Lane West, Austin TX 78759, USA
512-342-2185 (voice), 512-346-3017 (FAX), little eden.com (email)
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From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:10:53 1999
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I may go to Japan sooner, in June. It depends on how much Mizuno has
already written in Japanese, and the workloads of Mizuno and Ed Wall, who
do all the real work in this field. It will be July or August at the
latest, when the campus is quiet.
Norman Horwood writes:
Please keep back samples of EACH set of materials for analysis,
just in case some sets works and others fail.
Well, sure we will, but this is not a one-shot deal. The materials are
cheap and readily available. If the thing works, we will order materials
for a hundred more cells, either in the U.S. or directly from the suppliers
Mizuno deals with in Hokkaido. This time, we will not run out of supplies.
At least you will be able to analyse in detail the separate sets
- not like the Patterson balls-up (to coin a phrase.
Yup. We will be able to analyze in detail, and so will you, and so will
anyone else in the world who wants one, just as soon as I can make it
happen. That's our plan. That has been our plan for many years, but so far
the devices we have tested have either failed completely, or they have
produced marginal, borderline results, or they have been extremely costly
or difficult to use, like the Case cell and Griggs Hydrodynamic Pump.
Ed Wall says:
This is great news, Jed! Please bring a video camera.
Ugh! Do I have to? I hate video cameras. Also, the proceedings will be in
Japanese, which will not be enlightening to most American viewers. I
usually use an audio tape recorder and the electronic camera. The
electronic camera resolution is 1024 x 768, much better than a video
camera. It does nice close-ups, too. Anyway, you will have the materials in
front of you a week after I return. We will have to supply the pumps and
thermocouples.
BTW, is the flow calorimeter circulating the electrolyte
solution or just circulating water, such as through a tempering
breaker?
I have no details on that yet, but I suppose it is the standard arrangement
with circulating pure water. The electrolyte in this experiment is quickly
filled with debris, and I suppose it would screw up a pump. The only reason
to circulate electrolyte is to cool down something like a packed-bead CETI
cathode, which will overheat and delaminate unless you force cooling water
past the cathode components.
Scott Little writes:
I would accompany you to Japan this summer with my portable
water-flow calorimeter.
That would up to Mizuno & Ohmori. You'll have to discuss it with them
directly. I should warn you though, our sessions will be intense and in
Japanese only, because M&O do not speak English well and I am no good at
interpreting. (I can translate written documents but I have no talent for
simultaneous speech interpretation.) I think it would make more sense for
you to go later, after we publish English documentation. Or you might
purchase the materials from Japan or from us after we independently verify
the heat.
If negative results were obtained...well, I could help Mizuno
resolve the problems with his calorimetry...and you could save
yourself a lot of money and trouble.
You would not save me any money or trouble because I would already be there
-- with the air ticket paid for -- and we would go ahead with independent
tests no matter what you find. I doubt you can teach anything about
calorimetry to people like Mizuno, Ohmori and Akimoto.
- Jed
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:11:43 1999
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 10:33:29 -0400
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Subject: Pascal flavors
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Lynn Kurtz writes:
UCSD Pascal was even implemented in hardware ( the Pascal
Microengine). What killed all versions of UCSD Pascal was the
release of Borland's Turbo Pascal for under $100, which was
indeed priced and marketed aggressively at the time.
I purchased both products. As I recall, UCSD Pascal was too slow and poorly
marketed, and it died before Turbo was introduced. UCSD was more than a
language, it was an operating system with superior file handling and
options like fixed length contiguous files, which Window still needs and
still lacks 20 years later. Turbo Pascal was indeed "marketed
aggressively," plus it was a great product. It lives on in Borland Delphi
4, which I like a lot, but I wish they would document stuff like TOutline
and the TGraph Active-X component. I am sick of trying to figure them out
by guess and by golly!
- Jed
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:31:43 1999
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All,
There is a problem here, I'll recant the cycle (also I've renumbered from
the stuff I posted weeks ago to make it more logical)
1: At ambient just above curie point.
2: Switch on excitor coil field, sample rise in temp.
3: Let sample cool back to ambient with field still on.
4: Switch off current in excitor coil, sample cools and has magnetic
moment.
5: Switch in power tap coil so flux from sample links two coils: excitor
and power coil. Sample heats up, field collapses
6: back at start.
The excitor coil can be electrically configured so that the back emf is
recaptured - its like a 'tank' LC oscillator circuit. The net flux change
is zero so it does zero electrical work (forget losses which are small,
this is meant to be ou :)
The power coil sees a net flux change and so generates power. There is no
current in the excitor coil when the power coil is switched in, there is
no transformer action. The flux is independent.
How can X joules of field energy couple to two coils and generate 2X
joules of electrical power?
The circuit is linear, so I can make one equivalent coil with equivalent
load. This coil sees X joules of energy BUT partioned between the excitor
circuit load and the power coil load. The excitor doesn't come back round
to zero (with forward emf canceling back emf) even though it should by the
argument with two coils not one effective coil.
May be there is some delayed transformer effect. Say I build a core with a
soft material that takes months to demagnetise... Now I think someone
posted something like this, it May have been Mike Carrell which was why I
was asking for the list archive.
If I can find the *reason* I can engineer around it, if possible. I'm in
two minds: the second coil sees a flux change and the primary current is
off, No, its a slow transformer.
Remi.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 09:34:18 1999
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 09:32:56 -0700
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From: Ross Tessien
Subject: Re: meeting: SSE-18th at Albuquerque
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Bill B sent the info below a while ago re AZ meeting of SSE.
What are the next few CF meetings of consequence and where and when are they?
rt
At 02:01 PM 4/27/99 -0700, you wrote:
>
>http://www.scientificexploration.org/meetings/eighteenth.html
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 10:10:37 1999
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England is selling 60% of its gold reserves. Did Joe Champion get
out of jail? ;^)
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 10:50:42 1999
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From: "Ed Wall"
To:
Subject: RE: News from Mizuno
Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:48:42 -0400
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Jed,
You wrote:
> The
> electronic camera resolution is 1024 x 768, much better than a video
> camera. It does nice close-ups, too. Anyway, you will have the
> materials in front of you a week after I return. We will have to supply
the pumps and
> thermocouples.
>
Pumps and thermocouples we got.
Be sure to get a clear understanding of the contamination issue. It is
possible to take 'clean'-ness to such an extreme that it is out of our
reach. Next time you talk to him, ask if he works in a glove box, how he
assembles the cathodes, any rinses or other preparations done before
assembling the cell, etc.
Ed
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 11:09:40 1999
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From: "Ed Wall"
To:
Subject: RE: Ed Wall's Calcium?
Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 14:08:53 -0400
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The lab that is doing our analytical work had a problem with their ICP-MS
last week and were unable to provide full results. I got partial results
yesterday. It shows that our last effort proved inconclusive due to Ca
concentration in the distilled water we had used for the electrolyte
solution. I asked the lab for a good source of water and used what they
suggested, which was not good.
As far as the possibility that such contamination might account for the high
Ca concentration in the positive run that was described in IE #24, we cannot
be sure because that result was not planned for in the initial experiment
setup (we do not have a Ca concentration figure for the distilled water that
was used on that series of runs). If the concentration of the Ca in the
distilled water used on the previous runs is anything like what was detected
in the distilled water we used in the last series of runs (~4 mg/l), the
figure of 229 mg/l that was found in our filtrate was not due to the water.
The preliminary results from the last series of runs does not show the very
high Ca concentration, but the cell was run at a lower voltage.
At present, we are planning the next step.
Ed Wall
New Energy Research Laboratory
Cold Fusion Technology, P.O. Box 2816, Bow, NH 03302-2816
(603) 226-4822 fax 224-5975
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:JedRothwell infinite-energy.com]
> Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 2:38 PM
> To: vortex-L eskimo.com
> Subject: Re: Ed Wall's Calcium?
>
>
> I would like to mention that we should hear more about this topic from Ed
> himself next week. He is out of touch at the moment.
>
> - Jed
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:07:09 1999
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Organization: Room For All
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May 10, 1999 Hello Jed Rothwell, I am very pleased that you are
instrumental in testing and replicating these amazing claims of excess
energy in "simple" systems. As a layman, I suspect that the possible
flaw in Mizuno's claim lies in measuring the input power, made very
spikey by the intense bubbling. How can the input power be determined
in an incontrovertible way? May I send your post on? I will meet a
few of the cold fusion workers at the Society for Scientific Exploration
conference June 2-6 in Albuquerque: I will maintain a low profile in
public meetings, but of course answer any questions in face-to-face
discussions.
Regards, Rich Murray
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:34:18 -0400
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From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: Re: News from Mizuno
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In my previous message NatSpeak said "That would up to Mizuno & Ohmori." I
meant: "That would be up to M&O." It is hard to say what NatSpeak had in
his little mind. (I notice it faithfully transcribes all nasty comments
about itself, so the programmers have not endowed it with sentience or an
ego yet.) Anyway, Ed Wall writes:
Next time you talk to him, ask if he works in a glove box, how
he assembles the cathodes, any rinses or other preparations done
before assembling the cell, etc.
Yeah, those are the kinds of details we need to nail down to avoid Simon
Says experiments. I will outline the paper today and make a long list of
questions and issues to cover during the trip. I hate traveling and I do
not get much done at the customer site unless I plan meticulously before I
leave.
Rich Murray writes:
I am very pleased that you are instrumental in testing and
replicating these amazing claims of excess energy in "simple"
systems.
There's nothing simple about CF systems. Richard Oriani said that in is 50
year career in electrochemistry he has never seen anything as complicated
as a cold fusion cell. The cathodes are physically small, which makes some
people think they are simple, but that is absurd. An E. coli bacterium is
microscopic, but it is more complex than New York City, and if scientists
study E. coli for the next 10,000 years, they will end up with more open
questions than answers.
As a layman, I suspect that the possible flaw in Mizuno's claim
lies in measuring the input power, made very spikey by the
intense bubbling.
I do not think there is the slightest chance of that, but we will check. It
seems logically impossible, because the effect goes away when temperatures
and materials are changed, and presumably the intensity of bubbling is
about the same with all materials.
How can the input power be determined in an incontrovertible
way?
With an oscilloscope, of course. How else? I trust you will be satisfied
with a fast oscilloscope trace. Or if you are not satisfied with that, and
you cannot suggest any other method, I trust you will conclude that no
scientist anywhere can ever establish input power.
May I send your post on?
Kindly refrain from doing that. If I wanted the post elsewhere I would send
it myself, or post it on our Web page. I see no point in eliciting comments
from the Peanut Gallery at sci.physics.fusion (or "siphon effusion" as
NatSpeak calls it).
- Jed
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From: UNIR2B1NM aol.com
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Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:31:10 EDT
Subject: Columbine student interviewed: MORE GUNMEN
To: UNIR2B1NM aol.com
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...and because of this "incident", they're drafting legislation to ban ALL
guns!?!?!?!...
-----------------------------------------
From: "Hilary A. Thomas"
John Quinn: The Rocky Mountain Horror Show
http://www.cbjd.net/orbit/quinn/Quinn_Colorado.html
Quinn Interviews Columbine student, more gunmen
URGENT:
I have conducted a telephone interview with Columbine High School
student and witness Chris Wisher on 5/7/99.
Among his remarks and comments, Mr. Wisher stated to me that he and
companions are ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that AT LEAST THREE perpetrators were
involved in the mayhem at the school. This was directly witnessed by
them outside the school building. One of these was the person in a white
T-shirt throwing bombs onto the school roof. Another was someone OTHER
THAN Harris or Klebold, OUTSIDE, in a black trenchcoat with a shotgun.
SIMULTANEOUSLY they heard shots coming from INSIDE THE SCHOOL!.
Mr. Wisher also stated that he is personally acquainted with
another witness who witnessed a GROUP OF 7-8 ASSAILANTS UPSTAIRS at
Columbine, when Harris and Klebold were downstairs!
Mr. Wisher further stated that he is personally acquainted with a
witness who was blatantly coerced by Sheriff's Dept. investigators to
CHANGE THEIR TESTIMONY REGARDING ADDITIONAL GUNMEN! Every time she
stated that she saw more than three people they attempted to get her to
CHANGE HER TESTIMONY!
Mr. Wisher stated that many Columbine students, including himself,
WILL NOT RETURN TO SCHOOL, because some of the murderers are RIGHT
THERE, ATTENDING SCHOOL!
Further details forthcoming.
DON'T LET THE "AUTHORITIES" GET AWAY WITH THIS!!!
-=> Discuss the illusions of reality....
-=> Illusions Mailing List - Illusions beyond-the-illusion.com
-=> http://www.beyond-the-illusion.com/mailman/listinfo/illusions/
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From: rvanspaa vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk)
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
Subject: Re: News from Mizuno
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:59:07 GMT
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On Mon, 10 May 1999 16:34:18 -0400, Jed Rothwell wrote:
[snip]
>
>
> As a layman, I suspect that the possible flaw in Mizuno's claim
> lies in measuring the input power, made very spikey by the
> intense bubbling.
>
>I do not think there is the slightest chance of that, but we will check. It
>seems logically impossible, because the effect goes away when temperatures
>and materials are changed, and presumably the intensity of bubbling is
>about the same with all materials.
>
>
> How can the input power be determined in an incontrovertible
> way?
>
>With an oscilloscope, of course. How else? I trust you will be satisfied
>with a fast oscilloscope trace. Or if you are not satisfied with that, and
>you cannot suggest any other method, I trust you will conclude that no
>scientist anywhere can ever establish input power.
[snip]
Actually, given that the output is supposed to be 2.5 times the input,
and most power supplies are better than 40% efficient, it ought to be
possible to measure line power delivered, and the output should even
exceed this. This method has the advantage that the power supply itself
sits between input power measurement and usage, thus forming a filter
against any spikes.
I believe that the current at the cathode comprises hundreds of sparks
per second, as the dielectric layer formed by steam around the cathode
breaks down. This implies that the current is inherently spiked, and not
just spiked due to bubble formation (or have I got the wrong
experiment?).
I also suspect that inherent inductance and built in capacitance result
in a high frequency oscillating signal that is responsible for quenching
sparks at the zero cross over.
Regards,
Robin van Spaandonk
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 21:24:08 1999
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From: VCockeram aol.com
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:21:45 EDT
Subject: Re: H2K: H2 Calibration
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In a message dated 05/08/1999 05:34:05 Pacific Daylight Time,
hheffner mtaonline.net writes:
> At 4:14 AM 5/8/99, VCockeram aol.com wrote:
> > Looks like I have to scout for some good thermometers,
> > plastic tubing, "T's", buckets and a small pump for the return line.
> > I do have graduated beakers and assorted valves.
> You already have a fairly good one? Your thermocouple thermometer? You
> just don't want to waste the input on measuring the jacket temperature.
>
> I can send you some (free) teflon coated thermistors accurate to +- 0.02 C
> relative, and they are good in the 0 C to 100 C range, if memory serves me.
> If you epoxy them to the inlet and outlet and insulate around them, it
> should work OK.
Thanks for the offer Horace but I plan on using a Fluke dual thermocouple
meter
and mercury thermometers as a cross check. If you remember back when I
started this I was using a thermistor but found it too difficult to use,
which is
why I went to the thermocouple meter. Calorimetry is a bit in the future as
I want to see if there is a difference in heat out between H2 alone and H2K.
> Scott Little uses similar thermocouples in his
> calorimeter, but unfortunately mine are 100 K and his are 10 K, I think, so
> if you wanted to use his data acquisition stuff directly some modification
> to the software or hardware would be required. If you simply used an
> ohmmeter, there is a formula that converts resistance to temperature that
> can be used in a spreadsheet to calculate your values.
> If the serial interface is hooked up on your Radio Shack meter, you could
> convert to temperature by computer.
Unfortunately the computer room is above the lab and the wife would not like
me boring more holes in the floor for the cable run.
>
> Regards,
> Horace Heffner
>
Getting the instrumentation working well is my current problem. The glow
discharge is electrically very noisy and interferes with the instruments. I
must
have very stable instruments or the experiment is worthless. I found out
Saturday
that one of the two Hewlett Packard 15 volt power supplies that power the
MKS 626A absolute pressure sensor was _one_ of the culprits, putting out a
high freq oscillation that was causing unstable pressure measurements. I
ordered
two 15 volt linear power supplies from Harbach and Rademan today. They should
arrive by Friday.
I am considering enclosing the glow discharge tube stand and HV power supply
in a Faraday Cage. This, I hope, will effectively isolate the noise from the
instrumentation. I also have an EMI filter that will be used on the input to
the HV power supply to prevent electrical noise from feeding back into the
input
power line (and the instrumentation power supplies).
This is all very frustrating in a way. I get some really splendid instruments
and
find I have to just about redesign the entire setup but I know it will be well
worth the time spent. I am not comfortable with any result when I am not
absolutely sure the meters are perfect, so I'll spend the time to get it
right.
Regards,
Vince Cockeram
Las Vegas
702-254-2122
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Mon May 10 23:30:18 1999
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From: rvanspaa vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk)
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 06:29:04 GMT
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Regards,
Robin van Spaandonk
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From: aki ix.netcom.com
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May 11, 1999
Vortex,
Some time back (years), it was reported that the French exactly
replicated the F&P experiment and was successful.
Now, does somebody have more information on this? What laboratory? What
published papers? What website if any? What scientists did the
replication? In other woreds, the five W's and an 'H'.
In a side article in Science Friday's website, it made a point (by
Cornell U.'s study project) that hardly anybody does an 'exact'
replication experiment but each (science experimentalist) puts in their
own little twist into the effort, thus possibly contributing to the
success or failure of the 'replication' effort. Hummm?
-AK-
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:03:52 +0200
From: Jean-Paul Biberian
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Vortex
Lonchampt and myself made the boiling to dry experiment of Pons and
Fleischmann, using either their cell, or exact copies. The results were
given at ICCF in Japan.
However our results were not as large as the ones claimed by P&F.
Since then we have refocused on continuously boiling experiments where
calorimetry is easier to perform. Experiments are in progress, and we will
give the preliminary results soon.
Jean-Paul Biberian
aki ix.netcom.com wrote:
> May 11, 1999
>
> Vortex,
>
> Some time back (years), it was reported that the French exactly
> replicated the F&P experiment and was successful.
> Now, does somebody have more information on this? What laboratory? What
> published papers? What website if any? What scientists did the
> replication? In other woreds, the five W's and an 'H'.
> In a side article in Science Friday's website, it made a point (by
> Cornell U.'s study project) that hardly anybody does an 'exact'
> replication experiment but each (science experimentalist) puts in their
> own little twist into the effort, thus possibly contributing to the
> success or failure of the 'replication' effort. Hummm?
>
> -AK-
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From: "Frederick Sparber"
To:
Cc: ,
Subject: Re: Cold Fusion and Hot Bricks
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 07:37:47 -0600
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To: Vortex
As absurd as it may sound, pressurizing Common/Ordinary Bricks with Air to
about 300 Psi, then soaking them in H2O or D2O-K2CO3 under hydraulic
pressure followed by either microwaving them or running a current through
them (possibly using a capacitor bank) might show OU Effects.
The 23% (approximately) Void Volume and the Micron to Nanometer pore size,
and the presence of the alkali ions could yield some interesting results.
Regards, Frederick
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 07:16:36 1999
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 10:18:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Schnurer
Reply-To: John Schnurer
To: "Richard T. Murray" , Vortex
Subject: Input power....Re: News from Mizuno
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Dear Richard and vo.,
If the input power in question is electrical.... and-or...
if the power is, say, mixing or heat and is powered electrically
THEN: It is a straightforward task to measure the electrical
power. It does not take the entire crew from NBS... but it DOES require
care and the appropriate instrumentation.
J
On Mon, 10 May 1999, Richard T. Murray wrote:
> May 10, 1999 Hello Jed Rothwell, I am very pleased that you are
> instrumental in testing and replicating these amazing claims of excess
> energy in "simple" systems. As a layman, I suspect that the possible
> flaw in Mizuno's claim lies in measuring the input power, made very
> spikey by the intense bubbling. How can the input power be determined
> in an incontrovertible way? May I send your post on? I will meet a
> few of the cold fusion workers at the Society for Scientific Exploration
> conference June 2-6 in Albuquerque: I will maintain a low profile in
> public meetings, but of course answer any questions in face-to-face
> discussions.
>
> Regards, Rich Murray
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 07:58:55 1999
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 11:01:40 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Schnurer
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
cc: Claytor lanl.gov, Ron.Brodzinski@pnl.gov
Subject: Experiments.....Re: Cold Fusion and Hot Bricks
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Dear Fredrick,
I notice you speak of many experiments. Do you do any? Have you
done any? Do you have a background in experimental sciences?
I say because I do. I agree with Richard Feynman that the final
proofs are the experiments.
Are you near a college? Do you know any teachers or students? Do
you have a desire to actually see stuff work, yourself?
John
On Tue, 11 May 1999, Frederick Sparber wrote:
> To: Vortex
>
> As absurd as it may sound, pressurizing Common/Ordinary Bricks with Air to
> about 300 Psi, then soaking them in H2O or D2O-K2CO3 under hydraulic
> pressure followed by either microwaving them or running a current through
> them (possibly using a capacitor bank) might show OU Effects.
>
> The 23% (approximately) Void Volume and the Micron to Nanometer pore size,
> and the presence of the alkali ions could yield some interesting results.
>
> Regards, Frederick
>
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 09:36:20 1999
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From: "Frederick Sparber"
To:
Cc: ,
References:
Subject: Re: Experiments.....Re: Cold Fusion and Hot Bricks
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 10:31:26 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: John Schnurer
To:
Cc: ;
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 9:01 AM
Subject: Experiments.....Re: Cold Fusion and Hot Bricks
>
>
> Dear Fredrick,
>
> I notice you speak of many experiments.
YEP!
Do you do any? YEP
Have you
> done any? YEP Do you have a background in experimental sciences? MORE
THAN YOU WILL EVER HAVE, JOHN.
>
> I say because I do. At what LEVEL?
I agree with Richard Feynman that the final
> proofs are the experiments. I tend to look for POSITIVE RESULTS. :-). But
you might take some courses at Antiock , rather than learning by induction.
:-)
> Are you near a college? YEP
Do you know any teachers or students? YEP
Do
> you have a desire to actually see stuff work, yourself? OF COURSE NOT!
:-)
If you do the proposed Hot Bricks experiment, John, BE CAREFUL or Leave a
WILL for your NEXT OF KILN. :-)
Regards, Frederick
>
> John
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, 11 May 1999, Frederick Sparber wrote:
>
> > To: Vortex
> >
> > As absurd as it may sound, pressurizing Common/Ordinary Bricks with Air
to
> > about 300 Psi, then soaking them in H2O or D2O-K2CO3 under hydraulic
> > pressure followed by either microwaving them or running a current
through
> > them (possibly using a capacitor bank) might show OU Effects.
> >
> > The 23% (approximately) Void Volume and the Micron to Nanometer pore
size,
> > and the presence of the alkali ions could yield some interesting
results.
> >
> > Regards, Frederick
> >
> >
> >
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 11:04:29 1999
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From: Tstolper aol.com
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:00:01 EDT
Subject: Re: Videotape: Cold Fusion: Fire from Water
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Mike,
Mills set forth the scenario of catalytic orbital collapse to hydrinos from
the time he first surfaced at the end of April 1991. That's also in his
first published article (FUSION TECHNOLOGY, vol. 20, August 1991 issue, pp.
65-81).
Tom Stolper
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 12:36:56 1999
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:35:45 +0100 (BST)
From: Cornwall RO
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Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy (fwd)
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:34:25 +0100 (BST)
From: Cornwall RO
To: freenrg-l eskimo.com
Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy
Dave,
At the moment we have strong theory, though not strong enough to present
to an academic, maybe. I'm having conceptual problems with this idea of
an independant flux linking several coils:-
Forget the source of the flux for a mo, if it has a field energy, N coils
will generate N times this energy on flux collapse.
I think the solution is not talk about the field divorced from its source
(counter to what I said about forgetting the source). We ACCEPT that N
times the electrical energy is generated and figure how the source does
that; I know how it would work for heat mediated collapse of the field -
its harder to randomise the dipoles - its like an extra heat capacity.
Now if the collapse isn't heat mediated. Where does the energy come from?
I've got some ideas: an electron say promoted to an energy level where it
can take part in ferromagnetic processes by the exchange interaction; that
electron is perturbed in its orbit a la Lamb shift type effects (zpe).
Now I'm no quantum mechanist to be able to deal with QED but the answer
lies there because one is trying to cohere a random effect. An orbital
taking part in exchange processes is a very directional thing.
*************************************************************************
So to finally answer you question: no experiment just yet, though this is
near, cheap and simple to do; I'd like to put up a webpage but I don't
want to publish until I feel the gaps have been filled; I have circulated
a private document which I'll keep private for reasons of modesty and that
some of it is a patent spec. I'll put the science in the open but the
nitty-gritty I'll keep quite for a bit.
*************************************************************************
Remi.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 13:14:12 1999
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From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Second light electron experiment report
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At 2:37 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
[snip]
>An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than 0.035 ev)
>at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B field
>which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics of an
>electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this experiment.
If a magnetic field were aligned with an oscilloscope electron beam, any
light electrons present in or near the beam should be drawn down the beam
in a spiraling fashion, trapped in the longitudinal field. The field
strength used in this experiment was probably over 250 gauss inside the
scope. This would make for an about 1 hundredth inch radius spiral path
for the 0.07 eV light leptons. At least a good percentage of light
electrons should be drawn down the field lines to the phosphor screen, even
through the electron gun orifice, assuing they are freed at the hot
cathode.
If the light leptons are drawn to the center spot when the field is
straight on, moving it to the side, but still pointed at the electron gun,
should deflect the light leptons to the side more than heavies, so the beam
should separate into two spots.
To again take a cursory look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred
Sparber a 5" diameter electron beam style oscilloscope, employing a
Hitachi 5DEP1(F) display tube, was placed in x-y mode and the spot centered
in the middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about a
1/2 inch halo was produced.
A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B) was
imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to a
distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at a
distance of 3 feet. The magnet was moved toward the spot on the beam axis,
and was periodically moved to the side to check for beam diversion.
When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam moved in unison with the
spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The experiment was repeated
after reversing the magnet direction.
The result of this cursory experiment is negative with regard to a
sufficient number of light leptons being present to visibly affect the tube
phosphor. This is inconclusive in that imposing a longitudinal field upon
a bent gun will only increase the trapping effect. However, examination of
the gun through the beam tube glass showed no indication of a bent gun or
beam path.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 13:16:31 1999
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From: "George Holz"
To:
Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:15:31 -0400
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Hi Remi, You wrote:
>Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low
>resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage.
>We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux
>collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the same
>flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we
>have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules electrical
>power.
You do not get N times J joules of energy. If you truly have shorted linked
coils with low resistance, the field does not collapse as the shorted coils
force the linked flux to remain constant. A shorted coil cannot provide any
electrical energy output - it would have to appear as a voltage across
the short.
If a magnetic field exists, it must be caused by an
existing current or an aligned magnetic material. It is important to
know the source in order to evaluate possible available energy output
which would occur during the collapse of the field.
Regards,
George
-
George Holz Varitronics Systems
732-356-7773 george varisys.com
1924 US Hwy 22 East Bound Brook NJ 08805
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 13:40:49 1999
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George, good to hear from you again,
On Tue, 11 May 1999, George Holz wrote:
> Hi Remi, You wrote:
>
> >Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low
> >resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage.
> >We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux
> >collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the same
> >flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we
> >have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules electrical
> >power.
>
> You do not get N times J joules of energy. If you truly have shorted linked
> coils with low resistance, the field does not collapse as the shorted coils
> force the linked flux to remain constant. A shorted coil cannot provide any
> electrical energy output - it would have to appear as a voltage across
> the short.
Yes!
> If a magnetic field exists, it must be caused by an
> existing current or an aligned magnetic material. It is important to
> know the source in order to evaluate possible available energy output
> which would occur during the collapse of the field.
Yes too, I mentioned that in the previous email on this topic. The
argument for a heat mediated collapse is that: it is harder to randomise
the dipoles (current induced in the loops creates a field which tends to
keep them how they are) - it's as though we have a higher heat capacity.
BUT what if the collapse is non heat mediated? See my previous email. We
can talk off-line if you wish.
>
> Regards,
> George
> -
> George Holz Varitronics Systems
> 732-356-7773 george varisys.com
> 1924 US Hwy 22 East Bound Brook NJ 08805
>
Cheers,
Remi.
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 14:14:37 1999
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Message-ID: <51894749C42BD111AACB00805F191B5C0215B1DE XCH-CPC-02>
From: "Scudder, Henry J"
To: "'vortex-l eskimo.com'"
Subject: RE: Second light electron experiment report
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:13:18 -0700
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Horace
By changing the orientation of the magnet you should be able to introduce a
component of field transverse to the beam.
Hank
> ----------
> From: hheffner mtaonline.net[SMTP:hheffner@mtaonline.net]
> Reply To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 1:24 PM
> To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> Subject: Second light electron experiment report
>
> At 2:37 PM 5/8/99, Frederick Sparber wrote:
> [snip]
> >An LL of .07 ev (going by Case's experiments they could be less than
> 0.035 ev)
> >at 2 Kev will sweep a radius of about 2.5 inches with a 1.0 gauus B
> field
> >which is about twice the Earths 0.5 gauss B field. The electron optics
> of an
> >electrostatic deflection scope (4 inch?)is totally wrong for this
> experiment.
>
>
> If a magnetic field were aligned with an oscilloscope electron beam, any
> light electrons present in or near the beam should be drawn down the beam
> in a spiraling fashion, trapped in the longitudinal field. The field
> strength used in this experiment was probably over 250 gauss inside the
> scope. This would make for an about 1 hundredth inch radius spiral path
> for the 0.07 eV light leptons. At least a good percentage of light
> electrons should be drawn down the field lines to the phosphor screen,
> even
> through the electron gun orifice, assuing they are freed at the hot
> cathode.
>
> If the light leptons are drawn to the center spot when the field is
> straight on, moving it to the side, but still pointed at the electron gun,
> should deflect the light leptons to the side more than heavies, so the
> beam
> should separate into two spots.
>
> To again take a cursory look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred
> Sparber a 5" diameter electron beam style oscilloscope, employing a
> Hitachi 5DEP1(F) display tube, was placed in x-y mode and the spot
> centered
> in the middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about
> a
> 1/2 inch halo was produced.
>
> A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B)
> was
> imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to a
> distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at a
> distance of 3 feet. The magnet was moved toward the spot on the beam axis,
> and was periodically moved to the side to check for beam diversion.
>
> When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam moved in unison with the
> spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The experiment was repeated
> after reversing the magnet direction.
>
> The result of this cursory experiment is negative with regard to a
> sufficient number of light leptons being present to visibly affect the
> tube
> phosphor. This is inconclusive in that imposing a longitudinal field upon
> a bent gun will only increase the trapping effect. However, examination
> of
> the gun through the beam tube glass showed no indication of a bent gun or
> beam path.
>
> Regards,
>
> Horace Heffner
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 14:18:21 1999
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From: "Scudder, Henry J"
To: "'vortex-l eskimo.com'"
Subject: RE: flux linkage and energy
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:17:05 -0700
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Remi
At one time a ceramic permanent magnet was used in artillery shells
as a fuze actuator. When the shell would impact, the magnet would shatter,
and the coil surrounding it would get a large electromagnetic pulse, which
would cause the shell to explode.
Hank
> ----------
> From: George Holz[SMTP:george varisys.com]
> Reply To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 1:15 PM
> To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy
>
>
> Hi Remi, You wrote:
>
> >Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low
> >resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage.
> >We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux
> >collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the
> same
> >flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we
> >have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules
> electrical
> >power.
>
> You do not get N times J joules of energy. If you truly have shorted
> linked
> coils with low resistance, the field does not collapse as the shorted
> coils
> force the linked flux to remain constant. A shorted coil cannot provide
> any
> electrical energy output - it would have to appear as a voltage across
> the short.
> If a magnetic field exists, it must be caused by an
> existing current or an aligned magnetic material. It is important to
> know the source in order to evaluate possible available energy output
> which would occur during the collapse of the field.
>
> Regards,
> George
> -
> George Holz Varitronics Systems
> 732-356-7773 george varisys.com
> 1924 US Hwy 22 East Bound Brook NJ 08805
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:29:43 1999
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From: VCockeram aol.com
Message-ID:
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:26:26 EDT
Subject: Re: H2K: Noise (electrical)
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In a message dated 05/10/1999 21:23:51 Pacific Daylight Time,
VCockeram aol.com writes:
> The glow discharge is electrically very noisy and interferes with the
instruments.
..........
There are four standard 120 volt outlets with "U" grounds in my garage / lab.
One of the outlets had an open ground connection...want to guess which
of the four supplied all power to the lab equipment? ....Right! The ungrounded
one. The open was in a living room outlet / junction box. It was not
a failure, the ground was NEVER connected! Shoddy work, also dangerous.
It's fixed now.
Is this Murphy's Law rearing it's head? No. It's MY fault for making
assumptions.
First rule when setting up an experiment that will be powered from the
electric mains......Check the supply voltage AND grounding...It just
may save: (1) your life, (2) time, (3) frustration.
NEVER assume (as I did) that some licensed electricians assistant's
helper's gofer wired the facility that it's right.
Chagrined in Las Vegas
Vince Cockeram
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:37:28 1999
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Subject: Cathode Ray Tube
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Cathode Ray Tube
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Cathode Ray Tube (CRT)=20
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Cathode Ray Tube
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From: "Frederick Sparber"
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Subject: The Cathode Ray Tube
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:54:44 -0600
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http://www.ul.ie/~flanagan/ce4704/Graphics/ghardw/crt.html
Got I.E. 5.0 installed. Link capability back. Sorry about the long pages .
FJS
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From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 17:34:49 1999
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Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 15:46:57 -0900
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: RE: Second light electron experiment report
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At 2:13 PM 5/11/99, Scudder, Henry J wrote:
>Horace
>By changing the orientation of the magnet you should be able to introduce a
>component of field transverse to the beam.
>
>Hank
That was the object of the first experiment (see reposted below) that Fred
rejected on the basis that the cyclotron radius for (very) light leptons
would be much smaller than the tube length. In the second experiment a
lateral component IS introduced by moving the magnet to the side. However,
by keeping the majority of the field longitudinal, and only rotating the
magnet very slighly so as to keep it pointed at the gun, as in the second
experiment, a spiral path is maintained that should trap any light
leptons. The lighter they are the better the trap.
A better experiment might have been to place the magnet to the rear of the
tube, so as to impose a divergent field and thus avoid the possibility of
magnetically reflecting any light leptons.
The first experiment:
At 9:51 AM 5/8/99, Horace Heffner wrote:
>To look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred Sparber an electron beam
>style oscilloscope was placed in x-y mode and centered the spot in the
>middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about a 1/2
>inch halo was produced.
>
>A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B) was
>imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to
>distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at a
>distance of 3 feet. When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam moved
>in unison with the spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The
>experiment was repeated by diverting the beam in various directions
>including vertical and horizontal.
>
>The result of the experiment is negative with regard to a sufficient number
>of light leptons being present to visibly affect the tube phosphor.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
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From: "Frederick Sparber"
To:
References:
Subject: Re: Second light electron experiment report
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:48:59 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: Horace Heffner
To:
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 6:46 PM
Subject: RE: Second light electron experiment report
A problem with the CRT, Horace. The grid that controls the intensity (or
feeds video) is biased negative wrt the cathode. The focusing and
accelerator electrodes (1200 to 2000 volts) can capture the LLs. You need a
larger CRT and the "guts" tied at a high negative potential to push the
negative LLs into the MAgnetic Deflection Coil field. Same as two pair of
Helmholtz Coils.
I can buy a New 19" TV at Wal-Mart for about $100.00. :-)
Regards, Frederick
> At 2:13 PM 5/11/99, Scudder, Henry J wrote:
> >Horace
> >By changing the orientation of the magnet you should be able to introduce
a
> >component of field transverse to the beam.
> >
> >Hank
>
> That was the object of the first experiment (see reposted below) that Fred
> rejected on the basis that the cyclotron radius for (very) light leptons
> would be much smaller than the tube length. In the second experiment a
> lateral component IS introduced by moving the magnet to the side.
However,
> by keeping the majority of the field longitudinal, and only rotating the
> magnet very slighly so as to keep it pointed at the gun, as in the second
> experiment, a spiral path is maintained that should trap any light
> leptons. The lighter they are the better the trap.
>
> A better experiment might have been to place the magnet to the rear of the
> tube, so as to impose a divergent field and thus avoid the possibility of
> magnetically reflecting any light leptons.
>
> The first experiment:
>
> At 9:51 AM 5/8/99, Horace Heffner wrote:
> >To look for the light leptons hypothesized by Fred Sparber an electron
beam
> >style oscilloscope was placed in x-y mode and centered the spot in the
> >middle of the screen. Intensity was set so that a spot with about a 1/2
> >inch halo was produced.
> >
> >A very large field permanent magnet (large phi, not especially large B)
was
> >imployed to divert the beam by approaching from a large distance to
> >distance of about two feet. This magnet highly distorts a TV screen at
a
> >distance of 3 feet. When diverted, the halo of the oscilloscope beam
moved
> >in unison with the spot. There was no sign of beam separation. The
> >experiment was repeated by diverting the beam in various directions
> >including vertical and horizontal.
> >
> >The result of the experiment is negative with regard to a sufficient
number
> >of light leptons being present to visibly affect the tube phosphor.
>
> Regards,
>
> Horace Heffner
>
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Tue May 11 21:00:02 1999
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From: "Frederick Sparber"
To:
Subject: Re: Leptons and Fluorescing Incandescent Light Bulbs
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 21:43:53 -0600
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FWIW, Horace. Rubbing an incandescent light bulb by holding it by the base
in one hand and rubbing it with a Cotton Handkerchief with the other hand
will excite the 500 Torr Argon-Nitrogen gas in it enough to make it
fluoresce.
A Silk Cloth WILL NOT work apparently because it sequesters the Leptons
and/or Negative Ions (O2-) from the bulb.
You can get the same effect with about any fluorescent bulb.
I would bet that if you inserted a light bulb into the neck of a CRT with a
Negative "pusher" electrode behind it, when you lit the bulb you would
Photo-Detach the Negative Leptons from it an see them hit the tube phosphor.
The Negative Ion Blemish problem with the small screen TV picture tubes
only cropped up in the 7,000 to 14,000 volt range. Apparently the higher
voltages strip the Leptons off of the ions and the lower voltages used for
5" CRTs don't give the ions enough momentum to destroy the phosphor when
they hit it.
Any bets as to where they hit the side of the tube or the phosphor? :-)
Regards, Frederick
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From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: More from Mizuno
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I had another conversation with Mizuno today. I am preparing to tackle the
Japanese manuscript he will e-mail me. We went over the calorimetry and
some questions about the tungsten materials that Ed Storms brought up. I
want to look up some equipment specifications on Internet. Here are some of
my notes and my evolving checklist.
The tungsten is Nilaco 99.9%, which is not particularly pure. It is not
ductile, which Ed says means it has oxygen contamination. The lead wire is
also tungsten and it is spot welded onto the cathode and covered with
Teflon. Before and after welding the cathode is cleaned carefully with aqua
regia and various other preparations are made, which I will learn in detail.
We are preparing a list of cautions -- dos and don'ts.
The electrolyte is 150 cc of 0.2 mol. potassium carbonate. I will bring
back a bottle of the reagent.
Here is a look at the calorimetry:
Input power is measured with an Advantest R7326-B data logger. The
specifications are at: http://www.advantest.co.jp/catalog-e/eauto.htm, in
pdf format. (Don't you just LOVE the Web for stuff like this?!?) Voltage is
fairly steady but amperage bounces around, oscillating in one example from
0.6 to 1.4 amps with regular periodicity a few seconds in duration, caused
by bubble formation.
The cooler is an Advantec LF480 (not Advantest -- a completely different
company.)
The pump is a Cole Palmer Masterflex (a line that seems to be made by a
company called Barnant). I think the model is PA-71B, but I do not find
that on the web site http://www.barnant.com. Mizuno describes it as a low
flow rate, high precision, peristaltic pump. It looks like an expensive
little gem. The flow rate is adjusted from 1 to 6 ml/second to keep the
cell temperature above 80 deg C.
Mass flow is measured once per minute with high precision weight scale made
by a German company, Sartorius (http://www.sartorius.com), the BP model I
think. Another gem: 0.00001/0.0001 gram, 80/210 g. max model BP211D.
McKubre et al. describe a similar setup. This is the most accurate and
reliable way to measure flow; overall accuracy is ~0.7%.
Data is stored on an NEC PC, in Lotus spreadsheets. Data is also recorded
directly with a pen recorder for backup.
The highest excess energy recorded was:
Input power 120 volts * 1 amp = 120 watts
Inlet temperature was 23 deg C; outlet was 62 deg C; Delta T equals 39 deg
C. The flow rate was 1.689 grams per second, which comes to 277 watts.
Smaller Delta T temperatures ranging from 22 to 30 degrees at this flow
rate are more common.
Pure water is circulated, not electrolyte. The cell is a double layer of
glass, 5 cm in diameter, 12 cm tall. The cooling water enters the bottom of
the cell, fills the outer layer, and goes out the top, so a layer of
cooling water jackets the inner container. The calorimeter is not
particularly well insulated: 95% of the heat is recovered. Most heat losses
are from the top. Calibrations were performed with joule heaters and null
electrolysis at steps from 100 to 500 watts.
(If this was s.p.f. I would have to explain at this point that the 95%
recovery rate means the cell is producing *more* heat than the raw numbers
indicate, and no allowance is taken to account for recombination. Measured,
known heat losses make no difference unless you try to include a fudge
factor to make up for them. I could explain that until the cows come home,
but people would still be yelling that "the calorimetry is only 95%
accurate!")
I misunderstood Mizuno's earlier statements about the duration of the
tests. I hope I have it right this time! Each test run is 1,000 seconds
long (17 minutes), and one cathode was run 5 times in a row (1.4 hours).
The cathodes are damaged, but not as badly as ours were, I think. They run
every day, so total run times from all cathodes adds up "weeks," as Mizuno
told me on Sunday. A powerful run produces 200 KJ excess energy.
The cell components cost roughly $500 total. (The cooler, pump and other
calorimeter components cost a great deal more than that!) I plan to bring
back at least three fully assembled cells, plus a box cathodes and a bottle
of reagent. I am not sure whether we have the expertise to prepare
materials and assemble a cell, but I suppose experts can be hired.
Operating a clean, assembled cell should be easier than making one . . . I
hope. Ed Storms suggested that if the tungsten is not pure, contamination
should not be a major stumbling block with this experiment. There must be a
lot of random material in there already. Perhaps the tungsten must have
some specific impurity at the level of ~0.1%, and only Nilaco's samples
have the mystery element in them. I do not know how much mass spectrography
Ohmori and Mizuno have done on the cathodes. I suppose they have looked at
the chemical makeup closely, but they have not examined the samples that we
used, and the ones Scott Little used, which did not produce excess heat, so
they may not know what caused our samples not to work. I know that the rate
at which the tungsten was destroyed was quite different in these three
tests. Ours crumbled immediately, O&M's is robust (but I am not sure how
long it lasts), and as I recall, Little's cathodes were hardly damaged.
This huge difference in performance must have some bearing on the apparent
excess heat effect. This is speculation, but perhaps the effect did not
occur in Little's case, so no damage was done by excess heat. Perhaps we
have a Goldilocks problem: our tungsten is too soft, Little's is too hard,
O&M's is ju-u-u-s-t right, so it absorbs hydrogen (?) and reacts.
. . . well, I have my work cut out for me.
- Jed
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Hank,
Quoting Beethoven after a long struggle with thought -
'Can it be so? .. It must be so!'
In your example, a little bit of energy went into the manufacture of the
magnet and around it is a cerain 'field' energy. When the bomb crashes,
some of the ke gets converted into electrical energy.
I am now confused about the term 'field energy' because to me, a field is
just a messenger, a piece of rope, saying 'something has changed over
here'. So when people quote the Faraday/Lenz/Maxwell law: Curl E = -dO/dt
they must resolve all the contributions to the field from all the sources.
It is the resultant field.
So if I have a ferromagnet which I expend a little energy on going below
the Curie point then surround it with closed coils, when it heats up that
heat *is* getting converted to electrical energy. The apparent field
energy of the sample is not the only energy available on collapse, we must
find the net field from the sample and the coils. No?
Now what if the collapse is not heat mediated. What is the mechanism? For
heat, the dipoles find it harder to randomise when surrounded by all those
coils - a 'virtual' extra heat capacity exists as the sample warms up.
What dipole interaction exists for a non-heat mediate collapse?
Remi.
On Tue, 11 May 1999, Scudder, Henry J wrote:
> Remi
> At one time a ceramic permanent magnet was used in artillery shells
> as a fuze actuator. When the shell would impact, the magnet would shatter,
> and the coil surrounding it would get a large electromagnetic pulse, which
> would cause the shell to explode.
>
> Hank
>
> > ----------
> > From: George Holz[SMTP:george varisys.com]
> > Reply To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 1:15 PM
> > To: vortex-l eskimo.com
> > Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy
> >
> >
> > Hi Remi, You wrote:
> >
> > >Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low
> > >resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage.
> > >We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux
> > >collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the
> > same
> > >flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we
> > >have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules
> > electrical
> > >power.
> >
> > You do not get N times J joules of energy. If you truly have shorted
> > linked
> > coils with low resistance, the field does not collapse as the shorted
> > coils
> > force the linked flux to remain constant. A shorted coil cannot provide
> > any
> > electrical energy output - it would have to appear as a voltage across
> > the short.
> > If a magnetic field exists, it must be caused by an
> > existing current or an aligned magnetic material. It is important to
> > know the source in order to evaluate possible available energy output
> > which would occur during the collapse of the field.
> >
> > Regards,
> > George
> > -
> > George Holz Varitronics Systems
> > 732-356-7773 george varisys.com
> > 1924 US Hwy 22 East Bound Brook NJ 08805
> >
> >
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 03:26:49 1999
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To:
Subject: Re: Cold Fusion and Hot Bricks
Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 04:20:38 -0600
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To: Vortex
The 23% Pore Volume of Common Brick with Nanometer to Micron Pore
size, and the ability of the brick to effect ion exchange should lend itself
nicely
to CF experimentation (similar to Case's Pd-Activated Carbon activity).
A convenient high pressure vessel can be made using schedule 80 mild or
stainless steel pipe with welded flanges and matching cover plates with
threaded
penetrations. For a 6 inch pipe the flanges have 12 holes to accept
3/4 " bolts and use flat gaskets for a pressure seal.
Clamp-on band heaters (www.watlow.com ) are sized to fit most standard pipe
sizes.
The Brick can be "diced" using a saw with a masonry blade. Or you can use
Activated Carbon (about $7.00/lb at aquarium supply stores).
If the bolts are tightened to the proper torque rating, the 6" pipes can be
safely pressurized to 1,000 PSIG, with air, hydrogen or steam/hot water.
Regards, Frederick
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To:
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 04:35:21 -0600
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Lots of other goodies also. FJS
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From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 07:27:27 1999
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 10:09:41 -0400
To: vortex-L eskimo.com
From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: Additions and corrections from Mizuno
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Here are some additions and corrections to my note about Mizuno, based on
an English e-mail he sent to Scott Little and me:
Current is determined by measuring voltage through a shunt (Hioki Co. 9081;
0.01 Ohm, DC10A 0.1%) connected to a data logger (Advantest R7326B, as
stated earlier).
A digital power meter (Yokogawa co. WT130) is used to "calibrate" the power
measurements. I am not sure what this means.
A typical flow volume is 1.68 g/s.
Calibration was from 10 to 300 watts, not 100 to 500 watts as I reported
earlier. Maybe we are talking about a different data set; it is hard to
believe I got that wrong. Mizuno was riffling through spreadsheet printouts
when he described that.
Heat recovery is 95% when calibrated with joule heating or ordinary glow
discharge electrolysis, but it falls to ~80% with ordinary electrolysis.
This is probably because with ordinary glow discharge electrolysis,
overpotential is high so most of the energy goes into joule heating,
whereas with ordinary electrolysis more of the energy is carried off in
free oxygen and hydrogen. This is an open cell.
He used 0.1-m K2CO3. My notes say clearly 0.2 molar. Maybe we are talking
about a different run.
K type of thermocouples are used in the cell inlet and outlet. High voltage
noise from the cell affected the thermocouples. They were regrounded to fix
this problem.
- Jed
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To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
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At 11:53 PM 5/11/99, Jed Rothwell wrote:
[snip]
>The highest excess energy recorded was:
>
>Input power 120 volts * 1 amp = 120 watts
Two comments:
(1) I don't see in the description of the calorimetry where the electrode
is weighed before and after, and compensation made for the caloric value of
the oxidation of the tungsten. If this is not done the caloric input value
is low.
(2) The 1000 second run times may not be sufficient to establish that the
vast majority of the run was made during stable thermal conditions.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 09:07:37 1999
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May 12, 1999
Vortex,
Ali Javey sent an e-mail notice:
> The World of Science web site has been relocated and redesigned. Now
> it has its own domain name:
> <>
>
> A l i J a v e y
> ajavey worldnet.att.net
> The World of Science
> <>
A quick glance at the site caught a short news note that at Havard,
light was slowed to 38 mph (miles per hour) going through a
'Bose-Einstein condensate' with plans to slow light a 1,000 times more.
I've read that the speed of light changes going through substances. Does
E=MC2 remain immortal? What's going on?
-AK-
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 10:24:03 1999
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:20:23 -0400
To: vortex-L eskimo.com
From: Jed Rothwell
Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
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Horace Heffner writes:
(1) I don't see in the description of the calorimetry where the
electrode is weighed before and after, and compensation made for
the caloric value of the oxidation of the tungsten. If this is
not done the caloric input value is low.
If I can decipher my notes here . . . Mizuno estimated the maximum value of
chemical fuel in the cell at 1 KJ, if all fuel is oxidized. That never
happens. As I said, high-powered runs produced 200 KJ, and some cathodes
were used repeatedly.
The cathode is a rectangle, 10 mm by 5 mm, 0.5 mm thick, with a 1 mm
diameter tungsten lead wire spot-welded on to it. Maybe you can figure out
the mass of 25 mm^3 of tungsten, and the maximum caloric value from burning
it. Lesssee . . . that's 0.025 cm^3 of metal, which has a density of 12
g/cm^3, so we have 0.3 grams. If it was gasoline it would produce 12,600
joules. 0.3 grams of high-volatile B bituminous commonly agglomerating coal
(whatever that is) would produce 9,060 joules, according to Britannica and
the 1993 Annual Book of ASTM Standards, section 5, volume 5.05. (CDs and
the Internet are grand! They let you make these authoritative
pronouncements without knowing anything.)
(2) The 1000 second run times may not be sufficient to
establish that the vast majority of the run was made during
stable thermal conditions.
I have not seen data for this, but based on our runs and the small amount
of electrolyte (150 ml), I would expect the cell to reach maximum
temperature quickly. I don't think it goes into a "stable" condition. The
runs I have seen on video flicker, sputter, and change violently.
I'm not sure when he begins the 1000 second recording: from the time the
power turns on, or from the time the cell temperature exceeds the 80 ~ 85
deg C threshold. I may need to visit Japan to iron out these details. I'm
copying these messages to Mizuno along with questions in Japanese, so we
may get answers sooner, or I may interrupt him and delay the paper he is
writing.
- Jed
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 11:27:53 1999
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Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
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----- Original Message -----
From: Jed Rothwell
To:
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 1999 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
Jed writes,
>(CDs and
> the Internet are grand! They let you make these authoritative
> pronouncements without knowing anything.)
ROFL! So do Nobel Awards and other such Certificates! :-)
Regards, Frederick
>
> - Jed
>
>
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:00:39 1999
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To: vortex-l eskimo.com
From: hheffner mtaonline.net (Horace Heffner)
Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
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At 1:20 PM 5/12/99, Jed Rothwell wrote:
>Horace Heffner writes:
>The cathode is a rectangle, 10 mm by 5 mm, 0.5 mm thick, with a 1 mm
>diameter tungsten lead wire spot-welded on to it. Maybe you can figure out
>the mass of 25 mm^3 of tungsten, and the maximum caloric value from burning
>it. Lesssee . . . that's 0.025 cm^3 of metal, which has a density of 12
>g/cm^3, so we have 0.3 grams.
Using 1520.9 kJ/mol for Ti2O3 formation, that's (1520.9 kJ/mol)/(2*183.85
g/mol of Ti2) = 4.1 kJ/g maximum enthalpy.
Using your 0.3 g we have (4.1 kJ/g)(0.3 g) = 1.23 kJ, which I agree is not
significant compared against 150 J/s for 1000 s = 150 kJ excess heat,
especially considering it is a maximum value which requires complete
consumption of the electrode.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
From vortex-l-request eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:38:18 1999
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:39:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Schnurer
To: vortex-l eskimo.com
Subject: Re: Leptons and Fluorescing Incandescent Light Bulbs
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Dear Vo.,
Below is mention of "blemish" ..... what blemish is this?
What is the emprirical nature of the blemish? When and how and
why does it happen?
Thanks,
John
On Tue, 11 May 1999, Frederick Sparber wrote:
> FWIW, Horace. Rubbing an incandescent light bulb by holding it by the base
> in one hand and rubbing it with a Cotton Handkerchief with the other hand
> will excite the 500 Torr Argon-Nitrogen gas in it enough to make it
> fluoresce.
>
> A Silk Cloth WILL NOT work apparently because it sequesters the Leptons
> and/or Negative Ions (O2-) from the bulb.
>
> You can get the same effect with about any fluorescent bulb.
>
> I would bet that if you inserted a light bulb into the neck of a CRT with a
> Negative "pusher" electrode behind it, when you lit the bulb you would
> Photo-Detach the Negative Leptons from it an see them hit the tube phosphor.
>
> The Negative Ion Blemish problem with the small screen TV picture tubes
> only cropped up in the 7,000 to 14,000 volt range. Apparently the higher
> voltages strip the Leptons off of the ions and the lower voltages used for
> 5" CRTs don't give the ions enough momentum to destroy the phosphor when
> they hit it.
>
> Any bets as to where they hit the side of the tube or the phosphor? :-)
>
> Regards, Frederick
>
>
>
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Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 18:08:32 -0500
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From: Scott Little
Subject: Re: Additions and corrections from Mizuno
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At 10:09 5/12/99 -0400, Jed Rothwell wrote:
>Here are some additions and corrections to my note about Mizuno, based on
>an English e-mail he sent to Scott Little and me:
I'm glad Mizuno copied you, Jed. Your experience in interpreting the
unusual sentence structure of a native Japanese speaker is valuable.
I am delighted at Mizuno's cooperative attitude. For example he says, "I
am welcome anytime you want" regarding my proposal to visit his lab.
However, in view of the distance, I am presently inclined to make another
attempt at replication...this time matching his apparatus much more closely.
>A digital power meter (Yokogawa co. WT130) is used to "calibrate" the power
>measurements. I am not sure what this means.
Me neither. I've looked at his data logger's specs and it is possible to
make it sample at 60 points/200ms...or 300 points/sec...or once every 3
milliseconds. That's not fast enough to faithfully track the erratic
current spikes so I think the average of his periodic current samples will
be equal to the AVERAGE current drawn by the cell. If he multiplies that
by the measured voltage across the cell, he should be OK...at least not
understating the input power. But I wish he would just use the Yokogawa
power analyzer.
>A typical flow volume is 1.68 g/s.
Wow, this is pretty low for a 250 watt "signal". At that output power
level, the water will undergo a 36C delta-T. I don't see anything
fundamentally wrong with it, though.
>Heat recovery is 95% when calibrated with joule heating or ordinary glow
>discharge electrolysis, but it falls to ~80% with ordinary electrolysis.
>This is probably because with ordinary glow discharge electrolysis,
>overpotential is high so most of the energy goes into joule heating,
>whereas with ordinary electrolysis more of the energy is carried off in
>free oxygen and hydrogen. This is an open cell.
I could see this effect in my earlier M-O cell...it wasn't that big but it
was quite noticeable.
Scott Little, EarthTech Int'l, Inc. http://www.eden.com/~little
Suite 300, 4030 Braker Lane West, Austin TX 78759, USA
512-342-2185 (voice), 512-346-3017 (FAX), little eden.com (email)
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Subject: Re: More from Mizuno
Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 23:34:28 GMT
Organization: Improving
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On Wed, 12 May 1999 11:13:07 -0900, Horace Heffner wrote:
>At 1:20 PM 5/12/99, Jed Rothwell wrote:
>>Horace Heffner writes:
>
>>The cathode is a rectangle, 10 mm by 5 mm, 0.5 mm thick, with a 1 mm
>>diameter tungsten lead wire spot-welded on to it. Maybe you can figure out
>>the mass of 25 mm^3 of tungsten, and the maximum caloric value from burning
>>it. Lesssee . . . that's 0.025 cm^3 of metal, which has a density of 12
>>g/cm^3, so we have 0.3 grams.
>
>Using 1520.9 kJ/mol for Ti2O3 formation, that's (1520.9 kJ/mol)/(2*183.85
>g/mol of Ti2) = 4.1 kJ/g maximum enthalpy.
>
>Using your 0.3 g we have (4.1 kJ/g)(0.3 g) = 1.23 kJ, which I agree is not
>significant compared against 150 J/s for 1000 s = 150 kJ excess heat,
>especially considering it is a maximum value which requires complete
>consumption of the electrode.
Though I agree that the enthalpies won't differ by a factor 100, I'm
still curious why you used Ti rather than W for your calculation?
Regards,
Robin van Spaandonk
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