Off The Hook - 2020-12-30

[00:00.000 --> 00:00.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: ...online.
[00:01.840 --> 00:02.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Do it.
[00:02.680 --> 00:03.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: Tell a friend.
[00:03.800 --> 00:08.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: And if you have the ability to do that, we will greatly appreciate your efforts.
[00:09.000 --> 00:12.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: With that said, stay tuned for Off The Hook, coming up.
[00:20.110 --> 00:20.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now?
[00:20.710 --> 00:21.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, okay.
[00:21.730 --> 00:22.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: Here I am.
[00:23.010 --> 00:24.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's 8 o'clock.
[00:24.890 --> 00:26.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm sorry, no, it's 7 o'clock.
[00:26.430 --> 00:26.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm ahead of myself.
[00:27.170 --> 00:28.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's WBAI New York.
[00:29.130 --> 00:30.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's time for Off The Hook.
[02:09.990 --> 02:11.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: And a very good evening to everybody.
[02:11.730 --> 02:13.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: The program is Off The Hook.
[02:13.450 --> 02:16.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Emmanuel Goldstein here with you, joined tonight by Kyle.
[02:18.150 --> 02:19.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: The microphone is off again.
[02:19.630 --> 02:22.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, if you put a switch on your mic, you turn it off every time.
[02:22.110 --> 02:22.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Try that again.
[02:23.090 --> 02:23.390]  [SPEAKER_07]: Hello?
[02:23.710 --> 02:24.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, stop it.
[02:24.590 --> 02:25.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're going to break the switch.
[02:25.810 --> 02:26.050]  [SPEAKER_07]: Hello?
[02:26.590 --> 02:27.350]  [SPEAKER_07]: Can you hear me?
[02:27.490 --> 02:27.810]  [SPEAKER_07]: Come in.
[02:27.830 --> 02:28.890]  [SPEAKER_07]: We all hear you.
[02:28.990 --> 02:29.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: Come in.
[02:29.470 --> 02:30.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: We all hear you fine.
[02:30.590 --> 02:33.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: And let's turn on the Skype people.
[02:34.250 --> 02:36.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that always makes my voice sound different for some reason.
[02:36.710 --> 02:37.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: Join tonight.
[02:37.370 --> 02:37.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Look at this.
[02:37.850 --> 02:38.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're in the Coliseum.
[02:38.950 --> 02:44.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is some kind of weird mode that we're in now on Skype, where it looks like we're all sitting together.
[02:46.590 --> 02:48.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's really... whose bright idea was that?
[02:50.350 --> 02:52.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: When I introduce you, you can tell us.
[02:52.810 --> 02:54.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rob T. Firefly, is it your idea?
[02:54.910 --> 02:55.710]  [SPEAKER_11]: Good evening.
[02:55.730 --> 02:56.730]  [SPEAKER_11]: It was not my idea.
[02:57.010 --> 02:57.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Gila, how about you?
[02:58.230 --> 02:59.230]  [SPEAKER_09]: It wasn't me.
[02:59.670 --> 03:00.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[03:00.050 --> 03:01.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: A lot of innocent people here.
[03:01.710 --> 03:03.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, sounds like something you would do.
[03:04.570 --> 03:06.990]  [SPEAKER_10]: Good evening from the Poconos, but no.
[03:07.190 --> 03:10.150]  [SPEAKER_10]: Seems like you may have accidentally clicked on together mode.
[03:10.290 --> 03:10.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: Uh-huh.
[03:10.530 --> 03:10.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[03:10.710 --> 03:11.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Blame me.
[03:11.490 --> 03:12.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Blame the end user.
[03:13.330 --> 03:14.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Voltaire, you're joining us tonight.
[03:16.330 --> 03:18.350]  [SPEAKER_01]: I can either confirm or deny it with me.
[03:18.510 --> 03:18.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[03:18.730 --> 03:19.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: So it was you.
[03:20.670 --> 03:21.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, welcome, everybody.
[03:22.010 --> 03:25.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is our last show of 2020.
[03:25.210 --> 03:25.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: 2020.
[03:26.290 --> 03:31.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I'm sure we are all very happy to see this year go into the history bins.
[03:31.930 --> 03:36.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, you know, again, like I said on the show last night, COVID-19.
[03:37.570 --> 03:39.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: It came from 2019, not 2020.
[03:40.990 --> 03:43.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: COVID-20 might be something to worry about in 2021.
[03:43.590 --> 03:48.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hopefully not, but I'm just saying there are a few more days left in this year.
[03:48.550 --> 03:50.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, actually, one more day left in this year.
[03:50.830 --> 03:54.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: It can still cause some damage.
[03:54.110 --> 03:59.890]  [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I think we've learned a lot about mitigating that particular kind of disaster.
[04:00.170 --> 04:05.830]  [SPEAKER_07]: So maybe if we get another challenge that's similar, we'll have learned some lessons.
[04:06.090 --> 04:06.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: How did we mitigate?
[04:06.730 --> 04:07.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: Even by holding an election?
[04:07.770 --> 04:09.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's how we mitigated that disaster.
[04:10.250 --> 04:10.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Right.
[04:10.650 --> 04:11.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's one way to do it, I suppose.
[04:12.010 --> 04:12.550]  [SPEAKER_07]: Civic engagement.
[04:12.890 --> 04:13.350]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[04:13.830 --> 04:14.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[04:14.850 --> 04:18.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hey, any of you guys make it to the Chaos Congress?
[04:18.570 --> 04:19.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: It just ended.
[04:19.550 --> 04:31.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: It was called RC3, which confused the bejesus out of me because RC1 was the name of one of the rooms and then RC2 was another room, but the conference was RC3.
[04:31.930 --> 04:37.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: But it was really, it reminded me a lot of hope because it was presented in a similar style.
[04:37.810 --> 04:42.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: But they had a whole lot of tracks from all over the world, I guess.
[04:43.510 --> 04:53.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: And they had a two-dimensional place you could wander around and converse with people if you decided to turn on your camera and your microphone, which I didn't.
[04:53.390 --> 04:54.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Any of you guys make it over there?
[04:55.230 --> 04:55.730]  [SPEAKER_01]: I did.
[04:56.010 --> 04:56.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: You did?
[04:56.610 --> 04:57.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: What did you think, Voltaire?
[04:57.530 --> 04:59.910]  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the 2D game was the coolest part.
[05:00.570 --> 05:12.910]  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you mentioned, that basically whenever you would get in proximity, like a certain amount of pixels from somebody else, if you had this enabled, it would automatically turn on your webcam and your microphone.
[05:13.050 --> 05:17.570]  [SPEAKER_01]: So basically, it would be kind of like real life in that if you had to close to somebody, you can have a conversation with them.
[05:18.070 --> 05:18.510]  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[05:19.950 --> 05:23.630]  [SPEAKER_01]: And they open so much on this code and you can't make your own...
[05:24.170 --> 05:26.710]  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like a 16-bit type graphics.
[05:26.710 --> 05:28.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: It sounds like great fun.
[05:29.270 --> 05:30.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just have this...
[05:30.730 --> 05:39.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm averse to turning on my camera and my microphone automatically, but I can see where that could be a ton of fun for conversing and exploring.
[05:39.590 --> 05:47.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just walked around and it was kind of cool because it looked like I was at Congress in a two-dimensional style.
[05:47.890 --> 05:48.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: I actually...
[05:48.350 --> 05:54.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: I went to heaven for a while, floating around the clouds, and I guess that's where a lot of the volunteers hang out.
[05:55.530 --> 05:56.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: But the talks...
[05:56.330 --> 05:56.790]  [SPEAKER_01]: So I called them angels.
[05:57.350 --> 05:58.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, a lot of angels.
[05:58.350 --> 05:59.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: A lot of angels up there.
[05:59.390 --> 06:00.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: I might have even seen God.
[06:01.390 --> 06:10.090]  [SPEAKER_07]: They had a really interesting news program they mixed in called the Herald News Program or show...
[06:10.090 --> 06:10.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: In between talks.
[06:11.070 --> 06:11.490]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah.
[06:11.610 --> 06:12.710]  [SPEAKER_07]: And that was really interesting.
[06:12.710 --> 06:29.490]  [SPEAKER_07]: And as you said, reminded me a lot of our efforts to keep people updated because that's a big part of it is getting information so people know how to use the world or visit a page to find different streams or assemblies.
[06:31.390 --> 06:36.690]  [SPEAKER_07]: But to a great degree, they had promos and things.
[06:36.690 --> 06:40.670]  [SPEAKER_07]: There was the Chaos Choir getting together and performing.
[06:41.350 --> 06:58.470]  [SPEAKER_07]: They really went out of their way to try to bring as many attributes of the physical event, which these virtual programs are similar in a lot of ways as far as the information, but it's not obviously going to replicate the physical experience.
[06:58.650 --> 06:59.730]  [SPEAKER_07]: It's just different.
[06:59.850 --> 07:00.750]  [SPEAKER_07]: It's a little different.
[07:00.910 --> 07:03.350]  [SPEAKER_07]: And if you prepare yourself, it can be a lot of fun.
[07:03.350 --> 07:12.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: And yeah, between DEFCON, HOPE, and the Chaos Congress, I think the hacker world really showed some imagination and spirit this year.
[07:12.910 --> 07:16.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I'm happy that we were able to do something.
[07:16.850 --> 07:29.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: I sure hope that 2021, we'll be able to go back to actual in-person events and appreciate them a whole lot more, but also bring to the table some of what we've learned.
[07:29.690 --> 07:31.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: We'll talk about that a little bit later on.
[07:31.030 --> 07:48.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'd like to go back in time a little bit now, as we've been doing the last few weeks, and it's turned into a very popular segment of the program, where we, thanks to a couple of listeners, we have managed to restore our old 2600 Hacker Voice bulletin board system.
[07:48.810 --> 07:55.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: We had messages on there that were in some archaic format, and we couldn't figure out how to translate them so that we could listen to them again.
[07:55.950 --> 08:06.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: And now, thanks to that help that we received, we have been able to convert 4,000 plus, and we've been just kind of going through and playing some of the highlights.
[08:07.530 --> 08:09.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: Mid-90s, I think, is what we're looking at here.
[08:10.150 --> 08:13.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, well, let's just dive in and play one.
[08:14.590 --> 08:16.930]  [SPEAKER_13]: Hi, this is Joe from Insurgent Networks.
[08:17.050 --> 08:19.750]  [SPEAKER_13]: We're a new system starting up in upstate New York.
[08:21.150 --> 08:30.790]  [SPEAKER_13]: We have a website that's going to be going up very soon, www.insurgent.com, and a chat network, an IRC network in the budding.
[08:32.490 --> 08:49.670]  [SPEAKER_13]: We are looking for people who are willing to write articles for the website or help keep up the news information on the website, current people who might have boxes on the web who want to link in, or boxes on the net who want to link into the IRC network,
[08:50.070 --> 08:53.170]  [SPEAKER_13]: and general volunteers all across the board for anything.
[08:53.390 --> 08:55.210]  [SPEAKER_13]: This is an open system.
[08:55.210 --> 09:01.910]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is trying to further the free flow of information.
[09:03.050 --> 09:19.710]  [SPEAKER_13]: Any questions can be sent to me at irs-admn at aleph.insurgent.com, or pop by our IRC server.
[09:19.870 --> 09:26.630]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's coming to load right now, considering it's fairly new and it's not publicized, irc.insurgent.com.
[09:27.230 --> 09:27.670]  [SPEAKER_13]: Thanks.
[09:27.910 --> 09:28.130]  [SPEAKER_13]: Bye.
[09:29.430 --> 09:29.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[09:30.050 --> 09:33.490]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, I don't think the excuse of it being new is going to hold anymore.
[09:34.170 --> 09:36.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: If it's there at all, it's quite old.
[09:37.010 --> 09:46.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know if any email you send or any IRC connections you try to make will go through, but it is interesting to hear that kind of enthusiasm, you know, starting off a new project.
[09:47.010 --> 09:48.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Any of you guys remember this?
[09:49.030 --> 09:49.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: No?
[09:50.130 --> 09:59.470]  [SPEAKER_11]: I don't remember this particular one, but I, with a heavy heart, must report that apparently at some point, this person lost the domain name insurgent.com.
[09:59.470 --> 10:01.950]  [SPEAKER_11]: Now it's some sort of a food industry outfit.
[10:02.910 --> 10:03.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[10:03.650 --> 10:03.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[10:03.990 --> 10:04.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, that's kind of sad.
[10:06.090 --> 10:11.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: So maybe, maybe they will hear this and think fondly back.
[10:11.770 --> 10:14.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: And we're sorry it took us so long to help you publicize.
[10:15.090 --> 10:19.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: Although the, for all intents and purposes, uh, it, the system did what it was supposed to do.
[10:19.390 --> 10:26.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, you, you basically, you called into a particular telephone number, which I believe was five, one, six, four, seven, three, two, six, two, six.
[10:26.370 --> 10:27.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, we had five lines.
[10:28.190 --> 10:37.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: People would call in and they would have mailboxes on the system, but they, just like a regular computer bulletin board system, they could leave public messages that people could listen to and reply to.
[10:37.770 --> 10:39.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, we have another one.
[10:39.150 --> 10:41.490]  [SPEAKER_12]: Let's listen to, um, uh, to the next in the series.
[10:46.600 --> 10:48.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: Which for some reason is not coming up.
[10:48.440 --> 10:49.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm not sure why that is.
[10:50.220 --> 10:51.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, you know why?
[10:51.100 --> 10:54.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: Because I didn't, I didn't turn the volume up on the, uh, on the computer here.
[10:54.580 --> 10:54.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[10:55.000 --> 11:00.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, with the next, uh, next one from the old 2600, Hacker BBS.
[11:02.180 --> 11:10.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, this is Isaiah Sarek from 416 with a message for Drax regarding the, uh, the canned wires, the, uh, red, yellow, green, and black.
[11:10.540 --> 11:15.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, in most cases, the, uh, red and green are the ones that are going to be used with one another.
[11:15.560 --> 11:18.720]  [SPEAKER_08]: Red is, um, what the phone company uses to alert your telephone.
[11:18.820 --> 11:19.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: In other words, get it to ring.
[11:20.400 --> 11:21.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: Uh, green complements that.
[11:21.960 --> 11:24.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's, um, it's called a tip.
[11:24.660 --> 11:26.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: Um, red is called ring.
[11:26.420 --> 11:38.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yellow and black are rarely used, but in case you ever want to use them, they're in most cases used for, uh, multi-line purposes to get, um, in case you want to add an extension to your, to your house line off the existing line.
[11:38.520 --> 11:39.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: That was just about it.
[11:39.500 --> 11:39.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: Ice freak.
[11:40.240 --> 11:41.100]  [SPEAKER_08]: 416 out.
[11:41.940 --> 11:43.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: And of course, 416 is Toronto.
[11:44.920 --> 11:47.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, this information, Alex, I see you, you're, you're taking an interest in this.
[11:48.060 --> 11:50.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: This, this, this is something that's still pertinent today.
[11:51.560 --> 11:52.260]  [SPEAKER_10]: It is.
[11:52.360 --> 12:01.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: And what he was probably describing there was how to create something that was called a a beige box back in the day and still would be, what was a beige box?
[12:01.920 --> 12:02.600]  [SPEAKER_12]: What would that be?
[12:03.260 --> 12:08.020]  [SPEAKER_10]: A beige box is essentially a makeshift or homemade lineman's handset.
[12:08.080 --> 12:14.320]  [SPEAKER_10]: If you recall from the days gone by, you would drive past the telephone company truck on the side of the road.
[12:14.460 --> 12:24.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: You'd see the guy hooked into a big cross box, uh, using an orange phone, something like that, a big, you know, telephone company phone that he's clipped into something and using that particular phone.
[12:25.560 --> 12:30.100]  [SPEAKER_10]: The beige box was just a, a replication of that lineman's handset.
[12:30.720 --> 12:36.720]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you did that by taking your regular RJ 11 jack, your regular telephone jack, cutting off the end of it.
[12:36.800 --> 12:39.900]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you had four different wires in there that he was describing.
[12:39.900 --> 12:44.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: You had the yellow and the black and the red and the green, the red and the green, as he mentioned, was the ring and the tip.
[12:44.400 --> 12:59.320]  [SPEAKER_10]: And what you would do was go to RadioShack, remember when those existed, buy yourself for usually less than a dollar or two, a packet of alligator clips, splice the red and the green wires so that you had the copper coming out, run them into alligator clips.
[12:59.540 --> 13:11.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you had essentially, once you plug the other end of that phone into a handset, the regular, the other end of the RJ 11 jack into a handset, you had yourself a homemade lineman's handset.
[13:11.540 --> 13:13.780]  [SPEAKER_10]: The same thing that the telephone company guys would use.
[13:13.880 --> 13:16.420]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you could do all kinds of magic with that.
[13:16.580 --> 13:27.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: You could climb up a telephone pole, open up a cross box and clip onto, I think it was called a manual that the cable impair, if I recall correctly, and start using other people's phone lines.
[13:27.300 --> 13:37.420]  [SPEAKER_10]: Every telephone line had a connection, let's say on the side of the house, where the telephone system would, the telephone lines would connect into the house.
[13:37.780 --> 13:49.880]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's usually a little gray box with a special hex type of screw that was difficult to unscrew, but could be kicked off, if I recall correctly, pretty easily.
[13:50.540 --> 13:58.580]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then you would just clip on to where the telephone line ran in, and you were essentially using the phone in somebody's house, but outside somebody's house.
[13:59.580 --> 14:04.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: We had lots of fun with lineman's handsets way, way back in the day, I have to say.
[14:04.820 --> 14:11.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: And it was very cool to hear him describe those very wires that were near and dear to my heart to this day.
[14:12.060 --> 14:18.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that is what you can do with old recordings that you discover after 25 years.
[14:19.120 --> 14:19.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[14:19.780 --> 14:21.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't believe it's been that long.
[14:21.780 --> 14:24.600]  [SPEAKER_12]: 19, about 1995, I think is what we, we estimated.
[14:24.940 --> 14:29.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, well, this last one is certainly going to spur some passion.
[14:29.940 --> 14:39.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is from somebody who is extremely passionate, I guess, about their craft, about hacking, about technology.
[14:39.620 --> 14:40.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Let's have a listen.
[14:45.370 --> 14:47.830]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yo, the cable freaker out there.
[14:49.490 --> 14:54.990]  [SPEAKER_03]: I will tell you the best way to be able to get cable for free, you look at the bottom of your cable box.
[14:55.210 --> 15:01.250]  [SPEAKER_03]: Like it might say, Gerald DPV-7, or DPV-BB, which stands for baseband 7.
[15:02.190 --> 15:08.990]  [SPEAKER_03]: And there are several cable companies, cable pirating companies, that you can buy stuff to the mail order.
[15:09.590 --> 15:19.170]  [SPEAKER_03]: You can either buy the box, which usually runs about 400 bucks, or you can buy what's called an activator chip, which goes on the outside of the cable box that your cable company has.
[15:19.770 --> 15:24.530]  [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, you can either use your cable company box, or use a stolen box, whatever.
[15:25.210 --> 15:29.110]  [SPEAKER_03]: But what this chip does, is it activates the cable box.
[15:29.130 --> 15:40.190]  [SPEAKER_03]: Usually on the Gerald box is you press F, then 1, and then you flip the chip on, and you have a little tuning tool, and you tune it to where it goes from CE to C0, all right?
[15:40.390 --> 15:48.610]  [SPEAKER_03]: Then you hit the F key again, then you flip the chip off, then back on again, after pressing F1 again on your Gerald box.
[15:48.870 --> 15:50.690]  [SPEAKER_03]: Some Gerald boxes, it's F4.
[15:51.170 --> 15:55.390]  [SPEAKER_03]: And within three minutes, it'll flip the channel two, and you'll be able to get everything.
[15:55.590 --> 15:59.850]  [SPEAKER_03]: All the channels after 54 are going to be eight channels higher.
[16:00.250 --> 16:03.470]  [SPEAKER_03]: And there are several companies that sell these activator chips.
[16:04.410 --> 16:07.910]  [SPEAKER_03]: And all you do is look around and see what you can come up with.
[16:08.210 --> 16:15.350]  [SPEAKER_03]: Also, the DSS dish, there is a card that's out that allows the DSS to get everything.
[16:15.630 --> 16:19.630]  [SPEAKER_03]: There's several electronic companies that sell those as well.
[16:19.850 --> 16:21.390]  [SPEAKER_03]: So that stuff is out there.
[16:21.490 --> 16:23.910]  [SPEAKER_03]: If you know what you're doing, you can do it.
[16:24.010 --> 16:28.290]  [SPEAKER_03]: Now, another thing to do is to get what's called a standalone descrambler.
[16:28.330 --> 16:33.030]  [SPEAKER_03]: If you have a cable converter that's not addressable, that transmits channel three.
[16:33.310 --> 16:40.730]  [SPEAKER_03]: If your system is a Gerald system and not using BB, you can buy a Gerald standalone descrambler for about 130 bucks.
[16:41.070 --> 16:54.270]  [SPEAKER_03]: The Pioneer descramblers, which is like the Pioneer green, which covers all those Pioneer boxes with the authorized button on them, which basically sends a signal to the cable company telling the cable company that, you know, it's okay to go and start billing you.
[16:54.930 --> 17:01.090]  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, what you do is you, um, you hook that sucker up and, um, with your...
[17:02.010 --> 17:03.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, what happened to him?
[17:03.430 --> 17:07.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: I wonder if, I wonder if we cut him off and maybe, uh, maybe there's a maximum time.
[17:08.010 --> 17:12.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's that guy was, was so into what he was talking about.
[17:12.550 --> 17:24.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Of course, virtually none of what he was talking about is still applicable today, but you guys remember, remember the old Gerald boxes and, and, uh, the, the, the things he was talking about?
[17:26.850 --> 17:27.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: Nobody?
[17:29.130 --> 17:31.370]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, but I have a question.
[17:31.790 --> 17:37.810]  [SPEAKER_09]: Um, because I was thinking that was a whole lot of information really, really quickly.
[17:38.330 --> 17:41.990]  [SPEAKER_09]: It was there a way to access specific messages in the system?
[17:42.230 --> 17:43.990]  [SPEAKER_09]: Could you go back to that and take notes?
[17:44.210 --> 17:46.150]  [SPEAKER_09]: Or could you hear it once and try to remember?
[17:46.430 --> 17:46.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[17:47.070 --> 17:49.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, we haven't gotten into that stage yet.
[17:49.410 --> 17:51.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: With, with 4,000 messages, it's going to take time.
[17:51.990 --> 17:52.850]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, I mean, back then.
[17:53.010 --> 17:53.530]  [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, back then.
[17:53.870 --> 17:57.450]  [SPEAKER_09]: Could you, could you dial into a specific message if you wanted to get that information?
[17:57.910 --> 17:59.830]  [SPEAKER_09]: Because like, you can't print that out like an email.
[17:59.970 --> 18:00.210]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[18:00.210 --> 18:02.490]  [SPEAKER_09]: You can't do that for the guy, because he was downloading a lot.
[18:02.730 --> 18:06.050]  [SPEAKER_09]: But if you couldn't write it all down immediately, there was nothing to do.
[18:06.050 --> 18:06.450]  [SPEAKER_09]: That's true.
[18:06.590 --> 18:08.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, I know you ran the system for a while.
[18:08.570 --> 18:10.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you remember how it was set up?
[18:10.430 --> 18:10.470]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
[18:10.850 --> 18:11.250]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
[18:11.250 --> 18:17.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: You could, you could replay that over and over and over again if you wanted to, you know, and just, you know, re-listen to it.
[18:17.470 --> 18:23.710]  [SPEAKER_10]: And a lot of people would have this type of information as well as like their, their outgoing message on their voicemail box, right?
[18:23.750 --> 18:35.030]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's where a lot of people had distributed information was through their outgoing message, essentially the message that you would hear if somebody didn't pick up the phone and it was an answering machine, right?
[18:35.110 --> 18:37.950]  [SPEAKER_10]: Your outgoing message is going to contain a lot of information.
[18:38.150 --> 18:47.250]  [SPEAKER_10]: And for the voicemail box hackers and people that would exchange codes and credit cards that were not on with that, that was, that did not happen on the 2600 voice bulletin board system.
[18:47.690 --> 18:50.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: But that was the technique.
[18:50.490 --> 18:56.010]  [SPEAKER_10]: You would call up and you, they would read out phone numbers, calling cards, credit card numbers, et cetera.
[18:56.430 --> 18:58.190]  [SPEAKER_10]: You might not catch it all the first time.
[18:58.310 --> 18:59.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: So you would call back.
[19:00.030 --> 19:01.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, Alex, hold on a second.
[19:01.750 --> 19:02.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: We didn't do that.
[19:02.590 --> 19:05.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: We didn't have credit card numbers or codes or any of that kind of thing.
[19:05.530 --> 19:06.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: We were very strict about that.
[19:07.090 --> 19:15.870]  [SPEAKER_10]: That was not happening on the 2600 voice BBS, but on other, you know, hacker voicemail systems that were, that were hacked and that did distribute these things.
[19:16.030 --> 19:20.010]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's what would happen because they would distribute these through the outgoing message.
[19:20.010 --> 19:22.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: If you missed information, you would just call back and re-listen.
[19:22.830 --> 19:36.350]  [SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, as I was saying before this thing rudely cut me off, with the pioneer boxes that, you know, send that cable signal to the company, back to the company, there is a chip for those.
[19:36.510 --> 19:46.190]  [SPEAKER_03]: However, you have to read the, uh, the little, um, uh, six digit, uh, converter ID number, which is just below the barcode.
[19:46.330 --> 19:50.190]  [SPEAKER_03]: And the only, um, box that'll work on is that present box.
[19:50.390 --> 20:04.650]  [SPEAKER_03]: So buying the chip for the pioneer box really isn't the way to go because you either have to, a steal the box because, I mean, you know, if you move, obviously you're going to have a different box and then you have a $149 chip that isn't worth jack.
[20:05.470 --> 20:22.650]  [SPEAKER_03]: So, um, best thing to do is to get the, um, the non-addressable converter, which you can usually get like, like the Century converter or the Panasonic, which is like $100, and then get yourself the, uh, standalone descrambler.
[20:22.850 --> 20:34.250]  [SPEAKER_03]: Now, I understand that SA boxes, Scientific Atlantas, like the 8500 and the 8600, all of those in the, in the Hamlin CR6600s are being obsoleted.
[20:34.570 --> 20:36.410]  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, they're no longer going to be making those.
[20:36.670 --> 20:40.570]  [SPEAKER_03]: And TCI cable vision has been switching over to Gerald's all over the place.
[20:40.730 --> 20:43.430]  [SPEAKER_03]: So you need to find out if you're BV or not.
[20:43.890 --> 20:55.770]  [SPEAKER_03]: And the best thing to do with the Gerald system is to get the chip because the chip will work on the, uh, DPV-5s, the DPV-7s, the DPV-BB-7s, and the DPV-BB-2014s.
[20:56.110 --> 20:59.450]  [SPEAKER_03]: So the Gerald chip basically is the best way to go.
[20:59.630 --> 21:00.710]  [SPEAKER_03]: So there you have it.
[21:00.890 --> 21:04.490]  [SPEAKER_03]: And, um, I have been a cable freaker for quite some time.
[21:05.730 --> 21:06.470]  [SPEAKER_03]: That's it.
[21:06.690 --> 21:07.690]  [SPEAKER_03]: Have a good one, people.
[21:08.190 --> 21:09.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh my God.
[21:09.390 --> 21:11.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's just so incredible hearing that.
[21:11.710 --> 21:16.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, none of it is applicable anymore, but boy, the passion certainly is.
[21:16.890 --> 21:20.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, uh, I, you know, do people collect, uh, old cable boxes?
[21:20.490 --> 21:23.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm, I'm sure there's a, uh, a group of people that do that.
[21:25.290 --> 21:26.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Probably none of us.
[21:26.290 --> 21:26.930]  [SPEAKER_11]: There must be somewhere.
[21:27.210 --> 21:29.390]  [SPEAKER_11]: It was, it was a fascinating hobby at the time.
[21:29.590 --> 21:42.910]  [SPEAKER_11]: And, uh, as, as this person, uh, knew full well, because analog cable back in the old days, before everything was digital, basically when you get down to it, the company was broadcasting everything to every customer and everyone that was hooked up.
[21:43.010 --> 21:48.070]  [SPEAKER_11]: And it was just in your box where the, uh, smarts were to decide what you were allowed to watch and what you weren't.
[21:48.210 --> 21:57.070]  [SPEAKER_11]: So it was very popular to have, say, add on hardware or, uh, other sorts of hacks to get around the limitations that your box was setting for itself.
[21:57.410 --> 22:03.170]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, nowadays, everything is like two way communication and the cable company knows full well what's going on in your individual box.
[22:03.690 --> 22:08.670]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, so, but yes, I do remember the Gerald boxes, uh, J E double R O L D.
[22:08.970 --> 22:14.430]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, they were a very popular brand for these, for these things and, uh, a lot of fun to play with, as I remember.
[22:14.770 --> 22:24.570]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, to, to, to, to go back to what Kayla was asking about when you were listening to this, the voice messages were basically in threads there and you would control this with your Touch-Tones.
[22:24.950 --> 22:30.630]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, and you would have basically, uh, like any other forum, you would have a couple of different forums you could go in and listen to.
[22:30.970 --> 22:36.930]  [SPEAKER_11]: And then when you selected that forum, you would hear say the newest messages first, and then it would go back through the older ones.
[22:37.330 --> 22:42.030]  [SPEAKER_11]: And you could, you could go back to the, back to the previous message, go to the next one, replay the one you're on.
[22:42.150 --> 22:49.510]  [SPEAKER_11]: So it was easy if you had like a pen and paper while you're, while you were listening to this to, to write everything down in an info dump like this.
[22:49.710 --> 22:51.430]  [SPEAKER_11]: Um, and there was a lot of good info on it.
[22:52.690 --> 22:57.010]  [SPEAKER_07]: I've seen a repurposed, uh, for closed circuit systems, old cable boxes.
[22:57.230 --> 23:08.730]  [SPEAKER_07]: Like if you brought, if you, yeah, like you're basically kind of emulating a cable channel in your on site, and then you can have those box that coax distributed throughout the site.
[23:08.990 --> 23:12.970]  [SPEAKER_07]: And then a cable box then decodes each surveillance camera as a channel.
[23:13.130 --> 23:13.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[23:13.470 --> 23:16.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just want to remember how they used to work.
[23:16.310 --> 23:21.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: I remember, um, one of the first boxes I had, you had two through 13 on the top.
[23:21.370 --> 23:24.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: And then I think it was a through J on the second row.
[23:24.210 --> 23:25.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: And then it was a third row.
[23:25.170 --> 23:26.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: I think also letters.
[23:26.790 --> 23:35.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: So anybody still have those boxes because, because the channels used to be lettered channels, they, they, I guess they didn't figure out to, uh, go above a certain number.
[23:35.490 --> 23:42.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: So I remember in Manhattan, there was, I think channel I was, was that the naked channel of one of the public access channels was, was lettered.
[23:42.830 --> 23:47.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, the whole, the whole culture has changed, but it's, it's really important to go back and, and look at that.
[23:48.370 --> 23:55.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, and I, I'm just, I'm just curious if there are any, um, um, uh, technology groups that, uh, that focus on this.
[23:56.290 --> 24:03.030]  [SPEAKER_07]: Like a, a collection, uh, of sorts specifically for a broadcast satellites and cable.
[24:03.270 --> 24:04.270]  [SPEAKER_07]: That'd be fascinating.
[24:04.530 --> 24:09.810]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure somebody's tried or, or, um, pitched it as a, a, a cool, uh, spectacle.
[24:09.970 --> 24:14.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you remember, um, there, there were some, there were some channels that, um, would, would print out announcements.
[24:15.090 --> 24:19.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: It was just announcement channels, but they would print it at like 1200 baud line by line.
[24:19.850 --> 24:21.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: And there'd be, there'd be a scroll at the bottom.
[24:22.070 --> 24:28.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: There might be some kind of title at the top, but there basically it would, it would print out and you could read it as it was printing out.
[24:29.270 --> 24:31.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that was just the announcement channel.
[24:31.590 --> 24:36.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I, I actually saw a channel like that on Canadian TV, not too long ago, that still exists.
[24:36.610 --> 24:40.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: So they do still have the technology, but I just, I found it fascinating.
[24:40.370 --> 24:41.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: And it brings back such memories.
[24:41.890 --> 24:51.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: You remember last week we were talking about, um, uh, we just mentioned channel 11 and we got all this mail from people that also remembered, uh, the old time WPIX programming.
[24:51.950 --> 24:54.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: We were talking about the cop that used to host the kids show.
[24:54.230 --> 24:55.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Here's, here's one of the letters.
[24:55.430 --> 24:57.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: I've been a long time listener to your program off the hook.
[24:57.550 --> 25:06.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: Appreciate the information you and your partners routinely, uh, in part to the listeners in response to your question posed during the 1223 show about the police officer.
[25:06.510 --> 25:13.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, the police officer hosted kids show, which sounds awfully weird today, uh, that aired locally in New York city during the late fifties and early sixties.
[25:14.190 --> 25:21.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, he, he, uh, attached a link, uh, to a site called tvparty.com, uh, detailing the history of the show.
[25:21.550 --> 25:27.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, it aired, um, on, on channel 11 featured officer Joe Bolton, Joe Bolton was his name.
[25:27.830 --> 25:33.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: I have pleasant memories of those innocent years and immediately recalled the show when you mentioned it on the air.
[25:33.950 --> 25:40.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, so, uh, thanks Rob for, for sending in, uh, that clarification and a bunch of people sent in the same, uh, clarification too.
[25:40.950 --> 25:43.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: So there are people out there that remember these things.
[25:43.330 --> 25:47.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, and, and you probably remember every TV channel had its own personality.
[25:47.790 --> 25:53.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: Channel 11, they were known for a late night, odd couple, the honeymooners, twilight zone and black and white.
[25:54.190 --> 25:56.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: It was, and of course, New York Yankee games.
[25:56.390 --> 25:58.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: That was what they were known for.
[25:58.230 --> 26:01.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: But I'm curious, I'm going to ask you guys, uh, just a couple of trivia questions.
[26:01.970 --> 26:05.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: See if anybody, uh, uh, is as, uh, fixated on this as me.
[26:06.470 --> 26:07.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, do you remember a channel?
[26:08.230 --> 26:09.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm going to focus just on channel 11.
[26:09.650 --> 26:11.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: Like I said, every TV channel had his own personality.
[26:12.010 --> 26:19.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: Unlike today where you get crappy channels that don't do anything except play infomercials and they don't have any local presence whatsoever.
[26:20.410 --> 26:26.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, like, uh, channel 31 member WNYC before another thing, Rudolph Giuliani messed up.
[26:26.390 --> 26:30.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: He, uh, he sold that TV station to a commercial bunch and, uh, it was never the same.
[26:31.150 --> 26:35.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, or, um, channel 55 on long Island that doesn't have any local presence whatsoever.
[26:36.610 --> 26:38.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's, it's sad, but channel 11.
[26:38.610 --> 26:38.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[26:39.490 --> 26:46.490]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, what New York icon did they, um, incorporate into their logo?
[26:46.730 --> 26:47.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Anyone want to guess?
[26:48.110 --> 26:49.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, Rob, go ahead.
[26:50.310 --> 26:51.510]  [SPEAKER_11]: I remember it well.
[26:51.610 --> 26:54.530]  [SPEAKER_11]: They were the twin towers, which themselves looked like an 11.
[26:54.810 --> 26:55.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's right.
[26:55.410 --> 26:56.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: You had, you had this guy.
[26:56.510 --> 26:57.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know who he was.
[26:57.570 --> 26:58.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: He was a guy with glasses.
[26:59.030 --> 27:00.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know how I remember all this.
[27:00.510 --> 27:07.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, but a guy with glasses who was looking for the perfect way to spread the word about channel 11 and he's in the street.
[27:07.530 --> 27:10.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: And in the background, you see the twin towers forming a perfect 11.
[27:10.790 --> 27:15.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: And he's like, well, I know I'm, I'm, I'm this close to finding out how to say 11 to, to everybody.
[27:15.930 --> 27:17.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: So yes, very good, Rob.
[27:17.290 --> 27:21.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: And then, uh, there was another, um, I actually two questions here.
[27:21.950 --> 27:24.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: There was another slogan, um, that they used.
[27:26.230 --> 27:28.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know how to describe it without giving it away.
[27:28.570 --> 27:31.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Does anybody want to guess a different slogan that they used?
[27:32.470 --> 27:32.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: No?
[27:33.990 --> 27:34.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[27:34.650 --> 27:35.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: It was 11 alive.
[27:35.910 --> 27:37.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: They were called 11 alive for a long time.
[27:38.010 --> 27:38.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[27:38.510 --> 27:42.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: Finally, what newspaper was affiliated with WPIX?
[27:45.490 --> 27:47.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, we all should know this.
[27:47.310 --> 27:48.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's media conglomeration.
[27:49.530 --> 27:51.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: WPIX was owned by the daily news.
[27:52.170 --> 27:52.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[27:52.930 --> 27:56.710]  [SPEAKER_09]: And the daily news, it was the picture paper and that's why it was WPIX.
[27:56.710 --> 27:56.790]  [SPEAKER_09]: WPIX.
[27:57.130 --> 27:58.390]  [SPEAKER_12]: Then how come you didn't say that?
[27:58.770 --> 27:59.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
[27:59.090 --> 28:00.870]  [SPEAKER_09]: I raised my hand and you didn't call on me.
[28:00.870 --> 28:01.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're not in the video.
[28:02.090 --> 28:02.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, you know what?
[28:02.830 --> 28:04.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rob is in the video, but you are not.
[28:04.190 --> 28:04.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: There you are.
[28:04.830 --> 28:04.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[28:05.250 --> 28:05.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh.
[28:05.610 --> 28:07.710]  [SPEAKER_09]: Because you're in... Oh, I didn't realize I wasn't in a frame.
[28:07.710 --> 28:08.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, you're not.
[28:08.510 --> 28:08.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[28:09.030 --> 28:09.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're not in this.
[28:10.030 --> 28:10.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[28:10.450 --> 28:11.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're in a coliseum.
[28:11.650 --> 28:11.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: Disaster.
[28:11.970 --> 28:12.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm not in the coliseum.
[28:12.890 --> 28:15.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now you are because you, you, you've moved closer.
[28:16.370 --> 28:17.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, Kyle, you're not in it either.
[28:17.750 --> 28:18.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm, I'm in it and you're not.
[28:19.050 --> 28:19.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: I am well out of it.
[28:19.910 --> 28:23.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: But we're on opposite sides of the room, so there's no way you can be in it at the same time.
[28:23.770 --> 28:24.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[28:24.370 --> 28:25.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: So that, that's fun.
[28:25.410 --> 28:30.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: And all that, all that, um, because we're, we're reminiscing about the past, about past technology.
[28:31.370 --> 28:34.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, and that's, uh, that, that, that, that's kind of amazing.
[28:34.630 --> 28:36.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's kind of amazing that we still do that.
[28:37.030 --> 28:38.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, okay.
[28:38.370 --> 28:40.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, what's this story I'm hearing about GoDaddy?
[28:41.190 --> 28:44.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, uh, they, what did they do this time?
[28:44.590 --> 28:57.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: They, they, they're facing backlash after their employees received an email saying they were getting a holiday bonus, but it turned out to be a hoax set up by the company to test employees, testing them for what?
[28:57.970 --> 29:01.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: To see if they're going to burn the place down when they get pissed off enough.
[29:01.830 --> 29:04.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: This email was sent out on December 14th.
[29:04.570 --> 29:06.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, it came out, um, okay.
[29:06.930 --> 29:18.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: It, it came after employees had already been notified, um, that they would not be getting any bonuses this year, but the letter said this happy holiday, GoDaddy 2020 has been a record year for GoDaddy.
[29:18.830 --> 29:20.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Thanks to you though.
[29:20.330 --> 29:23.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: We cannot celebrate together during our annual holiday party.
[29:23.350 --> 29:32.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: We want it to show our appreciation and share a $650 one-time holiday bonus to ensure that you receive your one-time bonus in time for the holidays.
[29:32.970 --> 29:37.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Please select your location and fill in the details by Friday, December 18th.
[29:37.590 --> 29:41.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: And the email featured a large logo at the top that said GoDaddy holiday party.
[29:42.110 --> 29:47.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, the email was, was not an actual email as intentionally.
[29:47.370 --> 29:48.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, it was an actual email.
[29:48.770 --> 29:49.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: It just wasn't, it was a lie.
[29:49.990 --> 29:55.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: Basically it was sent out by the company on purpose to test employees to see if they would fall for a phishing scam.
[29:56.910 --> 30:09.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I mean, seriously, you, you, you first, you tell your employees that you're not going to give them a bonus, which seems hard to imagine that, uh, an online company isn't going to do well in 2020.
[30:10.110 --> 30:10.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, okay.
[30:10.950 --> 30:12.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: So you already did that.
[30:12.310 --> 30:21.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now you're going to mock them further by sending them an email saying they will get a bonus, but only if they, if they do something that probably they shouldn't do, like click on a link.
[30:22.370 --> 30:25.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: And then you're going to tell everybody, Hey, the whole thing was a big joke.
[30:25.850 --> 30:42.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, uh, we, um, uh, we're not giving you anything, you know, how about, how about something a little bit more positive reinforcement ish, like rewarding the people who didn't click on something, who didn't do something insecure and, and, and not holding a bonus over anyone's head.
[30:43.110 --> 30:45.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, because that is just cruel.
[30:46.130 --> 30:47.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, that's, that's so wrong.
[30:48.470 --> 30:49.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, Voltaire.
[30:50.310 --> 30:53.550]  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, one of the many bad things about this is it... Can you speak up?
[30:54.610 --> 30:55.190]  [SPEAKER_01]: Is this better?
[30:55.850 --> 30:56.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, not much.
[30:56.870 --> 30:59.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: Can it just speak more into your microphone or turn your volume up a little bit?
[31:00.550 --> 31:01.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't raise you anymore.
[31:02.770 --> 31:03.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead.
[31:03.410 --> 31:03.590]  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[31:04.210 --> 31:19.610]  [SPEAKER_01]: So one of the bad things about this is it, it lets, uh, management at insecurity or in it feel like they're doing something about security when they're really not, not like the, instead of using putting sensible security controls, they just use just to blame,
[31:19.650 --> 31:28.030]  [SPEAKER_01]: uh, things onto the user, onto non-technical employees who are always, you always have to assume that they've got non-technical employees they're going to mess up.
[31:28.390 --> 31:29.690]  [SPEAKER_01]: Or even technical employees as well.
[31:29.830 --> 31:34.590]  [SPEAKER_01]: But instead of putting on those controls, they just use this as to shift the blame around.
[31:34.810 --> 31:39.390]  [SPEAKER_01]: And amazingly, it's their fault when they don't invest in, um, security.
[31:39.670 --> 31:41.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that, that, that itself too.
[31:41.810 --> 31:50.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: But I just, it's so, it's so nasty to do that to, uh, to people to, you know, to make them, first of all, what happened to the people who did click on the link?
[31:51.230 --> 31:54.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: Did they, did they get some kind of scolding in addition to being told they weren't going to get a bonus?
[31:54.970 --> 32:01.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: And then the people who, who, uh, didn't click on it, I guess they chose not to get a bonus because they didn't click on it.
[32:01.110 --> 32:02.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: So you didn't have to tell them anything.
[32:02.510 --> 32:03.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, Alex, did you have something?
[32:04.490 --> 32:04.810]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
[32:04.910 --> 32:20.050]  [SPEAKER_10]: I think that somebody, uh, as a lawyer and somebody who's also been a CISO, chief information security officer, you're always looking to test the efficacy of your, your internal controls and your security awareness programs and, and always looking to try new things,
[32:20.250 --> 32:27.530]  [SPEAKER_10]: to fish your employees, find out who's clicking on these, uh, malicious links, and then give them some additional training.
[32:27.790 --> 32:32.330]  [SPEAKER_10]: So that will be a, another form of risk mitigation for you.
[32:32.750 --> 32:40.110]  [SPEAKER_10]: But it is always really difficult to find a new hook, to find new bait for these types of phishing lures.
[32:40.490 --> 32:47.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I think it, this type of insensitive phishing scam that's used to test employees.
[32:47.410 --> 32:51.950]  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm afraid it is probably more common than we think.
[32:52.150 --> 33:07.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: Uh, and I think a lot of security teams and a lot of, uh, it teams in particular struggle with trying not to cross over certain boundaries while also trying to test whether or not their security awareness training is, is actually working.
[33:07.710 --> 33:23.690]  [SPEAKER_10]: And some of this also, I think that maybe it can fall on, onto, on the fault of GoDaddy, but a lot of these types of phishing scams that test employees are run by third-party companies specifically to test whether or not employees are susceptible to phishing scams.
[33:23.790 --> 33:32.230]  [SPEAKER_10]: And so the sensitivity or insensitivity of these types of lures and hooks is always changing and something you really have to be mindful about.
[33:32.310 --> 33:38.250]  [SPEAKER_10]: It was particularly tone deaf, in my opinion, to send out something when we know that employees are hurting.
[33:38.350 --> 33:39.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: We know that people are hurting.
[33:39.310 --> 33:42.290]  [SPEAKER_10]: We know that everyone is, is suffering and it's the holiday season.
[33:42.510 --> 33:53.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: Anyone could use an extra 650 bucks, especially from GoDaddy, whom we know has had, you know, quite likely a record year, especially given all of the domains we've seen registered about the coronavirus, et cetera.
[33:54.370 --> 34:06.330]  [SPEAKER_10]: So yeah, I think this is a problem, but it's, it's definitely, it's, it's a push and pull between testing security and, uh, and, uh, and, and maintaining a semblance of, of reasonableness in the phishing lures that you imply.
[34:06.610 --> 34:07.490]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead, Gila.
[34:08.370 --> 34:14.970]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, I was, we had this, I'm echoing this exact thing happened in September.
[34:15.130 --> 34:22.230]  [SPEAKER_09]: I remember talking about it when the Tribune Corporation did this to their employees, um, literally the exact same thing.
[34:22.370 --> 34:23.710]  [SPEAKER_09]: And it happened right before we went on air.
[34:23.730 --> 34:33.930]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I remember reading it out from Twitter basically, but, um, the insensitivity, Alex, I would say would even border on cruelty at this point when you say we can't do this.
[34:34.050 --> 34:44.450]  [SPEAKER_09]: And then the phishing lures at the third-party companies, but also often it's the third-party companies coming in to say, listen, let us test your employees to prove you need our services.
[34:45.230 --> 34:52.830]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I think the idea of teasing people in this way to make your company spend money that they've just told their employees they don't have.
[34:54.130 --> 35:02.670]  [SPEAKER_09]: is cruel at this point in the game, but also there was so much pushback on the Tribune company in September.
[35:02.670 --> 35:10.010]  [SPEAKER_09]: I can't understand how GoDaddy didn't pay attention to that and think this might not be the right time for this sort of thing.
[35:11.610 --> 35:12.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Absolutely.
[35:12.870 --> 35:13.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, Voltaire.
[35:14.490 --> 35:24.930]  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's back to what Alex says, the, and I've seen this at my own company, it's the, these services are outsourced to company, uh, that specialize in phishing, running phishing things.
[35:25.110 --> 35:31.850]  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not like, um, the companies will be able to see that the, the pushback that the Tribune company got.
[35:32.190 --> 35:39.710]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think one of the risks is, um, company employees beginning to not take things seriously.
[35:39.710 --> 35:54.490]  [SPEAKER_07]: Like you're really, uh, burning them out at a certain point, especially, I mean, maybe, um, I'm not emphasizing the cruelty that was, uh, observed or pointed out as much, but it's, uh, more fatigue.
[35:54.690 --> 35:59.150]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think they won't be as alert because they'll think, Oh, it's just this other thing.
[35:59.270 --> 36:05.170]  [SPEAKER_07]: That's going to, you know, make me, uh, subject to some review or, you know, have some negative repercussions.
[36:05.390 --> 36:11.830]  [SPEAKER_07]: So they won't look at anything or there'll be a lot less, um, alert for the actual, uh, occurrences.
[36:12.310 --> 36:14.590]  [SPEAKER_07]: If, if you're constantly being berated, but with this.
[36:15.070 --> 36:15.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[36:15.650 --> 36:17.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: So they win the cluelessness award of the week.
[36:18.090 --> 36:27.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, here's, here's another story though, that, uh, is making the rounds that, uh, Delaware computer repairman, who went public with the, uh, sorted contents of Hunter Biden's hard drive.
[36:27.970 --> 36:28.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Get this.
[36:28.770 --> 36:35.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: He's now suing Twitter for defamation, claiming its content moderation unfairly branded him a hacker.
[36:36.350 --> 36:36.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[36:37.310 --> 36:38.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: How do you like that?
[36:38.170 --> 36:43.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: He's suing Twitter because, and I understand as Twitter users, we are all going to be responsible.
[36:43.590 --> 36:53.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: We'll have to pony up some cash if he wins, but, uh, he's suing Twitter because Twitter referred to him or, or referred to the material as being hacked.
[36:53.430 --> 37:00.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now, if you recall, well, when, when this, uh, New York post story came out, the New York post was the only newspaper to, um, uh, to print this.
[37:00.890 --> 37:03.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, nobody else wanted to print it.
[37:03.410 --> 37:07.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: In fact, that their own reporters, uh, didn't want their names on the story.
[37:07.590 --> 37:14.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: So right away, there is a lot wrong with the story, but, um, Twitter would not allow anyone to link to the New York post story.
[37:14.650 --> 37:16.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: I took great exception at that.
[37:16.130 --> 37:17.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: I thought that was stepping way over the line.
[37:18.050 --> 37:26.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not up to Twitter to decide if a newspaper story, uh, it came from a, um, uh, a rightful source or not.
[37:26.310 --> 37:27.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: If they think it was, it was hacked.
[37:27.970 --> 37:28.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[37:28.150 --> 37:28.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's on the New York post.
[37:29.050 --> 37:29.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's not on Twitter.
[37:30.050 --> 37:32.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, they, they saw the error of their ways.
[37:32.870 --> 37:33.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: They reversed themselves.
[37:34.170 --> 37:42.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, um, I think now they understand a little bit more about what journalism is, even though New York post might not be the best place to learn that lesson.
[37:42.550 --> 37:59.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, but, um, yeah, basically, um, uh, John Paul McIsaac's, uh, repair store was, uh, where allegedly these damaging documents were found on a laptop that was left at the shop in April of 2019.
[37:59.750 --> 38:10.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, the emails, um, alleged to have detailed, uh, Hunter Biden's shady overseas business dealings and, uh, are, are part of a bigger investigation.
[38:10.690 --> 38:22.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, um, this leads us to, um, um, do something a little bit, um, uh, a little bit more, um, uh, in depth as far as, uh, uh, this whole story goes.
[38:22.350 --> 38:25.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, um, well, there's no other way to say it.
[38:29.870 --> 38:30.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
[38:30.730 --> 38:35.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, John Paul McIsaac has been named hacker of the week by off the hook.
[38:35.690 --> 38:36.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
[38:36.810 --> 38:38.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, there's nothing funny about this, Alex.
[38:39.150 --> 38:42.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is, uh, in fact, we've been doing this for a number of weeks now.
[38:42.790 --> 38:45.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: We just haven't had time to mention it on the air.
[38:45.430 --> 38:49.030]  [SPEAKER_07]: In fairness, his name's been in the running for, um, several months now.
[38:49.230 --> 38:49.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: It has.
[38:49.610 --> 38:52.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now, uh, why is, is John Paul McIsaac hacker of the week?
[38:52.850 --> 38:53.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, you have to ask.
[38:54.090 --> 38:54.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[38:54.410 --> 39:00.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: First of all, he manipulated the media into talking about him when he actually hasn't done a damn thing.
[39:00.290 --> 39:10.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that is what a lot of the hacker community is about, but getting some attention for yourself when you haven't done anything and just getting the, the, the clueless media to follow whatever you do.
[39:11.510 --> 39:12.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: Or how about this?
[39:12.330 --> 39:18.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: Telling the world you're not a hacker when everyone has already forgotten about you and really couldn't care less.
[39:18.970 --> 39:20.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: We have been hacked by him.
[39:20.730 --> 39:24.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: He hacked us or, or, or getting the New York post to print your story.
[39:24.910 --> 39:33.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: Actually, that's the easiest accomplishment, but there's, there's something special about getting them to print a story that even their own reporters didn't want to be associated with.
[39:33.870 --> 39:43.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: But the real reason why John Paul McIsaac is hacker of the week is because he managed to get a lawsuit dismissed the same day it was filed.
[39:44.050 --> 39:49.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that, Alex, I'm sure you can tell me that's something that does not happen very often.
[39:50.950 --> 39:53.190]  [SPEAKER_10]: It doesn't happen very often.
[39:53.190 --> 40:00.250]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I, I think that there's two interesting points about this particular story, which really was, was crazy.
[40:01.630 --> 40:24.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: If we think back to 2016 and in the wake of the 2016 election, because of the whole WikiLeaks, uh, dispersion of the hacked materials from the DCCC, uh, ostensibly coming from Russia, of course, the social media platforms, Twitter included changed their policies to prevent hacked materials,
[40:24.550 --> 40:29.650]  [SPEAKER_10]: quote unquote, hacked materials from being allowed onto their platforms and being used to spread this type of information.
[40:29.930 --> 40:53.270]  [SPEAKER_10]: And so I don't think that it is reasonable to, to classify this person, even as a hacker, what really this, this type of prohibition on the store in the information itself was about was that this guy was likely some kind of dope who had unwittingly come into possession of materials that were hacked,
[40:53.490 --> 40:56.710]  [SPEAKER_10]: placed onto a laptop, put into his store.
[40:56.910 --> 41:01.510]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then he went and gave them to FBI, Rudy Giuliani, et cetera.
[41:01.690 --> 41:05.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: He was essentially used as a mule for these materials that were hacked.
[41:05.650 --> 41:07.570]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then they got their way into the public.
[41:07.610 --> 41:18.030]  [SPEAKER_10]: And that's the way that you would obviate or, or avoid the prohibition on hack materials that these, uh, platforms like Twitter had implemented in the wake of the 2016 election.
[41:18.430 --> 41:31.070]  [SPEAKER_10]: And, you know, more to the point too, how they had the lawsuit not been dismissed, I think suus sponte by the court, but, um, for any kind of defamation claim, here's what's interesting.
[41:31.710 --> 41:34.550]  [SPEAKER_10]: A defense to defamation is the truth.
[41:34.810 --> 41:41.230]  [SPEAKER_10]: So what he would be asking for is an investigation into the source of those particular emails, right?
[41:41.390 --> 41:48.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: And if those particular emails were in fact found to have been hacked and placed onto that particular laptop, then yes, absolutely.
[41:48.870 --> 42:08.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: You know, it, it makes the point, but it also makes the point that not that he was a hacker, which is completely misclassifying what Twitter did, but it make it would, it would have made the point if that would have been proven that he was a dope who then was used to disperse this material to various news organizations who then made their way onto,
[42:08.810 --> 42:10.030]  [SPEAKER_10]: onto social media platforms.
[42:10.230 --> 42:22.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: So the whole thing was really just be careful about calling him a dopey is hacker of the week and he can, he can cause all kinds of, well, let me clarify that until he sues me for, for defamation, you know, but it's my opinion.
[42:22.470 --> 42:23.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hey, he's already in a courtroom.
[42:23.830 --> 42:25.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: So he just has to check another box for that.
[42:26.670 --> 42:27.210]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's true.
[42:27.350 --> 42:27.610]  [SPEAKER_10]: Right.
[42:27.850 --> 42:28.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[42:28.270 --> 42:36.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, listen, uh, we, um, we're running out of time and, uh, I do want to focus on, on, on something since this is the last show of, of the year and we're not on next week.
[42:36.270 --> 42:37.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're back in two weeks.
[42:37.550 --> 42:48.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, and also, uh, we have overtime at eight o'clock, uh, go to our YouTube channel, Channel2600, and you can call us, uh, write down the phone number, 802-321-4225.
[42:49.090 --> 42:51.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's 802-321-4225.
[42:51.810 --> 42:52.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: 4225 spells hack.
[42:53.790 --> 42:54.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Clever, huh?
[42:54.510 --> 43:01.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, um, we will take calls starting at around eight o'clock for the, uh, YouTube stream that will be archived as well.
[43:01.670 --> 43:04.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: But we're asking the question, we're asking of, of, of, uh, you folks here.
[43:05.230 --> 43:18.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, since this is the last show of the year, how do you think technology played a part in this global pandemic and how in turn was technology affected by the pandemic?
[43:19.790 --> 43:21.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: Who would, who would like to go first?
[43:21.270 --> 43:22.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: Raise your hand and wave it.
[43:22.750 --> 43:25.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, and, uh, okay, Gila, I see your hand.
[43:25.730 --> 43:26.030]  [SPEAKER_09]: Thank you.
[43:26.550 --> 43:27.110]  [SPEAKER_09]: Very exciting.
[43:27.230 --> 43:27.410]  [SPEAKER_09]: I'm glad.
[43:27.550 --> 43:48.910]  [SPEAKER_09]: So I think for me, I feel like I've been repeating myself all year, but the fact that we have been able to connect and the fact that technology has in so many ways managed to shrink the world where we're all in our own spaces, but, you know, even right now when we're all,
[43:49.070 --> 44:06.450]  [SPEAKER_09]: most of us are together in the hacker thunderdome, um, this whole sense of virtual connection, there were virtual conferences, there were virtual schooling, there was virtual religious services and virtual holiday observances.
[44:06.610 --> 44:23.030]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I think the fact that the pandemic caused us to really pivot and reimagine what could be, but, you know, at the same time wondering then what will be going forward when we don't have to do it.
[44:23.270 --> 44:25.330]  [SPEAKER_09]: And in some cases we won't do it.
[44:25.550 --> 44:30.050]  [SPEAKER_09]: You know, how are you going to keep them on the farm once they've seen the hacker thunderdome?
[44:32.850 --> 44:33.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[44:33.710 --> 44:34.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, Alex, go ahead.
[44:37.330 --> 44:40.810]  [SPEAKER_10]: So I'm on mute, you know, for your bingo cards today.
[44:41.210 --> 44:51.370]  [SPEAKER_10]: Um, yeah, I've got a couple of points here that I, I, I thought about, you know, the number one, going back to, back to March of this year when things were really kicking off with the hysteria.
[44:52.130 --> 44:53.590]  [SPEAKER_10]: And again, just a few points.
[44:53.750 --> 45:09.670]  [SPEAKER_10]: The first thing that I really remember being, you know, really fascinating, and this was a story that went all around the world, was when, uh, using the DNS intelligence platform that I had created, we found a state-sponsored and live attack on the World Health Organization on the 13th of March,
[45:09.830 --> 45:12.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: that some people had then attributed over to North Korea.
[45:12.950 --> 45:23.670]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then this was the beginning of, I think, a massive wave of cyber security issues that related to pharmaceutical companies, to the vaccine, to the World Health Organization in particular.
[45:23.910 --> 45:36.270]  [SPEAKER_10]: And, uh, and in fact was what led to, my relationship with the CISO of the World Health Organization, Flavio Agio, who was one of our keynote speakers later on that year at Hope, which I thought was really cool.
[45:36.550 --> 45:48.670]  [SPEAKER_10]: But right around that time, and actually shortly before that, another thing that we saw was really fascinating, was this massive amount of activity, talking about technology, but activity specifically in the domain name system itself.
[45:48.870 --> 46:00.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: When we started monitoring for coronavirus-related domains, just as hysteria was kicking off in, in February, this started off first with, with, we would see around 200 domain names per day.
[46:00.890 --> 46:05.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: Now, putting this into perspective, you think about something like the Super Bowl, which is coming up shortly, actually.
[46:05.910 --> 46:06.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, Lord.
[46:06.530 --> 46:14.230]  [SPEAKER_10]: You see maybe five to 10 to maybe 20 domains per day, but to see 200 per day about the coronavirus was insane.
[46:14.510 --> 46:17.930]  [SPEAKER_10]: Then that kicked off to 400, then 600, then over 1,000.
[46:18.050 --> 46:25.110]  [SPEAKER_10]: At the height of this, we saw over 3,500 coronavirus domains being registered per day.
[46:25.490 --> 46:28.570]  [SPEAKER_10]: And now we're seeing the same thing with the vaccine.
[46:28.870 --> 46:35.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: Not necessarily to that extent or that degree, but we're seeing about 120 domain names per day about the virus.
[46:35.890 --> 46:42.650]  [SPEAKER_10]: And this relates to the companies, Pfizer, Moderna, BioNTech, all of the companies that are dealing with this, but a lot of it has to do with news.
[46:42.870 --> 46:43.670]  [SPEAKER_10]: We're also seeing...
[46:43.670 --> 46:44.070]  [SPEAKER_10]: No, I'm sorry.
[46:44.210 --> 46:49.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just got to say, GoDaddy really can't afford to pay its employees a bonus, all these new sites being registered constantly.
[46:50.070 --> 46:52.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: The business they've done this year, it's appalling.
[46:52.530 --> 46:52.770]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah.
[46:53.130 --> 46:55.290]  [SPEAKER_10]: That was a bit of foreshadowing that I made earlier.
[46:55.450 --> 46:55.730]  [SPEAKER_10]: Exactly.
[46:55.930 --> 46:56.050]  [SPEAKER_10]: Right.
[46:56.130 --> 46:57.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: But not all of these are GoDaddy.
[46:57.510 --> 46:58.930]  [SPEAKER_10]: I would say a good portion of them are.
[46:59.050 --> 47:01.930]  [SPEAKER_10]: But yeah, again, about 120 vaccine-related domains per day.
[47:02.030 --> 47:14.510]  [SPEAKER_10]: And what we're seeing is kind of interesting because a lot of them are clustered together, like domains that could be used for misinformation about the dangers of the vaccine are being clustered together, registered by individuals, and then sold off to the highest bidder.
[47:14.670 --> 47:29.290]  [SPEAKER_10]: So this is a really dangerous activity, I think, that's going to continue and it's going to shape-shift with the news and really has the potential to be dangerous both in terms of cybersecurity issues as well as from a public health perspective.
[47:29.530 --> 47:34.550]  [SPEAKER_10]: And the final point I want to make is really about what's happened to us as human beings.
[47:34.550 --> 47:45.850]  [SPEAKER_10]: I think this work-from-home mandate and the isolated nature of our lives has really altered us perhaps irrevocably in the way in which we interact and we collaborate.
[47:46.070 --> 47:59.490]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, the unremitting series of Zoom meetings, Webex conferences, FaceTime calls has now normalized these screen-based two-dimensional relationships for both our personal and professional lives.
[47:59.610 --> 48:16.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I think, look, we've become fearful of hugging, shaking hands, touching in general, and I don't think we quite understand how this year of distance and isolation may affect our psyches and the very nature of human relationships over the long term.
[48:16.610 --> 48:26.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: And what we do know is that, you know, given this slow march of vaccinations around the world, I mean, our operation warp speed is far slower than warp speed at this point.
[48:26.570 --> 48:31.790]  [SPEAKER_10]: We're not going to go simply snap back to normal, to the world of physical normalcy anymore.
[48:31.970 --> 48:41.050]  [SPEAKER_10]: This way of life is supported by what, 20 years ago when we were talking about beige boxes earlier today, this type of technology was science fiction-like 20 years ago.
[48:41.250 --> 48:43.650]  [SPEAKER_10]: You know, it's now part of our culture.
[48:43.850 --> 48:48.250]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I think for here, it's here to stay for better and for worse.
[48:48.250 --> 48:48.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[48:48.690 --> 48:53.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: I want to discuss this more and with our listeners as well, because you touched on some very interesting points.
[48:53.630 --> 48:54.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: I only have five minutes left.
[48:54.530 --> 48:58.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: I want to give others a chance to give their ideas.
[48:58.290 --> 48:59.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Voltaire, go ahead.
[49:03.450 --> 49:04.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're muted, I think.
[49:08.390 --> 49:10.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you're definitely, we're not getting audio from you.
[49:10.790 --> 49:12.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: So try again.
[49:14.290 --> 49:15.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, Kyle, how about you?
[49:17.790 --> 49:43.130]  [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I think definitely electron microscopy and the gene sequencing, stuff that has been around for a while was like an indispensable tool in working around the clock to speak in a collaborative way and to share what the scientific community was learning and in a really,
[49:43.250 --> 49:43.890]  [SPEAKER_07]: really rapid way.
[49:43.990 --> 49:46.410]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that's mind boggling.
[49:46.610 --> 49:54.570]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I don't think we've really been able to look back and appreciate yet how important that is and was, but will be in the future.
[49:54.730 --> 50:09.910]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I think the ability to develop things quickly and respond will lead to a lot more important and we will realize how essential that kind of research and development is to humanity going forward.
[50:10.050 --> 50:16.790]  [SPEAKER_07]: And that's, this is going to be the kind of protocol in the future.
[50:16.790 --> 50:19.790]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm not, I don't doubt at all.
[50:20.350 --> 50:29.410]  [SPEAKER_07]: And so I think that's definitely how technology, one of the major ways we saw technology, stuff that we'd been using in different ways really take off.
[50:30.330 --> 50:49.230]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I think at the more sort of everyday level for most people, the normalization, this kind of speaks to what Gia was saying is video conferencing becoming something we commonly understand, the divide, all the different types of platforms, the etiquette and behaviors around that.
[50:49.430 --> 50:51.270]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think they're not all the way there.
[50:51.590 --> 51:06.090]  [SPEAKER_07]: We're still learning how to make best use of this technology, but the understanding of it as a tool I think is emerging and that's exciting in how it has been able to bridge what has been a really isolated time.
[51:06.410 --> 51:07.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, Voltaire, can you have the microphone figured out?
[51:08.550 --> 51:09.010]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[51:09.230 --> 51:09.550]  [SPEAKER_07]: Okay, good.
[51:09.790 --> 51:10.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead.
[51:12.430 --> 51:13.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead.
[51:13.590 --> 51:14.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you have something?
[51:16.390 --> 51:17.370]  [SPEAKER_11]: You're muted again.
[51:17.490 --> 51:18.050]  [SPEAKER_11]: Oh my God.
[51:19.450 --> 51:20.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right, Rob, how about you?
[51:22.350 --> 51:22.810]  [SPEAKER_11]: Okay.
[51:22.810 --> 51:33.630]  [SPEAKER_11]: The thing I've noticed is that we've all been trapped in our rooms, our houses, our households, whatever, with reduced exposure to other people, if any at all.
[51:34.150 --> 51:43.750]  [SPEAKER_11]: And I'm a great believer in online community and the power of it, but I'm also seeing kind of a darker edge to it because everyone is on such a shorter fuse these days.
[51:43.890 --> 51:44.890]  [SPEAKER_11]: We're all stressed.
[51:45.010 --> 51:47.250]  [SPEAKER_11]: We're all suffering mental health effects from what's going on.
[51:47.570 --> 51:52.270]  [SPEAKER_11]: And in the sphere of online forums, comment sections, things like that.
[51:52.610 --> 51:59.650]  [SPEAKER_11]: Everyone just seems so much more prone to flying off the handle and going nuts and maybe arguing about why they don't want to wear a mask or things like that.
[51:59.950 --> 52:06.170]  [SPEAKER_11]: I'm finding that some bits of the Internet have become a significantly darker place through the pandemic.
[52:06.470 --> 52:22.230]  [SPEAKER_11]: And I'm still a great believer in online community and its ability to bring people together in positive ways, but we also all have to work extra hard to remember the person behind the keyboard on the other end and kind of temper what we do.
[52:22.430 --> 52:25.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: Boy, you're giving me so much to think about and talk about.
[52:25.170 --> 52:26.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm looking forward to overtime.
[52:26.370 --> 52:29.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: Eight o'clock, YouTube, Channel2600, Voltaire, one last chance.
[52:29.610 --> 52:30.590]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, you have your microphone working.
[52:31.430 --> 52:31.870]  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[52:32.090 --> 52:33.250]  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, you have about a minute.
[52:34.010 --> 52:53.230]  [SPEAKER_01]: It has been the failure of things like content tracing apps that policymakers have tried to promote them as things that will make up for a lack of healthcare services, basically, and actual employees that do contact tracing full time as their job.
[52:53.410 --> 53:04.290]  [SPEAKER_01]: But I think it also goes for remote learning when so many people don't even have Internet access, especially in urban areas, powdery sugar areas.
[53:04.670 --> 53:10.470]  [SPEAKER_01]: You can't use these technologies as a quick fix to make up for lack of basic social services.
[53:10.470 --> 53:11.710]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well said.
[53:12.390 --> 53:12.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[53:12.670 --> 53:15.490]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh, we are going to, uh, head out of here for now.
[53:15.650 --> 53:19.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: It is, as I said, our last show of 2020.
[53:21.110 --> 53:25.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, and we are reflecting on what has happened in this historic year.
[53:25.970 --> 53:29.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're also reflecting on what the future holds.
[53:33.890 --> 53:36.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: Join us on YouTube Channel2600.
[53:37.250 --> 53:37.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: We'll see you there.
[53:38.290 --> 53:38.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good night.
[58:31.260 --> 59:04.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: And welcome, everybody, as we launch into another exciting edition of Overtime Off The Hook Overtime, that is, did we all make it through, Kyle?
[59:06.640 --> 59:06.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: Are you there?
[59:07.780 --> 59:14.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm trying to be here, yes Okay, good, good and Rob and Gila and Alex and Voltaire, are you all here?
[59:15.380 --> 59:35.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yep Okay We are here We are here I don't know that we're online Yeah, I don't see any Okay, you know, last week we made the mistake of not being able to be heard and not knowing it I don't see any viewers And I don't know why that would be, unless we did something wrong Your stream is not,
[59:36.040 --> 59:39.580]  [SPEAKER_11]: your live stream is not on your channel where it would normally be Really?
[59:39.720 --> 59:43.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's just not coming up We did everything the same way, Kyle, did we do anything differently?
[59:46.040 --> 01:00:01.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: We scheduled the stream, so I don't know what possibly could have gone wrong here It says we're broadcasting I have, I can't see it from my microphone Okay, I'll get up and you can take over my station Well, I don't know that I could be of better help,
[01:00:01.780 --> 01:00:27.560]  [SPEAKER_11]: but sure, yeah Since you've offered, I'll make my way over there And then how about, I'll let you know once I look at it Okay, well, whilst you guys are shuffling around for the sake of anyone that can hear us I will say that maybe it's a non-published link and the stream has not been made public in some manner Maybe it's a non-published number What are you nodding your head for,
[01:00:27.640 --> 01:00:27.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: Kyle?
[01:00:27.780 --> 01:00:29.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, it's unlisted, hold on How did that happen?
[01:00:29.940 --> 01:00:30.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know why?
[01:00:30.480 --> 01:00:33.500]  [SPEAKER_07]: We were troubleshooting something else Oh my god, I know what happened Public?
[01:00:33.740 --> 01:00:35.060]  [SPEAKER_07]: We want to go public?
[01:00:35.080 --> 01:00:36.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, make it public, let's make it public, why not?
[01:00:37.760 --> 01:01:01.200]  [SPEAKER_11]: But when I get back to my station, I'll explain exactly what happened, because I know it now Sorry folks, we're going to move around the room again Okay, well, we are now public So, for those of you who didn't hear the intro, this is Off The Hook Overtime And we are all here and ready to communicate with you live And we are now streaming,
[01:01:01.320 --> 01:01:05.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can hear us We still don't have any viewers Wait a minute, if you can hear us, how come you don't show up as a viewer?
[01:01:06.600 --> 01:01:20.600]  [SPEAKER_11]: Yeah I see one, so maybe that's you I am now seeing... well, one of them is me I am now seeing two watching now, so there's one other person We're getting calls We got calls last week, even though we weren't on the air But let me explain what happened What happened was,
[01:01:20.620 --> 01:01:21.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: we...
[01:01:21.580 --> 01:01:22.200]  [SPEAKER_07]: Should I drop that?
[01:01:22.440 --> 01:01:50.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, don't drop it The person went to the trouble of calling us They can just hold on for a second We put up something on our YouTube channel over the week It was an additional video that was attached to a talk for Hope But it was unlisted The link was published in the talk So that people who saw the talk would see the link Click on the link and see the remaining material So I guess it saved that
[01:01:50.820 --> 01:02:05.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: as the last setting that we used Unlisted and applied it to this But, you know, we distinctly said Use the same settings from the last From the one that we just copied And it didn't do that Thanks, Google That was the one we fixed, right?
[01:02:05.640 --> 01:02:30.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah No, no, no I'm talking about something else that happened between that Oh, well, I think the one we fixed was also unlisted for a period Well, that was, but it's listed now Okay, anyway Enough about our trouble It works Not what sort of it works All right This is the show where we get worse at technology as we use it more All right,
[01:02:30.540 --> 01:02:58.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: so You know, I wanted to talk more about what you guys were We're mentioning with technology and all that And I don't know, Alex You had kind of Well, Rob, too I think maybe, Alex, you're a bit more pessimistic about The permanent effect this is going to have on us Where this becomes the norm We just use all these online services And don't actually meet in person We're afraid to hug each other I
[01:02:58.420 --> 01:03:27.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: don't know When this ends, and it will end I think people will be so happy to get back to the way things used to be They might actually overdo it And just want to do everything in person from now on I don't necessarily buy into us, you know, accepting this as the norm It's good It does the job We're doing radio because of that technology And so many other things as well But it's no substitute for
[01:03:27.520 --> 01:03:43.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: doing things in real life I can't wait to get back into the streets of New York And cause some real mayhem And just travel and see other places and other people in person Do you really think people are going to say Yeah, this is our life now We're not going to,
[01:03:43.120 --> 01:03:44.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: we're not going to go back?
[01:03:45.740 --> 01:04:05.060]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, look The point I was making there is that There's no toggle switch to going back to normalcy here It's going to be a very slow roll To get back to where we were Being unafraid of physicality Being unafraid of touching each other Touching the elevator button You know,
[01:04:05.200 --> 01:04:13.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: leaving the bathroom without washing your hands Or sanitizing your hands Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait Hold on a second Is this really the battle you want to fight?
[01:04:13.420 --> 01:04:15.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: Is leaving the bathroom without washing your hands?
[01:04:15.360 --> 01:04:37.260]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's what it's about for you No, that's not the hill that I want to die on here But, you know, the point I'm making is that There's not going to be something Where, like, today is Monday Or, you know, rather You know, let's use an accurate description Today is Wednesday Tomorrow is Thursday We're all back to normal We're back in the streets We're hugging each other This is going to go on for a
[01:04:37.260 --> 01:05:01.620]  [SPEAKER_10]: very long time And with the anti-vaxxers out there And the fact that herd immunity is not going to occur For at least six, seven, eight months And we still don't even know whether or not The vaccine actually would prevent people From spreading the virus Or whether it just prevents the symptoms of the virus Within the vaccinated person And so anybody who hasn't been vaccinated Is going to be
[01:05:01.620 --> 01:05:19.320]  [SPEAKER_10]: susceptible to this type of thing And, you know, we're going to have to be very, very careful For a long period of time And it will probably be two years, is my guess You know, of being extraordinarily cautious About germs, about the virus, about services About sanitization,
[01:05:19.540 --> 01:05:31.280]  [SPEAKER_10]: about our hands, about touching And that's going to have a major effect on our psyches I mean, if you think back a year or so ago Nobody had any qualms about touching a subway pole Pushing buttons in an elevator, etc.
[01:05:31.280 --> 01:05:56.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: But now, all of this is incredibly dangerous Now it is, yes Now it is But you're saying, okay, it's going to take longer Than we want it to take It'll take, you know, a couple of years maybe Instead of a few more months But my point is Whenever that period happens When that ends When we get to that stage I don't know if we're going to continue To be super cautious about everything Do you think
[01:05:56.900 --> 01:05:59.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: we're going to be ultra-paranoid about germs?
[01:06:00.060 --> 01:06:01.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: We'll all become germaphobes?
[01:06:02.040 --> 01:06:18.920]  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't think we're all going to become germaphobes But I think this has changed us The people who have lived through this Will have been changed, I think, irrevocably In some material respects In their psyche And how they approach cleanliness How they approach germs How they approach touching You know,
[01:06:19.000 --> 01:06:36.120]  [SPEAKER_10]: we may be happy to touch And embrace each other again But, you know, at the slightest drop of a hat Or the slightest provocation of the news media That something like a Corona-22 Might be coming down the pipe Voltaire sneezed right when you said that The slightest thing will set us off And yeah,
[01:06:36.580 --> 01:06:53.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: sneezing is going to do it People are going to run for the hills Well, we'll time that I think we're going to be About this And I think it also has changed the nature Of how we maintain our personal relationships And the way we do business, too We're not going to have that That continuous,
[01:06:53.460 --> 01:07:05.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: you know, business travel That we had in the past To, you know, fly from one continent to another Just to have a couple of meetings You know, we've become so accustomed To doing things through Zoom Is that a bad thing, though?
[01:07:05.480 --> 01:07:08.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: Is that not flying to Los Angeles To have a meeting and flying all the way back?
[01:07:08.800 --> 01:07:24.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, I could lose that But, you know, exploring the world Going to different countries Seeing people in person I don't think we're going to give that up I don't think people aren't going to be Going to New York City Or even going into the office As opposed to staying at home I mean,
[01:07:24.840 --> 01:07:43.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, come on You're a good example of this I'm sure you would love To get out of the house occasionally And just go to the office And, you know, be away from the kids for a while You love them But, come on You have to have different environments I don't think everyone's just going to stay put When the crisis ends Oh,
[01:07:44.060 --> 01:07:57.960]  [SPEAKER_10]: I agree with that I think, you know, there'll be a major period of revelry When we think that we're through Or through the thick of it Or out of the woods Whatever your metaphor is that you prefer You know, for the end of this particular pandemic Or, you know,
[01:07:57.960 --> 01:08:13.340]  [SPEAKER_10]: what appears to be the end of it I think that that will be a great period Maybe it'll be some kind of renaissance period And to a certain extent as well I think you look at a city like New York In particular You mentioned getting away from it So many people have left the city So many of these people have,
[01:08:13.340 --> 01:08:37.300]  [SPEAKER_10]: you know, have gone out And moved permanently out to the suburbs And I feel like here's a new opportunity For the city of New York To get back a lot of that edge that it had lost Exactly That had become controlled by gentrification Sometimes you need to be on the precipice of danger And craziness in a city In order for it to have that edge That creates some kind of tension That leads to creativity
[01:08:37.300 --> 01:08:55.720]  [SPEAKER_10]: And really fascinating things I mean, you think about what came out of New York in the 1980s When it was crime-ridden And, you know, frankly, a bit of an insane city But, you know, you think back from 2010 onwards I couldn't help but feeling like, you know,
[01:08:55.860 --> 01:09:15.020]  [SPEAKER_10]: New York And all of its neighborhoods And we've talked about this many, many times That they've become so homogenized to a certain extent But, you know, by the franchises By the juxtaposition of a Hale and Hardy Next to a CVS Next to a Duane Reade Next to a Bank of America Next to a Chase Bank Next to another Hale and Hardy Next to a Subway Next to a,
[01:09:15.020 --> 01:09:16.180]  [SPEAKER_10]: you know, a Pinkberry Right?
[01:09:16.400 --> 01:09:36.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's what every goddamn neighborhood in the city has become But those franchises have not made it through Those franchises have decided That it was better for them to shutter their doors And not support their neighbors And be there for their neighborhoods Than it was to stick through this pandemic And what we're left with Are pop shops that we wanted there in the first place That were being
[01:09:36.400 --> 01:09:53.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: threatened by these franchises And these chains And now they have an opportunity To resurge and to renew And perhaps give rise to another renaissance of New York That's what I really hope That is truly optimistic And that is something that I really hope we see as well.
[01:09:53.360 --> 01:10:04.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: The thing is, the infrastructure, the city has to support these mom and pop operations, not bury them with paperwork and regulations and make it hard for them to get through this.
[01:10:05.100 --> 01:10:07.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: They should be opening up doors, not closing them.
[01:10:08.340 --> 01:10:14.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: I've heard of cases where landlords are trying to charge tenants more to have outdoor dining because they're using more space.
[01:10:15.020 --> 01:10:16.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: Ridiculous things like that.
[01:10:16.340 --> 01:10:20.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: Remember, the franchises, the ones that you're talking about, they stopped paying rent.
[01:10:21.020 --> 01:10:22.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: They just stopped.
[01:10:22.240 --> 01:10:24.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's a lot of rent they didn't pay.
[01:10:24.360 --> 01:10:29.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: But they're still in business in other places or in suburbs or things like that.
[01:10:30.100 --> 01:10:36.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is a tremendous opportunity, not only for the mom and pop operations, but also for residents of the city.
[01:10:38.560 --> 01:10:49.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: If the opportunity is open to them for affordable housing, well, we can start crossing those gaps, you know, where nobody can afford to live in Manhattan anymore.
[01:10:49.940 --> 01:10:51.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Maybe that can finally change.
[01:10:52.640 --> 01:10:53.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: Voltaire, I see your hand is up.
[01:10:55.940 --> 01:10:59.780]  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think the situation is going to get better for mom and pop shops.
[01:10:59.920 --> 01:11:04.060]  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that the problem is a fundamental issue of the larger economy.
[01:11:04.400 --> 01:11:10.660]  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think they were priced out by the chain shops coming in.
[01:11:10.740 --> 01:11:15.740]  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that the chain shops coming in were the only people that could afford the real estate prices getting so high.
[01:11:15.740 --> 01:11:21.120]  [SPEAKER_01]: And the results of real estate prices getting higher is also a more structural thing in the economy of low interest rates.
[01:11:21.640 --> 01:11:31.940]  [SPEAKER_01]: And companies like BlackRock investment firms buying up real estate and treating it as an investment, whereas even in the 80s, that wasn't so much the case.
[01:11:32.060 --> 01:11:40.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, you know, I think it's kind of a chicken and the egg thing, because when you say that only the chains can afford the rent, well, they raise the rent because they know the chains.
[01:11:40.060 --> 01:11:53.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: On the corner of 8th and Avenue A, where the pizza place used to be, and now it's a Starbucks, they jacked the rent up when they found out Starbucks was looking for a place there, kicked the guy out, and Starbucks moved in.
[01:11:53.320 --> 01:11:55.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: Nobody else would pay that kind of rent except Starbucks.
[01:11:56.300 --> 01:12:02.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, yeah, the rent went up, but it went up because they know the chains will come in.
[01:12:02.280 --> 01:12:15.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: And when they realize the chains aren't going to come in anymore, and I think, you know, after seeing this, the chains will be a lot less eager to come into the city, maybe the rents will get more reasonable and affordable again.
[01:12:16.120 --> 01:12:16.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's my hope.
[01:12:18.540 --> 01:12:25.160]  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of these firms, the value of their properties is based on the amount of, is based off the last rent that they paid.
[01:12:25.160 --> 01:12:40.520]  [SPEAKER_01]: So, and because they're so, like, monopolized, all of these real estates owned by such few companies, they would rather have the stores sit empty so that they don't have to, like, re-appraise them than have rent out at a lower rate.
[01:12:40.600 --> 01:12:41.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: That should be illegal.
[01:12:41.700 --> 01:12:43.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: That should be illegal for them to...
[01:12:43.580 --> 01:12:47.580]  [SPEAKER_01]: It needs to be fixed by regulations and get back to, like, housing and stuff.
[01:12:48.220 --> 01:12:54.620]  [SPEAKER_01]: In order to have cheaper housing, we need better mass public housing properties.
[01:12:54.620 --> 01:12:56.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you need to do things like that.
[01:12:56.680 --> 01:12:57.900]  [SPEAKER_01]: Rent caps, like in Berlin.
[01:12:58.180 --> 01:13:01.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: All throughout the East Village, you see vacant shops.
[01:13:01.480 --> 01:13:06.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, you know, people keep sending us pictures because the realtor that owns those places, their number ends in 2600.
[01:13:06.960 --> 01:13:09.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, for some reason, people think that that's of interest to us.
[01:13:09.900 --> 01:13:19.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, yeah, they just have all these vacant places that they could easily rent out or, you know, just, hey, give a company, a small business, six months, no rent.
[01:13:19.240 --> 01:13:23.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: How is that worse than having it vacant?
[01:13:23.640 --> 01:13:24.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not.
[01:13:24.620 --> 01:13:25.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: You might have...
[01:13:26.760 --> 01:13:34.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: They might find out from other people that, hey, this company rented from me for free.
[01:13:34.280 --> 01:13:35.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: If they don't do...
[01:13:35.360 --> 01:13:41.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: If that's part of the deal where they don't tell anybody, maybe it'll generate more people coming in.
[01:13:41.860 --> 01:13:42.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know.
[01:13:42.380 --> 01:13:43.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm naive at this.
[01:13:43.520 --> 01:13:47.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: But I just don't think having vacant shops is the answer ever.
[01:13:49.160 --> 01:13:51.160]  [SPEAKER_01]: These companies have all taken out loans.
[01:13:52.020 --> 01:13:55.980]  [SPEAKER_01]: They're so over leverage that they've taken out loans to buy more and more property.
[01:13:56.200 --> 01:14:03.640]  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the loans are based on them having property which was the last sold renting price was a certain amount.
[01:14:03.820 --> 01:14:09.780]  [SPEAKER_01]: And if they rent out at another lower rent, then their loan payments will go up dramatically.
[01:14:10.220 --> 01:14:15.240]  [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas if they don't rent out anything, if they leave it empty, their loan prices won't go up.
[01:14:15.340 --> 01:14:16.400]  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very messed up system.
[01:14:16.520 --> 01:14:19.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: This sounds like something Trump would do and has done.
[01:14:19.820 --> 01:14:20.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:14:20.400 --> 01:14:21.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: We have some phone calls coming in.
[01:14:21.840 --> 01:14:22.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: Did you have something, Kyle?
[01:14:22.640 --> 01:14:28.020]  [SPEAKER_07]: I was just going to add that cool landlords are underrated.
[01:14:28.400 --> 01:14:31.240]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, there's so many cool landlords.
[01:14:31.400 --> 01:14:38.080]  [SPEAKER_07]: A lot of good things happen, especially when tenants have a working relationship or they have cooperation.
[01:14:38.860 --> 01:14:43.820]  [SPEAKER_07]: I know WBAI would not be in the position it is without a good landlord.
[01:14:43.900 --> 01:14:44.360]  [SPEAKER_07]: That's true.
[01:14:44.560 --> 01:14:44.900]  [SPEAKER_07]: That's true.
[01:14:45.300 --> 01:14:50.060]  [SPEAKER_07]: And that'll work through difficult times, crazy politics.
[01:14:51.360 --> 01:14:52.620]  [SPEAKER_07]: That's important stuff.
[01:14:52.840 --> 01:14:58.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: Veselka, the 24-hour Ukrainian place on 9th Street and 2nd Avenue.
[01:14:59.280 --> 01:15:00.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: They're thriving.
[01:15:00.340 --> 01:15:01.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: Not just surviving, they're thriving.
[01:15:01.620 --> 01:15:02.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: They own their building.
[01:15:03.440 --> 01:15:04.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, no, they don't own their building.
[01:15:04.720 --> 01:15:05.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: They have a good landlord.
[01:15:05.740 --> 01:15:07.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: They have a good landlord.
[01:15:07.240 --> 01:15:07.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's even better.
[01:15:08.180 --> 01:15:09.460]  [SPEAKER_07]: No, that's a great example.
[01:15:09.640 --> 01:15:11.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: I was probably subconsciously thinking of that story.
[01:15:11.980 --> 01:15:12.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: They're expanding.
[01:15:13.040 --> 01:15:20.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: And it makes all the difference when you have a landlord who works with you as opposed to looking for an advantage.
[01:15:20.700 --> 01:15:22.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, so let's let our listeners call in.
[01:15:23.080 --> 01:15:24.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: 802-321-4225.
[01:15:24.980 --> 01:15:25.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: We already have a call.
[01:15:25.920 --> 01:15:27.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm going to bring this up.
[01:15:27.380 --> 01:15:27.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: A warning.
[01:15:27.740 --> 01:15:29.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: I might make a horrible noise when I bring this up.
[01:15:30.020 --> 01:15:30.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Let's see what happens.
[01:15:31.660 --> 01:15:32.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: Nothing so far.
[01:15:32.340 --> 01:15:32.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: It might be Google, too.
[01:15:33.100 --> 01:15:33.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good evening.
[01:15:34.480 --> 01:15:36.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, it might be Google demanding we hit 1.
[01:15:36.720 --> 01:15:37.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, let's see if that...
[01:15:37.860 --> 01:15:39.400]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right, I think we have somebody.
[01:15:40.380 --> 01:15:41.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, hi.
[01:15:41.180 --> 01:15:43.200]  [SPEAKER_05]: I'd like to mention something about homogen.
[01:15:43.200 --> 01:15:44.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: Is this Rebel?
[01:15:45.500 --> 01:15:46.100]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, it is.
[01:15:46.100 --> 01:15:47.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, my God, Rebel, how have you been?
[01:15:47.780 --> 01:15:49.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's been like 10 years since I've heard your voice.
[01:15:51.920 --> 01:15:53.580]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I haven't been listening.
[01:15:53.740 --> 01:15:59.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: I listen to a couple of old shows, and I call in because I've been listening online.
[01:15:59.940 --> 01:16:01.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, you're on all the old shows.
[01:16:01.720 --> 01:16:03.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: All the old shows, but they haven't been on a new show.
[01:16:04.200 --> 01:16:06.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: And this is an overtime, so it's even better.
[01:16:08.240 --> 01:16:08.540]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[01:16:08.840 --> 01:16:12.200]  [SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, I was talking about homogenization of companies.
[01:16:12.200 --> 01:16:21.620]  [SPEAKER_05]: If you remember, like, Ramada Hotels and Days in Hotels and, I don't know, Comfort Hotel, whatever.
[01:16:21.940 --> 01:16:23.740]  [SPEAKER_05]: They're all Super 8 Hotels.
[01:16:23.900 --> 01:16:25.380]  [SPEAKER_05]: They're all one company now.
[01:16:25.500 --> 01:16:27.160]  [SPEAKER_05]: Remember in the 80s and the 90s?
[01:16:27.380 --> 01:16:29.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: It's all a Wyndham Hotel.
[01:16:29.960 --> 01:16:31.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's just one example.
[01:16:32.080 --> 01:16:43.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Maybe, I'm sure you remember, when you used to call us, incessantly, by the way, in our early days, you would always be telling us about particular phones in a particular bank.
[01:16:43.940 --> 01:16:45.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you remember what the bank was?
[01:16:45.660 --> 01:16:46.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[01:16:46.300 --> 01:16:48.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: It was Chemical Bank.
[01:16:48.360 --> 01:16:49.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: Chemical Bank.
[01:16:49.300 --> 01:16:50.340]  [SPEAKER_05]: Also, right.
[01:16:50.600 --> 01:16:53.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: And what did Chemical Bank turn into?
[01:16:54.440 --> 01:16:54.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: Chase.
[01:16:54.780 --> 01:16:55.900]  [SPEAKER_05]: But what did...
[01:16:55.900 --> 01:16:58.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: Don't you remember Manufacturer's Hanover?
[01:16:58.380 --> 01:16:58.940]  [SPEAKER_05]: Manny Hanny.
[01:16:59.220 --> 01:16:59.760]  [SPEAKER_05]: Bank of America?
[01:17:00.180 --> 01:17:01.020]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, not Bank of America.
[01:17:01.280 --> 01:17:01.700]  [SPEAKER_05]: It was...
[01:17:01.700 --> 01:17:02.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: What was the other bank?
[01:17:02.580 --> 01:17:03.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: Bank of New York.
[01:17:03.560 --> 01:17:04.520]  [SPEAKER_05]: It was Bank of New York.
[01:17:04.800 --> 01:17:05.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's right.
[01:17:05.580 --> 01:17:06.820]  [SPEAKER_05]: The Chemical Bank.
[01:17:07.160 --> 01:17:09.480]  [SPEAKER_05]: The Manufacturer's Hanover.
[01:17:09.760 --> 01:17:10.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: Dime?
[01:17:10.500 --> 01:17:11.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: I think it was a...
[01:17:11.240 --> 01:17:12.500]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, no, not Dime.
[01:17:12.580 --> 01:17:13.440]  [SPEAKER_05]: Dime didn't get...
[01:17:14.000 --> 01:17:16.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, Dime turned into something because they're not around anymore.
[01:17:19.100 --> 01:17:23.400]  [SPEAKER_12]: Anyway, yeah, so we're reminiscing fondly about banks that have changed.
[01:17:24.360 --> 01:17:32.340]  [SPEAKER_05]: And also about the virus thing about, you know, people not, you know, using Zoom and...
[01:17:32.340 --> 01:17:33.840]  [SPEAKER_05]: Zoom doesn't even work good.
[01:17:33.960 --> 01:17:34.480]  [SPEAKER_05]: I've used it.
[01:17:34.700 --> 01:17:35.320]  [SPEAKER_05]: And it doesn't...
[01:17:35.320 --> 01:17:38.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: WhatsApp on your phone works better than Zoom on your phone.
[01:17:38.240 --> 01:17:40.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: And it takes a lot of batteries out of your phone.
[01:17:41.240 --> 01:17:41.380]  [SPEAKER_05]: Wow.
[01:17:41.380 --> 01:17:45.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, do you remember the person that...
[01:17:46.000 --> 01:17:47.800]  [SPEAKER_05]: That Nashville thing that happened?
[01:17:48.060 --> 01:17:50.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, someone tried to blow up AT&T.
[01:17:50.760 --> 01:17:52.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: We haven't even had time to mention that yet.
[01:17:52.760 --> 01:17:53.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: But we're going to...
[01:17:53.720 --> 01:17:54.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, we're going to talk about that a little bit.
[01:17:55.500 --> 01:18:00.880]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but not that I encourage a terrorist act to...
[01:18:00.880 --> 01:18:01.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: That's good to hear, Rebel.
[01:18:01.780 --> 01:18:02.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's nice to know.
[01:18:03.640 --> 01:18:12.940]  [SPEAKER_05]: But, you know, he was afraid of 5G and, well, of what's going on, probably what's been going on with the, you know, pandemic and everybody's, you know, online...
[01:18:12.940 --> 01:18:16.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wait, why does everybody assume it's about 5G?
[01:18:16.340 --> 01:18:20.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Why does everybody assume this guy blows himself and part of the AT&T building up because of 5G?
[01:18:22.260 --> 01:18:23.580]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think 6G is scary.
[01:18:23.840 --> 01:18:24.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, okay, 6G, yeah.
[01:18:25.160 --> 01:18:27.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: He never said anything about 5G.
[01:18:27.340 --> 01:18:28.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're just assuming this.
[01:18:29.060 --> 01:18:29.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's just...
[01:18:29.860 --> 01:18:30.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're just making this...
[01:18:30.880 --> 01:18:30.980]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, no, I won't.
[01:18:32.020 --> 01:18:33.560]  [SPEAKER_05]: But, I mean, that's what the news says.
[01:18:33.980 --> 01:18:37.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, but the news depends on that kind of crap.
[01:18:38.000 --> 01:18:44.220]  [SPEAKER_07]: You think he was, like, disturbed by a lot of the advancements and it just was too much or he knew too much sort of thing?
[01:18:45.440 --> 01:18:46.760]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, he was an IT guy.
[01:18:46.900 --> 01:18:48.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, this is from what I heard.
[01:18:48.500 --> 01:18:53.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: And that he doesn't want 5G because it's going to create autonomous cars and take people's jobs.
[01:18:53.820 --> 01:18:59.020]  [SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, I could see the point, but to do something like that, I don't think...
[01:18:59.020 --> 01:19:00.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: Are there reports of that, though?
[01:19:00.300 --> 01:19:01.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: It doesn't really bolster his argument.
[01:19:02.240 --> 01:19:02.860]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, not really.
[01:19:03.000 --> 01:19:03.500]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, it's...
[01:19:03.500 --> 01:19:07.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: Blowing up cars is a lot worse than autonomous cars, I think.
[01:19:08.780 --> 01:19:10.640]  [SPEAKER_07]: It's a heck of a way to start the conversation.
[01:19:10.880 --> 01:19:11.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: Mm-hmm.
[01:19:12.120 --> 01:19:15.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, by the way, what are they going to do with all these new buildings that are building up in Manhattan?
[01:19:15.640 --> 01:19:18.300]  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, there's a big building by Grand Central Station.
[01:19:18.800 --> 01:19:20.740]  [SPEAKER_05]: It's probably going to be halfway occupied.
[01:19:21.120 --> 01:19:25.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you know, new businesses or residences, they can do that.
[01:19:25.880 --> 01:19:28.140]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, are you trying to say something or are you just scratching yourself?
[01:19:29.200 --> 01:19:32.000]  [SPEAKER_10]: No, I wanted to ask Rebel a question.
[01:19:32.000 --> 01:19:33.340]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's been many years.
[01:19:33.540 --> 01:19:36.220]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, I think Rebel, you and I met a long time ago.
[01:19:36.400 --> 01:19:40.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I remember you used to work at Wall Bounce in Long Island, and you used to be at the...
[01:19:40.780 --> 01:19:41.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wait, wait, wait.
[01:19:41.300 --> 01:19:43.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know where Alex used to work on Long Island?
[01:19:43.840 --> 01:19:45.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: You don't live on Long Island.
[01:19:45.760 --> 01:19:46.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: How do you know that?
[01:19:47.300 --> 01:19:47.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: I used to.
[01:19:47.600 --> 01:19:50.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: But Alex invited me to his house, like back in the 90s.
[01:19:50.400 --> 01:19:52.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: You invited Rebel to your house, Alex?
[01:19:53.900 --> 01:19:55.300]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, everybody makes mistakes.
[01:19:55.700 --> 01:19:56.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:19:56.360 --> 01:19:58.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, no, I didn't know you guys were so close.
[01:19:59.360 --> 01:20:00.180]  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, I remember...
[01:20:00.180 --> 01:20:01.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: You never invited me to your house.
[01:20:02.100 --> 01:20:04.720]  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, yeah, I mean, you've been there many times.
[01:20:04.820 --> 01:20:06.100]  [SPEAKER_10]: I don't remember if you ever came out.
[01:20:06.180 --> 01:20:08.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: You must have come out at some point, I guess, Rebel.
[01:20:08.380 --> 01:20:09.860]  [SPEAKER_07]: What's the question you have for him, Alex?
[01:20:09.900 --> 01:20:11.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm out to Long Island to meet...
[01:20:11.080 --> 01:20:14.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: Who was the other kid's name that you were hanging out?
[01:20:14.160 --> 01:20:15.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, hold on a second.
[01:20:15.280 --> 01:20:17.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: He's trying to social engineer us.
[01:20:17.220 --> 01:20:21.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: So be very careful how you answer that, because this might be information that he is not privy to.
[01:20:29.720 --> 01:20:34.560]  [SPEAKER_10]: But Rebel, I have a question for you, because back in the 90s...
[01:20:34.560 --> 01:20:36.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: I think Rebel has the floor.
[01:20:36.600 --> 01:20:37.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead, Rebel.
[01:20:38.500 --> 01:20:50.680]  [SPEAKER_05]: Back in the 70s, I remember back in the old days, I used to do prank calls, and I called this one person, I don't know, I remember why, if she would, I look up in the phone book and see these phone numbers and call these people.
[01:20:52.220 --> 01:20:56.480]  [SPEAKER_05]: This person, this is before, this is the analog days in the 70s.
[01:20:56.800 --> 01:20:57.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Analog prank calls, yes.
[01:20:58.700 --> 01:20:59.100]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[01:20:59.680 --> 01:21:02.380]  [SPEAKER_05]: She'd keep me on the phone, asking me questions, are you alone?
[01:21:02.560 --> 01:21:09.340]  [SPEAKER_05]: And I hung up, I had two lines in my house, two phone numbers, one that my parents had used, and one that we would use.
[01:21:09.820 --> 01:21:17.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: I called on the desk phone, we'd call it the desk phone, one line, and then I'd hang up with this person.
[01:21:17.680 --> 01:21:33.800]  [SPEAKER_05]: Inside of an hour, I got a call on the kitchen phone, which was the other line, from this lady, meaning, you know, mind you, I was young at the time, and she said, yes, this is the police station, we're getting calls, no, or something like that, or this is the telephone company,
[01:21:34.280 --> 01:21:48.160]  [SPEAKER_05]: we're getting calls from, there was a prank call made to some missus, whatever, and, and I'd be on the phone, and I, I wouldn't know it was her, and I'd be all scared, and she's like, are you ever going to call this person again?
[01:21:48.640 --> 01:21:49.800]  [SPEAKER_05]: And then I hung up.
[01:21:50.220 --> 01:21:55.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: You, you, you might, okay, well, interesting, that's before caller ID, so that's not how, how she got your number.
[01:21:55.520 --> 01:21:59.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: Or, um, you just called a regular phone number, and, and they were able to...
[01:21:59.740 --> 01:22:01.500]  [SPEAKER_15]: A regular phone number, and they knew my name, too.
[01:22:01.680 --> 01:22:02.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you know, it's possible.
[01:22:02.960 --> 01:22:05.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: First of all, if anybody gets a call from Rebel, they know it's Rebel.
[01:22:06.340 --> 01:22:12.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: Maybe your, your reputation really preceded you, and people recognized your voice way back then as well.
[01:22:12.700 --> 01:22:15.580]  [SPEAKER_15]: No, this is the 1970s, this is not the 90s.
[01:22:15.660 --> 01:22:17.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, but you've been at this a while, Rebel.
[01:22:17.660 --> 01:22:19.320]  [SPEAKER_15]: He was a kid, he was just a kid, he said he was a kid.
[01:22:19.440 --> 01:22:25.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, but he was probably a precocious kid, and probably everybody in the neighborhood knew him, you know, or all she had to do was make a couple of calls herself.
[01:22:25.520 --> 01:22:27.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: And ask, and, and somebody would rat him out.
[01:22:27.720 --> 01:22:28.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't know.
[01:22:29.960 --> 01:22:32.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, it's, or you called the operator.
[01:22:32.180 --> 01:22:33.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: Did you prank the operator?
[01:22:33.240 --> 01:22:34.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: Because they could do that.
[01:22:34.600 --> 01:22:35.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: What's Alex's question?
[01:22:35.440 --> 01:22:44.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, I know, I, no, I didn't call the operator, but there was, I heard that if you keep the party on the line for like at least two minutes or three minutes, you're able to trace the query.
[01:22:44.860 --> 01:22:54.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, yeah, I've watched a few TV shows where they're running through central offices and saying it's 80% traced and 85% traced, and then they hang out at just the last moment.
[01:22:54.380 --> 01:22:59.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, yeah, so I don't know if that's what happened to you, but I'm glad you got away with it.
[01:22:59.680 --> 01:23:04.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, I'm glad you, it could have ruined your life back then in the 1970s making that prank call.
[01:23:04.160 --> 01:23:06.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but I mean, thanks for my parents weren't home, but how did they know the other phone number?
[01:23:07.060 --> 01:23:07.880]  [SPEAKER_05]: That's what I'd like to know.
[01:23:08.620 --> 01:23:14.600]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, it sounds to me, and it's just a theory, somebody had a friend in the phone company and it wasn't you.
[01:23:15.180 --> 01:23:16.140]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's what I think.
[01:23:17.280 --> 01:23:18.140]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, go ahead.
[01:23:18.200 --> 01:23:18.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: You had a question.
[01:23:19.740 --> 01:23:20.640]  [SPEAKER_10]: I did.
[01:23:20.940 --> 01:23:21.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you remember what it was?
[01:23:22.580 --> 01:23:25.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: This has been a question I've had for several decades.
[01:23:26.120 --> 01:23:28.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: Every once in a while, it pops into my mind.
[01:23:28.680 --> 01:23:39.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: Because if our listeners go back to the 90s and listen to Off The Hook, whenever we took listener phone calls, the first voice anybody would hear on any show was always Rebel.
[01:23:39.840 --> 01:23:42.100]  [SPEAKER_10]: And he would say, you know, Emmanuel, right?
[01:23:42.260 --> 01:23:43.640]  [SPEAKER_10]: And we said, oh, hi, Rebel.
[01:23:43.820 --> 01:23:44.340]  [SPEAKER_10]: Are you again?
[01:23:44.880 --> 01:23:47.880]  [SPEAKER_10]: Rebel, how were you always the first caller?
[01:23:48.020 --> 01:23:56.140]  [SPEAKER_10]: You must have been calling on multiple lines into the old 212-279-3400 number for WBAI.
[01:23:56.320 --> 01:24:00.440]  [SPEAKER_10]: But you would have had to then, I guess, know which line was picked up.
[01:24:00.560 --> 01:24:01.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: Did you have some kind of switchboard?
[01:24:02.020 --> 01:24:02.800]  [SPEAKER_10]: How did you do that?
[01:24:02.860 --> 01:24:03.660]  [SPEAKER_10]: He was always first.
[01:24:03.920 --> 01:24:06.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: I remember I had two phones and I had to like call on both.
[01:24:06.980 --> 01:24:08.900]  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I never had one.
[01:24:08.900 --> 01:24:09.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: I never had two phones.
[01:24:09.640 --> 01:24:09.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: Really?
[01:24:10.140 --> 01:24:11.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: Because you seemed to be on every line.
[01:24:12.440 --> 01:24:14.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: And we could never avoid you.
[01:24:14.060 --> 01:24:19.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: Not that we were trying to avoid you, but, you know, we played a little game where we said, let's try and make it not Rebel be the first call.
[01:24:19.680 --> 01:24:20.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: And we always lost.
[01:24:22.120 --> 01:24:24.320]  [SPEAKER_10]: You must have had more than two phone lines.
[01:24:24.420 --> 01:24:26.340]  [SPEAKER_10]: There's no way you could have done that with two phone lines.
[01:24:28.440 --> 01:24:29.480]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, I did.
[01:24:29.600 --> 01:24:31.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: It was always two phone lines, actually.
[01:24:31.600 --> 01:24:32.100]  [SPEAKER_05]: Hmm.
[01:24:32.460 --> 01:24:37.980]  [SPEAKER_05]: Because I remember when, I mean, they used to cut you off when you got the new 5DSS.
[01:24:38.120 --> 01:24:41.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: They cut you off and then, you know, you just redial quickly.
[01:24:41.340 --> 01:24:43.780]  [SPEAKER_07]: It's like you would switch from one to the other, right?
[01:24:43.880 --> 01:24:45.940]  [SPEAKER_07]: While you're waiting on one, you're dialing on the other.
[01:24:46.100 --> 01:24:48.180]  [SPEAKER_07]: So as soon as you get hung up on one, something like that.
[01:24:48.440 --> 01:24:48.720]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[01:24:49.000 --> 01:24:49.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[01:24:49.540 --> 01:24:50.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: That's right.
[01:24:50.340 --> 01:24:52.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: And he dialed very fast, I would bet.
[01:24:53.260 --> 01:24:55.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: You had a Touch-Tone phone, I hope.
[01:24:55.180 --> 01:24:55.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: It wasn't rotary.
[01:24:55.840 --> 01:24:56.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, of course.
[01:24:56.820 --> 01:24:58.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: It was a Touch-Tone, sure.
[01:24:58.640 --> 01:25:02.880]  [SPEAKER_10]: But the WBAI switchboard back then had like eight or nine lines, I remember, right?
[01:25:02.880 --> 01:25:03.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: Ten lines.
[01:25:03.200 --> 01:25:04.080]  [SPEAKER_10]: People were calling in.
[01:25:04.300 --> 01:25:04.620]  [SPEAKER_10]: Ten lines, I was.
[01:25:04.620 --> 01:25:05.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: You could choose...
[01:25:05.680 --> 01:25:06.960]  [SPEAKER_10]: Ten lines, okay, sure.
[01:25:07.600 --> 01:25:08.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: New York City, come on.
[01:25:10.240 --> 01:25:19.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: So either you were really unlucky, or I think Rebel is not being entirely forthcoming with the number of phone lines that he was utilizing back in the 90s.
[01:25:19.160 --> 01:25:25.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: I had extremely poor luck many times back then, so it's entirely possible that's what it was.
[01:25:27.080 --> 01:25:28.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rebel, any other comments?
[01:25:28.660 --> 01:25:31.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're going to open it up to some other callers, but it's great hearing your voice again.
[01:25:31.820 --> 01:25:32.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: Are you still in the area?
[01:25:33.680 --> 01:25:35.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm still in New York City, in Queens.
[01:25:35.500 --> 01:25:37.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: You don't have chats for this, do you?
[01:25:37.400 --> 01:25:42.300]  [SPEAKER_05]: This is the first time I'm listening online on the YouTube thing, and...
[01:25:42.300 --> 01:25:43.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's disabled.
[01:25:44.380 --> 01:25:46.100]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think it's disabled in the stream.
[01:25:46.100 --> 01:25:47.100]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm not quite sure, though.
[01:25:47.600 --> 01:25:49.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: We have the IRC channel, don't we?
[01:25:50.760 --> 01:25:52.420]  [SPEAKER_11]: We always have the IRC channel.
[01:25:52.520 --> 01:25:53.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's a chat.
[01:25:53.460 --> 01:25:54.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, how many chats do you want?
[01:26:02.880 --> 01:26:04.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: Sorry, Rebel, we're having trouble hearing you.
[01:26:05.160 --> 01:26:06.340]  [SPEAKER_05]: IRC does not work.
[01:26:06.640 --> 01:26:07.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: IRC doesn't work?
[01:26:09.640 --> 01:26:10.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: What's the meaning of this?
[01:26:10.760 --> 01:26:11.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: How can IRC not work?
[01:26:11.820 --> 01:26:12.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: You go to IRC.com, right?
[01:26:13.240 --> 01:26:15.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, it's IRC.2600.net.
[01:26:16.520 --> 01:26:17.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: IRC.com.
[01:26:19.340 --> 01:26:21.760]  [SPEAKER_07]: You might get more chat than you bargained for, though.
[01:26:22.060 --> 01:26:23.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's certainly true.
[01:26:23.160 --> 01:26:24.260]  [SPEAKER_07]: Be careful with that.
[01:26:24.480 --> 01:26:29.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rebel, again, good hearing you, and stay in touch, and hopefully we'll see you at a meeting when those start up again.
[01:26:30.620 --> 01:26:31.760]  [SPEAKER_05]: When those start up again.
[01:26:31.900 --> 01:26:33.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, they will start up again.
[01:26:33.120 --> 01:26:33.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: We promise.
[01:26:33.980 --> 01:26:36.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, by the way, speaking of starting meetings, what is the Zoom thing?
[01:26:36.960 --> 01:26:38.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: The meetings are all on Zoom, correct?
[01:26:38.680 --> 01:26:39.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: I could go on my laptop.
[01:26:40.580 --> 01:26:41.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rob, do you know something about that?
[01:26:42.840 --> 01:26:49.640]  [SPEAKER_11]: Yeah, for a lot of local meetings, including our own, have been having virtual meetings while we can't have in-person 2600 meetings.
[01:26:49.940 --> 01:27:00.740]  [SPEAKER_11]: So if you go to, here in New York, if you go to nyc2600.net, all the info is there on how to get on our Zoom, which is going to be happening this Friday, New Year's Day.
[01:27:00.740 --> 01:27:05.220]  [SPEAKER_11]: And, yeah, you're free to join in via cam.
[01:27:05.380 --> 01:27:06.580]  [SPEAKER_11]: You don't have to have your camera on.
[01:27:06.680 --> 01:27:08.220]  [SPEAKER_11]: You can join in via regular telephone.
[01:27:08.520 --> 01:27:10.360]  [SPEAKER_11]: All the instructions are there.
[01:27:10.900 --> 01:27:12.720]  [SPEAKER_11]: And it's also something...
[01:27:12.720 --> 01:27:16.200]  [SPEAKER_11]: I noticed I got the most recent issue of 2600.
[01:27:16.440 --> 01:27:21.980]  [SPEAKER_11]: I got my subscriber copy and the meetings page, which would normally list the meetings all over the world.
[01:27:22.760 --> 01:27:32.040]  [SPEAKER_11]: Instead, this issue is a nice, thoughtful piece on the current state of the 2600 meetings as an in-person concern.
[01:27:32.680 --> 01:27:36.780]  [SPEAKER_11]: And, you know, I very much dig what you said there.
[01:27:36.880 --> 01:27:40.080]  [SPEAKER_11]: And also the fact that it's hopeful.
[01:27:40.260 --> 01:27:48.440]  [SPEAKER_11]: You know, we cannot do this in person now, but we can improve and adapt and take stock of what we're doing for when we can do it in person again.
[01:27:48.680 --> 01:27:48.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Right.
[01:27:49.020 --> 01:27:50.400]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're going to hit the reset button.
[01:27:50.520 --> 01:27:51.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're going to hit the reset button.
[01:27:51.940 --> 01:27:55.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: And just every meeting, we'll start again.
[01:27:55.940 --> 01:27:58.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: Then we'll have a lot more meetings as well.
[01:27:58.180 --> 01:28:01.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, and Rob, the address you gave out, I didn't hear the first dot.
[01:28:01.420 --> 01:28:03.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's irc.2600.net, correct?
[01:28:04.500 --> 01:28:08.200]  [SPEAKER_11]: The address for the website is nyc2600.net.
[01:28:08.560 --> 01:28:12.700]  [SPEAKER_11]: And on there, there's a post with the information on getting onto the Zoom.
[01:28:12.880 --> 01:28:23.020]  [SPEAKER_11]: So it's go to nyc2600.net on the web, or you could go to nyc2600 on Twitter, or we're on Mastodon as well, on mastodon.social.
[01:28:23.820 --> 01:28:27.600]  [SPEAKER_11]: And the info is all linked to you from there.
[01:28:27.720 --> 01:28:34.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know what, I bet we could make nyc.2600.net go to nyc2600.net.
[01:28:35.060 --> 01:28:37.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's what I'm going to work on for 2021.
[01:28:38.000 --> 01:28:39.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're going to figure out how to do that.
[01:28:39.600 --> 01:28:41.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rebel, want to say goodnight to you?
[01:28:41.700 --> 01:28:42.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Thank you for calling.
[01:28:42.680 --> 01:28:47.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, hopefully by the time we are ready to do in-person meetings, the City Group thing will be finished.
[01:28:47.960 --> 01:28:52.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you know, I think we like the new location better than City Group.
[01:28:52.700 --> 01:28:55.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's just a half a block away, and they're nicer to us.
[01:28:57.260 --> 01:28:57.860]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, okay.
[01:28:58.160 --> 01:28:58.340]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[01:28:58.360 --> 01:29:00.440]  [SPEAKER_05]: I know they've been rebuilding that lobby.
[01:29:00.520 --> 01:29:01.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: What's that place called again, Rob?
[01:29:01.580 --> 01:29:01.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do you remember?
[01:29:02.880 --> 01:29:03.600]  [SPEAKER_11]: The Atrium.
[01:29:03.740 --> 01:29:04.240]  [SPEAKER_11]: The Atrium.
[01:29:05.100 --> 01:29:06.340]  [SPEAKER_11]: The Atrium at 875.
[01:29:06.740 --> 01:29:06.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[01:29:07.000 --> 01:29:07.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: There you go.
[01:29:07.540 --> 01:29:10.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: Right there on 2nd Avenue?
[01:29:10.640 --> 01:29:11.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: 1st Avenue?
[01:29:11.100 --> 01:29:11.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: What avenue is it?
[01:29:11.820 --> 01:29:11.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: 3rd.
[01:29:11.840 --> 01:29:12.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: 3rd Avenue.
[01:29:12.420 --> 01:29:13.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: I knew it was one of those.
[01:29:13.380 --> 01:29:14.720]  [SPEAKER_11]: 3rd Avenue and 53rd Street.
[01:29:14.800 --> 01:29:15.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:29:15.640 --> 01:29:16.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: Talk to you later, Rebel.
[01:29:16.820 --> 01:29:17.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good night.
[01:29:17.100 --> 01:29:18.720]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, bye, Emmanuel.
[01:29:19.260 --> 01:29:19.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:29:19.820 --> 01:29:20.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good hearing from Rebel.
[01:29:20.560 --> 01:29:21.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't believe I heard from Rebel.
[01:29:21.760 --> 01:29:22.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: Isn't that amazing?
[01:29:22.540 --> 01:29:23.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: That was brilliant.
[01:29:23.860 --> 01:29:24.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:29:24.160 --> 01:29:26.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: I shouldn't hit that button when there's nobody there.
[01:29:26.260 --> 01:29:26.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:29:26.540 --> 01:29:26.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good to know.
[01:29:27.960 --> 01:29:28.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, yeah.
[01:29:28.680 --> 01:29:30.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: Somebody tried to blow up AT&T in Nashville.
[01:29:30.740 --> 01:29:31.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: That was something.
[01:29:32.040 --> 01:29:33.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, I know exactly what that was.
[01:29:33.620 --> 01:29:37.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: When we went to see the Eclipse a few years ago, Kyle and I hung out right by there.
[01:29:38.520 --> 01:29:44.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not the Batman building, which is a skyscraper, which I think used to be Bell South, but affiliated with AT&T.
[01:29:44.720 --> 01:29:58.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and that building, its proximity, I mean, it's probably got some kind of server or rack area for the business end that goes on in the taller building.
[01:29:58.720 --> 01:30:08.520]  [SPEAKER_07]: But the actual plant, the central office, was adjacent or right on that street where this person parked.
[01:30:08.800 --> 01:30:16.980]  [SPEAKER_07]: And so he parked pretty much like, it looks like right over some vaults and apparently some generators were knocked out.
[01:30:16.980 --> 01:30:18.360]  [SPEAKER_07]: So they ran out of battery power.
[01:30:18.480 --> 01:30:19.600]  [SPEAKER_07]: It was a whole mess.
[01:30:19.720 --> 01:30:27.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: Here's my theory as to what this is all about, because everybody is speculating that he have a problem with Hooters, which was across the street, you know, all sorts of things like that.
[01:30:28.500 --> 01:30:34.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: The recording that everyone is playing doesn't say what they say the recording was saying.
[01:30:34.220 --> 01:30:35.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: They say it was a countdown.
[01:30:35.520 --> 01:30:40.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: And the only recording I've heard so far says, it sounds like a police voice.
[01:30:40.380 --> 01:30:44.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: I was surprised to find out it wasn't, basically saying, if you can hear this, evacuate now.
[01:30:45.380 --> 01:30:47.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: Very professional sounding recording.
[01:30:47.540 --> 01:30:52.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: I didn't hear the recording that says 15 minutes, this thing is going to explode, 14 minutes.
[01:30:52.100 --> 01:30:56.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: And apparently the song Downtown by Petula Clark was playing.
[01:30:57.260 --> 01:31:06.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: So my theory, since Downtown by Petula Clark is the very first song I remember hearing as a child, and I'm just a couple of years younger than this guy was.
[01:31:07.400 --> 01:31:17.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: I have a feeling it might, even though the lyrics are very apropos for being downtown, I suppose, it might have been a sentimental favorite of his.
[01:31:17.000 --> 01:31:30.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: This might be his first pleasant memory as a child, and it might be just something that he was thinking of as he made this decision to end his life, and that's why he played that song.
[01:31:30.160 --> 01:31:35.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: Maybe he was isolated, lonely, upset at something, maybe 5G, maybe not.
[01:31:36.340 --> 01:31:39.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: I don't think it's really anything more complicated than that.
[01:31:39.460 --> 01:31:45.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: You know, somebody who just felt no other way out and went to the heart of Nashville.
[01:31:45.100 --> 01:31:53.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: Anyone who comes from Nashville or has been to Nashville knows AT&T is right there, and knows that is the busy street right there.
[01:31:53.340 --> 01:31:55.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's why he chose that area.
[01:31:55.680 --> 01:31:57.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: So that's my theory.
[01:31:58.400 --> 01:32:08.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: The story that I see in USA Today, the headline, Nashville Bombing Froze Wireless Communications Exposed Achilles Heel in Regional Network.
[01:32:08.020 --> 01:32:16.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's as if nobody knew that blowing up a truck outside a telecommunications facility might screw up the telecommunications facility.
[01:32:16.560 --> 01:32:17.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's what's going to happen.
[01:32:18.020 --> 01:32:22.780]  [SPEAKER_12]: There's really not much you can do about that unless you want to encase it in more steel and concrete.
[01:32:23.660 --> 01:32:24.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: That kind of thing.
[01:32:24.940 --> 01:32:27.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's the effect it'll have.
[01:32:27.620 --> 01:32:36.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: The way to not have that be a big deal is to have lots of redundancy and lots of different points of presence and things like that.
[01:32:36.280 --> 01:32:41.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: So I was impressed how quickly they were able to find the truck.
[01:32:41.800 --> 01:32:46.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: I was looking at Google Images from years earlier, seeing where he moved it.
[01:32:48.240 --> 01:32:54.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: And this kind of thing, you know, with detective work and with technology, you pretty much always are able to figure out what happened in the end.
[01:32:56.920 --> 01:32:57.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, Alex?
[01:32:57.820 --> 01:33:08.060]  [SPEAKER_10]: One of the things I think is really fascinating about this is the massive amount of media attention that the recording has attracted since last week.
[01:33:08.240 --> 01:33:21.060]  [SPEAKER_10]: As you mentioned, there were multiple accounts, certain recordings that showed really that the intention behind this was not to destroy people, but to damage property, right?
[01:33:21.120 --> 01:33:23.040]  [SPEAKER_10]: It wasn't to take lives in a sense.
[01:33:23.160 --> 01:33:41.500]  [SPEAKER_10]: But because everybody has become so familiar with the countdown recording here, what is interesting to me is that now anybody with a speaker, anybody can make a recording that broadcasts out in some kind of loud volume, that there is going to be an explosion in the countdown.
[01:33:41.760 --> 01:33:43.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: Wait, this is a new discovery?
[01:33:43.160 --> 01:33:46.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: People are just figuring this out now that they can broadcast something on a megaphone?
[01:33:47.560 --> 01:34:04.500]  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, look, because this had such an effect, everyone else is going to be on high alert for these types of activities, copycat type of situations, and you can cause a massive amount of business interruption with a recording now, because this has gotten so much play.
[01:34:04.700 --> 01:34:18.480]  [SPEAKER_10]: In the past, people might not have taken this so seriously, but you could easily shut down whole city blocks by placing a couple of loudspeakers broadcasting a recording, you know, stating that there is going to be an explosion.
[01:34:18.780 --> 01:34:21.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: But Alex, that's exactly what happened this time.
[01:34:21.720 --> 01:34:26.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: They did shut down a couple of city blocks because of that recording, and the recording hadn't happened before.
[01:34:26.780 --> 01:34:33.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think any time you announce that something's about to blow up, whether it's now or 10 years ago, people are going to take it seriously.
[01:34:33.680 --> 01:34:35.820]  [SPEAKER_10]: Look, I agree with that, but now people are...
[01:34:35.820 --> 01:34:41.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's more susceptible, and now people are aware of this particular recording.
[01:34:41.460 --> 01:34:43.980]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's got such massive attention, worldwide attention.
[01:34:44.240 --> 01:34:55.080]  [SPEAKER_10]: I think that there are going to be copycats that are just going to be playing some kind of recording or some kind of ominous countdown, and it can cause a really massive...
[01:34:55.080 --> 01:35:01.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's a very low-cost, simple way to cause a massive amount of business interruption in any area.
[01:35:01.400 --> 01:35:02.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: So are bomb threats.
[01:35:02.500 --> 01:35:03.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Those have been around forever.
[01:35:03.820 --> 01:35:09.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: I think only in a situation where you need some misdirection.
[01:35:09.900 --> 01:35:16.700]  [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like the high cost of not actually blowing yourself up is that, yeah, you're going to be hunted down a bit.
[01:35:16.700 --> 01:35:20.840]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, there's going to be some investigations, and people are going to have a problem with what you caused, that chaos.
[01:35:21.180 --> 01:35:32.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: But if you need that misdirection to further some other aim, that cost may not be substantial enough to think twice about it.
[01:35:32.900 --> 01:35:41.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm more concerned that a few years ago, his girlfriend called the police saying that this guy is building bombs, and they totally dismissed it.
[01:35:41.800 --> 01:35:51.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: They just said, well, we don't have any cause to search his place or to search the camper that's parked in his backyard behind a fence.
[01:35:52.120 --> 01:35:54.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, how about the person saying he's building a bomb?
[01:35:54.460 --> 01:35:57.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: And isn't that some kind of just cause?
[01:35:57.860 --> 01:35:58.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: Or, you know, I don't...
[01:35:59.320 --> 01:36:04.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's a fine line that you have to walk for personal privacy and things like that.
[01:36:04.540 --> 01:36:11.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: But if they had this kind of tip-off and they just ignored it, you have to wonder just how good was the policing?
[01:36:13.280 --> 01:36:14.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Alex, and then we're going to take a phone call.
[01:36:15.360 --> 01:36:15.720]  [SPEAKER_10]: Sure.
[01:36:15.860 --> 01:36:18.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, that would certainly rise to the level of probable cause in my book.
[01:36:19.320 --> 01:36:27.900]  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe there were issues with the credibility of the woman reporting it, or the circumstances under which it was reported might have been somewhat suspect.
[01:36:27.900 --> 01:36:40.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: But sure, certainly, I mean, in search warrants and even just, you know, a police officer going and knocking on somebody's door without a search warrant and sort of peeking in and around, that's something that could certainly happen as well.
[01:36:40.620 --> 01:36:47.980]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then that could lead to further evidence that could allow you to go to a judge and get a warrant on the basis of probable cause to go and search this person's apartment.
[01:36:48.100 --> 01:36:55.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, you know, it certainly is concerning that law enforcement didn't pick up on that tip.
[01:36:55.460 --> 01:37:02.480]  [SPEAKER_10]: But before we, I think, rush to judgment, we should know all of the facts surrounding that particular tip-off as well.
[01:37:02.620 --> 01:37:09.240]  [SPEAKER_10]: It doesn't sound right to me that law enforcement did absolutely nothing with a tip-off about a bomb.
[01:37:09.720 --> 01:37:10.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
[01:37:10.340 --> 01:37:10.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[01:37:10.560 --> 01:37:16.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: Our phone number 802-321-4225 is just going to be on for a few more minutes because we've been talking for quite a while.
[01:37:17.420 --> 01:37:21.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: We have to do other things with our lives too, but we had a nice conversation with Rebel.
[01:37:21.780 --> 01:37:23.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do we have someone on the line now?
[01:37:23.440 --> 01:37:24.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, I didn't know we had somebody.
[01:37:24.440 --> 01:37:26.180]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I already answered it.
[01:37:26.260 --> 01:37:26.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, okay.
[01:37:26.760 --> 01:37:27.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you were...
[01:37:27.440 --> 01:37:28.000]  [SPEAKER_07]: They've been waiting.
[01:37:28.260 --> 01:37:29.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm so sorry.
[01:37:29.700 --> 01:37:30.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: Caller, are you there?
[01:37:32.000 --> 01:37:32.700]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yes, sir.
[01:37:33.120 --> 01:37:34.060]  [SPEAKER_06]: Good evening, folks.
[01:37:34.460 --> 01:37:34.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hi.
[01:37:34.760 --> 01:37:35.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: How are you doing?
[01:37:36.480 --> 01:37:38.000]  [SPEAKER_06]: This is Bobson from Bulgaria.
[01:37:38.120 --> 01:37:39.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: Bobson, I wasn't sure it was you for a second.
[01:37:39.660 --> 01:37:41.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: You didn't sound quite as Bulgarian, but...
[01:37:42.460 --> 01:37:43.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, now I recognize your voice.
[01:37:44.380 --> 01:37:44.900]  [SPEAKER_06]: How are you doing?
[01:37:45.560 --> 01:37:46.400]  [SPEAKER_06]: Sorry about that.
[01:37:46.480 --> 01:37:47.340]  [SPEAKER_06]: I didn't mean to.
[01:37:47.840 --> 01:37:48.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hey, happy New Year's Eve.
[01:37:48.940 --> 01:37:50.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's already New Year's Eve where you are.
[01:37:51.820 --> 01:37:55.180]  [SPEAKER_06]: No, it's the early hours of the 31st of December.
[01:37:55.260 --> 01:37:57.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's New Year's Eve, at least where we come from.
[01:37:58.100 --> 01:37:59.280]  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, well, yeah.
[01:38:00.180 --> 01:38:02.060]  [SPEAKER_06]: The Eve is a bit later, I guess.
[01:38:02.180 --> 01:38:02.380]  [SPEAKER_06]: Uh-huh.
[01:38:02.680 --> 01:38:03.120]  [SPEAKER_06]: Whatever.
[01:38:03.380 --> 01:38:06.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: Did you make it to Congress, the virtual Congress?
[01:38:07.300 --> 01:38:08.180]  [SPEAKER_06]: RC3, you mean?
[01:38:08.300 --> 01:38:09.020]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yes, RC3.
[01:38:09.200 --> 01:38:09.620]  [SPEAKER_06]: It was so much fun.
[01:38:09.800 --> 01:38:10.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wasn't it fun?
[01:38:10.500 --> 01:38:10.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: It was.
[01:38:12.060 --> 01:38:29.440]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, I didn't have anything to use all the bells and whistles with the 2G world and all that fancy stuff they did, but I watched a lot of lectures, and I have about three times as many to catch up on in the next few days.
[01:38:29.580 --> 01:38:29.820]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[01:38:30.060 --> 01:38:33.900]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, they're going to release them online, media.ccc.de.
[01:38:33.900 --> 01:38:41.680]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, they started doing that, but they have some catching up to do with that stuff, so it was fun, too.
[01:38:42.440 --> 01:38:51.000]  [SPEAKER_06]: I heard our friend Mitch Altman was saying how he did a soldering workshop with 160 people.
[01:38:51.140 --> 01:38:54.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: How in God's name did Mitch Altman do a soldering workshop virtually?
[01:38:54.700 --> 01:38:55.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: How did he do that?
[01:38:56.980 --> 01:39:11.020]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, you have to talk to him about it, because I don't have the details on that, but he had 160 people in the workshop, which doesn't surprise me, knowing him, that he would do such a thing.
[01:39:11.580 --> 01:39:19.280]  [SPEAKER_06]: He probably had fun doing it, which is what Congress is all about, right?
[01:39:21.540 --> 01:39:22.820]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, definitely true.
[01:39:23.140 --> 01:39:31.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm just glad that hackers are figuring out ways to do things anyway, and I think we'll be all the stronger for it.
[01:39:32.220 --> 01:39:33.420]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we don't know unless we try it.
[01:39:35.980 --> 01:39:36.840]  [SPEAKER_06]: True, that.
[01:39:38.160 --> 01:39:40.500]  [SPEAKER_06]: It was lots of fun.
[01:39:40.680 --> 01:39:47.360]  [SPEAKER_06]: I'm looking forward to releasing the recordings, because there's a lot to catch up on.
[01:39:47.600 --> 01:39:52.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now, is it true that there was a limit on the number of virtual tickets that they had?
[01:39:55.100 --> 01:39:57.320]  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, yeah, the zero-euro tickets.
[01:39:57.620 --> 01:39:58.500]  [SPEAKER_06]: I think so.
[01:39:59.040 --> 01:40:14.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, I think it has to do with the new 2D world thingy that they did, which was some sort of modern, I don't know what thing of bells and whistles that I had to run on.
[01:40:15.400 --> 01:40:31.660]  [SPEAKER_06]: So, I mean, I don't have a modern enough operating system with modern enough web browser to take full advantage of the bells and whistles on it, so I haven't gone to it, but...
[01:40:32.400 --> 01:40:34.800]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I didn't get to check that out either.
[01:40:34.800 --> 01:40:42.320]  [SPEAKER_07]: It seems like it was a test, but they didn't want to overburden it, because then it would really be buggy, and they were working that out.
[01:40:42.400 --> 01:40:43.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: People were submitting suggestions.
[01:40:43.720 --> 01:40:47.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: We just discovered something really interesting, and, Bobson, you're part of the reason for it.
[01:40:48.660 --> 01:40:54.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: We just found out, we have a TV set that's tied into the telephone.
[01:40:54.420 --> 01:40:55.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: We see caller ID.
[01:40:55.420 --> 01:40:57.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: It shows up on the upper left-hand side.
[01:40:58.320 --> 01:40:59.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're on the phone.
[01:40:59.340 --> 01:41:01.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: We don't have call waiting on this phone line.
[01:41:01.280 --> 01:41:17.520]  [SPEAKER_12]: And if you call the phone line now, well, if you call the phone line direct, that is, the number we give out forwards to this phone number, if you call it direct, you get a busy signal if you call the number, but the caller ID shows up of the person who got the busy signal.
[01:41:17.840 --> 01:41:19.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: Have you ever heard of anything like that?
[01:41:19.600 --> 01:41:20.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is unbelievable.
[01:41:20.800 --> 01:41:21.140]  [SPEAKER_15]: No.
[01:41:21.760 --> 01:41:25.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just tried it for my cell phone, and my number showed up, even though I got a busy signal.
[01:41:25.880 --> 01:41:26.640]  [SPEAKER_07]: There's no name.
[01:41:26.840 --> 01:41:30.700]  [SPEAKER_07]: It just shows zero, I think, for the name, or an O.
[01:41:31.020 --> 01:41:37.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, that's just because of the way this happens to be programmed, but that's not the first weird thing I've found out about this caller ID.
[01:41:38.540 --> 01:41:48.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: If you block your number, and your number is listed as preferred ring for whatever reason, you'll still get the preferred ring, even though you blocked your number.
[01:41:48.620 --> 01:41:51.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: So caller ID is still being passed along, even when you block it.
[01:41:51.980 --> 01:41:52.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:41:52.540 --> 01:41:52.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay.
[01:41:52.720 --> 01:41:53.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: We have a lot to experiment with.
[01:41:54.260 --> 01:41:59.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: We just discovered that now, because we saw our caller ID come over, and you were on the phone, so that wasn't even possible.
[01:42:00.560 --> 01:42:03.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: There's another one coming over right now, in fact, which is weird.
[01:42:03.640 --> 01:42:17.600]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, it makes... it's not a huge surprise, technologically, that caller IDs are passed along the phone lines.
[01:42:17.720 --> 01:42:18.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: On busy signals?
[01:42:18.600 --> 01:42:19.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: I've never heard of that.
[01:42:19.880 --> 01:42:20.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's weird.
[01:42:21.620 --> 01:42:28.420]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we wouldn't know that there was another call coming in, were it not, for the fact that there is a screen to monitor with this system.
[01:42:28.580 --> 01:42:28.680]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[01:42:28.680 --> 01:42:29.640]  [SPEAKER_07]: It's kind of interesting.
[01:42:31.060 --> 01:42:36.520]  [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, Bobson, were there any other highlights from 2020, if you could have any?
[01:42:36.760 --> 01:42:43.000]  [SPEAKER_07]: Or are there, to put it a better way, are there things you're looking forward to in the coming year, new year?
[01:42:45.080 --> 01:42:52.680]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, what I'm looking forward to is the WHO press release saying that the pandemic is over.
[01:42:52.880 --> 01:42:55.280]  [SPEAKER_06]: That's one thing I cannot wait for.
[01:42:55.340 --> 01:42:57.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: I would like to see a press release that says that.
[01:42:57.640 --> 01:43:06.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, everybody go out and hug each other and do all kinds of fun things and lick the subway railings and whatever, for one day at least.
[01:43:07.120 --> 01:43:30.470]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, I could have it, I could use it happening in 2021, that press release from the WHO, because, you know, it would be a welcome change, I guess, with the way things are right now.
[01:43:30.650 --> 01:43:31.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's true.
[01:43:31.390 --> 01:43:31.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's true.
[01:43:32.090 --> 01:43:36.190]  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we got a preview of that, the daily election results were made official.
[01:43:36.550 --> 01:43:38.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, yeah, somewhat of a preview of that.
[01:43:38.990 --> 01:43:43.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: And maybe on Inauguration Day we'll get another preview of that, if we make it that far.
[01:43:43.970 --> 01:43:46.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm worried about what's going to happen on the 6th in D.C.
[01:43:46.950 --> 01:43:50.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: with Trump and his ilk, but we'll have to...
[01:43:50.930 --> 01:43:52.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you're not the only one worried about that.
[01:43:53.150 --> 01:43:54.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, you're in Sofia, Bulgaria.
[01:43:55.210 --> 01:43:57.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're so far away, you don't have to worry about that.
[01:43:58.310 --> 01:43:59.170]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, right.
[01:44:00.950 --> 01:44:05.610]  [SPEAKER_06]: The 45th has nukes at his disposal still.
[01:44:05.850 --> 01:44:06.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's true.
[01:44:06.930 --> 01:44:09.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: Does anybody realize Trump could launch nukes?
[01:44:09.270 --> 01:44:10.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's called ICBM.
[01:44:11.250 --> 01:44:12.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's not a good thing.
[01:44:12.950 --> 01:44:13.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, no, it's not.
[01:44:14.610 --> 01:44:18.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right, Bobson, we're going to keep our fingers crossed and hope that 2021 is going to be a better year.
[01:44:19.210 --> 01:44:20.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: But good hearing your voice, as always.
[01:44:22.170 --> 01:44:23.750]  [SPEAKER_06]: Have a wonderful evening, folks.
[01:44:24.130 --> 01:44:24.390]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:44:24.590 --> 01:44:25.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: You take care.
[01:44:26.390 --> 01:44:27.190]  [SPEAKER_11]: You too, Bobson.
[01:44:27.610 --> 01:44:31.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that is Bobson from Bulgaria joining us on the telephone.
[01:44:31.790 --> 01:44:35.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: And what do you think of what we just learned here?
[01:44:35.290 --> 01:44:36.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's very weird.
[01:44:37.210 --> 01:44:38.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: You get a busy signal.
[01:44:38.750 --> 01:44:39.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just tried it on my cell phone.
[01:44:39.990 --> 01:44:41.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: You get a busy signal when you call the phone.
[01:44:42.090 --> 01:44:46.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: But caller ID still gets passed along on the TV set.
[01:44:46.610 --> 01:44:50.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: Now, I can tell you, this is a cable phone.
[01:44:50.470 --> 01:44:51.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's tied into the cable company.
[01:44:51.950 --> 01:44:53.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's why it shows up on the TV set.
[01:44:54.190 --> 01:44:59.390]  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think basically that's what happens.
[01:44:59.610 --> 01:45:00.990]  [SPEAKER_07]: We're not writing down numbers.
[01:45:01.150 --> 01:45:01.850]  [SPEAKER_07]: No, we're not writing down numbers.
[01:45:01.850 --> 01:45:02.590]  [SPEAKER_07]: Numbers do show up.
[01:45:02.730 --> 01:45:05.310]  [SPEAKER_07]: We won't say anything descriptive about any of these numbers.
[01:45:05.310 --> 01:45:08.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: You can block your number, and we won't see it.
[01:45:08.490 --> 01:45:17.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: But as I also mentioned, your phone number is passed along in some sense because we had personalized ringing turned on on a particular phone number.
[01:45:17.870 --> 01:45:18.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: We blocked that phone number.
[01:45:19.130 --> 01:45:20.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: We still got the personalized ring.
[01:45:21.050 --> 01:45:23.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: So that means that information was passed along.
[01:45:24.130 --> 01:45:25.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, I'm going to turn that down a bit.
[01:45:25.930 --> 01:45:26.230]  [SPEAKER_07]: I didn't pick up.
[01:45:26.230 --> 01:45:27.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: I thought you picked up.
[01:45:27.450 --> 01:45:27.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:45:29.450 --> 01:45:32.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: How am I supposed to know when you pick up if you don't tell me you picked up?
[01:45:32.290 --> 01:45:33.590]  [SPEAKER_07]: I got a lot of responsibilities here.
[01:45:33.590 --> 01:45:35.610]  [SPEAKER_07]: Pick up the phone rings.
[01:45:35.750 --> 01:45:36.030]  [SPEAKER_07]: Pick it up.
[01:45:36.110 --> 01:45:36.790]  [SPEAKER_07]: What was the number?
[01:45:37.570 --> 01:45:40.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: The number is 802-321-4225.
[01:45:42.010 --> 01:45:43.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: 802-321-HACK.
[01:45:44.610 --> 01:45:46.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: And we're not blaming Google for this.
[01:45:46.430 --> 01:45:52.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's the Google number because we tested it on the actual number, and this is what happened.
[01:45:52.190 --> 01:45:54.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: So it's something involving the cable company.
[01:45:54.310 --> 01:45:55.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: That much I do now.
[01:45:55.590 --> 01:45:56.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm going to look into this a little bit more.
[01:45:59.270 --> 01:45:59.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: Gosh.
[01:46:00.030 --> 01:46:01.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: Should we wait for one more phone call?
[01:46:01.350 --> 01:46:03.330]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is the longest one we've done yet, I think.
[01:46:04.270 --> 01:46:05.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: You guys look tired.
[01:46:06.310 --> 01:46:07.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm sitting there in the Coliseum.
[01:46:09.270 --> 01:46:10.610]  [SPEAKER_11]: We always look tired.
[01:46:11.390 --> 01:46:11.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh-huh.
[01:46:13.470 --> 01:46:14.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Okay, there's the phone.
[01:46:14.950 --> 01:46:17.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: Let's hit one, and we're going to pick up the phone now.
[01:46:17.910 --> 01:46:18.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Good evening.
[01:46:18.870 --> 01:46:19.730]  I wanted to take this call.
[01:46:21.010 --> 01:46:21.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:46:21.690 --> 01:46:22.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: So that's Google telling us that.
[01:46:22.810 --> 01:46:23.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hello.
[01:46:23.010 --> 01:46:24.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're on Off The Hook Overtime.
[01:46:26.090 --> 01:46:26.710]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, hi.
[01:46:26.870 --> 01:46:28.130]  [SPEAKER_04]: I have a trivia question.
[01:46:29.230 --> 01:46:33.970]  [SPEAKER_04]: Did John Perry Barlow ever speak at Hope, and was he ever a guest on Off The Hook?
[01:46:34.370 --> 01:46:37.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: John Perry Barlow was, in fact, a guest on Off The Hook.
[01:46:37.490 --> 01:46:38.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: In fact, well, actually, you know what?
[01:46:39.450 --> 01:46:40.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Maybe it wasn't Off The Hook.
[01:46:40.630 --> 01:46:43.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: It might have been a different show I did on WBAI.
[01:46:43.990 --> 01:47:00.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: If you look at the Off The Hook archives, though, you'll see, I think it was 1990, where he did a late-night show, and I happen to know that he stayed on and was also a guest on the show that followed us, which happened to be a Grateful Dead show.
[01:47:00.950 --> 01:47:06.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: And since he was a lyricist for the Grateful Dead, I don't know if the recording of that exists, but the recording on our end exists.
[01:47:07.030 --> 01:47:09.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: He was not a speaker at Hope, though.
[01:47:10.470 --> 01:47:10.870]  Oh.
[01:47:11.050 --> 01:47:11.930]  [SPEAKER_12]: I wish he had been.
[01:47:12.150 --> 01:47:13.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: Do you still have the tape?
[01:47:13.150 --> 01:47:17.470]  [SPEAKER_04]: Do you still have the tape of the show, of the interview that he did with your program?
[01:47:17.470 --> 01:47:23.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes, that is online on 2600.com/offthehook, and just go to, I think it's 1990.
[01:47:24.330 --> 01:47:26.390]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's one of those late-night shows.
[01:47:26.490 --> 01:47:27.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: It might have been called The Fifth Corner.
[01:47:28.810 --> 01:47:29.630]  [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, okay.
[01:47:29.710 --> 01:47:30.490]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, that's great.
[01:47:30.630 --> 01:47:33.210]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's great, because he's one of my heroes.
[01:47:33.610 --> 01:47:34.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: He was an amazing person.
[01:47:35.750 --> 01:47:36.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, he was.
[01:47:36.970 --> 01:47:53.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: He once described New York as the capital of experiences, and I've been thinking about that a lot with the pandemic, because unfortunately, a lot of great stores and non-for-profit and cultural institutions have had to shut down, you know, because of the pandemic,
[01:47:53.790 --> 01:47:59.390]  [SPEAKER_04]: and I hope that some of them can reopen when life returns to normal, if it ever does.
[01:47:59.610 --> 01:48:04.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, it will, and I hope they do, and if they are around, we can still support them.
[01:48:04.610 --> 01:48:12.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: If they're open, you know, if your favorite restaurant doesn't let people go inside, you can still do takeout and support them that way.
[01:48:12.090 --> 01:48:17.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: There are many places that we've been in touch with that are surviving, because people care about them.
[01:48:17.230 --> 01:48:17.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: Rob, go ahead.
[01:48:18.970 --> 01:48:35.690]  [SPEAKER_11]: I just took a look, and if you go to the Off The Hook archive on 2600.com and look for the May 17th, 1990 episode, it's an edition of The Fifth Corner, and the guests are John Perry Barlow, and Steve Jackson as well.
[01:48:35.970 --> 01:48:36.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: How about that?
[01:48:37.210 --> 01:48:45.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: That was right before the EFF was founded, because the Steve Jackson Games raid was one of the things that inspired the Electronic Frontier Foundation to be formed.
[01:48:46.610 --> 01:48:47.290]  [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, wow.
[01:48:47.410 --> 01:48:48.830]  [SPEAKER_11]: It's a three-part episode, a lot going on.
[01:48:49.770 --> 01:48:53.870]  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm really glad that you got to speak to him, because he was a fascinating guy.
[01:48:53.990 --> 01:48:54.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: He really was.
[01:48:54.950 --> 01:48:56.110]  [SPEAKER_12]: He was a lot of fun to hang out with, too.
[01:48:57.350 --> 01:48:58.370]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right, thank you for that call.
[01:48:58.570 --> 01:49:01.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: You guys have a happy new year.
[01:49:01.880 --> 01:49:02.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: You too.
[01:49:02.300 --> 01:49:02.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: See you next year.
[01:49:02.920 --> 01:49:03.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: We will see you next year.
[01:49:03.870 --> 01:49:05.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're in two weeks on the OffTheHook.
[01:49:06.170 --> 01:49:06.640]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:49:06.760 --> 01:49:08.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's going to do it for us tonight.
[01:49:08.330 --> 01:49:10.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: Any last words for 2020?
[01:49:10.640 --> 01:49:11.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: And keep it clean, guys?
[01:49:12.790 --> 01:49:15.000]  [SPEAKER_11]: I'm going to kick you right in the zeros on the way out.
[01:49:15.600 --> 01:49:16.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:49:16.520 --> 01:49:17.100]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well said.
[01:49:18.480 --> 01:49:19.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: All right.
[01:49:19.060 --> 01:49:20.680]  [SPEAKER_12]: As always, it's been a blast.
[01:49:20.950 --> 01:49:22.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: Look forward to seeing you all in person.
[01:49:22.640 --> 01:49:24.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that day will come.
[01:49:27.100 --> 01:49:27.760]  [SPEAKER_11]: It will.
[01:49:27.980 --> 01:49:28.290]  [SPEAKER_11]: It will.
[01:49:28.830 --> 01:49:29.920]  [SPEAKER_11]: Next year in Leipzig.
[01:49:32.290 --> 01:49:35.760]  [SPEAKER_11]: And we wish the happiest new year possible to all of you out there.
[01:49:37.040 --> 01:49:38.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: And now I will click end stream.
[01:49:40.380 --> 01:49:42.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: And now I will click end to confirm.
[01:49:42.760 --> 01:49:42.830]  [SPEAKER_12]: See you next year.
[01:49:42.880 --> 01:49:43.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm going to check out.