[00:02.670 --> 00:06.610] [______WBAI]: Hi, this is DJ Baby K from The Sweet Spot.
[00:06.870 --> 00:11.630] [______WBAI]: On the go, but want to support the station dedicated to you, the listener?
[00:11.870 --> 00:12.890] [______WBAI]: No problem.
[00:13.190 --> 00:21.230] [______WBAI]: Simply dial 41444 and text TRANSMIT995 to make a pledge by text.
[00:21.470 --> 00:27.150] [______WBAI]: Support WBAI's unique voice and keep us on the air during this critical time.
[00:27.150 --> 00:35.110] [______WBAI]: Once again, dial 41444 and text TRANSMIT995 to make your pledge.
[00:35.530 --> 00:43.090] [______WBAI]: Thanks for supporting listener-sponsored community radio, WBAI 99.5 FM.
[00:49.850 --> 00:58.730] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes, you are listening to radio station WBAI 99.5 FM.
[00:59.610 --> 01:00.330] [ALEXURBELS]: WBAI!
[01:01.770 --> 01:02.490] [ALEXURBELS]: Back!
[01:03.290 --> 01:05.190] [ROBVINCENT]: The day is Wednesday.
[01:05.190 --> 01:07.530] [ROBVINCENT]: The time is just about 8 o'clock PM.
[01:07.890 --> 01:11.570] [ROBVINCENT]: That means it's time for the triumphant return of Off The Hook.
[02:09.730 --> 02:12.520] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes, the program is Off The Hook.
[02:13.740 --> 02:14.500] [ROBVINCENT]: Rob T. Firefly here with you.
[02:16.020 --> 02:18.240] [ROBVINCENT]: I am joined in the studio by Alex.
[02:18.580 --> 02:19.710] [ALEXURBELS]: Good evening again.
[02:20.300 --> 02:21.120] [ROBVINCENT]: Volt4ire is here.
[02:21.460 --> 02:21.680] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Hello.
[02:22.270 --> 02:22.930] [ROBVINCENT]: Gila is here.
[02:23.100 --> 02:23.360] [GILADRAZEN]: Hi.
[02:23.820 --> 02:26.060] [ROBVINCENT]: And on the phone we have Kyle.
[02:28.080 --> 02:28.680] [ROBVINCENT]: Hello.
[02:29.100 --> 02:30.060] [ROBVINCENT]: And Emmanuel.
[02:31.710 --> 02:32.280] [EVILCORLEY]: Hey there.
[02:32.500 --> 02:32.860] [EVILCORLEY]: Wow.
[02:32.860 --> 02:34.080] [EVILCORLEY]: We're back on the air!
[02:34.580 --> 02:35.060] [EVILCORLEY]: Hey.
[02:35.430 --> 02:36.180] [EVILCORLEY]: Welcome back, guys.
[02:37.620 --> 02:38.600] [EVILCORLEY]: Well, thank you.
[02:39.160 --> 02:40.710] [EVILCORLEY]: We're not back yet.
[02:40.710 --> 02:41.440] [EVILCORLEY]: We're on a train.
[02:42.280 --> 02:44.460] [EVILCORLEY]: You see what happened when the station got taken over.
[02:45.920 --> 02:48.220] [EVILCORLEY]: We just thought there was nothing in New York for us anymore.
[02:48.220 --> 02:52.450] [EVILCORLEY]: So we took a train ride and just started going west.
[02:53.040 --> 02:56.080] [EVILCORLEY]: And then when the station came back on the air, we hopped on the first train back.
[02:56.180 --> 02:57.040] [EVILCORLEY]: But it's not there yet.
[02:57.200 --> 03:00.300] [EVILCORLEY]: So unfortunately, we can't be there in the studio with you tonight.
[03:00.900 --> 03:07.540] [ROBVINCENT]: You know, it does make sense that you would have the urge to run away from the chaos that have been going on.
[03:07.730 --> 03:09.500] [ROBVINCENT]: But yes, we are back.
[03:10.340 --> 03:11.400] [ROBVINCENT]: WBAI is back.
[03:11.900 --> 03:13.540] [ROBVINCENT]: By extension, Off The Hook is back.
[03:13.700 --> 03:16.020] [ROBVINCENT]: And we are just happy to be back.
[03:18.800 --> 03:20.240] [_VOLT4IRE_]: It feels great to be here.
[03:20.700 --> 03:21.100] [ALEXURBELS]: Yeah.
[03:21.200 --> 03:22.600] [ALEXURBELS]: It's been a long time coming, guys.
[03:22.780 --> 03:23.920] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, I've missed you all.
[03:24.020 --> 03:27.800] [ALEXURBELS]: I haven't really seen you since the whole coup started.
[03:28.740 --> 03:30.640] [ALEXURBELS]: And, you know, we're all back.
[03:30.800 --> 03:32.080] [ALEXURBELS]: It's like putting the band together again.
[03:32.260 --> 03:33.280] [ALEXURBELS]: This is fantastic.
[03:33.600 --> 03:35.700] [ALEXURBELS]: It's great to see everybody's face.
[03:35.700 --> 03:38.280] [EVILCORLEY]: You know, we're professional.
[03:38.340 --> 03:43.800] [EVILCORLEY]: So we don't socialize outside of the show because, you know, that would violate our professional lives.
[03:43.960 --> 03:48.280] [EVILCORLEY]: So the only possibility of us actually interacting is when Off The Hook is on the air.
[03:48.400 --> 03:58.020] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, I think I speak for the whole show in saying we get enough of you between 8 o'clock and 9 o'clock every Wednesday that we probably don't need anymore the rest of the week, Emmanuel.
[03:58.230 --> 03:59.730] [EVILCORLEY]: No, I feel the same way.
[03:59.820 --> 04:01.180] [EVILCORLEY]: In fact, distance didn't even improve.
[04:01.360 --> 04:02.730] [EVILCORLEY]: So I don't know.
[04:03.140 --> 04:04.860] [EVILCORLEY]: We have some interesting times ahead of us.
[04:04.860 --> 04:05.420] [EVILCORLEY]: That's for sure.
[04:05.700 --> 04:11.340] [EVILCORLEY]: You know, let's go to what happened at the radio station because, wow, this was in all the newspapers.
[04:11.340 --> 04:13.230] [EVILCORLEY]: This was on all the TV channels.
[04:13.760 --> 04:15.120] [EVILCORLEY]: We were taken over.
[04:15.320 --> 04:22.140] [EVILCORLEY]: The station was shut down by a rogue group of people involved with Pacifica.
[04:23.020 --> 04:33.240] [EVILCORLEY]: I just want to make it clear that the reason we're back on the air is because the Pacifica National Board voted in our favor to bring the station back.
[04:33.440 --> 04:36.380] [EVILCORLEY]: There were certain elements that did not want to bring the station back.
[04:36.380 --> 04:42.170] [EVILCORLEY]: And they tried to disenfranchise the people who were voting for WBAI.
[04:42.170 --> 04:43.640] [EVILCORLEY]: They lost in court.
[04:43.800 --> 04:44.840] [EVILCORLEY]: There were a lot of court hearings.
[04:45.000 --> 04:47.140] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to thank all the listeners who showed up at those court hearings.
[04:47.360 --> 04:53.140] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to thank the listeners who showed up at our special program in October downstairs at the Common.
[04:53.500 --> 04:55.080] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to thank the Commons.
[04:55.200 --> 05:04.680] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to thank Melissa, who runs it and is our landlord, for being so patient with WBAI and for enduring all kinds of hardship on our behalf.
[05:05.330 --> 05:09.920] [EVILCORLEY]: But in the end, in the end, justice won.
[05:10.240 --> 05:13.560] [EVILCORLEY]: It's not really the end because there's all kinds of other things that could happen.
[05:13.730 --> 05:20.600] [EVILCORLEY]: And we still have some major, major challenges to deal with as a result of everything that's been going on.
[05:20.730 --> 05:24.040] [EVILCORLEY]: But for now, for this moment, I think we really should be happy.
[05:24.470 --> 05:26.410] [ALEXURBELS]: Yeah, I completely agree, Emmanuel.
[05:26.680 --> 05:39.560] [ALEXURBELS]: And one person I think that we really need to offer some very heartfelt thanks to is Arthur Schwartz, a fellow WBAI host, and the lawyer that has represented the station throughout this entire debacle.
[05:39.820 --> 05:41.380] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, it has really been a fiasco.
[05:41.520 --> 05:52.020] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, it started in state court that Monday night when we woke up in the morning and we realized that the station was taken over and the locks were changed and the employees were terminated and we were out of a radio station.
[05:52.340 --> 06:09.260] [ALEXURBELS]: That night, Arthur was able to quite literally rouse a judge out of his sleeping chambers in his home in his pajamas to show up on his doorsteps in Brooklyn and issue a restraining order against Pacifica.
[06:09.380 --> 06:14.100] [ALEXURBELS]: And that's that same restraining order that was reinstated a week ago today.
[06:14.700 --> 06:25.560] [ALEXURBELS]: So, I mean, I think we all owe a gigantic debt of gratitude to Arthur Schwartz because this has been a significant lift when it comes to legal work.
[06:25.560 --> 06:37.480] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, this is a very, very huge amount of work that he has done on behalf of the station, has done admirably, diligently, day in and day out, and to a very successful result.
[06:37.480 --> 06:42.620] [ALEXURBELS]: So, I think that, you know, we all owe him a round of applause, quite frankly.
[06:42.880 --> 06:42.900] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Yes, yes.
[06:43.040 --> 06:43.900] [ALEXURBELS]: Way to go, Arthur.
[06:44.540 --> 06:44.940] [ALEXURBELS]: Absolutely.
[06:45.320 --> 07:10.380] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And in addition to that, Alex, I just want to also add all of the people that are a part of the local station management, as well as volunteers, and our producers, the many producers, and, of course, our engineers, faithful engineers at WBAI, everybody who stuck with the station and saw this through and supported Arthur's efforts,
[07:10.380 --> 07:21.040] [_VOLT4IRE_]: as well as all the efforts from everyone in the listening area that really saw this action as an enormous loss, as it is, and was at the time.
[07:21.200 --> 07:33.840] [_VOLT4IRE_]: But coming back, it is absolutely something to feel a bit of triumph about, and all those people sticking with us and the legal efforts, that stuff really makes a difference.
[07:33.840 --> 07:48.680] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely, and the station, while we were off the air, producers from the station and people involved with the station, and listeners of the station had been coming to meetings that were being held and things like that to see what we could do to organize our efforts in taking back the station.
[07:49.060 --> 08:01.060] [ROBVINCENT]: And I met at these events so many Off The Hook listeners who showed up, who, you know, they weren't station staff, they weren't station producers, they just cared about the station.
[08:01.060 --> 08:20.320] [ROBVINCENT]: And I gotta, I gotta extend a really heartfelt thanks to, to everyone I met there and everyone else who's just out there and continuing to spread the news, because part of the hardest thing about all of this is when the station was taken off the air, the faction within Pacifica that had control of all this basically took our,
[08:20.320 --> 08:24.840] [ROBVINCENT]: our, our, our wavelength and broadcast generic canned crap on it.
[08:25.240 --> 08:28.380] [ROBVINCENT]: And the listeners had no way of knowing what was going on.
[08:29.060 --> 08:42.340] [ROBVINCENT]: You know, if they had no connections to WBAI via social media or things like that, it would be very easy for people to just assume that the station had changed format and, and go and find something else to listen to because what was on was not good.
[08:42.520 --> 08:45.540] [ROBVINCENT]: So we are back, but we have to get that word out that we are back.
[08:46.480 --> 08:53.320] [ROBVINCENT]: And the, the, the efforts of the, the people who are still listening and who still care about this station are vital in this.
[08:54.080 --> 09:10.280] [ROBVINCENT]: We, we can do all the shouting that we can, but one important thing I have to ask of those of you still listening to us is spread the word, tell people that WBAI is back, that WBAI is back in the hands of the people who, in, in whom it belongs and that,
[09:10.380 --> 09:12.900] [ROBVINCENT]: that, that we're still worth listening to and supporting.
[09:13.620 --> 09:21.070] [ROBVINCENT]: Get the word out, tell people, tell your friends, tell your family, tell your enemies, uh, spray paint walls with permission probably.
[09:21.520 --> 09:28.400] [ROBVINCENT]: And, uh, and just get the word, just get the word out that WBAI 99.5 FM WBAI.org is back.
[09:29.400 --> 09:38.860] [EVILCORLEY]: And, you know, Rob, uh, one of the, one of the things that happened in the immediate aftermath of the coup, and it was a coup, the October 7th coup is what it's being called.
[09:39.240 --> 09:47.450] [EVILCORLEY]: Um, one of the immediate aftermaths of that was, uh, a mass cancellation of listener subscriptions to WBAI.
[09:47.540 --> 09:47.900] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes.
[09:48.020 --> 09:53.240] [EVILCORLEY]: And, uh, I can totally understand why, uh, people would be outraged and why they would do that.
[09:53.720 --> 09:55.620] [EVILCORLEY]: Um, but we need those people to come back.
[09:55.780 --> 09:57.710] [EVILCORLEY]: We need those people to be WBAI buddies again.
[09:57.960 --> 10:04.740] [EVILCORLEY]: In fact, we need even more WBAI buddies to sign up because that is the only way the station is going to survive.
[10:04.900 --> 10:13.710] [EVILCORLEY]: Now you've seen what can happen, uh, if there is even a slight disagreement among certain people who allegedly are on the same side.
[10:13.830 --> 10:21.640] [EVILCORLEY]: Well, we've managed to, to, uh, to basically show those people for who they are, and they will never be trusted again.
[10:21.960 --> 10:23.020] [EVILCORLEY]: That's just a fact.
[10:23.140 --> 10:29.710] [EVILCORLEY]: But there are so many other people who really want to preserve community radio, really want to preserve local radio in New York.
[10:29.950 --> 10:34.020] [EVILCORLEY]: And we all realize that there's work that needs to be done to save this station.
[10:34.220 --> 10:48.420] [EVILCORLEY]: And we, you know, we would have realized, we did realize that before, but we would have certainly worked with people to ensure that we do things that make sense, that, uh, bring more, more listener support, that keep the station, keep the station, uh,
[10:48.620 --> 10:48.960] [EVILCORLEY]: surviving.
[10:49.220 --> 10:59.880] [EVILCORLEY]: Uh, it's really, really difficult to do that with people who came in, uh, changed a lot, kicked everybody out, told the landlord to find a new tenant and cut off access to the transmitter.
[11:00.020 --> 11:06.880] [EVILCORLEY]: That doesn't exactly, um, bring forth a whole lot of trust in what you really want to do with WBAI.
[11:07.100 --> 11:12.140] [EVILCORLEY]: So I think we're coming back into this with a renewed vigor, with more spirit.
[11:12.420 --> 11:23.640] [EVILCORLEY]: And I'm hoping, hoping that translates into more people calling us and going to the website and becoming WBAI buddies and pledging and making the station as strong as it deserves to be.
[11:23.760 --> 11:39.600] [EVILCORLEY]: And on our end, I hope that we really take a good look at the programming and, and provide things that people want and that we become a passionate voice of justice and peace in the New York City area, predominantly New York City, because that's who we are.
[11:39.740 --> 11:45.340] [EVILCORLEY]: And that's one of the reasons why we didn't just turn into a podcast because we're not narrow casting.
[11:45.500 --> 11:46.320] [EVILCORLEY]: We're broadcasting.
[11:46.320 --> 11:50.020] [EVILCORLEY]: We're broadcasting to all of New York, to all of the metropolitan region.
[11:50.220 --> 11:52.940] [EVILCORLEY]: And so many people find WBAI by accident.
[11:53.200 --> 11:56.460] [EVILCORLEY]: We want people to continue to do that for decades to come.
[11:56.600 --> 12:04.240] [EVILCORLEY]: And we hope, we hope that this unfortunate event that took us off the air and lost us many listeners who still don't know we're back on the air.
[12:04.660 --> 12:13.440] [EVILCORLEY]: We just hope that this renews the spirit that made this place possible in the first place, and that we go into the future with more passion than ever.
[12:13.680 --> 12:32.720] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Yeah, a lot of the things that we were already doing, we want to double down on, as well as, uh, embarking on new initiatives and, uh, taking those good looks at programming and, and, uh, new possibilities, uh, for, uh, delivering, as he said, delivering what people are after the kinds of,
[12:32.720 --> 12:43.180] [_VOLT4IRE_]: um, uh, uh, street reporting or, um, special events, um, or, uh, syndication of, of live events, uh, in, in government and elsewhere.
[12:43.200 --> 12:53.840] [_VOLT4IRE_]: I think all of those kinds of things are possible, but we want to basically pick up where we left off and, um, as I said, redouble all of those efforts with this renewed vigor.
[12:55.300 --> 13:01.680] [ALEXURBELS]: Yeah, I, I, I, and I'll tell you guys, I mean, you, you, you both make extraordinarily valid points.
[13:02.060 --> 13:17.600] [ALEXURBELS]: And let me tell you, with the people and the vigor that I saw at places like the First Appellate Division, when the Pacifica National Board had appealed the first order from Judge Nervo, um, I mean, the place was packed.
[13:18.000 --> 13:21.980] [ALEXURBELS]: And, you know, the, the people that really, really cared about the station were there.
[13:22.100 --> 13:23.160] [ALEXURBELS]: They were there in federal court.
[13:23.280 --> 13:24.240] [ALEXURBELS]: They were there in state court.
[13:24.440 --> 13:27.520] [ALEXURBELS]: They went from the First Appellate Division over to the Supreme Court.
[13:28.420 --> 13:40.100] [ALEXURBELS]: Look, there's just an extraordinary amount of, of dedication and purpose, I think, that, that underlies WBAI from the ground up.
[13:40.220 --> 13:43.380] [ALEXURBELS]: And that, that, I'm talking about you guys that are listening right now, the listeners.
[13:44.100 --> 13:54.480] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, and, you know, we can laud Arthur Schwartz and the producers and the staff and everybody that, that, um, you know, continued to work and work very, very hard to make this place viable.
[13:54.780 --> 13:57.920] [ALEXURBELS]: But it really came down to the community support here.
[13:58.160 --> 14:00.340] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think it was extraordinarily overwhelming.
[14:00.600 --> 14:12.420] [ALEXURBELS]: And we need to parlay that into financial support for the station to keep this place alive, because it goes back to that, that, you know, I hate to say an old platitude, but you don't know what you have until it's gone.
[14:12.960 --> 14:16.040] [ALEXURBELS]: And we lost this place for a little over a month.
[14:16.280 --> 14:19.360] [ALEXURBELS]: We've been off the air and it has made a big difference.
[14:19.360 --> 14:23.520] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think in, in everybody's life, we've all, we've all felt that loss.
[14:23.760 --> 14:24.800] [ALEXURBELS]: It's been palpable.
[14:25.460 --> 14:29.880] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, you know, we, we, we joke about it, Emmanuel, but I, you know, I really missed you guys.
[14:29.880 --> 14:30.980] [ALEXURBELS]: I miss being on the air.
[14:31.080 --> 14:32.340] [ALEXURBELS]: I miss listening to the listeners.
[14:32.780 --> 14:37.740] [ALEXURBELS]: And, and that's what's really important about WBAI too, is that we listen to our word listeners.
[14:38.140 --> 14:46.680] [ALEXURBELS]: And now I think it's a time for us to listen even more intently, change, change whatever we need to change to make this place financially viable, get back on track.
[14:46.840 --> 14:47.580] [ALEXURBELS]: Let's do it.
[14:48.040 --> 14:48.440] [EVILCORLEY]: Yes.
[14:49.100 --> 14:51.700] [EVILCORLEY]: Now, of course, uh, you, you said that we were off the air.
[14:51.800 --> 14:57.320] [EVILCORLEY]: I just want to address those people who will already be writing emails to us saying that we weren't technically off the air.
[14:57.520 --> 14:57.900] [EVILCORLEY]: True.
[14:58.080 --> 15:00.580] [EVILCORLEY]: We weren't technically off the air because something replaced us.
[15:00.580 --> 15:15.340] [EVILCORLEY]: And that was, uh, canned programming, uh, from a service called Pacifica across America, which, you know, normally I would say, Hey, that's not a bad idea for, uh, you know, overnights or something or, or to fill in programming or just to get Pacifica out there more.
[15:15.900 --> 15:24.960] [EVILCORLEY]: However, in this case, it's tarnished because it's forever associated with taking over a radio station and replacing it with content that really wasn't relevant.
[15:24.960 --> 15:30.640] [EVILCORLEY]: A lot of it came from California and was, uh, uh, you know, with, with, uh, local issues in mind.
[15:30.860 --> 15:39.860] [EVILCORLEY]: Uh, but it, it basically, uh, led WBAI for the last four or five weeks to ignore things that were going on in New York City.
[15:39.960 --> 15:42.180] [EVILCORLEY]: And that's precisely what we should not be doing.
[15:42.460 --> 15:45.380] [EVILCORLEY]: We need to have a station that serves the public.
[15:45.480 --> 15:46.300] [EVILCORLEY]: And that's what it's all about.
[15:46.440 --> 15:48.300] [EVILCORLEY]: That's what we need to be doing.
[15:48.440 --> 15:50.320] [EVILCORLEY]: And that's what we want to continue to do.
[15:50.420 --> 15:59.020] [EVILCORLEY]: But we can only do that with the support of the listeners, as we've seen that support of our listeners got us back and now we need to keep going.
[15:59.280 --> 16:05.840] [EVILCORLEY]: So Rob, do you have the info handy as to how people can become WBAI buddies or if they want to call now the various options?
[16:06.520 --> 16:06.880] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[16:07.180 --> 16:11.140] [ROBVINCENT]: Because, uh, we are, we, we have had our pledge drive interrupted.
[16:11.380 --> 16:12.700] [ROBVINCENT]: Our pledge drive was proceeding.
[16:12.960 --> 16:13.860] [ROBVINCENT]: It was interrupted.
[16:14.120 --> 16:20.320] [ROBVINCENT]: This was a very calculated move on behalf of, uh, the people within Pacifica that, uh, that orchestrated the whole coup.
[16:20.320 --> 16:36.940] [ROBVINCENT]: Um, and so we have taken a major financial hit, you know, and we, the, the, uh, the situation that we have been talking about for a long time of, uh, just being really, uh, struggling financially, um, that became so much, so much more exponentially worse.
[16:37.220 --> 16:44.060] [ROBVINCENT]: And, uh, so we depend on you now more than ever, uh, to keep us going and, uh, donate what you can.
[16:44.220 --> 17:00.160] [ROBVINCENT]: And what you can do is call our pledge line at 516-620-3602 or go to give2wbai.org and, uh, uh, proceed to where you can become a WBAI buddy.
[17:00.400 --> 17:13.260] [ROBVINCENT]: Either ask the operator or, uh, look for the link on the webpage and you can become a WBAI buddy, which, uh, lets you donate any amount that, uh, you want on a regular basis, which gives the station something that's crucial, which is a predictable source of income,
[17:13.460 --> 17:15.260] [ROBVINCENT]: um, a constant source of income.
[17:15.260 --> 17:16.620] [ROBVINCENT]: It doesn't have to be a lot.
[17:16.820 --> 17:17.760] [ROBVINCENT]: Every little bit helps.
[17:17.960 --> 17:26.420] [ROBVINCENT]: Um, of course, if you do have a lot that you need to do something special with, especially with, uh, the end of the year coming up, um, by all means, we, we would appreciate any help you can give.
[17:26.740 --> 17:29.460] [ROBVINCENT]: Um, or you can, uh, you can text us.
[17:29.580 --> 17:30.540] [ROBVINCENT]: Where is that information?
[17:31.380 --> 17:32.620] [ROBVINCENT]: Uh, yes, there it is.
[17:32.820 --> 17:45.460] [ROBVINCENT]: If, uh, if you are, uh, within the United States, you can text the letters WBAI to the short code 41444, and, uh, you will receive and return a, a special link you can use to, uh, make donations to the station.
[17:45.580 --> 17:49.750] [ROBVINCENT]: Now we don't have our special premiums to offer you in return for your gifts.
[17:50.030 --> 17:55.940] [ROBVINCENT]: Um, at this point, we don't have the, um, the infrastructure to, uh, to do that.
[17:56.180 --> 17:57.250] [ROBVINCENT]: Um, the station is basically...
[17:57.250 --> 17:59.720] [EVILCORLEY]: Actually, Rob, can I just, can I just jump in?
[17:59.860 --> 18:00.720] [EVILCORLEY]: Because yes, we do.
[18:00.980 --> 18:02.920] [EVILCORLEY]: The premium is the radio station.
[18:03.060 --> 18:03.420] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes.
[18:03.420 --> 18:14.840] [EVILCORLEY]: And folks, if, if the events of the last few weeks have not proven that to you, I don't know what we can say because, you know, your support is what's going to make 99.5 continue to exist in New York City as a community station.
[18:15.120 --> 18:25.680] [EVILCORLEY]: Uh, the fact is, if we don't get calls, if we don't get people pledging, not just on this show, but on all the shows, it's going to happen again, except this time they will have learned from their mistakes.
[18:26.040 --> 18:34.800] [EVILCORLEY]: They'll, they'll stack the board with people that agree with them and they'll make it so that no court order will overturn what they decide to do to that frequency.
[18:35.100 --> 18:40.060] [EVILCORLEY]: So if WBAI means something to you, maybe, maybe you, you don't think it's as good as it could be, fine.
[18:40.460 --> 18:41.540] [EVILCORLEY]: We can make it better.
[18:41.750 --> 18:42.580] [EVILCORLEY]: You can make it better.
[18:42.790 --> 18:51.160] [EVILCORLEY]: If you think there's any hope, any potential for that, and it's something that you value or have valued in the past, please, it has never been more important than now.
[18:52.100 --> 18:52.460] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[18:52.800 --> 19:00.200] [ROBVINCENT]: And, uh, that's, that's why it is, it is so especially crucial now that, uh, if you can help, um, you, you throw in what you can and help us.
[19:00.290 --> 19:02.480] [ROBVINCENT]: That is give2wbai.org.
[19:02.480 --> 19:11.540] [ROBVINCENT]: That is 516-620-3602, or that is texting the letters WBAI to the short code 41444.
[19:11.860 --> 19:16.580] [ROBVINCENT]: We were completely unprepared on every level for what happened to us and, uh, we suffered for it.
[19:16.880 --> 19:22.770] [ROBVINCENT]: And that, that more than anything else, the lesson we're taking away from is we have not gone to back to business as usual.
[19:22.880 --> 19:25.530] [ROBVINCENT]: There is no back to business as usual for us here at WBAI.
[19:25.840 --> 19:35.030] [ROBVINCENT]: We are struggling and we are basically in extreme panic mode right now because we have been shown how easy it is for us to actually lose this place.
[19:35.290 --> 19:42.840] [ROBVINCENT]: We can say, uh, you know, we should keep doing things as we were because, uh, you know, we've done it that way since 19 needle, not a new, but, uh, no, this is, this is a new context.
[19:43.010 --> 19:44.620] [ROBVINCENT]: This is a new, a new age.
[19:44.790 --> 19:52.420] [ROBVINCENT]: And, uh, we've discovered what can happen to us if, uh, if our tenuous grip on things around here is, uh, is made to, uh, loosen.
[19:52.720 --> 19:55.530] [ROBVINCENT]: So if you go to Give2WBAI.com... I just wanted to add... Yes.
[19:56.320 --> 19:56.900] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes, Scott.
[19:57.030 --> 20:12.640] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Uh, it, it is that strong show of support for the, uh, Buddy program because I think that, that it's so crucial because I think that, that, that money being something that, that we can count on, even if it's a small amount, it, it would really make a statement.
[20:12.750 --> 20:30.010] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Uh, and as he said, not just for our show, but for all of the programming that you enjoy and is, uh, is, is the gift of radio, so please, um, really small amounts over that extended period of time, that is actually something I think might be a little bit more valuable than,
[20:30.120 --> 20:35.180] [_VOLT4IRE_]: than a larger donation just, just because we're, um, we're talking to you now or you're thinking of it.
[20:35.400 --> 20:52.080] [_VOLT4IRE_]: If you can make that commitment and we can count on you through the Buddy program, I think that not only makes a big statement if we, uh, if we, uh, add some new Buddy, uh, um, uh, subscribers as well as ones who may have left during the coup, I think that that would be,
[20:52.080 --> 20:58.820] [_VOLT4IRE_]: um, really, uh, a really strong statement and something that would be even better, um, coming out of our show tonight.
[20:58.820 --> 21:08.030] [_VOLT4IRE_]: I just wanted to add that because it's not about how much, but that consistency and being able to count on it is, is really, um, it's, it's a thing in and of itself.
[21:08.030 --> 21:08.540] [EVILCORLEY]: Yeah.
[21:08.640 --> 21:20.530] [EVILCORLEY]: And we know people care because so many left and we need all those people to come back and we need them to bring friends because we need to be stronger than we were before so that this kind of thing doesn't happen to us again.
[21:20.720 --> 21:37.420] [EVILCORLEY]: There are wolves at the gate and, uh, even, even people within the organization, but imagine the wolves outside the organization, the ones that want to turn the station into something completely different, uh, and, and use the frequency, you know, those people who say radio is dead,
[21:37.700 --> 21:46.860] [EVILCORLEY]: here's your proof that it's not because the very first thing that they do when they want power is they take over the radio stations and they don't give those up.
[21:47.010 --> 21:51.120] [EVILCORLEY]: That's why it's, uh, it's not just something that you can do with a podcast.
[21:51.520 --> 21:52.820] [EVILCORLEY]: This is very, very different.
[21:54.180 --> 21:54.620] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[21:54.920 --> 21:55.160] [ALEXURBELS]: Absolutely.
[21:55.820 --> 22:08.720] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, and, and, and to that point, I mean, you know, I think that we have spoken with our actions here too, in that when this happened, we didn't continue to, to have a podcast, right?
[22:08.840 --> 22:10.520] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, you made a really good point, Emmanuel.
[22:10.540 --> 22:12.980] [ALEXURBELS]: We broadcast, we don't narrowcast.
[22:13.220 --> 22:16.060] [ALEXURBELS]: This is a radio station and a radio show.
[22:16.320 --> 22:18.920] [ALEXURBELS]: First and foremost, the podcast is incidental to that.
[22:19.100 --> 22:26.540] [ALEXURBELS]: It's a, uh, a foreseeable and an intentional consequence of doing a live radio show, but we have been doing this radio show.
[22:27.000 --> 22:35.060] [ALEXURBELS]: You've been doing this radio show, I should say for 31 years that I have to say is extraordinary.
[22:35.760 --> 22:43.520] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, and, and that's, you know, look, the success of this radio station is really on, uh, well, and this radio show is really on your shoulders.
[22:43.520 --> 22:48.680] [ALEXURBELS]: And, and we built such a amazing listener base over the three decades that you've been at the helm here.
[22:48.980 --> 22:52.940] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, you know, I, I think we owe you some, uh, gratitude as well.
[22:53.020 --> 23:07.620] [ALEXURBELS]: I hate to say it, you know, I'd like, I'd like to disagree with almost everything you say, but, uh, in any event, um, we didn't continue to broadcast because we are radio and we will not be here and we will not do a podcast.
[23:07.620 --> 23:09.340] [ALEXURBELS]: And that's why we need your support.
[23:09.340 --> 23:15.520] [ALEXURBELS]: If you're listening to this on a podcast, that podcast will be gone if this radio station isn't here.
[23:15.640 --> 23:17.720] [ALEXURBELS]: And that's what happened over the last four weeks.
[23:17.720 --> 23:24.420] [ALEXURBELS]: We did our, our singular show that we did in exile from the Brooklyn Commons as a protest show that won't happen again.
[23:24.580 --> 23:26.560] [ALEXURBELS]: So we really, really need your support.
[23:27.040 --> 23:31.120] [ALEXURBELS]: And, um, and I, and I, I don't think we can overstate that.
[23:31.120 --> 23:35.040] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, and because you're right, there, there are very much wolves at the gate here.
[23:35.400 --> 23:39.040] [ALEXURBELS]: Now I'd, I'd like to read you guys something if, if you don't mind.
[23:39.300 --> 23:44.780] [ALEXURBELS]: And, um, and Emmanuel, I'd like you perhaps to guess who said this.
[23:45.160 --> 23:45.620] [ALEXURBELS]: All right.
[23:45.800 --> 23:48.380] [ALEXURBELS]: And it's, and it's about, yeah, exactly.
[23:48.700 --> 23:52.100] [ALEXURBELS]: You, you know, you strangely get these things right all the time to tonight.
[23:52.280 --> 23:53.580] [EVILCORLEY]: I think you're going to George Orwell.
[23:54.100 --> 23:57.020] [ALEXURBELS]: Uh, no, no, no, absolutely.
[23:57.760 --> 23:58.480] [ALEXURBELS]: Donald J. Trump.
[23:58.960 --> 24:00.640] [EVILCORLEY]: Donald Reagan.
[24:00.940 --> 24:03.560] [ALEXURBELS]: You guys are really interrupting my narrative flow here.
[24:03.720 --> 24:04.160] [ALEXURBELS]: Was it me?
[24:04.720 --> 24:06.540] [ALEXURBELS]: Uh, no, it wasn't, wasn't anybody in this room.
[24:06.880 --> 24:08.120] [ALEXURBELS]: Wasn't, it wasn't an author.
[24:08.780 --> 24:11.520] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, but I'm going to, I'm going to just read it right now.
[24:11.620 --> 24:14.720] [ALEXURBELS]: And it's about WBAI and it's about Pacifica.
[24:15.060 --> 24:16.160] [ALEXURBELS]: Now here's the quote.
[24:17.500 --> 24:18.960] [ALEXURBELS]: Oh, for Christ's sakes.
[24:19.280 --> 24:19.380] [ALEXURBELS]: Yeah.
[24:19.780 --> 24:20.100] [ALEXURBELS]: All right.
[24:20.240 --> 24:21.220] [ALEXURBELS]: Will Rogers.
[24:21.620 --> 24:21.760] [ALEXURBELS]: All right.
[24:21.880 --> 24:23.820] [ALEXURBELS]: This, this fondness is wearing thin now.
[24:24.540 --> 24:29.360] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, oh my God, this guy, could somebody mute him over there?
[24:29.560 --> 24:29.800] [ALEXURBELS]: You know?
[24:30.160 --> 24:32.760] [ALEXURBELS]: Um, so, all right, here's the quote.
[24:33.240 --> 24:46.580] [ALEXURBELS]: Quote, our job is to foster the success of each station, the passion and dedication of our programmers, supporters, and volunteers, as well as drawing on our extensive archive are integral to making it all happen.
[24:46.580 --> 25:02.920] [ALEXURBELS]: If we stay focused on the critical mission of making great radio, first and foremost, we can deliver our foundation's goal of bringing underrepresented ideas and culture to our listeners and foster productive dialogue that can have a positive impact on our world.
[25:02.920 --> 25:06.680] [ALEXURBELS]: That mission is now more important than ever.
[25:07.040 --> 25:12.340] [ALEXURBELS]: That was said on July 24th, 2019, by whom?
[25:14.160 --> 25:17.300] [EVILCORLEY]: I wish you'd give me the date first, because I was going to guess Lou Hill.
[25:17.520 --> 25:20.000] [EVILCORLEY]: Who was the founder of Pacifica, but that was back in 1949.
[25:20.240 --> 25:21.600] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, it sounds very similar.
[25:21.800 --> 25:22.260] [ALEXURBELS]: I agree.
[25:23.440 --> 25:24.300] [ROBVINCENT]: Gilly, you had a guess?
[25:24.320 --> 25:26.840] [EVILCORLEY]: Gosh, um, I'm, I'm stumped.
[25:27.200 --> 25:29.420] [EVILCORLEY]: I know I'm going to be surprised by whoever it is.
[25:29.420 --> 25:29.840] [ALEXURBELS]]: Yes, she was.
[25:29.840 --> 25:30.660] [EVILCORLEY]: It wasn't me, was it?
[25:30.800 --> 25:31.660] [ALEXURBELS]: It certainly wasn't you.
[25:31.980 --> 25:33.380] [ALEXURBELS]: No, no, definitely not.
[25:33.500 --> 25:33.500] [EVILCORLEY]: Okay, good.
[25:33.520 --> 25:36.460] [ALEXURBELS]: It would be more run-on sentences, if there were.
[25:38.760 --> 25:39.740] [GILADRAZEN]: I have a guess.
[25:40.040 --> 25:40.340] [ALEXURBELS]: Go ahead.
[25:40.580 --> 25:45.760] [GILADRAZEN]: Is it, uh, now exiled executive director, interim executive director, John Vernile?
[25:47.080 --> 25:48.100] [ALEXURBELS]: She got it right.
[25:48.700 --> 25:48.880] [ALEXURBELS]: Wow.
[25:49.220 --> 25:55.400] [ALEXURBELS]: These are the words of John Vernile, or Vernile, uh, uh, July 24th, 2019.
[25:55.840 --> 25:59.140] [ALEXURBELS]: This was when he was appointed the interim executive director.
[25:59.380 --> 26:09.840] [ALEXURBELS]: These are words that are recorded and attributed to him, saying about the successes, you know, as contingent on our, on our local voices, making great radio, all of this.
[26:10.020 --> 26:12.160] [ALEXURBELS]: And he just made a complete sea change.
[26:12.320 --> 26:13.560] [ALEXURBELS]: He led the coup.
[26:14.240 --> 26:16.600] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, it just goes to show you, this makes the point.
[26:16.620 --> 26:18.280] [ALEXURBELS]: There are wolves at the gate.
[26:19.200 --> 26:27.680] [EVILCORLEY]: If I can say one thing, though, it is possible for somebody to say something like that and then do completely the wrong thing, thinking they're doing the right thing.
[26:28.000 --> 26:29.360] [EVILCORLEY]: And that happens a lot.
[26:29.480 --> 26:31.520] [EVILCORLEY]: In the corporate world, that happens all the time.
[26:31.860 --> 26:33.780] [EVILCORLEY]: And Pacifica has no exception to that.
[26:33.980 --> 26:41.400] [EVILCORLEY]: So I'm not, I'm not particularly surprised that somebody would say something so spot on and then do something so completely wrong.
[26:41.600 --> 26:43.520] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, you're absolutely right, too.
[26:43.640 --> 26:49.180] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think what we saw here was that the Pacifica National Board had a lot of disparate interests
[26:52.300 --> 26:53.100] [ALEXURBELS]: represented there.
[26:53.240 --> 26:58.620] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think those interests may have poisoned the mind and the mentality of the interim executive director here.
[26:58.940 --> 27:01.580] [ALEXURBELS]: And, and you're right, he may have been thinking he was doing the right thing.
[27:01.660 --> 27:03.760] [ALEXURBELS]: He may have been convinced that he was doing the right thing.
[27:04.060 --> 27:09.740] [ALEXURBELS]: But I think that this is a man who started out on the right foot and started off in the wrong direction.
[27:10.920 --> 27:15.480] [_VOLT4IRE_]: That's why a multitude of, a multitude of voices is so crucial.
[27:15.940 --> 27:36.020] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And an organization like Pacifica, that is member-based and that has a really large mission, as well as a lot of different people controlling that mission, you need, you need to also have your ear to the ground and, and be very vocal from the local station level and,
[27:36.020 --> 27:50.240] [_VOLT4IRE_]: um, and on up, uh, from listeners to local stations and on up to national, um, politics with it with an organization like Pacifica and, um, you read rebukes of, of actions like this, I think are, are part of that.
[27:50.380 --> 28:04.500] [_VOLT4IRE_]: But, um, you know, hearing from listeners, Hearing from the local management and producers and also community members, that helps the right path.
[28:04.660 --> 28:25.880] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And I think closing down listening and not hearing what producers are dealing with or what management is really facing or what the community is expecting of their station and thinking you are right and not being open to being wrong, you set yourself up for a sort of failure.
[28:26.160 --> 28:33.580] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And, you know, to, on the one hand, be community-based and then make these sort of unilateral decisions.
[28:35.000 --> 28:39.240] [_VOLT4IRE_]: It's, I think, evidence of not really hearing what people are saying.
[28:39.360 --> 28:42.180] [EVILCORLEY]: And one thing we really need more than anything is unity.
[28:42.180 --> 28:48.080] [EVILCORLEY]: I've been on a lot of the Pacifica mailing lists and watching what people say to each other.
[28:48.500 --> 29:01.640] [EVILCORLEY]: And, boy, we really have to do a better job because so many of us are closed off to talking to people we disagree with on some issues or even one issue or even the issues that we had in the past.
[29:01.920 --> 29:04.120] [EVILCORLEY]: And it's just, it's crippling us.
[29:04.220 --> 29:05.280] [EVILCORLEY]: It really is crippling us.
[29:05.280 --> 29:13.540] [EVILCORLEY]: Somebody who maybe loses their show 10 years ago on this radio station refuses to support the radio station ever again, no matter what.
[29:14.020 --> 29:16.160] [EVILCORLEY]: You know, you have stories like that.
[29:16.420 --> 29:23.420] [EVILCORLEY]: You have rivalries between different social groups, between different radio stations.
[29:23.960 --> 29:24.760] [EVILCORLEY]: Enough already.
[29:24.760 --> 29:29.500] [EVILCORLEY]: We have to put all that aside and say, do we want to have a powerful voice or not?
[29:29.580 --> 29:33.300] [EVILCORLEY]: Because there's plenty of people that will take it for us if we don't want to use it.
[29:33.300 --> 29:37.540] [EVILCORLEY]: This is a time in history where there are much bigger battles going on.
[29:37.540 --> 29:39.220] [EVILCORLEY]: We need to be covering those battles.
[29:39.360 --> 29:42.540] [EVILCORLEY]: We need to be the thorn in the side of the oppressors.
[29:42.940 --> 29:50.000] [EVILCORLEY]: There is so much work to be done, so much to be said, and so much that was not said in the last month and a week.
[29:50.300 --> 29:52.940] [EVILCORLEY]: And it's a real tragedy that that happened.
[29:53.240 --> 29:55.800] [EVILCORLEY]: We must make sure it never happens again.
[29:55.800 --> 29:58.420] [EVILCORLEY]: We have to bond together.
[29:58.620 --> 30:00.740] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And not get caught up in those differences.
[30:00.740 --> 30:01.700] [EVILCORLEY]: Exactly, yeah.
[30:01.780 --> 30:09.100] [EVILCORLEY]: We need to not let a disagreement keep us from communicating with other people and getting stronger as a result.
[30:10.000 --> 30:10.480] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[30:11.340 --> 30:21.400] [ROBVINCENT]: So one thing I want to say, in addition to the ways we've been talking about that you can support the station by going to give2wbai.org or by calling 516-620-3602.
[30:21.400 --> 30:31.600] [ROBVINCENT]: I was speaking with station staff earlier, and they reminded me that actually, if you want to bring or send a paper check, we happily accept those as well.
[30:31.600 --> 30:49.680] [ROBVINCENT]: And you can find the address for that on WBAI.org on the Contact Us page, or if you're listening to this on an MP3 and you have a pen and paper handy, you can send checks to WBAI in care of our address here, which is 388 Atlantic Avenue, Brooklyn, New York,
[30:49.880 --> 30:51.360] [ROBVINCENT]: 11217.
[30:52.380 --> 30:58.340] [ROBVINCENT]: And again, if you need that address, you can go to WBAI.org, hit the Contact Us page, and it is there.
[30:58.620 --> 31:04.520] [ROBVINCENT]: We accept all types of support, and we would be absolutely thrilled to have your support.
[31:05.100 --> 31:11.420] [ROBVINCENT]: Now, I want to shift gears a little bit because we got left so behind with not being on the air.
[31:11.520 --> 31:13.060] [ROBVINCENT]: There have been developments in other things we do.
[31:13.260 --> 31:14.940] [ROBVINCENT]: We have a little conference going, don't we, guys?
[31:16.000 --> 31:16.960] [EVILCORLEY]: Oh, my God.
[31:17.680 --> 31:18.520] [EVILCORLEY]: Yeah, you know what?
[31:18.580 --> 31:23.700] [EVILCORLEY]: In all the hubbub, we weren't able to announce the big news that we had.
[31:23.700 --> 31:28.440] [EVILCORLEY]: We would have announced in October about hackers on planet Earth.
[31:28.560 --> 31:38.420] [EVILCORLEY]: Now, we faced a kind of similar fate in that Hotel Pennsylvania had tripled their prices, making it virtually impossible for us to have a conference there anymore.
[31:38.420 --> 31:46.140] [EVILCORLEY]: And the future of hope was very much in jeopardy until we decided that we weren't going to just give up.
[31:46.440 --> 31:48.480] [EVILCORLEY]: And we started looking in earnest.
[31:48.980 --> 32:00.880] [EVILCORLEY]: Our visitors, attendees, readers, listeners, they were all so very supportive and gave us all kinds of ideas, and we pursued a bunch of them.
[32:00.880 --> 32:03.860] [EVILCORLEY]: And one of them really, really panned out.
[32:04.040 --> 32:09.040] [EVILCORLEY]: So hope will be happening next summer, July 31st through August 2nd.
[32:09.420 --> 32:18.580] [EVILCORLEY]: And it will be happening, get ready, in Queens at St. John's University in a bigger space than we had at the hotel, an open campus.
[32:18.740 --> 32:25.300] [EVILCORLEY]: We'll have outdoor space, we'll have indoor space, we'll have many, many rooms and all kinds of possibility for activities.
[32:25.300 --> 32:35.800] [EVILCORLEY]: But most importantly, we'll be working with people that get us, that encourage creative thinking, that encourage us to basically be who we are.
[32:36.260 --> 32:44.620] [EVILCORLEY]: And it'll be a very welcoming environment to hackers of all sorts from all over the country, from all over the world, in fact.
[32:44.940 --> 32:53.140] [EVILCORLEY]: It's close to the airports, it's easy to get to from the city, and we're working out housing arrangements that will be cheaper than anything in New York.
[32:53.140 --> 32:54.440] [EVILCORLEY]: So all kinds of news.
[32:54.640 --> 33:01.060] [EVILCORLEY]: Today we had our first bout of ticket sales, and they were sold out in about, was it one second?
[33:01.240 --> 33:03.260] [EVILCORLEY]: Maybe one and a half seconds, I'm not sure.
[33:03.520 --> 33:05.620] [EVILCORLEY]: It's hard to measure when it gets down to that.
[33:05.740 --> 33:07.440] [EVILCORLEY]: But that's a good sign.
[33:07.520 --> 33:09.520] [EVILCORLEY]: It means people are really enthusiastic about this.
[33:09.740 --> 33:12.660] [EVILCORLEY]: We're very enthusiastic about it, and we can hardly wait to get started.
[33:14.280 --> 33:15.940] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, this is a huge development.
[33:15.940 --> 33:22.960] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, absolutely fantastic, Emmanuel, to see that, you know, hope is resurrected here.
[33:23.140 --> 33:29.480] [ALEXURBELS]: You know, we lost hope for a little while when this happened with Hotel Pennsylvania, but here we are.
[33:29.640 --> 33:32.260] [ALEXURBELS]: You know, we're bouncing back, we're resilient, just like the station.
[33:32.820 --> 33:45.080] [ALEXURBELS]: You know, look, this is part of the hacker spirit here, which is, you know, you're dealt a bad hand, you make the most of it, you figure it out, you keep playing, eventually, you know, we will prevail.
[33:45.080 --> 33:54.560] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, it's the same kind of mentality, the fact that you didn't give up, that you and Kyle got out there, beat the bushes, went, I mean, how many venues did you look at?
[33:54.680 --> 33:55.960] [ALEXURBELS]: I can't even know.
[33:56.120 --> 34:13.440] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, we were talking about this for weeks and weeks and weeks, and you guys were stressed beyond belief, and now you've been able to secure a venue, St. John's University, a center of learning that I think is going to just be an excellent mesh with the hacker philosophy,
[34:13.620 --> 34:14.480] [ALEXURBELS]: the hacker ethos.
[34:14.480 --> 34:18.600] [ALEXURBELS]: I have a feeling that hope number 13 is going to be the best hope yet.
[34:18.840 --> 34:21.300] [ALEXURBELS]: This is just going to be so cool, it's going to be so different.
[34:21.540 --> 34:28.840] [ALEXURBELS]: The fact that you can stay on campus, in on-campus housing, at a hacker conference, is going to be a game changer here.
[34:30.080 --> 34:34.860] [ALEXURBELS]: I'm slightly terrified of what's going to happen, and looking forward to it tremendously.
[34:35.740 --> 34:38.200] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Yeah, it was absolutely a relief.
[34:38.540 --> 34:44.080] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And really, the stressful part was knowing how much hope means to people.
[34:44.440 --> 34:48.720] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And it's such a great outcome for us.
[34:48.820 --> 35:08.740] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And as you said, with an academic environment and a location that I think is going to really elevate and really encapsulate what hope has been about as far as learning and sharing information and educating one another.
[35:09.360 --> 35:38.700] [_VOLT4IRE_]: So absolutely, it was a huge, huge relief to know that we could continue to host that for so many people, and people that come from all over, to be a part of what we provide as far as speaking tracks, and also to check out New York and experience something that they may not ordinarily get to do in the regular day-to-day life they've got.
[35:38.940 --> 35:42.140] [EVILCORLEY]: So the website is hope.net, as always.
[35:42.900 --> 35:45.480] [EVILCORLEY]: There'll be some information on there right now.
[35:45.480 --> 35:55.500] [EVILCORLEY]: There's going to be a whole lot more information on there in the weeks ahead, including ways you can get involved, including new things that we're trying out, and all kinds of different projects.
[35:56.140 --> 35:58.640] [EVILCORLEY]: We're going to fix any problems that we had in the past.
[35:58.640 --> 36:01.560] [EVILCORLEY]: We're going to make things better than they've ever been before.
[36:02.180 --> 36:04.100] [EVILCORLEY]: And we're going to have an amazing space.
[36:04.100 --> 36:13.460] [EVILCORLEY]: It's going to be like a combination of a hacker campground and a hacker conference, the likes of which I've never been seen in this country before.
[36:13.460 --> 36:15.140] [EVILCORLEY]: So I'm really looking forward to it.
[36:15.480 --> 36:21.100] [ALEXURBELS]: Now, in terms of the speaker tracks, we're going to have more room, or are we going to have more speakers than at previous hopes?
[36:21.260 --> 36:22.260] [_VOLT4IRE_]: I don't doubt it.
[36:22.440 --> 36:23.240] [_VOLT4IRE_]: I'm sure we will.
[36:23.520 --> 36:31.820] [_VOLT4IRE_]: Plenty of breakout space as well, and rooms, and really even outdoor workshops, whatever you can think of.
[36:31.960 --> 36:53.980] [_VOLT4IRE_]: We're going to be really stepping up some of the recruitment and volunteer planning, because with so much of an opportunity, we really want to make sure that every inch of the resources we have is as amazing as we know what we've done before in other spaces.
[36:55.580 --> 36:56.020] [ROBVINCENT]: Excellent.
[36:56.260 --> 36:58.240] [ROBVINCENT]: And this is going to be amazing.
[36:59.000 --> 37:07.040] [ROBVINCENT]: It's going to be exciting for the attendees as well as the staff, because this is different to anything that we've done with Hope before, and it's exciting.
[37:07.040 --> 37:07.500] [ROBVINCENT]: It's new.
[37:07.720 --> 37:08.260] [ROBVINCENT]: It's Hope.
[37:09.660 --> 37:20.780] [ROBVINCENT]: And on that note, I would like to invite listeners to call in and tell us what's on your mind about what happened at WBAI, or Hope, or things that are going on.
[37:21.140 --> 37:25.280] [ROBVINCENT]: Give us a call, 212-209-2877.
[37:26.580 --> 37:29.180] [EVILCORLEY]: Can I just say one thing, though?
[37:29.300 --> 37:37.960] [EVILCORLEY]: When you call in, we're not interested in pointing fingers, we're not interested in personalities, in saying this person is evil or this person is great.
[37:38.280 --> 37:50.280] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to hear your feelings about the station as a whole, about ideas we can move forward with, perhaps experiences that you had listening in the last few weeks, things like that.
[37:50.520 --> 37:55.980] [EVILCORLEY]: So let's try and be progressive and think of ways that we can make this really work in the future.
[37:56.540 --> 37:56.960] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[37:57.240 --> 37:58.720] [ROBVINCENT]: Let's see who is out there.
[37:58.920 --> 37:59.540] [ROBVINCENT]: Good evening.
[37:59.740 --> 38:00.260] [ROBVINCENT]: You're on Off The Hook.
[38:00.720 --> 38:01.220] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, hi.
[38:01.500 --> 38:02.360] [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for taking my call.
[38:03.760 --> 38:04.300] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[38:04.300 --> 38:10.480] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think you might have been hinting at what my point is a little bit yourselves.
[38:11.620 --> 38:32.300] [SPEAKER_02]: Pacifica Radio is the problem, and I know that it's not a likely thing that the station will be able to do this, but in some way, somehow, the goal should be that WBAI should become independent from Pacifica Radio should somehow buy themselves away from Pacifica.
[38:33.260 --> 38:41.140] [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's the only solution, because they are a lunatic organization, I think.
[38:42.780 --> 38:43.800] [EVILCORLEY]: Can I just say?
[38:43.940 --> 38:49.900] [EVILCORLEY]: Can I just say, sir, the problem is Pacifica owns a license, Pacifica owns WBAI.
[38:50.220 --> 38:50.840] [EVILCORLEY]: Yeah, I know.
[38:50.840 --> 38:53.460] [EVILCORLEY]: It's a mighty hard task to break away from that.
[38:53.800 --> 39:02.940] [EVILCORLEY]: But the thing is, even if what you suggest is possible in the future, the way to prove that is to make the station as strong as possible now.
[39:03.400 --> 39:04.240] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know.
[39:04.540 --> 39:11.020] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm a WBAI buddy, as they say, and I've been a donor off and on for many years.
[39:11.200 --> 39:11.560] [EVILCORLEY]: Thank you.
[39:12.000 --> 39:12.280] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[39:12.280 --> 39:13.000] [EVILCORLEY]: Thank you for your support.
[39:13.540 --> 39:14.120] [SPEAKER_02]: What's that?
[39:15.660 --> 39:16.900] [EVILCORLEY]: Thank you for your support.
[39:16.900 --> 39:17.880] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, thanks.
[39:18.120 --> 39:18.360] [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[39:18.920 --> 39:27.300] [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, okay, I was on the air with James Ursay.
[39:27.620 --> 39:30.280] [SPEAKER_02]: I called him James Ursay a few days ago, also.
[39:30.500 --> 39:33.820] [SPEAKER_02]: And I brought up this story or point.
[39:33.820 --> 39:49.000] [SPEAKER_02]: During that period of time of the programming that was being pushed onto our, your transmitter from California, I think it was on, it was two Saturdays ago.
[39:49.000 --> 39:50.980] [SPEAKER_02]: I think that was the 2nd of November.
[39:52.080 --> 39:58.640] [SPEAKER_02]: In the late morning, there was a program on, and I don't remember who this guy was.
[39:58.640 --> 40:02.560] [SPEAKER_02]: There was a guy talking for about an hour, two hours, I think.
[40:02.700 --> 40:09.840] [SPEAKER_02]: And he was evidently from another radio station, not a Pacifica radio station, but some other radio station in the West.
[40:10.080 --> 40:14.680] [SPEAKER_02]: And I didn't, if I heard the identification of it, I don't remember.
[40:15.380 --> 40:35.460] [SPEAKER_02]: But then he put a guest on, and the guest was from a woman whose name I also don't remember, a woman from KPFA, who started doing a trash fest, along with him, of WBAI, but specifically, and I'm not a huge fan of the name I'm going to say now, but she,
[40:35.560 --> 40:50.920] [SPEAKER_02]: they were doing a specific trash fest of Gary Null, and saying Gary Null does not belong on the Pacifica station, he's just a cheat, a hack, for, you know, he sells his own products and this doesn't belong.
[40:51.180 --> 40:54.580] [SPEAKER_02]: And this went on for like 30 minutes or so.
[40:55.000 --> 41:00.500] [SPEAKER_02]: And this was, and she was definitely, she was from someone from KPFA.
[41:00.820 --> 41:05.980] [SPEAKER_02]: And I just thought, this is just one of the most amazing things I've ever heard.
[41:06.140 --> 41:08.040] [SPEAKER_02]: And it was specifically aimed...
[41:08.040 --> 41:18.140] [ROBVINCENT]: What's interesting about that, sir, is that like, as we were saying earlier, there's always going to be these elements that are, like, ready, and this has been true through the entire history of the station, I think.
[41:18.320 --> 41:28.320] [ROBVINCENT]: There have always been people who have been ready to either do things that would interfere with the station, or at least wait for it to fail and then dance on the ashes.
[41:28.760 --> 41:31.320] [ROBVINCENT]: And really, that's going to happen.
[41:31.700 --> 41:35.960] [ROBVINCENT]: I think if you're doing worthwhile work, there's always going to be people who are upset by it.
[41:36.320 --> 41:42.020] [ROBVINCENT]: And again, we don't want to speak to, I think, the value of individuals who are involved with this station.
[41:42.860 --> 41:45.400] [ROBVINCENT]: That's the job of others around here.
[41:45.600 --> 41:57.320] [ROBVINCENT]: But the way that we can really get things going in the direction that... get things going and moving the station in the direction that we want to is by supporting the shows that we do appreciate.
[41:58.260 --> 42:03.820] [ROBVINCENT]: If you want to donate to the station, donate in the name of a show that you enjoy, like, say, Off The Hook.
[42:04.120 --> 42:07.440] [ROBVINCENT]: And the numbers will not only save...
[42:07.440 --> 42:12.300] [ROBVINCENT]: help save the station, but also show which shows are appreciated by the listenership.
[42:12.720 --> 42:14.800] [ROBVINCENT]: And we're going to move on to another caller, but thank you.
[42:14.900 --> 42:16.160] [ROBVINCENT]: Thank you very much for that call.
[42:17.240 --> 42:18.360] [ROBVINCENT]: Let's see who else is out there.
[42:18.540 --> 42:18.960] [ROBVINCENT]: Good evening.
[42:19.140 --> 42:19.700] [ROBVINCENT]: You're on Off The Hook.
[42:19.700 --> 42:22.120] [__BERNIE_S]: Greetings from Philadelphia.
[42:24.540 --> 42:30.360] [__BERNIE_S]: Coincidentally, I received a phone call from John Vernile just before the show.
[42:32.000 --> 42:34.540] [__BERNIE_S]: And it was an interesting conversation.
[42:35.160 --> 42:47.560] [__BERNIE_S]: I'm not sure if the listeners are very aware of one of the reasons that Pacifica took action on October 7th.
[42:47.720 --> 42:55.880] [__BERNIE_S]: But I can provide some information that your listeners can verify about that, if you're willing to hear it.
[42:58.340 --> 43:05.220] [EVILCORLEY]: Well, we're willing to hear anything, Bernie, but this is not something that I'm going to really agree with, I don't think.
[43:05.420 --> 43:06.980] [EVILCORLEY]: I stand for what you've been posting.
[43:07.640 --> 43:13.200] [EVILCORLEY]: And it's really not in line with the truth, okay?
[43:13.200 --> 43:14.840] [EVILCORLEY]: You've been telling people that...
[43:14.840 --> 43:18.120] [__BERNIE_S]: Well, actually, I think the listeners are entitled to know the truth.
[43:18.400 --> 43:24.620] [EVILCORLEY]: ...donate to the radio station, and basically supporting everything that happened on October 7th.
[43:24.640 --> 43:25.460] [EVILCORLEY]: And I think it's shameful.
[43:27.000 --> 43:31.900] [__BERNIE_S]: Well, if you think it's shameful to follow the law, then I guess you're entitled to your opinion.
[43:31.900 --> 43:58.440] [__BERNIE_S]: One of the things that was going on prior to October 7th, and throughout most of this year, actually, is that the New York State Charity Bureau, which is part of the Attorney General's Office Social Justice Division, had categorized Pacifica Foundation as delinquent...
[43:59.740 --> 44:01.860] [EVILCORLEY]: Okay, Bernie, we don't have time for this.
[44:02.980 --> 44:08.540] [EVILCORLEY]: You're going to say that we don't have the right to ask for money on the air.
[44:08.700 --> 44:09.480] [EVILCORLEY]: That's wrong.
[44:09.880 --> 44:10.960] [EVILCORLEY]: There are links that have been posted...
[44:11.960 --> 44:14.300] [EVILCORLEY]: Well, listen, I can give a phone number on the air.
[44:14.300 --> 44:15.520] [__BERNIE_S]: Completely need to donate to the radio station.
[44:15.600 --> 44:17.360] [__BERNIE_S]: I can give a phone number on the air.
[44:17.480 --> 44:21.140] [__BERNIE_S]: I can give a phone number on the air that listeners can call to verify this is true.
[44:21.960 --> 44:24.360] [__BERNIE_S]: And you can just hang up on me if you want, but I can...
[44:24.360 --> 44:25.600] [EVILCORLEY]: The kind of pause is true, okay?
[44:25.820 --> 44:27.100] [EVILCORLEY]: It doesn't mean anything.
[44:27.100 --> 44:29.720] [EVILCORLEY]: You found somebody who will back you up on this nonsense.
[44:30.000 --> 44:32.740] [__BERNIE_S]: No, no, this is... I'm talking about the Attorney General's Office.
[44:32.920 --> 44:39.660] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, if I could step in here just for a second here, and moderate to a certain extent here.
[44:40.240 --> 44:40.840] [__BERNIE_S]: Thank you, Alex.
[44:41.040 --> 44:46.360] [ALEXURBELS]: Let's assume that what Bernie is saying is absolutely correct.
[44:46.640 --> 44:49.560] [__BERNIE_S]: I haven't been able to finish what I was saying, but...
[44:49.560 --> 44:50.120] [ALEXURBELS]: I know, but...
[44:50.120 --> 44:50.260] [__BERNIE_S]: Go ahead.
[44:50.740 --> 44:52.460] [ALEXURBELS]: Okay, let's assume both sides, then.
[44:52.560 --> 44:54.040] [ALEXURBELS]: What you're saying is correct.
[44:54.200 --> 44:54.500] [__BERNIE_S]: Assume what?
[44:54.540 --> 44:55.160] [ALEXURBELS]: You haven't heard what I've said yet.
[44:55.160 --> 44:56.180] [ALEXURBELS]: That there is a delinquency.
[44:56.180 --> 45:00.740] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, because Emmanuel finished the thought, so I'm saying, you know, let's assume...
[45:00.740 --> 45:01.640] [__BERNIE_S]: Well, he didn't finish the facts.
[45:01.760 --> 45:02.260] [__BERNIE_S]: But anyway, go ahead.
[45:02.520 --> 45:03.080] [ALEXURBELS]: Okay, sure.
[45:03.260 --> 45:10.420] [ALEXURBELS]: Let's assume that there is some kind of delinquency with respect to the New York State Charity Bureau, that there is some kind of filing.
[45:12.520 --> 45:17.600] [ALEXURBELS]: The thing is here, is that nothing is going to be done to the station without due process.
[45:17.920 --> 45:20.900] [ALEXURBELS]: Due process is the ultimate test here.
[45:21.100 --> 45:39.580] [ALEXURBELS]: Nobody is going to yank the ability of the station to fundraise, to acquire money, to exist, without having a formal process there, where both sides have an opportunity to be heard, and most importantly, where there is an opportunity to cure whatever defect may or may not exist.
[45:39.580 --> 45:48.640] [ALEXURBELS]: I'm not competent to speak as to whether or not there is or is not an actual delinquency with respect to the filing and the legal effects of that filing.
[45:48.640 --> 45:54.740] [ALEXURBELS]: But what I am competent to opine about is that there has to be process here.
[45:55.000 --> 46:05.700] [ALEXURBELS]: And the process that we're going through right now, after what happened on October 7th, that was, you know, extended until literally a week ago from today.
[46:07.020 --> 46:09.100] [ALEXURBELS]: It allowed us to get back on the air.
[46:09.320 --> 46:11.100] [ALEXURBELS]: WBAI is getting back on its feet.
[46:11.100 --> 46:14.460] [ALEXURBELS]: It's putting together all the documentation that it needs to put together.
[46:14.560 --> 46:16.440] [ALEXURBELS]: It's getting all of its ducks in a row.
[46:16.600 --> 46:23.840] [ALEXURBELS]: If there are any delinquencies with respect to any filings that are owed to the state of New York, they will be made.
[46:24.520 --> 46:26.840] [ALEXURBELS]: And as I understand it right now...
[46:26.840 --> 46:27.060] [__BERNIE_S]: I don't doubt that will happen.
[46:27.660 --> 46:28.740] [ALEXURBELS]: And it will happen.
[46:28.740 --> 46:29.760] [ALEXURBELS]: I believe it will happen.
[46:29.920 --> 46:37.400] [ALEXURBELS]: But as I understand it right now, there has been no formal process to prevent WBAI or to enjoin WBAI from raising any of these particular funds.
[46:37.400 --> 46:40.740] [ALEXURBELS]: So, I understand what you're trying to say.
[46:40.920 --> 46:43.380] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think, you know, I appreciate it, Bernie.
[46:43.780 --> 46:54.980] [__BERNIE_S]: May I provide some factual information that our listeners can actually verify themselves, instead of listening to you, me, and Emmanuel offer their versions?
[46:56.900 --> 46:57.640] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean...
[46:57.640 --> 46:58.080] [__BERNIE_S]: May I do that?
[46:58.080 --> 47:05.240] [EVILCORLEY]: You're going to give out a phone number where somebody will say something that you say they will say...
[47:05.240 --> 47:08.300] [__BERNIE_S]: Emmanuel, this is the New York Attorney General's office.
[47:08.460 --> 47:09.000] [EVILCORLEY]: You have...
[47:09.000 --> 47:12.020] [EVILCORLEY]: You have either the name wrong or something.
[47:12.300 --> 47:12.640] [EVILCORLEY]: You're...
[47:13.240 --> 47:14.080] [EVILCORLEY]: I don't know exactly...
[47:14.080 --> 47:14.680] [__BERNIE_S]: You're not going to...
[47:14.680 --> 47:15.520] [__BERNIE_S]: You're not going to let...
[47:15.520 --> 47:16.980] [__BERNIE_S]: You're not going to get listeners...
[47:16.980 --> 47:20.040] [__BERNIE_S]: You're not going to allow listeners to verify the facts for themselves.
[47:20.500 --> 47:20.960] [ALEXURBELS]: Okay?
[47:21.240 --> 47:22.180] [ALEXURBELS]: Once again, though.
[47:22.320 --> 47:22.940] [ALEXURBELS]: Once again.
[47:22.960 --> 47:24.320] [EVILCORLEY]: Can I say something, please?
[47:24.440 --> 47:39.800] [EVILCORLEY]: I do know that people who know what they're talking about a lot more than I do, like Arthur Schwartz and other people involved in this whole radio station, have refuted this already, have provided links to prove their point, links I don't have on the top of my head, but this is nonsense what you're putting forth.
[47:42.440 --> 47:43.620] [EVILCORLEY]: I also have to wonder...
[47:43.620 --> 47:44.880] [__BERNIE_S]: You can't say it's nonsense.
[47:45.420 --> 47:48.560] [__BERNIE_S]: I want WBAI to be on the air, man.
[47:48.820 --> 47:50.200] [__BERNIE_S]: I want WBAI to be on the air.
[47:50.220 --> 47:52.200] [EVILCORLEY]: Yeah, that's a real funny way of showing it.
[47:53.380 --> 47:58.080] [__BERNIE_S]: Listen, I'm just conveying facts to people about why this happened on October 7th.
[47:58.080 --> 47:58.720] [__BERNIE_S]: You don't have...
[47:58.720 --> 48:00.360] [__BERNIE_S]: You know, I'm not saying I agree with it or not.
[48:00.360 --> 48:02.640] [__BERNIE_S]: I'm just sharing why this happened, okay?
[48:02.980 --> 48:10.060] [__BERNIE_S]: May I say this so that people can verify this as a true fact instead of listening to you and Alex and me and other people?
[48:10.440 --> 48:15.860] [__BERNIE_S]: This will only take half a minute for me to get this information out of the air that listeners can verify themselves.
[48:16.940 --> 48:17.180] [EVILCORLEY]: Yep.
[48:17.420 --> 48:18.040] [EVILCORLEY]: Go right ahead.
[48:18.040 --> 48:18.120] [__BERNIE_S]: This is good.
[48:18.500 --> 48:19.660] [__BERNIE_S]: Okay, this is good.
[48:19.920 --> 48:20.020] [__BERNIE_S]: Alright.
[48:20.380 --> 48:40.360] [__BERNIE_S]: There were two reasons that the Pacifica Director, the Executive Director, who is also the Chief Executive Officer and the General Manager of the organization, felt after speaking with many people on the board, why they had to step in on October 7th and what they did.
[48:40.820 --> 48:45.920] [__BERNIE_S]: One is it was bleeding money and it was not being able to make payroll, that sort of thing.
[48:45.920 --> 48:52.760] [__BERNIE_S]: The other reason is, and this is in the court filings, by the way, if you look at what was filed with Judge Crane most recently...
[48:52.760 --> 48:53.860] [EVILCORLEY]: Yeah, that half minute is up.
[48:54.420 --> 48:55.220] [__BERNIE_S]: Well, okay.
[48:56.060 --> 48:57.020] [__BERNIE_S]: I'll be quick.
[48:57.020 --> 49:18.580] [__BERNIE_S]: Listeners can call the Office of the New York State Attorney General, Division of Social Justice Charities Bureau at area code 212-416-8688 and a legal assistant named Jacqueline Sanchez.
[49:18.580 --> 49:48.560] [__BERNIE_S]: She says, if you give her the Charity Identification Number, which is Charity Bureau File Number 19CHN as in November 0095 (19CHN-0095) and Charity Registration Number 02-88-84, she will tell anybody who calls that the Pacifica is legally not permitted to raise more than $25,000 per year in the State of New York, which obviously has already happened in WBAI.
[49:54.120 --> 49:58.260] [__BERNIE_S]: It gives me no pleasure to say that, but that is just a fact that I am sharing.
[49:58.260 --> 50:10.020] [__BERNIE_S]: And when you're on a board of directors at a charity, a 501c3, you have a legal due diligence obligation to follow the law.
[50:10.320 --> 50:15.920] [__BERNIE_S]: Whether you agree with the law or not, Emmanuel, you have to follow it when you're on a board.
[50:15.920 --> 50:18.420] [__BERNIE_S]: That's your legal obligation.
[50:18.880 --> 50:35.220] [__BERNIE_S]: So besides the fact that WBAI was not able to make payroll eight times this year, every two weeks there's a payroll, eight times this year, WBAI was unable to raise enough money to make payroll, to pay for the transmitter rental at 4 Times Square, and other expenses, and there was no money left to pay.
[50:37.320 --> 50:46.420] [__BERNIE_S]: And in fact, before the end of the next few weeks, if not sooner, there isn't going to be enough money to pay people at WBAI.
[50:46.620 --> 50:48.340] [__BERNIE_S]: And that's going to go throughout the network.
[50:48.520 --> 50:53.220] [__BERNIE_S]: So I'm not happy about that, but those are just facts that I'm sharing with the listeners, okay?
[50:54.400 --> 50:54.880] [ALEXURBELS]: Sure.
[50:55.520 --> 50:57.160] [EVILCORLEY]: I think we've heard enough.
[50:57.320 --> 50:59.080] [EVILCORLEY]: We need to talk about some other things, guys.
[51:00.000 --> 51:01.200] [ROBVINCENT]: I quite agree.
[51:01.360 --> 51:06.800] [ROBVINCENT]: But, you know, we do invite callers to call in, and you are a caller.
[51:06.800 --> 51:09.860] [ROBVINCENT]: So, in that aspect, thank you for your call.
[51:11.120 --> 51:11.640] [ROBVINCENT]: Alex?
[51:12.000 --> 51:15.260] [EVILCORLEY]: Now, can I just bring up a couple of points here, okay?
[51:15.440 --> 51:15.940] [ROBVINCENT]: Yes, Emmanuel.
[51:16.380 --> 51:17.660] [EVILCORLEY]: Just to put some facts forward.
[51:18.400 --> 51:25.260] [EVILCORLEY]: Look, WBAI did miss payments on certain bills and had to borrow from Pacifica.
[51:25.320 --> 51:27.320] [EVILCORLEY]: They paid them back every single time.
[51:27.520 --> 51:28.440] [EVILCORLEY]: That's never said.
[51:28.440 --> 51:31.160] [EVILCORLEY]: When this point is made by the people...
[51:31.640 --> 51:36.160] [EVILCORLEY]: I'm not happy the fact that Bernie supports the coup and is a part of this.
[51:36.340 --> 51:37.880] [EVILCORLEY]: I don't know how that happened.
[51:38.100 --> 51:40.260] [EVILCORLEY]: I really don't understand it.
[51:40.360 --> 51:41.940] [EVILCORLEY]: I cannot for the life of me understand.
[51:42.360 --> 51:51.940] [EVILCORLEY]: If you believe something that you support is doing something wrong, why would you invite everybody in the world to call them on it and to get them in trouble?
[51:51.940 --> 51:54.040] [EVILCORLEY]: Now, I can tell you, they're not...
[51:54.040 --> 51:55.340] [EVILCORLEY]: They're not doing something wrong.
[51:55.740 --> 52:03.700] [EVILCORLEY]: I've already seen evidence that shows that WBAI is completely up-to-date, or Pacifica is up-to-date in New York.
[52:03.700 --> 52:06.480] [EVILCORLEY]: It's been posted on these very same maps.
[52:06.480 --> 52:12.100] [EVILCORLEY]: So I have no idea why this kind of a thing is being pursued.
[52:12.340 --> 52:13.180] [EVILCORLEY]: It's insane.
[52:14.480 --> 52:19.000] [ALEXURBELS]: Well, look, and if I could speak to a couple of the points that were raised here as well.
[52:20.040 --> 52:40.260] [ALEXURBELS]: Again, I want to reiterate that if WBAI is delinquent with its charity's filings that are owed to the state of New York, you may be able to call that number and get verification of that point, but I find it very unlikely that anybody in any kind of New York State office is going to make an interpretation of the law with respect to WBAI.
[52:40.420 --> 52:49.580] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, all state employees are advised, whether you're working for a court, for a justice, for whomever, not to give out any kind of legal advice.
[52:49.580 --> 52:57.420] [ALEXURBELS]: That would be giving out legal advice to WBAI or to its listeners about the implications of this particular delinquent filing.
[52:58.520 --> 53:06.960] [ALEXURBELS]: Anything that is going to happen to WBAI and its ability to fundraise or not fundraise is going to have to happen on the basis of due process.
[53:07.360 --> 53:09.080] [ALEXURBELS]: I haven't seen any of that due process.
[53:09.220 --> 53:10.240] [ALEXURBELS]: I haven't heard anything of it.
[53:10.420 --> 53:19.920] [ALEXURBELS]: I'm not privy to all the correspondence between the state and WBAI, but I think that certainly we would have seen something about that particular point at least over the last month.
[53:19.920 --> 53:29.260] [ALEXURBELS]: Now, with respect to the fact that let's say that we are prevented from fundraising over $25,000, and we do fundraise over $25,000, what's going to happen?
[53:30.640 --> 53:32.620] [ALEXURBELS]: Almost nothing, in my opinion.
[53:32.920 --> 53:34.640] [ALEXURBELS]: I mean, this is extraordinarily low risk.
[53:34.780 --> 53:39.600] [ALEXURBELS]: This is a charity that has cured its filing and raised perhaps over $25,000.
[53:39.600 --> 53:42.860] [ALEXURBELS]: There is a particular legal maxim that comes to mind.
[53:42.860 --> 53:48.560] [ALEXURBELS]: De minimis non curat lex, which translates from the Latin to the law doesn't care about trifles.
[53:48.680 --> 53:52.320] [ALEXURBELS]: Because this is a filing, this is a procedural issue that can be cured.
[53:52.500 --> 54:03.520] [ALEXURBELS]: If we cure that procedural issue, then the effect of whatever this ban is on fundraising over $25,000 is likely not going to cause us to forfeit any of that amount.
[54:04.900 --> 54:13.920] [ALEXURBELS]: And I think it really just completely underscores the reasons why people do need to be supporting the station right now more than ever, because we do need to get our ducks in a row.
[54:14.040 --> 54:21.840] [ALEXURBELS]: If Bernie's call was indicative of anything, is that, you know what, the station is shambolic right now because we have been through this coup.
[54:21.840 --> 54:44.480] [ALEXURBELS]: And I would like to know specifically how much money the Pacifica National Board spent on their council and spent on a ridiculous bat-poop legal memorandum that disenfranchised several members of the Pacifica National Board from voting in favor of WBAI and the restoration of WBAI during this particular coup.
[54:44.680 --> 55:02.540] [ALEXURBELS]: If we want to talk about finances, I would like to know about what the Pacifica National Board has spent of the money that WBAI had fundraised for its own survival and own support and spent that money in furtherance of a coup to destroy the place that was actually getting back on its feet.
[55:02.680 --> 55:03.640] [ALEXURBELS]: That's what I would like to know.
[55:03.680 --> 55:09.720] [EVILCORLEY]: I think, listeners, first-hand you can see how this type of a thing is pervasive.
[55:09.720 --> 55:12.160] [EVILCORLEY]: It just kind of comes out of nowhere.
[55:12.160 --> 55:17.300] [EVILCORLEY]: And people that you think are on your side turn out to be on a completely different side.
[55:17.300 --> 55:18.540] [ROBVINCENT]: Also, you know, coming...
[55:18.540 --> 55:19.900] [EVILCORLEY]: And are actively...
[55:19.900 --> 55:22.960] [ROBVINCENT]: Sorry, coming from the viewpoint of...
[55:22.960 --> 55:22.980] [EVILCORLEY]: Absolutely.
[55:23.700 --> 55:27.540] [ROBVINCENT]: And coming from the viewpoint of this program, Off The Hook, we are the hacker radio show.
[55:28.880 --> 55:37.580] [ROBVINCENT]: And it's always been where our, I think, where most of our community and most of our programmers on this program have come from.
[55:37.580 --> 55:50.380] [ROBVINCENT]: The angle is, if you see a rule that interferes with something that you need to do, if you see a rule that's unjust or illogical or just plain obstructive, the thing we do not do is shrink and start complying with that rule.
[55:50.500 --> 55:59.000] [ROBVINCENT]: The thing we do is then look into how we can get around this rule, how we can get it changed, how we can get it unnulled, because we are hackers and we fix things.
[55:59.000 --> 56:04.280] [ROBVINCENT]: We do not just declare things broken and then be done with it.
[56:04.380 --> 56:09.580] [ROBVINCENT]: And I would have expected better of anyone from this community, from this program, who was forged in the fires of off the hook.
[56:10.720 --> 56:11.160] [EVILCORLEY]: Absolutely.
[56:11.260 --> 56:14.080] [EVILCORLEY]: Can I just make a suggestion and to counter this crap...
[56:14.520 --> 56:14.920] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[56:14.920 --> 56:16.900] [EVILCORLEY]: ...that we've been airing over the last few minutes.
[56:16.900 --> 56:17.440] [EVILCORLEY]: I'm sorry.
[56:17.440 --> 56:22.580] [EVILCORLEY]: It just angers me to hear such misinformation being given out by one of our rounds.
[56:23.620 --> 56:29.780] [EVILCORLEY]: Please pledge $25,000 and one cent just to show that we know where we stand.
[56:29.960 --> 56:32.840] [EVILCORLEY]: This radio station is following all the rules.
[56:33.120 --> 56:34.760] [EVILCORLEY]: And we want to be strong.
[56:34.760 --> 56:36.660] [EVILCORLEY]: We want to stand up for free speech.
[56:36.900 --> 56:40.260] [EVILCORLEY]: And we want to survive another 60 years.
[56:40.620 --> 56:48.600] [KYLEDROSDK]: Yeah, and I would just say that this argument, in my opinion, it really is just changing the locks in another way.
[56:48.820 --> 56:49.620] [KYLEDROSDK]: They lost.
[56:49.840 --> 56:51.260] [KYLEDROSDK]: We are triumphant.
[56:51.480 --> 56:52.520] [KYLEDROSDK]: We're back on the air.
[56:52.680 --> 56:58.180] [KYLEDROSDK]: And they want to go about, metaphorically, changing the locks with this type of argument.
[56:58.640 --> 57:08.000] [KYLEDROSDK]: And hamstring, from Pacifica, hamstring the local production and this show, among many others, and the service it provides to the community.
[57:08.560 --> 57:11.000] [EVILCORLEY]: oth@2600.com is our email address.
[57:11.000 --> 57:12.720] [EVILCORLEY]: I'm sure you'll have lots to say to us.
[57:13.700 --> 57:13.980] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[57:14.500 --> 57:14.960] [ROBVINCENT]: Volt4ire.
[57:15.520 --> 57:19.620] [_VOLT4IRE_]: And tweet at us as well, hackerradioshow on Twitter and mastodon.social.
[57:20.240 --> 57:20.700] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[57:21.140 --> 57:23.080] [ALEXURBELS]: And hey guys, we're back tonight.
[57:23.320 --> 57:24.840] [ALEXURBELS]: This is a win.
[57:25.020 --> 57:26.040] [ALEXURBELS]: We're going to keep it going.
[57:26.220 --> 57:27.600] [ALEXURBELS]: We will prevail, ultimately.
[57:28.160 --> 57:30.940] [ALEXURBELS]: And look, this was good radio tonight, everybody.
[57:30.940 --> 57:33.000] [ALEXURBELS]: As contentious as it was, this is why we're here.
[57:33.060 --> 57:34.680] [ALEXURBELS]: We're here to speak about the issues.
[57:34.880 --> 57:36.020] [ALEXURBELS]: And we will never stop.
[57:36.680 --> 57:37.120] [ROBVINCENT]: Absolutely.
[57:38.320 --> 57:41.780] [ROBVINCENT]: Thank you, Emmanuel and Kyle, for joining us from parts unknown.
[57:42.740 --> 57:54.880] [ROBVINCENT]: And thank you to everyone out there who has thrown in and done what you could, and who will continue to throw in and do what you can to keep us doing what we do here at WBAI.
[57:56.540 --> 57:58.300] [ROBVINCENT]: oth@2600.com.
[57:58.440 --> 57:59.300] [ROBVINCENT]: Send us email.
[57:59.520 --> 58:00.380] [ROBVINCENT]: Get in touch.
[58:00.660 --> 58:01.720] [ROBVINCENT]: Have an excellent week.