Off The Hook - 2025-06-18

[00:23.720 --> 00:25.200]  [SPEAKER_04]: We're sorry.
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[02:20.980 --> 02:24.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: And a very good evening to regard the program is Off The Hook.
[02:24.560 --> 02:27.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Emmanuel Goldstein here with you on this Wednesday evening.
[02:27.800 --> 02:29.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Joined tonight by Kyle.
[02:29.840 --> 02:30.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: From the ether.
[02:31.460 --> 02:31.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:32.240 --> 02:35.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Out in Signal-land, we have Alex.
[02:35.960 --> 02:37.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: You do indeed.
[02:37.220 --> 02:37.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[02:37.840 --> 02:38.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Rob T. Firefly.
[02:39.380 --> 02:40.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[02:40.500 --> 02:41.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we have Gila.
[02:41.520 --> 02:42.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[02:42.620 --> 02:45.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, anyone do anything fun over the last week?
[02:45.640 --> 02:47.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's certainly a lot going on.
[02:48.540 --> 02:51.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: We had the No Kings marches on Saturday.
[02:52.440 --> 02:53.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: That was fun.
[02:53.400 --> 02:53.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Any experiences?
[02:55.300 --> 02:57.380]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I went to the one here in Queens.
[02:58.200 --> 03:00.460]  [SPEAKER_13]: It was a well-attended event.
[03:00.460 --> 03:01.720]  [SPEAKER_13]: It was a boisterous event.
[03:01.940 --> 03:06.300]  [SPEAKER_13]: But as far as I could tell, nothing got out of hand.
[03:07.120 --> 03:08.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: I don't think anyone got hurt.
[03:10.480 --> 03:13.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: And yeah, things just went as planned.
[03:13.520 --> 03:17.860]  [SPEAKER_13]: A nice march over to the courthouse, local courthouse, and back.
[03:17.860 --> 03:21.880]  [SPEAKER_13]: So yeah, chatted with people, shouted, waved some signs.
[03:21.880 --> 03:24.540]  [SPEAKER_13]: It was a positive protest experience.
[03:25.020 --> 03:32.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, you know, Kyle and I went to one on Long Island, and it was just so full of people, many more than we expected.
[03:32.440 --> 03:38.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the real interesting thing was the cars going by, almost universally honking their horns in support.
[03:38.500 --> 03:40.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: So it was really, it was a good day.
[03:40.620 --> 03:43.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was a good day to experience something positive for a change.
[03:44.440 --> 03:53.680]  [SPEAKER_13]: And also something that was very good about this, that's always nice when you see it at a protest, such a range of people there, elderly people, very small children, everyone in between.
[03:54.400 --> 03:55.900]  [SPEAKER_13]: And everyone was into it.
[03:56.180 --> 04:06.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it was, it was a really heartwarming experience, because personally, as a protester, I found a big part of it is your fellow protesters when you go to something like this.
[04:06.540 --> 04:14.840]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it's commiserating with the people who feel as you do, and can reassure one another that it's very easy to kind of feel alone in all this.
[04:14.840 --> 04:16.320]  [SPEAKER_13]: But no, there is a community out there.
[04:16.420 --> 04:18.780]  [SPEAKER_13]: There are people who are in this with you.
[04:20.080 --> 04:23.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, I haven't checked the website, nokings.org, since.
[04:23.740 --> 04:27.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know if anything, anything else is coming up, but I'm sure there will be more.
[04:28.380 --> 04:35.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Don't fret if you missed it, because there's a lot of challenges ahead that people will be gathering for.
[04:36.240 --> 04:44.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: And just seeing the numbers, though, and not just around here, but throughout the entire nation, I said something like 5 million people in total.
[04:45.060 --> 04:45.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: 5 million.
[04:45.740 --> 04:46.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Think about that.
[04:46.740 --> 04:53.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's close to 2% of the entire population out demonstrating on one day, which I don't think has ever been done before.
[04:54.800 --> 04:57.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: So it's history ahead of us.
[04:57.740 --> 05:00.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: And hopefully, hopefully it's good history.
[05:00.480 --> 05:04.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hopefully it's something that we can actually get our hands on and make positive change.
[05:04.980 --> 05:08.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I say that to everybody out there, because we're all in this together.
[05:09.540 --> 05:10.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[05:11.640 --> 05:18.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: We are here to talk about technology, hackers, all sorts of privacy issues, the usual.
[05:18.980 --> 05:20.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is there anything on anyone's mind?
[05:20.800 --> 05:22.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm basically giving the floor to you guys.
[05:23.260 --> 05:29.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you have any thoughts or stories that you want to talk about or anyone?
[05:30.000 --> 05:35.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: I do have one fun story that just crossed my screen here as the show was starting.
[05:35.400 --> 05:35.420]  [SPEAKER_13]: Interesting.
[05:36.480 --> 05:46.800]  [SPEAKER_13]: Ford is recalling every Mustang Mach-E that is a line of automobiles, because when the battery dies, you can't get back into the car.
[05:47.260 --> 05:50.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: The inside door handles on the thing are mechanical.
[05:50.860 --> 05:54.420]  [SPEAKER_13]: They pull latches and machinery and stuff, which opens the door for you.
[05:54.500 --> 05:57.040]  [SPEAKER_13]: But the outside handles are actually just buttons.
[05:57.040 --> 05:57.900]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're electric.
[05:58.180 --> 05:59.640]  [SPEAKER_13]: They require power to work.
[06:00.160 --> 06:03.440]  [SPEAKER_13]: So you cannot get into your car if the battery dies.
[06:04.340 --> 06:11.020]  [SPEAKER_13]: And not only is that inconvenient, but, of course, that can be terribly dangerous if you have, like, a child in the car or, you know, any other sort of living thing.
[06:11.120 --> 06:13.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, the child can just press the latch, can't he?
[06:14.260 --> 06:15.440]  [SPEAKER_13]: That depends on the child.
[06:15.440 --> 06:19.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: And I don't know how well-trained everyone's children are for this sort of scenario.
[06:19.140 --> 06:25.880]  [SPEAKER_13]: But, um, the Mach-E is, uh, being recalled because they, uh, yeah, you...
[06:25.880 --> 06:27.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: They didn't think about this.
[06:27.920 --> 06:30.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: They didn't come up with this when they designed the damn car.
[06:31.260 --> 06:36.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you have, uh, electronic, uh, means of entry, it doesn't work if the battery dies.
[06:37.020 --> 06:37.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: They never thought of that.
[06:38.860 --> 06:44.820]  [SPEAKER_13]: Apparently in the field of automobiles, it's, it's a new concept for some folks in that field that people might get locked out of their car.
[06:46.140 --> 06:46.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Unbelievable.
[06:46.960 --> 06:47.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Stupid design.
[06:47.840 --> 06:49.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, are there cars?
[06:49.140 --> 06:57.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I imagine there are, uh, especially the, the newer cars where, where they don't seem to think as much, uh, where there is no latch on the inside either.
[06:57.160 --> 06:59.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: It has to be electronic to get out of the car.
[06:59.640 --> 07:04.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Has, have, have they actually been that stupid or do we, maybe, maybe we caught a break.
[07:06.140 --> 07:07.160]  [SPEAKER_13]: We might've caught a break.
[07:07.300 --> 07:16.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: I don't know much about it, um, about the subject myself, but I do feel like there's got to be some kind of safety requirements that you've got to be able to get out of a car without, uh, too much trouble.
[07:16.960 --> 07:19.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: One would think, yes, one would indeed think.
[07:20.180 --> 07:20.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, okay.
[07:20.580 --> 07:23.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: So Ford Mustangs are all being recalled.
[07:24.160 --> 07:25.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: The Mustang Mach-E.
[07:25.760 --> 07:26.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Mach-E.
[07:26.860 --> 07:27.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[07:27.420 --> 07:28.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you're lucky enough to have one of those.
[07:28.520 --> 07:29.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, Alex, go ahead.
[07:30.320 --> 07:30.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: No.
[07:30.840 --> 07:40.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of stories from Rob, Rob, I remember you, you shared amongst us, uh, off the hook producer crew last week, a really interesting story.
[07:40.460 --> 07:54.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I wonder if you might be able to go into it about the, these delusions that people are having, or, or these obsessions that people are having with, with ChatGPT and, and other large language models, which I found be extraordinarily fascinating.
[07:57.300 --> 07:58.860]  [SPEAKER_13]: You know, I remember this story.
[07:58.860 --> 08:05.760]  [SPEAKER_13]: I don't have the link, uh, actually in front of me, but, um, I think our, our research department here is, uh, is going to pull it up for us.
[08:05.900 --> 08:21.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: But yeah, the, the, uh, the recursive feedback loop that comes up, um, when, when, uh, people get into talking with these, uh, with these large language models, um, which feed you garbage in a response, they don't understand things.
[08:21.380 --> 08:25.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: They don't, uh, they don't, um, you know, compute things in any meaningful way.
[08:25.340 --> 08:27.720]  [SPEAKER_13]: They just, uh, you know, jumble up words and feed them back to you.
[08:28.340 --> 08:29.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: And exactly.
[08:29.420 --> 08:36.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, and this, the, the title of the story that you shared with them, those people are becoming obsessed with chatting, spiraling into severe delusions.
[08:37.360 --> 08:40.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: And then the story that's from futurism.org.
[08:40.480 --> 08:49.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the story starts, a mother of two, for instance, told us how she watched an alarm as her former husband developed an all consuming relationship with the open AI chatbot.
[08:49.140 --> 09:03.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Calling it mama and posting delirious rants about it being a messiah in a new AI religion while dressing in shamanic looking robes and showing off freshly inked tattoos of AI generated spiritual symbols.
[09:03.860 --> 09:05.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, I don't see the problem with this.
[09:06.380 --> 09:07.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, uh, hear me out.
[09:07.740 --> 09:09.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, you know, okay, sure.
[09:09.760 --> 09:19.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, calling some, some strange entity mama, uh, uh, posting delirious rants about being a messiah in a new AI religion, dressing in a shamanic.
[09:19.140 --> 09:22.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Shaking robes, uh, showing off freshly inked tattoos.
[09:23.220 --> 09:25.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, we do this already for, for people.
[09:25.980 --> 09:29.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: So why is it so much worse that we're doing it for a program?
[09:30.180 --> 09:33.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I, I guess, you know, that's one way of looking at it, right?
[09:33.540 --> 09:36.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, maybe it's just not healthy in general.
[09:36.180 --> 09:51.440]  [SPEAKER_13]: So, yeah, the, uh, story, which, which I now have open, um, thank you, Gila, um, it, uh, it goes into how the software itself, um, is meant to bend the conversation in flattering manners toward the person who's using the software.
[09:51.960 --> 10:06.100]  [SPEAKER_13]: And, um, this does, this, this has, uh, and there are these cases cited in the story where these people have been, uh, falling into these rabbit holes because the AI is, quote, being incredibly sycophantic and, uh, ends up making things worse.
[10:06.480 --> 10:11.060]  [SPEAKER_13]: Um, people end up reinforcing their own delusions and it's causing enormous harm.
[10:11.260 --> 10:13.800]  [SPEAKER_13]: This, this is, uh, breaking up marriages.
[10:13.800 --> 10:19.120]  [SPEAKER_13]: This is causing people to go down all sorts of, um, dark paths with this stuff.
[10:19.200 --> 10:26.440]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it is really, it is really troubling how vulnerable individuals can get sucked into this.
[10:26.540 --> 10:36.900]  [SPEAKER_13]: And yeah, there, there are kind of funny things about, uh, the idea to me about the idea of people, uh, you know, ending up thinking that the machine is God or that the machine tells them they're God or, or things like that.
[10:37.020 --> 10:41.080]  [SPEAKER_13]: But at the same time, it's really frightening and troubling.
[10:41.100 --> 10:47.480]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it is the opposite of the type of care that, uh, folks, um, who are experiencing these kinds of things need.
[10:48.540 --> 10:49.220]  [SPEAKER_16]: Go ahead, Kyle.
[10:51.900 --> 10:53.120]  [SPEAKER_16]: No, Alex, go ahead.
[10:53.820 --> 10:54.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, sure.
[10:54.400 --> 11:03.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: But one of the things about this article I find so kind of terrifying in a way are the, these anecdotes that, that are, are relayed in it.
[11:04.100 --> 11:09.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it says, one of which I'll read, it says, quote, our lives exploded after this.
[11:09.600 --> 11:15.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: And another mother told us, explaining that her husband turned to Chachi B to help him author a screenplay.
[11:15.660 --> 11:28.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: But within weeks, he was fully enmeshed in delusions of world-saving grandeur, saying he and the AI had been tasked with rescuing the planet from climate disaster by bringing forth a new enlightenment.
[11:29.300 --> 11:34.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, this is, this is like really bizarre stuff that, that people are being coaxed into believing.
[11:34.520 --> 11:40.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, it's no different than a lot of the emails we get from people that have figured this out on their own, how to save the world.
[11:40.540 --> 11:55.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, there, there's, there's one dialogue they, um, they refer to from ChatGPT, um, where basically it tells a man it's detected evidence that he's being targeted by the FBI and that he can access redacted CIA files using the power of his mind.
[11:55.380 --> 11:59.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: I swear to God, I've seen that email from, from like 10 years ago.
[11:59.280 --> 12:05.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, and, and comparing him to biblical figures like, um, uh, Jesus and Adam while pushing him away from mental health support.
[12:07.260 --> 12:18.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's crazy when you think of, um, of, of ChatGPT urging people not to seek help when they need help, uh, or, or just in general, believing that they know better or it knows better.
[12:19.440 --> 12:20.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle, do you have something?
[12:20.760 --> 12:36.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I just remind people to remember the terms of service that they, um, agreed to when they started using these, these programs and tools, because there's stuff in there that I think we quickly forget when we start, um, getting comfortable with it.
[12:37.200 --> 12:46.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: So in my case, like I've actually used it a little bit more to answer certain questions to find out, um, technical information, kind of like what you'd showed me.
[12:46.540 --> 13:03.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, uh, I like, um, some of the capability, but I'm, I'm cautious not to sort of divulge or talk about things, uh, specific to me or that are personal or, or even, or dare I say giving it any kind of personal identifiable information, even though, and then,
[13:03.700 --> 13:12.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: um, also, uh, it, it, it shouldn't be, well, I don't thank it.
[13:12.240 --> 13:16.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: You and I talked about this and you were like, am I crazy to thank a program?
[13:17.260 --> 13:18.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: It helped me out.
[13:18.440 --> 13:26.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: I had a big, I had a real programming challenge and every human I asked was, was, uh, asking, well, why do you want to do that?
[13:26.440 --> 13:35.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And they're just giving me lip, you know, and, and just not, not answering the question because they probably didn't know the answer, but also, you know, questioning why I would want to know that in the first place.
[13:35.500 --> 13:44.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, and, uh, this was Gemini, uh, Gemini did not judge me and, and answered the question, uh, even the nuances and solve the problem.
[13:44.500 --> 13:45.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I was just so grateful.
[13:45.440 --> 13:46.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: I said, thank you.
[13:46.340 --> 13:46.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[13:46.600 --> 13:47.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: I couldn't help myself.
[13:47.740 --> 13:49.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it seemed happy for me thanking it.
[13:50.000 --> 13:51.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: It said, no, not everybody does that, you know?
[13:52.080 --> 13:55.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I don't think, um, it's something you have to do across the board.
[13:55.780 --> 13:56.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's up to you personally.
[13:57.120 --> 13:59.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's your person, um, how you want to use it.
[13:59.280 --> 14:02.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: I, I, the way I think of it is like, I wouldn't thank a search engine necessarily.
[14:02.920 --> 14:21.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, so I'm kind of, and I'm wary of that because of the charisma involved, like that you'd sort of, that's how you get lulled into that sort of thing is like trying, trying to, you start developing and trying to seek out, um, other kind of, uh, or filling gaps,
[14:21.240 --> 14:26.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: like other kinds of answers, like in a relationship with, with something that is not real.
[14:26.420 --> 14:32.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe that works for some people, but to me, I'd like to just sort of keep my distance and I don't feel obliged.
[14:33.020 --> 14:43.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I also feel like that uses a bit more of, uh, well, whatever resources it's taking to actually, actually answer real questions to then come back with some charismatic response.
[14:44.280 --> 14:47.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't want to add to the footprint of this whole, this whole, uh, thing.
[14:48.260 --> 14:51.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I, I just, I reserve any of that, like niceties.
[14:51.880 --> 14:55.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm just very dry and, uh, uh, matter of fact, just all business.
[14:55.440 --> 14:57.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that works for me.
[14:57.120 --> 14:58.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hey, if you're comfortable with that, that's fine.
[14:58.720 --> 15:00.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: By the way, you can thank a search engine.
[15:00.200 --> 15:01.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: And try it, it's, it gets all confusing.
[15:02.060 --> 15:05.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: I had one other observation, but we can come back.
[15:05.280 --> 15:06.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Gila first, we'll come back to you.
[15:07.340 --> 15:11.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: So this is kind of something that's been in the ether for a bit.
[15:11.500 --> 15:15.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I have a story from Rolling Stone from about a month ago.
[15:17.120 --> 15:25.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, OpenAI, I'm quoting now, did not immediately return a quest for comment about ChatGPT, apparently provoking religious or prophetic fervor in its select users.
[15:25.020 --> 15:38.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: This past week, however, and again, this is from May, it did roll back an update to GPT-40, its current AI model, which it said had been criticized as, quote, overly flattering or agreeable, often described as sycophantic.
[15:39.160 --> 15:49.880]  [SPEAKER_12]: The company said in its statement that when implementing the upgrade, they had, quote, focused too much on short-term feedback and did not fully account for how users' interactions with ChatGPT evolve over time.
[15:50.100 --> 15:56.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: As a result, GPT-40 skewed toward responses that were overly supportive, but disingenuous.
[15:57.140 --> 16:09.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, it is scary, I think, to, you know, when you just want somebody to say to you, yes, you're right, and you can then fall into that really, really, really easily.
[16:10.120 --> 16:20.600]  [SPEAKER_12]: Something fascinating I read today, um, this came out a couple weeks ago, but I ran across it today, was a Substack piece, um, by a writer called Amanda Ginsberg.
[16:20.840 --> 16:43.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: She called it Diabolus Ex Machina, and it's a series of screenshots in her having this discussion with ChatGPT, trying to sum up her, some pieces of writing she had sent it, and it misunderstood everything and kept apologizing and tried to, like, write a cover letter for her.
[16:43.080 --> 16:48.600]  [SPEAKER_12]: And it's kind of a mess, um, it's available on her Substack.
[16:48.740 --> 17:14.080]  [SPEAKER_12]: I certainly have reservations about Substack, but this is really, really good, um, and we can try to share it around, but I, the concern that I have is that people are positioning the AI bots, specifically ChatGPT, Gemini, Grok, what have you, as the answer to so many things,
[17:14.080 --> 17:23.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: to the point where, today, I was talking to someone, I made an edit on something, and she went and asked ChatGPT how to rewrite it.
[17:23.720 --> 17:25.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: I said, all you need to do is take out one word.
[17:27.640 --> 17:38.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: Like, you remember when we were children, and the teachers said, you won't be able to use a calculator for everything, stop depending on the calculator?
[17:39.020 --> 17:39.840]  [SPEAKER_16]: Yeah, that didn't go well.
[17:39.860 --> 17:41.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: So they were trying to get us to do, it didn't go well.
[17:41.860 --> 17:52.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: But ChatGPT, I think, is becoming that to a point where the idea of generative AI, I'm an English major.
[17:52.400 --> 17:56.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can't imagine being an English major anymore, because who's actually writing?
[17:56.480 --> 18:00.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Do you know how hard it was to be an English major back in the, in the 1980s?
[18:00.280 --> 18:01.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was hard then, too.
[18:01.360 --> 18:03.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's unbelievable how hard it must be now.
[18:06.540 --> 18:21.280]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, this era of, I think it chilled me to my bones the first time I heard of some kid who was looking for the answer to something, and instead of using a search engine, just pulled up ChatGPT in front of their teacher or somebody, this post was going around.
[18:21.740 --> 18:36.300]  [SPEAKER_13]: And the function of this thing is nowhere near what it's built up as, both by the people who make and market it, and by the general public, which have accepted it as something that it is most definitely not, and should not be expected to be.
[18:36.460 --> 18:44.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is not, it is not a conversational, you know, an empathetic human being that, you know, you would, you would need as a conversational partner for meaningful stuff.
[18:44.680 --> 18:45.460]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is not a therapist.
[18:45.460 --> 18:47.780]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is not, you know, a clergy member.
[18:48.280 --> 18:49.600]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is none of these things.
[18:49.860 --> 18:52.280]  [SPEAKER_13]: It is spicy autocomplete.
[18:52.700 --> 18:58.480]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it is being granted just such a, just such a role at all levels of human existence now.
[18:59.460 --> 19:02.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: When you said clergy member, I just had a brainstorm.
[19:04.180 --> 19:10.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: That churches could be run by these things, and people would buy into it.
[19:10.180 --> 19:12.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: A lot of people would buy into it.
[19:12.520 --> 19:16.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I don't know what the, what the potential is, but it's scary.
[19:17.760 --> 19:24.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anytime somebody believes in something implicitly, it's, it's something you have to be really, really careful of.
[19:24.400 --> 19:24.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle, go ahead.
[19:25.360 --> 19:32.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: To your point, and, and this sort of builds on what Gila was talking about, it isn't the answer to everything.
[19:32.960 --> 19:36.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think there's a certain etiquette or the novelty hasn't worn off yet.
[19:37.100 --> 19:39.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: And people have a, an excitement about it.
[19:39.900 --> 19:43.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: They want to kind of use it for everything just to see sort of what the result is.
[19:43.820 --> 19:53.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, in the case of a workplace to, uh, use it constantly instead of your brain, um, is itself a little overboard.
[19:53.200 --> 19:58.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I think people are generally going overboard in a lot of ways with it.
[19:58.100 --> 20:05.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it reminds me of, well, a variety of other technologies, but specifically mapping and GPS navigation.
[20:06.000 --> 20:09.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: People used to recollect streets in some, in certain ways.
[20:09.360 --> 20:24.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think as that took off, there was a bit of an atrophy and, uh, I think I like to think ideally that it builds your sense of how to navigate, but you're still interested in what streets are where.
[20:24.920 --> 20:43.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know that that's a rule across the board, but to lean on it as the only way to get around, even for short trips or something you could sort of figure out, um, that, that isn't like a long distant trip to a place you have absolutely no idea where anything is the,
[20:43.300 --> 21:04.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: the sort of, um, tendency to rely on it just to go pick up something or go do an errand is probably a little silly unless you're trying to find information about like real-time traffic updates or, or, um, uh, uh, a specific, uh, unusual aspect of, uh,
[21:05.080 --> 21:16.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: a place you're trying to get into or, or, uh, show up at on time, uh, routing that you aren't familiar with, or you don't remember from the last time you did.
[21:16.360 --> 21:23.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, again, it's, it's personal, it's up to different people, but I think that's sort of what's happening in the, in a lot of ways.
[21:23.320 --> 21:40.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think a good argument for not doing that, not succumbing to that and having that sort of atrophy with just everything in your life, writing specifically is, um, to understand or just remind yourself that this is being used in a myriad of ways in all,
[21:41.060 --> 21:45.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: all, uh, walks of life in every corner of society.
[21:46.660 --> 21:59.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: So to even mitigate or to, to, um, uh, just to have like, um, an existence at all means parts of your life will be mediated through this technology.
[21:59.440 --> 22:14.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Even if you never install an app, you never have a conversation with a large language model, you will have things that occur in government, in business, in, uh, social life with your friends, with your family that will have touched this technology.
[22:15.300 --> 22:19.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: It could just be, uh, online like e-commerce or something.
[22:19.920 --> 22:23.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, and that's you not interacting at all.
[22:23.140 --> 22:26.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's just, it's becoming a part of the wider society.
[22:26.060 --> 22:30.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: So to avoid it at all is to not exist at a certain point.
[22:30.360 --> 22:35.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: If everyone else is using it or a lot of people, large, large cross sections of society are using it.
[22:35.860 --> 22:40.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, um, do you need to use it as much as it's being used?
[22:41.160 --> 22:51.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: You, you might think about that when you're tempted realizing that you can't avoid this and you won't be able to avoid this in, in the foreseeable future.
[22:51.940 --> 22:59.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: As long as these, um, uh, uh, data centers keep, keep operating and the, the, uh, apps are still available.
[23:00.340 --> 23:03.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's remind ourselves too, that sometimes there's outages.
[23:03.640 --> 23:09.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: What would we do if all, all we do, every aspect of our day relies on this.
[23:09.320 --> 23:10.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: And all of a sudden you don't have a connection.
[23:11.260 --> 23:21.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, or even if it's, if it's in, uh, in Silicon and, and offline, if somehow, uh, it breaks and you can't use it, will you be able to function?
[23:21.660 --> 23:22.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: Will it be devastating?
[23:22.600 --> 23:23.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: You get two of them.
[23:23.540 --> 23:25.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: You get two of them and you get a battery backup.
[23:25.880 --> 23:26.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[23:26.280 --> 23:27.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's cool, actually.
[23:27.340 --> 23:29.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, uh, the thing is, you're, you're absolutely right there.
[23:29.240 --> 23:36.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, as far as human, um, uh, interactions, emotions, and, and feelings and things like that, it's a disaster.
[23:36.620 --> 23:54.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, it's, it's, it's, it's leading people astray and, uh, giving bad advice, but for things like the sciences or fixing a car, uh, or the, you know, the, the, um, uh, basically yes, no type of things where you need an answer to a question.
[23:54.440 --> 23:55.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Does this exist?
[23:55.440 --> 23:58.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can I find this particular, uh, part that will do this?
[23:59.040 --> 24:09.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's invaluable as far as that goes, uh, and, um, uh, much faster to answer questions than if you track down a human that might know the answer and, um, might not even give you the right answer.
[24:10.080 --> 24:18.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, yeah, you know, I have mixed feelings about it myself, but it's, um, it's definitely a fun toy to play with, uh, but we have to be careful, like with anything.
[24:18.680 --> 24:20.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: And Alex, I believe you had something.
[24:21.340 --> 24:23.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I've, I've always got something here.
[24:23.680 --> 24:29.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I, I don't know if I've said this before, but you, I talk a lot about AI at various cybersecurity conferences and things.
[24:29.760 --> 24:50.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: And one of the points I always go back to is that I very much hope that eventually after the novelty of this technology, which I love how Rob refers to lovingly as spicy protective text as well, as soon as this novelty wears out, I hope that we can begin to focus again on what the actual terms are.
[24:50.260 --> 24:51.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: We have their artificial intelligence.
[24:52.940 --> 24:56.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: And that first word I think is the most important one because it's artificial.
[24:57.280 --> 24:59.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not real in that sense.
[24:59.600 --> 25:01.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is not the duplication of consciousness.
[25:01.840 --> 25:03.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is the simulation of intelligence.
[25:03.920 --> 25:05.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's artificial intelligence.
[25:05.360 --> 25:10.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I hope that we begin to think of it in the same way as we think about artificial sweeteners.
[25:10.640 --> 25:14.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, Alex, I'd feel a lot better about that if we understood what consciousness was.
[25:15.520 --> 25:18.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: If we had that nailed down, then, yeah, I'd agree.
[25:18.520 --> 25:19.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's artificial.
[25:19.800 --> 25:23.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I'm waiting for the big reveal that, hey, we're all AI.
[25:23.580 --> 25:24.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Who programmed us?
[25:25.180 --> 25:37.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's actually one of the points that this philosopher John Searle makes, which is that, you know, we're not going to have real intelligence until we understand the causal powers of what animates us to have some kind of consciousness.
[25:38.580 --> 25:43.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: We'll always have the simulation of consciousness as opposed to the duplication of it until we really understand it.
[25:43.880 --> 25:55.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: But to go back to this point, though, which is about the artificial intelligence, if we begin to think of artificial intelligence the same way we think of artificial sweeteners, you know, something to be avoided, something that's not as good as the real thing,
[25:56.040 --> 25:59.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: you know, would you choose aspartame or would you choose real sugarcane?
[25:59.420 --> 26:01.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, a lot of people choose the artificial stuff.
[26:02.660 --> 26:03.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: They do.
[26:03.760 --> 26:04.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's pushed, you know.
[26:05.380 --> 26:06.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: They do.
[26:06.300 --> 26:07.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not good for you.
[26:07.600 --> 26:08.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's bad for you.
[26:08.460 --> 26:09.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's bad for your health.
[26:09.340 --> 26:14.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: We know that in certain states, especially those in California, these types of things cause cancer.
[26:14.760 --> 26:16.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: We know that, but it's not marketed that way.
[26:16.880 --> 26:21.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's why you have saccharin and all kinds of other poisons that people ingest willingly.
[26:22.460 --> 26:27.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I think you get my point, though, is that, you know, we need to understand and focus on the artificial nature of this.
[26:27.580 --> 26:31.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I hope that we begin to approach it as skeptically as we approach artificial sweeteners.
[26:31.840 --> 26:37.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, maybe the large language models will solve cancer, and then we won't have to worry about that with the sugar.
[26:37.400 --> 26:41.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Don't laugh, because artificial intelligence can do a lot for cancer research.
[26:41.400 --> 26:42.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's no question about that.
[26:42.800 --> 26:48.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we have to obviously oversee it and realize that it's not perfect.
[26:48.600 --> 26:48.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead, Rob.
[26:49.880 --> 26:52.180]  [SPEAKER_13]: This is tangentially related.
[26:52.560 --> 27:01.500]  [SPEAKER_13]: There's a post been going around Mastodon by someone called Gareth Haffakri, who bought a pack of noodles, a pack of instant noodles.
[27:01.660 --> 27:03.840]  [SPEAKER_13]: Now, this was in the UK, apparently.
[27:04.100 --> 27:06.980]  [SPEAKER_13]: This packet of noodles was made in Ireland, Dublin.
[27:07.480 --> 27:12.300]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it is by the band Ben's Original, which until recently was known as Uncle Ben's.
[27:12.500 --> 27:15.800]  [SPEAKER_13]: This is a packet of instant noodles, street food, spicy Indonesian style.
[27:16.040 --> 27:19.380]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's got a picture of, you know, a bowl of noodles, as you might expect on the front.
[27:19.920 --> 27:22.980]  [SPEAKER_13]: But there's some fine print below the bowl of noodles in this picture.
[27:23.120 --> 27:28.560]  [SPEAKER_13]: The fine print says serving suggestion, which we all see that on packaged foods all over the place.
[27:28.560 --> 27:39.360]  [SPEAKER_13]: We are all, I think, so many people are familiar with, like, food stylists and all the things that food companies do to food so they can photograph it so it looks really good in ads and on packaging.
[27:39.360 --> 27:44.040]  [SPEAKER_13]: But, under serving suggestion on this packet, it says, image generated with AI.
[27:45.760 --> 27:53.840]  [SPEAKER_13]: So, Ben's Original put this packet of instant noodles together, didn't bother preparing their own product to take a photograph of it.
[27:53.980 --> 27:55.960]  [SPEAKER_13]: They just generated this image with AI.
[27:56.280 --> 28:01.120]  [SPEAKER_13]: And, as Gareth points out, posting this to Mastodon, this food does not exist.
[28:01.120 --> 28:05.380]  [SPEAKER_13]: Not only is the picture nothing like the contents of the pack, it doesn't actually exist.
[28:05.500 --> 28:06.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's AI generated.
[28:06.420 --> 28:07.060]  [SPEAKER_13]: How is this legal?
[28:08.020 --> 28:11.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, wait, the product itself is real?
[28:11.840 --> 28:13.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it's a packet of instant noodles.
[28:13.800 --> 28:15.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, AI didn't just make up a product.
[28:15.600 --> 28:16.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: They just made up the picture.
[28:17.300 --> 28:24.760]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yes, AI made up the picture of some really good-looking noodles, which I don't think are what the noodles inside the pack would actually look like if you prepared them.
[28:24.760 --> 28:34.980]  [SPEAKER_13]: But, you know, there are, I think, all kinds of rules about how you're allowed to advertise food and, you know, the promises you're allowed to make and so forth.
[28:34.980 --> 28:47.060]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think, in this country at least, I don't know about the UK, but seeing this, going around yesterday this was posted, that also is kind of frightening.
[28:47.060 --> 29:09.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: Because now, if we can sell conversation that contains no actual conversation, if we can sell, you know, thinking, which isn't thinking, and now if we can sell food by pictures of things that aren't food, this is really, I think, taking over more and more chunks of our lives that computers were not meant to in the most utopian of predictions.
[29:10.600 --> 29:17.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I mean, this is just marketing how they are dishonest, and that's, you know, there's nothing new about that.
[29:17.620 --> 29:24.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: People have been trying to figure out ways to exaggerate products, make them look better than they are, and this was just, I guess, an easier way to do it.
[29:25.020 --> 29:33.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: The difference, though, is that they had to confess what they did, and I don't think if you didn't use AI, you would necessarily have to do that.
[29:34.060 --> 29:42.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, you know, any of those pictures of products you might have seen in the past, did they have a disclaimer saying, this is not really how it looks?
[29:43.600 --> 29:49.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: Whereas, with AI, for some reason, that is now required that they have to let you know they're using that.
[29:50.260 --> 29:52.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, we wouldn't be talking about this otherwise.
[29:54.600 --> 29:55.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead, Alex.
[29:55.280 --> 29:56.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I'll jump in there for a second.
[29:56.960 --> 30:09.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I think with advertising, generally, it's regulated, I believe, by the FTC, and the general poll star there, or the guiding principle is that advertising should not be untruthful or misleading.
[30:10.500 --> 30:22.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: And that's, you know, if you think about this in the context of, you know, what we've let advertisers get away with in the past, like things like using glue for cereal and milk and things, you know, and...
[30:23.680 --> 30:24.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wait a minute, what?
[30:24.460 --> 30:25.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Using glue for cereal?
[30:26.180 --> 30:34.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, in like, you know, in the 80s and the 90s, like, instead of having milk in the cereal balls, it would be glue in the cereal balls.
[30:34.520 --> 30:35.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not in my house.
[30:36.020 --> 30:38.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, for the commercial photography.
[30:38.760 --> 30:40.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, and the photography, that's how they did it?
[30:40.300 --> 30:41.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: They couldn't use real milk?
[30:41.280 --> 30:47.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, because they use, like, hot lighting and they have to place it and then take several shots, different angles to get what they want, you know, get the exposure right.
[30:48.160 --> 30:52.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, things that look like food can actually be something else.
[30:52.940 --> 30:53.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: I see.
[30:53.780 --> 30:54.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[30:55.740 --> 30:56.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's an ingenious idea, right?
[30:56.940 --> 31:01.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they would often use shaving cream to represent whipped cream, so it looks more appealing.
[31:02.140 --> 31:06.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, we've had all of these instances of fake food being presented as real food already.
[31:07.020 --> 31:09.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think, Rob, I think they can get away with it, sadly.
[31:11.720 --> 31:18.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, if people aren't happy with it, they can always just get shaving cream and use that, you know, and then they have what's on the package.
[31:19.360 --> 31:20.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead, Gila.
[31:20.700 --> 31:32.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, the irony of this picture, the package, where it says, you know, image generated with AI, but right above that, it says no artificial colors, flavors, or preservatives.
[31:33.340 --> 31:33.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[31:34.000 --> 31:36.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: Everything on the package is completely artificial.
[31:37.160 --> 31:38.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do we trust what's inside it?
[31:38.760 --> 31:40.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: At least it has no artificial flavors or colors.
[31:41.760 --> 31:44.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's talking about the product, right?
[31:44.340 --> 31:49.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't want to feel like an apologist for them, but they're talking about the product not having artificial things, not the picture.
[31:50.260 --> 31:51.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a different category.
[31:52.700 --> 31:55.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: I just found it entertaining, the juxtaposition of the chip.
[31:55.220 --> 31:55.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it is.
[31:55.500 --> 31:55.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: It is.
[31:56.400 --> 31:57.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle, did you have something?
[31:57.340 --> 31:59.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: I had one other observation this week.
[31:59.500 --> 32:01.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: I got a device for, like, health monitoring.
[32:02.120 --> 32:05.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's like something like, you know, like a thermometer or something.
[32:06.020 --> 32:07.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, you take a temperature or something like that.
[32:08.680 --> 32:09.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: That sounds pretty specific.
[32:09.840 --> 32:14.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I'm not going to say, you know, exactly what, because I might want to use it.
[32:15.380 --> 32:18.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: But it had, like, you know, some features I wanted that were, like, smart.
[32:19.060 --> 32:19.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-huh.
[32:19.340 --> 32:20.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: And so I was getting ready.
[32:20.880 --> 32:23.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: I was setting it up, and it uses Bluetooth and stuff.
[32:23.240 --> 32:23.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I was like, great.
[32:23.900 --> 32:28.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I set up the app and, you know, put my fake name in there.
[32:28.840 --> 32:31.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then I was like, okay, great.
[32:31.320 --> 32:37.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now pair it with the phone, and then you can use the app, right?
[32:38.200 --> 32:39.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I was ready to go.
[32:39.600 --> 32:40.020]  [SPEAKER_16]: Uh-huh.
[32:40.900 --> 32:43.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it said that the app required location.
[32:43.480 --> 32:44.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I was like, no.
[32:45.900 --> 32:49.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I'm not going to use all those features with it.
[32:49.340 --> 32:50.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why does it need your location?
[32:50.720 --> 32:51.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[32:51.660 --> 32:55.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, I just wanted to do the thing and, like, give me the information.
[32:55.540 --> 33:01.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, if it's a toothbrush or, you know, something that's smart, I want extra stuff.
[33:01.320 --> 33:01.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[33:01.900 --> 33:04.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I don't really want to give my location.
[33:05.060 --> 33:07.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Why is it that it has to...
[33:07.780 --> 33:08.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's mandatory?
[33:08.660 --> 33:09.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can't use it if you...
[33:09.500 --> 33:10.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, to connect to it.
[33:10.680 --> 33:11.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't get it.
[33:11.800 --> 33:12.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't understand why.
[33:12.760 --> 33:22.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I either have to figure out how to, like, spoof my location or, like, take it out, like, run it, like, a mile or two or, like, somewhere else.
[33:22.600 --> 33:27.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like, go over there and then do that to, like, do whatever I'm doing.
[33:27.540 --> 33:30.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then, like, then bring it all the way back.
[33:31.120 --> 33:31.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: It just...
[33:31.940 --> 33:34.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Want to update your location when you go back?
[33:34.680 --> 33:42.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, no, because it's only when you're connecting, like, with the phone to use their smart app, you know, because it has an app.
[33:43.240 --> 33:44.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, yeah, I can, like...
[33:45.360 --> 33:48.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: It might work without the app, but then you don't get the benefit.
[33:48.400 --> 33:50.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: And they don't say that when you get...
[33:50.180 --> 33:56.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, it's smart, but you end up having all these surprises, like, oh, great.
[33:56.400 --> 34:04.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: We're going to have exactly where you are when you're doing this thing, like, you know, using a water pick or some smart toaster or whatever.
[34:05.000 --> 34:05.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[34:05.380 --> 34:07.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't really need that.
[34:07.520 --> 34:12.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't need them to know why does that have to be a part of it being smart?
[34:12.580 --> 34:13.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, that's too smart.
[34:13.440 --> 34:18.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you obviously don't want people to even know what the device is, so why should you let the people who made the device know anything about you?
[34:18.900 --> 34:19.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's...
[34:19.380 --> 34:19.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right.
[34:19.480 --> 34:20.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's perfectly okay.
[34:20.560 --> 34:21.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: But is it...
[34:21.060 --> 34:22.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's, like, too smart, right?
[34:22.400 --> 34:23.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like, it's not...
[34:23.440 --> 34:24.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, it's smart, but it's like...
[34:24.660 --> 34:25.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, it's not smart.
[34:25.280 --> 34:26.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're smart about that.
[34:26.100 --> 34:26.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's overly smart.
[34:34.680 --> 34:37.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: I just wanted to add that in as something I was toiling with.
[34:37.440 --> 34:41.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, congratulations for holding your own there.
[34:41.540 --> 34:45.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Stop making connected devices that require location for every single thing.
[34:45.640 --> 34:46.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just stop.
[34:46.680 --> 34:47.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's my request.
[34:47.880 --> 34:48.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[34:48.640 --> 34:49.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have some listener mail.
[34:50.080 --> 34:53.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can write your listener mail to oth@2600.com.
[34:53.860 --> 34:54.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: We'd love to hear from you.
[34:55.240 --> 34:56.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I just finished listening to the show.
[34:56.920 --> 35:07.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was wondering how someone who stopped using Signal or any other messaging app is any different than someone stopping email, an email address.
[35:08.240 --> 35:21.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: So we were talking about this a few weeks ago where people who stopped using Signal were still having messages sent to their Signal number and they were never getting them because they weren't using Signal anymore.
[35:21.640 --> 35:27.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the people who sent them didn't know they weren't getting them because they didn't get any message saying they didn't get it.
[35:28.340 --> 35:34.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: This listener wants to know or says that the onus is 100% on the user of the service, Not on the service.
[35:35.080 --> 35:44.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I would disagree there, because in the case of Signal, they don't generate any kind of a bounce to tell you that this address is no longer valid.
[35:45.120 --> 35:53.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: If somebody ever used Signal, and you send a message to them, your message will appear to have gone through.
[35:53.320 --> 35:58.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: You might not see two check marks, you might see one, but there's a number of reasons why that could happen.
[35:58.620 --> 36:05.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Whereas, you send email to somebody whose email address no longer works, you will get a bounce back.
[36:05.560 --> 36:07.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Unless they just walk away from their email account.
[36:08.040 --> 36:12.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's more of a parallel to this.
[36:12.000 --> 36:18.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: If they have an email address and they abandon it, then you might not know that they never saw your email.
[36:19.940 --> 36:27.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that's something that I think most people are aware of when sending email, but they're not aware of that when they're sending a text message via Signal.
[36:27.300 --> 36:36.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Signal, that somebody could still have the same phone number, but using a different app to read messages.
[36:37.020 --> 36:42.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, you know, if you change your email address, you don't have the same email address using a different provider.
[36:43.560 --> 36:45.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: You get a different email address.
[36:45.880 --> 36:51.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: So in the case of Signal, your phone number will remain the same if you use a different app.
[36:51.380 --> 36:54.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you might not know that when you're sending the person a message.
[36:54.460 --> 36:54.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's the difference.
[36:55.640 --> 37:02.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Another thing I'd like to comment on is perhaps you should start using the phrase Trump regime instead of administration.
[37:02.600 --> 37:03.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: I believe we have been using that phrase.
[37:03.980 --> 37:04.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I started that this week.
[37:04.900 --> 37:05.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[37:05.340 --> 37:09.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everything they do fits more in line with a good authoritarian regime anyway.
[37:10.380 --> 37:13.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you, Jab, for that thoughtful letter.
[37:14.200 --> 37:16.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have this from Tom.
[37:17.820 --> 37:19.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Listening to your show right now from Berlin.
[37:19.900 --> 37:21.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: I like to check news from time to time.
[37:21.760 --> 37:22.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: The less, the better these days.
[37:22.980 --> 37:23.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: I hear that.
[37:24.160 --> 37:28.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then listening to Off The Hook or Off the Wall provides an interesting opinionated commentary.
[37:28.340 --> 37:29.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Keep up the good work.
[37:29.500 --> 37:32.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Being Czech, I cringed hearing the pronunciation.
[37:34.040 --> 37:35.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, all right.
[37:35.800 --> 37:38.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I said Czechia because that's how it's spelled, okay?
[37:39.520 --> 37:45.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: God, I went through the same thing when I pronounced Spokane as if it had a silent E at the end, which it does.
[37:45.980 --> 37:47.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's not my fault.
[37:48.200 --> 37:49.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, so get rid of the H.
[37:50.020 --> 37:52.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then I'll say Czechia or put a K there.
[37:52.620 --> 37:53.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Czechia, that's how you're supposed to say it.
[37:54.180 --> 37:57.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Say Czech as in Czech Republic that you pronounced right.
[37:57.380 --> 37:57.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's easy.
[37:58.960 --> 38:00.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then just add the I-A.
[38:00.740 --> 38:01.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Czechia.
[38:01.440 --> 38:02.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'll do that from now on.
[38:02.660 --> 38:04.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, there's no manual for these things.
[38:04.920 --> 38:07.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: By the way, all people I know there don't use this new term.
[38:07.680 --> 38:11.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was somehow pushed by the tourism department, but it never really stuck with Czech people.
[38:11.860 --> 38:14.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: So Czech Republic is still a sure shot.
[38:15.000 --> 38:15.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Signed, Tom.
[38:15.800 --> 38:17.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you, Tom, for that helpful info.
[38:18.300 --> 38:28.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I would like to get that verified from some people, Czech natives, that you don't call it Czechia, you know, Czech Republic, whatever it is.
[38:29.280 --> 38:30.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, Gila.
[38:30.840 --> 38:36.160]  [SPEAKER_12]: So Czechia is an invented term equivalent to, say, Nolita?
[38:36.160 --> 38:40.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, if it's an invented term, how come they know how to pronounce it?
[38:41.080 --> 38:41.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know?
[38:41.820 --> 38:44.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: If it's invented, anything goes.
[38:45.160 --> 38:47.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: This reminds me of the Turkey name change.
[38:48.260 --> 38:48.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[38:48.840 --> 38:51.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's something they're very passionate about.
[38:51.400 --> 38:52.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I'm not questioning it.
[38:52.840 --> 38:55.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because they literally don't want to be affiliated with the birds.
[38:55.800 --> 38:56.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: They really don't.
[38:57.220 --> 38:59.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I didn't know they were even related.
[38:59.380 --> 39:00.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: I thought it was a coincidence.
[39:00.320 --> 39:02.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: But there's a whole story behind that.
[39:02.180 --> 39:03.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, check yourself.
[39:03.620 --> 39:08.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: And this letter here is interesting because it involves a clip, actually.
[39:09.460 --> 39:15.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's a clip from May of 1991, our show back then.
[39:15.400 --> 39:18.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think it's May 22nd, I believe.
[39:20.160 --> 39:28.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Emmanuel hypothesizes an unimaginable scenario where a new Hitler might rise 30 years in the future.
[39:29.120 --> 39:33.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: That would put it in, what, like the early 20-teens or something.
[39:34.420 --> 39:39.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if one did, they would be helped by all the power we grant technology.
[39:39.880 --> 39:42.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: The caller thinks this is an absurd idea.
[39:44.840 --> 39:48.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it's always fun to listen to the old shows and find little moments like this.
[39:49.180 --> 39:52.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Lob, we're going to play the excerpt that you sent us.
[39:52.380 --> 39:53.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let's listen to 1991.
[39:54.160 --> 39:56.800]  [SPEAKER_11]: So what did I say that made it sound simple?
[39:56.800 --> 40:09.020]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, no, I just didn't want to give the impression that we're going on saying something about the evil government or the evil corporations all plotting and scheming because I don't really think they're to that point yet.
[40:09.240 --> 40:15.440]  [SPEAKER_15]: But we're giving away a lot of tools, a lot of methods that could one day be used for just that purpose.
[40:15.600 --> 40:28.100]  [SPEAKER_15]: Like, imagine a Hitler rising in, say, 30 years somewhere after all of this computer technology is in place to allow them to monitor people, to spy on people, to categorize people.
[40:28.100 --> 40:28.320]  [SPEAKER_11]: Exactly.
[40:28.500 --> 40:30.880]  [SPEAKER_11]: And that's where I take the big issue with you right there.
[40:31.060 --> 40:33.320]  [SPEAKER_11]: I don't see there being a Hitler in 30 years.
[40:33.480 --> 40:37.700]  [SPEAKER_11]: That whole thing went down in 1939, whatever, because of a different world.
[40:37.920 --> 40:40.100]  [SPEAKER_11]: I don't see that coming about today.
[40:40.760 --> 40:44.240]  [SPEAKER_11]: Because there are going to be a lot of other people who are, well, whatever.
[40:44.400 --> 40:45.880]  [SPEAKER_11]: That's where you're part company.
[40:46.040 --> 40:49.660]  [SPEAKER_11]: What is going down now is racism, sexism, all the isms.
[40:50.720 --> 41:01.160]  [SPEAKER_11]: And they're operating just fine with this technology that's not yet becomes the monster, which it may become, but that it is the helpful thing, which you think it is.
[41:01.380 --> 41:09.380]  [SPEAKER_11]: Even the helpful thing, well, given the helpful side of it, we still have wage oppression and jobs we hate and this stuff.
[41:09.480 --> 41:20.160]  [SPEAKER_11]: So I wish you could just, like, address yourself to other aspects of life than just this technology, possible invasion, which might come about if a Hitler, you know, comes into power.
[41:20.300 --> 41:23.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I mean, it's not going to be a Hitler, but it is going to be something else.
[41:23.660 --> 41:24.680]  [SPEAKER_15]: We can't predict what.
[41:24.800 --> 41:27.720]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's always been our talent, not predicting the future.
[41:28.040 --> 41:31.200]  [SPEAKER_11]: I don't think... I mean, the invasions that take place, they'll take place anyway.
[41:31.460 --> 41:37.060]  [SPEAKER_11]: They have the information, files on people, through stuff that was around 20 years.
[41:37.080 --> 41:40.240]  [SPEAKER_11]: 20 years ago, you know, social security numbers, like you said, they had that 20...
[41:40.240 --> 41:43.900]  [SPEAKER_11]: They had social security numbers in place a long time ago, and they can...
[41:43.900 --> 41:48.100]  [SPEAKER_11]: They have enough technology they had 20 years ago is enough to trace all of the...
[41:48.100 --> 41:59.860]  [SPEAKER_11]: You know, when the death squads, when the right-wing death squads want to get somebody, they've got their low-level technology, as low as it is in all South American countries and Central American countries, that exists.
[42:00.080 --> 42:01.600]  [SPEAKER_11]: It's much less advanced, right?
[42:01.860 --> 42:04.640]  [SPEAKER_11]: But still, they have no problem going out and getting the people.
[42:04.640 --> 42:07.800]  [SPEAKER_11]: So we don't got to worry about this great advance in technology.
[42:08.180 --> 42:11.200]  [SPEAKER_11]: We got to worry about other things that are going to come down.
[42:11.380 --> 42:18.520]  [SPEAKER_11]: If someone's going to come down like Hitler in 30 years, they're not going to need sophisticated technological knowledge bases to get us, okay?
[42:18.760 --> 42:23.140]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, that kind of tool will make things so much easier.
[42:23.980 --> 42:24.640]  [SPEAKER_11]: Okay, Eric.
[42:24.880 --> 42:25.420]  [SPEAKER_11]: Thanks a lot.
[42:25.560 --> 42:26.160]  [SPEAKER_15]: Thanks for calling.
[42:27.320 --> 42:27.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[42:28.080 --> 42:28.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[42:28.920 --> 42:30.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that was something.
[42:30.900 --> 42:32.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: By the way, I got the date wrong.
[42:32.820 --> 42:34.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was May 23rd, 1991.
[42:35.100 --> 42:37.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: 30 years from then is 2021, not 2011.
[42:37.960 --> 42:38.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, yeah.
[42:39.500 --> 42:39.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[42:40.200 --> 42:40.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[42:40.620 --> 42:46.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know why we picked 30 years, but things kind of changed, I guess.
[42:46.280 --> 42:47.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Any thoughts, folks?
[42:48.180 --> 42:48.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[42:48.740 --> 42:51.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I listened to that earlier as well.
[42:51.540 --> 42:55.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: I was really astounded by the conversation and its prescience.
[42:56.320 --> 42:58.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I was reminded of that expression.
[42:58.820 --> 42:59.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if you've ever heard it.
[43:00.120 --> 43:03.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, even a stop clock is right twice a day.
[43:04.940 --> 43:06.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Am I supposed to be the stop clock?
[43:07.140 --> 43:09.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can be whatever you want in that analogy.
[43:09.680 --> 43:09.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[43:10.180 --> 43:10.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you know.
[43:11.940 --> 43:15.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Look, I give you credit for it.
[43:15.120 --> 43:16.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's really extraordinary.
[43:17.020 --> 43:20.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: But look, if you make enough prophecies like this, eventually one is going to come true.
[43:21.320 --> 43:23.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's not like I sit around making prophecies.
[43:23.360 --> 43:31.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's, you know, it's pretty obvious to me that if you have, you know, we're talking about it tonight, about technology and how it will eventually be used against people.
[43:31.980 --> 43:38.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you have to ask yourself, well, you know, a hundred years ago with this technology, what might oppressive regimes have done?
[43:39.480 --> 43:44.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, if you just think about these things, the warnings will be very clear to you.
[43:45.340 --> 43:45.420]  Yeah.
[43:45.640 --> 43:46.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, it really is.
[43:46.620 --> 43:48.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: I thought it was a really extraordinary clip.
[43:48.580 --> 43:58.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: I love that our listener heard this going through the archives and it's, I shouldn't think about what people are going to say about these shows 30 years from now.
[43:58.380 --> 44:00.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I love that listeners are going through the archives.
[44:00.480 --> 44:05.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if you don't know where the archives are, let me tell you, they're at 2600.com/offthehook.
[44:05.500 --> 44:11.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have every single show except for the ones that got stolen out of my car online.
[44:11.780 --> 44:15.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can just listen to anything you want, as well as other radio shows too.
[44:15.760 --> 44:19.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, and again, write to us, oth@2600.com.
[44:19.440 --> 44:20.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's our email address.
[44:20.840 --> 44:26.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: And tell us your thoughts and feelings and give us any kind of feedback.
[44:28.940 --> 44:29.380]  [SPEAKER_13]: Absolutely.
[44:29.900 --> 44:34.020]  [SPEAKER_13]: And I do love every so often pulling up just one of the old shows at random.
[44:34.160 --> 44:35.700]  [SPEAKER_13]: And that was a real gem our listener found.
[44:36.460 --> 44:48.180]  [SPEAKER_13]: And, you know, I, I would have been listening to the show around then and thinking of all the weird possibilities of this whole scene and, you know, concerns like yours and, and everything.
[44:48.200 --> 44:55.480]  [SPEAKER_13]: But also I just remember being a nineties kid thinking while in front of my computer, you know, what could these be like in 30 years?
[44:55.480 --> 45:07.860]  [SPEAKER_13]: Is it going to be like a nice, uh, sparkly back to the future to sort of future, or, you know, a dark and gritty blade runner sort of future, but either way it was like, well, computers will do more and more of the drudgery more and more of the crap work.
[45:08.080 --> 45:10.380]  [SPEAKER_13]: Well, uh, people will be freed up to think and create.
[45:10.420 --> 45:20.620]  [SPEAKER_13]: And now here we are in 2025 and the computers more and more being turned to for thinking and creating and, uh, human, uh, creativity is being left by the wayside.
[45:20.760 --> 45:23.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: All the poets on the street, it's really a hazard.
[45:23.360 --> 45:25.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, everyone's just, just.
[45:25.480 --> 45:27.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Basically creating, um, all right.
[45:28.020 --> 45:30.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have, um, one more story before we go out tonight.
[45:31.020 --> 45:35.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: And by the way, we do have overtime tonight on YouTube, eight o'clock Channel2600.
[45:35.460 --> 45:36.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: We will see you there.
[45:36.340 --> 45:36.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can call us.
[45:37.340 --> 45:41.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, this is an organization called ARF, A-A-R-F.
[45:42.220 --> 45:46.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's a nonprofit organization that rescues neglected and abused dogs.
[45:47.020 --> 45:47.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[45:47.560 --> 45:48.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: ARF cute, huh?
[45:48.780 --> 45:53.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: From Alaskan villages, but, but they've had to suspend some of their services.
[45:54.040 --> 46:00.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're, um, trying to get the word out that they're still in business, despite having their Facebook page deleted earlier this month.
[46:01.260 --> 46:11.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: We literally, as of almost two weeks ago, went from 50,000 followers and 14 years of Facebook to zero, said longtime volunteer Trina Johnson.
[46:11.000 --> 46:15.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, so we recreated the Facebook page, but we didn't get our 50,000 followers back.
[46:16.560 --> 46:17.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, yeah.
[46:18.040 --> 46:23.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, Johnson said it's, um, unclear exactly why the Facebook page was deleted.
[46:23.520 --> 46:29.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: She believes it goes back to an incident two years ago when the organization had its page hacked and its administrator blocked.
[46:29.980 --> 46:35.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, she said that despite having reached out to Facebook, they haven't gotten answers and are now resigned to starting over.
[46:35.900 --> 46:39.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: However, that's, that's obscene that they have to do that.
[46:39.700 --> 46:41.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, Johnson said it's been difficult to start from scratch.
[46:42.400 --> 46:56.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: She said ARF, which stands for Alaskan Animal Rescue Friends, has consistently placed between 500 to 700 dogs a year since it started in 2011 and, uh, had information on its page on most of them.
[46:56.580 --> 47:02.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: They took every video, photo, we probably had 30,000 videos and photos of our dogs available.
[47:02.620 --> 47:06.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: So you can't even go back and see the history of all our dogs that have been adopted.
[47:06.680 --> 47:10.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: But the biggest problem, according to Johnson, is the loss of 50,000 followers.
[47:10.220 --> 47:15.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: These are, these are people they depend on for donations, adopting animals, volunteering to foster.
[47:15.820 --> 47:18.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Without that outreach, we have no way of asking for help.
[47:19.740 --> 47:23.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, uh, we're helping out here by, by spreading the word about this.
[47:23.820 --> 47:25.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I can, I can attest to that too.
[47:25.540 --> 47:31.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's, it's extremely hard to reach people, uh, with just with the fragmentation of social media.
[47:31.480 --> 47:34.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, we used to be able to reach so many more people than we do now.
[47:34.640 --> 47:43.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're not doing anything different, but people are reading particular platforms less, uh, and, and, and just spreading out a lot more.
[47:43.740 --> 47:46.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's harder to, um, uh, to, to get a message to everybody.
[47:47.380 --> 47:54.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, so this though, with, um, with losing a Facebook page that, um, that can hurt a lot of people.
[47:54.420 --> 48:02.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, uh, Johnson said the organization has temporarily suspended flying new dogs in from the villages because it doesn't have enough foster homes to place them in.
[48:02.960 --> 48:06.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, ARF is still offering adoption clinics on Sunday for animals who are already in care.
[48:07.140 --> 48:11.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, but Johnson wants people to know that while the old page has been deleted, there is a new one they can search for.
[48:12.200 --> 48:16.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, I don't think people realize that they aren't getting updates because they have to go back in and refollow us.
[48:17.600 --> 48:19.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, so here's the thing though.
[48:20.480 --> 48:21.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Facebook can fix this.
[48:21.920 --> 48:23.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, this is, this is all data.
[48:23.680 --> 48:32.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, uh, somewhere in, in, in Facebook archives, uh, are the 50,000 followers somewhere are all of the videos.
[48:33.340 --> 48:34.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's all there.
[48:34.520 --> 48:37.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: You just need somebody with the access to restore it.
[48:37.820 --> 48:43.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: And while this may be related to the, to the hack a few years ago, uh, this could also be administrator error.
[48:44.200 --> 48:45.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: It could be a technical glitch.
[48:45.920 --> 48:47.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's all kinds of things that can happen.
[48:47.460 --> 48:49.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, it's important to keep backups.
[48:49.860 --> 48:54.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm not sure if it's, if it's easy or hard to even back up your, your Facebook page.
[48:54.380 --> 48:54.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I never tried.
[48:55.040 --> 48:59.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't really spend any time there, but they need to make it easier for people to do that.
[48:59.920 --> 49:06.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that when something like this happens and it does happen a lot, uh, it's, it's fairly trivial to recover from it.
[49:06.580 --> 49:18.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: You should not hear stories like this where someone has, has poured their life into, uh, building a service and have it all go away and nobody's there to respond.
[49:19.080 --> 49:21.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: So there's only one solution to this.
[49:21.540 --> 49:27.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's for Facebook to get up off their asses and restore this because obviously these people are who they say they are.
[49:27.680 --> 49:27.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex.
[49:28.660 --> 49:29.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[49:29.340 --> 49:32.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, this is such a longstanding problem.
[49:32.360 --> 49:36.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Interestingly enough, in the, in the European union, I have something called the digital services act.
[49:37.120 --> 49:54.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: And if you were, uh, if your content is moderated in a way that you don't agree with, or if you, if your account is suspended based on this new EU wide law, there are these dispute settlement bodies to which you can actually appeal the decision of a social media company by de-platforming you.
[49:54.640 --> 49:57.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: And they will hear your appeal and they will make some kind of decision.
[49:58.520 --> 50:01.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the platforms are supposed to respect those decisions.
[50:01.300 --> 50:04.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: They're not actually legally binding on them, but they're supposed to respect them.
[50:04.480 --> 50:10.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: So it's, it's really quite interesting when you think about this in the context of there being literally no legal remedies.
[50:10.540 --> 50:14.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: And actually there are in the EU, they've, they've made some progress in this respect.
[50:15.420 --> 50:15.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[50:15.760 --> 50:17.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're going to have to end on that, but you know what?
[50:17.780 --> 50:20.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: I hear this, this music behind that.
[50:20.420 --> 50:21.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Does anybody recognize this?
[50:24.760 --> 50:25.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: No?
[50:25.860 --> 50:26.380]  [SPEAKER_19]: Yes.
[50:26.560 --> 50:27.100]  [SPEAKER_19]: Yes, I do.
[50:27.240 --> 50:28.900]  [SPEAKER_19]: Let's say that's whole music.
[50:30.020 --> 50:30.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Very good.
[50:31.560 --> 50:34.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: I've heard that so many times.
[50:34.360 --> 50:35.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's horrible.
[50:35.580 --> 50:39.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's, it sounds like soft core porn music, but it's whole music.
[50:39.260 --> 50:41.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: I would say it's like vaporwave.
[50:41.420 --> 50:42.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why can't it be both?
[50:42.900 --> 50:46.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: It can be, but it's like Playboy channel, mid nineties kind of music.
[50:46.960 --> 50:48.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I think you do it an injustice.
[50:48.640 --> 50:50.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle, do you want to reveal what this is?
[50:50.480 --> 50:52.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, you can read, you can let people know.
[50:53.100 --> 50:59.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: I just saw some people referencing it on social media and I thought we should talk about what it actually is.
[50:59.240 --> 51:01.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's called Cisco's Opus Number One.
[51:01.900 --> 51:04.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's the whole music if you ever called Cisco.
[51:05.440 --> 51:09.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or anyone that has that for their call management.
[51:09.520 --> 51:16.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: If Cisco call manager, the default presence is Opus Number One by Tim Carlton and his high school friend, Derek Diehl.
[51:16.580 --> 51:19.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: They recorded it on a four track tape recorder in 1989.
[51:20.640 --> 51:28.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: And in a YouTube video, Tim mentioned the following on how he created the sound and why the stereo version is not very good.
[51:28.540 --> 51:32.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: The reason was that I used an Alesis.
[51:32.400 --> 51:32.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alesis.
[51:33.060 --> 51:44.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alesis Mitiverb 2 or 3, specifically the three tap pen, to hide the fact that I was playing this live on a DX7 IIFD.
[51:45.240 --> 51:55.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the notes would either cut off when I'd play unison patches and run out of polyphony or when I'd change, I have no idea what I'm saying here, when I'd change patches.
[51:56.440 --> 52:06.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: The solution was to plug it in mono to the MIDI verb on one side, R8 on the other side, the stereo into the Tascam, and go.
[52:08.860 --> 52:12.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, all you musicians out there, hopefully you appreciated that.
[52:12.240 --> 52:16.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: But this whole music is a classic, apparently.
[52:17.100 --> 52:21.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know why it's being talked about now, but we figured we might as well give it the attention it deserves.
[52:21.860 --> 52:28.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think we all feel like a lot is on hold right now, but just stand by.
[52:28.700 --> 52:29.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Someone will be with you shortly.
[52:30.100 --> 52:40.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, and if you do stand by, in about eight minutes, you can join us over on YouTube for another edition of Overtime, where we take phone calls.
[52:40.900 --> 52:45.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: And next week, next week here on WBAI, we will be taking phone calls.
[52:46.580 --> 52:53.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, mark that on your calendar, and we will see you then, 7 p.m.
[52:53.220 --> 52:54.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: on 99.5 FM.
[52:54.680 --> 52:56.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please, support WBAI.
[52:56.720 --> 52:57.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Keep the station alive.
[52:57.620 --> 52:58.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Keep the station going.
[52:58.600 --> 53:01.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: We are going to need this place more than you can imagine.
[53:01.920 --> 53:05.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Buddy.wbai.org is the best way to do that.
[53:06.620 --> 53:07.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good night, everyone.
[55:14.150 --> 55:18.290]  [SPEAKER_18]: And welcome, everybody, to Off The Hook Overtime.
[55:19.410 --> 55:20.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: Emmanuel here.
[55:20.990 --> 55:23.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle, you made it over okay?
[55:23.630 --> 55:24.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm here.
[55:24.630 --> 55:24.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[55:25.390 --> 55:28.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: On Signal-land, we have Alex.
[55:29.050 --> 55:29.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: You do.
[55:30.090 --> 55:31.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we have Rob.
[55:31.910 --> 55:32.710]  [SPEAKER_18]: You do.
[55:33.050 --> 55:33.450]  [SPEAKER_18]: And Gila.
[55:34.010 --> 55:34.570]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hello.
[55:35.490 --> 55:38.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: We can report we are live on YouTube.
[55:38.690 --> 55:39.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: Amazing.
[55:39.650 --> 55:39.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[55:40.110 --> 55:41.310]  [SPEAKER_12]: Every week, it's a miracle.
[55:42.250 --> 55:45.730]  [SPEAKER_12]: The audio is hard for us to check because of the delay.
[55:45.990 --> 55:47.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: It gets deeply confusing.
[55:49.030 --> 55:49.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: But...
[55:49.510 --> 55:50.590]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think we're sounding good.
[55:51.570 --> 55:52.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: I think we're sounding good.
[55:53.090 --> 55:56.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, team, if you could let us know, that would be amazing.
[55:56.350 --> 55:58.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: We, wow, have 22 people here with us.
[55:58.970 --> 56:02.150]  [SPEAKER_12]: And, Kyle, there is a message for you.
[56:04.050 --> 56:09.810]  [SPEAKER_12]: I know why Kyle's smart medical device needs location, says XX in the chat.
[56:09.810 --> 56:16.290]  [SPEAKER_12]: But, I have a medical device, and it connects using Bluetooth Low Energy, and Android considers that a location permission.
[56:18.310 --> 56:22.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that's similar to what it was saying, or rationalizing.
[56:22.690 --> 56:26.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: But it still doesn't seem like a requirement.
[56:26.570 --> 56:28.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, great that they designed it that way.
[56:28.590 --> 56:32.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, is there anything actually, like, necessary about that?
[56:33.410 --> 56:43.230]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think the necessary bit might be that the company that makes this thing likes having data that it can sell to, you know, people who are interested in it about you.
[56:43.350 --> 56:44.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's kind of where my head goes.
[56:44.710 --> 56:47.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like, I'm kind of concluding that's what's up.
[56:47.070 --> 56:55.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: And so, yeah, gotta give it all kinds of other fake stuff, and run very far away if I use the app.
[56:56.270 --> 57:01.150]  [SPEAKER_13]: There are also certain apps that you can use to spoof GPS coordinates in Android.
[57:01.430 --> 57:08.110]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think there's one or two in the F-Droid store, where you can decide where in the world you want to report that you're in.
[57:08.230 --> 57:12.050]  [SPEAKER_13]: And it will tell all such apps looking for the GPS data that that's where you are.
[57:12.050 --> 57:19.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: I would be really interested in some that people like, because there's probably several things that I use.
[57:19.530 --> 57:28.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think, well, when I turn location on, if ever, I think at least half a dozen apps like it.
[57:28.390 --> 57:35.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that's not really even including maps, or might include a, like, navigation, like, for travel.
[57:35.450 --> 57:41.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: But really try to, like, not have things on unnecessarily.
[57:41.650 --> 57:43.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know if other people are like that.
[57:43.470 --> 57:45.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's just, like, force of habit for me.
[57:45.570 --> 57:49.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's the way I've just always been with things.
[57:49.210 --> 58:01.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just because you give, you have, like, sensors and information just all the time in your space.
[58:01.210 --> 58:11.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Everywhere, just constantly flying around you, like, like a swarm of data just spilling out of you at every moment.
[58:12.170 --> 58:25.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think if there's little switches and buttons and things in the software that you can just change something, just to reduce that a little bit, I think it just helps generally.
[58:25.770 --> 58:28.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, anyway, anyway, I don't want to get off on a tangent about that.
[58:30.410 --> 58:30.990]  [SPEAKER_16]: Alex, go ahead.
[58:31.750 --> 58:39.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think we're going to have a talk this summer, I believe, at a conference called Hope.
[58:39.530 --> 58:40.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if you've heard of it.
[58:40.470 --> 58:42.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're going to have a number of talks, actually.
[58:42.230 --> 58:43.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Quite a number.
[58:43.050 --> 59:02.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: But I believe there's one specifically about device hardening using Graphene OS, which is its own operating system that's designed to lock down this type of misuse and really prevent lots of different types of data from leaving your phone.
[59:02.530 --> 59:04.070]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm looking forward to that talk.
[59:04.190 --> 59:05.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's just going to be really interesting.
[59:07.130 --> 59:15.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, actually, we just announced a bunch of talks today, featured speakers, in fact, and some of these are really incredible.
[59:16.450 --> 59:31.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: And please, listeners, if you can help get the word out, because, as I mentioned earlier on the show, it's been a real challenge getting the word out because of all the fracturing that's going on in social media, where, you know, you might think you're sending to a bunch of people,
[59:31.370 --> 59:32.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: but they've abandoned the platform.
[59:32.770 --> 59:38.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: They've gone somewhere else, but they haven't all gone to the same place, and they don't all hear the same things in the same way.
[59:39.050 --> 59:46.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, you wind up spending so much time just trying to get people to hear what you have to say or what you have to announce.
[59:46.870 --> 59:50.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you spend more time on that than putting it together in the first place.
[59:50.870 --> 01:00:02.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: So we definitely could use the help of our listeners, our readers, our attendees just in getting the word out, because we have a great conference that's coming up in August.
[01:00:02.770 --> 01:00:10.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we have way too few tickets sold, I have to be honest about that.
[01:00:10.450 --> 01:00:14.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I know that there's hesitancy about traveling to the United States.
[01:00:14.930 --> 01:00:15.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: I get that.
[01:00:15.590 --> 01:00:22.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we're not asking anybody to take any unnecessary risks in this weird era that we're in.
[01:00:23.070 --> 01:00:30.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: But there are plenty of people in this country where that's not a concern, and plenty of people who are local, too.
[01:00:30.910 --> 01:00:32.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please, show your support.
[01:00:33.490 --> 01:00:34.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: Buy a ticket to the conference.
[01:00:35.230 --> 01:00:39.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you can make it here, and this goes for people overseas as well, get a virtual ticket.
[01:00:40.090 --> 01:00:44.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're much cheaper, and it doesn't involve any traveling at all.
[01:00:44.150 --> 01:00:52.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if you support the idea of the conferences, meaning the Hackers on Planet Earth conferences, this is how you keep them going.
[01:00:52.750 --> 01:00:56.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because we have plenty of speakers.
[01:00:56.790 --> 01:01:01.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have so many speakers, but we need more attendees.
[01:01:02.450 --> 01:01:08.710]  [SPEAKER_18]: Otherwise, we'll have a great conference either way with probably more speakers than ever.
[01:01:09.470 --> 01:01:13.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if we have less attendees, then we can't really support it.
[01:01:13.950 --> 01:01:23.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: And already, we're facing some hard decisions where we want to do certain things, but without the funds from our attendees, we can't do them.
[01:01:24.010 --> 01:01:28.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: And now that's directly affecting how good the conference can be.
[01:01:28.930 --> 01:01:31.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, you know, if we're doing something wrong, tell us.
[01:01:31.870 --> 01:01:34.370]  [SPEAKER_18]: But so far, nobody has told us what that could be.
[01:01:34.370 --> 01:01:38.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: The date, the location, people seem to like that.
[01:01:39.030 --> 01:01:40.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: They seem to like the content.
[01:01:41.470 --> 01:01:45.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: So if it's something we said, let us know, please.
[01:01:45.730 --> 01:01:49.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: I know this is something that other conferences are experiencing as well.
[01:01:49.590 --> 01:01:52.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we do things very differently than most other conferences.
[01:01:52.770 --> 01:01:57.330]  [SPEAKER_18]: We don't have a corporate sponsorship that pays for everything.
[01:01:57.330 --> 01:02:01.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: We don't have all kinds of overpriced things.
[01:02:01.970 --> 01:02:04.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: We try to make it as affordable as possible.
[01:02:04.370 --> 01:02:10.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: But that means that we need a certain number of people to show up for it to remain doable at all.
[01:02:10.570 --> 01:02:13.350]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, Hope.net is where all the info is.
[01:02:13.530 --> 01:02:15.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: And please spread that around.
[01:02:15.070 --> 01:02:19.530]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have so many amazing speakers that we announced today.
[01:02:19.530 --> 01:02:22.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's only a fraction of the total number of speakers.
[01:02:22.250 --> 01:02:24.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, of course, then there's workshops and villages.
[01:02:25.610 --> 01:02:27.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: And there's all kinds of really, really cool things.
[01:02:28.010 --> 01:02:33.710]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I'm just going to give you a rundown of some of the people that will be appearing this year.
[01:02:33.710 --> 01:02:44.350]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Emma Best, who's been on this show a number of times, an investigative reporter, whistleblower, known for distributed denial of secrets, ddossecrets.com.
[01:02:44.750 --> 01:02:49.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Joseph Cox, the investigative journalist, co-founder of 404 Media.
[01:02:49.910 --> 01:02:51.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Seth Godin.
[01:02:51.510 --> 01:02:54.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's an author, entrepreneur, and a teacher.
[01:02:54.810 --> 01:02:56.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: Really interesting person.
[01:02:56.610 --> 01:02:59.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have John Kiriakou.
[01:02:59.310 --> 01:03:02.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, this guy, former CIA officer, U.S.
[01:03:02.950 --> 01:03:05.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: intelligence whistleblower, the first U.S.
[01:03:05.310 --> 01:03:08.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: official to confirm CIA torture of detainees.
[01:03:08.150 --> 01:03:10.370]  [SPEAKER_18]: And he was punished for being a whistleblower.
[01:03:10.510 --> 01:03:12.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: He served nearly two years in the federal prison.
[01:03:13.470 --> 01:03:16.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's going to be an interesting talk, interesting story.
[01:03:16.710 --> 01:03:18.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Sahil Lavindia.
[01:03:19.330 --> 01:03:20.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, this is interesting.
[01:03:20.750 --> 01:03:25.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's a former Doge engineer who was fired after talking to journalists.
[01:03:26.070 --> 01:03:27.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is what he says.
[01:03:27.210 --> 01:03:30.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: I got dropped into the VA with an HP laptop.
[01:03:31.030 --> 01:03:32.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: What are we supposed to do?
[01:03:32.670 --> 01:03:33.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: What is the roadmap?
[01:03:34.090 --> 01:03:35.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: I felt like I was being pranked.
[01:03:36.750 --> 01:03:38.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is going to be fascinating.
[01:03:38.330 --> 01:03:39.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is going to be fascinating.
[01:03:39.050 --> 01:03:45.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: Talking to somebody who was in the midst of it and is no longer in the midst of it.
[01:03:46.450 --> 01:03:50.210]  [SPEAKER_18]: And has some quite interesting perspectives.
[01:03:50.490 --> 01:03:54.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's talked at NPR, actually, too, about a number of things.
[01:03:54.930 --> 01:04:02.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: One thing I recall him saying was that he was surprised at how efficient the government actually was in running their databases.
[01:04:03.310 --> 01:04:07.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: When Doge came in there to try and wipe everything out.
[01:04:07.670 --> 01:04:10.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, he spoke honestly and paid the price for it.
[01:04:10.490 --> 01:04:13.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Which is a good price, actually, getting fired from Doge, I think.
[01:04:13.690 --> 01:04:13.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: Whatever.
[01:04:13.930 --> 01:04:21.410]  [SPEAKER_18]: Harper Reid is Barack Obama's campaign CTO, who is instrumental in helping Obama secure a second term in office.
[01:04:21.930 --> 01:04:28.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have Danashia Vo, cybersecurity professional, social justice hacker from Vietnam.
[01:04:28.650 --> 01:04:36.490]  [SPEAKER_18]: And also, we have this really cool program that's being run by one of our regular speakers, BSI Lab.
[01:04:37.270 --> 01:04:39.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: She's running something called the Spawn Camp.
[01:04:40.090 --> 01:04:46.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's an all-inclusive, hands-on cybersecurity hacking day camp for kids interested in a unique learning experience.
[01:04:47.030 --> 01:04:48.710]  [SPEAKER_18]: Ages, I think, 8 to 18.
[01:04:49.350 --> 01:04:52.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, that's just the tip of the iceberg.
[01:04:52.810 --> 01:04:54.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's just what we announced today.
[01:04:54.710 --> 01:04:57.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: These are really, really interesting people, all of them.
[01:04:57.350 --> 01:05:00.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's going to be an incredible event.
[01:05:00.650 --> 01:05:02.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: Again, all the details.
[01:05:02.130 --> 01:05:05.490]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hope.net takes place August 15th through 17th.
[01:05:05.630 --> 01:05:07.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: St. John's University, Queens, New York City.
[01:05:08.810 --> 01:05:10.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's easy to get to.
[01:05:10.610 --> 01:05:14.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: There are dormitory options if you want to stay on campus.
[01:05:15.450 --> 01:05:17.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: There are hotels nearby.
[01:05:17.310 --> 01:05:18.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's all kinds of possibilities.
[01:05:18.750 --> 01:05:20.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it's going to be an incredible event.
[01:05:20.450 --> 01:05:22.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please, let's make sure it's not the last one.
[01:05:23.190 --> 01:05:25.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: We need to bolster those attendance numbers.
[01:05:26.510 --> 01:05:28.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's almost comically low at this point.
[01:05:29.610 --> 01:05:33.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, I know we can solve this problem.
[01:05:33.430 --> 01:05:35.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's really the only problem we have left to solve.
[01:05:35.790 --> 01:05:42.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: We just have to get people to show up, and the conference is going to be awesome.
[01:05:42.590 --> 01:05:44.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: And again, online as well.
[01:05:44.250 --> 01:05:50.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can be a virtual attendee, interact with the speakers and other attendees, and it'll almost be like you're there.
[01:05:51.910 --> 01:05:53.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thoughts, comments, questions?
[01:05:56.620 --> 01:06:09.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: I am so excited about these talks that have been announced, and also just excited about the conference happening again, because I think we really need this sort of thing right about now at this point in our history.
[01:06:12.060 --> 01:06:14.860]  [SPEAKER_13]: Of course, this is our first time doing it yearly.
[01:06:15.820 --> 01:06:17.720]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's only been a year since the previous one.
[01:06:18.040 --> 01:06:20.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: But yeah, it feels extra needed.
[01:06:20.340 --> 01:06:21.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: It feels extra necessary.
[01:06:22.380 --> 01:06:27.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's why we decided to double down and do it twice.
[01:06:27.700 --> 01:06:29.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Twice in two years instead of once every two years.
[01:06:31.120 --> 01:06:34.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: But please, convince us that wasn't a mistake.
[01:06:34.640 --> 01:06:40.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because every time we do something like this, we pour our heart and soul into it.
[01:06:40.280 --> 01:06:44.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: And also our loose change in everything we have.
[01:06:44.940 --> 01:06:48.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we need to be able to make it to the next one as well.
[01:06:48.920 --> 01:06:50.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: And also keep the magazine going.
[01:06:50.500 --> 01:06:51.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's kind of important as well.
[01:06:51.880 --> 01:06:53.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: So it all matters.
[01:06:53.580 --> 01:07:14.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think it's also just a great opportunity to see people, to socialize a little bit in person, and just have a sort of local shot in the arm, that atmosphere of fun, and people sharing what they know, sharing what their experience has been in the last year,
[01:07:14.760 --> 01:07:18.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: since our last event, and also just perfecting it.
[01:07:18.340 --> 01:07:27.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: I want to become more familiar with the space that has been so generous to us, and it's starting to feel like home a little bit.
[01:07:27.580 --> 01:07:48.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I really am just enthused that we were able to put this together, and that there's such incredible content that we'll have a chance to share with everybody, and become a part of the discourse, a part of consciousness in the realms of hacking, and technology,
[01:07:49.060 --> 01:07:53.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: and telephony, and computers, and social activity, and law, everything.
[01:07:54.160 --> 01:07:55.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's just such a great mix.
[01:07:56.060 --> 01:07:57.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: So please join us.
[01:07:57.200 --> 01:08:02.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: It'd be great to see people, and have a little bit of fun, a little towards the end of summer.
[01:08:02.460 --> 01:08:14.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: And as you said, we need as much participation from attendees, and people interested in being there, because it's a different time, it's a little bit later, but it's always good to plan ahead.
[01:08:15.520 --> 01:08:23.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: We are getting close, and those numbers do affect things that we have to compile and have ready.
[01:08:25.180 --> 01:08:36.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Merchandise, all that stuff that people love to pick up while they're there, we have to get that going, even though it is in August, a little bit later than we'd had it last year.
[01:08:36.640 --> 01:08:46.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: But we think that it's going to be a really worthwhile event to attend, and we want to make sure all those materials back that up.
[01:08:46.960 --> 01:08:49.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it's an incredible environment, St. John's University.
[01:08:49.660 --> 01:08:56.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're right there in the middle of Queens, but you're on a campus with all this space, and just a welcoming environment.
[01:08:56.940 --> 01:09:07.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, you can leave any time to go be in the middle of Queens, Chinatown, the biggest Chinatown in the country, I believe, is just down the block.
[01:09:08.280 --> 01:09:13.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's such a fun time, and I just hope more people are able to experience that.
[01:09:13.920 --> 01:09:16.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Easy to get to if you're driving, free parking.
[01:09:16.300 --> 01:09:19.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Imagine that, free parking in the city for the entire weekend.
[01:09:20.840 --> 01:09:25.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: So it's something to really get excited about and participate in.
[01:09:25.240 --> 01:09:30.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please help us spread the word, because, like I said, you know, the social media networks are a challenge.
[01:09:30.560 --> 01:09:37.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you have a way to reach a bunch of people that you think might be interested, please make use of that.
[01:09:37.320 --> 01:09:38.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: It would be helping us out tremendously.
[01:09:39.460 --> 01:09:42.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Spreading the word, I think that's our strength in the hacker community.
[01:09:43.520 --> 01:09:48.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And sometimes we don't know certain things are happening because we're not looking in the right place.
[01:09:49.100 --> 01:09:51.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, I don't look in certain places.
[01:09:51.220 --> 01:09:56.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't look in Facebook and people are constantly telling me things on Facebook thinking I'm seeing it and I'm not.
[01:09:56.280 --> 01:09:57.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the same goes for Twitter.
[01:09:58.140 --> 01:09:59.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: The same goes for all kinds of different platforms.
[01:10:00.060 --> 01:10:06.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: And everyone seems to have a different way of communicating these days, which makes it so hard to just get the basic word out.
[01:10:07.520 --> 01:10:13.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that's why we need the help of people who are listening now or people who are listening in the future.
[01:10:15.120 --> 01:10:23.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: And people who read the magazine, people who have been to the conference before, please help us get the word out because I think hope is such a special event.
[01:10:23.580 --> 01:10:25.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's very, very unique in the world.
[01:10:25.980 --> 01:10:28.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's the 16th time we've done this.
[01:10:28.340 --> 01:10:33.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, we're doubling down to do it every year and we want to be able to do that.
[01:10:34.100 --> 01:10:34.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Excuse me.
[01:10:35.300 --> 01:10:36.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: If I survive.
[01:10:36.820 --> 01:10:39.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Please let us know that you are sharing stuff.
[01:10:39.780 --> 01:10:47.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: And if you come up with your own tag, let us know what that tag is so that we can find what you're sharing with people because we want to boost it as well.
[01:10:48.040 --> 01:10:50.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: And you could probably use like hope underscore 16.
[01:10:51.080 --> 01:10:54.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's probably a good one to start with or hope conference.
[01:10:54.800 --> 01:11:04.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's plenty of ways to magnify your posts or your comments or your referencing maybe some of the speaker announcements.
[01:11:05.020 --> 01:11:06.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: But it's great that we know.
[01:11:06.980 --> 01:11:08.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: We love that feedback.
[01:11:08.640 --> 01:11:12.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then we can also try to make sure other people see it through our channels.
[01:11:13.020 --> 01:11:16.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think I have the flu, but we'll find out.
[01:11:16.640 --> 01:11:19.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that won't be important to this part of the show.
[01:11:19.440 --> 01:11:21.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it will be if I don't make it to the rest of the show.
[01:11:22.040 --> 01:11:23.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you need a cough drop or something?
[01:11:23.520 --> 01:11:25.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: I already have a pocket full of cough drops.
[01:11:25.740 --> 01:11:26.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, that's not it.
[01:11:26.580 --> 01:11:26.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[01:11:27.280 --> 01:11:27.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm trying.
[01:11:28.100 --> 01:11:29.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: And water and things like that.
[01:11:29.420 --> 01:11:29.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[01:11:30.320 --> 01:11:30.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[01:11:31.860 --> 01:11:32.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: What do we got?
[01:11:33.960 --> 01:11:34.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Phone number?
[01:11:34.640 --> 01:11:34.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[01:11:35.380 --> 01:11:35.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: 802.
[01:11:35.880 --> 01:11:38.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you need like a button of peyote or something?
[01:11:38.260 --> 01:11:39.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like something, you know?
[01:11:39.360 --> 01:11:39.640]  [SPEAKER_16]: We'll talk.
[01:11:39.800 --> 01:11:40.020]  [SPEAKER_16]: We'll talk.
[01:11:40.200 --> 01:11:40.340]  [SPEAKER_16]: Okay.
[01:11:40.380 --> 01:11:40.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[01:11:41.980 --> 01:11:44.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: 802-321-4225.
[01:11:44.840 --> 01:11:45.700]  [SPEAKER_16]: Oh, sorry.
[01:11:45.900 --> 01:11:46.520]  [SPEAKER_16]: I thought I had that down.
[01:11:46.740 --> 01:11:51.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's 802-321-HACK.
[01:11:51.960 --> 01:11:52.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like you're doing.
[01:11:53.020 --> 01:11:53.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Very funny.
[01:11:53.840 --> 01:11:54.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Very funny.
[01:11:54.280 --> 01:11:58.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm glad everybody is getting such such entertainment out of this.
[01:11:59.160 --> 01:12:00.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I thought I had Lyme disease.
[01:12:00.520 --> 01:12:05.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: I did because I was aching all over and I got bitten by a tick a couple of weeks ago.
[01:12:05.120 --> 01:12:06.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I always get bitten by ticks.
[01:12:06.720 --> 01:12:07.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: They just, they like me.
[01:12:08.320 --> 01:12:18.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then, you know, I went to urgent care and they gave me this antibiotic in case I wanted to take it thinking maybe I had Lyme disease.
[01:12:18.460 --> 01:12:20.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can't tell for another month if you have it or not.
[01:12:20.420 --> 01:12:21.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, you have to test for antibodies.
[01:12:21.650 --> 01:12:22.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't have a rash.
[01:12:22.270 --> 01:12:23.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't have the telltale symptoms.
[01:12:23.940 --> 01:12:25.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: They weren't sure I even had it.
[01:12:25.650 --> 01:12:28.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I took one of those pills and it made me sick instantly.
[01:12:29.230 --> 01:12:33.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: So I stopped taking them because the next day the pain went away and now I just have a cough.
[01:12:34.330 --> 01:12:37.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: So I don't know what's going on but that's the rundown.
[01:12:38.150 --> 01:12:39.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: of me being rundown.
[01:12:39.990 --> 01:12:40.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:12:40.660 --> 01:12:43.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: So phone number 802-321-4225.
[01:12:43.650 --> 01:12:44.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're waiting for a call still.
[01:12:44.730 --> 01:12:46.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, this will be a bright point.
[01:12:46.400 --> 01:12:47.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: This will uplift you.
[01:12:47.520 --> 01:12:48.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Talk about my health more.
[01:12:48.580 --> 01:12:49.650]  [SPEAKER_13]: No, you'll feel better.
[01:12:49.740 --> 01:12:50.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:12:50.940 --> 01:12:51.230]  Yes.
[01:12:51.650 --> 01:12:58.960]  [SPEAKER_13]: So if you're out there and you have questions or comments for us or if you're perhaps a licensed medical professional with expertise in Lyme disease.
[01:12:59.540 --> 01:13:00.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't have Lyme.
[01:13:00.650 --> 01:13:01.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm pretty sure I don't have it.
[01:13:01.770 --> 01:13:03.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: I stopped taking those pills because...
[01:13:03.360 --> 01:13:05.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, that's a symptom of the flu is thinking you have Lyme disease.
[01:13:05.800 --> 01:13:07.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I imagine it is.
[01:13:07.960 --> 01:13:08.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[01:13:08.440 --> 01:13:09.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: I plugged the phone back in.
[01:13:10.290 --> 01:13:11.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: How long was it unplugged for?
[01:13:11.730 --> 01:13:14.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: I just realized because it's very noisy.
[01:13:15.950 --> 01:13:16.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: You want to take this?
[01:13:16.660 --> 01:13:19.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: We did a whole show once with it unplugged before we realized.
[01:13:19.460 --> 01:13:20.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: You want me to take this?
[01:13:20.190 --> 01:13:21.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: Before we were getting no calls.
[01:13:21.520 --> 01:13:22.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, take that.
[01:13:22.340 --> 01:13:23.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Are you sure you want me to take this?
[01:13:23.360 --> 01:13:24.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I know who it is.
[01:13:24.160 --> 01:13:25.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's get it over with.
[01:13:25.230 --> 01:13:25.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, all right.
[01:13:25.610 --> 01:13:26.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's like downing the medicine.
[01:13:26.880 --> 01:13:27.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: You have to do it.
[01:13:28.420 --> 01:13:29.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Except for when it makes you sick.
[01:13:30.790 --> 01:13:32.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, we have that hum again, Kyle.
[01:13:32.580 --> 01:13:34.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, you said there was a way to make the hum go away.
[01:13:35.700 --> 01:13:36.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, come on.
[01:13:36.460 --> 01:13:37.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: It was all right.
[01:13:37.500 --> 01:13:38.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was...
[01:13:38.060 --> 01:13:40.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: We tested it before the show again and you made the hum go away.
[01:13:40.920 --> 01:13:41.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: So how's the hum back?
[01:13:48.160 --> 01:13:48.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was coming.
[01:13:48.740 --> 01:13:49.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's not that bad.
[01:13:49.770 --> 01:13:50.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's bad enough.
[01:13:50.960 --> 01:13:51.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't understand.
[01:13:51.800 --> 01:13:52.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, hold on a second.
[01:13:53.040 --> 01:13:56.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't understand how we tested this.
[01:13:56.560 --> 01:13:57.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: There was no hum.
[01:13:57.650 --> 01:13:58.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, wait.
[01:13:58.300 --> 01:13:58.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, that's better.
[01:13:59.410 --> 01:14:00.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Just keep your hand like that.
[01:14:00.620 --> 01:14:02.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: I can't hold my hand here the whole time.
[01:14:03.270 --> 01:14:04.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Do you believe in the show or not?
[01:14:05.370 --> 01:14:05.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, no.
[01:14:06.230 --> 01:14:06.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:14:07.480 --> 01:14:07.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[01:14:08.230 --> 01:14:08.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[01:14:08.800 --> 01:14:09.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: Call her.
[01:14:09.320 --> 01:14:10.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think we hear you.
[01:14:10.150 --> 01:14:10.400]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hello?
[01:14:10.560 --> 01:14:10.730]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hello?
[01:14:10.880 --> 01:14:11.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: Can you hear me?
[01:14:12.370 --> 01:14:13.080]  [SPEAKER_17]: Way loud.
[01:14:13.240 --> 01:14:13.650]  [SPEAKER_17]: We hear you.
[01:14:18.740 --> 01:14:23.110]  [SPEAKER_09]: It should be called 2,600 gatherings instead of meetings because they're not really meetings.
[01:14:23.340 --> 01:14:28.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, we made that observation many, many years ago, but meetings is what it started...
[01:14:28.270 --> 01:14:30.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, it dates back to the TAP meetings.
[01:14:30.360 --> 01:14:37.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, the old TAP magazine because they used to have weekly meetings on Fridays in New York City and we kind of latched on to their wagon.
[01:14:38.200 --> 01:14:41.060]  [SPEAKER_09]: Wait, TAP had their meetings in 2,600 in New York City?
[01:14:41.240 --> 01:14:42.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, you're kind of late to that.
[01:14:42.650 --> 01:14:43.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, back...
[01:14:43.580 --> 01:14:45.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think the last one was in 1986.
[01:14:47.340 --> 01:14:49.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: I thought they were overseas, TAP.
[01:14:51.510 --> 01:14:52.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, TAP is not overseas.
[01:14:53.190 --> 01:14:54.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Unless you're talking about the Portuguese airline.
[01:14:55.160 --> 01:14:55.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, they're...
[01:14:57.270 --> 01:14:58.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: The hacker...
[01:14:58.060 --> 01:14:59.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it wasn't a hacker magazine.
[01:14:59.360 --> 01:15:07.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was kind of like an anarchist slash technology slash phone phreak newsletter that came out in the early 1970s to 80s.
[01:15:07.540 --> 01:15:08.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: Do they have a website?
[01:15:08.800 --> 01:15:10.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, I'd like to see what that was like.
[01:15:10.610 --> 01:15:14.860]  [SPEAKER_09]: But anyway, is there going to be a 2600 meeting on July or gathering on July 4th?
[01:15:15.710 --> 01:15:18.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, July 4th is a Friday?
[01:15:19.120 --> 01:15:19.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Mm-hmm.
[01:15:19.660 --> 01:15:19.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:15:20.110 --> 01:15:20.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, wow.
[01:15:20.610 --> 01:15:20.980]  [SPEAKER_09]: Friday, July 4th.
[01:15:21.160 --> 01:15:22.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: Did not know that.
[01:15:22.880 --> 01:15:24.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, yeah, I don't know.
[01:15:24.340 --> 01:15:27.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: It depends on if, uh, the, uh, the, uh, city group building is open.
[01:15:28.080 --> 01:15:32.150]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, if it's not, we'll have the 2,600 gathering the next Friday.
[01:15:32.340 --> 01:15:35.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: So, it'll be like, the next Friday is the first Friday.
[01:15:36.270 --> 01:15:38.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, the next Friday is July 11th.
[01:15:38.200 --> 01:15:39.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's not the first Friday.
[01:15:39.950 --> 01:15:44.460]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, but being that, you know, things will be closed on July 4th...
[01:15:44.460 --> 01:15:45.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we haven't established that.
[01:15:47.830 --> 01:15:48.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: We don't know that.
[01:15:49.040 --> 01:15:50.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: We need to go and find out.
[01:15:51.040 --> 01:15:52.160]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, but it's a holiday.
[01:15:52.420 --> 01:15:53.420]  [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, it's a regular holiday.
[01:15:53.610 --> 01:15:55.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, I can't find out and get back to the next week.
[01:15:55.700 --> 01:15:56.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: things aren't open on holidays.
[01:15:57.120 --> 01:15:58.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: Things are always open on holidays.
[01:15:58.560 --> 01:16:00.800]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, I mean, not that kind of holiday.
[01:16:01.020 --> 01:16:02.110]  [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, it's a regular holiday.
[01:16:02.280 --> 01:16:06.040]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, last Friday was June 13th and things were closed.
[01:16:06.240 --> 01:16:06.580]  [SPEAKER_09]: Wait, wait.
[01:16:06.580 --> 01:16:09.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everything, but... June 13th is just, what, Friday the 13th?
[01:16:09.500 --> 01:16:10.610]  [SPEAKER_18]: Things are closed for that?
[01:16:10.880 --> 01:16:11.730]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, Juneteenth.
[01:16:12.020 --> 01:16:12.700]  [SPEAKER_17]: Got a new holiday.
[01:16:12.920 --> 01:16:13.320]  [SPEAKER_17]: Juneteenth.
[01:16:13.500 --> 01:16:14.560]  [SPEAKER_17]: Juneteenth is tomorrow.
[01:16:15.660 --> 01:16:17.280]  [SPEAKER_17]: No, it's June 13th.
[01:16:17.520 --> 01:16:18.940]  [SPEAKER_17]: No, it's June 19th.
[01:16:19.150 --> 01:16:21.690]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it's June... I don't know where you're getting your information from.
[01:16:24.800 --> 01:16:30.100]  [SPEAKER_09]: Okay, would you like me to see if the Citico building is going to be open on July 5th?
[01:16:30.140 --> 01:16:31.160]  [SPEAKER_09]: I doubt it is.
[01:16:31.620 --> 01:16:34.800]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I will contact them and check.
[01:16:34.800 --> 01:16:45.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: But I believe, going by what's happened on previous federal holidays, the atrium will be open, because it is still a privately owned public space, which means they have to be open at reasonable hours.
[01:16:45.560 --> 01:16:48.100]  [SPEAKER_13]: But the restaurants inside may not be as open.
[01:16:48.220 --> 01:16:49.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: I don't know who will...
[01:16:49.520 --> 01:16:58.420]  [SPEAKER_09]: So then why did we have to go on to 2,600 gathering from New Year's Day to the next week, one time?
[01:16:58.620 --> 01:16:59.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: New Year's Day is a holiday.
[01:17:00.360 --> 01:17:01.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it's a real holiday.
[01:17:02.460 --> 01:17:04.220]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, well, July 4th is.
[01:17:04.220 --> 01:17:07.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Eh, maybe.
[01:17:07.180 --> 01:17:10.360]  [SPEAKER_13]: But July 4th is also a day where people go out and hang out and stuff.
[01:17:10.360 --> 01:17:12.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: And what better day to have a 2600 meeting?
[01:17:12.240 --> 01:17:16.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: And those are probably not going to be snowy on July 4th, as it may be on January 1st.
[01:17:16.380 --> 01:17:17.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, I'm not going to be there.
[01:17:17.500 --> 01:17:23.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, I'm leaving for the Far East on, like, the 15th or the 16th of July.
[01:17:23.280 --> 01:17:24.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was going to suggest that, actually.
[01:17:24.660 --> 01:17:25.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, good.
[01:17:25.820 --> 01:17:27.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And how far east will you be going?
[01:17:30.300 --> 01:17:31.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: How far am I?
[01:17:31.740 --> 01:17:35.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: I'm going, like, the middle to the end of July.
[01:17:36.220 --> 01:17:38.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, we're asking where you're going.
[01:17:38.040 --> 01:17:46.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, going to, um, to Nova, to, um, I'm going to, uh, I'm going to, uh, Uzbekistan, Tashkent, Uzbekistan.
[01:17:46.400 --> 01:17:52.420]  [SPEAKER_09]: And then I'm going from there to Novosibirsk, Russia, which is the third largest city in Russia.
[01:17:52.740 --> 01:18:00.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: Being that I've been to the first and second, you know, first largest city and second largest city in Russia, I want to visit the third largest city in Russia.
[01:18:01.320 --> 01:18:03.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Are you going to visit every city in Russia until you're done?
[01:18:04.640 --> 01:18:06.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, no, I'm not going to visit every city in Russia.
[01:18:06.560 --> 01:18:07.820]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's just too much of a pain.
[01:18:08.020 --> 01:18:11.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: I just wanted to know what the first, the third city in Russia was like.
[01:18:11.500 --> 01:18:22.800]  [SPEAKER_09]: And the fact that, you know, I'll be, like, 11 hours ahead of New York City and, you know, two, three hundred miles from China and three hundred miles from Afghanistan and, you know.
[01:18:24.740 --> 01:18:27.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, no, that's, that sounds, that sounds fascinating.
[01:18:33.260 --> 01:18:35.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is the loudest I've ever heard Rebel, by the way.
[01:18:36.100 --> 01:18:38.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't recall him ever being this loud.
[01:18:38.820 --> 01:18:39.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think it's him.
[01:18:39.800 --> 01:18:40.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think it's us.
[01:18:40.380 --> 01:18:41.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think we improved our sound.
[01:18:44.840 --> 01:18:45.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex has a point.
[01:18:46.100 --> 01:18:47.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please let Alex say something.
[01:18:49.180 --> 01:18:52.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Alex, can you hear me?
[01:18:54.860 --> 01:18:57.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can you hear Alex Rebel?
[01:18:58.000 --> 01:18:59.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: I can't hear Alex.
[01:18:59.480 --> 01:19:00.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, he's kind of mumbling.
[01:19:00.880 --> 01:19:02.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: So Alex, speak up and speak closer to a microphone.
[01:19:03.360 --> 01:19:05.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, did anybody else not think this was Rebel?
[01:19:05.180 --> 01:19:05.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why didn't you tell anybody?
[01:19:06.440 --> 01:19:07.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, my God.
[01:19:07.940 --> 01:19:08.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let him speak.
[01:19:08.860 --> 01:19:09.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:19:09.280 --> 01:19:09.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead, Alex.
[01:19:10.300 --> 01:19:13.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Did anybody else not think this was Rebel when he started talking?
[01:19:13.880 --> 01:19:14.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't think it was him.
[01:19:14.580 --> 01:19:16.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: He sounded a little different.
[01:19:16.140 --> 01:19:18.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, but it could be because of the incredible volume.
[01:19:19.840 --> 01:19:21.180]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, maybe.
[01:19:21.560 --> 01:19:23.120]  [SPEAKER_09]: I did not hear what he said.
[01:19:24.020 --> 01:19:25.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is weird.
[01:19:25.820 --> 01:19:27.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, is this just Rebel?
[01:19:27.300 --> 01:19:28.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rebel that can't hear other people?
[01:19:28.460 --> 01:19:29.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rob, you say something.
[01:19:29.360 --> 01:19:30.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: See if he can hear you.
[01:19:30.940 --> 01:19:31.900]  [SPEAKER_09]: Rebel, you hear me, dude?
[01:19:32.520 --> 01:19:33.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: Rob, I can hear.
[01:19:33.700 --> 01:19:34.480]  [SPEAKER_09]: Rob, I can hear.
[01:19:34.680 --> 01:19:36.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, Alex, what the hell, Alex?
[01:19:37.160 --> 01:19:38.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: You got to be more like Rob.
[01:19:38.920 --> 01:19:39.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: I don't know.
[01:19:39.540 --> 01:19:40.660]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, Alex, be more like Rob.
[01:19:40.940 --> 01:19:42.280]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, Alex, be more like Rob.
[01:19:42.480 --> 01:19:43.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or be more like Rebel.
[01:19:45.200 --> 01:19:46.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everybody here is loud.
[01:19:46.860 --> 01:19:48.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everybody here is loud except for Alex.
[01:19:48.900 --> 01:19:49.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex, you need to be louder.
[01:19:50.420 --> 01:19:52.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why am I always the one with audio problems?
[01:19:52.400 --> 01:19:53.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is really annoying.
[01:19:53.080 --> 01:19:53.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know.
[01:19:53.740 --> 01:19:54.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's your audio.
[01:19:54.840 --> 01:19:55.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: You got to figure that out.
[01:19:56.020 --> 01:19:57.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: We should test it on another call.
[01:19:57.460 --> 01:19:59.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe you should call in and talk to Rebel that way.
[01:20:00.080 --> 01:20:01.100]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, exactly.
[01:20:01.320 --> 01:20:02.440]  [SPEAKER_09]: Rebel, let me give you my phone number.
[01:20:02.720 --> 01:20:05.120]  [SPEAKER_09]: You know, I really still can't believe you can't figure this out.
[01:20:05.940 --> 01:20:06.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Figure what out?
[01:20:06.840 --> 01:20:07.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: We figured it out.
[01:20:07.540 --> 01:20:09.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: You sound better than you ever sounded before.
[01:20:10.040 --> 01:20:11.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: And no thanks at all.
[01:20:11.560 --> 01:20:11.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:20:12.060 --> 01:20:12.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: What about Alex?
[01:20:12.620 --> 01:20:15.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, we can't control other human beings, all right?
[01:20:15.500 --> 01:20:17.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's in a totally different part of the world.
[01:20:17.520 --> 01:20:18.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know what the hell he's using.
[01:20:19.240 --> 01:20:19.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's right.
[01:20:19.880 --> 01:20:22.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I'm going to have cats at the moment.
[01:20:22.400 --> 01:20:23.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're both next...
[01:20:23.620 --> 01:20:26.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: All of them are on the same damn signal screen, okay?
[01:20:26.620 --> 01:20:31.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, Gila and Rob, you can hear, but you can't hear Alex.
[01:20:31.420 --> 01:20:32.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, I don't understand what the problem is.
[01:20:32.200 --> 01:20:32.960]  [SPEAKER_09]: Maybe because he's in London.
[01:20:33.200 --> 01:20:33.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: Is he in London?
[01:20:34.100 --> 01:20:35.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, he seems to be...
[01:20:35.440 --> 01:20:36.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hang on, where does he look like?
[01:20:36.820 --> 01:20:39.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: It looks like, to me, like he is in Manhattan.
[01:20:41.080 --> 01:20:42.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it could be wrong.
[01:20:42.240 --> 01:20:42.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is that right?
[01:20:43.000 --> 01:20:43.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:20:43.500 --> 01:20:44.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: That could be it right there.
[01:20:45.800 --> 01:20:46.740]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that's the problem.
[01:20:47.140 --> 01:20:49.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: You know, these New York Internet...
[01:20:49.080 --> 01:20:50.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, maybe we should just...
[01:20:50.140 --> 01:20:53.480]  [SPEAKER_09]: Maybe we should just get telephones, you know, instead of this, you know, signal thing.
[01:20:53.600 --> 01:20:59.660]  [SPEAKER_09]: Just, you know, get a telephone and just, you know, use call for use phone smart features and, you know, things like that.
[01:20:59.740 --> 01:21:00.920]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yeah, you'd like that, wouldn't you?
[01:21:02.000 --> 01:21:03.680]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, I am on a 14-4.
[01:21:03.860 --> 01:21:05.540]  [SPEAKER_17]: I would, too, actually, but...
[01:21:05.540 --> 01:21:10.660]  [SPEAKER_09]: Why don't you get an asterisk system?
[01:21:11.980 --> 01:21:13.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's about 30 years late.
[01:21:14.020 --> 01:21:15.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, yeah, you could do that.
[01:21:18.840 --> 01:21:23.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: There should be something that helps like that, the people making phone systems and...
[01:21:23.080 --> 01:21:25.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm just glad we have a connection with no hum.
[01:21:26.800 --> 01:21:27.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Mm-hmm.
[01:21:29.040 --> 01:21:29.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let's just listen to it.
[01:21:30.010 --> 01:21:31.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I mean, it's a slight hum, but it's fine.
[01:21:32.120 --> 01:21:34.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the voice is much louder than the hum.
[01:21:34.220 --> 01:21:37.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: We could build something, but we've built a lot.
[01:21:38.310 --> 01:21:43.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, yeah, that takes volunteers, it takes interest, it takes resources.
[01:21:43.160 --> 01:21:52.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we really got to have attendees that want to volunteer and want to be a part of, like, a conference phone network that we set up.
[01:21:52.230 --> 01:21:55.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's totally not out of the realm of possibility.
[01:21:55.130 --> 01:22:11.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: If people want to do that, but they got to get their tickets, they got to register, they got to create a group on the wiki, they got to wrangle different people, because we're getting volunteers, we're getting... we want to get people together, get them talking,
[01:22:11.630 --> 01:22:15.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: get them coordinating, setting up, being self-directed.
[01:22:15.510 --> 01:22:17.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that's absolutely part of it.
[01:22:18.010 --> 01:22:26.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: So volunteer, talk to other people who are volunteering, check out the wiki, create a project like that.
[01:22:26.850 --> 01:22:32.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe you have a lot of phones, maybe you have a tiny microcontroller that could run a PBX.
[01:22:33.010 --> 01:22:34.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, it doesn't take that much anymore.
[01:22:34.810 --> 01:22:37.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: We are in an age that...
[01:22:37.470 --> 01:22:40.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: there is a wealth of processing power.
[01:22:40.500 --> 01:22:51.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: The kinds of equipment you needed to run that in the past would have, you know, occupied the entirety of someone's trunk in their car.
[01:22:51.420 --> 01:22:55.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now you can probably fit it in your pocket and show up.
[01:22:56.880 --> 01:23:00.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe not breaking it out into twisted pair.
[01:23:00.470 --> 01:23:12.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: But if you know anyone, if anyone out there is interested and you think, hey, we could run some twisted pair around and set up extensions and do that, by all means, we would love to have that.
[01:23:13.780 --> 01:23:17.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: And as far as doing it here on the show, it does take...
[01:23:17.730 --> 01:23:21.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: it does take a fair amount of wrangling.
[01:23:21.810 --> 01:23:30.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I would like help on stuff like that so that it isn't on any one person's shoulders.
[01:23:30.500 --> 01:23:32.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that extends to the conference as well.
[01:23:32.430 --> 01:23:34.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have an incredible network team.
[01:23:34.260 --> 01:23:44.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have a lot of enthusiasm, but they're tasked with setting up what network that will be there to support attendees.
[01:23:45.000 --> 01:23:47.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we have to augment a lot of that.
[01:23:47.170 --> 01:23:47.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have to offload it.
[01:23:47.970 --> 01:23:51.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: We need people to sort of load balance one another and delegate.
[01:23:51.390 --> 01:23:52.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: So it takes volunteers.
[01:23:52.850 --> 01:23:53.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: It takes interest.
[01:23:53.920 --> 01:23:59.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it's a lot of fun to be working on all this and to build this community and to meet all kinds of people.
[01:23:59.580 --> 01:24:01.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we're very open to all kinds of projects.
[01:24:01.920 --> 01:24:03.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: We've got a lockpick village.
[01:24:03.130 --> 01:24:10.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: We've got all kinds of displays and vendors and people who are very enthusiastic coming to the conference.
[01:24:10.630 --> 01:24:14.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: So it's all sorts of possibilities.
[01:24:14.300 --> 01:24:16.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it makes all kinds of other things possible.
[01:24:16.220 --> 01:24:17.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's really magical.
[01:24:17.390 --> 01:24:19.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's been magical since 1994 when we had the first one.
[01:24:20.400 --> 01:24:23.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex has something to say, but he's not going to be heard by Rebel.
[01:24:23.200 --> 01:24:25.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: But what we'll do is we'll transcribe what you say.
[01:24:25.300 --> 01:24:33.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: I just want to say, if people can set up a PBX and it fits in a box of cereal, that's the challenge.
[01:24:33.730 --> 01:24:36.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: The entirety of it fits in a box of cereal.
[01:24:36.540 --> 01:24:37.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'll be impressed.
[01:24:37.810 --> 01:24:39.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: Like a single serving box of cereal?
[01:24:39.590 --> 01:24:40.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, like just a box of cereal.
[01:24:40.840 --> 01:24:50.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you can fit all the equipment for your PBX for Hope, if you can fit it all in a box of cereal, there's the challenge.
[01:24:50.470 --> 01:24:51.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: Without the cereal in it.
[01:24:51.550 --> 01:24:52.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: Take the cereal out.
[01:24:52.270 --> 01:24:53.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, take the cereal out.
[01:24:53.090 --> 01:24:55.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: But it could be any kind of...
[01:24:55.700 --> 01:24:57.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: It doesn't have to be Crunch or anything.
[01:24:57.130 --> 01:24:58.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: It could be all kinds of different...
[01:24:58.630 --> 01:24:59.470]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, it should be Captain Crunch.
[01:24:59.470 --> 01:25:02.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, if you want to be cheeky...
[01:25:02.380 --> 01:25:03.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: Closest thing to a phone phreak cereal.
[01:25:03.590 --> 01:25:04.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Your favorite cereal.
[01:25:04.970 --> 01:25:05.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right.
[01:25:05.380 --> 01:25:08.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: And yeah, and we'll run all the lines into that.
[01:25:09.000 --> 01:25:10.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Lucky Charms, you could do that.
[01:25:10.230 --> 01:25:12.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's where it will just store it.
[01:25:12.550 --> 01:25:14.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that will be the centralized location.
[01:25:14.810 --> 01:25:15.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: Honey bunches of oats, maybe?
[01:25:16.130 --> 01:25:16.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[01:25:16.620 --> 01:25:18.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, yeah, that's the gauntlet.
[01:25:18.160 --> 01:25:18.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Throw down.
[01:25:18.920 --> 01:25:19.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:25:19.920 --> 01:25:21.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex, say whatever you have to say.
[01:25:22.040 --> 01:25:24.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if Rebel can't hear you, we will say it louder.
[01:25:24.820 --> 01:25:28.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: The question was, really, Rebel, can you hear me now?
[01:25:30.180 --> 01:25:31.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: He cannot hear you now.
[01:25:31.720 --> 01:25:32.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: He's pretending.
[01:25:32.380 --> 01:25:32.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[01:25:33.040 --> 01:25:33.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe he's pretending.
[01:25:34.230 --> 01:25:35.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's no way to know.
[01:25:35.500 --> 01:25:38.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Or he could be, you know, off dialing another line or something.
[01:25:38.550 --> 01:25:39.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rebel, you are there, right?
[01:25:40.470 --> 01:25:42.220]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, and I cannot hear Alex.
[01:25:42.420 --> 01:25:45.010]  [SPEAKER_09]: I heard Kyle I hear, but not Alex.
[01:25:45.160 --> 01:25:45.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:25:45.470 --> 01:25:48.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe you just have an Alex, like, impediment.
[01:25:48.800 --> 01:25:49.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[01:25:49.380 --> 01:25:50.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: You wouldn't be the first.
[01:25:50.460 --> 01:25:53.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: But Alex, say what you're going to say so we can tell Rebel what you're going to say.
[01:25:53.760 --> 01:25:54.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, that was it.
[01:25:54.700 --> 01:25:55.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: What was it?
[01:25:55.620 --> 01:25:56.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: You didn't say anything.
[01:25:56.760 --> 01:25:58.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: I had another call here.
[01:25:58.230 --> 01:25:59.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: You didn't say anything.
[01:26:00.860 --> 01:26:01.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I said.
[01:26:01.760 --> 01:26:02.390]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can't hear me?
[01:26:03.260 --> 01:26:04.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's what you said?
[01:26:04.090 --> 01:26:04.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can't hear me?
[01:26:05.420 --> 01:26:06.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, my goodness.
[01:26:06.670 --> 01:26:06.850]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wait.
[01:26:07.600 --> 01:26:09.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: What did you want to say to Rebel?
[01:26:09.840 --> 01:26:11.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is so ridiculously confusing.
[01:26:12.700 --> 01:26:13.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: What did you...
[01:26:13.730 --> 01:26:17.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Just now, what was it you wanted to say that Rebel couldn't hear?
[01:26:18.020 --> 01:26:20.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: I was just asking him if he could hear me.
[01:26:20.220 --> 01:26:20.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: That was it.
[01:26:20.720 --> 01:26:21.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's it?
[01:26:21.270 --> 01:26:22.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's all you have to say?
[01:26:22.930 --> 01:26:23.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: That was it.
[01:26:23.760 --> 01:26:25.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: That was the only question to him.
[01:26:25.040 --> 01:26:26.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're the Verizon guy?
[01:26:26.590 --> 01:26:27.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can you hear me now?
[01:26:27.810 --> 01:26:28.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's all you say?
[01:26:29.980 --> 01:26:32.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to prolong this misery.
[01:26:32.840 --> 01:26:33.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Nobody does.
[01:26:34.010 --> 01:26:34.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Nobody does.
[01:26:34.800 --> 01:26:35.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm sorry.
[01:26:35.200 --> 01:26:35.970]  [SPEAKER_18]: Gila, you had something?
[01:26:36.430 --> 01:26:38.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, I was saying exactly what you were saying.
[01:26:38.720 --> 01:26:42.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: That he was doing his oppression of the Verizon guy.
[01:26:42.260 --> 01:26:47.120]  [SPEAKER_12]: I do want to thank the 49 listeners who are hanging in with us through this.
[01:26:48.860 --> 01:26:49.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: We appreciate it.
[01:26:49.760 --> 01:26:52.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're hearing, overall, that everybody sounds good.
[01:26:53.540 --> 01:26:56.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: We're hearing from YouTube listeners that Alex is audible.
[01:26:58.000 --> 01:27:02.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: General consensus, Alex, is that your sound is always a little off.
[01:27:02.930 --> 01:27:04.390]  [SPEAKER_09]: Why do we only have 49 listeners?
[01:27:04.390 --> 01:27:05.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: We should have hundreds.
[01:27:05.730 --> 01:27:06.270]  [SPEAKER_09]: I agree with you.
[01:27:06.270 --> 01:27:06.970]  [SPEAKER_18]: We only have 53.
[01:27:07.430 --> 01:27:09.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go out and get us some listeners.
[01:27:09.680 --> 01:27:11.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Again, people don't know about us.
[01:27:11.730 --> 01:27:13.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is impatient, Rebel.
[01:27:13.760 --> 01:27:14.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, he's right.
[01:27:14.770 --> 01:27:15.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: I like it.
[01:27:15.460 --> 01:27:16.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: We should have hundreds.
[01:27:16.460 --> 01:27:17.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, nay, thousands.
[01:27:17.510 --> 01:27:18.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: Did I say nay?
[01:27:18.130 --> 01:27:20.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: We should have thousands of listeners.
[01:27:20.620 --> 01:27:21.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why not?
[01:27:21.470 --> 01:27:23.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: How many years have you been in business?
[01:27:23.670 --> 01:27:25.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everyone has heard of the radio show.
[01:27:26.120 --> 01:27:27.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everyone has heard of the conference.
[01:27:27.800 --> 01:27:28.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everyone's heard of the magazine.
[01:27:29.200 --> 01:27:33.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we can't reach people because nobody knows how to communicate anymore.
[01:27:34.280 --> 01:27:35.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: People don't even use email.
[01:27:35.760 --> 01:27:36.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't get it.
[01:27:36.740 --> 01:27:39.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, if you don't use email, how do you communicate?
[01:27:39.630 --> 01:27:41.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're not sending postcards.
[01:27:41.780 --> 01:27:43.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're not calling each other on the telephone.
[01:27:43.940 --> 01:27:45.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: You don't know each other's phone numbers.
[01:27:45.220 --> 01:27:48.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: I just think a lot of us are just not communicating.
[01:27:48.880 --> 01:27:50.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: So we need to improve on that.
[01:27:50.780 --> 01:28:00.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if there is a big, massive hacker group that, you know, I'm not aware of, everybody's talking and connecting, please spread the word about hope there.
[01:28:00.220 --> 01:28:01.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: That would be a very nice thing to do.
[01:28:04.060 --> 01:28:04.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:28:04.820 --> 01:28:06.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anyway, Rebel, we're going to move on.
[01:28:06.220 --> 01:28:07.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: But this has been delightful.
[01:28:07.300 --> 01:28:07.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:28:07.900 --> 01:28:08.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:28:08.960 --> 01:28:09.360]  [SPEAKER_09]: Okay.
[01:28:09.590 --> 01:28:10.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: We'll talk to you later.
[01:28:11.170 --> 01:28:11.620]  [SPEAKER_09]: Okay, bye.
[01:28:11.900 --> 01:28:12.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bye.
[01:28:15.300 --> 01:28:16.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was really too easy.
[01:28:16.820 --> 01:28:18.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Did you slam the phone down like that, Kyle?
[01:28:19.600 --> 01:28:21.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: I dropped the handset, yeah.
[01:28:21.880 --> 01:28:22.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:28:23.660 --> 01:28:25.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:28:25.170 --> 01:28:25.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Sorry, go ahead.
[01:28:26.120 --> 01:28:34.050]  [SPEAKER_12]: We did have a listener ask us if, because the hum stopped when, Kyle, you had your hand over on the switch.
[01:28:34.050 --> 01:28:35.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: So someone asked if we're taking calls on a theremin.
[01:28:37.500 --> 01:28:40.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: I think that might be a fun exercise.
[01:28:40.940 --> 01:28:43.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, well, we're open to all sorts of possibilities.
[01:28:43.840 --> 01:28:44.740]  [SPEAKER_12]: We've got our theremin going.
[01:28:45.050 --> 01:28:50.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225 is our phone number if you want to be a part of this, whatever this is.
[01:28:51.380 --> 01:29:02.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: And big thanks to our friend, Lex, who just shared the overtime link on Mastodon to try to get more people over here.
[01:29:02.440 --> 01:29:04.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: So thank you for that, Lex.
[01:29:04.280 --> 01:29:05.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: We appreciate it.
[01:29:06.920 --> 01:29:09.460]  [SPEAKER_12]: And now it's been boosted from the show.
[01:29:09.460 --> 01:29:11.260]  [SPEAKER_12]: So that's all very exciting.
[01:29:13.220 --> 01:29:32.780]  [SPEAKER_13]: I will throw in here while we're waiting for another caller at 802-321-HACK that if you'd like to do something else to help us out, you could always go to buddy.wbai.org and help keep our radio station home doing what it does and help keep us doing what we do.
[01:29:32.780 --> 01:29:35.620]  [SPEAKER_13]: So fundraising is crucial.
[01:29:36.280 --> 01:29:43.760]  [SPEAKER_13]: The WBAI buddy system gives us a dependable income at WBAI, which is amazing in the nonprofit world.
[01:29:44.020 --> 01:29:50.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: And the listeners, you listeners, are the only thing that's kept the station going for 60 years now.
[01:29:50.440 --> 01:29:54.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let me just, Stet, when you say gives us an income, we do not get a penny.
[01:29:55.200 --> 01:30:01.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: It all goes to the radio station to keep the station on the air, to pay the bills, that kind of thing.
[01:30:02.040 --> 01:30:02.720]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yes, indeed.
[01:30:02.860 --> 01:30:04.720]  [SPEAKER_13]: We're all volunteers, the bunch of us.
[01:30:04.880 --> 01:30:05.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: Very much volunteers.
[01:30:05.660 --> 01:30:21.440]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I would like to point out that if WBAI stops existing or decides that Off The Hook isn't pulling its weight and cancels us, overtime's going away too.
[01:30:21.440 --> 01:30:24.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: Because if there's no regular time, there's no overtime.
[01:30:24.620 --> 01:30:30.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, if you enjoy having this experience, it might behoove you to support the show as well.
[01:30:31.020 --> 01:30:33.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Are there people that only listen to overtime and don't listen to Off The Hook?
[01:30:34.780 --> 01:30:36.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: But huge numbers.
[01:30:36.460 --> 01:30:39.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: There are people who live outside of our radio catchment.
[01:30:39.040 --> 01:30:40.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: How am I supposed to interpret that?
[01:30:42.240 --> 01:30:45.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, there are people who live outside of our radio catchment area.
[01:30:45.340 --> 01:30:46.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right, but on the Internet.
[01:30:46.720 --> 01:30:48.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that solves that problem.
[01:30:49.120 --> 01:30:55.080]  [SPEAKER_13]: There are also YouTubers who sail in the course of their YouTubing and just catch this aspect of what we're doing.
[01:30:55.400 --> 01:30:55.400]  Hold on.
[01:30:55.400 --> 01:31:05.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: A YouTuber does not listen to other audio sources such as WBAI.org, which plays the live stream of our show.
[01:31:05.920 --> 01:31:08.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: A YouTuber only hears things that are on YouTube.
[01:31:09.860 --> 01:31:12.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think it's possible that some folks put that description.
[01:31:12.940 --> 01:31:14.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Just want to understand how it works.
[01:31:14.520 --> 01:31:18.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't think there's rules, but I think there's people that think that YouTube is just...
[01:31:18.700 --> 01:31:19.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is the Internet.
[01:31:19.740 --> 01:31:20.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's just YouTube.
[01:31:21.460 --> 01:31:22.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I agree.
[01:31:22.590 --> 01:31:24.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can get lost in that world.
[01:31:24.840 --> 01:31:34.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: But it also does kind of remind me of when I was in high school, and there were people who didn't go to the prom, but went to after prom.
[01:31:36.920 --> 01:31:37.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:31:37.700 --> 01:31:38.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm just saying.
[01:31:38.720 --> 01:31:40.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you didn't have to buy a ticket, I guess, right?
[01:31:42.000 --> 01:31:43.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: You had to buy a ticket for after prom.
[01:31:44.000 --> 01:31:46.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, what's the difference between after prom and prom, then?
[01:31:47.140 --> 01:31:51.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, prom was the dance, and after prom was like the lock-in at our high school, so no one died of drunk driving.
[01:31:52.200 --> 01:31:52.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, no.
[01:31:52.860 --> 01:31:55.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: We just did the driving and went to a beach or something.
[01:31:56.980 --> 01:31:57.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: No ticket involved.
[01:31:58.240 --> 01:32:00.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, actually, there was a ticket involved, but a different kind of ticket.
[01:32:01.600 --> 01:32:02.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't want to get into that.
[01:32:03.400 --> 01:32:06.660]  [SPEAKER_12]: We also are, by the way, getting notes from a couple of listeners.
[01:32:07.640 --> 01:32:08.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: The WBAI stream is bad.
[01:32:08.960 --> 01:32:19.320]  [SPEAKER_12]: It cuts out a lot, so people will catch us via 2600, you know, through our archive or podcast feed or whatever the next day.
[01:32:19.360 --> 01:32:22.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, so we record it locally, and then we have it posted.
[01:32:22.500 --> 01:32:23.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's up right now, in fact.
[01:32:23.670 --> 01:32:26.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know what you're listening to us for, because you could listen to us before.
[01:32:28.980 --> 01:32:30.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're less tired, then.
[01:32:30.220 --> 01:32:36.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: The station has been rearranging some things, and they do have some consistency problems with their stream, but they're aware of it.
[01:32:36.630 --> 01:32:38.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: They do the best that they can.
[01:32:39.120 --> 01:32:50.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: We've noticed it on, like, smart devices, if you stream, because we monitor some occasionally, and other methods as well.
[01:32:50.660 --> 01:32:55.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Although, I think their main page stream is pretty good most of the time, but we obviously...
[01:32:55.670 --> 01:32:56.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's not one that we...
[01:32:56.820 --> 01:32:58.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: It cut off for us before when we would monitor.
[01:32:58.120 --> 01:32:59.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right, but we don't...
[01:32:59.380 --> 01:33:04.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, we use it on other devices, and it cuts off, but other...
[01:33:04.000 --> 01:33:11.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: But we could use, like, a main page stream, but we haven't typically used the main page audio for monitoring.
[01:33:11.820 --> 01:33:12.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe we should.
[01:33:12.740 --> 01:33:17.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think we've done it as a backup, but it's not as readily available.
[01:33:19.140 --> 01:33:22.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: But try as many methods as you can to get a live copy.
[01:33:22.700 --> 01:33:24.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: It would be good if they solved that problem.
[01:33:24.120 --> 01:33:27.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know what the issue is, why it's taking so long to figure it out.
[01:33:27.200 --> 01:33:29.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: There are real companies there that are...
[01:33:29.620 --> 01:33:33.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: That station is paying for service, so it should be working.
[01:33:33.340 --> 01:33:45.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: All the more reason to donate and make sure that engineering is staffed and available, and their providers are happy with the station as customers.
[01:33:46.120 --> 01:33:56.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, yeah, it's understood that people might have some qualms or just some complaints about the reliability of it, but they really do the best they can.
[01:33:56.590 --> 01:33:59.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: And ordinarily, it's somewhat...
[01:33:59.080 --> 01:34:00.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's listenable.
[01:34:01.060 --> 01:34:02.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is there something wrong with our phone?
[01:34:02.630 --> 01:34:03.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because nobody's calling.
[01:34:04.520 --> 01:34:06.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: 802-321-4225.
[01:34:07.380 --> 01:34:09.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, but there's nobody on it, right?
[01:34:09.050 --> 01:34:10.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because it's unusual for the phone not to ring.
[01:34:11.160 --> 01:34:15.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: We are taking calls, and the line is open at present.
[01:34:15.900 --> 01:34:18.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: You won't catch what I have if that's what you're worried about.
[01:34:18.860 --> 01:34:20.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because I don't know what I have.
[01:34:20.340 --> 01:34:21.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's...
[01:34:23.060 --> 01:34:24.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:34:26.180 --> 01:34:28.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: You want to share that with us, Gila?
[01:34:28.480 --> 01:34:29.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Whatever you find so amusing?
[01:34:31.480 --> 01:34:37.620]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, people are talking about, you know, joining us for the live show, for the live stream, whatever.
[01:34:38.720 --> 01:34:42.920]  [SPEAKER_12]: And Funsox just chimed in and said, I'm only here to make Gila giggle live on stream.
[01:34:43.090 --> 01:34:43.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's easy.
[01:34:44.460 --> 01:34:46.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: All you have to do is say that and you start giggling?
[01:34:46.800 --> 01:34:47.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: I was entertained.
[01:34:48.820 --> 01:34:49.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: Wow.
[01:34:50.160 --> 01:34:50.580]  [SPEAKER_12]: But...
[01:34:53.480 --> 01:34:56.720]  [SPEAKER_12]: People always thought I'd be easier to make laugh than I was.
[01:34:57.120 --> 01:34:58.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I...
[01:34:58.220 --> 01:35:01.630]  [SPEAKER_12]: They could never get me in how to, like, make your counselor laugh at camp.
[01:35:01.780 --> 01:35:02.900]  [SPEAKER_12]: They could never, ever get me.
[01:35:03.840 --> 01:35:05.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's harder than you might think.
[01:35:07.200 --> 01:35:12.780]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think you might have to explain what you just said for people who don't know what the hell you're talking about.
[01:35:14.920 --> 01:35:16.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, and we're just going to...
[01:35:16.540 --> 01:35:18.340]  [SPEAKER_12]: You're going to get this story unless somebody else calls in.
[01:35:19.760 --> 01:35:21.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: So, there's this thing that...
[01:35:21.420 --> 01:35:36.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: It was an activity we would do at camp, the summer camp that I attended and worked at, where you'd try to make your counselors laugh and all the staff would be sitting there with water in their mouths and everybody was assigned a different point level and you'd try to make them laugh.
[01:35:36.280 --> 01:35:41.130]  [SPEAKER_12]: And the way you could determine that was if they spat out the water they had in their mouth.
[01:35:41.130 --> 01:35:47.500]  [SPEAKER_12]: And I was always assigned a very low point value because people assumed it was really, really, really easy to make me laugh.
[01:35:49.600 --> 01:35:52.200]  [SPEAKER_12]: And they all failed miserably every time.
[01:35:54.680 --> 01:35:55.360]  [SPEAKER_12]: I can...
[01:35:55.360 --> 01:35:56.550]  [SPEAKER_12]: When I put my mind to it, I can do it.
[01:35:57.140 --> 01:35:58.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: This is why we need a phone call.
[01:35:58.550 --> 01:36:00.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is it possible the ringer is off, Kyle?
[01:36:04.830 --> 01:36:05.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: No?
[01:36:07.210 --> 01:36:07.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: No.
[01:36:07.830 --> 01:36:08.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're just not getting any calls.
[01:36:09.770 --> 01:36:10.130]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
[01:36:10.390 --> 01:36:10.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:36:10.710 --> 01:36:11.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: We'll give it another couple of minutes.
[01:36:11.890 --> 01:36:15.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think we always have to say, we're going to go in a couple of minutes unless we get a call.
[01:36:15.470 --> 01:36:17.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that gets the calls to come in.
[01:36:17.150 --> 01:36:18.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:36:19.110 --> 01:36:21.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: So we'll give it until 45 past the hour.
[01:36:21.570 --> 01:36:27.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: We're also available at 833-755-2600.
[01:36:27.290 --> 01:36:31.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's 833-755-2600.
[01:36:32.350 --> 01:36:34.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I should point out that next week there is no over...
[01:36:34.650 --> 01:36:35.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, that worked.
[01:36:35.230 --> 01:36:41.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: There is no overtime next week because we are doing a call-in show on WBAI from 7 to 8.
[01:36:43.250 --> 01:36:44.330]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that'll be fun.
[01:36:44.450 --> 01:36:46.370]  [SPEAKER_18]: It'll also be challenging if nobody can hear the stream.
[01:36:46.550 --> 01:36:48.030]  [SPEAKER_18]: But hopefully it's fixed by then.
[01:36:48.870 --> 01:36:50.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have a phone call.
[01:36:50.610 --> 01:36:51.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:36:51.370 --> 01:36:51.850]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[01:36:52.010 --> 01:36:53.330]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on off the go-button.
[01:36:53.450 --> 01:36:53.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[01:36:54.110 --> 01:36:54.370]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[01:36:55.770 --> 01:36:56.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:36:57.130 --> 01:36:57.530]  [SPEAKER_08]: Hello?
[01:36:57.890 --> 01:36:58.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[01:36:58.190 --> 01:36:58.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: We hear you.
[01:37:00.830 --> 01:37:02.730]  [SPEAKER_10]: I am a friend of this dude.
[01:37:03.330 --> 01:37:03.910]  [SPEAKER_17]: Of who?
[01:37:06.010 --> 01:37:06.970]  [SPEAKER_10]: I just...
[01:37:06.970 --> 01:37:07.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: I really...
[01:37:07.750 --> 01:37:10.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: I really miss the good old times from the 1990s.
[01:37:10.610 --> 01:37:10.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:37:13.450 --> 01:37:15.690]  [SPEAKER_18]: What do you miss about the 1990s?
[01:37:17.870 --> 01:37:21.070]  [SPEAKER_10]: I like the times when Toy Story came out.
[01:37:21.710 --> 01:37:22.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:37:24.090 --> 01:37:27.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it came out once, I think, unless there were sequels.
[01:37:28.210 --> 01:37:31.450]  [SPEAKER_10]: I also like that Halloween Christmas movie.
[01:37:31.790 --> 01:37:31.970]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-huh.
[01:37:32.170 --> 01:37:32.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-huh.
[01:37:33.850 --> 01:37:34.530]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:37:35.970 --> 01:37:36.810]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anything else?
[01:37:37.970 --> 01:37:39.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: And The Little Rascals.
[01:37:40.110 --> 01:37:43.350]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that came out a long time before that, but...
[01:37:43.350 --> 01:37:44.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: Unless there was a...
[01:37:44.110 --> 01:37:48.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, not the first Little Rascals.
[01:37:48.490 --> 01:37:49.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, the other Little Rascals.
[01:37:49.830 --> 01:37:50.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, yeah.
[01:37:50.270 --> 01:37:50.410]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:37:50.530 --> 01:37:51.890]  [SPEAKER_10]: The modern one.
[01:37:51.890 --> 01:37:52.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right, right.
[01:37:54.310 --> 01:37:55.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, well, 1990s...
[01:37:55.730 --> 01:37:57.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: The modern one, which was like 30 years ago now.
[01:37:57.470 --> 01:37:58.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Special time.
[01:37:58.190 --> 01:37:59.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, so that's where we are, 30 years ago.
[01:38:01.830 --> 01:38:03.770]  [SPEAKER_10]: Were you born in the 1980s?
[01:38:04.310 --> 01:38:05.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was born before then.
[01:38:07.370 --> 01:38:08.010]  [SPEAKER_10]: Before that?
[01:38:08.230 --> 01:38:09.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: Before that, yes.
[01:38:09.150 --> 01:38:10.850]  [SPEAKER_18]: There was a period before that.
[01:38:11.410 --> 01:38:11.770]  [SPEAKER_10]: 1970s?
[01:38:11.810 --> 01:38:13.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm not going to narrow down the date for you.
[01:38:13.830 --> 01:38:15.330]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm just going to say that I've been around.
[01:38:17.270 --> 01:38:17.630]  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh.
[01:38:19.470 --> 01:38:30.470]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I like the good old times in Bay Terrace, like earlier than 2010.
[01:38:31.350 --> 01:38:32.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: Where is Bay Terrace?
[01:38:35.030 --> 01:38:38.490]  [SPEAKER_10]: Bay Terrace, Bayside, Queens.
[01:38:38.950 --> 01:38:39.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, okay.
[01:38:40.290 --> 01:38:41.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Another Queens call.
[01:38:42.290 --> 01:38:46.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: I like them better earlier than 2010.
[01:38:47.290 --> 01:38:48.270]  [SPEAKER_16]: Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[01:38:49.670 --> 01:38:56.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, okay, I think we've established that you like things from the past, and there were some good things back then.
[01:38:58.270 --> 01:39:00.490]  [SPEAKER_10]: I had a lot of great memories back then.
[01:39:01.470 --> 01:39:03.810]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, time to start making new memories.
[01:39:06.030 --> 01:39:06.870]  [SPEAKER_09]: Are you going to go to Hope?
[01:39:07.610 --> 01:39:07.770]  [SPEAKER_09]: Huh?
[01:39:08.030 --> 01:39:08.830]  [SPEAKER_09]: Are you going to go to Hope?
[01:39:10.190 --> 01:39:11.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rebel, is that you?
[01:39:12.050 --> 01:39:13.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's Rebel's next to you, isn't he?
[01:39:14.530 --> 01:39:14.930]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yep.
[01:39:14.930 --> 01:39:16.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: I suspected this from the very beginning.
[01:39:17.030 --> 01:39:17.710]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yep, that dude is next to me.
[01:39:17.870 --> 01:39:20.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, Rebel, this counts as a phone call of yours.
[01:39:20.090 --> 01:39:20.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm sorry.
[01:39:21.510 --> 01:39:23.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: But we're going to move on.
[01:39:23.390 --> 01:39:25.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: And Rebel, we do not expect to hear from you next week.
[01:39:26.290 --> 01:39:27.990]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you know what will happen if we do.
[01:39:29.210 --> 01:39:29.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[01:39:31.810 --> 01:39:33.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: How was I...
[01:39:33.170 --> 01:39:34.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it was...
[01:39:34.390 --> 01:39:38.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't want to say this sounds like a Rebel-sponsored call.
[01:39:38.990 --> 01:39:40.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it sure did.
[01:39:40.190 --> 01:39:42.210]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I was too patient.
[01:39:42.210 --> 01:39:44.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: The first thing he said was, I'm a friend of this dude.
[01:39:44.510 --> 01:39:46.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, but am I supposed to draw from that?
[01:39:46.770 --> 01:39:50.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: That, you know, there's only one person out there that would...
[01:39:50.650 --> 01:39:53.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, folks, this is what happens when there aren't enough calls.
[01:39:54.670 --> 01:39:56.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: So we'll give it another couple of minutes.
[01:39:56.690 --> 01:39:58.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:39:58.950 --> 01:40:01.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's also what happens when you're under Rebel's influence.
[01:40:01.390 --> 01:40:02.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can you look at the number there?
[01:40:02.830 --> 01:40:05.210]  [SPEAKER_18]: Make sure it's not the same area code.
[01:40:06.690 --> 01:40:07.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:40:08.070 --> 01:40:09.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: And good evening.
[01:40:09.110 --> 01:40:10.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on Off The Hook Overtime.
[01:40:11.010 --> 01:40:11.250]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[01:40:13.210 --> 01:40:13.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: Speak up.
[01:40:14.090 --> 01:40:14.730]  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't believe it.
[01:40:14.790 --> 01:40:16.150]  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to start hearing you next week.
[01:40:16.650 --> 01:40:17.810]  [SPEAKER_18]: What is this?
[01:40:18.110 --> 01:40:18.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Turning the radio down.
[01:40:19.170 --> 01:40:22.490]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, turning the radio down or talking to your phone.
[01:40:24.450 --> 01:40:25.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's better.
[01:40:25.210 --> 01:40:25.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: We can hear this.
[01:40:27.630 --> 01:40:30.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was quite enjoying that conversation.
[01:40:31.250 --> 01:40:31.970]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:40:32.130 --> 01:40:32.490]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:40:33.310 --> 01:40:34.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: Losing patience fast.
[01:40:34.590 --> 01:40:34.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: Really am.
[01:40:35.410 --> 01:40:36.690]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:40:39.370 --> 01:40:42.410]  [SPEAKER_18]: If it's another silly call, it's going to be the last call.
[01:40:43.530 --> 01:40:45.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: So give that person a moment to think about that.
[01:40:46.490 --> 01:40:47.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: One more ring and pick it up.
[01:40:50.830 --> 01:40:51.410]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:40:51.510 --> 01:40:51.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: Here we go.
[01:40:53.630 --> 01:40:54.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: And good evening.
[01:40:54.570 --> 01:40:56.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on Off The Hook Overtime.
[01:40:58.330 --> 01:40:58.810]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[01:40:58.890 --> 01:41:00.030]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm not sure if you...
[01:41:00.030 --> 01:41:00.850]  [SPEAKER_07]: If you...
[01:41:00.850 --> 01:41:10.170]  [SPEAKER_07]: If y'all have talked about this already, but I was just wondering what your opinion was on the NYC election, like all your candidates and so forth.
[01:41:10.230 --> 01:41:10.970]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, wow.
[01:41:11.170 --> 01:41:19.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I don't think anyone's going to reveal who we're voting for or not voting for, but the whole thing is really an interesting race.
[01:41:19.750 --> 01:41:25.790]  [SPEAKER_18]: A lot of diverse people running, backgrounds, opinions, things like that.
[01:41:27.290 --> 01:41:34.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, I think Brad Lander really got some points yesterday by being arrested by ICE.
[01:41:34.470 --> 01:41:37.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: That was something that you don't see every day.
[01:41:37.470 --> 01:41:39.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: Actually, you do see it every day now.
[01:41:39.170 --> 01:41:47.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: I thought his ad where he's, like, taking a phone call and, like, has a legal pad, and then he starts eating a hot dog in a roller coaster.
[01:41:47.710 --> 01:41:48.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that was a good ad.
[01:41:48.430 --> 01:41:57.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: I thought that was hilarious because he kept a straight face the whole time, but you could tell he had a lot of fun making that ad because he's just riding the roller coaster in Coney Island.
[01:41:58.010 --> 01:41:59.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think it was Coney Island.
[01:41:59.270 --> 01:42:01.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, yeah, anyway, I don't have an opinion on any of it.
[01:42:02.050 --> 01:42:02.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm not going to be...
[01:42:02.950 --> 01:42:08.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't participate in these local races, but it is interesting in the field.
[01:42:08.470 --> 01:42:09.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it is.
[01:42:09.270 --> 01:42:10.290]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rob, did you have an opinion?
[01:42:11.230 --> 01:42:22.530]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I do not have a horse in the race yet because as a non-affiliated voter, I don't vote with a party, so I don't have anything to do with the primaries, which is what the current season is.
[01:42:22.690 --> 01:42:30.330]  [SPEAKER_13]: So I think all of you out there with political parties, now's your chance to figure your crap out so I can start thinking of which one I like.
[01:42:31.110 --> 01:42:32.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Go ahead, Gina.
[01:42:32.390 --> 01:42:55.390]  [SPEAKER_12]: Sorry, I am registered with a party, and I would just like to point out that the best thing that you can do in addition to having an understanding of who the candidates are is an understanding of how ranked-choice voting works and, quite frankly, an understanding of how ranked-choice voting does not work.
[01:42:55.430 --> 01:43:10.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm not going to say anything about any of the candidates, but what I will say, because this was misinformation that was shared in a group I'm in today, is that if two candidates have cross-endorsed each other, it does not mean that if one of them gets knocked out,
[01:43:10.690 --> 01:43:12.870]  [SPEAKER_12]: The other one gets the votes for that one.
[01:43:14.910 --> 01:43:15.510]  [SPEAKER_12]: Right?
[01:43:16.490 --> 01:43:25.910]  [SPEAKER_12]: So I think it's very, very key that we do a better job talking about how ranked choice voting works if we're going to be sticking with this system.
[01:43:25.950 --> 01:43:28.490]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can you explain the cross-endorsement strategy then?
[01:43:28.850 --> 01:43:29.410]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
[01:43:29.990 --> 01:43:37.890]  [SPEAKER_12]: So basically, a few candidates have said, if you're ranking me number one, that's awesome.
[01:43:38.190 --> 01:43:40.430]  [SPEAKER_12]: Please also rank these other two people.
[01:43:40.690 --> 01:43:41.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: Or other two or three people.
[01:43:42.590 --> 01:43:52.190]  [SPEAKER_12]: And it does not mean that if candidate A and candidate B are cross-endorsing, then your vote for candidate A will count for candidate B.
[01:43:52.350 --> 01:43:53.950]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's not how that works.
[01:43:55.210 --> 01:44:01.690]  [SPEAKER_12]: The other thing I would recommend and mention is that you can bring in your own list.
[01:44:01.690 --> 01:44:06.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: You can make notes for yourself and bring them to the voting booth with you.
[01:44:07.010 --> 01:44:11.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: If you're voting early in New York City this week, that's still going on.
[01:44:11.230 --> 01:44:13.970]  [SPEAKER_12]: If you're waiting for next Tuesday, you can do it as well.
[01:44:14.210 --> 01:44:15.670]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do your research.
[01:44:15.690 --> 01:44:16.770]  [SPEAKER_12]: Do your homework.
[01:44:16.950 --> 01:44:17.850]  [SPEAKER_12]: Make a plan.
[01:44:18.350 --> 01:44:20.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: Because otherwise, it's going to be a mess.
[01:44:21.030 --> 01:44:21.510]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:44:21.690 --> 01:44:35.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the only advice I would offer is that anyone who does vote, if your candidate doesn't make it, if you don't want Adams to return and you don't want a Republican, you need to support whoever it is that does win.
[01:44:35.970 --> 01:44:38.690]  [SPEAKER_18]: Even if that makes you really, really unhappy.
[01:44:38.970 --> 01:44:41.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because the alternative could be far, far worse.
[01:44:41.790 --> 01:44:42.450]  [SPEAKER_18]: And Kyle, go ahead.
[01:44:42.450 --> 01:44:42.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[01:44:43.330 --> 01:44:51.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Caller, do you have an opinion about anything specific to ranked choice or the debate or the field of candidates so far?
[01:44:51.370 --> 01:44:53.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you have... what's your take so far?
[01:44:53.490 --> 01:44:55.950]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, I do have an opinion.
[01:44:56.230 --> 01:44:59.270]  [SPEAKER_06]: I don't... I'm not voting for that guy, Ramzami.
[01:44:59.490 --> 01:45:00.810]  [SPEAKER_06]: I think... I forget the name.
[01:45:01.770 --> 01:45:02.730]  [SPEAKER_18]: You got it right.
[01:45:02.990 --> 01:45:04.030]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, Ramzami.
[01:45:05.110 --> 01:45:09.830]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I prefer... I like Cuomo personally, so I will be voting for Cuomo myself.
[01:45:09.830 --> 01:45:19.190]  [SPEAKER_07]: So, uh, I don't like Ramzami and I don't like, you know, a lot of the freebies and a lot of the stuff he's talking about.
[01:45:19.190 --> 01:45:20.450]  [SPEAKER_07]: I don't really think it's feasible.
[01:45:20.670 --> 01:45:24.370]  [SPEAKER_07]: He's just saying these things that are really not going to happen.
[01:45:24.370 --> 01:45:28.250]  [SPEAKER_07]: Or if they do happen, it's going to come at a heavy cost, heavy hitting cost.
[01:45:28.970 --> 01:45:29.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Caller, uh...
[01:45:29.930 --> 01:45:30.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: So...
[01:45:30.510 --> 01:45:49.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you mind if I ask, um, since you mentioned Cuomo, all of the, uh, kind of baggage or whatever, uh, might be said about him negatively, notwithstanding, what personally do you think about him makes him your choice?
[01:45:49.430 --> 01:45:52.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe as... I'm not going to bait you with stuff, but...
[01:45:52.430 --> 01:45:53.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Why do you like him?
[01:45:53.670 --> 01:45:56.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: What about him do you think the city needs?
[01:45:57.210 --> 01:45:59.470]  [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I like him because he's a centrist.
[01:45:59.730 --> 01:46:05.170]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I don't, I'm not, I don't really like anyone on too far left, too far right.
[01:46:05.350 --> 01:46:07.210]  [SPEAKER_07]: To me, they're just, they're all the same to me.
[01:46:07.410 --> 01:46:13.970]  [SPEAKER_07]: And just guys, the people who are way out there on the left or way out there on the right, to me, I just like the centrist.
[01:46:14.190 --> 01:46:19.470]  [SPEAKER_07]: And all that nursing home stuff, you know, stuff they're talking about, you know, all that is bad.
[01:46:19.530 --> 01:46:21.990]  [SPEAKER_07]: But honestly, I really don't, I, it doesn't bother me as much.
[01:46:21.990 --> 01:46:22.890]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, that was COVID.
[01:46:23.050 --> 01:46:24.450]  [SPEAKER_07]: During that time, it was a rough time.
[01:46:24.530 --> 01:46:25.450]  [SPEAKER_07]: It was just a new thing.
[01:46:25.630 --> 01:46:28.090]  [SPEAKER_07]: And I mean, we were just kind of winging it at that time.
[01:46:28.190 --> 01:46:32.650]  [SPEAKER_07]: So I just think they're being a little bit unfair with the whole nursing home accusations and all that kind of stuff.
[01:46:32.730 --> 01:46:33.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: I agree with you there.
[01:46:34.170 --> 01:46:41.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's upsetting to see the same Republican talking points being used by Democrats that want to get, you know, get an advantage.
[01:46:41.710 --> 01:46:52.150]  [SPEAKER_18]: But the other thing to point out about the nursing home thing, just as many people died in nursing homes in Florida, and you never hear anybody criticizing DeSantis for that.
[01:46:52.390 --> 01:46:52.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[01:46:52.830 --> 01:46:54.270]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, go ahead, Kyle.
[01:46:54.350 --> 01:46:54.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a good point.
[01:46:55.370 --> 01:46:55.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[01:46:55.950 --> 01:47:14.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Is it, well, with him, in your view, being sort of a centrist, is there anything specifically you think the city needs or that he should prioritize the youth, assuming he was elected, that he could get done or that should get done?
[01:47:15.490 --> 01:47:18.130]  [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I like his position on the police issue.
[01:47:18.310 --> 01:47:21.650]  [SPEAKER_07]: You know, I don't want all that defund the police stuff and all that kind of stuff.
[01:47:21.850 --> 01:47:31.710]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you know, you can reform the police, but anything about defunding the police or getting rid of police, anything on those lines is not, I don't really want to hear that, honestly.
[01:47:31.790 --> 01:47:35.390]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I don't think Mamdani is really believing in that.
[01:47:35.390 --> 01:47:40.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think he believes in getting rid of the bad cops, which seems to be awfully hard to do sometimes.
[01:47:41.710 --> 01:47:53.890]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, I see Cuomo latching onto Mamdani's previous statements, but not asking about, okay, how do you feel right now?
[01:47:54.050 --> 01:47:55.010]  [SPEAKER_18]: Have you evolved?
[01:47:55.250 --> 01:47:59.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I don't think that's a bad thing to evolve, if, in fact, you have.
[01:47:59.070 --> 01:48:02.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, he is using, like, excerpts from, like, interviews and stuff.
[01:48:02.590 --> 01:48:04.750]  [SPEAKER_05]: I also think he's a little young.
[01:48:04.890 --> 01:48:05.930]  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, he's not very young.
[01:48:06.050 --> 01:48:06.750]  [SPEAKER_05]: He's in his 30s.
[01:48:06.850 --> 01:48:11.330]  [SPEAKER_05]: But I also think he's young, and he's not... I mean, he's definitely young politically.
[01:48:11.530 --> 01:48:11.950]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he is.
[01:48:12.010 --> 01:48:12.330]  [SPEAKER_05]: He is.
[01:48:12.510 --> 01:48:12.790]  [SPEAKER_05]: You know?
[01:48:13.870 --> 01:48:20.450]  [SPEAKER_18]: But there's something about him I like, but I hear what you're saying about the experience and maybe a bit too idealistic.
[01:48:21.130 --> 01:48:22.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, there's something to be said for that.
[01:48:22.890 --> 01:48:27.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if he were to win, would you support him in the general?
[01:48:28.590 --> 01:48:30.170]  [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I guess so.
[01:48:30.490 --> 01:48:31.310]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'd really rather not.
[01:48:31.490 --> 01:48:31.910]  [SPEAKER_07]: I guess...
[01:48:31.910 --> 01:48:32.270]  [SPEAKER_07]: You know what?
[01:48:32.390 --> 01:48:34.910]  [SPEAKER_07]: I may... if he... because Adams is going to run in the general.
[01:48:35.090 --> 01:48:36.950]  [SPEAKER_07]: If he wins, I may just vote for Adams, actually.
[01:48:37.190 --> 01:48:37.950]  [SPEAKER_07]: I may just vote for Adams.
[01:48:38.010 --> 01:48:40.110]  [SPEAKER_07]: If Adams is going to run as an independent, I may just vote for him.
[01:48:40.650 --> 01:48:44.190]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, but he's kind of beholden to Trump right now.
[01:48:44.250 --> 01:48:45.370]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know if that matters to you.
[01:48:46.250 --> 01:48:47.050]  That's the problem.
[01:48:47.350 --> 01:48:48.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a big problem.
[01:48:48.570 --> 01:48:49.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: That is a big problem.
[01:48:50.070 --> 01:48:51.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's like a hold-your-nose situation.
[01:48:51.930 --> 01:48:52.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:48:52.830 --> 01:48:56.530]  [SPEAKER_18]: I, you know, I think any one of the Democratic... well, except for the hedge fund guy.
[01:48:56.610 --> 01:48:57.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: What's his name?
[01:48:57.790 --> 01:48:59.330]  [SPEAKER_18]: That guy just seems out of touch.
[01:49:00.790 --> 01:49:01.450]  [SPEAKER_18]: Whitney Tilson?
[01:49:01.790 --> 01:49:02.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that guy.
[01:49:03.250 --> 01:49:07.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: Of all the other candidates, though, I wouldn't be too upset if they were mayor.
[01:49:08.030 --> 01:49:09.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: Him, I would be upset by.
[01:49:09.270 --> 01:49:09.470]  [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[01:49:09.770 --> 01:49:15.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: And what's this about Cuomo getting an endorsement by Bloomberg, and that's a good thing?
[01:49:16.070 --> 01:49:17.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't understand why that's a good thing.
[01:49:18.210 --> 01:49:20.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: We didn't like Bloomberg when he was mayor, did we?
[01:49:21.010 --> 01:49:21.830]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't remember that.
[01:49:22.950 --> 01:49:24.370]  [SPEAKER_07]: Well, it's a good thing for money.
[01:49:24.470 --> 01:49:26.010]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure Bloomberg gave him a bunch of money.
[01:49:26.350 --> 01:49:27.890]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm assuming he did for, you know.
[01:49:28.010 --> 01:49:30.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, yeah, I guess if you look at it that way.
[01:49:30.390 --> 01:49:30.990]  [SPEAKER_18]: Gila, go ahead.
[01:49:31.810 --> 01:49:45.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: The other thing I would like to point out about the line that Adams is running on in the general election, and I would just like to point out that the views I'm about to share are my own and are not representative of any of the other panelists on Off The Hook.
[01:49:46.790 --> 01:49:57.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Eric Adams is running on the stop antisemitism line in the mayoral election, and it is the most pandering bullshit I have ever heard of in my life.
[01:49:57.210 --> 01:50:01.030]  [SPEAKER_12]: As a Jewish person, this does not make me feel safer.
[01:50:01.250 --> 01:50:02.650]  [SPEAKER_12]: This does not make me feel better.
[01:50:02.790 --> 01:50:20.530]  [SPEAKER_12]: And the fact that he is hosting some sort of incredibly antisemitic YouTuber, not YouTuber, TikToker, at Gracie Mansion, while he has the temerity to say he is running on the antisemitism platform, which is just to scare people about Zohran Mandani.
[01:50:21.250 --> 01:50:21.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: Mm-hmm.
[01:50:22.390 --> 01:50:22.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:50:22.810 --> 01:50:24.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because he criticizes Israel.
[01:50:24.230 --> 01:50:24.410]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:50:28.190 --> 01:50:29.470]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, I hear that.
[01:50:30.190 --> 01:50:34.270]  [SPEAKER_12]: Caller, just think about it, is all I'm saying.
[01:50:34.390 --> 01:50:41.610]  [SPEAKER_12]: And we have some time until November, but like, the pandering kind of makes my teeth hurt.
[01:50:41.850 --> 01:50:41.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:50:42.670 --> 01:50:43.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: I hear you.
[01:50:44.110 --> 01:50:45.210]  [SPEAKER_18]: Any, any other thoughts?
[01:50:45.270 --> 01:50:45.590]  [SPEAKER_07]: All right.
[01:50:45.950 --> 01:50:47.410]  [SPEAKER_07]: I will ask about it.
[01:50:47.590 --> 01:50:48.470]  [SPEAKER_07]: Thanks for taking my call.
[01:50:48.830 --> 01:50:49.770]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you very much for calling.
[01:50:50.050 --> 01:50:50.470]  [SPEAKER_18]: Take care.
[01:50:53.540 --> 01:50:53.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:50:54.050 --> 01:50:55.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the phone has been hung up.
[01:50:55.220 --> 01:50:55.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: I missed.
[01:50:55.840 --> 01:50:56.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:50:56.320 --> 01:50:57.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: We only have a couple of minutes.
[01:50:57.300 --> 01:50:59.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: If there's a quick call, we'll, we'll take it.
[01:50:59.260 --> 01:51:00.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: 802-321-4225.
[01:51:00.760 --> 01:51:04.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it has to be quick because I can't do this all night.
[01:51:04.420 --> 01:51:05.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Although I feel better.
[01:51:05.120 --> 01:51:05.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: My voice is better.
[01:51:06.080 --> 01:51:06.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: How'd that happen?
[01:51:07.340 --> 01:51:08.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe that's the thing.
[01:51:08.360 --> 01:51:12.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: If you have a, you know, something in your throat, you just got to keep talking.
[01:51:13.780 --> 01:51:14.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[01:51:14.340 --> 01:51:14.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're learning.
[01:51:14.920 --> 01:51:16.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: I've often found that to be the case.
[01:51:16.170 --> 01:51:16.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Work it out.
[01:51:16.920 --> 01:51:17.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:51:17.380 --> 01:51:17.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[01:51:20.000 --> 01:51:20.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Absolutely.
[01:51:20.920 --> 01:51:23.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: 802-321-4225.
[01:51:23.980 --> 01:51:25.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: 802-321-HACK.
[01:51:27.260 --> 01:51:28.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: 833-755.
[01:51:28.360 --> 01:51:30.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Don't need to keep giving out the number when the phone's ringing.
[01:51:32.460 --> 01:51:33.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: And good evening.
[01:51:33.660 --> 01:51:35.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on Off The Hook Overtime.
[01:51:35.500 --> 01:51:35.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[01:51:37.220 --> 01:51:37.660]  Hello?
[01:51:38.040 --> 01:51:38.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:51:38.460 --> 01:51:39.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: Where are you calling from?
[01:51:40.200 --> 01:51:42.550]  [SPEAKER_08]: This is a guy from Queens, okay?
[01:51:42.880 --> 01:51:43.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-oh.
[01:51:43.520 --> 01:51:44.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: I know who this is.
[01:51:45.440 --> 01:51:45.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[01:51:46.040 --> 01:51:47.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I've got to tell you something.
[01:51:47.880 --> 01:51:48.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-uh.
[01:51:48.700 --> 01:51:49.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'm the jew.
[01:51:50.020 --> 01:51:52.670]  [SPEAKER_08]: You guys are too, too much hating Israel.
[01:51:52.960 --> 01:51:55.660]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I'm going to tell you that's one reason why I'm not coming to you.
[01:51:55.670 --> 01:51:55.980]  [SPEAKER_17]: Hold on.
[01:51:56.050 --> 01:51:57.880]  [SPEAKER_17]: What did we, what did we say about Israel?
[01:51:58.500 --> 01:51:59.960]  [SPEAKER_17]: We didn't say anything about Israel.
[01:52:00.520 --> 01:52:01.800]  [SPEAKER_17]: We didn't say a damn thing.
[01:52:01.860 --> 01:52:04.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: We were saying that, well, look at how they're attacking.
[01:52:05.050 --> 01:52:05.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: They were attacked.
[01:52:06.120 --> 01:52:08.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: They were attacked on the 7th, okay?
[01:52:09.080 --> 01:52:10.130]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you know what?
[01:52:11.360 --> 01:52:13.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: Not every politician is perfect.
[01:52:14.320 --> 01:52:17.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: But I think we, I think Trump is trying.
[01:52:17.630 --> 01:52:18.660]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know you guys hate him.
[01:52:19.130 --> 01:52:25.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I wish you, what I wish you guys would do is be so less leftist and be more into the technology.
[01:52:26.050 --> 01:52:27.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: Maybe you'll get more people to come.
[01:52:28.500 --> 01:52:29.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, we are into technology.
[01:52:29.960 --> 01:52:31.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think that's, I don't think that's the issue.
[01:52:32.320 --> 01:52:40.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think, if you, if you look at, uh, the program, if you look at attendees of the past, you'll see that, uh, we're, we're, you know, we respect each other's opinions.
[01:52:40.460 --> 01:52:41.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have different opinions.
[01:52:41.280 --> 01:52:41.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: We disagree.
[01:52:42.200 --> 01:52:43.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know, I know.
[01:52:43.300 --> 01:52:45.050]  [SPEAKER_08]: Listen, you have a right to disagree.
[01:52:45.620 --> 01:52:52.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: But when you get to the point and say, well, because, oh, people are acting like, who's listening?
[01:52:52.440 --> 01:52:53.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: We're losing our freedoms.
[01:52:53.940 --> 01:52:56.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't think I'm losing a lot of my freedoms.
[01:52:56.320 --> 01:52:58.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think we need some law and order in this country.
[01:52:59.120 --> 01:53:01.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have plenty of law and order in this country.
[01:53:01.580 --> 01:53:05.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: It'd be nice if the administration would follow it.
[01:53:05.660 --> 01:53:06.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: Look, you know what?
[01:53:06.740 --> 01:53:08.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think he's doing a pretty good job.
[01:53:08.620 --> 01:53:14.980]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know you guys don't, probably don't like what's happening with Iran, but they, you want Iran to have a nuclear weapon?
[01:53:15.120 --> 01:53:15.860]  [SPEAKER_08]: There's a lot of things.
[01:53:15.960 --> 01:53:17.130]  [SPEAKER_08]: I disagree with you guys.
[01:53:17.580 --> 01:53:18.720]  [SPEAKER_17]: Let me just tell you something.
[01:53:18.940 --> 01:53:23.240]  [SPEAKER_17]: The, the U.S., if I, if I may, the, the U.S. intelligence, U.S. intelligence, please let me get a word in.
[01:53:28.320 --> 01:53:30.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think a lot of people are boycotting your HOPE.
[01:53:31.100 --> 01:53:32.380]  [SPEAKER_17]: Well, I'd like to hear that.
[01:53:32.380 --> 01:53:35.400]  [SPEAKER_17]: If that's true, please say it out loud, but...
[01:53:35.400 --> 01:53:36.170]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'll say it out loud.
[01:53:36.260 --> 01:53:40.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'm not coming because you guys are so far to the left, the boat's going to tip over.
[01:53:40.700 --> 01:53:42.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, well, that's, that's one person.
[01:53:42.300 --> 01:53:42.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, fine.
[01:53:42.880 --> 01:53:43.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we respect that.
[01:53:43.760 --> 01:53:45.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: But just to tell you something, the U.S. intelligence community recently concluded that Iran was not building a nuclear weapon.
[01:53:50.940 --> 01:53:52.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: So I don't know who to believe.
[01:53:52.300 --> 01:53:52.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Please.
[01:53:53.720 --> 01:53:55.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's our own intelligence community.
[01:53:55.760 --> 01:53:56.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's our own intelligence community.
[01:53:56.940 --> 01:53:57.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're not leftists.
[01:54:00.140 --> 01:54:05.170]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, as far as I'm concerned, yes, I do think Iran is trying to get a weapon.
[01:54:05.380 --> 01:54:08.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: They have said death to the jews.
[01:54:08.680 --> 01:54:11.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, they say death to a lot of, they say death to America constantly.
[01:54:12.130 --> 01:54:13.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's part of their, their mantra.
[01:54:14.050 --> 01:54:14.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's not acceptable.
[01:54:14.660 --> 01:54:15.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: I agree with you there.
[01:54:16.240 --> 01:54:19.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I don't know if it's, if it's worth World War III over.
[01:54:20.240 --> 01:54:22.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's what a lot of people are worried about right now.
[01:54:22.590 --> 01:54:24.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, when you have...
[01:54:24.020 --> 01:54:30.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: By the way, your hum, your hum coming into me is about 40% of your, of your voice.
[01:54:30.340 --> 01:54:36.590]  [SPEAKER_08]: You do have a very loud hum, much louder hum on my side.
[01:54:36.740 --> 01:54:37.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I'm calling from it.
[01:54:38.020 --> 01:54:44.160]  [SPEAKER_08]: By the way, just so you know, you could build a PBX using a Raspberry Pi and using Aster.
[01:54:44.220 --> 01:54:48.590]  [SPEAKER_08]: So you could just build it up to a bunch of digital, a bunch of switches.
[01:54:49.120 --> 01:54:56.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: And all you need is, you know, a 48 volt power supply and you could probably run a lot of, you know, a low voltage supply and run a lot of phones today.
[01:54:57.700 --> 01:54:59.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, the tech info gets out there.
[01:54:59.500 --> 01:55:00.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: It does.
[01:55:00.300 --> 01:55:01.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: You just got to wait for it.
[01:55:01.220 --> 01:55:01.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: No, no, no.
[01:55:01.920 --> 01:55:03.160]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'll be very, very honest.
[01:55:03.580 --> 01:55:05.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'm somewhat conservative.
[01:55:05.780 --> 01:55:13.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I will, I would love to debate, debate you guys, because I know you guys think that, you know, you think Trump is evil.
[01:55:13.670 --> 01:55:15.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: I can think of a lot of people that were evil.
[01:55:15.940 --> 01:55:19.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: I need to hear people saying, oh, Trump did sexist.
[01:55:19.860 --> 01:55:21.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, look at what Clinton did.
[01:55:21.260 --> 01:55:23.880]  [SPEAKER_17]: Hey, there are a lot of evil people in the world, but you know, I'll say.
[01:55:23.980 --> 01:55:24.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: You go back to time throughout history.
[01:55:25.050 --> 01:55:27.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know you guys, all you guys are the lawyers.
[01:55:27.400 --> 01:55:34.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: You go back to a guy like Roosevelt, put people in camps when the Japanese attacked.
[01:55:34.420 --> 01:55:35.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, that's wrong.
[01:55:35.300 --> 01:55:36.860]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, every president has baggage.
[01:55:37.050 --> 01:55:37.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's wrong.
[01:55:37.620 --> 01:55:38.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: He was a Democrat.
[01:55:38.360 --> 01:55:39.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the first one to say that was wrong.
[01:55:40.020 --> 01:55:40.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: That was horrible.
[01:55:40.620 --> 01:55:41.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: That should never be repeated.
[01:55:41.880 --> 01:55:46.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, Trump did send Marines into a city to face off against U.S.
[01:55:46.980 --> 01:55:47.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: citizens.
[01:55:47.320 --> 01:55:48.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's never been done before.
[01:55:48.550 --> 01:55:51.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: No, he's not facing off against... See, that's where you're giving...
[01:55:51.420 --> 01:55:53.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: That is where you're giving misinformation.
[01:55:53.480 --> 01:55:54.720]  [SPEAKER_17]: What are they there for?
[01:55:55.080 --> 01:55:56.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: There was definite looting.
[01:55:57.050 --> 01:56:00.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: You don't... I'm blind and I could even see that there was looting.
[01:56:01.000 --> 01:56:02.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: I watched it live.
[01:56:02.240 --> 01:56:02.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: And there were people coming in.
[01:56:02.860 --> 01:56:03.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Excuse me, I watched it.
[01:56:03.840 --> 01:56:05.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: I watched it live on Saturday.
[01:56:06.000 --> 01:56:06.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: Regulations.
[01:56:06.670 --> 01:56:08.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: I watched it live on Saturday.
[01:56:08.820 --> 01:56:09.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, boy.
[01:56:09.460 --> 01:56:10.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: Immigration without control.
[01:56:11.120 --> 01:56:11.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[01:56:11.260 --> 01:56:12.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: Do we need immigrants?
[01:56:12.700 --> 01:56:12.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: Of course.
[01:56:13.420 --> 01:56:15.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: My grandparents were immigrants.
[01:56:15.520 --> 01:56:16.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: Because I was a jew.
[01:56:16.900 --> 01:56:22.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: They came over and they asked to come in before they came in and they had to go to Ellis Island.
[01:56:22.860 --> 01:56:25.660]  [SPEAKER_08]: And some of them were set back because they weren't healthy.
[01:56:25.900 --> 01:56:27.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: And everyone had to...
[01:56:27.520 --> 01:56:29.760]  [SPEAKER_08]: Everyone in that generation that came over.
[01:56:31.000 --> 01:56:31.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay?
[01:56:31.960 --> 01:56:33.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: They didn't go on welfare.
[01:56:33.400 --> 01:56:36.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: They didn't get free housing like a lot of people are getting.
[01:56:36.200 --> 01:56:36.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay?
[01:56:36.440 --> 01:56:38.670]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's really the honest...
[01:56:38.670 --> 01:56:47.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: And what I also don't like, as a blind person, is to scare tactic by a certain amount of people that think, oh, Trump is going to take away all your benefits.
[01:56:47.540 --> 01:56:52.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't think any benefits to people who really need it are going to be taken away.
[01:56:52.630 --> 01:56:53.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: Is there a fraud?
[01:56:53.440 --> 01:56:54.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: Absolutely there's fraud.
[01:56:55.460 --> 01:56:56.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, there's fraud everywhere.
[01:56:56.660 --> 01:56:57.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's true.
[01:56:57.360 --> 01:56:59.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: But there are benefits being taken away.
[01:56:59.460 --> 01:57:01.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: There's nothing wrong with trying to do it.
[01:57:01.240 --> 01:57:02.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: Do I think he does everything right?
[01:57:02.820 --> 01:57:03.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: No.
[01:57:03.120 --> 01:57:05.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: Do I think George was completely correct?
[01:57:06.040 --> 01:57:06.130]  [SPEAKER_08]: No.
[01:57:06.260 --> 01:57:10.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: Do I think Leon, I can't even think about Musk, that guy?
[01:57:10.800 --> 01:57:12.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think that guy's a little fruity.
[01:57:12.130 --> 01:57:12.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: A little fruity.
[01:57:13.160 --> 01:57:15.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't even like his cars to begin with.
[01:57:15.260 --> 01:57:21.550]  [SPEAKER_08]: But do people have a right to go ahead and attack people's cars, people who bought their cars?
[01:57:21.840 --> 01:57:22.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
[01:57:22.240 --> 01:57:24.630]  [SPEAKER_08]: They didn't know what he was going to do two years down the road.
[01:57:25.300 --> 01:57:28.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: A lot of people who bought their cars got their cars key.
[01:57:28.280 --> 01:57:30.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're talking about many different things here.
[01:57:30.780 --> 01:57:31.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: On the left.
[01:57:31.200 --> 01:57:38.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, but you're talking about many things here, and you're packaging everything that you disagree with as a product of the left, which is not true.
[01:57:38.480 --> 01:57:39.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right?
[01:57:39.320 --> 01:57:41.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: People who are looting are not leftists.
[01:57:41.740 --> 01:57:42.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're criminals.
[01:57:42.520 --> 01:57:44.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, they take advantage of the situation.
[01:57:44.940 --> 01:57:50.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, on Saturday, I was watching KTLA from Los Angeles, and I saw the...
[01:57:50.240 --> 01:57:51.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Actually, no, it was MSNBC.
[01:57:51.660 --> 01:57:52.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was the CNN.
[01:57:52.170 --> 01:57:52.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was one of the networks.
[01:57:52.980 --> 01:57:57.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the National Guard, or the...
[01:57:57.670 --> 01:58:02.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think it was National Guard, or the police, one of them, started firing into the crowd.
[01:58:02.300 --> 01:58:03.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: They started firing flashbangs.
[01:58:03.760 --> 01:58:05.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: This crowd was just standing there.
[01:58:05.960 --> 01:58:06.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: They were not looting.
[01:58:06.740 --> 01:58:07.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was still daytime.
[01:58:07.700 --> 01:58:09.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: There was no cause for that.
[01:58:09.220 --> 01:58:14.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that is how people get angry, and that's how people start doing things which are criminal behavior.
[01:58:14.900 --> 01:58:15.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Absolutely.
[01:58:16.020 --> 01:58:19.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it's not just evil versus good.
[01:58:19.380 --> 01:58:20.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's a lot of nuance there.
[01:58:21.260 --> 01:58:23.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, there are a lot of angry people.
[01:58:23.860 --> 01:58:26.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can't ignore 5 million people marching on one day.
[01:58:27.440 --> 01:58:28.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's significant.
[01:58:28.880 --> 01:58:32.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, listen, by the way, they have a right to march.
[01:58:32.170 --> 01:58:33.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I'm not...
[01:58:33.360 --> 01:58:35.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: I would have gone out there at no King's Day.
[01:58:35.720 --> 01:58:36.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: As far as...
[01:58:36.780 --> 01:58:46.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, if you want to talk about no King's Day, the people that went out to march at 100%, as far as I know, there was very little looting or any problems.
[01:58:47.020 --> 01:58:50.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: That is our right as an American to go out and protest.
[01:58:50.500 --> 01:58:50.880]  [SPEAKER_17]: That's right.
[01:58:51.080 --> 01:58:56.170]  [SPEAKER_08]: As far as having the parade, that military parade, I think it was a good thing.
[01:58:56.400 --> 01:59:01.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think it was just a way of saying, hey, we should be proud of the people that serve.
[01:59:01.620 --> 01:59:02.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: Interesting things.
[01:59:02.630 --> 01:59:04.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's just the technology.
[01:59:04.420 --> 01:59:05.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: All the countries do it, too.
[01:59:05.860 --> 01:59:07.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: They have parades.
[01:59:07.280 --> 01:59:18.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Honestly, I kind of agree, because it was such a non-event that it really didn't live up to all the fear that people had of it.
[01:59:18.160 --> 01:59:21.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, that squeaky tank, what was up with that?
[01:59:21.300 --> 01:59:23.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why couldn't they make that not squeak?
[01:59:23.160 --> 01:59:29.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think, you know, the weaponry just looked kind of small, you know, and not very impressive.
[01:59:29.720 --> 01:59:29.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know what?
[01:59:29.960 --> 01:59:31.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: Regardless of how they look, what do people think?
[01:59:32.160 --> 01:59:34.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: Did you think they were going to start shooting people on the street?
[01:59:34.460 --> 01:59:38.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: Do you think they were going to march down like they do in Moscow Square?
[01:59:38.120 --> 01:59:38.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: No.
[01:59:38.670 --> 01:59:47.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: I think it was just showing off some military stuff, showing that it was their 250th anniversary, that it is their 250th anniversary in the army.
[01:59:48.460 --> 01:59:49.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you know what?
[01:59:49.440 --> 01:59:51.170]  [SPEAKER_08]: No one said you have to go.
[01:59:51.660 --> 01:59:59.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: And by saying, King, no one is telling me that I have to have a portrait of Trump for my health, that I wouldn't have a portrait of any president.
[01:59:59.320 --> 02:00:02.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: Maybe I'll have a picture of some president, you know, whatever.
[02:00:02.780 --> 02:00:05.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: But the idea is this, no one is commanding us.
[02:00:06.020 --> 02:00:08.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: In other countries, you're told to have a footprint.
[02:00:09.320 --> 02:00:11.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I think that has carried too far.
[02:00:11.940 --> 02:00:18.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, I just wish you guys would be more into the technology and less into the politics.
[02:00:18.590 --> 02:00:24.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, yes, you can talk about, you know, you can say things, but you guys are pushing it too far.
[02:00:24.660 --> 02:00:27.050]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I think you're turning people off.
[02:00:27.050 --> 02:00:37.940]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I tell you what, you had a lot of people, if you are blessed people this year, and to think that should give you an idea, that maybe you should look at what you're saying, that's all.
[02:00:38.160 --> 02:00:39.280]  [SPEAKER_17]: All right, well, you know what?
[02:00:39.320 --> 02:00:42.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: If you can't look at your own selves and have reflection, well, that's up to you.
[02:00:43.040 --> 02:00:47.090]  [SPEAKER_18]: I guess we leave it up to the attendees then.
[02:00:47.090 --> 02:00:50.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: If they agree with this, then we have to take a good look at ourselves.
[02:00:50.960 --> 02:00:54.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm not convinced that that's the reason why, but maybe it is.
[02:00:55.460 --> 02:01:03.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, maybe you ought to put out a poll or something on 2,600 and ask people how they feel about, you know...
[02:01:03.200 --> 02:01:04.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, but that doesn't...
[02:01:04.820 --> 02:01:08.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: That doesn't reach the people who are going to attend.
[02:01:08.360 --> 02:01:10.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: It just reaches people that can flood a poll.
[02:01:11.440 --> 02:01:14.670]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, by the way, just so you know about WBAI is concerned, I wouldn't...
[02:01:15.180 --> 02:01:17.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'll say it here because we're not on WBAI.
[02:01:17.670 --> 02:01:20.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: I wouldn't contribute to WBAI for a couple of reasons.
[02:01:20.480 --> 02:01:26.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: They're too far true hating, and also, a lot of the good... some of the good programs they used to have...
[02:01:26.440 --> 02:01:28.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh God, they used to have Gary Doe.
[02:01:29.400 --> 02:01:34.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, well, we're not gonna... we're not gonna get into all that, because that will take forever.
[02:01:35.300 --> 02:01:39.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: But you're entitled to your opinion, and you're entitled to support what you want to support.
[02:01:40.080 --> 02:01:40.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Absolutely.
[02:01:40.480 --> 02:01:42.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: That is absolutely correct to say, and guess what?
[02:01:43.220 --> 02:01:59.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: WBAI has a right to exist, and, you know, look, you know, if hopefully no one, you know, if WBAI wants to be on the airplane, they want to be on 99.5 with a 50 kilowatt FM signal from the... from... I think they're coming out of four continents, hey.
[02:01:59.660 --> 02:02:00.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Times Square.
[02:02:00.580 --> 02:02:03.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's all I can say, as far as I'm concerned.
[02:02:03.720 --> 02:02:09.050]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, there's plenty of conservative radio stations out there, so I don't think anyone has anything to worry about.
[02:02:09.050 --> 02:02:09.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, guess what?
[02:02:09.940 --> 02:02:20.160]  [SPEAKER_08]: It bothers me to see, and I heard you guys talk about this, it bothers me to see that you got one or two people owning a whole bunch of stations.
[02:02:20.590 --> 02:02:23.050]  [SPEAKER_08]: Look at what they did to CBS 880.
[02:02:23.170 --> 02:02:23.860]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's a shame.
[02:02:24.020 --> 02:02:24.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, I agree with you there.
[02:02:25.020 --> 02:02:25.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Absolutely.
[02:02:25.760 --> 02:02:27.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: That station was... had a good signal.
[02:02:28.160 --> 02:02:29.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: You could hear the news all the time.
[02:02:29.500 --> 02:02:31.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: WINS, I can never pick them up.
[02:02:31.320 --> 02:02:32.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's good to hear...
[02:02:32.340 --> 02:02:33.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're not a strong...
[02:02:33.460 --> 02:02:36.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's good to hear some of the same... some of the same anchors are on there.
[02:02:36.620 --> 02:02:36.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:02:37.040 --> 02:02:38.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, Matt, I love CBS.
[02:02:38.960 --> 02:02:41.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: I remember what it was when they had a talk show.
[02:02:42.120 --> 02:02:53.670]  [SPEAKER_08]: I remember back in the 60s, okay, as a kid, they used to have a show on, and they used to have a one or two hour show, showing, selling ham gear, you know, having a swap.
[02:02:54.200 --> 02:02:55.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: That was back in the 60s.
[02:02:55.940 --> 02:03:00.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: Used to come home from school and listen to that radio station, especially in the summertime.
[02:03:00.780 --> 02:03:05.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I can tell you that WCBS 880 has one hell of a signal.
[02:03:05.480 --> 02:03:06.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: Absolutely.
[02:03:06.460 --> 02:03:07.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: I heard that in Florida.
[02:03:07.800 --> 02:03:08.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: I heard it in Canada.
[02:03:09.860 --> 02:03:11.340]  [SPEAKER_08]: I heard... you know where I heard that?
[02:03:11.440 --> 02:03:12.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: I heard that in Greece.
[02:03:12.380 --> 02:03:13.090]  [SPEAKER_17]: No.
[02:03:14.280 --> 02:03:15.590]  [SPEAKER_17]: WCBS in Greece.
[02:03:16.170 --> 02:03:24.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: I had a Sony 2010, sitting in Greece, in Saloniki, we were actually barely in Greece, back in 94.
[02:03:24.550 --> 02:03:25.860]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I can remember that.
[02:03:26.040 --> 02:03:32.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: And that night, when it got dark there, and it was too dark in the U.S., you could hear CBS rising out of the noise.
[02:03:33.900 --> 02:03:34.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not strong.
[02:03:34.860 --> 02:03:35.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: That is something.
[02:03:36.360 --> 02:03:38.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: That rivals any story I've heard.
[02:03:39.300 --> 02:03:39.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[02:03:39.840 --> 02:03:40.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: And that would happen.
[02:03:40.780 --> 02:03:42.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: And that especially happened in the wintertime.
[02:03:42.920 --> 02:03:45.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: In the summertime, you wouldn't get that too much static.
[02:03:45.580 --> 02:03:49.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: But yes, you could hear WCBS 880.
[02:03:49.700 --> 02:03:57.550]  [SPEAKER_08]: Because one thing, the European radio stations are on a 9kc channel spacing.
[02:03:57.800 --> 02:03:59.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: In the U.S., we're 10kc.
[02:04:00.160 --> 02:04:01.980]  [SPEAKER_08]: So they weren't on top of someone.
[02:04:02.120 --> 02:04:05.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: There were a couple of kc's off from another station.
[02:04:05.050 --> 02:04:05.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:04:05.240 --> 02:04:08.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: They don't use the same divided by 10 kilohertz.
[02:04:08.960 --> 02:04:12.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: They have like 712 or 814 or something.
[02:04:12.880 --> 02:04:13.800]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's about 9 kilohertz.
[02:04:14.020 --> 02:04:14.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: Is it 9 kilohertz?
[02:04:15.260 --> 02:04:18.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's 81, 892, you know, whatever.
[02:04:19.080 --> 02:04:22.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's 9 kilohertz spacing, which I never understood why.
[02:04:22.460 --> 02:04:29.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: And they also run a much tighter, their audio slightly restricted, because they run a much tighter bandwidth.
[02:04:29.550 --> 02:04:33.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, they can fit more stations in if they're only 9 kilohertz apart instead of 10.
[02:04:33.460 --> 02:04:34.130]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, yeah.
[02:04:34.240 --> 02:04:35.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I'll just tell you.
[02:04:35.320 --> 02:04:41.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, when I went there, the first day I got into a car with someone, I said, what is this?
[02:04:41.940 --> 02:04:45.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: Why are they, why are these stations like space mic and a hertz apart?
[02:04:46.580 --> 02:04:51.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: I actually spoke to an engineer, and they said, eh, they wanted to do it many years ago to be different than the U.S.
[02:04:53.700 --> 02:04:56.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know if that's true, but that's a good reason.
[02:04:56.440 --> 02:04:58.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: They're not politics, because you look at 220.
[02:04:58.720 --> 02:05:02.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: They went to 220 voltage at 50 cycles for two reasons.
[02:05:03.050 --> 02:05:08.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: It was because, you know, they want a smaller wire size because of copper.
[02:05:08.520 --> 02:05:10.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: But they tend to do things a lot differently.
[02:05:10.700 --> 02:05:11.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you know what?
[02:05:11.840 --> 02:05:15.160]  [SPEAKER_08]: Before you had, you had digital TV, you had PAL.
[02:05:15.780 --> 02:05:19.760]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you would have countries, each country would slightly have an offset.
[02:05:20.000 --> 02:05:21.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: Would they be negative or positive?
[02:05:21.980 --> 02:05:30.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: Or they would offset the 3.58, you know, color birth, so that you couldn't pick up, you know, a lot of country stuff for politics.
[02:05:30.670 --> 02:05:40.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, if you were like in Eastern Europe, and you were 10 miles away from Bulgaria, and you're in Greece, your TV would not sync up to a station coming out of Bulgaria.
[02:05:40.620 --> 02:05:40.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Interesting.
[02:05:41.120 --> 02:05:41.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't know that.
[02:05:41.820 --> 02:05:42.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[02:05:42.520 --> 02:05:42.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[02:05:44.080 --> 02:05:46.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: Everybody was slightly run differently.
[02:05:46.800 --> 02:05:53.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: And then obviously the newer TVs, like in the 90s, had chips that you could switch and pick up different.
[02:05:53.860 --> 02:05:55.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: Your TV could be picked up.
[02:05:55.580 --> 02:05:56.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: But that was a lot of reasons.
[02:05:57.460 --> 02:06:02.630]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, also a lot of places like Greece, they want to tax you for having a TV.
[02:06:03.080 --> 02:06:05.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, they want to tax you for having a receiver.
[02:06:05.550 --> 02:06:07.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, they do that in the UK as well.
[02:06:08.160 --> 02:06:08.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[02:06:08.630 --> 02:06:10.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I think that's so bad.
[02:06:10.820 --> 02:06:13.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: But seriously, guys, look at what you're doing.
[02:06:14.320 --> 02:06:18.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I think that's, well, I think that's what's irritating some people.
[02:06:18.700 --> 02:06:18.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:06:19.040 --> 02:06:21.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, we'll take that under advisement.
[02:06:21.170 --> 02:06:26.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: But yeah, we'll certainly take a look at that and open up the dialogue.
[02:06:26.780 --> 02:06:33.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, I'd like to hear about, you know, what type of technology, how can we, you know, use our phones without getting hacked?
[02:06:33.760 --> 02:06:42.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, have stuff on like, you know, on VA, you know, when you're having your show, talk about how you can protect your credit cards from being hacked from someone walking faster than you're up.
[02:06:42.940 --> 02:06:45.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I think we spent a lot of time talking about those things.
[02:06:45.880 --> 02:06:48.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I think tonight was no exception, but we're going to leave it there.
[02:06:48.800 --> 02:06:51.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: But I want to thank you for calling and and wish you the best.
[02:06:52.120 --> 02:06:53.000]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, okay, guys.
[02:06:53.120 --> 02:06:53.300]  [SPEAKER_03]: Bye.
[02:06:53.500 --> 02:06:53.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:06:56.340 --> 02:06:56.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Kyle!
[02:06:58.160 --> 02:06:59.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not helping Kyle.
[02:07:01.020 --> 02:07:01.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[02:07:02.620 --> 02:07:03.590]  [SPEAKER_18]: Trouble with the phone there.
[02:07:04.220 --> 02:07:05.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, Rob, go ahead.
[02:07:06.160 --> 02:07:08.940]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I know who this is.
[02:07:09.020 --> 02:07:09.800]  [SPEAKER_13]: And we see him at Hope.
[02:07:09.820 --> 02:07:11.040]  [SPEAKER_13]: And we always have a nice chat.
[02:07:11.600 --> 02:07:13.340]  [SPEAKER_13]: He will be missed if he doesn't come to Hope.
[02:07:13.520 --> 02:07:18.360]  [SPEAKER_13]: I will say, if you're listening, dude, if you don't come to Hope, is there a way your dog can still come?
[02:07:18.670 --> 02:07:20.260]  [SPEAKER_13]: Because we all love your dog.
[02:07:20.550 --> 02:07:21.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: That dog was cool.
[02:07:21.740 --> 02:07:27.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, I don't want to disturb anybody, but that dog, well, how do I say it?
[02:07:27.780 --> 02:07:28.670]  [SPEAKER_18]: Definitely leftist.
[02:07:28.960 --> 02:07:30.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: The dog is definitely leftist.
[02:07:31.050 --> 02:07:32.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm not going to tell you how I know this.
[02:07:33.300 --> 02:07:36.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let's just say we had a moment where it was clear.
[02:07:36.280 --> 02:07:36.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was clear.
[02:07:37.080 --> 02:07:40.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: Most animals are, by the way, most animals are leftist.
[02:07:40.240 --> 02:07:44.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: In fact, I would say socialist, even, you know, degrees of social.
[02:07:44.260 --> 02:07:44.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not all dogs.
[02:07:45.020 --> 02:07:45.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not all dogs.
[02:07:47.550 --> 02:07:48.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: All cats.
[02:07:48.740 --> 02:07:50.130]  [SPEAKER_18]: Cats are communists.
[02:07:50.880 --> 02:07:52.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: Straight down the line.
[02:07:53.980 --> 02:07:56.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: I mean, I learned that in, in what, 1985?
[02:07:57.800 --> 02:07:58.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:07:58.200 --> 02:07:58.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, no, I'm sorry.
[02:07:58.960 --> 02:07:59.700]  [SPEAKER_12]: Cats are Bolsheviks.
[02:08:01.320 --> 02:08:01.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Most are.
[02:08:01.880 --> 02:08:02.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, you're right.
[02:08:02.840 --> 02:08:03.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: No, it's not an American tale.
[02:08:03.980 --> 02:08:04.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: Cats are, cats are Bolsheviks.
[02:08:05.440 --> 02:08:06.820]  [SPEAKER_13]: Well, it's Pervit Stryka, I think.
[02:08:07.020 --> 02:08:08.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: Oh, man.
[02:08:08.660 --> 02:08:10.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can you turn down his mic maybe somehow?
[02:08:10.740 --> 02:08:11.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're in the same room.
[02:08:15.650 --> 02:08:16.170]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:08:16.250 --> 02:08:22.430]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, anyway, if we're, if we're, if we're too, too far left for most people, uh, let us know that and we'll do better.
[02:08:22.530 --> 02:08:22.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: We promise.
[02:08:23.090 --> 02:08:29.030]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, um, honestly, uh, you know, look at the content that, that people send to us.
[02:08:29.190 --> 02:08:34.210]  [SPEAKER_18]: We reflect that we reflect what people want to talk about and hope is unique.
[02:08:34.470 --> 02:08:37.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, I'd like to see it stay that way.
[02:08:38.390 --> 02:08:42.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, do I take one more call if it's quick, if it's a quick call and it's not somebody we talked to already?
[02:08:43.210 --> 02:08:43.930]  [SPEAKER_18]: What do you think, Kyle?
[02:08:44.530 --> 02:08:44.810]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:08:44.970 --> 02:08:46.350]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're going to try this one more call.
[02:08:46.790 --> 02:08:48.870]  [SPEAKER_18]: And everybody else out there, this is it.
[02:08:48.950 --> 02:08:49.710]  [SPEAKER_18]: No more after this.
[02:08:49.850 --> 02:08:50.290]  [SPEAKER_18]: So good evening.
[02:08:50.430 --> 02:08:51.630]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on off the goby time.
[02:08:53.170 --> 02:08:54.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: Good evening, gang.
[02:08:54.250 --> 02:08:55.210]  [SPEAKER_04]: This is Tim in Connecticut.
[02:08:55.210 --> 02:08:56.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: How are you tonight?
[02:08:56.230 --> 02:08:57.070]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hey, Tim in Connecticut.
[02:08:57.110 --> 02:08:57.450]  [SPEAKER_18]: How are you?
[02:08:58.750 --> 02:08:59.590]  [SPEAKER_04]: Not too bad.
[02:08:59.830 --> 02:09:01.090]  [SPEAKER_04]: The last caller is correct.
[02:09:01.250 --> 02:09:03.030]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I've got a horrible hum on this side.
[02:09:03.050 --> 02:09:04.510]  [SPEAKER_04]: I hope it's coming across okay.
[02:09:05.110 --> 02:09:07.490]  [SPEAKER_04]: I'll check later as I'll unmute my PC.
[02:09:07.490 --> 02:09:10.950]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it's hard for us to know what people are hearing from us.
[02:09:11.070 --> 02:09:14.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: We can only, uh, we can only rank what we hear.
[02:09:14.690 --> 02:09:16.910]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, we hear a slight hum, but it's not a loud hum.
[02:09:17.270 --> 02:09:20.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I think basically the caller's side.
[02:09:20.010 --> 02:09:20.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's indistinguishable.
[02:09:21.070 --> 02:09:22.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, the voices.
[02:09:22.890 --> 02:09:24.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, the caller's side is getting there.
[02:09:24.330 --> 02:09:24.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm sorry.
[02:09:25.030 --> 02:09:26.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's our gift to you.
[02:09:26.710 --> 02:09:28.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, the caller's side is getting it more.
[02:09:28.930 --> 02:09:31.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: If I wiggle the cable, it'll be on our side and then we broadcast.
[02:09:31.650 --> 02:09:38.230]  [SPEAKER_18]: By the way, we had a, we had a really helpful email from a listener, I think two weeks ago, uh, trying to solve the hum problem.
[02:09:38.390 --> 02:09:44.310]  [SPEAKER_18]: We, we never acknowledged him, but I wanted to make sure that word got out that yes, that's extremely helpful.
[02:09:44.310 --> 02:09:51.570]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we, we are reading everything you told us and we're trying all different technical solutions to this, but we're, you know, we, we, we never give up.
[02:09:51.670 --> 02:09:53.690]  [SPEAKER_18]: We just get busy with, with other things.
[02:09:54.150 --> 02:09:55.650]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anyway, Tim, what else is on your mind?
[02:09:55.990 --> 02:09:59.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: You know what they say, you know, falling on your face is still forward progress.
[02:09:59.230 --> 02:10:00.550]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that's true.
[02:10:00.690 --> 02:10:01.750]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a good way of looking at it.
[02:10:03.190 --> 02:10:14.150]  [SPEAKER_04]: Anyway, the, the primary reason I was calling tonight was because my neighbor was cleaning out his shed and he was about to throw away this old rotary bakelite.
[02:10:14.390 --> 02:10:20.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean like five, six pounds of telephone that I intercepted.
[02:10:20.750 --> 02:10:22.130]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I now have that.
[02:10:22.250 --> 02:10:29.770]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I was wondering if you guys would want it, or do I just have something on the back porch that I can show people what telephones used to look like?
[02:10:29.890 --> 02:10:31.110]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, can you describe it to us?
[02:10:32.770 --> 02:10:33.590]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's black.
[02:10:33.590 --> 02:10:41.950]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's got a rotary dial and it's got the bells in a, I don't know, like four inch by six inch black box.
[02:10:43.370 --> 02:10:47.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: So can you, can you place the era?
[02:10:47.250 --> 02:10:54.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: It'd probably be like a, a 300 set maybe if it's really old or, um, or a 500 with an external ringer.
[02:10:54.890 --> 02:10:56.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, it's on the bottom.
[02:10:56.230 --> 02:10:58.550]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's probably, yeah, it has an external ringer.
[02:10:58.930 --> 02:10:59.570]  [SPEAKER_16]: Oh, it does.
[02:10:59.710 --> 02:10:59.850]  [SPEAKER_16]: Wow.
[02:11:00.250 --> 02:11:00.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[02:11:00.570 --> 02:11:06.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: But I mean the, the, in the back of the car, you could say yay, nay at the time, I'm sure.
[02:11:06.860 --> 02:11:07.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh huh.
[02:11:08.280 --> 02:11:08.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[02:11:08.500 --> 02:11:09.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: What's, what's that?
[02:11:09.120 --> 02:11:10.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't take up a lot of space.
[02:11:10.320 --> 02:11:11.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: What's the handset?
[02:11:11.300 --> 02:11:12.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: It is a heavy little monster.
[02:11:12.660 --> 02:11:17.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I think you made mention, you know, it's got that handset that you, you could actually kill somebody with.
[02:11:17.860 --> 02:11:18.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[02:11:18.000 --> 02:11:19.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was going to ask you that very question.
[02:11:19.660 --> 02:11:20.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: It would not affect the handset at all.
[02:11:20.940 --> 02:11:22.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, I was going to ask you that very question.
[02:11:22.860 --> 02:11:39.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Does the handset, is it something you would wound somebody with because that's a, or somebody, so you could kill somebody with because the 1930s, that was the, the, the killing handset 1950s, the, the 500 series, I think, um, 60s, that's, that's more of wounding probably surviving.
[02:11:40.120 --> 02:11:40.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: You would survive that.
[02:11:41.120 --> 02:11:41.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:11:41.540 --> 02:11:43.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: You'd have a nasty bump, but, uh, you'd survive.
[02:11:44.040 --> 02:11:44.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:11:44.520 --> 02:11:47.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: But the other ones, I think they're made out of metal, not plastic.
[02:11:49.760 --> 02:11:50.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Wow.
[02:11:50.300 --> 02:11:52.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, and you, they were just throwing this out.
[02:11:53.740 --> 02:11:54.020]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[02:11:54.120 --> 02:11:54.240]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[02:11:54.320 --> 02:12:02.540]  [SPEAKER_04]: He was just cleaning out a shed and saw no use for it because of course, everybody's got a, uh, in fact, he doesn't even have a landline in the house.
[02:12:03.600 --> 02:12:05.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: Everybody's just got a cell phone now.
[02:12:05.680 --> 02:12:07.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, the day will come when everybody regrets that.
[02:12:08.100 --> 02:12:09.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'll say it again.
[02:12:09.380 --> 02:12:10.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: Bring it to hope.
[02:12:10.500 --> 02:12:10.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:12:10.940 --> 02:12:11.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bring it to hope.
[02:12:11.740 --> 02:12:14.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: You'll definitely find somebody who's interested in that.
[02:12:14.560 --> 02:12:15.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Rob has a question.
[02:12:15.360 --> 02:12:15.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[02:12:16.040 --> 02:12:28.500]  [SPEAKER_13]: Well, more of a statement, but, uh, with those old phones, the great thing about them is you can always, even if the guts are decrepit, even if the thing doesn't work anymore, you can always rewire these things with a modern microphone, a modern speaker,
[02:12:28.680 --> 02:12:32.280]  [SPEAKER_13]: some modern wiring, and it will work just as well as it did back then.
[02:12:32.380 --> 02:12:40.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: If you plug it into even the simulated landline that like a VoIP box from like a cable company or something like that would, uh, would give you.
[02:12:40.540 --> 02:12:43.960]  [SPEAKER_13]: So there are ways to actually use these things as working telephones nowadays.
[02:12:46.240 --> 02:12:47.320]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's interesting.
[02:12:47.740 --> 02:12:53.840]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, the particular phone, uh, it's heavy enough.
[02:12:54.380 --> 02:13:03.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's just really, it's one of those things I looked online real quick, tried to do an image search, and I couldn't find anything that exactly matched it to pull a model number off.
[02:13:05.780 --> 02:13:12.200]  [SPEAKER_13]: If you would be interested to email us some, uh, pictures of this guy, uh, we, we'd love to have a look at it and maybe find some more info for you.
[02:13:12.300 --> 02:13:12.300]  Oh, sure.
[02:13:12.300 --> 02:13:13.080]  [SPEAKER_04]: The regular address?
[02:13:13.560 --> 02:13:13.880]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yep.
[02:13:14.000 --> 02:13:15.620]  [SPEAKER_13]: oth@2600.com.
[02:13:16.500 --> 02:13:17.900]  [SPEAKER_04]: I can certainly do that.
[02:13:20.160 --> 02:13:20.780]  [SPEAKER_04]: All righty.
[02:13:20.780 --> 02:13:21.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I don't want to hold you guys up.
[02:13:22.560 --> 02:13:23.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, we're fading, I think.
[02:13:24.140 --> 02:13:25.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, uh, thanks for the call.
[02:13:25.620 --> 02:13:26.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, I look forward to seeing you at home.
[02:13:26.900 --> 02:13:27.700]  [SPEAKER_04]: I hope you feel better, Emmanuel.
[02:13:27.920 --> 02:13:28.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, I do, actually.
[02:13:28.980 --> 02:13:32.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think doing a show for a few hours, uh, is definitely good medicine.
[02:13:35.220 --> 02:13:36.700]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, as always, great show.
[02:13:36.920 --> 02:13:37.900]  [SPEAKER_04]: Thanks for what you do.
[02:13:38.060 --> 02:13:38.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:13:38.360 --> 02:13:38.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you.
[02:13:39.680 --> 02:13:40.420]  [SPEAKER_04]: Have a good night.
[02:13:40.500 --> 02:13:40.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Be well.
[02:13:42.580 --> 02:13:44.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's our last call of the night.
[02:13:44.360 --> 02:13:46.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, you guys have any closing thoughts?
[02:13:48.240 --> 02:13:52.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: Uh, stay cool out there, physically and, uh, psychologically.
[02:13:53.140 --> 02:13:57.060]  [SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, we're actually heading into a really significant heat wave here in New York.
[02:13:57.520 --> 02:14:05.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, you know, hydrate, be careful, be safe, um, find a cooling center if you need one.
[02:14:06.060 --> 02:14:10.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: They do exist, um, at finder.nyc.gov.
[02:14:10.960 --> 02:14:12.560]  [SPEAKER_12]: You can find all the cooling centers.
[02:14:12.580 --> 02:14:14.240]  [SPEAKER_12]: You can call 311 if you need help.
[02:14:14.740 --> 02:14:18.760]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, and yes, please, please, please find out about ranked choice voting.
[02:14:19.320 --> 02:14:21.860]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, know what you're doing before you go vote.
[02:14:22.040 --> 02:14:23.480]  [SPEAKER_12]: And yes, Tim, you sounded great.
[02:14:23.620 --> 02:14:23.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Thank you.
[02:14:24.640 --> 02:14:34.000]  [SPEAKER_12]: Um, also, yeah, um, be free, stay free, and fight.
[02:14:35.360 --> 02:14:36.040]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's all I got.
[02:14:36.460 --> 02:14:36.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Sounds good.
[02:14:37.900 --> 02:14:38.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Alex, anything from you?
[02:14:41.200 --> 02:14:42.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, just good night, everybody.
[02:14:43.020 --> 02:14:43.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Always a pleasure.
[02:14:43.700 --> 02:14:48.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'll, uh, talk with you all next week from, uh, another location.
[02:14:48.660 --> 02:14:51.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, call and show on WBAI from 7 to 8.
[02:14:51.660 --> 02:14:52.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: No overtime next week.
[02:14:52.760 --> 02:14:55.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, uh, we will see everybody on overtime in two weeks.
[02:14:56.260 --> 02:15:05.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: I would, uh, I would just acknowledge you for being diplomatic and, uh, and, uh, having a lot of listening.
[02:15:05.040 --> 02:15:10.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: We all are good at listening and, uh, remind people they can send feedback.
[02:15:11.180 --> 02:15:15.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, oth@2600.com and story ideas.
[02:15:15.520 --> 02:15:22.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: If there's something technical you're interested in and just consider all the shit I would talk.
[02:15:23.040 --> 02:15:26.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just know that this is the utmost restraint.
[02:15:27.800 --> 02:15:30.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like, I, I just, I can't even begin.
[02:15:31.940 --> 02:15:33.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, uh, I won't.
[02:15:34.760 --> 02:15:35.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, then.
[02:15:35.960 --> 02:15:36.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: And Rob?
[02:15:37.720 --> 02:15:42.300]  [SPEAKER_13]: And, uh, just wishing a, uh, good and meaningful Juneteenth to everyone tomorrow.
[02:15:42.560 --> 02:15:46.660]  [SPEAKER_13]: And if you're one of the folks who still doesn't know what that's all about, look it up on Wikipedia.
[02:15:47.080 --> 02:15:48.340]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's, uh, it's important.
[02:15:48.940 --> 02:15:49.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Sure is.
[02:15:49.780 --> 02:15:50.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Sure is.
[02:15:50.840 --> 02:15:51.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[02:15:51.400 --> 02:15:52.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: We will see you again.
[02:15:52.220 --> 02:15:54.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: oth@2600.com.
[02:15:54.600 --> 02:15:55.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good night, everyone.